The Ringer-Verse - Here Comes the Pitch: Award Show Bait | Mint Edition

Episode Date: September 16, 2025

Steve and Jomi join forces with Rob Mahoney to laugh, rant, and reflect on this year’s Emmy Awards. They break down the winners and losers, explore why fan favorites like 'The White Lotus' and 'The Bear' may have lost their edge, and predict what might win big next year. Later, they play a round of Here Comes the Pitch, where they share their own ideas for hypothetical shows, movies, and beloved fandom favorites that could earn prestige acclaim. Intro (0:00)Emmys Takeaways (4:00)Here Comes the Pitch (17:00)Outro (1:21:00) Hosts: Jomi Adeniran and Steve AhlmanGuest: Rob MahoneyProducer: Devon RenaldoAdditional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopowell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Hello and welcome into the Ringiverse, your Nexus feed for all things. Fandom, I'm Steve Allman. I'm Jimmy Dinner on. And we're no pleasantries right now. We're joined by the great Rob Mahoney with his wonderful sandwich takes. It's wonderful. They're terrible takes. Oh, thank you.

Rob is, I love Rob. Rob's one of my favorite people in the entire world. He's got bad chicken sandwich takes. Okay, let's relax. It's a bad take, Rob. Tell the people you'll take, Rob. Tell the people you'll take. My take is very simple and I think uncontroversial, which is a chicken sandwich.

should be chicken breast, not chicken thigh. And that's wrong. And it's cool that you're wrong. Here's the thing, Rob, and because, and this is how woke I am, I can overcome your bad chicken it takes. Wow. 2025 is really about sewing, sewing, soing, so of unity here. It's been a crazy time. We all got to come together.

And with that, I'm going to extend an olive branch because we also share a food opinion that I think angers a bunch of people, which is ricotta does not belong in lasagna. Get it out. Get it out here. The resolution is passed. We don't need ricotta and lasagna, best amount only. Exactly. Well, along with talking with sandwiches, we're also here to talk about the Emmys. The award show seasons and play a very fun game of here comes the pitch.

One of our favorite games that we do here on Mint Edition, joined by the great Rob Mahoney, writer extraordinaire, and podcaster extraordinaire of the WNBA feed. The NBA feed, excuse me so much. I mean, Rob, Rob, Bob, you be at the WNBA games. He went to the Spark game this year, right? I did not, but look, maybe I need to get into that world. Maybe I need to double my basketball intake. Dog, I'm telling you, the Spark games, they be crazy, bro.

They'd be fun, man. You got to end, man. You got to go, you got to come down. Next year. Next on the list. Because the playoffs, this is playoffs. They kind of stick. It's not going to make the playoffs.

But 2026, we're going to be good. Rob, don't worry. Come through. Okay, I'm banking on it. Not only does his basketball expertise come in handy here, but his prestige TV shops are also here as well, because he is also a co-host on the prestige TV feed with our beloved Joanna Robinson. and we're going to be talking about some great award show seasons roundups. But before we get into that, some great programming reminders for you this week.

Tomorrow, the House of Our is going to be giving you their alien earth deep dive with Rob on that very program. Love to hear that. How are you enjoying Alien Earth? Love it, love it. I mean, I'm an alien guy. I'm in my zone. I'm living and dying with the body horror. Let's fucking go chest burst me.

Well, the show is young. All right? The show is young. We'll get them dinner first. How about that? No, no thigh meat, though. No thigh meat. Absolutely no thigh meat.

No thigh meat, sir. Also this week, the Midnight Boys are going to be giving you their instant reactions to the season premiere of Gen V, as well as later this week. Button Match will return with their thoughts on Borderlands 4.

But today, we are joined to talk about the winners and losers of this year's Emmys, as well as play a little fun game. If here comes the pitch to bait for some awards show greatness in the world of fandom. But today, let's start with the Emmys. Rob, the Emmys were last night.

We've seen some of the great highlights and speeches. The studio swept and dominated with a bunch of wins, 13 nominations and pretty much 13 wins. Adolescence wins nine. Penguin wins nine as well. Severance wins eight Emmys and or wins five. What did you think about what the big takeaways were from the Emmys this year?

You're the prestige guru that we have on the pod here. What does this say about the state of prestige? TV. You know, not a lot of shockers. I think all the major players who came home with tons of awards that you just listed, all heavyweights. All shows that you would go into the Emmys expecting would come away with a lot of wins. The exception being, I would say, White Lotus, which whiffed in a bunch of different categories, especially in the performance categories, and The Last of Us, which also had kind of a controversial sideways season. Other than that, like, I'm not totally shocked by anything. The pit rules, adolescence,

could not be more deserving. The studio is not just good, but also Emmy Bate, in terms of its voting base, in terms of the subject matter, like all that absolutely tracks. My one knit, if I can pick one knit,

I love Slow Horses, wonderful show. Awarding the season four finale of Slow Horses for Best Direction over what Jessica Lee Gagné did for Severance, in what to me is the best episode of Severance ever,

I cannot go along with that. Other than that, like it's hard to fault too many of the winds. So here's the thing, Rob. I'm inclined to agree with you. Like, I'm, I think that what she did on that episode of Severance specifically is just like, just incredible television making.

We were all there. It was, it's an experience to watch that episode of Severance. However, I'm leaving here with something, right? And I love slow horses. And so I, you know what I'm saying?

Severance is always going to get its love. You know what I mean? And while, again, Jessica Lee, Gagne did the thing. I needed slow horses to come away with something. So, hey, you know, you hate it had to be her. You hate it had to be severance. You do.

But slow horses deserve to walk away with some hardware last night. I'm glad they did. If anything, I kind of took away from this year's Emmy wins as a kind of changing of the guard for the things that are bound to dominate in the coming years until something else dethrones it. The bear basically won nothing. It won zero awards this year. And regardless of what you thought about that season,

it's kind of a pretty big bellwether for the fact that a once darling for the awards, along with White Lotus, is kind of coming up empty-handed. Well, I mean, again, the first two seasons was something special, and I think this is, like, the nomination for season three. That's where you start to have, like, questions about, like,

all right, what are we kind of, like, what's the point of this whole operation? And you can tell just by how people talk about the last two seasons, we're kind of in a place where we like the bear, we enjoy the bear. It's still a really good, well-made television show. but it's not really the trophy maker that it used to be,

which is fun, which is okay. You can't all, you know what I'm saying? We can't all be Julia Louise Dreyfuss and VEP and win all the awards every single year. You know what I mean? Unless, of course, you're Gene Smart and you're playing Deborah Vance. I believe she's undefeated since tax began. Undefeated.

The closest thing we got to JLD. But even then, you know, you can be undefeated and still deserve more. And for my money, both of those queens deserve as, many of statues as you can give them. I think the issue with the bear is twofold one. You nailed it. It's been basically a not very great show, or at least not a consistent enough show for two seasons.

Also very clear, as you alluded to, Jomey, that voters don't know what season of the bear they are actually voting on at a given point in time, which seems like a bit of an issue. We've got to clear up the Emmy deadline so that we're not voting on a season of the bear, a full year in retrospect. Yeah. Steve, get your studio take off.

I thought that the studio might have taken away too many awards. this year. Again, as impressive as a show that that is technically, and as fun of a show as that is in spirit and in writing, like, a very star-studded cast, I could tend to agree that this is probably perpetuating the myth that Hollywood can't stop falling in love with itself, and then the voting bodies will reflect it in kind. While I think there is some real capital F filmmaking that goes on in the studio, I kind of walked away feeling unimpressed and knowing that, you know, Catherine Hahn walked away with nothing. I was kind of shocked. Because she was by far the best part about that show. Oh, well, that's just not true. I know it is. It is. Let's not lie to the people. Come on.

No, she was good. She was good. She was good. She was good. She was good. But, you know, the show was hooping. I think you are right about, like, obviously, a show about Hollywood is always going to get the nods because people love to, you know, look, Hollywood love to give itself

a little tug, you know what I'm saying? Like, that's the favorite thing to do. I don't know what you're saying. You wanted to explain that? Just a little bit like a, you know, it's a little OTP, you know what I'm saying? Like, just a little, just a little touch, you know what I'm saying? They love, they love, they love. Joe was alluding to Thigh me more and more this episode.

And I can't really, I can't really blame them. But am I lying, though? Am I lying? No, no, you're not. It's like the one thing Hollywood is known for. And so, like, when the steel came out and it was good, at least I think Rob and I can agree, the show's like, well, is obviously well made. And I find it hilarious, you know?

And so when I'm watching the show and I'm like, oh, this is really good. They're going to nominate for a billion Emmys. It's going to win a million and it's going to walk away on Emmy Night as the big winner. I was not surprised when I'm watching the show. And I'm like, winner, winter, chicken dinner. Everybody's getting their looks. I think Seth Rogan, if we had to like pick somebody as like a big winner of the night, he'd be one of those people.

I mean, what, best directing, best actor, best show. Like when they were on the stage, like after and they do the press stuff, They had like seven Emmys lined up. He had to set him down. There were too many in his arms to do the interview. Why can't I hold all these lime Emmys? He's looking like Braun after 2012 trying to hold all his MVP's. It's like I can't, I can't fit them all in my hand.

Just incredible. And so, yeah, while Steve and Dev don't like the show, guys, listen, the ball don't lie. The film don't lie. We're here. That's fine. And listen, congratulations on studio season two for its 12 Emmy wins. for next year. Well, I mean, it's got to repeat the performance.

Of course, of course. Needless to say. But the main takeaways that we took back from the world of fandom before we get to our fun game, The Penguin walks away with nine Emmys, major of which Kristen Milotti, as best actress in a limited series, well, well deserved.

I'm kind of aghast at the fact that as good of a showing as Andor had in the technicals, best writing in a limited series is probably the biggest one that it got. Rob, do you think that this show was at all shortchanged? was it just too stacked of a year against one of our favorite shows?

And or the penguin. And or? I mean, I think the fact that it's being nominated at all in spaces that do not respect genre filmmaking and television is an accomplishment in and of itself. And the fact that it would come home with anything to me feels like a win under the circumstance.

It's like maybe this is a defeatist mindset given that, you know, us, we the nerds have already won and this is what culture is now. Maybe we should also expect projects like Andor to come home with trophies too. But I'm willing to celebrate the way, that we do get on the penguin front,

I hope this is a safe space to admit that I, like Charles, I think, have not actually watched the penguin. Oh. Is this something I should make time in my life to do? I mean, I certainly would hope so if Nine Emmy wins doesn't persuade you. Yes, I, like, it's probably one of the more, it's, it's the mere fact that, like, not only was the work that Matt Reeves did on his Batman film,

a one-off, but his vision for what an ideal, genre space for Gotham as a TV show and as like a ongoing universe and experiment is genuinely worthwhile. Kristen Malati at the head of this, Colin Farrell, again short change, but adolescence was going to be hooping this year anyway. Yeah, that was going to be tough.

You weren't going to beat that. But Colin Farrell, a phenomenal performance and really like taking an elevating of interesting character choice in an otherwise great movie to genuine emotional heights. Did you like the Batman, Rob? Love it.

then please. What has stopped you other than 18 million podcasts about other TV shows? Yeah, you go. I think for me, I mean, look, some of it is just a logistical question of where where do you find the time? Some of it also is I'm just looking out at the landscape and I'm seeing the Dune prophecies pop up, the penguins pop up, and I'm like, how much of this supplementary IP do I need in my life? I'm going to make time for Andor. Am I going to make time for the penguin? And clearly it's been more of a wait and see it. I needed to see a little gold before I'm going to dive in. I think that's fair. Penguin, yes, Dune prophecy. Save you time, man.

Like there's, you know, NBA season coming up, you know, you know what I'm saying? Get ready for that. On the and or front, it was always going to be tough. It was always going to be tough, especially like in the best drama category. I mean, severance and the pit where it was like there was just too much momentum going that way. And so you just hope that, again, how I felt with slow horses, you just hope they walk away with something. And so Dan Gilroy got the Emmy for Best. writing in a drama. And I think that's obviously deserved. And I think that's, that's, we're

okay with that. Yeah, yeah. That's, that's fine. And it took away a handful of technicals, which we're very, very proud of as well. And frankly, again, I think that Rob it probably has the right mindset of a win as a win. And we take those. Take those. Because, like, for something that was probably one of the best things that Star Wars has ever produced in outright decades, this is a great recognition of that. And we're very, very happy. Yeah, if I'm thinking about the best shows that I watched, year and or is probably number one but obviously like there's just not enough people behind that to then give it the the push it needs to win like the best drama Emmy like it's just not how these things go and so with the pit and severance I mean severance and the pit specifically just

every week every Thursday or whenever those shows came out was just oh my gosh this episode of pit 2 p.m. oh my gosh severance did you see that mark blinked at this little point Oh, it was crazy. It was just like it was everywhere. You could not escape it. And yeah, those are always going to do numbers on, on Emmy Sunday. This is where we are with genre stuff, though, whether it's TV or a movie, is like the breakthrough hits, like true breakthrough hits are so few and far between.

And it's getting harder and harder to puncture through the noise to the point that even if you make something as great as Andor, there's a reason it has just like an evangelical audience. It's just like people begging their friends to actually watch this show. My algorithm is entirely people screaming into the void telling people to watch Andor. And thankfully, a lot of people watched it enough to get this Emmys push. But still, there aren't enough people that have watched Andor. Please God, watch Andor again and again and again. Keep watching that.

Before we go on, I'm curious as to see what things that you have been experiencing this year, Rob, that are easily in contention for Emmys next year. Even in the fandom space with what we have now with Alien Earth. Yeah. Anything else that's been standing out to you? Fallout has been getting a lot of buzz as well. For sure. Anything that you've been pinging us on the radar for for what a good

prestige Emmy push could be? Well, a lot of it hasn't happened yet. I think Alien Earth is going to be a great candidate, especially for the below the line stuff, but also maybe in the running for some great performances. Like there's some real heavy weights on that show. Bobby Sise comes to mind, Tim Aliphon, of course, I think could be in contention there. The summer's

been pretty dry TV-wise, and a lot of the stuff that we had early in the year, like I mean, White Lotus, Severance, the pit, those were all like January, February, shows. And so the best stuff that we're getting this year we kind of have yet to experience, task is just starting up. I would think Tom Pelfrey and Mark Ruffalo

for sure we'll get nominations for their performances. It's already been exceptional so far. We'll have to see the rest of the way. Like slow horses is coming back. I like you guys am always getting for more recognition for slow horses and I have it on good authority this season is starting out to be a banger. So I'm looking forward

to that. Other than that, like I don't know. Are we given the Glenn Powell show nominations? Like Like, what is actually... Are you watching the Glenn Powell show? Rob Joseph Mahoney, are you watching the Glenn Powell show? More important question. Will you be forced to watch the pilot and then subsequently bail when you weren't into it that much in the first place?

My plan is also to wait and see and avoid it all costs. Chad Powers doesn't move you? Chad Powers does not. The lowdown, however, does move me. And Ethan Hawk Emmy nomination that... Hey, now, let's start talking about the lowdown. Hold on. Hold on.

Rob said shows from genuine. in February are moving the needle. People are locking in. Those are winning Emmys. Guys, Lantern's going to win an Emmy. We're going to do it, guys. I mean, let's... James Gunn. He's going to do it, guys.

We're going to get an Emmy. We're going to do it. Does he change the Green Lantern's chant to clear highs, full hearts can't lose? That would be ridiculous. By Green Lantern's Light. Let's be serious, guys. Come on.

Let's take this, let's take this exercise here. All right, let's take this exercise. See, by actually going into this exercise, but we'll take a quick break, and we'll be right back. episode is brought to you by WeatherTech. Everyone knows winter is the MVP and making a mess. You don't need Weather Tech floor liners in the summer unless you hit the beach or go camping. Then you'd want a cargo liner or a road trip goes sideways, ketchup goes rogue, ice cream drips.

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Be a 2%er. Learn more at Wells Fargo.com forward slash active cash. Terms apply. And we're back. Here comes the pitch. Award bait season. I scared Rob with that one. I like that.

Awards bait season. This award show has been coming to a close, but now we are going to be throwing together some of our favorite pitches in the worlds of fandom that could make a legitimate prestige pull. So we're inviting us to both make up a whole cloth pitch for a either Emmy or Oscar-winning film or television show and or a fandom-based property.

be it video games, be it a book, be it a great comic book franchise that could potentially have a decent push for some prestige. Obviously these have been things that don't have a major adaptation before and things that are going to

be talked about our main directors or showrunners, the cast, give us a little plot synopsis and we could rib each other for how that show goes down. But mainly just print us a picture of a show you want to see, get a good Emmys push. How are we feeling? about this. Love it.

Feel great. Okay. Wonderful. Rob, you're the guest of honor. How about we start with you? I'm going to start with something that has been clamored for. The people want this. Okay. You know, the rumors are constantly swirling. The cast or in this case, the voice cast is often asked

about whether, you know, like, what's the future of this particular property? I want a Batman Beyond adaptation. Lovely. Here's the thing. I believe, by my count, there are nine superhero movies that actually won an Oscar.

Okay. About half of them are Batman or Batman adjacent. Yes. And so I'm thinking, you know what? Like, look, I love Pattinson Batman. Batman doesn't have to be emo, though. I also love emo, but look,

like, we can have different strokes for different folks. And if we're going to have a DCU that's open to different interpretations, I don't want Batman Brave and the Bolt. I think that is the wrong vision for an alternative Batman. I don't want to look backwards towards some touchstone of what people think they want from the past. I want a version of the future that actually feels cool.

And can we accomplish that in 2025 remains to be seen. But I'm ready to make the pitch. Okay. Well, a far-flung future sounds pretty cool. I'm very curious. So Terry McGuinness, the titular character of Batman Beyond, we have an older Bruce Wayne. We have a young protege that has experienced his own family tragedy.

I mean, that's the thing. He's not exactly an emo Batman. He's kind of a jock. He's a jock and he's smart and he's great with women but also bad with women. That's key. That's key. He's got to be like, yeah, like I can get you, but I can't keep you because I got to be Batman all the time and stuff. It's hard.

It's hard to juggle being Batman with having an active social and romantic life. What can I say? I mean, you would know. Would I? Yeah. You go out at night and you swing from rooftop to rooftop. No, he's a villain. He swaps people's thigh meat sandwiches with breast sandwiches.

He's some sort of reverse hamburger. This is important work that somebody needs to do. Yes. Well, let's hear that pitch. Let's get into why you think it works and some cast members. Well, as far as fitting our prompt today, you know, figuring out like the best fandom Oscar bait, we're going after with Batman Beyond.

Best visual effects. Best editing. Best sound. Best original score. You know what? Like, I went like a little bit of Tron in my Batman Beyond. Yeah, baby. If we're going to be this neon, like, let's just get the then daft punk, now Trent Rezner's score, like, absolutely popping on this thing.

But also, I think here's the deal. Like, as far as older superheroes, more established superheroes or versions, like, I mean, Terry McGinnis is like the Miles Morales to the Peter Parker at a lot of ways, except you get, you do have Bruce Wayne in it. And so that presence is important. But we also get to kind of play the ingenue angle, right? Like, we get to find out for Oscar purposes, if we throw out someone who's interesting and a little, little younger and kind of on the verge of stardom, can we tempt people into a Mikey Madison-type vote if this movie is saucy enough?

Wow. Okay. I say that. This is a bold angle. I like this. Okay, okay, okay. I'm going to speak out of both sides of my mouth because I say that, but I am also detached enough from the youth that I cannot in good conscience recommend

an actor who could pass it 17 to play Terry McGuinness. Correct. We're also in the DCU not doing origin stories right now. So, you know, Terry as a high school student, stumbling into Wayne Manor, losing his dad, all that stuff, that's not going to cut it right now. So we're going to age it up a little bit. We're going to be a little bit more, you know, post-college age Terry McGinnis. I'm going Charles Melton as my Terry McGinnis. I'm going a slightly aged up Brian Cranston as my Bruce Wayne.

Interesting. Jody Foster as my commissioner of Barbara Gordon. Very important role within this. story. How about showguns Anna Sawai as Dana? I'm in there. I'm watching the movie 100 times. Yes. Say no more. Look, I know my audience. I know the awards that we can

pull with this. I just need your investment funding to get this thing on. This is definitely winning every MTV video music award for best this. Best fight scenes. Best cinematography, best director. That's a lot. Rob, how much you need? $250 million? It's all yours, baby. Say no more. All of that goes to Anna. Just say no more. I'm there. No, that's wonderful.

I think that's a great vision that you have right now. I have a question. Why Brian Cranston instead of Michael Keaton? Why not just go with the old Batman in universe? Right. Why switch it up? Great question. My counter to that is, have you seen The Flash?

Okay, but that wasn't Michael Keen's fault. Let's respect Michael Keaton. It's not his fault. Look, he's innocent, not his fault. But I'm not looking to remind anybody of that movie under any circumstances. And plus, I think, in the name of kind of severing ties from DC titles passed, which seems to be what the DCU is doing in a lot of ways under James Gunn. I think a Keaton or a former Batman is like a really attractive pull.

But at the same time, like, I want someone just absolutely grizzled out. And a Brian Cranston that's in like full, like full Heisenberg mode, basically as old Bruce Wayne. That's something that's appealing to me. I do like that. He has, he'll have two great Danes flanked either side of him. He's got a cane. He'll have to work out of it because he still keeps the Bruce Wayne build. But I think this is an inspired pick

because you would think a Brian Cranston makes it into a villain play. He makes it into a sort of like a Lex Luthor people have always painted him with that brush. But Emma's Bruce Wayne is a bit more just cynical because he's old actually works for me. Who are you thinking for director here?

Look, if we get the budget and we can make the studio Allegiances work, like Deney in Blade Runner 2049 mode, like that's something that could be very attractive. So here's, okay. Now, in a pre-O7 directing news role, this is the problem. This would have been, no, I would have said you're insane. But now I'm not exactly calling him an IP merchant, but it's certainly not on the table.

He's not an IP merchant. That was crazy. I'm not calling him that. I'm not calling him that. I'm saying that even infolk his name and IP merchant in the same sentence is insane. I'm not saying that. I'm saying that like this isn't beneath him. This genuinely is not beneath him.

Have some shame. Nah. The man went Blade Runner to Dune to Bond. Like, come on. He's not above Batman. He's not above Batman. He's not. Guys, guys, let's be honest.

Let's be honest for real. Yeah. You do, you do a rival. You do Sicario. You do Dune. You do Bond. Blade Runner, too. Blade Runner.

Love. I mean, I love it. They call you for Batman. Beyond. Batman Beyond. The phone would go go black so quickly. Hang up devil so quickly. Excuse me.

I don't know. Warner Brothers loves him. Excuse me. You got to do Batman on a come-up. You got to do Batman on your scent. You can't be at the hidey your powers and be like, you know what I'm going to do? Oh, Batman. Nah, guys, come on, man.

I think you're... No, no, no. The reason why Bond makes a lot of sense, because let's be honest, fellas. It's been in the mud for a minute. It's been in the mud. We had, we had Casino Royale, good. Carlta Mollis. You know what I'm saying?

Not just, eh, it was bad. Yeah, you know what I mean? Skyfall? Great. We all love Skyfall. Specter? Shaky. No time to die.

And so you're kind of like, we need to revitalize thing. We got to bring 007 back to its former glory. How do you restore the shine of James Bond? You bring Denny. That's what you do. Batman has been, yeah, Nolan. do one, a trilogy, and then Matt Reeves, movies that we all enjoy, right? You're not really bringing, like, few Danny, like, people already love this.

I wouldn't do anything crazy or new. Maybe the beyond part is what would make him interested, like, okay, this is a different little take. It's not just Bruce Wayne, you got Terry McGinnis. And it's a far-flung future, not far-flung, but it's a future, for sure. Right. But outside of that, when you, Danny, man, you're a big boss. It's really new and you and Nolan boxing at the top. Maybe that's it.

Maybe it's like Nolan did Batman, too. I got a lock in and show to people my stuff. But outside of that, which is like, again, a reach. Then he's looking at Batman. James Gunn called Danny for Batman. You're like, is that James? Yeah, tell James to lose my number. Don't ever call me again.

Actually, I have our sources coming in that are telling me that Denea is a huge beyond head. He's out here just like rolling up into episode. He's grinding tape. It's his comfort watch. I have an ungood authority. This is 100% true. Right, right, right, right. I do love that.

I do very much. No, no, no. That's, I mean, we should have been had a Batman Beyond movie. Like, I don't understand, like, why we're taking forever. Like, again, I think, maybe people made this up, but I remember going online, they were like, they wanted to make a Batman Beyond movie in the style of the Spider-Verse films. And W.B. was like, nah, we're not doing that. And then there was that one bit of footage.

Yeah, just that little bit of, like, there's a screenshot of something. And you're like, this would change my life. It could have been generational. It could have been generational. They fucked up. They really, really did. Well, I love that, Rob. Do we want to go around the horn?

It's all you, boss. Take with me? Is it with me? All right, great. Rob, this is also going to be a nostalgia play for you and me. I think one of the first genuine bonding moments that we might have ever had when we met is we found out that we had the same phone lock screen. This was deeply shocking and upsetting to me. It wasn't upsetting.

First of all, we're both met. Two men of call. I'd be like, what's my mom doing? On, no. Rob saw the screen, Scrofts saw the screen was like, man, me and Steve got the same. I got to change mine.

Yeah, we got to change that. I got to change mine. It's 100% not that. Steve, I'm honored by the association. That's not what it sounded like. You sound like he was disgusted. Let me break it down for you. You move through the world as a man of a certain age

and you look in the mirror every day and you're like, you know what? I am a fully formed human being unique within my own skin and taste and interest. And then you sit down at a table at the office one day. and you see Steve pick up a phone that you think is your phone because it has your lock screen on it, but it turns out no,

you are not as unique as you thought you were. You are not a particular and delicate snow link. It'd be your own people. It'd be your own man. It really do. It really do. And what was on that lock screen, but a screenshot of the video game Firewatch.

Down to the gradient, by the way. There were a million different wallpapers to have, and it was the exact same wallpaper. Truly insane shit. Insane shit. Anyway, Firewatch, a video game, would be a perfect film adaptation, rife for awards. Obviously, you can get magnificent cinematography.

You can have great direction. Smaller budget, frankly, with basically a man alone in the woods, solving a mystery while also going through some emotional term while with the passing of a loved one. And there is a level of prestige that this could garner that is kind of like, oh, you just found out that this just so happens to be an adaptation of a video game, but really this is just an excuse to make a great story in the woods with one great actor. I want to start with director here because really I want to go for a ambiance and vibe that is very specific to the northwest of this country. You film this in one of the Dakotas, a rich, lush forest area. Just one of the

Dakotas? One of them. Just pick one. Just pick one? Yes. Okay. Wow. Then not the of the Dakotas. I mean, we'll find one. Of the many Dakotas we have. I mean, there's only two.

You got to flip a coin. We're going to find one. North to South. I want my director for this to be Chloe Zhao. Now, we've had this from Eternals, but Nomad Land, one of the most beautiful vistas

and like an amazingly like modern Western style that, like, she has a very amazing eye for the forest, frankly. And I really love her sentiment and ideas. she's done IP before. I know that Marvel burned her a bit, but I think that we can coax her into this.

It's really kind of getting back to a bit more of an intimate setting with a single actor, maybe a few other interactions with mysteries in the woods, otherworldly things, but it's mainly just a triumph of spirit type of story.

And I think that's one that she's really, really good at, especially with Nomad Land. So I want that, and for my star, this is going to be a very, very biased pick because he was my, like,

highest stock watch in the coming years. I want this to star Paul Walter Houser. This is truly your guy. This is my guy through and through. I think that he can carry this movie very, very well. Not only is he funny, but I think he also

has a very good dramatic sensibility to him. And he's more every man than I would ever want from anybody else. I don't want an Austin Butler. I don't want one of these like overly conventionally attractive charm machines. I kind of want a guy that you thought that you can go to the bar with.

Because that's kind of what he was. He leaves this suburban life and tries to find himself as a Firewatch volunteer and just spend time by himself. And I think that's a very, very good role for him. And then you basically have this other. It's basically a two-role lead where he's talking to somebody on Milwaukee Talkie for a majority of this, another Firewatcher a couple of kilometers away. And I want that to be Carrie Mulligan. Yeah. I think she's primarily a voice performance.

Right. And I think she's great in voice performances as well. well. She has a very like, not only like a reassuring, but kind of otherworldly, like, something's uneasy about her presence with her voice that I really, really like. I think she's going to be great about this. And like, set in the Wyoming wilderness of like 1989, it's going to be very retro. It's going to be very, like, stripped down to the basics while still being beautiful. We're going to go for cinematography. We're going to go for best supporting, for best lead actor, and then probably a bunch of other technicals. What do we think?

Very important question for you. On the Carrie Muller. in front. Right. Accent or no accent? We're going to go. We've got to go. We're going to go no accent. But she, this character is like more local than him.

Mm-hmm. But I wouldn't want to, like, you can't go full Fargo. You can't do that. Oh, definitely. You can't do that. So no. Right. You don't know how to do all that.

I mean, the guy was in like pretty much every movie to share. I think he was great and fidget for her. He was in The Naked Gun. Right. I don't know if y'all saw that, but that movie was hilarious. Yes. Legitimately like a laugh every five minutes. So I could see the vision.

I think he showed himself as a dramatic actor. I don't know if you guys seen the luckiest man in America about the game show thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But he was really good in that. So I think I could see him like carrying the movie like by himself. It would be like, I mean, it's a lot to ask any actor to be just be like, all right, you're on screen by itself the whole time. I mean, we saw what happened with Ice Cube and War of the Worlds. You know what I mean?

Well, he's not. Yes, but he's also not doing Amazon drone commercials. That's true. That's true. You know, but like, you know, just ask like, you have to, like, yeah, I know you're talking to somebody, you got the walkie and everything, but like you have to carry the movie on your face. You do.

The whole time is a lot, but I'd be willing to see if he's up for the challenge. And here's the thing. I feel like going to prestige too high profile of an actor would be a mistake here. Because I think that it kind of, it might be garnering too much of a, like a blatant cash grab for awards. And I kind of wanted to zag a bit. Am I too biased? Am I aiming too low?

do I think I could have gone higher. You don't think Timothy Shalamee would have done it? I don't want Timothy Shalamee in this movie. No, Timothy Shalemay doesn't play as, you know, man who has seen some shit and experienced a lot of life. This guy's up one day. The main character basically suffers from dead wife syndrome, and we don't have, that's not Timothy's bag.

Not yet. No, not yet. I'm going to be honest. And I don't like this guy, but this is true. That studio would be like, kill and get Austin Butler. No. No, no, the studio would say, can we get off? You need, you need early 40s.

You need every man. Like, you, like, you, like, you, I do not want this guy to have any visible abs on the and the show. And the studio are going to be like, cool. We can, we're going to have him eat 60 gallons of ice cream a week. Yeah, that's what he, that's what it's diet is when you're in a fire wash tower. We're going to be like, are you sure Austin Butler? You think he's doing pushups and eating granola in there?

No, he's, I'm just saying, I'm just saying the truth. I'm just saying the truth. You're going to put, you're going to say. There's not enough hog and. us in the world to turn Austin Butler into the beaten down man we need this lead to be. Yes. I'm not saying I disagree,

but, you know, studio people would be like, you want to lead the movie and have Paul Walter House to be the only person we've seen the movie, cool. Are you sure we can't go back at time and get Christian bail? We can't get like 20. I mean, you would put in the work for that role. We know that. We can't get 2014 Christian

bail? No. It's got to be Paul Walter. Okay. That's when you say, maybe we could. Do you want to triple the budget? Or do you want to make the shit thing like we're making a one guy in the woods movie I think that's in a lot of ways what makes it acceptable accessible in terms of the production

right is the idea of small scale personal story it lends itself to what Chloe Zhao does best it lends itself towards like very cinematic but personal filmmaking I really like the vision Steve I gotta say yeah I see it we love it all right Jomey let's hit us okay

I am going with the MCU obviously because I know nothing else in my life. This is everything I'm familiar with. And I'm going with something that I know for a fact people have asked for people who have wanted to see, but we haven't, we like, we've seen bits and pieces across the MCU since end game,

but we haven't seen a full story. And what I'm thinking is a movie that talks about what happened after the snap, right? Not just in passing in one line of dial. I'm talking about a whole movie. Oh, boy. So the pitch is a group of people come together for therapy after the Avengers have brought everyone back and share their stories about how their lives have changed since the Battle of Earth. Right.

And so it's a group of people, some of whom got snapped and some of whom didn't get snapped. But now all have to coexist in this world together and talk about how their lives have changed since Thanos came and attacked the Earth. Okay. Right. And we've got Monica Barbaro as Tess. And Tess's story is that she was married with a husband. And they couldn't have kids. They tried.

They tried. It was really sad. And she got snapped, right? And she came back and found her husband who had remarried and now has kids with his new wife. And it's really sad, really emotional. It's like, how do you deal with that? We've got another story with Alfred Enoch, the guy from Hadegaard Mered or Wes, if you guys are cool with Chondaland Thursdays,

if you guys were there for those moments. I wouldn't miss the world. Shout out, shout out my guy, Wes. He's Freddie. And this is how we bring, you know, kind of we bring the bigger, the wider Marvel world into it, is he didn't get snapped, but he lost a lot of his friends, a lot of his family,

and he's searching for meaning. And he goes to Carmar Taj and talks to Wong. And he's like, yo, I feel like I need this, like I want this. And Wong is like, I knew a guy who came to Carmarthage looking for me. and he's gone too, you know, like this, ultimately this right here won't give you meaning. You have to go out and find your own meaning.

And he's like, wow, cool, that's really woke. And then you have the, I got a couple more stories, but the one, another one shout out, Josh Dumas as Doug. Now, maybe I've just been watching a lot of Transformers in my off time, but I can't get this guy out of my head. And I want to, I want to believe. You can't get Josh Dumal out of your head? Yeah, bro. Man, you got, okay, so you don't, you're not a real Transformers fan. I'm not.

You're not. Clearly not. No. Because I watch the first, like, I have, like, multiple vocal stems from one part of the movie. And it's when Sam comes into sector seven. He's like, yo, I want to get Bumble will be back. We got to get Bumbo be back. And they take out all the guns and they start pointing the guns in Section 7.

And it's a whole thing. It's a great scene, Rob, lock in. And I think, like, okay, Josh Duma can bring, he. It's only a small scene, but he can bring some way to be like, hey, yo, give the kid his car back. And what if he lost his whole family in there? And he thought that maybe they got snapped. right but when everybody gets that back they're not there

they're actually gone for real and how do you deal with the fact that everybody got their family back but you didn't and it's again this I guess not my plan it's sad do we have a name for this I have a great name for it Joe me I have two notes in a name

please one let's recast Josh Dumas with Justin Thoreau two there and three let's just call it the leftover Okay, no, no, wait me, hold on. Because that's the, it's the, the, the, the, why it works, I've got it in the dock. It's the leftovers meets the MCU, which allows for a deeper storytelling within the vast interconnected world. We're seeing the pattern here. And have the Avengers successes and failures have affected the lives of normal people in that world.

Is it called? Oh, snap? No, I was just going to call it the snap or something. Nothing got to be too crazy. The snapped. You know what I mean? And just, you know, something, they didn't have to go too crazy. But, no, I'm thinking, like, bro, like, the leftovers, by the way, fantastic television.

I mean, yes. If you're not locked in on the leftovers, you have Max or HBO Max, whatever we're calling it. Okay, whatever their name is. Go watch it right now. Dude, just, what's it go? Justin Harvey International Assassin? Some of the best television I've ever seen in my entire life. So you just want to do that for the MCU?

I just want to do that for MCU. But, like, I'm thinking it's like vignettes, right? Like one person tells their story. Right. And then another person tells a story. And there's cross talk. And, of course, there's mentions of the wider world. But ultimately, it's just a group of five or six people coming together, being like, yo, this is what happened when I got back.

Or this is what happened when I was, when everybody was snapped. And it was just nuts. And it's crazy. And, of course, again, it's not going to be happy. It's going to be really sad. But that's how you get the awards, baby. Happy story. don't win.

Yeah. Win a war's, man. You know what I mean? Bree Larson got one for the room. We was not laughing in the room. Just, nothing was funny in that movie.

You know, it's so like that's the thought process. But yeah, it's absolutely the leftovers. I have only slight quibbles with like, a radical shift in branding for the MCU. Yeah. The radical shift being having real human emotion.

Yes, real human emotion. And frankly, it seems like little superheroes. No, I mean, again, Wong shows up.

Wong is the person who tells Freddie like, hey, man, this ain't what you want, big dog. Like, go live your life, man. You don't want to be a sorry. So are we thinking rotating door of came. Yeah, people will show up in and out. Obviously, again, that's how you expand the world. You know, you can't have Spider-Man show up. But maybe there's a scene with, again, Josh Dumas comes up and he's like, yo, oh, snap, is that Matt Murdoch?

How you been, bro? It's like, you know what I'm saying? How's life going? He's like, yeah, man, I'm blind and half the world got snap. How do you think I'm feeling? And, you know, just something a little light, you know what I'm saying? We ain't got to be crazy. We don't need, obviously, you can't have Iron Man showing up.

That's too much expensive. We got to say to the budget, you know what I mean? But yeah, just make the world bigger by making it smaller. Yes. You know, and talk to, like, seeing all these people live with what the Avengers did and how they failed in Infinity War. And even though they, quote, unquote, succeeded in end game, still left a lot of people. They're live shattered.

you know, who knows what could happen when you bring half the world back in an instant, you know? Do we have any Secovians in the support group? No, because... Do we have any scrolls in the sport group? We don't have Secovians because they write. They be like, hey, man, hey man,

like they kill my people, you know what I'm saying? Like, there's a lot of people who died because the Avengers was wilding, you know? Truly. And so we can't really, you know what I mean? We're not going to go all there. But I was thinking, like, originally when I was thinking about this,

I was like, oh, you know, who could do this? Who could host this, be the person in charge of this, like Cap was in Endgame, it could be Monica Rambo because remember, she lost her mom's, like she got snapped and her mom died while she was gone for the five years. But then I remembered

that she's in the Fox universe now because of the Marvels, and I am the only one who remembered that. And so... Yeah, no, wow, she is. I was thinking about it now. I was like, wait. Boy, what a time. She's not here. I remember, hey, guys, I remember the end of the Marvels. I'm the only one.

She out. Kelsey Grammer, baby. Jomey, I got to say I am a thousand percent into this idea. I love the idea of making the MCU smaller. I love the idea of introducing real human stakes. Rubber stamped, fully approved, go forth with production, please. This is also the kind of pitch that only someone who loves the agents of Shield could make. I know. Thank you very much, Rob.

Thank you very much, Rob. Hey, man, I do it again. You know what I'm saying? Thank you. Thank you. First of all, I want to thank God. And more importantly, I want to think, he's got a part, Greg. For me.

Yeah. Shut up my man, Agent Kosher, man. Maybe he could be like, yo, man. No, he, it makes, it means something that he doesn't return. That's the post-credit scene, is that we turn around the person who's doing the talking. It's Clark Gray. Wow.

Oh, wow. Cinema. About billion dollars. That's so crazy. All right, Rob, what's your pitch number two? So pitch two, I'm going to go for a video game adaptation. Look, they're all the rage these days. The IP is just...

They tend to be. It's right there on the vine, friend. you want to take. And I'm going to go with a big, glossy HBO drama adaptation of Red Dead Redemption. Okay. I mean, come on now. A real take my money situation. I mean, of course. I'm fully locked in. It's also, I will say for HBO, maybe like a little bit of a hedge the bet after everything that happened with The Last of Us this season. You know, it's like, okay, your last big AAA adaptation, like maybe it's draining its audience a little bit. Maybe it's kind of worn out it's welcome. Maybe people aren't along for the ride of the twists and turns

that story takes. We'll have to wait and see with all that. But a gang of outlaws trying to survive in the last gasp of the Wild West, that's a pretty good sell. Old world versus New World, brother against brother, a big American epic. Like, let's fucking go. This thing could be a bona fide hit. Okay, so I've got a couple questions, but I think the biggest one is how much would this cost? A lot. Yeah, a lot. That's, that's, That's the worry, right? Because I completely see the vision, right? And we have shows like Deadwood and West Road when it was good.

You know what I'm saying? Like, we've been out in the Old West. We've seen that these kind of properties work. However, I have played Red Dead Redemption. Yep. That is a sprawling game with so many set pieces and landscapes. Brother, it is going to be a, mission and a half to not only consolidate the story, but just to bring it along in a way that

feels real and natural. Speaking of missions, that a single game of that one or two would be like five seasons long at minimum. I think you would have to consolidate some of the story. You would have to. You would have to. Anything with mission-based storytelling, we're just going to have to pick and choose a little bit in terms of what the mainline story actually looks like. And obviously, you're not going to, you don't need to be the one that like you help that, that one, that one lady with her donkey or whatever for shit and giggles. I mean, you could. Maybe that's a whole episode. I don't know.

You know, we're going to have to get in the writer's room and find out. Ryan Johnson, you're making fly too. Now you're speaking my language. Yeah. But here's why I'm not concerned about that, Jomey. What if I told you that I have the guy who can turn any signature

Western into a cash making machine? Yeah. Yeah. You know, and similarly, what if that guy who's currently under the Paramount umbrella has been, you know, reportedly getting a little squeeze with a company that is looking to cut back on the spending of its own scripted television.

And maybe, and a guy, let's just say his name, Taylor Sheridan, who has been snubbed out of the Emmy conversation by a large jude. Okay, all right, Rob. I think we need to calm down a little bit. We might need to calm down a little bit. Hold on. Hold on.

Let's pump the brakes. I'm just saying, what if I'm Taylor Sheridan and I'm printing money. I'm bringing in huge audiences. And I can't get the academy to recognize me. What if what I want is the company with the biggest wallet with the gloss of prestige? And I'm going to take my talents to HBO to make this fucking thing happen. Okay.

Well, thank you, Mr. Sheridan, who is now incorporating the body of Rob Mahoney. But it seems like you don't seem to be interested in awards. You are interested in money and your ranch. So hold on, hold on. Why not all the above? Well, let's let's let's reset. Let's reset it for a second because Taylor Sheridan was nominated for an Academy Award for Best Original Screenplay. He's got some touch to him.

I'm not saying he doesn't. Let's be fair. I am not saying he does. And if we're being completely honest, Yellowstone, 1883, Landman, people, special ops, blindness, people mess with division. Right, I understand. But he's like, let's respect them. Let's respect them a little bit. And I'm not, and again, the comparison I'm about to make here, not disparaging either one.

But to say that the output of an individual is like, you know, subsequent to the quality that we're looking for in a thing like this. Am I, do I think that Taylor Sheridan knows Westerns? Absolutely. No question. Do I absolutely think so? I think that that's a very, very good thing that it can do. But again, I don't see rock star sensibility here. And Rockstar being the publisher of that video game, the, like, the autores of, like, storytelling and, frankly, game development.

that put a lot of work into that game. Like, like, it's suffice to say there's like a slight edge to the stories that they tell that I don't know if Sheridan has in him quite. No, you're smoking crack. See, I, I just agree. He wrote Sicario, Hell of High Water and Win River back to back to back. Nah, you got to.

Bang, bang, bang. Now, you got to respect him. Come on. That's, that was crazy. And listen, he can pump out seven seasons of TV. I get it. That's, again, I'm not in these worlds. Like, I'm not a Yellowstone guy.

I have Paramount Plus for three. reasons. Champions of League football, Tom Cruise movies, and Zoe 101. That's it. Right. That's it. But you got to respect him. That was crazy, bro. That was, that was nuts. Can I, can I slight counterpitch to the showrunner

here? Let's hear. Slite. Vince Gilligan. I mean, I'm never going to turn Vince Gilligan down. I think that he's wanted to make westerns for decades, and he hasn't yet. And I think this might be the perfect place for him to do so. He's basically made, like the latter half of Breaking Bad was a

Western. The latter half of better call Saul was more or less that as well. El Camino is a Western. I think that this is exactly what he's meant to do. I think that putting him in this place while also knowing how to actually constrain a budget

a little bit. He writes TV like he's hungry. Taylor Sheridan writes TV like he's full. Does that make sense? He has every resource available to him and he doesn't actually get them. I get what you did in terms of the parallel structure, but I don't understand with that. I think it's again, like, you can't stop Taylor Sheridan from writing TV.

Right, because they got him in the sweatshop. I understand that. But it's a sweatshop of his own making. Let's be fair. Yeah, well, because he was making, because Yellowstone went crazy. Yes. And they said, here's a bag. Whatever you want to do, you can do it. And he said, bet. I'm a just cook. But then he's given, again, what's the batting average after which? People like the shows. Did you like 1923? I, again, I'm not watching these television. Was the Tom Hanks cameo worth it? They are not. They are not for me.

But we've seen, like, he's got hits and people enjoy the stuff, dog. I understand. I would understand. Again, I think the output, like, I think, like, again, making, like, 100 episodes of TV a year is probably not sustainable if we're really trying to do this. Of course not. If we, like, yo, Taylor, you get, write the scripts, write all the scripts for a season of TV for, you know, how many months it takes you. But take your time. We'll shoot it.

We'll make it good. You don't just got to pump it out every six weeks. We don't need a script, like six scripts every six weeks. You get six months to like really nail it in. Again, brother, look at the output, man. Let's let's put respect on it. And in this universe, Rob, you're saying that he's freed from the shackles of the Yellowstone universe. Oh, for sure.

Look, he's technically under contract with them for a few more years. But as we all know, contracts in Hollywood end when the people involved say that they end. Yes. So I'm not worried about getting right now. Right. Everything's fake. if we can entice Taylor Sheridan with the scale and scope of production

and this is why I kind of don't want to go the cost-cutting Ben Skilligan around like I want to do this thing big and I want to do this thing right and I want a guy who can manage a Yellowstone level production or a three Yellowstone universe level production with the guy who wrote Wind River with the guy who wrote

Heller Highwater like how do we get those sensibilities merge together to make the small screen feel like the big screen and I can't and I can't argue with that I can't argue with Wind River I can't argue with Sikario. I can't argue with the things that are his hits. But I'm like, I don't know, man, landman was landman.

I enjoyed it. I'm not going to like to. It's ridiculous. Landman did numbers. What are you talking about? Of course it did numbers. It had John Hamm and Billy Bob and they were just arguing in front of Walmart or something. I think that's what it was.

Anyway. Look, look, I can promise that in this show there will be fewer arguments from high school quarterbacks about Chinese lithium mines. That's not going to have. happen on Red Dead Redemption? And frankly, I need that. Well, let me give you a couple of other things you cannot argue against. My core cast for this adaptation of Red Dead Red Dead Redemption.

I'm thinking you start with the story of Red Dead Redemption, too, and then just go straight into one. It's a prequel original situation. Tom Hardy as Arthur Morgan. Okay. Okay. All right. What accent is you doing, bro? I couldn't tell you.

He's doing whatever he wants. He's doing Bain for all I care. Yeah, you can try to give him notes, but he's just going to do what he's going to do. That worries me. Yeah, that's a little worrying. We're going to have to get like a real, like a dialect coach that's allowed to carry a sidearm and be like,

hey, buddy, lock it in. Well, the good news is it's the Wild West. You know, it's a true melting pot situation. Who's to say where that accent came from? There's a little creole in there, you know? There's just, there's a lot. Yeah. He's going to do the Shannon Tatum Gambit voice.

How about that? He might well. That Cajun. Christ. And to flank him. let's get Josh Brolin as Dutch. Let's get Aaron Taylor Johnson. Aaron Taylor Johnson as John Marston. That is a triumvirate that we can build a fucking show.

Aaron Taylor Johnson doing television. Okay. Okay. Well, okay. Well, it's going to be brand involved. It's got to be brand involved. This is very, very expensive. This is very expensive.

This is why I come to you, the two richest people I know. That's true. We are, we are yes. Yeah. Okay. I can see it. Is there room? for Timothy Oliphant in here.

I mean, it'll probably just be stun casting. He'll probably just be like a drugstore owner or something. Because if it's a Western, we have to cast him in the West. Like it's just, it's rules at this point. I mean, if Ian McShane is going to show up somewhere, he probably should, but you know, like we're not going to use the one. And with

Oliphant, look, like, we don't have to pay for the Stetson. Like, he just comes with it. Oh, yeah. Right. I'm not worried about it at all. It turns out his hair in Alien Earth was just a shave down Stetson. That's good to know. Yeah. I love it.

It's approved. Green lit. We're on to the next one. I think that's me. Oh, my goodness. Unless we had any final thoughts on Red Dead Redemption. I think it works, but like it's going to cost a mint and it's got to go for 10 seasons.

I mean, it's going to be the most expensive television show in the history of television and it will never be broken. Right. I'm here to win awards, guys. Okay. I'm here to make bank. I'm here to pull in the Taylor Shared and audience. Like,

we're hitting on every single pillar of modern. Rob said it's not my money. Go find a bag. And I need it now. Wonderful. Love it, love it, love it. All right. It's going to be on to mind.

This one, I fluctuated between making this a movie and making this a TV show because it's such a longstanding comic. And it's a like massive sprawling world. But then again, I keep thinking about how infinite the, infinite the budget would be if this were a TV show. and I would think of the constraints that we would need to happen. So I'm going to think about this as a case-by-case basis Dune-esque science fiction

blockbuster film. And I am going to be adapting the image comic by Brian K. Vaughn and Fiona Staples saga. This is a beloved comic book and a long, demanded adaptation from people. It makes the most sense

for a prestige TV show. But I want to kind of pivot a bit and think why this could work as a movie series if we get this signed on for at least three pictures. Okay. I think it's sprawling intergalactic, think the fifth element. Think of Star Wars. Think of Lord of the Rings.

Any like Heroes journey, but it's a found family with a like couple in love, a Romeo and Juliet-esque story with a crazy and like kind of insanely beautiful world of intrinsic characters. and far-off-flung planets with like interesting, like, geopolitical, like, implications as well as, like, what it means to truly love somebody. I think that we get this best when we have a sort of, I'm not suggesting we use this as a director, but a Luke Basant level of absurdity with a bit more prestige involved. Okay. With a bit more of gravitas and self-seriousness. Because at the heart of it, it's a great gravitas and self-serishness than,

a French filmmaker. Right. And again, I'm not suggesting that we use him. I do not endorse Luke Besson in any real way. But I think the Fifth Element

has probably one of the better instances of unique and inspiring world building in a science fiction epic while still being pretty like action driven and heartfelt. So I want that for a blockbuster. You're sure you don't want

the guy who directed Valerian in the city of a thousand plans? That is also Luke Bissan. Yeah, that's the... That would also be Luke Bissan. You know what that guy? We don't really want that, no. As relative to as that Rihanna's sequence was.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We can all remember that. So for this, I want in the lead role of Mariko, Oscar Isaac, all right? He's not exactly being quiet, but I think if we get him, this is going to be a bit more of a controversial opinion. Of the Pedro Pascals of the world, I feel like the Oscar Isaacs of the world probably should be stepping in for a couple more of those roles. Oh, he's better than Pedro Pascal.

I would say that. And I think that he's actually a great shoe in for this. Obviously, this is a character that's a bit younger in the comics. I think if we age both of these characters up, we have a bit more of an interesting, like, dynamic here, but we still work within those battles.

Real quick, real quick. Yeah. That was crazy Pedro disrespect. That was crazy Pedro disrespect. I think that we need to... I'm not saying that I disagree but I'm just saying like we come on man So you're saying I'm right but I shouldn't have said it. No, no, no, no.

I'm glad you said it. We're too accurate? But you got to talk about it. Like we can't just say that and not explain. No, I think we, I don't think we really need to explain. No, no, no, you got to, you got to be like, hey man, listen, you got to break that down.

Okay, can Pedro do ex machina? I don't think so. Pedro Pascal's never done anything in his career that's even close to inside Lewin Davis. Like, not even close. Like, not even in the same universe. When he's right, he's right, Jomey. When he's right, he's right.

Again, I didn't say, I'm not saying I'm disagreeing. I'm just saying we needed a little second to live on that. But you can't just come out and say that and just breeze by it like you didn't say that. Even if we just included Oscar Isaac's fandom entries alone, June plus across the spider verse is better than anything Pedro Pascal is done. I'm very, very sorry, buddy, but he's right. No comment on Moon Night. I co-side. No comment on Moon Night.

You don't really, again, honestly not his fault. As somebody who is not a Pedro Pascal hater, you don't think about it. But like, you're not, you guys are, again, you guys are not wrong. When you look at them side to side, you pull up the comparison

on a basketball reference. It's all green, it's all green for Oscar Isaac. Yeah, yeah. It's all green. I love Pedro. And maybe you, Steve might have a point. Everybody calling him Pedro,

like, maybe even with the first call. to Oscar Isaac. Phone works both raised for Oscar Isaac. Maybe if Oscar Isaac says no, then you go to Pedro. But you got to start there. You got to start there. You know, wow. I've got a couple of phone numbers before I call Payboard.

I'm sorry. We just had to address that. I'm sorry. We just had to address that. Because I was not going to let that slide. Y'all was not going to sneak that in there and not talk about it. It's as if you play golf with Pedro Pascal. I'm not throwing him bell.

Again, I agree with y'all. I'm just saying it is a hot take for you to just like say it in passing. I really don't think it is. I thought we were just stating an objective fact. A mere lukewarm to cold take for here. I'll tell you what? The people, the cast and directors don't agree. The cast and directors don't agree.

Oscar Isaac's not hurting for work. Exactly. And guess what? We need Oscars. We don't need box office here. Well, no, we kind of do need box office for Saga. We really kind of do need box office for Saga. So here's the thing about Saga that is that worries me besides just every time you

adapt someone. thing, you piss people off. Every time do you adapt something beloved, you piss more people off. Fair. And so this is a, and this is like, they're kind of hand in hand.

This is a sprawling story. Yes. It is involved. It is deep. There are so many characters, so much story. Even if you wanted to do like multiple parts. Right.

And make it like the next dune, you would have to cut stuff. you would have to rejigger some things. But it's, again, I don't say piecemeal it together, but you would definitely have to streamline the story in a way that regular audiences can understand, and that never goes down well. Absolutely. And again, like, this is a sprawling thing

that a lot of people are going to be up in arms about if it's not done properly. I think the things that we need to get right is the relationship between our two main characters. And I think that, and that's my utmost goal for making that. I think everything else can fall by the wayside, unless if we don't believe our two stars. And, like, the intimate story that's, like,

kind of like the first arc would be this movie. Like, the first, like, probably, like, ham full of trades fit into this one film. But I'm going to keep rolling down the cast, see how we feel about this, all right? For Alana, I think that we can all agree, our fandom queen, Rosario Dawson. Cook it. That's cooking.

Absolutely. Yeah. Let's save her from Osoka, please. Oh, God. All right, all right, all right. So, so, so yes. So yes, please save her. Yes.

Let's also save the character Asoka from Asoka. That's the main. Yeah. Save it from Dave Faloni question mark. Save it from Dave Filoni questions. We're going to have to have tough conversations. We need to start a dialogue.

We're going to have to have tough conversations one day. Not on this podcast, but maybe the next time we get Rob on, we're going to have some real tough Dave Filoni questions because yikes. At some point, you just have to take, you got to take everything away from that, man. You know, you just got to remove all of the pens from his general vicinity, and you just got to tell him to stop for a little bit. Steve, how much this movie going to cost us? This is going to cost, like, around, like, it's an easy 200.

I'm sorry. Like, the world is amazing. It's a multiple sets. Like, you got people, you got robots with TVs for heads. You got incredible set designs. You have, I want shit practical. I want shit looking very, very good. It's going to be a very well-written script.

I want a quick rundown of the other of the other two that I had had in mind. The Will, the Keith Stanfield. Okay. Could that work? Everything. Yeah. Stephanie Shue as Gwendolyn. Love her.

She's great. Love her. And for my directors here. I was, it was a bit of a toss-up between Lord and Miller. Because I think they obviously have comedy chops. They have a very good eye for science fiction. I think that's Project Hail Mary from the things that we've seen. Looks great.

It's going to be phenomenal. But I feel like that could be relatively too silly. But again, I think they could juggle the kind of sprawlingness of the world, a bit more of like a cosmic type of deal. Or director of Ghost Story and Green Knight, David Lowry. I like Lord of Miller. I like Lord of Miller there. Space, the fantastical.

I'm with Lord of Miller. Yeah. See, my ears perked up at Lowry, to be honest. You think so? Because I see the Green Knight. I see, like, ghost story I didn't really like, but like those vibes were right. The vibes in that movie were kind of right. It's something about him and his sensibility, like, really kind of works for what that story can do.

But again, I also kind of feel like it might be humorless, which saga is, is full of, like, levity. Yes. Green Knight has its humor in it. It does. He's not incapable of, but it is a different speed. And I will acknowledge that I am responding to the version of this movie. I would like to see and not the version that's going to justify a $200 million budget.

And now give me the version that you would like to see. Obviously the cast and everything, but is it smaller? What does that look like to you? Well, I just think, like, if we can lean into that kind of ethereal aspect and the world building of what that vision of the story could be,

that's interesting to me. But I want to avoid the like divergent series outcome of like, oh, we're promised a certain number. I say we as if I'm involved in this. As if they promised a certain number of movies and then bailed on the fourth one. Like, we live in a world where Denise is going movie to movie on Dune.

And like, okay. I might not make a third. Who knows? You know, we're waiting to see if we clear this line before we greenlight the next one. And so I'm willing to do whatever is reasonable to get this whole project off the ground. If we need like five movies to make this thing happen?

Right. And this is the thing about saga because like you have to go in for a multi-picture deal when you're pitching something like this. And it definitely has to be a thing that you know is going, to carry over. I'm not saying that when like the Harry Potter films got greenlit, it got to be that

level of thing. But that level of Hollywood doesn't exist anymore. When you knew that you would have a level of cast that would carry on that long in like, not even a television show, but for like near decades worth of work. Saga, obviously, this is long and the two, and there are multiple different main characters. There are multiple different arcs of this. But I think for the main arc of the first story that we get to see, I think it can justify a movie, potentially two.

And that I think I could pitch for two movies. I think Lord and Miller can be in for two. I think that knowing they could shoot this back to back and then ultimately upping it, upping the budget, wicked style to put it up to like maybe four or five hundred for the whole package deal, probably works.

I think so. You had the temerity to say that my Red Dead Redemption series is going to be too expensive. And you're like, here, let me. No, listen, I had the temerity to like put my nose up a little bit at Mr. Sheridan here. That's really all that I was doing. Again, that man's going to make more

than I'll ever be worth in five lifetimes. He's going to print money for the Warner Brothers Corporation. Generational wealth for him and his family. Yes. Because of all the paramount. He is the mountain on the Paramount logo. That's what he is. Whoa, whoa, whoa, respect Tom Cruise.

No, he's the 50 stars. Yeah, you got to respect Chris. Come on. Come on. Oh, it's my turn. It's my turn. It's my turn. What do you got, Joe.

Okay, cool. So I'm going to, to do, and you guys are going to be really mad at me, the fellows I'm talking to right now, and everybody listening, because I'm going to pull until dawn situation, which is I'm going to name my adaptation after a successful franchise and then abandon the conceit to meet the immediately. Okay. I kind of like this.

Yeah. So for my final pitch in awards bait, I'm going to. going to adapt, in quotations, ace attorney. Okay. All right. All right. Okay. Again, adapt.

Is this guy good or what? In the loosest terms. Yeah. In the absolute loosest terms, okay, it's just going to be called ace attorney. Okay. So no Phoenix Wright. No Phoenix Wright. No barristers.

What? We're abandoning all of it. We're abandoning all of it. Jomi, no. I'm going to bring you guys in and lull you into the theater. Okay. With the name as attorney. I am so upset.

And you're going to get a movie about two black lawyers. One junior and one senior that are stuck together on a case that seems a possible to win. Okay. And despite the generational differences have to work together to bring it home. Okay. You're going to come in. thinking you're getting Phoenix right, yonning objection.

So are you going to cut a fake trailer? What do you, like how are you going to lie to the people? And what you're going to get is a, well, you know, maybe there's a dream sequence that we put in there.

Right. That has like all the fake stuff and that's like all the trailer. So they, they dream that they're two Asian lawyers. No, no, they don't have to be Asian.

With slicked back hair. No, they can just be black, Steve. Okay. They can just be whatever color that they want to be. Okay.

I miscast somebody in a prior pitch. It's a thing. I'm just using. the name as the thing the vehicle to get people into the seat after the number is going to go it's going to drop a thousand percent after weekend one.

So this is a this is a Hollywood pumping dump. It's no, no, no. Here's the thing, right? Because the name is going to in the theater. What's going to leave people like after they walk out and I'm like okay, so a lot about the name, but the story was really beautiful.

I'm going to send you something right now Rob on Slack You're going to read So I have two characters here Oh God Oh I would love this I have two characters here One of them is

named James McDonald He's the older One played by Sterling K. Brown Right He's the older black lawyer And the other one is a guy Who is going crazy right now David Johnson

Yeah The Long Walk And Lean Romulus OG is known from industry Okay, I'm sold. I'm sold. David Johnson's amazing. And his name is Irving Kirkpatrick, but everybody calls him Kirk. Kirkpatrick. Yeah, basically. Everybody calls him. Well, his name is just regular name is Irving Kirkpatrick. It's kind of like a Barton Guster situation where people call him Gus, you know. People call him Kirk because who wants to go

by Irvin. Right. Okay. So, Rob, you're going to be Kirk. I'll be James. Well, first of all, let me, let me stop you right there. I feel like in our dynamic, I am the Sterling Kay. Okay, you want to be Sterling Kay? Okay, cool. I can be Kirk. I can be Kirk. I need you to channel Paradise right now. Okay, cool, cool, cool.

I need you to channel Paradise right now, right? So I'll be, so okay, that's fine. I'll be Kirk and you'll be, you'll be James. Okay. Okay, cool. All right, let's go. Yeah, let's do it. Interior, we are in the law office.

It's, it's late. It's about like 12.30 a.m. They're doing casework. It's late. It's like 8.30. It's on a Friday. People are trying to just like, you know, it's tense in there. They've been working.

All day. Right. All day on this. Paper's flooding the desk. It's just the TV's on. They're just like at this point, at both at Witsend, right? Let's go.

I'm going to lead off. They're on the news calling you on McDonald's. Because my last name is McDonald's. Do you think that's funny? It's kind of funny. Right. Listen, when you get a chance, make sure to look over those receipts

from May 2022 till December 2020. I think there's something there that corresponds with some discrepancies I found in their logs. Great. I'll do that first thing tomorrow morning. Excuse me? Listen, we've been working at this for two straight weeks now.

I haven't seen my girlfriend and God knows how long. And frankly, James, I'm tired. I just want a night where I can relax. Relax. You think I spent four years of undergrad, three years of law school, and 20 years climbing up the Godforsaken Hill to relax? Be serious, kid.

No, you be serious. You can't keep going on like this. treating each case like it's your last. This isn't everything. It's not everything. It's the only thing. We have to work twice as hard as them to get half as much in any slip-up. The slightest mistake, we show even an ounce of weakness, and we are done in this town.

We can't afford to treat each day like we're guaranteed the next one because we aren't. And where has that thinking gotten you? I beg your pardon? Your wife clearly doesn't love you if she ever did. Your children don't respect you. And if I'm being completely honest, I don't know anything. who actually likes to spend time with you. Mr. McDonald's, sir, your life outside of the law is empty.

And I don't want that for me. I want better for myself. Okay. I'm sorry. I didn't mean that. Listen, if you stay, I'd be willing to forget and forget the last five minutes ever happened. But if you walk through that door and turn your back on this, don't ever come back. That's what I'm talking about.

We might have cinema there. Come on. We might have cinema. We might have cinema. You're going to be upset. And guess what, guys? We just saved a bunch of buddies. Sterling K. Brown passed.

Rob Mahoney, you stepped into the role. I don't want to be involved in the controversy of replacing Sterling K. I don't want any part of that. I think you just did, buddy. I think you just did. That's incredible. That's unhinged. Listen.

But you see the vision. I do. You see the vision. I do. Yeah. We're talking full Oscar, babe. People are going to be mad at the title. But when they leave the movie, they're going to be like, Wow.

Rob Mahoney asked Sterling K. Brown as James McDonald was incredible. Yeah, no, that very was true. That was cinema. So we want Phoenix Wright by way of Buddy Cop Matlock. Yeah, I think what we could do if we're like really trying to sell the ace attorney of it all is have the law firm be Phoenix and Wright. Phoenix and Wright. That's as far as he goes. So they're both partners.

They don't own practice. No, no. McDonald and Kirkpatrick are like, again, he's just, again, again. He wants to be Phoenix, right, and McDonald. But he's been at this law firm for God knows how long and still hasn't made partner. Interesting. And instead of him being like, you know what, I can go do my own thing.

He's like, I have to do it. I have to sacrifice so much. This is the only thing that matters is getting my name on the door. And the young kid who's kind of like, again, he's like committed to the cause, but also like, brother, there are bigger things in my life than just make it partner. I want to spend time with my girlfriend I want to be like have a family I want to live I want to have a life

outside of this long They come together It's like one's the old head That's lost his wife That's kind of lost his way socially The other one he's brash He's young, he's smart He doesn't really follow the rules that much

But then again he's missing stuff in the case Yeah he's easy to miss He's a smart kid but not dedicated to the work Right right he's not in the lab He's not watching film studying. He's talented, but you kind of have to, you know, it's kind of two people on opposite ends trying to meet each other

in the middle, right? Jomey, can I ask you a question? Please. Is this creed? So it could be creed. Oh, shit. Everything is everything. Okay? It's fair. It could be creed. It could be creed, except for the fact that Stallone is not touching

my picture. Right. At all. And he would have to be the son of a famous, famous lawyer. Oh, NEPO baby, brash young lawyer. Oh, shit. Oh, hold on. Okay, wait. Nepo baby coming into, wait a minute.

Well, now, okay, it wouldn't work. But, like, now I'm thinking, what if, like, this is Tom Cruise's kid from the firm? And it's like, it's like, David Johnson, it wouldn't be, they have to be white. But, dude, we're coming back. We're coming all the way back. Rob, keep, stay by the phone. Stay by the phone. But, like, if that's the Nipo baby, what to go with his kid from the firm.

could work. Nah, his thing, like, I mean, here, if David Johnson says no,

Michael B. Jordan, what are you doing? Like, are you free? You know what I mean? Like, he's already been a lawyer once. He has.

That's right. He's got the muscle memory. That's right. And what was that? The Jamie Fox and, um, yes. Re Larson movie that everybody watched.

No, that I certainly didn't watch. No, that was Tommy Lee Jones. What was it? Tommy Lee Jones was in that? Was he in that? I think it was called mercy,

right? Mercy. Just mercy. Just mercy. Just mercy. Just mercy. Just mercy. Just that. Rob, you watched it.

Yeah, no, it is just mercy. I have not seen it. I cannot claim to see it. I saw the trailer. I said, okay, they got Kilmonger and Captain Marvel and Jamie Fox. Sure, sure, sure, yeah, yeah. I won't be there. Yeah, yeah, pass.

Let me. Have a great time. I got to tap into. Interesting. Okay, well, okay. I do love Phoenix Wright, though. And you have a lot of angles that you could have actually gone if you wanted to go for a, like, a true to form.

adaptation for Phoenix Wright. There's just a lot of wacky, amazing shenanigans. There have actually been Japanese film adaptations that are quite campy and funny and goofy. But I think this switcheroo

is quite frankly a heist for the century, and I'm in. I think it's inspired. Also, probably the truest to the current developmental process, which is a screenwriter has a legal thriller script sitting in his drawer. Yeah, which there's an open

call for specs for Phoenix, right? And he's like, okay, well, I guess this is Phoenix, right. By the way, Jumme, you've set the new standard. Now every pitch has to have at least a scene work in here. That's now ten amount to everything that we do here. Listen, I just knew that my man, Rob would cut me. You know what I'm saying? So I was like, how do we get him involved?

Also, and this is something that I just now thought of, you kept saying just mercy. And I thought that you said that you were talking about, the movie is just how mercy. The movie is actually called just mercy. This is that Rush Hour 3 me, you scenario.

He kept saying it's just mercy and I was like, yeah, the movie's called mercy. No, it's just mercy. Yeah, mercy. He's called just mercy. I had to look it up. I was confused. I was like, why does he keep saying

just mercy? I know it's called mercy. Bits never old. The bit never gets old. Guys, we did it. Directed by Destin Daniel Creton, by the way. The director of,

of Shang Chi and Spider-Man 4. Oh, wonderful. So great visual flare to this courtroom drama. I'm sure there was some action in there somewhere. Nobody, I wouldn't know because I have not partaken in the movie. If Sterling can disarm an assailant, like in the alleyways outside of the law office, I think. Brother, again, he's 95 at this point in the movie in the movie. Because he spent like 20 years in, 20 years at the firm.

I mean, Sterling is not young. He's not young. He looks great. He looks amazing. I mean, Paradise didn't walk away like big winters last night. But God, he looks amazing. He could be 30 or 3,000 years old. A timeless wonder.

A timeless wonder. Truly. Well, a timeless wonder for the ages. And what a timeless podcast that we had today. Rob, thank you so much for joining us. This was a blast. I hope that we can have you back again. But for now, thank you so much for listening.

Don't forget tomorrow on House of R. they bring you their alien earth deep dive with a one Rob Mahoney on the ones and twos on the mic this week Midnight Boys give you their instant reactions to the season premiere of Gen V and later this week button mash is going to return with their thoughts on borderlands

By the way Jomey where could people find that on the internet if they were so inclined I mean they can find it on Twitter on Instagram on Facebook and on the titty-tock at Ringiverse make sure to follow on Instagram we close to 60K Rob I noticed you don't

follow us on on Instagram. Do I not? That's crazy. I don't think that's true. I thought we were friends and I thought we all loved each other. And so the fact that you don't follow us is nuts. How about this? If we promise to repost your hiking photos,

the next time that you're out in the California Wildlands, will you then follow us? Here's the thing. I am already following him on. He definitely follows us. Okay. He definitely does. Personal and professional. He definitely follows us.

Do that thing where like you're being petty and you just got a follow and then refollow so you get the notification. Now I'm just blocking. Okay, great. Hey, guys, I was joking, but seriously, Rob, I need them follows. I got to pay my bills. Don't. Please don't play with my money, please. Thank you again for Rob Mahoney for joining us.

Anything to promote a declare for you, Rob Mahoney? Not a single thing. Just listen to all of our many wonderful ringer podcasts. Wonderful. That's great. We are produced by the great dev with additional production by Arjuna. Ram Gapel. Jomey, do you have any parting words for the people? I have a couple.

I just wanted to say, first and foremost, thank you to Rob again for joining us. I can't wait until basketball season. Your work with Zach Lowe is fantastic. Thank you, my man. Mahoney Mondays. That's a real cinema. So I can't wait for those to come back. I mean, along with all your TV podcasting as well, you're amazing. Thank you again for coming through.

Thank you for everybody for listening. again, give a shout out to our producer, Dev, a real one. Thank you as always. And we will see you guys next time. Love you, Junior Menz. Feels like every product claims real protein these days. But real doesn't start on a label. It starts at the source.

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