The Ringer NFL Show - Running Back Tiers

Episode Date: August 3, 2020

We talk through our running back tiers and point out the players we like the most, and the ones who should be relegated to the tier below. Tier 1 (8:30) Tier 2 (9:37) Tier 3 (12:51) Tier 4 (15:04) Tier 5 (27:11) Tier 6 (32:58) Tier 7 (38:03) Tier 8 (44:49) Tier 9 (47:11) Check out the Ringer Fantasy Football Guide for a closer look at our tiers, rankings, and more. Hosts: Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's up? I'm Danny Heifitz, and I'm here with my co-host, Danny Kelly, and the quarterback for the Los Angeles Chargers, Craig Horrell Beck. How are you doing? Doing well, doing well. How are you doing? I'm bad. Real bad. How are you doing, Craig? I'm happy to be here. Training camp is ramping up. I'm working on my body. I'm trying to do a lot of pliometrics get loose, so I'm feeling good. Do you know what pliometrics are, Craig? Absolutely. What do you do? Pliometrics are for like your vertical

that makes you jump higher it's like explosive muscle exercises do you have the jump shoes from like Seinfeld or whatever yeah oh what's that guy's name who has those

Jimmy Jimmy yeah I got those cool well it's it's August now so I just think about Seinfeld think of it George

just eating tomatoes like apples well we can do a Seinfeld pot if you want every running back as Seinfeld characters no

I I'm going to talk about something relevant, which is the best Twitter thread I read in the year of 2019. And I came across this incredible... No, no, this from last year, but it blew my mind. Got it. And it was... The person tweeted, please quote this tweet

with a thing that everyone in your field knows and nobody in your industry talks about because it would lead to general chaos. This was my favorite read. This got 15,000 retweets. I cannot tell you the things I read among the replies.

to this. Among them being most college professors were never trained to teach. The heat death of the universe is inevitable. Someone wrote that trees can feel pain. Oh, Jesus. Someone wrote, every hotel room is pretty

disgusting, no matter how clean it is. Oh, I know that. A lawyer wrote that settling cases is cheaper than winning. And then my favorite one is a flight. Someone wrote, flight attendants usually never know if you're going to make your connecting flight, but we say yes to get you all out of her face. Is the heat

depth of the universe is inevitable thing that the fact that the earth is slowly moving towards the sun and it'll eventually heat it up? No, it's basically, if Newton's second law of thermodynamics is true, then the universe constantly expanding, I think it's about entropy and chaos

and basically we're all doomed. It's just, their energy will just end. I'm not a scientist, but... This is like in five years or five billion years? I think that's happening this year. I think that's happening this year, actually. It's starting. It's like a cycle.

Also, just one other one that's mind-blower. When cities get held hostage by ransomware, like cyber hacked, and they hire a security consulting company to, like, stop the hackers, most of those companies just pay the ransom. That's how they get out of it.

Google pro-publica's story about it, actually the most mind-blowing thing. Well, I feel like the smartest hackers are the people who are not employed by companies like that, you know, They're just like the guys in like they're like dens in the basement. Yeah, they're pirates. It's great. Surfing the high seas.

Can we just start every podcast with really, really random facts? Yeah. Well, so here's things. First of all, yes. It's like we already do. But we can get better about it. But this got me thinking about what is the secret in fantasy football that everyone inside knows, but if it was public, it would lead to chaos.

And I've decided that when the best fantasy football players are drafting and there's like 20 seconds left and the clock is ticking. They're not looking at rankings. They're looking at tiers. And there's an entire fantasy football draft industrial complex around putting rankings out. But that's not actually what the best players are looking at right before they make their picks. So first off, DK, do you want to explain what draft tiers are and then how you use them? Yeah, I mean, basically, you can do tiers in a few different ways.

you can tier it by all positions, basically, like, where you're going to take guys. Or you can make tiers in each position group. It's basically a decision-making tool. It's something that helps you, like, in the heat of the moment, when the pressure's on, you can look at that tier and say, okay, I like four guys almost equally or around the same value. And if there's four guys there, I can probably pick, I can probably pick a different position and still end up with one of these guys in my next pick. So it's basically helping you predict where the cliffs are for each tier.

So, like, you know, if you really, really want a top tier quarterback, you're going to have to take him at X place, whereas if you're okay having a guy in the next tier, then you can wait or if you're okay having a guy later on in the tier, that's just fine too. You don't have to pick in that position. So I like to look at it like if I'm on the clock, I like four different guys. I like four different receivers in this tier. So I'm fine taking a running back here where the teardrop is about to happen and then I'll just be happy getting a different receiver a little bit later on. Again, for me, it's about a decision-making framework exactly as D.K. said.

And it's really helped. Like, at the end of the day, I think everyone knows, like, if someone is ranked 39th and another person's ranked 40th, that means the 39th person is projected to be better. But it's not like, we will like life or death say 39 will be better than 40. But where it's really helpful is that if scarcity changes throughout the draft, so even though you know, oh, here's how scarce running backs are entering the draft, when you get to like the 50th or 60th pick, it's very helpful to know, oh, there is two people left on this board that I would be very happy with as my second running back. And there are nine receivers left that I would be very happy left with as my second receiver. That's where it comes into and saying, wow, it's much easier to track scarcity as

it comes. And at the end of the day, value is about scarcity and supply and demand. That's really what it helped you track. I almost think you should label your tiers almost what you just said, Danny, like comfortable wide receiver twos, comfortable wide receiver three is like usable flex options, just so you can kind of organize your thoughts. Where it really helps, where it really helps is that someone when it's like, oh, low end wide receiver ones, wow, that could be. be my wide receiver three versus this running back. I don't care. There's, and that's where it really comes to help is when there's, you're like, oh, there's 20 seconds left. What do I do? And then there's a huge gap between your value of position. So that's how I'm labeling your tears.

D.K., is that how you use tears? Co loosely? That's exactly right. I think it's just, it's a matter of figuring out who you want, like what position almost to take. You know, that's why I don't particularly like grouping all positions together is because it really just depends on your strategy, on what you're taking into the draft. Like, do you want to go late QB? Then you can wait really late on a QB. You don't have to worry about X QB in that tier. So I like to tear them out in position groups just because it gives me an idea of like where

to target each position. And you can also draw a red line because some people are just like, you know what? I will not have Marlon Mack start for me. I will not do it. And it's very nice to be able to draw the line of, oh, crap. If I don't grab a running back now, I'm going to have Marlon Mac playing for me. So it's just as helpful for that. So with that intro, we're going to do running backs today.

We're going to do receivers later this week. I'm thrilled about this. This is one of my favorite things to do. So shall we dive in? Yeah. It's a good exercise to do, honestly, too, because then it sort of makes you like, make your calls and decide if you're going to, if you'd be willing to take these guys, you know, in these certain ranges.

I completely agree. So I encourage people who want to do this ahead of their draft. If you actually take the time to sit down and make your own tiers, it's one of the most helpful things you can do when you actually draft. But if not, the fantasy football draft guide at the ringer.com, that is fantasyf football. Dot the ringer.com. We have tiers in each position. This is actually the tiers we have in this episode.

We have from the draft guide. We will be updating that next week once all the opt-outs for the season are. public or known but right now we're going to use the tiers we have on the ringer and we'll be talking about you know kind of what's changed in our thinking since then so starting with in a tier of his own tier one one player tier we got christian mcalfrey do we have any qualms with mcalfrey getting his own tier no i see this as if we did a fast food ranking this would be in and out and it's just obviously deserves its own too okay okay oh my god the californ okay mcalfrey's the in and out of running backs moving on i do no no no no no no no no

First of all, can I spit some truth at you bit in and out? No. The name is a lie. I have never in my life been in and out of an in and out. It takes a long time. It's so popular. No, it's because they purposely spaced them across cities so they're really high traffic. But the result is they're not quick at all.

No, it's because they actually have to cook your food freshly upon order, and it's not sitting under a heat lamp. And they can just flip it out at you like a frisbee. So don't call it in and out. if you have to in and then stay and then leave. Is Burger King the King of Burgers? Names or just names? Feels like we're getting off track a little here.

McAvary is the best. We all know it. We can go to Tier 2. McCaffrey's number one. Yeah, it's clear. All right, tier two. We got Seekwon Barkley, Ezekiela, Elliot, Alvin Kamara, and Dalvin Cook.

I think in my mind, this tier is guys who could finish as the number one player in fantasy football this year and nobody would be surprised any qualms with that tier. one Zeeke, Kamara, Cook. No, I mean, I think, I think this is a pretty solid group. And the only question mark, I guess I have, is whether or not Dalvin Cook belongs in this group. I think he did enough last year to make his way up into this elite group. The other question I wanted to ask you guys, is there a world where you would take Alvin Kamara over Ezekiel Elliott? Or is it absolutely Barclay Elliott-Kamara, Ben Cook?

I mean, if we're talking PPR leagues, I think you can make the argument. And honestly, I'm okay. I actually think that I'm okay with any variation of these four people. If somebody took Dalvin Cook second, I wouldn't even like spit out my water or anything like that. That's that, so that's actually maybe even a better framework for how to make tears. Yeah. Is the way I look at tears is I don't care how you order these people. Maybe it's not the way I would do it. But if you're like, I think Zikaela Elliott will be better than Sequin this year. I disagree, but you're not crazy. It doesn't make me feel anything. But if you're saying Aaron Jones will be better than Sequel. Sequin this year. That's nuts to me. That's why Aaron Jones is in a different tier. So I don't care how we order the people in these groups at all. I took Alvin Camara in a dynasty superflex mock for Rotow world last week over Elliott. And then I was thinking to myself like, was that a hot, like, was that a hot take? Or was that something that people are going to be like, what are you doing? But I really don't think there's that big of a difference between any of these guys. I think it's just a matter of preference. That was a PPR league. I just think Cameras still, you know, got the

upside to be just this absolutely, you know, high, high upside guy, you know, in the receiving game particularly. So, yeah. Does it scare you guys at all? I think Kamara is the most, like, maybe it's Sequin as well, but he's definitely like kind of the sexiest pick, I think, in the first five picks is Alvin Kamari. He almost is every year. There's just something alluring about him. I don't know if it's the fact that he's just a receiving back and that's what's so cool or if it's like smooth style of play. Does it at all worry you? Because I think I want him out of those four guys because it's just fun to have them on your team. But like, isn't that just way safer to have Zeeke because he's going to get 300 rushes and just like be consistent. And Alvin Kamara is going

to have like 208 touches, but like 90 of them will be catches. So like those are more valuable. Like does it worry you at all from like a security standpoint? I have Zika over Kamara, but I'm not worried because if you have one of the first four picks, I want one of the first four running backs. At five, you can talk to me about Dalvin Cook or Michael Thomas, but I'm still taking cook just because of how running backs are this year. But like do you value rushes? Not the word. It's like an intellectual curiosity. But I don't feel worried. about like Alvin Kamara's work. So like the security of 300 touches

is not more alluring to you about a guy you're taking in the first round. I have, it absolutely is. And I have Zeke higher than Kamara, but it's not worrying enough because I think the Saints are going to be so good this year. And I think their defense is going to be so good this year

that I'm not going to get emotional. I think their lines are like doing the best shape of their lives thing. Oh, the best shape of their lives. Yeah, that's it. Yeah. Camaro posted some picture of him. Like he looks freaking jacked right now. I think the Saints are going to win the Super Bowl.

So, all right. Let's keep going here because we don't really disagree about anything yet. Tier 3. This is where we're probably a little different than everyone. We have tier 3 as just Derek Henry and Joe Mixon, which I look at as guys who could finish is the number one running back, but we don't really believe they're going to do it. There's at least more question marks.

The floor and the ceiling are further apart, I feel like, for these guys. So I'm a big Henry believer. I think Henry's just going to go off. I think he breaks tackles. He creates his own yardage at a higher rate than any other back. in football. He's going to get the volume. What do you mean he creates his most yards? What do you mean by that? He so actually I saw this from NFL.com to next gen stats. Nick Shook at NFL.com

did a study on it's yards over expectation for rushing for running backs. It's sort of like the completion rate over expectation for quarterback stat that that's been kind of gaining some popularity. And Derek Henry. Yeah, Derek Henry finished first in the NFL in yards over. expectation as a running back the last two seasons and by like a pretty good margin. So I think that, you know, to me is is indicative of like the quality and caliber of player is how difficult it is to tackle him. And, you know, pairing that with the fact that

he's going to get a ton of volume is what makes me feel really good about him. But he's in tier three because he doesn't get, you know, he's not a pass catcher in the, in at least anywhere near the guys above him. So I think that's the big question mark. And anybody in tier three is going to have some question marks. Craig, what pick do you have to have to take either Henry or Joe McI? Like, what pick do you need to have Derek Henry where you're like, oh, yeah, I got Derek Henry? Like ninth or tenth, maybe? I'm just not excited to have Derek Henry on my team.

I agree. I'm very not excited to have Joe makes on my team. I think I wrote this in our planning thing here. I just feel like I'd rather have the guys in the next tier more than the guys in this tier. And I know that's incorrect, but there is still something about being excited about your fantasy team and Derek Henry and Joe Mixon just don't make me excited. I'd rather take a receiver, I think. This reminds me of last year when we all wanted the fourth round guys instead of the third

round guys. Yeah, I mean, I think I'd rather have the first five picks of the draft or the last three. I don't want to be in like the 7-8-9 range. All right, well, let's look at Tier 4 for a second. Might as well merge them into tier 4. Tier 4 for us is Kenyon Drake on the Cardinals, Aaron Jones on the Packers, Miles Sanders on the Packers, Miles Sanders on the Eagles, and Nick Chubb on the Browns, Josh Jacob on the Raiders and Austin Echler on the Chargers.

First of all, any qualms with those guys should be promoted or relegated, and how do you guys feel about those guys in Jumbickson and Derek Henry? I think that's a pretty solid group. I don't really feel, I don't feel strongly that any of those guys should be dropped out. I would say, and Danny, we had this discussion yesterday. Is there any reason to be worried about Nick Chubb? So I... You think he could be higher, potentially.

I think Nick Chubb could be a lot higher or a lot lower. here's the problem with with with with the browns this year we have not gotten a normal off season obviously and so there's just very little information about the new coaching staffs there's very little information about this browns coaching staff because kevin stefansky who's the coach now for the browns has been calling plays for what like one year he's a very limited history i don't know much about what he's going to do and basically the knock on the like the approach to the browns goes like this nick chub is amazing since he came into the league he has like the first or second most rushing yards,

almost run the rushing yards title last year. But in the first half of the season, he was like a top three running back. And in the second half of the season, when Kareem Hunt came back from suspension, Nick Chub was basically like the 22nd best running back and Kareem Hunt was like the 23rd best running back. They were basically the same in fantasy points when he returned.

So is Nick Chubb really safe with touches? My problem with that argument is it's about usage. All the people who decided Nick Chub's usage were fired. That's a different coaching staff. It's a different front office. And I wouldn't usually cite a front office in running backs, but John Dorsey was the GM. John Dorsey drafted Kareem Hunt in Kansas City and then was in Cleveland. And the coaches in Cleveland were had job security problems.

It does matter about playing Kareem Hunt when John Dorsey drafted Kareem Hunt. So I guess that I'm just dubious of a lot of the reasoning to doubt Nick Chubb's workload. It's more to me about we have no idea how Kevin's defense is going to use Chubb. hunt. Do you guys have any clues to that? We're kind of just going off a different coaching staff from last year. Well, and I think that just makes Chubb not the pick you want in this, in this range, because I don't know, I feel like coaches always lean more towards a committee, like when you can, like, why overwork a player when you don't have to, especially when you have a backup like Cream Hunt, who won the rushing title as a rookie in Kansas City or was close to it? Like, these guys are

pretty similar in talent, whether or not Chub's an incrementally better rusher. But they're so close and talent that I really would find it hard to believe if they're just going to give Chubb like 80% of the touches. Like that just doesn't seem likely to me. Why wouldn't they use both? And I think they should probably be a bit closer in the rankings. DK., can you, I think that a lot of people succeed in an Andy Reid offense. There's a tendency to think maybe they're a system running back. Can you talk about how freaking good Kareem Hunt is on the field? Like just context that he maybe is not a system player. Oh yeah. I don't think, I don't think Hunt is a system player. I mean, he's been, he's coming out of college, he was one of the most elusive backs coming into

the draft. He proved that in the NFL. He's a much better pass catcher than I think anyone realized. He was running like vertical routes for the Kansas City Chiefs offense. You know, wheel routes up the sideline, all that stuff. Like he's a good receiver. He's very elusive. He's built like he's, he can, you know, shoulder a heavy load. And I think that's the main thing that worries me is none of these other guys in this tier. Like Jacobs has some other competition from like Jalen Richard and then a rookie. It's, There's other things there that were you a little bit. You were that Josh Jacobses rocks for hands.

No, I think he's a good receiver. It just doesn't seem like the Raiders want to use him like that. And then, you know, obviously you got Aaron Jones, has the rookie coming in, A.J. Dillon. But no one in this tier has the same caliber of, quote, backup that Chubb does. So ultimately, I think Chub's in the right spot here. I don't doubt this ranking. I think you could even maybe make the argument to move him up. But I think there's enough uncertainty over his volume.

with the new coaching staff, with his really good backup, that there's a little bit of a reason to, I guess, just be concerned. One of their player I'd like to nominate a conversation for in this tier, and I want to call him the Stephen Glansberg of this tier. What, so I've got to sit here and you need to desert alone like I'm fucking Stephen Glansberg? I get. Yeah, I mean, what do you want me to do? Josh Jacobs, who I actually think no one is talking about.

Like, we haven't said one word about him. Dick just talked about him. This is the first time. And I never read about him. No one ever talks about him. I think it's just kind of assumed that like he doesn't catch passes, but he was phenomenal. I think he was like, wasn't he PFF's number one running back in 2019? And he was so good.

He was so good as a rookie. Or whatever. He was really up there. He was high. Yeah. So here's my only thinking is like, are we all maybe underrating the possibility that Josh Jacobs could catch 42 passes and then be like the third best running back in the league? If you're looking for Christian McCaffrey, and by that, I mean the guy going in the middle of the second round who could just be the top running back, which was the case in 2018, I think it's in this tier.

Because I think maybe Nick Chub could just win the job, get 80% of the touches. I think Miles Sanders could do the same thing in Philadelphia. And he's up. He's amazing. I think Austin Echler, oh, yeah, he's exactly like September of last year or Josh Jacobs. Like, there's Kenyon Drake. Like, I do think basically everyone in this tier except Aaron Jones, to me, could finish top two or three. I wouldn't be shocked at all.

I feel like even Jones could. That's why having the last pick in a 12 or 10 team draft would be really nice to just turn the corner and hit both two of these guys. So to answer your question, though, I do think there is a chance that Jacobs ends up being a three-down back for the Raiders and ends up getting the vast majority of the receiving work. And I think that's what the Raiders have said they envision for him. However, the proof has been more in what they've actually done. They re-signed Jalen Rashard to a contract. They drafted Lynn Bowden in the third round and called him a running back. So I guess the assumption there is that he's going to be sort of their past catching running back.

He was a receiver slash quarterback, like wildcat quarterback in college. So I don't know. I think it's just their actions are different than their words. And I think that's really scaring people off. And I would probably be in that group of people that are scared off. I just think that he's really, really good. and he has, like one of the biggest things I love about him coming out of Alabama was he's a good receiver, but they just haven't used him like that yet. And so I think that's just the question mark there. But you could make the same questions. You could really have the same questions for a lot of these guys is how they're going to be used. What kind of volume they're going to have? Yeah, I don't know if it's just my human nature is why I was like, I'm starting to get interested in Josh Jacobs, even though I was so disinterested in him like a month and a half ago, just because no one's talked about him. I'm like, maybe this is a diamond in the rough that I can get some good value on. I like him. I think he's a good. I think he's a good. I like him. I think he's a. I think he's a. great player and, you know, I think he's only going to get better. So I don't, I don't think that's a

bad idea to kind of target him in that area. There is one guy who should be in this tier. Yeah, we're promoting, we're promoting Clyde Edwards O'Lear from the previous tier. Obviously, we, he is the rookie from LSU. He's expected to be really good. So yesterday, Damien Williams, the incumbent running back for the chiefs that we have had many arguments about. He opted out of the season. His mother has stage four cancer, so he chose not to play this year due to the pandemic. So his absence leaves, basically leaves Clyde Edwards-Hillair as the seemingly clear option to be the starting running back for that team. So where do you guys, would you take Clyde Edwards-Hillair? Obviously, he's no longer alongside Todd Gurley and Melvin Gordon people.

But would you put him in this group with like Kenyon Drake, Aaron Jones, Miles Sanders, Chubb, Josh Jacobson, Eccler? Or would you put him above them? I would squarely put him in tier four, but I know some people are putting him in like tier three or even higher. Like some people are putting him right below a doubt cook. They're that. They believe that strongly in the Chiefs' offense. They believe that strongly in their ability to score points and how they'll use him in the passing game. And I really, I'm not strongly against that, but I don't think, and you know, we talked about this on the last pot.

The Damien Williams opting out thing doesn't really affect my opinion of Edwards Haller that much other than it. It just kind of confirms what I was already believing that. I think he's going to be the lead guy anyway. I think they probably will end up doing like a 70-30 split with whoever, whether it's Washington or, you know, they go in and sign Devante Freeman or something like that. You know, there's still these chances they could bring in a veteran. But I still think Edwards is probably going to get like 65, 70 percent of the workload in that offense. And so keeping him in around this tier four, tier five, I think tier four squarely is where he belongs now. I agree, but I have no problem if you put him at the top of this tier.

Yeah. Because I- Putting it right with Kenyon Drake. feels right to me. You could take him in the first round and I wouldn't be upset. Yeah. Yeah, I think now that he's out, Williams is out. I don't think there's anyone in this backfield who really approaches what he's going to be able to do. And as much as I had my qualms when Williams was there, I just, I no longer have them. So there you go, DeKav. Join the CEH bandwagon. Hope there's still room. All right, guys, before we get to our next tier, let's take a quick break to talk about

Fandle because sports are back. Shout out the bubble. We are taking in all of the action on Fandul's sports book. How did you guys feel watching basketball this week? It was amazing. I love everything they've done. I have no problems with the virtual fans. I like the piped in noise. I don't know if it's just sports are back. That's blinded me, but I'm all in. I was shocked how much I like the baseball fans in the crowd, but I'm creeped out by the NBA ones. I just love seeing people argue on Twitter about sports and be excited about sports again.

It's awesome. Yeah, it's great. We should get a cardboard cut out of all three of us and put it at at Dodger Stadium. That'd be fun. How much would that cost? I don't know. I'll look into it. We will do that off there. Okay. Fandul is America's number one sportsbook app. The app is really easy to use. There's no thumb hover, which means I'm thinking I don't know what to click next.

Never have that on Fandall. Whether you're a season better or you're new to betting, you'll find what you're looking for in just a few taps. No thumb hover. And once you win, Fandle will page you out in as little as 24 hours. Best of all, Fandle's Sportsbook will let you place your first bet risk free. just place any bet you want, get up to $500 back if you don't win. Craig, have you already placed the bet, right?

Yeah, Fandle gave me 10 free bucks to bet for the return of the NBA, threw it on the Lakers-Clippers game, made a little lineup, 112 bucks. So like, I'm all in. I have one issue with you, and it's because you're a coward, because you sent us the screenshot that you were winning money with like eight minutes left in the fourth quarter, which is what you do when you want to show us that you are winning, but you're afraid that you will drop out of the winner's circle

and you want to capture it before you lose. I was at $15 then and then I ended up at 12 but you're right. I was a little... You're like you're on the down slope because I feel like you were way higher and then you saw it go down and you're like, oh shit, I got to make sure they know I'm winning.

I felt good about my lineup. I was proud. I picked Jamichael Green. You know, I really made some smart moves. Always bet on Jamichael Green. That's our fantasy football advice. Download the Fandle Sportsbook app to get started and be sure to sign up

with promo code ringer fantasy so they know that we sent you. That is Fandul's sportsbook with the promo code ringer fantasy. National disclaimer, 21 plus and present in New Jersey, Pennsylvania, West Virginia, Indiana, or Colorado, first online real money wager only. See sportsbook. Fandul.com for terms and restrictions. Gambling problem? Call 1-800 gambler or in West Virginia visit www.1-800 gambler.net or in Indiana, call 1-800-9 with it. Or in Colorado, call 1-800-522-470-400. Next tier, we've got, I guess I would describe this as high-volume guys with like a lot of question marks.

It's kind of all like guys aging out of their running back prime, maybe. Yeah. Guys, guys were like, they're still here. Todd Gurley on the Falcons Melvin Gordon on the Broncos Leonard Furnett on the Jaguars even though they were very openly trying to trade him David Johnson on the Texans

Chris Carson on the Seahawks James Connor and the Steelers Levion Bell on the Jets and then Jonathan Taylor on the Colts Do you guys have any qualms with anyone in this group whether they should be promoted or relegated? A lot of these guys are guys who are awesome on a different team and are now on a new team

and are a little bit older so I guess I want to talk about the young guys more than anything, because I feel like we kind of know what we're getting with guys like Levion Bell, Leonard Fournette, Todd Gurley to a degree. I'd like to, I want to talk about what your guys' thoughts on Jonathan Taylor and Chris Carson. Yeah. I was actually thinking this right as you were talking is that I could, I would not be opposed, but in Carson and Taylor, and maybe even James Connor, honestly, in tier four with with the likes of Josh Jacobs and that kind of group because, hey, look, for whatever reason, people just can't.

not buy into the Chris Carson thing. Like, you know, maybe it's because Richard Penny is there or they just don't believe in him. I don't know. Like he did have... Carl's Hyde. Yeah, he did have... Well, yeah, yeah. I think Hyde is more just like insurance in case Carson. It's the Rashad Penny

thing, but... Because some people can't wrap their minds that just because Rashad Penny was the first rounder, Chris Carson is the seventh rounder, that Chris Carson is the best running back on the Seattle Seahawks. I think it's hard for people to kind of, yeah, figure that out or at least just accept it. Last year, in half PPR, Carson was the QB...

was the running back 11. He was an RB one. He was fifth in rushing yards. Yeah. And he's on a team that absolutely will never give up running the ball for anything. Like it's the most locked in thing you could imagine. He just gets hurt all the time. What if they were cybersecurity hacked?

Would they stop running the ball? Maybe that's the thing. Maybe you have to hack them, DK. Just be like, if you start passing more on first down, I will relinquish. DK, why does Chris Carson feel? less safe than every other running back. That's what I'm trying to, that's what I'm trying to ask. I, you know what?

I went into last year, very, very confident, Carson. He did have the fumbling issue, which kind of affected him a little bit, but he still finished as a running back one. He would be played in 15 games. Richard Penny is not probably going to even start the season. He's going to be on the PUP list probably for at least the first six weeks, maybe longer. even if they do split, you know, the workload at, you know, after Penny gets back, I still think that Carson still has that upside to be a low-end RV-1.

So I don't know. I just don't get exactly why the consensus on Carson is so low. I think it's just pretty simple. Everyone else in this tier, Todd Gurley, real-life first-rounder, actual fantasy first-rounder was the fantasy top running back. Melvin Gordon, real-life first-rounder. Leonard Fournette, real-life top-five pick. David Johnson, real-life third-rounder,

who became the number one running-back in all fantasy four. years ago. James Connor, not a first rounder, but replaced Levi-on-Bell and then was really good, which made him very, for America's, like, third most popular team. And then Levy on Bell, real-life second rounder for America's third-most-popular team, very good for a long time. Jonathan Taylor's second round. Chris Carson, seventh rounder who got his job, like, after two other people ahead of him got hurt. And, like, he's just not famous. And he just, you know, it's just, it's completely different to his rise. And he's never stayed healthy for a full season. So it's just, he's never been, oh, like a league winner.

He's just never been, his ceiling's never been what these guys have. But to Craig's point, the biggest issue I have with this tier and the biggest change I've had since we made these tiers a few weeks ago for the guide launch is I'm wondering if James Connor should be in tier four or if there should be a tier ahead of this one with Todd Gurley and James Connor because I don't think James Connor and Levi-on-Bel should be in the same tier. Levy on Bell, in my mind, does not have the upside that James Connor. I can't James Connor's best case scenario is top five running back. Levy on Bell's best case scenario to be is not a top five running back.

So I would split this tier into like call me King Solomon. Oh, and then maybe that's where Clydezler is or maybe he jumps two tiers then. Yeah. And then I agree with you. And maybe we put Chris Carson in that tier because D.K. kind of convinced me. I'm looking at it. I'm looking at. Also Jonathan Taylor, maybe. I don't know. I would cleave this. We can maybe when you check the fantasy guide.

next week, we'll do this. But I would cleave Connor, Carson. I would rescue them. Or we could just, maybe we'd just go through the next tier and maybe we relegate Levion to it. Because the only thing about Carson is like, well, what's actually interesting is he played 15 games last year and 14 the year before that, which is more than I thought he played. I feel like he just is playing through injuries a lot than maybe, but he only caught 20 passes two years ago and he caught 37 last year. So is he a little Josh Jacobsy? Yeah. But maybe he should just be with Josh Jacobs then. Like, is there any reason why one of those is better than the other? Jacobs is a first rounder again.

No, but like in your head, like when you're drafting, if you were looking at the two of them, would you be like these are pretty much equal to me? I still feel like I probably put Jacobs on a higher tier mentally, but in reality, I don't think there's that big of a difference. What does that mean? Who cares about reality? This is fantasy football.

Don't give me reality. This is my escapism. I'm saying even me, who is a Seahawks fan, who's been a Chris Carson Truther, still can't quite get, there. It's just because everybody on the Seahawks is undervalued. It's going to be a truth or DK. You have to go all the way. I do think

I think there's a good argument to be made to move Carson up here and move Taylor up who's going to be running behind one of the best offensive lines. We might just be moving other people down. Let's go to the next tier. The next tier is a big drop to me. Tier 5 and tier 6 is huge. There is a chasm. There is a lot. This is

so in terms of like the practical element in all my drafts, what I've been realizing is I want one of the running backs we've already talked about. Like those tier five guys as I want one of those guys to be at least my starting running back would love to grab two and if I can't get two of those guys

then I want really good wide receivers I almost like the idea of starting with two big wide receivers and then getting two of those running backs whatever the formula is there's a big drop in my mind here Tier 6 is Chicago's David Montgomery Buffalo's Devon Singletary

Baltimore's Mark Ingram L.A's camakers and Detroit's DeAndre Swift L.A. These are all guys that there's just huge questions here. David Montgomery, how good is he? Devin Singletary, is he going to be like a great running back or is Zach Moss going to do his carries? Mark Ingram is he even going to start for the team? I kind of want to start there, D.K. Mark Ingram was amazing last year, but had a lot

of touchdowns. Now they drafted J.K. Dobbins. Do you think Mark Igrim is the starting running back for the Baltimore Ravens in like October, assuming there was professional football in October? Nominally, he's going to be the starter, but I think they're going to split it enough that it's going to really drastically affect his fantasy standing. And I just think Dobbins is such a good player. He's definitely going to eat into Ingram's bottom line. So that's why he moves down into this group. Looking at this group, if David Johnson and David Montgomery were on the board at the same

time for me, I'm going with Montgomery. Why? I know that you guys, I know that this is becoming sort of a bit on the pod that you guys love David Johnson. I don't buy it. But they're going to get, they're both going to get similar, if not. like exactly the same type of volume, I think. Montgomery is the guy in Chicago.

I think they're still standing behind him, even though he was pretty under-underwarming as a rookie. He's younger. He's been healthy. I don't know. I just think I'm picking Montgomery over, Johnson. No, there's a good argument here, and I think that there's a reason you're behind him,

which is, I mean, at the end of the day, you're a tape grinder, D.K., but there's no one else in the Bears roster that can do what David Montgomery can do. It's not like someone else using his lunch. Tariq Cohen, his skill set is nothing. like David Montgomery's. And behind him is, who is it, Ryan Nall? There's some Ryan Nall truthers out there, but yeah, I don't think he's going to be a starter. We will not mention them.

We will not mention them on this podcast. Yeah, but I think the biggest difference here is that Tariq Cohen can do what no one on the Texans can do. I mean, last year. How did David Johnson get roped into this? Well, I mean, this is a conversation and we're like, fuck you. This is how the tier system works, Danny. You got to decide. He's on the relegation block. Duke Johnson caught 44 passes last year and had 62 targets on the Texans, and Tariq Cohen had over 100 targets. And it's like, I think that David Johnson can do what Duke Johnson can do. And I think David Montgomery cannot do what Tariq Cohen can do. And I think that's the difference.

Yeah, but I think honestly, well, this gets into the question of like coaching decisions. But like Duke Johnson is a more complete running back. Like Duke Johnson could be one B. I don't know how you can say that. Didn't they trade for Duke for David Johnson? go look at any of any of Duke Johnson's stats. He is incredibly good. Can he run between the tackles or not?

What's that? Because it seems like three different coaching staffs have been like Duke Johnson can run between the tackles and then they try and he can't and they have someone else do it. The argument cannot be look at these two guys' stats. David Johnson was the number one player in football in 2015. Well, it's part of a whole offense. You know how long ago that is.

Dude Johnson's never been that. So how can you see it? Barack Obama was president when David Johnson did that. That's all I'm going to say about that. All right. So anyway, Leveon Bell, we had in the tier above this. Would you guys relegate Leveon Bell to this, or would you promote David Montgomery to the likes of Melvin Gordon and David Johnson? Or would you say you'd bring them down?

I would relegate Leveon before I promoted Montgomery. I think ultimately I'm fine with putting like Montgomery in the same tier as Ingram Acres and Swift. Singletary maybe worries me a little bit in this group just because I don't, yeah, I'm just not confident with how they're going to use him exactly. He's not going to be, I don't think he's going to be the past catcher for them. It could be like a 1A, 1B thing with Moss. And I don't know, I'm just not super confident in Singletary at this point. But it's hard to, it's hard to predict what they're going to do in that backfield.

I think I'd rather have Singletary than Mark Ingram. I don't really know why. But that's just how I feel. I think we can all agree. David, if you want upside, if you're who could, which of these guys could be a, I don't want to be like Josh Jacobs, but a top 10 running back. David Montgomery, Devin Singletary and Camakers, to me, clearly have the most upside. Mark Ingram does not

because Mark Ingram is unlikely to get better than last year and I like Craig's idea. Like you want someone to theoretically have the best year ahead of them. Mark Ingram does not. And I love Mark Ingram. So DeAndre Swift is the name here that I'm just like, yeah. I like Swift. I'm higher than on Swift, I think, than a lot of people. And maybe that's

just because I'm very low on carry on. Okay. Well, let's keep going because this is where things get interesting. Tier 7. These are like the backup running backs that could be really good. We don't know. Kareem Hunt on Cleveland, New England's James White,

Tampa base Ronald Jones. We had Damien Williams in this tier. Obviously he opted out. With San Francisco, we have Kevin Coleman and Ricky Mostert because when we made these tiers, Rahim Mostert wanted to trade. Detroit's Carry on Johnson.

We have Baltimore's J.K. Dobbins. Miami's Jordan Howard and Washington's Darius Geis. Let's talk about Ronald Jones because Tampa Bay signed LaShawn McQuay yesterday and Kishon Vaughn, who's the rookie they drafted, was put on the COVID-Rose.

list. Do you think Lashon McCoy would actually eat into Ronald Jones's carries, or did they just sign Lashon McCoy because they need someone to show up to practice? Hi Fitz. Can you describe what the COVID reserve list is? It is for people who tested positive for COVID-19 or were exposed to someone who tested positive and the NFL is not going to release which of those it is. So we don't know why, but we know that he was either tested positive or exposed to someone who did. But players aren't. aren't going to be doing padded practices until I believe August 17th, usually they do that late July. I mean, we'll see if we can get to August 17th at this point, the way MLB is going. But we're not at the point where I'm going to start saying, I'm out down on Kishon Vaughn because he's on the COVID-19 list. But I'm just more curious about the football wise. If LaShawn McCoy's skill set to UDK is more eating into Ronald Jones's skill set or Kishon Vaughn. I don't know, man. Like this is what a mess. What a freaking mess.

This is a disaster. Welcome to the 2020 season. I want Ronald Jones more now. Welcome to the 22 season. I've been the Ronald Jones truther. I still think he's better than Kishon Vaughn. I think he's way better than people are giving him credit for. He was a second rounder. And so I actually saw a report from ESPN that was doing like projections on depth charts.

And so this was like last week. And they had Ronald Jones as the early down starter. And then Dario Gmuale as the third downback. And then they had Kishan Vival. as the backup. Now, that's, that's obviously not set in stone. That's just an early, early offseason prediction. But I think people are, there's people who really, really think Kishon Vaughn is going to be like the guy in this backfield, and I really don't buy it quite yet. And, you know, hitting the COVID list, I don't, I don't know if that's going to affect his

season long standing at all. But adding McCoy into this group just, you know, makes an already really, really controversial, I think, and confusing backfield even worse. All that said, though, I'm still sticking with John. Like, Jones is the guy. I'm trying to targeting in that backfield. For five years, it's been really annoying to analyze the Buccaneers backfield for five years in a row. And now we're talking about how coronavirus impacted. My only statement here is, please, everyone just wear masks. Yeah. I saw someone say this. I saw someone say this on Twitter and I apologize. I can't remember who it was. But it was the perfect point. It's the person who ends up, the running back

who ends up being the starter in New England, or not New England, in Tampa Bay this year, is who Tom Brady wants to be on the field. Yes. And who Tom Brady, us. I think it's Ronald Jones for that reason. I don't know who that is. Like, Jones has certainly had his issues in his two seasons than the NFL. He improved a lot last year. I don't know if Kishon Vaughn is maybe going to be more reliable, but at the same time, he is a rookie who has proven nothing. I thought being a rookie running back didn't matter, D.K. Well, you came from Vanderbilt. Like, I'm sorry. I don't think the Vanderbilt running back is going to start out the season blocking for Tom Brady. I'm sorry. I just don't think it's going to happen. I think Ronald Jones has been in the NFL.

Lishol McCoy is washed up, okay? Let me reach out to Brady. Maybe we can get him on the pod. The other guy, just wanted to mention here, Darius Geis, Washington's going to carry like five running backs. Do you think there's any chance he's a significant enough workload to be a top running back, or they're just going to cap him and maybe he'll be exciting, but he's not going to get you to workload?

I think that's a very good question. I think it's smart. It would be smart of them to cap his carries just to be a little bit careful. He's obviously ended the last few seasons with knee injuries, multiple knee injuries. So that's just really concerning. He did look outstanding when he was healthy last year. There was a stretch there where he was healthy and looking good.

And it was like a three or four weeks stretch where he led the NFL an elusive rating, which is broken tackles and yards after the catch. It's a PFF stat. So he certainly started to look like the guy. I think that Washington drafted him to be in the second round. I think he was a second rounder. But at the end of the day, I mean, he's been, he's been so injured. He's had so many knee injuries that it's just really, really concerning.

I can't, I can't really say that I think he's going to get a really heavy workload this year. It could happen, but I think that's why we're putting him this low. Okay. Tier 8. Hold on. Before we move on, are there, is there anyone in this tier that you think needs to be lower? I personally have a problem with having Kerry on Johnson in the same, like, discussion as, like, Rahim Moster and Kareem Hahn. and even J.K. Dobbins

I would, like, Carillon to me would be like two or three tiers lower. Craig, as an unpaid public relations representative for Carriott Johnson, did you like to respond? You really feel that much more confident that you'd rather have Jordan Howard on the dolphins than Carion Johnson?

Yeah, I would pick Howard over Johnson at this point. Well, it's funny because it's like you're comfortable having Geis there who's had like a litany of knee injuries and Carriotton Johnson has had less injuries than Darius Geysen has produced better seasons and they're probably the exact same age. Yeah, but Darius, so there's a difference in projecting sort of the depth chart, too. They did just draft a guy almost in the first round.

He was like the 33rd pick to come in in D'Andre Swift, who I think is a far superior player. So that's the big difference to me. Gice, I don't think that Gice is going to have a heavy workload, but if he's healthy and good, I think he'll be their de facto number one. There's a couple other guys in that that are going to, like, eat into his bottom line, whether Adrian Peterson is there or Bryce Love, I guess, is healthy. So there's other guys that could potentially, like, eat into that bottom line. But he's not going up against a guy who's basically a first round pick.

So on that note, why is J.K. Dobbins in this tier? Because the Ravens have Mark Ingram, Justice Hill, Gus Edwards, and J.K. Dobbins. I think Dobbins is in this tier for me because the Ravens were by far the best running team in the NFL. And he perfectly fits their scheme. I think he's going to get the opportunity to really, really maximize his reps, which are probably going to be, you know, he's probably going to get fewer carries than the other guys, but I think he can do more with them because the Ravens scheme is so perfect for him, opens up so many run lanes, what Lamar Jackson does in terms of

holding defensive players on the outside. And all that, I think, to me, is what separates him from the rest of these guys. All right, tier eight, we've got Sony Michelle and the Patriots. We've got Denver's Philip Lindsay, Indianapolis's Marlon Mack, Tampa Bay, Kishon Vaughan, Chicago's Tarik Cohen, Miami's Matt Berita, and Los Angeles Rams running back Darrell Henderson. Sony Michelle, Jeff Howe at the athletic reporter this week, may not be ready for practice. He had foot surgery in May.

So, I mean, I think we're definitely going to move him down probably because of that if he's not even going to be ready to play. But anyone else in this tier, do you have any qualms with anyone in this tier? I think Tarke Cohen's got to be in the tier above. I don't know. I mean, he's James White. Yeah, I think I agree. I agree with that.

I think we should probably move him up. I mean, he just won a four guys with a hundred targets last year, and they had a bad year, and we talked about it. And he was in the worst shape of his life. So I think Tariq Cohen could have a better year this year. The only guy that I wanted to talk to you guys about. There's no Benny Cunningham, keep him in line. I mean, why wouldn't we just put Damien Harris in this tier? I will fight for that. So I let J.K. Dobbins go before when we had our whole little ranking summit. You know, you've got to pick your battles. I am going to use all of my energy for Tari Kohn and Nahim Hines.

and I think actually we have more than Mac in this tier. If training camp bears out that Neheme Hines has a Danny Woodhead-like role, I might fight for Neheme Hines in this tier, not at the three Cohen level. I'm cool with that. Yeah, I'm fine with that. I'm not going to bat for Mac. These are guys in tier eight right now. It's basically, and I think we move Cohen up into the next tier.

And then you have guys whose jobs and roles in their offense is very unclear. You got Matt Breda who looks like the backup. slash third downback maybe for Miami. Not really sure exactly how that's going to bear out. You have Darrell Henderson, who's pretty clearly going to be playing behind Acres, and we don't really know exactly how big that role is going to be. Philip Lindsay is stuck behind Gordon.

Remember Darrell Henderson is Lance Dunbar. That is how Sean McHill wants to use. So Cowboys fans just cringe. There will be zero Cowboys fans who know that information that will draft Darrell Henderson. These guys should not be starting, I think, in your lineup. But that's why I think Tari Cohen's in the wrong tier. I agree.

Thoree Cohen might be better. I'd rather have Tricone than James White this year. These are like non-startable, non-flex, third downbacks. These are basically betting against the other people in their backfield to some degree. If you're taking Philip Lindsay, you're betting against him. These are not hedges. It's more like, it's like a put. You're like the Melvin Gordon market's about to crash.

Yeah. All right. Tier nine. We've got Alexander Madison, Minnesota. He's basically handcuffed to Dalvin Cook. We've got Latavius Murray, who's the handcuffed to Alvin Kumar in New Orleans. We've got Duke Johnson here from the Texans. We've got Chase Edmonds, who is the Arizona, basically handcuffed to Kenyon Drake.

We've got Zach Moss, who is, I don't know what we would call him for Buffalo. And then Tony Pollard, who's the handcuffed to Dallas. We've got Adrian Peterson, who is 49 in Washington. And then Boston Scott, who's kind of a handcuffed to Miles Sanders in Philadelphia. Do you have any qualms with this handcuffed here and why Duke Johnson is here? I think you're just looking at this list and taking in mind what we've been talking about this whole pod, I would probably move Duke Johnson and Zach Moss into the tier above. I think Zach Moss is probably in the same boat as like Philip Lindsay and Marlon Mack.

I agree. The rest of this list are guys who, if the person headed them is injured, could be top 10, top 15 every week that the- pure handcuffs. Pure handcuffs. Duke Johnson has independent value, even if David Johnson is doing decent. And Zach Moss might, we just don't know what the Buffalo breakdown is. But everyone else, and then Agent Peterson is like, just, you know, who knows? He might not even be on the roster.

He could be their starter. We don't know. Washington has, to be clear, Washington is Adrian Peterson. They have Darius Geis. They have Bryce Love, who is the only, like, other person in Geis's tier of, like, just a lot of injuries and hasn't been playing. They have J.D. McKissick, who is the Seattle kind of pass catching dude. They have Peyton Barber who left Tampa Bay. And they have Antonio Gibson, who's this really exciting prospect from Memphis.

So it's like, they have six. They might bring five backs into their team. And I think, honestly, I think Bryce Love might get cut. And then someone, I think Peyton Barber gets cut. Bryce Love gets put in the practice squad and they carry five guys. But anyway. So here's what I think about tier eight and tier nine here. I think I actually would just draft every single player in tier nine before I drafted a guy in tier eight.

Because they offer way more upside. And if you look at everybody in tier nine that we just listed, they're pretty much, like the majority are all on really good teams. And then if you look at tier eight, a lot of these guys are on mediocre to shitty teams. And I think that you want a running back on a good team. And it's like you get the Vikings. with Alexander Madison, you get the Cowboys of Tony Pollard. The upside with them is so much higher that I don't even care if Philip Lindsay or if Matt Brita will get a little bit more weekly work than Alexander Madison will because I'm not

starting them anyway. I completely agree. My takeaway here is that this part of the draft, when Sony Michelle, Lindsay, Marlon Mack, Keishon Vaughn, Breed and Darrell Henderson are going, I'm trying to take receivers, tight ends or like I've waited long enough to take my quarterback. I don't want them. And then I'm going to go three or four rounds, probably without a running back. and then I'll circle back to this tier of Madison, Murray, Duke Johnson, Chase, Edmonds, Pollard, Moss.

I don't want Philip Lindsay. I just don't see the value in that part of the draft. Like, Dika, do you, looking at this whole draft now, I'm kind of thinking, I don't really want to be taking a running back, basically from tier eight, really we're talking about, like, the 80th pick to like 120th. Do you agree with that? I definitely don't get excited about any of these guys. I think I would take, I don't know, it just depends on how you feel about, you know, taking, like, handcuffs. type players. Like if Melvin Gordon gets hurt, Philip Lindsay could rush for a thousand yards and he's already done it in his career. So it's like there is some upside certainly there.

But would it just go back to the Royce Freeman, Philip Lindsay situation? I as someone, I have been called Royce Freeman Truther and I am passive. I mean, if this season happens 10 times, I think three of them, Royce Freeman might not even make the team. And I love Royce Freeman. I'm a little worried. So Philip, but Philip Lindsay, it's just uninspiring. But that's the type of player you typically getting in this area of the draft anyway. Well, that's the thing is you want upside. So I guess Lindsay makes sense. But I don't really see upside with Adrian Peterson.

I don't see upside so much with Darrell Henderson even. Which of these players, like with that mind, like you're trying to draft someone who's like, oh, yeah, he could just break out. Which of these players do you actually see a breakout scenario here that does not include an injury? It's got to be Zach Moss, right? Yeah, Zach Moss. I still think that Darrell Henderson is talented, but I don't. think he's going to get a full-time role. So I don't know. I'd say Zach Moss is really interesting.

And then maybe Duke Johnson. Yeah. Duke needs to be higher. And I think Boston Scott could carve out a role in Philadelphia that. Yeah, Boston Scott was awesome down the stretch last year. So the conference, I mean, the conference before the draft is Darren Sproul's because he's literally like Darren Sproles's size. And then he's been drafted by the Saints who, you know, we're using him to replace Darren Sprouls. And then he got cut. And then the eagle signed him off the practice squad to literally again replaced Darren Sprouls. So if he had a Darren Sproles role, I mean, it's like preordained. If we're taking anybody in this group, though,

I'm going with my guy Tony Pollard, I think. Just because he could be legitimately like the lottery ticket of this group. I'm a fan of drafting a handcuff for a guy that you don't have and just stashing him just in case. Yeah. All right. That's the people we have in our top 150 on our rankings from a couple weeks ago. Are there any snubs that you guys have that we didn't rank the first go around

that we're going to try to change for the next group of rankings? Any guys that we haven't talked about that you're actually going to be targeting? I have a couple of guys. No, I think, I mean, I think we've talked about him. So, Danny, why don't you just jump into your guys? Nahim Hines and the Colts. I will be fighting tooth and nail to get on our rankings. I think that there's a 50% chance that they're just going to give him a Danny Woodhead, Darren Sproul's role this year.

Damien Harris and the Patriots, again, I think there is, I have no idea what's happening. But we watch Patriots training camp because there's a chance that August 15th, Mike Reese reports, by the way, Damien Harris is just the starting running back for the New England Patriots. He's currently not even draft being drafted anywhere. And then Chris Thompson on the Jaguars, who is basically, to me, there's two reasons they brought him in. Like, what happens is anytime a coach goes to a team to be a coordinator, head coach, whatever, is you bring players in who know your system because they can teach it to other players. That's why they, why do they sign that blocking tight end? It's the, it's the training system. Chris Thompson was like this beloved locker room guy in Washington who is just universally beloved beloved by everyone he's ever played with.

he could have been brought in as a culture guy to just fix the worst culture team in football right now with Jacksonville or he could be brought into he's going to be the past catching running back for this team that can't block and like well could maybe be top five or six in running back targets. I have no idea which it is.

But I'm really curious to see like the fact they were trying to trade Leonard for the entire like spring and they couldn't. Yeah. I'm very interested to see if Chris Thompson actually just will be more than a third downback. In that vein, you have Reikwell Armstead, too, who could be the handcuffed to Leonard Fernette. I think, so if you're talking about guys, I think he's a decent running back. He hasn't proven anything in the NFL yet, obviously, so we don't have a lot of information, but.

It's not an endorsement. That didn't sound. Your tone was like, yeah, it's fine. He was a fifth rounder. That's exactly what he is, I think. Chris Carys was the seventh rounder. Yeah, the whole round thing. I'm out on that.

If Fournet gets traded. I'm just saying, like, he's fine. So, Fourneck gets traded tomorrow. What tier is right? Will Armstead in. I think he certainly, that's a good, that's a really good.

Like six? He's not good. That's my thing. He's not. So he's not a hundred percent certain to be the true handcuff there. That's the problem. They've got a couple of their rookie guys that they just signed. That could maybe outplay him. Devino Zigbo's still there.

That is exactly what you need to know is we don't know enough about Raikwell Armstrongstead to feel confident that he is the true handcuff. Leonard Fortinette's going to get more carries than we think now because they tried to trade him and they couldn't still like we're going to run you into the ground. that's the best honestly it's the best argument for taking Four Nett this year because that's

exactly what Levy on Bell said last year when he sat out the season was he told Jeremy Fowler at ESPN like as soon as I was on the tag and I knew I wasn't going to come back I knew they were going to give me 400 touches again

and now he literally averaged like 398 touches for 16 games but I agree that is the perverted and extremely twisted logic of football is that they will grind these guys too so who would you rather

this year. That is our final question. Levion Bell or Leonard Fournett? Fournet. No question. I want to, so we need to... You rather Levi on Bell or give up your job as Chargers quarterback. I love my team. I love L.A. I wish we went back to San Diego, though. All right. Those are our tiers. If you want to use our tiers, we will be updated them at fantasyf football.thringer.com where you can check out our draft guide. But

honestly, it's really worth doing it. If you can sit down and make your own tiers, ultimately, it is a decision-making guide. And really what you're doing is you're writing down your gut feelings about groups of players. And so in the moment, you can follow your gut because you wrote your gut down on pieces of paper. It's really helpful. I encourage you to do it. Guys, you have any last qualms with their tears overall?

Tears in general? I'm just saying Duke Johnson and David Johnson or both third round picks. And David Johnson had a better career. So I don't know how we can say Duke Johnson's better. I have a qualm of cybersecurity. All right? Those people paying the ransoms, get your shit together.

That's my quam. That's our next episode. We're going to do receiver tears. And then after that, we're going to tier cybersecurity ransom companies. Who's number one? I can't, don't, you can't do the episode before the episode, Craig. It's like 101. All right.

Thank you to everyone. Thank you, D.K., thank you, Craig. Thank you to Duke and David Johnson, who are going to provide a lot of content this year. Thank you, everyone for listening. We'll see you guys on Wednesday.