The Ringer NFL Show - Power Ranking the Stars You Should Bench (But Probably Won’t)

Episode Date: November 30, 2022

We power rank the most frustrating star players in fantasy football and discuss whether you should start them as we near the final stretch of the fantasy season. We finish the show by reading a few listener emails. Check out our Weekly Fantasy Football Rankings for positional rankings and more! Email us! [e-mail]. Hosts: Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck Producer: Craig Horlbeck Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

An Instagram post gets an unexpected boost. A TikTok catches in the algorithm. Sometimes that's all it takes to launch someone into internet fame. But then what? This blew up is a new podcast documentary that reveals how social media stardom is made. It's a different kind of fame. That's not always as glamorous as it looks. From Spotify and the Ringer Podcast Network, I'm Alyssa Beresneck.

You can listen to This Blue Up on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. To the Ringer Fantasy Football Show, my name is Danny Hyfitz. I am joined by Danny Kelly and Craig Korobach. And today it is power hour. We are power-ranking something every Wednesday. We're going to power-rank all the stars that are keeping us up at night. Stars that will keep us stargazing, if you will. But first, I'm going to shout out Craig because Esquire power ranks, their best podcast of 2022.

And we did not make it. But Craig's podcast that he does with MathBelty, the town was number one. Yeah, go check it out. Numero uno, the first one. Congratulations, Craig, on being a traitor to us. Top Dog. I'd like to thank in my acceptance speech, Will Smith, Tom Cruise, and Bob Iger, who have, without them, none of this would be possible.

So you're just like Will Ferrell and Talladega, you're like, helping Tom Cruise. Quite literally. Yeah, no, it's literally number one. That's really cool. That is very cool. We're going to power rank, this is not as, we could just power rank podcast that Craig is on. Number one is the town. Number two is rewatchables.

Number three. Number three is the times that he fills in for the Bill Simmons podcast. Hotest take is four. Maybe we round out the top five. I don't know. We're going to power rank

the players that are, like your starters, like your stars, they just don't know what to do with. They keep you up at night. You're worried. Don't know what to do with these freaking guys. They're starters by name brand,

but perhaps not in value right now. Yeah. If you kind of covered up the name and you just looked at the numbers, you'd be like, oh, probably should bench this person. Yeah. But you can't. It's kind of actually like the problem that Packers have with Aaron Rogers, if you were. But we won't get into that.

He's going to play apparently, which is wildly disappointing. Well, that's got up the theme. So we're going to just jump right into it. So D.K. Craig sent me a list that made my own list of just like, you know, handful of players who are just immensely frustrating and or you don't know what to do with. I rank them so if you don't like the order, just yell at me. I'm sure Dekin Craig Lee Lelt means the show goes on. And I'm just going to start one, two, and three.

I'm lumping them all together because you two both sent me like the entire Bucks roster. Like Craig, Tom Brady, basically everyone except Chris Godwin of the Bucks. So start the time. We love Chris Godwin. Let me clear. No, yeah, Chris Godman's fine. I can give this four minutes for all we want because Leonard, Furnett, Tom Brady, and Mike Evans. So we could just start with Tom Brady who Craig has been like you are whatever the opposite of him uses for the entire season.

So did you know that Tom Brady has one 20-point fantasy performance this year? That's less than Matt Ryan, Andy Dalton, and Carson Wentz. Wow. It's the same as Russell Wilson, Joe Flacco, and Zach Wilson. Brady's just kind of in that category in terms of sealing, weekly ceiling. The man is just 180 yards in a touchdown every week. And I'm at the point now. Obviously, listen, if you're in a two-quarterback league, not much you can do.

You're going to have to start Tom Brady. If you're in a one-quarterback league, though, and let's say you had to pick up a backup option when Brady was on by. Maybe you added Gino Smith, Derek Carr, Jimmy G, Daniel Jones. Craig, I did this. I have Brady in a one-quarterback league,

and I finally just lowered myself to Jimmy G. I went to Jimmy G. And I'm, like, sticking with it. So we have two weeks left of the fantasy regular season for most people in their leagues, and then the playoffs begin. Brady's next four weeks, he plays the Saints next week,

which he probably plays worse against than any other team in the league. Then they go and play the Niners. Then they're playing the Bengals. And then they finish out easy, I guess Cardinals Panthers. But my question is, is if you are a guy with Derek Carr

or Gno Smith or Daniel Jones or Jimmy G on your bench and you have Brady, are you kind of just playing the matchup game at this point? Is it like starting a defense or you just start the quarterback against the easier defense?

Is that where we're at with Brady? Yes. Not only is it yes. I think that that's actually the easy way out. like Gino, Daniel Jones, Derek Carr. I like, I mean, if you, if you, those guys are around, that's easy. I think the harder question is like, you know, even Trevor Lawrence against the lines this week, easy. It's like, okay, if those guys are gone, would you still stream, like, would you stream Jared Gough?

Who also has more 20-point games than Tom Brady this year? Man. It's kind of where we're at. But I think Brady's tough. And the other one, honestly, Leonard Frenette is also feels impossible. Very. Because he has this hip pointer injury. I'm not going to lie, it almost is easier if he's just out.

And you could just like, you know, if he was shot White and play someone else. It's 100% easier. Yeah. If Leonard Fredet plays, we'll see. So we're courting this Tuesday. We'll see what the deal is. Maybe he practices in full on Wednesday's that a big deal. But he didn't like when you get ruled out kind of like as quickly as he was, like he was doubtful coming out of Friday.

Like it didn't seem like there was ever really a chance he was going to play. If he is like limited Wednesday and Thursday, what do you do with him? He hasn't been great when he's been fully healthy. Now he's got like, also, I don't even know what a hit pointer is, to be clear. I don't either. Yeah, it really muddies the water of like what to expect and what kind of rotation to expect. So basically going back to before he was hurt, it was almost turning into a 50-50 split. The last four games, I looked at the numbers.

Fournett has a 54% snap rate, Rashad White, 43. Carries are exactly equal, 40 each. Fournett had the slight advantage in terms of like targets and catches, more routes. and in points for an average 10.3 PPR and White 7.1. So this is before the injury. Now he's hurt. He's probably, like Hafeitz said, probably going to be limited or maybe not even practicing and just like saving him for the game.

It sounds like based on what I've read that his injury can't really get worse if he plays, so they are probably going to throw him out there. Again, I love that. I love that assessment. They said that about James Winston's back when they're like, well, he has four fractures in his back. Right. But it can't get worse. As we have all learned, everything can get worse.

That's the whole motto. Yeah. So I'm worried. Like honestly, like, and I'm guessing a couple of people that are listening right now. I know I have both Fornett and White on a couple different teams. Like, what the fuck are we supposed to do with this guy? It's a conundrum. I think I've almost rather prefer White going forward just because he's younger and has more health.

But then again, Craig is in the back of my mind just going, no, they're going to trust the veteran. Brady's going to trust the old guy. Teams are stubborn, man. Teams do that. No matter, we always want the young electric guy who has more juice to come in and take over, but they always go back to the better. Especially in crunch time, it feels like that.

And in the passing game. I know Rashad White guy, he had nine catches last week, but Fournett is pretty much a zero on the ground game. I mean, up until the last few weeks, the bucks were dead last in rushing yards per game in the league. But Fornett has just used a lot in the passing game, and I still think that's super valuable. I still think you probably have to start Fournette.

Yeah, and he gets the goal line. The majority of the goal line looks, most of the third down, long down distance. So, yes, I think at the end of the day, I lean front of it. But yeah, it's just really tough. It's a mystery here. And it doesn't really help that Rashad White, like, hasn't really blown us away either in terms of like his efficiency or explosiveness.

So, yeah, this is just, to me, this is one of the toughest situations going into the final push here. So you don't have to play Brady. You probably should play fournett. You don't have to, but you probably should. And then Mike Evans is just. even more like for Nett where it's like you have to play Mike Evans you just hope that he plays better. You do. Do you guys want me to break it down though?

On Mike Evans? Do we want to spend time on Mike Evans? Yeah. Sure. Another two minutes on the clock. If you don't agree with the statement I just made that you have to play Mike Evans, then yes, I would like to hear what you have to say. Well, at the end of the day, I ultimately agree you probably don't have a better option

than playing Mike Evans. But Hyfitz, you were surprised that I put Mike Evans on this list. And here's the reason why. Like the last three games, Godwin has been just a rocket ship. going up. Like he's looking more healthy. He's looking more dynamic. They're using him more. He's getting more points, more targets, everything. And Evans has slowly tapered off. In the last three games, Godwin's averaging almost 20 points per game and PPR, Evans eight. I will say, in those games, particularly last week, Evans, actually no, really in the last three weeks, Evans has been overthrown

on like three, 50-yard walking touchdowns. True. True. And he's had a couple long balls like, he barely has one foot out of bounds. So it's been close. He mean, he had nine targets last week, six the week before that, 11 the week before that, you got to start Mike Evans. He just hasn't scored a touchdown. He's just like, if you actually, so if you look at there's like expected fantasy points basically based on how much they were targeted and where people were. It's with context. Mike Evans is most underperformed what he should have of any player in the last six weeks.

Like he's basically 30 points fewer than he should have. But to Craig, that's because he keeps being like five feet off on like all these deep balls. So the only thing worse than getting like 17 points for Mike Evans over the last like three or four weeks, would it be benching him and then I'm having 35. Yeah. Still annoying. And this is the players that worry about this week against Marshawn Lattimore, but yeah. Well, speaking of, yeah, so the bucks are playing, that's true.

The bucks are playing the Saints this week. That's concerning because Mike Evans could have 200 yards. He could also just, you know, get ejected. Speaking of the Saints, though, the other guy that is freaking me out, is Alvin Camara. Alvin Camara was like the word. pick in fantasy for like just the fun of September. He was great in October. He's been awful since then.

Like November, he's been unplayable. And his entire career, Camara was like he just scores a ton of touchdowns. This year, Alvin Camerra is more fumbles than touchdowns. Wow. Is that right?

Like he, he, yes, he's four fumbles, he's three touchdowns. He also, he fumbled the ball at the one yard line. He fumbled the ball on the first drive and their last drive.

And he basically lost, like, I don't know if it's fair to say he lost them the game. Like, they were shut out. And like, they would not have been shut out of Camaraded and a fumble. And, I mean, he had seven carries for 13 yards last week. I know they played the Niners.

That's the thing. Yeah, but keep going backwards. He had 42 yards week before that, 26 before that, 30 before that on the ground. I mean, the guy hasn't had more than 11 points since week eight. And I don't like that, again, they're getting shut out and they're not getting Camer the ball. But they just, I don't know, Tassim Hill is also lurking in these packages. And it's like the fact that they can't or even aren't even really trying. you get Camara the ball, and he also has, like, an injury he's dealing with this week.

And it's like, again, like Mike Evans, you have to play Alvin Camara. The difference being Mike Evans is still catching balls from Tom Brady. It looks good when you watch it. And you watch the Saints, and you're like, man, Camara. Like, this offense can't, the Saints offense is like impotent. Do you have to play Alvin Camara? They're playing the Bucks this week in Tampa. That's the thing, man.

And then it also is on by the week after that. I feel like you do have to play him. If you have like Miles Sanders, you're playing Miles Sanders over Alvin Camer. Yeah. Yes. Much better offense, much better offensive line, I suppose. Yeah. Yes, it's fallen that far.

Damn. I mean, I think I would play David Montgomery over freaking Miles, over Alvin Camara. Play running backs on good teams. That is always going to ring true. Like, are you playing Tony Pollard over Alvin Camara? Yeah. Probably. Yeah.

Yeah, definitely. So, yeah, Camara. Speaking of which, same problem, but honestly, even more frustrating. DeAndi Swift for the Lions. Yeah, this one is really tough. So D'Angre Swift, so he played in week one, he heard his ankle. Since then, since he heard his ankle, DeAndi Swift is just J.D. McKissick with better branding and a better name.

It's the same person. That sounds aggressive. I know. It's good. It's good. Deandre Swift has exactly five carries per game since he hurt his ankle. He gets five carries a game. He catches a few balls.

If you look at like J.D. McKissick for like a seven game stretch last, not even like the good when he was good, like three years ago. Jaden McKissick last season for seven-game stretch and DeAndre Swift's games this year, it's the same person. It's like five carries, few catches, two, like 40 total yards. That's it. I think he should have been second on this list after Brady. He might have even needed to be number one.

He is really keeping people up at night. I don't know what you do if you have DeAndre Swift and you're heading into the playoffs. You're playing the Jags this week. All these like sexy tantalizing matchups, but the dude gets like seven touches a game. Are you starting Rashad White over Swift? this week? Yeah. The only reason I didn't put DeAnda Swift number one was because I was worried you guys would say it was too easy. It's like you bench him because he's unplayable. Like, I was looking. I just want, so he gets, he gets about eight touches a game since week one.

And I looked, you know, the other people are getting more touches per game than DeAndre Swift. Cam Acres, who tried to quit football, Eno Benjamin, who was cut from the Cardinals. And then Aegee Dillon, who we decided was unplayable and put him in the burn book a month ago. Those guys, guys are getting the ball more than DeAndre Swift. Wow. He has such great name brand value. DeAndre Swift not only is one of the cooler names in the league, but the way he plays is so appealing and sexy that it's hard to sit him when you can envision like some highlight

reel S SportsCenter top 10, like 40-yard touchdown. Although that doesn't happen because he never gets the football. Tough to Deontra Swift. All right. Look at us respecting Tom Tom. Incredible. All right. Next up here, D.K., you had Dibo Samuel for the Niners. Yeah. Wow. So. I know. I was my reaction to, Craig.

Okay. D.K's coming in with my... Here's my reasoning. It's not that I think you actually should sit him. This is me being worried about this player relative to, like, their name power, their star power. You know what I mean? So like, this isn't me saying you should sit, Debo Samuel. This is me worrying he's not going to do enough to like get me through the playoffs.

And you know what I mean? So basically, I just hate the idea of relying on Shanahan offense in the playoffs. And the last four games since the 49ers traded for CMC. So this actually, and Debo missed one of the games. So these are the four games in which they've all played together. And in this timeline also overlaps with Debo having a hamstring injury. Right. And he's still going through this, by the way.

He's still suffer. Like he was, I think he left the game for a little while last week. There's still some like uncertainty whether he's going to play. To me, this is like worst case scenario because Debo Samuel, same deal. Sexy name. He went absolutely nuclear last year.

So it's like he's still riding on that. But this year he hasn't been nearly as good. In the last four games with everybody on the field together, you know, the superstar collection. the 49ers have. He's averaged four catches for 41 yards plus two and a half rushes for 16 yards. He scored one

touchdown in that stretch. That sounds like DeAndre Swift. It's like borderline very borderline usage. She's so good sometimes that you can like make up for that usage, that lack of like elite usage, but still like this to me is very worrisome. Ayuk has been much more consistent Kittal's still around.

Yeah, but now Eli Mitchell's out for six to eight weeks. Christian McCaffrey's banged up. Yeah. He'll get more goal. This is the danger. This is why we're talking ourselves into him. I'm just saying I'm worried. I'm just worried. If you have Debo, you're playing him.

I will say, though, if you have Debo, you both love Debo and won't get rid of him. And also, there has only been two games this season where if you have Debo, you're like, I'm so glad I took him in the second round. He's so worth it. Literally only two. Yeah, he pretty much is just like 12 points a game, which isn't, it's not enough to get you out of bed in the morning. If you cover up just everything, he's basic, his numbers are like Naji Harris.

Yeah. And to be clear, I didn't take this extra. exercises like I'm benching this guy. These are the players I'm worried about as we go into the stretch run here. And I just don't know. Like it just doesn't get me excited. And I'm worried that the injury is going to make everything worse. I didn't expect this, but you've kind of convinced me now looking.

No, I think it's fair. The reality is Diba has not been what people wanted. All right. Next one here. Craig, you have Mike Williams to the Chargers, who is your guy. This is strictly injury related. Yeah. What kind of practice reports do we need to see out of Mike Williams before you feel

good about starting him. Genuinely, real question. My serious answer is, I, with the, give the boring caveat that like it depends on your options, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I kind of can't imagine in like a 10 or even a 12 team league unless you're really injured riddled. I can't imagine playing Mike Williams without having seen him in a game before. I'd rather him, Mike Williams go off for 25 points on my bench than play him.

Because like, we just saw, not an ankle sprain, which is fine. He came back from a high ankle sprain too soon. And immediately re-hurt the high-encle sprain. And again, high-encle sprains are like career-altering injuries. Like Michael Thomas had a high-encle sprain. It's like we have never seen him again. Like Odell's career took it a completely different turn after high-encle sprain. Like this is like a changing it.

The fact that he came back too soon and got hurt again, I kind of don't know how you could play him unless you're basically like, well, it's him or like Josh Reynolds. Yeah. God, this is like, honestly, it's at the point where I'm almost just going for some rando off the wire over Mike Williams. That's like, like what I just said. I mean, I actually am having this issue in a league right now. And I'm like, God, I don't even know what to do with this guy. I think I need like back to back to back full participants in practice to think about it.

Yeah. Because I mean, Mike Williams is already a boomer bus guy when he's on the field. And the risk of him going down like he did in his first game back two weeks ago. and then immediately leaving after one target, it's just too risky at this point in the season. Like, if you have a Jacoby Myers or something, or juju sitting on the bench, you know what?

Maybe they're not going to get you 20, but they'll get you eight, and that eight points can go a long way when you're fighting to make a playoff spot. So I think I agree with you, Hyphitz. I think you kind of got to wait and let him play a game and see if he suffers any setbacks.

And if he doesn't, kind of like we did with Keenan Allen. Like Keenan Allen played kind of like in and out of a game. Yeah. you know, they took it easy with him. He did not suffer any setbacks, and now he's back. I think you have to do that with Mike Williams,

which is crazy. Yeah, if you have any option of any, like any confidence that you should take them with Michael Williams. And the worst thing happens is he goes off on your bench and he's back in your lineup. All right. I'm going to go out over here.

I had eight, nine, I'm going to switch this up since this is very similar to Mike Williams. The next guy I had, I had Gabe Davis for the Bills, who I think has actually replaced Mike Williams as the most boomer bust person in fantasy. And Mike, let's see if I can get this trajectory.

I feel like Mike Williams replaced Vincent Jackson who replaced Deshawn Jackson as like the people who could get you 35 points or two every week. And like I think Gabe Davis is the most Deshawn Jackson's player. They have nothing in common as a player. I think Gabe Davis is like 30, 40 pounds heavier than Sean Jackson. But like here's the problem with Gabe Dave. This is not even football analysis. He playing on Thursday two weeks in a row. And the problem is when he gets you like four or five points and you have to stare at that for like five days. You feel so stupid. You feel so dumb. Stupid. Stupid. It's like at least when it's on Sunday, you just, you know, you just ignore it, you know, compartmentalized. It's one of many mistakes that you made.

Yeah. It's like, yeah, you wake up Monday morning. I don't remember who won or lost. Five days of that. Conversely, the only thing worse is Gabe Dave having like 30 points on Thursday night football and he's on your bench. Yes. And you have to stare at that. That's even worse. And so he's playing the Patriots this week. This is a crucial week. This is such an important, like winning in for so many people. And yet, I feel like net, you probably do have to. You don't have to.

It depends on your options. But Gabe Davis is like the hardest person to leave on your bench because he is like the league tilt. He's like the weak tilting player. But it's also just terrifying when he gets the other four points and you feel dumb. You know what's annoying about boom bus players in general? They're already hard to start because you have no idea when they're going to go off. But even when they do go. go off, there's still a chance that it's on a week when you're already winning and it's kind of wasted

calories. So it's like the odds that you get Gabe Davis on a day where he actually goes off and it's the same day you happen to start him. And that happens to be the same week where you actually needed those points to win. It's like, what are the odds of that happening? I'm just looking at his game log right now. He has the, his, his pattern for scoring big points is big points, two games off, two games on, two games off, two games on. And now he's, he has one game off. Does that mean we sit him this week and then the next week we start him? Who knows?

I don't know. Yeah, this, I feel, I lean high fits even after saying all this that I'm definitely starting him just because I guess it depends to him like the type of team you have. If you are a underdog in a lineup, I'd probably start him just because he has that stealing potential. Has a single game inflated

kind of a random player's value more than that, that Chief's Bill's game did. Nobody also did it in the Steelers game. Three catches, 171, the two touchdowns. But that's kind of, bit. I mean, that's, he's had two good games in his last 18 games. He's like, he's like Deshawn Jackson. That's what Deshawn Jackson used to do. He's just like five inches and 40 pounds heavier than Deshawn Jackson. He was all projection, Dave. I mean, even if you

go in and look at his stats from 2021, like he wasn't doing that much. He was like a number two guy. Well, I think it's the Bill's offense also. It's just not as good. It's the Bill's offense. It's his role. It's his overall talent level. It all combines to make him very boomer bust, I think. Yeah. So good luck. everyone. Also, we just so disrespected Tom, Tom. We were doing so well. I'm sorry. Forgot about Tom, Tom. Next up here, DK, you're DJ Moore for the Panthers.

I feel like you were going to get mad at me for saying this one, but I got to. Why would I get mad at you for being mad at DJ Moore? It's like my whole thing. Here's the deal. DJ Moore with Sam Darnold is actually good. Is the argument a lot of people are going to convince themselves of. In 13 games with Sam Darnold at quarterback over the last few years, I looked at this. 14.1 PPR points per game,

29% target rate. He averages nine targets, five catches, 68 yards per game. In total, it's 13 games. He has 67 catches, 8991 yards,

four touchdowns. Sam Darnold feeds DJ Moore. That was a lot of numbers, but the ones I looked at was like that, and basically it was, he's literally 50% better with Sam Darnold

than he was all the other Panthers quarterbacks. D.K. Are you going to say, are you going to say, you're worried that they're going to bench Sam Donald? no here's the

the catch is that Sam Darnold fucking sucks and the and the Panthers suck and so it's like you're just I feel like they have the entire time that he's been doing all those numbers they've been bad the entirety of the process so why what matters

so it's like you just here's the deal I'm afraid this is this next game is going to be the one where it really fucks you over it's just how it goes because now it's like convinced people like me to put DG Moore back even though actually you shouldn't fall

for the siren song of last week Well, what's nice is like, the Panthers are unlikely to bench Sam Darnold because who are they going to bench him for? They've already seen the other two. No, I think D.J. Walker or Phil Walker, he's hurt anyway. No, you guys are on different pages here. Craig is saying that D.K.'s afraid of D.K.'s getting benched. D.K. is saying people will convince themselves that play D.J. Moore now because D. Donald's back, but then Darnold and Moore will both just suck this week.

They're going to implode. But I thought your whole thing was that D.J. Moore is good with Darnold. my whole thing is DJ Moore has been good with Darnold and that's gonna stop why I'm afraid because I don't want to trust Darnold during the fucking playoffs

that's why that's fair listen back to my motto play players with good quarterbacks or play players with bad quarterbacks sometimes like you just don't have a stack team like DJ Moore sitting there staring you in the face

I'd rather start Gabe Dave than DJ Moore because I have Josh Allen throwing the fucking football sure I actually agree I agree with that we talk of both sides of her mouth on this sometimes because on one hand, I actually kind of believe the thing

where the bad quarterback just kind of targets their first receiver more often. Yeah, that's fair. But you're not factoring in like the occurrences where the Panthers put up three points in a game and can't get the ball past midfield, despite him peppering DJ Moore. Like that happens on teams like that. Well, we're talking about all season

about the players where getting the ball, it feels like a miracle happened. Like Terry McLaurin with Wentz, it was like, it was miraculous. Donald actually just is like, fuck it DJ you're my guy he's down there somewhere yeah yeah but it doesn't feel like a miracle when you watch darnald throw to more you're like oh yeah this is the only thing he does cool darnold made some fucking sick throws in this game dude he had a touchdown to DJ

that was a thread yeah i'm like trying really hard not to like overreact to this all the backup quarterbacks were like the guys that you saw again from thanksgiving from high school i have to say don't know's the person who you're like wow i don't remember that they were that Darnold is going to get traded. Someone's going to trade for Darnold again. Darnold, you're like, damn, she was cuter than I remember. Speaking of which, how old is Sam Darnold? Darnold is 25?

He's like younger than fucking Kenny Pickett, probably. I was literally about to say that. No, Piquet's 24, I think. I know, but that's the point. Kenny Pickett is one year younger than Sam Darnold. Like, why are we done with Sam Darnold? Well, because we've seen Sam Darnold play 50 games. Because of a very long track record of being shitty.

I know. But I'm just saying when I say year, literally almost to the day. Kenny Pickett June 698, Sam Donald was born June 5th, 97. And I'm just saying perhaps Sam Donald was not in the best hands under like the Adam Gase regime. And I don't know. We'll see. This is, yeah.

This happens to like. The Adam Gase Matt rule. I kind of like would be down. He's going to get someone else fired. Just wait. The Texan should give Donald a shot. What else think of those? All right.

Next one here. Sorry Tom Tom. I apologize. Deontay Johnson for the Steelers, Craig, you had this. Yeah. He's essentially been turned into Robert Woods in this offense. He has the lowest yards per catch of his career. He essentially just catches balls in the corner of the field and falls down now. He's like a soccer player. Yeah, he has no touchdowns on the season. He has the most targets in the league for somebody not having a touchdown. Fourteenth most targets in the league. His yards after the catch are astoundingly low.

He is 14th in the league in targets. He has the 14th most targets in the league by any wide receiver. He has 121st in yards after the catch per game. He averages nine yards after a catch per game. He's in the Lockett tier of just falling down after you get the... Yeah, but Lockett catches the ball 25 yards down the field and then falls down. That's true. Deonti Johnson catches it seven yards, a little seven yard out, and then he collapses.

He is literally worse than Mac Collins this year on a per game basis. Still not picking up. Still won't pick up Matt Collins. I like Deonti as a by-low at the trade deadline because I just, again, I feel like the people who have Deonti Johnson are sick of him and ready to give him away for nothing. But the fact that he still doesn't have a touchdown, he's probably going to set the record this year if he doesn't score. He did drop a touchdown against the Colton.

That's the thing, right? Yeah. He scored like four almost touchdowns this year. Can you imagine? Again, it's one of those you've been playing Deion. for a lot of the air, you bench him, and then he scores his touchdown. I mean, he still leads the team in targets per game. Yeah, at least league, basically.

Almost. It's much more evenly distributed, though, I will say. Trubisky targeted him a lot more. Now it's basically like the three-headed trio of Pickens and Deontay and Friarmouth. They're all kind of seeing the same amount of looks. And like I've been saying, the Steelers' schedule has gotten easier. They've won two of three. The next four games are not scary.

I think Deonté, I guess, is still a flex play. but I don't know. Like, if it's him or Gabe Dave, let's say. Gabe Dave has the 30-point ceiling. That's a possibility. Deonte doesn't have that. They're exactly opposite players. Yes.

Gabe Davis defies the bell curve. Deante Johnson's only the middle. I will say, sorry, Tom, Tom. So Deonti on the season, 10th in targets, all players. Yards per target, he was 129th. Do you know he's tied with in yards per target? Five and a half. Ben Scoronic.

Yeah, sure. For the Rams Ben Skoronic. Anyway. Last one here, I want to do a little bonus. Adam Thielen for the Vikings. I thought this was a good one, Greg. Just frustrating. Yeah, I mean, Adam Thielen, his whole thing, his whole bit has been touchdowns, like his

whole career. His career is a bit. Do your thing. Dance, Monkey. He has three touchdowns this year. Adam Thielan hasn't had a thousand yards since 2018. He has not been a yards guy for a long time. And his whole thing has been getting touchdowns.

He's averaged 10 touchdowns a year. He's got three this year. And he's kind of just like a Donovan People's Jones now. He's just like the number two that you hope gets lucky. And they double up on the number one. And Adam Dillon has a good day. But what he used to give you is no longer there. And I think people still think he has that. And the Vikings are nine and two. But as we've known and as we've talked about, they're fraudulent. They have a really easy schedule for the next four games. But Adam Phelan, he gives me no. confidence anymore. I think that they're playing the Jets this week, which is tough, and then the Lions, the first week of the fantasy playoffs. So if you have managed to make it.

Colts, so it's like not, you know, it's not bad. But I don't know what you have to feel good about with Adam Dillon. He's a 32-year-old player who can't move and can't catch touchdowns anymore. What happened to Craig two weeks ago is like, I don't want to know anyone's age. Well, no, age only for superstars. Like Randy Moss was 30 when he had the 23 touchdown season. That blew my mind. I would have said he was 27. If you're not that good and you're like not that athletically impressive, 32 years old is pretty old. There's a big difference between

when Justin Jefferson is 32 versus Adam Thielan at 32. Correct. Oh yeah, that's actually really good. Yeah, I agree with that. See, that's why Craig was on the number one podcast of the year that was not this. That's why.

Travis Kelsey, though, I don't know. He's going to be 34 next year. We'll see. Getting up there. We're getting, we should actually get tattoos that's like that, Travis Kelsey. Yeah, we should. All right.

that's power hour. I want to get to a couple emails, starting with the most important topic of all, which is hope. Oh. We got an email from Alan who said long time listener, first time emailer, while D.K.

was bitching on this Sunday show, but the Seahawks being good and getting a top five pick because of Russell Wilson's demise. And Craig said, while D.K's complaining that there's somewhere, there's a lion's fan

on a walk right now cursing D.K. out. I am that lion's fan. It must be nice to have such ailments of a playoff run while also getting in top pick, D.K. When your team goes to own 16, I'll listen. He said PS, DK is completely right about hope. It's the most infuriating thing in the NFL.

What's funny about all of this is you could make the case that the Seahawks are having the most satisfying year of any team in the NFL this year. I thought about it a lot after I went down. I feel that I was reacting in the moment to them losing a frustrating game to the Raiders, a walk-off 86-yard run in overtime. I'm going to walk it back a little bit. I'm going to check my privilege. I probably shouldn't have been bitching in that exact moment.

Hope is not the worst thing. Well, you're right. Correct. Teams having the best year. Eagles, because the Eagles are doing the same thing. They're going to get the one scene in the N. They have the samest draft pick, which is insane.

Chiefs just because they're doing well. But then, like, honestly, if the Seahawks make the playoffs and get the top five pick. The CX are having a good year. I rescind what I said earlier. We had another lion's fan follow up. Opposite thoughts, same sentiment. Bernie says, D.K. is right about hope. I'm a Lions fan. It's awesome.

I never expect anything from them. The losses don't bother me because it's normal. Lack of hope allows me to be free of the ridiculousness that fandom requires and think about them rationally. It's Peter Lefleur. It feels phenomenal. It's literally the beginning of dodgeball. If you have a goal, you might not reach it.

But if you don't have one, then you're never disappointed. And I got to tell you, it feels phenomenal. Lower your standard. standards, folks. I think that's proof that I'm getting older is that that just rings more true to me. Starting to, yeah, starting to make sense. I'm younger. I'm like, oh, what an awful attitude. You know, there's like the expression, the older to get, the more you become a Republican, I don't know what the actual expression is, but is it like the more conservative you get or whatever? Yeah. Yeah. The more, the less goal oriented you get as you get older. Oh, I mean, listen,

when I was 20 years old, I was like, I'm going to be the next Paul Thomas Anderson. And now I'm like, man, I just want to be able to make money and go on the work. I just want to have my hell. Craig's like, I wanted the number one movie in America. Now he's like, yeah, sure, number one pod. Yeah, that's fine. Number one pie, that's fine. I got to tell you, it feels phenomenal.

We talked a lot about Cloyce this week. Names thing Clois. Did anybody know Clois? Box. For those of you who didn't listen, Clois Box, was one of the only players in NFL history to accumulate over 300 yards of total offense. And he has the best name of all time.

His name is Clois Box, twin brother, named Boyce Box. Boyce. Cloice and Boyce. It's a Boise. Cloice was born in 1923. His photo on Wikipedia is a drawing. Painting? They didn't have photography back then, apparently.

Yes. It's my favorite part of all of this. It's a drawing. There's no photo of him. So we got an email from Tim. Tim. Tim. You said, I was hoping you were going to say,

so we got an email from Cloyce. No, we got an email from Cloyce, I wish. Well, we just asked, can anyone email us if you know a Cloyce? There's no, there are no Cloises in the world who use emails. Well, he said, there's an older gentleman named Cloyce who posts historical facts about my hometown on a Facebook group I joined many years ago. I've never met him, but this is exactly what I imagine a man named Cloice to be doing with his free time. Also, I have twins and I am pissed.

I did not name my twins, boys and cloice. Seriously. Missed opportunity. Maybe that just still is Cloice posting those facts on Facebook. Is he still alive? Could be. Does Cloyce have children? I didn't look that up.

Is there a Cloyce Jr.? Cloyce was virile. Of course he has children. You love that word. Dude, I found out his wife's name is Fern. Come on. Wait, Cloyce and Fernbox? Her name is Fernbox.

Her name is Fernbox. Bors. Shut the fuck up. Oh, dear God. He has four children. Don, Gary, Thomas, and Doug. So he has Don box. Don box, Tom Box, Doug Box, and Gary Box.

Which ones is the best there? Doug Box. I like Don Box. Craig, I just did like a goose honk laugh. That's like when you know it's bad. Don Box, private investigator. Gary Box. Oh, God.

Holy shit. It sounds like seriously a name from arrested development. Like, Fern Box. Blah, blah, blah. Like, what is her name? Ann, Ville, like the backup name was Fern Box for Ann Beale. And they were like, no, no, no, we can't do that. That's two out there.

Oh, my God. Please email us if you, uh, if you know, we should get someone named Cloyce on the pod. There are no Cloys left. Maybe we can get Don Box on the pod. Oh, my God. I don't know if Don Box is alive. Oh, that would be a problem. I mean, Cloyce was born in 23.

He probably had Don in the 40s. Among the, we did a bunch of trivia on Monday. And I, man, we got a lot of, got a question about the government cheese stockpile. And this was such a wormhole. Basically, it's like the government keeps a bunch of cheese, and we couldn't figure out why. The government horrid cheese in case of famine or something?

What are we doing? I don't know. So we were like, oh, we'll just Google ovens cheese. Meanwhile, this is so complicated, the government keeping the cheese. So I try to look into this. and thank you to people for tweeting and emailing me. So basically, I'll just try to read, this is from Modern Farmer. Great.

So it all starts with milk. The price of milk. Wow, we're going back to the beginning, aren't we? Yeah, no shit, man. The price of milk has always been volatile jumping up and down based on limited supply and fluctuating demand. It doesn't help that milk production rises in the spring calving season, but demand for milk is generally at its highs in the fall when the school year. begins. To help the government look for ways to step in and calm the market, but milk is a short shelf life, couldn't do much with the actual liquid product, so the government turned to

cheese. And in 1949, the USDA introduced the dairy product price support program, later known as the milk price support program. And when the price of dairy products sunk too low for farmers, the USDA would offer to buy up the excess dairy. Long story short, they're like, we'll just buy it. But when the government sets a price ceiling for dairy, dairy, They also set like a price floor. There was a ceiling. Blah, blah, blah. The government was like,

we're sick of buying all this milk. But they never stopped, really. They sent a bill in 2014 to like change the process. But basically, they keep buying the cheese. They still do this. It's been like 70 years. That's still a problem,

the issue of price fluctuation with cheese in the spring and the fall. So I kept reading this article. I'm not going to lie. I've read so much on this issue. Wait, what did he say? D.K's like, I eat cheese every day. Well aware.

Craig and I are the problem because we're not eating cheese cassidias every day. Yeah, that's right. DK. DK., do you work for the government? You might. This just makes me think like there are so many fucking problems in the world. Just think about the amount of problems. I can't believe the government stepped in because of a cheese pricing issue.

It's just a million fucking things to figure out in this world. The prices of cheese getting out of control. God. It's just overwhelming. This incredible book by Michael Lewis called The Fifth Risk, which is just about all the problems the government solves. Was there a cheese chapter? I wish there was a cheese chapter.

But there was this crazy thing. He's like when we built the atomic bombs on the West Coast and they just dumped all the nuclear sludge into these giant like containers. and they just buried them underground and they used the wrong kind of steel so they're all leaking this nuclear sludge and it's created like this giant underground

nuclear sludge glacier that's like heading to like the Columbia River which is a water table for three million people people's job is just to like you know stop the glacier yeah really cool and then another guy's job is to figure out how to buy cheese at an affordable rate

I forgot the craziest part they keep them in caves in Springfield Missouri the cheese is in a caves Yeah because it's cold Yeah And whatnot Astute

It's like the cheese cellar You know Anyway So is it still So they still buy the cheese every spring Dude I'm not gonna lie I'm embarrassed to how much I've read about this And I still don't get it

I really tried to like understand this I get the concept of them step in, I don't understand how it's still a thing. Or it's made, it's really enlightened me on how little I understand about the economy. The issues, the issues with cheese is this just not something I want to carry on my shoulders? I don't want to talk about this anymore. This is like, how do people sleep? You know, there's just too many things in the world to worry about the cheese.

Homelessness fucking. Nuclear glaciers heading towards the Columbia River. By the way, I live near the Columbia River. So that's great. Thanks for that. I also can't stress enough how difficult it's been for me. to figure out who owns this cheese? Because there's a one and a half billion pounds of it.

300 million of it belongs to the USDA, but it's like, are they holding it? Is it basically like, you're like, oh, mom, that's not my weed. I'm holding it for a friend, but it's like they're holding it for like craft? Is this why you push the podcast back an hour? What kind of cheese is it, do we think?

What's the most abundant type of cheese? American. By definition, it's American cheese. It's probably cheddar. It's probably cheddar. Because American cheese like isn't even cheese. Right. American cheese is like plastic

or not cheese or not cheese. It's a good note if you buy something that isn't called what it is it's probably just legally not allowed to call it that thing just a good rule of thumb. Right. Anyway. I never, I've never knew that.

Craft singles. They're not legally allowed to call a cheese. Oh, can I blow your mind again? Well, the label says pasteurized prepared cheese product. Yeah, it's a cheese product. Can't call it cheese. It's not cheese. That's like when, that's like,

That's like when Subway had that issue where the sugar content in the bread was so high that they couldn't actually call it bread. It was a fucking patient. In Ireland, it was cake. I also can I give you, can I blow your mind? Do you, do you guys use dove soap like the bar? I mean, I have. You have? In my life.

Sure. The next time you're at a CVS or a supermarket, whatever, and you see them, see if you can find the word soap on the dove box of soap. What's the key ingredient in soap? Yeah. I don't know, but it's a beauty bar. But, like, I don't think they can, I don't, they, it's legally not even soap. It's not from the region in France soap. Well, I don't think it's like champagne.

How are they cutting corners? Like, what are they doing? I don't know. There's, I think there's like a legal threshold. All I know is that, like, the word soap is not on that soap bar. They call it a beauty bar. That makes me not want to use Dove now. I'm just saying.

I don't even know if it's soap, technically. Okay. In like 10 years, I'm going to be, like, living in a cabin on a mountain, making my own toothpaste. you I don't trust anything these days. Me and Shailene Woodley are going to be making our own soap and our toothpaste. Okay. Speaking of not trusting, I have a low-stakes conspiracy theory for you guys. Okay.

There's no way of football field 100 yards is the same as a golf 100 yards or like a soccer game. Like I was watching the soccer game and I see the goalie kicked. I'm like, there's no way that's 130 yards. You know what's funny about that is I, I, yesterday or today or whatever I was watching a soccer game and I was like, man, the soccer field seems so much bigger. than a football field. A football field is 100 yards long. A soccer field is only 136 yards long. But no, the end zones are 120.

So if it's because these end zones 10 yards. So the full football field's 120. It's very similar to the soccer field. Right. Which feels impossible to me. Is it way wider? It is much wider. It's 92 yards wide, which is essentially a football field and width and perhaps that

distorts your view of it. But I can't believe that they're only, like you said, I have it's 16 yards apart in length. That feels impossible. But I guess, but you ever, like, you know when you're like on at field level on a football field. You're like, oh, I could just hit a pitching wedge, end zone to end zone. Like, it doesn't feel that way.

Yeah. I think the lines on the field do a lot of work. A lot of heavy lifting, the lines. Makes you think it's longer than it is. I'm not crazy, though. You know what I mean, right? Like, the next time you're playing golf and you have 100-yard shot, you're like, oh, yeah, that's a football field.

No way. It doesn't feel that way at all. Yeah, like when you think of a 100-yard par three, that feels like a chip, not in a 100-yard kick return by Corderole Patterson. Yeah, honestly makes it less impressive. Anyway, thank you, D.K., thank you, Craig. Thank you for listening. Thank you.

Are we happy about the cheese storage or not? Thank you to cheese storage. It's nice to know it's there. Yeah. Thank you to the nameless, faceless government workers protecting America. We'll never want for cheese. I guess that's nice to know. Thank you, Lauren.

Lauren. I think he rancid. Was that cheese joke? No, it's a, it's a band. I was hoping you could figure out a cheese punned, cheese pun. Sorry, a cheese band. You're talking about rancid cheese, right? Was that not why you did that?

Somewhat related, yeah. Can you imagine just like walking around Springfield, Missouri and going to the caves and just finding like a billion pounds of cheese? What's up with this rancid band, D.K.? Ruby Soho check out the I mean I'm sure you've heard I'm not gonna lie we're at the point where every single time DK lists a band that we've never heard of

DK then says the title of the song like we are supposed to know it but then in you will if you Google it and listen to it I'm like 85% sure you've heard that song before yeah so just tell us like your lyrics because when we ask you name songs like I can't name songs

I just know what they sound like Ruby Ruby Ruby Ruby Soho yeah keep doing that and I'm listening now I don't think I know this. Go to the chorus. I don't. Man.

The alternative rock late 90s world is something I don't know a lot about. One of my buddies, I was talking to my friend the other day, he's about your guys' age, and he hadn't heard of Beastie Boys. I was like, that was like a mind fuck.

Is he living in the Cheese Cave? What's that guy doing? I feel like that's pretty surprising. He's never heard of the Beastie Boys? Yeah. Or maybe he had just never heard their their music. I can't remember, but still. Craig, when we're D.K.'s age, what's the thing

that someone would tell you they've never heard of that would hurt you most? GameCube? That? GameCube? What's that? I'm like, you don't know what GameCube is? Is that like a Rubik's Cube? What? Are you talking about you don't know what a GameCube is? What?

Revolutionized the gaming world. That was a joke, right, DK? Yeah, I had a GameCube. The best Super Smash Brothers. I don't know. That was just what came to mind. I had a, I remember being a senior in high school. school on the bus and like my bus home had like sixth graders too. It was like six through 12 and the sixth graders they had never

heard of Bugs Bunny or Looney Tunes. Oh my God. And I was the first time in my life I was like, what the fuck? These are Russian spies 100%. They've never heard of Bugs Bunny. They were just bored in like 2002. You know what it'll really bother me? High Fitz is if I'm like 52 and some 20 year old that's no idea what

SpongeBob is. Oh my God. It all comes back to it comes back to SpongeBob every fucking time. That's going to bother. It's going to bother me. That's going to bother me. Well, that's all we got. All right. Goodbye, everyone.