The Ringer NFL Show - 9 Players We’re Not Drafting This Year

Episode Date: August 28, 2025

The guys highlight (lowlight?) the players they’re avoiding at all costs in fantasy drafts this season, and make the case for why you should too. (0:00) Intro (1:44) The fantasy impact of Rashee Rice’s six-game suspension (6:20) The Vikings reunite with Adam Thielen (20:15) Baker Mayfield, Buccaneers QB (23:41) DK Metcalf, Steelers WR (26:46) Kaleb Johnson, Steelers RB (28:52) Terry McLaurin, Commanders WR (35:09) Mark Andrews, Ravens TE (40:32) Kenneth Walker III, Seahawks RB (46:22) David Montgomery, Lions RB (51:53) Joe Mixon, Texans RB (53:03) Chris Olave, Saints WR (56:01) The lefty tangent Check out our 2025 Ringer Fantasy Football Rankings here!  Email us! [e-mail] Getaway sales event. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Hosts: Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck Producers: Carlos Chiriboga, Ronak Nair, and Kai Grady Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Fantasy Football Show. My name is Danny Hyfix, and I'm joined by Danny Kellyan, Craig Horlebeck, and today we are doing the guys we will not draft. What are you laughing at me for? Honestly, because Austin Gale texted us right as we started saying,

a clear cup is a choice. Dude, all right. This is an unnamed energy drink you're drinking. This is an unnamed energy drink, which I was told I'm not allowed to have with the can because it's like no free ads or whatever. Looks like you haven't had a glass of water in three days. Well, you know what?

Maybe it's iced tea or something or a beer. I wish it was that. But no, this is what an energy drink looks like. when you pour it out, and I guess I'm not allowed to have the thing up here. The number one player I do not want to draft is whatever's in there. Yeah, this is the chart, you're a bad teammate if this is your color. Yeah, so that's, yeah, congrats to me. All right,

this is an incentive for everyone to watch on YouTube. Spotify, wherever you want to watch on video. I'm disgusted. So, yeah, we're going to go into all the players. We're not going to draft. We're also going to get a bunch of news. News keeps coming, so we're going to keep going through everything and then I'll, oh, stop being an adult from once. God. That was on me.

I don't even know. I just looked at you, Riley. Let's take a quick break. This episode of the Ringer Fantasy Football Show is presented by Hyundai. Get into the Hyundai Getaway sales event and get away with the deal so right, it almost feels wrong. You can get huge savings on their adventure-ready SUVs, like the Hyundai Santa Fe and Santa Fe and Santa Fe and Sanofa Hybrid Models. Or go all-electric and choose from America's most awarded EV lineup,

like the breakthrough, Ionic 5 or Ionic 6. Visit HyundaiUSA.com or call 562-3-34-4-6-03 for details, offers end September 2nd, 2025. All right, let's get into some news. Okay, so the number one thing, Rishi Rice, the chief receiver, basically accepted a suspension. They had a hearing for later this month.

Sorry, it's not September yet, but September 28th, they were going to have a hearing and determine it. They kind of did the NFL equivalent of a settlement where NFL wanted 10 and he wanted like two, and they decided on six, which is kind of roughly what we thought was going to happen. I think there was a chance. It was going to be less than that or whatever.

So now we actually know that it's going to be at the beginning of the year. Yes, that's the thing that changed. I think we thought around six games would have made sense. but that hearing was September 30th, I believe, which was after week four, and there was a conspiracy about why that was, about they wanted to be in all the primetime games to start the season.

All the Chiefs games are primetime games. The first four were like big games. I don't believe in that theory. Maybe I do. I don't. No, I don't. The problem is every Chiefs games in primetime, except three.

But now, Rishi Rice will be out the first six weeks of the season. If it would have been like he's out weeks eight to 14, things get a little dice here, there's more bi-weeks, fantasy playoffs are coming. So I guess if you had to pick six weeks, this is the best six weeks. weeks. So I don't think our ranking will actually change too much because we kind of assumed he would be missing around the six games, right? I think you can make the argument that I think

we had kind of assumed it would be six games, but I think that you can also make the argument that there were maybe if you would hope that it would be less, like maybe this is bad. The flip side is there was also a chance he'd play four games. Right. Those might be his worst four just because coming off the injury. And then you would get suspended six games in the middle of the season and then. So he gets a month and a half to start the season to begin to continue rehabbing his knee. The only bummer is that they have a week 10 by week, so he doesn't get to miss the by week. So the question is, where do you take Rishi Rice?

And I think the answer to me is really simple, which is after Ricky Pairsaw in the Niners or Matthew Golden on the Packers or Malkabuka on the Buccaneers, and once those, like, cool receivers are there, I think Rishie Rice is after those guys, but ahead, he's in the range to me of like, once you're near Khalil Shakir with the bills, or Jane Reed with the Packers,

or Darnell Mooney on the Falcons, or Cooper Cup and the Seahawks, Basically, like, kind of boring veterans that are kind of injured, but solid when healthy, or like Rishi Rice, who will miss six games and then maybe be a top 12 receiver, to me, that's just like different, completely different things. And if you're, like, I took them in the Ringer League and I kind of actively was like, you know what, this is one of those picks where it will either be the reason I want or lost is I probably could have gotten a better player here.

So I'm okay taking him in that range, but I wouldn't take him over like a Riqui Parasol. Would you, D.K.? No, I think, yeah, Piercell's upside. Piercell also has the upside, I think, that Rishie Rice has. And since he could be the number one receiver for the 49ers, he could be a top 12, top 24 receiver in fantasy, I think once you get past that kind of range, past like a Dunezay,

then you're getting into guys where just the upside doesn't really seem to be there. Like, it's a type of player you can plug into your lineup, he's not going to win you your league. So, I mean, yeah, I'm still fine, taking Rish, he showed last year that he could be, you know, top 12 guy, the number one receiver in this offense.

It's feeling more and more like the chiefs are going to have a pretty good offense and they're going to throw it deep more. They're going to be more explosive. The vibes for the offensive line are really good right now. So I don't know. I just kind of do feel like this might be a resurgent Patrick Mahomes season. So Rashid could really be the beneficiary of that. I just want to ask really quick about Xavier Worthy.

I think we kind of priced him as if he would be. Yes. The quote of quote, this was going to happen. for six games. I feel like I'm accidentally the highest person Xavier Worthy.

I'm fine taking him as your like fifth pick. I love Xavier War. I don't think you have to but I feel like I just like him more than other people.

I don't know. I just think he's going to be an NFL player. I think he's going to be a guy that always gets schemed touches but I,

it's like, I like drafting wide receivers where I'm like, could Ricky Pearson be a guy who gets 12 targets a game? Yes.

I don't think Xavier Worthy has that. Right. And so I'm like, even though it's the Chiefs and Mahomes they have a much better deep passing game, all that stuff. He's still in that, like, James and Williams kind of like, he will be schemed into the offense.

He's not just like they will pepper him every game type guy. I think that's why he has somewhat of a ceiling for me. Same. Yeah, I agree. I think he's, and especially if you look at last year when he started to come on strong, he was running a lot of the Rishi-Rice-style routes. So how long is he going to have his value of Rish-Rice is back after week six or week seven?

So, I don't know. It's really hard. It's tough to know his role. It's tough to know whether he's really good or if he just kind of, you know, came on strong last season. There's more weapons in the offense now. I don't know.

So the other one you mentioned, Craig, Adam Thieland traded from the Panthers to the Vikings. I don't, I think some people are like, oh, does this mean anything for Tetaroa McMillan, the Panthers receiver they took in the first round? I think no. Mustard he puts on that. How am I supposed to say?

Tetaroa. Tederoa. Yes. Really? That's it. Teto Roa is really hard. It's an A and I, I don't know. It's an O and an I, I think, isn't it?

Or the AI. No, it's TETA. Regardless, it's just say Teteroa. Okay, so I can just say Teteroa? Yeah. Sure. All right, yeah, I'll do that. That seems way easier.

You don't have to say croissant. All right, Teteroa. All right, Tetero, if his mom tells me I'm doing it wrong, I'm going to blame you. I'm going to say Craig told me to her wrong. We can do that. We can do that. If his mom moves out to you, you can give her my email. I'm sorry, Mrs. Macmillon.

Anyway, Tehran. He's going to email you. Anyway, there's nothing new to Tederoa McMillan. I think the Panthers basically have a lot of faith in Jalen Koker, who's the undrafted free agent. They signed last year who's just better than Xavier Leger who took the first round. So I think they basically think Jalen Koker can play that their team and have Justin Jefferson as the number one.

Jordan Addison is suspended for the first three games in the season for the wet reckless charge. Right. So, and they looked at it and they're like, Jalen Naylor, I don't know, is number two. J. G. McCarthy's Urki. And I just think they're like, yeah, Adam Thieland, can you play three games for us and then be our third receiver? D.K. How old is Adam? Dealing now?

34? So old. How old is he? He is 35. He just turned 35, five days ago. Hey, congrats to Adam. He's basically 34. Just like I'm basically 30.

Basically 36. D.K., Koker, Jalen Koker. He's like fringe going undrafted. Does this change anything? Is he now become like a late round dart throw for you? Yeah, I think so. I think he's shown enough in the limited amount

we've seen him that he has a good connection with Bryce Young. there was a preseason game I think their first or second preseason game there was a play where Bryce Young rolled out to the right nobody was open and he was like communicating with Koker and Koker ran basically got open and went the opposite direction

against the green in the back of the end zone he found him I think that was just like a good example of their connection he will be, Koker will be in the NFL longer than Xavier Ligat yeah I mean I wouldn't be that surprised about it he was very obviously the Holy Cross thing is

who knows like what it's hard to like extrapolate his production at Holy Cross to the NFL. With the Crusaders, I mean, that was thousands of years, wasn't it? But obviously, you know, people were interested in him in the dynasty streets and fantasy because of his production in college, his size, 6-1, 2-13. I think, and then this obviously clears a way for him to play in the slot, primarily early on the season. So, I mean, he's going to be a starter probably for them. I think, yeah, you can play Coker.

Coker's probably like, honestly, he's probably up there with, like, Romeo Dubs, to the Packers is like the worst player would probably play like all the time that you could put in your lineup and not be embarrassed. And feeling same thing but for the first three games of the season while Addison's out. Lions traded Tim Patrick to the Jaguars. I don't think this means anything for fantasy other than

just remember when we made fun of the Lasix for Slah. They traded up to Isaac Tesla who other teams have in the sixth. I hate Tesla. Tesla. God. I wish it was Tesla.

Dude no, it's actually it's actually. You know his mom. Reach out. You can email me. It's Tesla. Tesla. I couldn't, you know, there was something, man.

Miss. Sometimes you got to shoot, shoot or shoot. This has been a two week trip, man. You know, like, day two, I would have been like on it. I don't know what they. Day 12, I'm losing it. You tried. I actually respect.

I respect the attack. I knew there was something there, but now, is this how players feel they have to retire? I'm like, I can see the opening. Sometimes you just throw up a brick, you know? I feel like we talked about in the last episode that all of the rookie wide receivers getting a lot of hype, the Matthew Golden's, the Ibuka, all that stuff.

They're going super high in drafts. All of the preseason hype, the training camp stuff, like the value's been stripped away. I would say the only guy who has gotten a tremendous amount of preseason hype that is not translating to where he's getting selected in drafts is Isaac Tesla. It's because no one wanted to admit he was good on draft day. And then it's kind of like how I basically was like, I changed my mind on Travis Hunter and you're like, you're a bitch.

Yeah. Why change your mind? He's in the NFL yet. Yeah. So I think no one's willing to admit that they were wrong in this guy. I'm willing to admit I was wrong on this. Already. Yeah, yeah.

He's sick. hasn't played a game yet You guys know You guys know I'm just waiting for Brad Holmes is feeling himself as a GM I mean there's nobody who like You know

Talks shit to the media As much as Brad Holmes Like he's so offended if we think he made a bad trade Or bad pick or whatever But he was kind of talking about How his scouts didn't want the picks he made That he made anyway And then those guys were good and fuck them

But he can't say fuck them My take on all GMs is a little bit like They all kind of go back to the mean at some point and like Brad Holmes is on one of the all-time kickers that's your day. Yeah 100%. He's on one of the all-time heaters for a GM I've ever seen in my life. Chad GPT could be a GM.

And so anyway when he- I know a couple GMs basically just grok. Yeah. Didn't he trade like three third round picks to move up to get to Slawe? Which if you like look at the actual total of the trade, it's like almost giving up a first round or whatever. So do you think he should now 100% be drafted?

I don't know about that. I don't know about that. I don't know a deep league. I meant more. A normal 10-12 team league. Should have been driving. 10-team, no way. He's a party way for a. I would say, I mean, look, if Jameson Williams gets hurt,

Slav becomes a priority. But I think right now, Jameson Williams is going to be much more. 10 or 12 teams, it's more like if he does something in week one, he's probably going to be our number one receiver. Anything deeper than that or in a dynasty league, like, yeah, you should probably get this guy. Like, he's going to just be a thing. Mainly what I was saying, Craig, is that I was wrong.

He was right. He's good looking. I'm not attractive. You're convinced he's good. So what if he's bad? If he's bad, would you say, I actually always knew that? Or will you have to say, I was wrong again?

I'll have to go. I'll have to do that. Actually, you know what? I was originally right. No, you can't do that. The emotional toll. I can't do that? No, because you're admitting you were wrong.

So now that's the new base. So now that he's bad. Everything I said before now is moving. Because then now you can't lose. But you feel it's a bubble on a scantron. No, I'm losing. I'm fucking admitting I'm wrong.

It never happens next, you can't lose. Because if he's good, you're like, yeah, it changed my mind. But then if he's bad, you're like, well, I always thought he was bad. Well, he's not bad. He's good, man. Have you seen it? Until he's bad. Look how fast he moves.

The other one I want to mention, Caleb and Gary, the right tackle for the Falcons, is going to miss the season. It turns out. He just signed a contract extension. That sucks. I think it does suck. So he... I'm upset about this. I know.

So he's the right tackle for the Falcons, which is weirdly important because Michael Pennix is one of the few lefties in the NFL. So he's actually the blindside protector. I would argue. It's not that weird. Unweirdly. You're left. I think that never comes up on the show.

Oh, that is true. Yeah. Left-handed bias in the world. It's kind of prejudice against us. That is true. We can't cut scissors. We can't cut with scissors. The scissors is so weird.

It's a real thing. It's a real thing. It's a real thing. Emails that ring your fantasy. I can't find some fucking scissors that fit me. We get the lead on our hand. You know what's funny too. You're dragging your hand across.

You're sneering the page. The other thing that's the only thing that's like objective. And when right he's here, no one gives a shit. I don't care. You know what always was annoying was in class? You know those desks in like elementary school, middle school, whatever? They only have the one arm and it's always the right arm.

Yeah, yeah. You always like have the elbow hanging off the desk. Why didn't your dad do a two-a-thing and make you right-handed? Because that's cruel. You know, it's so funny. Even the most like liberal-inclusive people in the world. Because that's child cruelty. Even the most liberal-inclusive people in the world, don't give a fuck if you're lefty.

I don't care about your problems. It's not actually a real problem. I know, but it's funny. E-mails of ringer fantasy football at g-gimil.com, if you're lefty problems. I want to hear the lefty things I wouldn't think about your issues. It is filled with inconveniences. It's so funny. Question, do you golf lefty?

No. You golf righty. Yeah. Do you throw lefty? Yeah. Do you shoot lefty? Yeah. A right lefty.

Do you bat lefty? No. You're bat righty and you golf right. Is that because you were talking to bat righty? I have a take that I actually think swinging something right-handed is actually swinging it left-handed. Phil Mickelson feels this way too. What? Okay.

Because here's what I'll say. That lefty question that Craig just had actually continued. for so long that we picked it up and moved it to the end of the episode. So you can go and listen. It's going to be out of order because we kind of felt a little guilty. People are going to be upset about the take. I'm sure they'll be like, you're an idiot. So we're going to pick that up and drop it in later.

So skip ahead, I guess. But anyway, yeah, so Michael Panix Jr. is a lefty. And so the right tackle is the left tackle, kind of like Craig's take. And so anyway, Storm Norton, who's the other backup swing tackle with the Falcons is also, I know, God. Another storm. I wish he was better for the war. Who forms in the NFL?

That's crazy. So anyway, Storm talking. Storm Norton. Anyway, Storm Norton had an ankle surgery, so he's out two months. So the backup's going to be Elijah Wilkinson, who's like this 30-year-old journeyman. He's actually started like 40 games in the NFL. But so I guess he'll be right tackle. I feel like Bijan, well, I don't want to influence you guys. Fourth pick is on the board.

The first three picks are like Jamar Chase, Sake Juan, Jamir Gibbs. You're still taking Bejohn-Robbins at fourth, right, D-K, even with this news? I don't think that's controversial. I mean, he's still going to get the volume. He's still going to be explosive. It's just like a little more worrisome now, particularly to me for Pennix, less so for Bejohn. I think the question is now, does Drake London,

is that now enough for you to take like a different player of a Drake London and like the second round or something? Slight downgrade. But not anything major. Like what, if you're like deciding between AJ Brown and Drake London now maybe you would lean AJ Brown?

Maybe, yeah. It's like a tiebreaker, I guess, but not really. I'm not moving him down to see that again. Yeah, I don't know. I kind of don't think I'm doing a whole lot. I think it's okay. I think it's fine. Says now and then Michael Pennix

is going to get like smashed in week one and obliterated. From his blind side. I'm going to be like, oh, I guess lefties actually lefty. Bejohn misses the block, gets benched. It's like a calamity. Okay, this is the most important news of all. So I saw this.

We're at the era of media where I saw this and just kind of thought it was like fake. I did too. I thought you guys were punking. So I actually just couldn't. I just scrolled past. I was like, that didn't happen. So I guess Bill Belichick and Jordan Hudson filed a trademark. Is her name really Jordan?

Jordan? I actually don't know how to say it. I always assumed everybody's just kind of making fun of everybody. It's George de Warroa. Because it's O-N. It's not A-N. So everyone's saying Jordan is it. So.

Okay. I don't know. Got it. I would be surprised if her name is Jordan. But maybe. It's just Jordan. I don't know. Nothing would surprise me.

It's like people say Oregon. But the point being, so she signed, they tried to file a trademark for Gold Digger, which I mean, that's just incredible. No, here's a. I'm going to say this one out. In her defense. Look at how she spells.

her name on Instagram. It's a J-O-R-D with the O is capitalized. Oh, wow. Is she leaning in or has it always been that way? No.

That is the question. Well, here's my question. I'm sitting the gold digger thing. I can't. Do you think, here's my question. With the gold digger thing, do you think that she didn't know

that Kanye West has a song named Golddigger because she wasn't born when that song came out? Is that right? No, but it sounds true. It's close enough. She was like three years old

when that song came out. The point is it was close enough. people should stop trying to get trademarks trademarking things that existed before you were alive is preposterous right it's like a common expression yeah like I said I'm gonna sit this one I hate everything about it you can't

you're on a podcast here's the deal I'm not allowing you to sit this out I just like hate everything about this I hate that they're like leaning into the bit this actually is like more and more convincing me that he's senile like I don't know what's going on how is he allowing that So wait, so we're asking the wrong question here.

How the fuck is he allowing this? We're asking the wrong question here. He's going to start a jewelry company, correct, that they want to watch? Oh, that's, oh, that's smart. I know, but I'm like, God. That's brilliant. You market it to the women who are dating really rich 80-year-old men. That's smart.

Maybe he truly just, like, has no idea that any of this is happening, and he's not online. It's not on the internet. He's like unaware this is a problem. He's just like not online. No one's told them. Honestly, maybe. Maybe. Because this is shocking.

The second, if I were him, the second I would see this. That's a great thing. It would be hell to pay. to beg. What should we file a trademark for something? What's the funniest thing we could file a trademark for? We're like, we invented this. Pardon my take.

God. What is, I'm trying to, if they could do this phrase, what's the, I mean, Russell Wilson tried to do like. Sleeper. Sleeper. We trademark sleeper. We invented it. Ladma honky. Thank God we invented that.

That's pretty good, actually. Email us at ringer fantasy football at g-gumel.com. Anyone can help us with patents or IP and how to do that. to file a patent, please put that in the email of like patent help or trademark help. We're going to try to file a trademark. Email us also, if you are in a lawyer, email us ideas that we should try and trademark.

And I do want to see what's the thread the needle here of what's the funniest thing we could trade mark that we shot at? No, I want larger than that. I'm just spit out. Football? Ideas. Belichick. Can we get the rights to the name? Jordan.

Jordan. Now you're just talking about extortion. Jordan. Now you're just talking about extortion. Jordan. Yeah. Oh, my God. Anyway, I just... What is she doing that?

I don't know, man. Okay, all, let's get into the guys we're not drafting. And, uh... Yeah, it's like every year, there's the kind of guys that we just want to be honest, that even when we're in our... We have our rankings, and then, like, guys come and, like, fuck every time.

You know what? I hate myself. That one did jump out to me. I didn't... I did clock that. Whatever, man. You know what? I'm so tired.

My brain doesn't work. You guys fucking do the segment. Okay. The first player, that I am not drafting this year. And again, this is all relative. If this person was going dead last in drafts of it. When they show up at cost, we're like, yeah.

Exactly. It's just like basically the idea is you see them in the rankings. You see them in the draft room or whatever. They're there when you're drafting, but no part of you ever even considers taking them at that spot. Yeah. Yeah. It's like they don't exist.

My first one is Baker Mayfield, who I just think is going way too high. He's going as the QB7, 72nd overall. So it's like the seventh eighth round. this is his eighth offensive coordinator in eight seasons. God. God, that is, him and Jalen Hertz

are both, they haven't had the same coordinator in like 10 years. Yeah, it's honestly, it's kind of a boring argument, to be honest, it's just like regression. Right. If you look at Baker's first six seasons, touchdown rate is a really, like, easy way

to kind of tell if somebody played better than they should have one year. Or if they were like an outlier. Had an outlier season. Touchdown rate is just literally what percentage of your passes end up as touchdowns. Baker Mayfield's average for the first six seasons of his career was four and a half percent, which is like pretty solid, normal.

Last year was 7.1, which is really high. It was second in the league. It was only behind Lamar. For context, 7.1. Patrick Baum's has done that one time in his career. Joe Burrow has never done that. Josh Allen has never done that. Jerry Goff's never done that.

And I was actually listening to J.J. Zacharison on his podcast earlier today. And he was mentioning Baker Mayfield in this touchdown percentage, and there's basically been 15 guys. I'll try to remember this correctly. There's been 15 guys since 2011 who have had around a 7% touchdown rate. They averaged 21 points a game that year. The next year, their average was 17 points a game in the year.

So they drop basically like 20% of their points. And the point being also 15 is about 15 years. One guy a year does this. Baker happened to be the guy last year, and the odds that it's Baker again is actually more or less equal to the odds of guys going seven or eight rounds later. Yes.

So it's like there is, I actually think he is by far, the worst value at quarterback. And you should be taking Dak Prescott, Jordan Love, Justin Herbert, all of those guys are equally as likely, in my opinion, to produce a big season. Right.

To be clear, we're not saying Baker, like, Baker's really fun to root for us and a fun story. It's a great team. We're just saying it's closer to his ceiling than his floor. And again, to me, it's really simple. I just did, my oldest league, we did the draft. Baker went in the seventh round. Dak Prescott went in the 13th round. That's on Sleeper, where the quarterbacks are ranked a little lower than, like, you know, the guy who has the quarterbacks higher, so it depends.

But the point being, what the odds Baker out does DAC. The answer is it's not a six round difference. It's not a 60 player difference. No, I mean, if you had to pick one team to lead the league in points, are you picking the bucks or the Cowboys? Exactly. And so the other part of it and the other thing J.J.

Zach Reeson talks about all the time is just the reason rushing quarterbacks go high is not just because rushing points are worth more. It's easier to predict because there's no Jared Goff is not going to just run for 500 yards. It's not, we know who is fast and who is a good runner or not. The pocket passers, whether you throw for a lot of yards and touchdowns is not dependent on skill.

It's dependent on skill. A million other things. Your offensive environment and the need to do it because your defense collapsing either through lack of talent or injuries and you need to throw a lot, running game off. Like Joe Burrow could do what he did last year again, but if the Bengals had the best defense in the NFL, the Bengals wouldn't want Joe Burrow to have to do it again. And so that's kind of the point.

I think it's random. The other thing to add it here is you probably would, I don't know if your take would be quite this strong for Baker if Cohen was still there. Yeah. And he's, I mean, obviously, he's losing his. And it's like Josh Grizzard. You could take... Josh Grizzard.

Are you really like... I mean, Josh Grizzard might end up being the next Sean McBage. We don't know. If his name was like Josh Nelson, would you not feel this way? Right, yes. Grizzard. Grisard. King Gizzard and the Lizard Woodard?

All right. Next guy here, D.K. Lizard Lick? What is he from Lizard Lick? Another guy you're not drafting. I'm capitulating a little bit here. And I'm not drafting D.K. Metcalfe this year. Really?

Well, you guys warm me down a little. Former favorite player on the Seahawks. Yeah, I mean, obviously he got traded from the Seahawks. Even last year, he wasn't a good value. In fact, he was probably not helping you much. Okay. Relative to what you're expecting last year, he was a wide receiver 33, 10 points per game. That's not very good in the big scheme of things.

I have PPR. There's a lot of guys. There's a lot of receivers that can get you that. And he did that on a 19% target rate. More than what happened last year, though, I'm just like concerned about this offense with the series this year. I think there's just a lot of weird ingredients to make this all work together. You got Arthur Smith and Aaron Rogers together, which I'm very excited to see how this goes.

I just first of all from a, you know, like if you like watching reality TV, that to me feels like a good. It's like throw a couple like very opinionated weird people together. I can't think of real world season one or whatever. Two people more prepared to give less fucks than Aaron Rogers and then Arthur Smith, whose father founded FedEx and is probably worth billions of dollars. Like, neither of them give a shit.

And then obviously you have, you know, Mike Tomlin, the head coach who's trying to like smooth everything out and whatever. D.K. McCaff, in his own right, is kind of a mercurial person,

personality. He's like, Tsiuk fans kind of got sick of him because he kept getting in fights, getting penalties all the time. Like, there is a very, like,

the situation where Aaron Rogers gets really fed up with D. D.K. McHaff, to me, feels likely. So anyways, there's just a lot of weird ingredients here. And he's going to be really volatile. I also, the thing with Metcalf, I still have yet to hear an explanation of why this Steelers' offense will be different than just like probably a better version of what Rothesberger was at the end when he couldn't move.

The park and bark. And Rogers is going to run a park and bark offense where again, I know I keep saying this, but no under center, which so there's no play action. So no under center running game means you're running everything out of shotgun, which makes the running game worse. but then also because Rogers won't take hits every the ball is coming out fast so the receivers, sorry the secondary is playing up which also makes the running game hard but it also makes the quick throws harder

because they're not expecting it. So if you have to kind of figure out how are we going to protect long enough to get the deep shots we want and here's my other issue and how is D.K. Metcalfe really going to do on these slants and these quick routes that Rogers wants to run like is that really

DK. Metcalfe's game? I feel like he's going to have these like calculated. You can do it but I don't think that's like his core like talent. So who's doing? He's a explosive, explosive vertical threat. And so maybe they're going to figure out ways to have two and three tight end sets to make, and again, you know, they're aware of all this. I just, there's just, to your point, there's a lot of different

ways this Steelers season could go wrong on offense. And maybe there's two or three it goes right. What if there's just like a beautiful symphony that somehow just works? Maybe. If you don't think about it, you can kind of convince yourself that he falls into the Calvin Ridley, like, well, it's kind of just him. He's the only guy. Yeah, yeah. But I most I agree with you. Same reason with the Steelers' offense. I kind of just keep passing on Caleb Johnson,

the running back at Iowa. I think that he's like a guy that if you haven't thought about it since the draft because it was like, oh, Zone Runner needs to go to Zone team. Steelers love Zone. Arthur Smith, great. And we were like, damn, we comp Caleb Johnson. The fit is good. We comp Caleb Johnson, Derek Henry. He's a good next year pick, I think. Yeah, exactly. My joke of Caleb Johnson is that he's Derek Henry before the two years where Derek Henry was fine and nobody remembers it

and nobody deletes it. But Caleb Johnson and me, it's a combination of a rookie needing to impress Aaron Rogers enough to be on the field, which is like a strike one, needing to protect him at all times because Aaron Rogers can't get hit. Also, like, it is a little more nuanced to read blocks from shotgun instead of under center. Like, that is not quite the same. It's not, like, Madden. You just put a guy in, like, a little harder.

And Arthur Smith, Arthur Smith infamously wasn't playing Kyle Pitts over Johnny Smith, which I get, Bijan Robinson was getting mixed in with Alger. Like, this is not Bejan Robinson. It was a top ten pick. Like, this is a guy who was a third round pick. You have Jalen Warren there. Like, they have Kenneth Gainwell might be playing. Like, Kenneth Gainwell might be playing.

over Caleb Johnson in week one. And Caleb Johnson, there's a world where Caleb Johnson is closer in week one to like Trey Benson in Arizona or like Braylin Allen on the Jets instead of like the starting running back for the Steelers. And he's going in a range next to Jalen Warren. I'm like man, Jailen Warren. So I just don't mind. I was going to ask actually

like, does being out on Caleb Johnson make you in on Jalen Warren? I think he's a boring back that could be a pretty good value. Yeah, he's a boring guy, a Glansberg, a guy you don't think about. Like he's just, and Glansberg's a joke for players we end up not talking about all season. I don't think Jailin Warren has like, He's kind of small hit, small miss, so we haven't talked about Jill and Warren a lot.

I agree. But he's probably like a Kirkland brand Tony Pollard or something. But I don't, I just, overall, you don't have to hate Aaron Rogers personally or politically or whatever to be like this also could work,

but the Steelers offense just might be hard to watch and Caleb Johnson will be a rookie trying to break into an offense that's hard to watch. And I'm like, I don't want any part of this. So we'll see. Yeah. I'm okay being wrong that Aaron Rodgers.

If Aaron Rogers is an incredible season, the short answer is like, I don't need to be in on that. I will. You're going to be happy for him. Also, even if Aaron Rogers has an incredible season, that doesn't necessarily mean Caleb Johnson will have a good season.

Yes, exactly. So that's like, yeah, I agree. I do agree with you. The next guy who's on my do not draft list is Terry McLaurin. We've talked about him a little bit this offseason. He's just another natural regression candidate. He's going as a top 20-wide receiver. He's going in the top 50 of drafts.

Look, he caught 13 touchdowns last year. Before that, he was averaging five a season for the first six years of his career. So it basically, it was a tremendous. outlier season for him in the red zone. If you look at all the other underlying statistics, he was 34th in targets per game. He was 24th in yards per game. And that was before they had Debo.

They didn't really have much target competition last year at all. No, and they also didn't throw the ball a whole lot. They were bottom seven and pass rate. Anthony Lynn, Cliff Kingsbury gets all this credit in Washington, but Anthony Lennon is the run game coordinator. He really changed that team. Yeah. So this is just kind of like a plain and simple.

Plus, he missed a lot of training camp in this whole inn, so he may be a little bit behind. Yeah, I think him as the top 20 guy, I mean, even considering what he did last year, he was still only the wide receiver 15. You had 13 touchdowns, and he was barely a top 15 wide receiver. So you're basically, you need that to happen again for him to kind of return the value. Right. And the other thing about Terry, it's not just that he had 13 touchdowns, which was the most in history. And again, it's the least fun fantasy analysis.

Oh, won't score that much again. But the nature of his scores were fun to watch. They were all walkoff game-winning touchdowns. I mean, dropping his arms. I agree. The Cowboys. It was the Bengals. And this is when we realized

Jane Daniels was him. That was out of control. This is the one where I did a story on the resurgence. Oh, you were talking about the corner of the end zone one. The corner of the end zone. That was the moment I was like,

Jaden has it? Yeah, we were like, another one against the Cowboys, some late game. Or maybe it wasn't a touchdown. The Cowboys was weird because then Terp and returned the game. They lost that game actually,

Washington did. But Jayden Davis led a game winning drive and then Turpin returned to kickoff for a touchdown, which didn't happen that much last year. So they ended up losing. But yeah, he had another one to Terry. And again, if you really believe, like if you're Washington family,

you wonder if Terry McLarenke, your team's good, go for it. But overall, what we're saying is Terry's the first receiver you're going to take that it's hard for us to be like, he's going to join the Pukua range of like, yeah, not only we have 13 touchdowns again, he'll have 400 more yards. It's just like hard to get there,

but it's very easy to be like, yeah, he'll have the same season with four fewer touchdowns. It's still good for him in real life, but not going to, it's just replaceable. Bowl two rounds later. It's got to be annoying, I think, if you're a commander's fan this offseason. Like, for them to almost make the damn Super Bowl, and everyone's like, eh, they're my pick to not make the playoffs.

Oh, I don't feel bad at all. I'm just saying, and then, like, Flipside is like the Broncos squeak into the playoffs get fucking destroyed, and everyone's like, Broncos, sleeper Super Bowl pick. Meanwhile, the commanders and Jane Daniels is like, he's probably like a Hall of Fame quarterback, and everyone's like, they're not going to make the playoffs. Everyone agrees. Well, no, everyone agrees in Jane Daniels. I don't know.

My thing with Washington's very simple. I know. They're old team. The oldest team in the NFL. I'm just saying it's probably a little annoying. In the same way that everybody got mad at D.K. for not mentioning Jalen Hertz first as like one of the best Eagles players after they won the Super Bowl. I have to imagine it's a little annoying that it is the trendy pick to choose the commanders to miss the players.

You know what else is annoying? Tommy DeVito won two games for the Giants and sent Jadeners to a division rival. So if Washington fans are upset that I'm saying this, you know what? I'll trade you. Jadenham for Jackson Dart. Hydenz is basically saying that if your team is good, you're not allowed to complain about anything ever. He just doesn't feel bad for you. Yeah, no, that's it.

Yeah, you complain. I just don't give a shit. All I said is it's probably annoying for them. That's fair. You're right. I'm just getting jaded because the Yankees. The Giants are the worst team, literally by record points,

everything with the Jets less, like since I've been an adult. And the Yankees somehow made the World Series only to have the worst ending in the history of the World Series. And now they're, you know what, whatever? No one gives a shit. So you're complaining about the Yankees made the World Series?

They actually, I mean, they somehow made that unsatisfying. because they actually were like they're it's the you know what let's not go okay what no one gives a shit whatever um no one feels bad for yankees fans uh correct no one yeah whatever fuck that's like the last team of all time yeah yeah you know what you know what what are you saying no one feels bad for me that's my point week one of college football is finally here and fandal is kicking things off with a no sweat bet just for you that means you can place any bet on college football this week and if it doesn't hit you get it back in bonus bets whether you're riding with your alma mater or backing

a top 10 matchup, Fandle has you covered with live betting game props alternate lines and more I am kind of obsessed with the fact that Arch Manning is going to be playing versus Ohio State and I think they'll probably get rock but I'm not going to lie

Eli Manning won me two Super Bowls and you know what I'm riding with the family so I'm betting on Arch Manning and I kind of just want to have a little skin in the game and the fact that isn't Texas like the first number one seed to be underdogs in like 20 years, something crazy? Which they, I mean, both sounds right. Like, I don't know if you automatically... It's like, how can you be the number one seat

if you're not favored in the first game of season? It's a funny test because Ohio State... The number one ranked team? Yeah. People get mad when the national champion loses all their good players. Like, I mean, Abuka and Henderson, all these guys. Like, I mean, Will Howard, like, everyone loses. Like, oh, you're automatically number one.

But it's also funny that... I don't know. It's a funny thing. So, yeah, I just kind of want to bet on Arch in particular. Like, you want to take Texas? It's weird because I guess when I sit there in the number of team, but they feel like the underdog. They literally are.

If Archmanning comes in and throws for 400 yards, like that's cool. I will say, if Archmanning gets wall, like no matter what happens, it's cool for content. But I do, that game is going to be awesome. So, yeah, I'm rolling with Archman. I think the world will be a little more fun. If Archmanning's actually cool,

actually good at football. So bet confidently, because with a no-swept bet, even your first miss comes with a second chance. Download the Fandel app now or head to fendle.com slash ringer fantasy to get started. Must be 21 plus and present in select states or 18 plus and present in D.C., Kentucky, or Wyoming.

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All right. This one's probably pretty obvious, but I do feel like he's been getting a lot of hype as a post-type sleeper type player, Mark Andrews,

tied in for the Ravens. I hate this. I love Mark. I mean, I thought you changed your mind on Mark Andrews and you were kind of in now. You're out?

He's waiting until week one. No, I'm out. He's just one of those players when, like, you know, when you're in the draft, I just can't do it. I can't, like,

decide to do it. It's too many, like, things pulling me the other direction. I'm like, I'll look at other guys around that spot. Plus, like, if you look at our rankings, players that are going around him, RJ Harvey, Pollard, Pacheco, Omeca-Buka, Travis Hunter, Ricky Pearsall, Matthew Golden. These are guys that are going in, like, the round where Mark Andrews is going. I just can't get excited to draft him.

And it's not just because of, like, the previous bit I've had where he gives me the ick because he's volleyball setting touchdowns into the stands, or that he dropped, you know, the game tie, it would have been the game tying two point conversion to eliminate the Ravens last year. It's more just like the production was fraudulent or fraudulent. Fraudulent may be a little too strong. It was, it's due to regress. If you look at the underlying metrics, uh, after Weeks 1 through 4. So weeks 1 through 4 is coming off of a car accident. He had internal injuries or something. And he had tightrope surgery the year before that I think was under

disgust, including by us. And so he was a combination of we're still recovering from the injury And then he got into car crash. So he was like the worst, literally the worst player you were putting in your lineup the first half. One of the best second half. After the first month, he was the tight end five, or sorry, in total points. And then tight in seven and points per game. However. You're saying from October on.

Yeah, not absolutely. The first month, he like caught no passes. He was historically bad. I think you said after. Well, whatever I said, after he got over his injuries. Then he was great. Top five guys. We caught 11 touchdowns in like the last 10 weeks.

Yes. But he was literally, he like led the burn book for every. week for the first month of the season. He scored less than 10 points total in the first month of the season. The biggest question we got the first two months was can I cut Mark Andrews? And a lot of people did.

And we were like, you probably shouldn't. But he was valuable in the rest of the season. I get that. And he was a good waiver wire pickup after everybody dropped him. I acknowledge that. But the 11 touchdowns, I think, hid the underlying metrics, which was, you know, his snap rate,

61%, which is 26th among tight ends. He's not getting a ton of snap. Isaiah likely is not he's not gone he's injured right now but he's coming back high ankle he's coming back though he I like earlyish in the season and then even after week five so basically everything after that that first month where he didn't really do anything he still only had a 16% target rate so I hear so I hear everything you're saying volatile I just needs touchdowns to be valuable this is a good example of a war shock test it's just like well I guess that's not what it is but just different people can look at the same

thing and see different two different things everything you're saying is correct I would just pause at this last the simplest version As last year, Mark Andrews was the, and this is in every sport, fantasy football, fantasy baseball always has this. Someone who's the worst in the first half and the best in second half. I just think it might be reversed for him because Isaiah likely having this surgery that, frankly, the snap thing, I think Mark Andrews is going to play a ton of snap thing. And he has some nagging thing right now, but I think they're still going to platoon him. No, Isaiah likely has in practice. He's a foot issue.

Kohler. No, I think Mark, not as a receiver. Those are blocking tightets. I just think Mark Andrews is going to have a huge snap count rate in the first six weeks of the season. and he's actually going to get a ton of stuff, he will have the touchdowns. Because again, you know it's not a red zone threat? Zay Flowers.

I'm like, if they play DeAndre Hopkins is the red zone, sure. But I actually think Mark Andrews is the number one target at the red zone. I think when I say likely around, call it Halloween, is back to full strength or whatever. I think it's going to be two months into the season?

I mean, it's your foot. He's a receiver. It's not just, one, it's cardio. But it's already been like a month. Yeah, but I mean, it's your foot. I'm just speculating on his return, but it feels like that feels aggressive. I'm not a doctor,

but it's, one, you have to get back literal shape. Like you have to be an NFL level shape. Not likely. He's too good. He doesn't even know. Oh, I literally thought you were saying like, that's not likely. Likely.

I'm just saying that like, I think the Mark Andrews thing is like what you're, I just think he'll have a good, he's more likely of a good first half and a lesser second half than anything, which is ironic. I mean, that might be true. I'm just like doing the thing High Fitz does all the time. Like enjoy that on your team. I'm not going to do that. Okay.

That's fair. The other thing I think that is worth talking about here is, you. You just got done talking about touchdown rate. Lamar Jackson was number one in touchdown right last year. I think he threw 41 touchdowns. You don't think you'll have 10 touchdown passes for every reception again? He was like almost 9% touchdown rate. What was it?

41 touchdowns. Literally 41 to 4. 41 touchdowns four picks. Every time Craig says he should win the MVP, I'm like no. And then- Lamar is one of the players you probably least expect to regress significantly because he's just an outlier in general. But he's probably not going to do that again.

He's probably not going to have like a 9% touchdown rate. So I don't know. I'm just like you're betting. too much on this insane efficiency in the red zone and touchdowns every week. Mark Andrews or Travis Kelsey? This is like one of those where it's like a trick question because I probably have Mark Andrews ranked higher, but I think I would rather take Kelsey a little later. This is the point of exercise.

I would just stay away from tight ends at the area and take someone later. This is what we're doing. This is what we're talking about. It's like, yeah, there are just other positions we'd rather have with these guys of these spots. I'll take a rookie receiver in that spot and hope for a thousand yards or whatever. On that note, I want to talk about just while we're shitting on. people's favorite teams here

between my Giants and your Steelers. Kenneth Walker for the Seahawks is a guy that I just don't see any more in drafts and I hate to say it because I like him. He's so high variance I totally get that. I love, it's too bad because this is everything I like about it. I like the Kenneth Walker. I like the way he plays. I think he's actually per route, like or just per run like one of the most visually

distinctive players. Yeah. It's very rare to see a bow-legged. Yeah, you just see something you don't ever see a football field. It's unbelievable. Dude, he did that suplex that. I mean, Totally does all my shit. That's wild. The Sequan's reverse hurdle market corrected, Ken Walker is just doing

the thing I never seen in a football field where he did the Suplex thing. Anyway, the point is... It's like a fucking flip. It was unbelievable. I never seen anything like it. It was like legitimately a wrestling move. Yeah, it was crazy. But I just, I believe in the Seahawks offense.

I do think the coordinator changed from Ryan Grubb last year to Clint Kubiak this year in the offensive line. I do kind of buy the argument that they have the talent, the scheme shift. I do think the Seahawks could be that quiet juggernaut, the team that makes the leap like the lines a couple years ago. I think it could be the Seahawks with everything, like great defense running the ball.

My issue is, very simple. I don't want to use my fourth pick on Ken Walker, who just always has foot issues. Seems like, I'm not a doctor, seems like he will have to have a foot issue kind of managed all season with practice workloads. He's also got like oblique issues, which is actually more worrisome to me. It's just a leg. It's like, it's like these legs, for him, I believe it's always the right leg and it's like ankle.

It's accumulated. The bone. Exactly. Hip bone connected to the... Shin bone. To the foot, whatever. What is the song? The point is the way your weight distributes, eventually everything, everything affects everything.

Are you actually Googling that song right now? The hip bones connected to the... Leg bone. Is it leg bone? What are we going to say? Fiener. It's for five-year-olds. Side bone.

What is the leg bone kind of? All the ghosts are just screaming right now. Is the leg to shin? Is it hip-to-wing? No, there's another leg bone. There's your knee. Your shin isn't below your knee. I'm asking what the song is.

I never know the lyrics. I actually physically can't. There's an understanding what I'm saying. I don't know how the lyrics go. That's what we're doing. That's what we're trying to figure out. Footbone. Footbone connected to the heel bone.

This is what I'm seeing. I don't remember all this, but. It is thigh. Eat shit, hyphids. You said shin. I said thigh. And then shin. Oh, fuck, aren't you right?

Eat shin. Telling someone to eat. shit is just fucking hit. We should break insults one day in power. It really does just like feel good in your soul. Eat shit.

It works for every generation too. Eat shit. I feel like you can do that for boomers and for Gen Z. It works for everyone. Eat shit. It's great. Anyway, Ken Bones, bones are all connected and like Ken Walker. No, Ken Bones, the guy who googled the sex.

Was it Ken Bones guy with? Pregnant Lady porn or something? I don't know. Look, Craig, we don't judge. All right. that's fair. Ken Bone. He just like, you know. Look at Ken Bone. Don't sue me, Ken Bone.

Ken Bone can come on the show. Ken Bone. Anyway, I like him. His name is Ken Bone. Kay Bone. Kay bone. He is the human Kbone. He is K-bone.

He's K-bon. Also your favorite person. Kay-Bone. Kenbone. Ahead of his time. Now we'd be like, don't king's shame, Kenbone. I was going to say, he's not like actually canceled, right? He just got...

No, no. It was just like, we found a... porn online and now it's like, oh, whatever. He was the originator of milkshake duck, wasn't he? Yeah, no, the problem is at the time that was a skis. This is the, what did you call me? Do you know the origination of milkshake duck? There was like a famous tweet.

It was basically like, oh, I don't know it like by heart, whatever, but it was like, oh, milkshake duck. The duck is drinking a milkshake. We love the milkshake duck. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then it's like, I'm sorry to say the milkshake duck is racist or whatever. Like, it's just a, right, right. It was just an earlier era of the internet because I think that was. the Romney Obama election. It's the same year that the biggest things we had going on was Mitt Romney said binders full of women.

We were trying to hire and like he put his dog on his car 50 years ago and that was a political scandal at the time. I thought it was the Hillary. I thought he was, he asked Hillary a question. Was that not right? Maybe it was then. I thought it was 2016. I could be wrong. It was 2016. Yeah, yeah. It was the Hillary election. Oh, well, that actually makes it even funny that that was a problem. It was peak, it was right when like it was peak the second you get famous, we're going to look up everything you've ever done online. Except for Trump, Donald Trump. Well, we don't.

And then they found like, didn't they find his Reddit account or something like that? And he was like in some stuff. I'll give you a hundred guesses to guess what his occupation is. Nurse. Egyptologist. No, those are both good guesses. Private detective. Getting further away.

Systems network engineer. Former fighter pilot. No. Further. I'll just tell you. He was a power plant worker. Okay. Ken Bone, the power plant worker.

Just like the real life. normal job. Homer Simpson. Yeah. He's the Homer Simpson. Anyway, my point is just very simple.

Ken Walker has a bunch of footbone injuries connected to his other injuries. And I'm like, you know, what, Zach Charbonnet? Strike one is all the injuries. Strike two is, his backup is literally an elite backup.

He's a top four backup running back as Zach Charbonnet. Zach Charbonnet is going seven rounds later. I'd rather just have Zach Charbonne in the 10th round than take Ken Walker in the fourth round and then strike three is he re-injures the foot.

And I'm like, oh, no, Zach Charbonne is just going to have this job all year. I just would rather Charbonnet so I'm not too. It's fun. You can, but that's risky. It's this simple, though.

It's this simple. I mean, it's like, can you guarantee you get Charbonnet? The reason I don't like Ken Walker drafting is I feel like I kind of need to get Charbonne now. And at that point, why don't they just take Charbonne? And then if Ken Walker's good, whatever. Okay. I don't have any problem with taking Charbonne.

I think that's a good pick. The only running, honestly, only backup. Charbonne. The only running back I take over Zach Charbonne is a backup is David Montgomery. That's a good transition because I want to actually just talk this through with you guys. David Montgomery is tentatively on my do not draft list, which is funny because I literally drafted him in the Ringer League. However, I drafted him in the 10th round, I think.

And he's one of those guys where when you see him where he's actually ranked, I kind of think you always just let him go. But if he's there two or three rounds later, he immediately becomes like a wonderful bench player, a wonderful flex player. Right. But I don't know, other than Jemir Gibbs getting hurt, I think the upside is getting smaller and smaller with him

as Gibbs gets more and more involved, more prominent, all that stuff. Also, you know, the Lions lost seven coaches. They lost their offensive coordinator. They lost their passing game coordinator. They lost their tight ends coach. They went on the offensive line a couple spots where we're trying not to think about it. Yeah, their guards are a second year six-rounder and a rookie. They lost their center frame rag now.

And, you know, they were historically good last year. They were, they averaged over three points per drive. Only four teams have done that in the 2000s. So I'm just like, you know, they ran a ton of touchdowns. They were second in the league in rushing touchdowns. That's the thing I was going to say, too, is like, are they going to run for that many touchdowns again? The problem is they basically did it two years in a row.

But again, Ben Johnson. But 23 and 24, they ran for top five in rushing touchdowns. I think I'm kind of like, he might be the most, like, rock solid floor play. But every year the upside starts to disappear a little bit. So I'm kind of like, if he falls a round or two, great pick. At value right now, like ADP, he's going 53rd overall. he's going around like Trayvion Henderson and R.J. Harvey.

I'm like, I don't know. Those guys have so much more upside to me. The epitome of a boring guy list. He's going around Patrick Mahomes, Tett McMillan, Xavier Worthy, all these dudes that can like really explode. I don't know. How do you feel like that? How do you feel?

I don't know if he would count. I think he's very good. Yeah. I understand what you're saying. I think I agree with you on almost everything. Maybe he wouldn't be on my don't draft list. Behavior, yeah, it's not like don't draft tape in Montgomery, which is ironic because he's actually one of my favorite real life players.

Yeah, of course. I feel like he's not going to be a bad pick. But here's the thing. I agree, and I know that because I just never take him. Yeah. And that's the point of the exercise. I love him as a player. The lions are so fun to watch.

I want the lines to be good. But overall, the thing with David Montgomery is he's the epitome of you like having him in your flex. But for you, you'll never really win your league because of Montgomery unless Jim, your Gibbs goes down, which is kind of shitty to like, you know what I mean? So you kind of end up basically you're paying for like this like solid flex guy. But the case. It's a floor play. It's a floor play, which is in the part of your draft where you want ceiling plays.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's like, Xavier Worthy, maybe the floor is a little, but the ceiling for Xavier Worthy. I was like, oh, well, he's Rishi Rice now. I am the captain now. And you're like, oh, wow. And you could do that for all these receivers, which I won't go through. Like, D.K. McCaff, Jameson, Williams, Calvin Ridley, like, you know, Ted McMillan. I'll go through all these guys.

The ceiling play is the reason you're taking them. And there's Montgomery, which is just a floor thing. But he's a weird guy for us to rank because there's modeling and projections. And it's hard to come out with, like, a season-long number. for him that accounts for, well, if Gibbs pulls his groin or whatever, then he could do this and whatever. But in reality, that's actually one of the reasons that Jimere Gibbs has ranked so high because of any of the absent David Montgomery, he's like 30, 29. He's 28, shockingly. He's young. He actually just turned 28. That's actually wild. That's like how Ramontre's 27. And I'm like,

what? I know. David Montgomery, he's 26. I would have bet a lot of money he was 30. Yeah, yeah. So he's, God, I love him, though. He's just the heart and soul of that team. This is why I wanted to work it out, because I don't even know if I fully endorse this, but he is a guy that just like when he pops up in the round that he's a good he's the epitome of this when you're on the draft widget you know like the top guy like everyone's drafting and usually james connor just sits there for an extra round or two at the top and it's like his picture is up there and he's one of those guys here's the problem also also i mean i eat what day is today we're recording this august 27 for the record even like i think less than a week ago he said jimmyr gibbs like will be the best running back in the NFL and he's the biggest fan they you know they were called peanut butter and jane about peanut butter and jane he's the biggest fan they you know they were called peanut butter and jennie and they're like, no, no, that's kind of lame. And they try to rebrand themselves Sonic and Knuckles. And I'm like, yeah, give yourself a nickname.

It's kind of lame. But they are actually friends, but I do think that this is the season where, like, they understand that he's the heart and soul. I believe he's a captain. But, like, it's going to get a little phased out. And it's just weird in a range where that's, in theory, you're taking a second guy and a great team. But the guys around him are like, you know, there's Tony Pollard,

who's, I mean, Tosji Spiris is on IR. Tony Pollard's the lead running back on maybe a bad offense that, but even if it's average, that's the thing. But who's on the field in week one? at the goal line on the first drive. And you look around the guys around him. Pacheco, we think Pacheco is going to be the lead running back on the Chiefs Drive. And, like, in the first quarter.

And we think that, like, Tony Pollard certainly will be for the Titans. David Montgomery just might not be on the – Like, sometimes? Like, sometimes. Maybe the first drive because his captain. But, like, Gibbs is the guy the Lions are going to want in there. And it's just weird. He's the first player you're drafting that, like, isn't really –

you don't know what's going to be on the field. It's just weird. That's all. He's kind of the beginning of, like, the upside is over. tier. It's kind of the start of like, now you're just kind of drafting solid flex players.

And this thing is like, even James Connor, who you think, oh, James Connor, David Montgomery, there's someone. No, James Connor is going to be

on the field all the time for Arizona. And that's all. It's just the worst thing is like having a guy that's not on a flex, actual running back spot for you. Yeah.

And you're like, wait, put them in. Put him on the game, please. Sorry, I know I'm repeating myself, but that's,

I agree. It's a hard thing to follow during a game. Yeah. You want a player who's on the field. Speaking of which Joe Mixon, I know we keep repeating ourselves on this one too, but it's really simple. We've been on this for like a month, but basically Joe Mixon, I don't think, now they're kind of openly saying what we had thought, which is, they can't even play the season.

They won't even acknowledge he will play the season. Exactly. So he's, he is, I think we're moving him down even again, but basically I think that if you have an IR spot in your league and you want to take him in like round 14 and people are starting to take kickers, sure. Other than that, like, I kind of don't think he's going to play. We still don't know what the deal is with the starting running back. There's Nick Chub, but it's Craig, you know, Nick Chub is like empty calorie guy. that we, I mean, look, if Nick Chubb makes it through the whole season on a bunch of volume touches, like that's an awesome story.

It's unlikely. Sure. I still think over, he will start the year in September as their leading guy, but over the course of the season of Damian Pierce for Houston, Woody Mark, someone's going to merge. It's also possible that Texans O' Line just sucks. And actually none of these guys are good. Nick Chub is probably the best bet by far to get you like 11 points in week one. I don't know if that matters 11 points a game.

Ultimately, it's kind of like if you're really desperate for running backs, sure. I think Damien Pierce is, like, if you're totally someone of the Texans running backs when you're a league. It's probably Damien Pierce or Marks over Chubb. Mixing is like, unless you have an IR spot, probably you shouldn't draft them. Any other guys you're just kind of like you don't even see, like kind of invisibly to you as people do address. And this guy's a very good player. I just have not

been drafting Chris Olive for the Saints. I think, and obviously the concussion concern is, I would say, primary for that. But also if you look a little bit more, obviously the quarterback situation is in flux. Rattler is going to be the start of the season. We might see Shuck a

later on in the season, it's probably not going to be a very efficient, explosive offense. But more importantly, I just think Shaheed, Rashid Shaheed, and Chris Olavah are closer in the way that they're going to be utilized and their overall just talent as players than their ADP would indicate. And Alave is the 76 overall player, according to fantasy pros, wide receiver 33, and Rashid is the wide receiver of 54 going 145th. I would just rather wait for Shaheed. I think you're scooping up the value that you can get in the Saints' offense by doing that.

I think they're probably going to have somewhat similar production. And you don't have as much. Obviously, Shaheed's not been the healthiest player either. But, like, you don't have, it's a much cheaper bet that way. What you just said, D.K., which is basically... It's like the Charbonated Walker thing for me. Instead of taking Chris Oliva at cost, just take Rashid Shaheed at cost. I wish...

That's one of the number one things I wish we had communicated. I had communicated more when I was, the amount of times I said the Saints, I don't like the Saints offense. I wish I had framed it that way. Of instead of Camara in the fourth round or a lobby in the eighth round or whatever, like, please just take Shaheed, like outside the top 100.

And I think you're dead on because I think he's going to be a complete receiver and he checks every box we was talk about of the last guys that get the validation of we believe what you're doing are like guys like seventh round, undrafted player. Undrafted, thank you. Like the later you go in the draft,

the more you have to do it for us to actually accept we were wrong. Brock Purdy as the last pick. Amon Ross St. Brown had to be like a top seven receiver for like basically like a season and a half before he admitted it was going to keep going. Kyron Williams, Chase Brown, like all these guys. We just never, and Shahid is like the classic.

No one wants to, he's just such an outlier that people are afraid to get on board and look dumb. Because what Craig said at the beginning of the show of, oh, so you change your mind so you can't go back later. But like that's what people, so I think that's a great call. The other thing I just want to note, I was going through my notes and I found about Olave from last year. And this is like, you know, if you don't want to draft this way,

that's fine. But this is how I increase and think of fantasy as I get older. I just wrote down, I don't like watching Chris Olave play. Every time it gets tackled, I kind of like put my nervous.

I kind of watch Chris Olavi through my fingers, kind of like Tua. And if you don't give a shit about that, that's fine. But I just, when I watched the Dolphid, this too bad because Tua

was like one of my favorite players ever in college football history. And then I think since the hip, it's been a mess. But like, I, Olave, like,

he gets hit. And I'm like, and I'm like, man, so that's my Sunday. I'm going to watch Spencer Rattler, like Spencer Rattler try to find a lave on a play and then a lava gets hit. And I'm like, that sounds stressful.

I'm like, how about you just remove that cortisol for my Sunday's performance? It's a bummer, but I agree. Now we have to drop in the argument we had about the lefties. Right, right. So we should just like stop and be like, you're going to hear that right now. You're going to hear now. When you're swinging the golf club, quote unquote, right-handed, the most important arm is the fucking left arm. That is the lead arm.

That is the arm you focus on. That is the arm you need to be straight. That is the arm that determines the contact with the ball. You are really, it is a left-hand swing if you are swinging quote-unquote right-handed. Same with baseball. The left hand is, oh, Jesus. What were you saying about your left hand?

Dang. Dang. I'm soaking wet. It actually is shelter. That is what you're supposed to use to get stains out. Thank you. It's extra clean now. You're welcome.

So as he was saying, Craig has tremendous control and hand-eye with his left hand, right? Craig, that was your point? Do you want to stop and clean up or you? Absolutely not. This is all staying in the shell. Greg, thanks for that Is that the cold open? Is that what we put on Instagram?

Christ, I'm going to move my water over here. How many spills have been on this trip on this show? That just shows you. We've been on the grind. Actually, no technology was harmed. Okay, hold on. I don't want you to lose your train of thought here because... What do you think about that take?

So I'm intrigued. I'm intrigued because the thing that went to my mind, because I skateboarded and snowboarded back in the day, and when you're like a right foot, like regular footed. The opposite would be goofy. Right. Your left leg is the one that's forward.

For what? Goofy or regular? For regular. Okay. And you think left foot is. So you're saying righte's It is a little bit weird. So I don't know.

Hold on you're saying a righty, your left foot forward. If you are right footed and you're skating, quote unquote, no. If you're right-handed, you skate with your left foot forward.

But dumb question, but like you're saying, like, I mean, isn't that the same as any swing where it's like if you're batting righty, your left foot forward? If you're playing golf righty, isn't that what you're playing.

The point is that like your left arm is leading. The left hand is the most important hand on a right-handed swing. And you're saying the left foot is the most important foot when you're skating. Yeah, like you're doing the most dexterous stuff with your left foot. But isn't the power coming from your right side? Yeah, it's pushing. Yeah, but you jump off your left foot when you're right-handed. I'd ever learn to snowboard.

When you try, go try to jump off your right foot. You'll like almost fall down. What? What are you talking about? You're talking about skateboarding? No, I'm just talking about playing basketball. Go jump off your right foot. You do.

Oh, yeah. You jump off your right foot. You jump off your left foot. That's correct. But is that just because you're trying to put a basket in with your right hand? That's just the nature of like, you know, right and jump opposite hand, opposite leg. That's because I'm not good enough at basketball to be like, I'm going to finish the shot lefty. And so I have just, I don't know what it means.

I'm not like making a point. I'm just saying it is kind of funny. The real truth of it, it's not like I bat lefty or righty because I knew as a kid that, like, I think that's a left-handed dominated swing. I probably did it because, like, my dad showed me how to hit a baseball and I did that. How many people? So he did actually. do child abuse. He showed you how to do a right-handed. I guess.

But yeah, everything single-handed, I do left-handed, but if I, like, baseball and golf, I would do. So how many people tuned into this episode for the first time, having never listened to us wanting fantasy advice for their draft? I just heard that. The left-hand right-hand. Just picked it up and moved it in the back of the show. Like Phil Mickelson is right-handed, but he plays golf lefty. What? Yeah.

Oh, I didn't know that. And he thinks it helps because his right-hand is the most dexterous, and that's what's the most important for the swing. Interesting. I don't know. I think it's an interesting theory, actually. I think Hyvetts likes it, but he doesn't want to admit it. Because I think this is a classic Hyphitz take.

This should have been my take. It's such a classic Hyvitz take. You'd be like, actually, the left hand is the important one in the right-handed swing. And he's been very quiet. Either you think it's dumb as shit or you secretly love it. He's like, get off on my... I wish we'd done this at the end of the end. There's so much to get...

Can we cut and put it at the end? Sure, yeah. Okay, yeah. I like that. In that case, then, I will say, yeah, I guess it's weird to me that... and be dexterous people feel this way, because as someone who I'm very imbalance coordination-wise, like my left hand,

I can't throw lefty. I can't do anything lefty. And the, like, the, like, what you're saying, the idea that I would switch and, like, try to do anything lefty, but you're saying lefty would be, quote, unquote, righty. Like, there's no chance I could swing any, like, I couldn't play golf or hit a baseball lefty, like, never. Yeah, I mean, of course, I mean, same.

If I tried to switch right now and back, what is, like, currently lefty, it'd be super hard. But I'm just saying, I think the most important arm is switched for what is considered left and right. I think for right-handed, left is more important and for left-handed right is more important. Anyway, what were we talking about? Caleb McGarry?

The right isn't doing that much when you're golfing. We'll get into golf later. I feel like it is, though. But like, the left arm is the one leading the way. Do you think this is why I'm bad at golf? Because I'm very uncoordinated in my left hand? You're good at golf? What are they talking about?

Maybe it's why I can't put. Did you spill water on me before or after we? No, they just heard you just heard that. So now we're coming back again. And now this... I'm dry pretty much now. My pants are clean. So this works well.

They're probably less wrinkly now. This actually works chronologically well because now we can talk about we played golf and Sunday. We've never played golf together. All I know is Craig, Craig texts to me, he said, Hyfit says a fucking howitzer.

And I'm just like, I can... And then you should see me golf. Hey, High Fitz Sandbag a little bit. High Fitz was kind of like, I'm fine at golf, whatever. Yeah, that sounds right.

Yeah, which is, that's the way to do it. I mean, I am. I'm fine. They're pretty good. Tate is good. Tate is good. Tate is not good. Tate is fucking great.

Tate is a 2.2 handicap. That motherfucker was like, what's your handicap? Well, here's like, I see you guys, just a point two. Yes. Exactly. There's a point. You get a decimal in your handicap, you're good at golf. When you're that close to shooting par, then you start to get into decimal.

Dude, there are layers to golf. And I, Tate is, you're right. Tate's great. Tate's amazing. Tate's awesome. Sorry, I just wanted to enjoy it. He is. D.K.

It's also. better to go to do what Hyvitz did to say like, I'm fine, and then you're a little bit better than you say, than the other way where you're like, I'm great and you show up and under-promise and over-delivered. Hyvich can fucking pound the ball off the teeth. Well, that's new. That's new to my game. Can you, so like, this is me

being a very bad golfer, like, hitting a driver, it's like, who knows where the fuck that thing is going to. There was, I think, seven straight holes. It was kind of in the middle of the round. Like, maybe, like, hold. Because I was using Tate has an extra bag, which, by the way, Tate's backup clubs are like any normal person's best clubs. There were so many clues that Tate was good that I didn't realize.

I just asked him to play golf. Didn't realize, like, he was so good. Scottie Cameron Putter. Scottie Cameron Putter in his backup bag. I was like, whoa. What's that? It's just like a nice putter brand. It's like you can drive my backup car and it's a fucking Lamborghini.

If it swings like Bryson DiCambo, he like kind of gets up, like locks his knee, stiff as hell. Is he like moving? His club head speed is 10 million miles an hour. Smacks the ball. He just fucking. Takes like nine. It's the best of a ball. It's funny because it's nice.

knew. Like, I actually changed philosophically a few years ago. He used to be like, go slow, put it straight. Yeah, yeah. It's 20 yards, but I know exactly where it's going. Just swings as hard as he can. Swings as he can. Absolutely annihilates the ball. He's saying that, but the ball doesn't go as far as you. He's saying annihilate it. People can hit it far. No, Tate can hit it 300 yards.

Okay, but again, we're relatively. Stop comparing yourself. He's a scratch golfer. You're not. No, I'm not. And he cried. There was like seven straight holes where he drove the ball like 285, dead straight, downhill. Downhill 3. Was it making the happy Gilmore noise? like, yeah, it was.

It was screaming. It did. No, it did. I will say I did cream a couple of balls. It was fucking, I did anybody tell you,

hey, you should play at the Waterbury in this weekend. No, the best was actually, we tried to drive a part four and actually put it off the back of the green.

I was like, that's so, that's no status right here. It was downhills. When I saw you line up, when I saw you line up, when I originally saw you kind of line up

and you have a very interesting swing. You do this like, very weird. He does his leg thing. It's unorthodox. It's unorthodox. Right before he swings, he takes his left leg and, like, pivots it inward. It's unorthodox.

And then begins to swing. It's like a really jerky, like, turn in. And then he got to shit. But he fucking smacks the ball. It's only weird if it doesn't work. Who is the guy that would, like, jerk the bat around really? Gary Sheffield. Yeah.

He's my birthday, Martiteeat. Yeah. Me and Solac and Gary Sheffield. Yeah. I also, like, speedwalking between, like, everything I do between the shots, I try to do very quickly because when I'm on the ball, I'll take. He takes his time. I have to take a bunch of practice swings to get the weird fucking clanky thing.

No, I don't think I'm a slow golfer, but on the ball. Tate, if he puts the ball on the ground and the Tee, and you look away and you look back, you're going to miss. Tate is on the ball for seven. He's like Lietervino. He's like, on the ball for seven seconds. No practice swings. He doesn't even let his club like settle behind the ball. No, like that's the better way to do it.

Yeah, I wish I could be a two handicapped just taking zero time whatsoever. That would be ideal. Yeah, yeah. Unfortunately, when I don't take my four practice swings, sometimes I've hit it 20 yards. I just want to see this so badly. Also, wait, we forgot Craig Eagled the first hole. What? Craig on the first hole, on a par four,

Craig actually, yeah, Craig drove the green and then play it. Do you get anything like a little plaque? It was like an ex. That's like a hole in one. The first nine was more, and to be clear, we're not driving par fours all the time.

It was like a short hole. Yeah, it was a short hole. What was a par four? It was a par four, but the hole was like 280. Yeah, it's like, I don't think it's like an executive, but just it was more like,

it's a bunch of, we're playing an old man. was like a slightly shorter nine. The back nine was more traditional. He drove the green and then just made the pot. So he had an eagle in the first home. Did you go probably going to be my best shot all day? Honestly, yeah.

Honestly, we were like, you should go home. But it's funny because we'd always joke that we would just never play play golf together. And we're both kind of at the age where you get obsessed with golf, but we're like, we're never going to play. We actually made it happen. So shout us to say. And we're a similar skill level.

So that's always like great when you find somebody who is. Yeah, we're very similar. Craig's exactly my skill level, but like a little worse so we can play, but I'll win every time. So I did. I beat Hyvitz by 10 strokes. I lost so... No, it's true.

No, he beat me by lot. By the way, I saw an 88. Yeah, not bad. You should work well. No, that's the thing. I hit the ball really well, but my putting is a mess at the moment. And your drives,

you lost the drive a little bit where it started to spray. I'll say, if I want one thing known about my golf score, it's this. I take a breakfast ball and then I count every stroke. So if I lose...

It's just a joke that if you fuck up your first shot, you get a mold. Okay. Because it's like, whatever. But that's the other thing, Hyvitz and I agree on is We're usually like finish your puts. You're not like some bullshit drops.

I don't like, Gimmie culture is out of control. You know what? I actually have an announcement. Okay. Here we go. All the old people who think that like the boomers who think the millennials are snowflakes, fine. Bingo free card space.

You're giving up eight foot puts. You guys are fucking lying about your puts. Give me culture in the boomer generation is out of control. The idea if people made boomers. Participation trophies. If, yes, they participation trophies on greens.

If people made boomers, put out all the gimmies they gave. Oh my God. You don't even want to know, and it is just a classic, like, honor. You're never doing any gimmies ever? We try, no, put everything out unless it's within, like, within, like, originally. The original gimmie rubric was if it is the length of the grip of your putter,

which is like a foot. We do gimmies. I don't know. No one's missing that. No, we don't make someone tap in from two inches out. That's obnoxious. It's like, it's like, it's obnoxious to make someone put three inches out. We're talking about like, if it's like four...

I watch Rory McElroy lose a goddamn U.S. Open from three feet out. Now, you're not as good as him. It's gone from the putter grip to the length of the putter to really like the length of a putter and a half. Lent of a fives. That is actually... Dude, it's crazy. All the time it happens. I think the gimmie stuff's out of control.

And my rule is whenever someone's like, that's good, I'm like, look, if I do this 10 times, I'll miss one of them. Yeah. So it's not a gimmie. Make the put. It's only a gimmie if I'll make it 20 out of 20 times. So we agree in that. And I will say, I just, when I'm playing a course, I've never played actually in L.A. before. So when I'm playing a course, and the course we played the day, it was really cool.

It was really fun. It's in the, you know, it's in the valley. So it's like, healy and all the stuff. And I'm like, if I hit a ball out. We're talking like, it was like a hundred. I will defend. I do want to defend my 99 for a second and just say, one, my putting was horrific. I just changed my putt.

And it was a tough day for me. But I will say, if I hit a ball. If I hit a ball off the T. If I lose a ball off the T. Yeah. And I'm like, well, I'm not drop. like I want to enter their ball. And I lose that one.

I'm like, all right, well, I guess I'm going to get a triple bug and quad on this one. And that is what to happen to me.

I lost a lot of T shots. I mean, you know what? I had a great time. Yeah, yeah. He played very, very good. He just,

the last like six holes, he lost his driver and he hit a bunch of balls OB and that catches up with you. But you played great. Sometimes when I'm, sometime when I'm, sometime when my family isn't here

and it's not 95 degrees, I will come golf with you guys. Yeah. I would love to. I'm invited myself. You can't say no. This is how everyone else feels about fantasy football, which is everyone else.

DK's eyes just glazed over. We start talking about golf. DeKK.'s like, I don't believe I can't take a video of high fits on the T-E box. I can't believe you. I don't know. I want to do it. It's a weird looking swing.

I wanted, I'm trying to get it to be one normal looking thing. And I tried with the other clubs. And I can, but I just couldn't. I was like the Terminator, but you also hit it as far as the Terminator. So it works.

It was 100 degrees. I want to clarify again because I feel like I'm offending. fans when I say when you guys start talking about golf, my eyes glaze over. That's not true. I like the sport of golf. I don't want to hear your score. It's like your fantasy team. Do you know what that? Do you know what I mean?

If I say 88, 98, you don't know what I'm like... It's like your fantasy team to someone who doesn't play fantasy. You're like... 72 is like a par? Yes. There you go. There you go. You like the Netflix show. But like when you say I shot or whatever

and you start to talk about like the bogey I got on nine, I'm like I don't fucking You're shooting the 70s, you're great. If you shoot in the 80s, you're really good. If you're shooting in the 90s, you're solid. Right. And if you're in the hundreds,

then you're just for doing it for fun. Even low hundreds, I would say, is like you can play a little. Once you get north of like 1-10, it's, you know, it gets a little more difficult. Right. I mean, my style of golf is like, I've never actually kept score

because I fucking suck. You know what's the other thing? How do you feel about the, you probably would have shot in a 12 on this hole, but you just give yourself a snowman? Like the cap at the triple? Or the cap of the snowman? I think you have to do that because eventually what happens is you kind of, if you actually

play competitive golf, you start to, so like the reasons I did ones where I just picked up a couple times because I was like, I'm going to take a quad here, like a par four. And I was like, I get paid to play and all that stuff. No, it's not, well, it's pace of play for sure. But the other reason is you people end up strategically in basically, oh no, I had a couple 120s before. And so you went into a tournament and maybe you're like, let's say you're 980 cap. Suddenly you're like a 14.

and then you win. And so it gets like, it's actually unfair. Because the blowups inflate your handicap inaccurately. If I had counted my score accurately because I lost so many balls, I would have been like, I probably would have been, like if I take it, what am I going to do?

Take a 12 because I lost three balls in that one hole. And I'm like, but overall, though, then I would actually have a crazy competitive advantage if I wanted to play someone competitively. Yes. Because I'm like, my handicap is not represented when I'm going to shoot on this. I will say, like when you're not playing competitively,

it is kind of annoying. I'm not saying you do this because that's not case at all. But like when you're playing with somebody else and it's like, I like struggle my way to a double bogey on a par five. And then I'm saying the other guy's OV four times. He's like, give me an eight. And I'm like, you were not one stroke. You were seven strokes. It's like you almost should keep the real score. And then like when you put it

into the handicap system, if you do that, you should put it. You're right about that. You're right about that's fair. You're fucking got a 12 and you're giving yourself a seven. No, that's fair. It is like, it is a golf opada. You can't give yourself a 12 because you're like, that's actually, it's kind of bullshit in the funny way. Speaking of golf ball. I have a question about like just the golf. I like the game of golf. I think it's funny, like, all the tradition and everything. No, this is good to ask us because everyone's the show off. What's the worst? It's just us three.

It's just the three. No one's listening. The producers. They all left. Yeah. What is the worst golf? What's the word? I'm like, not tradition, but like etiquette. The best and the worst golf etiquette. What do you mean best? Like our favorite? Yeah, like, which one actually you like the most? And then which one you think is stupid. So there's two, well, there's like, maybe you can start with the one I used to do. There's fancy country club golf. And then there's

for lack of what I'll call municipal golf. And like, I mean, I love me and he's like, I live in D.C. The etiquette that I like is like, you don't talk in somebody's back swing. Yeah, you can't talk. You don't walk in a concert. So you don't want people to think it's a rock concert. Some people, yeah. Running golf.

This is golf. Go back to the shanties. When I lost that two balls in a rock concert, Tate Frazier was like, go back to your shanties. You don't walk in front of somebody's line on the green. Yeah, that's a, you know, because it's like fucks up the lie or whatever. You don't want to, like, step on their line. The real big one is, although I haven't met a couple people who are like,

I actually don't like when you are talking and stop talking to my swing. For the most part, you don't talk with someone's like hitting the ball. That's the biggest one. And I think if you want to be like a next level guy, it's, I actually have learned that I have just, no offense to my friends listening. I've better vision than most of my friends, so I've learned that I actually, which is ironic because I'm bad at remembering

things. Like you can track people's ball. I can track people's so I've learned that like I actually try to tell people where it's going. That's nice. Which I was worried would annoy people. I'm like, but I'm like, I'll actually the third tree in the shade go be, like it's simplest. He's like the Ted Williams of tracking your ball. Yeah. What's the etiquette that you think's bullshit? rules are etiquette.

Either. The dumbest rule of golf is that if you hit a ball, where there's a lot. Well, the actual rules of golf about how teeing up works and if you lose a ball, you're supposed to go back. It's funny. But to me,

there's a dumb rule that if your ball lands in a divot, you have to hit it off a Frankenstein's fact. Exactly. But I'm like, you hit it in the fair way. It's man made like a sprinkler. Take your shot. Divot's man made. He's right, Mr. Gilmore.

I'm afraid he's right. Nothing we can do. That's the stupidest. The head of the PGA. I'm afraid he's right, Mr. Gilmore. take your shot. They fucking allow him to hit it down a tube that goes out the middle.

Anyway, all right, well. I don't know what the etiquette is. That's like annoying that I don't like. I kind of like playing. Like, you're not allowed to drive the golf cart on... Are you allowed to drive on the fairway? That's a rule. Well, the cart will literally shut off if you get too close to the green.

Well, that's the new electronic... No, the point is, the course itself... Like the waymos of the golf carts. Yes, honestly. They based on rain... You made him get in a waymo. But based on how much it the rain or whatever is, going on, they'll let you drive to certain places. So sometimes no

fairways. But you can't try in the green unless, literally Donald Trump drives his car to the green every day which is funny. But other than that, no, you're not supposed to do that. What's your guys' take on using a golf cart in general? Oh, I fucking love it. You know what's funny about that? I mean, so I actually, for some reason

I thought like you'd be more of like a purist. No, no. I mean, look, lug in your heavy bag. If it's hot as hell, I mean, it saves you an hour. I just think it's... I like walking, but also, I don't have to play golf where, I mean, it's pretty hilly where you get you probably play golf. Yeah. It's like untenable to walk.

I like walking because. Also pace of play. I'm gonna die. If there's a for some in front of you and they're all walking, you're like, I'm gonna be here for five and a half hours. Hit it on the fairway. What? They did it on the fairway. You don't have to look for your ball.

No, I think the thing with, I will say it's funny. It takes a while to a walk. I used to get the little. Walk to your ball in the fairway or drive to your ball in the fairway. I would like get carts. And then I was talking to my good friend, shout up my friend of boss who's in the Marines. And I was like, so how do they like get you in shape to be a Marine? like how do they, you just show up

and then you're like, what is the process? He's like, what's the fuck are you talking about? And I'm like, you know, what's the, and he's like, how do you get in shape? He's like, you carry heavy shit all day, that's it. And then I started carrying my golf guy. Yeah, you go on these really long, I think they call it yogs. He's like, you just carry shit all day forever.

I'd rather just work out in a different way and drive. I'm not like against. I think golf cart, like, that's my most fun part is just like, If it's 95 degrees lugging your bag for four and a half hours, like a lot. Yeah, if it's 90, yeah, yeah. Do you think, so when do you think people, the last person listening turned this off? There's a lot of people that like golf, I don't know.

Yeah, look, our audience is a lot of dudes in their 30s and 40s. Who golf? You think, you're just going to get more. It actually went up at the end, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, all right. Well, you never said, do you like or hate my left-handed theory? Oh, Ryan, that was the whole thing. Yeah, you were right that.

What is the theory that you would? hit better if you did if you hit lefty no no I'm just saying that a right-handed batter is really using their left-hand more and a left-handed batter is using their right hand so that's like guide versus lead too I was I was just about to say that with basketball what how do you shoot lefty but that's a lefty shot right yeah that's a single that's a lefty shot yeah mostly um because the the right hand of this is like I actually think we should that this is an interesting question I think overall you're probably wrong like just probably someone would have thought of statistically, well, just the odds that

you're right and everything. But however, it's, I honestly, I don't even know if there is a right and wrong. I'm just saying, I, like, so here's, I guess could you argue that the right hand is more important? So what I was thinking about when I froze, and I didn't want to go into this early in the show, but I'm glad we picked it up and moved it, because here's what I was thinking about when you said that.

If I had to, like, if I had a hit ball like 40 yards, like, and I could pick one arm to do it, it was like closest to the end, I got one shot. You'd pick your right. I would pick, no. I'd pick my left hand, and I think I'd probably, be more able to hit up one hand. Well, no, I'd do right hand. That would definitely be right.

I think so. But no, I don't know. I mean, what do I know? I'm suck a golf. I mean, look at me. You don't suck a golf. You're saying that. You're sandbagging again. That's true.

Be nicer to yourself. I don't know. Thanks, D.K. Everyone be nicer to yourselves. It's hard out there. When you have two hands on the club or the bat, I do think the lead arm is the important one. Well, I think the need, well, I guess what you're getting at is actually, it's not that

simple. On one hand, it's like, you're wrong. But the other hand, you're getting into the nature of what does it mean to be lefty? Is it about powers, about coordination? I think my point is, is that like, being a, doing something two-handed, being a right-handed hitter, like, has nothing to do with being right-handed. Right. You just say it because you're on the right side of the plate. I will say this.

I'll say this with a lot of this. With all absolutely due respect to, like, MLB hitters, what they do is extremely hard. Yeah. I think relatively to some of the other things I've tried to do left-handed or goofy-footed or whatever, like hitting lefty. doesn't feel as weird as some of the other stuff. I guess what I'm saying is like there's a lot of like switch hitting players in the MLB. Cowellie is having the best switch hitting season since Mickey Mantle.

So like obviously I'm not a good baseball player. I'm not a good hitter, whatever. But I thought like the feel like the it didn't feel as weird as like throwing with your left hand. Yeah. Throwing with your left hand is like impossible. Or like riding like goofy footed or whatever like skateboarding goofy. I thought all that stuff all felt way more un like natural. It wasn't good at it.

But I could hit left. to eat. I think what I'm trying to say is that I think the connection between what you do with your single hand versus what you do with a two-handed sport is not that there's not that much connection. I don't know who what the discipline is, but if you are either like a neurologist or like a throwing coach or like a doctor or like just an actual mechanics expert, I don't know, kinesiologist. I don't know the fucking person. But can you emails at ring your fancy football at gmail.com to explain us? Tell us if Craig is just straight up wrong. But I also do, what you're talking about though is what is the nature of being a righty mean and then also

how does it actually apply to rotational sports, which is. interesting because the other reason and the other reason is interesting is that I didn't expect to tell me I don't think being right handed makes you better at batting right handed I don't think that there's a connection is my point interesting I think you just do it because that's what

what most people do that feels I feel so unqualified I don't know if having the dominant right hand like throwing riding whatever I don't know if that translates to a two-handed sport where you're swinging a baseball right hand but at one level it has to be connected to throwing because it's all the same rotational activity like throwing a football, functionally speaking,

if you forget the exact details, throwing a football, hitting a tennis ball, like bowling, golf. Those are all single-handed. Yeah, but the point is rotational. It's all the same thing, a baseball swing. Like, it is all on one level,

kind of the same. And so maybe it's as simple as the act of using one hand more means you're, like, neuromuscularly, like all the muscle groups are just easier using that way. So, like, maybe you're right, but also the active,

I don't know, but they're not different. Like, hitting a baseball is not as different as you think it's throwing a football. I also think it's interesting. Maybe I already said this because we've had this conversation now like half an hour apart. So, it's so funny. I feel like there's a lot more left-handed throwing people that hit right-handed than there are right-handed throwing people who hit left-eat.

Is there... We'd say that again because you're right. So lefties, I've had a few left-handed friends in my life who hit right-handed in baseball. Phil Mickelson is extremely rare. It's rare. It's on the right of that bad. My brother is going to test like a good experiment of this. because everything my brother was taught to do, he does righty.

Everything he learned to do himself, he's a lefty. So, like, he writes with the right hand, but he bowls lefty. You know, everything he just picked up, he is lefty. So my parents just thought he was righty and they were wrong, which is funny. Right. And then you have guys like Tua, like, Ralph Lendale was trained to go lefty to be, like, even though he's actually a righty. Then you have people like Tua, where his dad made him go lefty, but that doesn't actually help you. It actually hurts you.

It's kind of funny that Tua's lefty, but he's naturally a righty. That's still a bizarre choice that they made there. But the, that is interesting. There is something here. I don't know if your take is exactly right. But whatever you're noticing, I do think there is something to what you're saying. Yeah, there's always,

when I picture like batting right-handed, I'm like, I don't think this is a right-handed, dominant activity. You know what I mean? Is that also just because you're a lefty, though? That could very well be. I think a lot of people are screaming that

with their right-row. The only reason I started thinking about this is because Phil Mickelson has said this. And he was saying, me as a right-eat-golving lefty helps me. And that was what put it in my brain. And I was like, oh, interesting.

I never thought about it. How different is like, so say you're playing tennis and I don't follow tennis closely enough. I imagine people do their forehand and what's the forehand and off, backhand? Yeah. Some of them do it two handed, right? Yeah, that's the, it was one hand for a long time and now two hands the standard. So there's not much difference between in terms of like swinging a baseball bat and swinging a tennis racket and forehand and being a switch. Well, no, right?

Or maybe it's like your feet are different. I'm left handed in tennis, right? So my left hand is my forehand. but when I switched to backhand, then it becomes a right-handed baseball swing. Right. Isn't that weird? But I'm left-handed.

That's what I was trying to say. And a right-handed tennis player, their backhand is a left-handed baseball swing. Right. You know? That's what I was trying to say. I'm, I need to do my own research.

Is this what Joe Rogg's paw? I don't know. Is this a left? He's actually right. There's not an answer. There's not an answer here. I think it's just like interesting. This is just a fun hypothetical talking experiment.

I wanted to post. We've completely lost everyone. Yeah, I don't know. All right, let's get the fuck out of here. Okay, if anyone made it this far, yeah, genuinely, bottom of my heart, thank you. The tenor,

I never thought about the tennis one, but yeah, right? Am I right about that? I don't know. Lefty forehand, right? You guys guess how you play tennis? No,

I'm saying for anybody. If you were a right-handed tennis player and you obviously hit your forehand, when you bring it over to hit backhand, this becomes a left hand. It's not a baseball swing, but it's the only thing I do that. No,

are as if you were batting lefty. Close enough, sure. It's the grip's a little different. Which hand is on top of the other is a left-handed baseball? My buddy Logan was a really good test player. I'll ask him. Okay, that's Logan. But it's interesting, too, because it's funny about the backhand is you would,

it's almost hard from, you're right, but it took me a second because I would never hold my left, my hands for a backhand the way you would for a baseball bat, so I actually had to think and cut to the middle of. Yeah. I haven't played tennis enough to really know what the fuck. I can't picture it. I see. I guess what's interesting is just the idea that like your,

the nature of how important the lead hand is, is just, that's an interest. How much power, yeah, the nature. At the end of the day, though, it's all coming from your feet anyway. The whole thing's actually about, that's why Scotty shelves is number of God from the world. He's transferring, it's funny that Scotty leaves the ground when he hits. All in the hips.

But guess what? He's transferring 100% of his energy to the ball because his feet left the ground. It's all coming. Like, all this stuff is just a rotational kinetic chain. You know how, like, Jordan Love and Rogers, like, are off the ground when they throw? That's, like, Scotty's in the air when it hits the ball. It's literally the same thing. You are creating a chain of kinetic energy from your feet, the tip of your toes, through the tips of your fingers, into the ball.

And it is just the arm strength, as we know, it has nothing to do with that. It's core strength, and it's how much of the energy leaks from your kinetic chain from your feet to your arm. And when Scotty, what I just said is the most accurate possible explanation. And you were going to make fun of me, but I don't care. No, no, I wasn't at all. Oh, okay, sorry. Just reminds me of the, like, I've seen, like, bits on, like. Instagram of golf teachers

with all the shit they like will put on the ground and like where you're supposed to swing through and like have like something around your waist and like all this shit I'm like I don't it sounds complicated I was about to end the show and I went on that rant god damn it let's get the fuck out of here okay do you know the doc Prescott hip thing

oh yeah yeah that's kind of what Hyvitz does but right before he swings he goes that is what I do yeah that is that is exactly what it is yeah oh god I gotta go golfing with this thank you DK thank you Craig thank you Dak for the honestly Tom Brady to help my golf swing along.

Thanks, Tate for taking this golf. Yeah, shout out Tate. Thank you for taking us golfing. Thank you, Kai. Thank you, Carlos. Thank you, Ronick. Thank you, Austin. Thank you, C.T.

Thank you, Chris. There's a lot of people behind that studio. I think this entire different pod waiting for us to end this show. Thank you for emailing us for your fancy football at gmail.com. Email us. What did we want? We want the lefty-righty thing.

If you have any kind of experience, really a discipline that can answer these questions, email us there. Also, we're getting close to season. You're left-handed. If you're right-handed. We'll start saying as trivia questions for waivers. Start sending us trivia questions for showdown time

but it has to be a number. Start sending those in and yeah, email us whatever else we ask for. Thank you to everyone and thank you Lord. Lord. Whoa. Thank you Nerfherder.

Someone named the band after the slur in Star Wars? Yeah. Wow. Okay, sure. Who's scruffy looking? It's an old school punk band. The reason I thought of them is they have one of their favorite songs

or one of my favorite songs is called Golf Shirt. Okay. Look it up. good, old, just like, I guess they're, I don't know how you describe them, California pop punk, maybe they're not from California. I always wonder what like cherished

childhood memory is deleted from D.K.'s So that he could keep the knowledge that golf shirt was performed by Nerferter. Shohayotan. Nerfurtur was great, man. What about him? Doesn't he throw righty, but bat lefty? Um, let me look it up.

Otani hits left and throws right, yeah. Oh, wow. So he's like, no, he's the best best of one. Yeah. Craig knows the weight of my heart. I'm fucking how many so much. Atani's my favorite thing that's ever happened in sports that had nothing to do with my team.

Okay, I don't know now if this is, but Gemini says, Freddie Freeman, Bryce Harper, Kristen Yellick, Joyvado, Ty Cobb, Ted Williams, Yogi Berra, all throw right bat left. I don't know if that's kind of, well, no, but batting left though is also, well, no, it's not simply...

Choose to bat left because they're good because it's more at avicages. Yes. There were just fewer lefty pitches back in the day. I think that now more pitchers want to be lefty because it's right. But yeah, it was just easier at the time, but also that was back. You know, there were that many people. Yeah.

I was just wondering, I was like, who does throw right but bat left? I sure it's pretty common. I don't know what you've identified. Something's there. But there is something about what you're discussing that's interesting. And the other interesting thing while we're doing this is I think there'd be more lefty quarterbacks, but coaches don't want to teach lefties because it's just, frankly, it's annoying.

Can we complain about that, lefties? Yeah. Do we have grounds to bitch about that? Didn't I just talk about this in the show the other day or did we cut it? That Steve Young was moved his freshman year at BYU. He was quarterback. New coach comes in. Sorry, the old new coach was like, fuck this.

Put him at safety because he's like, we got to flip all our plays. That's great. We can't be flipping plays. We got, which on one hand is like, should have just put it on the overhead projector. Just flip the thing over. That's easy. Overhead just have been lost.

But no, but on the other hand, like I get it. Like you're going to teach everyone differently for the other. But here's thing. The next coach came in. Got Guy fired. I wonder why, because he didn't know Steve Young's good court. And the guy's just one day... Because he was like, let's make Steve Young's safety.

Too much work. So this new coach comes in. Steve Young's the third string safety. And Steve Young on the scout team just has to throw a football back down the sideline. The coach is like, what the fuck was that? It's like Uncle Rico. He's like, and he literally was like, yeah, I was quarterback. He's like, you're the quarterback now.

And that's a B-Y... Such a classic, like, fucking movie trope. I hear that. And I think about how many guys, like, just never got that second chance of, like, they were converted. I'm like, how many guys could have been? Me. My high school coach said I couldn't be a quarterback. I think all the time about Terrell prior, like in NIL era.

Probably could have been brilliant ground. Anyway, whatever. Us lefties, man. We haven't heard. All right. Yeah, email us to lefties by us too. All right. Goodbye, everyone.

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