The Ringer NFL Show - Ashton Jeanty’s Ceiling, Cam Skattebo’s Legend, and the Case for and Against the Top RBs in the NFL Draft

Episode Date: April 17, 2025

The guys take a look at every running back in the 2025 NFL draft. DK and Heifetz make the arguments for and against each player, but the twist is that they don’t know which side they’re arguing until Craig flips a coin! Later, emails! (0:00) Intro (4:58) Ashton Jeanty, Boise State (16:56) Omarion Hampton, North Carolina (22:50) TreVeyon Henderson, Ohio State (29:29) Quinshon Judkins, Ohio State (37:25) Kaleb Johnson, Iowa (46:48) Dylan Sampson, Tennessee (54:53) Bhayshul Tuten, Virginia Tech (01:00:38) Cameron Skattebo, Arizona State (01:11:02) Emails! Check out our 2025 Ringer NFL Draft Guide here! Email us! [e-mail] The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Hosts: Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck Producers: Kai Grady and Carlos Chiriboga Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey there, humanoids. It's the Masked Man here, David Shoemaker. It's officially a WrestleMania season, and we've got you covered here on the Ringer Wrestling show. Kaz here, every Monday and Thursday hang out with me and my gosh shoes on the Masked Man show. And Ben Cruz here. Come kick it with me, Cal, and Brian on Tuesdays for Ringer Wrestling worldwide, where we hit on the most interesting headlines and even react to some of mass men's and even your hottest takes. Don't tap out, tap in to the Ringer Wrestling Show feed now on spot.

or wherever you get your podcasts. Worldwide. NFL Draft show. My name is Dan Hifitz. I'm joined by Danny, Kelly, and Craig Horlebeck. Today we are going over the running backs in the 2025 NFL draft. There are a lot of running backs in this draft. I mean, there's always a lot, but there are a lot of good ones, D.K.

Is this the deepest running back class that you've seen since you started studying the draft in like the 40s or whenever you started doing that? In the 1900s. I don't, yeah, I'd say it's probably one of the deepest. I would probably quibble with one of the best running back classes of all time claim that's getting thrown around here. I don't know if I really agree with that, but I think it's definitely a very deep class. You're going to be able to find starters in the second and third round. So it's a very good class. I just don't know for sure if I'm quite as hyped up as a lot of people.

But it's both top heavy and deep. Right. Right. There's definitely guys, like I said, in the third round, who I'm going to be kind of excited about. So from that point of view, yes, it's a very good class. Okay. So we're going to do the continuation of the coin toss. What are we calling this, Craig?

Dr. Mary something. We should have figured that out before the show. Featuring DK.D.H. and Mary Edwards Walker. Once again, we'll be joining us. Dr. Dr. Mary Edwards Walker. I once again have her coin. So we're going to go through the show.

If you haven't listened to the wide receiver or the quarterback episode, we flip a coin and determine who has to make the case. for or against this player they can't make the other side. So if I flip heads, D.K. gets to make the case for Ashton Jentee, and unfortunately, Hyattvitz has to make the case against him. That's not great. That's not great. Before we start, the quick reminder, so we're going to be going NFL draft.

In fact, next week, by the way, it's literally next Thursday. Shout out to everyone coming to the live show. We're doing a live show in Chicago on Tuesday. Yeah. Shout out to everyone coming to that. That is sold out. But we're going to have another, we're going to have reactions episode on Thursday night. We'll have reactions probably also Friday night from rounds two and three.

we'll have an other episode for Monday from the whole draft. And then we're going to have like fantasy rankings coming to you later next week. Not next week. The week after the draft will have like fantasy rankings come to you soon. And then we're going back to a fantasy football show. We'll change your name back. Stip Snap. It makes sense.

Okay. It makes sense. You have any idea of the emotional toll. Changing the name takes. Emotional toll on our listeners every year. It's a rear fantasy football show. Then back to the NFL draft show. Then back to the fantasy football.

Hey, just don't touch that dial. We'll do all the work for you. We'll change the bed. We'll change the sheets. You just come home every night. You go to sleep, put it on our pod. That's all you need to do. Just hit follow.

Just hit subscribe. And then you don't have to remember the name of the show. It just shows up. Oh, shows up. I didn't even thought about that. Shows up. Shows up. I don't even know the names of TV shows.

I just opened Netflix and just click the first thing that's in front of it. Go by pictures. There was something that a little finger with a mustache. I'm like, cool. Started watching Piki blinders. It's perfect. Who knows what it's anything is called. If there's a minion on it, I'm clicking.

You know what I mean? And like, we're, maybe we should have, we should honestly put minions on our, on our logo. Should we do that? Can we do that? Probably not. There's like a little foam finger on our logo. My brother thought it was a dinosaur for like four years. It does kind of look like a, is it a stegosaurus?

What's the long neck? Brontosaurus. Well, bronosaurus has long. Stegosaurus, a little spiky guys with the tail. Right. The Brontosaurus. Brachiosaurus? You're the one with a child.

I think brachiosaurus and brontosaurus are now the same thing. What do you mean now? Now they're the same thing. You know how like the moon Or sorry, you know how like Pluto was a planet for a while And then they decided it wasn't a planet Neil deGro Tyson got it in there I don't know if it's a planet now or not

So they were two similar species And they decided to just call them one thing Yeah I think so I think DK's like a little I'm looking it up now DK's really easily walking it back as he Googles Jurassic World Rebirth is coming out this summer So we can revisit that then

Is it too early in the episode? Should we do like any running? running backs before I just screen share right now and just Google Brachysors, Bronosaurus. I think I'm mistaken. I think they're two different, you know, two different kind of us. There's something there, though. There's some two big dinosaurs that are now the same thing. Only if dinosaurs are real, which I'm not convinced.

Yeah, I mean, yeah, allegedly the dinosaurs are real. So we should get that in. Steven Spielberg invented dinosaurs. Okay. Starting off here with Ashton Gentie. I'm going to give a little backstory here, table set. Ashton Genty, one of the more interesting running backs to discuss. So, you know, kind of took college full of,

by storm last year. 2,600 rushing yards, 28 short of breaking Barry Sanders record set in 1988. Although Barry Sanders did it in 11 games, which is fucking crazy

and Gentie did it in 14. Genti finished second in Heisman voting. But he has a really interesting backstory. So he is the son of a Navy chief petty officer and he lived in Naples,

Italy while he was in middle school and parts of high school on a Navy base. And so he played at Naples high school and the football coach discovered him when he was in seventh grade

watching him play basketball because Genti was 5-5 and almost dunking. Oh my God. Which is insane. And he was like, hey, I'm going to need you to play football for me. And also, where they play in, so they play at this high school football field, but it doesn't have lights. So sometimes they have to go play in this place called Carney Park, which is, there's a

football field in the crater of a dormant volcano in Italy. They're never look at it. Literally, it's a football field inside of a crater. It looks like you're watching some. science fiction movie. It's actually insane. It's like a Tuscan villa, but instead of the villa, there's just a football field in a volcano. Yeah, the city

they played in is called Potsuali. Don't know if I'm pronouncing that correctly, but it's Carney Park. Look, Google Carney Park, and you'll see the crater in the dormant volcano that Genty played in. So not only that, there were no schools near them, so they had to drive to play other schools at other military

bases. So their shortest drive was nine hours to the next school, and their longest was 18 to play a German military base. So there was an 18-hour bus ride that he would have to make. Good Lord. So then after his freshman year, he moves from Italy back to the U.S., goes to high school in Texas. He replaces Marvin Mims, who was at the same school as him. Marvin Mims goes to college. Genty then takes the road. Most receiving yards in the history of Texas high school football. So it's like pretty big shoes to fill.

replaces Marvin Mims as wide receiver and becomes an all-district wide receiver, his first year in high school in the U.S. then moves to running back. The rest is history, I could go on about his accolades, seven yards per carry. After the contact stuff, I think is the craziest. He averaged 5.25 yards after contact, which in context, Quintan Judkins, who's another very good running back on Ohio State, he just averaged five and a half yards per carry. And Genty is five and a quarter after contact.

And in total, he racked up almost 2,000 yards after the con. 1,970 yards after contact, which would just be second. in rushing in college football. So Gentie's one. Gentie after contact is two, and then it's Cam Scadabo. God. So after all that,

we're going to flip this coin and one of you is going to have to tell me why he's bad. You shouldn't draft. I have so many notes and stats on Genti are the idea that I will have to argue against them and not say any of them. God on. It's my soul.

So we're going to start with our draft expert here, Dady Kelly. What do you want? I mean, yeah, I want tails. I want to see JETT. Just for the challenge.

Ash to Gentie. Okay. here we go. What does Dr. Mary Edwards Walker say? She says heads. Fuck. No. I feel like I don't really have to add a lot here. This sucks. I didn't get Travis Hunter and I didn't get Ash and Jenty. I have to argue against the close. Them's the breaks. I want you to. It's like obviously sure. Should he be a top 10? Obviously a top 20 pick. Yes. I want you to go even further. Tell me why he should be a top three pick. I mean, it's all about creation. It's all about his ability to create yards out of thin air. That is like one of the most valuable. things that a running back can do. It's one of the first things I look at at running back is your ability to, when the blocking is not there for you, if you're not running through a big open, like, hole in the line, what do you do with that?

And he is so good at slipping tackles. He beats guys in a phone booth, jump cuts. He's really like a slippery runner guys just sluff off of them for whatever reason. He's like he's made out of cement. He just is a heavier, denser material than anyone else, which is why I think sometimes people bring up like a Marshaun Lynch, uh, comment. and I think running style they're very different in terms of like the way they run

Marshall Lynch was bow-legged and ran really weird but the way that they're able to just run through defenders like elude tackles that kind of thing I think there's some similarities there you know and we talk so much about how good he is as a runner but he's also like Craig mentioned

he was a high school receiver he's also very good in the passing game so he's a three down back who can play you know obviously a really important role on early downs running the football, but then he's also good in the receiving game. He's just a offensive weapon that you can utilize in your offense.

And, you know, I look at a guy like Jemir Gibbs, look at a guy like Bijan Robinson, he can really bring a lot to your offense and really augment it in terms of that much more and like what you're doing for the quarterback. You're just taking that much more weight off the quarterback's shoulders.

Hi, Fitz. This might need to be an Oscar-worthy performance out of you, but do your best. The case against Ashton Genty. He's a running. back. Billy Madison when he's like, business ethics. I mean, he's awesome.

I'm not going to argue that Ashton Jentee's bad. I mean, D.K., I guess my argument is D.K., who's a better prospect? Sequin Barclay or Ashton Jenty? Seekwon. Okay, cool. How did the Giants do after taking Seekoine Berkeley? I rest my case, Your Honor.

Yeah. I mean, I think that that is 100% the argument that, you know, any running back, no matter how good they are, Seycombe Barkley. It's not going to move the needle enough if you're a really bad team. Yeah. So, yeah.

I have no argument that Ashton Genty will, like against Ashen Genty being a good NFL player. Like he's special. He's honestly, maybe just by the dumbest, simplest metric of hard to tackle. Ashen Gentis, he's like the hardest player to tackle I've ever seen.

Like I love that someone was just like he looks like he electrocutes everyone who tries to tackle him. That's what it looks like. But again, a lot of running back have been very good and taken high. The only ones that actually seem worth it are either going to the best offensive line in the NFL or the best coach in the NFL.

Like Todd Gurley sucked. And he, well, not sucked. He just didn't fulfill his promise. And then he got Sean McVeigh. And then Todd Gurley was like, whoa. Christian McCaffrey. I mean, he was also in Carolina, but Carolina sucked.

It was awful. And then when Christian McAfric got to San Francisco with Kyle Shanahan, he was up. I see the vision here. Sequin with the giant. Sick one had more than six wins in a season one time. And then he goes to the Eagles.

So the best offensive line in the NFL and seems worth it. Jimmy or Gibbs, the other best offensive line in the NFL. Right. So it's like if you're going to the best O line or the best play, or Kyle Shanhern or Sean McVe, sure, the running back, the high thing worth it. I think, you know, I went on Matt Harmon's show this week. I was talking about like dessert. Like, it's kind of like you're eating your vegetables out of your candy before you

have anything for dinner. It's like you're going to get sick. I think it's like if you're the Raiders at six. and you're taking Ashton Genti before you just take Armand Membue out of Missou. Like it's out of water. I'm not going to sit here and be like, oh, yeah, it wouldn't be sick if the bears took Ashton Genty. That'd be awesome. I just kind of think maybe get a better left tackle.

But I mean, yeah, that's the extent of the I can offer. I think that's, that is kind of, and this has been something we've been arguing about since I started covering football, you know, early 2010s is like the value of a running back. What does he do? What does he bring to the offense? I think my only rebuttal to that whole argument, the reason I'm not like, like 100% adherent to it anymore is that that argument assumes the guy you pick instead of Ashton Genti turns out to be really fucking good at a valuable position.

You know what I mean? Yeah. And the decision between taking an elite player at left tackle versus an elite player at running back, that's pretty easy. But the decision between taking a guy that you think is going to be elite and a guy that also just might not be very good at an elite position or whatever, a very important position, that's a different matter. So to me, it's like, is there any doubt in my mind that Ashen Gentie is going to be a good,

productive, useful player in the NFL? There's very little, it just feels very unlikely that that's going to be the case that he's going to be a bad player in the NFL. Some of the other guys in the top 10, I don't feel that much conviction with, frankly. So that, to me, is more of the discussion in, I don't know how, I don't know how GM's made that decision. That's fair. And it would help if you already had kind of an offensive line ready to go, because,

Because it's like how many years does a running back have anyway? It's like five, six years of playing in their prime. And if you take three of those trying to build up the offensive line, you're not really getting all the value. It's way easier if you just like Jemir Gibbs of the lion, slot him in, and you're ready to go immediately. Yeah, but the lions had a first round picket, what, center guard, left tackle, right tackle.

I mean, even like they had like an edge rush. No, they did they not have aided? No, they did. They did. But they did. Yeah. Yeah. The first, yeah, they what the second.

a roll-pocket defensive end and then four first-round offensive line. Yeah, so they kind of had all of their blue-chip positions theoretically filled out. And it took the Eagles 10 years to build the offensive line that, like, they put Sequin Barkley behind. So I think, yeah, I'm not going to argue against it. Can I say one other stat about Ashton Genty that, of all the ones that are insane is maybe my favorite? Yeah. He had a thousand rushing yards last season before you had 100 carries. Wow.

Yeah. Yeah, that is wild. What? that's weird that's pretty good that's pretty good deuce anyway yeah no he's good he's good at football again I think

my real question is where on the spectrum of drafting Ashen Genty are you going to judge a team like if the Giants took Ash and Genti at 3 you guys would mercilessly make fun of the Giants would you not That's just because it's the Giants if it were a different team at 3 like if the Browns at 2 mercilessly make fun of them

Probably yes but like if the Pats took Genti at 4 I'd be like whatever. Would you? Jaguars at 5? I don't know. It's like you can justify any of it. To me,

the sexiness of it, you can justify in a short amount of time you can talk to yourself into why that's going to be awesome. At least the Jags have a quarterback. That's true. I'm just, you know, just there's a world where,

you know, Dylan Samson in the third round is going to, you know, behind like a first round left tackle. And you're like, oh, that was probably a good idea. Like, do I think the Raiders should take Gentie at six?

No. But if they do, I get it. It's not going to take it long for me to be like, this is awesome. Yeah, exactly. Hit some diggers. As entertaining as Gentie is,

I'm not sure you guys are aware that our guy, Eric Collins, who is the announcer for the Charlotte Hornets, also does Boise State football. And I have a clip prepared for you of a Gentry run. Kai, please play the clip. Typical Ashton Genty. Look at him go.

You can't bring it down. Isston Genti. On his first touch. On his first time. Yes, he will. Is he? Yes, he will. Yes, he will.

That's almost as good as who do you think you are, I am. Or what it was. The bowling guy? Who do you think you are? I am. That's the fucking best. Is he? Yes, he will.

Yes, he will. Dude, you guys should play that every time. I'm going to disagree with D.K. Or something. It's like, is he? Yes, he will. The way he can, like, change octaves of his voice is really. It feels reckless.

Like he has no control over it, though. You know what I mean? It's like pure unbridled enthusiasm. It's a runaway train every time. It's great. Oh, my God. I love it. Okay.

Let's move on here to O'Mary and Hampton, the running back out of North Carolina. Six foot, 221 Jr. spent three years at North Carolina, rushed for over 1,600 yards, finished with over 2,000 from scrimmage, widely considered to be the second best running back on the board this year. High fits, where are you at here with Omerian? What do you want? You want heads or tails?

I... It's trying to reverse chinks it. I would rather have heads. You'd rather have what? It is heads. We're on an unbelievable streak. If you listen to the last episode, I think we're like 12 for 13 getting these calls right. Yeah, we're going to have to go to instant replay, like the progressive commercials on these quick flips.

Okay, so Hyphids, Omerian Hampton. Tell me what the hype is all about. Why is he closer to Ashton Genty than he is to anybody else behind him? Well, I mean, that's not what I said. Well, sure. I don't really like that lead in. But no, Omeran Hampton, North Carolina, he's a slower Jonathan Taylor. Like, he's not quite as fast as Jonathan Taylor, like that last breakaway speed.

But when I see Omerian Hampton, he's like a legitimate three-down running back, like 93rd percentile speed score, which is, you know, 40-yard dash, but like how heavy are you, which, you know, that's how Brian Thomas scores higher than Xavier Worthy. Like 93th percentile burst score, which is, basically, you know, explosiveness. The only player with more rushing yards per game, Van Hampton, was Ashton Gentie. Also, 95 acceleration in college football 25. No big deal.

96 trucking. No big deal. But I think Hampton, like, you can run inside. You can run out. I'm just saying. He does have a good trucking. He, like, seeks it out. He has that forenet in him where he's, like, looking for people to attack.

Come on. Yeah, he would be the guy to wave on, like the four net on the Steelers game. Where he's like, come on. Like the joke, I want you to do it. I want you to do it. But, no, I just. you think he could run inside, he can run outside. And I mean, you could argue unless you're like,

touches are bad because you don't want to tread on the tires or whatever. Like, don't steal my thunder. What? Oh, Oh, is that, well, I think I figured out what Deke is going to say.

Dike's issue is going to be that, like, they gave him touches. So, like, Drake Mae was there at UNC and he had 1,700 yards, like, total. And then Drake May left and you're like, all right, well, Hampton's the only thing left in this offense.

And then Hampton's got 2,000 yards without Drake May. Like, and that comes Gentiesque-in-esque in that they're like, he's the whole kid and caboodle. And so he's still able to get it, which is a big thing for me. He's just an awesome player. He just runs dids over. DK, what do you got?

Yeah, he's like a throwback guy. Okay, so to be clear, I'm going to be nitpicking here because I do like Hampton. But the touches thing is a concern. 601 touches over the last two seasons. That's not nothing in terms of especially the speed at which he makes collisions on the field. Very, very often. Craig said it. He's almost looking for contact on every run.

He tries to go through guys rather than around them. Stylistically, I think you could have a little bit of long-term durability concerns. You know, the downside comp for me for Omerian Hampton is Javante Williams, who, you know, obviously it was somewhat random that he suffered a very, you know, like a career basically ruining injury. But that's kind of the worry with him is like he's just so explosive and so physical that the collisions are going to catch up with them faster than you really hope. So I think hopefully there's a little bit of coachability there where he's just. not trying to run through someone's face every single time he touches the football. I think there's a little bit of stiffness in the way that he runs in terms of turning the corner,

beating a guy in a phone booth. He's not as elusive and loose-hipped as Genty is in terms of just beating a guy one-on-one in a phone booth. But yeah, I mean, so for me, the two things are just stylistically, you have to have a little bit of durability concern long-term, and I just think he's a little stiffer than Gentie. Hampton's awesome. I think Jonathan Taylor's a great cop. I thought the same thing when I first watched him. He just has that like battering ram one cut.

He'll run through everybody. I feel like he does have bursts at the second level. And you mentioned Denver with Jomante Williams. I feel like that would be an awesome landing spot for him. And a lot of people have him in their mock drafts going to Denver. So yeah, do you think, D.K., do you think a guy like O'Marion, if he ends up going to a team with a better offensive line with kind of a more stable situation?

Like, let's say Genti does go pretty early. Let's say he goes like top seven to a team like, you know, Vegas or. or something. Do you think Hampton could be the best rookie running back if he goes to a better team? I think there's a chance for sure, yeah. For all the reasons we just talked about in terms of, you know, efficiency,

playing behind a good offense, playing on an offense. Because he's probably the only guy other than Gentie who's right out the gate going to be a three down back, would you say? Yes. And he does have that passing game value. I don't think he's as good of a pass catcher as Gentie is, but he can do it. Like, you know, they can utilize him on, you know, screenplays,

dump off, swing passes, things like that. I don't think he's like running vertical routes that much, but yeah, I mean, he's a really good three-down player. You know, it's funny. You guys are talking about if Ashton Genty's a top 10 pick, you know, if he goes to the Raiders or the Bears or the Jags or the Jags or someone,

where would Omerian Hampton go? And you mentioned the Broncos replacing Giovante Williams at the pick 20th. I actually would go the other way. I think he could replace Giovante Williams again in Dallas. I don't know if Dallas passes on a running back whether it's Gentie or Marion Hampton because I think Dallas, I mean, let's be real. Jerry's just trying to

We live the 90s, which is a joke. But, I mean, I've talked about this a lot of, you know, Ben Babies at ESPN. Like, they really much want to just do the 90s again. They have Dak Prescott. They have C.D. Lamb as Michael Irvin. They don't have the running back right now. And the Cowboys don't want to live without a running back. They held on to Zieg for so long.

Like, no Tony Pollard. Like, I think O'Meer and Hampton could very... Wow. I think Gentie does not get past Cowboys. I would be shocked if the Cowboys don't take Gentie. But I also think Hampton would be right there with them. So, I wouldn't be shocked at all by that. Gentie is so Cowboysee.

Like there's no way Jerry's going to let Gentie go. In my mock draft, you know what I mean? Oh my God. Yeah, I did a mock draft at NFLDraft.org.com with DK. Or, you know, DK's big board and everything is there. And I gave the Cowboys Gentie. And I will probably do it again, to be honest, because I think it's going to happen. I'll fucking do it again.

The 12th overall pick. I'll do it again. All right. Let's go on to our next guy here. I feel like Gentie's in his own tier. I would argue maybe Hampton's in his own tier. And now we're dropping to another tier here. We're going to go with Trayvion Henderson, the running back out of Ohio State,

510, senior, 202 pounds. played all four years at Ohio State. He kind of, he had his best season, statistically, his freshman year, actually, where he had 12 hundred yards, 15 touchdowns. He was kind of injured off and on, his sophomore and junior season. And now last year they win the national title, Quinchon Judkins comes in from Ole Miss. And they kind of are a one-two punch, kind of a Gibbs- Montgomery type. D.K., what do you want here for Treveon and Hederson? I know you like him.

He loves him. I want heads. You want heads? He's got Henderson higher than Hampton. God, son of a bitch. God, that's just lie. I'm not going to lie. I'm not his name.

Look, Dr. Mary Edwards Walker would not appreciate me lying. That's not what she was about. Yeah, she wants to prohibit lying. So, D.K., talk up trivia on Henderson. Why should I love him? All right. So he is just pure explosive speed out of the back, though, which I love about him. He's a big play creator, a home run hitter in both the passing game and on the ground,

electric juice in an acceleration. He's actually also got a good combination of patience as a runner where he lets his block set up. He kind of weaves through traffic and lets his blockers do the dirty work so he can run to daylight. He's a coach's dream. Soft hands, route running chops in the passing game. He's excellent in pass protection. And he takes care of the football.

Zero fumbles on 667 touches over the last four seasons. And everything you've heard about him is everyone in the building absolutely fucking loves this guy in terms of the character, the work ethic, all that stuff. So I just think he's a really high floor guy who gives you that explosive skill set and he can play on all three downs. I don't think he's going to be a workhorse, but I think he has the skill set and versatility to play anywhere in any situation. I think the biggest knock on him is he might not be going to be carrying the ball a ton,

but that's probably just going to extend his career and make him a little bit more useful and more explosive on the ground. All right. Hi, Fitz. Trayvian Henderson here. Are you going to attack his character or just his play? I'm going to repeat everything D.K. just said, but instead of like the cool comp, I'm going to tell you, Trayvion Henderson is just like healthier Jerich McKinnon. And the team wants to take first round, Jerich McKinnon.

And just as D.K. said, pure explosiveness, home run hitter, dingers. Let's blockers do the dirty work. Coach's dream. High floor guy, explosive skill set. Not a workhorse, but a good player. Don't you want to take Jerich McKinn in the first round, Craig? There were moments. There were moments with Jack McKinnon. people. How about Austin Eckler? How about that? Let's just start naming players.

Willie Parker. Just call them whatever you want. How about fucking Jemir Gibbs? All right? Whatever. Just start saying names. Yeah. I can name players too.

Here, let's pick someone who was really underwhelming. Jeremy Kiddhar. Yeah. I don't, I think that, I think that Henderson, the question is like, is he actually good in tight space? Like at the end of the day, they paid Trayvon Henderson, NIL money to come back to Ohio State. Just like Michigan to play Corum. They're like, hey, I know you can go to the NFL, but like,

don't want to come back and win a championship. And Henderson's like, cool. And they're like, team player. We like, don't actually think you can do the whole thing, though. So we're going to have Judkins transferred to Ohio State, and he's going to be on the cover of the college football video game. And Henderson's like, cool. So I'm just saying, a first round running back, we're even in college, they were like, we don't think you have a three-down workload. I think one,

that's a little bit of a strike to me. The idea that you're going to take a player that high with that seal. I don't like that even at Ohio State that we don't think you're an in-between the tackles guy. That doesn't love, I don't love that. The other one is get foot surgery in 2022, as you were saying, like, that was the injury. I don't love the idea that anything else that happens to his foot.

You're going to be like, oh, just our speed, explosive guy, going to have to, you know what I mean? It's just like, look, I'm not a doctor. I'm not going to say the medicals, but I'm just curious, any explosive-based guy that already broke his foot and clearly needed a year to come back, don't love that either. DK.

Do you think you, should be drafting any running back in the first round that is not going to be a three down back. I mean, do you think it was a mistake for the Alliance to take Jemir Gibbs? He is at his best a complimentary back to David Montgomery. And they I believe they traded up to get him in the first round.

So I guess like that would be my counter. I think generally no. I think the answer to that question is no. But it's only if he is the kind of the final piece of the puzzle in an already form. formed offense. Right. Which I think it's just kind of general what we're talking about with running backs in the first round anyway.

You know what I mean? Like, don't take him if you want him to be the guy that you think is going to lift up your team from the last place and terrible. Running back, no running back's going to do that. But in terms of just the final piece of the puzzle, the guy that can give you that juice, the big playability, the explosive playability, take pressure off your quarterback because he's not having to do everything with his arm. I can understand that point of view. Detroit had the sixth pick and they traded. back to 12.

Oh, okay, my bad. I was thinking of Jamison Williams. I was thinking they traded up to get JMO. Anyway, regardless, I don't know if Travion is, I don't think he's on the level of Jemir Gibbs in terms of prospect, but I think stylistically, that's similar type of player, a guy that gives you that juice. He's probably going to be a complimentary back.

I think the similar thing with Gibbs too is he's not a zone rudder. Like, he has to go to a Gap scheme, which is fine. In your, in your latest mock, you have Trayvon Henderson going to the Chiefs at 31. one overall. Basically, them taking another crack at it after C.E.H failed

failed for whatever that was. It's been a while, all right? It was because Mahomes texted Clyde and they were like, cool. Man, they could have taken

Jonathan Taylor. That's always just the thing that kills me. You could do that with anybody, though. I mean, that'll just, you can try to something nuts.

But that one in the moment was like, Jonathan Taylor ranked higher than, like it was a coin flip. Like that was a Dr. Mary Edwards Walker situation. I don't know why,

but I can't, every time I say her name, I don't remember it. There's like, Dr. Mary Edward, the three, like, it doesn't stick in my head. Yes, it's just three-name gal. It's three first names.

I guess Walker is not a first name. All right, let's keep going here. But Walker, Texas Ranger. Yeah, Walker. That was more of a last name, wasn't it? No, well, in Tallinnagued Knights is a first name. Oh. I love the way he's.

Also, Walker Bueller. His full name is Walker, Texas. Walker. I would so say generally, Walker is a last name more than it is a first name. Well, yeah, of course. Of course. We got a Jalen Walker in this draft. We're going to stick.

with Ohio State, Quintan Juggins, Jr., 6 foot, 220, kind of has an interesting story. He was born very bow-legged and kind of couldn't walk right, and his mom refused to, like, have leg braces on him.

So he basically, like, learned to walk in a different way, and he kind of walked on his toes, and he developed massive calves when he was young. It's a super power. Yeah, and so if you look, he has ginormous calves,

and he's also a weird, was in a weird situation with COVID, where his recruiting cycle was screwed up. He basically couldn't go to any of the camps that all these running backs get recruited out of. So he was only a three-star recruit. He went to Ole Miss for two years, wanted to win a national title, transferred to Ohio State, split time with Trevian

Henderson, and then won a national title. He had 14 touchdowns. This guy, I feel like he's the first one where it's easier to go both ways, where you can make the case for and against him a bit easier. So, High Fitz, what do you want here with Quinn Sean? I'm in on Quinn Sean.

I would rather argue for him. We saw him. I saw him at the I was at his panel or his podium or whatever. He seemed like a very nice guy. Pan. He's such a movie guy. Podium panel. Press conference, whatever you call.

His junket. His press junket. What did you ask for? I like Quintzhan. I would vote for him. Well, suck it. It's tails. Fuck.

Finally broke the streak. Mary Edwards heard you talking shit about Walker. Yeah. Okay. So tell me, what's the downside with Quinshan? He, Quinton John Gids is just Trace Herman again. like just like this awesome like legendary running back who just like oh yeah between the tackles and get to the NFL and like power runner no vision not going to work out yes yes exactly like not necessarily making guys miss like like yards you know not be able to make guys miss in the backfield not hitting holes they just like it just you're entering the NFL you're like well this guy you remember the trade sermon game with the seven touchdowns looked up at the camera and you're like oh this guy's a star I think there's a lot of that energy the Jenkins what do you think it felt like when you were watching Ohio State in the playoffs did it feel like were you more afraid of Henderson or judge Oh, me or D.K.

Either of you. Who did he pop off the screen more? Who was the guy that when you watch that game? You're like, that's the best running back on the team. I think Henderson, for the duration of the college football playoff, I think Henderson was a little scarier. Yeah, I would agree with that. But Jettkins was always kind of just the engine, the warhorse for their offense. You know what I mean?

Like doing the dirty work. It really is so reminiscent of the David Montgomery versus Jury. Maybe a team should just draft them both. Right. They really are, they are the Gibbs. They very much are the Gibbs Montgomery of college football. No one would look at the Lions backfield and be like, David Montgomery's better,

except for maybe Dan Campbell, because Dan Campbell fucking loves David Montgomery because he does all the dirty work. He gets the hard yards, gets the tough yards. I think that's kind of the Judkins thing. He's like so good in the red zone, just a nose for the end zone,

you know, rips through contact, all that stuff. It's just kind of like, you have to think from a coach's point of view, this is the guy that we're going to give the ball to the 25 times a game. Well, my other thing with Judkins is my concern. is like if there's Joe Mixin,

I think that he would be like slow mixing because like he tested better. But honestly, D.K., like, Judkins, at the theory at the combine, ran to 448 speed. When you watch Judkins, do you see 448 speed? No, I think everyone was like shocked to see his numbers as a tester.

Because he doesn't really play that fast, I don't think. I think he's, you know, he's not slow. I wouldn't say, I wouldn't put him in the same mold as like David Montgomery, who's, I think, main thing coming out was he's kind of slow. But there was one play. and they all kind of blend together,

but there was a play in the college football playoff where he ripped off a huge run and then got caught from behind. And everyone was like, did he just like actually hurt his draft prospects because he got caught instead of having like a 50 yard, like he was like a 50 yard gain? But then people were, you know, saying,

oh, maybe he actually hurt his draft stock because he got caught from behind. But yeah, I would say he just lacks that top end speed. And that was the same story with a guy like Montgomery. Everything else is pretty solid in terms of, of elusiveness, power. He can play on passing downs. I don't think that's necessarily

like his strong suit, but he can do it. It's funny. I feel like he's the first guy who, who his outperformance, or him outperforming expectations at his 40 is like an ick for you guys. Like how is that? It is because he's not that fast.

It's like, where is the speed? So he ran too fast at the 40? He was actually truly one of the most, one of the best athletes, according to the relative athletic score, the RAS score. in running back history. But I don't think anyone thought that

watching him play football. I don't bring that up. Well, I didn't want to have a red herring reason to be behind it. You don't see it. You don't really see it on tape. I think he is athletic. Do you think half the problem with Quinshawn is that he was

next to Trayvion Henderson, every game who is more explosive to him? And if he was on his own at Ohio State, we'd be viewing him a little bit. Yeah, it's like a hinge picture where you have a hotter friend and you're like, I don't want to use this photo. He's like, damn it, I look good in this photo, but my buddy looks even better. Yeah, it's like you have one of those like six foot three friends at the jaw line and you're like,

I can't just have them think that that's me. And then they look, you're like, oh, that's you. And like, nope. That's why that has to be like the third or fourth photo in the slideshow where you establish who you are first and then show it's like, I also have hot friends. It's the greatest thing like, I think modern men, modern friendships you can do for your single friends is like men need to take photos of other men that aren't like selfies or group photos.

Like men need photos themselves. Do you find that men are better at photographing other men for hinge profiles or Would you still prefer a woman to craft? Oh, yeah. I mean, if you can, you need women to take the pictures and you need women to take. Honestly. The old, the age old, the maximum men don't want, men don't know what women find a trap. No, men do not know what women are.

I've got to tell you. Pete Davidson, I'll never understand. If you're a single guy listening to this and you are having trouble with hinge, I cannot give you any better advice than have literally any woman other than your mother. Look at your hinge. Even your mom. It's fine. Honestly, even you're fucking, anyone, like, let me tell you something.

I just, with my friend group, women know if a man has never had a woman look at their hinge. They know. There's a couple celebrity that I just don't understand. Like, Pete Davidson, I don't get it. I never will. Jeremy Allen White, I'm even like, I don't know. I don't know if I see it. Well, the Calvin Klein thing?

I mean, you see it's shirtless? Dude, the one that we just did on the rewatchable is a movie, D.K., this was right in your era. Have you seen Can't Hardly Wait? Yeah. Ethan Embry, who plays like the male lead, the love interest of Jennifer Lefewitt, apparently he was like a thing. And I don't understand that at all. What was he like in real life? What was his personality?

I have no idea. Because in the movie, he's kind of just like a whining. He's like this bumbling, goo-goo-eyed idiot. But like also the whole look, I didn't understand it at all. But apparently Joanna Robinson was like he was a heartthrob like a Lloyd Dobler, say anything, John Cusack type. Right, right. But maybe different era. But yeah, you're right.

We don't know what women want. No, we don't know what women want. Well, it's just the hair. It's a hair thing, too. It's men think your hair should look like an English soccer player and women want it like long and men don't get it. I just, I follow the Instagram thing, the guy with the Ick list. And it's like a thousand things long. Impossible to exist.

It's like you could not be, you can't live without being some woman's email is more X. I think we've more listeners than we did the last time we did this. Email us X. X are just things that. Don't be rich. Don't be poor. Don't be tall. Don't be short.

If we could do some like some polling to find out the man that the most women think are attractive that the most men do not. I think it's Pete Davidson. It would just be this whole exercise to get to Pete Davidson. You think it's Pete? I'd be curious. Email us. If you have any suggestions for who you think is up there with Pete Davidson.

Yeah, the most polarizingly attractive man. That's a good point. Okay. What we're talking about? Quinshot Jenkins. We're done with Quinn. Now we're going to talk about Caleb Johnson, the running back out of Iowa. Big boy, 6-1-224 Jr.

Spent three years at Iowa. He had a huge freshman year. They had a weird sophomore year where it was like class with the coaches. He had an ankle injury. He wasn't playing a ton. And then he exploded his final year. Over 1,500 rushing yards, 21 touchdowns set the single season record at Iowa for rushing touchdowns. Who are we on here?

D.K., Caleb Johnson. What do you want? I want to go for him. Okay. We'll see what Dr. Edwards Walker has to say about that. It is heads. Ha! Poor Hifis is getting shaft.

She never lets me down. All right. Caleb Johnson, he's not going to be for everyone because he's strictly a zone running back. And that's kind of his superpower is if you've ever watched a zone running game, it's basically like you go laterally at the snap and you try and get the, you basically read the defense and if they over pursue, you cut it up field. If they don't pursue far enough, you go to the outside. And he's really good at picking his lane, sticking his foot in the ground, and getting up field very quickly.

He had a ton of huge plays in this last season. He was third in college football with 28 rushes of 15 plus yards. Big playback. He needs a little bit of a runway. And to be very clear, I'm not comparing him to this player. But in the same way that Derek Henry. If he needs, you know how he needs like two or three steps before he gets up to top speed? That's very much kind of like Caleb Johnson, where, you know, he's going to go and stick.

his foot in the ground and get outfield, but if he doesn't have like a little bit of a runway to get going, and that's exactly why he's a good zone runners, because you start you go laterally at the snap. Without the runway, he topples like Derek Henry, like when he kind of gets hit in the backfield and it's like a dictator statue

falling in square. That's so funny. Literally watching him today, I wrote down, I said like he is both kinds of Derek Henry, like the one that is, looks like the worst running back in the league sometimes and the other who is truly unstoppable. I was literally going to say that, Craig, where you watch his tape and you simultaneously or you flip-flot between thinking this is the worst running back you've ever seen.

Yes, the cognitive distance is watching him. Right. I can't tell if I'm like, actually, is this guy incredibly boring and simple? And all he can do is hit an open hole and run straight. He has no mobility. He's not that fast. Sure, he's big. But like, this is a guy who is way too much of a finesse runner for how big he is.

He runs very upright. He kind of runs very politely for how big. big he is. And that, that doesn't jive with me. But I think the numbers bear that, the numbers say a completely different, tell a completely different story than that. I, I, I really liked him because I thought, even though he's not necessarily a traditional tackle breaker, he didn't seem aggressive to me. He meant he, uh, for 66 missed tackles last year, according to PFF, which is a really good number, uh, 4.4 yards after contact per rush. Yeah, but that's some safety 20 yards up the field that like ducked out of the way because he was no, because he, I, I disagree with that because he, I really did

think like his vision getting and picking his lane and running through he rips through arm tackles. I think that's where he picked up a lot of his broken tackles is basically when he get like his ability to get through creases that you don't really think he'll be able to get to. I thought he had pretty quick feet too in that, you know, in the ability to, you know, stick his foot in the ground, gather his feet, chop a little bit and turn to daylight. You have to have like a combination of vision and quickness and acceleration to be able to be good in the zone running game. Maybe like a good example was,

you remember Alfred Morris back in the day? Big, slow lumbering guy that was just fucking awesome in zone running game because he had great vision. He was decisive. He had that one huge year in Washington, right? Yeah. And that's why zone running offenses in general have produced all these guys over the years where they weren't really that big of a deal coming out of college,

but they just really fit that scheme and were really good at making the decisions that you need to make. It's like get to point A to point B and then. you can do whatever you want, but they're very good at doing that point A to Point B thing. I think that's what Caleb Johnson has. He didn't fumble the ball, 262 touches in 2024.

I think he flashed past catching ability. Iowa is not an offense where you're going to showcase your past catching, but I thought he flashed in his ability to like twist and turn and catch the ball. But yeah, again, he was fourth among all college running backs in yards after contact per rush. So I thought he had maybe it's like sneaky tackle breaking ability, not traditional tackle breaking, like Gentie or Marion Hampton. I feel like not all broken tackles are created equal.

Sure. That's 100% true. It's like a one-on-one Mexican standoff and it's like, I need to get past you. It's like the Oklahoma drill. And the others are like, a cornerback is diving at you and his arm slaps you in the hip as you go by them. And it's like, are those both broken tackles? A hundred percent. I think, you know, it's funny because I don't even disagree with what Diga saying.

I agree. I agree with what you're saying, too, though, Craig, because, you know, it's funny. Nate Tice at Yahoo also compared. paired him to Derek Henry. But when I saw that, what I actually think is, do you remember Derek Henry's first two seasons in the NFL? Didn't do anything. Of course you don't.

No one does. It's been totally retcon from memory that Derek Henry, frankly, wasn't that impressed him in the NFL for like two and a half seasons. Derek Henry. And I think that's actually the version of Derek Henry that I see with Caleb Johnson is the one where we were, like, kind of really disappointed. And I think Derek Henry is like, more than any running back I've seen in the last 10 years, they're like, I need a rhythm.

I need to be in the game. Like if you give me 10 carries, like I'm not going to get it done. He's not like a complimentary guy. He needs to be the lead back. Yes. And I'm worried there's an aspect of that with Caleb Johnson where you're like, I actually need a full time workload. And I'm not sure there's a full time workload skill set, especially the unspoken part of

this. Zone running back, the whole league's moving away from Zone. Like Shanahan McVeigh, I mean, you know, I think McVeigh in particular, like they're getting these giant, Mikevei gave a kajillion dollars last year to get these giant guards, which didn't totally work. But like, because they wanted to run more power stuff. Like duo and whatnot. Yeah, you're talking about a running back.

where you're like, well, we need to run this kind of thing. And it's, I don't want to be like so four years ago, but it's a little so four years ago. And I'm just curious what happens. Zone's not going anywhere, though. There's still going to be teams that are running it. But yeah, I understand what you're saying. But like the whole thing of like a decisive zone runner is kind of a thing you can get like in the six round.

Yeah, yeah. Like a not athletic guy, you can do exactly what you need to do and set up your pitches. Like a pitcher with like four pitches that can't throw 98 miles an hour. But like, you know what I mean? can really set up. Like, that's what Kyron Williams is for. I'm that's saying Karen Williams is like Caleb Johnson, but like you don't necessarily need to take him as high as Caleb's going to go.

So I'm intrigued by Caleb Johnson a lot, but I have a lot of questions. Also, the ultimate, oh, sorry, we're going to say, Greg. No, no, go ahead. I was going to say, I lean, I agree much more with you. There's just something. He doesn't seem dynamic to me in any way.

It's like, see open hole run through open hole is kind of just like who he's, that's who he is to me. And I, I mean, Forrest Gump was all America. Craig. That's true. Let's just be clear. I think the credit you get with Zone is like he's

creating the holes. Like there's a skill to that. The other thing I'll say though, if we're going to talk about Hinge with Henderson Judkins or like, oh, he's sitting next to the hot one. Making the Iowa offense good is the ultimate posing

with your like ugliest friend and putting them in the hinge profile. Like part of me is just like, is this just a trick of the light because we were so blown away that he looked awesome in Iowa? Nothing jumped off the page to me while watching.

I liked him a lot, but I also can see the criticisms. and Craig, you nailed the criticisms I've seen basically all along, hyphidt you to, too, in terms of just, you know, I think there's just so many plays

or enough plays where he just looks terrible that, like, is an ick, like speaking of the ick list, but I've seen so many plays where he is creating on his own. I feel like I really like him, but he's a very specific flavor that. It's like, yeah, he can hit threes if he's open in the corner, but like, can't create?

Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's going to be very interesting to watch, I feel like. He's a high variance guy. Hell, I'll go three for five from deep if I'm open in the corner. You know what I mean? Put me in the game. Isn't that one of your takes?

If you think you could hit three, you could hit three, what is your take? I forget what the exact ratio was. I think I said I could go three for five from three in an NBA. Three for five. That's the, that's the, dude, I actually had, okay, I'm going to just call someone out. I went three for four last night in my rec game, so you tell me. Yeah, there we go. Did we tell the story about how it translates completely to the NBA?

I'm saying if I'm wide open, if I'm just sitting there in the corner. I get five shots. I get three of them. Did we tell the story about how we met? Slightly different stakes, but yeah. Chris, the ESPN Chargers reporter. He's 82 games. Yeah.

Dude, we introduced you to, I introduced you to Chris, who's the ESPN Chargers reporter. And you met, guys met and you dapped up and you're like, wait a second. And you were like, he was like, I think I fouled the shit out of you in a game. And you're like, you did foul this shit out of me in a game. Yeah. He kept grabbing my jersey. Chris Rim. Yeah, he was, I'd be rolling off screens and he'd be grabbing my jersey, hold me back.

We've gotten like a little bit of a like a like a tiff for that game. You know what arrested development? Because he did the arrested development thing where you were like, did you foul the shit on me? He was like, oh yeah. And it was like the arrested development. He was like, Michael did some detective work. And he's like, hey, did you burn down the storage unit?

He's like, oh yeah, most definitely. Yeah, I did kind of calm out. I was like, dude, you were holding me the whole game. And he was like, yeah, it was. That's what I do. Like that's how you play defense. That's how he's possible. That's how I play defense.

All right. Who's up next there? All right. Dylan Samson, running back out of Tennessee, 5-8, 200-pound junior. This was his first year as a starter, and he had 1,500 yards and 22 touchdowns.

He broke the school's single-season rushing touchdowns record, which was a mark previously held by Gene McEver in 1929. Damn. Almost a 100-year record, the single-season touchdown record, broken by Dylan Samson. I kind of wanted to briefly go through the 1929 Tennessee Valls roster. Yeah.

They were good that year. 1922? 1929. 29. So Gene McKeever or McEver. The E is capitalized. Is that McEver? McEver.

McEver? McEver. McEver. So if you, first of all, if you look at him on Wikipedia, he looks like David Geffen. McIver? McIver? What?

David Geffen? He looks like David Geffin. He looks like David Geffin on Wikipedia. Running back for the Vols? Gene McKeever. Look him up. The man looks like he should be managing artists on tour.

He got to touch like David Gapha. I thought you were pulling that out of your ass. No, he looks like Gary of Gavin. I totally see it. That guy set the had the rushing record at Tennessee for 95 years.

I thought you were pulling that out of your ass. Anyway, some of the other people. So by the way, the falls that year, 9-0-1, they outscored their opponents 330 to 13 that season. Here are some players on their team. There are three. They're already dead.

Okay, ready? Tackle Oscar Derryberry. Come on. We have Houston Herndon and Herman Hickman. Get out. Stop it. We have Paul Hug at end. Paul Hug?

Paul Hug. H.U.G. We have Guard Conrad Templeton. There's just no shot. Anyone would ever be named that right now. The halfback was Theodore Disney. Not sure if he was related to Walt. Stop.

He adore Disney. He adore Disney. Get out. Did she look up if he's related? Yeah, I don't, he didn't, I couldn't find anything. And then their quarterback was Bob Dodd, who was longtime head coach of Georgia Tech. The Bob Dodd Blah Blah. Bob Dodd.

Bob Dodd. Bob Dodd. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Teddy Disney. They were fucking good, man. Holy shit. What was it 300 something to 13?

330 to 13. Jeez. That's pretty incredible. Yeah. Okay. Dylan Samson, Tennessee. I desperately want to argue for Dylan Samson. I'll be very upset if I can't. It is heads. Congratulations. God. Wow. Okay. Dylan Samson, tell me. So as Craig mentioned, the combine, you do these, as Craig said,

press conferences. Press conferences. But panels, it's just so funny. They're usually kind of blah. It's nice because you kind of like sometimes get something out of them. You never know which ones are going to be like totally bland and not worth your time. And then every now and then, you're like, wow, I actually feel like I got a vibe from this guy. I thought the most impressive one I've ever been to was Dylan Sampson. Oh, he left the most impact on me. Yeah, well, I mean, it's top tier. I'm sure I'm forgetting something.

But, it's actually CJ Strauss was actually crazy too. Like, but, uh, and Hunter. But I think Samson was the one, the less famous guys are a different vibe because you're like really just like a small group of people around him. And Dylan Samson like made such a mark on me. And I, because I met him personally, I am so convinced he's going to be great because I haven't met any of these other people we're talking about. So I think they're going to fail. But in all seriousness, I actually love Dylan Samson.

I totally acknowledge Tennessee's offense is kind of super fake. But I actually kind of think he's just like Tony Pollard. Like, Dylan Samson is so explosive. He's so good. I acknowledge there are certain questions about lanes. Honestly, it's all the Tony Pollard stuff. I think it's going to be like, oh, my God, he's just unbelievable. And I kind of want the coaches to give him the ball more.

And I'm sure he's getting capped at like 14 touches a game. And we're going to be like, give him more. and there's going to be reasons. But I think per touch, Dylan Samson's going to be like a star. D.K. Why is he not going to be a star? Why is he not going to be a star?

Well, High Fitz alluded to it, but I think you always have to take Tennessee anybody with a giant grain of salt because they run, speaking to Teddy Disney, a Mickey Mouse offense. Hey. Oh, that Mickey Mouse offense got them 330 points to 13 allowed.

So basically, if you haven't watched Tennessee play, they line up their receivers about 30 yards away from everyone else. There's a different zoom on their like plays than the other place. You got you basically are forcing the defense to have a lighter box. So that certainly would help your run game, right? Because there's just fewer defenders close to the box. I don't think that's the only reason he had so much successes here. I actually do like him.

But he's undersized. He's a one year starter. I think his lack of size is definitely a disadvantage in pass pro. So maybe he's not going to get on the field in the passing situations. He's not super physical. And he's not like a pile pusher type back. He's like 200 pounds. And he runs a little bit high, absorbs contact.

He'll, he's one of those running backs who's really shifty, but also he'll just take big hits at times because he's just running too high and trying to get too cute with something and they'll just get annihilated. And this is the big one. He needs to clean up his ball security for fumbles last year. If you start fumbling, it's so easy to just get relegated to the bench and the coach forgets about you. So that's just one concern.

When I was watching him, he reminded me of Bucky Irving, but there's so many Bucky Irvings in the history of the NFL that ended up just being sort of, you know, complimentary guys that don't end up doing all that much in the offense, six or seven touches a game. You know, maybe the downside is a guy like Tage Spears who is really explosive and electric, but just doesn't get that many touches. You know what I mean? He's just not a big part of the offense.

I think, I, I, actually don't fight you on any of those things except the Bucky. I think he's more explosive than Bucky, but probably Yeah, yeah. Athletically he is. Yeah. Yeah. But the Tadji thing's fair. I think Tadjia doesn't get touches because he doesn't have cartilage in his knee or whatever. But I think Dylan Samson, I acknowledge everything you say, especially the fumbling. My counter with everything is the stuff that gets rounded out. Dylan Samson's one of the youngest players at any position in this draft. He's like 20 years old.

He is 20 years old. I mean, so I think he doesn't. turn 21 until a couple weeks before the season? Or no, I can be wrong. I forget when it's, I don't know what his birthday is. But he's 20 years old right now. So, so, but no, but I just, I just, when you add that in, like, you know, not to be Captain Mathier, his rookie contract will end and he will be 24 years old. So, you know, I- He doesn't turn 21 until September. I just kind of nailed it.

Not going to lie. There you go. But yeah, so I'm just, I just love this guy. And again, can't stress enough when I met him. And again, this is why you really shouldn't meet the prospects because you meet him And you're like, oh, Will Howard. Love that guy. Two favorite players in the draft, Dylan Samson and Will Howard.

Yeah, the top two of my board, the two guys I met. But I really do, I have to say, I mean, we do end up meeting a lot of these players. Yeah. The most down to earth humble, like, he's just. What did he say that was so impressive to you? Like in anything in particular areas. I just was very impressed by his story. He talked about growing up his great.

So he's from Louisiana. He's huge Reggie Bush fan. And in my head, I was like, USC, you don't remember that. He was because Saints. and he was from Louisiana and then obviously there's a bunch of hurricanes that affected his life and moved around and then his grandfather

passed away. He talked about the way his grandfather passing and was quit football but it was about tumultuous time in his life and he was about his journey back Oh, someone asked him about his chain which is always a very good question actually

is asking guys about the jury There's always a story. And it was about his grandfather and I just was out of it I was very impressed and it's probably also why you shouldn't care about these things is because when you hear them you're like well I'm going to roof this guy

forever now. Yes, I was going to say Hyvids love story. I mean to be to great character I really like Dylan Sampson. I'm excited. He's sick. Yeah.

No breaking character allowed. Okay, let's keep going. Two more guys. I hate him. Next guy out of Virginia Tech, basal, Tootin. Yeah. Tootin.

Tootin. Darn Tootin. 5-9, 206 pounds, senior. Was that North Carolina agriculture and tech for the first two years of his career and then transferred to Virginia Tech? Ran a 4-3-2-40-yard dash. He had over 1100 yards and 15 touchdowns. D-K.

Yeah. Basial Tootin. What do you want? Four. Everyone wants to be four. Everyone's positive. Okay, it is Tails. Damn it.

Nice. Why am I not rooting for Tootin? All right. It's easy, rooting for Tootin. It's easy to get enamored with the speed thing. Yeah. But, you know, looking back over the years. Yeah.

It's not always the greatest. All those cool plays he makes. Yeah. Fuck those sick plays where that runs everyone on the field. I hate those. His highlights are awesome. You know that meme where it's like, hey, this actually sucks and it's like pointing at coolest thing in the entire world? I'm going to just go straight to the same exact thing I said about Dylan Samson.

Ball security is a massive issue with Tootan. In fact, it's the one reason I'm just a little bit nervous about him going into the pros. He fumbled nine times the last two years, two lost only, but still, that's a massive issue. If that's the type of thing that continues, again, you could just be relegated to the bench and your coach forgets about you for the next three years. years. He's a little undersized. I'd say he's a little bit stiff laterally. He's more of a one cut and go type of guy.

Obviously, he can go when he goes. He has incredible speed. But yeah, I'd say to me, the big worry is the ball security thing. And he was also not super utilized in the passing game. So is he going to be an early downback only at the pro level? All right. High Fitz.

I mean, imagine if Devon A chain couldn't catch when that's this guy. I know. He's like, There was times where I started to get excited Like I was excited about A-chan when I was watching Tootin play Dude, embrace it. Embrace it, D.K. Don't resist it.

Let your urges wash over you. I will say about him, this is exactly what I told High Fits about A-chan last, or two years ago, whatever it was. Don't suppress your feelings. I think Tootin can access rush lanes that other running backs couldn't even dream about getting through. And that's so exciting to me because, because, you know, if he fit him in the right offense

where he's doing the one cut and go type of thing, he can just, he annihilates the pursuit angles. The defenders, I've seen this so many times on his tape, defenders look surprised when he ran past him just because he has that much burst. So he gets on guys quicker than most running backs you see in college football. So I thought his turbocharged acceleration was super impressive.

He has multiple kick return touchdowns on his resume. There's another reason I was excited. He said, man, watch this guy return. turn kicks. Tell me he's going to be bad in the NFL, you can't. And there's also plays where his effort really pays off where he's second and third effort, keeps his legs churning, and then he like squirts out of the pile and keeps going. I just think he, I don't know, I'm trying not to get too excited about this guy because of the ball security stuff, but he is really fun to watch. You can tell DK's extra passionate out. Yeah. Yeah. Which I'm going to write that

down. When DK feels that way about somebody, usually it ends up being correct. The reason makes sense. again, when I say H.N, I'm not doing that lightly. Tutin ran, remember all the stats about H.N's 100-yard dash was like the most incredible thing ever. Tutin ran the same 40-yard dash at the combine as Devon H.N. Same thing. Tudson's 20 pounds heavier almost than H.N. And he ran the same 40-yard dash.

So we're not just throwing it out lately. I think H.N. probably has a little more of the speed on tape. But I think Tutin, similar is similar-ish to Judkins, but there's a through line with a lot of these running backs that just COVID screwed up these recruiting classes. Like it's just like junior year Where there's a lot of you know It's like Saturday at the Masters

You know it's moving day Like your junior in high school Is supposed to just change all the recruiting stuff And it's just these guys were juniors For the most part during COVID So Tooten was a zero star recruit Which is how he ended up at North Carolina A&T as a sophomore

And obviously that was wrong Because he runs a 432 40 yard dash Dude his hyphen says 10 yard split 1.49 seconds Getting anything under 1.5 is like electric. Yeah, that's the fastest of any running back in.

So where's he going to go? What round is he going to go in DK? How many pictures do the dolphins have? If I had to guess right now, third. Okay. I think guys with that kind of speed and explosiveness, and he jumped 40 inches in the vert, 1010 broad.

He had a 40 inch vertical? 40.5. He's stupid. He's stupid explosive. I think that type of explosiveness usually doesn't last until day three. There's a small chance because of the depth of this class

that he goes in the fourth. round. So the other thing I wrote down here was imagine if C.2 Spiller started his career at North Carolina A&T. Right. Right. Like, you know what I mean? Like he just never got to a PowerFive program, really? Or like, I mean, he did. It went to, you know, but he didn't start there because of the recruiting weird

stuff. So, yeah, just the speed's unbelievable. I think that the question is, is he really like a zero in the past a game? Like, does he just, does doot and just become like an Isaiah Pacheco? Where you're like, oh, that's, you know, if he ran like less freaking weird. What is it? Pacheco runs like he bites people? He runs like he's mad at the ground.

Shout out to that playlist. We made the crescendo songs that run like you Pacheco songs. Oh, that's on Spotify. He's just high knees all the time. Yeah, but this is the most bonk player to me in the entire draft. He is. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I got to him kind of late in the process, too, in terms of just like writing him up.

And the more I watched him, the more I was like, fuck, I kind of like this guy. So he is moving up my board quickly because I'm slowly sort of falling in love. Speaking of bonks, this is my bonk up next. This is the last guy I asked. Cam Scataboo out of the last. of Arizona State. 5-9, 219 pounds, senior. He's 23 years old.

He had 1D1 offer. He played at SAC State for three years. He sat out one, played for two years at SAC State. Spent his final two years at Arizona State. This year, second in rushing and college football, 1,700 yards, 21 touchdowns. He also had 45 catches over 600 yards receiving. He broke the Arizona State record for total rushing yards in a season.

He became the first Arizona State player to cross 2,000 yards from scrimmage in a single season. He was fifth in Heisman voting. And also had an incredible game against Texas in the college football playoff. If you watch that game, you would be sold. He did everything. He literally did everything. He had 143 rushing yards. He had

99 receiving yards and he threw a 40 yard touchdown. I'm going to just because if I don't get to say this, it's going to be crushed. To your point of that game, literally he has 100 yards to three quarters. Cam Scada does in that game against Texas. Again, in the college football playoff, cut to commercial break. He's throwing up

on the sideline. They gave him an IV. And he's yelling at his teammates because they were losing the whole game. And he's screaming at people. And he's like, they give him an IV. And he's throwing up. And then he goes, they're down 16 points with seven minutes left. He throws a 42-yard touchdown on fourth down.

And then the next drive, he catches a 62-yard pass that he runs in. Then he give him the ball, runs in a touchdown. And then he runs in the two-point conversion. In like two drives after he was throwing up and got an IV. Okay. What's that said? I swear to God, if I don't get to. to argue for this guy.

If I don't get, if I have to argue this guy of all guys. You better pray to Dr. Mary. So, Mary, please. All right. So Hyvetts wants heads. Hail Mary. Hail Mary.

Hail Mary. He's throwing up a Hail Mary. And I promise, I'm not going to lie whatever this is. It's tails. For who? Me or, me or D.K.

For you? No! No! Hyphitz or D.K., do you want to let Hyphitz get head? Let's let Hyphitz have this one. I just said let Hyphitz get head. We'll give Hyphitz.

You know what? That's what a friend does. Thank you, Dick. I appreciate you. So that game where I was watching it, I wrote down my comp for Cam Scada, for Cam Scadabo. God.

You guys ever read the Iliad? I've not read the Iliad. He's Ajax. I would fucking. Oh, sure. I read it in an original Greek, actually. You're right. You're right.

I watched the movie Troy. Ajax. You know, he's fucking Ajax. Contacts. Won't go down. Great balance. I would follow Cam Scatabo to war.

Like, I actually think, like, the most overused term in football is, like, foxhole guy. Cam Scadabotabot is a foxhole guy. Like, I would go into enemy fucking territory of Cam Scadabo. Not going to lie, probably the slowest running back I'd ever wanted an NFL team. But, like, I genuinely think, like, if my life was in danger, I would actually want him around. Yeah, D.K., do you want to try to make the case against him? I love him. You know what?

Was Achilles in the Iliad? Yeah, but that's Aschigentee. People literally bounce off him, impenetrable. Scadaboo is Achilles and his Achilles heel is he's slow as fuck. No, I would say here's the cons. He's slow. He's white. Okay.

That's going to hurt him. Yeah. Public perception, team perception. Yeah. General perception. He might fall to day three. General perception. Not supposed to be white anymore.

I mean, that's fair. Well, you can't be slow and white. If you're fast and white, there's exceptions to be made. But yeah, I would say, you know, obviously that is the big deal. But I'd say a little disappointing as a pass protector. I don't know if a coach is going to trust him right away to be in on third downs. I would trust him to do anything.

Dick is acting like Cooper DeGine didn't pick six in the Super Bowl to like seal the game. You know, this is a new NFL. I love Scataboo, dude. He's just a fucking dog. You're not even letting me do my bit. I love that he's slow. I love that he can do everything. He doesn't go down.

He has honestly, like, he has the closest balance to Ashton Genty of anybody else in this class. He will not go down. No, I genuinely like, yeah, if Genty didn't exist, we would be talking about Cam Scadabas. I don't care.

I don't care what his measurables are. He's going to be a productive player on a good football team, and he will matter this season or in his career. He's not fast in a traditional sense. We spent a lot of time talking about David Montgomery with Quin Sean Juckins. but I think Scataboo is closer to the David Montgomery

archetype of running back because he breaks a fucktime of tackles. He's pretty much good on all three downs. Other than I'd say the past pro's just a little shaky, but he's a really good past catcher. It can be utilized in the passing game. Around the same size as David Montgomery. He's going to get caught from behind, but he's not slow in the short area.

He has enough burst to make guys... He's like a bear. Bears are faster than horses in short distances. Right. So I would say I'm actually kind of excited about Cam Scataboo. I like, yeah, I would take him. I would be excited if he was on my team. He jumped 39 inches in the vert. I think he ran a 4-6 or something like that at his probably.

He's like, Jenty, he can dunk at 5 foot 5. Yeah. I'm so in. He's also kind of one of those guys that looks for contact. He just like loves being out there. I feel like he's having more fun than anyone else. Oh, well, you can rally on the sideline. He's more, I think the Montgomery thing he's in common with.

And again, the Montgomery, the meme of Montgomery, where it's like, feat of Sequin Barclay, vision of Achilles, you know? It's just like, it's just perfect. But I... It's feet of Saquan Barclay, vision of Levi-on-Bell, strength of Ezekiel Elliott, athleticism of Sodie, Michelle. That last one kind of threw me through it. The thing about Scadabo also that Montgomery has in common is every carry looks like

the hunger games. Like every other, like, you know, effort is a weird thing to get into because it's so, you know, how do you describe effort? Every run is like he's on the beach in Normandy trying to get to the fucking. He runs like if he doesn't make it, he's going to die. Like he actually, like, and that's why I'm joking about the battle thing that I'm not. It's very, very, very, D.K., I would say one of the rarest things you can say and actually mean about an NFL player, like, prospect is I think they are trying more and care more than the other players. Like, that's like the hardest thing you could argue.

You could argue it's like the rarest trade. I mean, he basically carried his team to almost winning in that game. It's like insane. Oh my God. Yeah. It's, he fires me up. I know. He has, we mentioned this the other day.

He has, he has best player on the field energy, even if he isn't actually the best player. Yeah, he has like Dion Waiters confidence. Yeah. It feels like it's, it sucks at the Steelers.

It sucks that the Steelers have Jalen Warren, who's kind of already a Cam Scataboo type, because I would love for him to be on the Steelers. All right. Right, that concludes it. Those are our guys. Is anyone else you want to just throw out? I want to mention some guys because we basically had to cut a few players here that I really like.

RJ Harvey from UCF, we talked about him on a previous spot. So that was one of the reasons we ended up not doing him on the show. Jordan James from Oregon, I really like. Why do you like Jordan James? He's just twitchy movement skills, very aggressive run style, makes guys miss in a phone booth. I think he's one of the more underrated running backs. this class. I haven't heard a ton of hype on him, but I think he's really good. Damien Martinez from Miami, Devin Neil from Kansas, DJ Giddons, Kansas State, Trevor E.T.N., Georgia. Ollie Gordon from Oklahoma

State. The list is really long. Jaden Blue from Texas is a really interesting guy. There's literally, there's like a couple dozen running backs that could actually have like a real NFL career. Right. So we kind of had to cut it out at, we wanted to end on Scatoo, let's be honest. Hard to follow him, Ajax. Right. Yeah. But I think there's, there's a ton of guys in this class that are going to be taken in third and fourth and fifth round who we could be talking about in fantasy next year yeah Damien Martinez I think is also very good he's exciting yeah he's big like pretty light feet physical run through your face a lot of guys my guys in this class nobody's quite as special as my my dear scataboo scataboo oh my god all right I'm so fired thank

DK, thank you for letting me have Scattermore. I'm not going to forget that. I think he was one of the first players you planted your flag on, like mid-season and the college season. You're like, I love this guy. You know why? You do this job long enough and you get a little cynical. And when players actually spark anything even resembling childlike joy,

like you have to like fucking hold on to that. And that's why I love Travis Hunter so much is I'm like, I've never seen anything like this before. It's actually different than everything everyone told me was possible. And that's what's got about. I wish we had Eric Collins on that Texas Arizona State game. Kai, can we play that clip again? Can we hear the Gentie clip, please?

It's got him to throw. Look at him go. You can't bring him down. His team on his first touch. Will. I love, I love, look at him go. Look at him go. Yes, he will.

Look at him go. God, that's good. We have to get Eric Collins on the show. I think anyone knows Eric Collins. Versus, who's going to win that battle? If anyone knows Eric Collins, We are his biggest fans. We really are.

We're obsessed with Eric Collins. I have watched a full 15-minute highlights of Eric Collins. I witnessed this. The day of the NFL draft, last year in Detroit, I actually think maybe the hardest I've laughed as an adult was last year, Austin Gale in Detroit showing us the 15-minute supercut of Eric Collins. The day of the draft, because there's so much time until it starts.

I was like cry laughing. Yeah. He's like, Bridges for the three. Happy lookouta. The fucking Hornets. We will. Lamello. All right.

Disaster. Disaster. Catastrophe! Oh, that's what it is. Catastrophe. Look at him go. Look at him go. Okay.

All right. We'll get to some emails. Yeah. But first, a quick thing, Craig. I can't get over this video. He said this morning of. minor league baseball team that had the bases

loaded and walked in a run and then the catcher threw the ball back and then three guys stole a base. They led it three runs on the walk. Which was funny. What? But then it way better than that was the team name was the Albuquerque isotopes.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That is like the entire minor league baseball experience right there. Albuquerque isotopes walked in a run. It's kind of genius though, like sneaking in an extra run on a walk where everyone's just like not paying attention. The catcher lackadaisically throws the ball back to the pitcher

and he sneaks in. They just kind of like, drafted off the guy in front of him. Yeah, kind of. No, it was just a catcher was just so mad because they walked in a run before. It was two to one. They walked in a run to make a two two.

And the guy on second got to third super quickly and then capitalized on the lazy throwback to the pitch. That is a savvy player. It really. Yeah, it was brilliant. Yeah. It was really, really brilliant. I kind of forgot you could even do that.

So, but anyway, Albuquerque isotopes. And then someone replied him. It's just like, so you're saying there was a chain reaction that led to a design? Yeah, it was good. All right. Emails. Again, email it should take purges.

We're doing the take purge. It's going to run next week. Email should take purge. You know, purge your souls, clinch yourselves with us. Anything last season, this season, this draft, players, your teams, what your team should do. Anything, I don't know. It could be whatever you want. Gentlemen's piss club.

Purge business. Perge, whatever's, you know, bugging you. Send whatever you want. I want to read a couple. We asked also for long cons, like things you pull in your friends. Keep feeling the most of those. Those are fun.

I'm enjoying them. I want to read one from Armando. Armando. When I was a toddler, I fell and I hit the top of my head. And it split open and the hair never grew back there. So I always had a small line on the top of the back of my head. And in middle school,

one of my classmates asks like what happened? there like did the barber cut you or what and i said no i told her no when i was a baby i was delayed i was and i was very dumb as a child so the doctor told my mom that i should have an experimental chip planted in my brain to help me develop and be smarter and then seven years went by and i forgot about this moment ever happening uh and i graduate with the four and a half GP gp english and i'm like what's it called summa cum laude or whatever like the top 10% of class, whatever. And so he's going to get a different robe and color, graduation, whatever. And this girl in class goes on this tirade that I should not be allowed in the top 20 kids at

graduation. And the teacher's like, what are you talking about? She's like, he has a chip in his brain. Oh, my God. That man is not real. Like the lady on the plane? He has a chip in his brain. Oh, that's funny. He invented Neurilink like 20 years ago. Oh, my God. I love that one.

The video of that woman on the plane. Dude, what happened there? You know what's funny? Did you guys, Chuck Closeman was on Bill's Pod talking about that like a year or two ago. And Chuck had this one thing where he was like, I don't know why that doesn't happen more. And I never understood what he meant by that.

What do you mean? He doesn't understand why that doesn't happen more. why people think other human beings are like... No, I think people tripping balls on drugs. On planes? Oh, like people freaking out on planes? Did he mean on planes or just people tripping balls in public? I think he meant like on planes or perhaps even suggesting that another human was not real. He was like, I'm surprised like we don't see that happen more often.

And I was like, really? I kind of get that, actually. I kind of agree. There's a whole genre of people on planes. Like, this is a whole genre of video. Planes are anxiety-inducing like scenarios. right so like you get your anxiety's already up and then you add in drugs or whatever it is i can see yeah time doesn't exist it's like a casino like you just don't know where you are you don't know when you

are it's all over the place there's no clocks being on planes is god i don't like being on planes it's just like for so many reasons especially when you don't can't use anything can't use any devices and whatnot air travel is truly a modern revelation and i i appreciate it every day and I respect it. However, if you offer Wi-Fi, it should work. Right. All right. This one's my favorite email. We've gotten in a little bit. The simple ones always hit. This one is from Steve. Steve. Steve-oh. Steve says, this is less lying to my friends and more lying to strangers at parties. Steve says,

which is great, too. E knows those too. Eno is lying to strangers too, but good ones. Not like, some people are like, I'm from Halifax. Good stuff like this. Making up stories for no reason. I like that I was a,

that I was a baseball player from Duke once at a party. It worked. Well, it's good. Don't make me. Okay. Yeah, you got Saxon energy. Okay, anyway.

This is from Steve. What are you implying? how's Scott doing You know I have a brother Anyway Okay so Steve emails it and says I'm pretty tall I'm 6 foot 4 Okay

But if someone asks how tight is flex But if someone asks how tall I am at a party Sometimes I lie And I say I'm 6 foot 1 I save this You're fucking with people's perception of reality Every other man at the parties Just fucked immediately

He says average height guys get really defensive and agitated. And they're like, no way, man. You got to be like 6-4 because I'm six feet tall. And then I'm like, no, sorry, man. I'm 6 for one. So you got to be like 5-9 mess. Every girl there's like, ew, dude. This is an egg.

He's like, you're 5-9. And he just. Desperate. Yeah. That's really good. He gaslights all the other dudes at the party. I think that's the party's thing. No, more importantly, he's gaslighting of the girls to think every dude is short.

Yeah. You're all lying. God, that's brilliant. I think that's the funniest. I think that's actually one of the funniest things you could do to a stranger guy at it, like a social thing. That's also, he is the perfect height and he chose the perfect height. If he was 6'6, it wouldn't work because it nobody would be. 6'4 is kind of just close enough where somebody would be like, okay, I guess you're 6'1.

And everybody doesn't believe it. Yeah, they're like squinting. Yeah, it's like, really, all right. Dude, if you're 6'4, 6'5, and you start pull that. Just three inches a good thing to drop. Like, six, five. Like, I'm six, too. I'm like, get the fuck out.

I would lose my mind if someone did that to me. Oh, my God. Okay. Last thing here, this is not an email, but I wanted to ask you about a conversation I have Jackie. Flex. Wow. Do you guys have an inner monologue?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're saying, like, kind of like talking to yourself in your head? Yeah. Yeah. Jackie just doesn't have that. What?

She just doesn't have it in her monologue. So we've been like Googling it. And it's a thing for like five to 10% of people just don't have like an inner monologue. What does that even mean? Because in my head they like, like an inner monologue is just like thinking. How do you? Yeah. Dude, she says she thinks in pictures and emotions.

She thinks in the third person. She thinks in vibes. But she says like it's very hard. She thinks in hieroglyphics? What's going on? You ever have anxiety and you like simulate a conversation? or something of how it's going to go. She just does it.

She does very hard for her. It's a proud. This is like the people that can like taste colors. It's like synesthesia or whatever. Stinesthesia? Dude. It's fascinating. At first I was like,

what are you talking about? And then I realized we have so little words for like how you think and how your brain works. Like I feel like we barely understand this. Yeah. Yeah. So she doesn't, she never thinks to herself in words. Yeah.

That kind of is baffling to me. Yeah. And one of my other. good friends, because everyone's like, you're crazy. What a psychopath. And then one of my other good friends was like, yeah, same. Wow. Yeah.

Well, Jackie is super smart. Is your other friend really smart? Is there a connection here? Yeah, she's brilliant. She's a doctor. There must be some sort of genius level of intellect going on here, I feel like. Yeah. Not to just gas up Jackie.

And Hyvetz is always outer monologing, so she doesn't have any time. She's like, there's too many words in my life. It's like opposite to intrack. Whenever she's alone, she's like, I just need peace. Yeah. Yeah, email us in about the mon. If there's anyone, doctor, anyone listening can explain that or shed light. And also, I'm sure there are people listening right now don't have an inner monologue and are just like, oh my God.

So we started looking up and reading Reddit threads about it and everything. And then some people are like, it's so funny to read Reddit threads about it because some people are like, I always thought like inner monologues and movies were like totally embellished. And I didn't realize that anyone ever thinks about that ever. Interesting. That is very interesting. I did not know that was a thing. Also, how little I know about thinking. Also, did she just figure this out?

Yeah, like a month ago. We still haven't been talking about it all months. It's a great party. Yeah, it's been a conversation starter. Like, do you have an inner monologue? I wish I could be like a fly on the on the inside of her brain and like got to witness how she thinks about things. So the way she described it, someone else described it on Reddit. She said that was the best one.

It's just really quiet in there. And how I'm like you would be really useful. Damn. I would, I literally was trying to explain. to how loud it is in my head. It's just symbols clanging. It's just the monkey with the symbols. Turn it off.

Want to hear the most annoying sound in the world? It's just brain laying in bed next to Jackie who's out cold. I wonder what he's thinking about. It sounds like the most annoying sound of the world. It's a prison riot. It's a tranquil garland. That means your baby is going to be a perfect blend.

Oh my God, that's so funny. Yeah, there you go. All right. Ebo is about inner monologues, if anyone could shed light on that. All right. Thank you, D.K., thank you, Craig. Thank you. Kai, thank you, Carlos.

Thank you, Austin. Thank you. Everyone for listening. Thank you. And again, dude, the next episode we do, it's the week of the draft, which is absolutely crazy. Yeah, take purge coming next. Yeah, take purge coming next.

And that's honestly, it's the best episode we do, maybe the entire year. So if you listen to this, please listen to that one. And again, thank you. We're back to Ringer Fantasy Football Show after the draft. So we're covering the drafts all weekend, like full bore after the, like a ton after the draft two. And then we'll go back to Ring Your Fantasy Football Show and dumb stuff and inner monologue followups and all that stuff.

Yeah. Thank you, Lauren. Uh, shit. I don't have any of monologue gone. Thank you, Montel Jordan. Hey, this is how we do it. Is he a one hit one or did more? I don't know

Pretty much a one hit one, I think. I don't know. My dad just randomly rediscovered that song during COVID and just was dancing to it. Like in the wild. He was just like, And just was like, all right. He was like, he felt like back to the future,

but it was like way late. Yeah, yeah. My hit rate for finding new songs that I like is better when I go back in time than search for new songs in the present. Right. Like, it is easier for me to find new songs that I like that came out 40 years ago than it is for new songs that came out.

today. Do you guys feel that way? Yes. Are you searching for new music that's current? I think what you're saying is accurate. Well, also, because the old music that's survivor bias, it's like, there's probably a lot of bad music that came out that isn't famous or isn't discovered. Yeah, the stuff that I guess I'm stumbling upon is proven. Like all the shitty music in the 80s, you're probably not going to find. You probably heard it subconsciously like 12 times in the past and it like clicks or

something. Yeah. I don't know. You hear it when you're at like a grocery store or something. I find it rare when I throw on my Discover weekly and there's like some new song by an artist I don't know of. That's current. And I'm like, wow, I love this artist now.

I don't often find those anymore. And yet I'm discovering how much I like the Alman brothers. So. Well, I think that's the problem. That's the comparison is like, just should I listen to these people in like some of the best people ever or like this album, this like person just put out. Yeah. But no.

I'm trying to go back through music because I think Jackie really helped me like, like, she really filled a lot of gaps in my music knowledge, but I'm realizing there's so... I want to, like, learn rock, and I think I'm going to go backward. Okay. I took a history of American popular song in college, and it was actually the most important class they were took, I think.

It was the most, like I learned the most, I think, from that class. What is a couple takeaways that still have stuck with you to this day? I mean, I don't know if there was any specific one thing. It's basically just the evolution of how they all blended together. And, you know, basically just the beginning of pop music in America, especially I think it was just, you know, like all the different genres ended up blending together over the years. And I think in like having that realization, like, oh, that is a derivative of this type of music and that's the derivative of that type of music. They were heavily influenced by these guys. And like learning about, I never forget the part where we were learning about the beach boys and the wall of sound and the way that they like recorded their music and stuff is so cool.

go back and listen to it. You're like, oh, my God, there's 17 layers to this, to this song, you know, and they're like overlaying all this stuff. They're all harmonizing. That kind of stuff, I think it stuck with me is really cool. Yeah, well, I really made a leap in my music knowledge, or I guess my interest in, like, music history in college when my buddy basically got me into the Beach Boys and specifically the Pet Sounds album, which is like kind of their experimental album and kind of what went into

that. And it's super interesting. And the album is really good and very just like melodically interesting. It's just one of the more interesting albums you'll ever hear. And there's a good documentary out on the Beach Boys. There's a good movie called Love and Mercy about the Beach Boys. But yeah, cool band. So I'm not up on the Beach Boys.

What were the Beach Boys doing with the Wall of Sound? The Wall of Sound was essentially they would record a bunch of layers with different instruments and overlay it to make it sound. It was more depth in the music than there had been, not like ever, but just like that was in pop music at the time. So if you go listen to, you know, the music, there's stuff from that era. It was like there's just, you know,

way in the background, you can hear like a little drum, way in the background. You can hear a different little instrument that's just adding one extra layer to the music that a lot of songs before that didn't really have. So it was like highly engineered music versus where I think, you know, obviously like there's exceptions to everything.

But prior to that, I was like, oh, you have a bass, a guitar, and a lead guitar. or whatever, you know, in drums. And then you play your songs. And then, but they were adding in a whole bunch of other shit and adding different layers, harmonizing a whole bunch. Yeah, tons of harmonizing.

They're adding in xylophones, which is cool. Yeah. Yeah. Kevin Love's uncle in the Beach Boys. Did you know that? What? No, I did not know that. Kevin Love's uncle was in the Beach Boys.

I believe. Is he tall? Don't know. Beach Boys, one of the worst names. What? Of a band. I mean, it did him pretty well. What are you talking about?

Talk about them 40 years later. I think they crushed it. No, I just don't like the name. You don't like the beach boys? No. Beach boys, dude, that's a pretty, that's a first round big name that ends in boys. Beastie boys? Come on. Backstreet boys?

Backstreet boys, yeah. Well, they were boys. They were children. But the, I mean, it's the first round pick. We should draft band names. Dude, that's actually a great idea. I would so do that. Let's do that.

It's like a 100 round draft of band names. We could go pretty quick. That could be a fun. June activity. Yeah. It's pretty good. If anyone wants to put together a big board, feel free to email.

Do like a March Madness type deal. The coolest band names. Yeah, Mike Love. Kevin loves uncle. No way. Interesting. Rose was fun though about the yacht rock doc, which also is just great to say the yacht rock doc.

Yacht Rock Doc. Bob Dog. Bob quarterback. Yeah. But that. Just like what a scene in music actually is and like just this little era. You know what I mean?

I don't know. Yeah, the scene thing. I was actually also thinking about that with regard to the Beach Boys. There was a whole scene around them. And they were, they were, wasn't there some connection with, like, Marilyn Manson at the time? I don't know. Because when he removed his rib, he had to stay at Mike Loves house.

And he babysat Kevin. Who? He actually taught Kevin to turn around jumper. Charles Manson. Charles Manson. Not Marilyn Manson. Wait, did I tell you guys that when my brother saw the, the, once upon a time in,

Hollywood. My brother didn't really know anything about the Manson thing. So the Cielo Drive thing went way over said. Oh, he was like, oh, why did they show the street name? So my brother, because I feel like the whole once upon a time and spoiler, but like the Mansons are involved. And once upon a time and I feel like there's so. Well, it's actually not really a spoiler because they rewrite history. So you won't even know what happens. There you go. So Quentin Tarantino. That is a spoiler in itself, Craig. Yeah, well, that's, yeah, I think of that. Yeah, I guess what the, yeah, whatever. So, well, we came out. You don't know what's going to happen is my point.

Yeah. So Quentin Tarantino, I think they go so overboard to not hit you over the head with, it's the Manson thing that they really subtle about it. My brother didn't realize that the Manson's, like, what was going on in that movie until we talked about it, like eight months later. Like, he had no idea. He watched it, didn't think it was that good, never read anything about it on mine, never talked about anyone.

And we're talking about ladies. He's like, I didn't like that one. There's a scene with Charles Manson, though. went way over his head. He's older than me. He's like 35. Oh, my God. And isn't there a scene

when Margaret Quali's like, Charlie's like, Charlie's going to love you. He didn't get that. That's the thing they called him Charlie. It just went over and he had no idea. So I got a chair. I was like, damn, is that like a really...

Speaking of that scene, though, Craig, this is up your alley. All the people that Tarantino casted for that scene, for the Manson family, they all like turned into superstar. Tarantino is one of the best castes out there. It was Austin,

Butler, early Austin Butler. Oh, yeah. Sidney's in the car. Margo Robbie. Wow, that's crazy. Well, Margo Robbie is already a big star. But Cindy Sweeney, Maya Hawke was in the, was in the Manson car. Mikey Madison, who just won the Oscar for that the actress is in the car.

Wow. She's the girl who gets lit on fire at the end by Leo in the pool. That's a spoiler. Whatever. The movie came out seven years ago. That's fine. Jesus. It's different than the White Lotus finale that was 20 hours old.

Like two days later. Yeah, that she gets shot by the monkey, yeah. Well, that's so funny. Sweeney, Madison, Hawk, and Austin Butler. That's pretty crazy. That is crazy. Wild. Yeah.

And he discovered Brad Pitt. He discovered Brad Pitt. And Leo. A breakout role for both of them. And there's like a kind of, not really, but kind of a sequel now in the works that David Fincher is directing. Oh, cool. What?

Mm-hmm. Really? For Netflix, it is going to be like a spinoff film featuring Brad Pitt reprising the Cliff Booth character. No way. Directed by David Fincher on Netflix. Yes, it's happening. Tarantino wrote the script.

Didn't want to direct it because he didn't want that to be his final movie. He's made nine, but he only wants to make ten years. Is he sticking to this 10 movie thing that he told himself 40 years ago? He believes that films get worse as you get older and he doesn't want to be 75 years old making shitty movies, which I kind of understand. That is just like a... Belichick said the same thing. A shot across the bow for a lot of...

Yeah, Belichick blew right past 70. There's like a lot of great movies that have come out from 70, 80-year-old directors. But I at least understand the line of thinking. But anyway, he wrote the script, was going to shoot it, backed out. And then Fincher is now taking over, going to direct it for Netflix. And Brad Pitt is going to come back. Is it a sequel or a prequel? It's not a prequel.

It's like a further adventures of Cliff Booth. That's good. It's a good idea. There's a lot there. Some sequels should happen. I don't like that it's for Netflix. That kind of bums me out. Why?

Just in principle. You want to be in a theater? Yeah. I'm surprised that Tarantino script would end up on Netflix. I mean, Brad Pitt won the Oscar for this character, and it was directed by Quentin Tarantino, and the sequel is going to be on Netflix. I'm like, what? That is, that is strange. That is a weird thing.

Yeah, so it's the state of things. Okay. All right. Oh, I already did the thank you, so we can get out of here. Yeah. Shouts out Beach Boys. Shot of Beach Boys. Beach men.

D.K. would prefer. Just beach. Just beach. Just beach. Just beach. Just beach. Lose the boys. All right, goodbye, everyone.