The Ringer NFL Show - Offseason Stories We Missed + Gronk Retires

Episode Date: June 21, 2022

We are BACK from summer vacation to revisit all of the fantasy football storylines we missed over the past month. We start with the news of Rob Gronkowski retiring from football, whether we think he'll return, and where he sits among the all-time tight ends. Then, we show-and-tell our favorite media stories from the fantasy football offseason, including Leonard Fournette and Najee Harris showing up to camp overweight, Zach Wilson and Mac Jones kicking off best-shape-of-my-life season, and Russell Wilson’s first months in Denver. We then finish by answering a listener's email. (1:37) - Gronk retires (7:42) - Bulky Lenny and Najee (13:27) - BSOML guys (26:30) - Russell Wilson in Denver (39:09) - Listener emails Check out The Ringer’s Fantasy Football Draft Guide! If you have any questions or thoughts, please email us @[e-mail] Hosts: Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck Producer: Craig Horlbeck Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey guys, it's Dave Chang here, host of the Dave Chang Show. You might hear me on with Chris Yang, Noel Cornelio, and a host of other guests. We've been on air for quite some time now, and it's changed over the years. But one of the things we always try to talk about is what's delicious, how to be a better eater. And you might hear me rambling incoherently, contradicting myself every five minutes. We talk about some sports and culture and all kinds of other things too. I think we're the most expert opinions you'll ever hear about anything. Check us out if you haven't before on The Ringer Podcast Network.

Fantasy Football Show. My name is Danny Hyfins, and I am joined by Danny Kelly and Craig Coral back, and we are back. Yeah. We're back from summer break. Little housekeeping right off the top. We are coming back to you every Tuesday and Thursday

here on this feed, the Ringer Fantasy Football Show. As we get closer to training camp, which is the end of July, we'll change it up. We're probably going to come to you more than twice week. But for now, every Tuesday and Thursday, our fantasy rankings are live at fantasyfewport. dot the ringer.com. So if you're like, what are our rankings? There you go.

Not only are they live, they are correct. They are correct. They are correct. Down to the man. Yes. We're back from summer break. So we figured what do you do when you come back from summer break? You do show and tell. Like tell us about your summer, you know? But first, we have actual news to discuss. Rob Grancowski has retired. And I think this one's for real. The other one was like, he is retired.

He is Instagramed. First of all, before we get to Grunk, The Instagram itself was kind of funny. First of all, I mean, it's a funny Photoshop. And then he just writes this endearing story of like, you know, when I was in college, I like wrote this essay of what I want to do. And I was like, I want to be tight end. And then he's like, I had a team.

So I like added the bucks. And then I was a book. So like, thanks for the opportunity. And then ends it with. Argue. Yeah, like he's going to go be a pirate. Did you notice he didn't mention. the Patriots in this.

Just like Tom Brady. Interesting. I don't think Grunk's done. I don't either. So do you think that Tom Brady plays his last season as a buck? Gronk recuperates again. And then when Brady goes to another team next year, Gronk just follows him again.

It's just a really easy way for Gronk to chill until week 10. Yeah, exactly. Why do the hard part? Why do any of it? Training camp, preseason, their first 10 weeks. It's like jumping into the, the last mile of the marathon kind of deal and just like sprinting it out.

That's what Gronk's going to do. I believe that Gronk and Brady will retire together at the same time. I think they're just going to play until they both quit. I have to say, few people have a better gig in all of like the history of human sports

than Rob Gronkowski's policy of I'll just never not play for anybody that isn't Tom Brady. Like Tom Brady will be my only quarterback. And now it's gone further and it's like I actually, I will only play with Tom Brady. Not only that,

I probably will only play in like the playoffs. I love it. Well, Bill used to joke about gronk would be kept in the garage until the playoffs. And now it's like, gronk is actually like, actually, no, I'm not coming out until the playoffs. But if he is done, though, I was looking at stats. And I kind of wise gets a simple question.

Like, do you think gronk is the best tight end of all time? I mean, that's tough. It's like Tony Gonzalez, extremely, extremely prolific, you know. Not career-wise. Career-wise, Tony Gonzalez played like twice as many football games as gronk did. The peak gronk, the best version of gronk versus the best version of every other tight end. I think he was, because there's like no one that's. been as unstoppable as him, really.

In a single game, he's more dominant than any tight endeavor, I think. I just actually looked this up because I was curious. Since 2010, when he was drafted, Gronk has scored the most touchdowns of any player. That's insane. There you go. I looked it up, too, because I was kind of playing with some stats, and I found this. So if you look through a player's first 80 games, because 80's just five seasons, back when we had 16-game season, it just seemed nice and cool.

clean to do 80 games. So if you just look at the players who had 60 receiving touchdowns in their first 80 games, it's just Jerry Rice, Rob Grankowski, and Randy Moss. Jesus. So I mean, it's not even just like tight ends. It's not Tony Gonzalez. It's like he's literally on the list with Jerry Rice and Randy Moss, except he was also the best blocking tight end during this period. He's essentially like an elite left tackle. Yeah. Yeah, it's like an unequivocal case. It's like he's literally catching more touchdowns than Randy Moss, and he's the best

blocking tight end. Like, who can compete with that? If you're one of Rob, Rob Garnkowski's brothers, how does that make you feel? Because I know they're like in the NFL and everything. Several of his brothers have played in the NFL, but like none have come remotely close to being as good as him. Like that must be kind of hard to be brothers like that. Yeah, but you also, I don't know.

You did make it to the NFL. I got to check him from my Ferdonia, New York anonymous, Soros. I told you that once attended a party at the Grunkowski's house, and then the next morning, Rob woke up on his own front lawn, butt naked. Yeah. That's what he's going to be doing until week 10.

So, yeah. But no, yeah. All right. So shout out Grunk. So how confident are you guys that he plays football again? 70%. That's what I was going to say. Yeah.

Yeah, I feel like he does. Adam Schaeffter tweeted it today like Grunx agent. Who I'm forgetting blanking on this name. The most famous. Yeah, Rosenhaus, the most famous agent in the world. He even texted Schaefter and was like, I don't know. I kind of feel like that. Oh, yeah, wait.

We got to do the chefter drinking game. All right, chefter drinking game. In reaction, okay, this is like a three drinker. In reaction to Rob Grancowski's news, comma, his agent Drew Rosenhaus text, colon, it would not surprise me if Tom Brady calls him during the season to come back and Rob answers the call. This is just my opinion, but I wouldn't be surprised if Rob comes back during the or next season.

End quote. It's his own agent. Yeah. That's, okay. He's coming back. Okay, he's coming back. That's a two drinker for sure. Well, wait, what's the rule if he mentions Rosenhaus but doesn't at Rosenhaus?

But didn't he quote him? He quoted him. Like with actual quotation marks. That's, it's a two drinker for Schaefter? Yeah. Easy. Okay. Cool.

All right. Other stuff. So it's the summer. We took a month half off. I don't know. It was smooth brain season. We had to like get the ridges back on our brains. It's going to be a slow process.

and we just, seriously, what do you do when you come back from summer break? It's like, you know, little show and tell from your summer. Yeah, and we're doing fantasy show and tell, right? We're going to do like, as we've been sitting on the beach, feed up, wherever we've been, weddings, all the little fantasy news that we heard, we're going to present that for the class today. To the class. I don't really get where this metaphor is going, but yeah, D.K., you want to just lead us in show and tell. I don't really know exactly how this is working either.

But I'm just going to pretend I'm talking to the class. Here we goes. Back from camp, D.K. What do you got for us? Hello, everyone. I missed you all. During my summer break, I just want to tell you, I decided to focus on my health,

getting into shape, eating better. I did a lot of walking, you know, cleaned up my diet. And then I read an article about, well, I read a couple articles about some so-called professional athletes who came into training camp or mini-camp, you know, these non-mandatory mini-camps,

a little bit overweight. I'm just going to say it. Lender for that. I'm going to be honest, probably should have thought ahead about getting a little bit bigger jersey when he showed up for the mini camp for the Buccaneers. Looked real tight. That jersey looked tight. It was stretching the tensile strength of the jersey on both sides.

And so, Lenny's a little bit fat. He just looks a little bit overweight. He came in at over 247 pounds or 240 pounds. I don't know exactly where. Is this body shaming? Are we body shaming? Also, is that okay? Can we body shame?

No, these big jobs. are to be in shape. It is your job. Lennon's not the only one that people are getting kind of upset about for being overweight. Naji Harris,

Craig's favorite player. Thick. According to a beat reporter for the Steelers, Harris came in at 244 pounds after being listed at 232 last year. So people were starting to freak down a little bit.

The quick thing, I have two thoughts of this. One, the listed weights are so wrong. They sometimes, times are the same thing these guys weighed from the combine. Yeah. Like years ago.

And they just net, like the guys when they weigh in, they don't update their weights on the websites. We're like, every time you see listed at, like, that's not correct. We never know what a player's weight is. Yeah.

Also, like, with these, with Lenny and, and, and Naji's getting thick in the off season, there's two types of off season thick, right? It's like cheeseburgers and beer thick. And it's like,

I've been bulking up to then cut. Like, it's a purposeful bulk. You know what I mean? And Lenny, I don't know if he looks like he's been kind of bulking season. It seems like he's been hitting a cheeseburgers and beer. Noggi, I'm hoping that this was just, he said he was at this weight last year and he cut it down in training camp. So perhaps this is just part of his process.

You add muscle, you cut fat. Here's my deal. Yeah. I am 100% buying both of these guys because they're kind of, they might fall a little bit, honestly, in ADP going into the season because they came into. No, because the drafts is not for. two months from now. Well, if you're drafting, like, early or doing best ball or whatever, like, I'm taking advantage of this because I think it's good that these guys came in a little bit fat.

Number one, the Nazi Harris storyline is absolutely, like, baloney. Did you see him? He doesn't even look remotely fat. Well, here's the thing. Here's the thing. Here's like, sometimes I think that these conversations are the dumbest things ever. I actually think they are sports distilled to the purest form because what sports are about, whether it's football or it's the Olympics

and it's a sport you've never seen. It's about sitting down in your couch with Cheeto dust on your fucking chest. And being like, that guy's fat. Yeah, and you're like, look at these elite athletes. Oh, mm, shouldn't have done that. Shouldn't have broke that tackle. And this, there's not even motion picture.

It's just a photo. That running back is fat. It's just, that's the sporting experience. The funny thing is, look, Lenny, like the pictures are not very flattering for Leonard-Frenet, But Naji Harris Legitimate Like, I don't, I don't know.

However, I'm just saying, Najee Harris looks exactly the same. You know, like the meme, it's like, it's the same photo. Like, Najee Harris looks exactly the same as he did last year. And he even said this.

He's like, I wasn't actually playing at 232. Like, that was just like, whatever, the intern at the Steelers decided to put that down as my weight. He's like, I played at 240.

He goes, I was at 242 last year. I'm now 244. That's like, I drank a little bit of water or whatever, you know, in the morning.

and I weighed two extra pounds. So to me, this is an absolute non-story when it comes to Najee Harris. I just think it's funny. And he even said, he's like, y'all are making it sound like I'm fat as hell. He's like, dude, he looks exactly the same. And by the way, and he pointed this out to the reporters.

It was like both, especially for running backs, I think, but like for any position in the NFL, really, other than maybe like quarterback, guys come in heavy at the beginning of the year. And by the end of the season, you're down, like, depending on how, like, depending on the position, you're down weight because you're not lifting as crazy hard during the season. Um, you know, obviously you're going a lot harder. You're practicing every single day, blah, blah, blah. Like the weight comes off. The weight sheds

during the season. And that's exactly what's going to happen with Lenny. I'm not worried about it whatsoever. In fact, he's done this. I think multiple off seasons, he's come in at like 240 plus and it ended up in like the 220 range. And that's exactly what he said he's going to do. I'm not worried about it. I just think it's honestly funny to talk about. And if it drives their ADP down, like that's a good advantage to take it, like, to go grab that guy. We have Najee Harris' 8 on the fantasy football rankings on the ringer. I think by the time we update him next, I swear to God, I'm going to have him in my top three. I haven't met two.

Yeah. I'm going to join. The Najee Harris one in particular is just like ridiculous. So neither of these guys are in the Eddie Lacey zone for you, D.K. No, and by the way, it doesn't even matter because I wrote this down, Eddie Lacey, there's famous training camp or I don't know if it was like mini camps or OTAs or whatever from his rookie season where he looked pretty, you know, rotund. He was also kind of stretching out the jersey a little bit.

Maybe we should just blame the equipment guys for this because just get these guys bigger jerseys and we won't have this conversation every off season. But Eddie Lacey, after everybody made fun of them for being fat, rushed for 1,100 plus yards and scored 11 touchdowns as a rookie. He rushed for 1100 plus

yards in his first two seasons, 20 total touchdowns, scored 20 total touchdowns. Zeke Elliott, you remember when he was fat? 1,300 plus yards and 14 touchdowns in 2019. Fri and everyone was like, oh, it looks pretty husky? Or is this celebration just eating? Well, that can't help everything.

It's the branding. This is a non-issue. I'm not worried whatsoever. Okay. I am less interested in the guys who, like, run for a living to lose weight. Seems super easy. I'm not going to lie. I'm interested in the best shape of my life, guys.

Yes. This is where you should start to be, like, skeptical, I think. This is what I'm bringing to show and tell. The last month, I've been just gobbling up Best Shape of My Life news. It's officially Best Shape of My Life season. It's my favorite media storyline during kind of this weird time of OTAs, the June, July season. I love Best Shape of My Life, guys. First one that I'm presenting to you today, Thick Zach Wilson, quarterback on the jet.

He's not thick. He's ripped. He's ripped. Bulky. I mean, the-Megasak-Effron. Robert Sala called him thick and beefy. So, beefy. When he said that, did it have two Cs and thick?

It always does. Yeah. So anyway, Zach Wilson was 208 last year, and he showed up 13 pounds heavier, making him 221 pounds. He's 6'2. Well, he was skin and bones. I honestly don't think he was personally. Whereas D.K. said, Kids Bop, Cars for Kids, Jim McMahon?

That was Derek Bassen. That wasn't me. I was merely quoting in a hilarious quote. But to me, like, he looked like he was going to, like, a high school prom. So I will side with hyphids on this. And he looks skinny to me. Zach Wilson will get carded at bars in New York for three more years. Yeah. Well, that's just because he has a kid's face.

I'm selling this. I don't like it when quarterbacks get ripped. I don't like it when they bulk up. Zach Wilson was not good in year one. And he comes back huge. And that doesn't, that's not what I'm looking for. I know he got banged up and he wants to, like, bulk up a bit to, you know, take some hits. this season, but there's a reason why Tom Brady only does playometrics and flexibility workouts.

None of the best guys are yote. Name a really good quarterback who got jacked and then was really good. It's so true. It's like, I feel like he worked on the show muscles. Yes. He did curls. You throw with your legs. Like it's like, you know what I mean? It's like, it's like cool to like have strong arms, but you're throwing with your legs. You know when you lift weights like you do bench press and then you go outside and you try to like shoot a basketball and it's like really hard. arm. It's weird. Yeah, exactly. The ball feels like it's like super heavy or super like you.

I've always been fascinated by this with like NBA players and like what their weightlifting regimen is during the season when you have to shoot. And I kind of wonder the same with quarterbacks maintaining that. I think it's why a lot of guys like Andre Goodala can't shoot because I think he's too ripped. Genuine. The range of motion. That was like part of the Zach Wilson's like the reason his arm is so good as it was like whip like.

you know, and he could just like fling it. And if you get like big biceps, isn't it gonna fuck up to like biometrics? Wait, we have backed ass first into a much more important conversation, which is, is arm strength as a category literally wrong? Because we're saying that Zach Wilson's arm got stronger,

but that he will throw shorter. Because it has nothing to do with like your biceps. It's like swinging a golf club. Like you can be tiny and still drive it farther than somebody who's ripped. Like it's all about like your core and your motion and flexibility.

It's transferring energy from your leg. I don't know why we're explaining. It's a lever. People know. Yeah. And it's like, it's like don't lift with your back. So anyway,

I agree though. Part of the wonders at the end of the day, these kids can say whatever they want. They're in their young 20s and they're extraordinarily famous and they live in New York. And I kind of just wonder if he wants to be in the body issue. And I kind of just won't hear it any other way.

Apparently he's already looked shaky at OTAs. And man, I'm just, I'm not end. I mean, OTAs are the easiest time to play quarterback. Like everyone's supposed to look good at OTAs. This isn't the same thing because Tua isn't like the best shape of my life guy, but I'm so intrigued this year.

Like the Zach Wilson Tua combo of these two teams, they're both in the AFC East, the Jets and the Dolphins where the Patriots had the shadow over the AFCs for 20 years. The bills now look incredible. And both the Jets and the dolphins have just had these like existential crises. is like, oh my God, do we have the right quarterback? And just absolutely through money and picks to put everybody around these guys to be like, if you're good, you better freaking show us right now.

And like, I'm kind of just fascinated to see how they deal with it. Oh, yeah, 100%. That's one of the biggest stories of the season, honestly, because there's so many teams, especially with multiple first round picks next year. You could add like Jalen Hertz into this equation. There's a handful of quarterbacks, Daniel Jones. whose teams are like, it's figured a bulking season.

They're just like adding so much around these guys. And if they don't pay off, then they just can move on, which I love. Okay. So Zach Wilson ripped, that's bad. We've decided. I'm selling.

All right. The other quarter of, speaking of AFC's quarterbacks, Mack Jones has lost weight. Is this correct, Craig? Yes. Mac Jones is trimmed down and I am buying this.

He's trimmed down his body fat a bit. Kendrick Bourne said, oh, he's in the best shape of his life. And it's like, I actually kind of believe it. I got to tell you, it's the least impressive thing. He's 23, and he looks like it. He was built like a mechanic at Alabama.

So it's not exactly a significant statement to say he's in the best shape of his life. But 90% of his body was his torso. And you're replacing Tom Brady. And so if you don't rise to the challenge, like I'm 23, I should probably follow the footsteps of the most, like, health conscious athlete that there ever was. Like, what would he, if Mack Jones was not in the best shape of his life, he should be fired or benched. Yeah, but Kendrick Boren, who maybe his Mac's best friend, was like, his stomach is gone and he looks really good. He's definitely a pro's now.

The reason why I like this is that he did the opposite of the Zach Wilson. He didn't like broaden his shoulders and get huge biceps and triceps. Like he's just a little trimmer now. He worked on like diet, sleep, wellness, whatever it is. He'll probably be a little more mobile, a little more lighter on his feet, less belly. That's all I want. I think I'm actually just fully leaning towards quarterbacks who just look like average people. Those are all the best ones.

I think you're honest, it's a great take because the more I think about it, it's true. Like the showering muscles just don't help you throw. Look at Eli Manning, man. God, there was that pick the other day.

Tom Brady, Tom Brady's posted shirtless picks. Like, it's not his, his beautiful face. But like, he doesn't have a, you wouldn't look at him be like, that's the greatest,

that's the greatest player at the most important position in American sports. And you can say that about all of them. Like Patrick Mahomes isn't like, no. In the best shape. I don't actually,

I don't know. if I've seen a picture with him out of his shirt on, but he doesn't strike me as like super ripped, does he? He has decent arms. I'm looking at Tom Brady's shirtless, and it's honestly, he kind of looks like Mac Jones, right? Did you see that photo recently

of Eli Manning and Tim Tebow hanging out? And it's like, there's a reason... Tebow's yoped. Tim Tebow looks like a Greek god, and Eli Manning looks like a plumber. And Eli Manning is one of the... You know, I don't know, he's maybe a Hall of Famer, but my point persists that, like,

I actually don't think being super, super ripped is what helps you play quarterback. Joe Burrow, pretty skinny. Yes. Herbert is big, but not like super mussely, right? No, he just has that naturally big frame. Yeah.

I think this is, yeah, I mean, this is not like, this isn't like novel. We're not like breaking new ground here, but I 100% buy it. Drew Breeze looks like a guy. How do we feel about best shape in my life at like other positions? Like when running backs,

like I'm in the best shape of my life. I'm okay with that. I like that. I want that. I don't actually, I don't really care about running backs. I think receivers and things like that can be advantageous to come in

and be really fast explosive, bigger, faster, whatever, stronger. I think that could matter. I don't really buy it with running backs, though,

because running backs is just, just don't get hurt, you know? Like, if you can stay healthy, that's the only thing that matters. Yeah, but right,

usually like putting on muscle when you're a running back, you could argue, would help you not get hurt, right? Like, I remember we all got excited about Markey's Brown

putting on all the weight that, you know, that didn't pan out. Receivers, I don't know, because so much of being a receiver is just, like, natural ability in terms of, like, how good you are at route running and, like, your hands. And, like, getting huge shoulders doesn't really help that. Yeah, but if you hear about running backs that put on 10 pounds of weight, like, usually that ends up being a bad thing. Yeah, I guess I just need to see if they still can keep the speed up.

Exactly. Craig, you have any of their best ship of your life guys for show and tell? The last one is, I guess, so, Dak Prescott, he said that he, he lost weight, or he's re-transfered weight, and excuse me, I am going to start using that. I've re-transferred a lot of weight

during the last nine weddings I went to. He's the same weight, but he said he's lost his baby fat, so is he fully matured, Dack Prescott now? What is he, 27? I think, that's, Dack is, Dack would have been the, example or the person that we use as sort of like the antithesis of what we were just

discussing, because typically he's pretty, like, built, you know, he's pretty, like, thick guy. Yeah. Ben Rothesberger pretty thick too, but he's not muscular whatsoever. Dak is like muscular. He is. And I think this is good. Like if he's slimming down a bit,

they're gonna, they were already talking about using him and more run game stuff and getting him back at like moving around outside of the pocket, all that stuff. This is all good. I think this is great. Yeah, I'm buying it as well. And the one reason why I'm really buying it is because this is what I'm going to call

the Clay Thompson, 2023 corollary, where I like when a guy is getting ready for the year after the year after he's been injured badly. And that is what, everyone's always like, oh, Dak Prescott, you know, horrible ankle injury. He's back. And he looks healthy in camp. Like, what can he do?

I don't want to touch him that year. I want the next year. And that's where we are right now. Most of these injuries, in my mind, are two-year injuries, even if they're playing one year after the injury. So I'm buying that he's in great shape coming into year two off that ankle injury.

I love it. I feel like I said this to you yesterday about Sequin. Yeah. And you've magically stolen my idea. That's a perfect example. both DAC and Sequin, I've talked about how much more confident they are on their, like, legs and lower legs and body and just like cutting and exploding and burst and changing direction. Like all that shit that really matters.

Like, if you're in the NFL, the margins are insanely small. The, you know, and if you're not really trusting your body to do that stuff, like, that's huge. That's a huge deal. It's so true. Like, there is, there is that by-low window. Like, I think going into this season, I feel like the perfect example of that right now, it's like Chris Godwin and O'Dell Beckham, where it's like, I have, I probably won't even rank O'Dell Beckham at this point. Like, O'Dell is probably going to do a gronk and just sign with the team around like Halloween.

And it's like, what are you going to do? Hold on to O'Dell for eight weeks and not cut him. That's ridiculous. Like, don't even draft him. But like next year, after O'Dell is terrible this year, next year, O'Dell will be a bargain. If Chris Godwin isn't good this year, everyone's going, oh, and it's like, well, next year, now that he's had a year and half to recover from the ACL. And he's probably going to be great. That's how I feel right now.

I think Craig's so right. Dak and Sequin are the two guys that just stand shining out as just huge values. Yeah, and the reason I gave it to Clay is like, I think Clay's going to be better next year. And you know what's crazy is like, he played the most minutes out of any warrior in the playoffs this year.

Did he? What? Yes. Oh yeah, Craig, congrats, by the way. More than Steph? Oh, yeah, we haven't talked about this. Literally the last episode we did, literally the last episode we did was the Warriors made the finals.

And so do you want to gloat? How do you feel the Warriors won the NBA? finals. I watched game five and six from the state of Massachusetts, and I got to say, it's never been better. Never felt better to be Massachusetts. Have you talked to Bill since they won? Briefly. Only like, you know, work-related things. Do you think Bill is dodging you? I don't. I think he's just fine. But, you know, he bears his soul in the pod, so he doesn't, talking to me is nothing. He has to tell a million people how he feels. Well, speaking of Bill in the pot, do you think the Warriors are a dynasty? Yeah, I do.

finals in eight years is pretty good. Probably, yeah. Okay. Yeah, congrats. It's bizarre. The Warriors, it's weird for them to be an underdog. That was really weird. Okay.

Other show and, yeah, great, you should have show and tell like Warriors won the championship. Didn't you give the best man speech for your brother during the game? During game four, I did, and I started the speech by giving a score update because my brother's now wife gave us all one rule for the wedding. No Warriors talk.

It thought it would be really funny to start. Because half the wedding were Warriors fans. So I started the speech with the score. And they were down four at the time. And it actually worked out great because, like, during all the dancing, people had their phones up. We watched the fourth quarter when Steph was going crazy. Because that was the Steph game, game four.

Oh, wow. And my brother was basically not allowed to look. And there's like these awesome photos of us running up to him being like, it's over. They won. And he's like, it is? And it was great. Hey, hey.

Yeah. Oh, okay. Anyway, Hyvitz. What are you bringing to show and tell? Mine is, mine's so weird that I want to go last. All right. I'll get back up here. Guys, during my summer break, had a little downtime, took that opportunity to binge watch

some madmen. Oh. Illuminating education about the history of big money marketing in America, especially in the ways in which corporate America manipulates the masses without any hint of scruples. Speaking of that, Russell. What is he talking about? Definitely paid a Madison Avenue marketing firm like seven, eight figures maybe to come up with this new Denver Broncos themed catchphrase. Let's ride.

Broncos country, let's ride. This is the worst. This, I can't. I have two questions. One, I can't believe you just use, I can't believe you just use scruples on ironically in a sentence. Yeah. Two. So you're saying, let's ride.

Did he never say let's ride before? Like, this is like a horse reference. Like, let's ride. His old thing was go hot. Go Hawks. So now it's like, let's ride like Broncos. Yeah, he switched up his catchphrase that it'll like use to end every interview or whatever.

Let's ride. So I was going to ask you guys to come up with some things on the fly. What do you think are some of the phrases that got left on the cutting room floor you know, up in that Maddison Avenue advertising firm, Don Draper up there kind of like going through the big cards, you know,

in the meeting. My first one was mount up. I was going to say saddle up. Saddle up Mountup That's a good one Moundup is better than saddle Craig you got to give me

at least one here Horse horse themed catch phrase Oh it has to be I was just going to Well it doesn't have to be Shout out Halo 2

For Mount Up We're headed away Rocky Mountain High Something with that No Russell's too He's too clean for that Can't talk about being high I bet Russellson's never done a drug

Other than the pain killers necessary to play in the NFL Life is a drug Every day for him um life is football is drug i like mount up um i think mount up is better is that probably already taken though maybe there maybe that's but broncos if you put a saddle on a bronco is it like not a bronco anymore like bronco is supposed to like free what about buck up you're like telling the fans to like grab the reins yeah buck up yeah that's mine let's ride and

If you have a better catchphrase for what Russell Wilson should do, please email ringer fantasy football at gmail.com. And please tell us what Russell Wilson's new catchphrase should be. Or other quarterbacks. I hope Russ thought of it. I hope that he was in the Zoom call with Wyden and Kennedy or whatever ad firm he has working for them. And they gave him 100 options that are all really clever.

And he goes, what about let's ride? And they go, I guess. They all look at each other. Shit. Speaking of Russell Wilson, I don't want to just spend this entire time just making fun of them. Are you guys buying or selling the whole Russell Wilson and Denver thing? Do you think this is huge for all the Denver skill players? Do you think Russell is going to cook?

Do you think he's going to get to throw a lot more? Or do you think it's kind of just somewhat similar to what we saw in Seattle in terms of what he's able to do offensively, like production numbers, all that stuff? Well, I want to know what you think. You watched Russell Wilson closer than we did for the last 12 years. years. I want to know, obviously he's going to throw more. Like the Seahawks literally passed less than any team in the NFL except for the Ravens since Russell Wilson came in the league. So like they're going to throw more. I feel like they're going to throw a lot. My question to you is, is Russell Wilson able to like run, I don't know how else to say like a legit offense?

That sounds terrible, but he's not been good at throw in the middle of the field because he's kind of short. And so I'm asking you, do you think Russell Wilson can like run one of these like elite high-octane offenses that keep up with Mahomes and the chiefs and like Herbert and the chargers and we'll see about the Raiders. But like, is he that good when he's been like the worst at hitting the middle of the field for like five years? That is the question because I think you eliminate a lot of the playbook and, you know, a lot of like what you're able to do early downs in the dink and dunk area. Like obviously he's one of the greatest like deep passers in the NFL. And that all ties together with like a play action, throwing

deep, throwing down the sideline, all that stuff works great. But in the times with the Seahawks that they've asked him to try and be really like a quick hitting, like hit your back foot, get the ball out, get it over the middle of the field, all that stuff, distribute the football. It's been a pretty hit or miss. And so I think that is the question. This is going to be a major storyline this year and it's going to be really fun to watch. I do think I agree with you, though.

I think stylistically he's going to be similar. But I think the volume is going to be better for him in Denver. But this is what I don't understand is the Jerry Judy Love. Now, as a player, I love Jerry Judy. I love Jerry Judy so much, probably more so than other people, even though he's relatively disappointed in his first season. But I kind of look, and everyone's kind of assuming Jerry Judy's going to explode. And I just feel like because Jerry Judy, obviously, he does all the steps.

He probably has four times more steps than he should going into a route. But I think he's an excellent route runner. And he's just good at getting up. But it seems like Jerry Judy is like a technical route runner kind of guy who's going to beat with footwork. But that's like a timing-based offense. And it seems like Russell Wilson's always been like backyard recess. And that just seems more suited to Cortland Sutton. Yeah.

And yet people aren't in on Cortland Sutton this year. It seems people, I don't know. What do you think? You watched Russell for 12 years. Like, why would Jerry Judy be better suited to Russell Wilson than Cortland Sutton would be? So I think you're asking the wrong question. Well, I think the question is in the riddle that we have to find out as fantasy analysts is like who's going to be the number one, who's going to be the top guy in this in this rotation in this receiving group. I do think there's a strong chance

Cortland Sutton is like the number one guy and he's the most underrated right now. However, when you're going from Drew Locke or whatever they've had Bridgewater over the years to a guy like Wilson, the accuracy is like way better. I think Russell, like Judy's floor is going to be so much higher.

The quarterback, the whole offense is going to be such a higher floor with Russell Wilson than with any of the quarterbacks they've had over the last few years. So I think that's kind of like, that's the nuance you have to talk about. I do think it's going to be. be very difficult to figure out, like, who, quote-unquote, like, fits best with Russell Wilson. You could make the argument KJ Hamler is, like, the best fit for Russell Wilson because he's like...

Because he's like... Tyler Lockett. Yeah. Yeah. But at the end of the day, it sounds like, based on all the reports, and if we're bringing show and tell, like, everything I've seen over the last month, month and a half is that Corton Sutton's just lighting it up. And he's going to be, like, Russell Wilson's favorite target. Tim Patrick is still in there, getting involved. You've got Albert O. You've got Greg Dulcich.

There's just a lot of guys in this offense, not to mention Javonte Williams and Melvin Gordon. So, you know, from the fantasy point of view, I think the floor of this offense is like way higher, but it's going to be tough like week in and week out. I could see this being sort of like a Seahawks situation where you have like Lockett go off one game, DK go off the next game, Lockett go off, and then you could have in this scenario it's like Judy Sutton, Judy, maybe Tim Patrick has a big game, maybe KJ Hamler catches two touchdowns, whatever. So it could be frustrating.

If anything, it feels like the person to draft out of this offense, other than the running backs, I guess, is probably just Russ. I mean, we've talked about it in the past few years with this show. Russ is extremely consistent. There's been like one season where he hasn't finished as like a top 11 quarterback or something. And this is maybe the best, you know, well-rounded supporting cast he's ever had just in terms of like the amount of quality players around him. So I think I'm kind of, I've been off of Russ recently. And I think there's like the Russ fatigue in fantasy football. but I might have to kind of trick myself to get over that hurdle

because this actually might be the best Russ we've seen in like the past two, three, four years. I agree. I think Russ is, if you're not going to draft a quarterback early, like there's the Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson, Kyler, like, there's suddenly it's interesting to pay a premium price for quarterback, but you're not going to do it. Russ is the guy that stands ahead and shoulders above everyone in terms of upside.

I mean, it's the quarterback so deep this year. I mean, Aaron Rogers is the back-to-back MVP, and like we have him like 11th among quarterbacks, I think. He lost Devante Adams, but like the back-to-back reigning MVP is not in the top. He's not a starting quarterback. According to us and most places, if you're in a 10-team league. Yeah.

It's pretty nuts. So you're going to wait on someone that's Russ. There's a clear tier break between like the quote-unquote running quarterbacks and the rest of the quarterbacks. And Russell could end up being sort of the high end of the rest of that group because he's not really a runner anymore. You know, he's not going to run much. And I think Dak Prescott is on that borderline, too. is he going to run more? Is he going to get 30, 40 yards rushing a game?

Probably not. Maybe, who knows? Like, maybe he'll just get a bunch of rushing touchdowns to, like, kind of buoy himself there. But, yeah, I think Wilson has a chance to kind of get back to, like, the classic vintage Wilson where he's, like, throwing three touchdowns game, you know, and maybe it's not the volume that you want, but he's going to have more volume than I I think he has with the Seahawks or has had with Seahawks.

All right. Well, let's ride on Russ. I have another Broncos, related thing. Thank you, Don Trayford. I have a genuine discovery. This has not been discussed. I don't think anywhere. No one's picked this. I don't know what's coming here. So, as you know, the Broncos team was purchased over the summer for four and a half billion dollars or so. And everyone heard probably that they were bought by the Walmart family, which is the Walton family. But if you saw the headlines, you read the stories, you know, it wasn't the Walton.

family that bought the Broncos. It was the Walton Penner group. And so I was looking at the story. I was like, who is Penner? Who is the Penner family? And so I looked into it. I got curious. And so here's the deal. So Rob Walton is the Walmart air. He's 77 years old. He's worth like $70 billion, which is nice work if you can get. He bought the Broncos with his daughter and his daughter's husband. Daughter's husband is Greg Penner. He's the chairman of Walmart now, the son-in-law. So hence the Walton-Pennar group. So it seems like it's possible that of what, you know, not so long in the future, Rob Walton hands the team over to his daughter and her son and her husband. And so Penner, Greg Penner is the owner of the Broncos. So I'm on

Greg Penner's Wikipedia page. And the last sentence of Greg Penner's, who again might be the controlling owner of the Broncos within 10 years. And the last line of his Wikipedia pages, and I quote, Penner is the son of two sex therapists. What? I said the same thing. They've also written many books, including the gift of sex, a guide to sexual fulfillment, the gift of sexual pleasure for women. And I say none of this to judge.

They clearly know a lot about family. They look very happy in their photo. And their son is the chairman of Walmart. So he's doing okay. They clearly know things. What I'm interested in is the real life meet the fuckers, which is can you imagine? Rob Walton, $70 billion man,

meeting the parents of his daughter, like his daughter is going to marry this guy, and he's meeting his in-laws. $70 billion guy, Walmart Air, and he meets them, and they're two sex therapists. What are they talking about at dinner? I thought when you first said this,

I thought you said sex terrorists. So the story took a turn for me. I did look it up, and I was like, oh, therapists. Okay. Did you Google sex terrorist? I was like, what's a sex terrorist? I don't know if that's ever been said before. Wow, that's an interesting term. I literally, that's why I reacted like that. I was like, what? I don't even know what that is. I'm not Googling that. I made the mistake. I'm not, I'm not Googling that. I don't want to know what comes up.

I like the idea of those family dynamics, though. That sounds fun. I've done the impossible and rendered Craig speechless. I don't know. I'm trying to think of what that dinner is like. Are they talking about, uh, so what do you do? The sex life of their children? Like, how does that work? Well, that's what's funny, is if you kind of try to line up the timing of when they got married, they wrote a book that's like the guide for sexual fulfillment for newlyweds in 1994, which kind of could be like right when they got married. And I'm like, did they write that book for their son?

Oh, boy, it's like that show Sex Ed. Has he read the book? Oh, yeah. I watched that too. That was pretty funny. Anyway, okay. You guys want to do some emails? Sure.

Let's do it. Okay. It's from John. John. John. J-O-N. Not J-O-H-N. Important. I'm part of a fantasy league

with an old co-worker, his brother-in-law, and their friends. I'm clearly the odd man out of this league. I only know one person. The brother-in-law asked me if I could be

the treasurer for this year. And I said, sure. Here's where it gets tricky. I'd assume that we would pay before you draft, but I was wrong. I proposed this last in the group text and was met with deafening silence.

So I texted my buddy who responded that, quote, pay before you draft, wasn't popular in this group, quote, everyone's friends, and quote, he said, and it would, quote, would screw people over if they don't pay and therefore can't draft, end quote. Moreover, we're switching to a dynasty format this year so the consequences of having someone missed the draft as long-term implications. Do you have any advice on how to manage fantasy payments? Does the calculus change when we're talking about context? Everyone in the league is 30 years older or older. The payment is less than $50. My two cents. My two cents is in the age of Vendos.

They got to move some money around. I mean, look, I actually, so I can kind of understand, like, if you're lax about the whole draft rule. Generally speaking, though, you need to pay before the season starts. Like, right? I don't really care so much about getting all the payments in before the draft. I don't, but especially if it's a group of friends and people generally trust each other and know each other. The draft rule is, is in a lot of my leagues, it's not like. necessary. We'll pay before the season starts

100%, but where you start really getting into trouble, in my opinion, is once the game start, once the records start happening, like, you're in last place and then you can't get that guy to pay. Like, that's where you start getting into trouble, right? Imagine explaining this to Tommy fam that people didn't pay out.

He'd be at your door. I actually think it gets weird because he doesn't know these people, so I think like trying to set up a punishment system of like, well, you're going to lose your first round pick if you didn't pay me the $40 or whatever it is. I actually think that's kind of weird. So I kind of think you just live with it. If it's less than 50 bucks, just it'll be fine. If these guys are all in their 30s and have jobs, like I'm assuming it shouldn't be an issue

to charge them $40 at the end of the season. So I think you just kind of have to deal with it. I completely agree. I think that not knowing people's big. Yeah, they have a leaving treasurer, but they're not collecting early as hilarious. They're basically making this guy the repo, man. Like if they If they don't pay, you have to go, like, steal something worth $40 from my house and stuff. When I heard treasure, I was like, oh, this is big money league. Like, you don't need a treasure if it's like $35. I think that he personally, John can't, I don't think John should do anything because he doesn't know these people.

And it being not that much money actually makes it, I think, less important to collect. And if they have all been in the league and they've been doing it, like, clearly it's going fine. Yeah. If there's been no issues in the past. And if there's a problem, yeah, it's not your problem, honestly. made you treasure, but you don't know these people. And you're like, I wanted to collect.

No one wanted to. Like, I think you're kind of blameless. But if you know your friends, then you harass them and make fun of them for not paying you $40 or whatever. I would say if you're in a league that you don't know a lot of people, though, like, you should be pretty strict about payment before the season starts, right? If you're coming into an established league that's different than like if you're in a league and other people have brought people into your league and you don't know them, that's different. Yeah.

It just seems it seems rife with problems. But, uh, yeah. well there you have it john pay money up front if these guys don't pay $35 at the end of the season then you don't want to be in that league yeah that's a good thing as you can go get first it was 40 now it's 35 these guys don't want to pay 10 bucks it's 10 dollars it's a sandwich chapulte bowl okay all right that's all right that's all we got we're coming to every tuesday and thursday check out fantasyfutball dot the ringer dot com i'm also doing the westworld podcast again if you the people out here remember from the westworld podcast it's on the prestige tv feed so go

check that out. When does it show air? Sunday, Sunday, June 26th. What season are we in here? Three? Four. Four? I know. Isn't that crazy? Oh my God. I forgot there was a third. Did I watch that? Yeah, me too. Well, it launched March 15th of 2020. So like, you know, I think I've just iced it for my brain. Oh my God. I actually didn't watch it. Yeah. Well, I mean, there was a lot going on. Hafeits, who is the main actor in the show? Evan Rachel Wood, right? Evan Rachel Wood, who is, if you, we could go for three more hours if you wanted me to explain the show. Tannie, you're still in it?

Yes. Tandy, yeah, she updated her name, actually. Is Anthony Hopkins? No, he died, right? Hopkins died, and then he came back as a... Spoilers. Computerized version and then is gone now. Westworld sucks, dude. Westworlds. I know, I know, I know.

I know. I know. I know. It's just fucking... And yet, I want to watch. It's like the Sammy Watkins of TV shows. It's like I should quit. but here I am. I'm like, oh, he's on the Packers with Aaron Rogers. It's like when like a piece

of new technology came out, but it's like the first generation of it. It seemed cool. And then you're like, Grandpa, look, an Apple watch. And then he like puts it on. And he's like, I don't know how any of this works.

And you're like, yeah, that's kind of what Westworld was. Like, I respect it. They try, but it's just way too much going on. I'm intrigued. I'm not going to lie. I kind of want to watch the show just so I can listen to Hyphitz's,

aren't they like out in the world now? Isn't like Evan Rachel Wood like running around like the city? trying to get a job set up a 401k? Like, what's going on nowadays? Dude, the trailer, I have to say, the trailer is ludicrous. The trailer was like,

she's been playing a character named Dolores for three seasons and... Two hours later. Thought you had screeners. I do, but I haven't watched them yet. Flex. Anyway, if you have any thoughts. Did I thank people yet?

No, I plug. I did the shameless plugs. All right, thank you, D.K., thank you, Craig. Thank you to Westworld. I think. Yeah. Thank you, Zach Wilson for the showers.

Thank you to Mac Jones. Russ. Thank you, Russ. Yeah, thank you, Russ. Yeah. Thank you, Lauren. Thank you the weekend. Oh, let's ride.

D.K.'s. Is that a weekend song? Sounds like one. Yeah. I can tell D.K.'s rusty because he just said the weekend instead of an actual band. He listens. I'm pretty sure I've probably already used that one before. Twice, actually.

That one guy, Tyson, I think, sent us that list of all the names. He's going to be mad. I just don't know what to do with you guys. It can't fucking please you. I say something you've never heard of and then you stare at me blankly. Bullshit. We love when you stump us with the game. It's a joy.

Absolutely joy when you stump us. I don't like seeing the look of confusion on Craig's face. Are we going to keep the Westworld stuff? That was a while. I don't know. We'll see. We end up that way. You should cut it and you should insert the SpongeBob like,

four hours later. And then you just cut all the conversations go back to back. You know what? I'm actually going to do that. So that's in there now. All right. Goodbye, everybody.