The Ringer NFL Show - The Most Important Lessons Learned from Past Drafts | The Ringer NFL Draft Show

Episode Date: January 19, 2023

Welcome back to another episode of The Ringer NFL Draft Show! This week, the guys open with a brief look ahead at the Giants-Eagles playoff matchup (1:20). Next, they discuss a handful of takeaways and lessons learned from previous drafts (2:52). Finally, they close with America’s favorite segment, “Two Jargons, One Lie” (26:44). Check back in on this feed every Thursday for more of The Ringer NFL Draft Show. Check out our Weekly Fantasy Football Rankings for positional rankings and more! Take part in the Ringer FanDuel Playoff Contest for both the Saturday and Sunday slate of playoff games this weekend! Email us! [e-mail] Hosts: Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, Ben Solak, and Craig Horlbeck Producers: Craig Horlbeck and Kai Grady Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, what's up? This is Danny Hyfitz. Before we get into the show today, we are running a Fandall contest for Divisional Weekend. You can play against everyone on this show. Me, DK. Solack, and Craig, and Word on the street. You can even play against Bill Simmons. The money is distributed, not just to the winner, but people in the top 10, top 20, so you don't even have to have the best. You can still get paid. And it goes across the entire playoffs. So you can take your top three scores and you add them up. And whoever has the most of that, you're like the winner of all the winners. You're the mega winner of the entire playoffs. So you're going to fandle.com slash ringer divisional Saturday or

Fandall.com slash ringer divisional Sunday. You can play either way. It's daily fantasy. So it's both days. That's fandle.com slash ringer divisional Saturday or Fandle.com slash ringer divisional Sunday.

Play against all of us. Thanks. All right, let's get to the show. Ringer NFL draft show. My name is Danny Hyfitz. I am joined by Danny Kelly and Ben Solek. And we're coming to you here on the Ringer Fantasy Football Show feed every Thursday between now

and the NFL draft in April 27th. And today we're going to discuss all like the lessons from drafts pass and what we've learned, what we've really most of the things that we were wrong about that we've changed their mind. But first, So like the Eagles who play in the Divisional playoffs. Wow.

Yeah, boy. How much do you think the Giants are going to win by? Not many. In negative? I don't know. One of two games will be played. A very close, weird, sweaty game that will have both of us wanting to die 59 minutes in,

or the Eagles will blow out the Giants. So, I don't know. If, if, if, if, if, if, Giants win, small number. If Eagles win, any number. All of the numbers are possible. Yeah, it's pretty much how I feel. I'm, yeah, I think that I might, you know how boxers and USC fighters,

like, you know, they lose all the water weight before a fight to make weight. I kind of feel like I might lose a few pounds of sweat watching this game. Yes. Oh, High Fitz is going to be so neurotic during this game. I can already see it in my mind. Yeah. I'm not going to do well. And it's Saturday night, too, which, like, I got to wake up.

up early on Sundays. And if the Eagles lose this game, I won't be able to fall asleep. So I'm just, I'm, I'm shaping up for a real bad weekend, how things might go here. Yeah, it's going to be fun. Yeah, fun, fun. It'll be fun. I will have fun watching. Yeah, that's totally how I feel.

Okay. All right, let's get to. We don't want to check in with Danny on the Seahawks playoffs. Hey. Yeah, we got them. I'm too busy just thinking about, I'm thinking about number five and number 20. Those are the two numbers I'm thinking about right now. There it is.

So this is a show. We've been talking about amongst, ourselves for doing for weeks now because it's always allowed to figure out where we want to do this in the calendar. But basically it's one of the most important shows I think we can possibly do, which is basically just throwing everything at the wall. What have you guys learned from doing this for years now that you're trying to apply through the lens of this year's class? Because, you know, obviously every draft comes, goes. There's all these predictions. But overall, like the process that you have and kind of sharpening or changing the process you have obviously

improves it year every year. So I was curious. I wanted to ask you guys some things. We could kind of kind of make this an open end of discussion, but DeK, I don't know if you want to go first, but basically just sure, you know, some of the big lessons you've learned after covering the draft for a long time now, what, 30, 40 years? I forget how old you. Yeah, something like that. I think the biggest thing

with the draft, and number one, it's kind of a moving target. It's never really the same. The NFL changes, things change, you know, prototypes for different players change, what's in vogue and all that. So it's never really just static where you learn something and then you can apply it forever. But that being said,

I think the hardest part of doing anything in the draft is evaluating quarterbacks. Like, quarterbacks are almost impossible to evaluate, it feels like. And as the longer I've done this, I've started to more and more realize I just need to keep an open mind with quarterbacks. Like every time I, well, not every time, but like a lot of the time when I have a really strong opinion that a quarterback is bad, they end up being a little bit better than I thought they were. And you could say the same thing opposite. And I think just generally like this year, the Gino Smith, ninth year breakout. the strange development of Gino Smith, like Daniel Jones turning into

what looks like a quality quarterback, the Brock Purdy, the legend of Brock Purdy. I'm just becoming more and more open-minded to the idea that a lot of these quarterbacks can succeed if they're in the right position, if they're in the right support system, hyphids you talk about it all the time,

like nature versus nurture, like finding a team that is built for, to help a quarterback land softer is obviously a big, big factor. And some of these things you can't know before the draft. So, like, long story short, I have an open mind about all. all these quarterbacks.

So, like, do you agree or do you want to be more close-minded about quarterbacks going setting them up? I've never been wrong on a quarterback, so it's not an issue for me. It's just kind of keep doing things I've been doing. Yeah. No, I think when I look back at the last few years of quarterback, like, evaluation of how the landscapes change, the thing that I always come back to is the mobility. And we had, like, the first wave of quarterback mobility in the early 2010s, Newman and

RG3, where it was like, get them in here and run the read option, man. This is crazy. Like we can, you know, the running game, we can add him, you know, and take a body away and, you know, make the math work. Oh, it's awesome. And then the passing game, like, everything was just like, it was still like dropback stuff. And you would roll guys out and like rolling everybody out was cool. But honestly, like it was the pocket passers, the immobile players who benefited from the rollout more because it was like kind of more surprising. Now we're in this second wave of quarterback mobility where it's like, okay, it's nice if we can get a guy who can pull the ball on a read.

Like, that's cool. Jalen Hertz can do that. Even Daniel Jones can do that. It wasn't what he was billed as coming out of Duke, but it's something that he brings to the table. Josh Allen, you know, the ability to be in the quarterback designed running game. But what really has come to the head is how important it is that a quarterback can extend

to play, how important is a quarterback can scramble, how important is that he can create a second reaction throw. And that construction is really important. It's the one that I always use and I like to talk about, which is when you have a quarterback who can scramble, who can make the first pass rusher miss, not like get to the checkdown and get the ball out quickly, make him miss, get outside,

of the pocket. You get two plays in one. You get the designed play. You get the route concept and the spacing and the one to two to three. Read this guy. Read that guy. And then after that's all covered and after the quarterback gets out of the pocket, you now have a whole second play. Scramble. You run this way. You know, scramble rules for wide receivers. You go down the field. You go across. Right. Talk the ball. Go. Like you're creating a second. You get two for one. It's a great deal, man. And so when we talk about open-mindedness at quarterback, I think one of the, I think the real like wrenching open of the mind, the real like widening of the horizon is in quarterback coaches,

private ones and ones that are employed by teams, individual players, general manager, scouts everybody realizing, okay, like we don't need to go find the next Peyton Manning. We don't need to say, let's draft in the first round, some six foot four, 210 pound, golden-armed pocket. manager. If we find one, Trevor Lawrence, sick. Like, that's great. It's awesome. It's crazy. You can do that. But let's also, like, watch everybody for like, okay, who gets out of the pocket? Who understands what to do when he gets out of the pocket? Who is the quickness, the experience.

Like, you know, Kenny Piggett being a great example of like, Pickett's got the prototypical build of like a pocket guy, but he's watches Pittsburgh film and then watch his university of Pittsburgh film. The best stuff that he does when he's outside of the pocket screwing around, right? Like that, that's where we've really started to open things up is in an understanding how to break the prototype, of course, quarterbacking, understanding that we need to find guys who have mobility. That widens the field of players that are viable at the NFL level. I like what you said so like about like the Bogo quarterbacks, the buy one, get one free, you buy a play and then you can just get one out of thin air. That's a great. Bogo is a great way of saying it.

I'm stealing that. John Harbaugh, when he introduced the Lamar, the Ravens offense then in 2019 said that he had this really cool quote that he basically was like, everyone's been chasing Joe Montana as a quarterback prospect model for like 40 years. And then like he thinks Lamar is going to be the big, like everyone will be chasing Lamar for the next 40. and I think that's a pretty insanely bold thing to say and it's ironic now that they might lose Lamar Jackson but I do think what you're saying like that is the point and I think that the thing I always think about the draft

and it applies to quarterbacks mostly is they always say that saying every general is trying to fight the last war as you know you're always prepping for the future with the past but taking too many specifics and not enough principles and I think that you see that all I mean we do it in fantasy football drafts

but also in the real draft it's like how many times Alvin Camara every team in the league passes in Alvin Camara then they're all looking for the next Camara they're looking for the next Christian McCaffrey. And it turns out it's not those guys. It's just Darrell Henderson. And you look at Zach Wilson. Does Zach Wilson go second in the draft?

If teams aren't trying to find Patrick Mahomes, I would say probably not. And so that to me is like, I think that's an important point. And I like starting with this of just quarterbacking as a product. What teams look for in quarterbacks has changed a lot. I'm curious how you think that applies D.K. to this year's class where you've got Bryce Young, who again, incredible playmaker. I think he's got really, you know, the intangibles, all that stuff. Just small.

He's small and he's thin. And again, if he had a Jewish grandmother, she'd tell him to put meat on his bones. C.J. Stroud, who's, you know, we've seen Ohio State quarterbacks fail. You know, Stroud, it's limited mobility. In this discussion, Will Levis. Like, I'm curious how you think all this applies to this group. Yeah, and I think the reason I brought this up first is because this group of quarterbacks is just all over the place. It's just all over the place.

This is a very confusing group of quarterbacks. Obviously, with Bryce thing, like you said, extreme outlier when it comes to his size. Will Levin. Travis. It's very like the narratives around him. I think draft Twitter, generally speaking, is going to be pretty low, like relatively low on him because of. Can you explain what draft Twitter is to people who, you know, are not on Twitter? People in my world, it's basically just like the people who are evaluating quarterbacks, people who are evaluating draft players in general for the media. Like, and a lot of the times we congregate on Twitter and we talk and we

give takes. That's, that was where I started, man. Yeah. That was me. Like that I was, I was, a random account with 200 followers being like, guys, look at Hassan Reddick. It's one of the best places to cut your teeth because, like, they're hands in a lot of pots, right? In terms of like college game, NFL game, offense, defense, technique, scheme, traits. Like, everything gets touched by the draft.

So I love draft Twitter. So I have a feeling and that's exactly right. I came up in that area too. And like, I have a feeling. And obviously, Ben, you correct me if I'm wrong. But I think people, I think Will Levis is going to be sort of like the whipping boy of draft Twitter.

Like, we're going to laugh. It's kind of like how Daniel Jones was. Like, maybe much less or so, but like, he kind of reminds me of like the Herbert thing where when Herbert was coming out of Oregon, people forget, like, he was sort of the funny quarterback that people didn't think was very good. You know what I mean? Like, if you liked Justin Herbert a lot, like, people would be like, what is wrong with you?

Like, you're weird. And Herbert has been such a zag relative to what we're talking about, right? Be more open-minded and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, I prioritize like scrambling, like see how players can make second reaction throws. Herbert came into the NFL and just started like dicing up defenses from the pocket with processing. Which he didn't do at Oregon. How, how could, how are you capable of this and did not do this in college? That's something I want to ask you about.

One of the biggest mistakes I made is I didn't like Michael Parsons because I didn't get it because he literally was at Michael Parsons was a better pass rusher as his first season is Dallas Cowboy than he ever was at Penn State. and I am curious, DK, you had one of these, I forget where it is. Traits. Traits. Yeah, basically,

I think a mistake that I've made is assuming, if someone hasn't done any something that you're looking for, why? I don't know that's so obvious, but like Josh Allen's a good example. Like, well, was he just trying to play hero ball? Why is he missing screen passes?

I don't know. And there are, like, technical answers for that. But I'm curious, like, the Michael Parsons has won. Herbert's a good example. I think this is absolutely part of the discussion of quarterbacks. And one of my other lessons was basically, especially for,

and if you're talking about what the league cares about, like traits over production generally. Not always, but like generally speaking, teams are looking for the guy that they can, that the player is going to turn into an elite player, not necessarily the guy who, you know, was putting up a bunch of numbers in college, but just doesn't have the traits to be an NFL player,

if that makes any sense. So that is highly applicable to Will Levis, Anthony Richardson, who I believe is probably the wild card of all wild cards in this draft, like extremely, extremely awesome traits, but still has to put it all together. And like, you know, like the production that wasn't necessarily there in college. Like, he didn't necessarily elevate his offense.

And there's going to be some concerns over that. But like the traits are incredible. And so I think you could say the traits over production thing for a lot of different positions, obviously last year with Trayvon Walker going first overall. Like that was the biggest lesson I took out of last year is like any of these guys could be the first overall pick. If you have good traits, it wouldn't shock me if any of these, like players that we have in the top, like 15 are going to be a first overall pick.

That's the type of class this is. I guess traits and having an open mind that not only are NFL teams willing to like invest in these guys, but these guys with practice and with development can turn into really elite players just because they have those rare physical traits. When we talk about Micah in particular and like Trayvon Walker is another guy that I think falls into this bucket, if a guy can do things athletically at his size that you don't see every year, take them. Yeah.

I've no further, like, I've no further questions, right? Like, I've gotten into it with some people on like Trayvone Walker and whether or not he was a disappointing first overall picks.

He's got like three sacks or something. And it's like, yeah, he is. Like, you want your first overall pick to impact the game more. Jaguars are, you know,

playing in the divisional rounds. Like, that's still kind of sick. Sorry, my dog's going bananas. Nugget. Is that nugget? Nugget is like Micah Parsons can't be judged based on justice production.

I'm going to, I'm gonna go check on her. Give me a sec. Cool. She doesn't, she's not usually like this. Hey, dummy. Wait, we gotta keep on her.

That's so funny. That's really good. This is like exactly what I do. It's my dog. What are you barking at? This is the kind of thing. If someone gets up from their chair, it has to go do something during the pod,

we always cut it out. I think we should keep this in. This is hilarious. It's funny because I was telling you guys before the show, this is the first time I've got George, my nine-month-old puppy free-roaming the house. Normally, I'll either put him in the crate or lock him

in the room here with me so he can't like wander around and get into stuff. So this is a big test for me whether George is going to like chew shit up during this pot. Everything good, So-Lek? Yeah, she's still freaking out, but I put it upstairs, so hopefully just be quieter. Sorry, Kai. Oh, I think we might keep it all. We're just, yeah, high fits

and I, we're keeping that in. We didn't stop. You guys made the executive decision? Okay, well, Trayvon, like three sacks on the seasoners. something. The Jaggs are obviously still playing football, but Trayvon's been like a little bit of not as much of an impact maybe as you'd hope from the first overall pick. Yeah, but like when you watch him play, he doesn't really know what he's doing. Like he didn't play edge last year. And just like there was like five or six reps a game where he's just like so much bigger and stronger

than the opposing professional left tackle. We were like, heck yeah. You know what I'm saying? Like this is good. Like this is where he's going to work. Mikea obviously hit a lot quicker, right? Like Micah started producing at a high level right away. But again, it was like, all right, we don't get guys that are this tall, this long that run this fast in a straight line. I'm very happy to just kind of like figure out what happens next when I get him in the building, right?

And the Cowboys about to play the Niners is such a good example of that. Last year when they play the Niners in the playoffs, Micah is one of the most unbelievable film I've ever seen. He played off ball linebacker in that game and it play Edge. And he's just chasing everything. The Niners are so good at making their linebacker

just like live in hell. And Micah's just like kicking down doors, like jumping over cats. I called him a deranged, pursuit hyena after that game. Like, you can just hear him cackling. Like, ha-ha, here we go! When you get guys like that, you just take them.

You take him and then you figure out the rest later. All right, D.K., give me another lesson you learned. So this is very related to the quarterbacks thing, but I just wanted to mention it again. I've said this on the show before, but backup quarterbacks are people, too. This is something I'm starting to realize more and more, and I think it's become more important to me,

is these guys can make a career, and end up actually being very, like, important. for NFL teams and still be backup. So basically that relates to guys like Stetson Bennett, Max Duggan potentially. Some of these guys that don't particularly look like starting caliber quarterbacks, but they're going to have long careers probably. And marked by words, these guys are going to be fucking starting for teams in like

playoffs. Stetson Bennett's already had a long career. He's a year away to get kicked off his parents health insurance. Stetson can rent a car with no surcharge, right? That's how you know. Setson Bennett is going to get kicked off his parents' health insurance. And these other guys, he played defense, that he's playing against the defense still won't be able to buy a drink in a bar. It's funny.

We make fun of Stets and Bennett, but like Hennon Hooker is really old and he might go like in the second round. I mean, like, Pickett came in last year. He was pretty old. There's multiple guys that are going to be pretty old. Well, Levis is old. He's like 24. He's like a year younger. Yeah.

Levis was born in June of 97. So he's going to be, or no, June of 98. How old am I? I'm 25? Levis is going to be 24 when the upcoming NFL season starts. I can't remember. I think that's right. what year that at 99 or something.

Shouldn't this be easy for you if he's your age? Like, shouldn't that be like easier? Well, no, because I'm going to be 26. So he wasn't born in 97. He was born in 99. I got the year wrong. You're a tape guy, not a math guy. Yeah, yeah.

You're not good on the analytics. Right. It's funny because one of my resolutions, one of my like lessons learned, especially from last year, is to care about age. And it's particularly because of the nature of these draft classes.

Because of the COVID year, for people who like really follow the NFL would don't follow a lot of college. Because of that 2020 season where like some team, teams played. Some teams didn't. They had indeterminate number of games. Everybody was rescheduling everything.

That 2020 season was a total wash in terms of eligibility. Nobody had a year counted against them in terms of the number of years they have eligible to play, which means that you now have guys who are like fifth, sixth year seniors who are potentially coming out in the previous draft class. Kenny Pickett was a fifth year senior. And then

in this draft class, like Jared Hall, who's a quarterback at a BYU who had like a two-year mission. And then obviously had that extra COVID year, he's going to come out at just under 25 years old when the 2023 NFL season starts, Hennon Hooker, like DK brought up, will be 25 years old, Stetson Bennett, but multiple years of eligibility, was in Georgia transferred out, transferred back in, 25 years old, Will Levis will be 12, becoming 24 years old. And when you look at the history of old draft prospects, you see good players, you

don't typically find stars. And the reason is because guys who have star ability, guys who of the true physical talent to go to the NFL and dominate, don't stay in college. They leave because that's true of them earlier. So there's no real reason for them to hang around in college. Just go to the NFL, start making your money, start developing. Last year, in terms of first round picks that were 24 or older, we had Kenny Pickett, Cole Strange, Jermaine Johnson, Devante Wyatt, and Devin Lloyd.

It's a list of some of the not-greatest first-round picks from last year. What are you saying about Cole Strange Chattanooga legend? Nuga. And yeah, Cole Strange was pretty good, right? But, like, Devin Lloyd got benched. Devonte White couldn't find the field.

Jermaine Johnson was not a huge part of the Jets rotation. Obviously, they could think it was okay. You start going to the second round, right? And you find, okay, like, Jolani Woods was there. And Jolani Woods was, like, a quarterback to tight-end transfer. There's always, like, context for these things. But then you find Bernard Raven,

Boye-Mafé, Arnold Nebuchady, Mijai Sanders, guys who, like, didn't have a huge impact on their teams coming the second and the third round. to like it's okay to be old, but there's got to be reasons for it. You got to care about it. You got to have context for it. You're that,

D.K. I know. That's okay to be old. He's speaking directly to me. Yeah. Dick, it's okay. That'd be an old, old podcaster.

Yeah. It's all right to be old. D.K., we'll put you in a home and everything. So because of the extra COVID year, the average age of NFL players in the draft is older than in typical seasons, and we have to pay attention to that. Whether a player is 23 or 21 to the degree to the degree to they're producing is critical context.

It has to be consumed. It has to be understood. Like Tyree Wilson, the Edge from Texas Tech is a great example. I've seen people suggest like, you know, Tyree Wilson, like similar to Trayvon Walker, big, super long, disruptive interior guy. Maybe he can jump Jalem Carter and Will Anderson,

like the same way we've seen happen in seasons previous, or happened last year, last year's draft, right? Like Trayn Walker jumped Dayton and Hutchinson, jumped to Kiev on Tibido. Yeah, but Wilson's two years older than Walker was when it comes out. And that matters in terms of why he's producing so much now relative to Walker who was drafted on his traits. And so you have to pay attention to age.

It's not something that can get overlooked in the process. DK, do you agree? Should we call the olds? It's funny because I wrote down pretty much the exact opposite of what Ben wrote down, which was not to get too hung up on draft age. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. You're trying to defend yourself. This is very meta.

I actually, there's a gray area because I mostly agree with Ben on all of that. Is it like at the center of your head the gray area or is in your beard? Yeah, actually, I'm kind of looking forward to going gray on my beard. that'll be fun. No, what I was going to say is, like, I think Ben is correct in that, like, when it comes to skill players, pass rushers, things like that, like age does matter. And we've talked about this on the show before. Basically, it's like, if you're a 23-year-old going up against, like, an 18, 19-year-old,

like, you're going to have an advantage. You're going to have a big advantage. And so- You should. You've been playing for four years of football longer than they have. Right. And so that matters. And I think that's very important context.

and if all else is equal, like, that should be the tiebreaker probably. However, I don't think it's necessarily like a deal breaker for me anymore. Whereas in the past, it was like, oh, God, this guy's old. I don't want to, there's no way he's going to be good in the NFL. I think with quarterback in particular, and Joe Burrow is a good example of this. Burrow was 23 or 24. He was 24 as a rookie. So Burrow is a good example of what I think is going to be much more common going forward

is like guys transferring, guys staying in school a little bit longer. obviously, Burrow, you know, had the most incredible season at LSU, like maybe ever, like that offense was insane.

But guys who go back and take the NIL money, take the extra year of COVID eligibility, whatever it is, transfer and trying to find a better system for them. I think getting those live-bullet reps with, you know, at the college level is ultimately going to be better

than coming out and being, if you're not an elite prospect, coming out and being like a late first or a second round or whatever, and then having to sit for a couple of years, Like getting those reps in college, I think, is going to turn out to be more important. You're going to see more of these guys stay in school a little bit longer, you know, if they're not that elite prospect, and then come in and potentially still be starters. So Joe Burrow's not like a great example because he was the first pick and all that stuff.

But like, I think there's going to be more guys that stay in college and are like 24, 25 years old come in and end up being good players in the NFL. Yeah. I agree with D.K. that old quarterback is not as prohibitive to go to the NFL level 16. as like old wide receiver. Right. Yeah, if you're running away from 18 year olds when you're 23, yeah, like that's what you're supposed to do. Like, you know, like that to me is more of a red flag.

What I, what I do think is important is when we talk about quarterback contracts and we talk about franchise quarterbacks, you're Will Levis. You come in the league at 24. By the time you finish your rookie contract, you're 29, right? Yeah, that's weird to think about. Yeah. Right. You get the Derek Carr deal, right?

And then you play on that for a few years. And then all of a sudden, you're 32, 33 looking at your next contract. And at that point, like, you're either Tom Brady or people are worried about you becoming Russell Wilson, right? And some of that's dictated by play style, right? Like, how much do you rely on athleticism? Predicting age cliffs, right, when guys fall off at what age they're going to fall off, is to me, like, if I were running a team, the number one thing I'd be dedicating resources

to right now is figuring out, like, I get, get doctor. get numbers guys. I need to be able to figure out when somebody's going to fall off. Because remember, like the decline in production in the NFL is very rarely gradual. It's very rare that you see a guy

get a little bit worse when he's 33 and then a little bit worse when he's 34 and then a little bit worse when he's 35. What happens is he hits, he's 33, he's great, he's great, he's 35, and he's terrible. And being able to predict that is critically important. But do you think that matters

at the quarterback position? Like I get that at running back. I get that at like wide receiver alignment. Right. Quarterback, you're already talking about three, four people a year are actually being expected to be a starting quarterback. And then within that, there's different styles. And then by the time you get to

like individual health things, your data sets like, well, these other four people, you know what I mean? It's like not, it's hard. That's a great question. Because I should have specified. This construction doesn't matter too much for the team drafting the quarterback. So much as matters for the quarterback deciding when to come out, right? If I'm going to maximize my earning potential, I want to be as young as possible when I get my second contract, gives me the potential to sign a third contract. Remember the Dak Prescott debate, like when he was trying to figure out his contract, what was the big thing for Prescott? He only wanted four years. Because he wanted to be to hit the market again, a year earlier, more likely to get a bigger deal because he's a year younger.

That's just sooner. I think that's just sooner is better. You're 20 years old. You want the money now. You're 30 years old. You're still want the money now. Sooner is better. I agree. But also, I do think it does matter when you start getting in your mid-30s and quarterbacking. And that's like a, like when it comes to, you know, the Texans deciding between Will Levis and Bryce Young, I don't think it's going to matter that much. But in terms of your long arcs and understanding how these COVID years, NIL deals and when quarterbacks come out, like how all this matters, you do have to look 10, 15 years in the future. You do have to start thinking about how many contracts am I going to get to sign and what's

that going to do in terms of the money that I can make. That's a very real calculus. I think that I get what you're saying in theory, but as just hearing enough about what DK it's like to raise a three-year-old child, I feel like D.K. struggles to get his son to look 15 minutes into the future, never mind 15 years. And I also increasingly don't think that men actually ate, like men age, but I don't think we grow up. I feel like we're kind of just four years old or whole lot.

Maybe Solac's been 60 since he came out the womb. But like, I have been like, seven. He was like seven my whole life. I just got older. That's the will Levis has been seven his whole life. Will Levis is like eating, eating weird stuff to piss off. Will Levis is a 13 year old boy.

I will say this to his face if I ever get the chance. Like if you eat raw, if you eat brown banana peels for a camera, you might as well be 13. That's middle school stuff. Past game impact more important than run game impact. And what we're talking about, we were kind of skirting around positional value

with that last conversation. So like you mentioned, contracts. Bejohn Robinson is like the booby miles of this drafts. He's just this legendary running back out of Texas and there's going to be a whole argument eventually about whether he's a first run pick or not, but he's good as a receiver, blah,

blah, blah, blah. And DeKam, I'm curious, big picture about just past game more important. The reason I thought of this, obviously, this is like a meta thing. It's evergreen. I think it's only going to probably continue to get more prevalent as we go forward that like receivers are gaining value, receivers are going to, and we're going to get into this. Receivers are more valuable than ever.

Obviously, like, being able to rush the passer if you're a defensive alignment is more important than stopping the run. That's why edge rushers are so much more valuable. They're more premium position than an interior defender, off ball lineback, all that stuff. The thing that made me think of this is because I remember

last year Charles Cross and Abe Lucas were two like quote unquote air raid tackles who had like, I don't know the exact number. It was like 700 past protecting snaps versus like 100 or 200 run blocking snaps. And I was kind of worried that the NFL wouldn't like that. Like they'd be, especially a team like the Seahawks would be like, oh, this guy, he's not a good enough run blocker, all that stuff.

Like we can't take him this early. And so I was a little bit where he's going to fall. So I remember thinking that and downgrading cross probably more than I should have because when I first watched him, he was my favorite tackle. I was like, this guy has just, he's so smooth, so good. And I had him originally as my number one tackle. And I sort of just like talked myself out of it. ended up having against my third tackle and I regret that.

And the reason was because I didn't know how he's going to be as run blocker. The lesson for me is it doesn't really matter. Like if you can pass protect, you have immense, immense value in the NFL. And we've seen what he did for the CX this year. And Abe Lucas is another guy. And I was kind of confused. The CX took two like air raid tackles and both of them were awesome in year one. And the CX actually ended up passing way more than you expected because of Gino Smith was great.

But you know what that reminds me of actually is, so Mike Lombardi, he used to work of this here at the ringer. you know, Bill Parcells once told Lombardi that they were having this conversation about, well, the college game isn't doing stuff like the way we want to do it. And Parcells was just like, but we can only take what they give us. Right. As in like, we only are picking from the pool of players that college is sending us. So like we can't be nipped.

Like that's what they're doing. We have to work with it. So I, that's interesting with like that the massive gap of like pass snaps to run. I think that's, to me the lesson is obviously, you know, if you can pass protect, like as a tackle, you're going to be extremely valuable. It doesn't matter how good or bad you are. as a run blocker. But I think the other guy that comes to mind in this one is just Bison Robinson.

As I've started putting together mock drafts, I don't know if you've done any yet, Ben, just for fun. But it's like hard to figure out who to give him to in the first round. It feels like I'm shoehorning him in because I think he's such an elite player, even though I'm not really sure any of these teams are going to take a running back in the first round. You know what I mean? Like, I think he's worth the first rounder.

I've had absolutely no issue putting him in the first round. I keep him to Carolina at nine. You and I are not having the same problems. All right. Well, that's good to hear. I mean, what, like, realistically, do you think he will go on the top 10? Probably not. I do think he'll be that top 20 pick.

Bijons. Why care he's amazing, then? Because they traded away McCaffrey and Donta Foreman's a free agent. So right now their room is Chuba Hubbard and Rahim Blackshare, which is like, eh. And I think if they, like, were to, let's say they promote C. Wilkes and they retain Ben McAdoo. I don't think they're likely to go running back because I think they just resigned Donta and they, like, kind of have proof of concept as to how well that works. I also think just plain old, no matter who they get a coordinator,

resigning Donta, it makes sense to me. I love Donta for him. I think he's so good. He's just been banged up. But as it is, if the guy who takes over Carolina comes in, and they don't feel like they're in a position for a quarterback, depending on how, like, veterans shake out and free agency shakes out, then yeah, I mean, like, they got a really steady offensive line with mostly guys secure.

They're too deep at tight end. They have D.J. Moore is a star receiver, and then they probably need more help at wide receiver too, and I think getting them a wide receiver in the top 10 totally makes sense. But the only thing they're really missing offensively is they traded away McCaffrey. They needed an impact back. Quarterback. Right. I'm saying, if not quarterback, I'm saying like, of the top 10, I can give a quarterback to seven teams right now. That's how it always is in January, you know?

If, and I like in the draft, when I like mock it out, I have, you know, the only quarterback left at their pick is sometimes Anthony Richardson. You know what I'm saying? So like, to me, like, Bejohn is not as much of a receiving threat as McCaffrey was. But it's not unfair to say Bijon is like a thicker McCaffrey in terms of how you'd use him. He's hugely impactful in the receiving game. I love Bejohn. And I feel like Bejohn is widely considered the best running back prospects since like, you know, at least Seiquon in 2018.

And as a Giants fan, again, I love Seekuan. Sequoan is like along with Jones, like the heart and soul of the Giants. Having said that the Giants could have traded down and got with like the Jets and gotten three second run picks. And they could have gotten with those picks. If they had just taken like Quentin Nelson, for example, on the Colts. And they couldn't gotten Nick Chub and then. second round. So it's like taking your, I know, Belson's a guard, whatever, but taking a running back at two, Sequin will probably be forever be the last running back ever taken in the top

two picks. That's probably not a good idea considering how replaceable running backs are. Having said that, Bejan Robinson's probably a really great, incredible pick if you can get them in the second round. Where do you got, like, where does this go? Because it's like, at what point is he actually just a value? At what point are you like, this is an incredible player. Because the top three seems too high, but the top 32, you know what I mean? I'm curious where you guys would be like, you know what, screw it. I want this guy.

I mean, honestly, like anything 20 after, I think is totally fine. And that's coming from someone who believes, like, there is some replaceability with running backs. I do think running backs, there's like a pretty big talent discrepancy from some of the best running backs

to the worst running backs. But, I mean, you can get by with sub-elite talent at running back position, like among all positions. All that being said, I think if you're taking a guy in the first round,

like you're getting five years out of that guy, And then just don't re-sign them. Just don't sign them to a massive contract. Because what teams really tend to regret is signing these guys to the big money. It's the age clip thing. Like I, how early would I be comfortable drafting Bejan Robinson? Seven. Now, if I need of running back in an edge, I'm going to take an edge.

Because it's a lot harder to find an impact edge in round two that is finding back in round two. But like, I can't watch the way that Nick Chub, Jonathan Taylor, Brees Hall, Kenny Walker, all have impacted their teams over the course of the last. couple years and like especially in the case of like guys like Kenny Walker and Jonathan Taylor the ability to take a regular run look and house call it right like the brief hall house call and like the busted fake running back play whatever it was against some team I can't remember but like the ability to turn a like okay it's nicely blocked up right we got the seal that we want on the edge oh shoot it's a 60 yard touchdown like that right there I'm if I can if I think

I can get that top 50 right like that's where all those guys went now I'm gonna take it right and with with a guy with Bejohn's telling like he's absolutely he's a walking house call he's unbelievable after contact he's got great patience he's got great hands he's laid on belt with a jet pack man but implicit with what you just said you just said but if i needed an edge all right if you didn't need an edge why don't just get another edge because like that's one of the most valuable things you can have in football is like more pass rushing talent so like you know what i mean but that gets in a need for not just a be something but need versus best player available is saying that comes up all the time the draft is so conditional on like understanding the team and understanding where they're at what their contracts

look like that we can like generate all sorts of like all right so you have a second round edge you kind of like. And then you've a veteran on a two-year deal. There's always like that that goes into it. What I know is fundamentally at at least 15 points in the game, I'm going to have to hand the football off. And then at at least like three more points in the game, I'm going to target the back.

If that guy's going to be potentially touching the ball 18 times. A third of the time. With a third of the game. Yeah. I'd like for him to be good at it. The holding of the ball and the running of the ball with it, right? I understand those replaceability. I understand that you can get

Aaron Jones in the fifth round sometimes. I totally 100% get it. I don't think we should draft Sequin Barclay at 2 and like, who is it? Joey Bosa was at 3? I can't remember which Bosa was around. But one of the bosses, I think it was Joey, is like, I'm 100% on board.

But Bejohn's a very good running back and I have a running back on the field on like all of the snaps. So there still is like a fundamental nature of football. It's like I need that one player of the 11 I have on the field. I need him to be good. I need him to be impactful. Just for the record,

Seacorn was 2018. that was the year of Bradley Chubb, 2016 was Joey Bose, and that was the year with Zeke Elliott. So you weren't, and you weren't off. Just same idea. Yeah, I knew Joey was around one of the backs. I'm so bad at remembering the last drafts, man. You can be you think I'm good at because I cover this?

I can never remember who went when. Your mind's just like a filing cabinet, but you open the drawers and it's just like all the papers are just like in a pile. It's a mess. I'm just on to the 2023 draft constantly. DK, the next lesson we got here. It's not even a lesson.

You just wrote down wide receivers are, just vibes, which is something you say a lot. I kind of just always like nod and I always like, I think I get what he means. I don't know if I get what you mean. It's like, oh, a lesson I've learned from covering the draft. I think trying to rank receivers is stupid. Like, I'm so in on this take. Yes, 100%.

There's no point in ranking these guys. Just make tiers. I'm totally fine with that. And you can have like five or six guys in the tier. It's kind of like ranking cars. It's like actually the one you pick just says something about. you and what you like. What do you need to use this car to do?

So basically, like, if you're looking at last year's class, this is how I would, like, sort of categorize some of these guys. Garrett Wilson, he was like chaos walking. He's just like a chaotic guy. Cadarius Tony, that can stay on the field, essentially. Crystal Lave was like the definition of polish. Traylon Burks, size, yards after the catch. Christian Watson, big plays.

Johan Dotson, catch point, great hands. And then all these guys come in and are like pretty good. And they're good in different ways. Like, basically my point is, like, there's a lot of ways to skin a cat in the passing game. And we should, I don't really see the point in, like, trying to, like, rank these guys per se.

Like, obviously, I'm going to have to rank them. But, like, I said, like, looking at this year's class, like Jackson Smith and Jigba. He's very polished. Yards have the catch. He's, like, kind of like an Ammon Ross St. Brown type player. Quentin Johnson's size yards as a catch. Jordan Addison and Josh Downs are both undersized speedsters,

playmakers, deep threats, kind of do-it-all guys. Jalen Hyatt, big plays. he's kind of like the Christian Watson of the Okay, we're going to do a game. Can you do that again, but make them cars? No, I would definitely need to prep for that. But yeah, I mean, basically my point is, I don't know what my point is really, other than,

I don't feel like it's that important. I'm picking up where you're putting down. I really do mean the car thing because it's like, oh, you want a Ferrari? It's like, okay, but do you have four kids that need to go to soccer a lot? Because that won't actually help you. And it's true, though, where it's like,

the Saints prop, I don't know if they needed Traylon Burks. They kind of needed Chris Olave. And like, you know, he's really good. The Saints. aren't, but like he clearly fits. And so I like what you're saying because I think what you're saying is that to rank them kind of reduces receivers, but in reality

the past game requires so many different things and so many, like there's many different skill sets that can flourish. It's almost like art, like there's, or basketball really, where it's like, oh, well, you can just flatten it, but in reality, there's all these different kind of skill sets guys have. It's like if you just ranked guards, well, shit, there's a lot of different

guards now in basketball. You can't just flatten the skill sets. Yeah. And so basically what I'm saying is, these guys are all going to come in and be productive in their own ways. And it's like trying to rank different positions. You know what I mean? Like they're all playing slightly different positions because they're different styles. They are literally playing on the field in different spots in some cases.

So that's what I've learned. It's like basically it's similar to the quarterback situation. It's like I like to picture what these guys can do versus like maybe they're not the best route runner. Maybe they're not super polished. I like to still picture what they can do and like what they're upside. it is based on some of the talents and traits that they do have, if that makes any sense. And for the record, that was Bill Walsh's like number one

motto is like drafting. If memory serves was literally, don't tell me what people can't do. Tell me what people can do. I'm not interested in what someone cannot do. Solek, I feel like receivers have been I mean, not if I feel like they have been contributing earlier than like ever. And that's part of what we were talking about earlier of like the NFL

kind of adapting where what college does. Do you think that makes the receivers like more valuable or less valuable. Like, where are you on that spectrum? It's actually tricky, right? Like, in a world of like general supply and demand, if I tell you, like, hey, there's way more receivers than there ever was, like, we're just funneling athletes into the receiver position. Guys who used to play running back, Traylon Burks, guys used to play, like, their body type would have been like linebackers, like tiny guys, Jordan Addison, these guys used to play corner. We're making them all receivers. Everybody's going to be a receiver now. In that, like, typical supply demand for instruction,

you'd say, okay, well, like, we're inundating the position with tons and tons of athletes, it's going to become less valuable. It's going to become more guys you can get in the second round and the third round that end up good. Like, you're not going to need to spend the premier picks on these guys. And then you go and you see five receivers go in the top 16 last year. I forgot to mention Drake London, by the way, another guy who's just like very different from all the other players. Right. He's a basketball player, right? He's going forward. Like, the number of ways in which a receiver can win has never been greater. The number of body types that can work a receiver never been greater.

So why is wide receiver become a premium position? It's because, like, again, like, I lose the economic metaphor here. I don't know the terms. But, like, the passing game is like a bubble. Like, it's flying. Like, the value of being able to throw the football and throw it in a myriad of ways and throw in a myriad of downs and down the field and the different routes that you want to run and the need to get guys involved in the blocking game.

Like, it's just we're doing so much throwing the football, throwing it in so many different ways. The floor of quarterbacking. play has risen tremendously because of the Shanehand offense. Such as like if you have the 16th best quarterback, the 17th best quarterback, you can have the best passing game. You can do it. I mean, just to make up an example, you could take, I don't know, like the last player

in the entire draft. And if you just give him like the best running back and the best tight end and like two of the most athletic receivers, he could like take it to the N. Two receivers you drafted in round two. Brandon, I can Debo's name. Our IQ was late round one. Debo was round two. Yeah.

Not a top 25 pick was spent on those receivers. Absolutely, right? And then like Joanne Jennings, third round, Tennessee, blocking ability. Danny Gray, third round, SMU, he's a speedster, Ray Rhea McLeod, veteran speedster. Like, just throw them in here, baby.

We're just going to run them on overs. Here we go. Like, there's just so many ways to win that you need to have a four deepet receiver. You need to have like a five deepet receiver. You really, you need so many different guys of so many different body types. Like Daniel Jeremiah always says,

build it like a basketball team. Get your point guard, get your small forward, get your power forward, get the different guys in the building. Such that, yeah, wide receiver is a premium position. Like my number one,

into this draft cycle over the next four months is to not spend any time being like, hmm, Jordan Addison's a little small. I wonder if he'll be a first round pick. He will. I was going to say, this is actually a true thing because I asked Ben, I'm like, is Jordan Edison going to be a first rounder? And he's like, yes. John Dodson was 5'10, 180 pounds.

Yeah. He was Ted Ginn, Corey Coleman, Tavon Austin size. You know the size of first round receivers who busted? Nobody cared. Six. Trade up. Washington, go get him. Chris Olavé was too small, too thin, went back as a senior, got outproduced by Garrett Wilson,

11th overall pick trade up from the Saints. The receivers are going. And then was great. And it was incredible. The receivers are gone. Quinn Johnson, yes. Jordan Addison, yes. Jackson Smith and Jigba.

Oh, he didn't play this year. He's hurt. Yeah, he's going round one. They're all going. And you know what the most underrated part of how these trends spread? I actually think this is literally the most underrated thing of how teams make decisions. is which teams in their own division kicked their ass.

Like I really don't think people understand that if there's a player in your division that whoops you, that you want to go get that. Like, do you know many teams in the, like the Raiders basically drafted Henry Ruggs because they were just tired of playing Tyreek Hill? You know what I mean?

Like there are so many teams that are like, we need a guy. Like we need that guy. And I think that when teams look at either if it's, you know, Josh Allen or Stefan Diggs and your division teams are like, wow, they all have quarterbacks. We need a quarterback.

And I think teams like Washington kind of know, like there's an arms race. You know what I mean? Like it matters to be adding that if you just are kind of getting your butts kicked every week. And I think you can say like pretty emphatically that if you have a top 10, top 15 receiver, then you can elevate quarterback play just on that alone, right? Like it doesn't even need to be a certain system. Like what Justin Jefferson does for Kurt Cousins, what A.J. Brown does for J. hurts what Tyreek Hill does and Jalen Waddle do for

Tootungo ILO, Brandon Ayuk, and Debo Samuel do for Brock Purdy. Like, Devante Adams for Derek Carr. Like, even with the Raiders moving on from Derek Carr, look at the season Devante had. Like, wide receivers are pretty plug and chug. People forget, but Chamar Chase really helped Joe Burrow. Like, it's not that Joe Barrow was bad, but Jamar Chase really helped. In LSU and then again in Cincinnati, right?

You know, it's, we have proof right now of one elite quarterback, not being affected by the gain or loss of a star receiver, and it's Patrick Mahomes. It was the exception that proves every rule, right? And it was his second receiver, though, because he already had Kelsey. He just had two before. So it's the fact that, like,

you really cannot get away with not having a top talent at receiver and not having depth at receiver if you intend on having a top passing offense. There's ways to have that and still struggle and still fail at New York Jets. But you can't, if you're not going to be able to achieve,

achieve having that top passing offense, which is what you need in the NFL, if you want to make a playoff run, without having top talent at receiver. Chargers being a great example, right? Okay, you signed Mike Williams to $20 million. Okay, Keenan's good, but they're hurt all year. And Justin Herbert's incredible, but it wasn't good enough.

They were not explosive enough in the passing game. I think meta, like, big picture, and I didn't even write this down, but I've been saying it all year is exactly what you guys just said, is basically wide receivers can elevate an offense. Why receivers can really elevate a quarterback, and it's so important to have those. guys, have those playmakers, have guys that could just take a little bit off of the

quarterback's plate. Like, so a quarterback doesn't have to carry the team on his shoulders, like every freaking game. Just having those guys that go up and make a play, run after the catch, break tackles, you know, do some of the dirty work that, you know, like basically just make the quarterback's job easier. That's, there's nothing more important in football right now. I think, I think really making the quarterback's life easier. And so, um, this goes back to impacting the passing game, you know, it's, if you're making the quarterback's life easier, like that's extremely valuable. And so yeah, we're probably going to see.

There's, I think, a discussion and some debate right now, how high Jackson Smith and Jigua's going to go because he's a normal-sized person. Like, he's not big. He's not especially explosive or fast. Like, he's probably not going to test super well. And he's sort of a slot-only player. And so there's some indication that he might not be taken as high as everybody else. But I know, Ben, you've mentioned this past.

You think he's still going to go pretty high, right? Yeah. I think it'll go around one. I think it's because. all of the Ohio state receivers in the history of the world who have produced well have gone round one

and then been good and so this one will also do that do you think do you think he has a chance to go top 15 or it's more likely late time. I mean what are we talking about? Yeah like I know like I right like my head

did a bunch of like well no because of size and no because of this and no because of that but like Johan Dodson went top 16 and like John's a good player but I can say yeah he does he absolutely does. James was a speedster who produced for one year who tore

as ACO. I know. Like in the last game of the season. The Lions traded up to 11. Yeah. Or to 12. I think it's just, if people think you got it, people think you got it. Like at wide receiver, like, arms race like Hyford said is the exact correct way of thinking about it. All right. Before we get to two jargots

in a lie, there's anything at last you guys wanted to hit? I had a resolution to ignore everything, which maybe is bad after an hour-long draft podcast. I was just, as I was like looking for stuff over the past couple years that, like, talk about in the show, I was stumbling on like combine buzz

notebooks from March before drafts and it's just crazy how wrong everything is. It's all bullshit. There was such a good like, you know, it's not anybody's fun not picking on any journalist, but there was such a good NFL network one, or NFL.com one, I should say, from last year that was like, the headline

was like tons of teams interested in the Jimmy Garoppolo trade and the subheadline was Kevin Sifansky emphasizes Baker Mayfield is the team's future starter for 2023. You know what we should do actually when we go to the combine this year? We should reverse a lot of lot of the declarative statements coaches make because Pete Carroll was like,

we will not trade Russell Wilson, Kevin Stefanski was like Baker as a quarterback. We should take all those, reverse them and then do a whole show on news. The Costanza. This is like the draft Costanza. Okay, here we go. All right. Let's write that down. All right, but let's get to America's favorite segment.

Two jargons that a lie. And if you're just joining us, it's a lot of really weird draft jargon. And so we started as a bit making fun of it by having DK and Solak make up draft terms. And we'd guess which one's fake. But then we like ran out of draft terms. So we are leading on our emailers to send them from your own work. So email us your own two jargons at a lie at Ringer Fantasy Football at gmail.com. This one is from Carson.

Carson. Howdy Carson? Carson writes, one of the things I learned in medical school is that medicine has its own language. And this is especially true in the operating room. So I thought I'd give you two surgical tools and a lie. this one is wonderful I also will not be able to pronounce

these the first is debaky it's D EB it's like bake But with a DET and a Y at the end DeBakey The second's Wolf With two Fs The third is just mayo

Real real things don't have Dable letters That's not Wolf has got to be named after some guy Oh yeah Some surgeon named Wolf made a tool The wolf device device.

Yeah. I would like it. I just like it stated on the record, in the event I ever need surgery, I insist they use the wolf on me. I don't know. I don't care what surgery I need. Give me the wolf.

It's like cult fiction. I need the wolf to be involved. I feel like all three of these guys are, or all three of these things are just guys. Or maybe the Mayo is named after the Mayo Clinic. Who knows? Is the Mayo Clinic named after a person? Mayo, Mayo is a head fake.

Mayo is just, It's just Will Levis is involved. I think mayo is fake. I think mayo is a head fake. Give me the head. Give me the mayo. They expected us. He expected us to make the connection to the Mayo Clinic and then think it was real and it's fake.

That's my take. That's what I'm in on. What's your take? Which one? DeBakey wolf or mayo, but I'm going to go with a different one. I'm going to go with the wolf. No, wolf is real. Wolf is the lie?

Yes. DeBakey is a type of forceps for grabs. And a mayo is a heavy scissors. No, it's not. That's such a dumb name for heavy scissors. You call them shears. What is, did he give an explanation for it to what a wolf would be? No, he did not.

It's very interesting. Psycho-analizing this Karsten fella now, why two Fs? That's interesting to me. Oh, you know, you've seen a debate. I guess that's a name. You might have one of these, yeah. Bro, I just looked up the different scissors. This is ridiculous.

They're all the same. There's three scissors on this diagram, and one is called general purpose, and then the other is called Metzenbaum, Metzenbaum, and then the middle one's called Mayo. Absurd. If you're getting surgery, I think you kind of want as many specific types of scissors as is needed. I'm not going to be complaining. There are iris scissors, Lagrange scissors, lister bandage scissors, operating scissors, which implies the rest of them are not operating scissors.

Noyes Spring scissors Hold on, wait We're here, wait, stop good We got more here You want one another one? Yeah Surgery scissors one No, two surgical sponges

And a lie Oh, come on The Kitner, the Raytech and the Blandy Or the Blondie It's like bland with why Say them again Kittner, Raytec and Blandy

Kittner Blandy's a weird one to make up I'm saying Kittner's fake Yeah, I agree I'm going to Blandy Blandy's the lie Damn it. There's a rolled up sponge

Raytex is an x-ray detective I don't want to go out of that All right wait two surgical procedures are the lie The Pusto the Laurent or the Appleby Okay say it again The Pusto The Laurent or the Appleby

LaRont Like Leron Robinson Appleby like the restaurant Yes That's real If it's not That's amazing So

What was the first one again Pusto? Pusto. I think Pusto's fake. I think Laurent's fake. I think Appleby. Shit, Laurent is the lie. Damn it. Good day for three.

What was the Appleby? It's a surgical procedure in pancreatic surgery. Okay. All these are just named after surgeons, correct? Or if you need Appleby's enough, your pancreas. No. I'm now official take surgery. This is too high.

high fluid. I know surgery is important, but this is too many names for things. Y'all gotta relax. You know what's also as funny is that we've got too far. You know, because you know, surgeons listen to music and stuff while they're operating because, you know, they want to be chilling all since hours. We've got emails that people listen to our podcast during surgery. In this, they're not the surgeons, though, to be clear. They're in the surgical room, I believe was the context. But how meta would it be if there are people in O.R right now listening to this looking at those instruments and screaming. While I'm disparaging surgery as a profession.

It's kind of important. He's just saving lives with Mayo scissors instead of Metzenberg scissors. And I'm like, what's the difference? Next time you go in for surgery, so you only get one scissors. Choose one. Which one do you want? Metzenbaum, obviously. Come on.

All right. Thank you, D.K., thank you, Solic. Thank you, Kai, for production help. Thank you, Nugget, Solic's dog. Oh, also, George was barking his head off during that receiver conversation. I'm assuming Kai is just going to mute me for that. Big dog episode today. Big dog.

Thank you, Lord. Thank you, Lord. Thank you, the Kinks. Oh, good pick. Love the Kings. Thank you. Love when we get a band that I know. So lack and Kinks, I never thought I'd see the day?

All right, no more edging jokes. We made too many of those on the NFL, on the NFL show. Dekin, did you hear that? I heard of it, yeah. Oh, my God. It's Solex. Like, yeah, they're edging the Ravens. Yeah, and Peter King also used it.

So I don't know, maybe I'm an award-winning football writer there, Chief. What was the other one you had that was worse? I don't remember. I thought that was bad. Oh, my God. Incredible. All right. Goodbye, everyone.

Oh, wait. What am I talking about? Last week, the Cardi B. That wasn't me. That was D.K. I know, but that was hilarious. Yes. Oh, boy.

Whap. It happens. All right, now goodbye to do it.