The Ringer NFL Show - Richardson Benched, Power Ranking Midseason Awards, and Fantasy Court With Second Gentleman Doug Emhoff

Episode Date: October 30, 2024

The guys react to the Colts deciding to bench Anthony Richardson for Joe Flacco, and the Ravens trading for wide receiver Diontae Johnson (1:41). Next, POWER HOUR! They hand out midseason awards, including the fantasy MVP (so far), the biggest bust, sleeper of the year, the Bonus Jonas, and much more (19:03). Later, they are joined by a very special guest, Second Gentleman Doug Emhoff, to talk about playing fantasy football in the pre-internet era, handing down Fantasy Court rulings, his decades-long Lakers fandom, and much more (51:55). Fantasy MVP (19:41) Waiver wire MVP (22:06) Biggest bust (26:07) Chaos agent (29:57) Sleeper of the year (complimentary) (32:07) Sleeper of the year (derogatory) (34:29) Most embarrassing pick who delivered (36:59) The post-hype sleeper MVP (39:29) The Glansberg (41:43) Don’t cry because it’s over, smile because it happened (44:45) Bonus Jonas (46:58) I won’t let the injury get this guy off the hook (49:42) Check out our 2024 Ringer Fantasy Football Rankings here! Email us! [e-mail] The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Hosts: Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck Guest: Doug Emhoff Social: Kiera Givens Producers: Kai Grady and Carlos Chiriboga Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Look, it's not that confusing. I'm Rob Harvilla, host of the podcast 60 Songs That Explain the 90s, except we did 120 songs. And now we're back with the 2000s. I refuse to say aughts. 2000 to 2009. The Strokes, Rihanna, J-Lo, Kanye, sure. And now the show is called 60 Songs That Explain the 90s, colon the 2000s. Wow.

That's too long a title for me to say anything else right now. Just trust me. That's 60 songs that explain the 90s, in the 2000s, preferably on Spotify. Football show, my name is Danny Hyphinson. I am joined by Danny Kelly and Craig Quilbeck. And today it is Power Hour, where we powering something every week. And today we are giving out our mid-season awards now that we're halfway through the NFL season.

And then after Power Hour, we are going to be joined by the second gentleman of the United States of America, Doug Amhoff. Yes, Kamloire's husband. Why not? Why not? Why not us? Why not us? Look at us. Who would have thought? No, really, who would have thought?

But yeah, no, we're just as confused as you. But yeah, no. So Kamala Harris' husband and the second gentleman of America, Doug Emhoff, is going to be a special guest judge, a guest justice on fantasy court with us here today after Power Hour. So stick around for that. And then also the whole interview is going to be live on YouTube on the Ringer NFL YouTube channel as well. So if you want to watch it, you can check it out there. So we're going to get to Power Hour.

We're going to get to Doug Emhoff. But first, we actually have a bunch of news that we have to hit right now, starting with. the Colts have benched Anthony Richardson for Joe Flacco at quarterback. Yeah. Reading from Adam Schaefter, my beloved Adam Schaefter's Twitter feed. A QB changed for the Colts, Indianapolis benching former first-round pick Anthony Richardson and turning to veteran Joe Flacco, sources tell Fowler you spin to me. Coaches met this morning and made the seismic organizational decision to change quarterbacks.

Craig, immediate gut check for you. Do you like the decision to bench Anthony Richardson? I don't. I don't like this move at all. This better be a temporary move. this better be a way for Anthony Richardson to like take a step back and reset and let the game catch back up to him a little bit

a few healthy weeks of practice and he's back out there. That's what I want. They're playing the Vikings next week. Maybe it would have gotten even worse and that would have officially broken him and they're going to take a couple weeks off. But if this is a season long bench,

to me this is just an admission that like, all right, I guess this is over now and it didn't work. You drafted this guy fourth overall. What were you expecting? He's played 10 games in the NFL. He played 13 games in college. Like they gave Bryce Young more time. They gave Jamarcus Russell more time.

Then they're going to give Anthony Richardson. I just think this is kind of ridiculous. I enjoy going nine and eight with Joe Flacco. D.K., do you agree with Craig? Yeah, pretty much. I think my first thought was like, okay, is this just going to be a benching for one week? So he doesn't have to face Brian Flores' Vikings defense.

And then after that, they're going to go back to him and just say, oh, this was just like kind of like a, you know, give him a second to kind of catch his breath. Ha ha. Like, that was a pun because that whole thing where he took himself out of the game is, is like, I think actually pissed a lot of people off. If you look at what some of the, the teammates said, Ryan Kelly, the center came out and, you know, was basically saying he had to take him aside and talk to him about it. Like, I think that is a, that's like the top of the iceberg or whatever. You can't really see what's going on below that.

I feel like they did the team as a whole was like pretty pissed about that whole situation. So maybe this is just sort of like a punitive benching for one game. We'll see. I think if they don't go back to him after that, then this becomes a much bigger story. What were you expecting? Were you expecting him to just show up and be good immediately? This stuff takes time. Again, this guy's played 10 games in the NFL. Physically, he's still one of the most gifted players out there. I disagree with the premise, though, Craig. I mean, D.K., I think that what you're saying is like he's, oh, well, he's playing poorly and he's young.

What did you expect? And I think what D.K. is saying is that he's playing poorly. What did you expect? Also, he pulled himself off the field because he was tired. and that pissed off all the veterans on the team. And I think those are, like it was poor play that the straw that broke the camel's back was poor judgment, right? Is that how you feel, DK? Yeah, I think so. I think it's like, look, this isn't, this is maybe just a reactionary move by an organization

that's done some pretty reactionary weird things in the past and it'll probably end up looking bad. I do think that there's a world in which Joe Flacco plays next week against the Vikings and he's terrible because the Vikings defense is really, really tough. And then they're like, okay, look, we're going back to Richardson. If that doesn't happen, if Flacco plays terribly, and they don't go back to Richardson after this next week, then I'm going to be like, okay, I don't know what the Colts are doing.

I really don't know what the Colts are doing with this. Because you even had the Shane Psycho, when they drafted him, was like, we think the best way for him to get experience and to develop is to play him. And, you know, benching him after however many, you said 10 games you started in the NFL, benching him after 10 games just seems so like, it's a departure from their very obvious plan.

that they had when they drafted him. So I don't know. To me, this whole situation is pretty bizarre. And I think it will know more, like this time next week, I think. I agree, we'll know more next week. I disagree, though. I think that they had to bench him. I think this is the right move.

And I actually, like, 100% agree with benching him. But you're saying this is a slap on the wrist for taking himself out of the game. No, are you saying? So you say they have to bench him? Does that mean they're done with them? No, and I think that that's the number one disagree. I think that's the number one conflation. I think that's happening with the story is that there's the idea that Colts benching

Richardson on the headline and ESPN is being conflated with like Panthers bench Bryce Young who's like being shoved away like you're not good enough to play in the NFL right now. We're not competitive with you. I don't think that's what's happening at all. I think that if he did not pull himself off and say that he pulled himself off the field for being tired, I don't think he gets benched. I don't think he does. Okay, well, that's a different story then. I completely agree with that. But yeah, I think that's what happened. But it's being communicated. Schefter used the term seismic. I know. That's what makes me worried about. They are leading you to believe that this is an organizational long-term decision.

I feel like maybe that's incorrect and that is just inflammatory language. I think it's inflammatory language. If this is a temporary benching because he made a stupid decision, then I completely support it. But if this is like we're done with Anthony Richardson, I do not support it at all. I think it's a temporary benching. Jeff Saturday went on first take and he said, yeah, look, this is crazy. They're going to have to bench him for a week and then we'll see. And like, I usually don't get all my great information from first take.

Jeff Saturday is such good friends with Jim Ursay. Jim Hersey fucking hired him off the goddamn set of first take to run the Indianapolis cults. There's probably nobody on television that talks to an NFL owner more than Jeff Saturday talks to Jim Ursey, or at least you should listen to when they speak more than Jeff Saturday speaking about what Jim Ursey would say about the Indianapolis cults. Jeff Saturday himself caught himself and said, a week and then we'll see. That's probably exactly what Jim Ursey's thinking.

There's a reason that I think we're having so much disagreement on this and it's also like just such a confusing situation. I think we're agreeing though, kind of. Well, I think what I'm saying is like we're having sort we're not really quite sure what's happening here is because if you and I saw I'm I apologize I don't know who did this. I saw this on Twitter. Somebody did a study of the last like 20 something years where where teams coached or teams benched like a highly drafted quarterback. I think it was like top 10 drafted quarterback in very very rare situations. Did that guy ever come back and like quote quote win the job back? Like it's only happened a handful of times in like 20 years. And so I'm just still trying to get a grip on like what this actual situation is. Is this a punitive thing? Like he's benched because he took himself out of the game or are they like giving up on him? Like I think that's the hard part here.

I think it's the easy part. I think it's 100% because he said he took himself out of the game. I think here's here's the thing. You're the quarterback. Like you don't get to leave. You know, it's to remember the Titans thing. You don't get to be tired. You don't get to be thirsty.

That's what all the credits for. Like I know, look, you think whatever you think of this and I know it's a little cliche. but NFL players are prepared to die on the field. I know that sounds a little dramatic, but that's how they feel. Right. You can't ask 30-year-old offensive linemen who have families to go out

and like risk, in their mind, risk their lives to go out for this dude. Because again, everyone agrees Joe Flacco makes the cults more competitive right now. Everyone agrees. We're saying, and the cults externally, internally, ever knows, we're playing Anthony Richardson because he needs to be developed.

He's the future of the team. You're the guy. The Colts offensive line, You're like, you're going to have to work harder because this guy doesn't know what he's doing. Receivers are going to be upset because this guy doesn't know he's doing yet. We have to be patient with him. And then you pull yourself off the field. This is all for you, dude.

You're 22 years old. You've been playing like shit. And the problem is that when he walks off, it's the implication that he can just walk back on. You check out of the game. You check back in like you're LeBron. That's not what it works. You're playing like ass. And the problem is the entitlement to walk back on.

I don't think he made it bad. I don't think it's an attitude. problem. I don't think, look, Richardson, by all accounts, is a hardworking guy. It's not like an attitude issue. It was a lapse in judgment because, again, I would argue the opposite. I think the people with the issue with benching him is, oh, well, he's supposed to play. He's going to learn something. I guarantee you there will not be one week of Anthony Richardson's first two years of his career that he learns more than this week because it's about the weight of being the starting quarterback. All these people depend on you. You don't get to be tired. That's what the money's

You don't get to be tired. I feel like Hyfe, it's your straw manning this a little bit. I don't think anyone disagrees with the fact that everyone everywhere is saying that he shouldn't be. I feel like most people are saying they don't think he should be benched. But that's because the narrative out there is that he's benched permanently. Right. If the narrative out there in the media was that he's getting a one or two game

kind of slap on the wrist because he stupidly pulled himself out of a game. I think everybody finds that to be a reasonable move. I agree. And I hear you. I guess maybe I'm putting card ahead of the horse. course. Maybe it's worth establishing. Look, he was playing terribly and they're sticking with him. And again, just to hammer home the numbers because they're incredibly completed 10 to 32 passes this week, 44.4% of his passes on the entire year, which is the second worst of the 21st century.

Austin, Gail had this stat. He's just ahead of Achillesmith. He's just behind Tim Tebow and Jamarcus, Russell and Ryan Leaf. Austin, Austin firing up that that search engine, man. He's affecting the course of history here. He's killing the rain for us to find out these numbers. He's the reason that they had to bench Richardson, because he's tweeting all these things. The ozone is disintegrating as we speak. But the completion percentage is not a perfect number and like all this stuff. And look, look, there's tons of drops.

Like he's sailing passes over guys his heads, but the ones he puts in a bucket sometimes get dropped. There's a lot of reasons. Like he's more aggressive downfield. There's a lot of reasons that it's such a bad completion percentage. But the other thing is, look, in his defense, he's the youngest quarterback in the league. He's like two years younger than Jane Daniels.

He's two years younger than Bo Nicks. Like, he's younger than these guys. There's going to be mistakes. That's wild. Yeah. Yeah, that's the point I'm trying to impress. And he's played four games last year. Again, it's still at 20 since he left high school.

The thing I'm trying to impress, this is a, to me, my take on this, this is about the implication that you can play like shit and walk off the field as if you can put and then just walk back on. It's about the, like, the sanctity of playing and the idea that you think you are entitled to play when you are playing terribly, when the entire organization is moving behind you to develop, you can't just opt out in and out when you feel like it.

And so to your point, if you wanted to get the message across that it's not something you can dangle with. You have to earn it. You have to like take it safe. You might have to play like you might never get to do it again. Do you want it to be publicly known? Oh, it's a slap on the wrist.

Don't worry. I think he'll be back in two weeks. Who is he arguing with? I don't know. Hyvitz. This is obvious. Who are you preaching to? I feel like you set D.K. and I up to be like,

Anthony Richardson is benched for the rest of his career. Craig, your opinion. And I'm like, I disagree with that. And you're like, Craig, you're so wrong. This is a temporary decision because he pulled himself off the field. I think everybody agrees with what you're saying. This is not a hot take that he should be benched for pulling himself off the field. But to your point about, oh, the confusion.

What I'm saying is the confusion's on purpose. They want Anthony Richardson to worry that he's going to be benched forever. They don't want Anthony Richardson knowing he's getting the job back in two weeks. That's why this is a narrative. That's why Schefter is using seismic because they want Anthony Richardson to worry he's Bryce Young. He's not Bryce Young. He's going to get the job back in two weeks. I think Craig's right.

We don't really disagree. Yeah, we definitely don't. We're like screaming at each other. The first thing I said was if this is temporary, I completely support it. Yeah, yeah. Austin Gale just texted me. So the YouTube, we're live on YouTube, the ringer NFL YouTube. If you want to watch power, we do this live on Tuesdays,

58% of the chat thinks Richardson should be benched. I know what you made. What does that mean? Benched for a game or two? Forever. Or forever. I see what you're saying where I think people are reacting as if he's benched for the season. And I think what I'm trying to say,

There's no fucking chance he's bench for the season. Like zero. That's like, is that controversial? No, no. I also think it really lines up nicely that they're playing Minnesota this week. I know. Yeah. What do you think Flacco's reaction to this is,

gee, thanks. You're sending me out to the wolves. Step out on my head when I'm drowning. This is like elder abuse. I'm sure he wants to play. But yeah. He's like, hey, pal, can you go in there and play this really tough, impossible defense?

And then then you'll get the bench after that. I feel like that was our first trial run at first take. We're all assigned roles in this, yeah. I was just fired. No, I think that I just, frankly, I think I just saw all this discourse defending him, and I'm kind of like, he's playing like shit, and he took himself.

I just got mad that he took himself off. I think he's deplorable. But again, everybody's mad because they think he's deplorable. Deplorable stuff. Whatever. Deplorable, you just said players are prepared to die out there, and he needs to re-grab the sanctity of the game. Craig, you're being really aggressive, dude.

Okay. Yeah, I feel like we're not disagreeing, Craig. You don't have to get so aggressive. Right, right, right, right, right. That was good. That was good. That was good. I feel like the producer of first take would love that. Call us. Panthers traded Deonti Johnson to the Ravens.

This was the other thing that happened today. The trade terms are hilarious. The NFL does not like this player. Very clearly. It's a fifth and sixth round pick swap. So basically, but the Ravens are good. To the Ravens are good at the end of the fifth round. for the Panthers are bad at the beginning of the sixth

and there's comp picks in the middle. So the Panthers basically moved up 15 picks in the sixth round. It's literally like moving from the 180th pick to the 165th pick in exchange for Deonti Johnson. It's like hard to find something less to give a team. Is that really all they could get? There was no better offer out there. I wanted to ask you that, D.K.,

of like, what questions does that? Throw it a seventh. But, DK., what questions does that raise for you? Because I'm wondering, is he actually hurt? Like, Devante Adams was like pretend hurt and then got back and he was, Do we think Deonti Johnson's actually healthy or is he actually worth this? Because I don't know what to make of this.

Well, I don't know. Craig, you're a Steelers fan. Steelers famously have an incredibly, incredibly long leash for their talented players. You know, going back through to history, Antonio Brown, Ben Rothesberger, Levy on Bell. Levion Bell. Mattaevis Bryant. Sure. The list goes on and on.

They've put up with some shitheads over the years, right? they got rid of Deontay Johnson for not very much I forget what the original trade They got a cornerback for him and they got Dante Jackson and then a seventh I think right He was getting cut then probably

Right like so I don't know That to me said something and then the fact that no other team Wanted trade for him more than like a day three trade up Like that is insulting Rather just you cut me Yeah I feel like to sure I know that Sherlock Holmes thing it isn't like you know logically very sound to be like oh here's every

option, but I feel like if you're going to say Deonti Johnson's such a locker room cancer that even Mike Tomlin couldn't deal with him, where it's like Levi-on-Bel was boxing within two years of leaving the Steelers, Antonio Brown took his jersey off and left in the middle of a game. So like those are the, I feel like Deonti Johnson, I know he's a diva, but I'm like, that seems, I don't think he's like that. No, I don't know what's going on with this. The Panthers, by the way, also ate a lot of his salary. He's basically getting paid the minimum on the Ravens now.

Do you think it's because Deonti Johnson also seems to often want to take himself out of the game? There's a pattern here. It's deplorable. Perhaps. Really. I love that that's what stuck out to you. The entire rant you just went on. He's an expert at rhetoric, Craig.

He will turn anything around on you. Craig, I think me and you were kind of like ganging up on him a little and he turned it immediately on you. That was expert level, expert level stuff. Maybe that's a good distillation in social media because all I saw on social media was people saying Richardson should play. But maybe that's a good reminder that popular opinions aren't actually posted in social media because it's like not cool to post anything obvious.

Because I feel like I saw the world everyone was like, this is dumb. But you guys were arguing different points. Everybody thought he was, he's benched for the rest of the season. Yeah, the point I'm trying to make is the cults are making it's lying to scare him. It's scared straight. It's making him smoke the whole back of secrets. Quick question before we move on. I want to know, what are you going to say about this whole situation if he's still benched like five weeks from now?

Then what's your opinion? Well, the problem is, is like, what if the cults, let's say the cults beat the Vikings by 20. I know. probably not kind of that is fine you don't have to bench him until you lose like I think it like there's not it's not like benching him is some death sentence back in my you know the first 100 years of football

you just let quarterbacks learn until they were good enough to play you know what I mean it's not the worst thing in the world he's the youngest he's the youngest I think Drake May's the youngest I think he's second youngest oh I guess yeah maybe Drake May's younger yeah he's Drake may younger this is fun no this was really fun

August 30th 2002 Anthony Richardson was born May 2. Oh, yeah, he's like four months younger than Drake May. We're older, sorry. Get your facts straight next time, please. Yeah, sorry. Pick up a win this NFL game day on Fandall, America's number one sports book. Right now, all customers getting profit boost every single NFL game day. That means you can pump up your gridiron winnings multiple times a week. Fandle has tons of ways you can get in on the NFL action. You can bet on money lines, player props, game day specials, and more. The Giants are

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Let's get in a power hour. Yeah, yeah. Power hour, baby. So we're doing mid-season awards. If you're new here, power ranks something every Wednesday, or every Tuesday now. Tuesdays and Ringer NFL YouTube channel

and then episodes come out Wednesday. So if you want to get a little early in on the action, you can watch us do this on Tuesdays. I don't know how you rank awards, but really what's going to happen is it's going to be more like an award show where we're going to give our nominees at the top and then we'll have two minutes,

and then we'll play ourselves off with Tom Tom, club and genius of love at the end. So that's really the power. our action for today. And again, we're going to give the midseason awards in every two minutes, power hour style. You're going to hear this sound. So boom, let's just get into it.

DK. Yo. Number one, fantasy MVP for the mid-season fantasy MVP. Yeah. Craig, I'm just going to read the nominees. DK submitted Derek Henry. Craig submitted Derek Henry. And then I submitted Derek Henry,

but also should we discuss Lamar Jackson or Jane Daniels. I think expectation. matters here and the satisfaction of drafting this person. It's like Lamar was the MVP last year in real football. I'm like, look, Lamar's Lamar. Is anybody surprised? Derek Henry, there was like rumors that he's washed. Is this going to work? He's 30 years old. The workload. Like, I think the gamble of Derek Henry and him being the number one running back in fantasy. He's the number three overall player, including quarterbacks. So I think part of MVP to me is feeling vindicated by the pick as well. I thought about putting Lamar here too. But ultimately,

just what Henry has done he has outscored the number two running back in total points by 30 fantasy points. He's averaging 21 points a game. Zero games under 10 points. If you just look at it from like multiple angles, whether it's like the really high spike games and the consistency

and what he's doing relative to the number two running back in terms of total points so far and obviously points per game. I don't know. It just feels like if you have Derek Henry in your team, you're probably in the top three in your league unless you're really, really unlucky. And I think Lamar, yeah, what Craig said is like, right,

there is a little bit of a narrative with MVP. And I think Henry doing this at his age, after changing teams, after some of the doubts, even I had some doubts about him coming into the season. I know Craig was really hyping him up and I was like, I just like, I worry about their offensive line. They're changing so many guys. Like this is a new team, new scheme.

I don't know if they're going to use them on. Remember week one when Justice Hill was in there like a whole bunch? I was like, started to be like, oh, God, this might not be. And I think John Harbo was talking about, oh, yeah, we didn't bring him in to, like, run him into the ground, you know. And he's basically, like, squashed all those worries and is awesome. He's basically, he's on pace for 300 carries.

Of course he is. Yeah, 946 rushing yards and 9 touchdowns. 946 and 9 touchdowns. It is week eight. Like, he's been eight weeks. He's on pace for 2,000 yards. So, Derek Henry, it is? Derek Henry.

Yeah. I think the season has cemented him as the, As the best running back of the 2020s. Yeah, definitely. WaiverWire MVP. DK submitted Baker Mayfield. I submitted Baker Mayfield and Tucker Kraft, the tight end for the Packers.

Craig submitted. Craig submitted Tucker Craft, Darnell Moody and Jordan Mason. I think Jordan Mason should not be eligible. I feel like every league I was in, he was drafted. And so I think Jordan Mason, we throw him out. But Tucker Kraft, the cop out is just give these guys like the positional awards because Baker's

definitely the way the quarterback waiver out of the year. He's the number two quarterback in fantasy. Baker Mayfield. He's unbelievable. He's averaging 23 points a game. That is that is hyper mobile quarterback numbers, right? Like that is a huge advantage. That's like the type of quarterback where you have a running back and a quarterback like

in one spot. And he's doing it all through the air. This is probably not going to last all year. Let's be honest. They've had some injuries. He's not going to throw, you know, three or four touchdown passes every game. but he is leading the league with 21 touchdowns right now, 21 passing touchdowns. He's also added 3.6 points per game rushing.

So he's scrambling around a little bit, scored a couple touchdowns. Yeah, I mean, he's, to me, the waiver wire MVP. Like, you could have, he went, he was basically a non, like no one was thinking about him before the year. He was just like a random statue quarterback that no one really thought about. And he is, I saw this for fantasy points. He's fifth and wins above replacement. They're war metric. The only guys in front of him right now, Henry Lamar.

Camara and Barclay in that category. So pretty valuable. I think it's probably Baker as the winner of this category. I think, but yeah, shouting out Tucker Kraft, who honestly has been amazing. He's basically a top five tight end in on the year. And he really would be higher if Malik Willis didn't play. He basically took three weeks to get going because of Malik Willis. But since he's gone back, he's been incredible. And then, I mean, Tucker Kraft was getting drafted outside the top 300. Yeah. He was the backup on it. his own team. Yeah. And then I want to shout out Darnel Mooney, who has been a wide receiver

one this year. He's been a top 12 guy in the season. Darnel Mooney. I mean, who's like in Van Jefferson territory to me, it was like a guy that people are just like, yay, good number three, number four guy maybe. But it's like Drake London and Darnel Mooney and Kirk Cousins are now like the Mike Evans and Chris Godwin where they're both top 12 guys this year. It's been incredible. Nobody predicted Darnel Moody. Craig, do you remember Eddie Royal? Yeah. For the Broncos all those years ago. had like a really big first season and then basically did nothing for the rest of his career, I feel like. I could be wrong.

He might have had like another good year or two in there, but Mooney kind of reminds me to him. It's like you hear about him as a rookie. He goes over a thousand yards or I think it was his rookie year and then basically just disappeared forever. Like I was thinking that would be what happened with Mooney. But it's awesome to see him playing so well again. Yeah.

I mean, maybe it didn't work with him in Fields in Chicago and DJ were there. And it's like now he's done a more traditional passing offense. So WaverWire MVP, we're going Tucker Crafts, a tight end copping out and then Darnal Moon is the receiver waiver wire MVP of the year and Baker's the quarterback. Are we saying Baker is the overall MVP? Yeah. I think Baker is. Yeah.

And then also we have quick breaking, mid-TomTom breaking news. Austin Gail has just texted us that in Rappap report from NFL Network's reporting, the Vikings just traded for a new left tackle. And they're acquiring Cam Robinson in exchange for draft comp, draft pick compensation from the Jaguars. And when they don't tell you what the pick is, that means it's a bad trade for the team who gave up the guy. That's a fun little inside fact for you.

If you don't know the pick immediately, it wasn't a good one. A conditional seventh rounder. Additional draft pick compensation means not a first or second rounder. So anyway, I think that just means, I mean, the Vikings, you know, Christian Derriss saw how had that injury and they need him for the rest of the season. I think that that left tackle injury took the Vikings out. Or the offensive tackle injury took the Vikings out of Super Bowl contention, frankly, just because he's, I, Brandon Thor is a really good offensive line expert compared

it to like the Niners losing Trent Williams. And I think that this puts them potentially back in the next to be a series contender. Anyway, we can keep going here. Number three, the biggest bust of the year in fantasy. Craig had Patrick Mahomes and or Anthony Richardson, which is fair. D.K. and I both had Christian McCaffrey. Yeah, it just depends how you look at this. Yeah, yeah.

There's an argument in both ways. Craig, I'm curious to hear, did you like consider McCaffrey at a different category? Yeah, I mean, like, I don't know. To me, a bust is when... Go on. A player plays poorly. McCaffrey's not playing. He got hurt.

I don't know. Patrick Mahomes is the QB21. He hasn't scored 20 fantasy points yet this season, and he has a pick in every single game. Like, if you want to measure expectation versus reality, it has to be Patrick Mahomes, at least with Anthony Richardson there was like, we kind of knew the floor was there.

We knew he was volatile. This is Patrick Mahomes. He's unstartable. It's like Bo Nix versus Patrick Mahomes isn't even a conversation in fantasy right now. I'm looking at these fantasy points had Mahomes was the number two quarterback drafted in fantasy. Yeah, dude, he's Patrick Mahomes. These are the three kinds of fantasy disappointments, though, because Mahomes is the guy

who's amazing and you're finally going to get to like have a stake in watching him on Sundays, and you're watching, you're like, oh, this sucks. Richardson's like, I have the coolest player in the league. It was like Richardson at A-Chann entering the year. Like, I got Richardson. Everyone's hyping him up, including us. And you're like, oh, and then you're watching, you're immediately like, damn, this guy kind of sucks.

made a huge mistake. Huge mistake. And then McCaffrey is like, you got Ponzi scheme. McCaffrey is like, I feel like I was part of a financial crime and I would like to join a class action lawsuit. Because the thing about McCaffrey and why I think McAfree is the answer here, as bad as Holmes Richardson were, I think we've forgotten that we didn't know

that he was even really not playing a Monday at football to like 90 minutes before Monday at football. McCaffrey, this whole thing is fraud. There's no way about it. This should legally be defined as fraud. They sold us a bill of kids. It's a different category. This is an SBF fraud award.

And I will say, the Niders with the injury reporting, Debo Samuel, not being off the injury report. And then he's like, oh, two plays in, oh, had pneumonia. How weird, fluid in the lungs. Couldn't have known. It's like buying stock in like a tech and then finding out they don't have any tech. Like, we don't know, actually we don't have, we don't have a. You say, Theranos?

It's Theranos. I only read about it. I wouldn't have got that right either. You only read about it. You never watched, you never watched the Elizabeth Holmes documentary? No, I read the Wall Street Journal reporting. It was based on. Doc's good.

Went right to the source. And the Amanda Seyfried show is good. The dropout? Yeah. Well, we're here. Syfried? What did I say? Seafreed?

Seyfried? I mean, I'm not going to go with my instinct at this point, but I always thought it was Seafreed. But again, kind of never heard her name said aloud until right now. I don't know. I've heard it both ways. Theranos. Let's bring Amanda in. I think Theranos is a better name.

She wouldn't have gotten caught if it was called Theranos. That's a good take. I don't agree, but that's a good take. That's a first take right there That was my first take, yeah. Wait, so we're giving it to McCaffrey. I think we should do a vote here in the chat. Yeah, vote in the chat.

The YouTube chat. I had Richardson written down. I said it was CMC or if you're actually counting it like players who played, it's Richardson. But I think Mahomes is probably better. At least with Richardson, you're like, yeah, I mean, fuck, he played four games

in his entire career. Like, was there a world in which I knew this could crash and burn? Yes. I feel like Mahomes, you were like, I'm safe. That's fair, but like three years from now, like we, and like Bill Simmons, like, people will just be referring to this as the McCaffrey year.

Like, the year McCaffrey never played. Like, it's like the defining thing. Some people think of number one overall. First, he was the first pick for a lot. We're the only place that moved him off the first pick. I just think it's semantics. I think it's semantics. I think it's a different definition. To me, if you want to, fine,

how about this? We give the biggest bust award to Anthony Richardson. Fuck, that's, I hate talking about football. What are we saying? We're saying the, the Theranos Award. The Elizabeth Holmes award is to McCaffrey. Yeah, the Elizabeth Holmes Award goes to McCaffrey. Next award here, we have the biggest chaos agent of the season.

I had Mark Andrews, Craig had Mark Andrews. DK had just put the Ravens. Oh. Yeah, so this is how I looked at it. This was a category that we started last year, and it was based on the Rams being just a fantasy chaos agent with Kiron Williams and Pooka Nakua coming out of literally nowhere to be like two of the most valuable players in fantasy.

And then Cooper Cup, who everyone took really high, was like one of the worst players to have fantasy. They probably lost to your league. last year. And the way that I look at it now is, and it's, this is a long way of saying it is Mark Andrews, but it's like, if you have Lamar or Derek Henry, like you're probably in first place. This is creating chaos across the fantasy landscape, these two. And if you had Andrews, you're, you're absolutely effed because you took him probably, I don't know what, the fourth round or something like that, fifth round. And he has done absolutely nothing. You probably had to

chase after like the Isaiah likely meteor that we saw in week one and you probably put him in week two and he effed you in week two. Justice Hill in week one looked really good and we're like, oh, he's going to be a thing. You chased that and then he was nothing. The Ravens are just creating chaos across the fantasy landscape. That's the way I looked at this. So you're saying chaos is a ladder or a shoot? The reason why I think it's just Andrews is,

DK, you're right, he's been such a disaster. But, I mean, look, he still hasn't scored a lot of points compared to like George Kittle. But you know, in the tight end rankings right now, he's eighth. I know, he's coming back. But that's like an average, that's like if your heads in the, your heads in the freezer and your feet are on the stove, it's like room temperature. It's like, it was a month of fucking zero points and then he's been the number one tight end for the last month. Isn't that the definition of chaos? Yeah, but I'm just saying it's like, oh, he's the number eight.

It's like, there are people who caught him when he was like 100th and then he's first now. That's exactly what I'm trying to get at is that he's eighth because, dude, he had literally back-to-back games with zero points while playing. and is now somehow the tight-in-eight still because he's had four touchdowns in the last three weeks. Like that is the definition of chaos to me. Yeah, I agree. I think it's Andrews. I just wanted to get my...

The explanation for the category is basically like which team or player is just completely fucking up your league. Mark Andrews is the chaos agent. Next one here. We got to got... It's sleepers. We always talk about sleepers is the random dart throw. And every now and then,

you hit a bullseye with the random dart throw. And we wanted to give the bullseye of the mid-season award, Craig, you had J.K. Dobbins as the random Darth or bullseye. Like that. D.K., you had Josh Downs. I'll admit I probably cheated a little. But I put Brian Thomas, because I know he's not like a $1.00 fantasy football player. It's like, in his soccer league. I know he's not like. It's hard. Yeah. It was a narrow category to think of a guy that actually went for a dollar. I just wanted to shout up Brian Thomas from the Jaguars. And of course he's hurt now. But Brian Thomas is straight up the number

five receiver in fantasy. Yeah. Literally he's only behind C.D. Lamb, Chris Godwin, Justin Jefferson. And the number one receiver in. fantasy, Jamar Chase. Is this total points? Points per game and total points, I believe. But to answer your question about what would I do if Anthony Richardson didn't play for two months, it's like the Bengals. I'm like, oh, yeah, Jamar Chase, number one receiver in fantasy.

Whoops, that's my bad. I think Brian Thomas is probably too good of a player for this. So, I don't know, you guys fight. Is it Josh Downs or J.K. Dobbins? Brian Thomas is the wide receiver 10 in points per game in half of the year. But regardless. Well, Craig fed me that number.

It was his fault. How dare you, Craig? I don't know. This one's tough because I think ultimately J.K. Dobbins is probably more valuable to have at this point just because Downs is going to be volatile. He still has Richardson. If Richardson comes back, that's going to possibly mess things up. But I mean, if you look at what Downs has done this year, he is the wide receiver 23 and a half pvr points per game right behind Mike Evans. Like, he's had two bad games

granted and he really kind of screwed you in those two games because there's really, really bad games. But in four out of six games, he scored 11 plus points. He's been pretty awesome. And he's, I think clearly better than Michael Pittman at this point. I don't, you know, obviously Michael Pittman could make a comeback, but he's like their number one guy. Josh Downs is like the Darnell Mooney to Michael Pittman's Drake London. Although Drake London's been very good this year, but yeah. But I think, I like the Dobbins one actually too a lot.

Dobbins, I'm just like, Dobbins was fun because he worked out immediately. Like if you believed in him and you spent $1.00 on him, like he came right out of the gate with a hundred yards and a touchdown. Every argument that you had in the off season, oh, they're going to run a lot. Gus Edwards is old. the Greg Roman system. Like Harbaugh really likes him. It just immediately was correct.

He's a top 20 running back on the season. Let's go with Dobbins. So that was, Dobbins is the sleeper of the year complimentary. Now we have the sleeper of the year derogatory for the sleeper who kept on sleeping. I'm sorry, Craig. We all had Josh Palmer.

It's correct. I said sorry in my, in my post. Look, you shoot your shot, you know. A lot of things need to go right for a sleeper to work out. We got off on the wrong foot with Palmer. He's banged up. the Quentin Johnson thing happened at the beginning of the year.

I still think he's a good player. He's also been kind of sneaky playing well as of late. I think, you know, didn't click. It doesn't always work. There's still time. There's still time. Also, Ladd-McConkie is really awesome.

And I think he's come on a lot quicker than maybe some people expected. Yeah, do we want to do a two-minute long apology tour with Craig here? What do we want to do for the rest of the time? No, I think so, look, everyone has a micdames. No, now you guys name sleepers that you like that didn't work out.

I've actually never picked anything wrong. Luckily, I can't ever remember picking a running back that would or would not go on to either, you know, I've never had my game. I think I mentioned Curtis Samuel before the season. That didn't work out. I will say this. I was, as you guys know, weirdly against the Josh Palmer thing. And then I was at Chargers training camp and they were doing a drill. And Josh Palmer caught a touchdown in the corner of the end zone.

And I have never in my entire career been as close to being run the fuck over on the. sideline as I was by Josh Palmer catching this ball in the corner. Because the charges, there's no room. They moved their whole practice facility to get people like in the stands. And so I almost got like decluded. Did he get up on you and let you smell his Cologne? Is that it's saying?

That's a grudanism. Wasn't it Craig? Didn't you say that? I don't know. Did he? Yeah, maybe it was a Gus Johnson. No, it's a Gus Johnsonism. Oh, actually. Austin and I were watching Gus Johnson highlights. He goes, gets up on you and lets you smell his

cologne. Anyways, it's Gus. Craig, do that. Agnew. Agnew. Agnew. At the sideline, Agnew. Shadotot. Shadden Stroud. Finds a scene. Anyway, I'll admit, Craig, before the Josh Palmer ends,

in that moment when he almost killed me, I was like, fuck, I bet that's a sign from God. Craig's going to be right. Palmer's good. Palmer's a good player. I would take him on the Steelers in a heartbeat. I'm sorry, I'm not sorry. All right. Dude, also, the meme of like, oh, you wanted, he was like, oh, you wanted Amory Cooper, Devante Adams,

but didn't have Amari Cooper Devante Adams money. Van Jefferson, it'll be then, but. Yeah. Dude, great game last night by Van. Oh, God. Most embarrassing pick who delivered. This is always a thing every year, and I like that we came up with this last year,

which is there's always a player that when you take them, everyone's making fun of you and you're a little embarrassed, you did it. And that guy's awesome. Just like feels bad to pick them, kind of. Craig had Kyron Williams. I also had Kyron Williams. and D.K. You had Terry McLaurin. I think those are both excellent. I think Karen Williams is actually the perfect one for this because so many people are like,

he's small, he's injury prone, he's got a plate quorum behind him. He's returning punts. Yes. He's returning punts. From now on, we are taking punt returns as a positive sign. They want to get it with the ball. So also, he's great. Cooper Cup, Cooper Cup returned puns when he had the Triple Crown. Guess how many puns? Kyron Williams has returned this year. Two, actually, no. Two. It's two. He returns two wins this year. He's the number four running back in fantasy Kyrin Williams. No one's talking about it.

He's second in touchdowns in the league. He's the four, he's a top five running back. He's basically doing what he did last year again and kind of just nobody cares. The only people with more fantasy points than Kairn this year are Derek Henry, Saquan, Barclay and Kamara at the running back position.

And to that point, yeah, I was made fun of for taking Camara in a league, or sorry, not Kamara. I was made fun of taking Kairn Williams in the second round of a league. And they're like, he's a punt return. He's going to lose his job to play Korm. I'm like, no, he's not get over it.

And then I was like, He's not got it, right? And I was like, can you imagine? Just like being a fantasy expert. Taking a punt return of round two. But I will say this. I had a memento tattoo across my chest at the end of last season.

I wrote down as one of my favorite lessons from the season. Don't worry about like draft. Pretend everyone who's good was a first rounder. Because teams care about like production. And once you've been good, you're good. And I was like, I literally wrote down, do not rank in my notes at the top of the running back section. Do not rank Breeze Oliver Caron Williams.

Don't do it. And I fucking coward it out. And I changed my mind. You did it, you coward. We should do, we should actually, we joked about this. We should make the 2025 rankings as soon as the 2024 season ends. We can tweak them once the playoffs happen. And I think we should compare them to our final rankings and see which ones are better.

Next year we got to just have like a gut rankings and like an actual, like a professional credibility rankings and then like a gut rankings. Yeah, remember we flirted with the idea of doing like a fuck it rankings. You should just purge rankings. Separate from our normal rankings. Yeah. It should be take purge rankings where it's like. Kyron Williams.

Like we, I, yeah. Karen is like the far in a way best pick for this. I think people were like a little bit worried about McLaren, but he didn't reach anywhere near the status of like literal putt returner Kyron Williams.

McLaurin's more like this category. So the post type sleeper MVP and McLorren fits this as well. So Craig, you had Chris Godwin before the injury, obviously. DK, you had Tony Pollard. I had Joe Mixon, the running back for the Texas.

Oh, yeah. That could have worked for the previous one too, actually. Yeah, I mean, Mixon, I mean, literally, no one ever wants Mixin.

I mean, we were in there, we were, we did it, we did a league here for, uh, with like a Yahoo Fantasy football league for the ringer and we did, we actually had a team together.

And Joe, we were talking about Joe Mixon. And we were like, yeah, and then he fell again. And it was like the third time. No one wanted him. Yeah. Number two running back in points per game.

Literally only only behind Derek Henry, Joe McInson. He looks like so much better this year than he did last year too. He looks incredible. Dude, there's like a whole collection of running backs that are taking some secret steroid. year and looks so much better.

Like Joe Mixin, Najee Harris, DeAndre Swift, those two guys I also think qualified for this category. There's a bunch of running backs who were kind of, you know, looked down on and kind of like written off that are awesome this year. They probably, Craig, this is like Occam's Razor and everything, but like they probably were just banged up. For three years, Noggi Harris has banged up. I mean, football is a very, football is a collision sport, man.

Most of the time you're banged up, I feel like. Yeah, Matt Canada was your coordinator and Arthur Smith is many things, but he's an American. with the run game. So I mean, I think that it's going pretty well there. Tony Pollard, I will say too.

Tony Pollard looks back. You know, he hasn't been as spectacular as Vixen. Again, his burst is really back. He's the RV 22 this season. Only two bad games,

really, 4.4 and 7.5 and a couple of games. But other than that, he's averaged more than 12 points per game. Yeah, I also wanted,

I threw in Dondre Swift, but I was like, it's kind of hard to get over the miserable start. Like, he didn't do anything for you for the first three weeks. In fact,

a lot of people probably benched it or dropped him even. I thought they were, I thought they might bench him because he was playing so poorly. And since those games, since week four,

he's been the RB three. Yeah, he's been awesome. That's like, honestly, one of the hardest parts of this job, instead of injuries,

is figuring out whether a guy who sucks can just be fixed or if they'll give up on him. DeAndre Swift's hurtle the guy the other day, and I was like, damn.

Where did this come from? Craig. Rick killed the guy. Jumped up a notch. Yeah, we were like, oh, DeAndre Swift, on his third team before his age 25 season.

What a good sign. The next one we have is the Glansberg Award. The player that nobody's talking about, who's being good. D.K., you had Brian Robinson, Jr. Who's being good? Who's being good? Playing well, whatever. Playing the football, good.

DK., you had Brian Robinson Jr. is the Glansburg. Craig and I had the same one. Chuba Hubbard. That's a great one. Running back for the Carbthers. Chuba Hubbard, man, has anyone had a single Chuba Hubbard conversation this year? He's like, it's like a movie. More fantasy team names than actual conversations about it.

Adam. It's like one of those movies that gets nominated for Best Picture, but just nobody talks about it. It just like slips into irrelevance. It's like Power of the Dog. It's nominated and then no one has ever talked about it again. That is kind of Chuba Hubbard. Yeah, Power of the Dog, to 2022 Oscars. Yeah, was that the one with the guy from Jesse Plemons? Yeah, Plymonds. Yeah, a mustache. Yeah, I never watched that. Cumberbatch. Curson Duntz, yeah. Dude, Chuba Hubbard's the RB 14. Yeah, he's been on it. He's been on absolute team. Better than that. Since Bryce Young got benched, Chubber is a top five fantasy running back.

No. Total points is cheating a little, but like... No, but still he's getting you points. Part of it. He's been reliable. He's in your freaking lineup, yeah. Since fresh young gut bench, Derek Henry,

Kyron Williams, Jamir Gibbs, Bejan Robinson, only guys have more points. And if you go points per game, which is more transparent, he's 10th. He's right there with Bejohn Robinson

and David Montgomery and James Cook at points per game since Prescient got bench on Chubbard. It always just kills me to hear these stats where you're like, I could have had Bejohn Robinson or Chuba Hubbard in one roster spot on my team. I know, I know.

Like this just kills me. It just kills me a little bit inside. But then the flip side is like, oh, I guess there were three receivers you could have drafted have been happy with in this, you know, C.D. Lamb, Justin Jefferson and the Jamar Chase. And if people don't have Jamar Chase, I'll take the hell on that. Honestly, the other nine picks in the first round sucked. They all got hurt or have been bad. So it was a minefield.

But the, the Chuba thing's funny. The other thing is the strike. He was drafted three regimes ago. He's drafted by Matt Rule. And like, those guys don't often like always catch on. He was drafted technically by Matt Rules. wife. Matt Rull's wife wanted, that is true. To be totally clear,

she told him she liked that guy. And so he was like, all right, we'll take him. I just wanted to shout out Brian Robinson real quick here. I think he has the distinct disadvantage of having a extremely boring name. Brian Robinson. In fact, I almost just said Brian Johnson. B. Robinson, yeah, helps. It looks better.

But he is through eight weeks. He's scored more points per game than A-chan, Rommandre, Rashad, Najee, Javante, E.N, Mo Sturt, Moss, Singletary, and Zemir White was drafted before this man according to ADP. He also looks good when you watch him. This is something I've long held.

Like, when I watch him, I'm like, this guy's good. He just runs so hard. Big, fast, strong. He's like really quick feet, really explosive. At least in the short area, he doesn't have long speed, but he's like, he's got really good burst and he's tough. And he scores a lot of touchdowns. But I think people were afraid that

that Jane Daniels is going to, like, steal all those touchdowns, which hasn't really materialized. So I just want to shout out Brian Robinson. Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened. I mean, DK and I had Chris Godwin,

Craig and Rishie Rice. They can split it, put it together, you get a full season. We're not even close, actually, but Chris Godwin's the number three receiver in fantasy football. I know.

I think this was like one of the most, the saddest things that happened this season was watching him lay there on Monday night football. Just because it was all coming together for him. It was like big comeback. like new role. The Buccaneers were a fun, exciting team. And then it seems like everything kind of fell apart at that moment for the Buccaneers.

So obviously we're bummed out about Godwin. I think he was going to end up like winning a lot of people in their leagues because he was, he was drafted as the wide receiver 34 gentlemen. The wide receiver 34. There's some bad, bad receivers in front of him, according to ADP. So, you know, he was a great value. I'd say the same about Rishie Rice. I think if he would have stayed healthy, he'd been winning a lot of people leagues.

but Craig Craig maybe next year also what fantasy sucks about doing this job I mean well relative but like it's annoying when Craig nailed the Rishi Rice thing and was all over it

was like Rishi Rice is not going to get suspended this is the number receiver in the chiefs and he's like top five receiver immediately and then Patrick Mahomes tackled him on a pick and then shredded his knee yeah and Craig you were totally you were totally on that with the Rishi Rice thing

but you were not smart enough to predict that Mahomes would tackle his best receiver. Yeah, flinging his body into Rishi Rice's knee. Hurling himself. And then they really dangled the carrot in front of us, the chiefs did with the whole injury situation with Rishie Rice. There was like a week where I was like,

I think he was coming back. What was that about? I know, it's such a bummer. Rishie Rice, wide receiver four in the first three weeks of the season. Back to work, John. Back to work. Back to work. That was so sad.

That's like the saddest moment I can remember in a long time on the field. other than DeMar Hamlin may be dying other than that. Jesus. Yeah. What? Yeah. You're not wrong.

You're not wrong. But yeah. Deplorable. What else we got? What else we got? All right. This is move on. Fuck Tom, Tom.

We got to get out of here after that. All right. Bonus Jonas Award for the fourth Jonas brother. I actually forgot what this meant and I had to be listed to last year's show that I guess there's a fourth Jonas brother. You guys. don't want me. I don't know. Fourth Jonas, third Franco, there's always another one

out there, you know, there's a third Hemsworth, although he's a little bit more fans. Probably like a handful more Scars guards walking around somewhere and there are thousands of scars guards. This award is for someone on an awesome offense that, like, you're, you don't, you're the fourth Jonas brother, and that's what you got. And so, Deke and I had Jaylen Waddle. You forget they're

exists. You forget they exist. Yeah, you forget they exist. We had Jailin Waddle. Craig had Sam Leporter for the Lions. I would like to just actually, I don't want Jailin Watt. I would like to un-nominate Jailadal. I think Sam Loporta is perfect. He is totally the fourth Jonas brother. I mean,

like everyone, like Amon Ra is a top 10 guy again, Jameson Williams' breakout year, Jamir Gibbs and David Montgomery, you look awesome. Just the team in general is literally firing on all cylinders. It looks like they don't even need Sam Leporta.

The only time they need Leporta is like when they're running some trick play. Hey, hey guy, go run down there. We'll run a trick play for you. Just like, you know, feed him a little scraps,

just keep him happy. Yeah, I remember in the preseason, we're like, you know, we really kind of like Jameson Williams. He has a chance to like play a bigger role. Maybe it's going to like cut a little bit into LaP his target rate. Should we

be a little worried that LaPora is literally the tight end one according to ADP? Should we just be a little worried? James and Williams took all his targets. I didn't expect him to take all of them. He's averaged, I don't know what he's averaged a game. It's like three or something like that. There's a game a couple weeks ago where he had one target

and it was literally on a trick play. So I don't know. With this James and Williams news though. James Williams is sustained for... We're live, so I'll be going to read directly from MLive.com. There we go. Detroit Police investigating why James Williams avoided gun charge and the Detroit Police Department opened internal affairs investigation to Y-Lines receiver James and Williams was not

arrested for carrying a concealed weapon without a permit. Williams passenger to cars pulled over by police and basically there were two guns in the car. It sounds like they were both registered. One, his brother to conceal carry permit. James and Williams did not, which is about whether he was out loud to have a concealed gun without a concealed carry permit and then basically

there was a whole thing over the officers there and yeah so basically the first officer's not a alliance fan the next one was body cam footage and they're like essentially sort of debating whether they should just let him go

not a good look we'll see how this goes I've never wanted Tom Tom Tom to come quicker Tom Tom is on his way saved by the bell it's like half these players talking about better late than never. All right. Last one here.

I won't let the injury get this guy off the hook. Craig had Jalen Waddle for this one. Yeah, yeah. And the injury is obviously to Tua. I'm not going to let the Tua injury get Jailen Waddle off the hook. I don't care. Craig has a, you have a vendetta right now against Waddle.

He has four touchdowns in his last 21 games. Please, I'm losing hope. My family is starving. Why is God giving me the toughest battle? I'm going to continue starting him. I will. Craig, do you want me to read off some receivers? Again, this is like the thing where it's like when you try and picture,

I could put this guy in my starting spot in a fantasy, in a real fantasy league. And he'd get me the same amount of points as Jalen Waddle. Here's some players that are scoring more points per game than Jalen Waddle this year. Jan Waddle, by the way, is the wide receiver 72 in points per game. Xavier Ligette, Trey Tucker, Jalen Naylor, Noah Brown, 2-2-Atwell, to Marcus Robinson, Tyler Lockett. Should I go on?

There's so many points. Yeah, actually, on that note, I want to just, you mentioned Jalen Naylor. He's the third best Jalen at receiver. He is behind Jalen Tolbert, like Jalen Naylor. Those are both third receivers on the team. And Jailen, he's barely ahead of Jalen Koker, who's like a rookie on the Panthers. You guys kind of have convinced me with this Waddle thing. But I will, I will keep playing him.

I'm not going to stop. I'm going to be there when it works. I'm Irish. I'll do this shit forever. I will be there when it works. Because I'm going to do this forever. I'm not going to wake. up one Monday morning and look back and see that he had 22 points and he's on my bench.

I won't do it. I will start him every single week. Dude, it's like the gambler's fallacy. Can I just say it again, the Jalen Waddle points this year 14 and week one, 645, 6226. Ugh. It's, again, I said this last week or last show, but it's so hard to bench him just because his name is Jalen Waddle. I don't know.

We should just call him Mike Davis until he plays well. We should. Everybody carries a lot of water for him. I really do think so. because offense is so fast and electric and cool. All right, that's enough Jalen Waddle talk for my taste. Let's move on. Let's get to Doug Emhoff, the second gentleman of the United States.

Hope you enjoy. All right, welcome to a very special segment here on the Ringer Fantasy Football Show. My name is Danny Heifitz, and I am joined by Danny Kelly, Craig Holbeck, and the second gentleman of the United States of America vying to become the first gentleman of the United States. Mr. Doug Emhoff, Doug, thank you for coming on the show today. Now, your wife, Kamala Harris, is running for president of the United States. United States of America, but we wanted to get into the real issues that matter here today.

So we heard you have a long time league with your college friends and you're six and two. So I wanted to start with, do you think you're going to win your fantasy football league this year? This is probably the best team we've had in a long time. We made it to the finals last year. We lost in the finals. And I literally was begging the other team to just tank. And then we will host next year's draft in the White House. And the draft was not in the White House because it was that game or I think, Dax,

and Lamb had like 100,000 points on that Saturday. Oh, yeah. The other team had both. So we were smoked heading into Sunday. So it was kind of a bummer. The league has been around since 1989, believe it or not. And it's essentially the same group of guys. And now it's been going on so long.

Most of us have our now adult children as partners in the league. So it's a generational thing. And it's great. Cole, my son and I, it's the thing that keeps us. in touch even now during the craziness of this election season. Of course, last night, I'm like, did Kittle score yet? We need that touchdown to win our game. And this is in the midst of, wait, I have a big speech in Pittsburgh today. I need to focus on that. Wait, did he score? So that that's the absurdity and the love of fantasy that we all love so much and brings our friends together,

families together, and we love it. So you're six and two during, you know, the busiest time of your life probably. Is that a problem? Should you be a little worse? Should I be concerned? Would I feel better if you were two and six? I was worried about that question. So Cole, my son, who's now 30, he's been my partner almost a decade. So he has stepped up every year he's gotten better and better at this and more engaged with the rhythms of the league. And he knows the other owners who are, he's known them his whole life as a little baby. I would bring him around with these guys or whatever. So now that he's going toe to toe with them and he understands their psyche on trades and drafting, I told him at the beginning of this season, look, you need to take the reins and figure this out.

I flew back to L.A. We did the draft together. And I was being that guy like, hey, pick so-and-so. He's like, shut up. You don't know anything, please. But I got him. Marvin Harrison, Jr. was mine because I said, look, I met him at the draft. I was able to go, and he just looked so good in person. And so did Jaden Daniels. I'm like, I'm not shocked at all how good this guy is after seeing him. Caleb, too. So I just said, pick Marvin Harrison, Jr.

And he did. And now he's had a couple of phenomenal games. But like Ladd McConkey was him. We lost Godwin, unfortunately, horrific injury. And he got that guy from Buffalo. We didn't even play. So he is all over it. But of course, I'm micromanaging from the road.

So I don't, I'm on a plane all the time. And I get off the plane. First thing I do is text him like, what's up? He's like, I got it. Don't worry. Okay, good. So next Tuesday, you'll be checking a lot of things that night. You won't be checking the waiver wire is what you're saying.

You won't be sneaking away to the bathroom. Look, man, I can multitask. I can try to save our country and make sure that our team gets to the finals again. Because I've only won once. It's so sad. It's a 30, what, 35th or so year of this league. I won one time. It was year 2000.

And I picked up this guy, Mike Anderson, off the waiver wires, played that one amazing season for Denver. I think it was a military vet and it was a great story. Had this one great year. And I rode that right to my only title. So there's a trophy like the Stanley Cup where it just keeps getting bigger and bigger with all the wins. So my name is on the trophy. That was 24 years ago. You imagine we win this election and we win the and win the, and win the,

league? That would just be good year. Great for the country and great for me and cool. So our boss, Bill Simmons, he's the only one that we know who's been playing fantasy football since 1980. Sounds like you're the second one now. I think when I met him, we talked about this because he's probably around my age and

it was pretty funny. The OG pre-internet, how do you do a team without internet days? Yeah, we actually just want to know. You're picking up the USA Today. You're like mailing people, things. Like, how did it run in 1989? How did you run a fantasy league? They were actually fantasy services that did exist back then, but it was so retro. It was a bunch of faxing and waiting for stats.

And then you'd have to kind of track everything in USA Today, watch ESPN, and you had to cobble together information. And there was one or two people in the league. The commissioner's job was very labor intensive back then because the commissioner had to make sure everyone got the stats and standings and faxed everyone because there was really no early email and no you couldn't so it was very retro very labor intensive and there was a lot of discussion amongst the owners for information and trainings it was probably a lot like the old days in the leagues where jams are on the phone all the time and talking so there was a lot more communication you know

between us in person or on the phone. But the smack talk is a thousand X more because, you know, there's a league chat, but then we have our own group chat offline and there are emails and then I know them all personally. And so since I'm in this position now, it's just, I just get basically abused completely at all times. Are those texts in the group chat being run by like the Secret Service? How does that work now?

That's a good point. It's like, are they? I don't know. And they might be. Yeah, no wonder. It's a little tamer these days now. It's funny, though. Like all these times they see me out there,

then it heats up. But whenever I bring up our fantasy league, I brought it up in our DNC speech. And I told these guys, look, I'm going to talk about you. And then I think I went on Jimmy Kimmel. And there's a one team, it's a 60-year-old man whose team is named Buttheads.

I said, I'm going to talk about buttheads on national TV, dude. And I did. So it was pretty fun. You're really doing the work for the fantasy community. That's right. Yeah, you are. We appreciate it. So if your wife wins the election,

can you host a draft in the White House? Has a draft ever been hosted in the White House? How does that work? There is a White House league I'm in. It's my secondary league. There already is a White House league. It's your secondary league. I forgot about it until you brought it up.

And even though it's the White House Fantasy League, it's like, look, you get that one special league that you've been in. I'm sure you guys are in multiple leagues. but this league I'm in for 35 years. That's my league. And then, oh, yeah, I'm in the White House League too, which, yeah, the draft. It's in the EEOB, which is that big building next to the White House. The one at the beginning of Veep.

It's the one from Veep and their staffers from all over West Wing and whatnot and Office of the Vice President. And I just roll in as, oh, yeah, the second gentleman's in this league. And one of my people that works on my team is my partner because I told him, look, I have no bandwidth. I can barely do with my real team. You got to deal with this other team. But yeah, no, we'll continue the tradition when she wins. And the offer to my old-time fantasy league, again, if we can get the W, I will be hosting that draft next year in the White House when we win.

What's the White House TV set up? Now we have the technology. We can watch four games, five games, six games at once. Is there a room where you can really consume it all? Situation room, maybe? Yeah, I like, I go into the city. No, just kidding, everyone, sarcasm. There are lots of TVs everywhere in the White House and the campus. And there's usually, and even the TVs have split screen. So oftentimes you'll have a big screen and then you'll have four, six or eight channels at once. So you can see every single bit of news at any given time. So of course, after hours or, you know, if there's Sunday, I'm assuming it's like eight games on. Nice. There must be a lot of TVs in the situation room, you know?

I've never been in there for the record. He's like, too much, be clear. But there are lots of TVs everywhere. So one thing we wanted to ask you about while you're here. So I understand, you know, you have a very successful career as a lawyer, but then, you know, obviously when your wife started this, you know, mega political journey that you kind of had put that to the side. But luckily, you know, I know, you, you know, very successful legal career.

I don't know if you're aware of this. We also have very successful legal careers of our own. We are our fantasy court judges. We're judges. We do a lot of very high level legal case work, pretty much on part of what you were doing as well. And so we wanted to give you the opportunity to, you know, get I know you missed the legal work. Get back and dip your toes in the legal water. And if you would honor us by being a fantasy court judge with us here today, like a special judge session, would you be down for that?

Absolutely. Yeah, I used to be commissioner of our league for four or five years. spent all my time, you know, adjudicating disputes amongst owners and making decisions and last minute rule changes. And it's a bunch of lawyers in my league. So everyone found every single loophole. So you had to think about every possibility. Otherwise, somebody would take advantage of it. So yes, I've seen it all, I think, over all these years. Perfect. Did that sharpen your legal instincts just being in a fantasy league? Like you went to law school thinking it would help you with your legal career and actually helped you run your commissioner?

It made my career, basically. arguing with all these guys, all these years, it developed these skills. So we can do a little fantasy court here. And we have a case here on the docket here. This is from a plaintiff named Andrew. Andrew. Andrew.

Okay, so Andrew writes, I was sitting on my couch this evening, this is yesterday, I was sitting on my couch this evening, basking in the downfall of the Bears Hail Mary yesterday. And just like a Friday afternoon political leak, a trade comes across my notifications. The commissioner of our league has traded Houston,

Texans wide receiver Stefan Diggs to his father-in-law for Arizona Cardinals wide receiver Marvin Harrison Jr. Now mind you, this was hours after, after Stefan Diggs had gone down with a serious non-contact knee injury and a couple league members brought up in the group chat. This is a little concerning since Diggs might be out for the season and Marvin Harrison Jr. is a top five receiver this Sunday. So they're asking in the group chat should this be discussed, the commissioner responds, and the commissioner is the one who traded digs away. The commissioner chimes in the chat and says, quote, we made a trade and don't owe anyone an explanation.

End quote. Here's my question. And this is Andrew. Here's my question. Doug, is that messed up? On so many levels. Where do I start? First of all, there has to be what we say in the law.

There is an implied covenant of good faith and fair dealing. So I'm going to give you guys some legal. terminology so you can rule. It's kind of like the no-a-hull factor. Does this sound right or not? So it's an implied covenant between the teams and the owners that we got to act in good faith and deal fairly with each other. We have in our league, we have many mechanisms to avoid that. So if it's the commissioner making a trade, someone else in the league will step in and adjudicate that. And then we have a process where if something like that egregious, that would not fly in our league. all ever. Conflict of interest. It's an injured player. It's just not, and it's just not fair to the rest

of the league. So that I would rule in favor of avoiding that particular transaction, Andrew. There's also something to be said, you know, this is a father-in-law relationship? Is there collusion going on here? Is the father-in-law's team out? And he's trying to support his son-in-law, who has a shot at the playoffs? That's why I said, where do I start? You know, there's so much a conflict of interest potentially. It's just, it's just not fair to the rest of the owners. Again, that wouldn't fly in our league for sure. Another fantasy court case we just wanted to bring to you, let's say hypothetically, hypothetically speaking, the best kicker in the NFL playing for the Dallas Cowboys had to go to jury duty. And you know, you try a lawyer. You've picked Jerry's right. He's on my team,

yeah, I got it. Yeah, he's on your team. Let's just say hypothetically he showed up for jury, Judy. Would you pick the best kicker in the NFL to serve on jury duty during the NFL season? That's a toughie because everyone's got to do their jury service. It's part of our democracy that we're all fighting for. So I'd have to say, you know what? I got called once when I was married to the United States Senator and I was shocked. A wife's name occupation, Kamala Harris, United States Senator. And it's like, okay. And I got picked. I sat there for two weeks. And, you know, I think if he's to serve, he's got to serve. I think the deal was he was, they're not adjudicating the case on Sunday, so hopefully he could still play. See, I thought you were going to ask another question

on another particular kicker who may or may not have said some things that are backwards. Would you pass on that kicker if you had the ability to pick the first kicker? So I can already answer that question, knowing who my kicker is not that person. It could have been. Also, wanted to just ask you. you real quick. You know, I know that you're also a pretty big Lakers fan. Hot start, too, three and no. They know, baby. Yeah. So, you know, I know that you described yourself as being the second gentleman as like the sixth man off the bench. And if you're the first gentleman, you know, that's a, that's a step up. So we want to ask if Kamala is obviously the star of the show,

if she's like the LeBron James or the Kobe Bryant, whatever, of the White House, what is like the Lakers role player that you would be as the, as the first gentleman? Who's your like NBA role player doppelganger from the Lakers? man. And you can go back into the Laker archives. If you want to toss out Jordan Clarkson or Lou All Dang, that's fine. Sasha Voyichich. Austin, I kind of like him. I know he's a starter instead, but I like the way he approaches everything and maybe that. Well, I want Brony to step up. So maybe Brony can actually start contributing to the best highest scoring father-son duo in NBA history and throw some points into the bucket there. We were all unsure about

JJ Reddick. I was right before I walked in here, I was on my Laker text group chat. I swear to God, I was sitting there talking about the three and O Laker. Did you see it? I was like, yes, I can't watch the games and we're like, what do you think of Redick? I'm like, we are all very happy so far because there was a, you know, it was a question mark. Nobody knew how he would do as a coach. And I mean, you can see the intensity. You can hear him in the huddles. It feels good so far. All right, Doug. So we like to end every show by thanking Lauren Michaels and a band like we're on SNL. So we noticed that you have your team name as Nirvana. Is that something that's always been? Does it change year to year? How does that work for your team? The league started in 89. I think Nirvana came out a couple years after. So as soon as they hit it big in the early 90s, I changed my team name to Nirvana. So at least 32 or three years, it's been team Nirvana, haven't changed it. And I even asked Cole, I mean, at some point, do you want to change this? He's like, nah, it's just so you. And again, if you look at some of the team names, Budhead, It takes you right back to the time.

It's just so funny. It's so early 90s and people just, for the most part, kept them. So, yeah, I know. It's team Nirvana. And it's a good way to talk about two of my biggest passions, which are music and sports. And music and sports bring people together. And that's what it's all about.

Is your son a fan of Nirvana? I think he's around me and Hypefitz's age. We're 30 years old. Is he a Nirvana guy? Because Nirvana kind of missed my generation, I think. Yeah. He's got really eclectic music taste. So he's someone who, 15 years ago,

Hey, Dad, have you ever heard of radio? I'm like, yes, of course. And so he'll bring up bands from my generation that he's discovered, whether it's pavement or whatever. But he also loves old-time jazz. And so he's a real eclectic kid, or kid, he's a grown man, 30, but his music tastes are really all over the place. So he's actually open to, like, you know, dad music,

dad generation music, and I've tried to turn him on to some things, and he's tried to introduce me to some things that he thinks I would like. And we've been to many, many, because he loved music and sports, so I had tickets for everything, and he would come. And then he loved concerts, so I remember going a Lollapalooza with him and Coachella. And of course, it's great because there's always like, oh, cool, like madness is playing, and he can watch all of his stuff. So it's something for both of us.

Do you have a Mount Rushmore favorite all-time live shows that you've attended? Yeah. So, again, going back in the 80s was just everyone came through. I'd say the all-time, like I cannot believe I was there, was the clash and English beat at the Hollywood Palladium. Nice. Wow. And R.M. at the Hollywood Palladium. So you're seeing Jane's Addiction played at Cal State Northridge where I went to college.

Oh, cool. The first Lollapalooza shows. radio head at a small club, benefit concert they played in L.A. I saw Jane's Addiction on a tennis court at a mansion. It's called The Mansion Show. I mean, I got to see some,

you know, chili peppers back in the day. These are all L.A. bands, but I got to see some crazy. And I tell Cole, and they just, well, it's like even talking about Michael Jordan and sports, where he can't believe that I experienced all that. When he saw the doc, he's like, did you see it? I said, see it.

I lived through it. through watching it on ESPN and watching and reading about it, it wasn't online. And so it's hard for my kids 30 and 25 to understand what it was like when I was their age, processing music and information in sports. You had to go find it and talk about it. And you talked about it with your friends. So it's just so different now in this age where you've got podcasts and YouTube. You can just see everything immediately.

There you had to find it. I mean, take the Dodger game, the Freddie Freeman home run. If that were 1985, I mean, you would have had to have been there. Sure, you could have seen it on sports center the next day. Well, in 86, I was out of sports bar in L.A., and I just happened to look up and see the ball go under Buckner's legs for the Mets to win. And then in 88, I just happened to be somewhere watching game one and seeing Gibson. And so I was trying to tell Cole, like, I'm shocked Freddie Freeman just didn't do this as an homage to Kirk Gibson running around the basis. Yeah, yeah.

For me to see both. But that Gibson thing was you had to wait. Not everyone knew about it right away. Freddie Freeman, I think the whole world knew within seconds of what happened and got to experience it. Yeah, you could watch the highlight 60 times a minute after it happened. It's too easy now for the kids. It's just like fantasy football. It's too easy to be commissioner now.

Everything's too easy right now. I can't believe it. When I was your age, that's my stump speech to young people. Everything, you have it so easy. We were faxing fantasy stats to our league members. I was his age when I had him. So I had him right at 29. So to experience his life as a 30-year-old, 30 years later, you know, it's just, it's the best thing in the world.

It really is to be this close to them and to go through this experience as a family. It's making us even closer. And the sports, like I said earlier, this fantasy is, it's important. It really is. It's one of those things that is so special between he and I. of course millions of people out there. That's why you have this show. And some people, it's a special thing.

Yeah, I mean, we always joke about, you know, taking fantasy not so seriously. But it is the best way to keep in touch in adulthood, the fact that you even in the middle of what I imagine is the busiest schedule anyone in America has, that you're still able to keep in touch with yourself. That is why we do all this dumb stuff. I don't know how you guys do with it,

your fandom for your team over your fantasy team, because that's always been a difficult thing when you really, when you're at odds with someone who's on your fantasy team, who you need to perform, but it might, you know, mess up your actual team that you're rude for. With Cole, what we kind of keep our love of the Rams separate from our team. So we have to, we decide we just talk about it separately. The hierarchy is fluid.

I feel like if my team is bad, I'm like, eh, fantasy team is probably more important. If my real team is good, I'm the Seahawks fan, by the way. Well, now that the Rams are kind of back in it, and we were like, whatever, they're one. Now, I know, okay, they're one game out. It's everyone's four and four. three and four and they're back to, I think everyone's healthy. I think they're keeping Cooper and everything looks good. I mean, the league, it's pretty amazing except for the Chiefs. It's just so equal. Look at the Browns beating the Ravens. I know. Look at that Washington commanders. And it's

just a bonkers, but that's why we love it. It's why we love NFL and fantasy. And democracy. In that order. Right. Vote. And then we. we'll talk about pancreatic. And so last question, obviously, you know, if, you know, if you guys win the White House, you'll host the Super Bowl, maybe Washington commanders, Jen Daniels, whoever wins the Super Bowl, you'll host them. If you do do the draft in the White House next year, do you want us to come to the White House and prep you for your fantasy draft next year?

We could do it, you know, maybe not the situation room. Yeah, and I think we make this like a weekly thing, you know, those various podcasts where, you know, you get like that rotating special guests. So, you know, I'll just come back once a week or so and just, talk about, you know, what's happening in administration, my fantasy team, and we'll just keep this thing going. Absolutely. We love it. Doug, thank you so much for coming on. We appreciate it. Thank you all. Love the show. Take care. All right. Thank you again to Doug Emhoff for coming on the show. Thank you, D.K., thank you, Craig. Thank you, thank you, Kyle, Carlos. Thank you, Allison,

and Kat. Thank you, Richter. Thank you, Jack Wilson. Thank you, Austin. Thank you, Connor. Thank you, I thank you, everybody who helped us out in the last couple weeks. And, of course, most of all. Thank you, Lord. Lord. Thank you better than Ezra. I don't know who that is. Nothing.

Wow. It was good living with you. Uh-huh. Anyways, it's a 90s song. You know, usually when you sing the song and get it, that one. People get it. Can you sing it again? No.

Come on. This was a band that was called Ezra originally. And then they got like a cease and desist from another band called Ezra. So they changed their name to better than Ezra. Really? Yeah. It's like the Michael Bolt in the... Why should I change my name?

He's the one who sucks. Yeah. That's the Stefan Diggs. I'm literally never the bigger person. I've never. Better than Esra's really good. Yeah. I don't know if they had like a lot of good song or a lot of hit songs, but I definitely

remember the song good. Were they better than Ezra? Do you know the other band? I think they were. I think they were more famous and better than Ezra. Okay. Or sorry. Than Ezra.

Yeah. The band isra. That's great. I love that. that's kind of like we were hearing about all the local business feuds, like that one in, I think Chicago, like the hot dog stands that were connected,

but family brothers who hated each other and like all those little things like that. Ezra and better than Ezra. It sounds like all those businesses where they're just slightly tweaked the name and they're like 60 feet apart. I love spite names. I love names that are like just straight up practical. At least like remember back in the day when there was phone books and companies would just like line up to get their name at the top of the phone book,

like whatever letter. So like there's a, there's a pizza place in Seattle called A Pizza Mart. Literally. I didn't know that. That's really funny. I didn't know that either.

But if you wanted pizza, wouldn't you open to P? Yeah, but it probably would be organized like it under pizza or something and then it would be like the top one would be a pizza mark. Oh,

I see. It's at the top of the pizza page. Right, right, right. The original SEO. Yeah. I mean, honestly, I can't remember how they organize.

I think they organized phone books. Like there was, was obviously the alphabeticals with just people. And then, man, I can't remember. I think businesses maybe were organized by like- Talking about phone books is one thing. I can't remember what was in the phone book. It's like, that's a different level of old.

To me, like, my only memory of phone books is not using them. It was like, it was like playing with them or hitting people with them. That was right. My brother and I, like the Dukes of Hazard thing, we would make bets and we would hit each other with phone books. Yeah, it was like, can you rip a phone book in half using it as like something to sit on? you know, hitting somebody with it. That was what a phone book was.

That's all I got to say about that. I think I can't remember anything sometimes because my brother, we used to use the local phone book and then one time he used Manhattan. I don't think of ever been the same since. That explains a lot. Yeah. All right, goodbye, everyone.

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