The Ringer NFL Show - The Players No One Is Talking About Before Your Draft | The Ringer Fantasy Football Show

Episode Date: September 5, 2020

The Ringer’s Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck give a quick training camp injury update before highlighting some of the underdiscussed players from the preseason and giving our thoughts as we head into the last few days of draft season. QB Carson Wentz, Eagles (17:43 QB Drew Brees, Saints (19:57) QB Russell Wilson, Seahawks (23:53) TE Noah Fant, Broncos (26:51) TE Eric Ebron, Steelers (29:17) TE Zach Ertz, Eagles (32:17) RB Nick Chubb, Browns (36:11) RB Josh Jacobs, Raiders (38:40) WR Henry Ruggs III, Raiders (40:05) WR DJ Moore, Panthers (42:31) WR AJ Green, Bengals (45:07) WR AJ Brown, Titans (46:25) As you head into draft weekend, make sure to use the Draft Tracker feature on The Ringer Fantasy Football Draft Guide. Follow The Ringer Fantasy Football Show on Spotify here! Hosts: Danny Heifetz, Danny Kelly, and Craig Horlbeck Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Call 1-800 gambler. Or in West Virginia, visit www. 1-800 gambler.net. Or in Indiana, call 1-8009 with it. We're in Colorado. Call 1-800, 522-4-700. This is the Ringer Fantasy Football Show. I am Danny Heifitz here with Danny Kelly and Craig Krollbeck.

And Craig, can we set the mood with some music because it is a day for celebration? Well, that didn't take long. Lenny found a home. Leonard Fournett has signed with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Craig, you were here with us when you were at the bottom. How does it feel now to be on top? Our man, Lenny, was basically evicted from like a shitty one.

bed apartment and then found solace in a mansion in Bel Air. The Jaguars to Tom Brady is quite the come up, I have to say. That's like an all-timer. Gardner Minchin to Tom Brady. It didn't take long. And Kevin Clark in the Slack was like, are we all dumb? Like, Fornoyne was probably underrated for a minute there, right? Like nobody wanted them.

It was like $4 million. And now it's like, well, you know, he was a top five draft pick and he's really talented. And now the bucks just got like a really talented running back. My favorite part about this whole situation is last night, the people who are doubting, or doubting Ronald Jones were taking victory laps because, you know, ostensibly, Fournett is now the lead guy in that backfield.

But then this morning, Ariens was basically saying, no, it's still Rojo's job. So the Ronald Jones truthers are now taking another victory lap. I don't know what to think about this. Hyphids, can you take us through Bruce Ariens, like, you know, merry-go-round of statements in his coaching career? Bruce Aryan seems to enjoy lying. And that's not really my words.

It's kind of his. He likes messing with fantasy football people, I think. But you know what he also does is sometimes he pulls through, like when he was like Chris Godwin will have 100 catches last year. And like he pretty much did. Yeah, well, Bruce says what's on his mind. But in 2014, he said outright, they cardinals when he was the head coach,

they were not going to draft a quarterback than they did. And they asked them after he says, quote, I lie pretty good. End quote. Yeah. And then in 2015, he said in February of 2015 that Andre Ellington was, quote, still the focal point of their offense.

Spoiler alert, that didn't happen. They actually gave the ball to Chris Johnson. And then last year, again, he said they wanted to build around Peyton Barber last year. And then obviously, that didn't happen. So shout out to Graham Barfield for compiling all those. Yeah, I love that. The larger point is when Arian says they signed Fournet and then they say, Roja is still the guy, Lechon McCoy will have a role.

Fournette obviously is going to have a role. What do you guys make of that? because I just don't believe a lot of what Aaron's is necessarily going to say here. And my honest reaction was when he first signed, I bumped Fournet back up into, I believe, like, the late 20s, the RB28 or something like that. This morning, I have to admit, the Arian's quotes at least maybe drop Fournet down a little bit more and put Rojo up a little bit higher. I think ultimately I do have Fournet a little bit higher.

but it makes me a little more interested in Ronald Jones just because, you know, if he is telling the truth, if Ariens is telling the truth, and Ronald Jones is the guy, that's who they want to be the guy, they want him to emerge in that backfield. I mean, it hurts both of their values. When Fournette was on the Jaguars,

he would have been higher than Ronald Jones alone, he would have been higher. DK, I was wondering, how easy is it at the running back position to get acclimated quickly compared to other positions? Well, I mean, I think compared to other positions, it's relatively easy. the one, there's a couple things that make it more difficult.

The big thing is pass protection. You know, you have to learn that. Well, let me rephrase that because you don't necessarily have to learn that. In some offenses, pass protection is sort of like a lesser worry that you could just like have a running back to scat protection, which means they run out into the flats instead of actually try and block someone, just, you know, give the quarterback a target to dump the ball off to. Now, in the Buccaneers offense, they actually pass protect. I don't understand it from me, but they pass protect with their running back a little bit more often than most teams. So I do think it is a factor.

Basically, it's really difficult because you have to be on the same page with the quarterback. You have to be on the same page with the offensive line and knowing what your responsibility is based on where the blitz is coming from. Sorry, I'm a little fuzzy. Who's the quarterback for the bucks again? Tom Brady, who he's going to yell at you if you mess this up. Is he worth blocking for? I don't remember. He probably want to keep him on his feet, I would say. That's the thing. So is this up to Tom Brady or Bruce Ariens?

I mean, that's actually what I think what it boils down to is who Tom Brady wants on the field is, I think, probably going to play a big factor in this. If he trusts Ronald Jones as his past protector, as his guy that he's going to trust to leak out and give him an option as a dump-off guy, then maybe Ronald Jones plays the vast majority of the snaps. We don't really know. So that's why I put these guys closer in the rankings, just because I think there's still, things that it could play out a little bit differently. Right now, in our half-PPR rankings, which we just updated, we got Fournet at RB24, we've got Ronald Jones at RB-35. And I think that's like, I think we're actually still a little bit above consensus on

Fournet. But, you know, that's kind of just where we are right now. Well, and what's tough about rankings like that is it's unlikely that either of those people fit. It's unlikely that both finish right there. We're basically to say Ronald Jones has a less, likely chance of being the guy this year than Leonard Fournett. But whoever is the guy, they will most likely be better than we are currently ranking them. And the reality is if you could eavesdrop

into Tampa Bay's facility and just try to figure out who they're probably sitting around like, we don't know. It's a great problem to have. Do you think Brady was consulted before Fournette was signed? That would be an interesting question. Is it like LeBron where he just kind of picks who he wants? The way that Ariens was talking about it is he didn't, he didn't seem like he was really that involved in this acquisition. It sounded like he was saying there was a good job by the front office and kind of bringing him in, getting that deal done. And he was very adamant and almost defensive saying like Ronald Jones is our guy.

He's earned it. Blah, blah, blah. So I don't know. It's going to be very, it's difficult to predict. If you think that 4-Net is better, then I think you have 4-Nat ranked higher. I think we all think he's a better overall player. But, you know, I think we're all kind of, I'm certainly a Ronald Jones-Truther. And this was like one of those moments.

So it's like, God damn it. Okay, let's get to some other training camp news. Update on the Alvin Camaro situation. Apparently, Kamar and Sean Payton are fine, and they're getting over it. It seems that Kamara's going to play. Yeah. And the other thing actually to mention about the Camara situation is, you know, a lot of people were saying, like, the trade stuff was burying the lead.

He got, like, it was reported that he got an injection in his back. Yeah, I mean, I was more worried about him having a back injection than him not getting signed in time. I know. That was like, oh, God, back injuries with running backs are never a good thing, but it was notable. I texted my brother. His girlfriend works in medicine, and I was like, oh, Alvin Kamara got an epidural shot in his back. And my brother texted back, like, my girlfriend said those are for pregnant women. And I was like, yeah, that's weird.

Like, why did he do that? She's like, why would he do that? And then, yeah, D.K., you keep going. But it's kind of scary. Yeah, so, I mean, I think that was kind of a lot of people were like, uh, what is, what was, what's that again? What was that last thing you said? But, yeah, Ian Rappaport tweeted the other day that the shot that Camaro received in his back was just for SI joint inflammation.

And the shot calmed it down, not considered a big deal. As if that means anything to me. Well, yeah, and that's what I was going to follow up with Dr. Jean Bramble. That was your S.I. Joint. Not a big deal. Yeah, oh, it was just the S.I joint. If it was the T.G. joint. Oh, my God. Okay, so here, Dr. Jean Bramel from football guys, great guy, very knowledgeable, knows his fantasy football. Also a doctor said there is a huge.

He buried the lead there. I would have led with that. Anyhow, he said there's a huge difference between, there's a huge difference between the epidural spinal injection and sacroiliac, sacriiliac joint injection. If this report is accurate, it's much, much, much better for Camara's short and long-term outlook. So three muches from the doctor.

And I think, yeah, that's kind of like actually the bigger story here. Danny, you're the guy who contextualizes numbers for us. Is three much as good? That's a lot. Or is that like they're trying to overcompensate? No, it's good. Okay, good. It's definitely good.

All right. All right. Other news from this weekend, not this way, is Thursday. The Seahawks have re-signed Josh Gordon. Again, he has,

he applied for reinstatement. He is still suspended indefinitely. So there's zero guarantee he can play. He's 29 years old. As of Thursday. Maybe something's changed. I'm not adding him in any leagues. No.

Are you, you're the Seahawks? No. I mean, I think it's a good depth signing for the Seahawks and it gives them another nice, you know, kind of like,

ancillary weapon in their offense, but I don't think he's going to be a go-to guy. I think it's going to be D.K. Matt Caff and Tidelock in this offense. The C.Ox also signed Paul Richardson and Philip Dorset over the offseason, so those guys might have to compete for a roster spot at the end of the day. So we don't actually know for sure, you know, if he's going to be in this offense. But I think Gordon is going to be, I don't want to say this too surely, but I think what's going to happen is Gordon's just going to be a role player in this offense.

And that's good for the Ciox, but I don't think he's going to be a fantasy factor, at least, you know, not early on in the season. I agree. Other news, if you watched Hard Knocks this week, you know Mike Williams, he hurt his shoulder. He's expected to miss two to four weeks with a shoulder injury.

But he's also kind of just really a good representation of our episode today of looking at like the Stephen Glansbergs, the guy that none of us have talked about all year. Yeah. Do you think people know, like, how popular, how ubiquitous is the term Stephen Glansberg?

I think it's very niche. Have we explained this yet? It's very specific. I don't know if we've ever explained. I mean, I've played the Cleansberg. clips in previous episodes, but it's from the movie's super bad. And there's a kid who sits alone at lunch every day. And it's a brief aside in the movie where he goes,

oh, I'm just going to sit alone like I'm fucking Stephen Glansberg. And it just shows a kid, like, eating a pudding cup alone. So it's just the guys no one's talking about, the lonely guys in the fantasy community. All right, let's stop this, man. Let's go get some dessert. No, I can't. I got to go meet my counselor. I'm picking out my classes for next year.

What, so I've got to sit here and eat dessert alone like I'm fucking Stephen Glansberg? I get. Yeah. I mean, what do you want me to do? I don't know. No, then. It's fine. Relax, man. I'll see you later. It's fine. I'll be fine.

And it's in the middle of one of the all-time movie scenes in the middle of super bad. I love the fact that Craig picked that line out. It's the best. Exessed by some kind of dick devil. So I think we all kind of moved him down after this. And none of us were super high on him before. But Mike Williams, right now we got him with the wide receiver 48, just in front of Michael Hardman, Divo Samuel, C.D. Lam.

kind of that range. Well, in the Hard Knocks episode, it affirmed what I think about Mike Williams, which is the receiver's coach who's like, Mike Williams, amazing 50-50 ball guy. And I'm like, Tyra Taylor doesn't throw 50-50 balls, does he? And he, and no one was going deep in the episode. They're like, someone's got to hit Mike Williams. And he was just like open and no one was throwing it to him. If you do the spectrum of quarterbacks who are willing to throw 50-50 balls,

Philip Rivers is Tier 1 and Tyra Taylor is tier last. Other news, Muhammad Sunu is cut by the New England Patriots. I think this is more. interesting in real life than it is in fantasy. Fantasy, it's, I mean, he was intriguing, but obviously you don't want Muhammad Sanoo anymore. It's more interesting that Patriots traded a second rounder for Muhammad Sadoo. Yeah. He was spraying his ankle, came back, was supposed to be at 100% and they caught him. Like, that is amazing that Patriots punted a second rounder. Well, and just like, I think it's interesting because it's like, if you want any part of this Patriots offense now that Cam Newton is

the starter and there's a little bit of buzz going on, like literally, it's Julian Edelman and then that's it. Like there's Nikiel Harry Demir Burr. Gunner. The keel Harry has not been impressive. I know. But someone has literally got to catch the passes. I think Harry's been getting

a little bit more buzz as camps gone on. I hope so. I think he's a worthy dart throw or it's that, what's their tight end's name? I always forget his name. Devin Asi Asi.

There's two rookies and Ryan Izzo who might be worse than a rookie. It's the worst, it's the worst group because Matt Lacos opted out. So it's at least one of the two or three worst tight end groups

in the entire NFL. Why aren't they signing, why aren't they trading for like O.J. Howard. I mean, they literally traded Gronk to the books. They could have just done that straight up. So that would have been a good idea. Maybe they forgot. I don't know. I think, I think Bill just has too much on his plate, to be honest. I think Belichick's just kind of like sitting around like whatever. All right. Speaking of the Patriots, though, Damien Harris, my guy has hurt his hand. This is really embarrassing, but I'm going to admit. I had a dream last night that I was

scrolling Twitter and James White was traded. That is embarrassing. And then I woke up and I realized that Damien Harris had a hand injury. So. So it looks like your lucid dreaming has not been working. The lucid dream is not going well. And to be 100% honest, what's really disturbing is I've started having dreams where I'm scrolling my social media. And my brain is like making up social media timelines. It's like a true modern nightmare. It's clearly corrupted my brain.

You think it's time to take a break? Take a break on Twitter. And take a break in the episode. The Ringer Fantasy Football Show is brought to you by Fandul. We're teaming up with Fandul again. this season, but we got something new this time around all season long. You can play the free ringer mega contest on Fandall. Free ringer mega contest.

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and you can compete for a share of $25,000. it is that simple. Who do you guys like in week one? Okay, who do you got in New Orleans, Tampa Bay? That's a good one. At New Orleans. Especially early, I definitely think that I'm betting against every new coach and new staff.

Bill Porcell said a quote this week or last week, I don't remember that, I mean, all the new coaches have had 14 padded practices. And he's like, Bill Parcell's like, I used to do that in 10 days. I mean, Bill's jets and bills are home. Give me the bills, whatever the spread is. I think the best bet.

here actually this week. I think the Steelers over the Giants. I would be shocked if the Giants beat the Steelers on Monday football. Like it would be stunning in every... I don't know who's going to block

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That is fandle.com slash megacontest And then just want to shout out ringer fantasy football at gmail.com. You can email us if you have any questions. Fun fact this week is from Matt Diggin. Did you guys know that Cleopatra was born closer to the moon landing than the building of the great pyramids of Giza? No. That is, that's such a mind-blowing thing. The pyramids are incredibly old.

Human civilization is basically half ancient Egypt and half everything else. That's so wild. Cleopatra was born. in 69 BC. Wow. That's closer to the moon landing than the pyramids.

Anyway, pyramids super old. Jeez. That is, that is actually blowing my mind. Some would say the pyramids are

the first piece of pop culture and the most important piece of pop culture is super bad. So, without further to the Stephen Glanzberg. From the pyramids to super bad,

no one's ever made that transition. I am the first and the only in human history. Wow. But no, really, Stephen Glansbergs, these are the guys

that have been sitting alone at the lunch table and we didn't invite them to lunch. These are the guys that somehow we go through a whole fantasy football season. We write about this. We podcast about it. And yet we just haven't really talked about what we think about these guys. Some of these guys I actually don't know how you two feel. We have actually gotten this far and not really had a conversation with some of these dudes. Well, you know, it's like we don't even know.

Stephen Glansberg could be a good guy. We don't know. We got to talk. Cool. Give people a chance. That's the thing. Little peek behind the curtain. We were legitimately actually just at talking to each other.

We're like, what do we want to do for this episode? and then we decided like, whoever have we not talked about, wait, let's just make that the episode, you know? And so anyways, these are the guys, like Danny said, that we just haven't really talked about this

that much over the last couple of months. So let's get into it. I just want to start a couple quarterbacks. Carson Wentz on the Eagles. I don't know if we've said his name three times in the last two months. I know, right? But it's just worth summarizing a little bit.

I actually don't know how you guys feel about Carson Wentz. I think it's simple. This is all just, it's happening again with the Eagles. It's crazy. They had the most injured season I can remember in recent memory last year. And it's all happening again.

Carson Wentz already has a lower body injury. He's day to day. The Eagles have already lost Brandon Brooks, who's their all pro guard for the season. Andre Dillard, the left tackle for the season. Jalen Rager has an injury. He's out for a couple weeks.

Alshon Jeffrey's hurt again. Lane Johnson has a lower body injury. I mean, Miles Sanders has got a hamstring injury. So it's not just that they're hurt. And it's not just the same people are hurt. It's also the people they brought in to replace the people who get. get hurt are also hurt too.

Like, they literally drafted Andre Dillard to be a left tackle to replace Jason Peters two years ago. And now he's hurt and they have to get Jason Peters to replace Dillard, who he wasn't even on the team. This is crazy. And it's one thing to have Carson Wentz be injury prone. It's another for him to be hurt and everyone hurt around him again. So I don't really want Carson Wentz to share.

Here's the thing, though. He finished as the QB9 last year throwing to dudes that were on the street. He had 4,000 yards last year with a bunch of just random guys. And he didn't miss a game. And so I'm actually, I think, you know, as a podcast, we're pretty high on him. We got him as our QB10. I'm pretty bullish on him. I was definitely a little more bullish on him like two weeks ago.

But I'm sticking with him. I think I think Rager will be back sooner than later. I think having Sean Jackson back is going to be huge for them. That was the first team in NFL Street or Carson once was the first quarterback in Infillist Street to have 4,000 yards in a year where none of his wide receivers. had 500 yards or something. That's never happened before. The Ertz was the leading one and Goddert was number two. And then everyone else was hurt. I don't exactly think Carson

Wend's ceiling is incredibly high this year. I think he's kind of more of a higher floor play if he's healthy. That's fair. But QB-1? Yeah, low-end QB-1. I just don't think there's enough like targets there for him to really like assert himself as like the number I'm just not excited about. Yeah. Yeah, I agree. I'd rather have Jared Gough

much later. He's just, he's already hurt. That's the problem. It's a guy who's in, I mean, we don't love the term injury prone, but this is now four years a row. This is ridiculous. Another person I wanted to mention, another, Stephen Glansberg, that's just been sitting alone. Drew Brees. We actually have not really talked about Drew Brees for Fantasy this year. Unexpected, Stephen Glansberg, Breeze, going into last year, kind of had a rep of like pretty amazing. And then Thanksgiving rolls around and he just kind of loses it because Brady is so old at 43.

We kind of forget that Breeze is also in his 40s and Brees is doing things that basically only Tom Brady has done at his age. But when Brees would turn from his thumb injury, last year. He was the fifth best fantasy quarterback for the second half of the season. He was the eighth best in points per game throughout the whole season. I think, and he's on fantasy pros, he's rated as the eighth quarterback taken right now in drafts. I think the thing

about Breeze, why we haven't talked about him is he's not polarizing and he's accurately ranked. I think it's just correct. It's a good take. The ranking's right. What do you think, D.K.? I mean, yeah, no, it's, we said it. Like, it's just, it's breeze. I was actually looking at his rankings, say, because we were, you know,

updating our rankings and I was just like, Have I under-analyzed where we're putting breeze? And then I looked at him, I'm like, actually, yeah, this makes perfect sense. In fact, he might be a little bit low. We've got him at, let's see, here we have him as the QB-11. It's probably a little bit low, honestly. I do fear for some reason there's just this inherent fear in me when I draft is that if a quarterback's really old, it just kind of freaks me out.

Is that because the quarterback or you're afraid of dying? No, it's not about my mortality. It's about the frailty. I just think that, oh, you know, Brady's 43, Goffs 26. And I'm like, that actually makes a difference in my brain. Does it not to you guys? Whereas, like, he could take one hit and he's like, you know, disintegrates. The body just doesn't recover like it used to.

I don't know. Maybe I'm the only one, but that affects me when I think about stuff. I think that's fair. I think that's fair. And that's why he's ranked as a... Well, let's be honest. If Breeze was 30 right now, if he could reverse age to age 30, he'd probably be higher on all of our list, right?

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's not exactly a take. That's, yeah, 10 years younger. At first, you guys are like, I don't know, man, like, you're ages. I think it's simpler than that. It's that the Saints were the best passing team in the NFL for a long time, in part because that's what they wanted to do, and apart because they're the worst defense. And now the Saints have one of the best defenses and a great running game.

They can do whatever they want. They can pass with anyone. They can run with anyone, and they have good pass defense, and they have good run defense. They destroy people, and then they don't really need to pass as much. So I think that really, it's just starting less shootouts. I actually think the Saints, I actually think they're going to win the Super Bowl. And I think they have one of the, three, four best defense and offensive lines in the whole league.

I got him going to the Super Bowl. Dude, it's crazy. Breeze has five, five thousand yard seasons. He has like five of the eight total NFL seasons that are five thousand. I mean, he hasn't done it for a few years, clearly, since like we talked about, the offense has changed, but. Well, the Saints as a team are fascinating because they're basically one of the best teams in NFL history to not win a Super Bowl. Like this three, four year window core of the Saints, if they don't win the Super Bowl this year, I'm I mean, the crazy endings they've had where they had the Minneapolis miracle when they might have been the best team three years ago. The NFC championship game where they almost made the Super Bowl two years ago and last year they screwed up.

But they're a pretty amazing team to have not done anything yet. I don't think it works out when you know what's your final year? Because Breeze is retiring after this year, correct? Oh, who knows? He probably doesn't know. But it's more likely than it has been in the past. Because I think that that makes it way harder. When you know this is the last year, I think you're more likely to fall short.

And that's why we don't think they'll trade Kamara. Didn't you watch The Last Dance? I think you watch the last dance, Michael Thomas, because Michael Thomas has taken on Michael Jordan's alter ego ever. You look at Michael Thomas's Twitter and you're like, is this someone who's watched the last dance? Let me tell you something. I mean, I guess we're not really counting like the wizard years, but yeah.

Oh, and also they had just come off winning two in a row. I don't know. If there's a Michael Jordan wizard's thing, it's definitely Tom Brady on the Buccaneers. Let's be honest. Craig, it's not different at all. Back off. Anyway, let's move on.

Last one real quick. Another Stephen Glansberg. This one, personality-wise, Stephen Glanzberg. Russell Wilson on the Seahawks. Mr. Unlimited. We have only talked about Russ in the context of his receivers, but we haven't really talked about Russ as a somewhere between three and top five quarterback this year for fantasy.

I just wanted, D.K., you're the Seahawks fan. I'm going to see this to you. I just wanted to say that Russell Wilson's quarterback finish in fantasy since he came into the league is 9th, 8th, 3rd, 3rd, 11th, 1st, 9th, and 3rd. D. Is Pete Carroll going to put a limit on Mr. Unlimited this year? Yeah. Damn it.

I mean, to an extent. To an extent. I don't think, you know, he's, he's, I think there is something to the idea. And Wilson's been lobbying for this, like, all offseason, saying stuff in the press, talking about getting stars, talking about opening it up, like talking about, you know, how the chiefs let Mahomes do his thing and all that stuff. So he's been, he's been definitely alluding to it. And the Seahawks have been staunchly sort of.

saying, oh, no, we're going to keep doing what we're doing. You know, Pete Carroll and I think Shotty, Schott and Hemer, both came out in the press last year, or last week or two weeks ago, and we're like, you know, we're going to run the ball. They were kind of like saying it. Like, they were being sarcastic. Yeah, exactly.

They were being sarcastic. They're like, no, we're going to run the ball. But, no, I kind of have the theory that they're going to have to pass a little bit more. They don't have any pass rush right now. That's kind of the problem. And so if their defense struggles, then they're going to get into more of these games where they have to like kind of unleash it.

him earlier in the game. Last year was like, wait until the fourth quarter before we do anything. Now, if they get behind early, maybe that'll change. But the bottom line is, man, he's, he's the most efficient passer in terms of fantasy. Like, he's ridiculously efficient. Like, points per dropback. It's always been like top three pretty much every year in his career, except for 2016 when he was hurt. So I don't really expect anything different this year. I mean, he's just going to be really efficient. If they pass more, he has a chance to be the QB one, honestly. Which you take Russell Wilson or Kyler Murray? They're one literally right next to each other.

I've got them. So I got Murray a little bit higher. One spot higher. Murray has more running upside. So maybe that's kind of like what I was thinking. But they're right there. They're really close. All right.

Let's get to some Stephen Glansberg tight ends. D.K., do you have a Stephen Glainsburg tight end for us? You know what I just thought of is Evan Goldberg and Seth Rogen wrote this movie when they're like 15 years old? I wonder if Stephen Glansberg is a real person. I wonder Stephen Glansford is out there. Yeah. Hopefully he's not like, you know, he doesn't have those two guys on his people to kill list, you know?

Well, it's not just like that. You know what? Craig just makes fun of people who don't have friends because Craig thinks making friends is all easy. That's like a theme that's popped up now. Yeah. So anybody who doesn't have friends, I don't like you. I don't want to deal with you.

Only people who are popular. Oh my gosh. Anyway, we're getting off topic. What are we talking about here? No fan? Yeah. That's your guy, right? DK?

Guy we haven't talked about this year. We haven't talked about Noah Fent enough. We haven't talked about no fan enough. His hype has been building a little bit. He is the perfect example of the type of tight end that could have a huge breakout year. If you look at kind of like, so actually I saw this tweet from Matthew Berry,

if you look at George Kittles' rookie year, he had 43 catches, 515 yards, two touchdowns on 359 routes, no offense rookie year, 40 catches, 562 yards, three touchdowns, 349 routes.

So it's almost identical. And they're very similar from a athleticism point of view. Fant ran like a 4-5. He's super athletic, good after the catch. There's so many good indications that he's going to be really good.

I saw this stat from Ben Cummins on Twitter. Noah Fant ranks 19th in NFL history in receiving yards and yards per reception for rookie touchdown, or for rookie tight ends. He had more receiving yards as a rookie than Gronk,

Kittle, and Mark Andrews. So anyways, you know, that's not necessarily going to say that he's going to have this massive 1,000 yard season or whatever. But I think it definitely gives him, it makes me confident that he is one of a few guys that's going to really break out this year. So I'm super excited about Fant. I think the thing with Noah Fent as well is that rookie is such a, it's such a hard thing to contribute as a rookie tight end in particular. And that a lot of second year tight ends end up being the breakouts. Like you mentioned Mark Andrews, those are the kind of guys that break out in the, their second year. It's really rare to do it in the first year. But Fant fits the exact mold of the kind of

guy. And he might see a decent amount of targets this year. I mean, he just told the Denver Post that he's going to be utilizing the slot in line. He'll line up outside because one of the receivers that Broncos drafted, Caj La Hamler, he might go to IR or he might go on the pop or something like that. He might miss like the first half of the season with his hamstring injury. So there's a decent chance that Fant, who's going to be battling with a rookie Jerry Judy and then Cortland Sutton could see a solid share of the targets from Drew Loss. That's a good thing that I want to just piggyback on because you're talking about KJ Hamler

he might go on IR. This year, remember because the IR rules are different, it's a COVID-affected season. If you go on the pre-season IR, you can come off it in three weeks. That's just something to remember, like a big picture, something to remember going forward. Well, other people to remember going forward.

These are the Stephen Glainsburgs. Is there any other tight ends you think we have not talked about enough this year, D.K.? I am getting excited about Eric Eber. This is a great one. This is a really good one. You hate Eric Ebron. That's not true.

Why do you think I hate him? No, you hate him. Isn't that what your tattoo says on your back? I hate Eric Ebron. So he's shaping up right now. He's shaping up to be another one of my favorite sleepers. Him and Fant, honestly, I have a lot of potential this year. Mark Koboli from the Athletic Steelers Beat Reporter.

He's been like all over Ebron the last few weeks. And in a recent article, he said, I keep harping on Ebron, but blame him, not me. Once again, it was more catches, more splash plays, and more running away from defenders. I don't know, man. He's, like, really flashed in practice. He's really flashed in training camp.

He's got really good athleticism. He's also the biggest target on the team. I mean, he could be a real red zone threat for Ben. Yeah, like, we are so bullish as a podcast. I think all of us are really bullish on the Steelers' offense overall. Getting big Ben back in there, I think we all think they could get back up to be like a top five, top three offense in terms of yards and points.

and Ebron is going to be a big part of it. It really feels like he's going to be a big part of it unless something goes terribly wrong. And don't forget, I mean, obviously, I don't know if he's going to have 13 touchdowns or whatever he had in 2018, but he is one year removed from finishing as the tight end four. So this is not like unheard of for him.

And I want to give one more fun fact that I saw today. And I actually ended up, apparently I stole this from Pat Thorman because he tweeted almost exactly the same thing like three months ago. but Eric Ebron is four and a half, I'm going to say four and a half months older than Hayden Hurst. He's been in the league for four years more.

Four more years than Haydenhurst. They're like five months apart. That's even better than the Keenan Allen is only one year older than Michael Thomas. Yeah, that blew my mind. Eric Eber is 27. He's 27 years old. Kenan looks older because he's bald and has a big beard.

That's why people think he's older, I think. Yeah, he looks wise. He's also disappointed two different fan bases, so that'll happen. Who? Keenan out? Oh, Eric Ebron. Oh, Ebron, yeah. Oh, Alan, yeah, Keenan.

Yeah, well, he's also been in the league much longer than Michael Thompson. You know why I think that Ebron is so underrated this year? There was, I don't know exactly. I don't remember who it was. It might have been Chris Ballard. But someone asked Chris Ballard, who is the GM of the Colts. It might have been the coach. I can't remember.

But they asked him, are we bring, are you guys bringing back Ebron this year? and he was just like, no, we're not doing that. And everyone was like, oh, like that was like the worst. There was a real big disagreement there because Ebron had surgery in both ankles and basically the cults. And Ebron had like a disagreement about what they did they not want him to get, they didn't want him to miss time or something like that. Yeah, it was there was like a real disagreement over his play and stuff. And that that makes sense. That if he's now healthy now after surgery on both ankles that, you know, if he's healthy, then wouldn't have to do with his cult's tenure.

Yeah. But that didn't end super well. All right. Any other tight ends you guys want to talk about? The only other guy I think is semi-interesting that we have not talked about is Zach Ertz. Who's like a top five tight end every year. And we've pretty much said his name once during this entire preseason. He's the Russell Wilson of tight ends.

He totally is. And he's just, he's not. And his wife is more interesting than he is? Hey, want to know something about Zach Ertz? Went to Monavista high school, played basketball against my brother. Did he dunk on your brother? Not, I don't know. What is with the whole?

and connections to tight ends. I don't know. Zach Ertz is a Bay Area guy. He went to Montevista and Danville. Which is right next to where I grew up. What? Yeah. He played against your brother or he dunked on your brother?

He played, I don't know. I mean, I probably went to the games. He was done. And then stared at him down. I think they played, they're similar in hype, but Zach Hertz is just a huge dude. Does your brother listen to this podcast?

No. Screw you, Scott. His brother has friends he's hanging out with instead of listening to him. That's what's going on there. Anyway, Zach, So, Ertz is, like, I think the only receiver in the last five years to have, like, 75 catches in 800 yards every single year. But as we said, everybody on the Eagles is hurt kind of exempt Zach Ertz again this year.

He's in contract negotiations right now with the front office. And then Ian Rapaport just reported on Thursday that talks have come to an abrupt halt and that the Eagles are now offering him less money than they offered him less guaranteed money than they did back in November, which is kind of alarming. And they're, you know, it's like, are they planning for the future and just saying, hey, we have Dallas Goddert? like maybe we don't need to give Zackertz a long-term deal. I think that's exactly what's happening. Yeah. And it makes me think that Dallas Goddard is getting more and more. Like, Dallas Gartre is a fantastic dynasty pick for tight end, in my opinion.

And also, I think he's a decent pick this year even. He has Zachert's upside, but last year he was still the 12th best scoring tight end with Zachert's playing. I mean, he's like a weird pick where he's safe either way you go. Like if you draft him with Zachert's healthy, he's safe. and without he's even more safe. I kind of like Dallas Gardner this year. He's a really good player.

He's legitimately Goddard. Well, I mean, both of them are, but Goddard is, he's big, he's fast, he has incredible body control. He made some of really, like, outstanding catches last year. And he was hurt. He heard his calf at the start of last year, and it lingered the whole season. I don't know.

I really think he's a decent pick. Yeah, I love Goddard. I have him in one league, but I just get worried because he's, he is exactly like Chris Godwin, Maybe this is the year he actually breaks out, but I feel like he has hype every preseason. And then it's just kind of like, oh, no, he's still behind Ertz.

So we'll see. But I do a really good player. And if Ertz goes down, he's, you know, top three guy potentially. So who's the Stephen Glansberg? Is it Goddert or is it Zachertz? They're twin brothers who are Glanzbergs. The Winkluvosses of Superbad. Yes, exactly.

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All right. A couple more Stephen Glansbergs. Well, not a couple. It's like, it's more than two. It's like six. I don't know. Half dozen roundabouts. I can't do math.

Baker's doesn't, yeah. People we've not talked about or not talked about enough on this pod that we wanted to fix that with. First up, I just think that Nick Chubb is just the strangest fantasy second rounder I can like ever remember.

He's tough. It's basically the whole thing with Nick Chub comes down to this. He was incredible in 20, 2018 and he was really good the first half of last year. The second half of last year, Kareem Hunt gets off his suspension

and they're basically the same in fantasy points like PPR leaks. And that's the thing. It's like, oh, well, you could take Nick Chubb, but what about Kareem Hunt? Well, the coaching staff was fired. It's a different coaching staff. We have no idea what to do

with the breakdown all being carries. We haven't gotten any hints through offseason stuff or training camp. So we just have to guess. The weird part is that if Kreme Hunt was not on this team, where would you guys draft Nick Chub? Because I would probably have him fifth or six.

Yeah, he, oh, yeah. I think so too. He would be up there. And yet Nick Chubb is going in the middle of the teens in a lot of drafts. Yeah, but that's exactly why. Like, why is that crazy to you? Kareem Hunt is the best backup, if you can even call him that in the league. Yeah.

Maybe I've just been staring at rankings for too long, but the thing I keep thinking is, if I just told you one of these guys in between 10 and 20 will be the number one back this year. The most likely person to me is Nick Chubb because it's just, oh, yeah, we overthaw Kareem Hunt. Nick Chubb's great. And also, in cases skill level is unknown. It's like he's number one in P. FF's elusive rating, like all the advanced metrics for running backs, he's like top two. Do you guys, you guys not concerned at all about Nick Chubb being underrated?

Maybe he should at least be in the Derek Henry tier. I'm kind of not. It's all because of Kareem Hunt. I think the reason we haven't talked about him, at least from my perspective, is that he feels like he's in kind of the right spot. Right now we've got him in half-p-pr, RB-13, you know, and he's just kind of like outside that top-tier guys. He's outside the RB-1s.

it is worrisome to me that Hunt is there. Like Craig said it perfectly, Hunt is the best backup running back in the NFL. Yeah, he's better than probably 10 or 15 starting running backs. Yes. Right. So it's like with a new coaching staff, why are they just going to suddenly walk in and be like, you know what we're going to do? Not feature one of our two amazing running backs who are both top 15 backs in the league.

Yeah. The new coaching staff argument actually doesn't do anything for me. Okay, so that's why we didn't talk about. All right. So I think we got to the bottom of that. Shot down. Okay. Keep going, Stephen Glensberg.

Someone we haven't talked about enough, it's just Josh Jacobs and Henry Ruggs on the Raiders. Yeah. I just, is Josh Jacobs just discount Derek Henry and discount Nick Chubb? How many touches do you think he can get, D.K.? I think that's why he is where he is.

He's a little bit lower than, you know, I think we probably have him higher than consensus. We got him RB9, but people are so worried about his ability to be a factor in the passing game. Like the Raiders have added pass catchers and past catchers and past catchers

and, you know, we haven't seen him be involved in passing game. He wants to catch 60 balls, but I don't know. It just kind of depends on do you believe that's going to happen? I think we are kind of bullish on him, but there's a lot of people in the fantasy community that are just like, you know, they're going to be playing from behind a lot. He's not going to have a big part of that part of the offense. I don't know. I think he's a two and a half downback.

I think if you like Derek Henry, you should draft Josh Jacobs because you'll get him around later. It's kind of the same thing. The off brand, the Kirkland brand. he's a, he's a, he's a damn good player. He led the NFL and forced miss tackles last year Josh Jacobs. He was number two in PFF's Seleusive Rating.

He's also, he's also in the David Johnson bucket of anti-litics, John Gruden just needs to be right. Yeah. It was like, you know, he's a first round pick that John Gruden made, and John Gruden's in control. And it's like, if Josh Jacobs can't play third down and you took him in the first down, what the, if you dropped a two-down running back in the first round, you messed up.

Yeah. That's why the Jaguars screwed up before net. Speaking of Raiders' first round pick, I think Henry Ruggs is like another rookie that's not really going to being discussed this year. And the Raiders depth chart at receiver is thin and inexperienced, man. I mean, Tyro Williams is out.

He's on IR now. So they're starting two receivers are Henry Ruggs and rookie Brian Edwards with Hunter Renfro in their slot. I mean, there is a real chance that Henry Ruggs, who's going as a wide receiver 49 right now in ADP, is going to drastically cremate his ADP. We're bringing it back. I'm so uncomfortable with that.

You know why I think that Ruggs is so low is because I think everyone's like, oh, Derek Carr can't throw deep. He's a checkdown artist. He's a checkdown artist. It's a chicken and the egg question. Ian Hardich just had a PFF article about how that's bullshit

and how when he was in college, Henry Ruggs was one of the, when Tua threw to him, he was like the highest rated passer in the league on intermediate and short passes. And Ruggs is extremely capable of catching those short passes and exploding like those Odell slants style,

you know? That was going to be my point. But yes, you made it for me. He's actually very good after the catch. He's very good on those short and intermediate passes. So, I mean, he could surprise. Are we missing anything here with Ruggs? Why is he 49th in wide receivers?

I think you guys hit it. There's a weird thing where when someone's fast, we just think they can only catch deep passes. Like, why is Emmanuel Sanders nine spots ahead of him? Yeah, it's like you look at Tyree Kill. One of the best things Tyree Kill does is catches a bubble screen. But the other thing is I also think that it's as simple as we just don't know. Can Derek Carr throw deep?

We haven't seen it. And I think that that's part of really just everyone's soured on Derek Carr. And also the Raiders are boring, which is crazy because John Gruden's the most interesting coach. The Raiders are a boring team. I don't think they occupy a large share of people's minds, to be totally honest. So I like rugs. And then also you throw on, there's a lot of hype for Brian Edwards who they took him the third round. And a lot of people think might be actually be a better receiver.

South Carolina, right, D.K.? Yeah, I love Brian Edwards. He's awesome. he's fair to call him more of a possession receiver but again it kind of implies that speed guys can't do that kind of stuff but I think all that but yeah

rugs is an amazing amazing pick I think he's a great late row I'm definitely look I'm way more interested in him over the last like two months or over the last like month I've been getting really interested in rugs late I don't have many rules but when someone

caught a quarter of their catches in college for touchdowns I might want to draft them in fantasy another receiver who this is a a dereliction of duty on our part. We have not really discussed DJ Moore in the Carolina Panthers. I don't know if we've honestly mentioned DJ Moore. I think we mentioned him very early on in July and then we haven't talked about him since. So we're sorry to DJ Moore. The Panthers. The Panthers are boring unless, no, that's it. Unless they're not. Well, I think the Panthers are

boring. I think not a lot of people have watched a lot of Panthers games. Like, do you think casual fan, I think casual fans could tell you about what AJ Brown literally looks like as a football player in the field and, like, couldn't imagine him catching a pass. I don't think a lot of people can do that with DJ Moore. DJ Moore is the best candidate in the entire league to go from relatively unknown to top five receiver. Why? In the next two years.

If not this year, for a couple of reasons. One, just the Panthers offense is being coordinated by Joe Brady, who led the LSU offense last year and was the Saints before that could be a big come up there. And just their defense sucks. Their defense is probably the worst in the league. They literally used all eight or seven of their draft picks on defenders this year, which I believe has never happened. Yeah, that was rare.

that just straight up has never happened. They're like, fuck it, every one of these guys needs to be a defender. That's what they think of their defense. It's going to be awful. So they're just going to be down a lot

and they're going to have to throw a lot. And then there's just DJ Moore himself who, it's just one of those that age in the NFL is kind of a threshold where if you can like be this tall to ride the ride, but if you're this good at this age, you're probably going to be really good. Right, D.K.? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like if you're, if you're younger and you're playing, against older guys who are more developed, more experienced, all that. You know, it's just a really good indication that you're a really talented player, and that's going to keep continuing. He is ninth in, this is per fantasy score, fantasy points, Scott Barrett. Most receiving yards in NFL history before 23rd birthday, he is ninth on the list. And the list is really good. Juju Smith-Ju's No. 1, Randy Moss, Josh Gordon, Mike Evans, Mari Cooper, Larry Fitz,

Sammy Watkins, DeAndre Hopkins, and then DJ Moore. That is a really good list. It's a crazy list. Yeah. So he's definitely like rocket ship up. I think he's going to be perfect for this offensive scheme. I think we just haven't talked about him because we all kind of agree we like him, right? Like there's no discussion to have.

Yeah, he's a guy in your drafts where if you're playing with a bunch of friends who are casual football fans and really maybe less in the weeds. Like DJ Moore falls to you because a little bit of the more popular guys like Alan Robinson or AJ Brown go. I would take DJ more. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, he's not DJ less. It's DJ Moore. No, that's not. I'll see myself out.

Another person we wanted to mention just we haven't talked about is AJ Green. We don't have to linger here. This is kind of simple. He already has a hamstring injury, so this is kind of like moot. But AJ Green has just been hurt. He's in his 30s. He's coming off, I mean, he had a foot injury. And then last year had an ankle injury. He's barely played in any games the last two years.

He's barely practiced in the last two years. AJ Green got hurt last year on the first practice of the season of training camp. this and then now he's missing practice right now with the hamstring injury a j green has basically not practiced since zach taylor has been the coach of the bangles and the history of guys who have returned from the kind of foot and ankle injuries he's had after 30 is low and i just don't really see any value because his name is so cool he was so good so well not recently but he was so good at his peak that he's being drafted at a level where people in their mind are like oh yeah j Green. Like, he could be back. Like, he's great. Joe Burrow, A.J. Green, like, people talk to

themselves into it. There's no value to this in me whatsoever. It's all downside. Which is really depressing. Yeah, it's, it's tough. He's been, he's been gradually sinking in our rankings. It's not fun to be like this player who was great and is in his young 30s is probably not going to be the same, but it's also not fun to have them in your fantasy team. So I'm sorry, AJ Green. The other person I wanted to ask you that is about is AJ Brown, who we haven't really talked about. AJ Brown was crazy. year. Like he owned me for my rookie receivers can't contribute take, which is true, except for A.J. Brown, who destroyed me because from week seven on, which is when Tannhill took over,

he led the NFL in yards per route run, which is what I call a hot dog on an ice cream, hot, ice cream on a hot dog. Nice. It's just not done. The dude had 52 catches last year and he had 1,051 yards. It's 20 yards a 20 yards a catch. Well, that's the question. I think he led the league in yards after the catch and the whole thing. And basically, in one hand, that's really unlikely to repeat. On the other hand, one, that's kind of the penalizing people for being good thing, which is dumb. And then also, if you do that as a rookie, almost most receivers get better in their second year. It's very, right. It's a small list of guys who are that good as a rookie and then really level off, which happens, but A.J. Brown doesn't seem to one of those guys.

This, to me, is more of a discussion about the Titans as a team. And that, and that's how you have to, you know, figure out how you feel about AJ Brown is what are the Titans going to do. going to throw more, is he going to get more targets? He had 84 last year. When Tannahill took over in week seven, Arthur Smith, the offensive coordinator, built this offense, and Titans literally averaged the most yards per play after week seven, like more than the Ravens, more than the Chiefs, which is cheating because Mohamed's got hurt. But still, it's like them and the Ravens and the Saints are the top three after week seven. And I think they led the league in points. There were second in touchdowns after the Ravens after

week seven. So, D.K, do you think the Titans' offense can be as efficient as last year, or they're going to come down? They're a running team in age. is going to suffer, or at least he'll be the only relevant player in this offense. I don't think they're going to be as efficient, but I think there is the opportunity for more volume. And so I think that AJ Brown has a really high ceiling. I mean, he was, like you said, he was the wide receiver three from the point where Tanna Hill took over to the end of the season. There is the worry that, like, the Titans will turn into the team they were in the playoffs where they pass ball like eight times in two games or three games or whatever it was. But I don't think that

they're going to be able to do that as much as they want. I think they're going to, they're going to have to pass it a little bit more and lean on Tannahill a little bit more. And Danny, like he said, A.J. Brown, like, he's still an ascending player. So he could be even better next year, this year than he was last year. I'm very high on A.J. Brown. I think the talent is going to show, show out. I think even if they don't have as much volume as some of these high volume passing teams, he's still going to do so much with it. So I'm very high on AJ Brown. Love that guy. Let me give you guys three players to close this out and you have to rank them how you feel.

about them right now. AJ Brown, Calvin Ridley, Tyler Lockett. Crazily enough Ridley Lockett Brown, even though that's probably, even though I might take Brown before Lockett because you might get Lockett later. But I would rather have Calvin Ridley Lockett, then Brown, which might be crazy. I would say Lockett, Brown, Ridley. I love Calvin Ridley. Also just a quick note on the Titans, their offensive coordinator, Arthur Smith, who was amazing last year, is the son of the founder and CEO of FedEx, the chairman of FedEx, who is worth five and a half billion dollars. He's the son of the founder of FedEx who's worth $5.5.5 billion.

The owner of the Titans, Amy St. Adams, is only worth $1.5 billion. So Arthur Smith, the offense accorded for Tennessee is literally richer than the owner of the Titans. He's a billion. That's a fun fact. And he actually came up, like, as an actual coordinator, like he came up as a, up the ranks, up the ladder. Happens to be in Tennessee when FedEx is like a huge city in Tennessee. But then he was amazing.

He literally had the best offense in the NFL. So it's like nepotism is the place actually just really good at this. And I wanted to throw out there another thing. His father, Fred Smith, was instrumental in getting the 2017 tax cuts passed with Trump. And FedEx's tax bill dropped from a 34% rate to a 0% tax rate in one year. So I want to ask you, do you think that Tennessee's fantasy plan here is, do you think that they can give all the fantasy points to Derek Henry and A.G. Brown? And then they will trickle down to the rest of the Titans players. D.K. I'll let you tackle that.

Oh, my God. That's a very good question, Danny, which I'm not going to answer. And I'm going to actually change my other answer before. I'm going to say, Brown, Lockett, Ridley. Wow. Brown number one. Yeah. And I'm not going to answer your other question.

It's probably smart. Okay. Thank you for listening. Thank you, D.K. Thank you, Craig. Thank you, FedEx. You're just going to be delivering Amazon packages very shortly anyway. Thank you to everyone for listening.

Best of luck if you haven't drafted yet. We'll see you guys on Wednesday.