The Right Time with Bomani Jones - Shannon Penn joins to discuss Giannis on the move, Knicks Issues, Giants pass on Shedeur Sanders | 4.30

Episode Date: April 30, 2025

On today’s episode, Shannon Penn of ESPN Radio joins Bomani Jones to discuss the New York Giants Draft and the New York Knicks playoff series. The show starts off with Bo saying why he has trouble with certain people who agree with his take on Shedeur Sanders (4:21) and why he is starting to hate both of the Giants 1st round picks (9:41). Bo and Shannon explain why it's absurd for Abdul Carter to request Lawrence Taylor's #56 (12:07) and that they feel bad for Dak Prescott having to face the NFC East pass rush (20:44). Sticking with the Giants, they criticize the front office for never investing in a young, black quarterback (26:20) and say they would never draft Shedeur Sanders because they were afraid Deion would want to replace Brian Daboll as head coach (29:49). Bo and Shannon transition to the New York Knicks where they have lost yet another series clinching game at home (33:48) and if they lose this series to Detroit, Tom Thibodeau will be on the hot seat (38:40). Bo and Shannon both agree Giannis Antetokounmpo has played his last game as a member of the Milwaukee Bucks but there's no great situation he can move to next season (43:35). They round out the show discussing Outkast making the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and why they're still underrated (52:10). . . . Subscribe to The Right Time with Bomani Jones on Spotify, Apple or wherever you get your podcasts and follow the show on Instagram, Twitter, and Tik Tok for all the best moments from the show. Download Full Podcast Here: Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6N7fDvgNz2EPDIOm49aj7M?si=FCb5EzTyTYuIy9-fWs4rQA&nd=1&utm_source=hoobe&utm_medium=social Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-right-time-with-bomani-jones/id982639043?utm_source=hoobe&utm_medium=social Follow The Right Time with Bomani Jones on Social Media: http://lnk.to/therighttime Subscribe to Supercast for Ad-Free Episodes: https://righttime.supercast.com/ Support the Show: Discover faster, more reliable search with Perplexity today. Download the app or ask Perplexity anything at perplexity.com! https://pplx.ai/bomani-jones Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the right time. A Wave Original presented by perplexity. My name is Bobani Jones. Thanks for listening wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for watching us on YouTube. Subscribe, like, rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are a hater.

It is that time of week where we have a guest join us. Coming to us live from the bustle metropolis of Bristol, Connecticut. You can check him out on ESPN radio with Harry Douglas and Harry Liles Jr. You got two black harries in the year 2025 in the same place on the same show, Shadden Pitt. I feel like that's an obligation. Like, what, you got to do the two black harries? You got to get them together. Yeah, we do some of the stuff on the digital front with Harry Liles as well. But no, I'm holding it down with Freddie Coleman as well, too. Oh, okay. My bad. I had that, I had that mixed up. See, I don't have a car anymore. Therefore, I don't know. I don't know what nobody radio is hitting all these days. I thought it was Harry and Harry. That's my fault.

You got it half right. You got the one Harry. We do have Harry Miles on the show, though. No, my bad to Freddie, man. I don't know why I thought. I think I had been, you know what he was? I'd seen stuff on like IG with Harry and Harry during like college football season. Right.

And then they just did the draft too. They did the digital draft last week. Yes. Yes. I'll tell you this, though. It's wild. Every time I think about somebody named Harry, I actually think about the Chinese folks I went to graduate school with

because you know very often our Chinese brothers come to the United States and they adopt, I don't know if they call it the Christian name, an American name, however they put it, but they adopt those names. But the problem is, whatever list we sent over there for them with names, they ain't updated that since like 1958. Right? So it'll be like, oh, it was going on, Dick? How do we? We're still making those, eh?

We're still out here with George's. Like, not horrible, but we're still out here with George's with the G. Yes. Well, what I'd always wondered is when they send, like, the second edition of that book, will we get us some like Andres by mistake. You know what I'm saying? Somebody put the wrong name in a wrong place or something maybe a little more neutral, like Carlos.

I'm still waiting because it's all the wave now and you see it in any of these NBA and NFL drafts, this wave of Jalens now, right? Yes. So I wonder when the Jalens are in volume three, when it's going to make this wave over there and we can come with some folks named Jalen. Jaila Mama, Jaila Rose's mama changed the entire world, right?

Like I think you and I've talked about this when you feel like you came up with a saying and like everybody. else is saying, like my brother is adamant that he is the first person to say, drop a deuce as a reference to the education. He firmly believes that he's the OG. Nobody came up with that. I got a couple. I mean, sometimes, you know, because of the internet, I know I started some of this, right? Right, right. I feel like it, and I just let it ride. But every now and then I search something, for example, when I started calling Tray Young, Trader Barge. I searched it. Somebody else had called him Trader Barge, but I still feel like I'm the

representative of the Trader Barge movement. Right, right, right. Right, right. And it happens all the time, too. And you see it on social. And some of the stuff, you got to let it ride. But as a matter of fact, I did a show with Randy Scott, Sports Center. Yes. Sports Center anchor the other, what, two weeks ago. And he said the first time he had ever heard free 99 was on the right time. So ever since then, he uses free 99. But yet he doesn't give us the credit.

But he told me, though, at least he told me that, Edge, we'll let you know, I've been using free 99 for the last five years now. I'm like, all right, Randy, it's cool. I think I've, and for those you who don't know, Shannon is the OG producer of the right time. I say this is Ryan is joining us now. We have a new producer coming in. I'm starting to wonder if it's me.

You know what I'm saying? But like, you know, these are the things that happen. My favorite, though, of all time. Sandy Dherty, my advisor and graduate school at North Carolina, is adamant that it is he who first called Barry White, the walrus of love. He is of all the things, right? And like, he's adamant in the way where he was like,

so, Kirsten, tell him. Curston, tell him, tell him. Let him know. The year was 1970. Yes, yes. His wife has to coincide, right? Like, this is where it goes. Now, I want to run something by you.

Okay. That's tangentially sports related. I've had a weird week this week where, you know, hammered things to say about what was going on with the draft. It should do a Sanders. Don't like everybody that's on my team with this. one, but hey, stand by what I said because what I said was correct, right? Just because dishonest people are broken clocks. They got it twice a day. Can't run for what you think,

right? But it made me think about something that had never crossed my mind. And I am going to ask this of you as you have twirled a cane or two in your tie. You have shimmied here and there. How in the world is Diyah Sanders not a capital? That's a great question. But my thing would be, would you want to be on the line with Dian, though? Like, Dian might be the first dude on line who would have LBs, but yet he would be the head and the tail of said line. Like, he would introduce his line at the probate.

I'm Diann Sanders, and these are the temptations. Like, that would be, like, oh, Lord, Dian, we back here, too. Like, nah, imagine being on line with Dion. Come on, man. I think I know exactly what happened as I thought of it. Because look, nothing seems to fit and be more on brand than Dion Sanders and Kappa. And this is in large part because when Deion got on with the Falcons, he in Atlanta playing for a team with them colors.

So I didn't see him in red suits. You know what I'm saying? I know he's about it. I don't seen how he dance all of those things. He's seen ready made to be a Kappa. But I could imagine they was probably on Dion's Joc. to try to get them to come out and di i'd be like man i went in there one time they was in there hitting them for you i was like i know they don't think they're about to be hitting me oh hell no

he's not about to be hitting me he was like don't get the jericho and the palmade twisted i like yeah yeah you think dion about to be calling somebody his big brother his his son won't even his son can't even act right at job interviews right he's not dion sanders You expect me to call my Dina Pledge's daddy? Nah, that ain't happening. There's only one daddy, and that's my Lord's saying. Jesus, right? The legendary stories of Dian being having a meeting with the Giants and being like,

wait a minute, when y'all pick 18? Oh, I ain't going to be there. And they're rolling out. Look, he wished you could have told the Giants that this year. Oh, man. Does he? Does he? Does he?

Like, Dion. I just imagined all of this, everything going down as Dion. And you and I, look, we've been doing this frighteningly almost 20 years. It's crazy. Yep. Literally almost 20 years, right? You got kids graduating from high school. I'm seeing pictures.

Children I've seen born having sweet 16s, the whole nine. I'm not here spending Fridays at the DMV getting driver's licenses. It's crazy. Well, you told me that. That's where I was like. I was honestly just glad that she wanted a license because these kids don't be wanting to go nowhere and do nothing. Right. That's a great point,

but I think so much of Shannon is built on independence too. Like she's not like myself. Like Braylin, he's like, no, I'm cool. Y'all can show for me wherever I need to be. Shannon has to, I got to get up out of here. Like, I don't got time to be waiting for y'all to be picking me up. So yeah, I'm about to go get this license. So my sister is 10 years older than me, and she figured out the con on the driver's license.

When she was in high school, Well, Baba wanted her to go get her license. She was like, so I can drive a bow around? Hell no. She ain't get a license until after her sophomore year in college or freshman year may be. But she was just like, all, you're not going to give me no car. I'm just going to be running errands for this little dude that I'm not even really that sure about. That was, it's funny you bring that because I actually thought about you in this regard when we were texting about this.

Since you're now, so much of a New Yorker now, right? When is the last time you drove a car? Because as we all know, having a car is not a necessity in New York. When was the time you actually drove a car? I hope to never have a car again, just to be clear. And I rented a car on my trip to, no, it wasn't the last trip to North Carolina. It must have been the last time I was in Atlanta at my parents' house. And I ain't going to lie to you, boy, cars be moving fast.

Like, when you don't really drive, And then you get on the freeway, you're like, oh. And also because I've been in New York so long, my math on distance to time is so thrown off. So I'd be somewhere and put something in the app, and it'd be like 17 miles. I'm like, oh, boy, I'm moving to the other end of the world. They're like 18 minutes.

I'm like, oh, yeah, you can go 60 here. Like, that's how the rest of the world operates. That's right. Yes, yes. I had no idea. Now, again, those you go back with us, Shannon's the Giants fan. And I was going to say at first that I worried that I had been like a curse to you as a Giants fan,

because it ain't been a lot of good times for you since I've known you as a Giants fan, except you don't want two Super Bowls as a Giants fan since I've been around. You know what I'm saying? I did my part. I hate one of your first round picks already. And I think I might not like the other one. Okay. I think I might not like Jackson Dart.

And I'm going to be honest. is Jackson with an X. Like it's enough that it's the last name, first name, situation. Last name, first name went to Ole Miss and it's Jackson with an S. By the way, shout out to you, white people, finally getting some creativity

about yourselves with these names, right? Eventually they're going to start getting these apostrophies in their name. That's right. That's right. We're going to get an accent mark in there somewhere, right? I don't know anything about the young man, right? But he got a show and proved to me. But that boy, Abdul Carter,

we haven't talked about this on the show. Abdul Carter is the number three pick in the draft. He wore number 11 at Penn State. And as you know, that's a big deal at Penn State. That's LeVar Arrington's number. That was what Michael Parsons wore. And look, they give that to Beasts, right? It's like 88 is wide receiver with the Dallas Cowboys.

They give that to Beast. He lived up to being the Beast. He is clearly a very Philly dude. After all, his name is Abdul. And I saw them at the, I saw them at the draft. That was Philly Islam full display. Right? You know, you know, go ahead.

We don't. Like, these, see, these are things about black people that white people don't understand and these subtle nuances. When they think about, they think about Philadelphia, they think about Rocky and all that. Now, keep in mind, the first scene in Rocky is Rocky playing summer madness on his record player. So I'm just saying, Rocky may not have been too far away.

But when we think about Philadelphia, they even, them cats got beers. They only be working at the mall with them beer. That's what I was about to say. I was surprised that Duke Carter didn't have a full beer. Like, that's what I was expected. I was expecting this first interview. He was going to drop some youngs.

He was going to drop some janks. It's the bulls and the young boys. The young bull coming to New York. Yes. My roommate, my freshman year was from Philadelphia. I actually lived over like four years. And I got to tell you, I had never considered Philadelphia as anything when I met him. I was from Houston.

I thought it was all New York. Right. You know, only to get here and realize they don't even think New Jersey is New York. Don't even get me started on Staten Island. I misunderstood. I didn't know what it was. But he started talking about the bulls and the johns. and everything else.

And I was like, oh, I have to learn a new lesson. But for those of you who don't know, Michael Parsons asked Abdul Carter if he was going to wear number 11. Michael Parsons still wears number 11 for the Cowboys, you know, put on for Penn State, a school I would never go to. Abdul Carter said he had a different number in mind.

And that number was 56. I don't like this boy, purely on the strength of that. And then when he didn't get it, LT, War Moon, for reasons I don't understand, told Cam Ward he can have it. Maybe Ward is putting off H-Town and being like the Titans ain't even really me, right? But he shouldn't have let him, like, these are ridiculous things that these kids are asking for. You should tell them hell no, right?

People don't do that enough with these. Anyway. Abdul Carter, they asked LT. And L.T. Basically asked him, you've been smoking rocks. Not because we wanted to, but because it was such a ridiculous request to make. And then Abdul Carter said, no, it's cool. This is basically something to the effect of this is going to put a chip on my shoulder.

And I'm like, how dare you? Right. How dare you? And then he was on some, well, you know, something along the lines of you, you know, I had to take my shot or whatever. And he said, no, what was the worst going to happen? You shouldn't have even asked. It shouldn't even have come to that.

Like, I appreciate the confidence. I appreciate where you want to be in the type of player and all of that. But some things don't need to be asked. I'm sorry. the reason you can't have it is the only reason you asked. And the only reason you ask is because it's LT's number. So have we reached a place where people just don't realize what exactly this Lawrence Taylor thing is or was about?

Because look, you and I are barely old enough to know what it was about. But we know. Right. And it's different. There's so many levels to the LT thing too. It's not just the performance on the field. It's not just the defensive rookie of the year and defensive player of the year as a rookie.

It's not just winning two Super Bowls with the Giants. It's doing all of this in New York and doing all of this in the New York in the 80s. Yes. New York in the 80s, the Doc Good and Dowell Strawberries, Michael Ray Richardson, New York. Yes. Like, it hit different then.

Like, if it hit, look, L.T wasn't the only thing hitting in the 80s. There was some things on the street. streets out there. Shannon, he was the MVP. That first year they won the Super Bowl, he was the MVP, and he's like Michael Jordan in the sense that he was relentless. Right, right?

Like, that was thinking about Michael Jordan, every play you had to strap it all because he was coming. L.T, that game where LT had one arm against the Saints and still racked up them two sacks, it was throwing them dudes all around. Like, no, no, no. Who was that? I can't remember what player it was.

It may have been Michael Parsons. It wasn't Michael Parsley, But somebody, they try to ask Bill Belichick about and ask him how he compared to Lawrence Taylor, Bill Belichick's just like, like, what are we doing? Like, really, what are we doing? Like, what are we doing?

And maybe the young people lose sight of this because, you know, obviously skill level, he's comparable to what Michael Jordan was in the NBA. And maybe because LT didn't have the shoes and folks may not talk about him like they do with such reverence of Michael Jordan, especially with the LeBron debate. but there's some things you know you don't cross.

And if you're Abdul Carter, like, you're already going into a tough situation. Like, yo, you're the third overall pick. You're going into a Giants team that has to win. You've got the head coach and the GM on the hot seat. Like, there's enough on your shoulders already coming in. And now you want to try to wear 56. It just doesn't help yourself. Like, I love the confidence.

I get all of that. And if you want to, you know, if you want to be a disruptor and be the next Michael Parsons, I would prefer to be the next Michael Parsons on the field. They're not trying to be with Michael Parsons in the media, but that's a whole other story. But you go, you already have enough on your shoulders. You don't need to come in and add this to it as well. Shannon, he's not guaranteed to start. Well, that too.

Like, look, I think I would assume, and you tell me if I'm wrong here, but especially you with the memory of these last two Super Bowls, I think you were like me and I agree. There is no such thing as having too many pass rushers. And, you know, like if you got a chance at a dude like that as a pass rusher, you do that. And I think the luxury that Carter has in this situation is that he's not just a pass rush as well. He did play some middle at Penn State as well. So you can line him up in other packages where he's not just a pass rush.

But the Giants were in a position there where they had to take the best player available. Was it a big position of need? No. But like you said, you can never have enough pass rushes, especially when you're in the division now with Jayden Daniels and Jalen Hertz and Rain Dakota. So like you need as many pass rushes as you can get. You're not calling him Dak. Rain Dakota, man.

You're not calling him Dak. I don't know why. I was listening. I was like, who is he? Is that what it's come to? Hey, man. That's what we are now. That's what we are now because, like,

like, he's still good, but you're not in that category with those other two. But he can't be his, he can't just be Dak Prescott not in the same category as the other guys. He can't be that on his own name. He ain't been Dak in a couple years

in some time now, man. He got to earn that day. I mean, his paycheck said that. We got to earn that on the field. Well, let me tell you where I feel bad for Dak, right? It is very easy for us because Dak get that money, right? Because I tell you what they call him at the bank. Mr. Prescott the legend.

That is what they call him at the bank. But I think we have forgotten that Dak Prescott is an all-time overachiever. Like to be a fourth round pick. Like every time he reaches some height that he can't get past, and I don't have an explanation for what it is. I have to go back and be like, well, he was a fourth-round pick. Right? Like, that was what it is.

Nah, man, he played for the Cowboys, and we be coming at him. And, and, and this is important. We at this place where people don't feel like you got to root for every black quarterback. Therefore, the brothers could be as hard on him as the white man is. Right. They be coming for Dax neck. Not to mention, too.

Like, you have to ask the question now. And I know you said he's an overachiever, but we have to ask the question whether or not DAC is peaked at this point? Absolutely. At this point, has Dak peaked. So now is he starting to teeter on good game manager levels here? But my thing is, at $60 million a year, you can't just be a game manager. So is he still at the point where you win games because of that?

Or is he at the point where you don't want to lose games because of that? Have they ever been at the point that they won games because of him because of the question, right? Like, that to me is the issue because he's going to be 30, two this year. We've seen the injuries that he's had. He has been, this will be his 10th year as a starter. Like he is moving into like Roger Staubach, Tony Romo

type territory in terms of his tenure as quarterback for the Cowboys. Danny White is probably most comparable, but I had lunch with Tim Kalashaw one day about that and I made that Danny White company. He's like, yeah, but Danny White went to, I forget it was three or four NFC championship games. Right. It just has it happen. So, Dak is a

dude who needs guys to throw to. He's probably, he is, and I'm not saying they're the same, but he is closer to the Kirk Cousins class of quarterback than he is to the say Joe Burrow class of quarterback. But they ain't getting him, are they getting him what is necessary to make this happen? And is that enough for Dallas at this point? Like you saw what DAC was when he didn't have Zeke Elliott of, you know, five, six, seven years ago and not having to run game.

Yes, you have CD Lamb. CD Lamb's great. We get this. But what is Dak if you don't have the run game? Not to mention the offensive line that Dallas has, not the offensive line that they had six, seven years ago as well. Yeah, well, they try to get it back, right? Like, they tried to, because you're right,

they were just like, we got Hall of Favorers up and down, right? Right. They drafted old boy a couple years ago that everybody told him not to draft and he turned out to be a pro bowler. And they drafted another guard this year that people said they shouldn't have drafted. However, did you see that interview with Tyler Booker where he said what he enjoys is making people. stop loving football.

Oh, really? Yes, he said that the reason he loves playing football, that feeling that you know, he's saying, when you're going against Tyler Booker, it's going to be like that all day long. And he said, you can look at his eyes and you make that man not want to play football no more. I said, I wish he was on my team, my team,

America's team, we need another one of those. I love to hear that. I love to hear that. Thinking about on the field, like, that's all well and good. But Mr. Booker, you're in the NFC East, right? So you got Jalen Carter and the rest of that eager defensive line. You got sexy Dexter Lawrence and the rest of that now Giants defensive line. Like, I love the confidence.

And, like, those type of dudes, in all honesty, I know he went to Cowboys, but I love him at the draft and his reaction, his excitement and all that. And I love the quote about making people not want to play football anymore, but it's going to be interesting to see, like, what Mike Tyson says, everybody got a plan until they get punched in the face? Like, that's going to be great. you're going to make guys want to stop playing football until you see Jalen Carter, until you see Dexter Lawrence.

Yeah, Joe, Janet Carter, you don't see that many football players anymore that look like disagreeable. Yes. He looks, he doesn't look like a good time. Like, I went through an Eagles Giants game a couple years ago, so had been pregame warm-ups. And I know everybody's getting in his zone. but you got guys bouncing and getting into it, he was all business. And he was like, he's like, I'm about that action, boss. He was all business.

Like, damn. Like I saw Jordan Day, like, his boys from Georgia was like, no, I'm about that action. I'm about to do damage. You don't want those problems. So I got to let this be known because last week, real quick, going back to the Giants in the draft and Jackson Dart and picking all, right? I had tweeted, I'm done. And I had tweeted, you know, I'm done.

done. I'm officially in the Giants Fan Trans Report. Yeah, you told me on text that you were there. Yeah. And for those who didn't see it, I actually had a prepared statement that I would like to read, thanks to Jack C.P.T. So in my Transfer Portal statement, I said,

after much thought and reflection, I have decided to enter the Fan Transfer Portal and step away from my role as a dedicated supporter of the New York Giants. The decision comes after evaluating my current situation and considering what's best for my mental and emotional well-being as a fan. While I've enjoyed the highs and weathered the lows with the Giants, it's clear my fandom

needs a new chapter. I will always cherish the memories, but it's time to explore new opportunities and find a team that better aligns with my current outlook. I wish the Giants the best moving forward and thank the organization for these unforgettable moments. As I transitioned, So my next fandom, I am open to new possibilities and excited for what lies ahead. Sincerely, Shannon Penn, I am officially off that narcotic. All right. Hey, hey, hey, hey, let me read some names for you. Jared Gough, Jemir Gibbs, I'm under Ross St. Brown, Jameson Williams, old stupid ass,

Sam LaPorter, Taylor Decker. They appear to have a white man named Mahogany and Left Guard. Oh, no, he blacked, my fault. He's black, but there's still a touch of irony. Frank Ragnall, Payton, Hutchison, DJ Reader, Jack Campbell, Terry, Arnold, Brian, Bradge, Kirby, Joseph. Come on over to America's team. So that way, that's where you are now?

That's where you are with the line. You're all in on the lines. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Why are you all in an alliance? I like what they stand for. I like what they represent. I'm picking up what they putting dad. And when J-Mo through that damn reverse, that intercession on that reverse,

I got so mad at Ben Johnson that I realized, oh, this is not a radio bit, guys. This is how I feel. Baby, I'm for real. I'm about this. I got, I got gear. I got to get some new, I got hoodies, but I need to get some T-shirts. You know what I'm saying? Okay.

Need to prepare. I ain't really got nobody's jersey I'm down to wear, but, you know, that's where we are. And if you go on Lennon, like, you got to get somebody. like Detroit line gators, you can get some Stacy Adams. You got to start working on your what up, though. I do. I do. I got to get some Chloe glasses.

You know what I'm saying? I got to decide. Like if I'm all the way in, I got to get a Hutch jersey. That's what we call them, Shannon. We call it Hutch. Oh, I got to. Okay. Because Hutch Daddy over for my part of town in Houston.

You know what I'm saying? Holding it down for the Northwest Burbs. Like, he doing that. But, you know, I already got one white man's name on my back, right? I don't really know. I don't really know about throwing another way. All right. So let me say this about the Giants, right?

Like, I'm in the portal, but I'm not, I'm not, I haven't left all the way. Like, I am in the portal. I'm willing to take on a new team. I'm willing to consider going back to the Giants. But here's, I'll explain why, my frustration here with the Giants. And granted, hindsight, what it is after hearing about Shador Sanders' pre-draft process and how he didn't interview. well with certain teams, certain

players and teams didn't have him high. But for me... Your coach really didn't like him. Well, that's the big part too. And finding out afterwards, you understand that now with the proper context. But for me going into it, and this is nothing to do with Jackson Dart, although I talk to, like,

people who watch football. I was like, hey, he's going to have to learn a lot coming to the NFL because he was limited there and Lane Kiffin's system. But that's a whole other story. I just wanted, for me, I look at the other teams, right? And you, former Atlanta Falcon fans.

You look at what the Eagles have in Jalen Hertz. And you mentioned Warren Moon before. And like, yes, the Giants have started a couple of black quarterbacks, including Tyrod. Like, that's all good. But not on purpose. But not on purpose. And we've never had and invested in a young black quarterback. And for me, coming up and watching the growth of the NFL from what it was when we were growing up,

when all we had was Randall Cunningham and Warren Moon, to where the game now where almost every damn their team has a black star and quarterback. And for my team to still not have one after celebrating. their 100th anniversary. It said a lot. And I said before the draft, I was like, prior to knowing where the Giants were going to be drafted, what Peck picked are going to have,

I was like, if Shador or Cam Ward were available in the Giants' past, I'm done. So when Jackson Dart's name was announced, my wife turned and looked at me and she said, are you going to stand on business? So essentially she was challenging my manhood.

But other than that, she made a valid point. It's like, at what point do we have to ask more? And I get it, Giants of that black general manager, before and the whole nine. But it seems at this point that it's more than a coincidence that they haven't, that they're one of the only teams in NFL that hasn't had a young black star quarterback yet.

Okay, I have thoughts on this, and we will talk right after this. This episode is presented by Perplexity. Perplexity is an AI-powered answer engine that searches the internet in real time to deliver fast, clear, high-quality answers. Unlike legacy search engines that respond with the list of links, Perplexity skipped straight to the answers you need explained in everyday language that's easy to understand with sources and citations.

Now, Ryan, how do you use perplexity, especially when it comes to the right time? You know, if you're a loyal listener or viewer of the show, you're already aware that we use perplexity throughout the show on Mondays, especially when you need questions answered or stats confirmed. But perplexity is great because you say you're curious about a specific topic from the show,

like how much will the Luca trade cost to Dallas Maver's? You can see how. quickly perplexity can get the answer, which is well over $100 million. Discover faster, more reliable search with perplexity today. Download the app or ask perplexity anything at perplexity.com. All right. We're back on the right time, Shannon Penn. Now, it's funny that you mention that because I am inclined to cut the giants a tiny bit of slack

on the black quarterback part. Though I am with you, I'll believe it when I see it, right? as I've said many times, the first time they started a black quarterback was Gino Smith and the only got so mad, he fired the coach and gave Eli mad in two more years to walk around on the field like a dead man. You remember that? You remember that? That really happened, guys. But I do think we have to remember that the black quarterback is a really a 21st century notion in the NFL. Like you started getting a little traction in the 90s, but it's really

a 21st century notion. And for most of the 21st century, they did have the one quarterback, right? Like, that's why I cut the Packers some slack because for the longest, they had two quarterbacks for a 30-year period. But then they went and got a black quarterback, and boom, they did it, right? I will say this, though, about the Giants. There is word, and I have, I don't necessarily know if this is true, but maybe it is, that people thought that part of what Brian Daibold didn't like about the idea of bringing in Shedor was that Dion Sanders might take his job. I could understand why he might have thought that

because why folks don't be thinking deep enough about these things necessarily. If he thinks for a second that the New York football giants were going to make Deon Sanders, the Dion Sanders that we've been talking about for the last 35 years, if you think that they would ever go make him to head coach,

you have lost your ever-loving mind. You haven't been paying attention. You haven't been paying attention. Hey, hey, let me tell you something, man. Everything we've talked about with black coaches and everything else having a hard time, that's how amazing Dion is. That go out the window and everybody's mind.

This old, well, if you do it comes, the team is going to hire Dion as his coach. We can barely get them to hire any black dude whatsoever, let alone. You talk about that one? That one? Like the idea that the people of the NFL hate Dion, not buying that. The black quarterback notion has changed greatly. We can't treat this like we did even 10 years ago, right? But the black coach, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. It's right where we were

when Jody Cochran died. Do you think, do you see him? Because here's the thing with Dion, too, and the coach, like he's expressed verbally that he has no interest in going to NFL. Like, I don't know if that's true or not, but he seems very comfortable. I think he likes to have the control that he has in college. That's why you see you have some college coaches that are lifeers because they like what they're doing. Nick Saban tried the NFL thing so that didn't work for him. Like you see that guys are just more comfortable

of what the process is in college compared to having to deal with the NFL players. Dion has figured out how to be a college coach who doesn't actually have to recruit. Like, I don't know if you've seen this. He's like, yeah, I'm too old to be showing up at somebody's high school. Tell that to the 65-year-old principal. Like, like, there's somebody in that bad boy pushing a mop. What, what does that have to do with how old you are?

But Deion ain't even got to do that. I'm just D.R. Sanders. A face time from D.I. Sanders will do the job. So if you can be a college coach and still have time to do a talk show on Tubby, which he does for those of you who do not know. Shout to Roxy. Yes, yes. Like, if you can pull that off, then you go ahead and, you know, you go ahead and do that.

But yeah, no, no, Chador. I told you, man. Some people being you don't like are using me on some, oh, they got it right about Chudor. And I'm like, I did. You're not wrong about that. But could you stop? Like, how about you just say the same thing as me?

But don't, like, bring me up. Right. Like, we talked about at the start. Like, hey, you can jack my slang all you want. Here, go ahead, take my ticket, go ahead. Leave me out of this one. You go ahead, take the whole take. Say it word for word, bar for bar.

I don't care, but leave me out of this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's wild how that works, though, because, you know, we got that one that one cat who'd be jacking our slag for like 20 years. And I kind of wish, I kind of want to send that one an invoice. That was, that was, and now, like, in this day and age, because before I'm like, hey, baby, it's a community.

You know what I'm saying? That's what we're here for. Yeah, but that one right there. That one I want to say to invoice. I want to ask you this, though. I was watching the game last night. Mm-hmm. The Knicks were up 3-1 to the Pistons.

Yeah. They are now up 3-2. You're a little nervous? Not nervous, concern. But I'm not surprised, though. If you looked at this team the entire year, they don't make anything easy. And they still, I'm just surprised

that we're so far deep into this season, and they still don't have an identity. Them dudes still act like they don't know each other when they're out there playing. Like, you're in the playoffs now. You're four or five games into the playoffs now, and you still don't know aside from, hey, Brunson, Beller Academy offense,

what you're supposed to be doing? Shout out to Bumonti for the Beller Academy reference as well. See how we do? And you're still trying to figure out. You're still not able to communicate. Like, you went out there yesterday. What's the stat now that the Knicks haven't won a playoff, punchy game in MSG since 1999?

Wow. Like, put that in perspective. Right here. Right here. Right here. Right here. Right here. Right here.

That was. It was the LJ season. LJ right here. It was the eighth seed of Knicks that got to the finals. So am I surprised that they lost that? No, they did the same thing last year to Philadelphia. They were at MSG in game 5 up 3-1. And Tyros, Maxey had an outstanding game and they had to go win a tough one in Philly.

And I expect the same thing in Detroit. And the disappointing part two. One last thing about that game is that like Thompson played well for Detroit. Kade didn't have a great game, although he played well late. The other guys, Hardaway, Beasley, some of the other streaky guys,

didn't play well yesterday, and the Knicks still lost that. Like, you need, and I still don't understand. You saw it in three and four. Get the damn ball of Carl Towns. Like, why is it taking so long to find him? So that's what I wanted to ask you about,

because as many of you know, you know, I'm a Carl skeptic. Uh-huh. I've always been a Carl skeptic. I think he's the best player on this team. he has been a better player this year than I would have expected. And I don't think I've seen him miss a shot in this series.

Is he like every time I look up, he makes a shot, it just look weird after he'd do it. And, you know, he's still out here. He's still a Harry Hackmaster. Right? Like, that's still going down. But it also feels like especially late, they don't get him to fall. Right. And I'm curious what you think about that.

I still don't understand. You saw it in some of the games in Detroit. Why don't it run more picky, and roll with Townsend Brunson. Like, what are we doing? You run Pick and Roll Townsend, Townsend Brunton. You either get a switch or you continue to get the matchup that you want it. And it's either going to be a pick and pop or pick and roll for Towns or a shot for Brunton.

I don't understand, I don't understand what they're doing. I don't, and I get it. It's the playoffs. You got to shorten your roster as well, but Tibbs only playing eight guys. And it's just not working. Like Bridges doesn't look like he gels. O.G. didn't play great offensively, although he played great defensively in that game. It's just like you never see the Knicks with this unit have a complete game on both ends of the court.

It's either, hey, they do something really well or they suck at all the other things, but they get lucky enough to win a game on the back hole in game four. Like that's the frustrating part with these dudes. I think they probably win this series just because, I mean, they did it last year, a couple years ago, right? They've got guys that have done things that have been in the postseason. I think the pistons, you know, that being new to it is a thing. I actually think that the Knicks will have a small chance against the Celtics. Oh, that makes one of us.

No, I just think, I think the Celtics, the likelihood of somebody getting hurt is high, right? They already put needles in Jalen Brown's knee. Tatum had that fall. Porzengis, hey man, matter of time. I don't know when, I don't know what. It's like when he out there, it's like final destination. Like, you know it's coming. At some point, it's coming.

You're just going to wait for it. It's going to be a slipping fall. You get out the shower. It's going to be going to be going to for a layup, a block shot. He's going to trip getting off the bench. Something going to happen with Porzingis, but he's about to miss a couple games. Matter of time, baby. Matter of time.

Like, it's going to happen. So I think from there, like the Knicks have a chance to kind of sneak in there. That's where I'm coming from. But now this, this is different. In the time that I've known you, the Knicks have been good, like, twice. Right? Like, maybe I was. the bad luck charmed on that way.

You said that matter of faculty as though you have entertained the possibility. It's had to feel good the last couple of years, right? Like, I hate that I'll get to talk to you every day as a result. I mean, it helps having, what, back-to-back 51 seasons for the first time in 30 years? So, like, that's been great. And it's been interesting, too, for my kids, especially for my daughter to watch now, because the Knicks haven't been good for her 16 years to live, like, maybe one year or now this recent stretch with Brunson.

So, like, for her to experience me watching games that, like, she's seen me watch Yankee games and Rangers and Giants. Like that's all really good. But she hasn't seen me like this. Yes. And like this is a little bit different. Like her watching me experienced that Game 7 loss last year to the Pacers and Halliburton. That was different.

Yeah. Like she now sees you get excited and frustrated. At the same time. You were just sad. Yeah. Yeah. And the thing too, like the whole next offseason, the roster, all of this was built for playing Boston. And I think, and yes, they haven't beat them this year and they've been blown out and damn there every game against Boston year.

But the whole thing, like there's no shame if you fall to Boston. I think there's going to be real serious questions if they lose to Detroit now, especially if they lose to Detroit and they would have to have dropped three stray games. Then there's going to be some serious questions about Coach Tibbs. I'm not saying he's going to be on the hot seat, but his seat's going to be very warm, especially when you got a guy out there, Michael Malone, who I know. He rubs people wrong with his approach, but he's a guy who's familiar with the Knicks, his dad having been there, him spending time in the New York area.

So not putting Tibbs on the hot seat, but there's going to be pressure. If you lose to the Celtics, as long as you don't get embarrassed and get blown out by 30 points in a four-game sweep, you're fine. But if you lose to Detroit,

some serious question is going to have to be asked. Hey, let me ask this as a serious question. Let's say you fire tips, which is, I mean, it's on the board, right? Right. Does the next coach have to hire Rick Brunson? Yes. Like, yes. Yes. That's easy. Yes. This is a yonness at the NASA situation. Come on, man. Look, the Knicks, when they had J.R. Smith, they signed his brother.

Like, if they were going to have J.R. Smith's brother on the roster, you know, sure of Brunson going to be the head assistant coach, associate head coach with the NICS. Come on. Now, what are we doing? That's a no brain. It is so bad with J.R. Smith's brother, there are people here who do not know that they signed his brother. And if we told you his brother's name and his brother's name was Chris, you still didn't know what happened. Right, Chris Smith from lawful. Like, I don't even remember when he stopped being an neck. I just knew he was on the roster. He was on the roster. Dude, I don't know how tall he is. I don't know anything about him. I just knew that one time they signed J.R. Smith's brother.

Hey, let me ask you this, too, while we're going around the NBA, right? I had this theory about heat culture. And this is not just me being as a Nick fan. But I think heat culture is a myth. And I'll explain why. Like, yes, it's great to have the determination and all the stuff. And you've had consistency with Spow being in the organization, of course, Pat Riley. But if you think about from the exception of Pat Riley's time with the heat, he's always had a star player. Think about once he got to Miami, what did he do?

He went out and got Alonzo morning. So my point in you've had De Wade, you've had Hardaway. You've had Jimmy Butler playing the level like he did. Of course, LeBron and Bosch. Like what the heat do and bringing in superstars and developing superstars is no different than most NBA teams. They just bake it wrapping with this cute term called heat culture. But it's always been, but it's always been based around superstars or stars that have played at superstar levels. You are correct.

I think what is more accurate, I do think the heat culture exists, but I don't think that heat culture is so good that you can do it without a great player. Now, I think part of why the idea got so much bigger in the last few years is the NBA's, continual underrating of Jimmy Butler. Look, Jimmy Butler has been the best player on two teams that went to the NBA finals. Go pull up the list of guys who have been the best player on two teams that went to the NBA finals. And ask how many of them went to the NBA finals with some of the rosters that those two heat teams had in order to get there. Right.

And so, yes, if you are out here playing Gabe Vincent and Max Drew, and all these guys considerable minutes, I do think there's something to be said about your culture and what it does, right? But at the same time, they got there because Jimmy was that dude. And I don't want to sell Bam, sure. But it's because Jimmy was that dude.

It's because Dwayne was that dude. It's because LeBron was that dude, right? Yes, that is, I think that after LeBron left, they really had to pump themselves up and make themselves feel better because it never dawned on them that he would ever leave. We were there for that.

Right, right. Right. But it just, like you said, but it's always been built around around superstars. And now you see it, you see what happened. And I get, there's still the shock of the Jimmy Butler trade. So you probably give him a pass. But right now, like, Hero is a third option, second option at best. Bam has the skill. But for me, with Bam, like, he's way too passive. Like, there's no reason why you shouldn't have 20 shots a game, Bam, and get into the free throw line at least 10. times a game. Like that's there, but it's way too passive. So with Miami, it's going to have to be

built around a superstar, which gets me to my next question for you, Bo. Yonis. Janus in his future, Milwaukee, man. Well, I will say this. If heat culture is not a myth, then the perfect fit for it is Yonis. Right? Absolute perfect fit. Here's my thing for Yonis about Milwaukee. You can leave. They're in bad shape. They're in bad shape. I just don't really know where you're going to go that's going to be in good shape for long. Like the nature of the league now is that nobody can stay in good shape for long. And again, this isn't like the NFL where players are disposable and you go get some young guys that might be as good. It's not how this goes, right?

Like, they got a structural flaw there. And so I don't think he's coming back to Milwaukee. Like, I can't imagine how miserable it would be to play for Milwaukee next year. And poor Dane, you got yourself up there and didn't even, couldn't even get to the reel on it. You know what I'm saying? And Dame got two years, 112, million left on this contract too. Yeah, but as I end, the thing about that 112, as I tell people,

if I told you I was giving you $112 million to kick you into nuts. If I kicked you into nuts, it wouldn't feel like $112 million. You know, like, good for you. You got that bread, but, dog, imagine being a basketball player and you got to live in Milwaukee, but not play. Uh-huh. In the winter. In the winter.

You don't even get to play. You don't even get your outlet, right? Like, what we're out here doing, man? Yeah. So my thing with Janice, because I don't think, like, he's not the type. I don't think he's going to ask for trade. But I think through his reps, he might let it be known that, hey, maybe it's the best option for us for you guys to maximize on my value now so that you can get a haul so you can start this rebuild. But he just doesn't seem like the type to ask for trade in that in that regard.

Now, but he'd be pressing them though. Can't say that. Well, you got to. But that's the thing. It's like he's pressing him because he's telling him like, hey, I want to be here. I'm going to show loyal to you guys because you guys took a chance on me in 2013 drafting this unknown kid from Greece. Like I'm trying to be as loyal as I can, but I can't be out here wasting years either. And what we saw and what we saw last night and we saw in the series with Janus against the Pacers was Janus and a bunch of four dudes.

And for him, and he's talked about his desire to want a second championship, how many more years can he go on like this? You think about, people make the comparison all the time with KG. Did he stay in Minnesota too long trying to be loyal? Dame in Portland being loyal, not asking for a trade until it came to that point. You wonder if we're getting to that level with Janus and Milwaukee. Also, boy, he stayed too long. We're going to keep asking these questions about how it is. He stayed going home early.

Like, we are nicer. Look, I had no problem with his, this is not a failure speech last year because I get it. You know, he's like, do you have any clue? what I had to do to get here, I don't think you do, right? Like, I think that goes. But at the same time, it's been losing the eight seeds. That's what we were saying. We just talking about Jim.

Two-O leads. We talked about Jimmy and the heat team. When he was an eight-seed, they beat the first number one seeded Milwaukee Bucks. And beat him in like five or six. Yeah, it wasn't even close. Yeah. Yeah, like, it wasn't, like, you know, so he's in a tough bag. But at the same time, that ain't what the people want to talk about when it comes to

to Yonis right now. First of all, I didn't know, like, I don't know, um, Gilly the kid's senior, um, was Tyrese Halliburton's dad. Like, I, I, I look up and Tyrese Halliburton's dad got all up in Yonis face after the game with a towel in his face. And I found out if you saw the full video finally where it shows the game ends and his pops comes out and stands directly in front of Yonis, then stops and puts the towel in his face.

And Yonis just stand there and look at him. And you got to understand, Tyrese Halliburton did not get the hype gene from his daddy. And he just standing there in Yonna's face and talking to him. And I just wanted to see Yon to slap him in the face, man. Just one time. It's just, I don't think it would take twice. And you knew it was something too because you look at the video. He said something.

Pat Conerton turned around a look to them, gave him a look like, what? Yes. Yo, T.J. McConnell had. to get in there and be like, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, we got to get them out of here, man. Oh, oh, we got to stop this. And then whatever happened with Matherin, a Matherin where, I don't know what it got on in that game, Janus wanted to fight somebody and just knew that this was not something that was allowed. And I know all week has been talking about 100 men versus guerrilla.

I'm just imagining you sort of like the video of Janus's huge hands around the back of Matherin's head. And I can imagine going against that damn gorilla and having his putting balls on my head. He had his hand around. Oh, boy. And he didn't do it to anybody else. Everybody else, he just dapped him up. Like, yes, good game.

Yes, good game. Get in here. He brought him in close. And whatever it was, Matherer wasn't trying to hear it. Right. And then Matthew pushed him back. And then it almost turned into a thing. I hope he got to go, like, work out in the heavy bag or something.

Right. Right. But I think all of this stuff is in totality with Janice, though. And he handled it great and talking about disrespect and being respectful after game, being a respectful win. Although, like, some of that, hey, like, if I'm winning, I'm winning, you can't tell me how to win. But I think he was absolutely right that there was no place for Halliburton's daddy to be coming on the court talking him like that.

And Yonis said he didn't realize it was his father. Father or not, fan or not, whatever, there was no business for that. And, oh, boy, is lucky that Yonis is a respect. for a young man because he's lucky because had he ran up on Bobby Porter like that there would have been a problem there would have been a problem

Bobby Porter's made Andrew Luck go back to the old country you know what I'm saying? Like he ain't really been back since that happened he didn't look at Michael Corleone that's right he sent him back to Colio

that's right he sent him back Laylo for a little while but what you and you use the exact proper phrasing for what it was. He ran up on him, though probably more accurately walked up on him. But at the same time,

anytime you blank up on somebody, too far. And here's the thing too. If there's any organization in the NBA that knows about player and fan interaction on the court, it would be the Indiana Pacers. If there's

any organization that would know if there's any footage that needs to be seen about those two fans in Detroit running up on Jermaine O'Neill and he hit him with the M. Bison, shout out to Bermony Jones. Hit him with that M. Bison. It would be the Indiana Pacers. The slide head bustle.

And you see Yonis' long-ass arms. Would anybody have been surprised if he would have hit him with that Dalzim and pop Haliburton's daddy like that? Nobody would have been a surprise and it would have been justified. Yo, even Tyrese after the game was like, yo, I don't, I don't agree with what my, what my pops did. I can't imagine having to discipline my daddy in front of people.

Halliburton, what he sounded like in that press conference was like Red and Friday. He was like, man, I'm... Pop's my pop. Pop, strip. It's like bullfired. You think about how bad it's got to be for you to have to say in front of people, yo, my pops was out of line and I apologize

for him. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Like, you put him in a bad light. And this sucks, too. Like, Halliburton, a tremendous comeback. You hit the game winner over Janus. Like, that's... Like one of those where, like, hey, we're putting you, that's one of those beige brother moments. Like, you having a moment there, but right now we're just talking about your daddy.

Like, that's the unfortunate part for him. Because I give him credit because I know Halliburton talks a lot of stuff and whatever and tries to be the new Reginal. I get all that. But I do have to give him credit. He showed a lot of maturity in that post-game press. Yeah, I'm going to tell you this, though. I tell you after the show.

But there's a reason there's no way in the world that I would allow Tyrese Halliburton's daddy to talk to me like he did in that game. There's a very good reason. No, partner, you, you, not you. Not you, not you. Not you, not you, not you. Maybe somebody else. Not you, not you, not tonight.

Not tonight. What would it can't say? We know you, doggy. Yeah, we know you, we know you. I got dirt on you, doggy. I get back to you in a minute. Right? It ain't.

Nah, dog. It ain't about to be, I can't, I can't stand for this from you. I'm confused. I did have a question for you on a non, on a non sports term. Yes. And I don't mean to throw you off on this. You're good. Your thoughts on your feeling, or what did it mean to you to have Outcast being inducted

to the Rock Rowell of Fame? Oh, good thing to wrap up on, right? When OutKaz won an album of the year, oh, you got you, it's in the mail? Yes, sir. Oh, man, I got mine's in the mailbox. I got to go pick it up. I ain't going to lie, them alerts.

That Spotify alert got you. Of course. Spotify, like, yo, we got a new OutKaz shirt. I'm like, no, we have a new Outk's shirt. I get every single thing. They don't thought that. Maybe I'm talking to me concert, taking stuff about other people.

I don't know so much about that. They be sitting out in that out, I can't shirt links. It was a really big deal for me when they won out in a year in 2004 because it felt like a legitimization of what rap was, right? I ain't going to lie. Now, I feel like they bigger than that damn Hall of Fame. And rather than my excitement about them getting in, they need to be glad that these dudes will show up.

Like, I've officially come to that place about this. I tell you this, though, they're going to not people to put in. Like when you start looking at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame truly and what it is and you get in 25 years after you put out your first record or whatever, they're running out of people to put in. You know what I mean? Like who start like how many people started their careers in the 21st century, which again, you're now eligible. Like we can start thinking about you now. Right. In that regard.

Who started their career in the 21st century that you're really like, oh, okay, we'll put them in. One of them done gone Nazi. One of them got his ass towed down all to 2024. Right. Now the other one, he'll get in. White people love him. But for all of us, they're going to have to start putting these rappers in because they're going to be running out of people to put in.

And it's going to be those one-hit wonder rappers too. Like that's the thing too. It's going to be we're going to start into the territory where you don't have the rappers who had the same power. Not saying you need it because I know rap. I know rap is a young man's game. So I'm not saying you got to have a 10 year or plus career. I'm not even saying that.

But you got to give me more than just one or two hits that sounded just like everybody else. You know? Well, that's actually kind of funny about this year's induction. For example, they put Chubby Checker in and Chubby Checker is an all-time one-hit wonder. Right. Right. Now, granted, that one hit changed everything, right? But he's an all-time one-hit wonder.

My issue with the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame or Rap, Scarface will never get in, for example. just about any non-black genre or white genre more specifically because I imagine our Latino brothers can say the same things. An act as influential as Scarface, even if it wasn't just straight-a-haired rock, they're going to find a way to put them in. Right. It's the same way they got to Madonna so much earlier than they got to Janet Jackson. Like in terms of like magnitude as musical stars, they're kind of what and what. Like you can say Madonna was bigger. That's fine, but Janet Jackson is on a, they're on the same plane. Right. And it wasn't the same. terms of them getting in. It's those types of people. So it shouldn't have to be LL Cool

Jay or Tupac in order for you to get in, right? KRS 1. If Outkast and these other people are in your Hall of Fame, KRS 1 should be in your Hall of Fame. It can't just be Tribe Call Quest who white rock critics loved, right? And so, but I think they're going to be running out of people to put in. And Rock is a genre has died off a long time ago. And I will say this too, getting back to Outcast and you've made this point. And maybe we don't even have to say it doesn't need to be said, but

y'all need to stop out here disrespecting Big Boy. Like we got to stop this. Because I know they had the AI generated stuff and they were doing Mount Rushmore's or whatever. And I've seen something that just had Dre and not Big Boy. Like, what are we doing?

Like, there's no doubt in my mind. Like, I get it. I'm a Dre fan. I'm a fan of both. But Big Boy, one of the best rappers out here ever. Folks need to like stop disrespecting him like he's the other dude. Like this was no pippin.

This was like we both Batman in this regard. Like people need to stop. What I don't think that people like fully recognize and where I think the credit doesn't come is that a major difference between Andre and Big Boy, his big boy has his own classics. Right? That Purple Rib and All Star album, which is not straight solo Big Boy, but is a Big Boy record.

the Sir Luce's Leadfoot Joint and the Business Lives in Dangerous Rumors are bangers. Y'all begged Andre for a solo album and all he did was just blowing in that goddamn flute and y'all stayed in here lying about that shit too. Y'all stayed trying to act

like, oh man, I liked it. It was really good. You lying, motherfucker. No, you didn't. If I told you, anybody else was out here blowing in that goddamn flute, there ain't a way in the world you'd be sitting in my face. talking about how dope that was. That ain't what y'all wanted. That ain't what it is.

Big boy got classic singles. That damn kryptonite still go. Still go. Still go. To this day. To this day. Still go. I contend.

General Packing. All of that. Yeah. Right. Speaker box greater than love below. It's, and I've said it before and I'll say it again. There was a time period that came around when saying you liked Andre, made you seem smart and cool.

Right. And that's his back for y'all. it transcended rap, right? As if rap could ever be transcended. It transcended rap. And y'all bought all of that hook, line, and sinker. And look, I do think the ceiling of Andre 3000 is higher than the ceiling of anybody else. Like, I do think that when he gets there, nobody can get to the place.

But he also, in the last 20 years, has been like, but I'm only going to let you hear me rap if I go there. right we got a selection bias situation but no they they go at some point they're going to give big boy his respect but you know big boy way up on the list of the rappers where let's just talk about music baby we start getting into a disagreeable zone when it goes somewhere else don't don't need that it's like I go back and listen to old goody mob but I'm like oh we don't agree on that much Now that I have a better year for this. It made me think, too, back some, what, 10 years ago, whatever it was,

and somebody had asked you to make a comparison between a certain rap duo and Outcast, and one of the members of said rap duo was none too pleased with your... Oh, I don't want to do that. Sorry, so people who don't know this, somebody got on Twitter once and asked on what planet do people think that Big Boy is better

than Tileu Kuali. And I said that planet was Earth. And I was like, my bad, I thought there was a consensus on this matter. I didn't think that this was up for debate. It is definitely up for debate in the Kuali Household. He was so mad at me.

It was so many tweets. It was so many tweets. And this was back when I used to be in the zone, right? So it was so many tweets, and I'm sending him links to Carl Thomas emotional. I got ninth one to DM and me and Kuali. Will you two in words stop doing this in front of everybody? Like the whole night. You know what I'm saying?

And I'm still just like, nah, and he was bad. He was hot. I'm like, brother, I didn't say that like, I don't even want to throw nobody else's day about there, but I ain't say you was worse. Like, okay, I ain't say that like the homie Turk was better than you. I ain't say Silk the Shocker was better than you. But he took it at that though. He took it that.

He took it hot. By the way. Go ahead. No, they let, did you know that Silk the Shaka now claims he was off, offbeat on purpose? I did see that. And I'm like, Ninja, please. Whatever you say, Pida. Whatever you say, Pada.

Uh-uh. You ain't can convince me at that one. It was so easy for you to spit a clean 16 bars or Myers moving on. You couldn't even do that. Come on. My fault was a layup.

You had mystical at the height of his powers. Amos fault was a layer. You need to quit like, go to him and like, roll with me. You know what, though? I'm glad he couldn't get it right on Best to Be Rebest of Me, because that necessitated what was at the time, maybe the best JZ verses that we had had, the best to be remixed, Jayce.

And that sucks for Jada kiss. Because like Jada kiss's verse and like his version wasn't bad. Like that was cool. But then you got, Jay Z was like, hold on. I'm JZ at this level with the best of me remixed. Yes.

Yolly, jigger man be bawling. And you got the Maya and the Jordan dress too. That did happen. Hey, look here. I'm a little tired of LeBron still out here playing basketball at 40. Right? it's time for you to go. Keep on, keep on, keep it all, Maya.

Keep on, keep on, keep on. Somebody need to go ahead and sign her to it. Max extension. Keep this rolling. Keep this rolling. She's still hitting the glass. She's still making hustle plays. She's doing all the little things, man.

She's still doing that. She's a consummate pro, team player, you know? Most people age out of that, right? They move out to the perimeter. No, no, no. She's doing it. Mm-mm. she's still got it going.

But hey, man, that is Shannon Penn, so I don't mess it up. Tell the people where they can find you on ESPN Radio. Yeah, Freddie and Harry, ESPN Radio, 3 to 7 p.m. Eastern, Monday through Friday. ESPN app, ESPN Radio, my Twitters, which I don't use as much, but I'm still there. Shannon underscore Penn, that's where you can find me.

And this is lucky we got a little different recording schedule right now so I could get the homie in, you know what I'm saying? Like, this is, I appreciate you. brother, top to bottom. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, thanks so much for joining us here on the right time. We do this here three times a week. Ryan Brumley handling everything behind the scenes. Thank you, sir. Remember, follow the right time. Subscribe, like, rate us, review us. Give us five stars. You only give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are a hater. We'll talk to guys in a couple of days. Take it easy.