The Ringer NFL Show - Final Preseason Winners and Losers

Episode Date: August 28, 2023

Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck open by discussing the fantasy implications of the Dallas Cowboys’ trade for quarterback Trey Lance and the end of running back Josh Jacobs’s holdout with the Las Vegas Raiders (1:31). Next, they discuss several fantasy-relevant players and how their performances in the final week of the NFL preseason affected their draft stock (6:57). Finally, the guys close with emails (46:33). Check out our 2023 Ringer Fantasy Football Rankings here! Email us! [e-mail] The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please check out theringer.com/RG to find out more or listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Hosts: Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck Social: Kiera Givens Producer: Kai Grady Audio intern: Jack Sanders Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Football is around the corner and we are ramping it up over here on the Ringer NFL feed in the month of August. Every week, Ben Solac and I will be bringing you not one but two extra point takens. That's right, double the trouble as we predict, debate and analyze our way through camp and the preseason every Monday and Friday. But that is not all. Stephen Ruiz and I will be coming to you every Wednesday. We'll talk about everything in the world of the NFL. And who knows, maybe Stephen will even have something nice to say about your favorite squad. Though frankly, I wouldn't count on it.

Subscribe to the Ringer NFL. show on Spotify or wherever you get your podcast. And be sure to follow the Ringer NFL on Instagram, TikTok, and Twitter at Ringer NFL. My name is Danny Hyfitz and I am joined by Danny Kelly and Craig Krollberg and the NFL preseason is over. We are T-minus 10 days from the NFL regular season beginning, which is crazy. Fantasy drafts are in full swing. You've probably either drafted or you have a draft coming up, maybe both.

We're going to parse through just the final week of the preseason, really just what we learned. Some of the game sucked. We learned a little bit. We're going to just leave all those stuff that was boring. And sorry to all the guys who were fighting for their stuff in the fourth quarter. But we're going to just go through the stuff that matters for us and your drafts and how it affects our rankings. So we go through all that. But first, some news.

The San Francisco 49ers have traded Trey Lance to the Dallas Cowboys for a fourth round pick. My friend Jackson, it was like, why? And I said, you ever go to Costco and buy something you don't need just because it's 90% off? I feel like it's the Niners did. No, that's what the Cowboys did. Yeah, that's what the Cowboys did. Oh yeah. Did I say it backward? Yeah. Yeah, you said that's what the Niners did.

Oh, well, I screwed it up. Which one of you were Costco socks shopping with the 90% off socks? I'll do Costco Sox. Don't talk shit about Costco socks. Costco socks are great. But yeah, you know, this is just one of those cases where the Niners just made a huge swing and miss. I saw some tweet about actually how the Niners are really bad at picking first rounders. Like their last, like five of their last seven have kind of been busts, which is ironic because they have the best roster in the league maybe. Yeah. So it's just a testament to how the Niners are so good.

team building, but they made this huge swing to trade up to get Tray Lance and the guy barely played. And now he's in the Dallas Cowboys and they're starting Mr. Irrelevant, the last pick in the draft for who makes $800,000 a year. And a lot of this was financial because Tray Lance is, you know, slated to make $8 million this year. And with the Niners having all these studs that they need to pay like Nick Bosa, they had to get Tray Lance off the books. You can't pay $8 million to a third stringer who can't beat out Sam Darnold. I feel bad for Lance. I mean, honestly, it's just tough to know because even going back to college, Like the he didn't get to play his final year at college because of the COVID season.

His season got canceled. This is something that we talked about when he was coming into the draft. I know on our draft show, we were like very concerned that he had only thrown X amount of passes in his playing career, like going back the most obvious. You know that like trend on Twitter that's like red flags and like the little like filter that there's the three red flags? I feel like the number one red flag for an NFL prospect should be doesn't actually play a lot of football.

Doesn't throw the ball. This is like a basketball player just not shooting. Like what, we got to have some practice here. Again, the Mike Renner's stat that Tom Brady had more throws last season than Trey Lance had in NFL college and high school combined. Crazy. To be more explicit. Like Lance has now in two seasons thrown 102 passes in in the NFL.

And the poor guy, Rothersberger hit that a couple times back to back weeks. I know. Tom Brady threw 733 passes last year. Trey Lance, 102 passes in the NFL. It's just, it's. It's unfortunate because obviously the injuries and just situation around all that stuff, like, did not help him. I don't, I still don't know if he's good. Like, I don't think anyone knows if he's good.

But the 49ers are just essentially saying, we want to compete now. We're not going to wait around. This is a distraction. I think Shanahan just got tired of talking about it and they decided to move on. Well, I actually agree with you. I feel bad for him. You said, like, last week that you felt bad for Baker Mayfield. I'm like, screw that.

He got a shot. Like, you feel bad for someone who knows. Tray Lance, I think everyone probably is a friend where it's like, oh, they're like them and a significant other where it's like, oh, like they were always, you know, kind of doing a dance, but just timing never worked out. And that was Tray Lance and like playing the game of football. It was like freaking COVID happened. He never got to play like in college football.

It's just crazy. So it's the one that got away for Tray Lance. The sport of football is the one that got away. Wait, hold on. What does this mean for the Cowboys, though? Nothing. It's a third string quarterback. Is he going to come in like Tebow in his rookie season and they'll use him in the red zone?

or on goal lines? Anything like you think or no? What happens when you buy something that it's 90% off? It's like I have my friend's mom used to buy pool stuff that was 90% off. They didn't even have a pool. It just sits in your closet and then eventually you throw it away later. I don't know, though. Also, sometimes when you get things for cheap, you actually end up using them more.

You know when you buy like expensive stuff you're afraid to use it because you don't want to break it? Sunglasses. Yeah, you get nice sunglasses that I don't bring them anywhere. Nice shoes. And you're like, I'd actually just rather wear the $40 sneakers that I can get beat up. Maybe Trey Lance are like, well, who cares? Throw him in the red zone. Maybe.

That's actually pretty good. Okay. Other news, Josh Jacobs signs a one-year deal with the Raiders, which it's basically what he was going to do anyway. It's still a one-year deal worth $12 million, basically. It's a little better than 10 in change. So he had his whole that, didn't have due to training camp that much and ended up getting a little more money.

Does this change? It doesn't really change where we had him ranked. It's not like we were really afraid of Josh Jacobs's holding out. It's still the same. Josh Jacobs was like a really, really good value second round pick, basically. If you get them in the third, it's like an auto draft. I'll bump him up a little bit, I think. I saw a video of him walking back to the facility, and he looked really happy,

which I don't know why that meant a lot to me. I was like, oh, all right. The million and a half extra he got really jazzed him up. I actually didn't really quite understand why. I don't know. I guess the difference here is that he made an extra million dollars, and now he's back and he was okay with that, and that's kind of all he could negotiate.

I think, well, what you said, Craig, is interesting because the fact that he's happy, and this is what we worry about with Jonathan Taylor, right? Like, if he gets dinged up halfway through the season, is he going to push to come back and, like, play through injury, potentially risk future earnings? I don't think, I don't know if like Jonathan Taylor's going to do that. With Josh Jacobs, he has per game roster bonuses. So I don't 100% know if it's tied to him playing or if it's just him being on the roster or what.

But like, I think there's some motivation now. And by the way, it's just happy to be playing for the team that he's less, it's like there's less danger that he's going to do that down the stretch. Yeah. The questions around Josh Jacobs are just he got a lot of touches and carries last year. And guys that do that, usually you're paying for the peak year. But he's a good sticker of a pick. And if he falls like outside the top two rounds, like, just take him.

It's crazy. Now that I'm in on Josh Jacobs, you know, I'm sure that it will have a terrible year. So it goes, say la V. Okay, we're going to go through preseason. Also, thank God they moved this stuff to freaking three games. I know. This was great. Good job.

Yeah. That's my big winner. Stock up on just NFL for only having three of these things. What do they do next week? I was thinking about this. I can't remember. Do we just do nothing next weekend? Just enjoy our lives?

College football just has crept their season up earlier and earlier. Was there to, and I guess there was football. Like, I mean, the first, the first game is Thursday. So was there preseason the weekend before that Thursday? I honestly have no idea. What are we, what are we talking about? We're talking about. The opening night of the NFL, the NFL.

The NFL begins on a Thursday. The Bills play, I forget. But that is Thursday. That's the seventh. Right, the seventh. traditionally back before they got rid of the fourth preseason game, was there, was week four of the preseason the labor day weekend right before the first game? I think so.

I don't understand how high but I understand this. I think I'm 100% maybe not right on this, but it feels like there was games like on, they would play them like Thursday and then over the weekend, they would make all their cuts. Yeah. And then week one would be the next. But that's just going off of memory.

It all blends together for me. But anyways, it's just a little bit weird that there's no football this weekend other than college football. I like it. It's Labor Day weekend. It truly feels like this is the last weekend of summer where you don't have to watch football all day. So the main thing coming out of preseason, I feel like the top line item is all the quarterbacks taking the top five picks are all going to start. It's like C.J. Stroud officially going to start for the Texans in the Texans in the Texan's in week one. Brayshund is going to start for the Panthers in week one.

I feel like we've talked pretty good about Richardson and Bryce Young. I kind of want to start here with the Texans and C.J. Stroud. D.K., looking at this, I mean, Cedestroud himself for fantasy football, not that interesting, but how do you feel about Houston? Houston as a team is like a bit in Glansburg for us we haven't talked about. You know, I think after one preseason game,

I was very worried about Houston because Stroud did not look good. He looked almost like a deer in the headlights just a little bit. You know, and I've heard former players talk about, like, their first preseason game, they were so nervous. You know what I mean? It's just such a big jump going from college to the pros. I mean, D.K., think about you,

in your first podcast. Is that an accurate representation of what you were going to be? Maybe not. But he has looked really sharp. CJ Stroud has looked really sharp the last two weeks. He's definitely settled in.

I feel like he knows, you know, he's just gotten his confidence. He's making some incredible throws. Like he had a couple really nice throws downfield, drop it in a bucket in this last week. So I think that makes me feel a little bit better. At the end of the day,

rookie quarterbacks tend to struggle. Like, we should expect him to not put up big numbers. but it's not nearly as scary as it was two weeks ago. I think that, you know, there's a chance that we can get some value out of these receivers in Houston. I'm more excited about like a Damian Pierce than I am about the receivers there, but I do think this offense will be at least be able to move the ball a little bit. Your beloved second year running back for the Houston Texans, Damien Pierce.

Yes, I love that guy. Who runs like a bowling ball of knives. He, you know, if you look at this preseason usage, it's really encouraging. He was playing with the starters for almost every single snap that C.J. Stroud played. That's probably obviously not going to carry on through all. the whole season, but he is the clear-cut guy in Houston. So he's going to get a good amount of volume. They used him on third down, so there's a chance he's much more involved in the passing

game this year. I think it's just wheels out for Damien Pierce. He looks great, too. He's probably the only guy on the Texans worth drafting this year. I think the Stroud passing game is probably a wait till next year situation. It might kind of be indistinguishable from the Davis Mills offensive yesterday. I mean, two of the three preseason game, Stroud was two for four. So it's not like we have a ton.

He didn't play a lot. Yeah, yeah. To go off of it. But if you use a percentage, it sounds great. No, I agree. The Texans pass, again, every year we're like, oh, someone's going to catch passes, but there's always two or three backfields and two or three passing games. So you're like, you know what?

I'm good. I don't need any of them. And the Texans passing game this year is probably one of those. But I think you're right about Damien Pierce, D.K., I think Damien Pierce does a really good value. I feel like everyone knows the Texans suck. He is falling. And you can, honest, I've seen people get him as like their sixth.

I actually saw someone get it. Me. It was me. I got it. He was the seventh player. I was like, you know what? Yeah, Damian Pierce. Hello. Seventh round, I'm sure.

That's insane. Nice. And then while we're here with rookie quarterbacks in the UFC South, he drafted quarterback top five. Anthony Richardson going to start for the Colts. He played the Eagles and on obvious caveat, the Eagles didn't have their starters. But the flip side is the Eagles backups better than NFL defenses. It's like just the other half of the Georgia championship unit.

For the Colts, it's funny. It's the eighth year in a row. The Colts have a different starter. at quarterback. That's a wild stat. It's the second longest streak ever. Wow. That's great.

Longer than that because luck actually got hurt and then play. So eight consecutive years where the starting quarterback is different than the guy before. So that's crazy. Hopefully that streak ends. The numbers he had, whatever. Like it's 78 past, he gets the first half, 38 rushing. Whatever, dude. He looks, the throwing's going to be a little whatever.

He just looks exactly as hard to tackle as we had. thought about. Yeah. I mean, it's he looks like he's buying a new position. It looks like he's like a different position out there. He's so big and fast. It almost looks like this is not like the quarterback position is no longer what we thought it was. He is the official line in the sand.

Yes. You know like Terminator 2? And it was like, oh. That's a big jump. This is what like you. Yeah. That's how I feel about watching Anthony Richardson like running out there. He looks too big. Except no one knows what to do with this liquid metal stuff yet. We're like, oh, well, we like the other transformer.

Yeah, but like to talk about how he played, yeah, he missed a couple throws. I think his receivers have been kind of letting him down a little bit too. Like they've dropped a few really nice passes for him this year. So there's going to be growing pains with the passing game, I think, for sure. But I mean, if you see him scramble, like he was stiff-arming guys, like making guys miss, really, really fast in space, explosive. He has like a very distinctive running style where he almost takes like these little short,

quick steps, but he's a, you know, six foot four, two hundred and thirty-something-pound guy. So it just looks kind of, I don't even know. It's like Uncanny Valley almost. It's like a really fast robot or something. Boston Robotics? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, seriously. It's like those, you know, the fake videos that you see on Twitter and stuff where the robots are just doing these incredible flips and things.

It was like a little bit like that. Those are real. Sure, sure. Yeah. Well, there's definitely some that are not real high fits. Put it that way. Hate to burst your body. I don't know what you're watching.

Anyways, but yes, he looks incredibly. He's super athletic, super fast. I think he's going to run a lot. Do you still feel like if you're in a one QB league and you want to wait on quarterback, that he is a viable starting guy on your roster because of his rushing floor and that you should go after a guy like him

instead of like a Gino Smith, a golf, a Kirk? I think he, just because he's, I do believe he's going to run a lot. I was kind of getting to this like Shane Stuyken, the coach there. He, you know, has a history with Jalen Hertz. I believe it's going to be a big part of their game. I don't think he's just going to be purely reliant on scrambling,

even though he will add in that area too. But again, it's just, man, the rushing floor that you get from guys like this is huge. And again, this is a coach that had Jalen Hertz the last couple of years, and he rushed for double-digit touchdowns both seasons. So I do feel comfortable doing it. And honestly, if it doesn't work out for the first couple of weeks, like you can pick up another guy on the waiver wire, you know.

I'd still pair him with someone else in a draft just because I think you can pair. It's a weird thing where Anthony Richardson almost could be your backup quarterback that you take first, which sounds insane. But again, Kirk Cousins, Aaron Rogers, Gino Smith. I mean, Daniel Jones, depending on what kind of league. These are all people if you're in a 10 team league, like outside the top 10 quarterbacks to like Dax. One of those people will be after the 10th quarterback taken. So I think you could pair Anthony Richardson with Kirk Cousins pretty easily and, you know, have it both ways.

And we've mentioned this before about like Ian Hartett tweeted something the other day was basically like, here's a list of all the quarterbacks who are rushed a hundred times in a season in history. And there's like 90% of them are top 10 quarterbacks and how they finished per game. in scoring and 100 rushes in over a 17 season is like, I think it's like six or something like that, six or seven a game. It's not that much. Like the bar is not that high. Can we be super clear about one thing though? Wait to take him. Like don't reach for Anthony Richardson. Well, you don't have to reach on him. I just want to be super clear about that because let's say you're in a 10 team league. The ninth quarterback's going to be like Dak Prescott or like Daniel Jones. Like the idea of Anthony Richardson is you don't have to go get him in the eighth round is you can wait till

the 11th round and try to skip the line on all this pocket passers. But I completely Yeah, maybe. It feels like he's so hyped now that there's going to be one guy in your league who will reach to get him. Yeah, you got to know who you're playing with. Okay, other, while we're on the rookies, just Bryce Young for the Panthers. I'm at, I'm officially nervous Jewish mother with Bryce Young. I think he's going to get Christ young. I think he's going to get some pretty crushed. I'm officially, I don't know. The Panthers, I kind of think in Greasing. I'm like, this team's just going to get the first pick again. At the same time, he has looked pretty comfortable. I think he looks the best out of all the rookie quarterbacks. Yeah, because all these guys are flying at. him and he's just like the pocket poised to just duck to the ground immediately. But I mean, to be clear, you're worried because he's small. And I'm saying at the same time, he's looked pretty comfortable out there. Like he's negotiating the pocket.

He's doing the things you saw at Alabama where he like ducks around a guy, sidesteps him, still keeps his eyes downfield, makes plays. Like he's doing the things that we were so excited about that he did at Alabama. Of course, I totally agree with you. The size is still a major concern. This is basically the only major concern with him. But yeah, I do think he has looked pretty comfortable. And he's not fantasy relevant in a one quarterback league.

I do think, again, so the Panthers receiving core is really weird. D.J. Chark is already doing with another injury. Leviska-Chanal has concussions returning soon, allegedly. Again, it's Jonathan Mingo, rookie receiver's second rounder, I think it could be really good. And honestly, Adam Thielen, who I don't love. But if you're talking about, like, a late round dart throw, like your last pick, Adam Thieland, I think I said like a third of the targets from Bryce Young, like in the preseason. It just, there's two players.

Like, Adam Thieland and Jonathan Mingo, I don't know who else they're going to start. Like, it's that simple. I feel in is just a more reliable option. I think Mingo the higher upset, but that's kind of just what I look at the Panthers. And also while we're on the rookie quarterbacks real quick, defenses, you're going to draft a defense in fantasy. CJ Strauss first starts against the Baltimore Ravens,

for the love of God. That's tough. I just take the Ravens and figure it out later. Other quarterback news, Baker Mayfield's officially started for the bucks. Sure, Craig? Stock neutral? Stock up, stock down? How are you feeling?

I don't care. I don't really care. about Baker Mayfield. I guess I'm more confident in him performing than Kyle Trash. Yes. But I got to say,

Chris Godwin has kind of started to like catch my eye. You know, he's healthy. He's a year after the year after guy injury wise. And Mike Evans just got hurt. And I'm kind of like, maybe Chris Godwin will just

catch like a hundred passes from Baker Mayfield this year and be awesome. Craig, did you, I had the exact same thought this weekend. I drafted him in one of my home leagues. Did you watch?

the bucks this week. He caught like, I don't even, off the time of my head, it felt like he caught the first six passes of the game. And it was, uh, Baker Mayfield went six for six. Um, and he looked really solid. Like, I was like, oh, I forgot about Godwin. I haven't thought about Godwin all summer. I think we have to interrupt Godwin to the all boring team. I think that he was young and exciting for so long. They won the Super Bowl. He like, didn't we, there was a video of him doing Snow Angels in confetti with his girlfriend, like after they won the Super Bowl.

Like, he's a wholesome guy, fun, upside. I think he's officially just like, not the new Brandon Cooks, but he's just, you don't think of, like, he's kind of now old enough to be boring. He had four catches and a touchdown out of the first six plays of the game. So pretty solid. Yeah, I had the exact same thought this weekend, Craig. I was like, he feels to me like a massive value. And he's not as much of a Prairie Arts guy as Mike Evans where, you know, we talk about

this with Terry McLaren all the time. It's like, it's a fucking miracle. It feels like if Mike Evans catches a deep pass these days. I know he does it a lot, but it's. still feels like a miracle. With Godwin, he's getting the short and intermediate stuff. He's winning at the line of scrimmage, you know, getting those quick passes and running after the catch.

And that's kind of his game. On that note, do you guys play Mario Party? I did growing up on Nintendo. So I never played it growing up. But then now I play, like, Jackie's family when they go to vacation or they do like Mario Party. And I guess the new Mario, like, you can get a custom dice. Like each character has their own dice.

So obviously, there's the regular one, one, two, three, four, five, six. And then each character, so, like, Mario's dice is like, three, four, and fives. And then Bowser's dice has like a 10 on it. So, and I realized I was playing this game and I was like, this is literally the difference is like, like, Yoshi's dice is Chris Godwin. It's like all three's and fours. And then Mike Evans's dice is like ones, twos, and then there's like, there's like a 10. And you're just rolling the dice hoping for a 10, but you're overwhelmingly likely to just move one or two spots. Yeah. And what is the 10? Like he catches a 40-yard pass. Like I don't even know if the upside is really,

he'd have to, you'd have to be rolling tens for the entire season. Well, it's 200 yards and four touchdowns after you've been eliminated from the playoffs. Mike Evans loves week 18.

It's his favorite week. Contracts instead of his baby. Also on the bucks, Rashad White, the running back. I just still love Rashad White. He just, very,

yeah, he's going to get a ton of volume. I think at the very minimum volume is good with this guy. I think obviously, there's question marks over how good he is. He didn't play that great as a, as a rookie,

but I don't know, there's not very many other people in this backfield. And he has dominated, to all the reps in the preseason. So like the coaching staff has been telling us, this is our guy, this is our guy. And then it showed up on the field in preseason. So there's no other reason to think that he's not going to be the guy.

So, yeah, I'm pretty excited about him too. I think he's a good value. Get ready for the NFL season with incredible offers from Fandul, America's number one sportsbook. Right now, new customers can you bet $5 and get $200 in bonus bets guaranteed. Plus all customers who bet $5 to get $100 off NFL Sunday ticket from YouTube and YouTube TV. I've been perusing Fandall's sportsbook. My favorite bet.

D.K. Metcalf is like 20 to 1 to lead the NFL and receiving touchdowns. That's crazy. DK.K. Metcalf had like 19 Enzo targets last year. He shouldn't be 20 to 1 to lead the NFL touchdowns this year. That's wild to me. Now is the best time to join Fandall. The app is easy to use and you can bet on everything from spreads to player props and more. So visit fandle.com slash ringer fantasy and kick off the NFL.

You won't want to miss. Fandle, official partner of the NFL. Must be 21 plus and present in select states. first online real money wager only, $10 first deposit required, bonus issues, non-mithrable bonus bets that expires seven days after a seat, restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.fandil.com. NFL Sunday ticket offer ends 91823, no refunds, terms and embargoes apply. $100 off NFL Sunday ticket, not YouTube TV.

YouTube TV base plan required to watch YouTube TV. Redemption requires a Google account and current form of payment, commercial use excluded. I actually think of all the games that I watched from week three, the one where I was I was most like, oh, oh my God, what is the Steelers? Thrashing. Backups for Atlanta Falcons, but whatever. Print the legend. Craig, did you go six to Bindite watching that game?

The Steelers have had such a good camp. It's so exciting. Kenny Pickett is definitely somebody who's like, you know, probably the most, he's probably the most hyped camp quarterback this year, right? Which is kind of surprising considering what, don't you think he's the most hyped quarterback from this training camp right now? is probably a bubble. I don't know.

Who else is getting more love than Kenny Pickett online from camp and preseason? I guess you're not putting Aaron Rogers in that category, right? No. I don't think it's been hype it up Jordan Love

but yeah, it's not even on the same level. Are we going to say Kenny Pickett? Whatever. The most hyped. Like it's a baseline thing. Like no one had any expectations for Kenny Pickett.

Hype over expectation. Hype over expectation. Okay. Because you're right. Rogers' hype is exactly at expectation. Yeah. That's a good point. they were like,

I'll give you that. The Jets are a Super Bowl contender. Yeah, I mean, look, the thing that, Pickett's had like a stellar statistical preseason. I know that doesn't mean a lot. And I actually really like that he is basically coming out and saying that. He's like,

everybody needs to relax. It's preseason. I'm like 15 passes. Let's all chill. Which is great. But I even like that he's saying that. He just seems like an adult in the room. And that's probably because he's already like 32 years old.

But because he is an adult. He just seems like, he seems very mature. Like he's like here to be a professional. He seems like an adult in the room. And you're not going to have to worry about him. at the very least, even if he's not the most physically talented. Like, this offense has so many weapons around it

that if Matt Canada can get his shit together, Kenny Pickett's going to be able to run the offense. And I heard this stat just today. I was listening to something. JJ Zacharisen, who has a great podcast, a couple of late round podcast, was saying in the second half of last season, the Steelers were third in yards per drive after week nine.

They kind of figured it out in the chief. Yeah. It also helped that they stopped playing like all the league's best defenses. like right in a row. Yeah, Pickett just got thrown into the wolves and their schedule's a lot softer this year. I mean, they're starting out with the Niners, which sucks. But after that, it kind of opens up.

But like, I don't know, man, for fantasy, probably not going to do a lot, although he does move with his legs a little bit. But Deonti Johnson and Pat Friermuth, I think, are going to be screaming values this year if Pickett is as advertised. Which I think he is. I think he's solid.

I don't want to jump the shark here, and I'm not comparing him to Joe Brown. Burrow, but like his personality and like his poise and how kind of just kind of cool he is, there are some things that remind me a little bit of Joe Burrow. You remember Joe Burrow. Wait, Kyle, turn the TikTok camera on, DK. Can he pick it better than Joe Burrow? The next Joe Burrow.

I mean, but look at if you go watch Joe Burrow play, like physically speaking, he's not the most talented quarterback. You know what I mean? Like he doesn't have like a cannon for an arm or he's not like super fast or anything like that. Joe Burrow is just really cool, really collected, really. did really confident. He's very accurate, of course, and that's huge.

But there's some element of that to pick it, I feel like. He's just very confident, very poised and cool right now. And obviously, he got off to a tough start in his career. But I don't know, he feels like he's really starting to come into his own a little bit, at least right now. And so I'm excited to see them play this year. Obviously, it all can fall apart once the regular season starts. And teams start actually disguising coverage and things like that. But so far, I'm pretty encouraged with what I've seen.

Heffins, you drink in the Kool-Aid? there's always NASCAR on the offensive line got better just because you saw I do guys until you see it. However, I do think those offensive lines better. Kenny Pickett, I almost feel like I was negative about Kenny Pickett because I was like he'll never win an MVP and Craig got really mad at me and I don't think he ever will. I mean like Josh Allen might never win an MVP.

You know what I mean? That doesn't really mean much to me. That's what I'm saying. Like I just because I said it so declaratively like that doesn't mean he's not good. But I think the other thing with this, again, Naji and Jailin Warren and like Jailen Warren's like a great aspect to this team. Like he had that touchdown where he just basically was tackled, but was like,

I'm actually going to fall seven yards into the end zone while you're tackling me. He's just squirly, man. And like I think he does yin to Najee Harris's Yang really well. So I think it's going to be a great. Jalen Warren is another guy. I just wanted to mention, like you said,

he just has looked really good this preseason. There's definitely a Zeke Pollard dynamic going on here. I feel like all the fans are clamoring to get Jailen Warren more touches. And I actually do kind of believe he's going to get. more touches this season. Like there's going to be more of a rotation. I think they want to protect, they want to protect Naji from injury this year

and not have a wear down. And so I think, you know, obviously in the past, this has not been what the Steelers have done. But I do kind of, I'm almost buying the fact that they are going to do this year, actually. You know, they've done this in the preseason. They did it down the stretch last year a little bit.

I can see it. Turning this into advice. We have George Pickens going, we have 82nd on our rankings. We have Deonti Johnson's 60th. We have Naji Harris all the way at 29th overall. which you two are a little higher than me. If you had to take, and then we have Patty Fryermouth at 94th,

if you had to have one of those guys at where they were going, which one would you take? For me, I want Pat Frymuth. If you could get Pat Frymuth, it's your tight end, like the eighth guy off the board. That's the one I want for Pittsburgh this year. I still like Deonté.

Yeah, Deontay seems to make the most sense. Again, I believe positive regression is coming for him. He's going to score more touchdowns this year. He's going to catch a ton of passes. He's looked really good in the preseason. I'm still a big believer in Pickens, though. I mean, it just feels like every time I turn on a Steelers game, he's making a huge play.

Like, just throw him the ball more. Did you see his play in the last game where he caught like that 40-yard ball on the sideline? And then while catching it reaches out with his hand to try and cross the pylon and gets tackled and doesn't lose the football? Yeah, it's truly special stuff. So basically, if you didn't see the, if he didn't see the play, he ran a route up the sideline. Kenny Pickett led him out of bounds and like in a good way away from the defense. Pickens went up and caught it, high pointed it. And while, like, it was like barely even, he didn't even barely move his arms.

He just reached out with one arm to try and put it over the pylon. He didn't quite make it. But like, most guys would just be concerned about catching the football. He's like catching it and almost reaching out for the pylon, like right away. He's just, I think he's truly a special talent. I just want to see him get the ball. We talk so much about like Justin Jefferson is the most catches or yards through three years ever. I think George Pickens is going to shatter the record for fewest games.

needed to produce the coolest NFL highlight real ever. Like he's going to do it. He's going to be like 26 and we're like, all right, it's over. It's already like it's better than Odell's and Randy Morris's combined. Okay. Preseason the event. Aaron Rogers made his Jets debut against the Giants. I am biased.

What do you, what, D.K., what was your impression first? Because I have thoughts, obviously, Jets, giants and I'm just going to remove myself first. I thought it looked good. I thought, you know, I'm. I'm rethinking my skepticism over Garrett Wilson. Obviously, we were never low on Garrett Wilson because, you know, we know he's an elite talent, but I was always a little bit, like, in the back of my mind, like, what is Rogers going to do? He's a little bit of a wild card.

I don't know if he's going to favor. Based on what I've heard in camp throughout the last, like, two or three weeks, and in this game, like Garrett Wilson, I am getting very excited about again. I mean, there was a couple plays in this one where Rogers just did like the smoke route thing or just the quick audible where he's seeing a sight adjustment. throwing it right to Garrett Wilson. He scored a touchdown on a play like that. You know, just like elite quarterback to receiver connection.

It almost reminded me of what he was doing with Devante Adams. I'm not, you know, going to jump the shark on that one. But, like, that was the way he was looking to Garrett Wilson on the first drive or the first and second drive of the game. And so, man, I'm excited. Plus add in the fact that Corey Davis retired. Al-Alan Zard is injured. Nicole Hardman is Nicole Hardman.

He's just going to do what he does. Denzo Mims is now gone. Randall Cobb is like projected to be a starter for this team. Like Garrett Wilson, I'm, again, I'm getting very excited and I'm backing off of my earlier sort of skepticism over him. I think he has a potential to absolutely go bonkers this year. So yeah, that was like one of the big takeaways from this week. I totally agree.

I saw this game and I started looking at Garrett Wilson as 20 to one to lead the NFL and catches. And I think I was like, look, you know, Devante Adams, Aaron Rogers, it took them three, four years to have that kind of connection. And I did watch and I was like, oh, well, maybe they won't need that much time. Because, again, my only thing was why is Garrett Wilson going ahead of Devante Adams? I thought that was a little wild. But yeah, I think at the point, there's so many second round picks that you can get. Like, if you can get Tony Pollard in the second round, Josh Jacobs is a great pick,

a Monra. But like, Garrett Wilson's right there where it's like, if you come back around, whoever you take in the first, you're going to have a good time if you have Garrett Wilson this year. I have a theory that all the best receivers in the league love to hold the ball with one hand. That's the sign that you are actually one of the best receivers in the league. I'll tell exactly what it means. It's in like in the NBA where it's like when you become good enough to travel egregiously. It's like if you're an NFL receiver and you are not great,

coaching-wise, they're not going to allow you to just like nonchalantly just not have ball security. But when you're elite and you're good enough to break the rules, then it's basically saying like, yeah, no, no one can really tell me what to do. Or it just means that you have the confidence to think that you are in that tier even if you're not, which is like George Pickens. Deshaun Jackson was like that too. Like, just second they caught the ball was like one hand. Dude, Plaxico Burris, I was convinced the Giants were going to lose Super Bowl of the Patriots

because Plaxico Burris would just basically keep one point of the football in his palm and the other point in the crook of his elbow and just like run like really awkwardly. Anyway, love me some Garrett Wilson. Giants didn't play their starters. Daniel Jones did not play in this game. But I'm just in. Giants are going to be credible. Before we get to Daniel Jones, because holy shit.

the Giants offense looked incredible in week two. I don't know if we've talked about this on this pod yet, because we didn't really recap preseason week two, but the Giants offense might be the greatest offense of all time based on that one drive to start the game. It was like seven straight passes or something like that, and they just marched down the field. Dave All was scheming them up.

But I want to ask you this. This is a probably way too like in the weeds thing, but like, what did you think of the fact they released James Robinson? I thought he was kind of like in line to be their number two back. So is it now coming down to Eric Gray and Matt Breda behind Sequin? What's the deal? Yeah, who cares? Sorry.

People fucking care. The people want to know. I just am stunned that that's your question. Oh, I mean, Seekwon is. You don't want to know who the handcuffer for Sequan Barclay is? It didn't occur to you? Eric Gray is the rookie. That's a plan B right there.

Plan B is planning to fail. I don't think about the backup. Eric Gray is the rookie. Eric Gray is the man. He can catch. He can be between tackles and he can receive. and he's going to be their kick returner probably. And Matt Breda is like this veteran guy.

And they also have, oh man, what's is there? Corbin. Oh, Jason Corbyn. James Robinson. Mays mentioned this on Twitter that it's like, for all the talk about Josh Jacobs and Austin Eccler and Sequin being upset, they're not getting paid, James Robinson's the guy who got fucked because James Robinson is the first undrafted

free agent to start a week one on running back in like 70 years. And then now Tours Achilles and just is leaving the NFL with a million and a half dollars after taxes and agent fees like $600,000 of an NFL career. Like that's tougher than, you know, sick one pulling in $30 million. So, but I don't know, he's the, the Pats cut him, the Giants cut him. What does that tell you?

Like he tore his Achilles and he's not that guy anymore. So, yeah. But the Giants' offense, though, I don't want to be hyperbolic, but I don't know. Beethoven's ninth. Do it. The moon landing. I don't know, some of the greatest feats.

And, you know, think symphony's coming together in human history. If Dayball can turn Josh Allen into an MVP contender and then hop over to Daniel Jones four years into his career and actually make him a legitimate quarterback in the league, Dayball is really going to ascend the ranks in New York. That man is going to... Bill always talks about who gets the table at a restaurant in New York. If the Giants start like 5 and O and Daniel Jones is like a fringe all-pro quarterback,

he's getting the... Dayball's getting the table over Aaron Judge. He's getting the table over anybody on the fucking Knicks. You name it. Dayball is the guy. I agree. I'm almost worried about Brian Daibald because he's so flirting with like he's so close to the sun that anything going with the team looking bad.

People would go to table. But I can't think of many instances in my lifetime where a New York figure, like a coach rose so quickly in the eyes of everyone. Like this guy can do no wrong. But like here's the thing I'm fully in. Like I actually just think. how many coaches in the NFC would you rather have than Brian Daibble? Like the NFC West has Pete Carroll and McVeigh and Kyle Shanan.

Is there anyone else in the NFC as a coach you'd rather have than Brian Daibald? That's an interesting question. Hi, Vitz, can I ask you this? So we obviously love Sequin. We think Daniel Jones is a very viable kind of late-round guy that you could draft. It's going to have really high rushing upside. We obviously love Darren if he's healthy. Do you think any wide receiver on the Giants is even worth throwing a late-round flyer on?

And if you do, who is that guy? I increasingly think Darren Waller should just be a top 50 pick. And if you get him after that, then you've just done a bank robbery and just a matter of how many games he played. After that, if you're in a 10 team league, no, I would not draft. I think it's Darius Slate and Isaiah Hodgins, Jalen Hyatt later. But like, even in a 12 team league, like you can kind of add those guys later. Like, you know, when Jailen Hyatt, I don't know when he'll be integrated to the offense.

I think in deep, like really deep leagues, Dary Slaten's weirdly underrated. But I don't think any of these receivers are going to be. They're kind of, it's almost going to be like the four. 49ers light where I don't know who's getting the ball after Darren Waller. Or it's like the Chiefs. Yeah, it's like there's going to be Sequin and Darren Waller. And after that, it's like, do you want any of these guys? Probably not.

So you'd have to be pretty deep. I love Jones, man. I'm really thinking about going after Jones in a two QB league, like as my number two guy for like a reasonable price. I just think they could put together a legitimate season. I hope he keeps running a little, you know. I don't think he's going to run nearly as much as last year. Let me, let me transition here because I was going to, you were asking what coach in the NFC would you want over. over Carol McVay, Shanahan, Dayball.

I think Matt LaFleur deserves some credit for what he's done for the backers the last few years. And he'll be on sort of that dayball, Mount Rushmore of like quarterback gurus if Jordan Love ends up being what you think he's going to be High Fitz, which I think you're really into him this year. And I got to tell you, I was texting High Fitz during the weekend and Hyfitts was gloating a little bit because I was like, wow. Jordan Love, he looked pretty good against my Seahawks, really comfortable. he was making some plays with his legs. He just looks like a veteran, which he kind of is because he's been around for forever. But obviously he hasn't played a ton.

But I mean, he looked really comfortable to me. I'm starting to buy in a little bit to the Jordan Love hype because I think, you know, with the scheme that they have for him where they're kind of trying to make it easy on him, not asking him to do a whole lot. You know, obviously he's going to have to manage the offense. But, you know, run game, play action, things like that. They have a bunch of young guys that I'm excited about. And additionally, like I mentioned, he made. some plays with his legs, which I wasn't really expecting. So there's a little bit of maybe hidden value here.

And kind of in the same way we look at, you know, like a Sam Howell who isn't the most athletic guy, but he will run around a lot. Like if Jordan Love can run around a bit, he might have some sneaky value in fantasy. So, yeah, high fits. Mia Coppa. I'm kind of getting excited about Jordan Love. Yeah, I think Jordan Love in a two quarterback league again is like he's the perfect pick and a two quarterback league.

And on the shooting very deeply, you don't need to add him in a one quarterback league. And then similar vein, Luke Musk gave the tenant for the Packers. I don't know if it would be good immediately, but I do know Luke Musgrave, Dalton Kincaid. If they're good, they will be better than all the tight ends around them. And the worst case is they suck. Okay, whatever, you drop them just like any other time around them might be bad. The difference is that you'll have to keep an eye on them all the year because at any point of Luke.

You said this last week, like my Mayacolpa, you're talking about Musgrave and Sam LaPorta. We're talking about why rookie tightens are good. And you're like, well, because I was saying, well, they have to learn this stuff. Dick is like, yeah, they have to learn it so they can play. All these guys are going to play. Luke Musgraves is going to play for the Packers because inexperience is an experience. problem because everyone in the back is an experience. So Luke Musgrave, it's just a lottery scratch-off ticket on the end of your bench.

And if you have to cut him in the first month, you still have to keep an eye on him. So I think he's been fantastic. You send me this no-tK. Jordan Love was 37 dropbacks in the preseason. Luke Musgraves ran a route 31 of the 37 times. That's what you want to see. Literally couldn't ask for higher than that, basically. So that's incredible.

You don't want to see him blocking. And thankfully, I don't think he's very good at it yet. So, yeah, I mean, if he can go out and run a bunch of routes, he's obviously very athletic. Move around. They move him around the formation. You know, it seemed like they were kind of scheming him up in different ways and having him run different routes. So, yeah, I'm getting excited about him for sure. All right. Next up, who else is stock up after preseason week three? The hype's getting out of control for Calvin Ridley, but I'm kind of driving the train.

I'm in the passenger seat next to, I don't know who, Doug Peterson. But Ridley looks awesome. And he's been awesome in the preseason. I like that he's been playing a lot. Obviously, look, this guy hasn't played in almost two years. And he's 29 years old. But he was not injured and is immediately seems to be the number one guy for Trevor Lawrence. And my number one, if I'm considering a, you know, a middle round wide receiver and fantasy football, I want a good quarterback.

I don't want a Terry McLaren situation. And that's not the case of Calvin Ridley. He's on an ascending offense. Lawrence could be an MVP candidate this year. And Ridley seems like he is immediately the number. number one over Zay Jones and Christian Kirk. I know there's a lot of malice to feed. I don't exactly think that's a problem.

All of those guys last year were solid, Jones, Ingram, Kirk. So I kind of think that the hype is, is deserved for Ridley, and I'm all in. So are you cool taking him third round? Yeah, I don't know. I mean, that's probably getting a little up there, but yeah, third, fourth round, I think is fine.

I mean, the 2020, before he went out, he's one of the best receivers in the league. Just straight up. He looked amazing this past week in the preseason game. I mean, he caught like a really nice pass down by the sideline right near the goal line. I think the other thing is, like you mentioned, Craig, is Trevor Lawrence looks really good this preseason. And like it really feels like that team and that offense could make a big jump, which is saying something because they were top 10 in scoring last year and top seven in past attempts. So there's a lot of potential ceiling here for Ridley.

As long as he continues to look like what he's looked like in this preseason, I feel pretty deep. damn confident about him going ahead this year. This is only year two in the Doug Peterson offense. And Lawrence really only started getting going the second half of last year. And I think it almost feels like he's been around longer and he's been good for longer. But it really has only been eight, nine, ten weeks that he has kind of like fully taken in the Doug Peterson offense and actually thrived in it. And so this year, I think we're almost pricing Lawrence at where he finished last year,

when in reality he could be even better. This is like an aggressively obvious way to think about rank. rankings, but sometimes maybe the easiest way to think of, especially with the quarterbacks this year is like, okay, who are the players I would want before these people come up, which no shit. But we have like 15ish receivers, 12, depending on account they want before your quarterbacks, right? Because how many people do you really want to bank on other than Sheila and Patrick Mahomes, right? And we're like, all right, these elite receivers.

And then I'm like, all right, there's that next group where you're like, all right, who am I going to really take before like Lamar Jackson? Like how many of these receivers are so enticing and different from the guys behind them that I, you know what I mean? And I look and I'm like, Calvin Ridley's in that group where I look and I'm like, Calvin Ridley, because the next group, Terry McLoren. I'm like, give me Lamar Jackson. Like how different is Terry McLaurin really going to be from Tyler Lockett or Michael Pitman

or these guys? I'm like, is he that different? Calvin Ridley is special or it could be special enough and has been in the past where you're like, yeah, fourth round. It feels like there's kind of a cliff after him where it's a bunch of like scary guys, like you said. It's like him and Debo are together. And then after that it's, you're like, oh, good.

drop. It's like the guys that have potential to be wide receiver ones, like top 10, top 12 receivers in this season. And then the guys after that are more just like, yeah, I could see them being a wide receiver two. You know what I mean? They're probably not going to be a wide receiver one. You got like, you know, Drake London and DeAndjohnjord Hopkins, Tyler Lockett,

Jerry Judy, Deontay. Those guys feel like very firm wide receiver twos and probably not a whole lot more ceiling than that. But like with Ridley, would it surprise you if it was a top five receiver? For me, it wouldn't really if he came back and. and kind of got back to that level. So, you know, I'm still chasing the ceiling at that spot, and I think he has it. Okay.

If you've made it this far as the episode, we're just going to run through last round of your draft. Yeah. Who should I take? Like, I got one pick left. Also, don't take a kicker if you don't need to. Right. If you're on sleeper or something, you don't need to. However, 10 team league, last pick.

Just take the dolphins running back. Take Jeff Wilson. Take Rahim Moster. Feels like Devani change dropped off the map for, like, the time being. Right. Unless they get Jonathan Taylor, you're just going to get starting running back in the last pick. I like Mostert, man. He's super fast.

He's looked really solid in the preseason. He had, like, quietly had a lot of touches last year. And we kind of just seemed like we've forgotten about him. I'm driving part of that train because I was so excited about Devon A chain. But he hurt his shoulder. He's still been playing, you know, behind some of these other guys in the preseason. He's like fifth on the depth chart right now. Obviously, that can change as the year goes on.

But he looks like he's a little bit out of the picture, at least to start the season. So I'm feeling pretty good about grabbing Rahim Moster at the end of my draft. I literally did this last night in a draft with like my last pick. Just grabbed Rahim Moster. He might be their starter. He might get, you know, 150, 200 carries in this offense that we think is going to be really good. And Jeff Wilson, I feel the same way. Like he's just a really good player.

And they're probably going to rotate those two guys mostly. Yeah, the sell for either of these guys is like, how many players can you pick in the last round of your draft that you could legitimately start on your fantasy team in week one? Right. Exactly. All right. And then the other guy I want to keep in mind here who has sort of, risen up really quickly over the last few weeks because of injuries and other situations is Marvin Mims for the Broncos, who looks like he's going to be a starter for them from day one.

Cortland Sutton is, I think, the de facto number one there. But, you know, you've got Jerry Judy battling an injury, hamstring injury. We don't know how long that's going to go. KJ Hamler was released after having it discovered a heart condition. Tim Patrick tore his Achilles or ACL, I can't remember. And so honestly, like, and I've been saying this since they drafted him, Mims, me is the perfect receiver for Russell Wilson, especially in this offense, I think, is going to be very run-heavy, play action, let Wilson do what he does best, which is the moonballs down the

field. We saw that in this preseason game this weekend, Marvin Mims caught a deep pass from Russell Wilson. I think he fits what I think Sean Payton is going to want to do in this offense, and Russell Wilson is good at. So I don't know, he seems like a kind of a good sleeper to keep in mind right now. I think that's a great pick. The Broncos offense is quietly in shambles. I mean, the options and the weapons have really kind of fallen by the wayside. I mean, they have Giovante Williams coming off a horrible knee injury. They have Jerry Judy has a bad hamstring injury.

Cortland Sutton hasn't had a good season in three years. And they lost Tim Patrick. They don't have KJ Hamler. And it's like, it's really getting down to Greg Dulcich and Albert O, their tight ends. And then Marvin Mims and Cortland Sutton. So Marvin Mims in the late rounds is a fantastic upside pick. Yep. Completely agree on Marvin Mims.

He's the exact kind of guy that might be like the number one receiver on our waivers episode after week one. So you might as well just have them on your bench entering week one. Deeper leagues, I don't even know if it's 12 more 14 team leagues,

but just, all right, I'm going to admit it. I don't know how to pronounce this guy's name. Cowboys backup running back. It's Rico Dowdell? Yeah, I think that's right. Dowdell or Dowdell?

Sure. It's Deuce Vaughn as much as we love him. Probably not going to be a big part of it. Yeah. I mean, like, I love Deuce Fod. I think there's a chance. Sufahan ends up actually working his way into into playing time this year. He had his

moment, you know, like baby Yoda. They're not going to make a whole movie around him. Baby Yoda. Oh, wow. Okay. Grogu. But yeah, RICO Dowdell. It looks like he's won the backup job to Tony Pollard. So if you're looking for a handcuff slash 1B, I'm guessing

they're going to utilize the backup guy a lot to try not to wear down Pollard. So that's a name to keep in mind as a handcuff slash potential flex option in this offense. And I'm sure most people have not heard about this guy. So Rico Dowell. Okay.

Shall we do some emails? Let's do it. Yeah. Okay. Let's get to the hard-hitting stuff. It's from Nathan. Nathan. Nathan emailed us about Gary Barnage who we brought up.

Craig, you weren't there, actually. We, DK and I had a conversation with Gary Barnage. I just had a flashback. So Nathan emails and says in college, I got a cat. The cat moved into our apartment with me and two buddies. And for months, we just could not. come up with a name for this cat. And our philosophy was, you know what?

Eventually a name would just come to us. And then one Sunday, as we're hitting the bong and watching football, Gary Barnage flashes across our screen. And he was in the middle of that one good year Gary Barnage had. And we all thought, what a hilarious name. So we named the cat, Gary Barnage. Sadly, we did not expect Gary Barnage to have only one good season. So over time, I've started just lying about why we named our cat,

Gary and we just say he's named after Gary the snail from SpongeBob. Oh, man. Honestly, like great backup idea. I know, right? Feels wrong and gross, but I just got tired of explaining to all the women who came through about Gary Barnage and doing the whole Gary Barnage spiel. I can't express the joy I felt hearing Gary Barnage's name on your podcast last week. Why did you bring him up?

What was that? It was a good, it was a very good analogy and I can't remember it now. Looking at Gary Barnage's football reference is, I think, the craziest thing I've ever seen in my life. This man didn't have more than 200 receiving yards for the first seven years of his career and then at age 30 has 1,000 yards and nine

touchdowns? Has that ever happened before? He's the Steve Young of 10. Oh, Craig, the comparison was, we were trying to compare L.A. Lights to a football player that we compared him to Gary Martinich. They had a moment a long time ago. Who was

that a tough beat for? Gary or L.A. Lights? I feel like L.A. Lights. Gary? We got to get them a sponsorship together. All right. We got a lot of emails about vanilla. Okay. We fucked up.

So the artificial flavoring does not come from beaver anal glands. Oh. Well, it like kind of used to like 50 years ago, but they stopped and we failed to everyone. And if you've told family members that, then I'm sorry. So spreading the urban legend. Yeah. Yeah. So artificial vanilla is made from synthetic vanilla, which.

it's basically can't keep up with all the demand for vanilla. However, this seems more logical. You don't have to grow a beaver to get that. Yeah. Yeah.

There's a vice article where flavor historian Nadia Barrenstein wrote that in the 60s food manufacturing. I know, right? What a job.

They did have small amounts of castorium, which is what the beavers butts make. We should introduce Nadia Berenstein to Kai. See what?

Flavor history. The all-time outlier in the world. Here's Kai. Talk to him about flavor. She could talk his ear off. The part of this vice article I thought was incredible was that using castorium, the beaver butt gland thing, became significantly less common starting the 80s as brands sought to make more of their products kosher. Ah, yes. Really?

I got to tell you, you know, I'm Jewish. I didn't realize that, you know, beaver anal glands were not kosher. I was not aware. Little note fact. That's in the tour and everything. Yeah. So were Jewish people not eating vanilla back in the day? Well, vanilla is very finicky.

The problem with vanilla is you basically have to hand pollinate it. We got an email from Christian. Do you remember the Australian Christian? Christian, the Australian guy who was like really mean to us, but we were fine with it because he was Australian and it was funny. Yeah, I'd let an Australian say anything to me. He could just berate me. So Christian was saying that he just was kind of email screaming at us. And he said,

the problem is, vanilla can be naturally pollinated when the appropriate bee species exist, but hand pollination is basically required to make a commercially viable fruit set of vanilla. And there are clusters of like 15 flowers, but only one opening at a time. And so this asshole flower is only receptive for like six hours a day, which is usually at the butt crack of dawn. So it's like,

so Christians explaining, I growed several dozen self-sterile flowers, including dragon fruit. and I have to hand pollinate them at night and my neighbor regularly sees me this is his words, hand fucking my cactus flowers with a headlamp at midnight

and I'm usually listening to you two gibbering fuckwits. Just finger blasting these flowers. Jesus man. And then he said giddy up. You left that out. That's the best part. He said giddy up.

Yeah. He fucking loves this. Kramer. He's Australian Kramer from Seinfeld. This is great. Anyway. Yeah. Hand fucking.

my cactus flowers. I didn't realize vanilla was so, was so finicky and required such specific kind of growing environments. Maybe we, why is it vanilla more cherished as a flavor? I feel like we just,

we kind of just cast it off aside as, as a basic flavor. Vanilla should be cherished. Connor also emailed in Connor. Connor. Connor. The reason French vanilla is more rich or creamy

is that the vanilla bean is French vanilla includes egg yolks, and that's why it's slightly yellower. Oh, yeah. Interesting. I do like French vanilla more. Perhaps that's why. There you go.

Thank you, Con. I'm a con head now after that email. Conhead. There are dozens of us. I feel like we learn a lot. We learn a lot from our emailers. I don't like the little beans, the little bean flex specs.

I do. I'd prefer just like a creamie vanilla. I think a little bit of texture. Not a fan, Craig? Craig doesn't like. Ho! Flex. What is the word flex?

Spex? What is it? No, he said you don't like the bean flicks. Yes, I know what he's saying. I'm moving on beyond that. I understand what he's saying. I'm saying, Chris, like, Liz might actually listen to the show now.

No shot. She's already going to hit her quota for the year. Is it, is the words, is it a spec or a fleck, or are those the same thing? Or is fleck not a word? I think fleck is a word. Little flex is a ball. Is a speck and a fleck kind of the same thing? A speck, they're both doing the job.

I know what you're saying either way. basically. It's funny when a word like that rhymes, but they also kind of have the same meaning anyway. See, I'm convinced that the only reason why one of those words was created is because it was just, it actually had a different meaning, and then somebody just kept getting it confused,

and they were like, fuck it, just make Fleck and Speck mean the same thing. Fleck is a word, a very small patch of color or light, or so like, do you have a fleck in your eye? Flex of light or something, flex of dust. Like a fleck of color. Yeah. Spex, flex. I just think of like there's flex of gold and Goldschlager.

super bad anyway should we keep talking about flex by the way there's no way that's gold what the hell is that

actually in the gold slager we've talked about this on this show before I believe well you see the thing where it's definitely just like aluminum foil

or something spray painted gold it's gold it's real gold speaking of things that I read on the internet and assume were trues

you know that like famous thing where it's like all the gold is so soft as a metal that all the gold in the world could be in theory

crushed and put into two Olympic-sized swimming pools That's wild Is that real? Yeah Well I mean

That's why like jewelry is not 100% gold right Because it's too malleable It could be dented Yeah you dent it That's why I don't buy 100% gold jewelry That's the only reason why Yeah yeah I could if I wanted to

We got from here to Jeff Wilson In like record time Sorry I listened to an episode On that Derek Thompson playing English episode about that So it's kind of Great pod

Yeah Shout out playing English by Derek Thompson. All right. That's all we got. Fantasyfewport.3.com. Rankings, top 200, upsides, downsides, everything you need. Draft tracker of fantasyfutball.30.com. You can do it.

Printable rankings. Printable rankings are up. We have our printable rankings now. Thank you, D.K., thank you, Craig. Thank you. Kai. Thank you, Kira, for help behind these scenes. Thank you, Lauren.

Lauren. Thank you, the Bronx. Shouts to the Bronx. I went to a Bronx show on Friday night. And I actually had never. I've never heard of them before, but it's like a punk band. They're kind of like scream punk. I don't know the exact genre is, but like there's like hardcore screaming punk.

It's pretty badass. The lead singer guy. They're from Los Angeles. Incredible, incredible stage presence. Like, I've never seen anyone pump up a crowd better than this guy. I would run through a wall for this guy. But yeah, it's a fun show. They have their own.

So they have another band. It's like, I think the same guys. It's Mariachi El Bronx and they just play Marriachi music. So they're doing mariachi music and scream punk in the same show? It's not, scream punk is certainly not like the genre, but it's, they're screaming punk. I don't really know. I got to be honest, scream punk could not be any less in my wheelhouse. It's really not my vibe.

I can buy everyone. Must be 21 plus and present in select states. Fandul is offering online sports wagering in Kansas under an agreement with Kansas Star Casino, LLC. Gambling problem, call 1-800 gambler or visit fandle.com slash RG in Colorado, Iowa, Michigan, New Jersey, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Illinois, Tennessee, and Virginia. Call 1-800 next step or text next step to 533442 in Arizona, 1-88-78-9-777. Or visit ccpg.org slash chat in Connecticut, 1-8009 with it in Indiana, 1-800-522-4-700, or visit KSgamley Help.com in Kansas, 18777-70-stop in Louisiana. Visit MD Gamleyhelp.org in Maryland. Visit 1-800-gambler.net in West Virginia or call 1-800-5-2-2-4-700 in Wyoming.

Hope is here. Visit Gamley Helplinema.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24-7 support in Massachusetts or call 18778-8-Hope-N-Y or text Hope NY in New York.