The Ringer NFL Show - Week 8 Recap: The Niners Lose Again, the Broncos Upset the Chiefs, and Another Geno Smith Comeback

Episode Date: October 30, 2023

Nora and Steven start their recap of Week 8 by discussing whether they believe the Bengals are back after handing the Niners their third straight loss (1:47). Then, they go through their winners and losers for the week, including the Broncos, Steelers, Vikings, and more (24:19). The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming, please checkout theringer.com/RG to find out more or listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Hosts: Nora Princiotti and Steven Ruiz Producer: Isaiah Blakely Social: Kiera Givens Additional Production Supervision: Arjuna Ramgopal and Conor Nevins Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The ringer gambling feat is your one-stop shop for all things betting throughout the NFL season. From week one all the way through Super Bowl 58 in Las Vegas, we have you covered every which way. We've got our favorite futures. We've got props. We'll discuss the lines. And, of course, we'll throw in a few parlase. That's a given. So whether you're a sharp or square better, we'll be breaking it down in terms.

Hopefully, everybody can understand. We'll try to win some money along the way. So be sure to subscribe to the Ring of Gambling Feed on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. And welcome to Dual Brett. On the Ringer NFL show feed, I'm Nora Pistiani. And I'm Stephen Ruiz. And it's week eight, a packed week eight. Stephen, not a single team on a buy this week.

How did you feel about it? I felt like YouTube TV. I felt overwhelmed. And it felt like Sunday ticket was overwhelmed because it was lagging all day. I feel like my analysis is going to be off because I didn't get to watch the games in full. Thanks a lot. You can't tell people to, what is that going to do

if you feel like your game watching was interrupted? Does that mean that you're telling other people to watch the games is subsequently interrupted because they're going to have a comeback and what are you going to do? Yeah, exactly. I can't even make that claim anymore.

Like I know I must have been thrown off because I saw Brock Purdy League MVP throw two interceptions in a losing effort. All right. We will get there. We will get there. We will certainly get there. But we're going to start with the headline.

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slash infinity. All right. We are starting with Bengals 31, 49ers, struggling on a three game losing streak, 17. And I think the headline of this

headline game is that the Bengals are who we thought they were. Joe Burrow looked completely healthy, said the calf feels 100%, sure looked like it. He made some unbelievable plays with his legs in this game, including basically steamrolling the entire 49ers defensive line,

uh, to scramble out of what looked like a sack to convert a third down. They were really dominant offensively, bros, 28 of 32, 32, 32, 32, 32, 26 total yards. And I feel like I've seen this movie before is even. It's, it's week eight and the Bengals have arrived and they're hitting the deep ball and burrows looking great and they're rolling. Is that what's going on here? And they ran the football effectively, which is the most surprising thing of them all. Like, I'm not, we found out that Burrow was 100%.

It was reported that he was 100% before the game. With Burrow healthy, I'm not surprised the passing game was as efficient as it was. But the run game, we have, we've seen them try to discover this for the last three years. And they finally got it really, this is like the most impressive I've ever seen it. And it's not too surprising because the 49ers have had a best. bad run defense. And I think that's a thing now that we need to talk about. But the fact that they were able to get the gun run game specifically going and they got some under center run going, that was a good sign going forward. Now the question is, is this just the product of playing

the 49ers bad run defense or is this a sign of things to come? I still think that's up in the air, but I mean, it's all green flags from this game anyway if you're a Bengals fan because Joe Burrow was moving. It was like he made it a point to show that he was healthy and run the football today. Yeah, seriously. I mean, the reporting around when a player is 100% or not 100%, I almost outright ignore whenever it happens just because the percentages are fake. Like, what does that even mean, right? But I mean, that play, like they had him.

And he's just shaking dudes off and running around. That's what it means to be 100%. I don't need your, I don't need per sources. I need Joe Burrow, juking guys. and tossing off 270 pound defensive players. Like, it's nothing. You mentioned the run game. And that dichotomy between their under center runs and their shotgun runs,

I feel like we could go back years. And that's been such an up and down sort of work in progress and such a thing that's been tough for them to figure out. What do you think the state of that is in terms of what they're, doing in the run game schematically. I do think it's kind of hard to say just because before today, let's just say those percentages weren't fake and Joe Burrow wasn't 100% before today, they couldn't go under center because of the injury.

He didn't have the mobility to do it. So this is really the first week we've been able to see that. And it's really the first week it's worked, but they are going up against a bad defense. So I'm still, like I'm still hesitant to say that they've solved the issue. because the 49ers tend to have issues with this specific type of run game, which is kind of weird because it's just like a basic RPO college-style run game that seems to give the 49ers problems, whereas like another approach, like the Cowboys approach, for instance,

which is more like bigger bodies on the field, going under center, having pulling guard and stuff, that doesn't give them problems, which is usually the tougher thing to defend, but just running like inside zone straight up the middle. They can't defend it for whatever reason. So I don't know, it's like a chicken or egg situation, for me just because the 49ers defense has struggled against it.

I want to see it next week. But again, I'm not sure it matters if the passing game is operating at the level it was. We've seen this Bengals offense make a Super Bowl without a good run game. Right. If they've got one, though, that's going to be all the better. In terms of San Francisco defensively, it looked to me like one of the things that was really going wrong was they just weren't tackling well.

Yeah. Burrow in the first half average 3.8 air yards. per attempt. So they were really nickel and dimming them. And a big issue is just that they weren't, they could make contact with guys, but they weren't bringing them down. I mean, look,

the crazy third down play where bro scrambled out of the grasp is an outlier, but in a weird way, it's symbolic because they weren't finishing. And they were less physical. And this is a 49ers team that typically is known for beaten guys up. Right. And beating up other teams. And in this lull that they're having, I mean, they came out and totally dominated the Cowboys three weeks ago and they haven't won since. That's something that it seems like they've kind of lost sight of. What do you think the problems defensively? What are the biggest ones going on? Yeah. I think you're on the right track there. Like, I think it's the fact. One, Kyle Shanahan had singled out. the tackling as an issue today, which I think was spot on, but I don't think it's usually

an issue for them. I think it's the fact that they play so soft and that they were, the Bengals were able to dink and dunk them in the first half. And going into the second half, I think Joe Burrow finished with an A dot of like six. So he was completing a lot of passes, but they weren't of like the downfield variety. They weren't big chunk plays. They were more like underneath and then intermediate area throws. I think just being able to play like more man coverage, more like, stinking.

key coverage and clamping down on those underneath throws. I think when you play man coverage, you have bodies in those throwing windows when you're playing zone. You usually give up the first five yards on the field, which is where Joe Burrow was attacking. And Joe Burrow, when he's playing like this, is good enough to do that for 60 minutes, as we saw. So I think, I don't know if it's like a trade they need to make or a schematic tweak. I think it could be both, but just figuring out a way to play stickier coverage and

maybe playing a little more unsound coverage. I know that that sounds counterintuitive, but just like being able to blitz and not just being a rush for and dropping the coverage type of team, I think we've seen around the league that offenses have no real problems figuring out those defenses unless you're the 49ers and you could just overwhelm people with pass rush, but that hasn't happened the last couple of weeks.

And I think that's the problem. That's when you see the holes in this type of approach. What have you seen and even watching Nick Bosa? I mean, I thought he was fine today. I know last week he got shut out and there was talk about that. And he even said, like, I got to do better. If I'm like the type of player that makes this type of money, I have to be a better player. I think he had pressures today.

So I don't think it was that big little problem. I mean, I don't think he's like the big issue. There was some commentary about how he's drawing fewer double teams. And that's a week to week thing, right? And some of that has to do with what Cincinnati wants to do. But it's just it's something to watch, right? because when we talk about that defense being one that has kind of lined up and played and counted on being able to overwhelm teams with force up front, a lot of that stems from,

you know, you think you have a superstar and someone who is going to affect every game that he's in. And that hasn't necessarily been true. I think they've got certainly more problems than that. But it's, it's a factor at least. I think he's not. getting as much help as he has in the past. Like Eric Armstead is having a good season, but outside of him, I don't think there, this isn't the overwhelming, like the historically overwhelming defensive line we've come to get used to with his team over the past couple of years. And like, that's the bar that it has to hit for the rest of this defense to work as intended.

And I don't think that's happening so far this year, or at least in the last three weeks. well that to me is is the more concerning thing than what's happening with the offense which we should talk about but for as much as the Brock Purdy conversation which we will have has completely jumped the shark yeah I don't think that people in that building buy into they know who like Kyle Shanahan knows who Brock Party is I think I I have to believe and I I have to believe and I I have to believe that he probably has a clearer understanding of the fact that there were going to be some games like this. And that was more to be expected or at least part of the equation than what was happening earlier in the year. But this defense really struggling, I don't know that they counted on that happening. Or I don't know that they when, you know, at the beginning of the season,

the 49ers visualized themselves in the Super Bowl. I think probably the expectation of how they got there. It had more to do with defense than with quarterback play, not more to do with defense than with offense. But, you know, Fred Warner after the game got a question about Purdy and said, you know, he's the reason why we have a chance to win games. The defense is what's lost the last three. Fred plays defense.

Fred wants to be accountable. totally reason for a friend to go up there and say something nice about his teammate. That's not technically correct, but that's okay. But I think it's emblematic of where they are, where secretly they probably had a clearer understanding that parts of their offense were overachieving or were at least vulnerable to some games like this, whereas I wonder if the defensive struggles are a little bit scarier for them just because I don't, it's, it's less expected, or at least it's less expected to me.

Yeah, and it just seems more structural. Like, I don't even know if the answer is making like a trade for another defender or just changing up the scheme. And when it's harder, when it's hard to answer that question, that makes it a little more scarier and a little more daunting of a obstacle for them. And Shanahan said after the game, he was like, I don't think this changes anything. for like the trade deadline. I don't think it like motivates them to make another trade.

They did get Randy Gregory. But I don't know. I don't know if you could just stand pat with this defense because it is not working right now. That doesn't mean there isn't an answer. We've seen this defense get off to slow starts like in the past. I think it was three years ago, two years ago. It got off to a real slow start. And then by the end of it, it was like the top defense in the NFL.

They beat Aaron Rogers in the playoffs, Fred Warner's an all pro and the rest is history. but I don't know if those answers are there. D. Miko Ryans isn't the D.C. anymore. We haven't seen Steve Wilkes solve a problem like this, like ever as a defensive coordinator, even going back to Carolina. I've seen a lot of him as a Panthers fan. And to me, he was always just a guy as a defensive coordinator.

I don't think he, like, ruined that defense. But I don't think he elevated it either. I don't know. It's tough. You know, I'm with you. Like, the offensive side, like I'm joking about Brock Purdy at the top of the show. But honestly, he played well before the interception. And the first interception apparently came on a, it was supposed to be a run play.

Shanahan said after the game it was supposed to be a run play and they missed the handoff, which is not something you typically see. And then Purdy throws the ball, which is just compounds the mistake. And then he throws an interception, which is another like mistake upon throwing the ball when you have blockers downfield. I don't know. It was just a weird game. But I thought Purdy outside of it before those interceptions, like made a couple of like impressive

throws and was scrambling and doing the things that he's done well. And we saw that against Minnesota too. It was sort of the same story. The only totally bad game we've seen so far is the Cleveland game. And I think the common thread over the last two games is one, you're going up against a creative defensive coordinators in both games. And Brian Flores and Lou Anirumo, Big Lou, as we like to call him. And there were two different.

Well, as Shield Capadia calls him Captain Lou. That's too far. I kind of support the sentiment but don't change the nickname, you'll come on now. I think she'll thought that she'll thought that he was Captain Lou

canonically and after they said that on the show I texted Ben just like Captain Lou in all caps. I actually kind of liked it. I enjoyed it. But Ben responded to that it was shameful. But anyway, Big Captain Lou, Big Lou, good day for the guy.

No, no, no. Only Big Lou. I don't like, because Captain Lou was like an old wrestler guy. So that's already taken. We're not, Big Lou deserves his own nickname. Sorry. Captain Lou was like an old wrestler guy. Say more. I don't, I'm, I'm not for he was in the Cindy Lopper video. Like, girls just want to have fun. He's very famous. I know, I know that video. He plays her dad in the video. I don't know if it's at the, it could be another video. That guy's name is Captain Lou. Captain Lou El Bano, something like that. Yeah, he had Oh my gosh.

Yes. Yeah. That's what Sheel was talking about. That's why you can't give away that nickname. It's derivative. Sorry, Big Lou deserves his own name. Wow. Incredible pull, Steven.

Thanks. I have absolutely no idea what we were talking about before you brought that up. We were talking about Brock Purdy's struggles against two creative defensive coordinators. Got it. Got it. And he still played well, like in the Vikings game at the beginning, before they intercept. since he played well. And I'd say the same about his game today.

So I'm with you. And the common thread besides playing the two creative defensive coordinators is they were missing Trent Williams, who was really missed today because Stray Hendrickson had a huge game against his replacement. It was like he gave up eight pressures and a sack. I think it was 10 total pressures. I don't know. But that was a big loss, obviously.

And then Devo Samuels, the other one, where I think he really helps in a game like last week when you're playing a blitz heavy team. It's because of those screen passes to the perimeter. That's usually how you answer those blitz calls. And then today I thought the same because the one thing that Lou did was he was going to stick in base defense. Like if the 49ers didn't have three receivers on the field, he was going to stick in base defense and defend the run game first and foremost.

And you saw the 49ers try to get to the edge of the run game and they really couldn't do it. I think having Debo Samuel would have given them a better plan B and he wasn't there. So for me, the offense is. struggles are based on them playing good defensive coordinators and them missing two of their most important pieces. Pretty also, you know, he was obviously cleared to play, but six games removed from entering the concussion protocol.

I'm not going to venture, I guess, as to whether or not that affected him. He certainly seemed like he was allowed to scramble, move around out there. It's more a comment on the game plan than anything else, but they weren't trying to limit him from taking those types of potential hits, which I hope they would only do if he was ready to do that. That said, it's still, you know, you hold your breath any time of players in a situation like that. They've got the buy now.

So hopefully if there is anything that's still bothering him, he can can rest up. It turns my stomach and knots a little bit when someone goes into concussion protocol and is back out on a field six days later. But obviously, that was the case. And he cleared it. Bengals.

They're four and three. Still tied with the Steelers and Browns in the division at this point. This is a game that makes me feel like since he's back. They've won three in a row. The Ravens obviously have the two-game lead in the division and are looking permissible. So that's going to be a lot to try to claw back. if they're going to end up doing that, but I think that this could be a serious race for the AFC North if the Bengals are going to keep playing with this.

I mean, I think we're going to figure it out in three weeks because they play Buffalo next week. In between that, there's a Texans game, and then they have the Ravens game. So they play the Ravens and the Bills in two of the next three weeks. I think we're going to know whether this team is back or not, or whether this was just a good matchup against a 49ers team and specifically a 49ers defense that I think they match up really well with. I lean towards the Bengals being back, though. I'm like a six and a half out of ten on the Bengals are back scale.

Where are you at? It sounds like you're like an eight. I'm like an eight out of ten. Here's the thing is that they didn't, they didn't really need the deep ball, but it was still working. Burrow was eight of nine on passes over 10 air yards, 133 passing yards and two touchdowns. It's just so smooth. And the run.

game, I think, is you're really wise to point that out because that's been the thing where they've always been kind of trying to find themselves. Again, let's see it against some other opponents. Let's see it against some different types of defenses. I still believe that you can do a lot worse in terms of quality opponent than the 49ers defense, despite some of their issues and some of their issues that can come up especially against a team like this. But I do really think when they find themselves, they find themselves. And that's what it looks like to me. San Francisco, I also think will be okay, but they've now lost the lead in the NFC West to the Seahawks who got a win today and pulled just slightly ahead of them, which will be an interesting thing to watch because

while I think that they will still be there, obviously, and they're still one of the top contenders in the NFC, what does it feel like to you? There was a time of a few weeks ago when we sort of felt like NFC championship game, San Francisco, Philadelphia. Let's get like pencil it in right now. And the Eagles are seven and one, right? Like they're looking good as ever. But I do feel like that's a little bit more of an open question, which for the Niners has a lot to do with just health. But I think we've seen real ways in which they're a little bit more vulnerable than that practically Super Bowl shoe in, which obviously is a high bar. Yeah.

If you're a defense that struggles against like gun inside zone runs and RPO's and basic RPO college style concepts, the Eagles are probably the worst team you could possibly play in that effort. And that's why I would be worried about the 49ers. Like long term, I think the offense is going to be fine. I think the defense is going to be fine. but they are now two games back in the conference in the race for the first seed from the Eagles. And I think the Eagles are just a team that matches up really well with them.

So, I mean, from like a 30,000 foot view, I'm not worried about the 49ers, but I am worried about that one specific matchup, but kind of how it's shaping up for the playoffs if they do meet. 49ers seem like still a very good team. They just seem like a team that might have a tough time playing at Philadelphia. in January. And we'll find out if they're going to have to do that. All right, let's take a quick break. And then we will come back with winners and losers.

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$5 pregame money line wager required. First online real money wager only. $10 first deposit required. bonus issued as non-witchrollable bonus bets that expire seven days after receipt, see terms at sportsbook.fandul.com. All right, we are back. This is dual threat, Stephen. I think there's a favorite coach of yours who might have had a good day today. I wonder if right now, as we record this, I wonder if he's driving around a parking lot somewhere thinking, I'm going to get some sushi.

I hate sushi. Will you start us off? Yeah, my first winner is the Denver Broncos and coach Sean Payton, who is doing a good job. Would you agree now that he's doing a good job? I can't believe you're doing this. Make the case. Make the case. They just beat the Chiefs 24 to 9.

That's my case. They beat Patrick Malmes. I don't care what happens for the rest of the season. They hadn't beaten this team in, what was it, eight years, 15 times? I don't care how it happened. A million times. It might as well have been. Like Peyton Manning was still playing.

But I will say this from the Chiefs perspective. Maybe you guys are expecting us to give the Chiefs an L here, but I watch the game and I just feel like the Chiefs have this game every year. This was the Colts game last year where everything goes wrong, five turnovers. Andy Reid took the blame for the loss after the game. And I agree with them. I put this on Andy. I do.

Outcoached. Outcoached by Sean Payne. That's right. Tweet about that, QB Collective. I thought they just got too cute on like second and medium. And then they set up a lot of third and twos. And like, in third and two, you kind of give up the advantage of having Patrick Mahomes because it's not like a drop back down.

And you know Andy likes to get tricky. Like, he likes to run these dumb. Like they work most of the time, but they're still dumb. Even when they work, they're dumb, okay? Like the ring around the rosy? Are you calling the ring around the rosy a dumb play? Yeah. Like, I wasn't really thinking when I said the word dumb, but I'm standing by it now.

I'm doubling down. They're dumb. But anyway, like, I think that's kind of what happened. And then you have, like, turnovers,

you have weird plays, big punt returns, big kickoff returns, whatever. Like, everything had to go right for the Broncos to finally beat the Chiefs,

and it did. And it was rainy. And there was reports about Patrick Mahomes not feeling his best before the game. So it's just like, whatever.

It's a weird. Not feeling his best. He had the flu. He had an IV today. He had an IV yesterday. You know what would have made this, you know what would have flipped the outcome is if Mahomes had walked up to the stadium in a Halloween costume as MJ from the flu game.

It would have turned everything around. He should have done that. It was a total missed opportunity. He absolutely should have done it. That's what you know he's feeling really sick is because you can't put those types of expectations on yourself. You can't put a target on your back by doing that. No, no.

Because then the press conference, the post-game press conference is so sad. Right. And then you're on the road, so you might not be able to change. And then you have to walk out all like sad and weird to your postgame presser and you're still wearing it. And it's, you know when when in big playoff games, if a guy just goes too hard with the outfit and then they lose. And then he's got to go to the podium. Joe Burrow, an AFC title game. Right.

Last year. He had like the pink glasses. Burrow has drip. And those glasses were great. And Sidney, wore them in euphoria. But that was a tough look. Yeah, it's tough. Cam Newton was like an all star of this team of wearing like just the goofiest outfit and then losing.

Looking so sad. Just having to answer the worst questions about like horrible turnovers wearing a powder blue suit. But yeah, I don't take a lot from this game, honestly. And I think like it's the Broncos played well. The defense played well. I thought the plan was good. I thought the offensive play calling was as. good as it has been for the past couple of weeks.

Russ had a couple of plays where he moved and created and you're like, oh, their old Russ is back. But then he would try to like go on a scramble and he would get caught by like a linebacker with a neck roll. And then it was like, oh, that's sad. So like I can't even get too optimistic about the Broncos, but they did beat this team for the first time in for forever, basically. So like, kudos to them.

And kudos to Sean Payton. Just add into the coach of the year resume. I'm not participating in this. Here's my thing. Maybe I'm letting the Chiefs off the hook. But I watch that game and I'm like, what is the problem that I'm seeing that I'm worried about down the road? And like, there just isn't one from this game.

They ran the ball okay. They moved the ball well for the most part when they weren't turning it over, when they weren't settling for field goals because of those third down calls I was talking about earlier. It was fine. There's no like red flags from this game for me outside of the score. I feel the same way because of the health stuff. I do think at a certain point,

it's like the opposite of the anytime a quarterback does something cool, all the people who post things like, if Patrick Mahomes said this, everybody would be going crazy. If they score nine points again, we're going to have to say something. But I'm not worried. By the way, Patrick Mahomes had like five of those plays in this game, and nobody went crazy. No one actually goes crazy

when people say they would over Patrick Malm's play because it happens all the time. We take his greatness for granted now. That's my rant from this game. I'm staying out of the Champagne discourse. Okay. I'm not staying out of,

however, the Gino Smith comeback machine discourse. My first winner is the Seattle Seahawks who beat the Browns 24 to 20 taking over first place in the NFC West as we talked about. Gino's pass to Jackson Smith. Nathan Jigba was his third in the final minute of regulation or overtime with Seattle,

the most of any player in the last two years since the beginning of 2022. Just an absolutely surgical drive at the end of the game to come out and win it. And a really, really impressive performance I thought for Gino. Still a relatively low-scoring game. There were turnovers. But I thought he looked really, really good. The Seahawks defense wasn't quite the dominant unit that we've seen in the last couple of weeks, but they were opportunistic.

They had three sacks, three takeaways, including the Julian Love interception that set up the game winning score. So just a clutch outing in the throwback uniforms for Seattle. How did you feel about this? Yeah, like, it's an ugly win. Sure, you beat PJ Walker. But guess you couldn't beat PJ Walker, the 49ers. They couldn't beat the Browns and they couldn't put up 24 points against this team.

So, like, I think you just got to take the wins when you can get them. good teams win ugly too. So I thought it was a good performance. I know there was, there's been some grumbling about Gino Smith, which I think is really weird, like in Seattle. And then the two turnovers today, I don't think they were good passes. And I think like we've seen more mistakes from Gino over the past couple of weeks.

But I think you're seeing them as a result of him trying to elevate this passing game. Like I do think he's more ambitious than he was a year ago. I think he's more confident. and his ability, I think he's less afraid of losing his job. I don't think he has to worry about that. Yeah. But there has been talk. And I think like these performances are just going to solidify his spot.

And I don't think like Pete Carroll is actually listening to the crazy fans calling for Drew Locke. So I don't think it's an issue, but I just think it's good for him to, whenever he seems to find himself in these situations, he comes through more often than not. And that's a sign of a good quarterback. Totally. One of the two players that he surpassed, and obviously these two guys, guys are not playing right now, so they've had fewer opportunities. But, you know, Tom Brady and I think Matt Ryan were the two guys who had similar numbers in terms of the last minute wins. And I,

that stuff is, you know, it's so fluky. It's so overblown. But I really do think, like, Gino's been spending a lot of this season talking about how Pete Carroll has, has really improved his confidence, has gotten him just talking to himself in a lot of. little bit more of a positive way. And for a player with his history and his resume and passed with other teams, overlooking him and moving on from him, I think it matters. I think those experiences matter. I think having a game where he turns the ball over,

but then leads a final drive like that where they are totally reliant on the past and where it's a multi-play drive and he's got to deal with the clock. and they're playing a good opponent and just executes, I think it matters more for someone like Gino than in some other situations, just because I think even though he does feel some of that freedom of not having to be fighting for the job, I think he's always going to feel to some degree a little bit of the pressure of having to prove over and over again, which isn't fair and is kind of dumb. But it's good to see him do it.

because I think it does have some dividends in that. Defensively, the thing that really gave them trouble was the Browns rushing game. They gave up 155 yards in the ground. And some of the short stuff, like David Njoku was really killing them on screens. So I think some of the like the gap soundness up front is still a work in progress. But if, if Gino's playing well, I think that's the most important thing by far for Seattle. and they did, I mean, Jamal Adams got the late pick to help set up the game-winning drive. So I think they were okay defensively.

And in some ways, this is probably more reflective of who they are than some of the more recent results where they looked really, really dominant. I think this is a good defense, but not a great defense. Yeah, I think that's fair. And I think it just has to be a good defense. I think they were overteaving a little bit over the past couple of weeks. and they did just have an easier schedule. Right. But they're one of a few teams that's top 10 in EPA allowed in EPA on offense.

Like on both sides of the ball, they're top 10 in the EPA. And when you have that type of balance, we've seen them win in different ways. I mean, they can go far. And the NFC is open. And I think we've seen over the past couple of weeks that I don't think they're better than the 49ers. But if they catch a couple of breaks, I think they're a team that can play with the 49ers. Right. Yeah, I really feel that way too.

And look, they are currently leading the 49ers in the division. And we're a long ways out, right? But when we talk about two teams that look like each one could hang with the other, something like home field advantage, at least to start the playoffs, it's going to be a big deal. So that's going to be a battle, certainly, for the division there. Would you like to give me a loser? I would. I don't know who to give the hell in this game.

The Vikings won it, but they lose Kirk Cousins, who is feared to have a torn Achilles. There's still an MRI, but that's usually an injury you can call pretty instantly. Has anyone ever been wrong about an Achilles? No, I don't think it's. I don't think so. So his season is probably over, and you would imagine with the dearth of options to replace him, Jaron Hall came into the game for the Vikings today, turned the ball over almost immediately. Nick Mollins is still on IR, can't come back until week 10.

There's been talk of Colt McCoy as a possibility just because he has some experience playing under Kevin O'Connell. But it's getting pretty dark. It's getting, we would be very lucky to land Ryan Tannahill dark. And this is a team, Minnesota, I'm talking about that is kind of in no man's land. Like they don't know whether to continue this team and double down on Kirk Cousins or just blow it up. I think they've kind of been in between those two worlds the past couple of off seasons. But I think this is something that kind of accelerates them and pushes them towards rebuilding. I do wonder if it affects their strategy at the trade deadline.

They're very much in the playoff race. But without Kirk Cousins at quarterback, Kirk Cousins has been playing very well over the past couple weeks. like it's hard not to think the season isn't over unless they land someone out of thin air. I think Ryan Tannehill is basically their best bet at this point. I would even say, I mean, look, I think this organization deserves a ton of credit for how they approached the off season, which had the rebuild in mind more than I think a lot of other teams would have after a season. where they won 13 games, despite the fact that a lot of it was, you know, the fluky, the one score games, the statistical underlying evidence saying that they weren't quite that good of a team. I think they were honest with themselves about that during the off season. And now the test is if they can be honest with themselves in the middle of the season.

And that's really an ownership question more than anything else. But it's harder because it's harder to be four and four. Truly in the playoff hunt, as you said, but still not, at least I don't think, and especially without Kirk Cousins, not a team that's going to be able to really make noise. And so it seems like the smartest thing for them to do is just sell, just say, look, like we got this started in the offseason, trying to collect some real draft capital and think towards the future. let's see what else we can get. But I do think that that's a harder thing to do when you're in the thick of a race

rather than, oh, it's, you know, it's the offseason. Let's not extend Kurt Cousins again. Let's let Delvin Cook walk. Let's make all these choices that happen when everybody's, oh, and oh. So we'll find out in a couple of days. but here's hoping that they keep the same energy. That was so impressive, just sort of being honest about where the team is. And they won this game.

We're talking about them so sadly, and they're the ones that won this game, 24 to 10. I know. The Packers are the other team, and it's kind of a good thing that they've lost and they don't get their hopes up and they can approach the trade deadline with the same approach, especially on the defensive side of the ball. 21st and EPA allowed. they brought Joe Barry back, they brought this defense back, and expected changes, and we just haven't seen the changes.

Like, this defense has to be very good in order for this team to work, the way it's set up. They're very young on offense, the youngest offense in the NFL, the youngest team in the NFL, and I think you have to kind of grade them on a curve on that side of the ball. And when I watch Jordan Love, like, still to this day, it's been bad the past couple of weeks, but I don't think it's been bad to the point where you just give up on Jordan Love.

I think he still makes like a handful of plays every week where you're like, okay, that talent is still there. It's the people around them. Like, they don't have a good offensive line. They don't have a good receiving core that's making plays for him. They have a receiving court that's doing the opposite.

They're giving up plays that should be made. And then there's just a bunch of pre-snap penalties on both sides of the ball. And it's really hard to win games when you don't have a margin for error in the first place. And then you're making these mistakes. Right. But at the same time, they're a young team. So it's like hard to blame it on the coaching staff. And it's hard to blame it on the players who are young

have been put in this situation. I don't know. I think it's in their best interest to kind of, I wouldn't say tank, but not try their best to win, not try to add pieces at the trade deadline. I know there was, I think it was a report from Jay Glazer from before the game today,

saying they might be in the market for one. But I just think after today, that's just not a conversation I would be having if I was them. Yeah. I think they did the sort of extension, reworking of the contract in the off season that gives them a little bit more flexibility. I don't think, look,

I think you don't give up on someone that you drafted that highly quickly, but I think they probably thought that they had a little bit more around him when they did that. Obviously, the Bakhtiari situation. is just something that can't possibly have gone the way that they expected. And I think they probably thought that they would be a little bit more of a complete team offensively. It's still, you know, he's still going to be cheap, right?

So you're talking about someone with a cap hit of a little under $8 million next year. So they're going to have the flexibility to try to put a strong team around him. I would be surprised if they do anything particularly hasty, but I also think that the results have been iffy to the point where you have to sort of start thinking about, okay, do we want to have some optionality here, sign a veteran, like what is the off ramp if they do give him a little bit more and the results don't improve?

Yeah, I think you just kind of fall into a situation where you can draft a quarterback, but you don't necessarily go out of your way to draft a quarterback if that makes sense. Like if they play out the season and they end up with the top five pick, I think at that point it's fine to bail from Love and look for the next guy. But if Love continues to play and it continues to show some flashes, but he still struggles, but they win like six games, seven games, and they're out of range of one of those guys,

then I think you just run it back another year. And they've kind of set themselves up to do that with this young roster. and I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. Like, I honestly don't think he's been that bad. He looks like a guy who hasn't played football in a long time, which is what he is. Right now, they would pick six if the season ended now. That's sort of, I mean, you know, maybe you can get a quarterback there. So much is going to change.

But it's probably kind of that no man's land where you're not going to go up and get one of the top guy. Like, that's it. That's the ideal. scenario, right, is that the decision makes itself apparent where you've such a high pick that you can grab someone or you just clearly don't. So let's give it another whirl. They could end up in a little bit of a murky spot. Speaking of quarterback-related decisions, just to bring it back to cousins one more time,

the thing that's going to be interesting about what happens with him is that he got hurt at a time when had we ever seen her cousins play football? that well over the last week in a chunk bit like it's a really interesting decision because I think everything has set itself up for the Vikings are going to move on from

Kurt Cousins which is not necessarily you know just because they didn't extend him doesn't mean that they have to but now the injury obviously becomes a factor and maybe that's something that decreases the cost limits his other options to go get an enormous bag like he's done in the past.

Obviously, I hope that doesn't happen because there are too many dumb teams out there. I'm sorry. All right. So you're still on that it would be dumb. Yeah. But here's my other thing. We haven't ever seen like Kirk Cousins. We've never seen him play this well.

We've never seen him hurt. That's the thing about Kirk Cousins. It's like he never misses games. The only time he's missed a game is when he had COVID. So it's kind of like you're guessing how he's going to come back from this, especially at that age. It's a major injury. But it's also, it feels like an injury that players are coming back more often from. Well.

I mean, it depends if he's, yeah, getting the dolphin therapy. See, he seems like a guy that would be, like his ears would be, he would be listening. He would hear Aaron Rogers out. Kirkhusins and Aaron Rogers have not dissimilar medical bullies. The center of that bend diagram is huge. Something in that vaccine that protects the Achilles. All right, we're going to move on. I'll give you a loser.

The tush push. Undefeated no more. Everyone argues about the tush push and goes, well, why don't you just stop it? And finally, someone did. The Eagles won 38 to 31 against the commanders. But when you can't have a win, I think the best consolation is being able to at least claim that you stopped the most unstoppable play in football because in the third quarter, Eagles lined up to run the tush push

on the goal line and Washington forced a fumble and got the turnover. And it was beautiful. It was beautifully done. And I think it should serve as a message to all of the tush push deniers out there. that it's not a cheat code, it can be stopped, you just have to go do it. And we've seen for ourselves that it's absolutely possible. Do you agree?

I do agree. And Jack Del Rio was one of those opponents to the play a couple weeks ago. And then it was a big moment for Jack Del Rio. Turn tables turn, Jack. Never mind the fact that they still lost the game. And he allowed AJ Brown to just dunk on his cornerbacks all game long and he didn't do anything about it. He still gets a win for stopping the play.

It was only a seventh shot at it. Both of AJ Brown's touchdowns, he had eight catches for 130 yards. It was just like absolutely unbelievable in this game. Both of his touchdowns looked like the most athletic thing I've ever seen on a football thing. Like the stuff that he does looks like when people are on, what's the game show where you have to do like a crazy obstacle course? Ninja Warrior. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, you ever like just like click past an enjoy warrior and you just see some dude like running through a thing and he's like jumping and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. That's what that looked like to me. He's the first player in NFL history with 125 or more receiving yards in six straight games. The most to the extent that I learned anything from this game, honestly, I thought Sam Hell was pretty impressive until he just absolutely fell apart in the fourth quarter, which helped the Eagles score three touchdowns and come away with the win. But he was, most of his game was fairly solid in a way that I would not necessarily have expected them to be able to put together. Finished, still finished 39 and 52 for 397 yards and four touchdowns.

So honestly, not too shabby. I am not shocked that the Eagles won this game. I'm not shocked that their offense was able to. to torch Jack Del Rio's cornerbacks. I was interested to see that while they did get the tush push stopped, they also pulled out a little wrinkle and ran a counter off of it to D'Andre Swift, which was exciting. So the Eagles are 7 and 1.

The Eagles are one of the best teams in the league. I don't know that this outcome changes all, like, really, very much about that. But it does, it's another game that to me cements just that they're really hard to prep for. Because think about all the stuff that they put on tape. You've got the tush push, which we now know is, you know, it can be stopped.

But now that we know that it can be stopped, you have to spend time practicing trying to stop it. And now you know that they have a counter to run off of it. So what if D'Andre Slift just tries to fake out and run the ball in? AJ Brown is an American Ninja Warrior Wizard. Julio Jones, you know, another wrinkle. He's there. I just imagine that Monday to,

they're a very hard team to play on Sunday, but they're also a very hard team to be playing Monday to Friday. Because that's a lot of work in the office. Yeah. Like, and. there are different elements of their run game. The passing game, I think, is like simple, but it's simple in a way that it doesn't make it any easier to defend it

because the receivers are so good. Right. You still have to make those decisions like, am I going to double this guy? But if I double this guy, what's going to happen to this guy? So that does make it hard, even if the overall offense isn't too complicated. This game, this was the first time.

But I think, I mean, what they do is not that complicated. like they, you know, sometimes, like they have like eight plays. But they run them in all of these different ways. Like there's no. I just think that they continue to prove that idea wrong because they can put a wrinkle on anything that they do. So I just, there's a big piece of the Eagles that's just you're not going to be able to stop it.

But I actually think that there's a lot more. There's more dimension to this offense than than meets the eye. I guess is my point. I think in this game, there definitely was. I think this was Brian Johnson, the first year offensive coordinator's best game by far. And I really felt like this was the first time. I felt like I was watching the Eagles offensive last year.

And it felt like these two teams played the same exact game in the same exact venue last year when they played it. But instead of AJ Brown dunking on commanders, it was Devante Smith doing it. But they played, like Jalen Hertz threw a bunch of deep balls against Washington last year. So I do feel like this was the, this was really the first time it felt like this offense is back.

But now there are questions about the defense. I, like, Sam Howell looked really good in the first half and things kind of turned for him. But the way he looked good with like the explosive plays, the throws downfield, kind of they weren't necessarily like coverage bust, but they almost seemed like coverage busts just based on how open the players were getting. And that's becoming a recurring theme. Like, we have seen the Eagles defense win some games recently. but we've seen them be exploitable, especially down the field. And that's a bit of a concern.

I don't know if there's any team in the NFC that can take advantage of that, but I know there are a bunch of teams in the AFC that can. Pringleord. Not looking too bad right about now, maybe. That's right. All right. You got another winner? I do.

My winner is the Dallas Cowboys who, they scored 43 points. But I will say this about the Cowboys. This game was really weird. And it got out of hand for L.A. really quickly. There was a pick six, there was a safety. There was a bunch that went down. And then, like,

Dak Prescott had 100 yards and the Cowboys already had 20 points. And I've noticed so far this season, every game where the Cowboys have this outburst, like an outburst on offense where they score at least 30 points, it's been driven by just chaos created by the defense. We still haven't seen this offense

do it on their own for 60 minutes. Like even against LA when Dak Prescott had that great game, they only scored 20 points. It wasn't like they had this great offensive explosion. So I still have questions about this team. And like things, after they got out to this big lead, they're up by like three scores in the second half. The Rams start to chip away. And the Cowboys like, I don't know, the Cowboys didn't really put their foot on the gas. They didn't really blow this game out.

They kind of let the Rams get back into it. Then Matthew Stafford goes out and that's the end of the game. But I think the score isn't as dark. dominant as it implies. Like, I don't think this game was as dominant for the Cowboys as the score implies, is what I mean. I don't know. I still need to see it. I'm still worried about Mike McCarthy in the offense going forward when the defense

isn't setting them up with short fields. So we've been stacking up NFC teams a little bit. Where do they fall in relation to the NFC West teams, right? I mean, obviously the 49ers result against them has to have some bearing. but when we're talking about Seahawks, Niners, Cowboys, today, October 30th, how do you feel? I would put them on the same level as the Seahawks, honestly. I know that's not how we kind of think of these teams just because the Cowboys had Super Bowl expectations coming into the year, but they're both five and two.

I think they both have similar resumes this year. And I think they're kind of relying on the same things, especially on offense. They're relying on their quarterback just having remarkable games. Their running game works sometimes, but it's not something they can rely on week to week. The passing game is good. They're stars in the receiving court, but I don't know if the passing game is as consistently good as we see from other elite offenses. So I think it's a similar setup. And then I think the Cowboys defensive ceiling is a little higher, but I think both defense,

have been playing well this year. So it's hard for me to kind of separate them. But I do think the most important thing for the Cowboys is they just don't match up well with San Francisco. I think they match up way better with Philadelphia. So they can avoid San Francisco in the playoffs and it won't be an issue. But if they can't, it's kind of hard to answer that question because I don't know. I don't know if they can get past that 49ers test. To their credit, C.D. Lamb, it's fantastic in this game.

two touchdowns, 158 yards. Yeah, totally. The thing that stood out about Dak in this game was that he moved a lot. And that's been, I think that was a discussion after the 49ers game when people were talking about like what's changed with Dak. And the one thing you do notice is he doesn't run as much as he used to. Like in college, he was, they were running like a spread offense and he was like a mobile read option quarterback. So it's in him. But we saw it in this game.

And that's another reason why I'm kind of skeptical about. this being a get-right game for the offense is not a lot of it came in rhythm. It wasn't like Dak was hitting the back of his drop and letting go with the ball. Like he was kind of moving, he was getting moved off his spot. He was getting outside of the pocket. He scrambled four times in this game, three times for a first down. It was a game where DAC had to create a lot, and it wasn't really the offensive play call and carrying them.

I want to see if they can score 40 points and have like a total team effort on offense. Get the play call and go, get the running game going. And then DAC just has a good game. He doesn't have one of these games where he looks like one of the best quarterbacks in the NFL. We've got the Eagles up next. That'll be a fun game. But as you said, they actually do match up pretty well against Philadelphia. That'll be really interesting.

And then another division game gets the New York football giants, who we will get to eventually. Panthers, commanders, and then Seahawks Eagles. So we are going to get some literal answers to some of these questions about how they feel. fit within the broader NFC. The stuff about Dax mobility is really interesting to me or just how much he's moving around and running because when he was coming off of his injury, I think that was seen as well, you know, he's either trying to stay healthier and not quite as sure of himself physically or there was a decline in how much running around out there he was doing after he got hurt,

which, you know, it's hard to know how much in terms of lasting. effects a player deals with, obviously, it was such a major injury. He's still, he's a young guy, right? And at this point, you know, you start to wonder if it's a little bit more of a factor of the offense. And that offense, that does tend to be a little bit stagnant. So if they do have to find more creative ways to score points and to move the ball, obviously that's going to be a referendum on this offensive coaching staff,

but I'll be curious to see if how DAC moving fits into that. Because as you point out, at earlier times in his life, like that was such a huge part of DAC as a quarterback, but it has largely gone away. And I don't know that we can totally say that that's schematic just because of the timing with when he got hurt, but it seems like it might be in part. I think that makes sense because one, he got hurt scrambling. And then two, it wasn't just like an injury.

It was like a devastating like a disgusting looking injury. If I was him, I would be like, okay, I never want that to happen to me again. Maybe I shouldn't scramble anymore. So like I think there's something to do that. I really want to believe that like just because he is good at it and it could help them, my brain is like, no, Mike McCarthy is making him do it. He's making him do it. He is the bad man.

But if that ever happened to me, I would be like, I'm absolutely not doing any of this ever going to mind my entire life. But that's why I don't ever want to see my ankle sideways again. I think that's a fair. I don't ever want to see my ankle. Like I would become like a never nude but just for ankles. Like can't do it.

All right. Next winner. The Miami Dolphins who got a much needed boost defensively, I would say from Jalen Ramsey, who played for the first time this season after spending the first seven weeks recovering from meniscus surgery. And he got off to quite the start. He picked off Mack Jones and returned the ball 49 yards in the second quarter, played 47 and 51 defensive snaps. The pick set up a touchdown. Dolphins ended up winning 31 to 17. I actually think they were much more dominant than even that score implies in this game.

The Patriots got a boost early when Tua threw an interception and New England was able to score on a short field. But for the most part, I thought Miami pretty much dominated this game. What did you think? Yeah, I thought New England had a good plan at first. Kind of saw them switch the leverages on Tua and he threw some inbreakers that New England was all over. But outside of that, yeah, after that, it was just, they were just.

Here's my question for you. Tua after an interception. Where would Tua rank on the quarterback rankings if he only played in the moments after he throws a bad pick? He might be in the top five because he does play well. He does bounce back. And I feel like that's the thing. It's really amazing. You've seen other quarterbacks not do it.

You've seen other quarterbacks not do it as in not bounce play well after they throw a pick. Yeah. Like I think Jared Gaw is one of those guys. Yeah, him too. It's a lot of, it's those types of quarterbacks. I feel like you see it where they throw a pick and then all of a sudden it sort of spirals and then he's got a disaster game on your hands. But Tua, part of it is just after he throws a pick, I think there's something in his head that's just if the deep ball to Tyreek is there, throw it. That's usually the answer, isn't it?

He usually hits the deep ball to Tyreek. You said you blame everything on Mike McCarthy. I'm going to give Mike McDaniel the credit for this. It's the power of positive thinking. He's giving him confidence. I'll figure out a way to drive credit away from Tua on anything. I think it's the power of having Tyrant Hill playing on your football team. That's true.

Him being wide open by 10 yards. If I cost my team seven points and I had a really easy way to just immediately get seven points back, I would do that. I would do that all day. And you can say to the, you know, to the defense, okay, if two a throw is a pick, go, go cover Tyreek. He's going to look for Tyreek. He's going to look for Tyreek on the deep ball if he's got it. They're covering him. Tyreek is post bracket.

He can't like that touchdown was another double coverage where he just split the bracket. It doesn't work anymore. Can we like, I honestly think we have to talk about him in the MVP conversation at this point. He's over a thousand receiving yards already. It's Halloween. He's getting open by 10 yards on these deep balls. Like he gives the quarterback such a margin for error on them. It doesn't matter where you put the ball if you're open by that much.

So I don't know. Like he just changes this offense in so many different ways. Like he's clearly the most valuable person on the offense. Like I think he's more valuable than to a, I would put Tyreek at the top in terms of most important. I mean, I'll give you. Tua at two and then Mike McDaniel after that, but like Tyreek has to be at the top. I don't think this works without, like it doesn't work like this without Tyree. I think what Tua does for the offense is a little more replaceable than what Tyreek does

with his speed. Because we've seen like Brock Purdy kind of do similar things for the 49ers offense that Tua does. But there's no one on the 49ers offense that does for that offense what Tyreef does for the Miami offense. And it's crazy to watch. But then like Jailen Ramsey, I think is the takeaway here, even more so than Tyree Kill. Oh, yeah.

I think that was my point. And then I got distracted by Tyree Kill. By how fast Tyree Kill is. Yeah, it's very fast. But yeah, I saw a stat from NextGen stats that was like, the Patriots threw to the left side of the field, which is where Jalen Ramsey lined up for like 98% of his snaps. I think it was five times. And they got seven yards total throwing to the left side of the field.

He literally shut down one side of the field. And that was kind of the impact you wanted to see. him have on this defense, and I think it changes the nature of the defense. It allows Vic Fangio to do more things that I think are going to help this team in the long run. I mean, we saw how much the Eagles picked on those Dolphins corners in week seven. So I think that's a big deal. I mean, they're ranked 24th in defensive DVOA. So if they can just inch toward average, which if he's able to have that type of impact, it'll really help them, especially when they're in in a playoff race, playing top receivers having someone like Jalen Ramsey who looks every bit himself, right?

You could excuse some rest hopping in after some time off, but he looked great. So really encouraging for them. Luzer? Yeah, I don't, I guess I should give this to the Bears. The next game is Chargers Bears, Chargers win 30 to 13 on Sunday night football. it started out as a game that felt like a get-right game for the Charters. They score a bunch of points early. They get out to this big lead.

And then it kind of just fizzles. I feel like this doesn't, this isn't necessarily a great sign for them going forward. They lose Josh Palmer to injury in this game too, another receiver down. Yeah. And we saw the, it wasn't like it was a bunch of explosives for the offense. There were some screen passes. But in the passing game, it was still Justin Herbert kind of dinking and dunking his way down the field. And at a certain board in the second half, it really stopped work.

And they relied on him to convert on third downs too much, and it fell apart. So I almost feel like giving the Charters an L here for not embarrassing the Bears more. You're playing against a Division II quarterback, making only a second start. And I know Tyson Bayton turned the ball over a couple times, and it looked bad on those throws. But like in between that, he looked like a decent quarterback. They moved the ball fairly well. I don't know. This wasn't the performance I wanted to see out of them.

I wasn't overly impressed at it from by LA in this game. Tyson Bejit has more tattoos every time I lay eyes on him. Every time I look at that man, he has just like sprouted another piece of artistry on his body. And I, you know what? Cool. Let's do it. I cannot find it within myself to, to take too much away from this.

I think the chargers know that. this season has not gone well and is not going well and is not going to go well. And if a little bit of onwee starts to infect that team, which is just what it looks like to me, it looks like they know that, that it's another year where the expectations were so high and it's just not coming together. And at a certain point, you can't expect them to not kind of feel that. I'm honestly a little bit like, cool. You got to win.

It's all we can ask of them by this point. At least they did win. I will give them that. The Chargers don't usually do that. They have enough trouble just coming away with the win that I think, I think the Bears have to get the L here because we have enough opportunities to give the Chargers Ls when they actually lose football games. Let them have it.

But I would argue that if Bejan had another good game, it would look really bad for Justin Fields. And that would be a bigger L than, I don't know. Like I feel like this game kind of gives you hope that Justin Fields' improvement was real. Interesting. I feel the opposite. In what way? I think the general thesis of the Bears has been that they have served this quarterback. very poorly.

And I think that that is fair and I think that that is true, but I think the overarching story of what has happened feels most correctly like maybe Fields was not the guy all along that they thought he was, but they have really failed

in the development of this quarterback. Having Tyson Bayesian pop in there and not light the world on fire, right? But look credible. immediately is, is tough. It's just tough.

And maybe it will all crash and burn. And we've seen this weird thing before, right, where sometimes a quarterback just comes in and has a couple good games and then it all falls apart. But I am finding it a tough look for the, it was all the Vares fault and not just in Fields fault. But they lost by 17 points. It's all like they won the game. And he threw two interceptions.

Like that's what I'm saying. If they would have been more competitive and he doesn't throw these interceptions, there would have been like memes saying, oh, it's over for Justin Fields. Like, and I don't think that's happening. I think now you're looking forward to Justin Fields coming back where there was a, there was an outcome where he Brock Purdy's this thing and kind of steals Justin Fields job and becomes a starter. I think that's out of the question now.

Like, that's a, that's not happening. He's not stealing the job. But, but. it's because of the investment. I mean, do you think that this game ends differently if Justin Fields is playing quarterback? Do you think the Bears' offense looks meaningfully better with him playing? I mean, maybe. I mean, maybe they score 20 points instead of 13.

Is that meaningful? But that, I mean, that's the Steelers. I don't know. That's enough Bears talk. Last loser, the Steelers, who lost 20 to 10 to the Jackwars, but also lost Kenny Pickett late in the second quarter with a rib injury. This was a yucky game all around. There was some bad weather, but in particular, costly,

not only because of the Kenny Pickett injury, but Minka Fitzpatrick for the Steelers also went down with a hamstring in the first quarter. Mitchell Chubesky came in for Pickett, had a tough go of things. He threw a pair of interceptions on the fourth quarter. Demonte Cazee also as Fitzpatrick's replacement gave up a touchdown to Travis Etienne, who had a great day, really good day for Jacksonville. The Steelers are four and three, and I still think that they could make a run for a wild card,

despite having maybe the worst offense in the league. But even something like the Thursday game that they have coming up against the Titans this week, having Pickett versus having Tribisky could matter. And the result of that game could matter. Adam Schafter reported that it is, quote, up in the air, according to a source if Pickett would be able to go. Obviously, I think, you know, we'll see how the early part of this week develops and what the news out of Pittsburgh is.

but it just feels like they've had these sort of overachieving results. And I do think that in coaching, in defense, in some of the run game stuff, some of the receiver playmaking, they've pieced it together. And I think they could keep doing it. but the margin for error is getting slimmer and slimmer. I don't know how big of a difference it is going from Kenny Pickett to Mitch Trubisky, to be honest with you. He was bad. Kenny Pickett was pretty bad too and has been pretty bad.

Like it's like a different. Like would you rather your quarterback spin out of the pocket and run into a sack or just run directly into it? Like that's the only difference. Would you rather him, his interceptions come on throws into double coverage or have them on just horribly overthrown passes? Like that's the difference. The results are the same. Just how you get to that point. I don't know.

I almost want to give the Jaguars a win here because this is a game, the Jaguars, we've kind of grown used to them making more competitive than it should be. It's in the rain. It's against Mike Tomlin who finds ways to win these games all the time. So even though it was an ugly performance

and Trevor Lawrence had one of the worst interceptions I've ever seen him throw in the end zone in this one, I think it's a good sign for this team. even if they didn't blow out the Steelers, I think it's a good sign that they're winning these games on the road against a good coach that pulls these games out in games that they typically give away. We even saw them trying to give away the Saints game last week.

And I don't think they ever got that close in this one, which is a good sign. Did it take a quarterback getting hurt? Sure, but they did it. One six games, five games in a row, right? Like this is a six and two team. They are, I think, especially as we've seen the, you know, the Texans dropped a game today, right?

They have quieted a fair bit of, is the AFC South going to be actually competitive? And it doesn't always look perfect, but they've won five in a row, right? Like they are winning these games, and I don't want to take it for granted. Yeah. These aren't games they usually do.

So, do it. Shall we close it out on the take purge? Let's do it. Would you like to go first or should I? How about you go first? Because I want to get to this game. Okay. So this is actually not a take purge.

This is just a regular purge because I felt that we needed to cleanse ourselves of Jets' giants. Just some, you know, like, just a rinse. Just take the day off. Just forget that this ever happened. But remember that it happened before we forget. I'm going to tell you some things that happened in this game. There were 24 punts. We actually talked in pre-production for a second about playing a sound like we did for the 70-point game for the Dolphins scoring touchdowns for playing a sound every time there was a punt or there would have been a punt in Jets Giants.

But 24 is too many. it just would have created a really aggressive listening experience. So we couldn't do that. They denied us that opportunity because this was too disgusting a game of football. There was not a single third down conversion in the first half. 18 were attempted. Not one was converted. And then the Giants at first.

I put down that the Giants had. seven total passing yards off of six completions. And to be fair, Tarrad Taylor had eight of them. And then Tommy DeVito, who I think I'm just going to call Danny DeVito, because that's more fun, had negative one passing yard.

If you factor in the negative yardage from sacks, the Giants had minus nine passing yards total. It made it to be. They made it to overtime. They made it to overtime and throwing the ball, they moved backwards nine yards. Seguan Parkley, I'm so sorry. The only competent entity involved in this game and his dad was wearing the other team's gear at the game. What?

Sequin's dad is like a huge Jets fan and I guess he was wearing like full. full jet skier i just i there are rats in the subway there's they're punting 24 times at metal life stadium we have the craziest mayor like new york just needs a break just leave me with my bagel in peace i i have a take i i'm gonna come up with an extra take for the take perch if you won coach of the year as an offensive guy and then you have a game the next year where you have negative passing yards, you lose the trophy. You lose the award. Can we give that?

You should have to return it? Can we give that to Kyle Shanahan retroactively? This is embarrassing. And by the way, this always seems to happen with Coach of the Year. I'm putting Coach of the Year voters. Didn't you vote for Coach of the Year? I'm putting you on fraud watch. Oh, no.

I did vote for Coach of the Year. Now I'm trying to remember who I voted for. Just lie and say Kyle Shanahanan. I think I did vote for Kyle Shanahan. Okay, good, good. I'll look that up. I'll be accountable. The problem is if I didn't vote for Kyle Shanahan,

I definitely voted for Daveo. But I think I voted for Carl Shanahan. I would have voted for Dayball too. So I would have put myself on fraud watch, but negative nine passing yards. By the way, why is Tommy DeVito getting into NFL games? It's insane. Yeah, thanks.

Sorry. I refuse to believe that that's a real person and that they didn't just like find him in the stance. I've never heard of him. Not one time. And he has and his name is Tommy DeVito. Like, come on. You're telling me that that guy wasn't just like hanging around MetLife. I went to Syracuse in Illinois.

Wait, what? Syracuse and Illinois? Yeah. Oh, I thought he said in Illinois. Okay. Oh, no, no. But he transferred to Syracuse. I don't know.

I don't know his lore. I just looked up his... But if he transferred to Syracuse... Like, that's just some guy walking around New York. This is just like a Syracuse grad who lives in Murray Hill. And his name is Tommy DeVito and he had negative one passing yards for the New York Giants today. and I can't tell if I want to think about this game every day for the rest of my life or just absolutely never again.

And I think that's probably the one. So I hereby purge Jets Giants, which the Jets won, but canonically to me, everyone lost. That needed to happen. We needed to discuss this game. But there was no way to do it like at the top of the show. So I'm happy this happened. Are you ready for mine? There could have been away.

We could have just, we could have ranked all the punts, every single punt. That would have been a long time. 24 punts. I mean the ice bath. The Scottish hammer is, is the Giants punter. He must be, I mean, having a real year. They got their money's worth with him. They really did.

Should I give you mine? Absolutely. So my take is that, like I, okay, Will Levis threw three touchdowns. Or was it four touchdowns? But he threw three over 50s. 50 air yards. Four touchdowns, three over 50 air yards. And I'm going to say his performance to me was just, me, just fine. I wasn't overly impressed by it. He's a shot play merchant. And one of the shot plays, he did a pump thing. A shot play merchant. Come on. That's literally like all they

completed. No, he had other completions, but I don't think he was impressive, like super impressive outside of that. I do think he had a couple of plays where, like, he showed off some good process and showed off some good pocket presence. But, like, the highlights are those deep passes, which I just don't think you can rely on that week to week. Like, I do think he has a big arm and it's impressive. I think that is fair.

But not everything can be a merchant. You can't, we can't be writing off play action merchants, but then also writing off shot play merchants, but then also writing off, like, you get one merchant category. category. No, no, I could be inconsistent. I can be hypocritical. I'm doing it. No, I actually think, like, Levis was an underrated prospect.

I think he got a lot of shit for playing on a bad Kentucky team. I just think this performance might get a little over. That's all I'm saying. Just don't be surprised if he falls down there on Thursday when they play Pittsburgh, and those shot plays aren't falling. Because without the shot plays, I don't know how good this performance looks. That's all I'm saying. I'm not going to disagree with you.

because then you'll put the curse of Brock Purdy on me. That's right. You don't want to end up like Brock Purdy. Who hasn't won a game since being asked about the ringer NFL quarterback? I won't say who asked him the question. All right. This is where I end the podcast. This has been dual threat on the ringer Annabelle show feed.

I'm Nora Pryanti. He's Stephen Ruiz. Thank you. As always, to Isaiah Blakely for producing this episode. Thank you to Kiara Givens and Eduardo Ocampo for their work. on socials and to Arjuna Rangupal and Connor Evans for additional production supervision. We will be back on Thursday, but next up on the feed, Sheal and Ben will have extra point taken their deep dive into week 8 games.

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