The Ringer NFL Show - Cabo With the Staffords(?), Dinner With Wolfgang Puck, and Being the Youngest Ones in the Room | Flying Coach With Sean McVay and Peter Schrager

Episode Date: May 21, 2021

Welcome to Season 2 of 'Flying Coach'! In the premiere episode, Los Angeles Rams head coach Sean McVay and NFL Network's 'Good Morning Football' cohost and Fox NFL insider Peter Schrager chat about their friendship, how they met, Wolfgang Puck crashing Sean’s interview with the Rams, and Sean’s path to becoming the youngest NFL head coach in history. Later they discuss how Matt Stafford came to L.A., the Aaron Rodgers situation, losing in the Super Bowl, best coach hangs, and much more. Follow 'Flying Coach' here on Spotify! Email Sean McVay and Peter Schrager your questions at [e-mail]. Or leave us a voicemail and it may be featured in our next episode! [phone]‬ Hosts: Sean McVay and Peter Schrager Producer: Craig Horlbeck Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, I'm Shay Serrano. And I'm Jinks. We're hosting a new podcast called No Skips. In it, we discuss the most iconic and unskippable albums in hip-hop history. New episodes drop on Thursdays, only on Spotify. Oh, baby, this is years in the making. I am so excited to start this thing off. My name is Peter Schrager. I'm one of the hosts of Flying Coach Season 2, and my co-host, who are you?

What is your name? And let's get this thing going. Well, Peter, I couldn't be happy to be. here with you. I'm Sean McVeigh, L.A. Rams head coach. But like you said, this has been a long time in the making. Couldn't think of anybody that I'd rather do this with. And we're sure going to have some fun giving some people some insight into, you know, some of the crazy things that make us laugh and enjoy life, you know? I think that's the goal here. So season one, a flying coach was great. It was coach Steve Kerr and Pete Carroll. This is season two. It's an NFL head coach

and a former NFL head coach of the year and Super Bowl coach and all this stuff. And me, who am I? I'm the host of Good Morning Football on the NFL network. I also work the Fox sidelines and the Fox studio show on Sundays. And I've known this guy for many, many years.

And Sean, we said, let's do a podcast. We talk to the ringer guys. We talked to Bill Simmons. And it was basically like, let's just pretend as if it's the two of us talking on a normal day and record them and get a bunch of guests and friends of ours, friends of yours, friends of mine, and let the listener in.

The goal here, I think, is just people kind of eavesdrop on a conversation we have. I hope that's entertaining. Hey, I love it. Don't forget you're an NFL draft expert. That's true, bro. Your mock draft was about as accurate as it gets. I know Mel Kiper was jealous of that thing. Yes.

But, no, it'll be fun. I think it's really, we can take this a bunch of different directions, but ultimately make it as engaging, but give some people some insight into the things that make us tick and the, I think, the fortunate connections that we've been able to make over the last couple years. I mean, the thing that resonates and comes to mind immediately is, let's go back before we were even in these roles back in time. I mean, it doesn't seem like it was that long ago when I had just first met my

fiancee the night before. I was just finishing up my second year. Washington as the offensive coordinator. And you know, you were in the midst of figuring out, all right, what's next in my career? And we decided to have a couple drinks at the Standard Hotel in New York as I was waiting for my family to come into New York and go on a family vacation. And you were talking about the possibilities of good morning football. And I was just hoping to, you know, figure out how to call it damn play. And we were sitting there and I'll go further for the listener here. We're sitting at the standard, which is kind of a posh,

hotel, kind of a scene in the meatpacking district of New York. And two of us are dressed in, like, cargo shorts, and I might have had Birkenstock sandals on. I don't know. Give me some more credit than that. We're standing there. Sean had just the night before, I guess, was it in D.C.? Where'd you meet her? It was. It was in D.C. went out with some mutual friends. Actually, you know, it was casual friends. And, you know, needless to say, it was a good night where, you know, we got acquainted with one another and we kind of have been dating ever since. But I remember telling you, man, I don't know, there was something different about her. You're feeling good. And like, you know, when your friend comes to the bar and is like, I met the

one. And you're like, all right, bro. All right. Yeah, the one. Okay. Sure. But then, sure enough, she was the one. And we started talking. And I'll never forget because we're sitting at the bar and no one gives a crap about who either one of us are. And we are no buddies. And we're sitting there. And I'm like just talking to you about players openly, honestly. We're talking and I remember asking you, I'm like, do you think Johnny Mansell can turn it around? Because this is like 2016 probably. And we're talking openly about Mansell. And what happened?

I mean, if I'm not mistaken, some like beautiful woman or like, I don't even know, it might have been like a model comes over and it's like, hi. And we're like, hey. And she's like, are you guys talking about Johnny Manzell? I love Johnny Manzell. And you and I were just like, geez, the Menzel brand. It is alive. It was a humbling moment.

You know, here I am sitting there talking to you thinking she's checking me out and wanted to come get a word in. And she says, I overheard you guys talking about Johnny Mansell. I said, Peter, what the hell's going on? What is it? This is it. But I'll tell you what, though, when you really think back to that and you talk about, you know, we were just trying to figure it out, you know, there was hopes of potentially

getting to, you know, accomplish or really get an opportunity to be in some of these positions that we're in and it's been fun just kind of shooting our shot you know i remember it this was before good morning football was this uh you know premier show that everybody tunes in into the mornings you know you were talking about hey what do you think about this concept and kind of went forward and and uh the rest is history and now uh you got russell westbrook and all types of people recognizing you hey man you're that good morning football guy uh it's true though dude i'm so proud of you and all you've accomplished because I mean our friendship goes back a long time and for the listeners wondering you know okay like where did it start I'll never forget it was the senior

ball mobile Alabama and I think it might have been your first year with Washington and I what was your title when you first got to Washington it couldn't have been anything like offensive coordinator what was it was uh quality control coach Peter I was I was assisting the receivers and uh you know it was basically like hey let's get in let's get an opportunity to get the career role and get a chance to work under a Hall of Fame coach and Mike Shanahan, get to work with Kyle Shanahan, and Matt LaFleur was on that stuff. A lot of great coaches that definitely was great experience, but I was the assistant receivers coach, quality control coach. So what was that, like 2011, 2012? What year was that?

Yeah, that would have been in the 2010, you know, so 2010 season was my first year in Washington. And, you know, that coincided where, you know, we got there. Mike Shanahan's first. first year, Bruce Allen was the general manager. And the year before, I was coaching the United Football League with Jay Gruden and Jim Haslett, a lot of good coaches, a lot of good experiences. But it started out in 2010. What is the United Football League? That is the UFL.

How the hell don't you know about the UFL, man? United Football League. I know about it. I know about it. Let's bring it to life. No, the United Football League, it was, you know, at the time, it kind of expanded after I had left there. but I spent one year in the UFL coaching for the Florida Tuskers.

There was four teams in the league. We played each team twice. We were 6 and 0. Ended up losing to coach Fossil. Their team, the Las Vegas locomotives in the championship. But Brooks Bollinger was our quarterback. Love Brooks. He was awesome.

He was basically MVP of the league. Jermaine Wiggins. I coached Germain Wiggins as a tight end. He used to always get a kick out of asking me if he was a big. needed to go buy beer for me after the games because I was just turned 21 basically when I was coaching him. And we had Michael Pittman. I mean, we had a lot of guys that were fun players to coach on that team. But it was really an unbelievable opportunity for me to be able to kind of learn right away. But more than anything, you know, the experiences, it's all about the people and doing it

with Jay Gruden. That was really where, you know, we got a chance to kind of learn in the FFCA under John Gruden my year after being with the Buccaneers. I mean, I could go on and on. about those experiences. That shit, that was a lot of fun. I'm sure. The FFCA, of course, is what, the fired coaches of America? What was it? What's the state? What's the Fired football coaches association? You know, I, uh, it's, I entered that, uh, fired football coaches. Very early. Yeah. Pretty quickly, you know, I, uh, I got in my first year after playing at Miami of Ohio. I got in right away, coach for the Buccaneers worked under John Gruden. And, uh, you know, oddly enough, our new defensive coordinator, Rahim Morris,

became the head coach of the Bucks and he actually fired me, which is making me wonder, why the hell did I hire him right now to be our defensive coordinator? No, he's, there's a lot of layers to that, but, but ultimately, I think I got introduced to this coaching thing at an early age in terms of figuring out that, hey, you got to cherish every single moment, a lot of different experiences. And it's, it is ever changing, whether it be good or bad. That's for sure. No doubt. So let's go to then that first senior bowl that you're at or that I'm at too. and I'm kind of, I guess, mid-late 20s.

I'm finding myself also. I was a writer for fox sports.com, and they're footing the bill. They put me out there, and it's like, all right, go make connections and go cover the senior bowl. And I walk into a bar in Mobile, Alabama, and it's literally every NFL coach, GM, scout,

and like, I don't know, these guys are in their 50s, they're in their 60s. A lot of these guys don't know who I am. They don't care who I am. and you're wearing a redskinned shirt, we start talking. I'm like, this guy's kind of normal. He's kind of younger. He's cool, and we started bullshit in a little bit.

And I'm like, I like this dude. And we exchanged information. And so the story goes. And I'll tell you, you're one of the first friends I made in the NFL as far as, like, coaches and GMs going. The introductions that you've made for me are invaluable because over the years, you've introduced me to Matt LaFloor, who then introduced me to Robert Sala. and then you've introduced me to Kyle Shanhan. I'll never forget a couple years ago, I guess at the owner's meetings,

you and I are sitting there out by, I guess it was in Florida, and you had just gotten the job with the Rams, and Kyle had just gotten the job with the 49ers, and we're sitting there having an outdoor lunch or a drink or something, the three of us, and it's one of those deals. We're like, all right, this is happening. And John Elway is sitting at the table next to us, and, you know, obviously Kyle's dad was John Elway's coach,

and you've probably known Elway, but I'm thinking to myself, gosh, is surreal and thinking about back to the senior bowl when basically you and I were two pipsqueaks no one wanted to deal with. It really is. I mean, I think about it all the time and you realize what a small network of people it is. That's why, you know, in a lot of instances, it's almost a joke how lucky I've been with the history that my grandfather has where, you know, he was the head coach of the Giants, was a part of the Music City miracle and that, not the good music city miracle. He was on the bad side of that. The miracle, the medal. The miracle at the

Meadowlands show, not the music city miracle. Yeah, what the heck, man. This is a sack check. That was actually Coach Fisher and Wade Phillips, but yes, it was the miracle at the Meadowlands. And, you know, I'll never forget, anybody that's met my grandfather, he's about as even keeled as he gets. He's the interim head coach at the time. And my dad was playing at the University of Indiana.

This is obviously a story and that I was not born yet. But he called his dad. He's getting, I mean, you can only. imagine New York media is just crushing him. Yeah. And my dad trying to be a supportive son, he says, you know, dad, one day we'll look back on this and we'll all laugh. And my grandpa says, hey, Tim, ain't no eff in chance, man.

That's it. No eff in chance. I love it. But you know what? In all seriousness, it ended up being a blessing in disguise for him. He ends up going to San Francisco. He's got five, he's got five Super Bowl rings. And I think the coolest thing that kind of epitomizes who my

grandfather is, is he gave his middle three rings to his son. So he kept the first and the fifth. He's got three boys. My dad is the youngest of three. But he gave his second to my oldest uncle, Uncle John, Uncle Jim got the third one. And my dad has the fourth one. And so when he wears that, I say, you know, you didn't, you weren't really a part of that. That is a good dad giving it to you. But I think that epitomized my grandpa. But more than anything, you realize, all right, he treated people the right way. They did things the right way. They had a lot of success. And a lot of people think that's my dad because I was so fortunate at such a young age to get into the NFL. You know, I mean, he worked with Coach Carroll.

I mean, he crossed over with so many people. And you just realized what a small network of people it is and what a, you know, a real blessing it is to be able to get into it. And that's why you cherish it. And, you know, I think that's why we have such appreciation for it because we were able to connect early on and kind of the trajectory. And you realize how many friends we've made as a result of the connection we've made. and the mutual people that we've met that are all kind of in that NFL circle, if you will. Yeah, I'll never forget when they were doing all the coaching hires. You had interviews with the Niners and the Rams in the same week.

And I'll never forget you calling me from, I guess, I would say, one of the fancy hotels in LA that the Rams were keeping you. And you'd already interviewed with the Niners. And I was on the sidelines that week for a playoff football game, Seahawks versus Falcons. And here is the irony of it all. and this was the year the Falcons went to the Super Bowl. The irony is, while you and I were talking and you and I were going through it, should I pursue this Niners thing?

Should I love what the Rams presented? It's amazing. I'm even interviewing. I'm 30 years old. All at that time, I was working on a crew with Kevin Burkart, the play-by-play guy, and John Lynch, the color guy. And so as you and I are talking secretly on the side, John Lynch is also secretly talking to Kyle Shanahan about becoming the GM of the Falcons,

all in parallel times at the same week. but I remember nothing. I mean, you tell me if this is the story, but you're calling me and you're like, holy shit, I'm at this hotel. It's beautiful. It's great. I'm thinking about my opportunity with the Rams, and I'm really getting into it. And Justin Bieber just walked by.

You're like, this LA is something else. Yeah, it's, uh, so that whole thing was a whirlwind. I mean, how it all came together. I mean, I'll never forget, you know, kind of the trajectory of it all, Peter. And you'll, you'll remember this is so we end up losing, you know, to the Giants in a game that was basically a play-end game for the, you know, for the Washington football team, which, you know, we were called differently when I was there. But, you know, we, the Giants, that was Coach McAdu was the coach there. They didn't, they really didn't have

anything to play for. They couldn't have changed their seed, but they still played their guys to kind of keep them fresh for their wild card game the following week. And, you know, I just remember, they didn't go well. I didn't call a very good game. I didn't put our players in good positions. And that always just, well, it just, it just, just, it just, just, bothers the shit out of me i'll be honest but yeah but anyways it's crazy because then you end up saying you're really disappointed after the game because you felt like you know you were uh you know a big reason why your team didn't get a chance to advance and you pour your heart and soul into it and then you get a call you talk about a mixed bag of emotions bob lamont calls he says hey the rams want to

fly you in tomorrow bob lamont is your agent right got to give that my agent he calls and says uh you know the Rams want to fly you in tomorrow. And I said, you know, let's see if maybe I could take a day to get a deep breath and recuperate and refresh myself so that I'm not such a basket case because of how irritated I am about this result. And so make a long story short, we fly out to L.A. I get a chance to sit down. And I meet with Demoff, Les Need, Tony Pastores.

We go to a restaurant that night, a real nice place in kind of Santa Monica. We actually meet one of our team doctors, Neil Eletrosh, and he's a stud. I mean, he's world-renowned. Everybody loves a guy. And he's looking at these guys like, what, are you bringing an intern to interview for that coaching job? No doubt. And so things go well with that. I ended up getting a chance to meet a couple of the players on that visit.

And then I flew out, interviewed with the 49ers. I actually flew up to New York to interview with the 49ers. Is that right? It was in New York. Yeah, I did. You know, it was actually kind of. kind of a smart thing that they did because they flew, most of their candidates that they were interviewing were on the East Coast. So they actually flew out, stayed at a nice hotel and

kind of, I think it was in the Upper East Side. And I flew up there, got a chance to spend some time with Prague and Jed York and Brian Hampton. And it was a really enjoyable visit and thought, you know, we had a real good rapport. Next thing you know, I fly back to L.A. And you're flying back there and they check you up. Second interview. It basically is like, if you don't shit yourself, you're going to get this job. Yeah, it's yours. At least that's what I had said in my mind.

And so I really went into this deal, you know, thinking that in all seriousness, Peter, you know, you get a chance to interview for an NFL head coach. And you're thinking, I mean, how flattering is that? I'm 30 years old at the time. And really, when you look at it from afar, you're thinking, okay, you know, we've had some decent success. I've been really fortunate to be around some great coach. coaches. But in my mind, I'm thinking, you know, in a big game against the Giants that's basically like, all right, you win and you're in. We needed to perform well offensively. And I didn't feel like I did a very good job as an OC. I'm thinking, you know, that probably hurts your chances.

But, you know, I'm going to go compete to the best of my ability. And what's the worst that could happen? You come back and you're still the offensive coordinator for a really good football team working for a great head coach and Jay Grude. And I'm like, I'm playing with house money right now. So you go through the two interviews and you kind of can get a feel. all right, things are going well. So then you're thinking, now you start to let your mind go. All right, I'm excited about this opportunity. And so I fly back out to L.A.

and Kevin Demoff, who kind of was facilitating and kind of leading, you know, the coaching search, he says, hey, we're going to fly you back out. You're going to go to dinner at Spago with Stan Cronkey, myself, and Marshall Falk. And so I'm thinking, all right, this is what you do, man. All right. So I fly back out. They put me up at the montage in Beverly Hills. I'm thinking now this is very, very L.A.

And so we end up going, we go to dinner. Dinner goes great. You know, I mean, the first thing that happens at dinner is legitimately, Josh Dumell and Fergie walk right up to the table. Yeah. They recognize Mr. Crocky. I love that guy. There you go.

They recognize Mr. Cronkey and Marshall Falk and, come up and hey congratulations big fans you know they're they're kind of uh you know and and you could see that these these guys are you know hey nice to meet you and hey hello and i'm thinking you know of course this is exactly what would happen when you interview in l a for the rams and then wolfgang puck is actually coming up to the table as well who you know he's the guy that puts it all together at at spago and this is a true story i've kind of mentioned this before but he walks up to the table. He's a very nice guy was great, but, you know, I would imagine that as a, I don't know, maybe he's a big time football fan or as a casual football fan. You're probably

not thinking that I'm the guy that's interviewing for the head coaching job. And so he kind of, he's talking to Mr. Cronky, hey, how are we doing? You know, hey, what's the situation with the new coach? You know, when are we going to hire a new coach? And everybody's kind of looking at each other, like, how the hell do we respond to this? because, you know, we've got a guy that's a, it's that, you know, we think might hire, we might hire this guy as the head coach. They didn't offer it to yet, right? They haven't offered it to you.

No, they hadn't offered it to me yet. And so I'm thinking to myself, well, this is certainly a nice, uh, awkward start. You know, this guy thinks I'm the intern at, at, uh, at dinner, which, hey, you know, can you blame him? I would have thought the same thing. So I'm, I'm right there with them. And so the dinner goes well. I mean, I couldn't think more of, you know, the.

rapport and the way that you feel. Do you prep for that dinner? Like, are you like, all right, here's what I'm going to say? No, I think you say, hey, let's, you know, the one thing I think you can appreciate and that I love about Mr. Cronky, he's a guy's guy, he's a man's man. And so, you know, he's got a lot of different interests. You know, it couldn't have been a more natural, organic conversation. And, you know, he's involved in a bunch of different sports. And, and then I tell you what I thought was, was pretty insightful on his part is to say, okay, we've got this great Hall of Fame running back in Marshall Falk, who's known for his ownership and understanding above the neck, really follows the game closely. He was as close as it gets to a quarterback playing a

different position in terms of his big picture understanding. And I think they were saying, hey, you know, the one concern is, is we've got a 30-year-old guy, is this guy in your mind somebody that you feel like is capable of leading an NFL locker room or being in the role that we're asking him to be in? And, you know, and then obviously Kevin was, uh, you know, had had a little bit more exposure to me. And we had a great dinner. And so in my mind, I don't know why, but I had just thought about, you know, I can't, you kind of visualize how things are going to go.

And so you're thinking, all right, things go well at dinner. You know, it's going to result in, hey, so you want to be the next head coach of the Rams or what? I shake. Hey, let's go, man. Here we go. I'm fired up about this. Get the cheesecake.

Let's go. Yeah, yeah. Well, I don't know about the cheesecake. What the hell's wrong with you, man? That's me. That's me. You like the cheesecake. The whole meal I'd be thinking about the cheesecake, not the job.

But go on. All right. Well, and so basically it goes great, and we're kind of saying by, and I'm walking across the street, which is basically where the montage is in proximity to Spago and kind of walking across with Mr. Cronky before he heads home for the night. And he kind of looks over at me, and he says, yeah, I really enjoyed our visit. You know, when are you heading back? And I'm thinking to myself, well, don't you tell me when I head back?

And so I leave. You know, and I'm going back to my room that night, and I'm thinking, you know, what's wrong with you, man? You know, you must have done. Couldn't close it. Couldn't close the deal. Right. This is what you do. You closed.

And I couldn't close. And so I know this is a really long-winded way of getting back to your original point. So, you know, I said, I'm going to go grab a drink at the bar because all I'm doing is driving myself crazy. You're overthinking it. Yeah, I'm overthinking it. So then you go back through the gauntlet of, all right, you know what? You got a good job.

in Washington, man. You know, you let yourself go there. I could win with cousins. Yeah. No, you say you got a good job. What's the worst thing that could happen? But I'm still wondering, what the hell did I miss? Yeah.

And so I go to down to the bar. I have a couple drinks. And Bieber was there. You know, we, he was, he was down there. And, you know, he was sitting in the restaurant part of the montage and just kind of casual. And, you know, we didn't have any sort of interaction. But, you know, he was definitely low key. with some friends, nobody was kind of bothering him. I didn't want to say hello. I was too

distraught over wondering why I didn't close the dinner. And, you know, Mr. Cronkey and I get a good laugh about that now looking back on it because now I've realized that probably one of his greatest strengths, which is one of my biggest weaknesses is he's extremely patient and diligent with all of his decisions where I'm very impulsive. And sometimes that can be good, but sometimes bad. but I think make a long story short, there was pure torture where I waited about 24 to 36 more hours until they did finally offer me the job. But I was sharing that same thing with less need the next day. And he tried to make me feel better. He said, well, if it makes you feel better, my process went about two weeks. I said, Les, it's not making me feel any better about this.

Yeah, no. Dude, that's a great story. But it's just a lot of times we hear about these teams, not letting the guy get out of the building. Like I remember when, um, Sala interviewed for the Jets this year, and I knew he blew them away. I heard from both sides that it went really well. But then the Eagles had a private jet waiting for him. We're like, we're interviewing down here in Florida. And he gets on that jet. And I think a lot, and we'll probably bring Sala on as a guest at some point.

Like, I think a little bit of him was like, wait a second. You're letting me get on this jet? Like, I'm going to get on the jet. Like, are you really going to let me get on the jet? It's this game of chicken, but the jets all along, we're going to offer him the deal. But they let him get on that jet. And sometimes that's what it is. It's just like crazy game of like you're flirting with the other.

side, but you're also, you don't want to show your cards. And at the end of the day, when that offer comes in, it's got to be overwhelmingly a relief, but also a life changer. And for you, it absolutely was, right? Yeah, it was. I mean, that doesn't surprise me. And really, like, I mean, you talk about, you were prepped and you kind of understood, but until you really go through those interviews, you have no idea what that really entails. And so it was such a whirlwind for me where it all came together in a matter of, you know, six days right after you lose a game that you're anticipating, getting ready to play in the playoffs and try to, you know, make a run if you get an opportunity to get in.

And next thing you know, Wednesday you're in L.A., you fly back, you interview with the 49ers. And that was all in the same week. And you could tell, you know, I got real positive feedback from both places where I think there was more probably intrigue and interest, you know, more intrigued than there was actual interests like, okay, this is somebody that is a legitimate candidate. And then on Monday, the following Monday, I'm flying back. And then by Tuesday or Wednesday, I don't remember when it was they officially, you know, offered me the job. But I can promise you when that dinner didn't end the way that I thought, those next 12 hours were about like two years,

way to figure it out. But they, it was more kind of just getting to know the circumstances. And it all worked out and couldn't be happier. And so from my perspective, I'm so happy for you at the time. And I'm like, I'm like, holy shit, he's now got to go be a head coach. And no one ever that young had ever done it. You're the youngest head coach of all time. You walk in that first, let's say, I want to say training camp, but I'm sure there was like a mini camp in the spring.

Like, had you establish yourself with veterans? Because a lot of the people listening to this podcast, it's leadership, it's also coaching interest. And it's also, I want to hear stuff from Sean McVeigh. Like, what was the approach? Was it just be myself? Or did you have to kind of establish that I am the coach? And I am 30.

I am a man beyond my ears. Like, what was the approach those first days? It's funny that you ask that because, you know, even just something as close to as getting to know our rookies and having to introduce yourself through a Zoom call last week, you realize that, hey, you know, when you get it to the professional level, this is about, all right, building and developing relationships. How can we establish, all right, that there's going to be mutual respect that exists. But ultimately, our job is to help provide the, you know, the teaching in the atmosphere and the platform to help you become the best football player. And oh, by the way, if a lot of those things that are in alignment with becoming the best

football player also help you to become the best person and the best man in your life on and off the field, man, you're really checking all the boxes. And so I never really tried to pretend that I had answers to things that I didn't. I think one of the best things that happened was you surround yourself with guys that have more experience that have some of the answers that you didn't. And from the jump, it was about, hey, we're going to work hard at football. We're going to have a mutual respect about, hey, we're going to be urgent, but we're going to be respectful about how we expect to get that done.

And you know what, we're going to have some fun doing it. You know, I always talk about having an urgent enjoyment, you know, because that's the one thing that I know that when I reflect back on, especially being in this role for four years going into the fifth year, you know, a lot of the same things that helped you earn an opportunity to get the job are the things that as long as you don't lose sight of those core values, you know, you keep yourself in good shape. And the number one thing for me is, is don't ever forget about having fun, you know, doing what you're doing. You know, sometimes you can let a lot of the different things that go on and the pressures get the best of you. But I think keeping it in perspective and, you know,

that's really never been an issue because, you know, we're all grown men trying to ultimately put together a really good product of football. But, you know, you want to establish, hey, I want to build a relationship, let you know, this is Coach Wooden at its finest. You know, people don't care how much you know until they know how much you care. And I'd like to think that, you know, our guys know we care about them. There's going to be a respect, but we're going to be urgent in the way that we go about our stuff, but we're going to make sure we have some enjoyment in the process of doing that. And unfortunately, when you've kind of strayed away from those things or when I look back

and say, man, I could have been better. I should have been better. And, you know, you want to just make sure you don't make some of those same mistakes again. Yeah. And then you got this crazy season where you be coach of the year, you guys go to the playoffs, and the boy genius label happens. Everyone is like this wonder. And then I'll tell you, I've told you straight up, a lot of coaches were rooting against you that second year.

And they were like, all right, let's bring this guy down. This is not that easy. Were you aware of that? Did you kind of go in knowing there was a target on your back and that, you know, some coaches were now looking for you to get humbled a little bit? Well, if they were looking for it, it certainly happened in the Super Bowl. Don't laugh. I mean, I think a lot of, honestly, Sean, I think a lot of,

coaches rooting against you in that Super Bowl. You know what? I think this. I think that I can understand because if there's somebody that has grown up around this game and you look at the trajectory that my grandfather took in order to get to the position when he was the head coach of the Giants, but looking at his history dating back to being a high school coach, a college coach, working yourself up through the ranks, I can understand it.

I'm not naive to the fact that it is, it's embarrassing when you almost talk about how fortunate and blessed I've been to get an opportunity to work under some of the great coaches that were willing to put their arm around you. You get a chance to start where your first opportunity in coaching is working with the Bucks assistant John Gruden, you know, and a kind of an assistant to the quality control coach. And so can you blame them? Absolutely not, you know. And I think this is a humbling game.

You've got to always adjust and adapt. I think that we were fortunate enough to take over a pretty good situation, Peter. But, you know, there was a couple nights those first couple years where we saw. certainly got humbled and none, none more documented than the Super Bowl. But what a good learning opportunity it was. And, you know, you keep growing and keep pushing forward. And, you know, I feel like I'm 85 if that makes anybody feel any better. Look, I know. I know. And I think that Super Bowl aged you. Do you ever think about it still? Like, is it one of those deals where like that, like, the way they say it, like you wake up in a cold sweat and suddenly it's the fourth quarter of the

Super Bowl again? No, I don't, you know what? I would say this. You know, you can go back and and you can rewind the game and there's a lot of different things. But I think you want to make sure that you learn from it. If you were to say what was your biggest takeaway from that game when you really reflect back on it, you know, one of the things I talked to the guys about is, hey, you know, we're in such a, hey, what have you done for me lately? We want to attain and achieve results. And every single team, especially this time of year, is talking about, hey, let's go win a Super Bowl.

Let's give ourselves a legitimate opportunity to compete to win a Lombardi trophy. and because you have so much focus on the end goal, you can lose sight of the joy and the journey, you know, and that's a big reminder for myself. And, you know, I'm actually, you know, you think about going back and I grew up in Atlanta. Atlanta, you know, I was born in Dayton, Ohio, but I grew up in Atlanta.

That's where the Super Bowl was. And if you said, what do you really remember about that week spent in Atlanta, those two weeks leading up to the game, not a whole lot because I was to a fault, so intentional, Let's not, you know, let's not let any sort of distractions. Like, where like high school friends hitting you up.

Yeah, I mean, you know, and I still saw them and stuff like that. But, you know, you talk about enjoying the opportunity. There's a way of, you know, like I've always had this trouble of finding this balance, right? And there's a way of still, hey, let's get our work done. Let's try to really work our ass off to put together the best game, plan, offense, defense, and in the kicking game. But let's not lose sight of what a blessing it is that we've earned the opportunity to be one of the final two teams. Let's go compete to the best of our ability. Let's let it all hang out. No fear, whatever. And I say it, but did you really live it? Did you really do the things

that are in alignment with enjoying the opportunity that you had to compete for a world championship? The answer is no. And I think in a lot of instances, I let some of those early successes that we were fortunate enough to have get in the way of the enjoyment in that process that you go through season in, season out. And, you know, this is something that I've talked about a lot with, you know, a huge mentor of mine and an unbelievable guy's Dick Vermeal. And he and I have really talked about, you know, you can, you can let the success or some of the good things that you've done get in the way of, you know, enjoying the things that allowed you to do it the right way from the very beginning. And those are things that you constantly got to go back and remind yourself of. But,

you know, I think all in all, when you talk about, you know, wanting to get humbled, whatever, I think there's tremendous respect for this coaching profession and more than ever, the more you accumulate experience, the more you realize how difficult it is, what a high level of competition it is, weekend and week out from coaches, from players. And I think that's what, you know, people love so much about it as well. We're going to get to a lot of the current day topics, or at least some of them in a second. But my last question about that first year for you, you hire Wade Phillips who was what in his 60s? Yeah, I mean, he was in his late 60s and finished up in his early 70s.

He's sharp still on it. I mean, he was awesome. So you had Coach Wade, then you had guys like Joe Barry, and you had a bunch of different offensive coaches with you. Like, for people listening who are maybe of our years in their 30s or 40s, and they work with people who are older than them and like, how did you manage that? Because it's one thing with the players, like I'm the young coach. It's the other thing with, hey,

technically we're all in this together but you are working for me and you do have 10 15 20 30 years on me how did you walk into that situation because i think that's a great management and leadership question for anyone who's trying to be an entrepreneur or trying to really go for it at a young age yeah i i think uh wait phillips said it best peter i walked in i'll never forget this and i thought you know truer words this was just such a great thing that he had said is um when he opened up with his defensive staff he said let's first and foremost establish one thing. You don't work for me. You work with me. And that is this, and I thought to myself, wow, what a great approach from an incredibly successful, accomplished man that has such a

great humility that anybody that's been around, Wade Phillips loves him. And I think you want to try to mimic and emulate those things that became so endearing about him and not pretend to have all the answers because you don't, you know, experience is such a valuable thing. I think that's what I've realized more and more. I've heard this said, as repetition is the mother of learning. well, you know, how can you really create experience without having those years of experience? And I think it's by the hard work where you try to make up for it. But there's a lot of things that I just didn't have experience in because, you know, you hadn't been there. But you know what? Wade Phillips had been a head coach. We had some other guys that had great experiences. And I think

it's surrounding yourself with people that are better than you so that if you don't have the answer, you can defer to those guys. And it is about we're going to figure it out collectively and together. And that was kind of the motto that I tried to take. You know, I don't ever want anyone to feel like, you know, other than, hey, we're in this together. You know, we're really working together to try to accomplish things. But more about, hey, we are, you're not working for me. You're working with me. And I think Wade Phillips said it best there. Love it. All right. So let's shift gears a little bit because I think there's some things we want to hit. And I'm still trying to figure out our guardrails here. Your current NFL head coach,

you've got media opportunities. We're not going to necessarily. try to make any bombshells. So you tell me where you're comfortable going on this stuff. But I'll never forget, I guess it was Super Bowl Week. And you called me and you're like, hey, want to hear something funny? Stafford's actually here. And then that was the last I heard of it until after the news came out that there was a trade. And you guys were in a hotel. Stafford shows up. What can you say? And how did this thing happen that Matt Stafford went from being a Detroit Lions quarterback who was going in their ring of honor to a week later being the Los Angeles Rams starting quarterback. Yeah, I mean, you really can't make it up. It really is. It's,

it's unbelievable. So Veronica, my fiancee and I had gone to Cabo and we were staying at a nice place that we had gone before. And there was actually a handful of NFL people there because when you look at just around the country and this was still during, you know, where there were some COVID restrictions, things like that. And so kind of coincided. with we had just lost to the Packers in the division around the week before. So we said, let's get away. Let's go out of town. And so we're in Cabo.

And it kind of coincided where it came out that, hey, Matthew Stafford was going to be made available. He was seeking kind of an opportunity to look elsewhere and knowing that they were kind of going through a transition, new head coach, new GM. And they granted him permission to seek a trade. And then, lo and behold, no joke. this, you know, I don't think anybody will ever really believe this. No, because I'll tell you what people think. People think that you heard that the Staffords were going to be down there and then you guys booked a trip to Cabo in that minute. But the truth is you predated them being there, right? There you go, Peter. That's a real friend that knows that. And now, so we were down there,

I mean, I'll never forget. I mean, we're sitting there. I'm by the pool watching the conference championship games and texting me about it. Texting you about it. And, And we were down there with Andrew Whitworth and his family. And, you know, I mean, you talk about just all the things kind of aligning to present a possible opportunity. He had played, Matthew had played with Clint Bowling at the University of Georgia. Well, Andrew played with Clint Bowling, who they are still close friends. The Bengals. Yeah, with the Bengals.

And so, you know, it became known that Matthew was available. We were interested, you know, we didn't really know how serious it was. But there was a lot of things that align where Brad Holmes. who was with us is now the general manager. And so, you know, I was talking to Witt, and he said, you know, it's funny. I was talking to Clint Bowling and the Staffords are actually coming down here. I think they get there, you know, this was on Sunday, either Monday or Tuesday. And so they come down there and you can't make the shit up, Peter.

You can't. I mean, and really, we got a chance to spend some time together. Obviously, the lions knew that we were both down there. they had given them permission to seek a trade. And so you try to be cognizant of all those things. But you talk about an opportunity to be able to, you know, get to know somebody a little bit in a more relaxed setting. It really provided an opportunity for us to spend some time.

And I think it happened and it accelerated a lot faster than anybody anticipated. You know, I don't know if it came from Matthew or if whoever it came from, you know, there was a couple of these Peter Schrager guys that have all these. these Twitter followers, I know you didn't say anything, but, you know, it became known that, hey, the Rams are interested in Stafford. And, you know, I didn't think it was anywhere close to being able to get done. And then it really comes together in a matter of a day. And the next thing you know, we're actually in Cabo together and, you know, being able to say, all right, let's, let's go do this and see what happens moving forward. But it was, it was a rare experience. That's for sure.

What's the connection with him and his wife and you? Isn't there a connection? His wife knows someone. Like, what was the connection there? Because I remember you telling me that. And I was like, this is really a small world, a creepily small world. It really is. I mean, there's so many different connections now that we've spent a lot of time together.

But in its simplest form, you know, her brother, her older brother, Chad Hall. Yeah. So Kelly Stafford, who's Matthew's wife, her older brother, Chad Hall, he and I are the same age. He's all he, you know, he played in the league. He was a baller at Air Force, but he was playing quarterback when I was at Maris. He was playing at Wesleyan. And, and so we knew of one another. And we had a friendship going back to our days in high school as rival quarterbacks in the greater Atlanta area. And, you know, he ended up going and doing a lot of big things. He played a handful of years in the league and was an awesome player at the

University of Air Force as a running back. Actually, was a conference player of the year, his last year there, but he's now doing an unbelievable job as a receiver coach for the bills. Yeah, he's doing a heck of a job. You know, those guys have done really good things there. But we've known each other for a while. And actually, you know, like Matthew and I more just through the NFL connection, hey, how you doing? But we really hadn't had any sort of interaction other than kind of the surface level dialogue. And then you get to know him and you realize when everybody comes out and says, what a great dude and what a, what a baller he is. You know, you realize, you realize, and the more you get to know him, yeah, this is all pretty true and accurate.

Has it been? Like, that's, I guess, we're now a couple of months in. I don't know how much you guys can talk, but for the sake of this podcast, I assume you've had a couple conversations. What's the relationship so far? Yeah, we've had a lot of conversations. He's awesome. I mean, he's been great.

It's been amazing just to allow him to kind of talk and reflect back on the 12 years of experiences that he has in Detroit, being around a lot of great coaches, too. I mean, you know, these guys, whether it's Scott Lenehan, whether it's Darrell Bevel, whether it's Jim Bob Cooter, you know, you look at the different experiences, Joe Lombardi. I mean, he's played for. Jim Caldwell. Really good. Yeah, and Jim Caldwell is his head coach.

But, I mean, really, when you look at the four offensive coordinators, he's been exposed to so many different things football-wise. And you can tell when you talk to him, I mean, his inventory and his ability to recall things. And then he's also just got such a nice way about him. You know, he's got a great humility about himself. he and his family are fun to be around. So, you know, really today kind of represented the first opportunity for our players to get

out on the field together. And, you know, it'll be fun. We're looking forward to being able to just get some good work in in a smart way this off season. Yeah. And all right, let's move around the league a little bit because this is where we get into the, what can we say, what can we say? How can we say this is our first episode?

We'll see where we go with this. There is a quarterback who used to be in the same division as Stafford, who publicly, was news came out that he was not too happy with things. And we won't get into the details. He still doesn't set a peep. He's been silent, which I think has been pretty powerful, his silence,

to be honest. You're a head coach. LaFleur is a buddy of yours. How do you even handle something like that? When the player of that magnitude, there's these stories, and it gets to the point where it's all anybody's talking about, and you're the head coach involved.

Yeah. I mean, first of all, I think when you look at it from afar and you just step outside the box, I think, you know, what Matt's done is exactly the right thing, you know, made it known, you know, I know that, you know, I'm sure that he and Aaron have had great conversations where Aaron knows how important and how instrumental he is in everything that they're going to do, you know, he's made it very clear in the, in the press conferences that he's had. But, you know, I think most importantly, it's, hey, let's let's get to an understanding of, all right, how did we get here?

And then what are the things that we can do to try to find a solution? You know, everything is about a solution-oriented approach. Now, whether that can, you know, be had or not, you know, that's not for me to say. But I do think that, you know, from a coaching perspective, you're really saying, all right, what's the most important thing and what is the outcome that is desired for us on this end of the spectrum and what we're looking to? And I know for Matt, hey, what's the end goal? Let's just make sure that we do everything we can to help facilitate Aaron coming back and leading the way for the Packers when they open up next season.

You know, now whether that happens or not, shoot, you probably know better than me, man. You got all this inside info. So it is, you know, it's something that I think only they can speak on. But I know that, you know, as a really close friend of Matt's, I know that he wants to do everything he can as the head coach to ensure that the MVP. of the league is still leading the way for his team that has been pretty good the last couple years where two seasons 14 and four and you know a couple plays away from from playing for a Super Bowl this past year yeah that's the thing two 13 and three seasons two trips to the nFC conference championship a lot of people are like hey dude the grass isn't always greener but

rogers is his own deal man and maybe it is greener somewhere else or not playing at all and i you know from the coaching standpoint i don't think this is a la floor issue i think that's been made pretty known. I'm curious, you know, between us and the listeners, I just, how do you handle it with Matt as part of the organization? But of course, knowing how important keeping Rogers is. Yeah, I would think, too, that they're all in alignment in terms of wanting to get that done. How does that look? What is the solution-oriented approach? You know, that's, to me, things that are going on behind the scenes. But I can't imagine that there's not a consistent alignment in terms of, all right, let's do these things to try to get them back.

But it's definitely an interesting situation to say the least. Yeah. All right. So now we're going to do this. We're going to alternate. We're going to do something what we're going to do to do quick hitters. I ask you a question. You answer.

You ask me a question. Then I, and we'll just do a couple. Let's see where we go with it. I'm going to ask you the first one. Sure. All these head coaches, who's the best hang? Who's the guy you would choose to spend the dinner with or a night at the bar with? like who's a fun, but also the guy you'd look forward to saying, oh, on the date, next Wednesday,

I've got dinner with this guy. I can't wait. Who's that, who's that individual? Man, you know what? That's a, that's a loaded question. You're setting me up there because I got a lot, you know, that's like asking who's your favorite co-host of good morning football, you know? I'll tell you, it's Kay Adams. That's not a question. I mean, what do you care? Go on. See, that's a smart answer there, all right? But I would say that, you know, there's guys that are, a lot of fun to hang out with. It really just depends, depends on what type of fun you're looking to have.

It's not an all, we're not going to Vegas and we're not opening up the new win. What we're doing is we're going for a dinner. And it's going to be you. It's going to be your fiance. It's going to be this coach. It's going to be his wife. And it's one of the 32.

It's next Wednesday. I am so fired up to pick the brain or to just share stories with go. Yeah. I mean, I think, I'll tell you what, this is one of the things that in the short amount of time that I've gotten a chance to do this, Coach Belichick couldn't have been better to me. No, really?

Well, I mean, he is, no, don't, don't, you'll be. Fun though? Like, yeah, fun, engaging. He is, uh, he's been great in the minimal in the, you know, the limited interactions that we've had. Matt Lafleur is one of my best friends. So I'm going to say, you know, you'd love to be able to go with Matt, but, you know, Kingsbury's close by. I mean, there's, there's a lot of guys that, that, you know, you're, you're putting me in a spot that, uh, you know, it just depends on what type of atmosphere we're looking for.

I got a pretty, I got a, I got a defensive coordinator and Raheem Morris that's about as much fun to be around as anybody. We all know how dynamic Mike Tomlin is. I mean, we're, we got a lot of potential options. This is like the, you can't go wrong, Peter. I can't go wrong with that one. All right. Feel free to ask me anything. I don't think anyone cares about the good morning football dynamics, but ask whatever you want. I would be interested to see this. You know, and this is kind of staying on the football, you know, topic. But so you're a guy that you've been around this. You've obviously got great insight and knowledge. And then I think one of the strengths that you have is your feel for people. Yeah. Put on your owner's cap. Okay.

And I want to know what are the three most important things you're looking for when you're hiring a head coach, and then how do those three qualities differentiate when you're hiring a GM, if at all. Oh, my God. All right. So head coach for me. Yeah, three qualities. It's so, maybe it's just generic, but you kind of get the feel.

I need someone who owns the room. And I think that matters. And I think a lot of these owners fail and realizing it's not just this interview that I'm getting and it's not who you've coached in the past or what offense you run. Who owns the room? I always think that's the most important thing. know that pretty quick. And that's just a feel for people. Number two, I think the most important thing is the way they treat people, because I think that really bleeds into things. So now I scoffed

at you saying, you know, Belichick, he can't be interesting. But everyone who's ever worked for Belichick absolutely loves the guy. And that goes to Joe Judge, to Josh McDaniels, to Brian Flores, to Matt Patricia, all these head coaches I've gotten to know over the years who all swear by Belichick. So I think that's important. And then the last thing, who's going to represent me as the owner because the quarterback and the coach are really the faces of the team. And I think it's the two most important pieces of building a franchise. So if I'm hiring this coach and this coach, you know, I like what he did on offense or I like what I like what his team did last year, but he and I were not really on the same page or he and I, I just don't know if I would ever,

I feel like that matters. Like this person is a representation of me. So for example, you know, Sala being hired by the Jets. I think. What Sala represents is high energy, accountability, discipline, and it's nothing against the previous coach, who you and I both really like as a guy, Adam Gase. This is, all right, what do we want to be as the New York Jets? All right, well, now we're Robert Sala's New York Jets. And I think that's something of great importance.

That can be the same thing said for you guys in the Rams, for what Arthur Smith's going to do for Atlanta, for all these teams. Now, GM, to me, I think a lot of that is, who's got an eye for this thing? Who's got an eye for it? Because to me, I want to know who has the vision to say, all right, I'm going to take this player over this player, or we're going to really lay our, you know what, on the table, we're going to go and make this move and this acquisition. One of the things I always appreciate about, let's say, less, or what about Lynch has done since he's been in San Francisco, it's like, we want to do this, we're going to go for this, we'll apologize later. We'll make it work. We'll figure it out. And I think the amount of criticism that not only Les Sneed got, but also, John, Schneider in Seattle for trading multiple first round picks to get defensive backs. Well, let's see what's happened since. You know, the Rams made that trade.

And I'm not blowing you guys up too much here. But it's like, all right, K. Levan Chaseon was the first pick. And then I guess the second one was what, Travis Etienne was I guess who they got for that. So that's the trade pretty much. You're getting a defensive end and a running back or you're getting Joan Ramsey, whom many think is the best cornerback in all of football. I appreciate that kind of vision, knowing that there's. There's going to be heat.

There's going to be people firing at you. And I like that. So GM is about that. And then the other thing with the GM, a lot of times they just hire, you know, this guy was a scout anywhere that I need to know what makes you forward thinking and makes you a little different than just the best scout because I don't think the best scout necessarily is always the one. So David Tepper had 14 different people interview for that GM job.

Scott Fitterer got the job. I don't know Scott Fitterer. I know John Schneider very well. I don't know, Scott. Everyone rames about him. He's going to be great. I appreciated that David Tepper brought in Brent Tillis, who is the salary cap guy from the chiefs. I appreciate that there were some other outside the box kind of interview candidates.

And I like that. I like when you say, okay, well, it's been done this way for so many years as far as we hire a GM who's been a pro personnel director. He's been a scout. He's been the number two to this guy. How could we flip it on its head? maybe there's a better way to do it in 2021. So fitter where they hired, it's going to be great. It's fine. But even interviewing some of those other candidates, I love it because, candidly, between us, I think a guy that we've both become very friendly with is Mikey Greenberg

down in Tampa Bay. Mikey's job is, I think, director of operations or administration. His job, though, essentially is to manage the salary cap and to keep Jason light honest on what we can do and within reason. Gosh, I think Mikey, who's in his late 30s, but has been doing it for a long time. I think he'd be a great candidate. He hasn't sniffed an interview yet. So to me, as an owner, I would, A, bring in the best guys that I think can see talent, but I wouldn't be scared to interview some of those people that maybe aren't traditionally your NFL general managers.

And I think there's a lot of fantasy football players out there. I know there's a lot more that goes into it. But I think that's the one job, GM, that everyone at home says, well, shit, I could do that. Well, I don't know if you can, but I certainly want to meet all different types when I'm hiring that kind of guy. Yeah, no, it's a great point. What's interesting about it, too, all of those people that have success in each of those roles have some form of leadership qualities that enables people to, you know, have belief in them,

their vision. There's a conviction in terms of not being afraid to do things if they have a belief in and what it is guided by, you know, strong values and principles. And I think the one thing about the real head coaches that separate. themselves are when things aren't going good, who has the ability to keep that belief and dig people out of that adversity that inevitably you face? That's to me a great separator. So you haven't had many of these, but when you have that losing streak, I kind of think the coach is feeling it more than anyone is in the tank more than how do you stay up? Like, you just got to be cognizant and

self-aware that they need me to be this way. They need me to be positive. I think, you know, I think you got to be a real guy. And, you know, I've heard it said before, you know, you can, can have bad moments, but you can't have bad days. You know, there's a, there's a lot of talking to yourself, not listening to yourself. But, you know, I think it goes back to having those values that guide your everyday approach and easier said than done when you're in the midst of that, all right? But, you know, what are the types of people that are helping you fight out of it? You know, who can you really lean on?

You know, I think that's why as a head coach surrounding yourself with great assistance that you can really lean on during those times that can help get direction, having the veteran in leadership. All those things are so important. And that's why, you know, at the end of the day, all this comes down to his people. You know, I don't care whether it's sports, whether it's business. You know, whenever you hit a tough patch, you know, what are the things that you can hang your hat on, you know, those values that can help kind of guide it? Or do we have enough agility to be able to adjust and adapt accordingly? And then who are those people that are not going to allow the circumstances to dictate a certain response? You know, they're going to be the people that,

they're going to be the thermostat instead of the thermometer that just goes up and down, you know, like a thermometer with the outside external things that are occurring. Those are the people that they decide if it's hot or cold and they're not going to, you know, I always tell our players that mental toughness is being your best regardless of the circumstances. And, you know, I think that's something that you see consistent amongst anybody that's great at what they do. And I think it especially rears its head in our profession when every single week that narrative is written. And if you ride that emotional roller coaster,

it ends up being real challenging. All right. We're going to do one more question for each other each. And I think one thing to note here, which is going to be cool, we're trying this new thing out. And the ringer guys have been awesome. And we've got a great producer named Craig Horlebeck,

who's going to, he does the fantasy podcast for the ringer, and he's producing this one. And he's been awesome setting us up, obviously. But what we're going to try to do is have the listeners of the podcast send questions in like these, and you and I answer. Now, it's going to be Flying Coach Podcast at Gmail. people can just send them. And our goal is that we could either hear them,

they can record them, or we could just get a bunch of emails and we almost do like a Simmons mailbag and we answer them. But let's finish up episode one here with me asking you one more and you asking me one more. We know about the superstars you coach

with Aaron Donald, and we know about the pro bowlers that you've had in Gurley and golf. Who's the most random, maybe under the radar guy that you have loved coaching over your time with either Washington, Tampa or the Rams.

Like a guy that you say this name, fancy would be like, oh shit, I love that guy. Like, I haven't thought about him in several years, but like, who's that guy that kind of maybe didn't always have the same sort of accolades

or maybe public persona as some of the more famous players? Yeah, so when I first got an opportunity to be the tight ends coach in Washington, you know, Chris Cooley was a really prolific pro bowl tight end. Fred Davis was an unbelievable athlete. I love coaching both those guys. but there was this guy Logan Paulson, undrafted free agent out at UCLA.

He played a long time in this league, but one of the most conscientious players, detailed, you know, Chris always kept me on my toes, but Logan Paulson, I mean, you talk about a guy that loved football, love the process, the approach every single day, you know, and you got what you, you know, when you flipped on the film, you know, because he had such trust in us, you know, you were going to see, you know, what you were coaching. and great competitor. He would always piss guys off because he'd always be finishing. He's one of those guys that just gets that last little shove in.

He's always winning the inside hand position. But Logan Paulson is one of my all-time favorites. And love the guy. I think you realize how fortunate you are to work with a lot of different special types of players. But that resonated with me because that represented my first position job. And this was a guy that I worked with for all the years that I was in Washington. love him the death and, you know, maybe Logan's listening right now. And I miss you, buddy.

I sure miss you. Who was the room? It was you said Fred Davis or was it Vernon Davis? Who was it? No, it was Fred Davis. I don't remember Fred Davis. Who's Fred Davis? USC.

He won the Mackey Award at the University of Southern Cal. He's from Toledo. He was like a five-star receiver. Pete Carroll recruited him to USC was a second round pick for Washington in the same. I believe the same draft they drafted. Malcolm Kelly and Devin Thomas. I think Fred Davis was a part of that draft class as well. Go back and Google him.

We actually placed a franchise tag on him one year. And then unfortunately, he ended up tearing his Achilles. But he's a really, really talented player, you know, played in Washington. And then he and Chris Cooley were kind of like a one-two punch dynamic duo. Vernon Davis was on the team when I left Washington. He and Jordan Reed were a pretty, unique pairing. We had Niles Paul. But Logan Paulson kind of rounded out that group when I first started coaching the

tight ends in the 2010 season with the Washington football team now. I love that. All right. Give me one more and then we'll put a wrap on this first episode, which I think has gone really well. I'm enjoying it. What has been, you know, if you said, you know, going back from, you know, our conversation back in New York when you're saying, all right, I'm really going to, I'm going to dive into this thing full steam ahead. You know, you were doing the Fox thing, but then, you know, doing the every day, the good morning football. That really represented taking a chance, betting on the opportunity. Obviously, it's really worked out for itself. What's been the most, you know, amazing part of that

journey on GMFB that you'd say, like, man, this has been a pretty special part of that. I know that's kind of an all-encompassing question. No, dude, it's been life-changing, and I didn't realize it when I took the job, and I don't think I realized it the first couple years. When I mean life-changing, the way it has introduced me to different people and to different experiences, like, I'd never been to Europe before. We did a good morning football week in London before a Jaguars-Eagles game, and to see that they watch our show over there, and that people love the football over there, and to see how that fan base operates out there overseas, amazing, would never have had that opportunity.

Our show, because it's on the NFL network, is on in every building. As you know, it's probably on in the wait room for you guys. It's on, and it's wallpaper a lot of times. People aren't really watching it. It's just kind of on. But they know my face. They see that guy,

and to be able to walk into a building now, an NFL building, a facility, and not have to do the, hey, my name's Peter Schrager, I write for foxports.com and here's my accolades. And I just need five minutes. If I could just get five minutes with, you name the random player. If I can get five minutes with Debo Samuel, that'd be great. And begging the PR guy. And instead it's, hey, I walk in the building and Debo Samuel or whoever just will be proactive. Be like, oh shit, what's up, man? Let's talk.

It's been career changing. And then the life changing part has been the experience and all that, of course, but just how rewarding it is. I love it, dude. I love it so much. And it was my dream job. got my dream job and a day does not go by where I don't appreciate having the dream job. Now our show has been nominated for sports Emmys. It's nominated this year where we're up against like, we're up against PTI, dude. Like I grew up worshipping Kornheiser and Wilbon. Now we're in the same category for an award as them. And, you know, right now we're in the dog days of the off season. And it's May 20th, May 21st. And it's like we're starting the show with Tebow. And part of you wants to roll your eyes and say, oh my God, I'd love to be doing anything else. And then it lasts for one second.

You're like, holy shit, I talk about football for a living with three other people I really like that we've got a great relationship with. And people actually care to listen to what I have to say. It's a dream. So to me, Sean, it's just gratitude, gratitude, gratitude. And I know it sounds, you know, it's maybe a little Pollyanna and all that. I never forget it. Like, I get it. I totally get it. And I'm aware of it every single day. And I hope that's a endearing. quality and not one where it feels like I'm rubbing that in people's faces, how happy I am. But gosh, after the year we went through with this pandemic and is there going to be football, are you going to have a job? Is the NFL network still going to be open? Is everyone going to

make it healthy? Are we going to play any games to get through that season and now we're starting to open up again? I mean, God, it's been an unbelievable experience and a realization of just how good I have it. So, yeah, that's my big takeaway. Sorry to get so emotional on it. No, but you know what? I will say this. You know, obviously you're a close friend, but, you know, there's something about when you watch the show, you can feel if people have a genuine joy for what they're doing. There's an enthusiasm at which you attack every single day that you're having fun, man. And people like that, you know, it's like, I always think about the people that I spend, you know, time with, you know, you want to surround yourself with the

people that, hey, you know, you always leave and you say, you know, I always feel better about myself because that person's got a zest for life. And that is something that I feel. You know, feel from you and really, you know, just to show. And that's why I think it's become so successful. And, you know, I think that's what we both want to make sure that people feel is that, you know, you're enjoying it. And I think at the same token, while we're both, you know, expecting to compete to the best of our abilities in the arenas that we're in, you know, shit, we're both still

fans at the same time. Yeah. And, you know, to be able to be in this, you know, arena where you're competing against coaches and you're getting a chance to work with or coach against, players that you have tremendous respect for. And, you know, on this, on the flip side, the same thing for you. I mean, we got it pretty good, man. Life is good.

The fans know, though. Like, it's a crazy deal. Like I said in passing, I said last week on the show, I'm like, well, if the Packers wanted to make Aaron Rogers happy, drafting an undersized cornerback out of Georgia isn't going to do the job in the first round. And I got about 500 tweets being like, yo, Eric Stokes, their first round pick is six foot one. He's not undersized.

Like, they know. Like, the fans are. knowledgeable. You can't fake it, bro. You cannot fake it. So, you know, Craig, our producer, he's on the NFL show. We got Kevin Clark on the NFL show. Like, I'll hear like, the listeners, like, you don't need to prove it to him every day, but like if you don't know what you're talking about, they sniff that out really quick. So it keeps you accountable. And the fact that we're now five years in, and I feel like I've passed that litmus test is huge. It's like you got the credibility, you can talk about it. And then to then maintain that with be informative, be

insightful, maybe bring some new information to the table, but also have fun with it, dude. That's the balance. So what have I learned the most? It's just to be appreciative of it. And that gratitude pays off. Yeah. Hey, joy in the journey, baby. You're enjoying it, man. Join the journey. Urgent enthusiasm. What was it? Urgent enjoyment. You know, urgent enjoyment. It sounds cliche, but it's a good, it's a good one, man. It's, you know, it's sometimes those little things that kind of just keep you on track and just good reminders of. And this is what I want you to remind me of in week eight. Yeah, seriously.

It's easy, right? Every team is going 16 and O. Stafford looks amazing. Aaron Donald is gorgeous. And then week eight when you got a three-game road trip or whatever, you have to remind yourself that. This is going to be an ongoing thing with this podcast, your terms, because there's another one you used above the neck.

I think we're going to make a glossary. It'll be coach speak, man. We'll start making all the coach speak above the neck. It's McVeighism. Well, I think we're going to make a glossary of McVeigh. Well, I'm going to make a glossary. Well, I'm not. I mean, I got above the neck is, no, no one uses above the neck.

I got that from John Gruden. Did you? Yeah. Yeah, I got it. Urgent enjoyment. I haven't heard that one before, though. I'll take that one. Urgent enjoyment.

All right. We're going to wrap here. This is great, Sean. Now, here's the goal. We're going to try to bring on some of your friends, my friends. We're going to try to have interesting guests. That's the goal. We're not going to name any now.

But the goal is every week for 10 weeks. We're going to bring in, it might be one guest. It might be two guests at the same time. and just do this, cut it up, chop it up, have friends talking, and yeah, we'll hit football and all that stuff, but, like, kind of give you conversations you might not be getting on the other 9,000 podcasts that are out there in the sports world. What's your goal for doing this? Because no other current NFL head coach is doing this right now, and yet you have been

gung-ho since the very mention of it. Yeah, I mean, I think it's to have fun. I think be able to get some insight on how we operate our friendship, you know, just kind of a different perspective and then some of the people that this platform has enabled us to really develop some good relationships with and just an interesting listen that gains, you know, helps get some perspective and hopefully you come away with saying, you know, that was a fun 40 minutes or so if give us the time. I love it. Dude, you're the man. What we're going to be doing is asking you guys at home to follow the show on Spotify. You can click the link in the

episode description. And then we also want you. guys to send in these questions. I think that's cool. The Flying Coach email is going to be Flying Coach Podcast at gmail.com. You can send it over email or you can record a voicemail by calling the number in the episode description. Yes, we're going to have that. And then we're going to try to answer those. Maybe Craig will read them to us. We'll get Craig involved. I feel like Craig's like our third brother in this thing. We're going to get him involved. And then we're going to do each week with different guests and hopefully make a difference in your podcast listening habits and that you guys stop on ours every week because we're hoping it to be a little different. But on behalf of Sean McVeigh,

this is Peter Schrager. And we're going to be back next Wednesday on Flying Coach. Sean, wrap it up for us, dude. How do you close out a meeting when you're with rookies for the first time? You know what? I close it out and saying, until next time, get your mind right, get you, get your mind right. I love it, dude. All right, guys. Thank you. Flying Coach. Let's do it.