The Ringer NFL Show - 2021 Trade Deadline Recap

Episode Date: November 2, 2021

Kevin, Nora, and Steven were live on Spotify Greenroom to recap the trades that took place and how the outlooks for a couple of contenders have changed. They also discuss some rumored trades that didn’t end up happening. Hosts: Kevin Clark, Nora Princiotti, and Steven Ruiz Production Assistant: Isaiah Blakely Additional Production Supervision: Arjuna Ramgopal and Patrick Muldowney Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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It's trade deadline reaction or I guess as a while. lack of a trade deadline, but there's a lot to talk about. I'm joined by Nora Prince. I didn't know what's going on. Happy trade deadline day, Kevin. How was it for you? I had a nice time. I was texting somebody in personnel like a couple hours ago and he was just saying, this is always such a fun day, even though stuff really doesn't happen all that often.

And that, I found that comforting because I was just like, ah, personnel people are just like us. That's how I feel. The one thing, and you know this as well, the amount of boredom in NFL facilities in the regular season would really shock you unless you're a coach, a position coach coordinator or whatever. Like the personnel guys, they're not doing a whole lot. NFL people either work 120 hours a week, drink eight red bowls a day, live incredibly work intensive and unhealthy lives, or like they're just on Twitter kind of a lot. That's correct. And I would say this, the famous line is if they're, if these guys work as hard. as they say they do, why are there so many scratch golfers?

Who's not a scratch golfer? It's Stephen Ruiz. What's going on, buddy? How do you know I'm not one? Because you have a PS5. That's true. I'm not a scratch golfer. I'm pretty good at golf video games. Guys, the chat is alleging that Ruiz might be the Bangalorian. Oh, wow.

Explain your rivalry with a Bengals superfan, Stephen, before we get into this. Well, I have a rivalry with the whole Bengals fan base, but he's one. of the, if there was a Mount Rushmore of Bengals fans, he would be on it, along with the Bengals captain, there's a Bengals Batman. There's a whole Bengals extended universe. Yes. Okay. The Bangalorian was the funniest of the characters to me. So I latched onto him and me and him have kind of gone back and forth. And then I lost a bet to Solac. So now I have him as my Twitter avatar. Wow. Okay. So let's get to the actual trade deadline. Interesting few days. We're going to start. We're going to get to the Von Miller stuff. We're going to get to the Odell Beckham stuff and the

11-minute video that his dad posted this morning. One of our colleagues said, I wish that our dad's posted stuff like that in defense of our job performance. But okay, all right, so we'll start with Deshaun Watson and the lack of a trade. So a couple different reports, all saying the same thing. Ian Rapp report reported that Dolphins owner Stephen Ross received permission to talk to Deshaun Watson last night and there just wasn't enough time to get a deal done. According to Rapsheet, the fact that Deshaun Watson did not settle his legal situation.

was the reason that nobody traded for him. That seemed to be inevitable and obvious. And this goes on. He cannot be traded now until March 2022. I guess in theory there could be a deal in place before that. Shefter said it was due diligence by Miami, but they're not going to do what Ross made the call. Nora, this seems like common sense from all sides.

Yeah. I think honestly, the most notable thing is that even it was allowed to get to this point. I wrote something last week. I just fully don't understand why he was not placed on the commissioner's exempt list. It is the only outcome that makes sense to me. I just do not understand why it's not worth figuring out the legal situation, letting those investigations run their course while putting someone on paid leave in a way that's been, you know, used on other players. And I don't want to say similar situations because it's ultimately, you know, apples to oranges at absolute best in cases like this. but it just makes no sense to me

that we batted this around like no pun intended a football for however many weeks when it just was either going to end in nothing as it did, which is probably within that context the best outcome

or if it didn't, it's either as you said on the show a couple weeks ago the riskiest and most reckless trade a team could have made ever. It'd be the most reckless trade in the history of football.

Yeah. including by the way, I mean, even play out the scenario where Watson figures this all out, his name is cleared, whatever, the team that traded for him under those circumstances doesn't even get to say, well, we knew. They just have to live with, well, we were kind of maybe, maybe not, but he's a really good football player, so we went for it. Like, there's just no, I just wish this hadn't been. as big of a story. But it was and nothing happened.

So people were covering it like it was normal trade. And that was so strange to me. And so, and also what does settled legal issues even mean? Ask the grand jury to come back early so that he can go replace Tua. Excuse me, grand jury. The dolphins have a quarterback crisis. I don't know what that ever meant. It was all very strange.

Stephen, where do the dolphins go from here? I thought the sense of urgency for the trade got stranger and stranger as a season. Them being one and seven, like Deshaun Watson. all the horrible things that come with trading for him. He's not going to turn around the season. So it didn't make sense. And where did the dolphins go? I don't know.

Maybe they asked the Eagles for their top five pickback. I think this is a situation where now you know. That's going to go. Now you have to wait. Why don't they try to trade Jalen Waddle for their top five pick and see how it goes? That would be a good idea. I mean, at this point, they have to wait two years to even address their quarterback situation. So now it's just like to have at it again or trade for Aaron Rogers in the office.

Yeah, I mean, there's just, there's just not a lot that they can do. Nora, the dolphins plan now is, is what? Yeah. Draft better? I, wait, I got an idea. Right-handed Tua. Right-handed Tua. We flip that around.

I mean, I think that there's just a couple of teams now that will be kicking the can down the road, and that's the Panthers, who obviously David Deppar wants a franchise quarterback. That's the Dolphins who thought they had a franchise quarterback when they drafted Tua. They don't. and the Justin Herbert thing makes it worse and worse every single week. And so I think that it's going to be. Without Justin Herbert was washed now. Well, I mean, it depends.

He's less washed than Tua. Is Tua washed or was Tua never the opposite of Washed? He was pre-washed. Yeah, he was pre-washed. Yeah, he was pre-washed. What evidence do you have that suggest David Teper wants a franchise quarterback? Well, he says it a lot. He has a lot of money and seems to want to use it.

Then why did he use it on acquiring? Sam Darnold a year ago, or a couple months ago. You know, Stephen Ruiz, you raise an interesting point. The real answer to your question, right, is that the Panthers, a team that you could argue is a year plus away roster-wise from being like, okay, all they need is a good quarterback. Let's get ready to go.

They were reportedly in the mix for Stafford, for Rogers. For Watson, every high-level quarterback that's been even, you know, rumored whispered to be available, the Panthers are like, ooh, do I want some of that? Maybe. Let's see. Which at least creates the impression. Right. But that's what they're looking for.

To your point, actual evidence that's going out doing it. Right. That's, that was the whole issue. But yeah, I, I don't think the dolphins have an easy way out of this. That does it involve starting over? in the front office, I get the idea of, oh, if you're going to take an analytical approach, you have to be patient. And sometimes things aren't going to work out. And the owner can't be scared off by minor setbacks. But this isn't a minor setback at this point. They put all their

eggs in this basket. They were supposed to compete in 2021. And they are now one in seven. They are now worse than they were the year when everyone was asking, are they tanking on purpose? And is this safe for the players? Like two years ago, we were having that discussion. And this team is technically worse than that team. I mean, I don't know how you continue on with this front office going forward. Yeah. It's really, no, I think there's like a full, full reset button situation that's kind of necessary.

Which kind of explains the sense of urgency when trading for Deshaun Watson. Like, that's a whole PR storm you have to deal with. And obviously, you shouldn't be trading for players that submit these things off the field. But it would have glossed over the fact that they botched this quarterback situation. And like the pessimist in me thinks that may be the reason why they pursued this trait so heavily at a time when things were so uncertain. Well, totally. I mean, that was, that was in my view at least, kind of what made, put it into relief

why I felt like the NFL just needed to put him on the exempt list because it was creating situations where it was like, okay, one week, there's a commitment to, coach says we're committed to the quarterback. then quarterback plays terribly, then all of a sudden Deshawn Watson rumors cycle into high gear, and then you just get this feeling like, okay,

teams are not going and making an assessment over whether or not they can stomach, adding this player to their roster, given what they know and more importantly don't know about his situation. It actually exists on a spectrum based on what their football needs are, and that's what gets kind of troublesome.

Yeah, that makes sense. Should we discuss trades that actually happened? Yes, I think that would be delightful. All right. So let's talk about the Melbourne Ingram trade. I feel like that's the one. I would love to. I feel like that's the one that,

like the Von Miller trade has obviously stolen the headlines. But I think a trade for Ingram is the kind of trade that kind of just changes one little thing for the Chief's defense, but it could have a knock on effect that really, helps them out. And assuming Patrick Mahomes figures out this turnover problem and he starts to play better when teams aren't when the too high doesn't confound him anymore. I think the chiefs, this move could potentially get the chiefs back in the race for a Super Bowl.

Well, so the thing is, the chiefs are in a weird way still in the race, right? Like they're four and four. The AFC is a mess. So they're absolutely like the wild card is very, very, very much in play for this team. I don't think they're in a great place for the division. Because particularly because I don't think their defensive issues are just going to go away. But they are absolutely in the playoff hunt,

like very squarely in the AFC. The reason why I'm optimistic about this trade for the Chiefs defense is that it allows Steve Spagnolo to stop blitzing so much. Because one of the problems is that it's not just that he's blitzing. He's blitzing in an effort to get a free rusher because they have no one that can defeat one-on-one blocks. Now that you have Ingram, you could kind of mess with protections enough

where you're getting Ingram on, he's still getting blocked, but he's getting blocked by a tight end. He's getting blocked by a running back. And he can win those one-on-one matchups, whereas other edge rushers on the Chiefs roster before the trade could not. So I think it takes some pressure off him on third down. He could do more covered stuff. And it should make the Chief's defense look a little like it did in 2019

when they won Super Bowl. It wasn't great back then, but it was at least passable. It was decent. I mean, Ingram Frank Clark, Chris Jones, Reid is a decent sounding group. And I think decent would go a really long way for the Chiefs right now, particularly as you're saying, Stephen, if it would enable them to blitz a little bit less and not leave those linebackers and safeties on as many islands they're currently really, really unable to hold up on.

Are you saying Daniel Sorensen is no Derell Revis? I am saying that Sorensen, Island is not exactly a vacation destination. Ruiz, what's your best guess on why Swaronson keeps getting snaps? I don't think Juan Thornhill is good against the run. And I think when you're at

safety, it becomes harder to decide like, oh, should I trigger against the run or should I stay back and play my coverage? And like when you're not a player who can do that instantly, it's hard to play you on early downs. Okay. So Ingram has a 13.7 13.7 pressure percentage rate this year, percent past rush win rate according to pro football focus.

If there's a schematic thing that the cheats can do, Stephen, like, what is it? Is it what you said? It's just blitzing less and trying to get pressure up front? I mean, is there anything solving this? Or is this just going to be Patrick Bowman saves himself and that saves the season? I mean, I don't know if the move is going to work out. So it could end up being Patrick Mullins has to save this. But let's say it does.

I think it allows them, it's not necessarily blitzing less. It's how they're blitzing. It's instead of sending a six-man pressure because we need to have a free. rush against five offense alive. And we could send a five-man pressure now and get a good matchup on Chris Jones or Ingram that we can win. Now you have more players in the secondary to defend the pass. I think that's what it does.

Less six-man pressures, more five-man pressures. That's what the Steelers were doing early on with him. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, they had to do something, right? Like, this was the kind of trade deadline where if the chief didn't do something, we would have all killed Brett Beach and said, okay, they stood pat and they shouldn't have. They also traded for Tite End Dan Brown. They traded Duberinary Tardee to the Jets.

I mean, it's fine. It's the best thing I get. $600,000 salary is not huge. Giving up a sixth round pick is not huge. It moves fine, right? Yeah, it was worth the risk. I mean, if it doesn't work out, who cares? He also didn't want to be in Pittsburgh.

Tom went unveiled once again his, we don't want hostages quote, which is what he says about guys you don't want to be there. So it's fine. I think it works for all parties and they can just, they can, you know, it's not a huge investment. I love that Mike Tomlin's like bit is just to casually invoke a hostage situation. I love that this is just a thing that Mike Tomlin is known for doing.

Like, oh, Alex Highsmith is getting more snaps. All of a sudden, he's a hostage here. Wait, Ben Rathesberger is choosing to be there. He's not there against his will. Ben Rathesberger is volunteering to do this. I mean, to be clear, Ben Rathesberger is the one person who opts in every single year to make $30 million. That's a good point.

It's one of his, it's one of his. I too volunteer to make $30 million. Is immediately checking down on fourth down like a form of time theft? That's why he's there. That's why he ups in every single year. All right.

It's possible that Rathusberger is the one who's holding the Steelers hostage. That's correct. Yes. That is more to the point. He's both salary caps schematically. One of the offensive coordinator of Phil's about that. All right, let's, let's kind of move off this and go to Von Miller and the trade that went

down on Monday. So lack and I did an emergency pod on Monday about it are all of our, um, dots are, are mostly there, but Nora and Stephen, you guys haven't talked about it. I do want to add this note, which is that apparently a Noah fan confirmed this. So it was reported on Monday that Von Miller was upset about a Halloween party in which the players did not chip in. And then Noah fan went on the radio and confirmed that. Devon wanted to cancel the party because of a losing streak. Money became an issue with the guys and fan added that he was sad that that didn't stay in-house. I didn't know a Halloween party could change the fortunes of NFL franchise nor. I'm sort of not, I'm not surprised in this. Halloween party drama, I think, is a little too common

because it's like, it's this big weekend. Everybody wants to go a little too hard. It involves a lot of machinations. You never host because what if you start? Yes. I actually love to host, but not a, not for a, not for a holiday where people like really go hard. Sure. But only close friends. Only close friends. Yeah. The lesson is host a dinner party.

Could you imagine throwing a party in the result is the greatest player in franchise history wants out? He threw the party. Oh, he threw the party. Oh, he threw the party. That's his own party. All right. Football wise, not party wise. Stephen, what does this give the ramps?

It gives them Vaughn Miller. It gives them, no, no, it gives them like another play. Like one thing they've done well this year, Rahim Morris has done well is what I was talking about with the Chiefs, getting matchups for certain players. And now that you add Von Miller into that mix and all of a sudden we maybe can't slide your protection towards Aaron Donald on third down, I think that makes it so much harder. for offenses to even game plan. Because you have to game plan around players like this. You can't call certain plays because of it. You have to leave certain chunks

of your playbook out because you have to worry about blocking Von Miller, Aaron Donald, Leonard Floyd. It just makes things so much harder. And I understand there's like some kind of there's some pushback to the straight from the analytics people saying

the Rams are going all in. They're doing too much. They're giving up too much for this. The second and third round pick is also in part because the Broncos are taking $9 million of the $9.5 million salary. So Vonneller is basically free. And one would assume that they're going to get a comp pick if he does leave in free agency. That's right. And they're going to get third round comp picks because of some of the hiring,

new finagle hiring stuff and stuff and stuff like that. The compick for the compick for Miller would be up to a fifth. I think some people thought it could be up to a third, but it could be up to a fifth just because how long he's been tenure. They also have their own fifth round pick. boy, the Rams are just hitting that fifth round. That's when they, that's when they shine. So here, here's where I think like the analytical analysis of this trade fall short.

Get them. When you're a team like the Rams who are going to make the playoffs, I think you start worrying about those playoffs and how you're going to game plan and how teams are going to game plan against you. And individual matchups become so much more important. Whereas when you're an analytics person, you're trying to study as, as big of a sample size as you possibly can. You're not necessarily worried about how we match up with a certain team.

I think they made that trade because they want to beat Tom Brady. I know they beat them already this year, but in the playoffs, it's going to be different. And when you have Von Miller, Tom Brady's job becomes a lot harder. Yes, as the Broncos proved when they won the Super Bowl. How much does he have left? I think it was 19th the NFL in pass rush win rate, 19th the NFL in pressures. Like, Von Miller is what now? he's still a very good pass.

I would say top 10 pass rusher. I don't know if he's still top five. But like he's still good in the ways that you would expect a young pass rusher to be like he still has bend. That's like the thing. Like he can turn the corner really fast. That's the first thing that goes. On a team that makes like Leonard Floyd look really, really, really good on a routine basis. Like I think he's got plenty left in the tank.

And Dante Fowler. He got paid off of playing with Aaron Donald for a year. Yeah. Nor are the Rams going the Super Bowl? Are they going to win the Super Bowl? Here's the problem. Tom Brady wins the Super Bowl. That's just like his shit and he's not on the Rams.

But I think this makes the top of the NFC Rams bucks. It's like that's like your little, I hate to do a tier for you. I know you hate that. But if I were to tier this for you, I would make a little top tier of the Rams and the bucks. Maybe the bucks in the ramp.

It's not the packers. But they're in a nice little. Packers might be hypothetically if we're tiering it, which we're not, we are not tiering it. We're not tearing it. But if we're not tearing it. But if we were, we might say that the Packers and I think as long as Dat gets back and healthy, which he seems like he's like very well on the on the road to be doing that. But if that's the case, I'm saying Packers Cowboys is maybe the top of that second team. Where do the Cardinals fall in? Further down in the second tier. Secondary. Again, we're not doing tears.

We don't do tears on this podcast anymore. The tears are canceled. The tears are on my pillow. Ruiz. Broncos blow it up. Oh, yeah. I mean, isn't this blowing it up? Yeah.

Assuming it wasn't 100% the Hollywood party, a Halloween party drama. Right. This is blowing, this is the first step. Also, also, you don't like, if Aaron Rogers, if no one showed that Aaron Rogers, John Wick party, they wouldn't have traded them. Like, you know, it's just a, it's a separate deal.

All right. So let's go through a couple of the notes here. The Eagles did not trade Fletcher Cox. Seems like a good move. I actually didn't even follow why that had to be reported. They're thinking about it? Yeah, there were some rumors. I mean, I guess it makes sense on paper

just because he's an aging player and they probably need to reset. But I don't think you just give away players just because I think the analytics people would have applauded that trade. Like just getting rid of good players for draft picks is a good deal. Who are the, let's stop you right there.

Who are the analytics people? You want me to name names? Name people like Merrill Streep and the Oscars. Is it like, who, who, who is it like Billy Bean? No, I'm talking about the people on, on Twitter. Okay. The analytics people. The Illuminati.

No, yeah, Billy Bean is a, you could use him as a stand in. All right. So let's get to this one. This is a non, this is a non trade thing, would have obsessed with it. So Sam Farmer of the LA Times called Philip Rivers today. And he said he is not heard from the, Saints, but he'd be listening. His high school season is over. He was a high school coach in Alabama this year. That is over. He's got nothing to do. Stephen, you had a take on this. I'd like you to make it

a public take. Yeah, he's just like publicly lobbying for the Saints to sign him at this point. I think this is like his way of, you know, like when an agent leaked something to the press and they tweeted out and they try to will it into existence, he's doing this. Like someone gave him the idea. And I think by next Sunday he's going to be doing the fake two-minute drill Russell Wilson does outside of the Saints complex. It's going to be a bettery. Just go, it's like the Pelicans are also there.

So he could also just do, just try out for both teams. Um, wow. Wait, hold on, hold on. Here's the Sam Farmer tweet.

Philip Rivers tells me he hasn't heard from the Saints, but would listen. Tells me, we sure Philip Rivers didn't call Sam Farmer? No, I think that might have happened. It definitely happened. I think that might have happened.

Like this does not say I called Philip Rivers. I'll ask, I want to ask both of you, but I will ask you first even. Should the Saints sign Philip Rivers, since Philip Rivers decided to get this out there? Yes, why not? I feel like Phil.

It sounds like he'd play for the minimum. Yeah, I think he would. I think he would just like allow the high school that's employing him to pay his salary. And then he'll just play for free. Offsats? Offsets with the Faroebe Alabama High School? The high school probably has more caps space than Saints.

Let's be honest. That's a very nice area of the country. I'll say that. It's a very nice. It's sort of by the Senior Bowl. Nora, what would you do if you were Mickey Looms, Sean Payton right now with quarterback position? Heck yeah.

That's it? Like, was that a, I would just say, heck yeah. Okay. I probably, I would love to sign Philip Rivers because it would be very fun. I wish that one Theodore Bridgewater and or Tyrod Taylor. had been an option. But maybe Sean Payton just keeps, like, winning with Tassum and Trevor Simeon.

IDK, man, I feel like he can do that. How about Cam Newton? Yeah. Would you rather have Cam Newton or Philip Rivers? Probably Cam Newton, because he just has... I don't know. He was, like, out of training camp and stuff. Yeah, I don't know. I think Philip Rivers...

Then again, I also feel like Philip Rivers probably just, like, hosts training camp for himself in his backyard with all of his children. I would say Philip Rivers, as much as it pains me to say, just because of the timing aspect. I just think that when guys stop playing, it like really,

that can be quite, quite problematic. That's correct. When you talk about Odell Beckham Jr., and I purposely waited until sort of the middle of his pod because otherwise we were just going to spend the entire time on it.

Odell Beckham, senior, made an 11-minute video or posted an 11-minute video. I don't know if he actually edits it. I don't know if he's, if he's, I mean, if we should, the ringer should hire him as a video editor if, if he made it. Um, posted an 11 minute video of O'Dell Beckham, I guess not getting the ball from Baker Mayfield. I guess that's the way to put it.

Uh, and then in the, in the chat, he responded, he said that, uh, Mayfield is quote, either hating on O'Dell or he doesn't want him shining. Can I read some hashtags? Please do. So I don't want to dunk on a, on a dad trying. to hashtag, except that's what the internet is for. So I'm going to do it. Here's some hashtags that were in the caption on the video that was on Instagram.

Hashtag I hurt for him. That's the number four. Followed up by hashtag, this really hurts. And then hashtag, very hurtful. So we know how Odell Beckham Sr. feels about this. He is hurt. He is upset. And then LeBron sends a tweet saying free OBJ.

A couple other people. Dame Lillard, I think, was like, yo, this is crazy. So obviously. Dame Lillard had like plausible deniability on his comment, though. The group chat, whatever group chats, O'Dell was in, Odell Jr., and maybe senior, with superstars. There was clearly a concerted effort to free OBJ today. A couple of things.

Number one, this was reported. There were, I saw a couple reporters who acted like this was, like O'Dell Beckham Sr. had just accidentally, like, dropped an atomic weapon on somebody. Like, this happens all the time. Parents are mad about everything with their kid in the same way that, like, if we all play professional sports, our parents would be like, I think they should give the ball to my child on every single play, right?

I was in the student, or the family section at the Miami UNC game a couple weeks ago. And I literally every parent was just like, why don't they give it to my son on every single play? Okay, that's how these things go. That's what parents are supposed to do. I'm not going to name the receiver. There's receivers' parents who were right behind us who would just yell, open.

He's open on every single play. The child was never open. The child was never open. But he looked open, okay? But Odell's dad had video proof. But here's my thing. Enough with the conspiracies, can't Baker Mayfield just be bad? Maybe he doesn't have these ulterior motives.

Maybe he just sucks. Yeah. That's what I wanted to get to here. Is it, it's, everyone's like, oh, yeah, Baker, O'Dell's here's like, Baker, it really doesn't want him to shine. Maybe he just can't get him the football. It would really help if Baker could get on some of these easy throws, get the ball in Odell's hands, you can run 80 yards like you used to.

I don't think, A, O'Dell is capable of that. And B, I really don't think Baker is capable of that. What say you about the Brown's offense right now, Stephen? When I watch them on film, I will say this, I agree with O'Dell's dad. Odell is not the problem. He gets open consistently. He's not O'Dell from 2016 or whatever the last year he was considered elite. But he's still a very good player.

And the fact that there's this misconnection between him and Baker Mayfield, I don't think it's all on Baker. But I don't, I think we're taking the wrong conclusion away from it. And that's like, Odell's presence on the field is ruining the offense. I don't think that's true. I just think it's a small sample size of targets that haven't gone right.

But he's still a good player who can help this team win. And the offense is still fairly productive outside of a few notable games. Nora, how do we fix it? Well, I think there's this tendency for it to either be, it's got to be Baker's fault or it's got to be Odell's fault. I do think that there's a preponderance of evidence that these two players don't work particularly well together. So since 2019, Baker's got a 69 passer rating when targeting Odell, which is the lowest figure of any quarterback and receiver with more than 100 passing attempts in that span between them. I mean, we're not holding up pass a rating when targeting a specific receiver as like the be all end all of whether or not an offense functions. It's not great, right, to be last on that list.

There are a lot of metrics that say that Baker's an at least slightly better quarterback when he's not targeting O'Dell, whether that's because he just has this tendency to try to force it to O'Dell or tries to spend a little too much mental energy on making that something when it hasn't been. maybe that's it. I do think that those two guys just like don't really have it going on together. I do want to go back to not to criticize LeBron here, who I think did an excellent job. I mean, speaking of dads, being just like a great football dad on the Manning cast just muttering a draw play right here over and over again while Walt Peyton Manning tried to make jokes. I think that went a little bit better than the tweet, right? Because speaking of hostage situations, as we have discussed elsewhere in this division,

Odell is not exactly being held hostage. I think it's a fairly open secret that if another team were offering a second round pick for O'Dall Beckham, a second. I think it's a lot lower than that. I think he would. So I asked around today and the response that I got most often about like, what's O'Don? L's value right now is like maybe a third. I think if there was maybe a fourth, they would have thought about it.

He's not helping the team in any meaningful way. Well, right. And because he is not helping the team in any meaningful way, the fact that he's not getting traded means that the offers aren't there. Right. So like free OBJ is like a little bit of, he could be freed. I'm sure the Browns would be probably pretty amenable to free him. His dead cat this year is 15.

I mean, next year, according to Spowchak, he doesn't have a dead cap. So they can get out of his deal pretty easily next year. So we'll see how that goes. Does this anything here tie into how much you pay Baker, Nora? Oh, God. No. No. The how much you pay Baker thing is like the most complicated and fraught question in football right now.

And I think honestly, the answer is trending towards like you kind of don't pay Baker. I think at this point, which is a really, really, really scary position to be in when you were the Cleveland Browns. And when Miles Garrett wears a Halloween costume that has all the quarterbacks that he's sacked on it and from a distance, it looks like it has all the Browns quarterbacks on it. Yeah. By the way, thank God nobody upset Miles Garrett during his Halloween thing. That's the kind of guy. If he has like a bad party or whatever, you just don't say a thing. You just keep it moving. You go as a dinosaur because he really likes dinosaurs. He does like dinosaurs. But no, the answer to your question is that like the Baker thing is so complicated that I think

you almost have to, you kind of have to address it in a vacuum just because if that's not the thing, it's kind of the only thing. I feel like there's like an obvious answer or solution to it. It's just let him play out the fifth year option. And then if he, if he plays well, just play the franchise tag game. Just franchise him. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. No, I agree. When I say don't pay him, I mean like big contract. now is just a no. I agree with you on where it is right now. Like before the season, I would have been like, yeah,

you pay him. You have to pay him. Yeah, that's how I felt. But now it's like, that's how I felt too. But I also thought he would have a good season. Well,

also the market now is like $35 million for Baker Mayfield. Right. You can't pay him. I'm sorry. No, 35 million dollars. I will not be doing that if I'm Andrew Barry. I don't think Andrew Barry will either.

I understand it like it can work under the cap and everything. If anything about Carson Wentz taught it or golf taught us anything, you can move. any contract. Any contract is movable. But still, you don't want a, a, you don't want to have to attach a first round pick. If Wentz and Goff also

taught us anything and Baker, I think, is better than those players. But if he's certainly better than golf, they also taught us that maybe it's not always ideal to hand a quarterback who has been supported by scheme and has been

good in small sample sizes, but not consistently. a huge bag of money. That also might be a secondary lesson. All right. Let's go big picture. Who won trade deadline week, Steve? The ramps.

I think they're the only team that tried to win it unless you can't have the chiefs trading for Melvin Ingram. I guess. I have a list here. She has to put out a list. We're forgetting Zach Earths to the Cardinals. Fine. Steph Gilmore to the Panthers, C.J. Henderson to the Panthers.

Kenny Young to the Broncos. Okay. Stefan Gilmore was good last week. Flacco, you got a pick. Flacco to the Jess. Mark Ingram to the Saints and then the trades that we've already mentioned. So no one- I'm switching to the Jets.

You got to get a good backup for Mike White. And they got a doctor. You can save a medical cost with Diviv B'nai-Tardee. He could get Zach Wilson back on the field. It's like a Belichick values positional flexibility. And they hired John Beck, which absolutely doesn't have we're panicking about our quarterback vibes at all. No, you know what happened?

I interviewed John Beck for a story a couple weeks ago. And then the Jets hired him? I'm like the Sean McVeigh of coaching hires now. All right. I think that still might be Sean McVeigh. I have another winner. Okay, go ahead. We might have the same one because we think pretty similar on this lines.

Go ahead. It's the Broncos trade package for Aaron Rogers next year. Oh. They get an extra second and a third. Okay. The Broncos have a first round pick, two seconds, two thirds, one fourth, two fifths, and two seventh. Okay. But my counterargumentary.

is that things are going so well in Green Bay right now and the Broncos are not in any way going to be a better option. I just think he should just stay in Green Bay. Should and Will are a different thing. I just don't think, especially as the Broncos just, I mean,

they got rid of, it isn't having a good defense like part of the reason he wanted to go there. Also, he's very into Halloween. It takes it very seriously. So that's correct. Oh, you got to think about that stuff. The Halloween party stuff might be nightmare. It's going to be real sad when this Aaron Rogers trade package

turns into a Sam Howell trade package. I have a winner. I think it might be the Buffalo Bills because nobody in the AFC made a Von Miller type move. And I kind of feel like if I'm a top top, and I'm using them as a proxy for any of the top teams in the AFC, going into this

week, I mean, however small, there was a chance that some third tier second tier AFC team would have made a leap and they didn't. So the Ravens benefit from this, the bills benefit from this, just those teams that we talk about as leading the way in the FC to me, I think standing pat, it seems like a pretty good move right now. Flip side of that, a loser to me is the Titans because you lose Derek Henry.

And that's just absolutely. Right. Like, which first of all, okay, that is underwhelming in and of itself. But I don't like what it says about how they look at the rest of their season without Derek Henry, right? Because Mike Frabble's out here saying stuff about, well, running back by committee. And it's just like, you need to recognize how significant of a blow that is. And our guy, Ben Solac, who's in the chat, who's in the chat, has made, I think, very articulate and convincing arguments about how the way to pivot from that is go get another receiver, just become a passing

team in a way that the Titans have not been, show some recognition of how drastic this has to change your offense. And they just did not do that. All right. A couple of questions. Have you guys heard about the Texas special teams coaches monkey? Oh, boy, have I?

No, I. I don't actually think we should elaborate on that. No. Get that clear with Spotify legal before we comment on that. Are we allowed to name the poll assassin? We just did. We just did without asking.

Sorry. Um, so my take is don't have exotic pets. I have a lot of takes from that, actually. Dominic, Dominic asks, which parent of the ring around NFL show universe is Odell's dad saying my child has the best take and not getting enough podcast time? I don't know. I don't know. I don't know anybody's parents well enough. So my dad had a take, um, based off our last podcast. He, uh, it's texted me and was like, Nora, when Kevin mentions the Zonauton, the Pruder film, do you know what that means? And I was like, I was a U.S. history major in college, dude.

Like, you wrote those checks, buddy. That's kind of an insult. That's a, yeah, I was like, what are we doing here, Dad? He's not a surprise to Sean Jackson announces he's parting ways with the Rams. Fine. Wasn't a lot of room for him. Tough scene. Someone's asking what is a pruder?

And I don't want to answer that. Um, okay, so. Google it. The, uh, my dad asked if I needed to do. Darren Ravel will tweet the film out. Hey, um, I would say, you know, I was supposed to, this is actually a famous, uh, ringer moment is that I actually was going to have dinner with Malloy Rubin and her father in Baltimore the night before the Ravens, AFC championship game right before they lost of the Titans.

So that, that dinner is still on the books. It has never happened. Then there was a pandemic. so we have never had that dinner with Mallory and Barry Rubin. So that's it. That's why I've never met anybody there. Someone says Rivers to Carolina, Stephen? Sure.

Why not? What do you want me to say to that? Is it better or worse? I mean, I assume, it's clearly better. North would be a better option for him? And it would be New Orleans best option, right? I think I would, if I'm feeling, Philip Rivers, not looking at record, just like offense and situation, I feel like the Panthers

would be more attractive than New Orleans in terms of weapons. Yeah, not in terms of coaching and all that. I mean, Sean Payton is a better coach than. I feel like Philip Rivers has, he could be his own coach. Like, you don't need a coach necessarily. Yeah, but I think he would like to hang out with Sean Payton. I agree with that. Ben Solac is upset because he was the one that asked what is a pruder and I didn't realize it because I was just turning out content too busy to read names.

So, uh, all right. Anything else guys? Google it, Ben. I got nothing else. Thanks everybody for joining the live show. This was fun.

We'll do it again sometime. Probably have more in-depth takes on, uh, Jeff Banks's girlfriend's, uh, monkey down the line. This episode was made possible by producer Isaiah Blakely with additional production supervision by Arjuna, Ramcapul. Next up on this feed is the players podcast, Jason Goff, James Jones, and Ryan Shazier

break down everything from the player's perspective. I will see you on Sunday with Ben, Stephen, and Nora. It's been the Ringar NFL show and Green Room, part of the Ringer Podcast Network.