The Ringer NFL Show - Ep. 83: Free-Agency Reactions

Episode Date: March 9, 2017

The Ringer's Robert Mays, Kevin Clark, and Danny Kelly discuss DeSean Jackson and Tampa Bay (01:50), Brandon Marshall going to the NY Giants (04:00), the 49ers signing Kyle Juszczyk (8:10), Mike Glennon becoming a Chicago Bear (14:00), Calais Campbell's future (28:50), and Matt Kalil's massive contract (37:45). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The Ringer's gaming podcast, achievement-oriented, and our wrestling podcast, The Mass Man Show, are breaking off of Channel 33. You can now subscribe to each of them on iTunes, Stitcher, SoundCloud, or wherever you get your podcasts. To The Ringer NFL show. My name is Robert Mays. I'm a writer at The Ringer.

And joining me on two other lines are Kevin Clark and Danny Kelly. Guys, what's going on? I don't know. We just went through about a 15-minute period where it seemed that Jay Cutler was going to go to the Jets and they were the best moments of my life. I don't know if it's going to happen. I don't know if it's going to happen, but I just,

entertaining the idea of it is just a phenomenal experience for me. So letting people behind the curtain here, it's about 2.18 p.m. Eastern time on Thursday. Shit is happening. A lot of shit has happened in the past 24 hours, but that doesn't preclude it from happening when we're recording. I couldn't get all 32 GMs on the phone and tell them not to make deals over the next 45 minutes. So this is some real-time stuff,

and we're going to do our best to make. sense of the first day of free agency. I don't even know if we can hit everything in the next 45. We're going to hit the stuff that we like, the stuff that we didn't. But there's a lot of things happening right now. We're going to be back tomorrow to help tie up some loose ends because there's really just no way we can get to everything. I'm actually not going to be back tomorrow. I've signed a $40 million deal with the Jaguars. I'm really proud of you, buddy. Yeah, it took that. All right. So, they missed on Buoy and they just, they panicked. So let's just try to get our arms around this. I wanted to start by asking both of you, you know, let's start a positive note,

something you've liked over the past 24 hours, a deal that you think just makes sense for player, for situation, for money. Kevin, let's start with you. But what's the one where you're sitting here saying, yeah, I'm into that. So we don't know the final figures. It's not signed just yet, but it's going to happen. It's Deshawn Jackson to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. It's going to be about $10 or $11 million a year, if you believe, the annual value figures at this point.

Deshawn Jackson, I was amazed as Deshawn became a free agent, looking at some of the splits, looking at some of the advanced stats. He made Kurt Cousins deep game work. And now you put in with James Winston, I understand that James has had problems going down the field. But I think that Deshawn Jackson is the rare commodity that actually can manufacture a deep game. And I can't wait to see him with Mike Evans. I can't wait to see if they invest. You know, you joke yesterday, Mayes, but O.J. Howard did the Bucks know with him? If they've got a ton of weapons like that on the Buccaneers' offense, I am ready, Robert Mays.

After years of you threatening it, I'm ready to say that they're going to actually make the playoffs. I love it. I mean, I think that it all makes sense. And I actually talked with Lombardi about this on our last show. If you're the Bucks, Jackson makes a lot of sense in terms of how you're spending resources because their offensive line isn't very good, but they've also put a lot into it recently. you know, what's his name? Your buddy from Seattle, Danny. J.R. Sweezy.

Oh, yeah. They paid J.R. Sweezy last year. He didn't play. So they spent some money on him. They've drafted a couple guys in the second round. You know, they have a lot of stuff invested into that offensive line. So the only spots where they can really chase some resources

is in that skill position player set. And the idea of Deshawn Jackson and Mike Evans across from each other is beautiful. They do different things. They can really push it. and then I know that the OJ Howard thing is far away, but it was fun last night even considering it. Yeah, I'd say.

And also, by the way, the Buccaneers will have a really good opportunity. There are so many fast playmakers in the first round this year, even in the second round. I mean, hell, even if O.J. Howard's not in the mix, draft Christian McCaffrey. I mean, there are going to be so many playmakers in the first two rounds of this draft. Danny, what about you? What's the one that's jumped out to you so far?

I think, I like the Brandon Marshall move with the Giants. I think it's first of all they got him for a steal because I think he wanted to stay in New York you know to keep doing what he's doing and so I think it's like two years 11 million I mean that's a pretty damn good price for a guy who's you know one season off of like a huge year with over a thousand yards and a double-digit touchdown so I mean this is one of the top touchdown makers in the league in the last you know five or six years you know he's still as far as I'm concerned, he still got it. I mean, watching him last year at times,

it was a pretty dysfunctional scenario in New York, but there was a really great battle between him and Richard Sherman. I can't remember what week it was, but when they played the Seahawks, he had two touchdowns. It was really fun to watch him go up against, you know, one of the top corners in the league. I still think he's, you know, a really, really good player. And I think putting him on that Giants offense is huge

because sort of similar to the Buccaneers, like getting someone opposite O'Dout Beckham, someone actually like, you know, a big time threat that defenses have to pay attention to, I think that's going to be huge for them. And their offense was terrible last year outside of what Beckham was able to do. So to me, that's, it's kind of an underrated move. And Brandon Marshall's moved around so much I think people are kind of just like whatever with him nowadays. But I still think he's, you know, a top tier receiver.

I agree with that. I think a lot of times we look at these deals and we want to find the young guy on the Ascent, who's 26 and hit free agency early. and, you know, took a team-friendly deal and it's going to be a great piece. But I think sometimes the deals that really matter are a team like the Giants who get a guy at the end of his career for almost nothing. I mean, that's a really below-market deal for a guy like Brandon Marshall. And so I think that that's, I think, you know, we're sitting here, analyzing everything

in a vacuum. I think come January, we're going to realize the Marshall deal was much bigger than it was today. I totally agree. And I think that with a Marshall deal, you want to give those end-of-career below-market deals to guys when you're a couple pieces. when you're a couple of tweaks from getting where you want to go. The Giants are a playoff team last year. The best defense is in football, you need to just get incrementally better on offense.

And Marshall does that for you. That offense was so inconsistent last year, a ton of three-in-outs, couldn't really sustain much. Marshall's a sustainer. He's a chains-moving guy that can just post up one yard past the marker and get you first downs. And with a dude that's built like him and plays like him, age isn't going to take its toll in the same way. as it is for a guy who's a speedster

who relies on getting open. Brandon Marshall's never open. It doesn't matter, though. You just throw them the ball. So I think that it makes a ton of sense. It's a really good one, Danny. And let's just overall. Just one thing.

I just want to say one thing about Marshall, and that's that we know he's not going to go on a boat with the rest of the receivers. He's going to be taping like five TV shows at once. No time for boats. No free time. You know where Brandon Marshall is these days, which I guess is a good thing.

So in fact, you guys, both mentioned receivers, I feel like, is telling about what's, happened so far. In the last 24 hours, that's the position that the run, they just went. And there are a lot of interesting names and a lot of interesting deals. We talked about Marshall, talked about Sean Jackson, but there's a bunch of other guys in play here. I think the first guy to go off the board was Pierre Garsohn. And I love Pierre Garsohn, but for the money they had to spend to get him, it's not as if he's a complimentary piece. And I feel like that's kind of what's

happened with this entire market. Garsohn's making what he's making. The fact that Robert Wood's got that deal from the Rams. Kenny Brick got a ton of money from Cleveland, $8 million a year. Kenny Stills in Miami. The market was robust in the way I thought it might be. You wrote about this like last week, right? Like how there's so much money that's going to saturate the free agent market that everyone is going to, it's going to feel like everyone's getting overpaid. Totally. And the 49ers especially, I think it's like the money's burning a hole in their pocket or whatever because they're going out and spending it. They're spending a lot on, I mean, they gave Kyle Eustech the fullback, I think, a pretty damn good deal, too.

So it's like a right tackle contract. They gave Malcolm Smith a lot of money. Yeah. So, I mean, I can understand where they're coming from. They had like 80-something million. 13 million guaranteed for Malcolm Smith. Who was going to give him like a lot? That seems like a lot.

The Malcolm Smith deal I don't necessarily understand. The Kyle Eustech deal, I feel is kind of fascinating. I mean, the idea that they're going to give him that much. How much does he need to be involved in the offense? to warrant that contract. I mean, they're going to have to throw it to him a bunch. And it wouldn't surprise me if they did. It still is just a weird deal when you look at it on paper.

Especially when you think about like the competition involved with getting a guy like you check, like how many teams even use fullbacks these days? Yeah. So I don't know. It's interesting in the fact that they're just, they're spending so much money. You start to question like where the competition is coming from. Are they overpaying? But at the same time, it's definitely kind of.

fun to picture what they're building because we saw what Shanahan was able to do not only last year but a couple years ago with Hoyer in Cleveland and kind of make chicken salad out of chicken shit like there's some interest I just think it's kind of fascinating to watch what they're doing I don't necessarily have high hopes for it but it wouldn't be like the weirdest thing in the world if it kind of does work in year one especially now that they have you know an answer at quarterback I thought it was fascinating I think there were some things going around today about how interesting it was that Kyle Shanahan chose Jusak over Patrick DeMarco, who he knows. And I think it actually shows, and I think Tim, Tim Kawakami made this point out also.

It shows that Shanahan isn't just going to try to replicate Atlanta in San Francisco. And I think a lot of times young coaches try to do that. You know, Nick Saban did that in Miami and it was a disaster. He just took a bunch of guys that he had recruited or that had played for him or that he's. played against, and it really showed sort of insecurity about the talent pool in the NFL. And Shish, yeah, and Shanahan is going out and getting guys he's not familiar with, which I think is an interesting little plus. Before we get back to the rest of the madness, I want to talk to you guys about podcasts.

All this month, we're asking you to tell a friend about a podcast they'll love. Right now, think of a friend, your mom, anyone you care about. What podcast is what they really love? Got it? Now do it. Tell them about it in real life or on social media. And if they don't know about how to use podcasts, show them. Tell us what you recommend with the hashtag Tripod, T-R-Y-P-O-D.

Thanks for spreading the word. I'm going to swing back around just the entire wide receiving group for a second. I want to kind of parse it more than we did the first time around. So if you're looking at these deals, Deshaun Jackson gets north of 10 million. It's going to be an eight-digit contract per year. And what I wrote in what I might think today about Spain, is just the idea of spending for a specific skill set. And I think that Deshaun Jackson's a better player than Kenny Stills.

But would you rather have Deshawn Jackson at $11 million, who's 30? Or would you rather have Kenny Stills for $8 million who's $24? And I feel like that's kind of the question we're asking. And then even further down that line, the Eagles get Tori Smith for three years, $15 million. So of all these deals, which of them on a value level do you guys like the best? Danny? Oh man Value is so hard to figure out

I think I like the Deshawn Jackson deal the most I think even though it's probably It's the most expensive right I still like it the most Just because I think he's a game changing talent More than those other two guys And I mean obviously like with value

It's a little bit subjective And there's different ways of looking at it But like I think I mean he has a chance to really change the entire complexion of that offense. And so I just really kind of like that one the most. It just in my gut, like that one seems to me the most exciting. And I think most valuable, ultimately.

Do you feel the same way, Kevin? Yeah, absolutely. I love the Deshawn Jackson deal. I love it. I just think it's really good. You know, look, I like Kenny Stoll's a lot in the way that he functions in that Dolphins' offense. I like the Dolphins' offense a little more than most people do.

I think Jarvis Landry is really, really good. And I know that he's a bit of a divisive topic and, you know, NFL Twitter in those circles. Yeah. I get all my evaluation. I don't get that, by the way. I seriously don't get that. I don't know. If I'm looking at the Dolphins offense right now,

I wrote this a couple weeks ago, I think that they have a chance to be one of the best offenses in the league. Yeah. If Tanna Hill can kind of gate it a little bit in a year two under Gase. I think Gays is one of the best offence. And if he doesn't break his leg or whatever the hell he did in December. I mean, they were on the up swing.

Look at the skill position players on that team. You have, and I know the line needs some work, but you move tonsil out, you maybe try to draft a guard, you figure something out there. You have Kenny Stills, Jarvis Landry, a J. Ijaii. Their number, uh, freaking Devante Parker is the most talented guy of all of them.

And now they have Julius Thomas, for which, for whatever you think of Julius Thomas, Adam Gase is the guy that got the most out of him once, once upon a time. That is a serious collection of dudes. And I, I like the Kenny Stills contract. I love it. I was arguing about it with Barnwell yesterday. But for essentially a two and a half year deal for Kenny Stills, who's 24, and absolutely is a talent at $8 million in this market,

I don't hate it. But that's why I kind of like the Tori Smith contract even more. I can't wait. $5 million a year for Tori Smith is pretty damn good. I have a feeling that the Dolphins or this year someone in June is going to say they're going to win the Super Bowl, and then we have to have a huge backlash to that. Like that's going to be it.

Like somewhere in June, someone's going to be like, the Dolphins are my Super Bowl pick, and then they're just going to be a massive backlash, and then all of a sudden they're going to be underrated again. For the Tori Smith one, how shitty does he have to feel? Because right now, the 49ers are driving up the price of every single person on the free agent market, except for him because he basically spent two years, or how many seasons? Two years in San Francisco in passing game.

Wasting away. Yeah. So they basically ruined his value on the free agent market, but they're making everyone else better. It's like, how bitter would you be right now? The guy I just have to salute is Robert Woods. Robert Woods gets a $40 million deal, 15 guaranteed, still pretty good. Like about what Kenny Stills and Kenny Brick got. He goes from Buffalo, New York to Los Angeles, where he went to college.

I mean, well done. Well done for you, Robert Woods. Extremely proud. Maze, you keep asking about our favorite deals. My favorite deal is anyone who got an undeserved shit ton of money. Does Mike Glennon fall into that category for you? Absolutely. Cut the check.

So here's essentially my feature. feelings on on glennon there was this weird thing that went around oh well starting quarterbacks cost 14 million dollars i don't understand why everyone is so upset this is what the market has well you don't need to get a free agent quarterback you don't need to sign the darling of the off season who has been who hasn't thrown a pass a meaningful pass in three years um who by the way wasn't even that great when he was i mean people were saying oh look at cars and wince's numbers versus Mike Glennon's numbers. First of all,

Glennon has been on the bench for three years. Second of all, he lost his job to him a count, did he not? At one point? That's a disqualifier for me. I'm not put a lot of credence into that because that's a Lovey Smith.

We need a veteran bullshit thing. Yeah, okay, but it doesn't matter. My point is, I think you could get, I would much rather have seen the Bears and I understand John Fox trying to save his job. I understand that Ryan Pace is trying to make an impact

and whatever. I would have much rather than just sort of get a bargain basement guy, we're even bring back Brian Hoyer for Christ's sake, draft the guys. That was my thought. And go, go, go, go three and 13 again. I would much rather go that. You can't do that, though. Then you get fired. I mean, that's the problem. John Fox gets fired. So does Ryan Pace. I don't know about that. If they go three and 13 again, Ryan Pace is on the street. 100%. You can't, that's why I understand it. If it were up to me, I think it's only $19 million guaranteed. So they can get rid of him. They can get rid of him in a year. I just, I just think for this year,

I would have much rather them to go bargain basement, not even gone after a guy like this, and then just basically tanked. Of course, but you can't do that. And that's the problem. In my perfect world, they sign Hoyer to that two-year, $12 million contract. He comes back.

You get some sort of continuity. He was actually pretty good last season. Try to figure out with Alshan and see if you can get him back in the fold. I like the line. That offense has a chance to be solid. We've talked about the defense. They bring in Quentin Demps. If they go get a big time corner,

I think they have a chance to be really good. That's a real football team. but if it doesn't go very well, then Brian Hoyer is the definition of we are running in place. And when you've won nine games in two years if you're John Fox, or 14 games in three years if you're Ryan Pace, you have to show ownership that you're trying to go somewhere. And that's what Mike Lennon is.

You're paying a premium to do that, but at least you're getting a quarterback option without a defined ceiling. It may be defined after this year, but right now, Mike Lennon has a chance to be more than Brian Hoyer was. And that's why they made the move. They have to do something to show their moving forward. And because it's a one-year contract,

and because his average salary yearly, is the third lowest in the league among starters that are on their second deal. It is a bargain basement contract. But you don't have to have a starter on your second deal is what I'm saying. Well, you could just pick the quarterback. But that's the thing. If, say you love the quarterbacks. Say you love Watson.

And somebody picks him at one or two, and then you don't love him anymore. If you love one of these guys and he's their, at three, take them. Take them. Yeah, you're going to get one because the Browns are going to, the Browns are going to draft Miles Garrett. And if they don't, that's malpractice. And then you get Miles Garrett and that's phenomenal, okay? But what I'm saying is that you're going to get either Watson or Trubisky, if you hate one of those quarterbacks, I understand this move. But I think that-

Or if you hate both of them. I mean, it makes sense to me that you're just kind of, you're putting yourself in a position to not just be left standing when the music stops. I'll tell you what I'll get you fired a lot more than Tanking going three and 13 is signing Mike Glennon and going three and 13. But it's not a risky deal. It's a one-year contract. I understand that. What I'm saying is they're clearly trying to win seven or eight games this year.

And I don't even know if Glennon guarantees you that is what I'm saying. But you have to try to do that. We can't all be the Browns and just say we're going to be bad every year. I mean, that's just not how it's going to go for most teams and most ownership groups. I just envisioned Paul Dupidesis just announcing every spring. Okay, we're going to be bad again, guys. They essentially do that. I know, I know that's what you're saying.

I'm just laughing at just the vision of them saying, guys, it's sorry, next year. Maybe. It's just one of those things. I just wrote about it. It'll go up later today about the Glennon thing. It's not exciting. No one is happy about this. I know one person who's happy about it.

How we got to this place. Mike Glennon is happy about it. Yeah, that's true. Mike Glennon's doing fucking backflips. Danny, do you have any parting thoughts about this before we move on? I'm just like looking at. What has happened in Chicago with the quarterback situation? And I'm just thinking to myself, like, everyone who's ever complained about their starter quality top 10 quarterback just should feel really bad right now about themselves.

Because, I mean, you're going from Jay Cutler or Brian Hoyer, like, those are the two options you have. Like, re-sign Brian Hoyer or whatever is hang on to Cutler. And then your third option is Mike Glennon. It's like, to me, it's like at most, it's like a horizontal move or whatever. It's just something. It's different. It's just another bridge guy, but like, to me, it's just like, man, it's so hard to find a good quarterback. I don't know what the bears were going to do to do any better than Glennon.

They certainly could probably have done worse. I don't think it's a very unexciting signing, but I don't think it's like the worst thing in the world either. So it's just kind of one of those things. I feel the exact same way. I mean, when you look at it, yeah, the jokes, $45 million from Mike Leonard are funny. It's a one-year contract. It's a one-year fucking contract. But the Brock Wasweiler is going to make 18.

million dollars this year and he got paid last year. I'm cool with it. I'm okay with what happened. Better than the alternative. No, it's excited. But I get where we, where we are and where we are is a team without one of those big time quarterbacks. And when you are one of those, these are the type of things that have to happen, unfortunately. Right. You can't wait to see John Fox's work as magic. Yeah, John Fox, renowned quarterback developer. Doyle Loggins. All right, let's move on. I don't want to talk about this anymore. One of the other spots. It went Tennessee, Cleveland, Chicago. What a career path for the band's office coordinator.

Did I, like, wrong you at some point recently? No, we had a great week last week. I want to have a phenomenal time. I probably should have talked about this when we were talking about the receivers, but the Cook's trade is still on the table, apparently. You know, we've heard a bunch of stuff about where he could go, you know, everything else. So New England offering 32 for him to me is fascinating. I think that if you're the Patriots, you should be trying to do that.

But now we're hearing a little bit, even more creativity coming out here. So New England apparently is looking at maybe trading Malcolm Butler for Brandon Cooks, which can you, is that the most interesting player for player trades since like Champ Bailey for Clinton Portis? What about Jonathan Baldwin for AJ Jenkins? Oh, yeah, that was a great one. That was the best training. It goes out in the NFL war. I remember where I was when that happened.

Yeah. Yeah, who could forget. I just want to say one thing very quickly before we get into the nitty-gritty of this deal, and that is that something interesting has happened in the last year or so, even though it should have happened before, which is that when I hear that Belichick wants to trade for someone,

they become, in my mind, the best player in the NFL. Like, Stefan Gilmore. Even Shane McClellan? Well, no, Stefan Gilmore. like nine hours ago, I was like, who the hell is going to sign Stefan Gilmore?

And now they sign him for 14 million. And I think Stefan Gilmore is a future Hall of Famer. I'm very upset. My team missed out on him. Yeah,

no. But it's just funny him makes me sad. Even hinting, and that's what's happening with Cooks right now, even hinting that he's interested, it makes me believe

that the player is about 50 times better than he actually is. I now think because Malcolm Butler is involved in this trade, that Malcolm Butler is like the worst player in the NFL. Well, what they're doing is,

and they're trying to avoid giving Malcolm Butler a huge contract. I mean, that's what's going on here. And you get cooks for cheap for two years. And it just makes so much more sense to me than going out and getting somebody. Right now, still, if I'm Tennessee, I'm handing them the number 18 pick and I'm going home. I just don't think that I think it's worth it when you consider what all these guys are getting.

When Kenny Britt and Robert Woods are getting $8 million a year and you can get cooks for two next year, it's hard not to say yes to that, even for a first round pick. I agree with that. Based on the fact that they're reportedly signing Stefan Gilmore, too, like it seems like it's going to happen. I really like it.

Yeah. I mean, I absolutely, I like it a lot. It's going to be interesting to see what they do at corner and just independent of that. So it would be Gilmore Row and that you'd assume if they give Gilmore that deal, then Logan Ryan might not be back. So then you got a little,

get a little bit more creative as to who that third corner is. Yeah. The speculation was that the reason they're doing all this is that Logan Ryan came back to them with his offer and that they just sort of, they moved on. They realize that Logan. He's going to make a lot of money. Yeah, that's the problem. Yeah, they have a ton of cap space, which is not, it's newish for them.

They don't usually have this much money to work with. They're always shrewd, but they're not flush. And that's what they are now. They have a lot of flexibility. That's everybody. Everybody except like the Vikings. Yeah, that's true. Data Hightower, they said he may be back.

You know, he went and surveyed the market, wasn't thrilled. He's a guy that they could bring back. I wouldn't be surprised if Herman came back because that allows you to have a little more flexibility if you lose one of those corners, just different ways you can use him. So what the Patriots do is going to be interesting. And another part of that is

the Dwayne Allen trade is fascinating. I mean, he's another one of those guys. As soon as they trade for him, it's like, oh, well, I guess Dwayne Allen's good. Well, they're buying low because he's had two pretty crappy years. He's been hurt. I mean, that's the concern.

Right. But they have liked them, you know, according to different reports, and they've liked him for a couple of years now. So to me, that feels like a, this is like a perfect buy-low situation

and hope he turns into something good. I mean, they're not giving up a lot. It's like they give him a fourth-round pick and they get a six-round pick and the player back. So, I mean,

it's kind of just like they're, you know, sticking a flyer on the guy. If it came out like five minutes after the Super Bowl that Belichick was thinking of trading Tom Brady, I would have been convinced that Brady sucked. Like, You go like in the end zone while they were celebrating.

If someone was like Belichick once trade, but Brady sucks. Get him at Belichick. I trust Belichick. So, Schefter just reported about five minutes ago. Kevin Zeitler is signing with Cleveland for the highest, the biggest guard contract in NFL history.

Oh my God. Cleveland's a big deal for you. Big deal for Robert Mays. Could you imagine if they had kept Mitchell Schwartz? From left to right, it would be Joe Thomas, Joel Betonio, J.C. Tredder, who they just signed and I'd like.

Kevin Zitler, Mitchell Schwartz. Who's their right tackle right now? It's a great question. I guess it'll be Cam Irving? Sean Coleman, maybe. I mean, I say Cam Irving because they spent a first round pick on it. It'd be hard to put him on the bench. Right.

And he has played tackle before. I have no idea what they're going to do there. Yeah, they should. Coleman was a third round pick last year. So whatever they do over there, the rest of that line is pretty damn good. Seriously. Yeah. I don't hate.

this as a way to spend your money if you're Cleveland. I like that a lot more than giving Terrell Prior $11 million a year, everything they've done so far. Who's going to sign Prior? It's a great question. It seems like the market's drying up a little bit. Here's my guess. It would be if Philly misses out on Alshan, I think they may go after Prior is like a

secondary choice because they signed Tori Smith, but that's one specific skill. I think they want to diversify the receiving core a little bit more than that. Yeah, I don't know I mean the thing is Everyone has money to spend still Yeah No one has no one has capped himself out And so I think you could see an actual

Like maybe a contender even Saying hey, Terrell prior is available For $8 or $9 million a year Just go get them That's the thing I mean you're gonna see teams like that You're gonna see moves like that I'm surprised that Minnesota hasn't done anything yet

They don't have a ton of money But they have some I think they badly needed an offensive lineman So the way the offensive line and stuff is shaking out so far. Let me see if I can get this right. So it's Leary in Denver. Botonio gets the extension. Apparently we get Zitler and J.C. Treter and Cleveland. Whitward signs with the Rams, which is a great move. I mean, there's no reason you shouldn't sign that guy for two years. It's kind of like the Brandon Marshall situation, Kevin. It's a guy that is a proven commodity. Yes, he's aging. But if you

can sign him to a two and essentially one year contract, why not bring him in? He's not blocking anybody. Go ahead, Danny. I mean, that's just huge. If you want to develop Goff. Competency. Give him a chance. That is exactly what they needed. I mean, because they were just terrible offensive line, past protecting last year.

I mean, they were just terrible all across the board in offense last year, but I think this will help them a lot, just kind of just give them a baseline ability to have him drop back and not be scared, you know, scared for his life or whatever. According to SpotTrack, there are only two teams that have below 10 million. million dollars in cap space one is the chiefs and one is the cowboys

Seattle's right there right though not according to spot track Seattle's right in the middle of the pack yeah they've got quite a bit actually yeah I thought everyone does everyone does here's a thing I just made the joke about Minnesota like Minnesota is middle of the pack like everyone has cap room they were capped out last year yeah yeah they were they everybody was capped out last year and now the cap rises $10 million everyone has a wiggle room you can restructure what do you want? I mean, we're in a new reality for the cap. You know, we were joking yesterday about Romo and like what kind of cap gymnastics are going to have to do. And we know, Romo's

deal is actually a little more manageable than we thought, Robert, you've been talking about this, but anyone can do anything. There's tons of freaking cap room. Yeah. And even if you're Houston, you can sign him to do a cash heavy deal this year. You can put a lot of the guarantees in the year two. You can play with the bonuses. I mean, there's a lot of stuff that people can do to make this work. Also, a little more breaking news. Callais Campbell. Jacksonville. It's not It's not on the Broncos, which is so sad. When somebody mentioned that he was having a change of heart and wanted to go to Denver, I was imagining it in my mind.

And just the pure carnage was so much fun to picture. I'm very sad that we didn't get it. Yeah, but now what, do we, does this mean that we get to start talking about the Jaguars being an up-and-comer again? No, we don't, actually. It's inevitable because it looks like they're going to get Bouye as well. Wow. And they also signed Barry Church. How many years are we going to do this?

Not. I'm not doing this. I'm not doing this. Six. I've moved on. It's not just not in the sense that like we're pumping up the Jaguars. Just in the sense that they can just sign guys all the time because they're not going to have to pay their quarterback. Who knows if he's going to be around for much longer? They don't have to pay any young guys because none of them stick around. They even got Alan Hearns on a cheap-ass deal because he's on draft and they signed him early.

They don't have to pay anybody so they can just do this every two years. When are they going to get capped out? Like the Saints and the Saints like the Saints are like the Saints. Like the Saints have what $20 million in cap room or something? The Saints are going to find a way to be capped out in like 20 minutes. Oh, there's no doubt about that. It's incredible. And we don't have the Jaguars.

It's like they, every free agency period, they have like $100 million to spend. Dude, that's because the first couple of years with Gus, they rolled over like 20 or 30 million a year. I know. I know. It's just they've been banking it. They have $73 million in cap space. God. Calais Campbell 30 years old gets $30 million guaranteed.

That's a nice little hole. I mean, especially because when you're looking at his deal, it's actually you should compare it to the defensive tackle market more than you should compare it to the defensive end market. He plays outside sometimes, but he's more of an interior player. So if you're looking at that, that changes a little bit just because of the way the market is working currently. You know, the Millie Jackson got so much money.

McCoy got $50 million. The tackle and end market are getting closer together, which I also think is why the guard and tackle market is getting closer together. But still, if you compare to the interior guys, one, two, three, four, five, six, he's the seventh most guaranteed money of any interior player in the league and he's 30 years old. It's a nice contract. Not bad. We went to college together. It's a good guy. Yeah, I've always been a fan.

And I think that what made him really attract. I know we're just kind of like spouting off the couple of what's happening, but that's really the way to do this. I think what I liked about him in Denver is that he's a very solid interior passenger. You know, you're going to get 6, 7, 8 a year, but he's a monster run defender. And he's the type of guy that can instantly make the run defense better. He swallows

blockers. He's a legit 6-8. I mean, he's the biggest player. When he was in Arizona, there were so many instances where there'd be a huge play, whether it was a honey badger turnover or a sack or whatever. and you would look at the play again, and you'd realize that there was a double team that Cleas Campbell was in charge of. Yeah. I think there's a situation where they have enough individual pieces back there, Jalen Ramsey.

They have a pretty decent young defensive line around Campbell, and Malik Jackson was at least decent last year. I think there's a situation where, you know, the Jaguars' defense could be pretty good next year. Leading with Clayas Campbell swallowing blockers, you know, getting double teams, then things are happening. I could talk myself into it. If you have, Ramsey's a star, if you bring in Bouye, who I think is very good, Campbell is the exact type of free agent you want, somebody that's not going to be a problem with how much money he makes in the locker room. Like, that's the type of stuff you enjoy.

Because everybody makes $30 million in the Jaguars. It's a good point. There's really no worry about hierarchy because everyone makes the same contract. It's like Wall Street. It's just like everyone, everyone's got a helicopter there. So if you look at, if you look at Jacksonville's defense, all right? And I know we're going to do this to ourselves every single fucking year. But you have a defense that finished 13th in DVOA last season.

If you look at the pieces, it's reasonable to say that Buiye is an upgrade over a Mukamura. Church is, in my opinion, a slight downgrade from Cyprian, but similar types of players. And then you add Callais Campbell to that mix. Why can't they be a top eight defense? I'm refraining from this. You just can't do it yourself anymore. Wait a second. Wait a second.

Like five minutes. ago, we were making fun of hyping up the Jaguars. And now we're all in a place where we're sort of an agreement. They might be a top eight defense. Danny's not doing that. You can't excuse me, buddy. I'm here. I'm with you.

Hey, I can see it. I'm not going to hype them, though. I refuse. I'm doing it. I'm on board. Duvall. A couple more things I wanted to hit here as we're, as we're waiting for more things to happen.

The safety market I thought was interesting in the sense that I really, when I didn't say my favorite signing. but Tony Jefferson's in the conversation. Oh, yeah. I think Tony Jefferson can really play, and combining him with Weddell is a fascinating duo. Because Weddell is that classic center fielder that can really make plays deep,

but also can play around the line of scrimmage. And I think that there's the pieces fit. I love that with safeties, and your team does it better than anybody, Danny. The Thomas Chancellor complementary skill sets, and I think that that's exactly what you get with Jefferson and Weddell. Jefferson's 25 years old.

He's limited in the sense that he is in the box near the line of scrimmage guy, but I still think that with Weddle, it's a really dangerous combination. I absolutely love it. Yeah, I mean, I think I've, I heard a, Daniel Jeremiah was talking about Bill Belichick's like scouting principles one time on their podcast. And in Belichick's words, you know, you can dominate from the safety position. With a couple of good safeties, like they can take over the entire middle of field.

and so I mean they also have a pretty dang good corner in Jimmy Smith so I mean this is already a defense that was like one of the top defenses in the NFL last year and I like deciding a lot I think that it just gives them an ability I mean those he's not he is a box safety but he's he's more than you know he's not like a Cyprian where he's a you know he's crap in coverage right exactly that's what I was looking for I mean he I totally agree with tight ends. Yeah. So to me, that's a great signing.

It's kind of underrated, but it's a great signing. And, I mean, I love the, I love the Ravens defense already. And that to me is kind of an exciting underrated moves. It's interesting that, oh, go ahead, Kevin. Oh, no, I was just going to say, the Ravens need to do something. I just, I mean, this year, I mean, I really need, the Ravens have been kind of mediocre. Like the last, I mean, last year, they were the height of mediocrity. they're giving so much more.

They're hiding mediocrity last year because their offense was the worst in football. I know. I understand that. But what I'm saying is that I think that the Ravens and John Harbaugh really need to show something. I think Ozzie Newsom needs to show something. I think they've lost a little bit of that luster

as far as evaluation and all that. So I'm intrigued with the moves they're making. I just still, I worry that their offense is still going to be pretty bottom of the barrel. Yeah. And it's interesting because the way that the Ravens operate, to them comp picks are the most valuable thing in the history of the world.

And as a result, they let a lot of their own guys go. You've had like 42 the last five years. It's absurd. I saw a stat like the saints. The saints have had like three. It's a very shrewd. I mean, it's a good way to build your team.

And it's a smart way to build your team. So you lose Osama last year. Wagner walks this year. By the way, Wagner's $9 million a year or whatever it was kind of resets the right tackle market for pretty much everybody that's not Lane Johnson. And that makes, I know it's a different market every year is different.

I'm not saying Mitchell Schwartz got bested, but the chiefs having Mitchell Schwartz for six and a half million bucks is fucking beautiful now. And when you're looking at what the right tackle market, who I guess includes Kyle Use Check and the guard market, getting Mitchell Schwartz for that price is excellent. So now you're looking at Baltimore, you lose Wagner, you lose Oscemole, and there's a chance of Brandon Williams walks out the door. So I know that they like to be able to get those extra picks and whatever else.

Ricky Wagner was a compensatory pick. but eventually if you keep letting quality guys walk out the door, it's going to be tough to get much better. You're refilling the coffers through the draft. I mean, that's the problem. They're not quite doing it at a high rate as they were earlier on. Speaking of the Lions and Ricky Wagner, the Lions just released DeAndre Levy.

I saw that and that's just, I don't know what's going on there. I feel like health is just going to be a big problem for him for a while. I loved him when he was healthy. He's one of those linebacks. Interesting. He's an interesting flyer to take now. Totally. Because in my opinion, it's hard to dominate the game from that position. It's why we don't see those guys get paid very often.

What in God's name? The Matt Colell thing? Oh my God. I was waiting for that. I just were to say for the listener, Mays and I are not together. We're all in different rooms right now. We both saw the same tweet at the same time. I knew what that Yelp meant.

Yep. I knew what it meant. Danny knew what it meant. Mace hasn't even confirmed that that's what it meant. It was like mid-sentence. But I know. Mays, I want you, I want you to read this news

because it's your baby. Go ahead. Tom Palliserro, who does a wonderful job. Great guy. Great reporter. Panthers will sign left tackle Matt Kille

to a five-year, $55 million deal with, wait for it, $25 million dollars guaranteed. What? Think about how hilarious this is for people in Minnesota. I was searching Matt Cleo's name on Twitter the other day.

There was so much slander from Minnesota fans. It was pretty funny, actually. Can anyone explain this to me? Danny? I mean, desperation combined with, I imagine they feel that it was an injury situation, not a talent situation? I don't know. That's a lot. 25 million guaranteed?

Wait for this. one how much do you think Tyron Smith got guaranteed I don't know 15 22 22.1 geez guarantees are well guarantees are always kind of iffy when you first hear the deals right like it could be a one-year deal like kind of like the Okun thing last year where they can get out of it and then you know even like guaranteed doesn't mean guaranteed anymore all right so let's let's parse this a little bit so macalil gets 25 million guaranteed it's 11 million dollar average the 11 billion average is slightly less than Joe Thomas.

The $25 million guaranteed is $3 million less guaranteed than Joe Thomas got. The $25 million guaranteed at the left tackle market is 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, the seventh most guaranteed of any left tackle in the league. Was Matt Kahlil one of the seven, he was one of the seven worst offensive tackles in the league last year? Oh, boy. There is outside of some inside knowledge of his health and the fact that he's fine and whatever knee issues have plagued him have magically disappeared. I don't understand this for the life of me.

Who else was going to give him $55 million? That's what I keep wondering with all these deals. Who are giving, who's feeding these teams? This isn't, you know what's, okay, all right? So like in soccer, right? I'm big soccer fan. They get leverage because they're able to just like make up mystery routines. Even they exist sometimes where it's like, oh, well, I play for Todd.

him Hotspur, but I got this offer from China. I got an offer from Turkey and three clubs in France, right? The NFL is only 32 teams, okay? And not everybody's looking for a tackle or not everybody's looking for the position you're at. So you're really dealing with three or four teams. It shouldn't be that hard to realize that this player you're negotiating with has no leverage.

There's no other league. You're not going to go join Vince Young in Saskatchewan, okay? I think we need to take a sense. step back and realize that a solid majority of teams here in the NFL have no idea what they're doing. We're doing this whole thing. Oh, this guy's going this. Meanwhile, Bill Belichick is just assembling all of his talent for like nothing.

Get Dwayne Allen for fourth round picks. He's getting rid of Malcolm Butler. He's going to end up with Stefan Gilmore and Brandon Cooks. I mean, like, like how many people know what they're doing, Mays? Like 12? Apparently the Browns, the Browns are just getting off. The Browns, the Browns know what they're doing. Oh, man, that is insane.

We are in, you know the New Yorker of that story about we're in a computer simulation? Yeah, I think it must be. I feel like we're in a computer simulation and the Browns know what they're doing now. We're in that simulation. The two things that have irked me the most, that's number one. What, the Kalilip thing or the fact that one of Brown's-related computer simulation. The Matt-Kalilio thing is number one with a bullet. The other thing, if you're a Bengals fan today,

and you draft Kevin Zeidler in the first round, he turns into an all-pro-level guard the exact way you wanted him to. You don't have anybody to replace him. You have a little bit of money to work with. In what possible scenario is it okay? Just be like, nah, we're good. It just doesn't make any sense to me. The way that these teams are trying to build

and the types of players are willing to let walk. I struggle with the draft and development model and then teams end up just letting their starters leave to because the Seahawks do that with their offensive line they do a great job with their defense in terms of draft to develop and then re-sign long-term contracts keep their own guys but the Seahawks are fucked this year

because there are no athletes at offensive line in the draft I know it's a terrible over that's a good run I mean okay so when we no sparky guys in the draft at O-line. They're going to end up taking like four defensive tackles and turning them into all pros.

And this is how we get here, right? Yeah. This is how we get to Matt Collio, $55 million over five years of $25 guaranteed. Because there are no tackles on the market. It was Andrew Whitworth and nothing. So that's the pool you're looking at at the position. And then when it's dry in the draft,

what are you going to do? If you say we need to get better instantly, those are the types of deals that happen. I still don't understand how it possibly got that high. How much money is Okun going to make now? Yes. I mean, he's the last guy. I'd say, good Lord.

Maybe he knew, maybe he, this is, maybe it ended up he's looking smart because he knew next, next year the tackle market was going to be insane. That's why he did a one year. I'm not giving him that much for a second. I'm kidding. Yeah, that's, that's something I'm willing to do. Oh, God. All right. Is there anything else you guys want to hit before we get out of here?

Anything else that is burning a hole in your? soul and we need to get out before we're tomorrow i we know i i got to tell you when we started this podcast i didn't think my last point would be we're living in a computer simulation you know what i kind of i kind i kind of did think that might be it and only the only way the collo thing makes sense is if carl's brother was in charge of the negotiations 100% and that he might have been right we know he might have been ryan why don't you take this it's like the member of the movie blank check when the guys like posing as a as a as a computer guy.

Now your final point's going to be the movie Blank Jack. Yeah, no, Ryan Cloil was just posing as Dave Gettlement for the past six months via computer, just sending emails. A couple more just house cleaning things before we get out of here. Probably worth mentioning that Antoine Bethay is going to essentially replace Tony Jefferson in Arizona, just a smaller scale signing. Jaliel Aday goes back to the Chargers. I like him as a player.

I think that's secondary and defense overall is a chance to be very good. don't blame them whatsoever for trying to go with some continuity there. Nick Perry probably back with Green Bay, which not at all surprising. People go back there for cheap. I was looking at Brian Blago's contract the other day. It's ridiculous.

I guess people just, I don't know what it is about Green Bay. People say, yeah, you know what? Yeah, I'll come back here for two thirds of my market value. Sure, why not? What?

Did you play behind Aaron Rogers? It's a chance to live in Green Bay. Yeah. I mean, how could you ever turn that down? Ronald Leary, do we talk about him going to Denver? Yeah, I kind of like that. Oh, yeah, that's a big one. I think he's a really nice player.

And I think that defense over or that line really needed some work. And he's the type of guy. I wrote this today. I think guard is a very safe move in free agency because I think offensive line in general is, except when you give Matt Khalil $25 million guaranteed. Because at offensive line, you need players to allow your offense to function. And by getting guys that you know or. functional even if they you're inherently overpaying infraisingcy so even if you have to

overpay a little bit you're ensuring competence of your offense and in a way it's why i really like what the browns are doing you are a guaranteeing your offense is at a certain the floor is at a certain point because you have offensive line yeah when i don't wait wait till october and we'll see about that floor buddy hey i guys anything on lear i just want to say that that that alleviates some of the concerns we had about romo you know we talked yesterday about romo sure and it's him at the line, but sure. Yeah. No, no, I know, but it just, we're just getting to a spot.

Sports Illustrated just treated out a Matt Kullel thing, and the photo was Alex Boone, which is just peak Kalil. Oh, God. That's so incredible. Yeah, I think that's all. I mean, there's a couple of, Alvis Dumaville got released, Connor Barwin got released, some guys that could be helpful. The interior off, or defensive line market hasn't really shaken out yet.

We don't know where Williams is going to go. Hankins is still on the board. So a couple of positions where the run hasn't quite gone down, but I'm sure it will very soon and that's why we're going to be back with you guys again tomorrow so great great all right guys thanks for doing this we'll be back uh to yeah to clean up more of whatever mess teams make of themselves over here in the next 12 24 hours so appreciate you listening and we'll talk soon