The Ringer NFL Show - Making Sense of the Texans' Wild Weekend | The Ringer NFL Show

Episode Date: September 2, 2019

Kevin Clark and Robert Mays examine Houston's recent all-in moves, including their franchise-altering trade for Laremy Tunsil and decision to trade Jadeveon Clowney for pennies on the dollar. The guys then analyze what the moves mean for the Seahawks' short-term hopes and the Dolphins' long-term plans before sorting out some other odds and ends from cutdown day. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Your special Labor Day edition of the Ringer NFL show. I'm Robert Mays, joined as always by Kevin Clark. Kevin, how you doing, buddy? You know, we were on the fence about reporting this podcast after the clowny trade. And we talked over the weekend and we said, uh, the clowny trade, I don't know. And then the Texans just sink further into the abyss. And now we have to record an emergency, what the hell are the Texans doing podcast? we had no choice.

There was no way we could let this go. I cannot remember a more bat-shit insane set of moves from an NFL team in such a short period of time. Can you? Well, uh, no, I can't,

but it's, they're going all in and they're still not going to win the Super Bowl. Does that make sense? Like, I understand, I understand what they're doing. Like, they have a better roster for 2019 than they did before the tonsil trade.

But they are, they are acting like they, they have a window that lasts like 25 more minutes. We both made a lot of analogies on Twitter on Saturday as this was happening. I think you compared it to a scenario where there's a cousin Greg-esque figure

just sitting in an office taking these calls unsure of what to do. I mean, he's almost sitting there looking at Tom playing Boer on the floor, being very confused about what's happening. The clowny trade I compared to a guy that won 10 bucks playing Blackjack and then decided to spend 10,000 because he had more money in his pocket.

Yeah. It's so crazy. I really do think that like Bill O'Brien accidentally named someone general manager in secret and then they actually accidentally signed off on the trade and Bill O'Brien was like, you did what? It's it is the strangest thing. I mean, there's a million things to one pack here. But the first one is this is clearly an overreaction to the Andrew Luck thing. Just like we have to figure out a way to keep Deshaun Watson upright. And because I've been thinking about this for a week.

If you have an elite quarterback and he's young, whether that's Deshaun Watson, whether that's Patrick Mahomes, the Andrew Luck thing should scare you a little bit because he was as sure a thing as you could possibly have and he's retired at age 29. And I think that there is now a feeling among people like Bill O'Brien that if we don't do everything we can to protect Deshaun Watson, then we have failed. And I agree with that. However, however, you're way overpaid for Laramie Tunsell. And now, like, maybe the other scenario here is that, like, they all got really into

like weird apocalyptic scenarios and they think this is the last season of NFL football. That's the other option here because they've mortgaged their future for a good left tackle, but a left tackle. So we'll get into the trades themselves and the value and everything else for a second. But the first thing I want to address is that I can't remember which podcast we talked about it on where we were, we just asked kind of the blanket question of how important is it to have a general manager as you enter an off season, you know, with the draft and free agency over how much doesn't matter. And we both concluded that it's very important because a lot of the best teams in the NFL

are teams that are tinkering not only with big portions of the roster, but the margins of their roster through the end of the season. So having somebody to do that matters a whole lot. And the Texans don't have a general manager. And I know the joke, it's funny to say, you know, did he name someone and that guy's doing it. This is Bill O'Brien's. This is all Bill O'Brien's doing. And the apocalyptic scenario thing, I understand that. But in his mind, it might as well be the last season of NFL football.

Because as a head coach, you're always on borrowed time. And that's why head coaches shouldn't be in charge of personnel decisions. Because their timeline and their understanding of what matters three years from now is not important. Bill O'Brien, the Texans think. on this is that the hit rate on picks in the 20s is very small if you look at it over a three-year period. I had this on good authority. And the problem with that thinking is there's a chance that in two years the Texans aren't picking in the 20s. If DeShon Watson gets hurt either this year or next year, which by the way, even with Laramie Tunsel is certainly not out of the question

because the rest of the line isn't very good. This team can be picking on the top 10. And then you're given the eighth overall pick to the dolphins, and in two years, you're screwed. It's just, it's not a smart way to think no matter how good you think you're going to be over a three-year period. I understand going all in, but this is an entirely different conversation. Well, also, I understand going all in if you're the chiefs, and you have, you almost won the Super Bowl last year. You were an overtime away from getting to and winning the Super Bowl, okay? The Texans are not there. I think that what's funny about the, is the GM important thing is we were talking about small moves.

We were talking about like the Eli Apple trade. Okay. We weren't talking about remaking your entire future in a day. I think that's the interesting thing. And, you know, I think, you know, it comes back to football guys. And I don't want to paint with too broad a brush here because Bill Belichick is a football guy. Hallie Roseman in large part is a football guy, even though he was never a coach. But football guys tend to not understand value.

They only understand the roster and what's in front of them. They do not understand, you know, sort of the new realities. You know, one of the things I did a Sashi Brown piece a couple weeks ago, and there were people in football and outside football who were like, no one learned anything from the Browns. Not one person was like the Browns crushed it, even though they did. They got a ton of picks and you cannot build the roster they have now without getting a bunch of picks. They basically showed you can have two first round picks forever.

Do they have missteps? Absolutely. In fact, Deshawn Watson is one of them. of those missteps, but you have to imagine that someone at some point is saying, wait, is the fact that the Browns had a bunch of high picks, did that, did that help them? Yes, it did. Don't trade them away. You cannot win, you know, listen, they traded a first round pick for Deshawn Watson.

I understand that. I get that. That's fine. But if you're just going to keep doing that for every good player on your roster, eventually the well is going to run dry. That's how the draft works. The draft is extremely valuable. The smart teams understand how to play the draft.

The Texans are not a smart team. And there's a limit to this, right? We talk all the time about getting the most out of your quarterback on a rookie contract, but your quarterback is still going to have a second contract. And you'd like some assets to continue building your team. When your quarterback becomes expensive, the most important thing that you need at that point is relatively cheap, affordable assets, including players on rookie contracts.

They just gave away two of them. I understand there's a middle ground here that the Texans did not find it. I mean, it is just incredible what they gave up in this trade. And I understand that they're better now. I said that when it happened, they are. And I think that Kenny Stills is weirdly intriguing because Will Fuller's hurt all the time. And he provides some insurance as a deep threat in that offense. I mean, it's undeniable that they're better. But what they gave up is just crazy. Okay, this is the football equivalent of not studying for a test than trying to cram the morning of. Okay. That's right. I certainly have. is applicable to that as well. No, no, that's what I'm saying, is that you're trying to do an off-season's worth of moves in 24 hours. If they had traded Clownie or attempted to trade Clownie before the tender deadline, just at the draft when you could have gotten the most forum. Sure. And you had a GM, by the way. You could have started negotiating with teams that could sign him to a long-term deal at that point, which they cannot now. He would have had less leverage to explicitly say where he was going to go. Also, there was, you know, there's, there's just a simple matter of there were probably

teams that he wouldn't want to go to that could have tempted him with a bigger, more lucrative long-term contract. And maybe the dolphins are one of those. I have no idea. But what I'm saying is that they just sort of tried to cram everything in there. If they had said, hey, we can pay King's ransom for a left tackle. They would probably have been able to get a good left tackle for far less than that. There were reports yesterday that basically the reason this trade went down like it did was the Dolphins said Larry Mutantso was not available. And then the Texans just kept going and going and going until they got him. And so it's kind of ludicrous that they, I mean, this is just the, you know, Moneyball is, I think, the best book, maybe about sports ever, right? And there's a

line in there where Billy Bean says, if you have to do something, you're screwed. And I think about all the time. And this is having to do something. And not surprisingly, they were screwed. And that happened twice in the same day. Somebody, an executive with team, a couple, like last month, we were talking about a totally unrelated issue. And he brought up the idea of the longer you wait, the more you have to pay for information. And this is how, this is exactly what just happened. I mean, they had to pay to gain the information necessary about how the market was going to fall, all of that stuff. And think about, it's actually a really interesting kind of comparison, because consider what happened with the Seahawks and Frank Clark, right? They also franchise tag

their elite pass rusher. And look at what they traded him for. Look at the hole they got. Imagine if you got, maybe it's not even the same hall for Clownie if you do this before the deadline happens. But even if it's a first round pick, how much more palatable is the tonsil trade if you have an extra first round pick in the equation? It changes the entire calculus of this. It's all related. I'm 100% agree with you. By the way, I've now named like 40 books, the best sports book of all time.

I just need to, I just realize that. Every team is going to be good and hedging your bets with every NFL team in 2019. It's a smart approach. I actually didn't do that. I actually just said the Cioxs are going to be good, which you disagreed with me on,

which should lead us into our CX discussion in which you just backtrack. Like, you know, when I said that on Twitter on Saturday, it was kind of a joke. I still have concerns about this team, but it is really. Can they win the Super Bowl? I still think it'd be a long road.

Just based on what they have on offense. Coney's a nice player, but I'm not sure he swings that entire thing. No, I'm just saying. I will say I move them into that tier. They were already on the edge to me, but I moved them into that tier with Baltimore and with the Texans and everybody else. I was willing to do that. I adjusted my preseason power rankings because of this trade.

It was one spot. But again, that one spot to us was kind of the color. Can I say something? The Texans are still in my group of 17, but I actually feel like moving them out because yesterday suggested that maybe they're just going to keep doing crazier and crazier moves until they're out of it.

Even if the team is better, it gives you less hope about them going forward. I actually understand that. They're going to, they're weirdly just going to, you know, in week nine, just be like,

we're going to bench Deshaun Watson for some reason to save him. I don't even know. I mean, like, this is not normal behavior. They're not thinking rationally. They're on tilt. Yes, that's totally fair.

And obviously the Seahawks are in the opposite scenario. The Seahawks and what they were able to do this offseason, the picks they got for Clark being able to get, you know, not the same. I mean, I think Clark and Clawney are probably similar in terms of overall production. You know, Clowny is a little bit more of a unique asset. You have to move him around. It's necessary to be creative with him. You can't just throw him on the edge and hope that he's going to be a dominant force playing and play out. But I do think if you have a defensive coordinator that's willing to kind of

do some fun stuff. He's just a really disruptive player. So if you consider that and the fact that they traded a third round pick for him and we forgot to mention that the Texans paid a $7 million signing bonus for Clowny. Sweeten the deal. It's unbelievable. So Seattle will be paying half for Clowny of what they would have for Frank Clark. And they got two first round picks in the deal.

Or in the first round pick in the deal. Excuse me. We won first round pick in the deal. Everyone's like, I want a 30 for 30 on like the deal. or whatever. Here's what I want. Okay. I'll try to do this at some point. What I want to know is what the phones looked like after the tons will trade. Because I guarantee you that some smart executive called about like D'Andre Hopkins.

Oh, you have to. Because why not? You have to call about JJ Watt at that point and be like, yeah, we're looking to unload a seventh round pick. We like your Watt guy. What do you think? Just see what happens. So with Seattle, I think that now, one of the. reason, and I know what's one player, but when you're talking about addressing what is arguably the biggest need on your team, and outside past rusher, even with Ansa in the fold, I think was Seattle's biggest need. And now they have it. I think that in Nichols situations, there's still some stuff to be addressed because one of Cloudy's biggest strengths is that you can move him inside. And if you

move him inside, then who do you put on the outside with Ansa if he's healthy? I think there's still some stuff to think about when it comes to the Seahawks. But I do think the talent that they have in their front six now if everyone is right, it becomes intriguing. And if that can make up for what is a very young secondary that has some question marks, all right, let's see what happens. I think that now you can be a little bit more excited about their prospects long term as a defense, just because he does unlock some other pieces. I totally agree with you. And one of the things about the Seahawks is, again, they have an incredibly good front office who understood the value here. They get a Kings ransom of Frank Clark, don't have to pay him. I understand there's some risk with

Clowny. He could walk. But you said, I mean, he could walk. Who cares? No, no, no. You get a comp pick. Yes. So you just, you get a compick for him. And then you pay him essentially nothing.

And then you're getting rid of Barquevius Mingo who you're going to cut and another linebacker. Who cares? Literally, who cares? There's no. What you pay an average defensive end for that. There's no actual risk. You will get a third round pick in a comp if he leaves.

So you, it's basically is. zero-sum game for them, and then plus they get clowny. Yeah. It's an unbelievable home run. And again, it's about making the other pieces on your front four better. It's a little bit different, and they're not the same caliber of player. But when the Bears traded for Mac last year, the reason I was so excited about it was beyond the prospect of having Khalil Mack on your team.

It was understanding what having that piece in your front seven does to the rest of your front. It makes everybody better just by virtue of the numbers. And that's why I'm so excited about Clowny. It's not just his talent that makes the Seahawks better. It's what happens to the rest of your players because he's there. And again, he's not Camille Mack, but he's still an unbelievably disruptive presence. It reminds me a little bit of what John Dorsey told me where he said, okay, well, everyone talks about building around Baker Mayfield and the offense and going

all in on Baker Mayfield, but they also do the same thing on defense with Miles Garrett. and that Garrett now has all of these pieces in the front seven that will unlock Garrett, whether that's it'll be a burning on the other side, whether that's Larry O, obviously in the middle, he was there last year, but it's just a different look for them, Richardson, obviously. And so it's just, it's not just going all in on your offense. You can go all in on your front seven too. And Clowny's going to unlock some things with their front seven now. Yeah, I'm with you.

I think that it's, again, it's a move that has a domino effect with the rest of your team. And that's why I think it has such an impact for them. And to do it for nothing, God, that's incredible. I mean, I think a lot of people tweeted out the picture of John Schneider wearing that belt in the locker room. And after the Super Bowl, I'm not sure he's ever just like deserved it more than he did this weekend. Because what he pulled off is amazing. I'm photoshopping your face on that belt when they win the Super Bowl. I'm willing to accept that.

That's totally fine. All right, before we move on, let's take a quick break. The two thirds of guys experiencing noticeable hair loss by age 35. most guys assume losing their hair is inevitable as they age. Some don't care. Some shave their head, some embrace hats. What knows I do. But what they don't know is their FDA-approved medications designed to stop hair loss,

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That's get roman.com slash ringer NFL for a free visit to get started. Go to get Roman.com slash ringer NFL. And while we're here, for over 20 years, DirecTV has been the exclusive home to NFL Sunday ticket the only way to get every live game every Sunday. Good news, NFL fans, DirecTV has expanded the service. If you're a student actively enrolled in college or university, you can now get NFL Sunday ticket without a satellite. Plus, there's an exclusive student discount. See if you're eligible, go online to NFL Sundayticket.tv and stream every NFL Sunday ticket game this season to follow your favorite team, matter where you live. Use promo code Ringer at checkout to save 15%.

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and that's the Miami Dolphins. I, when we heard about them shopping tonsil, or the tonsil was available, or the, you know, it was whatever. But that seemed to not even be true. It just, the text is. And it didn't make sense to me, because why would you trade a young, really, I mean, let's, first of all,

let's kind of hit reset about how good Laramie Tunsell is, because Laramie Tonto is a good left tackle. Laramie Tonsel is not Taran-Steaded, Tyron Smith. And now Walter Jones here. No. Larry Tonsel is a good left tackle. He's very good left tackle, and he's young. He'd be worth the biggest left tackle contract of all time when he comes up in a couple of years.

He should be asking for it right now from Houston, who has zero leverage and a ton of cap space. That's totally fine. But he is not, you know, this, you know, we're all world player. That being said, he is still a very, very. good young player. And if you're a Miami team that one has an endless pool of cap space next season, they're going to have $100-something million. They have no building blocks.

And you're probably going to be drafting a quarterback in the top three next year. Wouldn't you want a really good left tackle to kind of help ensure your quarterback succeeds? That was my thought process initially. That being said, it's really hard to turn down two first round picks for anybody. Take the picks. I mean, you're rebuilding or tearing it down. Just take the picks. The dolphins, I guess, we're not going to, listen, there have been rumblings for months.

They were going to do a full-on tank. Then there were rumblings. Well, Brian Flores isn't going to allow that because Brian Flores is competitive. Well, there's a couple of things. Number one, I don't think it's now a question of whether or not Brian Flores will allow a tank. I think the tank is on because of the roster talent. Okay. This is not a competitiveness thing.

This is a talent thing. So they're going to lose a lot of games. they're going to be in real position to draft high the next two years. And that's important. The next two years is quite a window. And, you know, if you don't, if you believe that you can get your guy in two years, then you can trade out this year, kind of like what the Browns have done. Kind of, you know, the Titans did that a couple years ago.

And so there's a lot, there's a lot to work with for them. And they're going to have a lot of picks to do it. And I thought that it was so weird, this sort of meme that went around afterwards. It was like, well, draft picks are working. worthless if you don't hit the picks. Well, okay. What just happened here? Like, we've always known that. That's the point of maximizing your picks. That's why you get more picks. Because it's all sort of random. Like Jeffrey Lurie said this. I've talked to a million people about this. The Eagles and the Patriots' Offensive draft philosophy is just to get a bunch of picks

because it's all random. Like Bill Belichick is not a good drafter in large part. No one is a good drafter. We know this. It's, proven over the course of like 15 years. I thought it was interesting. There was a study a couple months ago I saw that basically the Packers and the Seahawks were the two teams that in the last couple of years have done better, last decade or so I've done better than everybody else. But then you look at a team like the Ravens. The Ravens had a historically high hit rate and then they kind of tailed off a little bit. You know what I mean? Everyone does. Everyone does. You can be a little bit better.

Joe Banner said this couple in my Sashi Brown story actually, but he said essentially Jimmy Johnson is the one that taught the Eagles about the process, because Jimmy Johnson certainly processed those cowboys, okay? And one of the things he said was, listen, if you have a GM who's a little bit better than everybody else, if you give him a lot more picks, eventually that 1%, 2%, 3% edge is going to be massive because it's 3% on a bunch of picks instead of 3% on one pick. That's all we know about the draft. That's all that's definitive. And the dolphins have put themselves in an excellent situation. my thing now is, okay, you have two first

round picks next year, I believe you have an extra second round pick next year, a couple like, I mean, they're loaded. I can't even list them all off. It would take like 20 minutes. But now you have so much ammunition. Here's my thing, and this is why I think it's tough, and the Browns did this very well and they managed to pull it off. If you

have the number one pick, and there's a quarterback there that you really like, let's for hypothetical reasons here, say it's Tua. And if you know you can get that guy now, isn't it tempting to do that rather than wait until 2021 when you may luck into six or six wins or so and have to move up. How do you feel about that? Or do you spend next year just building the infrastructure and know you have two first round picks

in 2021 and you do everything you can to go get your guy? I think there's, I can understand both scenarios. I think that guessing now is really hard. And I think it comes down to, I'm just glad that those guys have a scouting department and a bunch of people who are looking at this because I think that we have always historically been quite wrong when thinking about which quarterbacks are going to hit a year out. I don't think that's necessarily the case before the draft or after the season or come November. But there's a lot of quarterbacks that we've looked at. I think too is a great, great prospect. But there are a lot of quarterbacks that we've looked at a year out and said, this guy is surefire John Elway, plug him in 15 years, and it hasn't really

worked. I mean, someone like Matt Liner. someone like, I mean, do you remember the freaking hype around Brian Brom this time in Brian Brom's last year? And I'm not, I'm in no way comparing Tua to those guys. What I'm saying is, is that these generational quarterback prospects, there's a lot more that's been pegged before their last season than after their last season. That's all I'll say about that. No, that's what I'm, that's kind of my argument here.

So if we get to April and Tua remains that guy, do you, and you have the number one pick, do you take him? Yes. Because there's no way to know about. about Trevor Lawrence, whatever. I think you do too. If they come out and say, we think Tua's the generational prospect after the season, you absolutely take him. There's no reason to wait. I'm just saying you keep your options open. You don't say we have to have a quarterback by next season. No, I think so too. If he's there, I agree with you that

I'd rather have the bird in the hand. Here's my concern about that. Now you're putting him into a situation with absolutely no talent. That's what I'm worried about. And that's why I think there's an argument for using this upcoming draft and all the picks you have in it, again, if someone needs to, which a lot of teams are going to want to, what could you sell that pick for? I mean, you would get unbelievable amounts of return. And you could use that to replenish a roster, start building an infrastructure for the guy you try to find in 2021. There's no certainty that guy is there. But if you have confidence that Trevor Lawrence is that player, then maybe you take a risk and do it. I totally agree with you that there's a ton of down.

downside to that plan. But I still think putting any quarterback onto the roster they're going to have next year is a dicey proposition. Well, part of that, by the way, is that if Trevor Lawrence is the prospect, they think he is, they may not be alone in tanking. No. And they may not be alone in trying to pool everything they can to go up and get him if they're not in the top two or three. That's what I'm saying? What if the bucks, what if the buck's whole thing with James doesn't work, right, in two years? Or Marioota or the Bengals or the Raiders. There are tons of teams that could be in the market for a quarterback in two years. And all it takes is one smart owner to either just tell the coach like we're not winning a game

this year or as I've suggested on this podcast before, hire Mike Mularky and then just tank. Hired to be fired. Hire Mike Malarkey for the tank. The organic tank. You don't have to tell him a thing. Just let him sort it out. I think it's a really interesting argument. I could see both sides of it.

I would say if you believe he's the guy, you take him. but I also think that's where your second year of Ryan Fitzpatrick is really nice. You just toss them out there and say, here you go, buddy. Here's round two. I hope you enjoy that five million bucks. I feel like that's way safer. I'm with you on that one. Poor Josh Rosen.

Or maybe you start Josh Rosen. Who cares? He seems to be a good tank candidate. I said this the other day, and I firmly believe this, if you're another team, let's say you're the teams we talked about before, whether it's new and England, the Chargers. They probably wouldn't trade him to New England, but the Chargers, a team like that, where you're really kind of looking at the end with your quarterback, wouldn't Miami give Josh

Rosen away for like a third round pick right now? What incentive do they have to keep him into next year if they're going to draft somebody? Yeah, I don't know. It's a great question. I would be calling. I don't know what sort of pick that he'd be available for that. I'm sorry, but like, what are you calling about? He can't beat out

Ryan Fitzpatrick Oh, I disagree with that. At some point, Josh Rosen is just not a great quarterback. But I'd still be willing to take a chance. I am not willing to close the book on that.

For a third round pick? You get Jedevi and Clownie for a third round pick, apparently. I would call and see what Rosen would be available for right now. I would be doing it.

If I were a team that needed even a backup quarterback, I'd be willing to do it right now. I feel like the who won the quarterback competition in that place is not say much. Do you think that the Patriots think that Jared Stidham is better than Josh Rosen? I have no idea. How would I possibly know that?

I don't know. I'm just saying that if you, if you are a team, you talk yourself, you develop a quarterback, and at some point you say this guy's probably better than Josh Rosen. I don't think there's a lot of teams right now that would trade a third round pick for Josh Rosen. Third round's probably high. Maybe something less than that. But I would be willing to see exactly how little I could offer for him right now. I would take Josh Rosen. I would take Josh Rosen if it was like a Brock. Oswald or a deal where you also had to take a second round pick. That was a joke, by the way. I'm not actually suggesting that. I was trying to figure that out in my mind.

I would trade a seventh round pick for Josh Rosen. And then I let him in my quarterback. I would do more than that. But your third round is high, but I would definitely see what he was about before right now. So let's just kind of put a bow on the Texans very quickly because I don't think we talked about, and again, necessarily what this means for this season.

We know they're better. What is the Texan sealing right now after the moves that they made? and the same as their stealing last year. AFC South winners, which was probably already confirmed when Andrew Luck retired. They're probably on that track anyway. This still to you doesn't put them

in the same tier as the chiefs and the Patriots and even the Steelers maybe. Getting rid of Clowny and getting tons. Or even the Browns. No, I think that they have the possibility to be better than the Browns because they like the Browns have just a lot of blue chip talent everywhere.

I mean, like, we forget, JJ Watts. I disagree. J.J. Watts is still pretty good. Deshawn Watson is what, in my opinion, a top 10 quarterback. DeAndre Hopkins is quite good. So they have blue chippers. I mean, in a strange way, it almost reminds me a little bit of the conversation around Seattle the other day, where they've just got a handful of players who are top 10 at their position.

And they've got a lot of question marks, but all you need is a couple of things to break right. So I would put them on definitively on the second tier of the AFC. see. And I think they've wasted a lot of resources trying to get to that first tier and they're not going to get there. I think the Browns have a much better roster than Texas. I think that no, no, I agree with you. I said they have a chance to be better than the Browns. But if you're, I think the Texans are a 10-win team and the Browns are an 11-win team. That's probably fair. I just think that there are holes on defense. And now, again, it has the same sort of domino effect for Houston that it did for the Seahawks.

I mean, now you have a pass rushing group that no longer includes Clowny, so you have to lean so much on merciless as that guy. And he was very good last year when he kind of had rehab that injury. But you still now have two high-end pass rushes instead of three, which is a world of difference. They still have question marks in the inside linebacker spots. You have an aging corner in Jonathan Joseph. Bradley Robey is fine. Your corner, Tashon Gibson was okay last year with Houston, but I think he's a downgrade

from what Tyron Matthew was for them and less versatile. So, I mean, their defense, it's hard to find a reason where they'll be nearly as good as last year. And this was a team that already was thriving on a ton of turnover luck on that side of the ball. So, I mean, their offense has a chance to be really good and I think they will be, but I still think that it's hard to imagine a scenario where they're a lot better

than they were last year. Yeah, that's what I said. I mean, they are marginally, they obviously have upgrades in some departments, but they're just, they're not an elite AFC team. All right. Let's knock off a couple tidbits here. Let's stick with one of the elite AFC teams.

The Kansas City Chiefs signed Lashon McCoy after he was cut by the Browns. When he's cut by the bills, does this move the needle to you? Do you care? I think this has way more impact on fantasy football than it does to real actual football. I don't know, man. I mean, I think that he's a good player. I think Andy Reid's going to know how to use them.

I have no idea of the fantasy implications. I saw some of the analysis last night. But I think that it's better to have Lashon McCoy than not have Lashaw McCoy if you can afford it. So I'm in. yeah it's fine with me i think this offense does such a good job getting the most out of its backs that you could plug a lot of guys in there and they'd be really successful especially in the passing game but yeah i mean the equation is probably better with lashon mccoy in it i still don't think

this is something that necessarily puts them over the top anything like that i mean they'll be a little bit better but they were already the best team in the afc to me anyway so i mean it's just a little bit of bolstering their position offensively a couple more a fc east tidbits before we get out of here. I just wanted to mention the fact that the Jets cut a third round pick from this year. The last gas of the Macaghanan era is just unbelievably funny. Also, it was one of those

picks where everyone beforehand was like, this guy probably shouldn't draft this guy. It's like watching yourself lock your keys in your car. Everybody was like, he was dropping so much. He was a first round pick when the draft process

started. He fell to the third round because of just how bad his entire entire process was. He was the Brian Brom of 2019. No, he's just, he's not he's now on the Seahawks practice squad. I mean, that kind of says it all. Seahawks will probably make him into a

pro bowler at some point. Yeah, I'm sure they will. Apparently find ungodly amounts of money for being late all the time and missing practice or whatever. So you probably don't want to take him in the third round. That's my, that's my advice. So this goes back to, again,

something that I've been saying for six months, if you're going to overhaul your franchise, you're going to hire Joe Douglas, who has a nice track record, spending some good front offices. If you're going to do that, what if, and let's not go crazy here,

what if you did that before letting Mike McHaghani in a full draft class and spend like $100 million in free agency? What if we did that? It's a novel idea, man. Who would have thunk it? It may work out. Whatever.

Anything else? Not really. Harry went on IR. It's not particularly notable to me. I think that for the most part, this team is going to have enough receivers. Getting Josh Gordon back again really changes the calculus for that position group. But outside of that, there was nothing that really jumped

out to me. I mean, you know, guys like, you know, Tees-Tabor getting cut by the Lions, that wasn't necessarily a shock, considering how bad he'd been recently. I mean, for the most part, these are names that made a ton of sense. I think that no one really jumped out outside of McCoy, and

he found a job pretty quickly. I mean, that backfield in Buffalo was so crowded that losing him was easy to, it was very palatable. I mean, they're just going to plug Singletarian Gore and Yeldon in there in some sort of, you know, trio and kind of live with it. Running back is not a position where I'm really worried about them especially.

Yeah, that's where I'm at too. Yeah, the cut day was pretty quiet. I mean, the McCoy thing makes sense. For the most part, yeah.

Not their words. Draft of Devon Singletary was flashed. Frank Gore is just immortal. He was always going to make the roster. so not too surprised by anything on Cut Down Day. Yeah, me neither. I mean, the biggest surprises were definitely the Texans losing their mind slowly over the coast of 24 hours, which I don't know. I enjoyed it.

I'm curious to see how it's going to work out for everybody involved. All right, bud. Is that all we got? You hate to see it. All righty. We will be back later this week with our preview podcast. We were going to just do that one, but there was really no way to ignore everything that the Texans did over the weekend. Well, we've previewed the Texans.

We can leave them out of the preview. The Texans are not necessary, but we'll be talking about all the major stuff, you know, who we think is going to make the playoffs, everything else. We'll be getting to that later in the week. And until then, I hope you guys enjoy your Labor Day. Hope you have a nice barbecue going. And we'll talk to you later. Thanks so much for listening to the Ringer NFL show on the Ringer Podcast Network.

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