The Ringer NFL Show - NFL Super Wild-Card Weekend - Saturday Games Recap | Dual Threat

Episode Date: January 14, 2024

Nora and Steven recap the two games from Saturday’s wild-card round, starting with the Chiefs dominating the Dolphins at home. They discuss what’s next for Tua Tagovailoa and the Dolphins, how impressive this win is for the Chiefs, and more(1:15). Then they talk about the Texans comfortably defeating the Browns, C.J. Stroud’s impressive playoff debut, what to make of this Browns season, and more(23:11). Lastly they wrap up by providing their reactions to the Patriots promoting Jerod Mayo to head coach (40:10). Hosts: Nora Princiotti and Steven Ruiz Producer: Isaiah Blakely Additional Production Supervision: Arjuna Ramgopal and Connor Nevins Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey everyone, it's Peter Rosenberg from Cheap Heat. Join me and the fearless, physically large stat guy, Greg, and of course Super Agent 35 under 35 Dipperstein as we tackle the biggest stories in pro wrestling each and every week. To hear us, follow the ringer wrestling show on Spotify or wherever you get your podcast. Stay mage and enjoy yourself. I'm a very warm and toast and steward. Yeah, it is cozy on this pod. Maybe not so much in Kansas City.

But we are having a toasty and warm start to suit. Super wildcard weekend over here in our various dual threat offices. It is Saturday night. The Chiefs just routed the dolphins earlier today. The Texans did the same against the Browns. Those are the first two wildcard games of this weekend. We're going to break them down. We will, of course, be back tomorrow night to talk about those games.

But let's start with what we just watched. The Chiefs beat the Dolphins 26 to 7, Kansas City advances, they will play the Bills in the divisional round if Buffalo wins on Monday since that game, Bill's Steelers was moved to Monday because of the weather in upstate New York. If the Steelers win that game, then the Ravens get the Steelers and Texans Chiefs is the other AFC divisional round matchup. I don't know, Stephen, if you heard, it was very cold in Kansas City for this game? It was a frigid temps, wind chills in the negative 20s.

Were you made aware of this meteorological development? Yeah, yeah, throughout the week. This is the most I've ever heard about Kansas City's weather. And I mean, to be honest, I feel like all of the time we spent talking about the cold and how it might affect one certain quarterback in the game, like it was worth talking about that because that's what it felt like. It felt like one team could throw the ball normally. they could call all their normal past plays.

They didn't have to change their offense. And I'm talking about the Chiefs with Mahomes. And then another team, it felt like their whole identity almost shifted. There weren't any throws downfield really outside of the ball that I would say was underthrown for the touchdown to Tyree Kill by Tuah. But in the middle of the field, 10 to 25 air yards, in between the numbers. That's the part of the field that Miami dominated throughout the year. Tua had 88 total EPA in that area.

He attempted two passes to that part of the field tonight for minus 2.5 EPA, one interception and then one completion. But only two attempts into that area. Like when you take that area away from the Dolphins, the offense just isn't what we expect from them. And we saw that tonight. You just ran with that into the Dolphins almost got shut out, were it not for one underthrown pass that Tyree Kilt turned into a touchdown.

I was like ready to talk about the Andy Reeves. snot stash sickle and the exploding beer cans. And Stephen was like, no, let's get down to business. The Dolphins got creamed offensively. But they did. I mean, they absolutely did. And I think this was the type of environment where it's fair to some degree to be affected, obviously, by the conditions.

But it didn't really seem like it was just... the weather, right? It's, it's some of the same issues that have, have plagued Miami where once that, you know, borrowing that Ben Solac phrase that we've, we've adopted, once the grain of sand gets in the gears there, it all falls apart. And that was even despite the fact that, you know, too had plenty of time to throw. And it wasn't as though the spag's pressure just absolutely demolished him in his face. I mean, some, some piece of the cold conditions makes it very hard on a pass rush to get off. So the dolphins really struggled offensively, obviously, but it wasn't quite in the

exact way that we thought it could. What did you think about the spags versus two a dynamic and how it played into this really brutal loss? Oh, yeah. Like going into the game, I think we all thought he was going to try to, like, bully him. And like, we were going to see a bunch of cover zero and a bunch of blitzes and put two under pressure, make them throw quickly. And that's not what we saw.

I think at one point, on the broadcast, they said it was the highest time to throw for Tua all season long. It was up over like 2.7, which is crazy for two. It was usually down around 2.2, 2.3. And then we didn't see one rep of cover zero in the first half from Spax. He did dial it up a couple times in the second half, a couple, I think it was three times. I think the approach was we're not going to show them our cards in the first half and let them make adjustments throughout the game and find answers for cover zero.

Because if Mike McDaniel finds answers for cover zero with Jalen Waddle and Tyree Kill out there, presumably with a quarterback who can throw downfield, like you're giving up six every time. And I felt like throughout the first half, he never really had to tip his hand. He never had a show like his pass down calls because they were in third and extra long. It wasn't third and seven. It was third and 13 instead.

And instead you get a screen pass instead of like a real pass call. So I thought the game script worked in his favor. and I thought he took advantage of it. And the blitzes he did call worked every time. What did you think? Did you think Mike McDaniel could have done anything more than he did? Obviously, there's some limitations that we're talking about with the quarterback, limitations given the conditions.

I did feel like later on in this game, you know, they're down multiple scores. They're still huddling and they're throwing the ball behind the line of scrimmage on fourth and 16. And it didn't always feel like there was an awareness. first of all, just of the game situation. But two, it never felt like there was that moment where he just went, well, fuck it. Let's try to make something happen. What did you think about McDaniel in this game?

It's always hard to say, like, watching from the broadcast, but like I was tracking the next gen dots because they have it on the site during playoff games. And there were some dots open downfield. I will say that. I thought Tua took some underneath throws before he had to, including the fourth and 16 play. Like, there were two downfield routes for Hill and Waddle on that play. Okay.

So he just opted not to. And he throws underneath, like, within seconds. It looked like, like, I don't blame you for assuming it was like almost a screen pass because that's what it looked like with the timing. The ball came out like in 2.2 seconds, which it wasn't a blitz. It was Tampa too. Like, they were dropping into a deep zone. I don't know why you're throwing underneath.

And the guy got tackled like right away. It was a terrible decision by the quarterback. But that was not a design call by me. Daniel. And I feel like that was a theme throughout the night is there were guys open. And I think the plan from Spaggs was to force Tua to make those throws that he's made throughout his career throughout the last two years, those throws in between the voids and the zone, like two linebackers. And we've seen him make those throughout. But like on this night where like we know Tua doesn't have the best arm to begin with. But tonight it seemed like his arm was

almost unviable tonight. Like he couldn't throw down field, couldn't put zip on the ball downfield. And I think Spaggs was content to let him try to test those windows and see what happens and he never really did. Like all of the completions downfield were like those outbreakers that seemed like they were in the air for five, ten seconds at times. Yeah. Where the receivers are catching it on the sideline and taking a hit from a safety.

And like we saw a bunch of other throws short when he was throwing at the line of scrimmage where the chiefs defenders were just triggering on it and like hitting guys behind the line of scrimmage really hard. like Tyreek at the end of the game took a big hit that he didn't need to take. So I mean, what were the options for McDandiel? You can't throw short to the flat. You can't throw deep. He's not testing windows over the middle.

Like there were only so many parts on the field. Right. Run game wasn't working either. You just run out of options. Yeah. At one point, like two literally threw it into the stands. Like maybe that was a call by McDaniel. He's like, okay, it's not working.

If we throw anywhere else, throw it into the stands. So look. We should talk about the Chiefs. They won this game. They're still alive in the playoffs. This is going to be an interesting game in terms of where Miami goes from here. Because this was a positive season in a lot of ways. McDaniels' offense, at least for a time, was doing really cool stuff.

And I think there's still a lot of belief in him as a head coach and just what he's done schematically. That's all really valid and exciting for Miami. There's an infrastructure of a team there and a lot of great players. But you do have this year where the Cowboys were the only, you know, real playoff caliber team that they looked good against. And you go out with this game where the quarterback looks non-viable. And two is a $23 million next year on his fifth year option would be a free agent after that. I mean, what do you do?

Because if there's not a decision to be made on the fifth year option anymore, they pitch that up, obviously. But you got to start. thinking towards the future here. This is obviously a quarterback who, at least in terms of how they've opted to behave publicly, the dolphins have done nothing but expressed their belief in. But it's it, I do think that especially coming off of this game, but even before it, a rational decision maker has to be thinking about other options.

So what would you do if you're in Miami? Like I think over the first two years of this partnership, it's hard to blame McDaniels for too much. Like, obviously, he's had his own mistakes. He's a young coach. He's had game management mistakes. I think he kind of blew the Titans game. But you've given him a pass because the offense is designed so well. And we do C-2A's limitations. And they've obviously worked around those. After this year, though, I, like, assuming they keep to a, and they continue with this partnership and it looks the same, I'm not giving him a pass because he made his bet at that point. I think he needs to want more for himself.

Like he needs to look for a quarterback who can do the things that Matthew Stafford did for Sean McVey. That's such an interesting way to look at it because one thing McDaniels has highlighted as part of his philosophy of connecting with players is like, I'm a spindly guy. Like I never played in the NFL. There's never any way that I was going to do that. I have to prove to everyone that I can make them better and that I that my coaching is going to help them perform. and can make them look good. And then that's how they're going to respect me because they're not going to respect me because I'm some, you know, big hulking Mike Rable dude who played linebacker in the league.

And I wonder if there's a kernel of that philosophy where you're sort of not allowed to be like, this guy's bad and like this guy doesn't have it because your, your chosen tactic for how you connect with your players is I'm going to take whatever you have have, which is better than I could have ever, you know, I could have ever offered a football team and I'm going to get the most out of it. And I wonder if like that'll it. I think I'm playing armchair psychologist a little bit with that. And obviously he got there. It was to, two, uh, two was there. And he had to do with it what do with two of what he could. Um, but it just raises an interesting point about like, can he recognize and can he have the ego as a

head coach to be like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, you got to get me someone better. Like, when you listen to the play caller's podcast from the offseason by Jordan Rodriguez from the athletic, like he was the one coach that I felt like wasn't like smelling his own farts on the podcast. He was the one that was like, what do we do? Like, we're just calling place. Thank you for that, Stephen. Sorry, the players are the ones that do this. But no, man, I think you need to like have some more respect for yourself. Like, he needs a little more ego. And I think it's fair for you to play armchair psychologist because I feel like Mike McDaniel's thing is kind of like pseudo psychology, like, especially with

Tua, it was such like building him up and like giving him the confidence to play the way he plays, which is totally different from how he played under Brian Flores. And I think it required a lot of confidence not only in himself and in Mike McDaniel in the system, but like, I don't even think it's a question at this point. Like, I don't think this is this like a thing where we have to debate about it like with trying to think of like a good example, like Kirk Cousins in Washington at the end where there was a question of if he was the guy or not. Like he put up the stats, but in the big games, he never played well. And ultimately, like, Washington was kind of proven right over the long haul.

Like, Kirk obviously was better than anything they had, but he never won anything in Minnesota. I just think you can't afford to make that mistake. We have so many of these, like, examples throughout. And also, like, look, Kirk had v. He said Justin Jefferson in Minnesota, but, like, Kirk didn't have this offense in Washington, certainly. No, no. He had a decent offense, but it wasn't anything like that. Which is not to make the argument that he would have won something with it,

but it is to make the argument that you don't want to miss out on what this group of skill position guys could do with a quarterback who can maximize them. Like it would have felt worse for Los Angeles to have never traded Jared Gough, considering what that team looked like compared to Washington, which was probably like, maybe they would have went to like an NFC championship with a better quarterback, but they weren't winning a Super Bowl, to your point. but I just think he needs to want more for himself. And every time we get to these big games and we have these podcasts after,

it's the same conversation. Like, it doesn't change. Like, how are we so able to predict the outcomes of these games every time? Like, Dolphins fans could say we're hating on Tua. They could say, like, we underrate him and that, I don't know, we fall in love with, like, the arm strength guys, like Pat Mahomes and Josh Allen and accuracy and timing is what matters and what wins games.

Then why doesn't he ever win big games? why do we have the same conversation after every big game? Why is it always the same, like, strategy that disrupts this offense? You take away the middle of the field, make them throw outbreakers, and he can't do it. He can't throw outside the numbers. Like, it's the same conversation every time. And unless Miami wants to keep having these conversations for the next three to five years,

like, I think this is the offseason where they need to make moves. Because if they wait another off season, the price is just going to go up. And then you're going to have to trade a first round pick to get your Matthew Stafford. I mean, okay. So then let's ask the question. I think we've asked it before, but let's ask it now with the information we have. Who's the Stafford to Mike McDaniels as Sean McVeigh. It's Gino Smith. From South Florida, Miami Boy. Okay. He can make those throws downfield way better than two again. He's a way better downfield passer. Tirec Hill won't have to come back to the ball if Gino Smith's throwing it. Yeah. I like it. tonight. I like it. That, and you know what?

The Pete Carroll move in Seattle, I think, if anything, makes that more possible. And, you know, the finances even to do that, it's complicated because you don't know if how, okay, is to a willing to be the backup. Can you do that in a clean way? Is it better to see if somebody wants to trade for him, see if you can make the money work, whatever? they could make Gino and two a work if they absolutely had to. Now that's messy, but 23 million for a quarterback on a fifth year option on a rookie rookie contract.

That's at a certain point, that's, you know, that's a dead cap hit for Carson Wentz. Like you can live with that. I think that would be really interesting. All right, let's talk about the Chiefs because they actually won this game. Wait, I thought I won the game. I thought we won the game as two. questioners. We won the game.

Not nothing. No, I'm joking. So it was cool. And I actually, to still talk about the Dolphins for one more minute, defensively, I saw that there was this whole conversation going on online about like how, you know, how dare you blitz Mahomes? And they did blitz really aggressively. They used cover zero on 18 dropbacks, which was the second most in a game since 2018. And actually, Mahomes did not.

perform well on those plays at all. So first of all, it was more effective than I think there was credit given for. But also, this is a team that went into this game without their top three pass rushers. I mean, at a certain point, you cannot get,

like they were not going to be able to pressure him with four. And I think Vic Fanjou just sort of understood that he had to roll the dice. Now, look, it didn't, it didn't work out. And sometimes it doesn't work out. But I don't blame. them for taking that tack because I just don't know what else they really could have could have done. And now it's especially hard to try to play such a pressure game in the cold weather,

which as we talked about, it slows down the pass rush. And they really didn't make the negative plays that you're hoping you get out of that strategy. But again, like you kind of at a certain point just have to roll the dice. So I don't really blame Vic Fangio for adopting that strategy because I just don't know what else they could have done. But Mahomes is Mahomes. And though he did actually struggle against a lot of the cover zero, he just finds a way. I mean, they started adopting the underneath stuff.

Your guy Rishi Rice had a big game, 130 yards. Mahomes was running with the ball when he needed to. they just, they struggled in the red zone to some degree, but this, this was such a comfortable, I mean, in control performance. And I know they're more accustomed to the elements than Miami is, but it's, it's still impressive to see them go get it done. Yeah, to your point, Mahomes versus cover zero, seven for 18, 74 yards, a 51.6 passerating, four point. Yeah. Like, that was the best part of the plate. Yeah, that's not. And with his edge rushers out, like, that was the plan that made the most sense. And it was the part of the plan that worked the best. I thought if Banjo deserves any criticism, it's how they defended the run. I thought they played their fronts were a little too light for my liking against Isaiah Pacheco. But I mean, when Mahomes is playing this well, and I know the stats don't look all that great, I think it's like passer rating was like 80. It's hard to beat them, though, especially when you don't have answers schematically. Like, they can.

couldn't rush with Ford. Like he had all day to throw when they did. Even when he blitzed, I thought he found answers still and they just like barely missed on those throws. So it could have been a lot worse. But I don't think Fangio's to blame. I just think this was like a masterclass from the homes. At the same time, it was an unorthodox game plan.

So I don't know if like the chief's resurgence angle for the offense is really like accurate. When you say an orthodox, you're just talking about how they approached it because of the conditions and this is just a weird game. And the cover zero, like, you don't blitz Pat Mahomes like this. Like, they're not going to get this game plan again. They're not going to see this again. I think, like, other teams are going to make it harder on the receivers. They're not going to force them to, like, are they're not going to leave them one

on an island. So. Well, also, they're going to score more than seven points. Like, that too. That too. It's an interesting, like, it's an interesting, look, this is a game that, you know, it was one of the coldest games in NFL history. Lots of stuff about this just doesn't happen that often.

So it's interesting to talk about. at no point was this game a contest. Like even when the score wasn't, wasn't that bad. I mean, 26 to 7, that's sort of blowout, but like it's not insurmountable for a team that's moving the ball, but the dolphins were not moving the ball. They had one drive of two plays. Yeah. This is easy to say right now, but it felt over like the moment the chiefs went down the field

on the opening score and it scored a touchdown with like no resistance. And then the dolphins answer with a drive that. where they did nothing. It felt over then. Like we said earlier, it felt like they couldn't throw the ball downfield. So I don't know how you win a football game like that. And it's unlikely that Kansas City is going to get that further on in the playoffs.

They did, you know, there were some of the same old mistakes. There were a few drops. Again, I'm sure that football felt like a hockey puck. But we've seen it so much from them that it feels notable in that way. there were some penalties. You know, Joanne Taylor got called again.

Andy Reid had a couple sort of Andy Reid's senior moments, like calling the timeout just a challenge. We're picking nits, obviously. But it does, I don't know that much about this game changed my outlook on the chiefs. They have some of the same weaknesses. They certainly have the same strengths, which are a very capable defense.

and Patrick Mahomes, who can just make stuff happen when he needs to. But in general, I think we kind of know who they are. And it was a little bit more dramatic on the offensive side of the ball for Miami than I thought, I guess. But this game sort of went how it was predicted to go. Yeah. Like Kansas City, the offense they're facing next week, assuming it's Buffalo and Buffalo takes care of business on Monday. quarterback's going to present a different challenge. Right.

Might be cold again, though. Yeah. I don't think that's going to bother Allen as much as it did, too, with going out. There was a, so Alex Earle, who's an influencer who is dating Braxton Barrios, I saw this video that she posted this morning, just talking about how she spent her entire morning, texting Braxton Barrios, articles about Frost Fight. Just like one after the other. And I was like, I can't imagine that's helpful.

No, not at all. All right. Shall we move on to Texans Browns? All right, let's take a quick break first. And then we will come back with that. Welcome back to dual threat. So earlier in the day, the Texans put on an even more dominant showing than the Chiefs. They beat the Browns 45 to 14.

there was a moment in the first quarter of this game when both teams came out and they were trading touchdowns and everyone had their little Twitter fingers out going instant classic this game is going to be the best game of all time. And then the Browns did not score again. And the Texans absolutely ran away with this game. I mean, first takeaway here is just that this is an incredible turnaround for Houston. It starts with C.J. Stroud, who becomes the youngest quarterback ever to win a playoff game. And when we think back to this team, winning three games last season, one of which they were like openly mocked, including by me for winning. And hiring a new head coach where the narrative was, I mean, there have been two one and done coaches here. Who's going to want that job?

Oh, geez. is like, Topico, is it going to be okay? They got the right quarterback, maybe by by luck of the draw, right, for not having the first overall pick, but whatever, they've wound up with the right guy and hit their other picks and have just have, have reshaped this roster in such a short amount of time. And, you know, to, to see that get to this point. right, where it's not just like, oh, nice little season you had there. It's a 45 point playoff win and a potentially, you know, interesting conversation about where they might go from here. It's just one of the most, one of the fastest and most sort of like emphatic turnarounds by a

team that a year ago really felt helpless. And I mean, let's talk about CJ Stroud because if there's one person, you know, to meet her eye and said after the game like it's it's because of cj stroud he has has brought us here what did you see from him in this this route i mean he made the throws downfield that he had to make uh this is like the opposite conversation that you're having about the dolphins like you have your quarterback you know what if you design the right game plan he's going to be able to execute and i think bobby sloak was a star today the offensive coordinator if rinds is a loser in any way today it's he's losing that offensive coordinator.

His only chance of keeping him is that we have a bunch of big names in the coaching cycle and maybe he'll have to wait a year. And if he does have to wait a year and Houston gets them back next year, sky's the limit for this offense, especially when it's healthy and Tank Dell comes back. But I thought this was really about Houston's coaching staff, the offensive coordinator, D'Amico Rines, and then C.J. Stroud, making the throws. He made a couple throws downfield.

I know he had some misses. He had like the Nico Collins miss. Yet another miss, but like every other throw, under pressure, off his back foot, a couple fadeaway balls. Quick decisions against that pass rush. You've never heard Miles Garrett's name unless they were showing like a highlight package for Tunsell in the past pro. You didn't hear say Smith's name. They combined for three pressures on the day, total. Laramie Tunsell against Miles Garrett 12 reps, one pressure allowed.

All one-on-ones. No help needed. So they took out everything. from Cleveland. I know there were some early hiccups with the defense. They were playing a little bit of single high, a little bit too much for my liking. And I think that gave them some opportunities downfield.

We saw some explosives from Cleveland, like in the first game. But after that, they go to too high and that was the end. That force flacko to throw underneath. And then he messed up through a couple picks, game over. That second pick. That was the moment. I actually disagree with this. To make your case, but I disagree with that was the moment.

Play the sound, Isaiah. I need the sound. I need the sound that everyone heard after that moment. That's the PS5 bleeping sound. That's what everyone knew the game was over and you can turn your PS5 on. There was no chance Flacko was coming back. And I felt like we got two PS5 bleep games today,

which I didn't appreciate. We were really hyped about this wildcard slate. And I got to say, through one day, not living up to the hype. I feel like both games could have been on Peacock. So can I tell you when the sound really should have been played. It was when

it was when the ref didn't call the defensive pass interference on the throw to David and Joku in the second quarter underthrown not catchable ball but clear pass interference didn't get called. That's, I mean,

that's the clock striking midnight for Joe Flacko. Yes. They never scored again. Like it was over. It's just that's not it's not his time. If the DPI is not called, it is not Joe Flacco's time. Like the bell is tolling. And it ended with him becoming one of five quarterbacks in the Super Bowl era

to throw multiple pick sixes in a playoff game. So look, Joe always gives us something. And in the case of the Houston Texans, he gave them ball. He was throwing some darts over the middle of the field early on. Like Joe, I thought we were getting playoff Joe early.

And then the wheels. But in some ways, as we were, right? Like, he just, he goes out swinging. The, the defensive adjustments from Ryan's are, are interesting and obviously coaxing Flacco into some of those turnovers felt like the way that the Texans were going to be able to win this game on that side of the ball. Just going back to the offense for Houston, Bobby Sloick certainly made his case.

He has four requested interviews. so far with Tennessee, Washington, Atlanta, Carolina. I mean, this is a pretty good way to go out and add something to the resume that I figure would have those teams really taking notice. I saw a lot online that I wanted to ask you about. That seemed really interesting about just the way that he uses the motions and the fakes to pull away from where the ball ends up going. And our Danny Highfits was posting a bunch of clips of it where you can just see it,

where the entire flow of defense is. going one way and then the throw just goes somewhere else and there's absolutely no one around. What did you, I mean, where was, for a guy who was just in his bag, how is he making that happen? Yeah, I felt like that was the game plan, take advantage of their aggressiveness. Like, that's the Jim Schwartz approach to the defense. Fire up the field. We're playing one gap. We're not doing that like gap and a half like Van Geo stuff. We're getting up field with Miles Garrett and Zay Smith and we're attacking. And he took advantage of that. He just, he, he, sent a guy one way and the whole offense, you saw there were a couple of times where they

would like throw a toss play and like the whole Brown's front seven would go after. And I really felt like that was by design. Like he was giving them these wins. Like he would also call like a basic inside zone play with no motion or anything. And Cleveland would tackle it for like a gain of one or maybe a tackle for loss. But I felt like he was just trying to almost play Kate Jim Schwartz and kind of like give him this false sense of success. So he would keep calling these plays where they're super aggressive. They played a lot of single high, a lot of cover one,

a lot of cover three, and he was just picking it apart. And I think being able to kind of like shape the windows and widen the zone windows was a, it made Stroud's day a lot easier. Not that he needed it. He was making throws without it. But that just,

I think that's been the setup all year is. Stroud has been so good that it's kind of hard to notice that he's in one of these offenses, the Shanahan offenses that makes playing quarterback so easy for other guys, more limited guys usually. But that was the case today. Like Sloak was so good in that regard. I thought he outclassed Jim Schwartz tonight.

Anything else from Cleveland's defense? Because there was a whole thing with the home road splits, right? That at home this season, they allowed 13.8 points per game on the road almost 30. I never quite know what to make of that stuff unless it's like a crowd noise thing. But do you have any thesis on if anything that was already visible, and those splits was part of the problem? I mean, that would make sense. Like, when you think about get off and, like,

playing on the road versus at home, the defense and the past rush especially has an advantage there. Like, on the road, you don't have, like, the silent count happening. And that's when you can get a beat on, like, when the ball's getting snapped. And I think that might be the difference. That's anecdotal, and it,

maybe it's too convenient of an explanation, but that makes the most sense. Yeah, that's interesting. So, Look, I think this still goes down as a shockingly fun season for the Browns and for Browns fans. They are in a little bit of a strange situation now where 38-year-old Joe Flacco coming off his couch. Obviously, he goes out on a relatively low note, but he was the most effective quarterback for them this season. He said after the game that he wasn't sure if he would keep playing or anything and that it was all too early.

But it seems unlikely. It seems like Joe is probably going back to the couch. But what do you think happens next for Cleveland and how they proceed? Yeah, he's definitely going back to the couch. He took a couple hits in this game. Like he had one where he slid kind of late and they wanted a flag for Ruffington. I don't know what they would have called it. But he's not doing that again.

He, like, Desmond King, like, did a twister move on his helmet. Yeah, it's bad. But, like, he reverted to old Joe Flacco in the second half. I felt like he was like, I'm just throwing the ball. I'm not taking a hit. Check down instantly. I'm not doing this anymore. But I don't know.

I don't think this, like, convinces them that, like, Deshaun Watson can't be saved. I don't know. Like, I think you look at it and you're like, oh, we did this with Joe. Flacco, a 38-year-old Joe Flacco coming off the couch. We could do this with Deshaun Watson, who's what, like 28 years old. And I thought Watson was playing better at the end before that injury. You started to see signs of him getting it. So I don't think it's going to complicate things too much.

And then obviously, like the financial commitment. You can't even get out of it. But obviously, if you're a Browns fan, you would prefer this run to what, even like Deshaun Watson making the same run is not going to be as fun as it is with Blacko. Because you have that dark cloud hanging over at all times. I think you're right to say that the financial commitment is such that it's sort of, it's less of like, okay, where like is there a decision that they have to make? But it's just it is an added bit of pressure and it is an added piece of stress of, oh, if it's not going very well, they pulled Joe Flacco off the couch last year and it got better.

and I mean, you know, the tiniest of violence, but it just, that, that continues to be a very complicated dynamic for a bunch of reasons. Houston, more immediately, is probably the bills are obviously favored in a big way against the Steelers and especially getting clear of the worst of the weather. I think that that favors Buffalo. So if the bills end up winning that game, the Texans are going to play the Ravens. That is a hard matchup. We just saw Houston look really, really dominant against a really good defense. Do you think, do they have a shot in that game? No, no.

Maybe I'll sound stupid when this gets flipped if they win, but I just don't think they do. We've seen this matchup before. I thought Stroud looked as good as quarterback can, making his. first start against that defense on the road. But we've seen this defense go up better versions of this offense. Like we've seen it take out the 49ers. We've seen it take out the dolphins. Baltimore doesn't have problems defending motion.

And like you said, that's a big part of the offense. That's so critical. Yeah. And you're not going to get them in a script. And even if you put Lamar in the same situation, you put Flacco in, like, he's going to make plays. He's not going to make the same mistakes. He's not going to throw you interceptions that break open the game. Without those interceptions, this is a competitive game.

So, no. That's my short answer. No. Would you think they'd have a shot against the Chiefs? Oh, yeah, yeah. I think you can make the argument they're on the same level as the Chiefs in terms of like how well they're playing at the moment. Yeah.

I wouldn't pick them in that game, but I could see it happening, especially on the road. If they were at home, I could see them pulling an upset, but on the road, no. But they're ahead of schedule. Like this is all icing on the cake at this point. I mean, it was really, so there was somebody, and I'm realizing that I put this in my notes and I didn't credit the person. So whoever tweeted this, thank you, was putting together the list of players and results of the picks that Houston got in the Watson trade. and the running list is Will Anderson, Tank Dell, Kenyon Green, Christian Harris, Damien Pierce, John Mechie. There's a bunch of other guys and then you've still got a first round pick and a third round pick coming.

I mean, the future of this roster just looks so bright. I also think they deserve a lot of credit for, and in a season where because of the timeline of when they got hit with the injury bug, in a season that sort of took a dip and then got back on course. They really stayed hungry for it. I mean, Derek Barnett was making plays in this game. That's a guy who they added on waivers late in the year.

Howie. Got tear tart that way. The Eagles could use some pass rush, Howie. The Eagles could use some Derek Barnett right about now, I think. But it was Houston who said a million bucks for Derek. Derek Barnett, don't mind if we do.

And just in terms of the roster building, which has been, you know, the thing. I mean, the coaching staff has done such a good job that it's, you know, you don't want to differentiate, but the roster construction has just, just been superlative. And I do think they deserve a lot of credit for not stopping. And, you know, I don't know that we want to be spending a ton of time talking about the things that Nick Casario learned from Bill Belichick. But that was always one of the principles that I think.

think worked out that was sort of the best in New England was like you're never done. You're never done building the roster. And they've just, it's just a really impressive run and start of a run no matter how long this, this playoff run lasts. And I do think, no matter who they match up with, it should be an exciting game. And we are still due for one. So at least we can hopefully count on that. Anything else from this game, anything we forgot from Chief Stolphins before we were going to hit a couple little news items and then wrap this up before we get some sleep before tomorrow.

Yeah, Amari Cooper, after breaking the Brown's record in the first game, basically shut out in this one. I don't know if it was the ankle injury on his early catch in the first quarter. He kind of went to the sideline nursing his ankle and then barely did anything. after that. But Derek Stingley Jr. was shadowing him. That was a switch from the regular season that we didn't really ever see during the season from Ryan's. Another tip of the hat to him for that. And he shut down Amari Cooper. And I thought they, after the early part of the game, they shut down David and Joku a little bit. They took away the explosives in the past game. They took away Cooper. Like they did everything that they didn't do in the first matchup. And

me, that's a sign of a good coach. D'Amico Ryan's like, he's my big winner. on this night. I might give it to Slowick, but when you score 45 points, there can be more than one winner. Another winner this week, Gerard Mayo, named New England Patriots head coach. We talked about the Belichick dismissal mutual part of take of ways, cough firing. But that was before the Patriots very quickly elevated Mayo and named him. their next head coach. What do you think? I mean, not the most exciting hire. It would have been

cool to see them go through like an interview process, but I think I don't have any problem with this. I guess you can make the argument that like it's more the same. And if you're going to move on from Bill, like what was the point of doing this? But Mayo is just as impressive as any of the other candidates outside of like the established guys who we know have a track record. And just from hearing him talk and like kind of how he approaches things in the locker room. But like I think it's promising. There was a quote from him about diversity in the locker room. And for him, it was really about diversity of thought and like generational diversity.

I think that speaks to why the Patriots may have swapped out Belichick for Mayo, a younger guy who can relate with the locker room, all the stuff we were talking about in the midweek pod. I want to see it happen. Like, I want to see what happens. I don't want to rush to judgment. We've said many times on this pod, like, We don't know with these coaches. We really don't know, especially they have no past experience coaching in that spot.

I mean, it may have been a coach, not a head coach. Yeah, head coach. Not a coordinator in title. He's been a coach for five years. So he comes with a really, really, really good reputation as someone who connects with people. But he is relatively green. So there's sort of a blank canvas in that way, even though he obviously is a continuation in some ways from the Belichick era.

I have sort of mixed feelings about it. I think maybe I would have liked to see them at least go through the process and just talk to some more people, get a little bit of a wider net. I just, I think there is, there's a real insularity to that building. And to some degree, it's probably necessary just because they do do things in a very specific way. And it's hard to integrate people who don't have any familiarity with that. into that system. But then at the same time, I don't know, in the NFL in 2024,

I do want to be sure that I wouldn't be benefiting from, do we want some voices from the Shanahan tree? Do we want some voices from, you know, different parts of the league who have sort of different information? You can even get that from interviews if you don't hire someone. The only other thing that I would raise is a concern is,

did you read that Seth Wickersham piece about sort of the end of the end of the Belichick era and how it all went down? I did not. Okay, you should read it. It's good. There's an anecdote about Gerard Mayo bringing a baseball bat into meetings

and just like just like holding it and sort of like tapping it in his hand as a quasi-authoritative gesture and I think that's weird. He has a bit. Everyone loves him. He should do it on the sideline

during games. I mean, And maybe he'll make it his thing. I don't, I'm being mostly facetious because everyone I've ever spoken to who's been with the Patriots really truly thinks that he's a special guy. I also think it's really meaningful for the New England Patriots to have a black head coach is just like it's, it's a meaningful thing in that region. I think it's a meaningful thing for that franchise just given sort of the stature. And he, you know, there are a lot of times when. certain coaches don't get the leashes that other coaches do and he should should I think picking a bunch

of nits is probably a silly thing to do at this point um but I thought that was weird I thought that was a weird anecdote I was concerned about the report that that Josh McDaniel might be the leader in the clubhouse for OEC that's I think the biggest red flag from they just need to like they need to get out more like I don't understand what has happened with this team where it's just like you can hire someone who didn't use to work for the Patriots. Watch other games. Right. Presumably they watch Philb on the Dolphins.

They have to prepare to play them too. They don't watch that offense and they're like, hey, why don't we do stuff like this instead of like watching the Raiders offensive going, let's do stuff like that. You know what? Let's bring Jacob Johnson back. Right. Yeah.

It's a confounding habit. And I would love to see them break. but I guess we'll find out. But here's hoping that the Giraud Mayo era is successful, and here's hoping that he understands that you do not just have to hire former Patriots coaches. Because I think that would be for, that would be to everyone's benefit. All right. Stephen, we're going to be back here in 24 hours.

We are going to break down. The rest of Sunday's wildcard games, although obviously Bill's Steelers having been moved to Monday, will be covered on extra point taken with Ben and Sheal. Anything you're looking forward to tomorrow? Not having to watch Mason Rudolph. Those extra point guys, lucky then, they get to have all the fun and talk about that performance. Slow clap for Ben and Sheel. We are grateful to them. All right.

This has been dual threat first installment of our super wildcard weekend coverage. I'm Nora Pinsiati. He's Stephen Ruiz. Thank you to Isaiah Blakely for producing this episode. And thank you to Arjuna Ramcapaal and Connor Deppens for additional production supervision. We'll be back tomorrow.