The Ringer NFL Show - Belichick Regret? One and Done? Answering Five Questions on the New NFL Head Coaching Hires | Extra Point Taken

Episode Date: February 2, 2024

The NFL coaching cycle was completed Thursday after the Commanders named Cowboys DC Dan Quinn their new head coach. Ben and Sheil discuss the new hires and how they fit with their new teams. Plus, who will regret not hiring Bill Belichick? The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please check out theringer.com/RG to find out more, or listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Hosts: Ben Solak and Sheil Kapadia Producer: Cliff Augustin Additional Production Supervision: Arjuna Ramgopal and Conor Nevins Social: Eduardo Ocampo and Kiera Givens Musical Elements: Devon Renaldo Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

There are a lot of quarterbacks in the NFL draft this year. My name is Ben Solac and I host the Ringer NFL Draft Show with Danny Kelly, Danny Hyfitts, and Craig Horlebeck. We cover trades, free agency, and the draft, which is, yeah, obviously. We'll tell you about everything, which includes which quarterbacks are good, which quarterbacks are bad and which quarterbacks are just Kirk Cousins. That is the Ringer NFL Draft Show. Search the Ringer NFL Draft show on Spotify. Welcome to Extra Point. Thank you, Geelkefati here, joined by Ben Solac.

No games this weekend. What do we do? No props. No picks. No long shots. We're still here. Here's what we're going to do. We're going to talk about coaching hires, all eight openings. So-Lak, have been filled. We have a series. It is straightforward. This is the little abbreviated pod. Five questions, superlatives, however you want to frame them about these new hires. What do we think about them? That's the show today. That's it. What do you

think, So-Lac? You ready for this? I'm ready for it. I love the suggestion that there are no props this week. You are not trying hard enough, my friend. There are plenty of props. We got Super Bowl props coming out. Initial overruns, we got to put on any draft props coming out. No props coming out. No, no, no, no, no. There's... All right. There are props, but you cannot win money on them this weekend. Is that correct? Unless you're betting a different sport. Not this show. Not this is the, yeah, not this Friday show is taking a new direction. There we go. Before we get started, here's what I want you to do. Pause, pause the pod recording. Go to YouTube. Go to Ringer NFL. subscribe.

You're aware the pod can play in the background while you go to a different app, right? You don't leave just Spotify. No, no, no. We don't want people like you trying to do seven things at once and then not paying attention to two of them. I want you to do it like me. Focus on what you're doing. Task at hand.

Pause the show. Go to YouTube. Ringer NFL. We're going to be doing a lot more video content. Already stuff out there. The play sheet from Benny Souls is on there. We're going to have next week from the Super Bowl full. video podcast. You can watch the entire thing. You can watch Solax's wild reactions. When he makes

those noises that you hear, you can see what his face looks like. I mean, who doesn't want to see that? So go, subscribe to that page. It's going to be a lot of fun. We'll be adding a lot more stuff there. All right, let's get to it. Eight coaching hires, okay, Washington commanders, Dan Quinn, Seattle Seahawks, Mike McDonald, Atlanta Falcons, Rahe-Morris, Carolina Panthers, Dave Canales, Los Angeles Chargers, Jim Harbaugh. Tennessee Titans, Brian Callahan, Las Vegas Raiders, Antonio Pierce, and then New England Patriots, Gerard Mayo, a quarter of the league turned over their head coaches this offseason. So here are the questions we have.

Let's start with number one. Now, before we get into this, Ben, I do have to say, because predicting what coaches are going to be good is maybe the hardest thing in like the NFL analysis. I mean, you go back and you look at any of these grades or rankings, best hires, worst hires, and I've had my name on some of them over the years. Don't get me wrong. And you will be completely, completely wrong. So we're just letting you know that.

So don't get mad if we rip your coaching higher. And then a year from now, that person's in the Super Bowl. Speaking of which, first question, coach in this cycle, Ben, most likely to win a Super Bowl in the next three seasons. Who do you got? Yeah, I wanted to be. more spicy than this, but I think the answer is Jim Harbaugh with the Chargers. And this is of the guys who got new jobs, the best quarterback on those teams is unquestionably Justin Herbert, right?

Like that's your best quarterback situation, period. And I think that's your greatest predictor of Super Bowl attendance. If we want to argue that coaching quality is also a strong predictor of Super Bowl attendance, which I would, Jim has been there previously. So I've got a decent argument that he's. got that caliber as well. Now that that charges roster is obviously like decimated and and and oh, they got no one of defense and they're old and they're aging.

And that's true. But like in the same way that predicting head coach quality is, uh, it can be a fool's errand. Rosters can change really fast, man. They can. Like you ask the 2023 Detroit Lions what hitting on one draft does for you,

man. And obviously like they had four top 40 picks, right? Like the charges don't have that level of draft capital. But you just got to run hot and then all of a sudden you have maybe, not a perfect. Los Angeles Rams, right? Right in their backyard is a good example. Yeah.

You got to run hot in a couple of picks and all of a sudden you have the cornerstones that are necessary to make a run. We're giving Harbaugh here three years. I went and I looked in in 2020, CBS Sports wrote a piece about coaches who made the two bowl in their first year on the job. And on that list is George Seiford who inherited Joe Montana for the Niners and the 80s. You have Jim Caldwell who inherited Payton Manning in the mid-2000s. You have Bill Callahan.

He was the Raiders offensive coordinator who inherited Rich Gannon. right? Like if you just step into a spot where there's already a really good established coach, you can get to the game pretty quick. And so I think Harbaugh is, I wanted to be like Dave Canales, but no, it's horrible. It's got to be Harbaugh. I went with Harbaugh too. Yeah, sorry. I think we're going to disagree on some of these for sure. I don't like when we agree on everything. But it's, I mean, you laid it out. I mean, here you have by far the best quarterback of any of these eight teams. And you have a coach who has been very successful. everywhere he's gone, including at the NFL level.

Like, there's a lot of unknown, a lot of uncertainty with new head coaching hires. We're going to talk about some of them specifically first-time head coaches. I mean, Jim Harbaugh has been an excellent NFL head coach. I think the, you know, the biggest question for me with Jim Harbaugh is always going to be like, how long will it last? You know, like, will there? And it lasts a long time in Michigan. So I do want to make sure that's clear.

But just in the NFL where it's you, it's a general manager, there are different power dynamics at play. That's what we saw in San Francisco when he was there previously. You know, is this somebody who can be the Chargers head coach for the next eight to 10 years? Or is this more of a, hey, let's, you know, next three to five years, it's kind of your time to pounce. And then who knows after that? This was funny from via my friend Daniel Popper at the Athletic. So like, I don't know if you saw this, but this is from his story.

It might have seemed like a passing joke when Harbaugh said he got fulfillment out of heading to Home Depot. and buying a shopback to use on remodeling the wait room at the Chargers Orange County facility. But I'm told that was no joke. Harbaugh actually went to Home Depot first thing Wednesday morning to buy that shopback. So of course, the Chargers are moving into a new facility. They're not in the new facility yet. So while they're in the old facility, Harbo wants to do some remodeling. How are you?

I literally, I'm not lying here. I do not know what a shopback is. What is a shop back? You know those big cylindrical vacuums? They plug into the wall and they have like a big long black tube at the end. You can walk around. You can, instead of like a household vacuum, which is like designed to pull really fine dust, a shop back is designed to pull like sawdust or like off cuts really, really fast at a quick level.

So it's your cleanup tool. If you saw a picture of a shot back, you would be like, oh, that thing. I mean, what an answer. I mean, you have given, listen, we've been doing this for what, two plus years? that might be your most, you came in, did you just like, were you doing

shopback research this morning? Do you have experience with a shopback? What was that answer? You're like the new Bob Vila. You probably don't even know who that is. And you Al Borland,

you probably don't even know who that is. Nope. I hope those are good. When I'm not, when my objective is not riling you up with football,

hipster takes, I can be very concise and clear. It's just in this, in this aspect of expression, I instead go for convoluting. and annoying. All right. It's a stylistic choice and what I've committed to in my career and I will remain rigid on it. I like this. So in the future, if you're rambling, I'm going to be like, dude, just give me the shop back answer. I don't need to know the 10 minute back. I don't do anything around the house.

As listeners know, I can mow the lawn. I can do a little leaf blower. I can do a little edging. And even that's not that good. That is the extent to which I use any type of machinery inside or outside the house. So I'm not lying about the shop back for Christmas two years ago. Good shot back. Look at you. There you go. So there you go. Yeah,

I think we're on the same thing. Now, have you done a mock draft yet? Solet. I haven't tried to have that fifth overall pick. Yeah, I haven't done a real mock. I've done some back in the napkin stuff.

Okay. Wide receiver, offensive tackle maybe there or no? Yeah. So everybody wants wide receiver because the big names right now are the top three quarterbacks, which is Caleb Williams at a USC, Drake made a UNC and then Jaden Daniels at LSU.

And then after that, there's wide receivers, right? Obviously Marvin Harrison, Jr. out of Ohio State, but also Malik neighbors at LSU is going to be a very hot name. Robin Dunzei, who won the bulletinikoff out of Washington. He's going to be a real hot name.

So, Chargers, need a receiver, there's a receiver. It's great. I personally think it should be tackle. Ray Sean Slater is great along the left side. That right side of the line has been an issue every single season that Justin Herbert has been playing for the team. It is frustrating. It is, and they have been trying to develop at that position and they've given youth the opportunity to get better. And it has led to Herbert getting sacked on, like, you know, all the Herbert

could have won two minute drives end of the fourth quarter comeback drives. They all end because they're in clear past situations and they can't protect off the right side. And Herbert takes shot after shot to shine. He's got rib injuries. He's had throwing arm injuries. Like, I would want to steal up protection.

Joe All at Notre Dame, Olufashanu, out of Penn State, some really good tackles in the class. So I lean tackle, but wide receivers there too. And for what it's worth, it's an introductory press conference, but Harbaugh did hammer home the point that we are built, like priority number one is to make sure this offensive line is shorter.

And to be fair, they've tried that. They've poured resources into that offensive line, but now they have questions with Corey Lindley, potentially retiring the issues you mentioned there at right tackle. And so that's something they absolutely need to address. I will point out, 2021, you know, they were fifth and offensive DVOA. Like this has, there have been times during this Herbert era. It hasn't happened every year. Maybe not to the point that the, you know, hype warrants, but they have had a tremendous offense

for at least one season since he's been there. That's what they got to get back to. Like you mentioned, fifth overall pick, 37th overall pick. Like, they have a chance here. It's not, you know, like I'm not saying it's going to happen this year. But man, all of a sudden you hit on those, maybe one more draft in 2025. You know, I think they can make the playoffs in 2024. But if we're saying Super Bowl, I think most likely they probably would need one more offseason.

You need the injury luck. You need all the stuff that the charges typically do not get. So Chargers fans, Eddie, if you're listening here, Eduardo Ocampa, our great video production. And you're saying, shut your mouth. This isn't going to happen. Stop jinxing us again. I understand it, but I think Harbaugh is the right answer there. Just for fun, if I said you have to pick someone other than Jim Harbaugh on this list,

I didn't prep you for this one. Who would you have there? I can answer first if you want a second. I have a, I have a name. Okay, go ahead. I was trying to make it Dave Canales. I don't actually think it's Dave Canales. If I had a guess, I would say it's Mike McDonald with Seattle.

Again, going to your quarterback theorem, I think the guy who has the best quarterback for And now is Justin Herbert. I think the second best is Gino. And that can change. Like, obviously, Dan Quinn's going to get the second overall pick. Antonio Pierce's Raiders might trade up, but who knows. But right now, I would say the second best quarterback is Gino. I think that McDonald also showed you in Baltimore, hey, give me a year and a half and I can flip a defense pretty quick. And that's also something that I think is meaningful for the Chargers. Their DC, Harba brought in Jesse Minter, who was the DC in Michigan. I think this was a really good call. Mentor is the first branch off of the Mike McDonald's tree.

and with what you saw with McDonald in Baltimore, he said, hey, give me a good mic backer, give me really versatile safeties. I'll figure out corner and edge. Don't worry about it. I'll just get some guys off the street. We'll make this work. Don't worry about that.

I need those positions and that I can make my defense work. And that is, if Minter can follow that blueprint, not only is that very impressive, this defense has been excellent. It's also the sort of thing where it's really hard to go get elite corners. It's really hard to go get elite edges. It's hard to go find those guys because teams will let them go. really good linebackers, you can go get them.

Because teams, teams, you know, that's a lower value position. Safety, I think is starting to catch up a little bit. But like, ask the Jets how they got Quincy Williams. They just waited for the Jaguars to cut him and then made him into an all pro, right? Like, you can, you can personnel-wise actually flip that that defense over, I think, pretty quickly. So if Minter's got the McDonald goods, I think that's a big deal for the Chargers, but I think McDonald can be a huge boost that Seahawks defense fast. I think that defense has talent and they just weren't deployed super great last season.

I wouldn't be surprised if Seattle gets better, faster than we expect. I don't know if I agree with your positional stuff there, but I'm going to table that for a later conversation. We have an offseason of podcasts to get to writing a note. Free agency. Go get you a seat. Maybe linebacker conversation with Solac, maybe somewhere around like the second week of April. All right. No, you'll be doing draft.

May. No, you'll be paternity leave. All right. At some point, we'll talk about linebacks. We do a lot of podcasts. We're going to get to it. I would say, Dan, I would go Dan Quinn, because I, I think there's a chance you hit on a quarterback who's really good right away, maybe not

CJ Stroud right away, but by year two, you really have something. You have some pieces there on that team. So if I had to pick a second one, I would go with Dan Quinn. All right, second question, most likely to be won and done. Again, this is the one that's most likely to be thrown back in our face when this coach ends up being good. But what do you have? Most likely coach where you say he's just last in one year.

I have Dan Quinn. Yeah, really? Okay. Well, here's the thing. I would be, like, there's a couple of guys who, the one and guns are weird. It's very rare to see a young coach get a one and done. Usually, like, if he's the first time head coach, and he gets a year and it's not great and everything,

okay, he's building it up. Like, you know, well, let's let them figure it out. Like, usually it's like guys who are retreads, guys who have been around, it's their second opportunity where you bring them in to be like a CEO sort of a type. And immediately the vibes are bad, and that person is one and done.

Think Lovie Smith, think David Cully, think Urban Meyer, think Frank Wright, right? So accordingly, like, I don't think your Dave Canal says and your, your, your, uh, um, Gerod Mayo's have like a chance of being one and your Mike McDonald's. Like, that would surprise me. Antonio Pierce won and done. Like, doesn't make any sense to be like, let's promote Antonio Pierce's the interim. Let's get rid of him this year.

Like maybe Pierce, if it's like tectonically bad, but with Quinn, Quinn's been a head coach before, right? Quinn's been here for a long time. And defensively, Quinn was, I think, really, really good the last few seasons for the Cowboys overall. But they're certainly kind of hiring him on a down trend, relative to like an uptrend of the last couple of years. You brought up that second overall pick.

I can see a world where a second overall pick is crazy good. Dan Quinn handles the defense. Devens gets a lot better, faster. And then the commanders are a lot more respectable than they were previously. And we're feeling good about the Dan Quinn area. He hires Chip Kelly's his OC, hires some cool OC, and they start doing some good stuff, right? I can also see a world where that second overall pick is good. And that O.C. is good.

But the defense is out of the ball is not what you wanted from Dan Quinn, right? We got to remember, this team traded away their two-stop star edge rushers and Montev Swet to Chicago's Chase Young to the Niners and is now going to run a Dan Quinn defense? What? I don't know if I like that. This team drafted a corner top 15, Emmanuel Forbes at Mississippi State who could not stay on the field for them. They benched him because of the quality of plight. Now, you want, Dan Quinn defense? Well, man coverage. I don't know how I feel about this marriage here. This, this defensive roster is not equipped to do what Dan Quinn has historically asked his defenses to do. So I also can see worlds where Quinn walks in and the commander's defense is like bottom five and stays bottom five.

and just like clearly a bad unit. There's not a marriage from schemer talent at all. They're asking guys to do things they're not capable of doing. And meanwhile, Drake Mays out there looking good, but fighting an uphill battle and losing games 28 to 35. And ownership says, shoot, we have a golden goose here. We have a guy that everybody would love to come coach. Let's make a fast transition, get a really good offensive coach in here. Like, for example, I don't know, pull name out of a hat.

Ben Johnson, who's the guy the commanders wanted all along? So I think there's some Dan and Quinn won in Dunn worlds. All right. Yeah, I would agree they're high variance. And also, I mean, you even painted the picture there where the quarterback they draft is good. Like, that's what, 50-50 proposition? Like the quarterback, as much as we're going to fall in love with all these guys in the next couple months here, we know that a lot of them just don't end up working out. So I understand that one. I went with two names who you said you don't see. One is Dave Canales. That's for two reasons. But the main one is the owner. I mean, the owner is, a wild card. What, you're buying the David Teper's now all of a sudden going to be staying out of the way and like we're stable and we're good with... Dave Teper cannot pay a fourth head coach contract.

Sure, what do you tell? The guy the guy has more money than anyone could ever dream of. What do you mean he can't pay a guy? Are you nuts? That's very accurate. I'll rephrase. Dave Teper is financially capable of paying a fourth head coach and contract. Dave, the idea of Dave Teper

paying a fourth head coaching contract, which for those who don't know what we're talking about, when you fire a coach. He continues to make the money on his deal. The only way he stops making that money on his deal is if he goes and takes another equivalent job somewhere in the field. And even then, you have to pay on top. And so he is paying Matt Rule. He fired Matt Rule. Matt Ruh, being the head coach Nebraska, but he still owes money to Matt Ruhl. So like if rules owed seven from the Panthers and Nebraska is giving him five, he's got to give him the remaining two. He also owes Frank Rake all the money on his deal. And I would wager Frank Rack is not going to

work a job at all, which means he has to pay Frank Rake his full contract, all right, to just sit at home. First team all CTC right there. Nice job, Frank game. You're all fly fishing, all right? A good deal for Frank Greig. And he has to pay Dave Canales. He's paying three head coaches right now. I think that I would be shocked if stepers is really, you know, jumping at the bit to go pay a fourth coach next season. I think they hired Canales to be a young developmental guy. That would surprise me. Listen, Canales has potential. He could be very good. I liked what he did. this is a rapid rise type coach when you look at the last few years. He was an offensive coordinator for one year and now he's the head coach of your franchise. So I would not, you know,

Tepper has had three in season coach firing. Like I'm not ruling anything out with David Tepper if that goes badly. And then the other factor with the Panthers would be Bryce Young. I mean, if Bryce Young just doesn't have it, I like Bryce Young, but if he looks like the player we saw in 23, now you have all kinds of organizational questions. Now maybe it would just be all right. We got to restart this thing with Canales and we're getting way too far down the road. But I think those things are possible. This was another little nugget that I like. This was from Joe Person of the athletic hero.

The Panthers owner hired an outside consulting firm to help conduct a thorough search and landed on an in-house candidate for GM, hired off a 2 and 15 season, and that guy's former colleague as head coach. In a hiring cycle with eight coaching vacancies and five GM openings, Canales and Dan Morgan's only interviews were with the Carolina Panthers. So that's good, you know, he has points. I'm not saying they can't work out, but he has points there. They also have no first round pick.

And then the other one I had written down was Antonio Pierce. I mean, you mentioned on a previous pod, the history of interim coaches being hired is not good. They're going off of nine games. Now, I understand the hiring. I hope it works out. I like the energy of that team in the second half of that. the season, but nothing is a given. It's a totally different thing to start over beginning of a season

and how does this look with Antonio Pierce as your head coach? They have no obvious answer at quarterback. They hired Cliff Kingsbury as their offensive coordinator. I personally don't love that. Maybe Cliff Kingsbury has changed and he's going to be great. The version of Cliff Kingsbury I saw with the Arizona Cardinals, that guy is not the best option to be your new offensive coordinator. So I don't know if Jim Harbaugh wanted to go to Vegas this offseason is Antonio Pierce, the head coach? I don't know. Maybe. Maybe not.

So it's just something I would keep in mind there. All right. Let's take a break. We'll come back. We'll get to some more of the superlative. Happy Super Bowl to all who celebrate with Fandul, America's number one sportsbook. If you're like me, Super Bowl Sunday is all about scoring the best seat on the couch, grabbing your favorite football snacks, and placing some Super Bowl bets. that I like early doors. Chiefs plus two and a half. I think they win this game, to be honest.

And I do like Isaiah Pichico to go over his rushing yards total at 67.5. Fandle has so many ways for you to end the season with a W or two or three. Not only can you bet on who will win Super Bowl 58, but Fandall also has bets for who will score a touchdown, how many points will be scored, and so much more. If you're new to Fandle, join today and you'll get $200 in bonus bets when you win your first $5 bet. Just visit fandle.com slash ringer NFL to sign up. That's fandle.com slash ringer NFL. Make every moment more with Fandle, an official sports betting partner of the NFL. Must be 21 plus and present in select states.

Gambling problem, call 100 gambler or visit the ringer.com slash RG. $10.1.1.1.1.1.1. Bonus issue does not with drawable bonus bets that expires seven days after receipt. See terms at sportsbook.fandle.com. All right. We are back on extra point taken. Next one. Dolek. Most likely to still be coaching the team 10 years from now. That's a long time. 10 years. You know, we're talking Tomlin territory, Carol territory, a Harbaugh territory, Bellet, like there's not a lot. There's a handful of guys that last this long,

typically doesn't happen. Who's the guy you could see, you know, when Papa Sollack is looking at his 11 kids like Philip Rivers. Well, I am, all right, that would be a math. Mathematically speaking, twins happened at a very much. When so long, let's just say 10 years from now, I'm going to abandon that. whatever I was trying to say there. Who is the coach you could stay still coaching their team? I thought you were referring to Papa Soak like my dad looking upon his grandkids. And I was like, yeah, I kind of there, whatever.

Okay, all right. Yeah, that's better. I like that. Papa Solek looking down on his 11. We're getting the car under control. I'm going to just, right, this is an impossible one. This is the most, you can't even remotely predict this. I'm going to say draw on male.

Why not, right? The Patriots, I'll think, known for coaching stability. But I guess when the coach is winning like all of the Super Bowls, It's not really coaching stability. He's just the best. But they had Belgium there for a long time. Like, I don't know at all what their line length is going to be. Like, they might actually have a quick hook on Mayo.

If they feel like it's not working, maybe they do want to give him time to develop because they've kept him in the building and they've given him contracts to retain him. And if they've kind of made him the prince and the heir apparent, they've very clearly wanted this guy to be the guy. And so I think they feel like they're invested in him. I also like when I go and think of what makes, a guy be able to hang around for this long. Firstly, I think, like, having, like, a unique energy for and a love for the job, like,

for the role. Like, if you just think about Pete Carroll and what he, like, the way that kind of Seattle ended up being built around him, even like Andy Reid is a little bit more of a quiet guy, but still just like an unbelievable love for like the game and doing the thing. You know, Mike Tomlin and the way that building's been built around him. Like, you, you have to really have like a dynamic. Firebrands the wrong words. It's not always like Rha Rossus's boombaugh stuff, but it's just a, um, um,

magnetism of a personality, right? In order to like stay in one building for that long, right? When Carol was like out from the Seahawks, there was that quote that went around, I think it was Ron Wolfe, who said, like, you should never have a head coach more than 10 years because it just starts to get stale.

Like, even if they're good, it just starts, everything starts to get route and routine and kind of, you know, entrenched in its niches and its grooves. And so it's hard to be in a place like this for that long. But Mayo to me, when I see him talk,

when I hear him talk, when I hear the players talk about him, I see the way he behaves. He reads to me as the sort of guy who could establish for himself a presence in New England that will keep him there for a decade. Now, the last guy who stayed in New England for that long was winning every other Super Bowl. And so the problem is that the expectations are toweringly high, right? Like, Mayo could be the sort of guy who deserves to stay,

but there's just going to be ancilliness in New England to get rid of him. Because the last guy, when he was here for six years, they already won four, you know? like it's like it's yeah belichick sets a really high bar so you're going up against that i think think that makes things really challenging i i'm really interested in in in mayo's staff meos coaching hires where it's like an internal dc hires they're going to keep doing the same defensive stuff which is great but then alice van pell at oc is the most like okay the thing i've ever seen ever like i'm not like i'm not like cliff or i'm like i don't like this i'm just like okay alice van and pelt sure uh and so i don't really know what that's going to look like so this is an impossible one

I'm saying Mayo because I like Mayo, final answer. Yeah, Mayo sort of the, I'm glad you mentioned him because he's sort of the forgotten guy. He was hired so early and it's kind of like, well-down. I mean, the forgotten guy is Antonio Pierce. I keep forgetting that he, looks like he was the coach last year. So every time I have another guy who is a forgotten guy who we haven't even mentioned yet, who maybe, you know, in the next couple of questions we will get to. But yeah, I mean, we'll see that roster stink.

So it's like, this isn't going to be a quick turnaround for the Patriots. We'll see if they draft Jade and Daniel. or what they do at quarterback there at number three. But like that thing is going to take some time. So I think that's a good one. But you never want to replace like legend, you know, life lesson for the young kids that you want to replace the train wreck. You want to replace the Urban Meyer, the Joe Judge, the Matt Patricia,

you know, go in expectations are low. Josh Harris replacing Dance Nighter. That's what you want to do in life. You don't want to go in and have to. You're right. I mean, if they don't three years, if they don't win like, you know, if they're not in an AFC championship, it's going to be like, what's that you don't happen?

but it's like that, that's going to be hard for them to do. So that's a good one. I went with Mike McDonald for this one. McDonald is 36 years old, has shown an ability to be creative, innovative on defense. Obviously, I think he'll be, you know, coming from that Ravens organization. I'm thinking he'll be analytically sound, be good with the game management stuff. It really is hard to find, now this always makes me nervous. Like, I haven't heard anyone really knock Mike I haven't heard a single criticism of Mike McDonald in any way. That might just mean he's very well liked and, you know, like a normal person, which is rare for an NFL head coach.

But everybody just seems to be an agreement that this is a kind of a home run hire for the Seattle Seahawks. And I like it a lot too. So if I'm nitpicking, I would say, all right, I don't know too much about his leadership, his ability to delegate, all those other things that are associated with being a head coach that maybe we forget about. But I think he has a chance to be, you know, really. good in Seattle. Now, it's similar to New England where you're replacing a guy who was a legend

there, who had a lot of success in Pete Carroll. And that one's even trickier because, like, the players love Pete Carroll. Like, you know, there is a bar to clear there where the players are like, I'm happy that we have a new coach. Now, again, everything I hear about McDonald is like, no, no, no, the players love him, the coaches love him, his colleagues love him, his opponents respect him, he's innovative, he's collaborative, he's on the cutting edge. Like, It's everything you want in a head coach. So I think that one has a chance to be a long lasting relationship in Seattle, again, acknowledging that we have no idea and I could be completely wrong about that.

So there you go. Yeah. Right. It's another legend replacement, which makes it, right, the tricky thing. Right. My first thought for this was McDonald. And then I was like, I like Mayo and like whatever this. On your point of like, I can't hear anybody say something bad about him.

Yeah. I agree. Okay. Yeah. I well I one of the things like I was in Mobile when this hire happened right like we went from day one Ben Johnson is going to the commanders like you know this kind of whatever like Seahawks have just decided to interview McDonald's to like by the day I left like he's already there and we're getting OC rumors right like McDonald thing moved faster for last week so he was like the guy and everybody that you talk to you were like Mike and it's just like yeah like everybody is convinced this is the dude like all right like this is the next one and and I think that his vibe reads differently to me than like the Staley vibe coming out where a lot of the staley vibe coming out was like this guy's doing revolutionary things on the board and then I think when Staley struggled on the charges it was because A he wasn't doing revolutionary things on

the board but also be like the other aspects of the job CEO management and roster management whatever Mike it's not about doing revolutionary stuff on the board it's just about like how he teaches about how he behaves how he leads like that's sort of stuff that you hear about him So I know a lot of people feel Brandon Staley burned. Like the last young, really cool defensive coordinator guy was bad. I would remind you that, like, D'emiko just took the Texas playoffs in year one. And a huge part of that is because Deco is like an insanely good defensive coach who really improved that unit. But then also like it was the way that he taught and the way that he led Christian Harris on the sideline telling you how you're going to get a pick in this game right now.

McDonald reads way more to me like a Domeco than he does like a Staley. I would agree with that. I agree with that. Yeah. All right. Number four. most likely to be a great broadcaster post-coaching. You know, we just want to there.

There's a lot of broadcast talk out there. It's going to be a lot of broadcast talk next week with Tony Romo doing the Super Bowl. Who is the guy who you say, all right, if coaching doesn't work out, don't worry. You'll still have a good life. You're going to be very good at broadcasting. You're going to get paid handsomely, and it's all going to work out for you. So the correct answer here is Jim Harbaugh. You can just see Jim Harbaugh on a broadcast.

Just going nuts, running around, saying ridiculous things that don't make sense. to anybody. Studio or like color? Are you saying doing games or in the studio or ESP? Like what role? I think like studio. I think he's like like the Rex Ryan mold where he's on ESPN at 9 a.m. on get up just being like, you know, they played Patrick M.

Holmes and they ran cover two. I would have died before I ran cover two. I hate cover two. And I would, here's what I would do. And then 19 different schemes. And then he's like running around yelling like faster falling off and Mike Greenberg's laughing at him. Just like zany crazy.

coach, but who also like provides very good color and also like clearly hates 19% of the league. Like that is the Harbaugh mold. I would love to see Harbaugh on a studio show. However, I already gave Harbaugh for one. I'm saying Dave Canales, one, handsome man, good looking fellow Dave Canales is. Two, that clip of him explaining stuff, right? Where you're watching it and you're like, ah, I get this.

I do football now. He is very good communicator. And Canales, the thing is like you have to be a better, you have to be a good coach for a He has to be a coach for longer in order to get, I think, like, enough juice, enough name recognition to be a broadcast guy. So he's not going to be on, like, the Bill Cower arc or like the Rex Ryan arc where, like, he was a coach for a bazillion years. I think he's more going to be on the Jason Garrett arc. He's just going to hold the Panthers job for a while. And everyone, like, and then it's going to end.

And no one is going to be like, let me go hire Dave Canales. And so then he's just going to go on TV. Now, unlike Jason Garrett, who watching him on TV is a, you have secondhand. You're a secondhand embarrassment guy? I've actually never heard that term before, but as you mention it, I would probably say yes, I am. Right. I have crippling secondhand embarrassment.

I would rather be doing something embarrassing than be watching somebody else be doing something that's embarrassing themselves. It paralyzes me. So I don't enjoy watching Jason Garrett do television. I think Canales would be better than that. But Canales is my guy where I watch you and I'm like, yeah, tell me more about football, good looking and well-spoken man. I'll put that on TV.

That'll play. So for your Harbaugh one, I have to remind you of this quote where he said, I'm going to play as long as I can, then coach, then die. So I don't know that. But, shield, but shield, think about how good that quote would be on television. It'd be amazing, right? I'm not saying he wants to end up on TV. I'm saying when he ends up on TV, it would be unbelievable content.

Okay, got you. I'm going to go with the guy I said is. sort of the forgotten guy who we haven't mentioned yet. I don't think unless I'm missing it. Is this rock old here? Yeah, Rahim Morris. I mean, I don't have like, you know, a very specific reason for this. It just seems like everybody loves this guy. He's gotten endorsements from Mike Tomlin, Kyle Shanahan, John McVeigh, Jalen Ramsey, he's coached Aaron Donald. Like I feel, I mean, he has been in the league so long. Rahim Morris must have so many great stories to tell that if you, you know, though if you were willing to share with the public, people would

eat them up. I've seen a little bit of him on podcasts, entertaining, good energy, feels like he could do it if he wanted to. He's coached offense and defense. He's coached, you know, with, again, that Shanahan scheme, the McVet. Like, he has so much knowledge, or he has to have so much knowledge just in his brain that it feels like he would be able to, I mean, you mentioned like, Jason Garrett, like, I'm ready to replace him with Rayne Morris, like tonight. Are we sure Morris wants to coach? I mean, that feels like, Like that would be a big upgrade for everyone. All due respect to Jason Garrett, of course.

So, yeah, that was mine. I felt like, you know, if it doesn't work out in Atlanta, that maybe he could go. And I could see, I could see Rahim's head coaching tenure going frustratingly because of like stuff outside of his control, ownership, GM, quarterback, whatever. And so this would be his second time doing a head coaching thing. We're just like, it's a mess from stem to stern. And he's like, I am so done trying to figure this out. I am going and getting $3 million from CBS to be friendly. cool. And I'd be like, I appreciate that, Rahim Morris. That is an acceptable life direction.

That's a good choice. There you go. All right. Let's take one more break and then we'll finish now with our final question. All right, we are back on extra point taken. Team most likely to regret not hiring Bill Belichick. Solac, your dream has died. Well, no, I guess it hasn't. Bill Belichick could technically take over a team. He's going to dock a team. In the middle of a season. All right. He's going to dock. Or there could be something weird where coach just gets fired in July, August. Listen, it's the NFL. Weird things happen. There could be a health issue. We hope not. Coaches, we hope you stay healthy. There could be a health issue where all of a sudden,

a team has an opening. And Belichick says, all right, I'm in now. So your dream is not dead of Belichick winning a playoff game next year. But it's unlikely. Framing real quick. You say dream. I say like my second take from the week 11. So there's a lot, you're putting a lot more of my chest into this than I put into this. So we think Bill Belichick is not going to be in the NFL in 2024. Which team, which fan base, which like, which columnist will come out with the column in like week six? Like, oh my gosh, how did they screw this up? They could have hired Bill Belichick.

What do you think? Who's the team that will regret not hiring? When I think of team regrets not hiring Belichick, I think of team who like really falls flat on their face as the result of like a young hire and they look back and they're like man, if we just brought in like a veteran good coach who like knows how to maximize players, then we could have just with this roster been a lot more reasonable, a lot more regular, a lot more successful. Like that's the kind of team I'm looking for. So guys, I landed on the Raiders with Antonio Pierce. We've talked about Pierce a couple of times now. Pierce for me, he's been a coach for six years at the college or NFL level, right? He was Arizona State Linebacker's coach, and then he got to the Raiders job,

and now he's head coached to the Raiders. He is such an unknown, and that lack of experience, I like my coach to have a little bit more experience. I do. I don't think it's because experience is a predictor of being a good coach. I don't. I think it's because experience allows you to connect with enough coaches and connect with enough players to have a network to do the job. I think the network is important.

I mean, when you haven't been in the field for so long, you're a little bit siloed in your ideas and in your connections. And so there's a chance. Pierce is great. I think it's very much unknown. Obviously, the players love them. But to me, like, I don't love the Cliff Kingsbury higher. I don't love, we need to get Marvin Lewis in here as an assistant head coach.

Like, I get why they're doing that. It's just for me like, okay, if you need an assistant head coach, the guy's probably a year away from being a year away, right? Like, let's just call spade a spade here. I disagree with that. I think the Marvin Lewis thing is perfectly fine. You don't have experience bringing a guy. you trust who's done it before.

So yeah, I don't have an issue with that part. So, and Marvin was with the team, apparently, for much of the end of last season, right? And so, you know, Pierce is your interim. You need a voice to just help him kind of manage the day to day. Like, here's how you schedule practices. Here's how like, you know, like, here's, like, here's some common pitfalls. Here's some common traps or whatever. So I think Marvin's already there and already trusted.

Like I don't have a problem with it. I just look at this staff right now and I go like, I don't, I don't look at this and go like, wow, look at all the good coaches that I love. Like it's just, it doesn't have that juice for me right now. And I think like the Raiders roster, which I know they just had a general manager change over Dave Ziegler and Tom Telesco also don't love that. I know they just have general manager change. The roster has like some like it got Max Crosby and Devante Adams.

It has tent pole pieces, right? And there's, there's development to be done around it. There's improvement to be done around it. But there's still like, there's still good young talent as well. And so I don't know. There's a word in which the Raiders are like. very embarrassingly bad next year. I think just because Pierce is a little bit in over his head.

I'm not hoping for it. I'm rooting for him. I'm freaking love the guy, but this is just my reading on the situation. And I think that team might look back and be like, man, it would have been nice to have a Bill Belichick in the building. With that said, like, they just fired Josh McDaniels. So I get why they didn't bring in Bill Belichick. So the Titans are the same thing for me with Brian Callahan,

but they just fired Ravel. We haven't talked about him. Talk about a guy we haven't talked about the whole episode. Yeah, Brian, I guess he is the forgotten guy. I mean, just as evidence, we didn't bring him up until like the 40th minute of the podcast. Well, he's, I mean, like he, Brian Callahan right now to me, if I were to add a six superlative is my guy who could be surprisingly a little bit better than we expect in year one. I'm not like a, like there's some folks who are huge Brian Callahan fans. I'm not like, woo on Brian Callahan.

He doesn't, he doesn't blow my socks off. I don't have that experience on him. I just like, I haven't met the guy. I'm already talked to the guy who's kind of watched him from afar. What I will say, though, is that Callahan got his pops, Bill Callahan, to come in and be the offensive line coach. Bill Callahan is a historic and respected offensive line coach, very good offensive line coach. Or is in the process? I don't know if that is that finalized yet or it looks like a thing that's going to happen.

Yeah. It Mary Kay, how you say, Cabot? Cabot. Cabot. She has reported that it's official. And so like that's been like kind of shared whatever. Yeah. And so he brought him his pop.

Bill Callahan, I think it's going to be really good for that offensive line. Dynard Wilson, who is the Ravens defensive backs coach, who is a guy that I think is a good future DC of like Denard Wilson. He's brought in as their DC. Like, I like the staff Callahan's putting together. And I think Callan's a smart cookie. So I think you see Callahan being better than expectation. Pierce, I think, is more likely to come in below expectations. That's why they land for me as the man.

We should, we should have Bill Belichick this thing. Yeah, I could see. I could see the Titans having a little bit like a better, a quicker turnaround maybe into a competitive team. than it's expected after losing frayball. I mean, offensive line coach, like, if you can nail that higher and get somebody who is just, you know, to use my own cliche, give you more with less and you're like, you're confident that, hey, we don't have all the talent, but he's going to be able to give, give us a chance here. I mean, that's like the best hire you can make.

And they now have a guy in Bill Callahan who's shown he's able to do that, like an all-time offensive line coach. So I think that's huge for them. And, yeah, their offense, they just haven't had anything. here in recent years. And I'm not saying they got a lot of talent there. They don't, but maybe Brian Callahan can come up with some stuff there and then you mentioned it on the defensive side of the ball. So I think that's a good choice for whatever category you mentioned, a guy who could be a little bit better than people think he could be. Was that the category? Yeah, I like that

one. All right. My team, most likely to regret not hiring Bill Belichick, I'm going to go with the Washington commanders. I mean, I guess we should probably, we should probably talk a little bit more about this process. I know we talked about Dan Quinn, but I think this was, this hire was made after Nora and Stephen recorded, I believe. So it sounded like the commanders wanted Ben Johnson, targeted, and this is all, you know, various reports. It depends what, you know, we're reading through some spin as we can and trying to figure out what exactly happened here. But it sounded like they wanted Ben Johnson. Ben Johnson, for whatever reason you want to believe, decided to stay in Detroit as the Lions offensive coordinator, which, by the way, huge if you're a Lions fan.

I mean, listen, you had a rock last week, but man, we talked about this Monday night, and this was the big takeaway. It was like, Lions might not be as good next year because they're losing their offensive coordinator who seems to be really, really good. Well, now he's coming back. So that's great news for you, Lions fans. Then maybe the commanders were in on Mike McDonald. He ends up going to Seattle instead.

Now, Diana Rossini of the Athletic, reported that the commander, at least spoke to Bill Belichick and that there was some support in the building to bring in Bill Belichick. So I'm, you know, they end up hiring Dan Quinn. I'm wondering, like, is there a scenario where they don't like, you know, go out there and hire GM Adam Peters right away and they just say, you know what, Bill, like the bar to clear here is pretty low. We have some talent on the roster.

We have a high draft pick to take a quarterback. Come in. You love Annapolis is right down the street here. You like the area. Come in, build us into a good, strong, competent team right away. And that they're in the playoffs in 2024 with Bill Belichick. Like, I think that is a pretty realistic scenario that could play out here. Now, having said that, so like, I don't think Dan, like, I feel like Dan Quinn's getting, like, there's a little too much Dan Quinn hate, like a lot of it based on kind of the last playoff game. Like he evolved as a defensive coach, he coached good defenses in Dallas. He coached some really good teams in Atlanta, like as far as quote unquote retreads go, I don't think this is a bad one. So one thing we have to

remember is that NFL teams often don't get their first head coaching higher and that ends up being the best thing for them. Their plan A doesn't work out and they end up getting their plan B and it ends up working out. So that's how I feel about Dan Quinn. I don't think it's terrible at the same time. That's the team I look at and said, could this be more interesting with Bill Belichick. I agree. I think that the commanders in Belichick were kind of always the connection and the fact that that never really came to even like smoke fruition, right? Like he's here for an interview and they really like I'm like whatever. That was surprising to me. So I think Washington is like the sportsbook favorite for like why wasn't Belichick a thing here. I brought up the Raiders having

the Raiders deserve that mention as well. Yeah, Washington sat search. This is like kind of when you grade a draft. You want to grade it based off of the process. Based on what we know about the players at the time. Why do you do things this way? And then later we discover if the players are good or not. And then we have to think, all made fun of the Lions draft. Turns out Lions draft was amazing. Like that's part of how the business. Coach is a similar thing. You kind of have to grade the search and then figure out, okay, how good is the coach end up being when he gets there. Search wise for Washington, this was stuff. This was, this was, I think that they were pretty clear they wanted Ben Johnson. And to get Ben, to get a phone call from a Detroit area code while you're in the air,

all right, to Detroit. And then it's Ben Johnson being like, yeah, I don't want to leave, dude. That's rough. And then, dude, the hour after that phone call where the Washington is doing as much damage control as they can, just every insider is tweeting Washington executives who are so cool with this, just like they're so fine. And saw this coming, actually, are feeling great about interviewing Dan Kwan. Like, BS, no, they're not.

There was the report that was like, I think Shafter had it where he was like per source. Washington, Ben Johnson was, his asking price was scared off some teams. I think that was the framing. Ben Johnson asking price scared off some teams. And then like 10 minutes later, Washington, another chefter tweet, it was like, Washington could have gotten

if they wanted to because Washington just realized they leaked that they were too poor for Ben Johnson. By accident, they were like, yeah, we were a little too cheap for Ben Johnson. It was a mess of damage control. It was so cool to see. This was a bad, bad search. This was not,

it was all over the place was, was haphazard, and it lands on Dan Quinn. They might be 10 and 7 next year, dude. Like, they might get Drake May, and Drake May is just Justin Herbert, but faster, and they go and they win 14 games. Like, you got to kind of talk about the search as it is, and then we kind of see how the coaches do when we go from there. Yeah, no, I think that is, excuse me, that is well said.

Did we hit on all the coaches? Dan Quinn, we talked about, McDonald's, we talked about, Morris, Canales, Harbaugh, Callahan, we eventually got two Pierce and Mayo. So there you go. Those are our superlatives for this head coaching class. All right. We got a pack. We got to get ready for Super Bowl. How's your pack? Are you a good packer? So like what are you bringing? You bring in a big like checking a bag, carry on, back pack. Were there for a week shield? Could you not check a bag? That's a long time. Yeah, you have to check a bag. Oh, I don't know how you young people do. You know, you always brag. Oh, we're minimalist, you know, we're just going with the backpack.

Yeah, but I got to wear a T-shirt every day. What are we talking about? Listen. I'm on television. All right, let me ask you this. How many hats are appropriate to pack for a handsome Indian bald man where the, you know, the hats are an important accessory? Yeah, I bet also shoes.

I would also want to know about shoes. That's true. That's tricky. Right. Because like, for me, it's just like, I just need one or two for like if I'm like doing something real quick. But like, I'm not going to be wearing them when I'm like on camera for you, like more more consistent.

So, like, I would probably bring, like, four to five hats if I were in your position where I'm wearing them on different days. There's nothing I hate more than when I'm on video for two separate days and I'm wearing something similar because I feel like it ruins the continuity. It ruins the cinematic universe, man. You got to look different. This is like a cartoon where you wear the same shirt every day. Come on now.

Shoes. I will bring three pairs of shoes precisely. And that is- Including the ones you're wearing or not including the ones you're wearing? Including the ones I'm wearing. And it's because they're the same. three pairs of shoes that I pack for every business trip ever. Oh, no, I'll bring four because I'm going to church on Sunday.

I got to bring church shoes. Four pairs of shoes. All right. That makes me good. I got church shoes. I got the divine lineage on Sunday. And then I'll wear a suit for the Super Bowl, actually. So yeah, four shoes.

All right. Oh, so you are going suit for Super Bowl. Huh? All right. You got to. My younger days I did. You know, since I've got a little more, a little more casual for the big games, but we'll see.

You got a, it's a little bit of like it. You got a dress good to feel good thing. If I'm sitting there at the Super Bowl, feel it high key like an imposter. How did I get here? Why didn't they check my ticket? How did I get in this building? I got to write a piece after this. People are going to read it.

I need to wear a suit that way. I feel like a journalist. All right. So all of this is going to fit in your checked bag? Or are you going to have a separate bag carry on to fit some of this? I'll jenga that sucker in a check bag. No problem. Or Tetris in a check bag.

Yeah, yeah. Lock it in. Recording stuff. We'll go on the check bag. I fit a check bag real nice. I feel very strongly about my packing abilities. I get the trunk of a car before a big, trip looking real good. I like a game of Tetris with the luggage. And you feel good that you won't

be over that 50 pound limit where they'll be saying grab some jeans and throw them in your laptop bag like happened to me last year at the Philadelphia International Airport. I think I want some irrational confidence with no with no logical basis. I think I could pick up a suitcase in my right hand and tell you the weight of it within like three or four pounds. I really think I could. I think I could. This is nice. You know, you know, you know, You know, the clock app on your phone, you know the timer app where you can like scroll the 60 seconds on the iPhone. You know what I'm talking about?

I do. Yeah. I can spin that and get within any number you want within like two or three numbers. All right. I like being able to estimate. It's fun. All right. This sounds like some social media opportunities from Las Vegas.

What about what? Okay. Well, now I got to ask you. How am I bringing too many shoes? How many shoes you bring them? One shoe? You can't bring one shoe. You got to bring one shoe.

No. I mean, I think I will probably bring three. pairs of shoes. Three pairs of shoes. Four to five hats sounds right. Now, I don't know, you know, I don't, I like to overpack. I don't like to be, I'm never in a place this long. A week, I don't like to be there and not have something that I wanted to have. So I will overpack. If you see, if anybody is in Philadelphia and sees a man, you know, opening his suitcase and throwing random stuff into his backpack because he's over the limit for the checked bag. That will be me. So yeah, that's what I got to work on in the next.

couple days here. All right, good thing to end it on. Packing. If you have any tips, if you have any comments, feedback, go ahead and let us know. Or better yet, just go on our YouTube channel, ringer NFL and leave comments there. All right, that will do it. A little programming note here. Dual Threat with Nora and Stephen will be Monday night from Vegas after opening night. So a little change, and then Solek and I will be back Tuesday. You will have shows every day next week on this feed. Some fun stuff playing. So looking forward to all of that.

All right. Thank you to Solek. Thank you to Cliff Augustine for producing Eduardo Ocampo for the video production and additional production supervision by Connor and Evans and Arjuna Ram Gapal. Thanks for listening, everyone. We will talk to you next week from Las Vegas. Laspe 21 plus and present in select states.

Fandwell is offering online sports wagering in Kansas under an agreement with Kansas Star Casino LLC. Gambling problem? Call 100 gambler or visit fandul.com slash RG Colorado, Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, New Jersey, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Illinois, Tennessee, and Virginia. Call 100 Next step or text next step to 533342 in Arizona. 1-88-78-9-7777 or visit cccgggg.org slash chat in Connecticut.

109 within Indiana. 1-800-2-2-470 or visit KSgamblinghelp.com in Kansas. 1-877770 stop in Louisiana. Visit MD Gamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Visit 1-800 gambler.com to M. West Virginia. Or call 1-8005-2-2-7-0 in Wyoming. Hope is here. Visit Gamblinghelp line M.A.org or call 800 3-3-2-7-550.

for 24-7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-8778 Hope-N-Y or text Hope-N-Y in New York.