The Ringer NFL Show - 2024 TE Arguments, Kelce Dethroned, and Why Heifetz Hates ‘Oppenheimer’

Episode Date: May 21, 2024

LIVE SHOW in Los Angeles on July 30: Click below for tickets! The guys fight over the most interesting fantasy tight ends going into next season and place them into categories including the hardest player to rank, the hipster pick, post-hype sleepers, and much more (1:13). “You guys want to do some emails?” (61:18) Tickets: https://www.theelrey.com/events/detail/564772 Hardest to Rank (4:35) BONK! (18:54) The Hipster Pick (26:09) Sleepers (37:20) Post-Hype Sleepers (43:10) The Pair of Teammates You Aren’t Sure How to Rank (49:28) The Ricky Bobby “If You Ain’t First, You’re Last” Guy (54:02) Beta Testing (57:11) Check out our 2024 Ringer Fantasy Football Rankings here! Email us! [e-mail] The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Hosts: Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck Social: Kiera Givens and Jack Sanders Producer: Kai Grady Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The Ringer is hosting its first ever residency this summer in Los Angeles with a series of events at the El Ray Theater and the Ringer Fantasy Football Show will be there. Mark your calendars and join us for a live show on Tuesday, July 30th. You can get your tickets right now at the ringer.com slash events or click the link in the description to go straight to our event page. Again, the Ringer Fantasy Football Show is talking training camp, prepping you for draft season and seeing Haifist mispronounce words with a live show at El Ray Theater in Los Angeles on Tuesday, July 30th at 8 p.m. Full details are available at the ringer.com slash events. We hope to see you there. Football show, my name's Danny Hyphen. I am joined by Danny Kelly, Craig Horlebeck,

and we are doing Tideon preview, baby. It's May. We recorded this a little bit ahead of time, so if anything's happened between now and then, forgive us. We're doing our first pass of positional rankings, quarterbacks, running backs, receivers, tight ends. You guys know the fucking positions.

So we're going to go through each one. God. And sorry, I don't know. We're off the real. Impressive. Sorry. It's an aggressive day. I don't know.

But we're doing tight ends. end. So we're going to go through and just kind of like basically give our first pass. So rankings are at fantasy football.org.com. You can check those out and yell at us or whatever. And we're kind of going to just go through this. But before we get, we have some categories. We all, we all brought some answers to. But I want to just start with is tight end fixed?

D.K., I feel like we bitch about me, but all of us, bitch about tight end for, I don't know, literally the entirety of the time I've played fantasy football my entire life. I just hate tight end. I hate dealing with it. frankly, it's like the single worst part of playing fantasy football other than losing itself is if you have to stream tight end every week and you're staring at like, oh my God, like you're scrolling waivers. Like I have to deal with this shit.

Dalton Schultz is questionable. What am I going to do? It's just going to get three targets. Counterpoint. Counterpoint. Yes, it sucks having to pray that Cole Commet has a good game every week. But the two times a year, your shitty tight end scores a garbage time touchdown. Oh, I know.

You feel like a genius. Nothing better. But looking at the tight end rankings this year, I think this is the first year I've ever felt that tight ends fix. Like it's deep. I don't feel like everyone will leave their draft and you're wrong, but you feel like I'm fine at tight end. Everyone will feel that way this year.

Do you guys disagree or agree? I still don't really feel that confident in tight end. I feel like it was half of these guys that can make up reasons why they're going to suck this year. I think I kind of agree, Hyven. At least sticker value to me, I'm like, oh. You could get to tight end 12, 13, 14, and I'm still like, hey, Dallas Connard. And I'm looking at it because here's the thing. Like, so our top tight ends, we have, you know, we have Travis Kelsey, Sam Laporte,

Trey McBride, Mark Anger, George Kittles. You got those guys, you're feeling pretty good. And they got Dalton Kincaid, David and Jokalpitz, Jake Ferguson. But then you step growing down. We have Brock Bowers who's like the best thing you pretend. Brock Bowers is like 11th. He's high upside. Our 12th tight ends, T.J. Hawkinson, which is weird.

It's coming up for 20th sale. He's like the number one tight end for like a lot of, like, the last year or two. T.J. Hockinson's 12th. Pat Friermuth, cold commit. Dallas Goddard's going to be a backup tight end. You're going to have Dallas Goddard on your bench.

You're going to have Dalton Shultz on your bench. And at some point, I don't know. I just feel like this is the influx of young talent of combination of Trey McBride, Sam LaPorte, and Dalton Kincaid, mixed with Kyle Pitts at least being in a position

where maybe we believe in him again, David and Jokkew being the best he's ever been, like Evan Engram, like getting better. as he hits, like, approaches 30, than he was at like 25. All this is happening at the same time. And I just looked at the list and I'm like, there are 18 guys last year that I feel like I feel better than like the 12th

tight end three years ago. And I wonder if this is going, if this is the new norm or if this is a flash in a pan. Part of me wants to think it's a little bit of the new norm because, like you said, like tight ends usually start slow in their careers. It usually takes a couple years to get going. We had a huge, huge group of rookie tight ends take off immediately last year. And with the way that players are sustaining their careers like Travis Kelsey is, they get older. It's like the good tight ends are staying good for longer and the new tight ends are getting

good quicker. So maybe this is the beginning of a deeper position in fantasy football. And so with that said, I want to go through some categories and just again generally to set the table, tight end as it gets deeper, you know, there's less distinction at the top. So last year, Travis Kelsey is like a top 10 pick my bed. And then Mark Andrews is like top 25. We don't have anyone like that this year. We have. So I want to start here with the category of hardest player to rank. I have Travis Kelsey as the hardest player to rank. I feel that this is really weird. So Travis Kelsey is our number one tight end.

We are off that marked from everyone else. I would say everyone else is Sam Leporte as the number one tight end. DK. And we have Sam Leporta too. Like, I mean, we have Kelsey 33rd. It's Sam Leporter 35th. DK, you have Sam Leport as your number one. Craig, you have them like back to back.

So if anything, I think that this is our like slight hesitance to pass the baton. But I'm curious what you guys make a Kelsey because I'm looking. On one hand, Kelsey didn't hit 1,000 yards for the first time since 2015. I mean, that was a really long time ago. But then he turned it on in the playoffs. And like, if you just look at basically targets, yards, catch his role, not roll, but targets yard statistics. Travis Kelsey was basically Devonte Smith for the regular season.

And then he was like AJ Brown in the playoffs. And so I'm curious what you think. Craig, I want to start with you. Do you feel like Travis Kelsey has now reached late stage Rob Grancowski where it's like they're going to try to like keep them in the garage, as Bill Simmons would say, in the regular season? And then Kelsey comes out as the super weapon for the playoffs. Or is it like Kelsey missed week one with a knee injury,

wasn't fully healthy, but like his rapport with Mahomes is mostly mental anyway, and Kelsey would probably be full strength and he should be number one again for this year. And we shouldn't be worried about him. I lean more of the former. Again, I have them back to back, but I like Leporta at one,

and I give the slight edge to Leporta. Look, Kelsey's going to be 35 in October. Like, this can only go on so long. And yeah, sure, you could argue he started the year with a knee injury, but like, look, what happens when you get older? You get hurt. What happens when you get older?

It's harder for those injuries to recover. So other than like Tony Gonzalez, who had 800 yards and seven touchdowns at 35, we're kind of getting close to the uncharted territory. You know, if you look at somebody like Antonio Gates, who people look back on and be like, oh, he played until he was almost 40. When you look at Antonio Gates at 35,

he was not putting up Travis Kelsey numbers. So, like, also, you know, the chiefs brought in two really skilled wide receivers. They drafted Xavier Worthy in the first round. They brought in Marquis Brown. They have Rishie Rice. I personally feel as though this will be the year that they kind of keep Travis Kelsey on ice.

I was going to bring up Kelsey in a, a later category here, but we might as well just say it. Like, yeah, like, I'm a little worried. I mean, look at what they did with Chris Jones during the year. I guess Chris Jones just kind of did it for himself. But our buddy Nate Tice pointed out that Chris Jones basically just kind of hangs out for the first three quarters of every game. And then he just like turns on in the fourth quarter.

What it really matters? Chris just doesn't stop the run. Yeah. Which I kind of get. Like, you know, it's worked for him. And I think that they're quitting. Yeah. Well, it's just like saving it for the right moment.

Right. You know. Dude, challenges. That's better PR. Yeah. But I can see that what happening with Kelsey. You know, like you guys said, they have more receivers this year. This was like a really weird, weird season, outlier season for the cheese who had basically

no one for over half the season until where she Rice started to come on strong in the second half. But, and Kelsey still was averaging like 11 points a game. It wasn't super impressive. So it wasn't super helpful, you know, for the people that drafted him very, very early last year. And so, you know, at the risk of doing what we do every year. I'm kind of off Kelsey this year. He is my tight end too,

but I feel like I might start to push him down as the off season goes along. Also, let's be honest. Do you think he's going to be as focused in the off season? Absolutely not. Considering his current relationship situation. He's got a day-in a pop star.

He's got a smash hit podcast. As much as he can. Yeah, he's like a media personality. What does that have to do? Like, yes, but also, what was he doing the off season anyway? He's playing in the match with my home. He's like, he can work out and chip. He's a five-star attack.

in the Ritz Carlton and every season she goes there. I don't think it's the same. I don't think it's the same. I think him traveling all over the globe with Taylor Swift the entire summer and then showing up at training camp is not the same thing as him just being like a guy in Kansas City working out in the offseason. Can I be a total fucking sap for a second? I would agree with you if Mahomes had not said while the confetti was raining down and Mahomes grabs Chris Jones, the defensive tackle that doesn't defend the first two quarters.

And it's like, you have to come back. We have to do a three Pete. like the confetti's falling. And I think that Kelsey knows and Mahomes and they all know that if they get a three-peat, they're fucking immortal. And they really are because a back-to-back happens. Back-to-back has happened.

When was the last three-peat football? I don't think either of us are saying that he's going to he's going to loaf it for the entire season. But it's that they're saving it for the end now. Yeah, I can see that. Dude, the Chiefs weren't even good in the regular season last year. I still can't believe they won back-to-back. I think the chiefs, if you gave them true serum, they'd be like, yeah, we were like setting up the next decade.

I can't believe we won the back. I think they're actually stunned that they did it. Anyway, so Kelsey is tough. Yeah, we'll see where we end up with him. It's weird because at the same time, it's, I don't know. It reminds me there's also, there was like Larry Fitzgerald around 33, 34, had like been declining. And they just had one year with like 1,200 yards and like eight touchdowns again. And I keep wondering if that's, if Kelsey is one more in him, but.

I have a rule that if you sell a podcast for. eight figures in the off season, I don't want you in my fancy football team. Yeah, that's a good one. All right, so next up, DK, who's the hardest player to rank for you at the time in this year? I think David and Joku is a tough one. Because part of me wants to get very excited about what he did last season. I mean, there was times, especially late in the year,

where every time I touch the football, I'm like, oh, my God. He's going to truck three guys, jump over another one, stiff arm of a fifth, and then run into the end. So I was like, he's one of the most exciting players in the NFL when he gets the ball on his hands. They were feeding him. like incredible amounts of targets down the stretch. And then I remember that Deshaun Watson is the starter again for the Browns. And if you look at the games that Deshaun Watson was the starter for most of the game or all of the game,

and there was five games where he was the starter for basically the entire game. And Joku in those games averaged 6.3 half-p-r points. He had a 16% target rate. So he averaged about four catches and 35 yards game. That is not good. That's not going to get it done. You know why he was great? you know what, Injoku was really, really good down the stretch

because any other quarterback except Deshaun Watson was playing. In particular, Joe Flacco, who just, like, feed him incredible amounts of targets all throughout the game. I was like basically his outlet underneath. And so I'm worried that Joku is just going to fade back into obscurity when Deshaun Watson's out there fumbling about and not doing anything. Yeah, stuff. We also probably didn't talk enough that, like, David and Joku, like, almost died last year,

like with putting lighter fluid on his fire pit and then came back and like Loki had like the best stretch of his career after that happened. That was kind of fucking crazy. A good origin story. Yeah, he had four touchdowns and like 250 yards in a three week stretch after that happened. What was with that?

You're very, you're so right about this, D.K. He was so electric and it finally happened. I feel like people have been waiting for David and Joe could take off. He was like in that Irv Smith camp where it was like, it's coming, just keep waiting.

And it actually happened. I mean, he's not young. He's 20. David and Joke was drafted before Baker Bayf Baker Mayfield. A year before Baker Mayfield. Baker's been on five teams, and David and Joke is still in the Browns. Yeah. But I agree with you.

I don't know if his breakout will then, you know, cause the play calling to start featuring him more. Right. And, you know, that's the hope. But I agree with you. This is very tough. We haven't been as a 10-on-7. I think he finished as a 10-8 last year. I mean, didn't he have like a 40-point game last year?

I mean, the last, like, five weeks of the season, he was going nuts. Yeah, he had, there was a three-week stretch where he scored like 22 plus points per game in all three. He was like absolutely just, you know, the number, essentially like the number one target in their offense for a stretch there. But that was again, with Joe Flacco, who was hucking it up like 50 times a game. You know, he's just feeding in Joku. In I think the perfect world, this is a Brown's offense that's going to be super run heavy, super balanced. And again, like, Deshaun Watson since coming back to the NFL has done absolutely nothing except suck. He has not looked good at all.

He's probably going to be a guy to avoid, honestly. Even though I think he's a really talented player, probably just can be like, okay, I'll let someone else pick him. The Browns are just like a kind of a crazy team entering this season because Cleveland played well and made the playoffs despite being maybe the most injured team in the NFL. Deshaun Watson's shoulder was messed up. They lost both tackles.

I think both backup tackles too. They were third-string tackles each side. If they make the playoffs with that team and they missed the playoffs with their start is healthy, it's kind of like one of the most fucked up teams I can ever remember. Like, it's what a bizarre thing if the flacco Brown's making further than Watson with the like if Deshawn's bad, the team, I don't know what they do. The irony, though, I mean, obviously, there's several different ironies with this whole situation. But like, this is one of the best rosters in the NFL, except for quarterback. Yeah, it's, which is like crazy. Insane.

Anyways, yeah. Craig, who was your hardest tied into rank doing these rankings? It has to be Kyle Pitts. Yeah. It has to be cow. We just don't want to talk about them, Craig. I know. God. You You know, once again, I went back, I did the whole thing. I was looking at Kyle Pitts' last three years. She said three years in the NFL. Year one, one touchdown. Year two, two touchdowns. Year three, three touchdowns.

So. 2024. Looking pretty good for 2024. He was the titan 16 last year, which I guess was higher than I maybe thought. But I think looking back now, I've read that Pitts was perhaps a little bit more injured than people let on. He, like, couldn't turn left. He could, like, only run routes to the right because of the way's, like, knee-fing. Not an Ambie Turner.

So, like, if I had to talk myself into this, I'd be like, all right, obviously, this is a massive quarterback upgrade. You know, he was, Kyle Pitts is a guy that goes deep a lot. He had the highest A-Dat in the league at the position by, like, two yards. Like, he is down the field open a lot. And Ritter and Heineke were just, like, sailing balls over his head for the entire year. Now they have obviously Kurt Cousins, who's like a great quarterback, a solid quarterback at the very least. So, look, it's all there, and I get it. The real question is, is like, who do you want to be?

this has nothing to do with stats or quarterback player scheme it's who do you want to be this year do you want to go through it are you willing to what's the shareline uh do you believe in life after love are you willing to do it or do you just want to like draft dalton cancade and have like a perfectly nice life yeah you know it's it's you know what it's like do you want to let's go home and be a family man yeah yeah it's or did you listen to my demo Did you get it? Did you get it? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You know, I was going to do that. I was going to draft Kyle Pitts. Did you look at the argument for Kyle Pitts this year? Did you read it? I just carried on living my life. It's a philosophical question more than it is anything else. Also, I have this giant tattoo on my back. Right, right.

Do not trust Kyle Pitts? He's the type of player who, if he finally does hit and does well for you, it's like, all right, thank God, finally. There is no bigger satisfaction in fantasy football this year, then the guy who drafted Kyle Pitts and he's great. It's the number one satisfying, most satisfying pick. It's like better than winning. But also if he's not elite, it's better than winning.

You're going to be like, I fucking hate myself. Why did I do this again? To your point, look, the argument against Kyle Pitts is easy. I hate him and he brings me no joy. And actually it's like the biggest drain on my, it's honestly like the biggest, he's one of the worst relationships I have in my life, is my relationship with Kyle Pitts. Well, the argument for Kyle Pitts is really simple.

You guys know how the 49ers drafted Ricky Parasol, the receiver in Florida in the first round went to San Francisco? I heard about that, yeah. Kyle Pitts is fucking younger than Ricky Parasol. Yeah. That's the argument. Oh, my God. When Kyle Pitts was a rookie at, Kyle Pitts was a rookie

getting a thousand yards in the NFL. Ricky Parasol wasn't even at fucking Florida yet. Ricky Parasel was still at Arizona State. Catching passes from Jane Daniels or something. The idea, like the arguments, the siren song is so clear, which is giving up on this Kyle

on Kyle Pitts, who still is younger than first round NFL rookies, is insane. I don't think it was an accident, high fits that you said that you have the giant do not draft Kyle Pitts tattoo on your back. Can't see it. You put it, you subconsciously put it there for a reason. It's like Ben Affleck's giant Phoenix tattoo on his back. At the end of the day, he gets up, he looks at himself in the mirror. He's not looking at that thing.

He barely knows there's there. So I do think there's something at play there with Kyle Pitts. man, I don't know what I want to do. I really don't. It's the worst relationship I have in my life. Emails during your fantasy football channel. That's like a very funny way of putting it. Yeah, emails if you have like a relationship cop for college.

Like I just want off this roller coaster. You know what? Sometimes the like he's, look how young he is thing, you kind of just carry that on when a player's not good. Like the NBA did it with Andrew Wiggins, his whole career. He was, they called him Maple Jordan or Air Canada. he was like the guy coming out of high school. Number one overall picket was like, this is the next Jordan. And he just kind of never was that.

You won an NBA title because he joined your team. I wouldn't say it's because he joined the team. He was your second best player for the Warriors run. He was the second best player on the team when you won the title two years ago. Yeah, I mean, yeah, he was like, I love Wiggins. He's an incredibly important factor. But like, I don't think that justifies him going number one overall in being called Air Canada. No, but the Warriors literally bought low on Andrew Wiggins and then won a title.

That's literally what the Warriors did. I think my point, well, again, Wiggins was like 28 when that happened. But my point is that Wiggins came into the league at 18. And sure, I guess 10 years later it worked out. But my point is that like everyone just talks themselves into like, oh, he's still 23. Oh, he was bad again. Well, now he's only 24. I think to your point, youth is also bad.

That's kind of like, like being young and rich and famous could also be really bad. Also, like, the reason why Wiggins work is because Wiggins didn't have to be the guy. So it's like, did it work or did it not? Like, he's comfortable being like the fourth option on a team, and that's why he was able to thrive because there was no pressure on him. But, by the way, Trey Lance, 23 years old, Jane Daniels, I think 24 or will be 24 soon. Who are you taking in a draft?

Trey Lance, what do you mean? Well, Trey Lance is younger than Michael Pennix and Bodex. Yeah. My point is being young doesn't really matter if you're not going to be like. We're out on the youth. Yeah. Getting targets or scoring fantasy points. All right.

So next there, we have the, uh, the six. Speaking of Jonah Hill and forgetting Sarah Marshall, we have the Six to Midnight Award, a.k. Award, a.k.a. Someone you are way too horny for award this year. Inside of you. Inside of you. What a good song. You're like upside down when he's singing it. Can you imagine somebody singing about singing that song to your ex-girlfriend? That's brutal.

The guy for me this year is Dalton Kincaid, the Bill's Night End. Dalton Kincade's going 20 spots later than Sam Lipporta in basketball. He's 50 spots lower than Sam Lipporta on like fantasy pros and consensus. I kind of think Dalton Kincade will just like straight up have a better season than Sam Loporta. Like the second half, I do. Like the second half of last season. So like after week nine, Dalton Kincade and Sam Leporta had same number of catches.

They had basically the same amount of yards. And the only difference was Dalton Kincade had one touchdown. And Sam Lipporta had six touchdowns. But touchdowns are really volatile. They're like four or five percent of all plays. And then you look at the situations, Detroit's is more or less unchanged. Buffalo, Stefan Diggs is gone.

And then, yes, they got Kean Coleman, the great yellow jacket purchaser and like just the most likable receiver I've ever seen. But like, like, I don't think he's going to be that good as a rookie. I don't think he's the number one receiver. I think the bill's number one receiver is not Keon Coleman. It's not Khalil Shakir. I think the bill's number one receiver is Dalton Kincaid.

And so he's going 20 spots or more later than Sam LaPorter. I'm like, why, I kind of just think he'll just be like a top two tight end, top three tight end. I don't even think this is like a hot take. I kind of like this. I remember last year, Leporta kind of faded a little bit towards the end of the season. And he had a knee injury, but it wasn't enough for the seasons. He was like still playing, came back for the playoffs. But he had just delayed.

And I think also one effect that we saw last year was, I want to say Gibbs was a little bit more involved in the passing game. I'm just looking at his targets, you know, from like week eight. on he's like five, six, eight, two, four, seven. Like he's getting a lot more targets in the passing game. Some of those short intermediate area targets that Leporto was getting earlier on in the season started going to Gibbs. There's just more mouths to feed in this offense. I think there's much better talent in this offense in terms of Amon Ra, Gibbs.

Montgomery's still there getting his targets. Jameson Williams is potentially a sending player who could get much more targeted in this next season. Donovan People's Jones, the greatest one of the greatest receivers in the NFL. DPJ. I mean, that's not to say that I don't love Leporta because I do love Leporta, but I think the target competition is probably going to be much stronger in Detroit. It's, this is a perfect six to midnight bonk player hyphids because there's kind of like on

his face, there's nothing wrong. Like you're like, why wouldn't this just be a rocket ship? It's like, it's kind of like, why is he single? It's like, why is he single? It's like, why did he score like two touchdowns last year? Like that's my fear is like, what if he has like a thousand yards, it just scores like one touchdown in the second half again? because like Dawson Knox does get more looks from Josh Allen

and so I will admit that my fear is that I'm counting on so much of the bill's offensive designs just kind of sucking last year and they like switch coordinators and they don't plan and maybe I'm banking too much but I kind of think they might build the offense around Dalton Kincaid I also think maybe he's just not Josh Allen's red zone guy which would be bad

but I also kind of think Dalton Kincaid is the number one tight end in 2025. I love it. I like it. Yeah, who's your bonk guy Craig? D.K. and I have the same guy. We both love Trey McBride. I wrote one thing and one thing only. This guy might be God.

This is so interesting. I love Tray McRae. Dude, have you ever watched him? He's like if Josh Allen was a tight end. Yeah. He's like a rumble. Yeah, he just, he's like the rock'em sock him robot. It's literally like the second he catches a pass,

he kind of just looks like Josh Allen like 10 yards down the field. And he's just chaotic, no fear. Like, like super shifty for his size. And if you go back to the last year, so it's like, obviously the start of the year, there was no Kyler Murray on the Cardinals. He was out. Zach Ertz was the starting tight end. Zach Ertz went halfway through the year. Kyler came back. And then Trey McBride went nuts. He was the tied in five from weeks 10 to 17, put up some ludicrous stats. 14 target games, over 100 yards, almost three, four straight weeks. I mean, literally in a 10 week span, he had 95 yards in a touchdown, 131 yards, 89 in a touchdown, and 102. That was in a 10 week span. Like every other game, He was doing that with Kyler Murray. So, yeah, I mean, you added Marvin Harrison, Jr., which doesn't bother me at all. There's still not a ton of mouths defeat at all in Arizona.

How does that not bother you? Because, like, I don't think a tight end needs to be the only good player in a team for them to be able to play well. I mean, look at Sam LaPorteur last year. I mean, look at George Kittle in San Francisco. I mean, Tyreek and Kelsey for a long time, yeah. Yeah, I don't think it matters at all. That's like the exception that proves. I mean, it's literally just rookie Marvin Harrison Jr. and nobody else.

And then Tremick, right? And now you have a full healthy Kyler. Like I am all in on Trey McBride this year. Also, his Wikipedia picture is him playing basketball. Wait, what? Don't know why. I love that. What?

At Colorado State. Wait, excuse me. It's like a weird, like, what the fuck? It's because Wikipedia is not allowed to use. Wait, let's, we can put this up on Spotify. Kai, yeah, wait, we have, because this is public, we can put this up on the Spotify. You click on Spotify right now. We put this picture.

How is this is Wikipedia? a picture. Like no one took a photo of him at a game? Yes, not. Yeah. Holy cow. Do you think we could launch a campaign and find a better picture of him and get it uploaded? Do you think we can get this changed? I bet we could. If you have

a good photo of Shrey McBride that meets the Wikipedia standards for photos, hit us up. Also, I'm incorrect. This is not a picture of him playing basketball in college. It is basketball in high school. Dude, do you look like that in high school? The Ford is Mason Mustangs. Sorry, Fort Morgan, He looks like he's a 26-year-old actor in euphoria,

but you're telling me he's 18 years old that photo. But yeah, no, I... Anyway. How are you going to talk me out of Trey McBride this year? I'm just thinking of Trey McBride all the time. Yeah. I will not for three seconds defend that like Dalton Kincade is more fun to watch than Trey McBride.

Like, it's not even remotely close with the balls in their hands. I just think like it, to me, Dalton Kucade is the number one receiver for the bills. And Trey McBride is the number two receiver for Arizona. And you're draft, but you have to pay the price of last year when Tray McBride was the number one receiver for Arizona and it was that simple. It's because they had Ertz

there and Ertz is really receiver. It's like they had this like Marquis Brown was injured for parts and I think that Tray McBride was the number one and then this year he will be the number two. He will still be good but I don't think you're getting... Like is he going to be better than what you're paying for? I feel like no. But he might be worse. Yeah. That's fair. But I get it. He's super... Like you won't... I'll give you this.

We need to come up with the term for this. There are people you won't regret drafting because they're fun to have. And we need a word for that that people who reward you watching them on Sundays and being like, wow, that guy's on my team. And I'll give you that McBride's more fun than it for that.

I just think like he's going to be the number one or number two on what should be like a good fun offense this year with very little competition elsewhere. Well, this goes red new. I'm kind of a hater this year. The hipster award, which is the player team or thing that everyone loves that you don't.

Like this is the end when Craig's calling him on Craig Robinson, not you. Craig is calling Jay and he's like, I bet you hate things people love. I bet you hate Forrest Gump. He's like, yeah, it's a sack of shit movie. Like, these are just things you hate. I'm out on Sam LaPorter, tied in for the lines.

Everyone loves him. Everyone's got him's the number one guy. It's going to age Farley. And I'm Jay. I'm Jay. He's just going to age for him. But the problems, I love Sam LaPorteur. I like him.

I just kind of am amazed that everyone's like, yep, I'll take him with the top 30 pick. And I'm like, I guess it's as simple as this. I get awesome rookie year for Sam LaPorte. Most touchdowns for rookie tight ends. It's like we're gronk in 2010. Sam Laporte almost 900 receiving yards. He's a rookie. He should get better.

My fear is just, it's super boring, but he had 10 touchdowns. And I'm like, I feel like he could very, very, very easily get better in real life. And if he has like six, you're going to regret taking him. And it's like that simple to me. Like, I just, what are the odds? You're going to pay top third?

I'm like, I don't know, just like, we're talking about the deepest year for tight ends ever. It's not that I just like Sam Lapporteur at all. I love Sam Lapporteur. I'm like, the deepest year for tight ends on my lifetime. I'm going to take Sam Lapporteur with the 29th pick. That seems crazy to me. Counterpoint.

My hipster take is just, I'm going to counterpoint hypoet tier. Last year, the number one tight end, Travis Kelsey was going top 10. Like sometimes like fifth, right? Now you can get the number one tight end at 30, 35. But that's because Kelsey was, we thought Kelsey had a gap between him and the other tight ends that was absurd. And that didn't materialize. Yeah, but like, I guess what I'm saying is, is like, look, he was a rookie last year. To me, the 10 touchdown thing, I'm done.

looking at touchdowns as something. I know that the nerds, the analyst, the regression police are going to come out after me and be like, that's not correct. You can't depend on touchdowns that happen year over year. Remember, we joked about Austin Echler had 20 touchdowns. Is he going to do that again? And then he had like 17.

To me, it's like good players are good at scoring touchdowns. Sam LaPorteur was a rookie. He was a rookie last year. And he had 900 yards and 10 touchdowns. If you look at the lions heading into this year, they check every one of my anti-anxiety boxes for 20-20. And it's fun. It's a fun team.

There's no turnover. There's no new target competition. They actually lost Josh Reynolds, if you want to count that. Same stable situation. Grado line, same quarterback, same OC, same head coach. This offense is a fucking Xanax. It is dependable, bankable. Vives are high.

I know. I just, I can't think of a more like buying the peak and selling the ballet. You're not. You're not. You just said, he was the number one tight end. Yes, but you just made the point that you're getting him at 30 or 35. That's not that pricey. Yes, it is.

He's the first tight-down of the board. But getting Sam Lipport at 35 and Trey McBride at 45, to me, like, that is you're not losing that much opportunity cost there because you don't have to take him 10th like you did Travis Kelsey last year. I'm not even giving an answer. I'm posing a question. Is the lesson from Sam Leporter last year, you should take Sam Leporta? Or is the lesson the 15th tight end off the board might be the number one fucking tight end.

Obviously, that's not the lesson. Well, why not? Brock Bowers is the 14th tight end and you could get him 140th overall. Like I'm just saying. This is so funny. Hivez is falling right into the Tidin trap that we are just hoping we got out of like, oh, it worked for one guy. Maybe it'll work for me again.

Like, no, take the guy who's good. Sam Leporta is very good. Take the good tight end. There's only like three that work out every year. All right. I think it's as simple as this. Where we have him ranked, Laporte, this is the crux of my argument. Sam Leporta, where we have him going is like you could get.

This is funny. This is hilarious. Hyphids is talking himself into grabbing a tight end 14 and have quashing his finger. I'm not. I'm saying that, like, I would rather have, with our rankings, I guess basically the question is, would you rather have Sam Leporta and Joe Burrow or Jalen Hertz and Dalton Kincaid? I'd rather have Jalen Hertz and Dalton Kincaid. Oh, I think I'd rather have, I think I'd way rather have Burrow and Leporta.

But you're also just picking the one tight end you like, Dalton Kincaid. Like, pick a different tight end. Trey McBride. I know, but, okay, look, you're talking about the guy who's guys going. like 10, 15 spots later. You were saying should you go after the tight end 14 like Sam Laporte and hope it works out. Like to me, because Sam Laporta worked out...

Kind of, yeah. Going and looking at like Cole Comet? Dude, no shot in now. Don't you put that on me, Ricky Bobby. Don't you put that on me, who do you want? Dalton Shultz, Dallas Goddard, Luke Musgrave. Like, I don't want any of these guys.

Bowers, Hawkinson. I don't know. I mean, I look at these guys that I'm just like, I just don't think my lesson from last year is that I'm going to spend my third pick on Sam Leporta. Like, that's it. And I'm not saying you're wrong. Again, I hate this.

I love Sam Lipporta. The lions are the most fun team number for in the entire league, bar none. This is why I'm the fucking hipster. I'm just saying, we literally saw Kyle Pitts of 1,000 yards as a rookie, and then he hasn't had three touchdown. And three touchdowns as a rookie. And then we're like, he'll get better.

And he has had three touchdown since. He got hurt. So did Sam Leporta. Yeah. In the year that he was the number one tight end. What are you fucking talking about? He was, like, banged up for the last four weeks of the season, and he still was the number one tight end.

I hate that I'm arguing against this. I have him, like, incrementally lower than you guys. In this whole discussion, I feel like you're allowing that Dalton Kincaid is going to, like, make this leap. And then, but you're saying there's no way Sam Laporta will make a leap also. No, I'm saying, to be clear, oh, okay, it's priced in. I think what I'm saying is that the assumption he gets better is baked into the price. That's all I'm trying to say is like, like, where is the value on top of this pick?

And I think that's what I'm saying is that. Like the idea that he improves is baked into the idea he goes 29th. But if he doesn't improve or he does improve, but he just doesn't hit 10 touchdowns again. And I'm like, all right, so you think that, let's say somebody could guarantee right now that Sam Leporta is just going to have the exact same year again,

900 yards and 10 touchdowns and finish 11.5 fantasy points a game. You wouldn't take that guaranteed at 30 or 35 overall? Yeah, yeah. Probably would. Well, that's him not getting better then. okay yeah but like I'm just saying that like within the context of the deepest year I'm saying that it's about the people around him look and I like I like him to be clear you're just saying it's baked in that he has to improve to do that but you just said you would take his exact year last year I'd rather

have I think I'd rather have like Michael Pittman Jr at that spot and just get a tight end later I mean that's the rest with tight end right do you want to do you want to roll the dice on some guy at tight end nine that you're like this is my guy DK is so torn but I can see DK wrestling with wanting to shred me versus like a little afraid that I'm right versus mostly sure I'm wrong. No, I think what I'm thinking about this whole time is just like it feels a little inane to to be like, oh, you draft him as the tight end one

and he ends up as the tight end three. Like are you really going to be like fucking pissed if he ends up like progressing a little bit and he's still really good? No, I'm saying that Kincaid's 30 spots later. I know, but the other guy that you pick at that spot has zero risk. I feel like you're saying I can either pick a really risky guy or a not risky guy. But that's not that's a false like that's a false assumption. Here's my main takeaway.

Like he's sitting right next to our ranks. He's sitting right next to Cooper Cup. Cooper Cup probably has a higher ceiling. But he also could ruin your fantasy season like he did for so many people last year. You know what I mean? He's sitting there next to T. Higgins. He's sitting there next to Isaiah Pacheco. Like these are our rankings that we're looking at.

Michael Pittman. Fantasy football. 3. Devo, all these guys. are fucking risky and that's why they're at this spot instead of the first round well i don't know i kind of just i have a couple lot lower than you guys but yes i just i just feel like um by the way your your ranking of sam laporta is so low is the reason Travis kelsey is our number one tight end so don't

don't blame don't say we're higher on Travis kregg and iron far apart right i got sam laporta 22nd i have d't dek is right in the middle of this i know but craig and i have laporta as our number one tight end you don't. Maybe I should move majority should rule. But Doyle rules. We don't need to convince one another of something. We're just... I think my main takeaway is that I was right to put Sam Laporte as the hipster pick because

I brought out the same anger that happens when you tell someone some beloved movie sucks. Yeah, which you do with Oppenheimer. I like Oppenheimer. I hate the Robert Downey Jr. ended. Just boring. They didn't name it the atomic bomb. It's called Oppenheimer. It's about the man.

The man was kind of boring Sorry Okay Well actually no The man was fine The man who The subcommittee hearing Was boring

I don't know how that's crazy He created a sea change In world history Was kind of boring You know It made a billion dollars A movie about people Talking in rooms

So And one best picture Sorry everyone's pretending To love a subcommittee hearing Jesus Christ Anyway who's your hipster thing Don't see The way that you argue

Like pisses me off so much I'm sorry everyone's Pretending to like that Like it's our fucking fault The entire academy and the billions of dollars worth of ticket sales, the public and the critics are both pretending. Oh, so now billions of dollars

at sales are indicative of high art. Yeah, the whole one did it happen is because I was afraid to give him an Oscar for Avengers. No one wanted to say that Avengers deserve an option. Are you mad at the movie or that Robert Dennis Jr. won an Oscar? I'm mad at, well, no, I'm not mad at, no, the Oppenheimer thinks mostly a bit. I just, I'm surprised.

He feels it hard. I'm a, I'm just like, I just, I'm confused that people like the subcommittee. hearing stuff. I'm mad that everyone who gave Robert Downey Jr. and Oscar is pretending that was some Oscar worthy performance when in reality it's a career achievement award for hidden in Marvel but no one wanted to recognize that Marvel was good.

And it's just like it seems crazy to me. It's very high school cafeteria to me. It's very odd. In what way are people not recognizing that Iron Man is good? Not Iron Man, but like the character I mean. That like Marvel, like the idea that Marvel would get an acting award is ridiculous. But then the first thing Robert Downey Jr. does that isn't a kid's movie out of Avengers, they're like,

Oscar! And I'm like, it's a career achievement. Just call it that. You think Robert Dena Jr. deserved an Oscar win for his, for his portrayal as Tony Stark? He was better as Tony Stark than in fucking Oppenheimer. Yes, whether he deserves an Oscar, not up to me. But you're telling me he was better in Oppenheimer than fucking any of the Ironman movies is insane.

Including Avengers as Iron. I do believe he was better in Oppenheimer than he was as Tony Stark in any of the nine. Because he was in black and white? Marvel movies. Like, what? I don't know. That's you like projecting onto other people. No, it's not because it's a, I thought he was good in the movie.

I don't think it was the best performance I've ever seen, but I think it was harder to do that than to play Tony Stark. I think that my emotion and anger comes from like genuine lack of understanding. Like I feel like a chasm between all these people that I watched all the Christopher Nolan movies with and agreed with everything. And then I look around and I'm like, who am I? I feel alone. I'm scared. I'm yelling because I'm afraid. I agree with you that there's some like career achievement stuff involved.

But that's just like that's how it works in the academy. Like Leo won for the Revenant. That was not the best Leo movie. It was a career achievement award. That stuff happens. Yes. It's similar to that. Look,

the Academy is a bunch of old people. What do you expect? That's true. We use biggest sleepers, T.K. Tedd. We're Oscar. Biggest sleeper Robert Downey Jr. Performances. All right.

I'm going with one that I've been thinking about lately. And actually, this doesn't really reflect my ranking, so I need to move him up. But Hunter Henry for the Patriots. I'm starting to get into this. I've heard some very compelling arguments. We're still doing this.

We're still doing the Hunter Henry thing. We're still fucking doing it, Craig. All right. We did it forever with David and Joku. It finally paid off. So much well with Hunter Henry. The next gronk, if you will remember. No, but I think situationally is more what I'm excited about.

I think Hunter Henry is a perfectly fine tight end. I don't think he's a super above and beyond talent necessarily, but he's a pretty good tight end. What I'm excited about is the Patriots offense under a new offensive quarter, Alex Vent Pelt, who is bringing the Browns offense essentially to New England. If you look at the target rate to tight end for the Browns or the last three seasons, 26% 24%

27% 6th 5th 4th most among all teams this is a this is an offense that utilizes the tight end

position a lot and add in the fact that Micasicki is now not in New England he played about 50% of the team snaps last year

he's kind of out of the way you know I know they did sign Craig's you know arch nemesis over the off season Austin Hooper

but I don't think he's good enough to really What a jerk for For people that don't know what we're talking about, Craig played Austin Hooper in Little League Baseball. And I don't remember what happened. Did you strike out?

What happened? Did you hit a home row? Well, he was just kind of a baby in Little League Baseball. We also went to the same middle school and we played the intermural sports against one another. Got it. I would have gone pro if coach didn't hit. Austin Hooper wasn't bullying me. I would have gone pro.

If Austin Hooper wasn't held back a year, so he was bigger than all the other kids. So anyways, Mike Kisicki, gone. He definitely doesn't know who I am, by the way, which is like, if you asked him, who's Craig Rolbeke, he'd be like, I have no fucking idea. Good for Austin Hooper. He gets a touchdown in the Super Bowl. Like, he's doing well. He's done fine with himself.

Hunter Henry last year played 74% of snaps. If we could get that up like 80, 85% this year playing time. I don't know. I feel like things could be good here as a sleeper. And there will be almost surely better. quarterback player, at least, you know, acceptable quarterback play from either Drake May or Jekyllby Reset. So, you know, I don't think he's necessarily going to be like a tight end, top five titan, but I think he could be a sleeper that he could plug in. Yeah, this is nice. This is much

deeper than mine. My sleeper was Jake Ferguson on Dallas, who was the top 10 tight end last year, and nobody cares. Because this name is Jake Ferguson. It honestly might be. High Fitz, Hyvitz and his rankings doesn't have him top 90. D.K., you don't have them top 115. I need to I need to move up. I haven't read around 70. I moved all the tight ends down because there's so many. I mean, last year he was the 81. He was, he finished 81 overall in football.

And this year, I'm like, what's kind of not to like? Like, what is worse? There's no target competition in Dallas. Dallas is sneaky, like one of the shittiest kind of like skill position groups in the league now. They have nobody at running back. They brought in Ezekiel Elliott. They really just have C.D. Lamb and that's kind of it. They still have Brandon Cooks.

Michael Gallup is gone. And then they kind of just have Jake Ferguson, who has become kind of, Dak Prescott's like dependable security blanket guy. Last year, he had over 70 catches, 750 yards. But he only had five touchdowns. And I think that's the area where I'm like,

dude, this guy led all tight ends in red zone targets last year. Jake Ferguson. Dak Prescott loves him. He was number one in the league in Red Zone targets last year. So I'm like, I don't know, what's really the competition here? To me, the floor is quite high for Jake Ferguson. And the ceiling, although I don't know,

maybe he's not going to be Travis. Kelsey, I'm like, he's kind of just in a nice sweet spot of like going to finish in the tight end five to nine range. I like this one a lot, actually. I need to move him up because I think you're absolutely right. He's essentially the type. He's essentially the receiver two in this offense. I think he's actually pretty underrated as a talent too. When you watch him, he can move around.

He's, he's shaking guys as a route runner. He's really tall and long as a huge catch radius. And I think most importantly, Dak Prescott loves to feed his tight ends. Like, that's his, that's always been his thing throughout his career. I was looking at the numbers last offseason, and his target rate to tight end has always been one of the, you know, maybe top eight or seven in the NFL going back several years. He just,

that's a big part of what the offense does. So, yeah, I think the only thing that scaring me a little bit about Jake Ferguson is just, he feels a little bit replaceable if, if, like, some other guy comes in or,

you know, like maybe Scood Maker makes a big leap or something. They draft this guy in the second round a couple years ago, Scootemaker. So I feel like there's just, a little bit of he's not as entrenched as other players, but at the same time, I mean, he looked pretty good to me last year. I don't see, they're most likely not going to like replace him anytime soon. Schoonmaker is such an interesting name. I know. I'm surprised it's not Schoonmaker.

It might be. I'm not 100 sure. It's not. You know how people's last thing like Cooper was like a barrel maker? It says Schoonmaker was a shoemaker from middle low German, like middle low German name for like a cobbler. I thought there's going to be a schooner. I thought it was, that's why I googled. I was wondering if these family built ships. Maybe schooners are, they look like shoes. Is that what a,

somebody who builds ships is a schooner? Well, no, schooners. There's a schooner that is a type of ship. Scooters. How do you guys know that? You both knew that?

Yeah, you come to think of it, I can't tell you why I do that. Mall rats. That's crazy. I don't know. You guys. I got to read more.

there's sleepers then there's also post-type sleepers I have Kyle Pitts but I don't need to do that again but I feel like he's kind of the most post-type sleeper of all time are you in high fits I don't know if we got your official decision are you in he's like it's like again it's a toxic relationship and I'm kind of looking at the thirst trap on Instagram and I'm like this is having in every draft like especially if he falls at some point you talk yourself into this is a value at this spot even though you do not want to play it's just we're just right we're just hook up we're just gonna hook up one time yeah yeah no strings

attached no strings attached oh there's strings there's strings there's strings of this guy's same laporter 30 else of cowpits those cowpits later there's no player in the in the NFL with more strings attached than cow pits dk who's your post type sleeper uh speaking of uh players that we're never going to give up on no fan for the seahawks another first round tight end that has doesn't done anything much in the NFL. This is his year, though, guys. Situation, let's take a look at the situation, because that's the most important thing.

I think I've always believed in his talent, but he's just been on really crappy situations with the Broncos. And then with the Ciacs last year, the Cioxx used, they had three good tight ends on their offense. This was like one of the main, the most strong position groups for the team last year. And we saw that this year. Like Will Disse had a three-year, $14 million deal with the Chargers.

Colby Parkinson got a three or $22 million. dollar deal with the Rams, surprisingly. And those guys, those three guys rotated out throughout last season. Phant played on 55% of snaps. Dissly played on 40% of snaps. Kobe Parkinson played on 47% of snaps. It's just very difficult to be a good any position.

If you're not playing a full complement of snaps, but especially a tight end, if you're playing 54% of snaps, it's just not going to happen this year. If we can get Fant, again, up to like that 80% mark, that would be amazing. The team's a rookie number. He's got to bump the numbers way up.

Got to get those numbers up. But I mean, he's the guy who's running routes for the Seahawks at the tight-up position. You know what I mean? And so I don't know. I don't know what this offense is going to do in terms of how often it's going to, you know, target the tight-in position. The Searx did just sign him to a two-year $21 million deal. That is a lot.

That's 11. I was going to say, if you pay your tight end $10 million and still rotate him, once again, I could be a fucking gym. I could give someone $10 million dollars and not fucking. and throw them the ball. 100%. My only worry with that comment, High Fitz, is I think they did that with Will Disley.

They gave Will Disley like a weird amount of money. They're paying for the intangibles. I, the locker room by. I increasingly think I could do this job. Yeah. I actually, like not a bit kind of think you could do this job. Dude, I'm in.

I'm all in. Step one. Hire Bill Belichick. He's already ahead of like two. thirds of the NFL. I know I never played the game. I never played the game, guys. I don't know if I know what I'm doing.

But anyway. Yeah, but so anyways, no fan. In the Seahawks offense, which I think could make a big jump in this new offensive scheme. I don't know, man. Why not? No fan.

Last round, pay. My sleeper, my post-type sleeper is Pat Fryermuth. I-Hugh. Howdy fries? Yeah, I was kind of like reading about the Steelers' offense and thinking about it, looking at all these tight ends.

And I was like, you know, let's revisit all. patty fries. Last year, 27th best tight end in points per game. He was terrible. But he got hurt last year and the season was a mess. The year before that, he was a top 12 tight end in his second year with Kenny Pickett. Year before that, he, as a rookie,

he was a top 15 tight end with vegetable Ben Rothesberger as his quarterback. They wheeled him out for the game. Like the Kirk Douglas Award, Ben Rothesberger is going to roll out to get out an award for worse team. I see Pat Friar Moot. Like the question, the connotation of a question at the end, Pat Friar Mute?

Look, D.K., you might not want to hear this, but Arthur Smith uses his tight ends a lot, just not Kyle Pitts. Yep. If you look at last year, the Falcons had the highest, highest tight end target share in the NFL. Yes. The Falcons, that's the most incredible. fucking stat. They threw more to their tight ends than any other team in the league. 34% of their passes went to tight ends. Michael Pruitt, Jono Smith. Johnu Smith. Literally more than one in every three passes went to a tight end in the

Falcons offense. And if you look at the Steelers last year, they were 23rd in the league. 19% of their passes went to tight ends. So one, I think Arthur Smith coming in, he likes throwing to his tight ends. The Steelers, two tight ends are Pat Friermuz and Darnow Washington. Darnow Washington is essentially an offensive lineman. It's pretty much just Pat Friarmouth. and you look at the rest of the skill position group in Pittsburgh. You have George Pickens. You have rookie Roman Wilson, slot guy out of Michigan. You have Calvin Austin, the third, who I'm pretty sure if you Google him,

his college stats pop up before his professional stats. Like, he's not really involved. And so I'm kind of like, Pet Firemoot is kind of the number two option here in Pittsburgh for an offense that I assume will be better. The offensive line will be better. The quarterback play should be better. And I'm like, no, no. Pet Firemooth, you know, the first one.

first two years of his career, he was one of only two tight ends in a history of the NFL to start his career with two back-to-back seasons with more than 60 catches. No one else had ever done that. That's wild. I never like think about Pat Fryer Muth. And then last year, everybody was all in on him and it was a complete disaster. And I'm like, I don't know. Pat's still good. Of all the guys that we've talked about today, that would be like a shocking top five finisher in amongst tight ends next year, I feel like Fryer Muth could be the guy. I like all I like everything. You're saying right now, Craig, you're selling me on this. He's like discount Kincade, not in that he

plays like Dalton Kincaid, but is he just the number one receiver for this team kind of? Right. Like what if, like, I see what you're saying where it's like, yeah, what if Matt Ryarmouth just what if the Arthur Smith thing happens though again and it's just darn out Washington is the guy that you actually want? Well, that'll be a fun, that'll be a fun

world with Darno Washington's the ball and NFL games. The next one we got here is now the tuxed up a word. Yeah. From stepbrothers when they go in for the interview to two people come for the same interview. Yeah. Yeah. And it's the teammates that kind of like you don't really know what to do with and there's one job. And I was looking at this and I was thinking about, I know everything I just said about all the other tight ends, but I'm like, why don't I just draft Mark Andrews and Isaiah likely from Baltimore? It's like the only tight end situation. If you had just taken Mark Andrews last year, Mark Andrews got hurt. He was out for the season after week 11. If you had Mark Andrews and then just picked up Isaiah likely, that was the number two tight end in fantasy football last year. It was just if you just had the Ravens tight ends. And I'm like, Mark Andrews coming off in. What are you just did that again?

I'm not against it. Honestly, there's something about Mark Andrews that has never interested me. I've never drafted him. Boring name. I don't, yeah, boring name. Mark Andrews is like Jake Ferguson? Is it because he volleyball sets potential touchdowns into the fifth row of the stands? Yeah, maybe that's too big of an ick for me.

It's like every year Mark Andrews is good. He usually misses like three games because of an injury. But I don't know why I don't draft him because he's great every year. There's guys in fantasy that I just have a pure blind spot for. I just literally will never consider taking them ever. I don't care for Job. Truly, like, I'll just see them. They'll be on the queue.

I'll never once consider taking them. And you know what? Sometimes this guy's turn out to be really good. Having this whole discussion, it kind of makes me mad that the Ravens took Isaiah likely and have Isaiah likely because they're just keeping him from the world. Let him out into the world. You guys are stifling him. Isaiah like this incredible.

Every time that dude plays, he's great. I'm so mad at the Ravens for having him. Give him up. It's time to let it go. D.K., who should ride him to the Seahawks. Give him to any other team. I don't give a shit who. Well, not the Chargers or the Steelers.

Well, not another team that would ruin our fantasy world. That's kind of the Bowers' mayor conversation with the Raiders. Like, I was pretty excited about what mayor was going to be this year. And then they drafted Bowers and like, what the fuck? The other team, I think that's very confusing. That's actually the now that tuxedos are kind of fucked up. Yeah. Like the second round of Ameri.

Why are we doing? And they're in black and white. Tuxedos. There you go. Well, there you go. Um, I think this is a team just in general that I don't know what I'm going to do with this

year in drafts. This is the Packers. And Luke Musgrave versus Tucker craft. So let's let's run down the Packers offense. It's going to be super annoying. They have two to three running backs, Josh Jacobs, Barshad Lloyd, AJ Dylan. What do we do with that group?

There's going to be a rotation. The Packers have always used a pretty heavy rotation. They have like a million. like a million wide receivers that we have to sort through Christian Watson, Jane Reed, Dontavian Wicks, Romeo Dobbs, Bo Melton scored like a bunch of points to end of the season. Should I keep going? There's more guys on that team, I feel like.

And then two good tight ends, Luke Musgrave, who they took in the second round, I believe, and then Tucker Kraft, who they took in the third round. And Musgrave was the presumptive starter. Like everything we heard was, and he did end up starting the season for them last year, but then Kraft came in when Musgrave got hurt, and he was arguably more effective and like a little bit more versatile. Musgrave scored, he had two games last year

where he scored 10 plus PPR points. And Tucker Kraft had four. All of them when Musgrave was out. And then you put them together, we're going to have like a potential Seahawks situation where both guys are playing like 50% of snap. So I don't know what to do with these guys. I think they're stayaways in fantasy

unless one guy gets hurt. Because I think they're just going to cannibalize each other's production. The Packers are weird because I don't like, any of the players on their team for fantasy football. And yet I think the Packers are like going to make the NFC championship. Yeah, they're going to be really good. You just never know who's going to score points for them. Would we be happier if you could just draft Packers running backs?

Like Packers' tight ends, you just got the whole unit for a team. There's definitely something to that. I mean, maybe. Instead of hating Kyle Pitts and Arthur Smith, we just drafted Falconsidstead ends and we're thrilled every week. Do you think, though? It's too easy. You know how like with our WaverWire show on Monday, we kind of stopped? Remember on our Waverwire show, we kind of pivoted away from like going.

after one specific player and we just like made the showdown time about a position group. It made more logic sense, but was it as fun? No. No, we're going back. Yeah. You know, there's something more fun about just being like, I'm going to draft fucking Kyle Bitts and hope it works. Not Arthur Smith's interest in the tight end position in just,

no, I'm not drafting target share by team. I'm going after one guy. You got to start, you got to draw the line somewhere. And that's where I was. the Ricky Bobby first or last guy, which is like, you know, we have to rank these players,

but in reality, there's always, like players that, or they're going to finish way higher or way lower and you just kind of have to middle them somewhere in the ranking. Like Cadarist Tony last year, you put him 100th.

You're like, yeah, it'll be 40th or like, unranked, but like you can't put him there. So I think this year, that guy from his T. T.C. Hawkinson for the Vikings. Yeah.

That's a great one. No idea where to put this guy. Teacher Hawkinson is a top two tight end. T. Jachkinson might be the number one tight ends. We're probably not with Justin Jefferson fully healthy, but like he's probably at least the top three tight end, if healthy, but he is coming off a torn ACL and it was somewhat late in the season.

Yeah. It's scary. And so it's like, will he be healthy in September? 100%? Probably not. 100% October, mate. But then again, from Thanksgiving on, Conti J. Hawkins would be like the fantasy playoffs, the number one tight end.

Totally. I put him on. I have him as a 12th tight end, really because it's almost like, he's almost like a target to actually hold all year. and just hope that he recovers. But I don't know what to do with him, but he feels like someone who genuinely might be not only not playing,

but if he's playing an active detriment to your team, but then a league winner late. I completely agree with you. I think he is the biggest boom-bust player at the position. He's definitely going to fall too late in drafts. Nobody's going to want him because he's hurt. He's going to have that little hospital logo next to his name that everybody's terrified of.

Someone's going to take him in like the 10th and he's going to be great and probably make the playoffs because of him. this is a very different area or whatever than the T.J. Hawkinson question, but Johnny Smith, going to the Dolphins, you want every piece of the Dolphins offense that you can get because obviously they score a lot of points and they're really high octane and super fast. And Johnny Smith, the idea of Johnny Smith in this offense is really exciting. And then you realize, like, he might score two points a game.

But maybe, you know, this is probably more like a Waverwire type pickup guy. But I'm also very intrigued with this. The Dolphins had the lowest pass rate to tight ends last year. in the NFL. 9% of their past targets went to the tight-end position. That's also probably part of the reason for that is that they had a 17th century tradesman from rural England named Durham Smyth as their starter. You were talking about how the English name, name their names are like what they do, Durham Smyth. He's the town's Smyth.

Yeah. But now they got Johnny Smith, who is more modernly named. He's like a new Durham Smyth. Like a new city. New England. New Durham. Yeah. So this is, I don't know. I'm just excited about Johnny Smith. He run after the catchability. He's fast. He's elusive. He seems like a really great fit for, you know, the type of offense that they run. So I'm just excited to see what Joe Smith does. But at the same time, like, you don't want to over-excite people because he's probably going to do nothing.

So I guess maybe he's more of a sleeper or something like that. But I just don't know where to rank him because I don't want, you know, I don't want to get too ahead of my stuff on this, but also this might be awesome. he's good everywhere he goes Jono Smith somehow still only 28 years old he feels 32 every team he's on he's just like productive get shit done usually steals targets away from the guy who everyone thought was better than him exactly he's really dependable

next up here we have beta testing which is basically just the guys you hate but have to rank it it's kind of the opposite of the Ricky Bobby picks these are like flaccid they're like low T as they would say it and so he's sunny in Philadelphia soy boy beta cut picks yeah kind of just like guys that you're like this doesn't get me anything this doesn't get me anywhere

but this doesn't do anything for me it's dude cold commit I want you to close your eyes and imagine I want you to imagine on a Sunday afternoon crisp fall Sunday you're watching the Chicago Bears

duel with the Green Bay Packers epic Caleb Williams and you're hey Caleb don't throw it to Keenan Allen don't throw it to DJ Moore don't throw it to Roma Dunes you're the fucking moron sitting there

say throw it to cold commit like an idiot yeah no I will not it will never be me I might put him 200 this year I won't have them on my team I will not be rooting for cold commit to get the ball yeah that's fair there's a lot of these type of guys just like in the tight end 12 to 17 range that you're just like this is ambient this is it's important to imagine yourself rooting for them to get the ball and how you'll feel like DK who's that guy for yeah no this is exactly I'm thinking it was like why even play if this is going to be a pick you make and that's Dalton

Schultz from the Texans. Why are you even playing? Just hang them up. In my fantasy, I want Cesar Stroud to turn down Stefan Diggs, Nico Collins, and Tank Dell so that he can get the ball to Stolton Shultz.

I just like, I also just have a personal bias against like the quote-unquote catch and fall down tight ends. I know that I'm definitely selling Dalton Shultz short by sort of making fun of him and not thinking he's that talented. But I don't know. He just, I don't think he's that talented. I just, I don't like him. I don't care for Job. I don't care for Dalton Schultz. I think he's just like such a,

the definition of an average player. And I'm just like, I'm not, it's not what I want on my team, especially with Diggs now, uh, in town. Tank is still ascending. I think Nico potentially is still ascending. Nico Collins might be the best player on this team, or the best offensive weapon on this team. And then Brevin Jordan mixes in. They drafted Cade Stover. I just feel like, everything about this is you're just asking to be disappointed. I don't understand why people would want to draft Alan Schultz. Just go touch grass instead. You know, there's another, can I ask a quick question?

This is a beta, a beta guy for me. Tyler, is Tyler Conklin the starting tight end of the jet? No one knows because everyone stopped watching that team last year. Yeah, as scientists maintained. I'm kind of just like, what's going on over there? Tyler Conklin had 60 catches, 600 yards last year. What's going on over there? Which is like what Odell Beckham did.

Right. I'm like, I don't know. But I have not heard a single sentence uttered. I actually think Tyler Conklin had 87 targets and Dolan Shultz had 88. My random, my very random opinion, I actually think Tyler Conklin's actually kind of good. And if Rogers hadn't gotten hurt, like I actually, Tyler Conklin is like the second best receiver on that team. Well, my point is there now. Which we keep forgetting about, but the poor guy scored zero touchdowns last year because his team was an abomination, but he had 600 yards.

He had the 13th most yards at the position last year. And I'm like, is Tyler Conklin going to be sneaky good with Aaron Rogers and no one? That's a good. I actually, I actually think Tyler Conklin's really good. Our dynasty league we do with your friends from home decay. I have Tyler Conklin. I actually got him from you. I traded him, yeah.

It was an incredible trade. I won the league with the tight ends you sent me. And then I sent you a third round pick used in Pukukukukkah. Fuck yeah. win-win. But Tyler Conklin, I just refused to give up on because I actually think that it's good. But, uh, I can't remember,

I cannot remember saying his name one time last season. No. Well, it's, I mean, you should look into that. Did he, did, did you win you a lot of games? No, that was a Rogers, Joe. Oh. I just love that phrase from here, Rogers. You should look at.

Would he finish dead last? Yeah, I had a good day, though. All right. Let's do some emails. Emails. Actually, wait, Craig, you added these. You found some more. I was going to top off on the Orioles thing,

but you wanted to follow up on this Oreo stuff. Yeah, we got a couple, we got a couple follow-ups about the flavoring of Oreos. Because one guy emailed us and was like, or we got a bunch of emails that was like, Craig's annoying and wrong. No, no,

it was worse. They said it was your high-fitz moment. Yeah, they were like, Oreos tastes like chocolate, dude. Like, wake up. And I was like, yeah, but they taste,

there's something about it that's different. We got an email from Jack. Jack. Jack says Craig was right. Nothing quite tastes like an Oreo. That's because it's made with black cocoa powder. According to at least two sources, parentheses, my girlfriend who loves baking

and this Australian baking blog linked below. Black cocoa powder doesn't really taste like chocolate. It's basically like alkalized cocoa powder. Oh, yeah, yeah. It's heavily dutched. Like a battery? And it reduces, yeah, it reduces bitterness. And I guess apparently it's very different

from regular or dark cocoa powders that you would find in like Hershey's or something. else. That's why it tastes different. I believe it. What fuck is alkalized? You can alkalize. Oh, it's turn it basic and less acidic. It's literally basic chocolate. It's incredible. Yeah. And then we got another email from Raffy. Rafi. Raffy. Who says he was also investigating into this Oreo conundrum. And he said that it turns out that that Oreo cream filling is made from a fondant. However, unlike most fondants, it does not contain

milk, which is why Oreos are vegan, which is one weird. That's another conversation. Well, that's how this all started is because Solek was eating Oreos. Oh, right, during lunch. Because he had to eat vegan, yeah. But Rafi says because of this, because this is like vegan fake milk, it uses other ingredients to it to mimic the flavor of milk, meaning that the cream is essentially milk flavored, which is why this cookie tastes like milk and cookies. Milk flavored fondant. Is it fondant or fondant? I'm not the pronunciation guy.

I believe it's fondant. Fuck, I thought it's fondant. That sounds cool. That sounds like the last name of like a cool French action star. Or Dolphins tight end. Pierre Fondon. Yeah. But anyway, so it's different cocoa powder and it tastes like milk.

Sweet milk. This is like the most. It is cookies and cream. This is the most American like cookie ever. Just that's American culture. An incredible amount of fake shit. They alcoholized the freaking chocolate. They put in milk flavoring.

No wonder. we're so healthy in this country. I told you guys my definition of American culture is that we're the place where, like, colors are flavors. Yeah, yeah. What's your favorite flavor of Gatorade? Red, blue. But that's America, but this is right up there. Like, you can't

even eat Skittles in Europe, I'm pretty sure. Dude, we got to hear about that, too. Wait, what was the thing we had to? Like, against the law to sell them. Oh, my God, dude, yeah. Wait, what was the other candy we were talking about? Not Oreos. Starburst? Starburst. And, like, yeah, we're talking about how the amount of corn syrup and all the things we eat, which means European and Australian versions are completely different.

Yeah. Because, you know, I don't know, the corn, big corn syrup. Haven't you heard about people who like have lactose issues and then they go to Italy and they eat cheese on their entire trip and they don't have any stomach issues? Oh, no. I mean, I still had stomach issues, but no. My friend's wife claims that after she went to Italy, she no longer has, she is no longer lactose intolerant. That it cured her. That sounds. Okay. That sounds. Okay. Okay, yeah, I believe it. I know. Look, we all were like, you're crazy.

But she would have like, she couldn't have anything. A slice of cheese on a burger, pizza. Like, it would all just destroy her. She went to Italy for two weeks, hit a bunch of cheese and pasta, came back, and now each cheese and it's totally fine. That actually, I come to think of it. There is something to it, though,

because maybe something with the bacteria is all the doctors. Got biome. All the medical people listening. Email us if there's any way that's possible. Oh, yeah. By the way, emails, yeah. If I can fix the lactose intolerant thing, just email me.

Should I go to Italy? That'd be certain science. Yeah. Yeah, I'll be done. Crowdsourcing cures to our ailments is actually a pretty cool idea. That would be the best possible use of the show, which we just live forever because we just get everything. Yeah, I get hung over after I drink a lot.

What do you guys, what do you guys think? What's the cure there? Noritos. Yeah. Email surrogacy football jibble.com. You can cure my lactose intolerance. Oh, so I got an email from Dave. David.

This is just like a general cringe email that I liked. I just, you know, we cringed, you know, just those moments. Anyway, do you guys are, what? Remember that? What are you talking about? What are you saying? Do you remember that email we got about, um, it's an anonymous. It's an assistant coach who was on the chief staff.

He was getting married and they were at the wedding and they were like signing the, the wedding book. And the woman goes up at the date and she's like, oh, hey, we got a lefty here. And then he turns around and he didn't have no. arm. Yeah, no arm, just the left arm. Yeah. Anyway. Hall of Fame moment.

Yeah. Dave. Dave. David. Dave. I was working in Midtown Manhattan. I'm walking out the door of our lobby. And I see someone struggling to carry something into the doorway.

And I'm like, do you need a hand? And he turns around. I realize he says an amputee is missing a hand. Did the guy have a sense of humor about it? That's what I want to know. He didn't say so, which makes me, um, pessimistic about it. That's a real curve of your enthusiasm. That is.

That's brutal. You got to remove that phrase from your lexicon. You can't say do you need a hand anymore? Just do you need help? Play it safe. That sounds so... Do you need help? Sounds worse. Sounds so demeanor. Do you need help? Yeah, what's the word? Patriotizing. You need help. Can I help you old man?

I also got an email from Peter. Pete. I'm 40. You crazy kids will never know the sheer of burning hours of mixed CDs to take on planes or long car rides to play in your Sony Discman in the backseat while your dad listens to hours of smooth jazz in the front and your mom has stacks of 50 books on tape shoved in between. I did burn CDs. Did you?

I did too. Yeah, I was at the end of the CD Burning Era, but I never made a mixtape. I never, I don't know how to do that either. You mean on an actual tape? Yeah, like, is that what they're called? No idea how that works. No, dude. It's like I was, so white collar just went on Netflix and I watched the first episode and part of the, he like rewires a fob by like sticking it into a mixtape thing.

I was like, dude, I don't know how that thing works. Interesting. I did mix tapes for sure. Cs are wild if you think about it. It just spit. I don't get records either, but at least there's texture. The CD just spins and it reads that. How the fuck does that work?

No clue. Dude, that was. Look, I don't know how the mail works. You expect me to know how to fucking CD. They read from a CD. I don't know. I still can't figure out how they told the pigeons where to go. Yeah, email us about the pigeons.

We still want to know about the pigeons. So I'm trying to remember exactly how I made mixtapes back in the day. It's been probably like, I don't know, 30 years or something like that, but I'm pretty sure. Holy shit. You just said that.

And I thought you were kidding. Yeah, I'm 41. It was probably when I was like 10, 11, 12. Wow. There's a long time ago. I'm pretty sure that there's like boom boxes or whatever that had two different tape slots in them. And you could play one, hit record.

on the other, and then it would, like, transfer it to the other tape. Oh. And then you would stop when the song was over. You'd put it in the new tape, start a different song. You'd have to find, like, the right spot. That's, like, how I'm remembering it, but I could be right. I can't actually remember specifically how. Grandpa's forgetting about the war.

Yeah, seriously. I need to write the shit down. I kind of miss boombox culture. Yeah. The 49ers, man, they come out with that boombox. It looks sick to have a giant speaker on your show. Because I know it's, like, big and bulkying in the way. And I know now you can have this, like, this, like, tiny little Bluetooth

two speaker that will give out the same amount of volume. But I'm like, there's something nice about the fact that it's giant. It feels substantial. You know, those people who like drive bikes, but instead of having headphones in, they just have a speaker that goes like two blocks. Yes. Yes. And I'm like, how do those people not lose their hearing?

But it's really cool. Have you noticed that? Like, well, this is not, I'm not breaking any news here, but everything gets smaller the longer you go along. And so like speakers. Everything? You know what I'm saying. I'm talking about technology.

the rule of technology there's some law that everything gets smaller the amount of data you can fit on like a computer chip or something although it's now almost getting bigger again it's like iPhones are now getting bigger now it's like the size of people's jeans you know it's like cyclical

wow is that why the iPhones are bigger now because everyone is wearing baggy of your jeans now they can fit in the pocket by the way yeah I have an iPhone SE which most people don't even know what that is I think I have is this phone's probably like six seven years old people

You have one camera on your phone. You have one lens. I have a button. I've got a button on your phone. People see this and they're like, what the fuck is that? Which actually reminds me of the story I was just going to tell. It belongs in a museum.

I had like a Bose speaker thing. It was like a little bit like a U shape or something like a big speaker. It's like a boombox, but like a Bose. And my friend came in. He's much younger. He's like your guys's age. He was like, what is that? He had no idea what it was.

He literally like, didn't know what a speaker was. What is that VCR? Get that out of here. I thought it was cool and he's like making fun of me so hard because I have this giant fucking speaker in my house. He's like, what the fuck is that thing?

Speakers look cool. Like to me it's like if I was in a room with friends, a big boombox blasting music is more of a vibe than some tiny little speaker. Dude, you remember like tower speakers? They had like the big subwifers. You had like multiple levels. Yeah,

I miss that shit. That's a real aesthetic. Yeah. You can like feel the woofers. Speaking to the You guys, it's like, yeah Tell us about the war grandpa All right

Multiple people Kyle John, Brandon, shout on everyone email us But we're talking about the Mazda MPV Mm-hmm Classic car And really popular song

And rap lyrics Including Cream Yeah By Wu Tang And that's what the line is Raqwan's like Rolling in MPVs Every week we made 40 Gs

I had no idea what he was talking about My buddy texted me this Yeah Mazda MPVs I couldn't believe Shouts the life He texted the life to me this that like right after that show came out.

He was like, you know, the, you know how the Spotify will show the lyrics or whatever when they're going. Yeah. I couldn't believe that. Wow. Good car. Shout out. Yeah. All right. So we got on tight ends. Thank you, D.K. Thank you, Craig.

Thank you. You and email this. Email us at your fancy football at gmail.com. Yeah. Literally anything. We'll take anything. Please. Help me with the dairy, though. Thank you, Kai, for producing this episode.

Thank you, Lauren. Lord. Thank you, Wutang. Nice. I remember when I was a ringer intern, I walked by, I don't remember why, but Shea Serrano,

he was out of ringer happy with Concepcion. And we were talking about rap, and she was like, how old are you? And I was like, young. And he was like, do you, like, how many members of the Wu Teng clan

can you name right now? And basically it was like, I was not allowed to participate in the conversation, unless I got it right. And I actually got it right. like all mine. He was like, okay, you can stay. It's great. Wow. You got all nine when you were like 22 years old? Yeah, I was very proud. Well, I don't know. I'm sure. As before, people email

on to say nine. I know that there's like guys who went in out. But like I got like the core. Shee DM'd me yesterday out of the blue. He said, yo, I had a dream last night that I was in the courtyard of a school and you were there too and you announced that you were engaged. Then Barack Obama showed up to ask you about football things. Get the fuck out. Just want you to know that. What did she say? I was like, I just laughed. I was like, this sounds like a tremendous omen.

So, yeah. Wow. Maybe we can get Obama on the pond. Talk football. It is Carl Pitts takes. Yeah. Oh, my God. Yeah.

I can sleep on Barry. All right. Goodbye, everyone. Must be 21 plus and present in select states. Fandall's offering online sports wagering in Kansas under an agreement with Kansas Star Casino LLC. Gambling problem. Call 1-800 gambler or visit fandle.com.

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