The Ringer NFL Show - Drafting the Most Exciting Things for Week 2

Episode Date: September 16, 2022

This week, Sheil is joined by Lindsay Jones to draft the things they are most excited about for Week 2, including Lamar Jackson (7:00), Aaron Rodgers (17:00), and Saquon Barkley (21:00). Then, they team up to answer your mailbag questions from Week 1 (27:00). Host: Sheil Kapadia Guest: Lindsay Jones Associate Producer: Mike Wargon Additional Production Supervision: Arjuna Ramgopal and Conor Nevins Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey everyone. This is Chris Ryan from The Ringer. As many of you have heard by now, we lost a treasured colleague and friend over the weekend. Jonathan Charks passed away on Saturday. John was 34. He leaves behind a wife and a son, and we are obviously mourning his loss and sending all of our love to his family right now. If you go to the ringer.com slash Jonathan Charks, that's J-O-N-A-T-J-A-R-K-S. You will find a memorial page for John, which has links to his GoFundMe that benefits his family. and the amazing writing he did throughout his experience. I encourage you to go there, and if you can, please support the Charks family.

Briefly, I will just say that John was among the first people that we hired to work for the Ringer, so he was instrumental in defining the voice and perspective of the site. He has as much to do with what this place is as anyone else. And throughout his experience with Cancer, John communicated eloquently about the challenges he was facing, both through his writing and his podcasting. You could never stop John from talking about his passions. It's one of the things I loved about him. Over the last few months,

whenever we would talk, whenever I would reach out to see how he was doing, I would try to keep it very John focused, and the next thing I knew we would be talking about James Hardin or Better Call Saul. He really loved this stuff. He loved talking about it, celebrating it, debating it, illuminating it.

We're going to keep putting out our pods and writing while we grieve, but we wanted to let folks know that John was in our hearts and that his family was in our thoughts. Thanks for listening. Welcome to the original. ringer NFL show, Shield Capadia, joined by Lindsay Jones. The idea today, Lindsay, is very simple. We passed week one. We got excited about some stuff. We overreacted to some stuff. What are we excited about in a week two? So we're just going to go back and forth, very nonchalant and draft some things

we're excited about in week two. And then we will, of course, finish with a listener mailbag. We're going to do that on this episode every week throughout the season. So tweet me those questions every week. I appreciate all of them. Lindsay, what do we think? Does this sound like good format for a show today. I'm pumped about this because one of the last times we did a pod together, it was very, like, depressing, like serious topics. And so I'm just really excited to kind of like bring the energy up. And it's a pretty, it's a weird, fun slate of games.

There's a lot of really big point spreads, which we'll talk about, I think, a little bit here. But yeah, it's going to be a really fun weekend. So let's go. Let's talk about the stuff we're pumped about. All right. You get the first pick. What do you have? What are you most looking forward to this weekend?

I'm going to go a little weird here. I'm really excited about kickers. Is that an odd where to go to start this off? If Andrew Siciliano and Scott Hanson are friends from NFL Red Zone, the two different red zone channels are listening, I would like to make a request to give us every field goal attempt on Red Zone this weekend. Because last weekend was a bloodbath, right? I mean, it was a wild weekend for kickers.

It was really rough. So I want to see every field goal attempt. I want to see every extra point attempt. I kind of live for the drama. I live for the messiness. But I also live for a redemption narrative here when it comes to these kickers. So I want to see these guys rebound because last week was really rough. I believe they were at, let me make sure I have this stat here, right?

I believe it was 81% of made field goal. attempts. It was a lot of kickers. This wasn't just Evan McPherson in Cincinnati who had the best excuse for having a kick blocked and then missing a kick because he had a brand new long snapper who isn't actually a long snapper. But, you know, this was Young Wai Ku, or having a game-winning attempt blocked. This was Rodrigo Blankenship missing a kick in overtime and then losing his job. Already waived. I mean, how often is it is a kicker already week one? Poor guy already waved. Yeah, I mean, I think it was building. You know, I don't think this was like a one-time thing.

Like, I think it had kind of been building there, some issues going on in Indianapolis. But this was kind of happening. You know, this is Chris Boswell from Pittsburgh, missing a kick in overtime. And then ultimately he ended up kind of redeeming himself and making the kick at the end and winning that game for the Steelers. And then, of course, this is Brandon McManus. And I want to get into a little bit more than Nathaniel Hackett of but all. And I'm guessing that this might be on your list at some point here.

too. So look, at least Hackett has kind of walked back a little bit. Yeah, maybe we shouldn't have attempted the field goal. Maybe we should have gone for it. But couched in that was, we had our line at 46. And we still have not had a good explanation from Nathaniel Hackett about why that was the decision that they had come to and why he and the rest of his coaching staff had decided that kicking a 64-yard field goal attempt was something that was even worth trying let alone being their end-of-game strategy. And this goes back to Brandon McManus to me, who is the Broncos' longest tenured player.

He's the only player left from the Super Bowl era, from the Peyton Manning era. And he has a huge, maybe like outsized voice inside that locker room and within that team, much more than probably any kicker elsewhere in the league outside of maybe Justin Tucker, who has really the resume that he can back this kind of stuff up. up.

Brandon McManus has been the Broncos NFL PA rep. He is on the exec committee of the NFLPA now. He's been around for a lot. He's one of the only guys there who's won a lot of games as a Bronco. And this is a new head coach, new special teams coordinator. And somehow he convinced them that he could make a 64-yard field goal at the end of regulation. His career long is 61. He hasn't made a kick over 55 yards outside of a dome or outside of Denver.

Seattle is neither of those things. So this comes back to me for decision-making and kind of the authority that Nathaniel Hackett has is the head coach of that team. And part of becoming the boss now, like he very much to me seems like a people pleaser. Like he wants his guys to believe in him and he wants to be like a cool guy and, you know, he's just so high energy and stuff. But like sometimes being the boss means stepping in and saying, I'm sorry, Brandon, you are wrong. we cannot do this. And I think that's something that now he is learning about being a manager, being the boss of everybody here, is that you kind of have to step in sometimes

and tell your subordinate or your direct report. Like, I'm sorry, this is a bad idea and we cannot do this. And I want to see, one, if Brandon McManus can make some, they're going to be back in Denver, whether's going to be great here this weekend. You know, let them try one at the end of the half or something, but let's not do it at the end of game situation. So I just want to see what Hackett has learned from this situation. Yeah, the game management.

is someone asked about that in the mailbag, so we'll definitely get to more on that. But yeah, I think Nathaniel Hackett, like, if I had to pick a head coach, like, you would most want to be your neighbor or something, like he seems like a very agreeable, fun, happy guy, but man, that was a rude awakening for week one, that decision. And there's all the, you know, analytical models and stuff this week. Say maybe it wasn't, like, to me, this one was just, like, pretty simple. Like, you have Russell Wilson for a reason. You call the time out.

You want to get closer. want to give yourself the best chance at the field goal. It's fourth and five. It's not fourth and 17. And so that was a baffling decision. And even when he walked it back, I was kind of like, I don't know if he totally understands kind of what he did there. So we will see.

The Broncos certainly will be in the spotlight in week two. Give me the kickers. Give me a lot of kickers. Like kicker zone. I'm here for it. And you didn't even. How about just I like when the non kicker gets to kick. Like the Justin Reed in Kansas City.

That's like when the position play. Yeah, we might get to see that Thursday night. So by the time you're listening to this, maybe we'll have seen Justin Reed in some high-levered situations. That's fun too. All right. You got the kickers. I'm going to go with Lamar Jackson is the guy I'm most excited to watch in week two.

You know, week one, they're playing the Jets. That game didn't have a lot of juice. It wasn't that exciting. They hit on some deep passes, but it wasn't like a consistently fun game or a competitive game, really. Now he goes up against the Miami Dolphins. We remember that Thursday night game from last year when it just looked like the Ravens players had just met each other like three minutes before kickoff and they had no idea that these blitzes were going to be coming at them against the dolphins. And they just looked terrible.

I mean, one of the worst offensive performances you would see, especially for a team that has a quarterback like Lamar Jackson. I was looking it up. They've had 54 games with Lamar Jackson. That game against the dolphins last year was their 53rd ranked offensive performance. And so their second worst of the entire Lamar Jackson era. And it wasn't just that one game. I mean, that really, I don't like to get carried away with blueprint talk a lot of the time. But really, if you just look at what ailed the Ravens last year with Jackson, the Blitz, they never figured it out.

And man coverage, they really struggled against man coverage last year. And so now what are you going to see from the dolphins? Heavy blitz, heavy man coverage. They made Mac Jones look terrible last year. The Patriots looked completely flustered, which who knows? Maybe that won't be that hard to do this year. Maybe it will. I don't know, but I am curious to see because John Harbaugh has in Lamar Jackson,

they've even talked about it this week. Like, yeah, we did spend a lot of time this offseason trying to figure out how defenses were attacking us and how we can come up with better solutions. So I just feel like we're going to learn a lot about the Ravens, how their offense might be different this year by how they perform against that Dolphins defense. Yeah, I had this one on my list, too. I very much feel like this is a bellwether game for both of those teams. You know, obviously both have gone through some pretty significant

changes in the offseason. The Ravens, most of their changes have been on defense. And this is going to be a much bigger test than they got last week against the Jets. I want to see how they handle the dolphins speed and what kind of their plan is to handle both Tyree Kill and Jalen Waddle. So I'm excited to see that. But for all the reasons that you already explained, I am very curious. I mean, this is probably my favorite Sunday game. Yeah, I think I agree. Yeah, that's game of the afternoon. So, yeah, that's the one that, you know, I will probably isolate on one screen while I have Red Zone or a four box or an eight box on one of the others.

And my kicker, kicker channel. Of course. What's number two on the Lindsay Jones list? I've got Trey Lance and nice weather. So I went ahead and looked at the forecast for Santa Clara, which is where they were going to be playing the Seahawks this week. The forecast is a high of 88 with a 1% chance of rain. Oh.

So pretty good, a little bit different than what they were dealing with in, than what they were dealing with in Chicago last week. So I just want to see, like, I don't think we got a fair representation of kind of who Tray Lance is of what the Niners offense is actually going to look like. So I think this week will get a little bit better sense of who they're supposed to be and maybe where he actually adds in his development. George Kittle still not practicing, I believe. Elijah Mitchell is definitely not playing.

He's going to be out for kind of an extended period of time now. So that stuff is not helping Trey Lance. I mean, when we talk about who is Trey Lance going to be as a quarterback and what is their offense going to look like, a lot of that is predicated on having a really strong running game and a interesting and dynamic running game, which is what, you know, Kyle Shanahan is known for. And you don't have your number one running back. And then having George Kittle, who is, you know, one of the most reliable tight ends and also a monster. in the run game in terms of his blocking ability and you don't have that right now. I mean, I guess they haven't ruled him out yet,

but the fact that he wasn't practicing on Wednesday is and didn't play last week is not a great sign. But I just think this week we're going to get a much better accurate assessment of where Tray Lance is at right now. And I, not to spoil your picks too much, but go read Shield's picks against the spread. I think we both kind of think Seattle might be in for a bit of a letdown after their really big emotional win on Monday night.

So this could be a nice night for a nice afternoon for Tray Lance. This game was number two on my list. So we're on the same page, 49ers Seahawks. There's, you know, what you laid out, that's absolutely intriguing. I mean, every week with Lance is going to be sort of just an evaluation, a referendum. People are going to be making, drawing big conclusions. He hasn't played a lot of football. That wasn't fair.

You know, it wouldn't be fair to judge him on last week in those weather conditions. At the same time, this is why the, I think the 49ers is the most interesting team in the league because if you lose to the Seahawks at home and go 0 in two in two games that you were favored in. And Lance doesn't look good in the good weather. And Jimmy G's just sort of, you know, hanging out on the sideline there. I mean, it's not going to happen in like week three where they're going to make a quarterback change. But it is going to be a story. If you go 0 and 2 and Lance doesn't look good and you lose both those games, that's absolutely a big story.

So yes, I'm very interested to see what he does this week. And really, he's just one of the most intriguing guys for the entire season. I mean, could really swing the league one way or the other. If he's great, they're a Super Bowl contender. If he's not, holy cow, what do the 49ers do by the time week six or seven rolls around? And then you have the Seahawks part of it. I mean, Gino, can he do it again? Not to steal.

I know Stephen Ruiz will be on tomorrow with Ben Solek and Danny Hyphid. So I'm sure it'll be, you know, 35, 40 minutes on Gino Smith. But what does he have for an encore that Seahawks defense? I thought did not look good to me against the Broncos. I mean, you're not going to get those stops at the one yard line twice every week. And so I sort of feel like they can be had a little bit, come down, a little emotional letdown. But we will see. I'm not going to totally count them out.

And it is only week two. Week one's weird, but week two can be weird as well. Yeah, I want to see also if the Niners defense can just kind of play a cleaner game. I mean, we have really big, you know, high expectations for them. We've talked a lot about Domeko Ryan's and what we like about him as a coordinator. And it was just messy last week. And like, yes, it was weather conditions and stuff. But the defensive penalties and stuff, it just was very uncharacteristic for a unit that's usually really well coached.

So, yeah, I kind of want to see if that Nick Bosa, my defensive player, the year pick, can really mess stuff up for Gino Smith. Yeah, well, it was such a weird game. I mean, they were dominating and then all of a sudden fields makes the one play. And next thing you know, you look up and they're losing. So, yeah, I still have faith in them. I think they could give the Seahawks a tough time, but we will see. All right, I'm going to move on to my next one because I don't want to repeat the next one. Sometimes what you want gets drafted and you have to move down the board like a fantasy draft.

I'm excited about which team is going owe into the Cardinals or the Raiders. I mean, I look at these two teams and there's like a lot of under the radar juice to this game to me. I mean, the Cardinals looked like the most rudderless team in the NFL in week one. After that offseason that they had, they come in. Week 1. At one point, I think the Chiefs had 11 first downs and the Cardinals had zero. Just a massive coaching mismatch between Andy Reed and Cliff Kingsbury. Like, yeah, who could have predicted that after that offseason, the Cardinals would come out and look terrible in week one?

So if they go 0 and 2, they gave everyone an extension in the offseason. I don't love the offensive line. The defense to me is one of the least talented defenses in the NFL. You know, Isaiah Simmons, they still have no idea what to do with him. there on that defense. So I don't have high hopes for the Cardinals at the same time. I think they're five and a half point underdogs, which I was like, that's pretty big against the Raiders team that week one, they used, I think,

seven different offensive linemen, like by plan, not because of injury. They're just rotating guys in and trying to figure something out. Devante Adams was fantastic, but Derek Carr did not look comfortable. I mean, six sacks, three interceptions, two fumbles. And so that offense, it was very up and down. I mean, he was definitely pushing the ball down field. But man, if they go O and two in that division, if they get upset by the Cardinals, I know you cover Josh McDaniels, right?

Or was that not? I did. Yes. Yeah. I've got opinions about the Josh McDaniels era. But we could do a whole other podcast about that. Yeah. So, I mean, I'm interested in that because, I mean, I felt like I was on an island.

I think you were probably with me. So maybe I wasn't alone on an island, but being like, why is everyone convinced Josh McDaniels is going to be great at this? and he still might be, but you go down O and two, that's when all the non-Xs and O stuff starts mattering. You know, people are going, all right, we're O and two. This was supposed to be different. Our offensive line is an issue.

We didn't really address it in the off season. We have these shiny new toys with Devante Adams, and we have good pass catchers, but are we going to be able to have a good offense? How are we going to adjust? So just those two teams, whichever one goes O and two, all of a sudden, to me, the pressure is really on that team really early in the season.

Yeah, and I want to see kind of what their defense. plan is for Kyler Murray. My big questions about the Raiders going into this season were, well, one, what exactly would this offense look like? Who is Josh McDaniels going to be as a play caller and a head coach there with Derek Carr outside of New England? But it was

really kind of their defensive personnel. And, you know, they brought in Patrick Graham to be their new defensive coordinator. A lot to like about their past rushers, right? That duo of Max Crosby and Chandler Jones, who they brought in. Chandler Jones could be facing his old team, which that'll be an extra little like element of juice. But

neither Crosby or Jones was really that impactful last week against the Chargers. Chargers offensive line played great. Justin Herbert handled the pressure really well. They weren't really able to get any consistent pressure. Neither of them had any sacks. So I want to see if those guys can have a bigger impact on the game this week and what they do for kind of Kyler Murray's ability to escape the pocket and throw on the run and all of those different things that just, you know, are a little bit hard to game plan for. So that's a really fun game as well. That'll be fun.

All right, what do you have for number three? All right. I previewed this a little bit on Slow Newsday on Monday with Kevin Clark. We talked a little bit looking forward into week two. But I'm really looking forward to see Aaron Rogers just go off against the Bears. I think the Twitter content and memeability of that game is very, very high because, look, I think the bears last week beating the Niners. That was a nice little, like, feel-good story. We got to see them slip and slide and splash around in the rain, and that's great.

But I think that might end up being kind of the pinnacle of the bear. season. Whereas I don't want to panic too much about the Packers, at least their offense after last week, because if there's any game that Aaron Rogers is going to get up for, it's going to be playing the Bears on Sunday night

football. Look, their defense, some issues. I was very disappointed in their defense's performance last week. I think a lot of people were. I was higher on the Packers defense going to this season than you were. But I just think this is one of those classic like Aaron

Roger's F you, I'm just going to show you that I am the man and we're going to get something figured out. That does require his receivers to catch passes to when they push the ball down field to not let them go through your hands. That's something that's a little bit out of Aaron Rogers control. But I just have a feeling that he is just going to go off. And that is going to be a completely lopsided game on Sunday night football. His face after the Christian Watson job.

I mean, great job by whoever, you know, the camera, the producer. whoever gets credit for that, but just to zoom in on him and just looking, not even hiding it, just looking at Matt LaFleur, like, I told you, I don't know what the conversation was during the week. If he said, let's have someone else run this route. If he said, I don't trust this, that's the first play of the game. But there was some sort of, I told you so right there in his face. He was not hiding it at all.

So I'm with you. Yeah, I think I'm not as concerned about the Packers offense. I think their offense is going to be good. I don't think it's going to be like as efficient, as explosive as it's been in previous years. I think some of those issues that they're going to have are real. But the defense to me, you know, and I would expect them to bounce back against the bears. But that was a concerning performance by their defense against the Vikings. I mean, they have a lot of continuity in the secondary and they looked like they didn't,

they had never played together before. So yeah, I think the Packers will bounce back. But hey, if that's a close game, if they struggle a little bit, you know what? That'll be pretty fun for us also. that will be entertaining for us as well. The Twitter content in that case will be very high. All right. With my last one, I'm going to keep it very simple.

Sequin Barclay. I almost feel like his performance in week one did not get enough attention. And I did not have my eyes glued to that Giants Titans game. But man, just rewatching it. He really looked like he did when he first came into the league. Their offense was completely sputtering, you know, their first five possession, possessions, four punts and a fumble. and then he just breaks off that 68-yard run where he looked like he did again when he was in his first season in the NFL.

And I like these stories, you know, a guy who's really talented, who's really fun to watch, has had some injuries, hasn't had success. Like, I came into the season wondering it just might, you know, he just might never be the same guy that he was previously. And now we get that glimmer of hope that maybe he can be. He's only 25 years old, you know, so there is still, you know, I know he's a running back, but there should still be so much more football left. for him to play. I think the league's better. The Giants are more fun when Sequin Barclay is playing and breaking off those big plays. He really saved that game for them. If he doesn't break off that run, who knows what the final score is and what the conversation is about the Giants this week. So he's also a free agent, by the way, at the end of the season, which is sort of a sneaky,

fun one. If he just goes off this year and has like 1,700 yards from scrimmage, and we've all had the talks about, well, what are running backs really worth? When should you sign them? that will be an interesting test case just because of his upside and what he can do for an offense. So the Giants have the Panthers at home. It's not the most exciting game, but I am excited to watch Sequan Barkley. And I'll give a shout out to one other guy on sort of the defensive side of the ball, who I think is similar, watching that Eagles Lions film, Jeffrey Okuda, who again, this guy who high draft pick, sort of a forgotten guy, you wonder, will it ever happen for him?

He was outstanding in that game. It was really fun to see sticky man coverage against Devante. Smith for a lot of that game. And so if you're a Lions fan and you're wondering about corner, you probably are still wondering about corner and the defense overall. But having a Kuda there, if he can be a quality starter or maybe he has even, excuse me, maybe he has even higher upside than that. That is another guy.

I want to keep my eye on to see if he can build on what he did in week one. Well, and you and I have talked about this a little bit offline. And I know you guys did the pod where you did award winners predictions. Come back player of the year is just a really weird award. And in our staff predictions, you and I both went completely off the grid because, honestly, like the list of favorites, like the betting odds for that were really kind of grim. I picked Mitchell Trubisky because why the hell not? So when the Steelers won last week, I was like, all right, my picks alive.

You picked Alan Robinson because you just thought it was funny. He lit it up in week one. Yeah, no, not looking great. But so Sequin Barclay played in 13 games last year. So I don't think technically he would be, I don't know, would maybe qualify to be comeback player the year. But if he has like 1,500 yards this season or something, why not, right? Coming back from playing for Joe Judge. And, you know, he did have, you know, he missed a lot of time, obviously, before 2021. So maybe he could be on that mix and maybe Jeffrey Okuda. I mean, there isn't a clear,

there's not a big quarterback favorite, right, who's coming back from, you know, there's no Joe Burrow or Doc Prescott from the year before. So I think that award is wide open. It would be kind of fun to see a skill position guy get it. I'd be all for awarding someone comeback player of the year after just coming back from playing for Joe Judge for a year. I'm all in on that. I'll be honest. When I looked at, I couldn't believe he played 13 games last year.

Yeah. Like, I thought he was more injured. I thought he played like half the season. I was like, oh, he played 13 games last year, but certainly did not look like himself. He did look like himself here. All right. Before we get to the mailbag, I think you have a bonus draft selection to get to. So what is the final thing you're looking forward to here?

I do. So I basically, this, this has. happened really last year, but I've kind of started watching games based on who my now six-year-old daughter picks. And now I also edit your picks column. So I feel very invested in who's going to win these games and this who's going to be better at picking games, my six-year-old daughter or Sheel. Last week, I will say my daughter had a better week in week one. She's in first grade. You and I both have first graders. So we're very kind of like in this mode of like what are what do first graders know about math. And my daughter's very into math. We're not quite at point spreads yet,

but we're talking about it a little bit. So technically she's just picking winners. So she went eight and eight last week and picking winners. But if you had bet her side, she went 10 and 6, which that was a weird week. So 10 and 6 against the spread. So I'm looking at her picks this week. She picked them as winners. But if you, we'll see, you know, you guys had a lot of picks that overlapped this week, which I'm not sure if that's a bad sign for her or a good sign for you. We'll see. It's probably a bad sign for her, but I felt better about my picks after watching hers this week.

Everyone should watch her picks every week. I wish I could, I wish Fanduel could set up a way for me to like bet on Lena's picks to beat my picks, like bet against myself because that would be something that I would certainly do. Yes, I was six and ten last week. So I know what you're feeling, though. when I'm watching these games on Sunday, when your picks are out there for the world to see, and you're just going, oh, my gosh, this is a blood bath.

Like, I need both Sunday night and Monday night just not to finish 4 and 12. That's pretty much how I view Sunday. It's ruined my Sunday, so pretty much. She had the Giants last week. Like, I had no rooting interest in the Giants game. But then when Dave-Ball goes 4-2 at the end, and then they get it, I'm like, fist pumping. I'm like, Lino was right. I'm texting my husband's at work.

I'm texting my husband about these games. and how Lena's picks are doing. So if anybody at Fandall is listening or anybody at the Ringer, hello, we have a pitch for you for a new segment. Absolutely. Yeah, her picks are much more entertaining than my picks. I will much better content on her YouTube channel than with me. But I will say your picks column. Your picks column is great. It is online now at the Ringer. Make sure you go read it and bet with caution. Companion pieces, my column and Lena's video. All right, Let's get to the mailbag. You are in Denver.

So I think this is a good one for you to answer. This is from side tweet Sports 1. He says, is anyone in Denver concerned that it seems like so many of Russ's former teammates genuinely don't like it. Now, I covered the Seahawks for two years, so I'll give a little perspective. But I'm curious about just the conversation in Denver this week after that game, after the reaction from guys like Richard Sherman and Doug Baldwin, when and there were probably others on Twitter, like the second after the game ended.

What has the conversation been like in Denver this week? I mean, honestly, the way that game ended probably was good for, like, Russell's reputation because the discourse was, what the hell are you doing? Why are you not letting this guy have the ball? So much of the focus has been on Nathaniel Hackett and the decision making. So here's where I'm going to go with this. I think a lot, I mean, there are thousands and thousands of words written about what happened in Seattle. Greg Bishop, Sports Illustrated, did some incredible work. Seth Wickersham at ESP

in the magazine back, I think, in 2017 wrote a story that at the time everybody in Seattle was like, none of this is true. I can't believe you'd write that. And now it's all been vindicated. Literally when all of those Legion of Boom guys showed up for this game to like root against Russell, it was, and some of the offensive guys, some, you know, Doug Baldwin and some receivers were there as well. I think a lot of the heart of the issues in Seattle wasn't that they didn't like him personally. I don't think he was like super close with everybody and a lot of that I think is just kind of his personality a little bit that maybe he's not like one of the guys the way that like Peyton Manning necessarily was kind of always like one of the guys. A lot of it was the

treatment and the way that the relationships were like in that building and the way that Russell was treated by the organization and by Pete Carroll. So it wasn't so much that they like hated Russell. It was that the situation was really messed up. And the way that that Super Bowl ended against the Patriots was a huge issue. And then what happened after that? And then there were some financial decisions where it was very much, it seemed like that the organization was picking Russell over the defense. They weren't

able to keep a lot of that defensive core together. You know, Russell was maybe getting special treatment or was not getting the account, you know, wasn't being held accountable for his mistakes the way that other players were. So I think that was a lot of it. It wasn't so much that like, while they hate this guy. It was just that it was a pretty toxic, or it had to become a very toxic situation. So I'm going to look forward here to Denver right now in terms of like likability and like obviously Russell Wilson's personality and the like the let's ride and all that some of the cornyness

and that stuff has been a big thing. I will say the Broncos have spent the last five years with quarterbacks who everybody likes, who were good dudes and they were popular in the locker room and they were fun to have a beer with, but they couldn't play football very well. And when it came to actual, like, what you were bringing to the practice field, how you were leading meetings, what you were doing in the two-minute drill, how you were actually, you know, moving the offense, it was terrible. So I don't think they're that worried that, like, their quarterback isn't cool right now or that, and they're, I think they just want a guy who can win. And I think what they've seen so far is that Russell Wilson is giving them substantially better play and leadership and those sorts of things

than they have had at any point since Peyton Manning retired. So I don't think they're especially concerned that, like, Richard Sherman doesn't like him. And then I think the other part of that is that there's no question about whose team this is, right? There's no, like, weird organizational dynamics of, like, oh, they're taking resources away from us and we should be the focus point of this team. It's very clear from ownership on down, this is Russell Wilson's group right now, and he is going to be the leader. We are going to follow him. This is not like Legion of Boom versus, you know, there's none of that dynamic. So I think that helps. And it's, I think, kind of important to when we're considering that, you know, that stuff. We remember the

bigger context. Yeah. I feel like we could have done the whole episode on this. I have like 50 different thoughts floating around in my head for that, those Seattle years. So if there's any, you know, additional stuff, you want to bring in. Right. I got there the August after they lost that Super Bowl. And so it was an interesting time to sort of be there. All right. How is this team?

I'm just kind of popping in, you know, how are they going to react to this? I actually remember Richard Sherman once. I was asking him something about, I can't even remember what player was. It was a player who had off-field issues. And like, in my head, I was surprised that, like, players would have been okay with whoever it was being in their locker room or whatever. and he said very eloquently what most NFL players

who are secure, you know, not the ones fighting for a roster those who are on a roster and are just looking at their careers and have great careers like him, what they care about is can this guy help our team win? Like that's it.

He's like, we'll overlook stuff all the time. You don't have to be best friends. Can this player help our team win? And so that's like an interesting lens to look at the Russell Wilson stuff through because Wilson did help them win a lot of games, but there was just this battle about who deserved credit.

And, you know, was it really Russell Wilson who was doing all this? Or was it the defense? And why was Russell Wilson getting all that money? And why was Russell Wilson getting all the endorsements? And why was Russell Wilson getting all the attention when, you know, all the defensive players were so good? So I think there was always that battle. I don't think, you know, I think there were times where, yes, Pete Carroll, not holding Wilson accountable, contributed to it.

I also think there are times where Pete Carroll's culture of like just cutthroat, if you can't handle this like intense practice that we're going to have where guys are throwing punches at each other. And, you know, I'm going to interview people after a practice and they've got like a cut on their nose. And I'm just like, what is going on here? Like, if you can't handle that environment, then how can we count on you in the fourth quarter when we need to in a regular season game? Like, that's what Pete Carroll really believes. And so there was that tension between the offense and the defense for many years. And so I think Wilson and Denver, I think you nailed it. It's a different place. and they've been in QB purgatory,

and they have a guy who, you know, should be able to play, and they just paid him a lot of money. There's not going to be that tension. And then honestly, Wilson doesn't make it easy on himself. I mean, he's had a team around him since he entered the league. Everything is strategic. Everything is cultivated. Everything's orchestrated.

Stuff doesn't feel authentic, whether it's go hawks to let's ride, to him posting videos on social media to what he's wearing. I mean, you can take it in any number of different directions. I think you're right. I don't think Wilson is a bad guy. I don't think there are people who, like, you know, hate him personally or anything like that. I just think there probably aren't a lot of teammates that felt like they genuinely connected

with him, you know, on a day-to-day basis. And what do we hear all the time from players who retire? It's like, yeah, we miss that camaraderie. We miss the locker room. We miss being around the guys. And, like, I don't think that was a part of a lot of those Seahawks players in terms of their relationship with Russell Wilson. So there's a lot there to sort of unpack.

and I feel like I was rambling a little bit. But did you see Pete Carroll's radio quote? Let me read this for you. Yeah, read it to us. 710 in Seattle. And, you know, he was asked basically about the game and why it meant so much. And he said, I just wanted it.

I just wanted to win. I wanted to win for all the reasons that come along with this one. Maybe as much as anything is representing the guys that have played before. It meant a lot to those guys. I was so thrilled to be able to hug those guys up and see them and look them in the aisle. Then he was asked, why did it mean so much to them? And he said, you figure that out.

I feel like Pete Carroll, this is just like the best week of his life. He's won Super Bowl's national championships. But it's like kind of ignoring his role in like creating the toxicity and like the reason that these guys all just didn't get along. But yeah, great week in Seattle all goes back to kind of what we talked about earlier. I think it's setting up for like a tremendous letdown. in week two. What is the reunion for that Seahawks Super Bowl team going to be like? I mean,

does wrestling even go? Do you think everyone will be good at that time? Yeah, I don't know. I mean, it's going to be, it's just so blatant, you know, the bald wins and the Shermans, their reactions afterwards and how happy they were that it'll be, you know, time heals a lot of those things. Yeah, time will heal. Like, maybe the 10 year would be super awkward.

Like, maybe we don't do a 10 years next year. Oh, my gosh. What? Let's file that one away for some content, uh, content on. the ringer. 10-year anniversary is next year. That's incredible. Bring back Percy Harvin, Golden Tate. It'll be awesome. I can't, I can't wait. I'm shocked. If I don't feel old enough, it's 10 years next year since I can't believe that. Okay. All right. Next question. We actually had two that I think kind of, they're both about the Cowboys. So one is from Jake. He says,

considering the Cowboys had the worst offense in the NFL this week, just how low is their floor with Cooper rush and then Tony asked, what should Cowboys fans watch this season instead of the team? So I think those two kind of go together. What are your thoughts on both those questions? Okay. So I think the floor is pretty low. And we saw that last week. I mean, I think the thing that's gotten lost a little bit in the whole DAC press got up at all is how bad they were for 54 minutes last week, offensively, how kind of decimated their offensive rosters right now, how just kind of like bizarre the scheme is. Like it just doesn't seem like they have any answers, right?

And like, Doc Prescott is a quarterback who should give you answers, help you solve the problems when things are going wrong. And that wasn't happening. And, you know, I don't know if I don't have a lot of confidence that Mike McCarthy all of a sudden is going to like be the guy to scheme up something for Cooper Rush to make this work. And Kellyn Moore was a really hot coaching candidate last year, two years ago. I mean, it was not very long ago. And now of a sudden it's like, what are they doing that's interesting?

How are you maximizing the talent that you have? And there's two problems, right? It's that there's been a major talent drain there for, you know, contractual reasons. And they haven't really drafted and developed well there yet to kind of replace the guys who have left. And that's a Jerry Jones issue. That's a Jerry and Stephen Jones issue. And then I think there's kind of just like a coaching issue right there. So I think their floor is pretty low.

And I'm afraid that they're going to like ruin. or waste, not ruin, maybe waste is a better word, a spectacular year of Michael Parsons performance by, you know, they're going to be counting on basically Michael Parsons and that defense to win a lot of games like 13 to 10 or, you know, to close out games, get, they're going to be really reliant on turnovers again, just like they were last year. And that's really hard to depend on week to week to week. I think Parsons is going to be spectacular. But if this is a team that is not that competitive. It's going to be hard for him to kind of get the individual accolades that maybe he's going

to deserve. So I will say instead, so we go to the second part of that question, what to watch. When the game is on, just watch Michael Parsons. I mean, that is, that is, offense comes on. If you want to, like, go get a beer, go check on your kids, whatever it is you need to do, come back, watch Michael Parsons when they're on defense. He is that special. He is a one-of-one kind of generational type of defensive talent.

So that should keep you interested. In terms of other stuff to watch, I think on Sunday, the WNBA finals is going to be wrapping up. I think game three. So I would watch that. Becky Hammond is awesome. The Las Vegas Aces are awesome. They have a chance to win that game. So maybe flip over, I need to check and see if the timing is exactly right.

But then sometimes once the WNB players, WNBA playoffs are over, ESF fans show some really weird shit on Sundays. They show like Corgi Racing and Cornhole. I don't know, like there's good barbecue to eat, like get out, mow your lawn, play with your kids, anything other than Cooper Rush. Yeah, I was going to go completely off the board and just say Indian matchmaking. I mean, I don't know how many, I don't know if you are tuned into that or if our audience is tuned into that. I'm about to lobby for the ringer to give me my own podcast just to break this show down because the second season just wrapped up.

And I am highly, you know, maybe because I'm sort of in adjacent to that. world know a little about it, but I found it highly entertaining. That was a big hit in the Kapadia household. Ben Solac was looking up like rotten tomatoes and reviews. And listen, you don't need to look at that. You just need to listen to my opinion. So if Cooper Rush is out there, if they're struggling, I think that would be a good option on Netflix. And then, yeah, go ahead. I was going to say, I would say the ringer has like a ton of like pop culture content. So House of Dragons. Yeah. If you need to catch up on succession, they just want some big Emmys. Like there's a lot of other stuff. Can I, before you fit.

it shares. Our producer, Mike just jumped in and said the WOM finals might be over by Sunday. Game four is scheduled for Sunday. So if it goes to game four, make sure you watch that on Sunday. There you go. In terms of their floor, I talked about this a little earlier in the week. I just feel like this is the worst case scenario for the Cowboys because they don't have an infrastructure around a guy like Cooper Rush for him to succeed. If this were two years ago and you had Amari Cooper and Michael Gallup and a great offensive line, then yeah, you could talk yourself into just kind of tread water for six weeks or whatever it's going to be. Dak comes back.

The NFC isn't very good. Maybe you still have a shot at it. That's not this team. You mentioned it. The offense looked terrible with Dak Prescott. They don't have Tyrant Smith. They lost another starter in Connor McGovern. They don't have good wide receivers other than C.D.

Lamon. So I think it's just really going to be tough for that offense. Meanwhile, Dak Prescott's eventually going to come back. So you're probably not looking at like a top five pick. And maybe the worst thing, which I've mentioned, Mike McCarthy, sales, he can go to Jerry Jones at the end of the season.

You can't fight. You can't even think about firing me. I didn't have Dak Prescott for six to eight weeks. And I know Jerry Jones has thought of as this like impulsive owner, Jason Garrett coached nine and a half years in Dallas. You know, that might have been eight and a half years too long. I don't know. I don't remember what they did in year one.

But we were having those conversations, you know, they had the back to back to back eight and eight seasons and he stuck with him. And so he actually has been pretty patient. If he likes the head coach personally, I feel like, which I think he might with Mike McCone. then he's more likely to stick with that guy. So if you're a Cowboys fan, you're not going to get a great draft pick. You're probably not going to be in the playoffs.

You're not going to have a coaching change in the offseason. And you're just going to come back and run it back in 20, 23. It really, to me, is the worst case scenario if you are a, if you are a Cowboys fan. So, yeah, I think they're going to be tough to watch. Although I'm with you on Parsons. He just picked up right where he left off. And he was my pick for defensive player of the year. So maybe just watch those highlights at the end.

You don't have to watch him on every snap, but get excited because he's going to be there for a while. And the last thing is, they got draft Dak Prescott, you know, later in the draft. They got Michael Parsons. You mentioned it, generational defensive player. They got Trayvon Diggs. And it's like, this is where they are. I mean, it's such a, it just feels like a bummer for if you're a Cowboys fan that you kind of wasted all those things. And you have like nothing to show for it at all. And the future right now doesn't feel that right. Last question, let's get to this one. Bill, this is from Steve says Bill Belichick always gets recognized. as the NFL coach least willing to give reporters answers, but do Tomlinisms, Mike Tomlinisms,

actually give less answers while making reporters still like him? He said this week's Tomlinism might be my new all-time favorite. Tomlin asked to define a dominant defense said, I want them to be what we need them to be whenever we need them to be it. And that was it. And then the unit gave them exactly that. So you are a veteran with the coaching press conferences and observing these types of things?

What do you think? Does Tomlin not get enough credit? Gets too much credit. Is he really doing the same thing as Bill Belichick is doing in a more crafty way? How do you see that one? They are very different, but they are both extremely skilled at kind of saying nothing.

So Bill Belichick is just kind of gruff, right? His demeanor is he doesn't generally doesn't like go long on topics. Like he doesn't give you these really detailed answers about stuff that he doesn't want to talk about, unless you want to start asking him about, like, special teams theory or football history. And then it's incredible. It'll be like these, you know, 15-minute answers

that goes really, really in depth into, like, the history of a free kick. And it's incredible. And it typically happens on Fridays. That's when his press conferences actually get interesting. What Tomlin does, if there's a question that he doesn't really want to answer to or he doesn't want to give something specific, is he just rambles.

and he just talks and talks and talks and talks. And you get to the end of it and you're like, there was literally nothing usable in that. Like, he just talked. And kind of pulling back the, like, media curtain or whatever. Tomlin does things a little differently, which from a pro football writers of America standpoint can sometimes be a little bit challenging

because they take the league media policy and kind of do with it as they choose. Hi, Bert, Lawton, if you're listening, the Steelers PR guy. But he kind of gets away with it because he does give them their reporters there are pretty extensive time. So what he typically does is he talks on Tuesday

instead of talking on Monday and then he doesn't talk again until later in the week. But what he does is like he basically filibusters. He'll sit down at a table and he'll talk for like 15 straight minutes without taking a question where he goes into stuff from the last game and then he starts going into his next opponent and he'll

basically go like, he'll go through like 22 guys on the upcoming opponent and he'll just be like, oh, and they've got this cornerback and he's from the University of Central Florida and you know, a really strong guy and blah, blah, blah, you know, and he just talks. And you're at the end and you're like, what, what came out of this? But the Tomlinisms are pretty fantastic,

where he just will say these kind of little nuggets in there. So I would say that he's right in there. I was looking back to some of the best, like, Tomlinisms. And some of his things are like, not necessarily cliches, but he likes to use all of these kind of phrases, like one man's misfortune is another man's opportunity. He talks about blades of grass and he's got to keep the dogs off you. And that team, that opposing defense, they got some goons.

He likes to say things like, when I ring the bell, they better answer. He likes to talk about pressure that burst pipes. So it's stuff where you're like, what exactly did that mean? Is that telling me anything? But it all sounds good when it comes out, whereas Bill Belichick will just be like, next question. I don't want to answer that.

Tomlin was asked this week. I'm seeing this now. He told me he was asked about Jalen Warren in their opener. And his answer was, you know, he didn't urinate down his leg. So come on, you're not getting that from Bill Belichick. That's great. Yeah, that's pretty good. I do, you know, Tomlin had a great interview in the offseason on the pivot podcast.

I don't know if you listened to that one where it was just like a revelation where he was explaining coaching in such clear terms that I just had like this newfound appreciation for him. And so he might be different in the press conference setting. But I actually was thinking about Tomlin last night. We had a back to school night here for the kids. And I'm sitting in a fifth grade classroom. And I don't, I'm sure you're much more mature in these settings than I am. I'm basically thinking of jokes the entire time, like either to, you know, mutter them to my wife, whisper them to my wife so that she can give me an eye roll an annoyed look or to be like, oh, you know, save this for later. This is something I want to talk about. And my daughter's fifth

grade teacher was explaining her great teaching philosophy. She said, I want, you know, basically, I want my goal, number one goal is for everyone to feel comfortable in this classroom all year. It's fifth grade. They got to go to middle school next year. Like, this can be a challenging year. I want everyone to feel comfortable. And all I could think of was Mike Tomlin in my head saying, we do not seek comfort. And I'm just thinking, if I raise my hand and said, you know, reference that. You know, Mike Tomlin says we should not seek comfort or just mention it to my, mention it to my wife afterwards. She did not find it that amusing.

It was happy. I did not bring it up in time. But yeah, Tomlin's in my head. So the Tomlinism's work. And I think, you know, probably in those non-press conference settings, he's probably just a great guy to talk to and understand he probably just at this point. Yeah. He just has a strategy for how to.

approach those. So, okay, I think we got through all the mailback questions. I've got one more Bill Belichick press conferences as you're like following along. The more nice things he says about a player, the more you know that he actually thinks that guy is trash. So keep that in mind when you're reading stuff and hearing stuff about not his own players, but about opposing players. That's the other like Bill Belichickism. So if he like talks about This week, they're playing the Steelers. Let's go back and see what he actually said about Mitchell Trubisky. And if he was overly praising Mitchell Trubisky, we know what Bill Belichick actually thinks.

There you go. Absolutely. All right. That will wrap it up for this edition of the Ringer NFL show. Thanks to Lindsay Jones for joining me. Thank you to Mike Wargon for producing. We will have Danny Heifitz, Ben Solac, and Stephen Ruiz with their week to preview coming up. So stay tuned for that on the next episode of the Ringer.

NFL show additional production supervision from connor nevins and arjuna romgapal we'll talk to you soon