The Ringer-Verse - ‘House of the Dragon’ Season 3, Episode 3 Instant Reactions | The Midnight Boys

Episode Date: July 6, 2026

The Boys are back, and they’re so in! They give you all of their thoughts on ‘House of the Dragon’ Season 3, Episode 3, diving into the politics of Westeros as it stands, the pressures Rhaenyra is dealing with from every direction, and the reveal of Team Black’s newest opponent on the game board. (0:00) Intro (13:49) Spoilers ahead (15:33) ‘House of the Dragon’ Season 3, Episode 3 reactions (1:13:02) ‘Supergirl’ roundup (1:24:32) Outro Hosts: Van Lathan, Charles Holmes, Jomi Adeniran, and Steve Ahlman Producers: Aleya Zenieris and Devon Baroldi Additional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopowell New 2k+ doorbells, coming to your front door Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This episode is brought to you by Blink. Want smart security that's easy to set up and design for modern life? That's the new Blink 2K video doorbell lineup. They've got battery powered or hardwired options so you can choose what suits your home and start greeting your guests and tracking your deliveries from anywhere. Because whether you're a renter or a homeowner, you deserve peace of mind. Shop the new Blink 2K video doorbells at Amazon.com slash blink. Welcome into the Ringiverse.

This is, of course, the Ringers' Nexus podcast feed for all things fandom. We are Steve, the architect, Almond, the builder, and tigger of things. Jomi, the explainer on. You've got questions. He's got answers. Old Man, Van.

He of the receding and resurgent hair lining. Code Baby Chuck, 24-carried closing. Together, we are known as the Midnight Boys. Right back after this. I want to say something real quick. What was I watching? I was watching something. I was watching the James Corton.

Oh, no. After. Why would you do that to yourself? It was on. It actually wasn't bad. I watched the James Gordon after the World Cup show. Yeah. They had Colin Farrell on there.

Colin Farrell was amazing on there. That's you. He's a great guest. Great guess. They had Ian Carmel on there. Yeah, yeah. He's funny too. Ian is very funny.

Yeah. When Ian was talking about, he was talking about going to like see the American outlaws. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. He was talking about like handshakes and things that he does when he sees them. When I got once, this was with the outlaws, why don't we go, Pugh, pew, pew.

That's us. We see you, Ian. Yeah. Not proprietary. It doesn't matter what we've taken from you. Yeah. Also, I do have to ask, is this, I'm liking the hat van. Is this a new Satorial choice?

Gucci bucket hat. I got a couple of different buckets. Well, is this bucket hat van summer? Bucket hat van summer. Okay. You got Louis? You got Louis V one too? I did, but that's, I got Gucci.

Yeah. I got a Gvonji one. I got a couple different buckets. It's not as bucky. Wow. This is the way I like. I like to wear this one like I'm a dapper French. A dapper French?

That's what you think dapper French? You sure it's not the 80s. We get you a tracksuit. I can do that too. Yeah. That shit is five to me. I'm 46. Bro.

We sit around. What are you talking about? I like that shit. I like, I watch Payton Fool and be like, them niggas had that shit on. At Midnight Boyspot on Insta and TikTok at Ringiverse on Insta, Twitter, Facebook, and TikTok. Jomi had a real.

Real, not Ring of Verse related, but Jomey had a real triumph on the socials. That was a banger last night. Just a little moment of genius, you know, the recording Talk to Thrones. I'm like, there's no way CR knows about the Jalen Brown trade. Keep the cameras going, you know, let's let them know. Then you popped into the room. You're like, does he know? We're like, nah, pod engine getting there.

Cameras are still rolling. We get his reaction. Went crazy. Jomey, that's the genius, man. Yeah, this is, you see art where everybody. else just sees nothing. Everything is content, unfortunately. The real

endorsement of that was the retweet from Simmons. Oh, the quote. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Bill quote tweeted it and then went, hey, you guys can't see my reaction until tomorrow. But if you want to see CR's reaction, they got it. They started off Bill's podcast

this week talking about it. Jomi got a shout out. Oh, I do what I can. So, so Jomi moving on up? This is Jomi. Kaleek was talking about it not too long ago, I mean, last night actually, how you've changed since you got your own place. I got to be real. Sometimes it feels like you don't want

Joni to like step out a little bit. I love it. I've been trying to get him to step out for a year. This is like the face. Not because literally you're always like, but you change it. I'm like, we want our niggis to grow. We want him to change.

It's true. I've been trying to do it for, I just didn't know that it was going to be the apartment that was going to be the catalyst. I thought it was going to be something else or somebody. No, he got up from under the Parents.

You're going to be something y'all got her out of here. I thought she was going to. Hey, hey, hey. No, Cuddy. Come on this guy, man. We're on YouTube, like, comment, subscribe, share.

You can watch every midnight boys episode, every House of Our episode on YouTube. com backslash at Ring Reverse and also on Spotify programming reminders. Tomorrow, the House of Our continues their House of the Dragon deep dives going deep, deep, deep. So they're giving you two episodes.

They're giving you talk to thrones, and then they're coming back and giving you the deep dives. There's so much to deep dive in Westrose. Yeah. What's the most deep diveable property that's out there? Maybe loaded, probably, probably. I was about to say Lord of the Rings.

No. Star Wars probably, too. I was going to say Star Wars. You think it's Star Wars? There's so many. Can I be honest with you about the Star Wars stuff, though? There's a lot of lore for Star Wars. But as far as lore that the fans want, I do feel like it starts to get in.

But that's the, that's like the in-joke-glob-shito stuff where we're like, okay, what are we even doing when we're talking about this guy? I'll put it to you this way. When you are at a point as a franchise where a company could be like, hey, yo, you know, you know, all that lore we've been selling y'all for like 30 years? Nah, it's done. We got new lore. You can't compete. Game of Thrones got one.

Lord of the Rings got one. Star Wars, you like, shit. I don't know. We should have, we had, we had, we had, we had, mantle wars. Mantle Wars. We should have lore wars. We should have lore wars. This is not fandom wars.

Okay, guys, because we don't, I'm just talking about just how deep your lore goes. But the quality of the lore, too. Well, quality of the lore as well. like what lore matters, like where it is, so it's going to be Lord of the Rings. Star Trek is going to have something to say here. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

Star Trek is going to have something to say here. And not all of the fandums are going to be represented in the quality. I'm going to get my weep shit off, you know, Dragon Ball. Has a lot of lore. A lot of lore. A lot of lore.

The question is the quality of the lore, the depth of the lore, like, seriously, can you go to like, is your 10th or 15th biggest character like a big deal? But also, what are we talking about? What's the YouTube space like? The content creators, like, can your lore videos really get the people going?

Yeah. Or do people not give a shit? Right. Come on. Wow. Are we doing, like, separate comic book characters in the lore? You can't just do DC in Marvel. It has to be.

It can't do because that's too much. Like, you have to do contain universes of the Avengers lore, X-Men lore. Right. Batman lore. That's the only way to make it fair. Because if you just did comic book stuff, then you're, you know, you're talking about thousands of writers. There's all, you know, all that different type of shit. What does Quentin Tarantino count?

Like, does Tarantino lore? You can do it? Because he's got a whole, he's got a whole world that he's created if you wanted to. I don't think that he's going to stand up. No, he's not going to stand up, but he does have a like, like, oh shit. Like, I'll say there's a lore there. Have we established that his movies are all in the same, like, universe? Allegedly.

There are three of them for sure. Yeah. Right? So, so, like, so Pope Fiction and Reservoir Dolls are definitely in the same universe. Yeah. Okay. Definitely in the same universe. Kind of?

Kill Bill. I'm not sure. I don't know. But like those two, and then maybe Jackie Brown, maybe Jackie Brown. Nah, nah,

what's the third one? Because I know Wizard of Dogs is, like Mr. Blonde is somebody's brother in Pulpiction. Oh, hold on, hold on.

You know what else might be in that universe? When you think about it, true romance might be in that universe. Because in Reservoir Dogs, he says you used to do something with Alabama. And, of course,

the girl, in true romance is named Alabama, so maybe that's the same person. Maybe, maybe, because for people who don't know, fucking movie, Neanderthal, dumbasses. Yeah, they say rewatch fools. Well, whatever. The people who don't know, Quintaritino wrote the script for true romance. Yes, he wrote the script for true romance, directed by Tony Scott.

But look, all of that, lore wars is great. But to your point, he does have a lore. There's a lore. I don't know. What would be the other movie, though, that would be, if it's not the name. It would just be those, too. Yeah. No, because if you start really get,

you want to know who actually has the lower, Pixar has a lot of war. Oh, Pixar's got deep lore. You'd have to do the same thing you did with Marvel and DC, though. Like, Toy Story. No, Pixar War is... Nah, it's five Tor Story movies,

so they have their own lore. If you do Toy Story and Wally, I don't know, maybe, we'll think about this. We'll think about this. I want to, who should we have guests for lore awards? Should this be Voss? This could be Voss.

Who knows their lore better than Voss? Voss. We put Voss on. we put somebody with Voss. Rob Mahoney. This is the CR host. Is this where you bring up yours? CR host this one.

But lore wars, but we do have to think more. We'll get some barbecue and talk it over. Because to Charles' Maybe genre-wise, we could do sci-fi lore, fantasy lore, like comic book lore. But we have to figure out how you define

the lore because if you did all of Pixar, then Pixar is like fucking weird. But if you do it by fantasy, it's like then you get the it's top have you got Game of Thrones you got Lord of the Rings and after that Yeah I mean yeah Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I mean

There's a lot of stuff there's some stuff that people Want is wheel of time here All right Real time is deep is real time deep man It's like you know once again we're talking about The depth of your lore If I go outside I'm like hey yo you want to talk about some wheel of time lore My fuck is like

You're not to set up the streets off fire But people love it the law now, you're talking about the broadness of the families. True. Yeah. So, like, that has to matter as well. Because if you can have all the lore in the world, if niggas don't care about your motherfucking little fucking motherfucking shit. All right. This is my last question. Then we've got to get to that episode.

What's the greatest black lore of all time? Oh, shit. Fictional, right? Fictional black lore. Fictional black lore. What's the greatest fictional black lore ever? Oh. I mean, there are honestly, we have a lot of

great stories, a lot of great black mythology, but to be real with you. We don't have a lot of like... That like the lore, uh, not really, though. Damn. Not really, man. Because I'm even trying to think directors, I'm like, the closest you could get is

kind of Spike, but it's not like, it's not a Tarantino thing. It's more of an aesthetic and a... I mean, Spike has a couple of movies that are interconnected. You know what I mean? A couple movies where the characters, like, are still around, stuff like that, but like, when you think about it, there's not... It's not... I'm like, I'm thinking like,

even in like recent years, you could do miles. But even then, like, a lot of that stuff is not tied to. Yeah. Google, we need the werewolf movie. Get on your Robert Eggers shit. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Well, if you're talking about, like, you know, the depth and stuff.

Think about the... Milestone is probably the closest. Oh, no, hold on. We have story. Yeah. Like, don't give me real much. Shout out to Milestone. Shout out to, like, but we have story.

Like, we have stories. We have mythology. We have all of that stuff. but in terms of like Octavia Butler has like brilliant stories and things that she told as a fiction writer right so all that's but like in terms of like this

lore that people are going to come back to that even we all come to sometimes there's a lot of things that could exist where we're still building that but if we were talking about like on the level of some of the stuff that we're talking about is probably not there. Shit. It sucks. Tough. It sucks. Not once again

I'm not saying that the stories, the mythologies and all All of that stuff and the creativity and all of the ingenuity and all of that stuff isn't there. It is. But like, you know. I mean, it's 2026 and they just let niggas on the beach. Right. So you got to have, you know, with dragons.

With dragons. The hufflepufflepuff crew. The Hufflepuff. Harry Potter, that's a lot of lore. Right. I thought that was. You did get very close. Hufflepufflepuff is very.

Is that what they call? No, it's Huffle Puff. Puff. Puff is this, that's the same shit, niggle Puff. Huffle Puff. Huffle Puff. is different. Then it's going to be

Hufflepuffie and then Huffle Lowe. Wait, what do you think the four houses are? And what? Harry Potter. I don't know what the fuck

y'all talking about. What are you? Let me try. Let me try. Let me try. Okay. Oh, I do know some of this. Okay.

Griffin Dorf. Griffin Dorf. That's right. That's right. It's Griffin. It's not Gryffindor. It's not Gryff. But we'll let it slide.

What's the actual name? It's Gryffindore. Okay, Gryffindor. I know. There's no. But what I'm saying is, Some of this is just pop culture. So then Hufflepuff.

Yes. Hufflepuff. The bad people are called something. The evil ones. Think about the animal. Can I give you a hint about what their animal is? What's their animal? A snake.

What do snakes do in the grass? Slytherin. Yeah. I'm not getting the last one. This is what you must feel like when Rachel can't name a Star Wars character. This is... Yeah, no, it's true.

It's true. Slytherin. And so... So the last one is... A bird? Gryffindale. Griffin... Close.

Not Gryffindale, but you're getting there. He already said Gryffindor. Is it... Griffin Hobbit? No. Ravenclaw. Ravenclaw is the thing? Yeah.

So there are no Griffin people in there. No, no. Griffin door... Uffapuff, Slytherin. Did I say Griffin door? Yes, that was the first one. He said Griffin Dorff. He said Griffin Dorff.

I don't know if I didn't... You said, like, Gannendorf. So what's the last one? Ravenclaw? Yes. Who's in the Ravenclaw? I don't know the Ravenslaw. No, niggas.

No, niggas. No, niggas. Well, fuck them then. On Wednesday, Budmash returns with Assassin's Creed, Black Flag. I don't even do the program. And the best games of the year.

Today show, we react to the latest episode of House of the Dragon. We are going to be spoiling almost everything. We're going to spoil lore wars later on. We're going to spoil everything that's in House of the Dragon, everything that's in Game of Thrones. But we always like to warn you about the stuff that we do, even though we shouldn't have to. Steve, take it away.

We're getting ready to talk about House of the Dragon. listening to a reaction podcast. The spoilers are coming. Also, we cannot begin our reactions without telling you what's happening. We do that by the Midnight Manifest. The guy who does that, is Chuck, Chuck taking away. All right, this is your Midnight Manifest for episode three of House of the Dragon,

directed by Claire Kilner, Sarah Hess. I'm not going to lie to you. We're recording this at 8, so I didn't write it. So we're going Lil Wayne style right off the top. of the dome. Rainira is queen. Her kingdom is a mess. She has to deal with religion, the high towers, rats, everything is falling apart. Damon wants to burn it all to the ground. We see him trying to parlay with the high towers. And guess what? By episode end, these high towers are like, you think you got Darren. You didn't. And Renera realizes it's not just as simple as sending the young boy,

To the wall. No. The war hasn't ended. And if she truly wants to be queen, she got to get these motherfuckers in line. That's been... Honestly, you've got to do this more. These motherfuckers are lying.

I loved it. Let's get it to the episode. Yo, so, then... Before I throw to you, I'm going to be honest. I'm so surprised. I love this episode. I'm riding with this. We were talking about it, I believe, on the X-Men podcast,

you know, some of the critics weren't that nice about the first four episodes. And when I watched this one, I was like, oh, this is Game of Thrones I love. Office Romance, like, Office Not Romance. This was literally like a workplace comedy. Kind of, yeah. It is, at its best, Game of Thrones to me is you have all these motherfuckers fighting over the throne. and that episode once they get the throne they're like, damn, it's not

it but bureaucracy. I think like, well, it's my turn to talk. All right. Well, you're looking at it. So it, it, uh, this is one of the best episodes of the show ever for me. Really? Yep.

I feel, I feel very similar. This is one of the, um, this one of the best episodes of the show ever to me. It's one of my favorite episodes of Game of Thrones that they've ever made. I couldn't agree with you more. I think as much as we, we love the war and the sword swinging of Game of Thrones. I think the show is at its best when it's doing two things.

One, being political, and two, investigating the interpersonal dynamics of the characters. And that's what this entire episode is about. I thought following her throughout, she's like, she's lost so much. She couldn't possibly win. It doesn't matter if the throne is still a loss. There's a brilliant line in this when she, She so, well, they say, um, you deserve justice. She says,

nigger, like, I will never have justice. I know it. They are acting their asses off. Yes. Like acting their asses off. She's like, I will never have justice. But whatever crumbs of it are left, I will devour. I'm like, yo.

Like, it, but that is an admission of how much she has already lost. like Rainer has already lost everything. And now she is like legitimately clinging, scratching and clawing for victory while she's got the throne. And then on top of that, has to rule with all these expectations. Every scene interrogates that.

And I thought it was brilliantly done. Yeah. She doesn't know what's going on in her own place. She has no clue. It's not her stuff. She just got there. And even if she were a seasoned monarch, like ruling is into details

and you can't be a hero to everyone. The crazy thing like for me was you finally see the person who for two seasons and change would be like, want to see her on the Iron Throne I want to see Renera

accept her destiny and get there and then once she gets there she's like, actually it's kind of whack I don't really know if I can do this and the acting to your point Emma Darcy last I mean we talked

about the last week. Like, she's basically in, like, every scene this, this episode. And she is, like, you can see the tiredness, the sadness, just the weight. You think, like, getting on the throne, you take the weight off your shoulders. Like, I'm finally here. But you can see it dawn on her from scene to scene, like, yo, I did not sign up for this. This is not what I thought this thing was. And there's a scene when she's, like, walking.

with the, like after the carriage with Masari, she's walking with the common folk. And you see like the circles under her eyes. She's been crying. She hasn't been sleeping. This is the worst thing that's ever happened to her. But it's the one thing that she always wanted. What they're doing this season is remarkable.

And I can't believe people aren't enjoying this because this is awesome. This has been like kind of one of the best directed episodes of the show that I've also ever seen. because in order to illustrate how bedraggled she is throughout this episode, there are so many creative choices about how to illustrate the way that she is seeing the world. Like every scene that you are ushered in between begins and ends with this sort of like out of focus, people behind her, people in front of her, and she isn't focused on anything. There's this amazing like over the shoulder thing that the camera does where every time that she is going from place, to place and people are demanding things of her.

People are asking things of her. And she doesn't really know how to cobble together the answers, let alone the resources to do these things. Everything that the show shows us about what is in her mind is perfectly illustrated on the screen. And in the castle itself. Everything is in shambles. There's furniture everywhere. When she's knighting three people, there's a bunch of just flags and tables and people like lying in the middle of the house. It's completely in chaos, and that's exactly what her world is now.

The, the, it's a fantastic observation about what they're doing with the cinematography as far as her and the blurring of people. People are already there. Like this entire, how can I put this? This entire episode really takes place in her mind and her emotional state. That's where we are. And people pop in when they're already there. So she's sitting there and there's a close up push in on her almost all the time. And you see that the war is like on her face.

And then all of a sudden the camera focuses and you see she's in a room for the people. Or there are people behind her and they're in the scene. Right. Or people walk into it. People are walking into her grief. They're walking into her pain. They're walking into her loss. They're walking into her confusion.

And towards the end of the episode is when she starts to, to ask more people for counsel. And then even when she does that, nobody's even, nobody's a help. She asks Corliss, say, Coilis, what do you think? He's like, I defer to my queen, useless. Like, she's in it by herself. She's alone.

And even, even Damon, Damon is like, he's, none of this bothers him. That's one of the worst things. One of the worst things that can possibly, one of the worst situations you can fire yourself in is when you are having the same experience with someone, And it's just not bothering this. It's just not bothered.

This is what you got to do. You got to kill this person. You got to do this. This is the way it's been done. It was like the recurring joke of being like, got to kill him. Got to kill him. And that's Damon being Damon. But he's calloused over, right?

Yeah. And also, he is probably more prepared to be a monarch in the sense of the reality of the monarchy. She is still incredibly like. optimistic, ambitious, and a little bit head in the clouds about what it means to actually rule. I push back on that slightly.

I think that Rainer is coming into the throne as if there wasn't a war happening. She kind of operates as if once the war is over, everything is fixing itself. And then I can just rule with grace and demeanor and whatever. But Damon's still operating as if there is still a war to be fought.

and he is looking to conquer more. You're making my point. My point is that he understands, like, what she wants to do is right away be benevolent. But, like, if she had ascended to the throne in the typical way, then that would have been okay, right? Let's say that Veseris dies, and he says he does what he should have done, which is go and, like, take out ads in the Westeroce Times and say, hey, this is he the queen, right? Well, then you can come, you can sit down, and you can be like, hey, the golden age of Westeros begins today. The golden age of Kingslanding begins today. We're the hottest country in the world.

Nobody's ever been better. You can start that right now. But if you get it the way she got it, you can't do that, right? And he knows that. So they're going through the same thing, but he understands, hey, you have to cleave off a bunch of cancer before you even can begin to think about your reign. Yeah. To begin to think about it. You want to feed the small folk.

You want to break it off with them. All of that stuff is cool. You got people to kill and you still have a throne to grab. You are the queen, but to solidify that rule, you have to step on some. next. And so he's prepared to do that. She's not because he's more prepared to rule in this

particular reality because he doesn't give a fuck about anybody by himself. I mean, what's genius about this episode is it's interrogating something that is so universal. The reason I think a lot of movies the TV shows in the Trump era

fail is that they're trying to say something about Trump when really what you should be saying is something about what does it mean to rule. To get to a place where you are a king or you are on the Iron Throne, you are no longer a good person. And this episode is constantly being like, to get that power, you had to wage a war. Get, you started the blockade.

So even if you are giving food back to the common folk, you are, like, you are complicit in why they are starving. It is this story about what happens when you get to that level of power where you're like, A, even though you might have not been the one who was actually on the battlefield, you did send people to their death. Even if you want this religious house to back you, what are you actually going to do? Do you believe in the religion or do you believe in yourself? And it's very funny that Damon's like, hey, we have dragons. We're gods.

And she's like, no, we're not. And I'm like, what, Ramiro, that's how you kind of claim. the throne though. Like she's still trying to be a like a benevolent ruler but I'm like you had to ride in on your dragons and scare these people to take back what you think is rightfully yours. It's not that

Damon, Damon is not morally right but for this world he is the character that's like you want it to be one way but it's this way. Well I think the thing is that their wives are different and this is the deal that drives the show to me, which is why House of the Dragon is such a specifically interesting

endeavor, firing blood, whatever, beyond the Game of Thrones universe. Their why is different? So this throne is yours, but why? For him, this throne is ours because we're gods. Yeah. And we could have more. We could go to Dorn, we could burn up Dorn. We can go to S.S.

You can't burn it and Dorn. Well, you can't burn up Dorn because they go into the thing. Yeah. And, like, you have to try. treat the doris, you have to treat them nice. Yep. Like the dawn is like, come burn us, hey, we'll go. We'll kill a dragon.

We'll kill a dragon. We'll go into ground. We'll let you do your thing. They ended up getting Dorned by marriage. Right. You have to treat them nice, right? But he still thinks he can do it. His why is because we're gods.

Her why is because my father said that this was mine. Yeah. Like her why is because like my dad chose me to rule. And he chose me to rule. above tradition. He put me above what's customary here, above whatever. My father said this.

My father said that this was mine. And so when she claims it, she claims it in the name of all the privilege that she has, but she also claims it in the name of Vezeris. She claims in the name of their relationship. She claims it in the name of everything that they went through, her past away mother, all of that stuff.

She claims it in the name of the trauma and the bond that she had with her father. And she's fighting for that at first. Now, that's gone. Now, the only thing she has left is the fight. And he is saying, we're more than that. Yeah, we'll be literally because he's like, yo, your dad gave away his dragon. Yeah.

Like, I don't think that, like, in the books, like, he, Belerion flies. And then, like, I mentioned some of the podcast, then Malarian was like, yo, this guy, kind of a loser. I'm dying. I've been around a long time, whatever. But he's like, you're, Your father abdicated his dragon.

He wasn't really about this for real. The dragons are what made us gods. Right. That's what you got to do. That's what you got to lock in on. Figure out all this, my dad stuff, my dad, this. He wasn't really one of us for real. He wasn't really a dragon.

I was like, yo, oh, my gosh. David. But what's- He got to cook it right? Real quick, I say this. I think that thing that the critics are not like in season three, I think I made that up. I apologize. Oh, did you make that up?

Yeah, I don't think it's, I'll think that's, wow. Fake news. That was you? I think it was fake news. Like, it has a 901. I have heard some critics be like, I've definitely,

I've definitely some people like, 91% on Ron. I'm not too, but there are other publications that are like, yeah, okay, but go ahead.

No, but I actually want to go back to what y'all are saying, which is interesting about Reneer's father, because there's such a fascinating scene with Allison. This is the,

where Allison is telling Rennira, because it's so true to life, where Reneer's conception of her father is a father and a daughter. So she looks at his rule through rose-colored glasses, where he was a king that was trying to be benevolent.

But Allison is like, hey, he had a whole world that he did not let us into. She's looking at him as his wife. And Damon is looking at him as his, like, brother. So there are these two people on her side who are just like, yeah, your dad gave you this throne, but he was not this perfect rule. that you are envisioning him as. Yeah. Well, I mean, also, yeah, that's what this episode is kind of about.

This episode is about the reality of ruling. And when she finally asks Allison, like, how did you do it? Allison basically was like, yo, you're going to do it by understanding that you are not all powerful and not, and it will not be beloved by everyone. And you're compromising a lot of yourself to do it. Right. And I think part of this wake-up call, part of the, the first Game of Thrones show was everyone seeing how people would fight for a throne that wasn't theirs. Right. Actually, a lot of those claims to the throne and the original Game of Thrones show are flimsy.

Right. Like, they don't really make any, like even the Baratian, it was usurped, right? And this show is about someone fighting for a throne that by the rule and right of this world kind of is theirs. Yeah. Like it, by all, by everything that has, she should be the queen. But that doesn't mean anything. Like the fact that, the fact that she's the rightful claimant based upon what her father said, not based upon the traditions, so she's the rightful claimant, that doesn't mean anything. No.

All the problems still rule. and it's still this land, this way is just a riding carcass. I mean, and the reason I think maybe why we were responding to this episode so much is that the genius of the original Game of Thrones in the universe that Martin creates is that he asks, what could be a boring question but opens up so much story, which is like, whoa, what would it actually be like to be a king at this time? How do you feed the common folk? where is the money coming from?

How does religion play a role? How does disease play a role? All the minutia that actual politicians in our world get tripped up on. And this, to me, this episode reorients the story back to that. Where it's like, I was asking earlier in the season, I was like, what does Renira believe in as a ruler? And I finally got an episode where we're like, oh, she really, it's flimsy ground. She did not. She was thinking so much to your point then about what it means to take back the throne

that she didn't have time to think, okay, once I have it, what are like, what laws do I believe? Yeah. What are we going to do this? What's my policy? How do I feed you people? Like none of that. It was all about sitting on that throne and for her to be there on there and feel empty. Just like, that's great storytelling.

Yeah. I mean, and look, there are a lot of things that she just didn't know, right? Because there are a lot of things that are different. She couldn't have known that she's a broke-ass queen, right? She couldn't have known there was going to be racks everywhere. The rats appearing all episode was a great. Amazing imagery. But, you know, all of this is the consequence of this war.

This war is not about these people. Like, another thing that's happening in this episode over and over and over again is she is reminded that she has emiserated them. her no not like the ceres or damon or or or agon or anybody like that she as a ruler of um an adversarial house decided to institute a blockade yeah and that blockade emiserated those people like she did it she closed the straight and like so and like in that in that situation she leveraged people's misery and their economic misfortune as a war tactic. So when she's talking to the guy at the end, great little scenes, right?

She's talking to him and he goes, yeah, maybe if you give them enough food, if you give them enough scraps, they'll forget that you're the reason why they're begging it in the first place, that it was your blockade that did this. And the noble's not even mad about it. He's just like, hey. Oh, no. Like he's like, oh, go to my house and take my goal. Nothing that you can do in this moment is.

going to it's going to change at least instantaneously the years of misery that these people have gone through because your fucking family is fighting tormentor life though when we look at like economic policies that are enacted in our country

it is so funny where it's like people have such a short memory that is like yo it takes four years eight years for people to forget you give people a little check you give them a little thing back, and they forget that this party or these politics or this economic system took your money from

you, and they're giving it back to you like it's a present. But one scene that I was like, oh, this to me was the centerpiece of the episode. It's why you cast, sorry I don't know the actor's name, Corliss, but... Oh, yeah, Sea Snake, yeah.

The scene between Corlis and Ranira Steve Toussaint. Steve Chish, phenomenal. Just phenomenal. He was like, dog, yo kids was bastards. I lost everything

backing you. And the minute you get power, you can't even do this. I was like, this is phenomenal. This is everything this series is like leading to. I thought that shit was. I got to be real, man.

Did you read it as racial? I did. I did too. I did. I read, I read, like, I read that as like, the black people talking to the Democrats. Like, I, like, I'm, like, I'm, I, I read, but tell me about, tell me about Leah. Like, sitting there and like, hey, man, you know, these are my sons. And the way, like, she's looking, she's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure.

I see the vision And then when Knight's Adam, Adam of Hole, right? Not Adam Valerian, right? Even though in the room when she was talking where when, when Colus was talking,

she was very like upsetting and open to it. So then when he's talking, he's like, yo, it kind of, like, what's wrong? Like, I literally, my house is burned, my wife, my kids, everything in service of you.

And you can't give me this. And she's like, yeah, but think about, how to look if one of the first things I do is give these you know these bastards your name I'm like yo this is very much yeah the way to your point the way I read that was that and there's I'll speak for myself and I won't put this on any of the midnight boys one of the most enduring tenets of like

this invention of white supremacy has to do with the two difference of it. One is of praise and the other one is of shame. Right. So we get that the praise isn't the same.

Like white people are praised for things that we don't even get recognized for. Right? Like there's there, you go out of, because white people in this Western world, this Western white supremacist's world are valuable, then society finds a reason to value them. That is almost understood. The thing that's really enraging, though, is that the shame isn't the same.

Because there's this thing that you understand, like, for me at least, as a black person, that you have to earn your way into value with white society. You have to earn your way into it, right? You have to be able to run really fast. You have to be, you have to prove your value and your worth

and your counterparts don't have to. The thing that really drives at home, though, is what about when a 15-year-old white man does something terrible? Like, what about when he fucks up? Oh, yeah. It's good.

Like, what about when he, gets drunk and takes somebody's life or doesn't get drunk and take somebody's life, wait until you see how a community rallies around him to find the value in the future of someone who has fucked up. It is the Zach Fox tweet where it's like when a white man kills all of his family. There's a way that the media, they find the best photo of him. Graduation. Oh, this was a family man.

When a black person does something that's not even on that same level. It's a mugshot. It's a smoke shop. And like, this is why I always give love to Orlando Jones and this, this monologue that he wrote for American Gods because he talks about something that's so fundamental. And he was getting really, really, really direct in that show. And that's an underappreciated performance there.

But he says, you know, when a white person does something bad, you look at it as someone, it's a good person who did a bad thing. When a black person does something bad, you look at it as someone showing you who they really were the entire time. Because that idea of who we are is intrinsic to the project of Western white supremacy that is built

upon capitalism, right? In this situation, they're litigating that. In this situation, he's saying, he's right, he's got her. He's saying, yo, I, when everyone was saying the same thing about you, I vouched for your shame. Held it down.

Like I was the one that was that like not only that like I named your bastard my heir. Like we're here. We're the same. And then you're going to tell me that my shame is worse than your shame. You're going to tell me that my folly is worse than your folly when I sacrifice for yours. Like, my shit was burnt up for yours. All of this stuff was burnt up for yours. And when I looked at that image of a black man looking at a white woman and telling her that and her not understanding her clinging to her laws, him clinging to his reality, there was no other way for me to read it.

That's, but can I also say, and this is what, once again, phenomenal episode. The scene works because you have the scene of Damon, said, but we are gods. And to Ranira, her policies are like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, we're not gods. We have dragons, but my father believed all this stuff. So in that moment, she's like, I'm not like you, Damon. I have these morals.

But when she is faced with a situation where she has to be like, oh, I have to use my power right now to do the right thing, she is closer to Damon than she realized. She is closer to that. view of supremacy because it's like oh actually when I

have a bastard it's different when you have a bastard but let me tell you something I don't think Damon would have done that well Damien would have killed him so I think Damon in that situation would have done whatever he wanted to do legitimately I think if

Damon were in the situation that she was in I think he would have done whatever whatever solidified his power or made him feel good that's what he would have done like you're right But she's a Targaryen, so that means that part of her is like me trying not to be a misogynist. I try every single day. I do.

It's an effort. People laugh when you say something like that. But like I was raised by a man who was born in 1955 in a town with 2,500 people in it. Some of the ideas and beliefs that he has that he injected into me, the best thing I can do is try. The best thing I can do is listen. And if you get with someone from some other group or whatever and they actually try, that's really all you can ask. You can kick their ass for when they fuck it up as much as you want. Like we could kick white people's ass.

We could kick, we could kick their ass. But if they are trying, like sincerely trying, then that's all you can really ask, right? Yeah. But it's so funny because it was like, I remember this happening. Sorry, we get up a lot of the show where when they were doing the break. down to like, oh, how did how did Trump get in office? And they're like, look at how many

white women voted for Trump. And I'm like, hey, yo, a white woman, white before. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, they are going, like, you, in that moment with, with Reneira, I was like, oh, she is always going

to be a Targaryen. Yeah. First. Right. Where it is like, when you think about just how power is enacted, and this is why it's so interesting having

two women in Reneira and Allison fighting for this throne, it is like, Reneer is in a situation where she's not wrong. Her claim to this throne because she is a woman will always be in doubt.

So she always has to think, if I give this to Corlis, what does this say about me? Are they going to view me as weak? As a woman, she has to be like, the show's not saying, will you back a black man? but you realize in this why they

put in that situation. And she's not in, and the reason why to your point, you feel something for her is because she's not as powerful as Damon would be in view as him. She's not as powerful. Would Corliss even ask Damon? Damon would be like, fuck they, they're not.

Well, I mean, he might. He might ask him. You can't call us, you can't call Ranaris' kids pastors. No, no, he would have never done that. And then that's what the scene does at the end of it. At the end of it, he treats her

in a way he would not have treated a more established male monarch. True. In the end of it, even though his indignation is completely righteous and right, he does something that he would have only done to a woman. Yes. He legitimately in front of everyone. Yells at her, insults her dead children. The whole thing, he asserts whatever privilege that he can over her,

which is his male privilege, in that moment. He gets big. He gets threatening. He leans in. Everything changes. He puts manness on top of her. So they have this competing and like dueling trauma. But to your point,

I'm sorry for everybody. Part of the way that scene reads raises a major, major part of it. That's incredibly valid. But going off what you say, what I love about this is it makes everyone and Reneer complicated because not only is that scene dealing with race,

when she's talking to Allison, there is a like, hey, yo, you don't get to be a girl's girl no more. You got like, there's a thing where it's like when you're sitting in that seat, it's like, hey, yo, my dad's dead. Taking it fairly well, by the way. Allison kind of understood. No, Allison understands, but it's like, Allison understands almost too well where he's like, hey, yo, sis.

We can't dab up after this. Yeah, when she pulled up the first time to the little tower, whatever. And Allison and Helena were looking at her like, what are you doing here? Yeah, we're not cool. You can't just pop in.

She looks there. She goes, you kill my father, man. Yeah, like, come on. We're not cool. It's like, yeah, I get that you got problems and the shit his wife for you and stuff like that.

And me and my dad, we weren't on the same. You know what I'm saying? But you did kill my dad in front of everybody. What the fuck you want for me? Every single time she walks back in the room because it's like, Renera is searching for someone who will be her friend,

understand, she goes, yeah, and also we got your son. I was like, you know. You just talk about that. Of all time, Game of Thrones scenes, connect three scenes here, throw it to you guys.

Number one, this episode starts with Damon and Ulf and Hugh. Off and Hugh, like getting the High Tower Army and forces to submit to them. And the whole time in that scene,

you're waiting for something to go wrong. You're waiting for something to go wrong. Brilliantly shot. What's this guy's name? Ormond. When Ormond pulls his sword, the sound design on the pulling of the sword is like, they show you how sharp the sword is.

Like you know that war is one misstep, one misunderstanding away. This is very tenuous. The whole time, even when Damon goes, I almost forgot. you're like, this is where they're about to fight. Yeah. Like, you know what I'm saying?

Like, I almost forgot. But he doesn't. Like, he gives him the kid. And so you think they avoided it the whole time, they didn't. They didn't avoid it. He is fighting. He is, that is war. He, they have, because part of war is espionage and subterfuge and all of that stuff, chicanery.

So he gives him the wrong prince. Then when that's realized at the end, in the moment where, where she walks in. Man, poor Reneira. Reneira in this whole thing, Renara, like, she's looking, she's like, man, what the fuck else could go wrong? You don't know this boy?

You don't know this boy. That's like, that's not your- But she reads it on Allison's face. Yeah. Because you're the mother. Exactly. Yeah. Like, their relationship, again,

is the crux of the whole show. For her to look at the boy, look at Allison. See, Allison looking like, I love seeing that boy, damn. Yeah, she's a little niggia. Like, just with their eyes and she's like, this is not your son?

And the whole thing kicks off. That's like, it could have been easier for Allison. Just be like, yeah, I've never seen this white hair boy. My son got red hair. I don't know who this person is. Just for her to like take a look, see that Allison's like, huh? And then just like go into it. Just like deaf piece of storyteller.

I will say, I was wondering, damn, if y'all could, if y'all could bleach hair. like this whole time, I'll be walking around Westrose like Cisco. I'm like, I'm a Targaryian bastard too. Fuck it. They just go they're going they're just going to fuck you up when they find out though. Right. Like you know what I'm saying?

I thought about that too because like when they when they because Egg was shaving his shit so people didn't know. They're going to look at you and then you're going to be like yeah man I'm I'm Benny Targary and I'm from you know, I'm from the west side situation. I'm the west side Targary's yeah they just going when you when somebody

all of a sudden there's going to be like a I don't know, some Kingsguard or something that's going to be there having a drink and they'll be like, eh, and then they're going to just cut your dick off. Wait, this reminds me, dog, the funniest see, I was dying. We're near as asking them, hey, yo, what y'all want your names to be? Off is like, Oof Targary. Absolutely. She's like, oh, but once again, though, too, you got to a point that you guys are making,

she is still Targaryen. She's still like, like, you put your life on, if I'm Oaf, I'm. You made some promises. I get a house, you get my wife, like, you know, she left what's going on. When they was like, yeah, see the way the budget set up right now. Yeah, it's not really, you know, I'm going to have to get back to you. These are people who are putting their lives on the line for you with dragons every single day. You kind of just like, all three of those nights did not get what they wanted.

But here's the thing, and this is what I think is brilliant about the show. I think a lesser show would have been like, Reneer is evil. Reneer got the throne Absolute power corrupts absolutely And what it does Is that every turn it shows you No actually What it takes to be a ruler

A queen day to day It chips away at you a little bit Your morality, your beliefs, your promises So you don't start off All the time is like super evil It is just like little by little This foundation that you thought was so strong Starts to crumble

because to your point, every single point someone asks her for something and she realizes how powerless she is because she can't really give it to them. Yeah, it's a trade-off. Every single thing is a trade-off. And there are people who are making it harder for you

to do your job. Yep. Right? There's dissension within your small counsel. Your mistress of whispers and basically your sergeant-at-arms are having a power struggle. They're not on the same page. Corliss is like,

he's lost everything and he is understanding of the pop and circumstance of this but he's dealing kind of with this new family she still doesn't know how to relate to Bella like she is basically ignoring her this there's this

like bubbling of trauma and mistrust that a good monarch is supposed to know how to deal with you're supposed to navigate that and when we look back at even functioning monarch They always had a good hand, always in this world.

Yeah. They always had a good hand. And they also always had people who were extremely good at their jobs. If you even think about Littlefinger or somebody's, they were extremely adept, dangerous. Yeah. But adept. And that means, though, that when you needed something, you could go to them and they could deliver. She doesn't even have that.

No. But also, it's, this is history. A, when you take a throne by. revolution Yeah. You have to the amount of work you have to do

to get your government back up and running hey, that's where the real shit happens and it's also And it's also Would you like to say something about the 14th

July movement or cash row or anything like that? Like you want to talk about the difference between revolution and governing go ahead and piss all the

like piss everybody piss all the social social stuff. First of all I'm shout out I know this has been out for a while I'm listening to the revolutions

podcast. nigger, you be listening to these revolutions like, damn, they threw, like, they did the shit, they got back the crowd, and then every single time they're like, yeah, they started willing and motherfuckers started fighting them most of their selves. Everybody's like, the army is like, you know what? Maybe it's my turn. Every time.

And also what I think has always been in the show is like, and we've touched on it, it is not lost on me that almost every single time Renera is undermined in this episode, it is by a man, where it is like, yes, technically you are, you have the crown, you are the queen. But it's like, what's the title for the church, the septent? Oh, the seventh. The faith of the seven. He's like, come on.

Even that lord, there's the lord who's like standing and like looking at her. And the way he's talking to Reneer is like, I don't respect you. So you are in every scene, you're just like, damn, Renera finally got everything. she ever wanted, and there are still these men that are beneath her that are like, but you're not a man. There's also wonderfully illustrated the fact that she gets her period in the middle of this episode, and it is a massive, painful inconvenience that she does not tell anyone but other women in her room about.

I hated that scene. Really? I loved it. No, I love it. And it go for a scene. Well, it's because it perfectly illustrates the fact that, like, even if she were to even remotely show. that she is in pain or

like bewildered by this people are going to write her off there's a part of it and this is this is like you know because here's a thing oh boy what are you going to see you know that he's trying every day so I but so here's the thing so here's the thing

if you've lived with a woman or been around a woman for a long time I just have to say this and this is not this is sometimes not okay to say right but you know that there are certain times where she's more irritated. That's true.

I know. Like, where, we're trying carefully. You know that there are certain times where she's more irritated. Now, there's two things. Number one, don't bring that up because you shouldn't. And then number two, also kind of understand that that, even that being a real thing is not an excuse for you to say that actual. things that are

bothering her are only bothering her because of that. Because sometimes you know that, hey, a little bit more space, I might even send you

to get a massage. I might, when I know that that's the deal, I might make sure that that's a cool time, especially if there are other stressors that are involved in this relationship,

right? Right. But you never want to say the only reason why you're on my ass about this is because that just going to make everything.

How long did you take you to learn that? Lesson. Years. Okay. Years. Because you know, because you know somebody after a certain point. But when you watch this episode and then that happens, two things. Number one, she's feeling discomfort. Like the burden of her womanness is not just in the way people are treating her. There's a biological component to it in this particular moment. You feel your body is turning against you. And she's got, she's got to sit in that. in that small council meeting and deal with the inefficiency that's inside of there, but also she's drinking a tea that might have a little milk of the poppy in her

or whatever the fuck is. She refuses it. She refuses it, or they give it to her and they say, this is for the cramps. She's in pain. Everything about her womanhood right now is painting her. But I will say one really smart choice in that seed is if you think about it,

if it's a king in that scene, he don't even got to worry about whether he's going to take a sword out or not. and she's like, damn sword. And, like, her mate is like, hey, is that? Not really conveying the message. Is that what you really want to be telling the people? And I'm like, oh, for something,

if Damon was on the throne, this nigga don't care. He's not thinking about whether he has a sword or not. So I want to go back to the period thing really quickly before we leave it. Because look how we just tiptoed in and out of that, because we want to be sensitive, right? But the reality is that women have periods. Yeah. And they have them.

And a lot of times when they have them, there's discomfort that goes along with that. This show is legitimately putting that discomfort on Front Street and saying all it is and her body too. Yes. And further to her isolation. Right. And I think that they did that so that we could talk about it. The fact that we do have different experiences than our female counterparts. And there are sometimes things that we are.

that they are dealing with that we could not possibly understand. It's true. What? I'm not nervous talking about periods. By the way, I mixed up my, the 14th of July is actually the,

that's the French Revolution. The 26th July is the Cuban. So shout out to. But, no, it's not that I'm uncomfortable talking about periods. I literally was just like, damn, y'all a nigga is so obvious because this is literally just the like,

it's the easy metaphor. It's like, damn, a woman could never be president. What's you gonna do when she has her period? I was like, all right. But even that, but here's the deal, though. Even that, though. It just felt like an obvious, but like, very... I know, but even that, though, if we just talk broader,

even that, though, is like, a man can never be president. What is he going to do with his aggression? Yeah. I mean, like, what is he going to do with the fact that he has this toxic aggression to where, like, you get, you got to get fucking, think about, like, you're in high school, and the girls are the only ones

that are fucking the voice of reason. The dudes are like, let's fucking get screwdrivers, sharpen them and stick each other and to see who may like just dumb shit. What's going on in your house? What hunger games ass?

We used to fight. Y'all niggas don't do that shit no more, but we used to fight. Wait. And you want to know. You're going to have to cut this. You want to know why? Why?

Because the niggas started shooting up schools. That's fine too. But, But even that, though, no, leave that in. Even that, though. Even that, though. That, like, proclivity for violence and violent outbursts, we never question, well, what if Dylan Klebold or elected president or somebody who has that in them?

That person has a nuclear code. We get hung up on the fact that women have periods and go, well, what is a woman going to do when she has her period in the White House? The fact men do violent, heinous shit routinely every day for fun all the time. And we never question. What if one of those gets in the White House? One of them is in the White House because we think that the system can control and deal with maleness in a way that we don't think that it can control and deal with ladies, which is, I'll say, what's happening in this episode? What's happening in this episode is she is, these problems are systemic. She thought that she could be better than these problems as a person

when these problems are about dysfunctioning systems. Yeah. When you were talking about earlier, like what people think they need from government and stuff like that, I will give the framers of the United States of America one, one deal. One real, real big up is they had a revolution. Yeah. Then they took a crown. And they were like, the only way this works is if there's no crown.

Like, the only way that this works is if the only thing that we acquiesced to is the actual rule of law. And they go, okay, so let's, and they then made these laws to exclude women, to exclude black people, to exclude a lot of people. But the only, but even amongst themselves, they were like, we can't really leave it to who's going to be a good ruler or who's not going to be a good ruler. we have to have laws that exist in perpetuity that are actually bigger than all of us. And they really, they made a system for themselves, but they also ceded power to that system.

They said that in some regard, and there was all kinds of arguments over this guys between people who didn't believe in democracy and people who are like, all that stuff's there. But in some regard, they were like, we kind of have to leave this up to the rule of law. and at some point consent of the governed or it will never work.

And so a lot of the stuff that she's running into is the fact that the system is broken in Westrose and it always has been, it's never really worked because you can only really take it by force, you can only really maintain it by force and because of that it's death in the thought. I mean, also all the people are like, at this point in time they're like,

if you're even a lore, a minor lord or common folk, you're like, dog, this throne has changed hands so many times. Yeah, you're just the next thing. That was some G shit. Where she's like, and this is what y'all people have been eaten. That's pretty great. I was like, damn. But, yo, Reneira, to your point, I think what I loved about this episode of Reneer is running up to the fact of like, it's so true to life.

You think once you have power, like, when I have power, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do that, I'm going to do the third thing. Then you get into the seat. And you're like, oh, okay, this is exactly why I have even less power. than I thought I did. Then you got who you think are people who are under you telling you what you should be doing. Yeah. Like, I learned the limits of power when Obama became the president. I used to think the president could do any, and I was studying on presidents.

But then Obama would become president. And I was like, all, you know, we all get used boxes now. And it's like, I, they're telling Obama a lot of stuff he can't do. Yeah. He's running into a lot of things. And I'm not even talking about from a legislative standpoint. obviously you know that they're checks on the power of president. I will just say after the last couple of days,

I don't know how true that is anymore because you get the New York Times where you just, you get the alert where you're like, the Supreme Court upholds, like, upholed this. And then they're like, actually they just did it. Well, well, this is the deal. Once again, if you care about the larger thing, and that was the, that's the deal.

If you care about the larger thing, There are all kinds of mechanisms to where someone who doesn't care about the stability of the system could just assert themselves. Yeah, yeah. But we never thought that anyone will really do that. Yeah.

Because, I mean, especially not the nigger that they put in there, right? So we never thought that, like, somebody like that would really do that. But someone went, oh, fuck it, I can still do this. I can still do it that way. They're holes in it. That's supposedly how you make the system better,

but it's not. Okay. Back to Westeroos real quick. All right. So the coales thing, I don't know what happens with him Oh no Corliss might be out

He got no money Well he has money But like a bunch of his fortune is gone Yeah You basically say Your kids are bastards Deal with it And he got two dragons in his house

If I'm him I'm like you're not talking to me I got two dragons I'm like what the bus Like Hey I don't think Reneer can

I mean here's what Like Hey yo damn He was tired of talking to me crazy you know, I can't kill him because, you know, that's my family and whatever. I had to go, it's your family, too. That was, you know, your first wife.

But, you know, something's got to give. You know, he can't talk to me like that. Again, if David was there when he said that, just like his brother, his head's gone, I would be worried for Corliss. I ain't gonna lie to you. There's some Wu-Tang clan shit. This is, the family, like, it's fractures.

It's fucked up. Nobody wins. Okay. Then where do we, we didn't talk about the fact that obviously the high towers are still on the rampage. Yeah.

But that was great too, though, because to our, like, we were talking about the all episode, she was like, yo, man, I did it. It's over, man. Man, it's nice to be in charge. It's not nice to be in charge, but at least the war is over.

Actually, you're not going to believe this Rainier. But they, not only do they, you not have Darren, who's got a dragon. They out there running wild. in Tumbledton. You got to get back on a horse. You got to lock back in.

I felt so bad for that kid. Oh, we must be scared for his life. Because you have to think about it. You're like, damn, they bleached my hair. They're about to kill my mom. She's looking at his roots. Yes. He's like, they didn't even do it right.

He probably fucking every day looking in the mirror like, shit, man. My motherfucking, my brunette shit not showing, right? Nick of your kids was brunettes. Bastards. your son was a bastard your son lived and died

a bastard this d'ning was getting this shit off that's my favorite scene ever he looked at her like I came off everything for you he's like listen he's like fucking I'm sick of it you have you ever been around somebody that's sick of the bullshit

exactly to the point to where they go you know what not only these lies don't work no more they're not working anyway no fuck you fuck you I watch this my parents used to go through this. Mama's in town right now. Mama, I could say some of the stuff

that you said during arguments. But I'm going to go ahead and say. I'm going to go ahead and say it. I've got to say it. Mama's a... So, my grandmother was in a relationship with a man. This is your mother's mother? No, no, my father's mother.

My father's passed away. My grandma, mama did pass away. So my girl i've never forget this i never i gotta share this with you guys so my grandmother when she died she was the relationship had three kids with a man who was married right so like when you guys are all like when people are all high up on their moral hog and all

that stuff like that i keep trying to tell you i'm not from that right that's not what i'm from like technically i shouldn't even be a latin because like the Lathen family the big mom and big papa had nine girls and only two boys and I come from one of the girls right so it's like the Kennedy thing where like

there's Sloshbirds there's Shriver's there's there's all of that stuff like that like there's but like you're Kennedy but right the reason why I'm a layton is because I am a snow I am like a bastard like I'm born out of that right and so

that was not known to me until this argument in our between my parents my mom had friends you hang out of my friends my mother is a very free-spirited woman and stuff like that and my mother my dad goes

like I don't want you hanging out with them women like the women is hoes and my mother went Terry your mother's a hoe it's like your mom your mother your mother's a whore

And he was like I'm like What are they I'm like what are they talking about? Like what are they mean? I'm jumping for cover Like not me I'm like that's the coldish shit

And she was so calm She was like he was like he was like What? She's like no your mother Layed down with a married man Popped out children And then popped out more Like how could you

How could you be hung up on that Your mama's a hoe And I'm sitting there like, wait a minute, what? Amazing. I've got a couple questions. I'm like, I'm like, what happened? She was like, she was like, yeah. She's like, you, he's like, Van, how many pictures do you see?

This was a cold line. She's like, how many pictures do you see of your father with his father? Whoa. I was like, oh my God. Oh, my cool. I haven't seen Barryman. I was like, she was like, she was like, she was. like, yeah, yeah.

That's some of the most gangster that's, that's one of the most thing where I'm like, you should have to be like, yeah, I lost that one. There's no way. There's no way

coming back from that. He stands there. He's like, fuck. And he walks out. And I'm, and I'm, and I'm, and I'm, like, and I'm, and I'm,

and I look at her, and my mom will always put a bow on it. I look at her, my mom will go, it's not fair, son. particularly where we live at and how we live, to judge, categorize, or presume a woman's access or choices.

We all, she's like, look around this place. She's like, look around this place. And she's, I'm just not going to let your dad do that. I'll remind your dad.

And she goes, your daddy loves a hoe, by the way. Like, your daddy loves, like, like, you know,

like, you know, like, your daddy loves hobs, by the TV. Vans mom is awesome. I'm not going to let your father do that. Okay? Your daddy loves him.

That's incredible. That's the greatest thing I've ever heard. But, but, you know, it's funny, if I, if I brought it,

she might not even remember that she did this because she probably wasn't in, like, but I'm like, that's the way I find, and I went up, I talked to Ebney, like,

I had a very, by the way, before my grandmother died, it's like, just so people know, before my grandmother died, like, she was like,

she had like, I sat with her for like three days while she was in the hospital and like she confessed to me because I don't think she knew who she was talking to so she's like she like was trying to maybe she thought that like maybe she thought that like she wasn't going to go to heaven or something

but she like I sat there for three days and she confessed she was like JT was playing of my my grandfather's name was JT like JT was playing on me and I didn't know and she goes but by that time I was, and I'm like thinking to myself I'm like, like,

like what is she saying? Like what is she trying to say? Like what is she trying to say? I asked my dad, my dad's like she's getting right. Just go back over there tomorrow. Go back over there. I sat with her for six hours the first day.

I think like three or four hours the second day. And the third day she died. Yeah, like but so like all of that stuff weighs really heavy. So when I watch some of these things or like when I defend some of this stuff particularly it's because like

what's the rose kind of remind me of Baton Rouge is bastards it's gangster shit is people who think they powerful but what they really not is people who unfairly meet checking your roots early death

checking your roots all of that shit like that family reunions where somebody comes in pregnant and then the aunties are in the corner counting the months back like like it's not to hit

It's like, there's nothing like going to a family reunion and the uncle show up with the new wife for the first time. And they like, and they like, look, she's like, that pregnancy don't look. And other people like, would y'all just let this man and this woman have whatever? All of this stuff. Remind me that. Okay, before we get out of here, before we get out of here, before we get out of here, before we get out of here, real quick, Supergirl. The numbers are in. Everything's happening.

Why are you laughing? What? What? It's crazy. It's crazy hate for me. Break this out. Why do you like it? You like this.

Come on, man. You like, why are you laughing? Why is that make you laugh? Wait, do you, y'all really want to know? I would love to know. I would love to know. Hey, motherfuckers was killing me where I was like, hey, yo, we got to demand more. If we don't demand more, this shit going to get bad.

And when it gets bad, they're going to be on our necks. We got the film bros. We are down bad. Niggas, you cannot tell them, niggas, shit. okay and I was telling y'all from the beginning you're like nah you're so you hard you hate everything you hate all these movies I'm like yeah because this shit is trash

and once we turn we're going back to the dark ages and I don't want to go but I was I was in the dark age so let me tell you something first of all the film bros they do their same shit right because they they'll always be that way they still shout out to the film bros they still eating each other alive over Disclosure Day

right right yeah honestly let them have let them have that so like they do they do they got their own fans And it is what it is, but it is a fandom. We talked about that. Yeah. I'll say this, though. We thought that this was, because this is James Gunn running the shit, what the expectation,

you're not wrong with anything that you said, but the expectation was that this was a remedy. That, like, putting an artur, somebody who is a director with a very distinct visual and storytelling style as the head of one of these joints and not a business guy. Shout out to Fagie, who's a creative. But at the same time, like that's someone who runs these movies like an assembly line. The remedy to what was going on before was supposed to be James Gunn. And it seems like it's not. Yeah.

If I'm going to be real, though. We only got, we only two movies in, but it seems like it's not. If you look at James Gunn filmography, I'm not saying it's bad. It is very, very singular to him. And I think what I'm realizing with the DCU, and I don't think this will be forever, if they continue, is that a lot of his movies after the first Guardians are a little shaky

in terms of just... I'm looking right now. The Suicide Squad? Peacemakers, Suicide Squad, Guardians of the Galaxy 2. Guardians 2 was weak. I give you guardians... So he's got...

Gardens of the Galaxy, the Belko Experiment, which is a movie that I like, he wrote that one. Guardians of Galaxy Volume 2, the Suicide Squad. Guardians of Galaxy Volume 3, and then Superman. And I don't know, since he found his... I've never seen this movie Super with Rain Wilson, but since he found his...

Have you seen it? Yeah, it's not great. Since he's found his stride, that's Guardians, Guardians 2, Suicide Squad, Guardians 3, and Superman. That's not bad, Charles. It's all right. Yeah. I'm not saying he's a bad filmmaker.

But he is a very, his vision is something where I'm like, it is of a space and it is of a time. The best way I can describe it, hey, yo, motherfuckers love Jarl Rule. Once 50 Cent came in, niggas don't want to hear Jarl rule no more. And I'm not saying James Gunn is Jarl rule. I'm just saying when you are of a time, aesthetically, right, visually, when that time goes away, is very, very hard to pull it back. We've seen the same thing with Drake right now. When that shit, when you had it for a moment and then it shifts, you usually don't get it back. That's fair.

But like the order of operations makes sense for him because when Disney fires him after Guardians 2 because of the tweets, then he goes off to DC to make Suicide Squad, which everybody loved and DC loved. And he's like, well, great. Well, since I'm not with Disney anymore anyway, like here's what I've got for a whole slate. Like if you want me there, you got me. The Suicide Squad was in the smash. I know it was released during the pandemic. Now, people, people, not people enjoy it. But it's a movie at that point.

Right. Because it was released during COVID. The only thing that you really judged the movie on was so that not you like that. Once again, I'm not saying James Gunn is a bad filmmaker, but I'm saying like, after Guardians, what is the movie that you can point to where you're just like, oh, this is a movie that the masses can enjoy in the same way a lot of the MCU movies are like. I would say Superman. Superman for sure. Like, I would say Superman, Superman got to 618, which was less than Manusil. I would say Superman was that.

But I would say overall, the James Gunn experience, by the way, we should also say that James Gunn is not the writer-director of Supergirl. Well, that's the thing, though. But that movie's filled with so much James Gun stuff. It feels like a James Gun impression of a movie. You know? I'm not saying James Gunn sucks. I'm saying like James Gunn is not a, is James Gunn a filmmaker that a 15 year old, a 16 year old, will feel like, hey, yo, I can see myself in him? Or is that like old people shit?

Is that 33 year old shit? Like, I mean, you gotta make movies. Yeah, I don't know about that, though. You got to make movies. You can't make movies only for 15 year olds. No, no, no. That's not what I'm saying. But what I'm saying is, is that when I saw Guardians for the first time, it worked on me.

so profoundly because it felt like it was for me. I was like, oh, this is something that is like new and exciting. And I was like so, I was like, what is James Gunn have next? I don't know if his movies still have that. If somebody coming to that to his movies now at the age that you were, feel like, do you think a kid is coming to Superman feeling like, damn, I've seen something new for the first time. I'm at the beginning of something and it's so exciting.

I don't know. if you watch something like Backrooms or Obsession, you can see a 15-year-old being like, I'm at the beginning of something and it's speaking to me, I want to invest more. James Gunn is investing in something where it's like,

he's making movies for us. I don't know if he's necessarily making movies for everybody. Right. So I'll say this. I'll say this to that. We've got to get out of here. Well, number one,

he's been around for the better part of a decade now. All right. So that happens, right? So you're familiar with his style, his aesthetic, all of that stuff. The backrooms and obsessions guys, they are kind of just getting here. So a lot of the people are finding their filmmaking appetite with them. It's kind of the same thing. You could say that those guys are probably more inspired by like a Jordan Peel.

People like the Jordan Peel and that type of aesthetic. Like that, obviously obsession is very heavily inspired by like Jordan Peel and that type of stuff. Right. But like even Jordan Peel now is on his third or fourth movie. So the question would be for anyone is if you watch Nope or even Us, is it going to hit you the same way that Get Out hit you? Well, I mean, no, because, well, it might, but maybe not because Get Out is made at a specific time at that filmmaker's life. And so if you can access that movie in the same way when you're 15 or 25 might just have to do with how into, film, how much you've watched, how much you've seen, and what is speaking to you at the time

that your entry point is. There's no way that, like, anything that Peel makes will influence some of these kids the same way that curve. No, but I agree with you. But I think when you look at obsession and backrooms, there's something thematically and narratively that is speaking to a generation where it's like, if you have a Superman and supergirl movie where kind of the spine and backbone of it is like, superman. man, it's punk rock.

Nigger, that's not something, like, it's, that's not, that's not, that's not the zeitgeist. And you, I mean, you created in 1938. Yeah, it can only be so. It's like, so, at some point, like, what you touched on it, though, but

James Gunn, older, these kids, I know Kay Parsons is like 21, right? Curry, Curry, uh, Curry Barker is, uh, 26. Yeah. Yeah, they're making movies for young audiences because they're also, yeah,

they're the young audience. But that's the zeitgeist. now, and I think with Supergirl, what a 40, 50-year-old man thinks is progressive about Supergirl, it's like, look at Supergirl, she getting drunk, and she's saying, fuck you, and look, and she's a party girl. Like, I can see a 50-year-old being like,

damn, the kids don't love is, and the kids be like, man, fuck the shit. Like, look, for me, I get it. I don't know necessarily that, like, and, you know, we have to do this with your podcasters, and the movies coming in very light box office, and it's also, it's going to be a pretty massive flop, $100 million lost.

It puts more, to me, pressure on lanterns and things that are coming behind it. We'll see. You know, we can have a conversation about the entire character of Supergirl and her existence and the superhero movie.

The question is going to end up being with all of this stuff. And if anybody's listening to this, is like, as many societal conversations as we have, cultural conversations we have that's good. was this movie good? Like, was this movie good?

Because if you make a good movie, like Thunderbolts, and people don't, then there's and that. But we can't even really have that conversation because this movie wasn't very good. No. And so then the question,

and by the way, when I say it wasn't very good, Supergirl was fine, by the way. It was fine. Like a lot of the... It was a dog pod. It was fine. That's why I'm a little confused.

Supergirl wasn't a great movie. Yeah. I've seen worse. Supergirl was fine, by the way. It was fine. So when you say not a very good movie, I mean, like, not a very good movie. Like, Supergirl was fine. So then the question becomes, like, what creatively is, like, gone wrong?

Because if you give people a good movie and then they don't respond to that movie, then that's a specific problem. But if you give people a movie where it doesn't really work and they don't go out to see it or they don't, then you can have the larger, like, where are we at and all of that stuff, but this movie

not even good enough to even warrant that to me. Yeah. Like, you just can't keep burning the audiences, my thing. Yeah. Where it's like,

people are dogpiling on Supergirl because there was a bunch of movies before Supergirl where they're like, damn, I spent $25 on this. I took a night out to the theater and this shit was kind of wet.

And then it's like, Supergirl gets the like, raw deal just because it's like, oh, you finally get to a moment in society where people are like, I don't know, if I want to invest my time and money in this. And that's the story

of comic books. And that's probably why in previous years I was very, very critical of this because I've seen this cycle happen where these companies burn through these characters and burn through your childhood. And then it takes 10, 15, 20 years to get it back. Right.

Charles had the cat's paw dagger. He saw the future. Yeah. Yeah. He knew it. Yeah. I could talk about this forever. So we're going to go ahead and get the fuck out of here. Oh, my literally can talk about this forever. It's like, one of my favorite things to talk about. Okay, we're out. Tomorrow, House of Arc continues.

Their House of Dragon, Deep Dyes, on Wednesday. Button Mash returns. Puttmash is back. I love this. Assassin's Creed Black Flag, the best games of the year so far. Our producer today are Aalaya Zanaris. Jeff Cornett, Devin Baroldi.

Jomey of Dinole. Hashtag Jomey of Whole. God damn. That's tough. I'm not a bastard. You're like, nah, you are. And that's what Steve. That's what your partner said to you.

Jomey of Whole is crazy. Andy say you look like one of the niggins, Steve, there's nothing for you to say. That's great. Adam's very handsome. He is. Additional production from Arjuna Ram Gapal. Chuck, takes out. Reneer is queen.

Every dragon needs a master. Shout out to all my snows. Shout out to all my bastards. Woo!