The Ringer NFL Show - Recapping the NFL Trade Deadline

Episode Date: November 2, 2022

Nora and Steven recap a busy NFL trade deadline. They discuss the biggest moves of the day, including Bradley Chubb to the Dolphins, Calvin Ridley to the Jaguars, and some of the other trades that caught their attention. Hosts: Nora Princiotti and Steven Ruiz Associate Producer: Isaiah Blakely Additional Production Supervision: Arjuna Ramgopal Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hi, I'm Issa Kwanga and I'm Ryan Hunt and we co-host Stadio, a football podcast on the Ringer Podcast Network. If you like soccer or football, make sure you search for Stadio, a football podcast on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello and welcome to a special emergency trade deadline edition of the Ringer NFL show. I'm Nora Princeati and I am here with Stephen Ruiz. It is Tuesday evening, November 1st. The NFL trade deadline has come and gone in. historic fashion. I believe there were a record setting 12 trades that got done by the deadline. So we've got a lot to talk about. And let's start with what I think is the biggest trade of

the day, certainly the most draft capital changing hands. And that is the Broncos trading Bradley Chubb to the Dolphins for San Francisco's 2023 first round pick. They got that when the 49ers moved up to take Trey Lance. A 2024 fourth and Chase Edmonds, the running back, in a related move, the Niners traded Jeff Wilson to the Dolphins for a 2023 fifth round pick. Wilson will be the upgrade from Edmonds who is traded to Denver there. Stephen, what's your biggest takeaway from this sort of this multi-team kind of

machination here. Yeah, I thought the dolphins had two big problems going into the deadline that they needed to address. And it was the pass rush, which had fine results, but defensive coordinator, Josh Boyer, had to do a lot of creative stuff and a lot of blitzing in order to get home and get after the quarterback. And that had created problems on the back end and coverage. And then I thought that the running back position needed to be upgraded. I know we don't really care about the running back position doesn't move the needle. But I think in a Shanahan style offense, you want a guy that's, that's comfortable running those concepts because they are so foundational for that offense. And if you look at like the advanced metrics, they say that

Chase Edmonds and the Dolphins running back room as a whole was really bad. They were leaving a lot of meat on the bone in terms of what the offensive line was blocking for. Their rush yards over expectation was the worst in the league. Jeff Wilson just happens to be the best player in the league in that stat. Right. So so far this season, I think Chase Edmonds was at minus. 100 and Mostert was also in the red had been minus 33. Wilson was plus 119. So a pretty clear upgrade there. Yeah.

So if you let's just like interpret that literally. So basically if you put Jeff Wilson into the dolphin situation, he would have gotten 200 more rush yards than the dolphins running backs would have gotten, which is a big, big, big difference, especially for the Dolphins offense, which on early downs has kind of struggled to find a run game. And I think you bring in Jeff Wilson, who knows the system, the onboarding process is going to be seamless. Mike McDaniel was an offense coordinator in San Francisco a year ago.

It's a no-brainer move for me. And then the big one, Chubb. Boyer, Josh Boyer is a good defensive coordinator who had to do some things that sometimes turn out badly for the defense. They did a lot of those double A gap blitzes. they did a lot of zero pressures. And it's because they didn't have a pass rush they could trust. But now you have Bradley Chubb and you don't have to do that.

And here's the benefit. The dolphins gave up the most explosive pass plays when they blitz. They're giving them up on 20% of their dropbacks when they blitz. Now that they don't have to blitz, that's a lot of big plays that you don't have to worry about anymore. And in today's NFL, stopping big plays is how you put a good defense on the field. And I think the dolphins are better equipped to do that now. It's crazy to me how fast the dolphins went from being this like, how's the rebuild going to go team to all of a sudden behaving like their, you know, the East Coast Rams or something. But I like the move too. I mean, so many of their inconsistencies defensively, I think came in part from issues in the coverage, but also from how often they were blitzing and how little pressure that was resulting in. relative to how much they were blitzing, right?

So I will be honest with you, it's been a busy day. I pulled this from my week seven notes, so we're a little out of date here. But at that point, they ranked 23rd in sack rate and 29th in pressure rate. They'd been blitzing at the fourth highest rate in the league. And the issues there were particularly bad inside the five yard line. They'd blitzed seven times in that area. And the results from those place had been one sack and they'd given up five touchdowns. So a lot of, like, they've had these games, right?

Like you think of the Vikings game where it's either they got what, like 11, three and outs or something, but then every drive that wasn't a three and out, the Vikings scored points on. Right. That's so characteristic of what this defense has been like. And I think having a finisher, someone who can turn, whether it's those blitzes, or if the presence of somebody like Chubb will make it so they don't have to blitz as much. Like, I just think it's going to, like you said, mean that they're giving up

fewer of those big plays. And right now those big plays are kind of becoming like drive breakers for them. So while normally or in in other contexts, I would be a little wary of trading fairly significant capital for a guy who you're going to have to pay and who. who is playing really, really, really well this year, but in a way that's an outlier from essentially how he's played since his rookie season, right? Like he had that 12-sack season was really, really exciting. He hasn't had a double-digit sack season since. He's been a very good player, but not like, oh, my gosh.

This year, he's third and pass rush win rate behind Micah Parsons and Miles Garrett, right? So normally I would be like, okay, like, great. you know, I wouldn't stake that much expenditure on what looks a little bit like it might be an outlier performance, but I do think it's going to make a really big difference for their defense. And with the Wilson thing, yeah, just everything you said, I think we all assumed coming into this season that there was going to be this floor to the Miami offense based on what they could do in the run game because of Mike McDaniel's track record in that San Francisco scheme completely, has not happened. They're 26th in EPA and designed runs so far this year. So if importing the coach to get it started doesn't work, maybe importing the player will do it. So we'll see. That's obviously less significant capital. But the dolphins are going for it. And I can't say I dislike either move

there. No. And I think you have to go for it. When these windows open up, I don't think you can treat them as if they're going to stay open for even more than a season. Like you have to attack this window this year. And I think they're doing that because there is, even though Tua is off to a great start and he's playing well, there's still uncertainty when it comes to that position for them going forward. And that really dictates the long-term viability of this current roster. So the fact that it's working this year, I think it makes sense to just go for it. Anything in terms of the trading teams ends of this for the Broncos with Chubbs saying goodbye there or the 49ers saying about to Jeff Wilson? I mean, it kind of feels like the Broncos are saying, whoops, we had, we had

too high of hopes for the season and maybe, maybe we're not the contenders we thought we were. I think that's what that screams to me. And they do have two young, good pass rushers behind Chubb. So he was kind of a luxury. So I do. do get the move, but it's always a bad look to the locker room, I think. A locker room that thought they were competing for a Super Bowl this year when you're trading away the best players. I think it's more of a culture. Like, I take issue with it from a culture perspective, but on paper in a vacuum, it makes

sense. Famous culture guys, Stephen Ruiz. Yeah. I hear you though, right? Like, it's those homegrown players who have played well, who you always hear about, oh, it means so much to the other guys on the team to see them rewarded. Now, I don't want to make too much of something like that. But because if you're not good, right, like I would credit,

I would credit the Broncos for knowing where they are here more than I would be like, yeah, yeah. Oh, shoot. The locker room is going to be bummed that Bradley Chubb didn't get rewarded for, you know, coming in and playing well for you. But it's not like it doesn't matter. That in tandem with the quarterback, with the quarterback making all that money, might cause some friction.

But I don't, yeah, I don't think it's a bad move. It's not going to like ruin the franchise. No, I think it was a smart move in. And yeah, it's admission that they or it's a sign of self-awareness, which I think that's like the biggest, the best trade of front office can have is self-awareness. It's not going to ruin the franchise. Only, only Russell can do that. Sorry, that was mean.

I had to get it in there. All right. Let's move on Calvin Ridley to the Jags. So the Falcons trade Calvin Ridley, who's currently suspended, and they get a 2023, fifth round pick in return, plus a 2024 conditional fourth rounder that stays a four if Calvin Ridley is on the roster in 2024. It becomes a three based on some playing incentives. And it can become a two if the Jaguars sign him to.

a contract extension. And I will say, I love this for the Jaguars. The last time Calvin Ridley played a full season, he averaged 2.5 yards per route run was just like a really, really good playmaking

receiver who would be really valuable to the Jaguars to any team. The compensation is pretty low. That's obviously because of everything that's going on off the field with Calvin Ridley. He had a bit of down year in 2021 in the five games that he played. He only had 281 yards. So I think that's part of

it as well. But then he obviously stepped away. He wanted to work on his personal life, was dealing with some mental health issues, and then get suspended for gambling. He can apply for reinstatement in February of 2023. So there's a lot going on there, right? And I would never pretend to know what it's going to look like when Calvin Ridley plays football again or when that's going to be or what the deal is. But when Tyree Kill costs you five picks, when Devante Adams is the first and the second, I'm not saying Calvin Ridley is those guys. But when that's the cost at the position, it is worth taking a low cost risk here.

Because if the most that this can possibly cost the Jags is a 2023-5 and a 2024-2 and they've re-signed him, that means that Calvin Ridley was still Calvin Ridley. And if Calvin Ridley is still Calvin Ridley, they'll be thrilled that they made this deal. Yeah, I like it from a front office perspective, like taking advantage of this deal. Even if you aren't technically a buyer, I think what if the Jaguars 2 and 6 right now, you usually don't see those teams trade for players. But Calvin really is a legit talent at receiver, a borderline top 10 player at the position. And I think he fills a void for that roster.

they don't have a deep wide receiver target they can rely on. Like if you look at Trevor Lawrence's past map, like at 20 yards, it just cuts off. There's nothing there. He doesn't throw over 20 yards. And I think it's a personnel thing. And Calvin Ridley has proven that he can win downfield. And then, I mean, it's just more support for Trevor Lawrence, which is what you have to do. And I think it's a good sign for the franchise going forward.

And sure, they overspent on receiver this year in the offseason. But this is what you have to do to support. a good young quarterback and we're not seeing other teams do that around the league. Like you could argue the Ravens have never made a move close to this for Lamar Jackson. And they've had every incentive to do that. So I applaud Trent Balke, another masterclass by the most maligned GM in the NFL. We applaud Trent Balke. If this wasn't the best takeaway from the pod that we could have had, I don't know what is.

Yeah, I think it would be really cool to see him in that offensive. all works out because I mean, yes, we all criticize not all, but a lot of people criticize the size of the Christian Kirk contract. He's played well. He's done a lot of good things. It's just that offense is missing an element, right? Like Christian Kirk has always been the best when he's in the slot and it just hasn't quite all come together. And part of it is because I think that that deep threat downfield guy is just sort of missing. thing here. If you remember like Doug Peterson's offenses in Philly, I thought they were at their best when they had that downfield threat, when they were throwing to Tori Smith downfield in 2017.

And then they tried to replace Tori Smith with Mike Wallace who got hurt right away, Deshawn Jackson, who got hurt right away. They never were able to figure out that position again. And we saw what happened to the offense. We're kind of seeing that same thing happen in Jacksonville right now, where Evan Ingram is their best deep threat right now. That's the guy getting the deep targets. And you can't run an offense like that. Yeah. I mean, and it's funny for as good as I think the value is for Jacksonville. I guess I got it from Atlanta's perspective.

If there are things that I don't know that are going on inside that building where people are just sort of saying, everybody here needs a fresh start. We need a clean break. There's weird baggage here with this player. And he'd prefer it and we'd prefer it. And let's just do it and get something back in return. I got to say, I'm surprised they couldn't get more. Or I'm surprised they didn't think that they could maybe wait until he can apply for reinstatement, see if there's any resolution there, if it might have been possible to get more than this back.

Because like you said, like Calvin Ridley, in his last fall season, we could have made a very compelling case that this is a borderline top 10 receiver. Those do not come cheap. And this just isn't a whole lot. So I'm a little, I get it from the Falcons perspective if this is just about like, we all got to sort of wash our hands of each other. But I don't think that they maximize value. I like the creativity with the structure of the trade because it would have been hard. If they just had traded for a pick that wasn't conditional, it would have been hard to ask for a second.

But I do agree with you. I think in the end, I get the circumstances. But in the end, if we look back at it and Calvin Ridley picks up where he left off in 2020. and has that same type of season, we're going to look back on the trade and be like a second round pick for that. Like we've seen receivers go for much more. So I agree with you.

Even though they were in a tight spot, I would have liked to see if you just moved up all those conditions one round, like if he signs a long-term deal, you get a first. I would have liked this trade a lot better for them. Right. All right.

Another receiver trade. The Steelers traded Chase Claypool to the Bears. That was for a 2023 second. I was kind of underwhelmed by this for Chicago. What did you think, Stephen? Yeah, a day two pick, a second round pick, and I think it was Chicago's original pick, which means it's going to be higher in the draft.

It's not the Ravens second round pick. Yeah, there was some reporting that it was going to be the Ravens pick, but that is not the case. It's the bear's own second rounder. So it will be at the top of the round instead of the bottom of the round, which obviously adds value. And I don't know. Does it make the Bears better now?

Does it help Justin Fields development this year? I don't think so in either case. And he only has a year and a half left on his contract. So they are going to have to sign them unless he wants to go into next season without a contract. It's a weird trade for a team that was seem to be offloading talent. Like they just traded Roquan Smith for a second round pick. They obviously get that back kind of are they bring in Claypool, which is kind of like a like trade. They basically traded Roquan for Chase Claypool.

that's a downgrade from a personnel perspective in terms of individual talent. Obviously, wide receivers matter a little more. But it doesn't really go with their long-term vision. And I think the Steelers got really good value here because Claypool wasn't working out. He wasn't getting the ball much. Pickens had come in and kind of stolen his position and his role in the offense as the deep, deep ball contested catch guy. And to get a second round pick for a guy that you probably would have let walk in a year, that's good value. They got basically what the Falcons are hoping to get for Calvin Ridley, which, and obviously the gap between those two players is large. Right. Yeah. I think they totally, it's not always helpful to be like, oh, who won the trade.

But if I'm the Steelers, I think you feel really, really good about this right now. There might have been a little bit of a bidding war or just the perception of other teams being interested. The Packers were reportedly interested in trading for Claypool and also offered a 2023 second. Aren't they always interested in these receivers that get traded to other teams every single time? Maybe playing to an audience of one there. Like, oh, hey, Aaron, we tried. But, you know, the Steelers just think we're too good. They don't think our pick is going to be high enough.

So they said, no, they went with the Bears. I'm really sorry. I don't care what everybody says there about Aaron Rogers being so much more involved in what the front office is doing. Got the Lions trading for T.J. Hawkinson. You've got like moves in the division. You've got the Bears adding receiver. It's got to be a little tense there right now.

It's days like this where I wish I was like an insider, like Rappaport, where I love when they announce a trade and they always add like a sentence at the end of analysis. It's like, yeah, a position of need they needed to fill for three years. or whatever. But with the Steelers trade, I would be like they got a second round pick. More draft capital if they want to move up for a quarterback in next year's draft.

Just I would throw that little. A second round pick is like the Steelers can just spend that on a receiver and we'll be like starting his Hall of Fame campaign in August in like week three of the preseason. They're going to need to package that with the first round pick to move up into the top 10 to draft a quarterback to replace their current one.

But, you know, Yeah, I mean, I think the, the biggest takeaway from that trade to me is that the compensation for Pittsburgh is really, really good. I guess my best guess is what the rationale is in Chicago is just like they can get a better evaluation of fields. He's had a couple good weeks. Maybe by the end of the season, you add another decent receiver to the mix. obviously that that room is lacking in a lot of talent. So by the end of the year, you're hoping you just have a clear picture of what he's been able to do

and what type of player you have on your roster, maybe. I'm just with you in terms of look, like this is kind of one for one with Rokan Smith. I thought that was a good trade. I think it makes a lot of sense for them to be loading up some assets. But then if you're just going to spend, it again here for a player who's not as talented as the one he let walk out the door. And, you know, at the most you get him a year and a half cost controlled.

I don't know. And it just seems a little funny. I feel like the Ridley trade kind of makes it look worse in hindsight too. Because even that trade, obviously the Jaguars have to wait to get their player and they might give up a second, which is the same compensation. but the bears are should be on the same timeline as the jaguars where they're not trying to add talent necessarily in the season right now. And then two, it's a long term play and the bears are obviously on a long term plan.

So Claypool doesn't really fit in with their plans. I don't know. It's a weird trade for them. All right. Let's let's go through some of the other ones. So, uh, the lines traded T.J. Hawkinson within the division to the Vikings, Nike Mines went to the bills. Jacob Martin to the Jets,

William Jackson to the Steelers, sorry, I meant Jacob Martin, the Broncos from the Jets, Jackson to the Steelers, he'd obviously want it out of Washington. Anything else that caught your eye, Stephen? Not really. Like, I think the Hawkinson trade for Minnesota is, it makes sense for them. The offense has done well enough to get off to the,

this good start, but it's clear that they need another layer to it. Kirk Cousins hasn't had the best year statistically, and their play action passing game hasn't been very good, which it has been in the past. And I think adding a tight end, a second tight end allows them to do more with formations, personnel grouping. They had been like really 11 personnel and that's it. And now they have two tight ends that can use. I just think it gives Kevin O'Connell more flexibility.

And I think the offense could get a lot better. There's room to grow in that offense or for that offense. and sure the Vikings are probably overachieving right now, but they can win this division and adding talent to a roster that is good enough to host a playoff game. I think, I don't know, they can go on a run in the NFC. Yeah, if they think they have something this year, you know, Irv Smith got hurt on Sunday,

Kirk obviously spends a lot of time throwing in the sort of short intermediate areas. That's where Hawkinson's targets are going to come. that makes a lot of sense for me. I mean, I kind of think like it's very hard to identify who the fourth team in the NFC would be right now. I mean, obviously the Eagles, Cowboys, and at least for me, the 49ers are very clearly a group of three. And then it's sort of anybody's game. So as untrustworthy as I tend to feel about Minnesota, that's not a bad bad.

position to be in. That's sort of objectively a buying position. They didn't give up all that much for it. I get this one. And I get it for the Lions too. This seemed very even to me. Like Detroit's going to build their passing game amount around St. Brown, around Jamison Williams. They were going to have to start paying Hawkinson on the fifth year option in 2023. That's not that bad because it's, you know, for a tight end, it's nine million, whatever. But. But divisional trades don't happen that much. Generally speaking, when they do, it's kind of an even deal because you're able to get those two teams to make a trade with each other.

I think that's very true here. Like, I get why neither organization looked at this and was like, I don't know. I don't like you. I don't want to make. Because like, it makes sense. Like, why not? It makes sense for both sides. And the reason why we don't trust Minnesota is because,

because Kirk Cousins is the quarterback, but like look at the other teams at the top of the NFC. You have Jalen Hertz who's unproven. You have Gino Smith, who is obviously unproven. And then you have Jimmy Garapolo who is like Kirk, but even more untrustworthy. So yeah, go for it. I guess I forgot about the Seahawks in the NFC thing. I still think it's a three, but I would trust the, I don't know, I might even trust the Seahawks more than the Cowboys. We've talked about this. Yeah, it's at least even. It's at least even. Point stands. I just didn't want to disrespect, you know, the fight in Gino Smith's.

Anything on Naim Hines to the builds? I'm sort of not particularly wellmed in any direction, but think it's good that they're still paying attention to making sure that that running game is something before the end of the year. I think it's just another weapon. It's a guy that they didn't have before. They get a another running back. And I'm at the point where it's the bill's offense and anything you drop into it is going to work.

Like any player you drop into it is probably going to fit. It's almost like the NFL version of the Warriors at this point where every move they make is going to work out because they're so good. And the talent around them allows these players like Heinz to shine a little bit more than they would for a more mediocre roster. Yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense to me too. anybody who didn't get traded that surprised you um brandon cooks was tweeting some some convoluted and he wasn't at practice right i was yeah he didn't go to practice and he tweeted i'll pull it up but something about like not wanting to have his career messed with no yeah

brandon cooks is i really wanted to see him get traded because he's like a really good football player who has been lost in houston for the last couple years but like low-key Houston kind of made out well after the Hopkins trade because they just they got cooks for cheap and cooks ended up producing at almost the same level as Hopkins did for Houston. So I

would like to see him get a little more shine on a bigger stage, but he's just going to have to play out the rest of the year in Houston with no one watching. Okay, here's the tweet. Don't take a man's kindness for granted. Covered for the lies for too long, those days are done. Cross the line with playing with Mike

career. That's a receiver tweet if I've ever heard one. You don't think that's a defensive back tweet? You think that's a receiver tweet? I think that they have the same mentality. So they kind of fall into the same genre. Yeah. I'm interested.

It's been a lot of drama coming out of the Houston Texans organization lately. I would be curious. I would encourage Mr. Cooks to speak his mind, let us know what's on his chest. And if he wants to tell us what's been going on. the man did sign a contract extension there before the year. I don't think that, you know, he knew what he was signing up for.

I'll just say this. This would never stand. This type of speaking I would never stand under Jack Easterby's watch. You have to wonder if the organization is going downhill after losing that guy. Wow. It's a fair point. The glory days are over. Shoot. He was the glue that was holding everything together.

All right, Stephen. I think we will leave it on that note. this has been the Ringer NFL emergency trade deadline recap pod. Because of this show, we're going to be switching up the lineup on the feed a little bit this week. I will be on the island, which will be dropping Thursday. And then the preview show is going to come out on Friday. Looking forward to that with Stephen Ben and Danny Hafeitz, of course. No scramble this week.

Sheal is busy with all sorts of Philly sports stuff, but it'll be back next week. Thank you to Isaiah Blakely for production on this episode and to Arjuna, Ramgapal, for additional production supervision.