The Ringer NFL Show - The Bengals Shrink Without Ja'Marr, Pete Carroll for Coach of the Year, The NFC's Three-Team Race, and More Big Takeaways from Week 8 | Extra Point Taken

Episode Date: November 1, 2022

Ben and Sheil get together to share their reactions to the Cleveland Browns' dominating win over the Cincinnati Bengals on 'Monday Night Football.' Then Sheil sends a heartfelt apology to Pete Carroll while Ben explains why the Bears sending Roquan Smith to the Ravens is just step zero of their rebuild.(10:38) Next, they talk about the NFC teams that are most likely to make it to championship weekend and give some much deserved flowers to Carolina Panthers QB P.J. Walker.(31:15) They end the pod by trying to figure out what's going on with Trevor Lawrence in Jacksonville and Ben uses this week's extra point to detail his trade deadline wishlist.(45:11) Hosts: Ben Solak and Sheil Kapadia Associate Producer: Chris Sutton Production Supervision: Conor Nevins and Arjuna Ramgopal Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Mac Jones is ripped. Matt Patricia's calling plays. The Celtics are title favorites. And The Ringer has a new Boston show. I'm Brian Barrett, host of Off the Pike, the show covering all things Boston Sports. I'll have shows multiple times a week covering your favorite teams and with your favorite ringer and local guests. Plus, maybe Bill will stop by to rant about the socks. Follow off the pike with me, Brian Barrett, now on Spotify.

Welcome to Extra Point Taken. I'm Shield Capati. As always, joined by Ben Solac. After Monday night football, I can't say this is one. We'll be telling our grandkids about, you know, bouncing them on a 32-13. The night that Jacoby Berset and the Browns beat the Bengals 32 to 13. But that was the final score, a sleepy first half, a busy second half in which the Browns took over, took control the game. This is maybe the fastest we've ever started upon after Monday night football because we really didn't need to focus in there on the final two minutes.

Benjamin Solac, how are we doing? I will be telling my kids about this game because the under should have cashed and it is unreasonable that it did not. I hate garbage time so much. It was a very interesting gambling weekend. I mean, there were a bunch of games that were decided at the very end and you end on the right side of some of them like a little PJ Walker and then you end on the wrong side of them like Bill's, how are you not covering 10 and a half in that game that you dominated the entire time. But that's listen. Bill's not covering was ugly. Those, none of my takes will be gambling related.

today. If you're joining us for the first time, here's how it works. Extra point taken means we each offer three takes from the week that was, and one of us ends it with an extra point. As always, we start with the game. We just watched, Ben, you were on Monday night football duty today. What's your takeaway from a game like this? Yeah, it's tricky. I don't want to do a, like, Bengals writ large takeaway, because they're just so banged up, right? It's hard to say, like, oh, the Bengals are in trouble. If they just, like, they had no interior defensive line. You saw how much that matter. They lost Shadobya Wuzier during this game. You saw much that mattered in the passing game. There's no Jemar Chase in this game, which is kind of what I'm going to talk

about. But it's, I don't want to like do a hold right off the Bengals take, nor do you want to do like rounds or back take for the exact same reason because it's like, yeah, you should be able to run the ball against this team, given the interior issues. I was really big on Atlanta upsetting Cincinnati last week because of that. I forgot that Atlanta was going to have massive corner injuries. It's just the nature of midseason NFL football. But you should be able to run the ball on a team like the Bengals when they're dealing with this. And then defensively, yeah, I mean, you generate your pass rush and that's how you win. So like large-scale takeaways, so the team is banged up as the Bengals were, I feel like is tough. What I will say is, it's really scary. Like, seeing Joe Burrow without Jamar Chase again

was a stark reminder of what Joe Burrow looked like before Jamar Chase, right? You remember that season when the Bengals hadn't drafted Jamar Chase yet? And like, they get a pass for like young quarterback and young coach and they were still figuring everything out. I'm not going to be like, well, Burrow is exactly what he was in 2020, now that he doesn't have Jamar Chase in 2022. But the inability of the Bengals to get the football down the field in any meaningful way without Jamar Chase was terrifying, right? So much of Bengals' off-season conversation,

Super Bowl run conversation went like this. You have Joe Burrow, you have Jamar Chase, and then you also have T. Higgins on the outside. You can get, if they take away Chase, you can go for Higgins, and you just have these two skyscrapers to win on the outside, one-on-one, pick your poison. And then you remove Jamar Chase, and it's like, okay, huge T. Hagan's opportunity. And he's just nowhere for the first three and a half quarters, right?

Big touchdown, garbage time. Catch kind of, you know, makes the stats look a little bit better. But he was erased by a secondary that was largely playing him with greedy Williams and Martin Emerson, man. Didn't separate, right? He was asking for flags. They didn't win his contested balls until late. You lose Jamar Chase. And all of a sudden, this becomes a quick passing team, which they've been deciding to be a quick passing team.

in recent weeks. Don't get me wrong. In terms of time to throw, the Bengals started this season, a ton of their attempts more than three seconds. Burroughs holding on the ball, he's rolling out. They had against Pittsburgh,

against Dallas, against the Jets, which are their weeks, two, two, and three games. Attempts over three seconds was like 10% of their offense, 15% of the offense. They're still generally quick game, but they were pushing the ball down the field.

This game, this game against the Browns, their quick game, and everything is behind the line of scrimmage. They had over 30% of their passing attempts, targets behind the line of scrimmage in this game. Without Chase, they just shrunk, man, just shrinking violent. And that's scary because that's not going away for the next four weeks.

And I don't know if I trust this coaching staff to do what's necessary to open that up. I don't know if I trust there's offensive line to protect long enough to open that up. Like, this is some of the regression that we were talking about. So I guess my first point from Monday Night Football is we talked a lot in the pre in the 2021 season about how Joe Burrow had developed into the superstar quarterback that was like defining the Bengals season. I think Jamar Chase was a superstar wide receiver who was defining the Bengals season. I think Joe Burroughs is a very good player, but it feels right now like Jamar Chase was really that keystone. Jabbar Chase was really that key cog and losing him makes this just an ugly looking

offense. Well, I think Bengals fans would probably hear that and be a little sensitive and be like you're taking a jab at Joe Burrow, which I know you're not doing. I think that's a little bit of it's a, it's a league. I mean, look at the zoom out a little bit and look at it league wide. Yeah, the Bengals without, look at what these number one wide receivers do for these offenses. I mean, it's everywhere. It's one of the stories of the season this year, A.J. Brown with the Eagles. Oh, totally changes their entire offense. Tyree kill with the dolphins. Oh, totally changes their entire offense. The Packers without Devante Adams totally changes their entire offense for the worst. Like, it matters having that guy, having that problem solver. And Chase, I would put him like at the

top of the list with those wide receivers because of what he can do with the ball in his hands, what he can do to stretch the field. He's the guy on Tuesday, the defensive coordinator. All right, what is our plan for Jamar Chase? They've got other good players. You mentioned it. T. Higgins is a good player. Tyler Boyd is a good player.

But they're not the ones that keep you up at night if you're a defensive coordinator. And so to me, that's what really stuck out, you know, to go with what you're saying. I still very much believe in Joe Burrow, you know, in this situation, I'm going to give him a little bit of a pat you know i i feel like like like you said i mean i i don't think anyone's really believed that this coaching staff is giving their offense like huge schematic advantages like some of the other offenses we see in the NFL then you look at the offensive line below average offensive line still and now you lose chase and it's your first time playing without him uh this season and so uh let's see what it looks like for the next few weeks i mean it could be a a month long issue or however

long until he's back because chase is just that freaking good that he changes everything and you build a lot of stuff around his ability. He's a problem solver in high leverage situations. That Saints game, I mean, he just makes the 62-yard catch and run. And like that, that wins you the game. And how many instances of that have we seen in two years? So yeah, I think it's fair to be concerned about that. I don't think it says anything, you know, about Burrow.

I think it says like some of these guys, the top whatever, five, eight guys at wide receiver can really totally make over some of these offenses. I think the framework to me is in the offseason. And I don't want to pick on Bengals fans. Bengals fans have been notoriously pugnacious since their 2021 season run. And they get upset with a lot of people in the media for being like, hey, this four seed from the AFC north that's getting really good defensive play. Like maybe isn't that great of a team in the playoffs. There's a lot of reasons about I understand that.

So I don't want to go out Bengals fans. But I think if you had polled Cincinnati fans and even like NFL analysts writ large before, I said writ large too many times already on this. podcast. If you, if you polled them in the summer and you'd said, who's closer? You have to pick one. Who's closer? Joe Burrow to being a top five quarterback or Jamar Chase to being a top five receiver. I think the, the outstanding majority of both Bengals fans and analysts, would have picked Burroughs closer to being a top five quarterback than Chase to being a top five receiver. I don't know that I agree with that. I think that that would have been the general consensus, at least among Bengals fans. And I think the longer this goes, the more evidence we had that

like Burrow, who is a good quarterback, clearly above average, clearly good, clearly a positive to his team is much further away from being like a top five guy than Chase is to being a top five receiver because it's very difficult to rank receivers. You can win at the position in so many ways that like 95 different rankings make sense. But right now, man, like Chase is somewhere between like six and nine. You know what I'm saying? He's right on the fringe for me of that top five group. Oh, I think he's there. I mean, Chase, Jefferson, Devante Adams, Tyreek Hill, AJ Brown, who am I missing? Hill Cup, Jefferson, and Brown. I think you cannot get out of the top five. I have a particular affinity for Debo Samuel that I would understand if others are

hesitant of. I would also say that Josh McDaniels failures should not so quickly expunge Devonte Adams in the top five conversation as well. Like, Devonte is still that guy. They got to find a way to get in the football, but he is. So to me, it's like Chase is in that second tier still with the ability to kind of work up into that first year. But I think he's closer to making that jump than Burrow is to making the top five quarterback jump. Yeah, I think a quarterback and we can end on this. I mean, the only guys who I feel like could do it without, I'm not worried about their supporting cast at all, or Mahomes and Allen. I'll put them in that category. You drop them into any offense and I'm saying they're going to light it up. I feel like pretty much everybody else needs

help. And so I still have Burrow right there among the, you know, if you ask me, what quarterbacks do I want for the next decade. I don't think I could name five ahead of Joe Burrow. I still have him there, but it'll be interesting to see what it looks like here without Jamar Chase. All right, my first take. We're going to move off of this game. We're going to move to the Sunday games. Pete Carroll is the coach of the year in the NFL through eight weeks. Oh, yes. That's my take. That's such a good take. And I owe you an apology, Pete. I covered you for a couple of years in Seattle.

I thought you were going to say it would be an apology. I was like, oh, cool. No. No, I'm not apologizing to you. It'll be week 24 before that happens. I thought this team was going to crater this year. I thought they'd be in the mix for a top five pick. I remember saying on this ringer NFL feed that the best thing for the CIOs might be to suck.

Go get Bryce Young or whoever. And guess what? It'll only be one down year and you'll be back in it. I mocked you for Gino Smith and Drew Locke quarterback competition. I laughed in your face. I ripped you guys for putting these unknown rookies at tackle at cornerback. No one does. You don't play rookies at those positions.

Island positions. Yeah, in the NFL. And you're fine with it. Well, guess what? Through eight weeks, the Seahawks are five and three in first place in the NFC West. On Sunday, they beat the Giants 27 to 13. and there were a few moments in this game that really stood out to me. One, they have a drive in the second quarter where they face a fourth and one in the red zone.

Carol has been notoriously conservative in these spots. He goes for it. Then they have a fourth and two on the same drive. They go for it again. They score a touchdown later in the game. This spoke to culture to me. Tyler Lockett drops a short touchdown down the right sideline. What do you see on the sideline?

You see Carol. You see Gino Smith. You see veterans. everyone going up to Tyler Lockett. Not only that, they call a double move for him against Dory Jackson, who was having a great game until then. Great season. Yeah, great season. Lockett smokes him down the right sideline.

Gino Smith throws another dime, touchdown to Tyler Lockett, redemption. And then maybe my favorite. And the one that really made me think of this take is late in the fourth quarter of this game, Gino Smith scrambles for a first down on third and eight. Pete Carroll is so fired up, basically runs onto the field. the official bumps into him, throws a flag for unsportsmanlike conduct. But you can see it on Pete Carroll's face.

He loves coaching this team. And what did we hear? And I know I've probably written it or said it somewhere. Oldest coach in the NFL. Now he's going to trade Russell Wilson and go to Gino Smith. And you're telling me they're going to be able to rebuild. Guess what? They have their over under for wins, five and a half.

They've already got five wins. Only the Falcons and the Texans had lower over undersers. And here's what I think I underestimated. about Pete Carroll and I probably do this with other coaches and we'll probably do it on this podcast later is sometimes they earn the benefit of the doubt and they know their team better than you know their team. And I was there with everyone. Let Russ, let Russ Cook be aggressive on fourth down, all these things. And listen, some of that I think was fair. If you look back at, you know, some of those teams, I think the criticism was fair. But look at how he's coaching now.

Now he's combining all his great qualities, leadership, culture, motivation, a team that plays with joy. What do we talk about last week? I hate the charges. The charges play with no joy. You know what team plays with more joy than maybe anyone in the NFL right now? The Seattle Seahawks. He's combining that. And you can tell he loves the offense.

They're passing the ball at a very high rate. Gino Smith might have a better understanding of the offense he plays in as much as any quarterback in the NFL. I mean, you watch them play. He knows where the answers are to all the issues that defenses are throwing his way. Pete Carroll's being aggressive, as I mentioned. on fourth down because he believes in his offense. This man is, what, 48 games over 500 as the head coach of the Seahawks.

They've been in the playoffs nine of 12 seasons. I thought they were not getting back there this year. They got a great shot to get back there this year, whether they win the division or get in as a wild card. And so, Pete Carroll, I apologize. I shouldn't have doubted you as much as I did going into this season. You are doing a fantastic job. Your team is fun to watch.

I get this wrong every week. greater than the sum of the part. The whole is greater than some of the parts. That is coaching. That's all that matters in coaching, and you're doing it. What do you think? Do you see the clip of him that's kind of circling around on Twitter of him kind of, you know, taking a little victory lap, taking a whiff?

Yeah. Thank you for not tagging me. The Hawks, I mean, you could have tagged a number of people. You could have tagged me. We got the cable Thanos putting the great Seahawks video out there again. I'm watching that hold in my breath going, all right, am I going to be in here or not? Thank you for not including me in that, but I'll call myself out because I had a lot of those takes. So, yeah, I have to own up to it.

Yeah, the video I'm referring to Pete and his press are basically saying, you know, people said, I was the oldest coach, people said I couldn't keep up with the new stuff. People said, you know, we, you know, I wasn't going to cut it. And then he said, and I quote, that's a load of crap. He just looks so happy to say it. He's just feeling it. And it's an interesting point because the Seahawks all. are extremely pass happy, right?

Neutral down, pass rate up. Person 10, pass rate, pass over expectation. Up, up, up, up. They're being aggressive on fourth down. They're going for it. Why wasn't this happening with Russ over the end of his career? The Seahawks would love to say, we always wanted to be this forever.

We couldn't be this because of Russ. Right? They're just like Russ's play style. Like we'd go for and forth and when he'd throw up 45 yards down the field. Right? Like we needed to be like like, you know, under center run. center run, play action, play action, play action.

We had to be that with Russ. So we couldn't play this way. Being aggressive on fourth down, being a high pass rate, doesn't map onto the offense we had to run with Russ. That has some credence to it. Some of that's a load of baloney. I think the general Seahawks criticizing public would love to say, we bullied the Seahawks into doing this, right?

Like, the Seahawks had that let Russ Cook moment. They saw what a pass happy offense could be. It fell off the rails, but it took. taught Pete Carroll, like, oh, you could pass a lot in 2022 and it's good. That has some credence to it. There's also a lot of bologna to it. I don't think the man who went into the summer with the Gino Smith, Drew Locke, quarterback competition cared that much about being bullied into any decisions.

Yeah, and let's not even say, like, the media bullied him into it. Let's say, like, Russ did. Let's say, Russ was like, I need a pass. I want to pass all the time. They're like, fine, Russ cooked. And then it didn't work over the course of a season. But in the first few weeks, it's like, oh, like, actually, you kind of chalked. kind of chuck it a lot.

Like, he had some good things happening. You know, let's squirrel this away and see if you can use this later. But let's also not forget, you know, do you talk about a Drew Locke, Gino-Smith quarterback competition? Yeah, it was a Drew Locke. They didn't walk in and being like, oh, now we have Gino. Time for, you know, 66% pass rate in fourth and four attempts. They thought Drew Locke was going to win this job, man.

That was the message that they were sending in the summer was like, we really like Drew's talent. Pete said like three weeks ago, Drew is. nipping at Gino's heels, right? Yeah. So it's, it just, all of this goes to show you how really, really, really, really thin the margins are, right? It's just a couple of things break your way. And all of a sudden, you're no longer the oldest coach in the league who still talks about the value of running the football.

You're the oldest coach in the league who's got like an MVP candidate quarterback out of a guy who was on five other teams before it was with you. And it's just a couple of different things that change it. It just makes me love the chaos of the NFL all the more. Yeah, no, it's true. And your point is a good way. I don't want to come across and say all the criticism at the Seahawks over the last five, six, seven, eight years was unwarranted. I mean, absolutely some of, you know, coaching decisions, him being conservative, even some of

the run past balanced up. That was warranted, I think, that criticism. But for this version of Carroll to emerge with this team and this quarterback to me is one of the more fun things that has come out of this season. And again, just a reminder to myself, listen, if a guy has a track record like he, has sometimes. You're always at a information deficit. You know what I mean?

We can look into everything we know and report and analyze and numbers and film and everything. We're always at a bit of an information deficit. And so it's a good reminder to kind of humble ourselves as analysts when somebody has a track record to, all right, let's make sure we see the other side and are open to the possibility of success. The best grading scale for a head coach is always tenure. How long have you held the job? for an assistant coach and coordinator is the opposite.

It's the worst thing in the entire world. If he's been there for 20 years, it's bad. But for like a head coach and like, if you look at your hard balls, you look at your Tomlins, you look at your beads, you look at your Pete Carroll's, obviously you're Bill Belichick.

If you've just survived a couple changes front office guys leaving, assistants leaving quarterback changes, yeah, you're doing something right. I guess that I was trying to think if I agreed with that or not with all the politics of the NFL

and, you know, sometimes I don't like the name to mention. That's why for assistants, it doesn't count because the assistants it's always nepotism. But if you've got a head coaching job with that visibility for that long, yeah, you're pulling it off. That's true.

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I wear a certain hat, I wear a certain t-shirt, they won. Second game, what am I going to do? I'm going to wear the same one. Third game, what am I going to do? Wear the same one, guess what? They were three and no. All right, sports fans were a little weird, but you don't have to get that personal.

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What do you got? Roquant Smith, traded to the Baltimore Ravens. We've got trade deadline movement. For anybody who missed it, Bears linebacker Roquan Smith sent to the Baltimore Ravens. In return, the Ravens sent to the Bears a second round pick and a fifth round pick, both in the upcoming drafts of 2023. And they also sent A.J. Klein, which I always love when they do this. They're like, yeah, second round, fifth round pick.

Oh, and do you want the guy? we're not going to play anymore because we got him. Just like, you get first dibs. And then the other team's like, yeah, well, AJ Clyde will have eight tackles for us randomly in some game. Always tickles me. Roquan was in contract negotiations with the Bears this year, had a hold in in camp because he felt like he was not getting the deal he deserved from the Bears,

represented himself, moved on from his agent. Ryan Poles, the general manager in Chicago, claimed that he had, quote, record-breaking, end quote, parts of his contract offered a Roe Kwan, which, okay, I don't know, like, best linebacker contract in the league. I feel like you would have taken that. Like, I don't know, whatever. So it was a messy, messy, messy situation. Roquan ends his hold-in, plays the, over the course of the season for the Bears,

plays quite well, I might add, but was not in the Bears' long-term plans. Important to note that Roquan is under contract through, I want to say, the 20-23 season. Yeah, he was a 2018 first-round pick. So, excuse me, into 2022, this is the fifth year for Ropwon Smith. So he'll be a free agent in 2023. Ravens, pretty obvious. Linebacker play is bad. Defense has been improving week over week, but Patrick Queen has been a liability for them.

They can't have him to be their primary linebacker at this point. He just guesses too much, not good enough against the run. Rokwon solves a lot of problems for them. They're getting David O'Jabo back. Their second round pick out of Michigan purported to be healthy. Tice Bowser's coming off of IR. Reinforcesments are coming at the second level for the, for the Ravens. They're going to get more talented on defense.

I think there's Ravens defense, which was disappointing to start the year. I think it's improving week over week. I think this team is a legit AFC contender. I've talked about them on this spot before. As like the third best team in the AFC, I still believe that. Bears angle, and this is the tape. Selling the farm is not step one of the rebuild. It's step zero.

And you don't get credit for doing it. There's a lot of Ryan Poles, like, like Ryan Poles, like Ryan Poles, create a clean slate. I'll fill in the coffers. getting geared up for a big free agency run in 2023. Man, I could do that. I could answer the phone and be like, hey, here are my good players.

What's the best thing you'll give me for them? Trading away good players for picks is the easiest thing in the world. You want to know why? Because the other 31 teams want to use the picks to get good players. That's how you build good football teams is you have these resources,

draft picks, cap space, and you use it to get the best players possible and build good teams. I will say you get credit You get a little bit of credit for knowing that that's what your roster needs. You get a little bit of credit for selling ownership on it because it's hard to sell ownership. I'm like, hey, we're just going to get rid of all the good players. Are you cool with that?

That's hard to do. So you get some small credit for having the self-awareness of saying, okay, we should probably just reset this roster. It's a little bit beating up. The defensive, you know, a depth chart doesn't really map from Vic Fangio's system, Sean DeSys system, onto what we want to do with Matt Ibrose. We've got to kind of turn this over. Let's take a year off.

Like that takes some humility. It takes some patience. There's plenty of potential general managers don't have it. So sure. You get that, that's good. But let's not act like this is difficult

or requires good general managing skill. It's not if it's like, oh, good sign for Ryan Poles. He traded away Robert Quinn and Rochwan Smith. Man, like, anybody could do it. You just kind of get on the horn and you figure out who wants to good players.

The only way this is a good move is if it is returned with adequate value after the picks are made, which is not fair. Like, I say that, I understand that's not fair. Like, that's, that's not real. I won't actually judge Ryan Poles, like, you know, I won't judge his second round pick that he got from Roquan more harshly than the regular second round pick they got.

I'm not saying that. But what I am saying is, you as a general manager, create this big war chest. And in doing so, you are being patient, you are kind of punting on 2022. But with the way that, like, the Bears' offensive began better, week over week and then they hung around with the Cowboys for three quarters. They had the win against the

Patriots. They had been close in games against the Giants, against the Vikings, against good teams that they should have beaten. This team had legs and polls stuck to his motto, sell, sell, sell. Okay. You better deliver on this war chest. You better

not miss, especially because you took this job knowing you don't get five years of rookie contract quarterback. You get four because Justin Fields already played one year. And then you decided to sell on a year. Now you get three. And that third year is the fifth year option. It doesn't really counts. Now you get two. So if you're going to load up on 2023 picks and in doing so, move on from a 24 year old multiple all pro season linebacker, you better not miss. So I always,

whenever we see these general managers in these big rebuilds and these kind of sell phases, it's always like, great, they're doing the right thing. They are, but it's really not that hard. The hard thing is the next thing. And that's the thing I want my general manager to actually be good at. It's a great point. I'm glad you brought it up. I think people have gone way too overboard. First of all, they traded him for a second and a fifth, and they traded Quinn for a fourth. This team doesn't have like, it's not like they have three first round picks all of a sudden. If they maximize the value and you went, oh my gosh, I can't believe what they got for player X, then we can get in the conversation of, okay, this was really smart. They're loading up. That wasn't

really the case here. I mean, I could easily make the case that they botched this. And if they would have traded Robert Quinn when he was coming off an 18 and a half sack season before this year even started, and Roquant Smith, when teams would have him for the full year, you know, back when the Bears' brass

took over last year, that they would have gotten better draft compensation. By the way, maybe they would have gotten draft compensation in last year's draft and already have those players in the building and maybe it'll be a little bit ahead of the rebuild. So I agree with you. I don't think they deserve any, you know, what, gold stars?

I don't need, I should know. I'm the one with the kids. I don't know what they put on their homework anymore. I think you make the point where, like, we've just a little bit gone too far down the mountain of, like, fans are so cognizant of good team building because, like, I think we as a football consuming public and as a football communicating media, have done a great job of talking about, like, hey,

not every team has a chance to win the Super Bowl every season. Like it was just, it was not useful for the Panthers to be like, let's build a contender. Like that was just not going to happen, man. So like your self-awareness is important. It's just it reaches a water's edge. And to me, things like, woo, my general manager traded the multiple all pro linebacker for not a first round pick. It's like, you know, it's just, it is good. And in my opinion, it's also like a little bit better return than I thought they'd get just because I thought the league knew they had no leverage on Roquan.

Roque 1 hated the Bears by the end of this. He held out in camp, and his contract was going to expire. Like, he was not going back to Chicago. So they got, like, I didn't think they could get a second. I thought the league would say, we'll wait eight months away for this guy to get on free agency. Kudos to the Ravens for saying, no, no, no, let's get him in the building. The real reason the Ravens kind of get to do that, though, is because they have a little bit more cap room right now. It's because they haven't extended their quarterback.

And now the Ravens have one franchise tag and won the Marjorie. accent and one Roquan Smith. And it's like, all right, they have plenty of cap space. They can get this done. They have two players in the building right now. Both of whom represent themselves. Both of whom have contracts expiring. And they have one franchise tag. So Baltimore is like, for the next four months, it's like, oh, sick.

Baltimore's got Roquan, they got Lamar. This is a great team. The moment we hit the off season, it's like, heck, you've got to sign somebody. This is a, they were positioned to make this move, but it is an aggressive move. It's just saying, like, even forgetting that extra. return on it. I will celebrate the Bears rebuild when I see the young players get out on the field and actually help the existing cornerstone players that they have, which right now are what, Justin Fields, Jalen Johnson. Maybe on Justin Fields, I would say.

Right, but in terms of like functioning what you have to do, you know what I'm saying? I don't think they're going to draft a quarterback with all the other holes. So Fields, Jaylon Johnson. I'm not completely convinced of that. They're not drafting out of the quarterback. Yeah. We've talked about Justin Fields, Jaylon Johnson. Kevin Jenkins, who's playing great at right guard. They don't have cornerstones right now. They just straight away at Rokwon, who is who is their big defensive key piece.

So I will celebrate the Bears rebuild when I actually see it start to work. I think the compensation is fine. I think the age is a big thing. It's hard to find all, you know, like you said, pro-ball, all pro-caliber players in their mid-20s. Those players are hard to find.

Those are players you can build around and you can give them a four-year contract. if you like him. Now, I don't know what kind of money he was asking for. We'll find that out. But generally, when you draft a player and he turns into a great player and he's up for a second contract, those are the players you want to keep around. It's good for the culture. It shows the younger players, hey, grow here, you know, work with us, be good on and off the field, and we will reward you. And so that doesn't set a great precedent. Now, from the Ravens perspective, I think it's okay. I don't love this move. I don't think I would have done this move if I were then. The move doesn't

come with an extension. And so now is it a rental? Now you're giving up a second and a fifth for a rental, or are you committed to paying him? And if you're committed to paying him, you're talking about $19 to $20 million per year at the top of the linebacker market. So what I like about the Ravens is what I just said. They focus on, hey, is there a really good player we can get who's not that old? Let's go get them. That's sort of how they drafted last year with Linderbom. That's what they do here. Hey, this guy's really good. It's a problem area. Let's go get them. So I don't hate the deal. I'm just a little more on the fence because you mentioned it. Now you have to sign Lamar at a minimum of $46 million per year. Now you're going to be signing an offball linebacker

at a minimum of $19 to $20 million per year. Is that where you want to put that money? I don't know. So we'll see what they decide to do. All right. My next take. The NFC is a three-team race between the Eagles, 49ers, and Cowboys to get to the Super Bowl. We can. and say, we don't have to say goodbye to everyone else. There are some cute teams in there. Listen, if you're a fan of one of the other teams, you could have a fun season, you'll get in the playoffs. But if we want to talk serious, who's playing in Glendale, Arizona,

representing the NFC? It's a three-team race now and barring crazy injuries. It's going to be a three-team race in December, in January, and two of those three teams will be playing the final conference championship weekend. I've seen enough from everybody else. So let me give you the case. I don't know if you agree or disagree or have a team that you think should be in there. You saw me bouncing on the Zoom.

I'm in with this. Yeah, I never, I never, I don't know what that means. That could mean, oh, I'm going to come at him with this or it could be. Yeah, I'm on board with this. I will find out. It's only week nine. A lot can change Eagles. I don't have to make much of a case.

You can listen to the ringers, Philly special with Solac and I. They're seven and no, and they had the easiest remaining schedule in the NFL, according to football outsiders, Benjamin. I don't know if you, if you knew that or not. the easiest remaining schedule in the NFL and their 7-0 49ers. Here's the case. Christian McCaffrey, I said on this pod last week, reckless, but fun. We saw the fun part.

My gosh, he took over that game. I mean, that's a 17-14 game going into the fourth quarter, and he just comes through on like seven plays in high-leverage situations. They're playing with Debo Samuel, and honestly, you kind of forgot they were playing without Debo Samuel because McCaffrey was doing so much. Now you picture that offense with Debo, with McCaffrey, with Kiddell, with IU, Trent Williams is back. They just have so many all-pro caliber players.

I mean, the guys I just mentioned, and then on defense, you have Warner and you have Bosa. They're well-coached. They had the fourth easiest remaining schedule in the NFL, by the way, according to football outsiders, DVOA, and they're like a battle-tested group. They've been there, you know, they played in these big games, a lot of these guys before. So I have them in the mix. I think they have a Super Bowl ceiling. then the Cowboys, that was the seventh best offensive performance by any team this season in a single game, what they delivered in terms of EPA per drive Sunday.

It'll never happen again because they need Zeke to run the offense. So they can't have the seventh best offensive performance on the season. They can't keep doing that. They need to get back to what was actually working, which is having offensive performance is worse than the seventh best offensive performance of the season. Yeah, I mean, what Jerry should really do is just find someone to anonymously call like, the opponents that they're playing and ask them, would you rather see Tony Pollard or Z? Because my goodness, Tony Pollard,

with the burst he showed in that game, he was an explosive play waiting to happen every time he touches the ball. Michael Gallup, I thought, looked better than he has probably all season. Dak looked great. We know their defense is good, even if that wasn't their best game. And they have the fifth easiest remaining schedule. So I think those are the three teams.

maybe I'll change my mind in a few weeks and I'll say I was dumb. I have had a habit of doing that on this pod. Ben, am I missing anybody? You say, Sheal, what about this team? Why aren't they in there? Or do you agree that's a three-team race from now until conference championship weekend? I promise I'm trying to watch the Vikings and figure it out. And I just, I don't.

Like, I just don't see a team that is a good contending caliber team. I see an absolutely good team. Like if you gave the Vikings, you know, forgive me, like an improvement of quarterback, but also I think if you gave them a stronger outside corner room and a little bit more aggressive of a defensive coordinator, then I'd be like, yeah, yeah, for sure. But I just, I don't see this team playing three good passing offenses in the NFC playoffs and beating all three, which I guess like if they get the minors, it's just two, but also it's not really because the minors, they can always make it happen, you know what I mean?

But I love about Vikings fans, and you know, as you go into like a national role, you kind of find out which fan bases are insecure and which are Vikings fans, I can tell you right now. And Vikings fans, if you're listening, let us know if I'm wrong. I would highly doubt that they actually believe in this team. They're probably like, this is cool. It's a change job. It's fun to be six and one. But no, take us seriously.

What are you nuts? We've seen these guys too long. I thought they tried to kind of give away that game, honestly, against the Cardinals on Sunday. The Cardinals had all kinds of opportunities, bad interception by Kyler Murray, block in the back. They had the third down snap where the ball gets snapped in Kyler Murray's face, which is like a weekly thing for them. But anyway, sorry, go ahead. I'm with you.

I don't buy it with the Vikings. In terms of, like, losing a football game, Vikings try to lose a football game every week. You know who does a really good job trying to lose football games every week? The Arizona Cardinals. And don't you worry about a thing? Yes. So, yeah, I was asked on a radio hit this week, like, who are the Super Bowl teams? And it's Bill's Ravens, Chiefs from the AFC right now.

And it's Eagles, Niners, Cowboys from the NFC. and there was that period in like early October where we were like, oh, where are all the good teams, man? Bills are good, Eagles are good, Chiefs just lost the Colts, where are the good teams? The Ravens have been under your nose. Cowboys been under your nose the whole time. There were stuff to figure out, unlike the Eagles and the bills

were just like deleting people. There was stuff to figure out, but these teams have been there. The Ravens, you put on Ravens football, that's as good of a team as you're going to see playing an AFC or the NFC. You put on Niners football right now, defense. especially, that's as good of a team. Cowboys, defense good as a team. Like, this whole, like, there's no, this is a weird year with parity.

There's no good teams. No, no, no. They've been there. Ravens, Niners, and Cowboys are a very legitimate second tier of NFL teams right now. All three of them could go to the distance. Wouldn't be surprised. There you go. The Bucks, I've been hanging on the bucks for a while, but I don't know why it looks like Tom Brady and Mike Evans met like five minutes before kickoff

three times a game where they're not on the same page. The O-line injuries, I think, are too much. Now, Shaq Barrett's out for the season. Giants are a fun story, but I'm not taking them seriously as a Super Bowl contender. Packers, I thought that wasn't the most devastating performance on Sunday, to be honest, but they ruined their chances in the offseason with how they handled their wide receiver situation. And the Rams have been outscored Ben now by 39 points on the season. Only the Lions and the Steelers have a worse point differential

than the Rams this season. Okay, go ahead. What do you got? What is, is this your third take? I'm losing track. Yeah, this is take number three because I have the extra point. Okay. Stats. coming off the dome for you. Five games, 119 for 184, completion percentage of 65%, 1338 passing yards, 15 touchdowns to four interceptions, 5 and 0.

So PJ Walker did in the XFL in 2020. Oh, a PJ Walker take. He was the best player in that XFL. He was evidently the guy, and he was the guy that teams are calling for after that 2020 season. Of course, that 2020 season was, as we know, immediately abridged by the onset of COVID-19 there in March. In May, Walker wrote through the Players Tribune a piece about why the NFL and deeded the XFL.

And I want to read a piece, a part of that piece because I got to say, this is, we've done, we're in what week. This is the most unexpected moment in extra point taken history. Ben Solac is going to read a Players Tribune piece from PJ Walker on the XFL. I'm very excited. Hit me with it. I haven't read this piece. I read this today and I got emotional, which is why I wanted to read it.

Oh. Most people hear XFL, I think pro wrestling and he hate me, Jersey stuff, everyone remembers me old XFL's. The new league I played and was still owned by Vince McMahon, but there was nothing pro wrestling about it. It was real football. Most XFL teams are really,

really good, no gimmicks, no controversies. And I felt like the longer the season would have gone, the better league would have gotten, more intense, more competitive. Beyond that,

the best thing about the XFL was that it gave guys who are in the fringes of pro football, the opportunity to go out there and play and show what they can do. There are so many great talented players on NFL rosters that the league just isn't big enough for everybody to play, and that's a shame. The XFL was important to so many guys. It's hard to single out names because I don't want to leave anybody out because there are just a lot. If the season had gone on, most of them would have definitely be getting their chances to play in the NFL. I believe that. I mean, some of them already are, like me. He wrote that May 2020, he signed with the Panthers. He would play his first game for the Panthers in 2020

following a Teddy Bridgewater injury. I'm here to tell you, of the quarterbacks I've seen the Carolina Panthers trot onto the football field in the last three seasons, the best one I've seen play is PJ. PJ. PJs against the Bucs and against the Atlanta Falcons was making grown man downfield progression froze from inside of the pocket. How in God's name a player with that ability was on the depth chart. It was quarterback four behind Sam Donald, Baker Mayfield, and Matt Corral this offseason. I have no idea.

Zero surprise that the head coach who was responsible for that was fired, especially when it was PJ Walker's temple connection to Matt Rule that got in there in the freaking first place. Unbelievable. The fact that they, in the first game he played, only had him against the Rams thrown behind the line of scrimmage, equally inexcusable. But it goes back to the point that PJ made,

Give a talented player a window. Create more opportunities for fringe NFL players, and some guys will surprise you. PJ Walker right now is the herald for developmental leagues. So this is an NFL take, and then it's an outside the NFL take. The inside the NFL take is that PJ Walker is the best quarterback of pants to put in the field for three seasons.

If he continues to play the way he played in the last two weeks against Tampa and against Atlanta, which two banged up secondaries, I understand. He's got a slew of team. tough defenses up coming. They got to play Dallas. They got like Buffalo. I don't know how Buffalo got on the Panthers schedule. They got to play some tough defenses. There's a chance

that this comes crashing down. If he plays like he's played the last two weeks, he should absolutely be in contention for the Panthers starting quarterback job. I don't really care who they draft one overall. This has been an NFL caliber play the last two weeks. So number one is PJ Walker right now is auditioning

to contend for a starting job, probably in Carolina, but I'm not there somewhere else next year. It's 27 years old. You can do work with his legs. He can throw downfield accurately into tight windows. He can read defense. This is the pro player. Number two take outside of the NFL. Let's get these developmental leagues back up. The XFL has kind of like changed hands and they've been reorganized and the USFL's paired with the NFL. But man, oh man, like every week I watch PJ Walker play, I just think to myself, I want to see Quentin Flowers again, man. I want to see some more of these players. I want to see

some more of these quarterbacks to get opportunities. It's so cool that this guy came out of the XFL stuck on a roster through COVID was quarterback four and is now starting and going to overtime with the Atlanta Falcons of 67 and a half yard DJ Morehill Mary Bomb man. It's awesome. So kudos to PJ he's playing well and deserves to be highlighted. Cudos to the XFL for bringing this player along. He's fun. I mean, he's fun to watch. I can't tell you. I've broken down the PJ Walker film and can tell you whether I think he has staying power or not. But, you know, one of my longstanding theories is that for sports fans, it should be less about winning championships and more about do you enjoy the time you spent with the team you root for and the team whose jersey you buy and the team you buy tickets

to and the team you talk about with your friends and all those things. And he's been way more fun than their other quarterbacks that they've played. And I'm just, I just pulled up his stats here. I just wanted to look at every start by a Panthers quarterback in the last three years. There's been 43 starts by Panthers quarterbacks and his last two among that group have ranked 11th and 15. So it goes to what you're saying. I mean, he has, and those have been his first two in a situation with a team that just fired its coach and not a lot going for it. It's not like he's dropped in to a great situation. This kind of goes to the Gino thing. I mean, there will be, you know, the cases for giving guy shots who have not gotten a shot who you feel like have something to

them, you know, the Gino thing sort of adds more credibility to that, you know, it feels like a lot of times they haven't worked out, but something like that works out. And it's like, hey, maybe you should look at this guy a little bit more. So I think that's a good one. I don't have a strong take for you on the developmental leagues. But I like, listen, I like, you know, when you like cover a team as like a beat reporter and you get to know like the guys who are just fighting for it and how much it means to them and those things, like those are fun stories and makes it very meaningful.

And so if that allows more guys to have opportunities and the talent to rise to the surface and them to live a lifelong dream, whether it's for what you. year, whether it's for one week or whatever, those stories are really cool because you see how much these guys actually put into it. The guys on the bottom of the roster on the practice squad, the guys in camp who are just like want a tryout. It is so cool when those stories come out. So I think that's a good one. And that's PJ's point, right? Is they like, like, PJ was the best player in the XFL and is now playing really well in the NFL. That's wonderful. But the idea is like, hey, if this league, like the XFL was the most successful development

league we were having the pre-COVID one, right? Like, it was like, The games are competitive. They were doing interesting stuff. They were actually scoring points, right? It wasn't like the AAF where it was really tough to watch. This was legit. And it was like, if we just could have gone on longer,

could have really gotten this plane off the ground, then COVID hit. And that happened for a lot of things. That's why it's important to reinvest in the developmental leagues. We can't forget that we were doing that pre-COVID. Because if there's a legitimate developmentally for fringe roster guys, you're going to get more stories like PJ Walker and get more players like PJ Walker, hugely to the benefit of the league, if you can.

All right. My last one, I don't think you're going to like this one. the Trevor Lawrence experience has left me wanting more, Benjamin Solac. Now, let me get all the caveats. Left me wanting more, too. I'm not loving this. It does. Okay.

I wasn't sure. Let me be clear. He's playing fine. He's a competent starter. You'll watch it statistically. You know, however you want to break it down. He looks like a competent starter. There are a few things that leave sort of a bad taste in my mouth.

One is the negative place. I mean, he had that red zone interception this last week in the London game where he's had that exact interception already this year. It's in the red zone. I mean, it's first down. You have a chance to go at 14-0. You go, you bootleg out to the right. You don't need to make that throw.

He has three red zone interceptions in eight games. Only Kirk Cousins has more than one among the rest of the starter. So I just like, let's learn from some of those mistakes. I know you're young, but you don't need those negative plays later. He has an intentional grounding when the Jaguars are in field goal range. Like these are plays that matter. when you're losing all these one-score games like the Jaguars are. Number two, the accuracy.

And I'm curious to hear what you think of that one when I'm finished here. But I just feel like he misses throws every week. And it's just erratic. He missed one to Marvin Jones on a third and eight. He missed one to Evan Ingram on a corner route. Every quarterback misses throws. Nobody's perfect. It feels like his accuracy is a little bit more erratic than I was anticipating.

And then the third one, I want to see him, create more. Like, I was sold on Trevor Lawrence as a generational prospect, the arm, the athleticism. When they boot him and move him out of the pocket, he makes some unbelievable throws. He makes some of his best throws, some of his best plays. But I thought there would be more like, hey, you know, come up with an answer here and do something. Like, I thought he had the physical tools to do that. And you watch an entire game, and you don't see him do that once. I know scrambling isn't everything, but, you know, you did a good job talking about scrambling last week. He ranks 20th. in total EPA on scrambles this year,

just ahead of Matthew Stafford. Like, that should not be the case. Why is he not picking up a few first down, a couple first downs every game with his legs? And so those are some of the things that stood out to me again. He's doing a lot of the things within the structure of the offense, the decision making. But then those are some of the things that leave me thinking like,

oh, you know, you felt like he would be the reason they would be winning more games this year. And too often it's felt like there's been games or moments. where it feels like he is the reason why they're losing some of these close games, some of these one-score games. And so that's just where I am with him. I think a lot of people probably watched him for the first time, maybe not the first time, but maybe a full game because they were playing in that London game against the Broncos last week.

I think we were both bullish on the Jaguars coming into the season. He had the bad game in the rain against the Eagles. But I remember even after week one, that game against the commanders, I'm going, they left some plays on the field. They easily could have won. that game. So what do you think about my critiques there of Lawrence and where are you with him after eight weeks? Yeah. So I'll start by saying I did not see much of the Broncos game at off. London games happened during church. I always miss these London games drives me nuts.

With that said, the Red Zone Interception thing to me, that's the thing where like I'm most pissed. That's the thing where it's the most frustrating is just like I said this after the game and people got really mad at me for it. But I keep on watching this Lawrence season as his rookie season. To me, just like the 2021 season for Trevor Lawrence is just so emphatically useless. And like, yeah, I know why people don't like that take because it feels like unnecessarily excusatory. But I always say like Urban Meyer was not a bad coach.

He was the worst coach. It wasn't bad. It was horrible. Do we want to play the who were his top receivers in 2020? one game again, right? Leading receiver, Marvin Jones. Second, Leviska-Cenault, was traded away for Peanuts to the Carolina Panthers.

Third was Laquan Treadwell. Yeah. Dan Arnold, with Brian Schoenheimer and Daryl Bevel coordinating the offense. Inexcusably miss on, like, it was not a real year. So if you frame this as his first year, a lot of the stuff that doesn't make sense,

He doesn't know when to scramble and he wants everything to be in the pocket and everything to be perfect. He has his progression to every play. That makes sense. He's got this decision paralyization that a lot of rookies have. They don't know when it's like, you know, take the positive play and go. You know, the big misses of inaccuracy, that starts to make a little bit more sense because he's trying to make every single feel perfect. He's got some Herbert syndrome to him where like Herbert's like, all right, the textbook said one to two to three. If it's middle of the field closed, you go to the running back.

and then you're just an alien. So if you want to just like run, you can do that. He's very robotic. I feel like on the chalkboard every single time that is what he's doing, which probably pleases the coaches. But yeah, sometimes I want to be like, dude, you were built as a

generate, you have tools that not a lot of people have. Let's see them on display a little bit more. You have to know that because you're better than a lot of the other players, that you can make decisions to just put more of the game in your hand and that's excusable. That's acceptable, that's reasonable.

The red zone interception is the thing where you just kind of want to grab them by the scruff of the neck and be like, buddy, you're good. Stop. You don't got to prove. You don't got to always seven. This is childish stuff. Stop. And like, Zach Wilson is doing the same thing. When you feel yourself near the sideline behind the line of scrimmage, the defense one, get into the huddle, second and goal.

get into the huddle, third and goal. These aren't happening on fourth and goal. This isn't happening on, okay, the risk reward calculus has changed. These are happening on early downs in the middle of games. So the first thing I would do is I would just start running the football. You don't get the ball inside of the five anymore. You misbehaved, right? This is unreasonable and you know it.

You've played enough football to know that this is the red area. We don't turn the ball over here. So first you start running the football. And then secondly, you have to be able to communicate him and say, like, listen, Bill Barnwell wrote wonderfully about the 2021 quarterback class for ESPN. I encourage everybody to read it. And he brought up. Like, Trevor Lawrence is like seventh in EPA per play before he gets to the 20-yard line.

You're doing it. You're doing great, sweetie. Stop this. And the offense is going to be fine. It's going to work. We're going to win games. You don't need to like, you know, emphatically punch every drive where they contested Evan Ingram closing window touchdown.

There's no need for this. I was getting a funny visual there of you grabbing Trevor Lauren. and telling him he's misbehaving. Again, I don't want to ask people with Photoshop skills to do anything to get the extra point-taking brand elevated a little bit, but I'm also not telling you that you're not allowed to do that either. All right, Ben, finish us out with the extra point. What do you got?

This week on Extra Point, it is trade deadline season, thereby, it's not Christmas is Halloween, but I have a wish list anyway. Trade deadline, big name, wish list landing spots, and then we go to Shio Copadia for his take-on, what I would like to see tomorrow. I said earlier today on Twitter, I'm feeling a big trade deadline. I'm feeling it in my bones.

I like the storms are brewing. Like my knee is sore. Like I don't know how that works. It's always disappointing. It is. You're trying to wish it into existence. I feel it. And right after I said that,

Roguan got traded. So the portension for there, the signs, yes. Okay. We start with Naim Hines. Reports this evening, as we record Monday evening, there's going to be a lot of Naim Hines trade.

I'd like to see Naim Hines and the Giants. I think it's super fun. Like Matt Brayda is cool. in terms of being the second back, but two running back there who can both cast, you can both line up out wide, do the freaky weird stuff on offense.

That one's very fun. Albert Oak Wabanon, the tight end for the Denver Broncos. I'd like to see him, the Philadelphia Eagles. Talk about this on the Philly Special. The Eagles need a backup tight end. Jerry Judy, I would like to see on the Los Angeles Chargers.

Brandon Cooks, I would like to see on the Los Angeles Chargers. The Chargers so badly need a receiver who can stretch the field. They have no juicer receiver right now. Keenan Allen is apparently still not practicing this week. It's the world's longest hamstring injury for Keenan. They're going to play Michael Bandy again at receiver.

They really need to get the help. Are they going to be able to get Jerry Judy out of an interdivisional team? I doubt it. I still want to see it. This is my wish list. William Jackson. Corner for the Bengals. Get into the Falcons.

Falcons corner one, AJ Terrell is great. Corner two is Casey Hayward, extremely weak. Falcons are leading the NFC right now. Why not get a little bit friskey with a trade? William Jackson gives you, I think, two corners you trust in man coverage on the outside makes you stronger on defense. Cam Acres, I don't even know why we're kind of like caring about the whole Cam Acres thing.

I don't think he's very good. I don't think anybody's trading for Cam Acres. Yeah, I sent him to the Saints for a late round pick. Mark Ingram was really, really bad this year. Go get another really, really bad depth running back and see if he's a little bit better. You don't want to be running Kamara into the ground. Camara coming off, then you're getting a little bit old. Kareem Hunt, I have going to the Rams.

That feels extremely Ramsey, right? Like big name. He was once a star. it's going to make us so much better than it doesn't really happen. Kendrick Bourne to the Raiders. Let's get a Josh McDaniels transplant into Las Vegas. If they insist on being like spread the wealth, we don't throw it to Devante Adams.

The Mack Holland's experience has been weirdly great, but let's get more receiving talent into the building. If we're going to play it this way, you need to get more depth of receiver. As I said on the scramble last week real quick, Mac Collins talking junk this year has been one of the most underrated storylines in the NFL. You and I watched Mac Holland.

And just yelling, I am that dude. Yeah, all right, sorry. Go ahead. I mean to interrupt you. You had to get that in there. It's so annoying how good Josh McDaniels is it unlocking and utilizing bad players in the framework of how bad he is at using good players. Like, this is such a cool trait. Like, you should do all these like pass catching backs.

And he's like random, you know, transplant receivers. He's small slots. Now, like, all Mac Collins. Like, it's so cool that he's pulling this off. Also, can you please get the ball at Devante Adams? This should not be the hard part of the job. This should be the easy part. A couple more.

Cindy Jones, the Dallas Cowboys. Cowboys with a potential Jordan Lewis injury, needs corner depth. Sydney Jones right now just kind of like chilling in Seattle, not playing. He's been quality over the last couple of years. I think you get him to Dallas. And then Bradley Chubb to the Seattle Seahawks. I love the idea of John Snyder calling Denver back up and being like, hey, I know it didn't go great for you last time we were here, George Payton.

But I could use a teammate. for Uchena Nuwosu. It's been wonderful off the edge for them. Bradley Chubs out outside linebacker. He can drop a little bit. He's obviously going to be a high-quality pass brush. You're going to kind of round out what's a really good defensive brunch for the Seahawks.

And actually, I realized I forgot, Josh Allen, the edge from the Jaguars, send him to the dolphins. Dolphins, like I said, if they can get better on defense, they need corner depth, and I think they need edge help as well. Jalen Phillips has developed in a nice player for them,

but they need more in the pass rush. Josh Allen's ability to drop and blitz works for them really, really well outside linebacker. All right, I have two comments. I'm not going to comment on every one of these because we would have to do a whole other episode there, but I did enjoy that. It's Ben's trade deadline wish list for the extra point. Yeah, I did enjoy that.

So I'm going to tell you the ones I really liked from this. Well, no, first of all, what I thought was funniest is you asked for a trade deadline with juice. And then, you know, some of these names here, you'd have to be a real football. Oh, Albert O to the Eagles as a second tight end. I don't think that's going to lead ESPN sports center, Ben. But you gave me some juicy ones. You gave me some juice. I did it in order of guys whose names I found rumored on like,

trade deadline report of pieces. Okay. Brandon Cooks to the Chargers. I'll tell you what, that's my favorite one that I have not heard anyone. Say yet, that's a great one. An adult, a professional, pencil and in for a thousand. I mean, he gets 1,000 yards, wherever he goes, he knows what he's doing. He fits well. Herbert throwing bombs to him.

Give yourself some insurance. That's my favorite one among the ones that you mentioned here. I'm looking at the rest of them. Kareem Hunt to the Rams, I could definitely see. and I thought Bradley Chubb to the Seahawks, I loved. I haven't heard that one rumored. I mean, yeah, they went into the season needing pass rush. As I said, pass rush corners, tackle and quarterback, I thought.

They've got some young players. But yeah, you can never have enough pass rush. They could use some more pass rush. I think he compliments Nwosu's a little jack-of-all-trades type guy. You know, Chub, just, hey, get after the passer, pin your ears back. I like that fit there. I'll give you one, I'll give you one ludicrously spicy one, unnecessarily hot.

Okay. For the sake. Derek Card of the Jets? Yes, sure. Because Mac Jones for the Raiders. No, I was going to say Mac Jones to the Raiders. Okay. Let's get them both done.

Derek Carr, eminently movable. Mac Jones, for some reason not liked in New England right now. Let's get a mid-season starting quarterback trade at the deadline. Double swap. Let's get a double swap. Eric Carr goes to the Jets. The Jets all of a sudden are going to be real fun down the stretch with Derek Carr. Mack Jones goes to the Raiders.

He already knows their system. And Patriots fans can get what they want in Bailey Zappy because this mystery of what happened to the quarterback you drafted in the first round last year who played well and got you to the playoffs. And then everyone all of a sudden turned on very quickly and something weird happened. And he wasn't playing well. And we'll find out in a Seth Wickersham book 10 years from now. I like it. It's spicy. Good one.

All right. A reminder, as I do every week. I'm hosting the Thursday show The Scramble on the Ringer NFL Feak and have Stephen Ruiz on this week. We're going to break down some of the trades that might happen that Ben's so like suggested. So you can email us for the mailbag segment, the Scramble Mailbag at gmail.com. That's the Scramble Mailbag at Gmail.com. We'd love to hear from you. Ben, what do you need to pluck?

I'm on the pods and I write the pieces. So wherever the ringer is. On YouTube. On YouTube. Thank you. Ringer, Philly Special. and the ringer NFL shows and the ringer.com slash NFL and at Benjamin's

like at Twitter. Tuesday on this feed. You will get the power rankers Wednesday. You'll get Nora Princeati on the island. All right. Thank you to Ben Solek. Thank you to Christopher Sutton for producing additional production supervision by Connor and Evans and Arjuna Ram Gopal. We will talk to you next week on

extra point ticket.