The Ringer-Verse - 'Andor' Season 2, Episodes 4-6 Reactions | The Midnight Boys

Episode Date: April 30, 2025

The Boys are back, and they’re diving into ‘Andor’ Season 2, Episodes 4, 5, and 6! (0:00) Intro (7:16) Spoilers ahead (9:20) Reactions to the episodes (1:14:37) Outro (1:15:33) Post-credits Hosts: Van Lathan, Charles Holmes, Jomi Adeniran, and Steve Ahlman Producers: Aleya Zenieris, Jonathan Kermah, Chris Thomas, and Steve Ahlman Additional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopal Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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So visit Spectrum.com slash business to learn more. Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas. Welcome into the Ringiverse. This is, of course, the Ringer's Nexus podcast feed for all things. Fandom, we are, Steve, the architect, Almond, the builder and tinker of things. We are, Jomi, the explaining at dinner,

and you've got questions, he's got answers. We are. Oman Van Van, here with the reception, hairline. We are, Kobe, Kourke, we are, known as to join us. I'm up midnight, boys. Poo-billoo! Follow some socials, instant, Twitter, Facebook,

TikTok, Jomi. Guys, you guys are doing a great job following us on Instagram. Appreciate it. Follow us on TikTok, too. We're blowing us. up on TikTok, guys. Are we? Dude, all the Cinners content is going crazy.

You know Cinnies is really touch with the community because the security guys that let us sit. He goes, hey, yo, I actually watched your show. You guys are funny. I'm like, damn, we've been here for four years. 54 feet away from us this whole time. That's good. Hey, we reaching the masses.

That's what so. Centers is the gift that keeps on giving. It is. Making a lot of money. We're on YouTube. Like, comment, subscribe, share. You can watch every Midnight Boys, a House of Art episode on YouTube. YouTube.com at slash backslash

YouTube.com backslash at Ringiverse. Also on Spotify. The Ring ofverse is deep on the Last of Us. I don't know. Weird. I'm in there. I've been there mushroom guts. Deep on the Last of Us is weird, Steve. Okay.

But Match will be with you on Thursday. On Friday, the Midnight Boys will be giving you their instant reactions to Thunderbolts, which we saw and are ready to disson. We will be discussing that film. We'll be talking about thunderbolts, guys. Thunderbolts crashing. Thunderbolts crashing.

People together. You are so offbeat. That's so nuts, Steve. When I give you the thunderbolts crashing, I want you to give me the beat. Thunderbolts crashing. There you go. Thunderbolts crashing. We're all together.

We are thunderbolts crashing. Steve kept the beat right there. We're getting a little loopy. That's how I know we're podcasting a lot. Yeah. Where there's a lot of loopy that it's right now. The question before we move on, is Haley-Signfeld black?

Oh. I'll refer to that. Okay, so here's the thing. So I say she's not black. Okay? She has one grandfather that's half black. This is like the married character on incinters. But people are going hard.

on the internet, Twitter sphere, whatever, about whether or not Haley Steinfeld can now be considered as a blick. All right, I'll put it to you this way, before sinners. Would our people have gotten in arms if an N-word video dropped from Haley? Okay, let's look at it this one. You're right.

So an in-word video drops from Haley. Post-Centers. Post-Centers. No, I'm saying pre-s sinners. Pre-scenters. Well, pre-scenters we didn't know. But here's the thing, now that people, people like the movie, I feel like they kind of like let it.

I think, no, but I think the movie illustrates the point, which is like, is cool, you know, part black, whatever, but at the same time, you can't, the optics are not really there. Because think about it, let's say like a Hardinstein or Adonis, okay, Hardinstein. Hardinstein's dad is half black. If Hardinstein gets with a snow bunny, that pulls a Jemey. then you're not going to be able to really say that Hardinstein's kid is black, right? It's not black. A lot of the sisters, a lot of the sisters.

Are we just figuring off the cutoff? Look, look, because back in the day, there was no cutoff. Your people were like, if you sang a black song three generations before you were going to lynch you, your people were very, very bloodthirsty, Steve. You should take some time right now to think about it.

But, but, but, you know, There was octaroons, there's, you know, quadroons, octaroons, all of these things, right? The sisters, some of the sisters are getting very perturbed that some of the brothers are being like, Haley is up, put her Ebony Jet Beauty in the Week. Like, you know, like, Eminie and Jay is crazy.

I'm telling you, straight up, it's like, a lot of people are like, you know, if we have smooth magazine right now, we're putting Haley on the cover of that bitch. Well, I will say black men have to do better because, like, every homie that I see, like, I haven't seen the, while the person's like, hey, yo, you've seen sinners.

I'm like, yeah, he's like, hey, yo. That Haley, though. I'm like, bro, we don't got to go straight to the Haley of it all. Perlene is the star of sinners, man. The two black ladies and sinners are sexiest. Oh, man. Perlene and Annie, I'm a Perlene and any type of nigga. I'm going to be honest with you.

But I need answers from the Midnight Boys because they're talking about it. Before we get into Andor, like a lot of women or black women are getting perturbed about this narrative and discourse over whether or not Haley Steinfeld is now black. I've seen people saying that Jomi was right

there's hashtag Jomey was right going on right now the whole time that Jomey was really into her because he could see the blackness in her. They understand Jomey and Shamek's crash out? Yeah, they understand it now that everybody, the niggas was crashing out because they could see the, no.

Okay, let's keep. How fucking no. No. Charles says no. So Charles rules. I love Haley Stinefeld, but we're not doing this. Yeah, I'm not co-siding this. I would benefit from this

so I can get the milk moniker off me, but at the same time, no, brother. Well, here's the thing. We can, two things can be true. The milk can have a dash of syrup in it, but that don't make it chocolate milk. You know what I'm saying? She's not black.

And that's okay. It's okay. We still love Haley. Over here. Haley, you're the best. We love you. She's not black, but the sisters that are getting upset about it

is, it's not, it's funny. It's funny because, It's funny. You're just like making people mad, though. No, it's not. It's funny when they have to set things right. Because things go too far. It's like everybody loves it.

We're all in there. We're in the juke joint chilling. And some things are. No, who's taking it too far? Some of the brothers. The brothers are they take. Like, we, I take a low responsibility. We came out of the theater.

Brick thumb. Da-da-da-da-da. Oh, look at Hailey. Look at Prelin. Perlene looked good, bro. I'm sorry. I didn't know about her. Annie? What's my girl?

Women. Honey? The women of sinners are killing it. All right. So the Midnight boys have decided it. Hey, guys, brothers, chill. Chill. We got to chill. We got to chill.

You got to chill. Pump the brace. It's okay. It's okay. It's milk. Steve, you have anything to say? I will continue listening to Black women. Thank you. Toma. Yeah, play the drums. Play the drums. Play the drums.

That's the biggest band. Steve. for Ander. Oh, my God, played a joke. Jesus Christ, man. We're getting ready to talk about Cassianander.

You're listening to a reaction podcast. The spoilers are coming. All right. To begin our reactions, we once again bring you the Midnight Manifest. Go for it.

All right. This is your Midnight Manifest for Andor episodes 4 through 6, directed by Ariel Climman written by Bo Willamon. Willamon? All right. We start with Cassian and Bix. It's B.B.Y.3.

Cassian grows paranoid on Carriotan as Bix continues to struggle with their PTSD. Luton sends Cassian to meet with the Gorman Front and assess their operation, but the rebellion leader is upset when Cassian reports back that they're unprepared. Luton tells Cassian he needs him to think like a leader and not a soldier, but their relationship further fractures when Cassian learns Lutth, Luton visited Bix, who is in throws a drug addiction as she tries to get over the psychological warfare the empire put her through. Bix and Cassian take matters into their own hands when Bix kills Dr. Gors, the man responsible for torturing her on pharynx. Meanwhile, we go to

Dider and Cyril. Cyril is relocated to Gorma in order to be a mole on the Gorman front for Didera. The empire is building an armory in the middle of the city, and Cyril is successful in feeding the information to the front so they can ambush a weapons carrier. All right, now Luthen and the rebellion, aka Valentinta. Meanwhile, angry that Cassian won't embed himself on Gorma, Luton decides to send Vell and Sint it to help with the weapons heist, finally reunited and learned through the couple that Luton is purposefully separating friends and lovers inside of the rebellion to better control to soldiers. Cassian's hunch was right and the Gorman Front's inexperienced leads to the death of Sinta. And on Corrassant, Luton and Clea must attend a party to retrieve a listening device they implanted at one of their benefactor's homes. Last but certainly not least, Saw kidnaps Willam and forces the engineer to help him steal the starship fuel Riodonium.

Solisaw takes Willem in under his wing and radicalizes the young man away from Lutheran's faction of the rebellion, and that has been hopefully or not very long midnight. This episode is brought to by WeatherTech. Everyone knows Winter is the MVP and make it a mess. You don't need Weather Tech floor liners in the summer unless you hit the beach or go camping. Then you'd want a cargo liner or a road trip goes sideways, ketchup goes rogue, ice cream drips. Yeah, you'd be pretty happy about those WeatherTech seat protectors. So just to be clear as the mud, you're inevitably.

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How do you feel about Gorman? How do you feel about the Gorman arc, Gorma? How do you feel about all of this? Beautiful, beautiful people, beautiful threads, fresh as fuck. Got it on. I will say, this is why I love Cassie so much. Cassie took one look at them. It's like, they're not ready.

They're not built for it. They're not built for it. And that's what I actually love about this show is that I feel like the whole center, potentially of this season is revealed when Bluthin meets Cassian again. And it reminded me of that first discussion that they had in and or season one. And when he's like, you need to start thinking like a leader. I'm like, oh, this illustrates just have. how big and unwieldy, both the rebellion and the empire have gotten.

On the empire side, you have people where they're like, we're arresting so many people, we can't even interrogate them. And on the rebellion side, they're like, we have so much information, so many soldiers, and none of this is put together and organized, that Luton is going mad. And what I loved about at least the bones of, like, can Cassian become a leader?

is that Cassin was actually right. Being a soldier, he saw these people. He's just like, this is going to get fucked up. They do not have this. And to Luton, it's like, it doesn't matter. I'm not thinking on a planet level. I'm not thinking on a people level. I am thinking on a galactic level.

Do your fucking job. And that's why, even if I think this was a doughy trio of episodes, the meat of it was enjoyable. So, yeah, the soldier, two things. to kind of talk about right there. The soldier leader dynamic is very interesting. Remember soldiers, their moniker is, you know, leave no man behind.

Go grab the guy because they need numbers and they build all these bonds, brotherhoods, all that stuff like that. Leaders send soldiers to die. Yep. You know? You are a leader somewhere in a room making a decision, situation room, wherever it is.

And you send a bunch of teenagers and young adults. to kill somewhere and to die somewhere. And you hope that they have an understanding as to why they're doing that. So, you know, when Cassin is looking at things as a soldier, he's thinking, I don't want to send people to die. It's important. And Lutheran looks at him and so it goes, if they die, you know, if the city, if the planet burns,

let's hope it burns brightly. Yeah. Because for his machinations, he needs people to understand the tyranny of the empire. So he's looking at it. from the standpoint of someone who's moving chess pieces around and sometimes a pawn gets his head knocked off. That's the way there it goes. I also thought it was interesting that we see a clear counter to some of the ethos of the original trilogy in Cassian. The original trilogy, they have these big goals of overthrowing an empire.

But the reason why Luke is able to do it is because of the connections that he has, because of the connections that he has to father, the connections that he has to his sister, to his best friend, and to basically his dog, which is what what Chui was, justice for Chui. And, you know, Luke won't do certain things without his friends.

Luke is willing to put really, honestly, the health of the rebellion second to the fact that his friends are out there. That's Empire Strike. That's literally the second and third act of Empire Strikes.

Right. So, and it's actually in that situation, it's Kenobi's Force Ghost and Yoda to a degree that it's saying, hey, you can't do this. Like, there's a fight, a war to be waged. So all of these leaders go through this, Cassian's rebellion is different than the rebellion that we're used to. And the show continues to make that point, and it continues to make that point in a very desperate way. That's almost the central ethos of the show to me, which is that there's a whole other rebellion where you couldn't sell out the mission for your friends,

where love wasn't the most important thing, where connection is not the most important thing. It's just not that way. To where mission accomplishment is the most important thing. And, you know, I think every time I watch the show, particularly Luther's character, he reiterates that all the time. Mitt boys, what you guys got.

Van, I think you're completely right when it comes to the themes of, like, unity and friendship and connection, the things that, like, A, the Jedi rail against to prevent you from getting too attached from things in order for a greater cause and a greater good.

And that theme is pretty much held home at the very end of these three episodes when Val loses somebody very important to her and she chastises the person who's fault it is and she will carry on. And I think that like the kind of key

tenets of this show broadens the scope of Cassian's fight into the circles that are kind of like orbiting him and knowing that he's actually the kind of the perfect person to both maintain connection and then sever what needs to be done.

Like we see that he's like rallying to Bix's cause and like getting revenge. on that terrible doctor at the end of this arc while still trying to remain committed to Luthin and Luton is just as correct to want to see somebody who isn't exactly all there with it to... Is Lillthin correct?

In a way he is. I mean, when you see Vell, where it's very purposeful, when she sees Sintz's dead body, she's the leader, she's supposed to be getting them out of there and she's just so distraught. Frozen.

frozen and they have to like pick her they're like, yo, we have to go. I'm like, I don't think it's the show saying that Luton is right, but there is a level of like, there's a reason Luton is keeping them separated. It's a, yeah. It's really interesting. I think the show does a great job of blending the micro

and the macro because you have the scene with and or and the contact on Gorman. And the guy's like, we got to go. And he's looking at you like, yo, I'm not built for this. Like, I promise you. And the dude is like, you're just going to let him kill him.

You can let him kill us? I'm like, no, but that's kind of, you know what I mean? Like, you guys are going to settle down. And then Luton, oh, sorry. And then you have the big portion of it where she's, I mean, obviously, she's been through so much. And all Andor wants to do is protect her. But he knows how independent she is. He knows what he's all about.

And so when he finds out that Luton talked to her behind his back and he didn't tell him that, He's like, yo, what's going on? I'm doing this. I'm running here. I'm running here. It's like he wants to protect everybody in his orbit. He wants to protect the galaxy from the empire. But when you're in war, when you got to start sacrificing stuff, you have to make calls that he's not ready to make that Luther is.

You know, it's interesting. The war hasn't started yet. They're terrorists. Right. Right. So it's- Or freedom fighters. one man's

let's not have that conversation at a number six hey hey I don't want to get into it I have my own thoughts okay

and so terrorists resistance whatever you know the show is obviously litigates that

and obviously if we just there's no way around it we litigate that question in the real world all the time in our actual world all the time.

You can make an argument that this nation was founded by terrorists who decided to organize and rebel. You could argue that the Boston Tea Party is a terrorist action, okay? Whatever. But the reason why that's important to talk about is because the fact that there's no centralizing structure to the rebellion just yet, it ratches up the intensity for everything that they're doing. It makes every single small mistake, like much, much bigger because there's no transport that's going to come in and give you air support or air cover.

There's no, there's no, you have no backup coming, right? So there's no like a situation, hey, we're clearing this room in this place somewhere. they're 12 more enemy, 13 more, 14 more, 50 more enemy than we thought. Air support, air support, air support. They're not that organized at that point. You fuck up, we die. We die. We don't get this chance again.

The empire re-fortifies. They change the way they're doing their thing. And our mission objective is lost in perpetuity. So then you start to kind of think, well, Luton is definitely right, right? Then you look at it. The whole fucking show, it gives you Bix and it gives you Cassian. It gives you Sinta and it gives you Vell. It gives you all of these deep connections and you know why they're forged.

So you leave it not sure who you think should be right in the situation. I mean, what I think the genius of the show is, is like, what we're seeing is that Luton is almost, the leader that the rebellion needs to get started. And I feel like they're showing us Mon Mothema might be the leader that gets them to... Because what Luton is basically saying to Bix is like, hey, yo, look, like, we're probably going to die. But at least if we die, we'll take a lot of these motherfuckers with us. He's like, I don't even know...

He seems so closed off where it's like he can't even dream of himself winning a rebellion. It's almost like he signed himself up to be like, I'm going to die and most of y'all are. the foundation and y'all are going to die, we're not even going to see the thing that we're fighting for. Let's get out. He's a sicko, too, because when he's talking to Cassian in episode six outside his shop, and he's like, I, Bix told me you talk to him.

He's like, well, I'm disappointed in her too. It's like, brother man. Come on, have some shame. It was also, like, kind of brilliant because he didn't come to Bix to talk to her, not without compassion. Like, he wasn't an asshole, too. Nah, he wasn't. He wasn't.

No, he was on a minute. He was checking. He was on the, There's a thing that he was in every single movie. Yeah. When the OG comes in, SCs like someone's like, like he's in the throes of addiction,

becoming a crack at and shit. And he's like, God damn, becoming a crack hit. I felt for bix, but at the same time, I was like, like,

man, we got to get her off that stuff. Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, let me just get her all the drugs. That stuff, man. First of all, first of all, I was worried. It's always an old ass.

Stop, put down the drugs. Let my, let my girl get a little, you know what I'm saying? She's been through a lot. You want her high on the mission? All right, first of all, first of all, first of all.

She had a business. Let me break this down. Let me break this down. The rebellion don't got no like fucking therapy. No, like, no, she can't go talk to anyone. She can't go to the park. There's no mental health plan or some shit. First of all, I don't disagree with you, by the way,

and I have a lot of space for people dealing with addiction. But I'll say this. Probably not a good situation to have somebody who's so close to a very important person. as Cass in the Endor is, dropping the drops and getting low. She was getting low. I was just worried for my girls all. No, I was worried for my girl, too.

It's like, Bryce and Taylor literally has a song about this. Well, it's a call. Jesus Christ, this guy. Don't get too high. Don't drink too much. Don't smoke too much. I was just like, first of all, it was looking a little crazy when they did the,

like, when they came back into her apartment, and she was just eating Cheetos. It's like that scene of euphoria where Zanddea's just been in bed, for like, what, 24 hours watching Love Island. And it's like, wait. Now I have to ask, how do you think Luton would handle Rue from Euphoria? No, he was going to do.

She would have got a lot of motherfuckers. A lot of people killed. The first call Luton would have made, just been like, hey, Senta, I got you got a hit. That's right here. Just make it quick, make it easy. Get out of here. I would like to see Luth in different arenas.

Luton as coach of the Lakers. Like Luton. He's just basically JJ. They miss one assignment. Like, hey, yo, blow it up, bro. Blow it up, bro. Blow this whole court up. Forget this, man.

If you could take Luton and put Luton into a real world situation for him the actual soft problem, where could we best... What's the best place? What's the best place for us to use Luton in the real world? I mean... I mean, there's an answer. You don't want Luton. You don't want Luton as your president, guys.

No, you don't want Luton as your president, guys. No, you don't want... That's not the answer. No, it is not. This is fictional, but I would love to put Luton in the original Avengers. Could you imagine, like, Tony can't put on him sniping? And he's like, motherfucker. But I would say that Nick Fury kind of is a Luton, no, right?

No, but Nick Fury, I don't think they're scared in it. Like, no one, like, there's like the angry dad, and I feel like Nick Fury is the cool dad. Luton is like the angry, like he's like. I'd be afraid of Lufth. I think, yeah, I mean, they are two sides of the, two sides of the same coin because while Lufthin's like, I'm going to die, we're all going to die, but the mission is going to get done.

Nick Fury is basically like, look, as long as I'm here, the world's going to continue to spend, right? We're going to act like it's going to continue to spend. Right. It's two different people. Luther's ready to, like, lay it down. Nick Fri's like, we got options. We're always going to keep this thing over.

And Nick Fury comes through with the very paternal, like, I love you guys, pep talk. Yeah. When Lutthin's pep talks are not like that. Not at all. PEP talks, you don't want Luther's Pep Talks. No. It's a sunrise he'll never seen.

You know what we do? Like, if we like, Lutthin as a college football coach, right, pre-NIL pre-transfer portal. Yeah. Hey, we die on this field today. Right? Every single one of us. That's how you're injuring young boys. You're sending kids to the hospital.

We go, that's what I'm saying. No. You don't want that. In 1975, sure. Luther would have won 16. national championships.

Yeah. He'd be better than Bear Bryant. Question for you guys. Are the Gorman's plucky? A little bit. What's... Okay. A little bit.

How? What do you mean how? It's a little pluck. Because they're dressed like French spies in the 60s. No, no, no. They're not plucky. That's who will?

Who will? They really got... Dr. Susan figures. Like, it was a little cute. How? That's crazy. That's crazy. Am I wrong?

No, no. I wasn't thinking who? I was thinking... Gour is Hovin? Like that's why Cassian landed He was like Yeah,

Nah They don't get to I wasn't I was thinking That I thought it was I thought I thought

I thought I thought I thought I thought Her and her people were like Like the French people Of Star Wars

Yeah They're like French Yeah They're like Super duper French Yeah You know

Like her dad It's got like The French accent They're Braids True Yeah No no

I thought I thought that That was just Like Yeah they were the Twylex, but not as a people. Like, the Twylax have a whole

like continents and shit. Maybe Hera and her are like French. The Gormons, though, they got, you know, they got a lot of questions. They ain't ever done shit. They transformed shit into little spiders.

They got, they got the little spiders, they're dandies. They have one job and they can't do it. I want to say Plucky, though. I would just, because Plucky's people, they succeed. They get the job done.

Not necessarily. Unseasoned, I would say. Plucky people don't unseasoned, huh? Uh-huh. Plucky people. What is going on? So what I'm saying, okay, so I guess, okay, so let me say, let's not overuse plucky. The Gorman's are.

They're excitable. They're excitable. They're neophytes in terms of warfare. They are in over their heads. For sure. And they, and it costs. It costs our core. people. It costs

us center. It costs basically that mission was unsuccessful. It cost. I mean, it was absolutely unsuccessful because they know the way we know. Well, Cyril was watching. Searle was watching. And he was like, gas can clock that

shit. He's like, where'd you get that information? Exactly. Don't worry. Don't worry. It's tight. It's tight. It's tight. We just work. We just know a guy that works at the office. Cassie was like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Honestly, Drake's team could have used Cassian during the beef. You know what I'm saying?

The information. Why did you get this? So, rest in peace, Sensa, it's really tough. However, as somebody who's been watching television for almost 29 years, as soon as they showed up, as soon as it said to show up, I was like, I saw her. Oh, yeah. And they had the yin-yang. As soon as they started coming together, like, oh, man, he kept us apart.

It's like, oh, man, we're finally, we can be together. I'm like, well, well, somebody's talking. What happened to her in the year span? Do you think that she fucked up deep? Because when we last are, she was trying to get, she had the hit where she was trying to get rid of that motherfucker. I'm like, does something go down that? She had an accident.

She said she had an accident. Yeah. We don't, yeah, we don't know the exact answer. How's that working for you guys? Like, back to the core plight of the show. Yeah. The, the year off where we then get filled in through dialogue or exposition, which, by the way, very well done.

Masterclass in Mexico. Very well done, the exposition of the show. Is the narrative of the show suffering a little bit because there's so much that we miss in that year and then we have a small sample size of one arc and then we move on? Like, is there anything about it that's not worth? Well, I think yes and no

because, like, obviously, they do a pretty solid job catching us up. They're awesome stuff that we're missing, but hopefully they get filled up on the back end. But I was, and maybe this is just like me being silly, but I'm thinking about the second part of last year, or the first season, where we had the Aldani heist. Yeah.

And the God's eye and just like that entire thing. And it's harder to like do stuff like that when you're playing catch-up with characters every three episodes, right? It's one thing when we're like basically just following Cassian and Luthin, two characters that we know from the jump from the start versus, is all right, so it's been a year. Where has everybody been? Cassian's been here.

Well, now they're here. Oh, and then Luton is somewhere else. And Val is, like, you know what I mean? Like, we're doing a lot of catch-up. So with Cyril, too. Well, I thought Cyril was the best example of it. Yes. But I'm just saying a real story when you come into it

and you realize that, you know, he's talking to his mother. And he's saying all of these things about the empire that are negative. You're like, what's going on here? Yeah. Yeah. Like, you're like, it's been a year. Has Cyril changed in the year? His mom thinks that him and Deirdre broke up, but they really didn't.

Right. And so you know that spawns intrigue. And that's what I'm saying. The worst execution of it to me is big. Well. I think, but that's my thing is like it does a pretty solid job of catching all, but it doesn't allow for some of the more grandiose things that we liked or like we saw in the first season. And it's very hard because, again, it's a master class in getting people.

up to speed while still having semi-naturalistic dialogue. Like, the conversation that Cyril had with his mother in the third or the fourth episode catching us up on everything was, like, kind of amazing. But it's as if Bix, like, just had that last episode happen to her yesterday. And it can be illustrative of the fact that she's just been in a dark, emotional place for an entire year. And Cassian can't really connect with her like he used to. She's been using drugs.

she's like really wayward and Luthan doesn't know how to use her. That might be the only thing that we really need to catch up on from a strict plot thing. We're missing a lot of humanity when it comes from that. And I find myself the things that like actually work poorly in this season are actually amplified plot-wise and amplified in small character moments.

Okay. Rather than big, broad, emotional send-offs that somebody, I don't think we're going to get like a one-way-out speech that we got in episode whatever it was from season one. I don't think we're going to get something as big as Luthyn's like affirmation of like calm, kindness, companionship. Because these affirm the things that these characters are all about. Now this is kind of the work that's grinding them down into the things that they'll eventually die from.

I mean, I'll be so honest. I think this was the probably the weakest trio of episodes that I remember from Andor. And I think like I was talking to Arjuna when we were walking in. I was just like even weak Andor is still a phenomenal show. But I feel like the structure of it is like a lot for me sometimes to wrap my mind around where I'm like, okay, this is basically a three hour or a three and a half hour movie. There's a year in between. But I think what we're talking about is I'm like, to me, not much is,

really happened with Bix. So I'm still thinking when it's her storyline, that it's only a few weeks later, versus Cyril, where I'm just like, a lot has changed for Cyril. And I think that, like, going back and forth, it does take kind of a whole episode to be like, all right, remember, it's a year,

it's been a year later. Bix has probably been on these drugs for a fucking while. They're not going to explain it. But I also think, honestly, if I'm talking about my feelings about this trio of episodes, while I like the ideas and there were great moments in it, This was the first time I was feeling like the three-episode mini-movie. Was it working for me because the middle section was so doughy?

And I was just kind of like, wait, like, let's get this. Let's get the show on the fucking road. So I agree. But the problem is that I don't even know what I wanted to happen is the issue. So I understood there was, the show relies on tension building. Yeah. Right? because it's not a war show, right?

It's not a show, it's not Rogue One, even though it's Roe 1's companion. Rogue 1, which I've revisited several times. It's like, there's a lot happening to Rogue 1 all the time. It's a war movie, right? It's not a war show. This is an espionage thriller,

which means the central thing that is at the core of whatever is driving the episode tranches has got to be filled with this incredible intrigue and this high-stakes poker-type emotion. And the Gorman stuff just kind of didn't get there for me, right? It didn't. And also I was confused about stuff because Tarkin's fucking plane already landed on the Gormons.

That's all right. I wanted to ask about this, because I had to go on Wikipedia and shit like that. I was just like, oh, I thought that that was what we were leading to. Are they saying that there was, was already a Gorman Massacre and there's about to be a second? Let me tell you something.

I am a moron because they've been changed this. The Gorman Massacre, Arjuna, you can jump in whatever you want and help for a change. What was that? Jesus Christ, man. He had a great conversation about this and he's just sitting back there letting us fumble around and fuck around with it.

The Gorman Massacre in Legends, that was the Gorman Massacre. Okay. Him landing his plane on top of the protesters, right? That was the thing. They've already changed that, though. It's not the thing now. When did they change it?

Right. It's different. Okay. Give it to us, Arjuna. So the massacre, the landing is the thing, like you said, Van, that happened in Legends. That isn't here. There was a smaller massacre that happened. That's the monument that's in the plaza that they talk about.

That is a thing that has happened that they referenced throughout these episodes. But then there's something that we still haven't seen yet. that will be, I guess, the bigger incident that we're assuming, by the way, there'll be the bigger incident that activates Mount Mothma and really organizes the rebellion around fighting. I mean, the other thing that when we're talking just kind of about the show and the structure of it, do you think it was a little bit easier for us in certain parts of season one? Because they were doing genre exercises where it's like it was a prison escape.

There was a prison escape. There was the heist. You know, it was like even the first trio of episodes was the, all right, how did you become a spy? Or it was like a very James Bond. That's the point. The point is those things were very clear. I apologize for it.

Those things were very clear North Stars that would then, they were elastic. They would stretch across the three episode tranches. And the Gorman stuff in this three episodes, it didn't. Not for me. By the way, we're nitpicking because we're podcasters

what I watch was it was good TV yeah but what I'm saying is it didn't it wasn't there wasn't enough I wasn't like by episode three where they're pulling off the highest I wasn't like

oh my God is this going to be it was it was this stuff happening I have a question do you guys think that Cyril knows he's getting slutted out no probably not no no no not at all interesting question

because DJ the way what he's just like he's like, oh, am I going to fuck this up if I say this is the best day of my life? And then Deidre's like, but she gives him the love like. It's crazy. He's so happy, man. He's so excited. He's just like, he's such a puppy for her.

She's like, yeah, man. Yeah, this is good. This is all good. This is, you're going to be all right. Don't worry about it. Like, it's very much like, they are going to let hang him out to dry when this is all over. Is that why the Dejur tried to get his mom out of it? He's like, I got to get her out of here.

I think she also, I mean, she also annoyed by her. You can also probably extrapolate that like he probably wasn't going to back down from like being all lovey-dovey from his mom. So he's just like, all right. So we just tell your mom we broke out. I mean, there's also the scene with the maister where he's talking to Deidre. And he's like, you're walking a very thin line here. You know, this entire thing is very, you're doing a, you're walking a tightrope. Like, brother, I think she does like him to some extent.

but the job comes first. Yeah, no. I mean, do you, I, maybe I misread the scene when he finally reunites with her, and he's like, yeah, we got an hour. And he was like, that's it. I thought he was ready to be like,

yeah. She's like turned off the lights. I was like, yeah, hey, good for them, man. And then leave, but, you know. You know who, what two characters in Star Wars might hate each other the most? Mom, Mothma, and Krennick.

Oh, it's so. good. That's so juicy. That stuff was phenomenal. That scene was fire. That stuff was phenomenal. And they got our girl just trying to install the bug and she's just like bleeding from her hand because she can't. Trying to take it out. Or try to take it out. Yeah. That was fucking awesome. I feel bad for my guy.

I love that. And they're just like debating about like this was a massacre. That dude, Lottie was fine for his life. Lottie is the, uh, it was a Lottie, right? Lottie. Yeah. Lottie or Lonnie. Lani. Lani. Lani is the serial of the rebel. He's the bitch. He's the serial of a rebellion. He's getting fucked over. Every time somebody's shining on someone, they shining on him. Hey, don't say shit.

And when I say move left, move left, motherfucker. Wait, what's that woman's name, the brunette? Kay something. Who's trying to get the bug at it? Oh, Caleb. Caleb? Because I would just say, if I was lying, I'd be like, sis, I'll do whatever you want.

To the right. Oh, pretending to the front tonight? All right. She said no more. Souter. Caleb was even like, she knew that he's the bitch of the rebellion. Because when credit comes over and he's just like, so what makes this so special? He's like, yeah, yeah.

Lottie. Tell her me. I was like, yo, she's a cheap. Yeah, she's trying to make him look good in front of the boss man. The critic and the critic and my mouth of the stuff is really why I love the show so much. Yeah. Because that is. is legitimately

they are through dialogue you have in that scene you have the dialogue between those two you have somebody on the other side of the room that has an op that's like executing that op as they are talking and it's going poorly and it's going poorly they are litigating through dialogue

in scene the ethos of the rebellion yes the essential thing that we've been talking about terrorism versus resistance versus how much slaughter is enough slaughter for order versus how much slaughter is enough slaughter for freedom? What is crime? What is, like, and I was just like, oh, to your point,

I do think even when maybe the show I feel is like a little bit slow, they always have these scenes, whether it's Mon Mothma in Krennick or Cassie and Luton, where I'm just like, they're constantly guiding me like, this is the show. Like, keep the North Star. And I felt like even the tension between Mon Mothma and Krennick is stuff that I feel like we never really get, especially

in the first trilogy, because the rebellion and the empire are already so far apart. And I think the genius of Andor's, it's like, we finally get to see these people in these rooms. We get to see, like, the conversations that end up leading to a galactic civil war. Right. It's like, you know, when you watch

the Empire Strikes Back, there's a secret base on Haft. When I was a kid, I would ask a question, like, how'd they build that? Yeah. I would literally ask, I'd be like, okay, so Hoth is a remote winter planet. How did they build an entire secret base on there without the empire knowing and like why? Right.

And, you know, a lot of those questions when you will go back and read extended universe stuff, like the legend stuff, they would answer stuff like that. But this show is answering questions like that. It's answering questions of how you do something under the nose of a police state. what you have to sacrifice in order to do it. So that's the kind of stuff that, like, really works for me. Will Lonnie survive? I don't know. Will Lonnie be someone?

I'm not a lot of these guys. Yeah, the closer, the more episodes we watch, I'm like, wouldn't it be great if we just cut to the next year and Lonnie's just dead for some reason that we don't even know? Like, Lottie's doing his best. They found Lani out. And, I mean, the one thing to your point, because I think it's a really good one about,

just in terms of this show answering a lot of the questions that you have as a kid when you're watching that first trilogy is the saw stuff. His name is Wilman. That nigga Saw so crazy, bro. It was like Saw the man, bro. This was a good

saw trot. I think this was the weakest part of the whole thing. Oh, for real? No, no. No, no. I'm by the end, no. When he's the Rydodium and they're getting high and they're like,

I was like, all right. But I liked everything before that. I thought that she was funny as fuck. I was, I just didn't under, I mean, I got it, right? But I'm like, the other stuff was just infinitely more interesting. Right. And while I do enjoy Saw as a character, it's kind of like a wild car, somebody's going to come in and just completely mess up a plan,

basically he, the Joker of the Rebellion. I'm also like, man, where are we, where is this going? Well, but here's the thing, this is why I think that the act of putty, when so much of the, this trio of episode, is both the empire and the factions of the rebellion having too much access, not being organized enough. And I think what Saw you realize is that Luther is, Luton is coordinating so many people. He doesn't know how valuable this engineer is.

He doesn't actually value him to the extent where Sa is just like, this is a guy who is smart enough to get us unlimited fuel. And what have we been talking about? Hey, how did they build this base? how do they get fuel for all of these fucking fighters? It's not like they can just go to the gas station and fill it up. They don't have, and I was just like, oh,

it not only is it interesting to see Saw being like, hey, I love Luthyn. We can work together when we want, but shit, I'm still going to steal from him and then on top of that to give the engineer, like to me that engineer character woman is like,

he's really not indoctrinated into the rebellion yet. He's just doing stuff. He's just doing stuff. He hasn't gotten the Luton casting can talk yet. Yeah. And Saw recognizes that. And Saw is like, you see in the scene, even if it's a little goofy.

I can form him. I can form him. And in that moment, it's like, not only do I want him because of what he can give me in terms of the fuel. Yeah. I can indoctrinate him and take an important piece away from Lutheran. And I'm just like, oh, this is why the empire is running circles around them because they're not working together at all.

And Saul and they, Saul will never work with him because Saw's nuts. And like every single scene that Saarerera is in, it's ridiculously high leverage. You're like, what's he going to do? He's so unpredictable, like, what the fuck is going to happen? Steve, you were going to say? And that's the beauty and genius of that character and, like, incredibly performed by Forrest Whitaker.

But, like, I am really, really intrigued at how informed we are because we know him from Rogue One and how fucked over he was when we meet him in that movie to where he's just this used tool of the rebellion. And at this point, he's now this kind of agent of chaos that's kind of actually useful but dangerous. And I really want to see what happens in these next few episodes because obviously he's going to be a lot more important

in these final three. But to Jomi's point, I felt like it was kind of the weakest part only because it felt a tiny bit out of place because he's the fly in the ointment, because he's the thing that actually kind of gets in the way of order and organizing, which the rebellion so desperately needs. He's good at his job,

and he's incredibly well executed performance-wise, but it shoved in at the end of these few episodes. I was like, oh, where are we going with this? Yeah, I think when it all comes together, I think it'll massage and make it better, but just on the surface, just again, watching these episodes and everything going on, like, I get like, the scene where he shoots, oh boy, in front of him, right? Because he teaches him how to do it.

And it's like, oh, actually, I can trust you. That guy has information. He's a spy and he has a relationship. I thought the other guy was going to get killed. Right, yeah. Really? Or not willing him? No, I knew the white guy.

Once he's trying to ask him too many questions, I'm like, yeah, he's done. But when Saul was like, you've taught him everything, I was like, okay, well, one of these guys is expendable. Yes. It's redundant to have him both. Yeah. So I was wondering who was going to get killed in that situation. But even the same. scene after that where Saw is basically going,

hey, I have to kill him. You guys, let's see you guys know. He's the proof that he was a spy. But we will, and everybody's going, eh, I like Saul so much. I like him when he's on the screen. Saul's nuts. He's a completely unreliable,

rebellious zealic. And I just like, I don't give a fuck type guy. Like, I like that. I think I'm fighting to save the day. I am not the type of dude where it's like, when he started talking, he's just like, we was in the jungle and all. And everybody was freaking out.

And Steve was, I was just like, let this engineer do his job. He's just like, ranting. I wouldn't, I'm sorry. Like, yeah, I'm Ra, Ra, I'm with the rebellion too. So like on on. I wouldn't, I would have been like, I'm not following this month. I need to get like this. I need a shower.

I need a. So, Biggs has to die. Wait, whoa, has to. Well, they all have to die. They all, I guess they all do. This episode... It's a friend or obviously. Well, he eventually does.

Yeah, but not in the 12 episodes. This episode kind of makes me... The big story is both incredibly fascinating to me, and it started to lose its steam a little bit. They really got it back at the end. Where her and Cassie went on the op together, they were cool. You saw what she could do the whole.

whatever, but because we know that he goes through Rogue 1 solo, and almost has a little daliance with Jen Erso in a way. Not really, but, you know, there's a connection there.

Does it in any way mute what's happening with Cassian and Biggs? I don't think so, but I mean, we talked about it earlier. Just like to see, like, we understand that she's going through some stuff with like the PTSD Steve from getting brain blasted at the end of season one

and everything that happened in the first part of season two is just like complete and utter like broken her down and so she can't even sleep, right? Start taking drugs and you, like we love this character. Like this character of Bix we have fallen in love with over the, what, 18 episodes that we've seen of her. And to see her like this is just, it sucks, right? Because we know how capable she is.

We know how ferocious she is, right? And to the point, to your point of, we know this doesn't end well for everybody, right? How can we like see our character come back from how low she is right now, knowing that at the end of the day, it probably doesn't all come together. It's just a bummer. Well, I was also confused. At the end, am I supposed to take it that Luton realizes that the fastest way to get Cassie into fucking focus

and potentially Bix under the fold is to give them a mission where she can get revenge. Or was this, or was I, maybe I missed something, or was I supposed to understand that maybe they went a little road. I think they went independent for that.

Well, there was a, they got the mission. The light. Oh, that's true. So the light was flicking. The light was flicking, so they got the mission. So the mission came in from someone.

So I think it might have been looted being like, I think what potentially happened is when Cassie and, is about to crash out and is about to blow the fucking whole thing by showing up. Lutton's already showing up at his art gallery.

Crazy. Lutton is already like, I almost got found out by the fucking bug. Like, I don't even know if he knows about Sinton Bell yet. Fucking mom, Martha's like, how's my, how's my, fucking, my cousin. My cousin, he's like, fuck your cousin. We got that shit happening.

I took that as Luton is like, the easiest thing for me to do is to give him a little bit of a little. which I thought was interesting, but that was far more interesting than watching Bix go through it for two episodes. I was just like, well, right, we get it. But it's a direct mirror from how much she went through it

at the end of episode three. Like she was at her lowest then. And now this is the best that can happen for her now. She gets a lick back now. And then in the subsequent year or time jump that we have, where is she going to be? Is she going to be better? Is that going to be enough to get her back

on track. The show's so good because episode four starts and Bix and Cassie are living like this fake clandestine life, you know what I mean? Like they're going shopping, they're going on walks and stuff. And both of them are like, again, we know that they're

again, terrorists, right? They're on Coruscant, which by the way, enormous planet to where you can just kind of be like, yeah, we bombed a couple places, but we'll come to this place with all the Jedi and stuff and just like that. Well, they said that Coruscant's the

It's the frenzy and the chaos, of course. That makes it easy for it to hide it. That's how big it is. But even when they're pretending, even with they're pretending to play house, it's still like Cassie can't go outside without a little, little thing. She's like, I want to go to the park today. He's like, not the big one you don't because they got cameras and everybody out there. I've been Cassie and in a relationship.

She's like, can we get some towels for their apartment? Can we get some flowers? And when I was at my brokis, I'm just like, hey, yo, I got to line some shit up. kick, you relax. I was just like, we will make it look nice later. Right? He's due to. Well, he was trying.

He was trying. Yeah, yeah. We're not tomorrow. Hey, Cassian. I felt for him in that moment. I was just like, Bix, you should be able to go to any park you want. I'll take you. Forget about Cassie.

But also with Cassie, I'm like, Cassie got a lot on his mind. He's waking up. You got the blicky in your hand. He's like, see, I kind of got on my nerves. Because I was thinking, we're trying to say the Galaxy. And you're talking about going to the park. Like, that's like, is the. She's strung out on drugs and she's like kids shit.

Like, can we go to- Oh, man. Saji-Saji. Don't do that. Don't do that. Saji-Sagey. I'm sure Cassian would love to go to the park right now and relax, kick his feet up. I'm just looking at it like, why they got her saying, can we go to the park?

Because she's emotionally distraught and on drugs. All right, man. Also, look at that, look at that fucking apartment. They got them in the fucking. Yeah, bro. They're in the Bronx, bro. All right. All right.

Don't say that. The Bronx is a very beautiful place. They got beautiful places. They got, they're in the Bronx, man. They got, they. That's a nice view, though. They got, you know, I guess they in the bus. You can see the Jedi Temple all the way over here from over there.

Yeah, they're in the projects over there staying in a goddamn, like, he leaves. She cleans up. They got bigs down bad, man. It was also when. But that's the point, though. That's the point. She's like, why'd you come over here, Ruth? Just ask the question.

He's like, shh. That was hard, that was hard. That was hard. The meeting, upon first reading, the Luthan coming to the apartment and talking the Biggs, when you first saw the scene and you didn't have the context for everything, because Cassian really breaks down, like, why Luton would do something like that.

Like, it's really through Cassian and Luton's conversation that we get a deeper meaning of that scene. When you first watched it, what did you read that as being? I thought it was the same thing from the jump. Which is, I come to scope out and make sure she's on a level. Because, again, we saw in the last three episodes, as soon as TAY even a little bit was getting a little off the rails. It was like, she got to go.

Now, I don't think he would, like, kill Bix on the spot. But Lutthin is so meticulous. He's growing paranoid too. Yeah. He's like, I need to make sure all my ducks are in a row. Hey, it came for a visit. I can't stay for a drink. Just wanted to say hi.

Ooh, what's this? You want that stuff? Ah. You know what I mean? Like, he's very much just trying to make sure. Didn't bring it up by the way. way. Didn't bring it up. They like saw it.

But that's, Luke is becoming a leader though. I mean, Cassian is becoming a leader because he's like, I know how this mother. Like, she's like, calm down. He's not thinking like that. And Cassie was like, you don't understand how this motherfucker is. Like, thanks he's.

And that's the genius part because not only is him showing up to that apartment checking in on her, checking in on her, it's his lack of an assessment for her and like not giving her a mission and not telling Cassian a wake up called a Cassian being like, hey, I saw her, I didn't give her a mission. I know she's going to talk to

you about it. Come see me when you realize how much of a problem this is. Like, that's like passing a note to him through someone else. Like, I think it's genius. Does Cassian trust Luther? No. And I think, but I think what is actually happening is Cassian is actually slowly becoming more like Luther. Right. And I think That is what makes him Lutton's biggest asset. And it's probably why Lutton gives him the mission to be like, Bix is still useful if she's useful to Cassian. But I do think what I loved about this episode is this slow realization of when we get to Rogue 1,

casting at that point is as emotionally. He's empty. He's just mission accomplishing. He's Luton at that point. He kills a guy at the beginning. You're like, am I watching the Star Wars movie? Yeah, exactly.

And I think, like, this part of this project is like, How do we break this character down? Because, like, if I'm going to be honest, this was the, these six episodes, I was like, Luton kind of has to die. Like, Luton, he's becoming almost too paranoid. Where it's like, he's even, he's yelling at Clea. He's too much of her thinking out, bro.

We have all these things. We can't keep it together. I'm like, bro, y'all. I was like, bro, thanks, man. Clay on top of her stuff. I will also say, but I've been a Luton in the situation where, you know, your boy comes to you and he's just like, you was talking to my girl?

Did it all? You did it all? I was just like, nigga, she thinks she's cheating and like, I had to keep it. I was just like, fuck. I'm like, relax. Yeah. I guess for me, looking at it,

this was, these three were a lot about the relationships between the people. Yes. And I thought the Cassian Lutheran scene where Cassian comes to Luthan's shop is one of the most useful sunnings

I've ever seen in a show. Yeah, that's fair. You're sonning him, but you're suiting him not even in a paternal way. He says little shit. Like, I was disappointed in her,

disappointed with you, and his lack of control that you're showing right now. You realize that you can ruin everything. But he's saying it, he's going in and out of his Luton counterpart character. He's sometimes I'm talking to Kathy and as Luthan, the leader of the rebellion. Sometimes I'm talking to Cassian as Luton, the fucking owner of the shop.

He's going in and out of it, but he is making a crystal clear point is that, like, you ain't got no likes, you ain't got no wants. We don't have any of that. The only thing that we have is the finish line. And you got to be willing to cut anybody's throat to get there or it's not going on. I mean, not to bring it back to what we were discussing previously, but do you think that that maybe is what? Sometimes when I watch Star Wars, that's not Andor, I'm just like, oh, this is so interesting. Because even if you look at the new sequel trilogy, so much of that was built on the emotional foundation of like, our heroes are going to do dumb shit for love.

Our heroes are going to do dumb shit for their friends. These are my friends, yeah. They're going to sacrifice everything, even mission accomplishment. If, like, you know what I'm saying? Like, Ray ended up kissing, spoiler alert, spoiler alert. For the worst movie in the franchise history? Ray ends up fucking kissing space Hitler and shit because Star Wars had, like, Star Wars, I feel like was always built up on that very, it's what our heroes do in everything, which is just

like friendship is the most important thing. Family is the most important thing. And I think what's interesting about Andors, it's kind of like, it's not, can you actually lead a revolution and have loved ones? Like, and you can, but in terms of, like, can you lead a revolution? And if it comes down to, are you going to pick your loved ones, or are you going to pick the cause? And if you throw that to the arc that we have on Gorman with those, like, wannabe rebels that, like, try to orchestrate at Heist, that try to, like, maintain a semblance of identity and decorum around their outrage, they can see. from the outside looking in that, oh, you're not willing to, like, actually sacrifice a part of your identity to win this.

You're just willing to be a family, hunky-dory, and if something gets in the way, you're going to throw a temper tantrum, because I told you not to bring a gun. This is actually, you bring up an interesting point, because I know it's been two years or, yeah, two years for Casson, but for us, it's been a week. and Cassian starting off with those rebels, Maya's rebels out there watching that disaster, then go to Gorman and said out, they're not ready. He's looking at Luton, like, bro, I don't know what you want for you, you dog. It's not, it's nasty out here. Lul's like, nah, man, we can do it, me.

You got to get the job done. He's like, brother, have you been outside? Have you seen? Nobinole point. The thing, like, this place is not what you think it is, bro. It's a mess out. And the only thing that he could possibly see is like, well, if it gets fucked up, it will burn very brightly.

and then we'll have people to watch this mess. Lutthin doesn't care. Like Lutthin's thing right now is he's an agent of chaos and what he's trying to get Cassian to see, he's trying to get Cassian to extrapolate victories from things that would be considered losses. Cassian has also lost a lot of people.

And being that he's lost a lot of people, he's very close to what it means for someone to lose and give their life for this cause. And he's still trying to protect people. Do you think it's the, he saw what happened on Therick's and he's just like, dog, this exact same thing is about to happen on Gorman. Why the fuck would you even send these people? Like, he's like, he sees it with Bix every day.

He's like, why would you want to basically push them into their planet and their culture being destroyed? And Luton, it's like, you're thinking too small, man. Luthin is thinking every single day that people are allowed to concentrate on getting to and from work, that they're allowed to concentrate on going to the supermarket. And there's not a headline that says this happened here or this happened there. Every single day that they're allowed to get used to the status quo in the galaxy is a day that they lose. Yeah.

He would rather them have to think about and intellectually negotiate a huge, huge, huge slaughter on Gorman than he would be them just being able to have dinner and get used to life under the emperor. And Casson's not there yet. He's not there. He's seen it. He's been around it. He has it. He's not to the point to where he could give the one way out speech to somebody yet. He's not there yet.

He's, we're still watching him get there. He'll get there, and it'll probably be to our point after he loses a little bit more. I mean, how much more can this money? All he has left at this point is bics. He don't even ask about the engine. If they touch B2 emo, he's like, fuck, him up. We haven't even seen. Where was bro?

Where was bro? I think, if I'm going to be honest, I think Cassie has been trying to get rid of B2 emo for a while. No. He didn't even bring him up. That's fine. I don't want him near any of this harm. I'm going to start crying. Don't do that, man.

That's my son. I think they're benching B2 emo purposefully. Because I think that Gilroy is trying to do to us what Luton is trying to do to Cassian. I think that we're Cassian, the audience. They don't want us to feel. They just want us to watch a bunch of people blow a bunch of shit up and be like, yeah, this is what we got to do

for Luke Skywalker to finish. job. I want to be too emo. I mean, before we wrap up, I miss my son. I know I get it from an artistic standpoint. Death happens fast.

You're not supposed to expect it. I felt like the death of Sinta was a little bit. Like I'm like, I could see it coming from a mile away, but it felt rushed because we had not actually spent that much time with her. And that was what,

when you're talking earlier about, does the year mark, like, does the year in between, do we lose some shit? I'm like, I'm a I'm a I'm a man shout out to my uncle Charles man rest in peace of Charles Stewart so my uncle Charles is in Vietnam and I remember I I watched this Vietnam movie and I'm going back and we go up to his crib and he

man was the perfect country crib he had you know his dogs his hunting dogs there he had a nice little spread we ride the three wheeler and run there and a whole done and I was in there I was seeing all of his awards and stuff. He had had like a bunch of different things, being injured and all of that. I remember I said to him, I said, because I watched this movie and it was about everything in the jungle that would kill you when you used in Vietnam.

I was like, obviously the VA Kong will kill you, but like disease would kill you and all of that stuff. And so I asked him, I was like, what's the most dangerous thing when you are out in Vietnam following? You know his answer was? Unfollowed orders. He said the most dangerous thing when he was a soldier

was unfollowed orders, people not doing what they were supposed to do because it had a downstream effect on everybody else and what everybody was doing. And when I saw, like, sent to die with somebody that wasn't supposed to have what they had,

I thought to myself, in a situation like that, the most dangerous thing is unfollowed orders, not doing what the fuck you're supposed to do. She died of unfollowed orders. I mean, Valencia had that conversation while they're planning. And it's like, I knew,

I already sensed it was going to be that dude, like the pretty boy. Because for the entire three episodes, that motherfucker kept talking when he wasn't supposed to talk. His daddy would be like, shut the fuck up. Everybody would be like, shut the fuck up. No, you can't have a gun. I'm just like, he's going to.

I wanted him to be forced choked. so bad. Do you, I would, I would have been mad if that I would have been like, I would like that too. The only thing that this show is missing is, is some force choking. Lightsabors, man. But like, because, because, no, no, no, no, no, no,

no lightsabers. No. But Vader, because Vader never used his lightsaber on other members of the empire. He would force choke the shit out of an empire person. Right. Because I was going back, this is an aside. They was talking shit to Vader. Oh, yeah.

I feel like he wasn't shit. Like he wants to see that guy. Well, because again, the Jedi are supposed to be like, Faye. All the fourth stuff is like, oh, it's a myth. They've been gone for a couple of years, and these motherfuckers was acting like, who's this crazy nigga, like Wizard Man?

Like, fuck this, nigga. Like, fuck that, nigga. You got to remember the Jedi and the four stuff, like, even before the fall of the Jedi order, it was still, like, kind of crazy to see a Jedi because they were very rare. It kind of doesn't make any sense because the only reason why I say that, first of all, they were very rare.

they had a big ass temple right now. Yeah. If you had been gone for like 30. And also there's literally like thousands of Jedi that we've learned of from all these cartoons, all these video games,

I've seen a Jedi. But this is the only thing I would say. Let's say it's two guys and they have the controls and one of them doesn't believe that the Jedi shit is real. Yeah. I feel like the conversation

would go like, hey man, you know, that Jedi shit, I don't even know if those guys really have powers. When they would be like, nah, fuck shit, no, bro.

Fucking rear album. Admiral Pauley, I seen him. Real Admiral Paulie, bro. I've seen him. I'm telling you, bro, the big, you know the big tall guy? And all black, the emperors do? With the cape. With the half robot?

Yeah, like the robot guy, yeah. He did like this. And real Admiral Pauly, he just choked out and died. You lying. I swear. I should you. He did it over Zoom. He did it over Zoom.

Swah God. I shit you not, bro. He just grabbed his shit and started fucking shit. And then he was, and what they do? What they do? Rear Abel Polly, man. Rear Apple Polly. I feel like those stories would be getting around.

Do you think Darth Vader ever, like, horse choked of, like, a freaky-ass nigga who was just like, he's like, he had stuff? See? See? I would have said it. You know what I would have said? What?

First of all, he ain't got a, he ain't got a peepee, so it don't already matter. Who, Vader? Yeah, it burned off. He wasn't, no, he's not about, choking for his pleasure. He's like, he's trying to rubber band him. And maybe that. maybe that empire lackey is just like that family guy bit yeah there's a literal family guy there's a family guy cutaway bit yeah yeah nah anyway so back to what we're actually talking about

val i mean we talked about a little bit vell in that moment like being shell-shocked right being frozen but her whole thing the whole time was man she fake luthan bro you know what i'm saying like she a fake demon because the whole time's like you got to be ready to die for it man you're ready to go man, like no matter what, we got six minutes. The whole thing, as soon as sister gets shot, all goes out to war. I mean, you're kind of, well, also, she might have been in love with her.

I mean, but that's the same. Live your laps, right? I'm not saying, like, obviously, I understand why Vail would, like, were you act that way, and I understand what she would feel that way, but she was talking about. She's not after back, though. But I won't say, also,

Sinta, R.P. since I miss you, but she was a little bit of a fuck boy, because she was, she was spitting game to Vell. She's like, you know, I've been through it. It's like, It's like loving basketball, you know you, you get injured. You start looking at that old one. Like, she held me down.

When you go to college, you come back for Thanksgiving break or spring break or start break and you see your old joints like, yeah, man, it wasn't the same without you. You know what I mean? Like I missed you, I was there. Yeah. What do you mean? Big dinner. Oh, yeah?

Bill O'Ganna, Oregona. Organa. My guy. Benjamin Brad. Benjamin Brad. Benborn. You're man Did Jimmy Smith pass away?

No Jimmy Smith is alive and well I looked this up actually because I was like That's not Jimmy Smith's I'm not crazy I was just like Has that always been? No it's not

I was like am I going on insane? That's racialism What? I didn't know they recast him I was just like He don't look like you're That's racialism That's not a racialism

Racism. That's not a racialism? No, whoa! That's a racialism. That's a racialism. You're doing racialisms right there. I literally, in that moment, I was just like, that don't look like my nigger, but I'm not going to question.

Oh, you know what's funny? You know what it's funny? It could almost be looked at as racialisms made you stop from asking the question because you go, because it could be like, if you ask, That's not the same guy, right? That could be looked at as a racialism as well. James if you do, Dave, if you don't. You damned if you don't.

So what happened was, and this is a couple of the people from Rogue One and other Star Wars stuff have been recast due to scheduling conflicts and financial stuff. So maybe they didn't want to pay Jimmy Smith to money or he just had something else going on when they were filming and or. But there's a couple of those characters who aren't going to come back. Will Bill O'Garna, will he be back? Yeah, he'll be back. but as Benjamin Bratt. Yeah.

So Jimmy Smith could come back for, you know, the layer show, season one or whatever. But right now it's going to be Benjamin Bratt because of schedule conference. I'm cool with Benjamin Brat. That's a good subject. I love Benjamin Brat, but I don't know. Well, yeah.

Benjamin Brat's an OG. He's a legend, but come on. And he's supposed to be a little bit. Well, no, because we've seen. There's only two years. We just seen that, dude. I know. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, we've seen them. It's interesting, though. Also, he got, like, what, three years left? So, three years left of, wait a me. Well, because so it's three BBI, right? Oh, yeah, yeah. I thought you were saying that Jimmy Smith had three years. No, no, no.

Am I going insane? I thought Andor has 12 episodes this season. No, no, no. It's got 12 episodes, but it's three BBI. Yeah. And they made this three years. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

They blow up, they blow up Alderon. So, yeah. Spoiler alert for a movie that came out 100 years ago, 1977. Before we rap two, I gotta be honest, I'm pro spoilers now. Fuck all this shit. Well, I mean, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. We're getting, we're getting, you're getting, you're absolutely correct.

Muffalo's getting mad that I, spoiler alert said that foggy die. Niggins there, we had eight weeks. We had, what, eight weeks of that shit. Like, if you didn't watch the first episode. So people wanted to wait. I'm so, I don't care. I don't care. I don't care.

I don't care. And, like, I was, like, I'm not MAGA at all. I wouldn't be very clear. but my most conservative take is be a grown-up, be an adult, take care of yourself, be responsible. If you're using your online, they're going to spoil stuff.

I'm sorry. Don't forget the podcast. If you are using the internet to listen to podcasts, to get news, whatever it may be, be mindful of what you're scrolling. Because, again, these are live events, right? The movies I can understand, right?

Movies is a whole different conversation. You've got to go to movies, the whole thing. Television, it's just, it's like, for me, it's like live sports. You're not going to be like, yo, yo, yo, don't talk about the liquor game. I don't want to, I don't want to hear what's going on. You wouldn't do that. Lock in.

Be responsible. I'm not, yo, daddy. This is, handle your business. Let me tell you something right now. This is all a part of the complaint currency of your generation. My fault. I actually agree. I'm not, I actually agree.

I'm not, I actually agree. My fuck is high on complaint. Because here's the thing, too. Back, I remember for a year, first of all, for years, motherfuckers didn't care. I get my haircut. Motherfucks were spoiling in the movie

that came out of this man. We talked about the movie from the fucking first frame of it to the last frame of it. Like, Hey, bro. Yeah, and then I was tripping because the motherfucker

shot him in the handle and that made you want to go see the shit more. But here's the thing, at the beginning of social media, the rule was by the, no, I remember the rule

being if it's a movie you basically got opening weekend. Yeah, exactly. At the weekend. Shit is good. Game of Thrones, all that. It's like night of. Stay offline.

We live tweeting the shit. I don't know where this shit has come from. Like, your spot, I'm like, bro, that shit's just two months old. That's a month old. I'm sorry. The crime about the succession spoiler is crazy. Movie came out like 45 years ago or the show came up. Like, come on.

Motherfuckus is like, you ruined the Sopranos. I don't know what to tell you, bro. Yeah. Roaring the Sopranos is crazy. This is crazy. But look, I was on it before. You guys are listening to two. He dies in the wire.

I'm sorry. He gets shot by Brother Mazzone. Omar dies. Gets domed in the head by a little kid out of nowhere. That's crazy. That guy, I don't kill you for the second. Nah, man. What was called?

Bruce Willis is always dead the whole time. Turns out the Terminator was a good guy. And what else? Oh, and obviously, Vader is Luke's dad. Sorry. Oh, Rosebud is the sled. Yeah. I don't care.

Right. What? Citizen King. I've been talking about that in a long time. time. That was in the 30s. Oh, and Kevin Spacey is the bad guy in real life and in the usual suspects. God damn. I like this, Jome.

I love this, Jomey. I love this. Jomi, Sporlorooney, Adiron. I love it. That's a wrap. This week on the Ring ofverse feed. The Ringerverse is deep on the last of us. But Nash will be with you on Thursday on Friday. Midnight Boys will give you their instant reactions to Thunderbolts. Our producer is Steve Almond, Jonathan Kerma, and Jomey Adiron on social. Hashtack

Spoiler Boy! I love that. spoiler boy spoiler boy karma what I'm so fucked up here I'm pleased to see the architect Alvin Jonathan Kerma Jomi the explainer of dinner on on social hashtag

Spoiler boy Additional production Marjuna Ramca pal Chuck We love us some spoilers The Gormans don't know ball Sintai I love you

Bix give me a call The thing I love about Jomi The elevates it is what Rick's a good. He will always be mad. Jummi gets so mad when somebody doesn't like something that he likes. Yes. It's not what I don't like it. Brother in Christ, it's the studio.

Why can't you like it? Again, it'll be like, man, if Steph Curry couldn't shoot, he'd be just a six-three dude. And it's like, what the fuck are you talking about? He's sick. Yeah. What does that mean? What does that mean? What do you mean?

What does it mean? That's what I said. The Wunners and the clever filmmaker. People don't realize. Steve, the real hater. What is that? Steve, you don't bring it to the show, but Steve, you got some spicy-ass things.

So, before we move on, because this is going to post-credits, this is over the show, the studio, which Steve doesn't like. Because of the stuff that it does that makes it different from other shows. It's a really good show. It's a really good show.

I haven't really watched it. I can only watch him just be like, so many times. I can understand not liking Seth Robbins character. You do be goofy. That's the whole goddamn thing. Brick boys? What you can do is be like, man, if you take away the stuff

That makes it cool. Listen, I hold stock like high and early. Like, that guy's great. People are acting their asses off. It's really fun. It can be. But I'm just like, this doesn't feel any more special than anything else that Seth Rogen has done other than Apple money. The tension between the brick boys recently has been crazy.

It's because you call this the brick boys. And then you're trying to put bricks in between us. No, I'm not. I'm not. I'm listening to you guys. Like, I'm listening. this conversation and I'm listening to this getting way too intense for no reason. I don't want to know.

Man, John Moran would suck if he didn't have crazy athleticism. I don't know if we need to have a brick boy's intervention. Yeah. I think we need to examine Jomey's blood pressure. It just, you take... Whoa! Again.

Because he gets way too geeky. Whoa. Way too upset. Now, Steve, I guess the question is, why would Jomey be predisposed to have high blood pressure? I didn't say he's predisposed. I'm saying that he's giving himself it. Let's go ahead and get into it.

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