The Ringer NFL Show - How to Improve the AFC’s Non-Playoff Teams Through the Draft

Episode Date: April 5, 2023

Nora and Steven open by discussing the news surrounding Cardinals owner Michael Bidwill. They then break down how the non-playoff teams of the AFC can improve through the draft and free agency. Hosts: Nora Princiotti and Steven Ruiz Associate Producer: Stefan Anderson Additional Production Supervision: Arjuna Ramgopal and Conor Nevins Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Did your favorite NFL team win the Super Bowl? No? Then the NFL draft is your Super Bowl. I'm Danny Haifitz, and for now until the draft, we are turning our fantasy football show feed into the Ringer NFL draft show. Every Tuesday and Thursday, we talk about the top players and most important storylines for the NFL draft. So join us on the Ringer NFL draft show. Hello and welcome to the Ringer NFL show.

I'm Nora Pintziotti. I am here on a lovely Wednesday. As always, with Stephen Ruiz. Stephen, how are you doing? I'm doing okay. It's been, there's been some allergies going on this week for me. And then it's draft season now, which is always, I'm choosing my words wise. An interesting time of the year.

An interesting time for discourse. Everyone loves a good draft discussion. Stephen and I are both playing hurt a little bit today in the lamest possible fashion. We've got some allergies going on. I like tweaked a nerve in my neck just sleeping. Like always a humbling experience when you just hurt yourself by sleeping. You heard yourself sleeping. You heard yourself laying down.

I have the sniffles and we're both complaining about it at the top of the pod. We are washed. Absolutely washed. Horrible energy to start this off. It's fitting, though, because we're going to talk about some non-playoff teams today. We are starting a little series over the next two weeks. We're going to go through every team, do some team needs leading up to draft time. And we're breaking it up.

We're going to do two episodes a week. and we're breaking it up AFC, NFC, non-playoff teams and playoff teams. So we're going to start today with the non-playoff teams in the AFC, the teams that have the most to gain if you want to put a positive spin on that.

And so we're going to go through all nine of those teams hit on what they need to round out the roster, either through the draft, through the last trickles of free agency. First, however, we have a little bit of a news item to get to. Stephen, I don't know if you saw, but on Tuesday, former Cardinals executive Terry McDona filed an arbitration claim to the league accusing Cardinals owner Michael Bidwell of gross misconduct, including cheating, discrimination, and harassment.

There were a lot of really, really serious accusations in the filing, including that McDonough and former Cardinals coach Steve Wilkes were forced by Bidwell to communicate with former Arizona general manager, Steve Kime, using Bidna. burner phones when Kime was suspended in 2018, stemming from his extreme DUI, which I feel like we've had to talk about on the show before. Extreme DUI is a charge in Arizona. I know it sounds a little bit ridiculous, but it's a real serious thing. And there's a whole laundry list of accusations, including that Bedwell was mocking towards all sorts of employees, including a black woman and two pregnant women. And the Cardinals responded in a very long statement disputing a bunch of the claims.

They levied some accusations about McDonough's own conduct and his personal life and that it was bleeding into his professional life. Again, this all seems very, very, very messy. In general, they have 20 days to respond to the charges to the league. and then the arbitration process, which Roger Goodell runs, sort of proceeds from there. There's a lot that we don't know, and I want to stress that, about sort of exactly what went on here. Maybe we'll find out someday as this preceding carries on. But Stephen, did you have any reaction to this? I wasn't surprised that, like, the Cardinals' organization seems to be in turmoil,

and the Cardinals, like, fired back with accusations of their own. There was talk of domestic violence. They had proof of based on going through his emails while he was working there. And they wanted to make it very clear. They didn't know about this before they released this statement. So it's a very messy situation. But part for the course for this franchise, which has had, I would say problems that are less serious, like in real life. Like squabbling with your quarterback publicly, fallout from the Cliff Kingsbury era and all that.

Steve Kime, not doing a great job. And then apparently behind the scenes, all this stuff may have been going on. But it sounds like the other toxic workplaces we've heard about around the NFL. And I mean, I'm at the point where I kind of, I don't expect this to happen. But when you hear about a team not having the best work environment, it doesn't come off as a surprise. And the Cardinals are one of the teams that came out of that player server, that NFLPA player survey looking really bad. Apparently, their facilities.

And the way they treat their players was not, it was not. really up to par. So Cardinals got a lot of soul searching to do. And I think Michael Bidwell, even if they come out of this somehow unscathed, I still think it leaves a stain on the franchise that they're going to have to clean up eventually. Not an awesome look to be accused of cheating during a season in which you went three and 13. No, no, not at all. And you mentioned that survey, one of the areas in which they graded really, really poorly was families. family support with players mentioning that they didn't have daycare, they didn't have a family room. The majority of teams do provide those things. So there was a little bit, you know,

there's some relationship between some of the accusations of mistreatment of pregnant women. Again, that's really serious and we'll see how this all plays out. But it does make you pay attention when it's not the first time that you've heard something indicating that it's not a great place to work and that there are some similarities in the things that came out in the survey and the things that Terry McDonough is talking about. The other thing being, I mean, look, the Cardinals fired back and they said all of these horrible things about his own conduct. And if that's true, it's also sort of like,

all right, you shouldn't keep someone employed who's acting like, acting like that in your workplace. So it just doesn't seem like a great state of the fairs. They wanted to make it clear. They didn't know any of this until the, until after the filing from McDonough. They want to make it very clear. Don't put it in the paper that they knew any of this. But apparently a family member reached out, unprovoked, and provided them with some of the information. It seems a little sketch is all I'm saying. So this is not my. joke. Somebody said this on Twitter and I wish I

wish I had the proper credit. But the NFL just comes up with the lamest uses for burner phones. Yes. Like if I'm ever using a burner phone to talk to a suspended Steve Kime, like it's just, it's all over. What did you think came up with the idea? Was it Bidwell? Like apparently

it was Bidwell's idea and he was very mad when they pushed back to him. Well, and look, as we will, I think we're two episodes away from talking about the the Cardinals roster, but when we have to sort of

go through that wreckage and figure out how one of the worst rosters in the NFL got to that place, it is worth understanding that Steve Kime and Michael Bidwell had a really, really, really, really, really close relationship.

I mean, that was his sort of right-hand man, the person he got, his understanding of the state of affairs of the team, the state of affairs of the league from, and obviously Steve Time's track record towards the end of his work there was not awesome. So whether that has any relevance to this situation or just to how bad things have gotten there in terms of the talent on the team, that that seems like a factor.

Yeah. I mean, it's, I feel like the list of owners that probably aren't doing the best job is growing. And I feel like in this day and age, you kind of get more insight into the dysfunction of organizations where, like, I would say even like 10 years ago, you really didn't get this information about teams, unless it was really bad. And I'm happy this is being that more of a light is being shined on some of the incompetence around the league. You're making a serious and important point. And generally speaking, I very much agree with you. However, whenever stuff comes up with the bidwells, and you start looking into it.

I always find myself reminded that this was the family that two generations ago had, like, major ties to Al Capone. Check his taxes. That's all I'm saying. Check is taxes. Messy stays messy. That's the moral of the store. All right.

On to greener pastures. The Houston, Texas. Shall we begin? Yes. We're going to go, as least significant. Let's put a positive spin on this again. The most to gain to the least.

So we're going to start, we're going to go in reverse order by record worst to best among the non-playoff teams. So Houston Texans roster needs as of Wednesday, April 5th. First one I think is pretty obvious here. Quarterback. Yes. You're not a Davis-Mills fan? that's not fair

I like Davis Mills but Davis Mills is not the future of this franchise I had so quarterback is the biggest thing here right they have the second pick in the draft because thank you lovey and five in the top 73

so a ton of ammo to get a bunch of players but to get a top quarterback one way or the other there was I found this very interesting Peter King in his column this week gave some sort of informed speculation, I guess, that they could trade out of the second pick

and not go quarterback at the top of the draft. I was trying to figure out what to make of that. And I wonder if between Bryce Young and C.J. Stroud, I wonder if they really like one and don't like the other because Ryan Poles, the bear's general manager, a couple weeks ago, had also said something to the effect that they'd tried to work out a deal with Houston to swap the first and second picks

and that that fell through before they did the deal with Carolina, which to me would indicate that there's at least someone at the very top of the draft that the Texans would be interested in taking. And so I suppose if there's only one of those guys that they feel really strongly about and he's not available at two, they could try to move back, take someone else, and then they have the 12th pick. So if there's someone lower down,

they could try to use that on a quarterback or go up with that pick. I just, the idea that the Texans are not going to take a first round quarterback, a quarterback in, let's call it, the first half of the first round of the draft, would flabbergast me. Nick Casario is a conservative guy,

conservative drafter. it would still, I would be speechless. I think I would have like a less extreme reaction to it. I think it would be fine just because I'm a really big fan of the next quarterback class. I think you have two guys that could be legit stars in the sleeve in Caleb Williams and Drake May. And in this class, I feel it's obviously a deep class because we're expecting at least four to go in the first round. It may be a fifth. Depending on how you feel about Hendon Hooker, I personally don't think he's a first round pick.

but that seems to be where the momentum is heading. But I still think it's one of those drafts where you kind of have one guy that you fall in love with and then the rest of the prospects are guys that you don't really care for that much, that you would be fine passing on. And that's what it sounds like. I think you were doing some good tea leaf reading there, that it sounds like they want one guy and if they can't get that guy,

they're fine dropping down. And I don't know if that means we're dropping down and drafting a quarterback that falls to us, or we're dropping down and kind of delaying that part of the rebuild. Because that is a key part of the rebuild. And I also think the timing of when you get that quarterback matters. I think it would be in the best interest of Houston to get that quarterback maybe a year from now because you're starting.

I know they've been doing this rebuild thing with Casario for, what, like three years now, but this seems to be the real start. This seems to be year one because you have Demico Ryan's in there now. That seems to be a coach that you're going to commit to, more than one year at a time like they were doing with the past guys. So I don't know. If I'm them, I would be fine trading down again, using this first year under Damico Ryan's

as a way of building up the roster even further. So once you drop that rookie quarterback into the roster, he's not dealing with as much adversity as he would with this roster right now. I know they've made a lot of moves in free agency, but there's still like a bottom 10 roster in the NFL. So here's the thing, though. And in general, I'm with you because I think at the top of the draft, you have to have a ton of conviction on the quarterback that you're going to take.

And if they really only feel strongly about one guy, then I would be all in favor of see if you can maybe use that 12th pick and try to move up a little bit from there and don't use the number two if you don't feel strongly about who you'd be bringing into the building. Having D'Amico in Year 1 in some ways pushes the timeline, but you mentioned all of their free agent acquisitions. And it's not, you know, they're not the biggest names. it's not the splashiest, like,

trajectory of the franchise altering decisions. But they brought a lot of guys in, you know, Robert Woods, Jimmy Ward, Sheldon Rankin, Dalton Schultz, Andrew Beck, Denzel Perry, like, it gets not super exciting very quickly. But you look at all of those deals, and they're either for one or two years.

They didn't do a single, the biggest contract they gave out was to Robert Woods, and it was two years and 15 million. They did not give a longer-term deal beyond two years. So what that says to me is you can't, I don't think you can have your major franchise decision point

be in one year, because you're still going to have most of those guys, but then you're also going to be hitting this inflection point where you probably have a lot of money that you can spend and by the same token, a lot of decisions to make two years from now. And the way that I would look at that is if you get a young quarterback in the building, you have this,

this sort of one, two-year period where he's developing, you're not expecting him to be at the absolute peak of his powers, but you want to have a good enough infrastructure so that he can actually develop. And then you take the big swing and actually try to compete. And maybe you're right. The fact that D'Amico's in year one there means that the timeline can be pushed out a little bit. But Casario isn't. And at a certain point, this team is going to be on.

pressure to not be, you know, a bottom five NFL franchise. So I would be pretty surprised if they didn't do it, although less surprised if they didn't do it with the number two pick and tried to use their other first rounder to move up and do something in quarterback if they don't like how the board falls for number two. Did you have anything beyond quarterback? I think Robert Woods, Noah Brown, and Nico College. probably says you need a little bit,

something extra at wide receiver, but that would be nice. They need to, like, they're kind of, they need, their needs are at the premium positions. Like, we already talked about quarterback.

I think wide receiver is another premium position. They don't really have any edge rushers. Defensive line isn't great. Obviously, I think the line could be better, the offensive line, I mean. But it's also kind of a weak draft.

And it's not necessarily a draft. If you're not, let's, let's say they, they don't want to, take a quarterback at number two because the Panthers are taking the guy that they have their heart set on. It's not really a draft where you want to be drafting at the top because there are some good players and good talents like Jalen Carter for instance. There are a lot of question marks around

him. And Jalen Carter seems to be a good fit for what they need and a good fit for a Domeko Ryan's defense. But all those questions and then the pro day workout, which was underwhelming to say the least, makes it hard to really have conviction about drafting him with the second pick overall. So I think it makes sense that they would move down if it's not going to be a quarterback. And like you said, they have a lot of flexibility with that second first round pick. Number 12, which ironically, I believe is the pick they traded for when they drafted their last quarterback. And the Browns had it before. And they got this pick from the Browns.

I don't know. It's really interesting to see where this team goes because I do think there's like a fork in the road here where Casario is on a different timeline than Damiko Rines. And I've seen this movie before. I saw it play out in Carolina, and it didn't really work out. You saw like Scott Fitterer trying to rebuild while Matt Rule was trying to salvage his career. It's kind of the reverse of what's happening here. So it's going to be interesting. I think we're going to find out how in sync Damika Ryans and Casario are

and how much their timelines really match up. Because that's a question that the only person that can answer is the team owner. And I don't think he's going to come out with that answer for us. And you see that in the roster too a little bit, right? Because in general, they are still in a place where other than the second overall pick presents its own set of questions. But in general, they can kind of go best player available because they just need talent. But at the same time, this was a pretty decent secondary last year. They're starting to, you know, they could, Scott Questenberry, I think they would want to replace its center.

but in general, they have an okay offensive line situation, particularly maybe Kenyon Green takes a step forward. Then you're starting to look pretty good there. Defensive line they probably need to add to, especially they lost Agbo Acaronkwo, who is pretty solid, and Jerry Hughes is 34 years old. But there's still, for now, there's still something in the cupboard there. So it's not, it's not as terrible as it used to be. No, it's a protein. Pressure starts to mount.

Yeah, it's a professional football team, but the problem with that is then you start to have expectations. So I think they got to do something. I don't think they can completely punt. Anything else, or should we move on to the Colts? Let's just move on. No more Texans talk. No more Texans talk.

That's enough. What do you got for team needs? I mean, obviously, it's quarterback again. And they're in an even worse situation than the Texans if they do have their heart set on a quarterback, because they're drafting fourth. And there are only four legitimate first round prospects. And you don't want to be,

you don't want to be the team that is just having a guy fall to you. Although, in theory, like the nerds will tell you that that's not a bad strategy because NFL teams are too confident in their ability to evaluate players, especially at that level. They're too confident in their ability to discern the best quarterback from, say, the third or fourth best quarterback. So maybe it will work out for them.

But I think this is a team that has to make a move for a quarterback. Whether it's moving up the draft board to get someone not named Will Levis, it would be my recommendation. I don't think Levis is a bad quarterback. I just wouldn't draft them in the top 10. Like I would be fine drafting them in the bottom half in the first round. But I think they have to make a move, man. They have to make a move.

And if it's not for Young or Richardson or Stroud, depending on who the Panthers take, it has to be for Lamar Jackson. And so I think like this draft is about putting themselves in a position to find a quarterback. They have other needs. They need offensive tackles. They need quarterbacks. They need a playmaking receiver to go alongside Pittman, who I think is more of a steady hand at wide receiver. They have a lot of needs and a lot of needs at important positions.

So if they're not going to go up and get that quarterback, I think it makes the most sense for them to go down and just throw as many darts at the a dartboard as they can because this team needs a lot of help and a lot of important positions. And frankly, it's Chris Ballard's fault for being a little too conservative, something that we've criticized them plenty for on this podcast. But this is his chance to go against his typical strategy and be aggressive and find some stars. That's what this team has lacked for the last, what, five years since Andrew Luck retired. They haven't had star players. Their biggest star was DeForest Buckner, who's a defensive tackle. like a great player, a star player who can impact the game at a high level,

but it's still not a premium position. They need to find stars at premium positions, and it starts with this draft. They need to find a star receiver. I mean, quarterback is obviously the number one thing, but they cannot do, at least in my view, another year of hoping that Michael Pittman can really be a true one plus. Oh, hey, we've got Alex Pierce, and we added Isaiah McKenzie instead of Paris Campbell. How exciting.

This to me was one of the biggest failures of their roster, construction last year was just going into the season with essentially, you know, other than the, um, having Campbell instead of McKenzie with essentially that group and thinking, oh, well, we have this great offensive line. We've got Jonathan Taylor, you know, Matt Ryan will be solid. We can do this with this crew. And then obviously some of the, the way that the offensive line completely fell apart was unexpected. But I think that that was really proven to be a big failure was just thinking that those wide receivers could cut it, and you can't do that again.

You just absolutely cannot do that again for as much as I think we look at quarterback as the emblem of how Chris Ballard needs to change his philosophy and how he designs this roster. I think the receiver stuff is right up there with that.

Other than that, I'm a little... I don't know what they can do about the offensive line just because of the money that they have committed to those players. I think you kind of have to give it another year and hope that it gets a little bit better because you're still, you know, Ryan Kelly's making 12 million, Quentin Nelson's making 20 million, Braden Smith's making 17. I think you just kind of have to hold your breath there and hope that they bounce back a little bit.

You're not going to have Matt Pryor and Danny Pinter starting, which is going to help probably. but I think they're pot committed there. I would rather see them go corner to try to replace Stefan Bielmore rather than make big moves for the offensive line just because I don't think you're going to be able to be able to play them, really, given how much money they have committed there. Yeah, I will be like interested to see how the offense is built up.

Like they get Shane Steichen from Philadelphia, and obviously that was a, I would say, unique roster that's going to be hard to replicate. Like you can't just go out and say, oh, I'm going to build the best offensive line in the NFL. Oh, I'm going to get two receivers who are impossible to cover one-on-one. And I'm going to get this quarterback who is basically, who, if we call

his number in the run game, he's basically an auxiliary running back. Like, that's hard to replicate. And you're not going to do it with Bernard Raymond playing left tackle. Our Gardner, Minchew playing quarterback. Although, I guess the Eagles did fine with Minchew at quarterback last year.

when he had to play. But you need star talent. And I think the lesson that we take away from this, I don't even know what to call it. It wasn't a rebuild, but it was like Chris Ballard trying to- Slow roll. Yeah, I don't even know what to frame it as.

But I think the key lesson is when you take big swings, they can't be at offensive guard and defensive tackle. You can't spend $100 million on offensive guard and give out a similar contract to a defensive tackle. You have to take your big swings at the money positions. and they did the opposite of that. They were swinging for doubles at receiver and quarterback and edge rusher and cornerback.

Like, you can't do that and win in this league. It's a different league. It's not 1995 anymore. I don't know. Chris Ballard, I feel like he should be on Barrow Time right now, but it seems like Jim Mersey is just cool with riding Ballard out until the end. It's kind of morbid that I just said that.

Lamar Jackson would fix almost all of this. Yes. Lamar Jackson look, oh. Do it. Also, for the storyline of you guys

taking another thing away from Baltimore, it would be, would be great. You already took their team. You kind of took Johnny United us already. Take Lamar Jackson.

I love it. All right, Broncos time. All I have down for them is edge rusher. I have positive vibes. I think that's the biggest need of this team.

I mean. Or a burner phone. so they could set up a frame rust for a crime plot, but apparently that's not a serious suggestion. Right, right, right, right. I already tried to pitch that on the island.

It didn't get, it wasn't received well. I don't know. I think we're percolating on that one. This roster is in such a weird place because it is, you, you go down the list and there's really not a lot of, especially, you know, look, they're committed to Russell Wilson.

For better, for worse. that for the time being for this year is how it's going to be. But you go down the list and there's nothing that like, there's very little that's sort of a glaring weakness. I put down edge russia because their top two sack getters,

Traymont Jones and Bradley Chubb are both gone. Jones went to Seattle. Chubb obviously was traded. But other than that, they spent so much money, in free agency. They've kind of got their guys.

I'm not saying I think it's necessarily going to work out super well, but they spent $235 million in total free agent spending over the last month or so. So they don't pick in the draft until 67. They've kind of got a roll with this roster. And let's talk about the division.

Patrick Rahomes and Justin Herbert reside in this division. It's not a good look. I really don't know. I don't know what prescription to write here. I think it's just take your medicine for the next two years and then hope that once you get out on the other side of this Russell Wilson experiment, that you can rebuild. But in the meantime, I think it's similar to what you said about the Colts offensive line. You're kind of pot committed and you just have to roll with it.

I know they've tried to fix things. You bring in Sean Payton. And Sean Payton, I think has a reputation as like an offensive fixer because obviously you had a Hall of Fame quarterback for the majority of his. career in New Orleans. But the last couple of years there, it's not like the quarterback position was great. Even Drew Breeze on his last legs wasn't a great quarterback, but they got some good offenses out of it. So I think that's the hope. Did you see Travis and Jason Kelsey's part of their one of their podcasts recently? They took the coach's photo from the owner's meetings

and they, I think Jason made Travis try to name all of the coaches. And when he got to Sean Baten, he just goes, ah, quarterbacks, quarterbacks. Right, yeah. I mean, but that's what he is. That's what he's known as. I don't know how he earned that reputation necessarily. The Broncos are banking their entire future and hundreds of million dollars on that reaction alone.

You think the Walmart guy knew who Sean Payton was before Sean Payton. He probably just looked at the, he probably looked at a list of coaches and was like, quarterbacks, quarterbacks. And then it was like, pick him. By the way, I love that Kelsey was like, oh for six on the friends of McBay hires. he could not tell one of those people. He could not, he did not name one of them. He was like, ah, he had Zach Taylor.

That's coach. They played the Bengals four times in like 24 months. Like a hundred times in this incredibly like contentious thing. And Zach Taylor was just like, oh yeah, he's that guy. And then he was like, oh yeah, he's a dog. I've never heard anyone describe Zach Taylor as a dog. And that was the biggest proof that Kelsey has no idea who Zach Taylor is. no one's like no one looks at

Zach Taylor's like oh yeah he's got that dog in him no one has ever said that the one that and I've I've spoken to him I've seen him probably I don't know a half a dozen times I've looked up his photo when I can't remember

who that guy is my brain is incapable of remembering Matt Eberfluce's face I'm not sure I've ever seen it and I've like known of him for like five years and I'm not sure I can place him he looks both older and younger than I expect him to.

And I've gone through this many times. I'm just going to have to live the rest of my life being like, who's that guy? And it's Maddie the police. That's the answer. That was some good Broncos talk. We just said some good Broncos analysis. All right.

Edge rusher. Let's do it. And then, you know, on to the Jared Stidamera. That's right. I got a question. Does Jared Sidham start a game? For non-injury reasons, does he start a game this year?

Because Sean Payton seems to feel like he's talking like he will. Yes, I think he will. But I don't think that... I don't think that... Russ... I don't know. I don't think Russ is going to play so poorly that he's going to merit getting benched.

I don't think... I think there's a difference between... between, I don't think that Russell Wilson at this point in his career was worth the investment that they made in him. I don't think that he can compete with the other quarterbacks in the division. I don't, my prediction for Russell Wilson this season is not that he's going to play so badly that he merits sitting down. I mean, the team was a disaster last year, but they were also, and I don't think people realize this just because of how much else went wrong. They were the most injured team in football. I think the offensive line is going to be in a better spot. I think the

offensive line is going to be in a better spot. I don't think Nathaniel Hackett was doing anyone any favors. I think they're just going to be boring. That's the thing about the Broncos is I don't think they're going to be a dumpster fire like they were last year. I just think they're going to be kind of black. No, I agree. And you kind of saw them figure things out once they fired Hackett. Like they changed the offense and they kind of went back to the Seattle style of offense for Russ.

Right. They let Russ be Russ. Yeah, I think the concern there is like shelf life. because he is on the wrong side of 30 now. You can't play that style of football forever. I don't even know if he could play it for another year. But I think if he could still play like that, Sean Payton is going to mold the offense around his strengths

and avoid his weaknesses. So, yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if it's like a seven out of 10 year for Russ. But like you said, that's just not enough, especially against these quarterbacks in this division. It's just, I mean, it's a recipe for eight and nine. So the Broncos were number one in an overall space. spending in free agency. They spent $235 million. Can you guess who was second place? Was it the Panthers? No. It was the Saints. And I know it's because they gave it's because they

gave Derek Carr $140 million or whatever. So it's a little bit cheating. But it's just I, I saw that and I was like, how? How do they always, how is there always more money? Their burner, their burner phone system is up and running well. Is, is, yes. They're making good use out of those burner phones. I don't know. they're saying on them, but they're getting good use at them. Speaking of burner phone burner phone controversies, weren't the Browns in one? I think they're next up on the list. Didn't they get like

this was like three years ago. Like Ray Farmer was using a he was using a phone during games. Oh, oh, oh, oh, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, all right, we will move on to the Browns and all of their burner phones after this. Okay, Cleveland, I have

defensive line, run defense, fix it. The word run defense I've ever seen for a bit. I'm not saying over the course of the season, but for like a good month there, they couldn't stop anyone. The chargers ran on them and the chargers famously couldn't run on anybody.

That's what it was, is that month in the season when it was just so brutal because when I was looking it up, they allowed 4.7 yards per carry, 22 rushing touchdowns. Both of those were like near the bottom of the league. But I was almost disappointed because I was pulling those numbers and going, no, no, no, no, no. It was worse than that.

I know it was worse than that. In general, I think on paper, the roster is pretty solid with the biggest question being just is Watson going to make meaningful improvement in a full season. But even though they're not picking until 74, Jordan Elliott should not be a starting defensive tackle

anymore. I think that's probably the way to go. They added Dalvin Tomlinson and Free Agency. I liked the Ogbo signing. We mentioned that in the Houston section. They've done things I think with a mind

towards improving the spine of that defense, but it was really bad, so it can never do too much. Yeah, they just need their draft picks to start playing well. This team was built on draft capital. That was famously their strategy was

accruing as much draft picks as possible. beginning of the Dibat, I can't even say his name, the Batesda era, but none of these picks have really hit. Like you look at like, like Grant Delpit hasn't really played. And I'm talking about like the second round picks. Obviously Denzel Ward has been a big hit. He was a part of the Baker Mayfield draft class. But he was a first round pick who's had trouble staying on the field.

J.K, the linebacker from Notre Dame, hasn't really stayed on the field. I'm forgetting the cornerback now. He's not on the team anymore. Greedy Williams wasn't a hit. Grady Williams, yeah. Yeah, he was supposed to be a big part of their defense. Greg Newsom has been okay, but he's an undersized corner. Miles Garrett has obviously been everything he's been built up to me,

but they haven't gotten that star, like the multiple superstar talents from that draft capital they did have. And now they put all their eggs in the Deshaun Watson basket. He obviously didn't play well last year. I think he's going to be better. Like the last time we saw him play, he was one of the better quarterbacks in the NFL. obviously the vibes there are a little different and it's hard. Like it's impossible for either of us to predict how that's going to affect his performance going forward.

Not that we shouldn't even care about it. But this is a team that I just am uncomfortable talking about. But I don't think it's a team that's going to be good enough to challenge the Ravens. If Lamar is there and he's healthy and the Bengals. So I don't think it's a team that we're going to be talking about. Like I really see this as a Broncos level team where they're competitive, sure. but they don't really figure into the AFC playoff race or at least the race for who's going to represent the conference in the Super Bowl.

I really think this is a middling team that took a lot of their big swings already and this is what they got out of it. They got that one win over Pittsburgh in the wildcard round. I really think you need a reset here for this roster because unless Deshaun Watson turns into a top-pipe quarterback again, I don't see this as like a roster that can prop up a second tier quarter. It needs a first-tier quarterback

to be a playoff team. I think that's right. For no other reason than you have first-tier quarterbacks in the division, you know, with the asterisk on. Lamar, I don't, and I don't like talking about the Browns either.

I don't like talking about Watson either. It's a weird, weird, weird, weird thing. It's not out of the realm of possibility that he becomes a top five quarterbacks. No, I don't think it is either. But I agree with you that that is what that's what they would need. We should point out they don't pick until 74th in this draft. And then they only have two top 100 picks.

So it's not like they're going to be adding top level talent. Now, you could always hit on a day two pick. We've seen it happen before. But the likelihood of a day two pick impacting this team in a meaningful way in 2023 is very unlikely. It doesn't happen even with first round picks all that often. And like Jamar Chase, sure. But those don't, players like that don't come around often. So I think this team is going to be the team we saw last year with a few upgrades.

And then hopefully for their sake, Deshaun Watson plays back. I mean, I do think that like the Tomlinson signing, they brought in Juan Thornhill from Kansas City. I think, again, we were talking about what looked at times like the league worst run defense and it really did hurt them. I do think that they can make some meaningful progress in that way. And that is the type of thing that you see where you are at pick 74. Maybe they even trade down from there so that they can have a few more throws at the dartboard. But they kind of are what they are offensively. They traded for Elijah Moore.

They have a ton of receivers. But at least that is sort of an – it's not an easy fit. but it's not, you know, the biggest challenge in constructing a football team is not like, we need a better defensive tackle in here. You can do that. That's fine. I believe in them.

I think the Browns can work this out. Yeah, they did upgrade their defensive coordinator. Going from Jim Schwartz from Joe Woods, I think is a huge upgrade. I mean, we haven't really seen Schwartz run a defense, but like he's been, wherever he goes, the defense gets better. That's been his track record.

So I do expect defensive improvement. They need the offense to take a massively to get to where I think this team thought they were glowing when they made the Watson trade. I think the optimism that building has probably been dialed back a little bit, but that's the key to this. And it's impossible for us to predict how that's going to play out on the field. All right. The Raiders.

What do you have? I mean, they need to fix the offensive line. I think when you bring in Jimmy G, and let's assume that Jimmy G is a multi-year commitment, that they're not just going to use Jimmy G as a bridge quarterback and move on from him. They need to build up that. And the most likely outcome with that contract

is that he's there for two years. Yeah, right. And if he's there beyond two years and that's the guy, it's him and McDaniels for the next five years, say, offensive line needs to be the main priority. You need a running game. You need at least the threat of a running game.

You need the defense to respect your running game. If you don't have that and you're just throwing Jimmy G out there into the deep end, the drop back passing deep end and asking him to swim, we've seen that before. We know what that. He fails that swimming test every time. So that's the only thing that matters.

They have other positions of need. They need to fix the defense. They don't have a lot of depth around like Max Crosby, really. They need to fix the secondary. But man, if you don't get offensive line right, it's not going to matter because you're not going to get the best out of Jimmy G. But I do think if you get the best out of Jimmy G, like you have the makings of a top 10 offense.

And then you just need to figure out the defense. and then I think you're back to a point where you're at least competing for a wildcard spot. Competing for the division is another story because of the division you're in. But I think that's the fastest path to success for Josh McDaniels. It's building a great offensive line.

It's the interior especially too, right? Like Alex Barr is at right guard, I think is probably the number one. Okay, let's fix this. Germain Illuminaur, right tackle. The right side, I think, is sort of, where you want to work on there. The secondary, too, in particular, defensively,

I think they could upgrade pretty much anywhere on the defense. But the secondary, they took a nice flyer on Duke Shelley from Minnesota, which I think was a cool move. He's still 5-9. I'm a big Duke Shelley guy. Don't slander Duke show. He is small. He had a nice little end of the season there.

It was definitely a contributor. It's a good move. I don't think it's quite enough. I'm biased with him, by the way. I like tweet it out something, some videos of him before his draft and his dad like DM me. He was like, oh, you like Duke, huh? And I was like yeah. So I'm a little biased.

You like Duke Shelley? I've been tracking I'm his father. I'm very like, I'm very aware of the Duke Shelley lore. I've been following since beginning of Day 1 fan here. Okay. Well, shout out to Mr. Shelley. No, I'm, I think that was a nice little signing they got there. Emphasis on Little. I'm not sure that it is. I'm sorry.

I'm not sure that they don't still. have a little bit of work to do at the corner position. Just a tiny bit. And all I am saying. Defensive line as well, I think, you know, I don't know that

Jerry Tillery and Blal Nichols I think are their current starting defensive tackles. Max Crosby and Chandler Jones probably a little bit less pressing. But still, Chandler Jones, I don't know how much you can expect at 33. he's getting paid so he'll be on the roster,

but he had four and a half sacks last year, still played the third most defensive snaps. So if there was a way to make him a little bit less of like a mainstay high snap count player and move him into a, into your mid-30s, we're going to limit your snap count and just try to put you in spots kind of role.

That would probably be better. I just don't think that there's anywhere on this, defense that they couldn't pay attention to and have it be a good idea. But offensive line as well. Yep. That's where I am. They have a seventh pick. Yeah, I think like a good plan for this team would be, like they have Max Crosby,

who I think is a very good player. Like bordering on a superstar level talent at edge rusher, the Raiders have been in this particular situation before, and they traded their last superstar edge rusher for a, bunch of draft picks. The only problem with that plan, it would have worked, but they let Mike Mayhock and John Gruden decide who those draft picks were going to be. I know Raiders' Trans will get mad at me if I throw this out there, but maybe trade Max Crosby for a bunch of first-round picks. And that's one way to rebuild this roster, because I do think it's going to take.

It's hard to build the offensive line. That was like my prescription for the team at the start of this segment is build the offense line, but that's tough to do. I think the seventh pick is a perfect spot to get a very good tackle prospect in this draft, though. So if I'm them, like my first couple of picks are on offensive line this year. I really like the teams that just throw a bunch of picks at one particular problem position. Me too. I'm a sucker for that. It seems to work out every time.

So that's what I think the Raiders should do. Just spend their first three picks. They have three picks in the top 70, four in the top 100. Spend at least two of those on offensive line. That's all I ask. A lot of buzz about Will Levis and this team. Yeah, I've heard them and the next team. A lot of teams in this range,

it's like 7 to 12 drafting range seem to be in on Will Levis. And that's the spot of the draft where I would want to avoid him. I would want him to drop past that and then get him in the bottom half of the first round. But teams get desperate when it comes to quarterbacks. And I wouldn't be surprised, even after they signed Jimmy,

if the Raiders made a move for one. Jimmy and Brian Hoyer and hired Danny Amandola as a coaching assistant. Play the hits. Jimmy Garablo, Brian Hoyer, Jacob Myers, Philip Dorset, Brandon Bolden, Germain Illuminaur, Chandler Jones,

Jacob Jodson. Jacoby Brissette. Jacoby Brissette should be on this roster. Truly. Truly. Truly. Get the first. wolf backpack together.

Okay. The Jets. What I put down for the Jets was paperwork. Finish your Aaron Rogers train. Get this done. Yes. Like that's all that matters. If they don't get Aaron Rogers, this is a disaster no matter what.

Yeah. And now apparently the 49ers are getting in on the action. So like there's another team that's kind of. Well, okay. Are the 49ers getting in on the action or did someone on Fox Sports say that the 49ers might make sense to get in on the action?

And then now this cycle has kicked into overdrive. That's all we need. That's all we need. Chris Zoom said like the 49ers are trading up for Mac Jones and that was like a storyline for three months. So all we need is someone from Fox Sports to drive something out there. But it makes sense.

Like it makes too much sense for them not to at least explore the option. This is a team that's at the end. We're doing a fantastic job of discussing teams that we're not supposed to be discussing right now. But it would make sense for the 49ers. But for the Jets, it's just get this deal done. I think this is another team that...

This is my concern about them. Is that they look at last year, I think we've had this discussion before, but they look at last year and they think, oh, we were just a quarterback short, and the rest of the team is going to come back and be the same exact team they were last year. But if we throw Aaron Rogers into this,

we're going to be a way better team. And I think they really have to be vigilant about maintaining that defense, maintaining the defensive line in the pass rush, which was better last year and I think helped them be better as a defense. And in maintaining the offensive line, the offensive line has to be better, especially if you want to run this style of offense,

like the Shanahan style, it's probably going to look more like Matt LaFleur's offense in Green Bay because, you know, that was adapted for Aaron Rogers in particular. So. Totally. And I think the one thing you could say about Aaron Rogers last year, like I'm not going to go as far as, to say he's washed,

but I think the one thing you can't say about him is that he lost his mobility a little bit. He didn't scramble as much, and he wasn't making as many off-platform throws. And those are the abilities that allow you to work around a mediocre to bad offensive line. Right.

I don't think you can expect, like, 33-year-old Aaron Rodgers to come in here and be mobile and run around and avoid pressure. So, like, I think that's the priority. Beyond, yes, please finish this trade. The sooner the better. Why is this taking it?

And by the same token, I mean, I don't know that you can, like, Dwayne Brown is 37 years old. Mackay Beckton's availability is not something to count on. They drafted Max Mitchell in the fourth round last year, but he dealt with, I think, a blood clot issue at, uh, for a few months of last season. So that's,

the status there is I don't think something that you can feel totally confident about either. Um, I don't think they totally know who their center is. is they added West Schweitzer from Washington. Interior alignment, he could play center, but I think they might want him to play guard. They can still re-sign Connor McGovern, but for whatever reason they haven't,

they added Tristan Cologne from Baltimore, who's another center, but, you know, for a veteran minimum deal, basically. So I do think they have a chance if they do keep focusing on the offensive line, that could get better, particularly, you know, assuming Elijah Vera Tucker is healthy and developing. You have some opportunity for that group,

which I still look at as a unit that's on the rise and it seems like they want to put resources in there, but definitely has some questions and some holes that they need to fill. That should definitely be a priority. And then like you said, I do give them credit because they were in on Fletcher Cox. It seems like they know that they have to keep stocking the cupboard on the defensive line. But doing that especially after losing, you know, Nathan Shepard and Sheldon Rankins,

neither of whom is like a huge name there and they have a deep group there. But Rankins played 50% of the defensive snaps. Shepard played 37. That's a significant thing to move on from just from a depth. perspective. So there's definitely stuff like that, but if they don't get this Roger's trade done, this is a disaster. So that's probably really the only thing that matters. I don't know how Joe Douglas survives. Like barring the team going like making the playoffs next year, if they botched this situation, which maybe I'm just like reading the headlines wrong,

but it seems like it's becoming more of a possibility by the day that this trade doesn't ultimately happen? I still think it will, but if it doesn't... I think it will. You have to look at Joe Douglas a little differently if your ownership, if he fumbles this bag. Yeah. I just don't understand how that's possible. Because here's the thing is that as badly as the Jets need to make this happen, so do the Packers. Yes. That's true. Which should make it easy to say, all right, they'll get it done. No worries. At the same time, it makes it weirder that it hasn't happened yet. I mean, I understand that Joe Douglas would love to

get this done without giving up the 13th pick. I guess I think the fact that it hasn't happened yet makes it more likely that he will be able to do that just because I do, I do think pretty clearly that if he called Gouda Kuntz right now and said, Aaron Rogers for number 13 straight up, like that's a done deal. They shake hands. It's done by the afternoon. So I'm sure like figuring out the right balance of compensation, getting to Green Bay relatively quickly, but also ensuring the jets have some conditions on stuff that influences what

they'd pay if Rogers decides that he only has one year left or isn't with them for the long term. protecting that, I'm sure, is a big part of the conversation. Figure it out, guys. You can do it. It's going to be okay. You could do it. The thing that I haven't heard talked about that I wonder if it ends up being a part of where they end up is they could put a condition on it where the Jets give a significant pick next year. And then the condition is that Green Bay has to send some.

something back in 2025 if Rogers doesn't hit a certain either performance level or play a certain number of games in 2024. Because I think one of the things that's that's stickiest about this is Green Bay being like, 2025 draft picks don't mean anything to us right now. Like, screw that. We want capital and we want it faster. But the Jets saying, we're worried about this guy being on our team in 2020. and if we don't attach conditions to something in 25,

we have no way of controlling for that. And I do think that one way of fixing that would be, okay, Jets, give the Packers draft picks sooner, and then have the conditions, instead of the conditions being, the Jets give you a pick that becomes X, Y, Z in 2025, if he plays, have it be give them more up front and then have the Packers have to owe you something back if Rogers doesn't stick. So that's my two cents.

That's my, I know everybody's favorite game these days is playing Joe Douglas and Brian Gutakoun's make a deal. But that is how I would do it. I feel like the Jets are just overcomplicated. Just give them the 13th pick. I know like it seems like they're

opposed to giving up that first round pick. But I would just give the 13th pick and just be done with it and not think about this ever again. I'm not mad about it. If they, like, there is a, simplicity in that. There's also, I do think that if you're Joe Douglas and you give up the 13th pick for Aaron Rogers, even if it doesn't work out very well, I think you can sleep at night, right? Like, I think you can, you know, look your, I don't even know if Joe Douglas is married, but I was going to say you can look your wife and kids in the eye and say, I needed to bring Aaron Rogers to New York. I needed to make him a jet. We had the 13th pick. That's what it took. It's, you know, look at what Russell Wilson costs. Right. Just wear Russell Wilson Broncos jersey to every press.

conference for the rest of your 10 years. I think you're okay there. The flip side of that is that if you are Joe Douglas and you just drafted Sauce Gardner and Garrett Wilson, I think you're kind of like,

come on, let me get another. Let me do another. Let me make another pick. Send me back into the first round. I got a hot hand. That's honestly what I think it is. I think he's overvaluing his ability to draft. And that's like something I brought up earlier.

like teams are very confident in their evaluation abilities. And I just like the 13th pick, you don't even know who's going to be there. First round picks are a little overvalue to me, especially if they're not like in the range where you can draft a quarterback. And obviously the Jets aren't, they're interested in Aaron Rogers and no one else. So just give up the 13th pick already. All right. The Titans are up next.

We will be right back after this. Tennessee. Quarterback. Yes. Ryan Tannhill, 34 years old, contract year. Hurt last season. Mike Rable started Josh Dobbs,

who'd been with the team for three weeks in place of Malik Willis. Doesn't seem to be a fan of Malik Willis. Does not seem to like that young man. So, yeah, I think they have the 11th pick. Wouldn't be shocked if they are in the Will Leavis

they have a Will Levese vibe to them as well. Yeah, very much. Or an Anthony Richardson vibe to them as well. Other than that, this is a very weird roster. This team is in a very weird spot. It seems like they fired John Robinson for sort of pushing them into a bit of a roster tear down,

but then they replace him with Rancarthon and kind of go, okay, well, We're already, we're too far into the teardown to backtrack from it. So they released Taylor Luan, Nate Davis, ends up in Chicago, cut Bud Dupree, cut Ben Jones, released Robert Woods, who ended up in Houston, Zach Cunningham, DeMarcus Walker ended up in Chicago. Like, the Titans are going through a tear down. And I don't think they wanted to be necessarily, but they kind of,

are. So either one of these quarterbacks, if that's what they end up doing, is going to be a little bit more of a project. And I don't know. I would be a little bit nervous just because I think the cupboard is going to be fairly bare. Yeah. What are you dropping

this rookie quarterback into? Like Kyle Phillips is penciled into the starting lineup right now. Racie McMath will be in a training camp competition for a starting gig. Racing McMat sounds like like someone opened up the voting to name a boat and that was the name that one. You know, like when like...

Voting McBoat face. Yeah, like that. That's what it sounds like. And like you look at the defensive roster, like this defense down the stretch last year was one of the worst defenses in the NFL. They were like kind of passable and they were kind of carrying the team through the first half, but then it just, it just went to shit in the second half and I don't see any obvious upgrades. Like Kevin Byard, I think his, I still think he's a good player, but I think his best is behind him. Christian Fulton, I think is a good player, but he's had some trouble staying on the field.

Caleb Fairly, the first round pick, I think two years ago now. I mean, he came into the league with injury concerns and he has done nothing to alleviate those since coming into the league. So it's like the Titans, it's like the bare bones of the Titans roster that you've gotten to know over the last three years. Only they've gotten rid of like the stars. Like AJ Brown has gone, obviously. And I really think like John Robinson was right to maybe he was a little early, a little early for Mike Vrable's liking, tearing down this roster. Because you could make the argument, they could have made the playoffs that they kept

AJ Brown last year. AFC South was there to win. And they obviously they played for it in the last week starting Josh Dobbs. But I mean, you're not winning the Super Bowl. You weren't winning a Super Bowl with the 2020 Tennessee Titans roster. So it made sense to tear down. And now it seems like they're in. this weird situation where you look at the roster

and I think you say, like, very astute you look at it and you're like, yes, we need to rebuild. I don't think Mike Ravel looks at it like that, though. And I think that's one of the reasons why he kind of clash with John Robinson was, Vrable comes off as someone who I think, thinks he can win no matter what. You give him a decent enough roster.

He's going to make a playoff team out of it. And he's probably right to believe that. In that division, it's not the craziest, like, it's not the craziest strategy. And I think he's a really good coach. I think he routinely, right, he gets more out of less, but... He's not thinking on those terms either. He's not thinking like, oh, what's the ceiling of this roster?

Oh, can we win a Super Bowl with it? He's like, oh, let's win some football game. Let's win our next football game. And while I do think that's commendable when you're the coach of a team, when you have a bigger say in running the team and the direction of the team, then it gets a little iffy. And I think they're in that iffy spot where they're kind of in limbo. And I don't know.

I think they need even like an even bigger tear down of this roster. Like why is Ryan Tannihill still here? He should not still be on the roster. Or Derek Henry. Or Derek Henry. Carthon said at the owner's meetings that he was not a not on the trading block. There have been some reports to the contrary, certainly. I don't know if that's true.

And he has to say that, right? Like what's he going to say? But I don't see why he shouldn't be. And I know Derek Henry's been, you know, he's been the face of the team, heart and soul of a franchise. And I think that's like, that's going to be sort of

one of the more emblematic things in how committed are they and how committed is able to doing this and to starting fresh. But the reason why I bring that up, though, is because I think that, like, I would say they're not even like in year one

of a rebuild. I still think they're in that like year zero, that awkward year. Yeah. where drafting a quarterback doesn't even really make too much sense. Like, drafting quarterback that highly, I mean. Whereas I think they should kind of take the Texans approach where the Texans, they drafted Davis Mills.

Was he a second round pick? I know he was day two. And kind of let him prove himself and it didn't work out. But I think that makes more sense when you're still kind of trying to reset the roster. Rather than you drop Anthony Richardson into that offense, like a guy that needs some development. I don't think he's as big of a project. as people make them out to be.

But he clearly needs development. You drop him into that offense. And I think it's a disaster, a disaster. You dropped Will Levis into that offense. We saw that at Kentucky last year when he played with a bad sporting cast. It wasn't pretty. So if I'm them, I'm not even thinking about quarterback, but that seems to be the rumor out there is that they're very much in on a quarterback

and they're willing to trade up for one. And I just think that makes no sense at all. Yeah, it's a really, it's an odd situation. Beyond quarterback, I think finding Taylor Luan's long-term replacement is going to be a big deal for this team, whether that's this year, whether that's next year at some point. They signed Andre Dillard from Philly and Free Agency and Daniel Brunskill from San Francisco. So they have tackle options, but that's going to be a big one. I'm very much with you that I think adding a cornerback, just given that their guys have been some combination of underwhelming. and injured there.

And Brable does, you know, he's not a direct Belichick descendant in the same way as some of these other guys, but there's still a team that, that defense is at its best when they have good corners. So there's a bunch of stuff that they could do, but they are, to me, one of the hardest teams to read for

where do you think you are in a rebuild, tear down whatever cycle? And I'll be really curious to see what happens with Derek Henry, just because I think that'll be that'll sort of clue us in a little bit more. They do have, you know,

they have all their picks, 11, 41, 72. So they have some stuff to work with, but they're in a strange spot. Speaking of the Patriots, New England. I would be interested to hear your thoughts on this to you.

It's strange. It's a strange situation. Apparently Mac Jones has been shopped and maybe we should add quarter back to the list of needs. They weren't on my list. Yeah. Or it wasn't on my list of needs, but apparently Belichick thinks differently. Yeah. So Mike

Gloria and Pro Football Talk reported on Tuesday that the Patriots have shopped Mac to multiple teams, including the Raiders, the Texans, the bucks, and the commanders, which is kind of wild after you hire Bill O'Brien.

It's crazy. Call Kyle. He loves Mac Jones. let's just put them on that list. Let's be the Fox Sports people that made up the Aaron Rogers rumor. Let's start that rumor right now. The 49ers are in on Mac Jones. But it's like it's not,

it is not crazy by the way. Like that is so not crazy given how badly the Trayland situation is going, which was the guy that, you know, by all reports, Kyle Shanhan loved Mac Jones and that draft and was kind of talked out of it. To go with Lance, which I think is in the moment I thought was a good call,

but I could understand being him and being like, I wish that my life had just been simpler for the last couple of years and that we just drafted Mack Jones. So it wouldn't be crazy. They could even, they could do a quarterback swap. And the thing that's, the thing that's interesting about that is because the part that doesn't click to me about them trying to trade Mac now is just how low they would be selling.

Because he's coming off a bad year. And I think it's really fair to hang a lot of that on Matt Patricia and what was going on with that offense and the coaching. But it's not as though you're coming off of his rookie season even going, oh, wow, like really might have something. But if you're the 49ers who also have some quarterbacks who might be in a cell low situation, maybe you can work. something out. I don't really know what New England Patriot Tray Lance does for anybody, but... I'd be excited. Crazier things have happened.

I think it makes more sense for the composition of that offense, which seems to be an offense that needs to be able to run the ball. Like, if you want to run play action, you have to be able to run the ball a little bit. I know there's no correlation between the success, but I think you have to play that style of offense. Yeah. Also, like, we can say that there's no correlation until we're blue in the face, but two-thirds of the coaches in the NFL refused to act like it.

And the defensive coordinators seem to act like it. So if they believe it, I think it does matter a little bit. But this team, like, the metaphor I made last off-season was this was a team trying to play chess, but they had, they only had ponds.

They had no real pieces. They didn't have any kings or queens to move on the chessboard. And, like, you need that. You need to put constraints on a defense with your personnel. You need a receiver where the defense can't just be like, all right, we're just going to cover them with our second corner one-on-one on the outside.

And we're going to be fine. We can load the box. You can't run on us. They need coverage dictating talent at the receiver position, something they haven't had since Randy Moss, probably. Maybe Wes Welker, if you think he's that type of player. But that's what they need. Gronk is the best example for that team.

Yeah. So they need star power. I think, like, I'm not the biggest Mac fan. I don't think Mac Jones, I would not have drafted them in the first round. Shocks. But I don't think he got a fair shot last year. And I think last year wasn't indicative of his true talent level. And in order to give him a chance, this is another team, need to build up the offensive line,

need to get some receivers that put some fear in the defense. And do that. And if Mac fails, then I think it's time to move on. But there's no reason to move on after two years. That's too quickly. Give them three years. And then let's talk about it. If they move on for Mac, it doesn't have to, it's not a performance thing.

It's, uh, I do think that people will come to a greater understanding of how fractured that situation has gotten because I do think if you're Mac Jones, it's, it was very fair to go through last season as I think he did going, what are you guys doing? You're putting me in a horrible position. Matt Patricia does not know what he's doing. This offense doesn't work for me. I'm openly questioning it. which is something that Bill Belichick hates.

I think there were a lot of issues having to do with the fact that when Mac lost that kind of trust in the coaching that he was getting, he was relying on, you know, people from Alabama and people in his circle who he does trust to sort of either vent to or just go like, all right, what's my plan here? How do I sort of navigate my job right now as opposed to being like fully. in the system which Belichick views as you use our people for everything and you talk to our people for everything. And, you know, this was something that became in a different way, an issue with Brady, right, with the way that he managed his training and treatment. And I think they've gone through a little bit of that too, just because I think Mack had very justifiable skepticism about the advice and the coaching that he was getting

with their offensive staff. I will say though, but I do think that kind of makes sense based on the type of prospect Matt Jones was billed as. Like, I think he was the, I don't know how to put this, but like the prototypical quarterback where he was going to come in,

he was going to lead the locker room. He wasn't a flashy prospect. He didn't have the strongest arm. He doesn't have athleticism. He's a guy that gets by on doing the right thing, every time. And I think over the last two years, like even on the football field,

we kind of saw that that wasn't really the case. Like when things break down, he kind of loses his mind a little bit and makes some weird plays. But then when the off-field stuff happens. He had some incidents of trying to do way too much. Especially at the beginning of the year of this year. Yeah.

Yeah. But and then now you have like... I was throwing picks and... Yeah. And now you have like this like off-field tension, which I do think he's justified. Like, you give me, Matt Patricia and Joe Judge

as offensive coordinator and quarterback coach. I would be complaining. I would be complaining, but I don't think Belichick sees it that way. Whether that's a good thing or a bad thing, I think it's probably a bad thing. Yeah, totally. That's spot on. So I think like the perception of like what Belichick thought he was getting

when he drafted Matt Jones has really been soured. And I think that's the reason why this looks like a relationship that just needs to end. But I still think it's a year early. And I think there's an easy one to mend. And I think Bill O'Brien bringing him in was a good first step because Bill O'Brien was with Alabama. Like that is kind of giving Mac what he was looking for at the end of last year.

Yeah. And that's right. And I think Bill O'Brien is a good hire for that. I also think not Matt Patricia is the meaningful piece. Beyond figuring out whatever happens, at the quarterback position, which I agree with you. I don't think this is happening. I don't think that it's completely, you know,

I don't think this is coming out of thin air. But I think it's unlikely just because it's hard to think of that many good landing spots where the compensation would make sense on both ends because I'm sure the Patriots would want something reflecting, okay, we drafted this guy in the first round and he had a pretty good rookie season and see him as someone who could be a long-term starting quarterback,

but also is coming off a bad year. Beyond that, I really like the chess with all pawns analogy because there's no glaring weakness, an absolute, oh my gosh, you have to fix this need on the roster. But they're pretty just okay, kind of everywhere.

I mean, at some point, I don't know if it's this year, it's not a great draft for receivers, and this is a team that has a particularly scarred history in drafting receivers with significant picks. But at some point, they are going to have to get a wide receiver one. Like, at some point, this team needs to have an impact player or receiver. You tell me, Devonte Parker, isn't that guy?

No, yes, that is what I am telling you. Ju-Ju-Slooster, isn't that guy? Devante Parker, Kendrick Bourne, and Jujis M. Schuster are all nice players who can contribute but it's just not enough. They're pawns.

They're ponds. They're ponds. And Corner is an area where they have done well in being able to find guys in the draft but I think

particularly in adding someone who's a little bit bigger because some of their guys, Jack Jones, Miles Bryant, are a little bit on the small side. You need another guy who's a shutdown cover corner.

I think we've talked about this a bunch. That is when Bill Belichick defenses are at their best, is when they have those guys and they do have a decent track record of finding them. So wouldn't mind seeing them do that. the defensive line too I mean Matt Judon always gets a bunch of sacks but they stunt the living

daylights out of him to get him there they found Joshua Jay who's promising but there's just really nowhere like the offensive line they've got a decent starting five but no depth there's nowhere where they couldn't benefit from adding real star power they need a big draft they need like

the draft and there's been talk about Belichick's drafting record of late. So I really think they need one. They need a draft similar to the one New Orleans had. And I think it was 2017 where it looked like the Peyton Bree's era was on its last breath. Or the Seahawks from last year. Or the Seahawks from last year. And they bring in a bunch of guys. And the Seahawks were in the same situation. Look like the Seahawks were in decline. They nail the draft class. And it fixes everything. I think that's the thing. We're speaking so pessimistically about the Patriots. But they're one draft class away from being right back where they were two years ago when

there was a lot more optimism surrounding this team. Oh, totally. Because look, the other way to say they're pretty just okay across the board is this is a roster that doesn't have any clear glaring weaknesses. They are a professional football team pretty much everywhere. And I still, while I skew this to the defensive side of the ball, certainly and think that a lot of the decision making that went into the offensive staff last year, goes on Bill Belichick's shoulders.

I still look at this as a well-coached team. I still look at this as a team that gets an advantage from who is on their coaching staff. I do look at it as a team now that is disadvantaged by the division that they're in. But if they nailed a draft class and if whether it's max... They have a lot of picks.

They have a lot of picks. And if they nailed a draft class, if either it gets worked out with Mac and the O'Brien thing goes well and the offense doesn't have the same types of issues that it had last season. If maybe, I mean, Kendrick Bourne, as much as I'm criticizing the receiver room,

Kendrick Boren was one of, had some really, really, really good moments last season, was their most sort of explosive and exciting pass catcher but he was late to a meeting, I think, in like July, and Matt Patricia decided he hated him, and it was all, like, this could turn around. It really could turn around. I'm not optimistic based on the division,

but they're working from a solid foundation. I just think right now they're working with a very low ceiling. Yeah, I would agree that. But the fastest way to fix that would be to absolutely smoke a draft class. Right. Yeah. All right. Last one. the Pittsburgh Steelers.

What you got? A lot of positions. I would put quarterback on the list, but I know like no one else is going to put that. I'm not a big Kenny Pickett fan. I didn't have that as the first, but I had corner. Just because, I mean,

they essentially swapped Cam Sutton for. No, I said quarterback. Oh, you say quarterback. Yeah, I'm talking about Kenny Pickett. I was trying to get some Kenny Pickett slander in there. No, Patrick Peterson's 32. That's totally reasonable. No, no.

I think. cornerback is one thing that they have to address at least. I don't know if it's their top need. They pick 17th. Kind of a weird range to be drafting. And I don't know, you don't know what's going to fall to you. I think they're going to be in a best player available mode,

which makes sense for this team. Because I think this is another team that needs to load up on talent. They have T.J. Watt. Yeah. But I think they need star players. They need to restock their talent cabinet. And we haven't really seen them be an ultra-talented team since the heyday of Brown,

Rothensberger, and Levyon Bell. And until they get back to that, it's hard to compete in the AFC now without that top tier talent. You can't beat the Bengals, you can't beat the Bills, you can't beat the Chiefs without top tier talent. Even like the second tier

is filled with teams that have really, really, really good players. Like Miami is stocked with star talent. Baltimore has a lot of star talent. So they have a long ways to go, and I think this is another thing that really needs to nail, not only one draft class, but I think several draft classes.

And I think they're in a similar spot as the Patriots where they have this young quarterback that they're invested in, but he hasn't proven yet. And Pickett obviously hasn't gotten much of an opportunity to do this, but he hasn't proven yet that he's the guy. And until you find that guy, it's hard to craft a, like, or come up with a direction for the franchise. And I think they're in that weird situation where year two

is going to tell us a lot about Kenny Pickett. I think it's more than fair to judge him after his second year, just because of where he came in as a prospect. He was 24. He spent five years in college. He was billed as a pro-ready guy. If it's not working after year two, I think it's fair to move on from him.

But that's the question here. And I think for the draft, a lot of spots, like a lot of premium positions that they need to refill. So I don't know. I think this is a draft strategy that gets dictated by what happens over the course of the first half,

for the first round. Yeah, I mean, they can definitely be a best player available team. They worked on interior offensive line and free agency. They signed Isaac Samalo from Philly and Nate Herbig from the Jets. Also inside linebacker, Cole Holcomb from Washington and Alandon Roberts. So I think you figure that they feel like they've worked on those positions through free agency and it's probably more offensive tackle

defensive tackle I would look at in the draft for sure. But yeah, I'm like flirting with becoming a Kenny Pickett fan. I think he showed some. I was really low on him as part of it. But I thought he sort of showed

he had flashes last season and he's not in an awesome situation. But I hear you. I just think they either they have to go in, they are in that sort of murky middle. like Tomlin never has a bad season, but they either have to tear it down, pave the way for a different quarterback, try to get an influx of young talent and actually rebuild.

Or it's trickier because I don't know what the path to being really, really competitive in the AFC is. that's the thing. And stuff changes really fast is just if you are in the NFC, the path is so easy. And then when you switch conferences and you're talking about competing

with Mahomes and Burrow and Josh Allen and, you know, at least for now, Lamar and the Dolphins offense and Herbert, Trevor Lawrence, like it's so tough. And I agree with you that it's hard to be like, and Kenny Pickett.

Yeah. sure. And they certainly would need a real influx in star power and ability to be able to get there. And I'm not sure if that would even happen. But they're in a weird spot. They're definitely in an odd. They're in an underratedly, I think, like, I don't know if this is going to work out situation. But then again, it's Tomlin, so it'll be fine.

Yeah. And can you draft an offensive coordinator, by the way? can draft an offense coordinator because Matt Canada somehow is still here much to the dismay of all every Steelers fan I've ever

engaged in a conversation with nobody likes Matt Canada but he's still here and like I kind of get the person like I kind of get Tomlin's perspective of keeping him because you want to keep Kenny picking

in the same offense but it's been like five years since Matt Canada has looked like a good offense coordinator no they are like a guy this is the danger. They're too good to blow it up, but they're not good enough to do anything with it. And there's a stasis creeping into this organization. All right. This has been the Ringer NFL show.

We will be back on Friday going through the playoff teams from the AFC. And then back next week when we'll do the NFC. Thank you to Stephen Anderson for production on this episode, as well as Connor Nevins and our Juno Ramgapal for additional Suburvision.