The Ringer-Verse - ‘House of the Dragon’ Season 3, Episode 6 Instant Reactions | The Midnight Boys

Episode Date: July 27, 2026

The Boys are back, and they’re starting off in the Riverlands! They give you all of their thoughts on ‘House of the Dragon’ Season 3, Episode 6, diving into the decisive battle between Tully, Cole, and Stark; Baela and Alyn’s changing relationship; and the mechanics of ancient dragon eggs. (0:00) Intro (10:05) Spoilers ahead (12:01) ‘House of the Dragon’ Season 3, Episode 6 reactions (55:51) Outro Hosts: Van Lathan, Charles Holmes, Jomi Adeniran, and Steve Ahlman Producers: Aleya Zenieris, Devon Baroldi, and Jamie Yukich Additional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopowell Nintendo: Power up your play with Nintendo Switch 2. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome into the Ringiverse. This is, of course, the ringer's Nexus podcast feed for All Things Fandom. We are Steve, the architect, Almond, the builder and tinger of things. Jomi, the explainer at Diron. You've got questions. He's got answers. Old Man, Van, here, the receding resurgent her hairline. Code Baby Chuck, the 24-carried closer.

Together, we are known as, I'm a midnight, boys. We'll be right back after this. This episode is brought to you by Nintendo. The best fictional worlds are the ones you can't wait to revisit. The Nintendo Switch 2 system is packed with adventures, whether that's exploring exclusive games like Amazon, Animal Crossing, New Horizons, Nintendo Switch 2 edition, Mario Kart World, and Yoshi in the Mysterious Book, or Nintendo Switch compatible games like Tomodachi Life, living the dream.

And with upgraded hardware, it's easy to jump in anytime, anywhere. Learn more at Nintendo.com slash Nintendo Switch 2. Games and systems sold separately. Some Nintendo Switch games may not be supported or fully compatible with Nintendo Switch 2, games rated E for everyone. Okay, so files on socials. At the Midnight Boys Pod on Insta, Twitter, Facebook, TikTok, whatever. I don't know if I said that.

Why would you even need that? At Reverse on Insta, Twitter, Facebook, and TikTok Jummy. Why don't you care about me? I care. You don't, though. You really don't. That's hurt my feelings. I don't know what I'm saying?

I got a job to do, you know what I'm saying? No, you don't, though, because you just, you just hate me. You have a job to do. Another person at this company who don't care about social. Wow. Wow. Who? Who.

Who? What? I care about social. That's crazy. You don't, though. Yeah. I got a lot of stuff to do. So I try to support where I can't.

Where you can. Yeah. I got a lot of stuff to do. I care about social. I care about health. How could you look at me? I'm looking at and tell me I don't care about your job here. Yeah.

I could, you know what? You know what? Talk to the people. I could reveal some things. What you're trying to do? And like I could reveal some things. No, no, no. Because another day.

I have, I can reveal some things. You know more than anybody I care. No, no, no. That was some other times. No, no, no. Because, you know what I'm saying? Not today, though. Other days, oh, let it slide, not today. Well, I'm going to remember that.

I want you to remember it, too. I want y'all to remember it. Well, I want you all to remember that. I don't care about your career. All right, nigger, tell us about this. Oh, you know what? Let's talk about something else about, I don't care. We went to Jomey's birthday party.

Yeah. How's that? We went to Jomey's birthday party. Great party. And it's a fantastic party. Beautiful family. Beautiful family. Like, ridiculously beautiful family.

Great family. I saw two things happen at the birthday party. One, the Nigerianian. Sequester continues. There were two different events. One was Jomi's birthday dinner. And the other was the birthday party. Now, I know everybody now. These are some beautiful,

amazing black people. I got to push back on this, bro. This is a van. Like agenda, man. We're not doing this. But you know how I know that it's not? No. Because they know. I look. They know. You guys can say that because part of the bid on here is to go against everything that I say.

Cool. But you, but they know. They know. Two different times. Number one, at Jomey's birthday dinner. Right. They all had a table together. Because they know everything.

True? True or false. True or false. They all had a table together. Then at the park, everybody sitting under tents. That one was tough. And we're all chilling. And we're all having a fun time and stuff like that.

There were two different Nigerian tables. There was a Nigerian table over there with the older folks. Okay, but this is also his family. Which I get. And then the same group of people that were in the hug at Jobb's birthday party last year had their own table over here. This is a family and friends who have known each other for years. So here's what I will say. The them sitting at the other table instead of under the tents, you got them.

That's tough. That's like, I just know the optics. I even came up to you. It was like that stuff. I don't know. But are they doing it because they're Nigerian and they don't respect their actions. African-American. They're doing it because they don't really fuck with us like that.

That's not true. The on table, you got to calm down. The own table was, I like the on table. The on table was... I loved them, bro. I talked to them. I liked the untable. First of all, they was fly.

They prayed. By the way, I want to let y'all know something. Jomey's uncle came up and did a prayer. Mm-hmm. And most of the blacks that were there, Charles of course, hadn't arrived yet. But most, like, most, like most of the blacks that were there, we bowed our head. we bowed our head and we prayed along with this man

as he blessed this party bless his life and bless the food right well so the white people looked at this guy did not pray he looked at him as if it was PBS

Steve that's not true you're lying you're lying that's not Steve did you bow your head did you're lying I looked at Lauren and we looked at it's a lie Lauren, we looked down. Wait, why do you have to look at Lauren?

Why can't you buy your head? I wasn't even going to name you. I was just going to say because there was a contingent. But we looked directly at you. Our white ringer colleagues? Oh, so why was your daughter? To look your head up at me. Look at my business.

Calica was like, Kalika was like, I'm like, what does she say? Wait, right, no, you got to say. No, no, no, no, I can't. You got to say. It wasn't nothing bad. But it was just like, mm-hmm. Like y'all y'all were over there sitting and looking at the

like looking at the man and nobody bowed their head nobody showed different it's a cultural difference it's not a bad though you're getting touched don't get touched I learned about prostrating but what? Dobala yeah so and you know what I like this is all we got to he was showing y'all white people

to weigh we have to talk we have to talk about house of dragon but at some point but postrating when you meet an elder in the Nigerian culture you gotta like they drop down and give me 10 you gotta you like

like how you're supposed to do it lay flat like a pusher you're supposed to go down all the way now you know we're hip now we're cool so really you just got to like touch the ground

just touch the ground where you see somebody like you're lining up on football yeah okay I promise you and so like for the most part like a lot of my

own ten uncles who I usually do that for they're not there but like if you like you'll see my sister getting married next year. I'm sure your guys will be there. I just be like, yes, ma, hello, my.

And I'll just, like, go down on the ground. And if you don't, if you don't do that, it's disrespect. They're not going to let that slide. That's the one thing Nigerian's not going to do is that disrespect. So, like, I'll be honest with you. You know, I want to react in a real, whatever way. But every culture has their version of that. Like, it, where

I'm from, you don't necessarily do that, but what you do do is like whatever they say. Like, legitimately. Like, if you're at a Lathen family gathering in Mariguan, and somebody gives you the keys, at my age, somebody gives you the keys and say, hey, drive to New Orleans

and pick up your cousin from the airport. You got to drive to New Orleans and pick up your cousin for the airport. So while we don't have that type of situation, I could every, like, it is a heavy, is heavy, heavy on the elders. And when I say that, I mean, that happened.

I mean, you're at a family reunion and you're being asked to drive. Somebody comes to the side like you did to, a like somebody somebody somebody somebody you gotta stop talking to ale like that bro you got to shill we we got to get tired of drag we gotta stop no you got to me no you got to me no bro i've never seen like i hate him for real but like you like you gotta stop bro like it's like it's like it's like it's locking let's lock in let's be for it's all right bro and this is not to say that like a no bitch-ass nick because he not at all

Like he's not at all. But like Jomi, hey, go. Now he's strict with it. And then like, hey, Luke at the sister was like, hey, talk to him. I'm like, Joe, what the fuck is happening, bro? Playing around. All right, cool. It's a great Saturday, though, man.

It was a great thing. I want to, like, see somebody. I want to witness somebody, like, catch the ground for one of the elders. I would never do it. But I want to witness someone never. I would, never. So if you were marrying a Nigerian woman, you wouldn't, like, to show, No, I say it's over.

Really? I'm not, no. Bigger than the program. Bigger than the program. Bigger than the program. Not bigger than the program. That is the definition. That is the definition.

No, no, no. That's the definition of the beginning of the program. Deference to you. Deference and all of that stuff. You want to the ground? I can't get on the ground. I can't, that's a bridge. So this is, if I was in the culture, that would be one thing.

But it's not like, I can't get on. This is insane. You see, making it on the program, you're the star. You always got to be the star. You always wants to be the star. I'm not getting on the ground, bro. You got it. I'm sorry, you're going to get on the ground?

You'll do it? For my Nigerian queen? No, so you'll get on the ground. If her grandparents, whatever, just like, hey, yo, sign of respect. Yeah. I would get on the ground. My light skin ass, you know what it would look like to be like, I'm not. Here's the thing.

You don't have to do it all the time. You have to get on the ground all the time. I thought it was like an initial, like. Initial, you have to sell out. Just to show respect to the elders. And then they'll be like, hey, get up. And then for the most part, you can just get down and just like, hey, just touch it.

Just be like. So every time you touch it. All right, let's go. We're on YouTube, like, comments, subscribe, share. Y'all stay on y'all feet, man. To watch every midnight boys and house of our episode on YouTube. com, backslash at Ring Reverse. And also on Spotify, program reminders stay tapped in at Top the Thrones every Sunday.

This Friday, the Midnight Boys return with their instant reactions to Spider-Man brand new day. Come on. That crept up. God. We're here. Damn. On today's show, we give you our instant reactions. to the latest episode of House of the Dragon.

We're going to be spoiling everything that happens in this show in past Game of Thrones shows. The Tower Ball of Wax. Steve's spoiler warning. We're getting ready to talk about House of the Dragon. You're listening to a reaction podcast. The spoilers are coming. Okay, to be hearing on reactions,

we once again bring you the Midnight Manifest, putting you in the No, Chuck, take it away. All right, this is your Midnight Manifest, for episode six of House of the Dragon season three, directed by Lonnie Perris Stair, and written by David Hancock and Shyam Poppet. Sir Chris Nicole is ambushed by Oscar Tulley and Lord Roderick. He shot with three arrows as Rainier's forces kill his men. At the Queen's council meeting, Renera's advisors argue about what to do with Ormond

High Tower. Damon wants to burn innocence to the ground while the rest of the council urges against his Targary need to conquer. Reneera demands Damon finds the traitors, killing the gold cloaks, while setting up an assassination plot of her own against Orman and Darren. Reneera's dragon riders are getting antsy in more ways than one. Alpha bandits is posed to reunite with his drinking buddies at the tavern, but is caught by Damon.

Hugh sneaks into the reach to reunite with his wife, but she rebuffs her husband and all that he's become. Bail and Allen continue the Westerosi tradition of bumping uglies with your kin. Alice Rivers shows Aymond's sixth dormant dragon eggs and convinces the prince that they make a good team ruling from Harenhall. Alice and Helena are captured by guards after their failed escape attempt infuriating Reneera. To smooth her latest bungled operation, Allison reveals that Helena is pregnant

but trades information on Amon's whereabouts for mercy. Renera sends Allison in an assassin party to Heron Hall to take care of Aman while still imprisoning Helena. After Sergwain saves his family from Nere's fake Barathean assassin scheme, Orman returns the favor in kind. Corliss and his men are attacked in the night by the High Tower Forces, and that has been your midnight manifest for House of the Dragon. Instant reactions then.

I love the episode. I think that I was, you know, seeing the way, Aero dramatics in this season are crazy. People getting shot by arrows? Out of the blue. Just in your face. Like Kristen Cole thought that he was going to get. It was an interesting way that he went out.

He envisioned his death differently. He thought that his death would bring about this freedom and this magnificent end. So the way he wanted to die was in this glorious battle that he felt like was commiserate with everything that he had been able to accomplish above his station. But he was. killed basically like someone that didn't fucking matter at all.

So he didn't get what he wanted. I laughed a little bit. I love it too. I'm tired of him. No, no, no, because to your point,

and this is a great part of the show. Like, last, last week he gives this speech. We're feeling like he's this grand hero. He takes out Allison's handkerchief just one more time. You're like, all right,

he's going to go. It almost, it was like they were setting up like a, like a John at the Battle of the Bastards. where it's like, oh shit, he's going to get the arm, and they're like, like, damn. The show has always essentially been about people not getting what they want.

Yeah. Any iteration of Game of Thrones besides a Knight of Seven Kingdoms. But this show seems to be more about that than even the first Game of Thrones is. Just because there's a smaller cast of characters that have this like direct want in a Civil War. Anyway, I'm not going to be typically hyper-provose about the entire thing.

I love the episode. The episode had the right. mixture to me of like Game of Thrones mess. Like there seems to be a love triangle amongst the blacks of the show, which I really enjoy. I love that. Wait, which blacks? Well, the blacks. No, not the blacks.

The blacks. The blacks. The blacks. The blacks. It seems to be a look. That was. All right. Wait, can we just go straight there?

I was like, yo, not her uncle's trying to press up on her. Well, all right. So this is how I read the scene. Bela seemed a little bit like on some Hey yo, Alan. She like Alan better. She like Alan better.

Alan was a little bit like, I noticed the way she rebukes him in the last episode where he was like Lady Bella is tired and stuff like that and she went, hey, nigga, don't speak on me. Like he was giving us, she like Alan. She like Alan more. My bad, Steve.

Alan was trying to do his thing, right? Alan was like, yo, like you're very dutiful. He was like, hey, you know, try you know he was really humble about it he was doing his little humble gimmick she like him that's good for all the man i think it's actually like a big character moment for him because he's very much a meek and meager character in the lights of all of these other people that are that he's been told are her better are his betters for all of his life and for the first time he actually like went for something that he wanted and like kind of and took his place i don't seem as meek at all

out? I mean, meek in the sense that like he doesn't feel like he wants to cuss his dad out for not like actually. He doesn't, he hasn't cuss him out. But he,

whenever his father says something that he feels like runs a foul, like, his father goes, you know, like, I'm sorry that I forgot you. He's like,

we weren't things to be forgotten. Like he doesn't like, I mean, even in this episode where you're like, your anger hasn't run out. Hey, his dad is still mad at Renier. And he's like, hey,

yo, it took you even long. to claim us. What are you talking about? He won't step out of line, though. Like, he won't do anything. Because it's not his way. Exactly.

But I think that's what he said. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's not, what I mean is, though, but, like, he don't get run. He goes, he don't get run over. No, no, no, no. For a long, his father, I feel like, had to earn it from Allen.

Mm-hmm. But so, but can I be real? Because this was, this was a very monumental episode to me, because I had to really dig deep and look at how I view the world. Because usually I'm like, when nieces and uncles and nephews and aunts and cousins is fucking on this show, it's usually white folks.

I'm like, yeah, that's white folks shit. Yeah. When it happens to our brothers and sisters, I was like, hmm. I agree with it. I was like, this is, this is something new, okay. You didn't like it. You didn't like it. They did that on purpose.

Okay. Why is that? They wanted black incest on this show to draw us into their fucking pit, pit of they wanted it. They just didn't have enough black characters on the show to even have incest. You know, they didn't, they didn't even have it before. But now that they got them, they

was going to be like, hey. Wait, do you count this as a form of inclusion, though? Well, it depends on how you look at it. There's some white shit that we don't want to be including in. That's what we don't want. That's what we don't want to be including in. Nigger, NASCAR, don't care. Have a NASCAR. Now, wait, you can't speak for all black people.

I'll speak for myself. You don't want any part of NASCAR. I'll say this. I'm saying this. NASCAR is not unfun, but I don't give a fuck that there's no representation in NASCAR. If you get represented in NASCAR,

I will support you. Okay, but you're not going to fight that. I don't care. It's not Congress, nigga. You guys can have your car race. You can have it. It's for you.

Okay. So hockey is for you. Hockey as well? Bluegrass. Hey, no niggas in bluegrass. Don't care. Like, don't like, don't care. The black people,

shout out to Willie Jones. Shout out to all of the black people that made me care that there's not allowed black people the country because all another. I don't care. I don't care if there's some cousin kissing, you don't need it. The more I think about it, we have incest. We don't need representation

in incest. I think we didn't. I can't disagree more. I don't think we, that's not false. Y'all want black people to be to be representing. Hey, hey, hey, I'll hear the same. It's their right to have it. Let me just, let me just defend my point. Go for it. Please. If we want more representation in our fantasy, if we want

black people in these stories, And yo, sometimes, you know, y'all gonna have to bump uglies, y'all not above the program. The blacks, the blacks and the black, the black's in, I'm gonna jacking, not above the boat frame. This is the deal. I got my own program. If inclusion mean, I gotta fuck my auntie,

I don't want to do it. Like, I'm just saying, in that situation, in that situation, man, I looked at that. And at first, I was happy for Allen. And they're also They're a great looking couple Absolutely I'm not going to

I looked at bail out I was like Any kind of old? Hey, fuck you know. What's strong with Ellen? Hey, you know, I know what kind of guy Charles is. What?

Family reunion, I don't even if I can talk about this because people can get mad. Family reunion like 91. 91. A lot of times if the family reunion is big enough, you meet cousins that you didn't grow up with. No, don't put a lot.

Oh, tell you. Don't. Just listen. No, no, no. A lot of the time, a lot of times, a lot of times in the family union, a lot of times in the family union, you meet cousins that you didn't grow up with, right? So there's one of my cousins, like sitting down,

he was talking about how beautiful one of our cousins from California was. My daddy was like, well, yeah, that's your cousin, you know that, right? And he was like, yeah, but he was like, no, yeah. ain't no yeah That's so-and-so's daughter That is your mom's cousin's cousin That's your, that's your, yeah Ain't know yeah

And yeah, that's your cousin Genetically speaking though They say, you know, if it's a third or fourth It actually helps. It was second. Oh, actually it wasn't second because it was a cousin cousin. So that means it has to be third, right?

Guess what else it is? Fucking disgusting. And so, and so like, Like to me, to me. You weren't bringing this shit up. Right. It's because we got the blacks doing it now. I wasn't bringing it up before because it didn't hit home.

And now. That's our representation is important. When it's happening to white people. But here's the thing with Allen, but think about it from his position, right? Damn, this entire time my daddy didn't really want to claim me. I've had to get out the mud. Now, Bella, this is a woman from like a higher class system. She's looking up looking at me like, why can't I have my Westerosy Beyonce?

Why can't I be hove? He's trying to come up. You should have done it. So it's the worst thing, though. And like, I'm seeing, I'm seeing them, you know, kiss. And I'm like, oh, Black Love in Westrose. This is crazy. This is, like, the second couple.

Like, because we had the Mastande and Grey Worm. Yeah. And the first one. Like, we've, I mean, not to, like, do this whole, like, I mean, it is a race thing that we've turned it into. Anyway, like, it's only like the second. like two black people relationship we've seen in the show. And if I'm gonna be real.

The first one was different though because the first one had I think it was too nah I don't even want to go back to the world. Hey, Bill! Wow. You said to her list.

No, no, no, I don't want to go back to the West. And all I'll say, the last thing I'll say this, you know, Bella was just like, damn. I was married off to Jace. That nigga wasn't shit. Yeah. She's like, she's see Allen. He's like, he on the council.

He needs business. He's a lot of. He's a living. He's on a... He's on the cup. Jason was out here on fucking dummy missions. A dummy.

Fuck, fuck. I don't mean to rest of peace, Jason. Same mission. He was all right. He was like that. He was young. He did die, though. So, okay.

So, all right. So, uh, that moment happens. What else in this episode, Ormond seems to be, Oman shows both strength and weakness in this episode. So I, what I thought was so, I love the Orman High Tower plot. I love it.

In this season. because when Gwain comes back seeing how Orman and Gwain are not on the same like are not having the same plan but to also see Orman trying to son him at first He's trying to son him and Gwain is looking at Darren

Like Nick are you with you? You're like what are you doing? I was like oh that scene was crazy Yeah bro you ever been in that situation with one of your homies It's like everybody laughing and you like You signed with him?

We drove here together, bitch. I ain't charged you no gas money. What you laughing with the bullshit for? You're fucking with them? I didn't realize Gwain and Darren. So they, as people have read the books, in the books, do they have a closer relationship? This is a- This is a show thing.

But it's a show thing, but it's very, it's a show thing. But it's very clear how, like, how, like, that triangle works, right? Where Ormond and, and Gwain grew up together. And obviously, like, don't really. like each other, but Gwynne had to, like, Gwen and Daron had this, like, nice little, you know, hey, this guy kind of crazy, right? Like, have that little relationship.

But Gwain had to dip, right, because of the whole Blacks versus Green stuff, leaves Duran with Ormond, right? And then obviously we get that scene, which I think is really beautiful. We're a closer kin, right? Closer kin, because his mom's, his uncle, his mom's brother. That's his own. Yeah. Right? And, like, that particular scene, I love, like, when he's, like, you'll escort him to your quarters, you see Darren, like,

hey man why did you leave me with this what you're leaving me with this dude Ormond is his great uncle no no Orman is his Orman is his sister's great uncle because his mother's cousin Mother's cousin so great uncle yes Yeah his great uncle because the mother Because their grandfathers are brothers

Correct right. Am I right about that? That's right Orman's father is Otto's brother Yes right okay What does that make him? I'm done I think he's a great uncle I think he's right is it a great uncle Great-nephew, great-uncle.

Great-uncle, great-nepie, right? So, like, he's actually a little removed from him, you know? Right. And whereas Gwain is like... His uncle. His uncle. Like, nigger, that's... We in the same fucking...

I mean, the Hot Towers moving like a black family because they're... They absolutely do, bro. Because I've never been times where it's like, I come from my great-barred Sam. Like eight kids. And I'm like, damn. There have been times where they're like, I thought... I'm your uncle. And I was telling me about...

is that you don't have to listen to nothing he says. I'm your uncle. I'm Cookie's brother. You don't have to listen to nothing he says. Don't listen to him. Now go get me a beer. But yeah, so I thought all of that stuff was good, but also I thought it was good at the end.

Gwain both sniffed out something that Orman couldn't see. Yeah. Snift is good. There you go. There you go. Hold on. everybody to tell me this is utterly ridiculous

so wait basically you got to hit the spider-man pose it's just a superhero post I think he's all like every time it's like it's more Ola every time I see a Nigerian person I'm going to start doing that Jesus

It's more like you get a three technique It's closer to that It's closer to that But yeah and so Because not only does he sniff that out because he's been in combat He can see it a little bit a little bit better.

So he proves, he saves his life, which proves his loyalty to him a little bit and stuff like that. But he also, in a way, tell me if I'm reading this scene wrong, he seemed like more of a man in that situation. He seemed like more active. He killed those guys while Ormond was showing weakness in the moment, both because he didn't realize that they were there to kill him. And they smelled like shit.

And also they smelled so he threw up. So if you're Darren and you're watching that, right? And you're around. you see one of your uncles get busy while your other uncle, even though he's super, super dangerous, he's retching and throwing up and all of that stuff. But it's also, like, very well reflected

after the fact when Daryon's, like, training in the field and they're talking out in the window, and they're, like, ultimately collaborating together, knowing that they're with the same ends, but, like, it's a bit more of a hate. You got to chill around him because this high tower bullshit that you're on is ultimately going to lead your downfall

if you don't actually focus, like I am. From his purview at looking at both of these guys, he's, it's interesting because he's trying to, it's almost like Mike from the wire. Oh, yeah. Do you remember like when, when everybody was competing for Mike? Yeah. Like, Mike was the number one big of draft. Oh, right. He was the number one crew.

Mike, hey, shout out to my man, bro. That's the guy's a great guy, bro. Shout out to him. MacMack. I never understood that about the wire. What? I was just like. About Mike?

No, I understood the, I love the character of Mike, but I was a little bit like, this nigga not the Punisher Like who Mike Like after No they were like talking about him Like everybody wanted him like

Oh he like a superhero and a What it really was was the rest of his friends With some slap dicks There was really no it was He was the best among them right So so like Damon had his problems Randy had his problems

Everybody else had their problems But Mike out of all of them Seemed like the one that you could get the most value out of So he was good at boxing Cutty was trying to get him. He was good on the streets. The bar, the, not the barstales, the Stanfields were trying to get him. And he was kind of smart and with it in school.

So in school, remember Mike freaked out. Everybody's so goddamn friendly. But that's kind of the thing that's happening with Darren. And it seemed like Ormond had it clearly. But after I think what happened with Gwain and all the wretching, and he talks to him, it seems like he might be filling the pool of Gwain a little bit. I mean, but I also, because they set it up beautifully where. Ormond is trying to sun Gwain

and he's being homophobic and he's trying to basically throw dirt on his name like why did you come back and then when the assassination attempt happens what you realize is you're like oh because Orman has that thing with his nose he's very good at playing chess and moving armies around

but when it comes to the nitty gritty of like having to slit someone's throat smell shit whatever and it was funny seeing like Orman trying to make seemed like Wayne was a coward for wanting to go home. And the entire episode, Gwain is like, this is not chess, these are actual people. How many lords have actually signed up with you?

How many houses do you actually have? You're talking about, what I liked about it is like, Gwain has been on the ground. He's seen the war up close. He knows, he's basically to me, obviously he's not a commoner, but he's not a coward because he's like, no, no, no, I've seen what's happening.

This is such a great point because not being a commoner is one thing, right? But if you have been in warfare, like if you've been to war, there's an experience of the every man that you understand because there's not much nobility, unless you're like you're one of those guys on the back of the horse going, charge, but there's not much nobility in that situation. You're dirty, they're dirty. You're saving the life of people who are commoners. They're saving your life.

So there's a real world understanding an experience that you would have that somebody who's just like pointed and shit like that might not have. I mean, even think about in the last episode, Gwain, basically giving Sir Kristen Cullen out. He doesn't have to do that. That is coming from someone who's like being in the mud with him being like, you don't have to go out like this. Come with me. So it was like a very interesting. I got to say the high towers. I am not rooting for them.

I like, I like them. They are so, extremely fascinating. Yeah, I like, I like them. And they were fascinating Game of Thrones as well. Steve, what you got? I love this episode. I think that this was an episode of, like, plays. I really kind of liked what Allison is trying to, like,

ply for when it comes to, like, appeasing Reneera. And Reneera actually, finally kind of evolving into a ruler that doesn't give a fuck, at least about when it comes to Allison. because not only sending her off to kill her son, but really not having any regard for the utility of Helena until she knows that she's a dreamer, that, like, you actually see the gears,

like she sits up and perks up about, like, the fact that she can be used for something. And that, to me, is fascinating. Great podcasting by Steve there, because that was a very interesting thread in this episode. I feel like the frustration of, of Renera's rule is expressed more through her relationship

with Alicent than almost anything else. No, it literally is everything that's wrong with Renair ruling is with Allison. I mean, I'm, but here, Allison was pissing me off. I have never seen. No, no, no, there's a little bit, there is a lot of that, but like Utah, you, you, you, I'll just, I've seen Alicant all fucking season

run around with plans that are so fucking dumb. I'm like, girl, you're not talking about nothing. Every single time. She's like, this is what we going to do. This is what we going to do. What happens? If I'm Helena, I am looking at my mom like, all right, sis.

You call her Rob Polinka? Tough. That's crazy, bro. Wait, what has Allison done in this situation to put herself in a place where she can even succeed? I mean, technically, no, no, no. She's done absolutely jacked nothing. And that's why Reneira sending her to Harenhaal to kill her son is the most boneheaded thing I've ever seen. Right.

I have no idea what she's thinking. Reneer, well, I will say this as well. The only people who are down worse than fucking Reneer for sending Alson off, I'm like, this is the dumbest shit I've ever seen. Dog, can we get some better assassins? Can we get the hand in here? Can we get some better asses? Every single assassin, they send out not worth fucking shit. I am like, yo, Reneer, you just fucking.

up with the high towers. Why are you sending one of your only bargaining chips away to Heron Hall? Are you an idiot? Completely another brain fart. I legitimately, I'm watching it happen. She's like, Ayakasin one sword. I'm like, okay, what's that?

The dude, her hand of the, her King's Guard, whatever, or Queen's Guard. I'm like, oh, she was saying that me, that's interesting. I think they would recognize them. She's like, nah. I'm gonna say Allison. Yeah. Okay, I was like, yeah.

She's gonna have a very nice hood on. You're not being serious right now. I get it. I get it. you got a blind spot. It's not real. I want to ask you guys something about this regarding Reneer. So Ormond says something about Reneer, and he goes, she won't kill him.

We'll kill the people. She's a woman. She won't kill him. She lacks the stomach for whatever. And I thought that that was interesting. We have looked at Reneer's reluctant story. to kill even in her own interests as something that is decent about her. Seems like a lot of people in the realm look at some of that stuff as something that a king or queen,

a ruler or monarch must do and think that that shortcoming comes because she is a woman. Would Reneira be better off as a lady ruler if she just purged everyone? If she just killed everything that she had to kill. If she just, like, a lot of this, I'm asking just because it seems like there are, all of her problems are because her heart is so big. I don't think the problem is her heart is so big. I think it's just the fact that she's a woman regardless.

Well, so that is actually, that's what confuses me about the show. Well, let's negotiate both things. Who should you go to first? Who should we go to first? So your point, when Ormond says that, I take that as, of course, another person in Westeros being misogynistic against women and a woman ruler. But sometimes it feels like the show wants to have it both ways. It wants to show the transformation of Reneira into a ruthless monarch, a ruthless killer.

But it also wants us to be rooting for her in the blacks versus the greens. And sometimes I feel like it's a, it's not as to me, as seamless as a transition from good to evil as let's say like I don't know like a Walter White. Sometimes it feels like the show still wants us to really root for the blacks which to me dilutes it.

So Walter, there's a difference in Walter's character, it's a great character to bring up or even in Tony Soprano's character, right? Tony Soprano, you give Tony Soprano out for all that stuff he did because he was born into it. Yeah. So this is only the only ethics like Tony Soprano being like a good dad that cares about his children

or every time he does something that's a little bit good, oh my God, Tony's not all bad. And that's only because you know that he was born into this. His birthright is being like a killer. Walter got to a point where he actually says this, obviously, where he liked it. He, like, really enjoyed it, right? It doesn't seem like she's having very much fun at all, right?

And she certainly would not like the prospect of killing Allison and Helena, although she should. like you know what I mean so like and and maybe she should maybe there's a different way to rule but it doesn't seem like Westeros is ready for the type of monarch that she wants to be it almost seems like in order for her to get to that

she would have to almost excise all of the bad blood and bad people and get them all out of there and then maybe on the back end she could negotiate with the rest of the people a new version of Kingsland or the whole deal I mean the math is that you're waiting no I'm good you know Joe me, good.

No, you're good. All right. Tell me, you're good. Enough is that. I just wanted to say, the math is that she's a woman in this universe. And no matter what she does,

it's always going to be viewed through that lens. And so if she burns, if she goes the Danny route and burns Kings Landing and Burge Tubbleton, she's a mad, she's the mad queen, right? Like the book would call her, uh, Magur with teats,

right? Versus what Ormond says, which is she doesn't have the stomach for it. It doesn't really matter which way she goes. She can't win. It's true. I agree with that. But they said the same thing about Viseris.

And whenever she brings up the fact that she is trying to rule in the same way. Damon hated that. He doesn't like that. So part of it is definitely because she's a woman and she's looked that differently. But part of it is because she wants her rule to be informed by her father, who a lot of people thought was a weakling. And that's kind of the. framing that Rainier has been in probably since the beginning of this season very much,

because she has had a lot of things that make her a sympathetic character that is now forced to do things that she doesn't want to do because it's against the way that she wants to rule. Whereas in this episode, she's actually starting to lean into the things that makes a type of Westerosian ruler typical. She's being conniving and she's actually being a bit more low standing in the ways that she deals with these things, whether or not she likes it is kind of immaterial to the fact that the show might be framing her as a sympathetic figure, but it doesn't matter because we might know this outcome already. Right. Can she stay one? Yeah. Right. Can she stay one?

And it seems like almost her paralysis by analysis is doing more harm than good. I mean, I think it is perfectly symbolized earlier in the season, which he has to kill. auto, this is a ruler who has to cut twice. And a good ruler does it once and is decisive. And even if it is the wrong move, great rulers are able to be like, I'm going to make this decision. I'm going to stand by it. Whatever comes, we will deal with it then. Whereas, like, Reneer is like, well, I really don't have to kill this person.

Do we really have to do it? Yeah. It's all half measures. By the time she does it, the habit, you're just like, now you have five, ten, 15 different fucking problems. Speaking of getting cut, she cuts herself on the throne. That is a, that's,

in the book, that's an omen, right? You cut yourself on the throne. Like, that means you're unfit to sit upon it. Right. And part of like the mythos, part of the mythos about it is that, like, she was, she wanted it so,

she wanted the throne so bad. She gripped it too tight. And like, you end up, you end up with the life you got. Interesting, though, it doesn't in the books, it says that that's the first, time that she sits the throne.

Yeah, so like, that she gets cut. When she sat in episode two, people were like, where's the, where's the cut? Where's the cut? We get it.

We got it here. Yeah. You love it. You love that. So how are we feeling about the dragon writers? Because they both. They seem like they're out of here.

They're done. Oh, man. Hugh's down so bad. Hugh, I'm a little bit confused off. It's over for him. Yeah. He's out of here.

Opha is done. And by the way, they're, the fact that they're treating all the way that they're treating, him shows that they don't know what the fuck that they do. Yeah, obviously. You know what you're supposed to tell Oaf?

You're supposed to tell Oaf, hey man, look, you're going there and do it? You're supposed to treat Oaf like Dennis Rodman. Yeah, go to Vegas, take the weekend? Yep, exactly. Phil Jackson, like, go to Vegas, take the weekend. You stay too long, I'm going to send Michael to bring you back. Right.

You know what I'm saying? But they're not doing that at all. They squeeze him so hard he's slipping through their fingers. It's nasty work. The Huel one is a little bit more perplexing. Only for the fact that, like, you went to see his girl. She was like, I don't even know who you are no more, bro. It's been too long.

I don't recognize you. You smell different. That hurts. You're not the same man I knew. I was like, yo, he risked everything for her in that moment. I don't know if that was fair. You know what? She's been through a lot, but I don't know that.

I think that whole, the reason it did not land for me is because I feel like that whole storyline has been dragged out so much that what she's just like, no, fuck you. it did not necessarily seem like earned? I was kind of like, what am I supposed to interesting? I feel the opposite. I really, like, it hit me because there's, I can't remember who said this,

but like I've carried it with it. It's like, it's not, the worst thing that a woman can say isn't no, it's I never asked you to do that. And when she's like, I never asked for you to be this noble hero and be a dragon rider and do all these things for me. I wanted you to be with me and whatever we came.

up with, we would have done it together. No, but I mean just in the context of these seasons and the story, those two characters to me haven't been built up enough where their relationship disintegrating, I was just like, oh. Yeah, but I feel like that scene is all I need. But does it, it, how does it land with you knowing that

the fragility of that relationship might lead to Hugh feeling like he hasn't gotten anything out of being a Dragon Rider, which might lead to him, to him switching allegiances. I, because it's just like narratively, I'm like, it just makes a lot of sense

that they're gonna lose their dragon writers. Yeah. To me, maybe the creators are leading on that too much where it's like, we aren't necessarily

getting enough time with them, actually. It's just usually what has happened this season with like, Hugh and Ulf, is like a lot of times they're just like sitting in a field or like sitting by a camp being like,

this sucks. This sucks. That's not very, Well, in this episode, you did have Damon smacking the shit out of oath. And, like, in embarrassing him. Damon, who is normally pretty, I guess, disciplined and confident, I think this episode has showed him in deep water more than I've seen him for the entire run of the show. Damon's fucking up his episode.

Oh, yeah. Well, he's way, it's had his way underwater with the Gold Cokes 9. He's like, he's like literally fumbling around. Like, yo, how do I figure this out? I mean, he does do, you know, dresses up. goes in the thing, finds a guy, and kills him, but he does the whole Hydra thing. You kill one of us, two more, we'll take his place, whatever.

But what did he learn, actually? Hydra and Western Rose. That's funny. That would be funny. Red School. That would be funny if they started back then. Oh, Hydra starts. If it was a Rosteros.

It'd be funny. They should do, like, Hydra. The Hydra start with the Freemasons or something. Is that normal-in-backed? What if it went to, like, the first thing and the thrones? No, no, no, no, because Disney. Because Hickman did a story where it was like Leonardo da Vinci was in that.

Oh, he did, he did, he did. And they made Shield. Yeah, yeah, yeah, there was some stuff. They're shield during the Renaissance? Yeah. There's some stuff. It was like Marvel back in the day or some shit like that. I mean, Marvel's 1609 or something like that?

1609. They made that into a movie that crazy. That would be a tough one. I don't know if it'd be good. I'd be tough. Well, they made an episode of what if we didn't like that. That sucked. But yeah.

So, you know, it just, Damon seemed like he's not good at anything right now. He's not good at serving his queen because he has his own things that he wants to do. He's so exasperated at court. Like, everybody bothers him. He's so pissed off. That master of coin was so funny. When he threw the thing at Tor Manley, I was laughing. That was funny.

That was funny. I'm not saying Damon's right. There is a level of, I'm like, yeah, you might have to burn some people to a crisp. We might have to shut some people up. Dog. You're talking about Renair? Reneer might have to get I'm like Reneer you got Damon on the

You got your best player on the bench I think the show is trying to get us to the point To where We believe that she should be more militant Than what she's being And that's almost like A soft acceptance from us That there's no way to be in the throne

And be good It's almost the show almost is trying to pervert the throne And her character narratively Is holding on to her decency And it's almost, it feels like it'll be a release, and we'll understand when she lets it go. Will, so this to me, though, is a dangerous route for the show because to me, the ultimate failing of Game of Thrones

was not selling us on Danny's descent into madness, where when that happens, we're like, this rings false. Like, you know narratively how she got there, but emotionally the payoff didn't seem like that. Trushed. And with Renira, It seems like they're being more careful, but they're almost being a little too careful,

where I'm just like, okay, no, I understand by the, she in, she marked out, she's in all black, the walls are fucking closing in, she got no more gold cloaks, I get all of that. I just, there's something kind of missing into this descent, not into evilness, but I'm like, we know Renira is going to have to put up her shut up.

Right. To keep the bro. So then, I guess, the question is you feel like Danny's descent into madness wasn't, was too fast. You feel like this was too slow. I don't know if it's too slow. It seems like the show, I keep going back to, I'm like,

the show still wants us to be rooting for a Nira. Right. And I think Game of Thrones at its best, you almost stopped rooting for anyone because you realize this is a poison chalice. and I would like it to be a little bit more balanced where I kind of just like the high towers and the greens more because there's less of that feeling of they want us to feel like these are the good guys.

I'm like, no one's good here. They're all evil. They're all doing evil things to get to this throne. You don't have to keep showing me that Reneer is decent because I know deep down to me she's actually not decent. Like she's done a lot of nefarious things to get her way. the more interesting thing is is that because she's our protagonist,

we kind of start forgetting it. There's only one thing, though, that puts a little quill in that is what it's cost her. So, like, there's, so she's done a lot of things, and let's say that it hadn't cost her anything, it would be a lot

easier to kind of let go of it, but she's lost two sons. And so the fact that she's lost two sons and we've watched those sons die in, like, brutal ways like that, that's the thing that kind of like the moment that Reneira and Allison

in my opinion no longer have any type of bond it's the moment that severs the trauma that they've that they've had as mothers which is why it was so interesting that Allison was so afraid of Helena being pregnant.

Yeah. It was almost as if she was afraid of her being pregnant because the pregnancy was inconvenient for the lineage of the throne. Of course it makes her dangerous but also seemed as if, it feels as if in this particular show,

motherhood is such a violent, brutal thing, and there's such cost to it that she just didn't want another mom. Well, she wanted to stop that cycle of violence and, like, corruption. And I know that she's already a mom, but she just didn't want another, like, thing to have to consider. So something else with Reneira in this regard is that, like, we've watched it cost her a lot, and she's trying to, like, figure out a way

to make that cost worth something. Yeah. I think, I mean, just a little, like, she left Jahara. They're going to leave without Jahara. Right. So to your point, like, not ending the line per se,

but to, like, have Elena just not have to worry about that and cut that cycle off of motherhood and being there for your children and, like, however messed up way the greens are, like, absolutely correct. That's not, she doesn't want any parts of that. Right. At all.

Yeah. So before we wrap up. Corlis. So I thought that we're going to do it to him. And I stood up. Really? Yeah. I thought it was about to happen.

I stood up. I stood up. You didn't see a body. Oh, he's not dead. He's not dead. Oh, was there anything? Well, let's finish Corlis. But because we're going to end with Corlis.

Did we want to touch at all on the fact that Agon and Larry's basically not in the episode. They are in it. But did we, did you need a break from that storyline? I didn't need a break from that storyline. I just think that like there's so much going on. Because we haven't even talked about aiming, Amy and Alice.

And Alice revealing like, oh, surprise, we got six dragon eggs. I was like, very interesting. Oh shit. Yeah. Oh, shit. I don't know the way the dragon eggs work. I want to ask y'all. I was like, are dragon eggs like,

is this like an N64 cartridge you just like blow some dust on it? I mean, I'm just going to pull stuff out the recesses of my mind, but I'm pretty sure like they like to be kept warm, right? They don't like to be, for the most part, they can be like,

I feel like those are like stone, right? Because if they're not warm for a long time or they're not kept for a long time, they're stone. However, we know that the dragons died out during House of the Dragon, and then Danny had three

that's what I was Exactly so sometimes they can stay alive So those could be like some Those might even be Danny's eggs Who knows, right? But just eggs The thing that was surprised to me It's just like oh they just had some eggs

And air haul the whole time Yeah, that's a little convenient That's where I'm like That's where I'm watching the whole scene I'm like hmm How long do these eggs stay viable? They can stay viable for a long time They usually like they kept warm

Like for the most of again They like if they're not They turn a stone So I don't know How old are viable? How old are those eggs? There was dust on them. 100 years?

I'm actually glad, though, that Witch Lady and Amin got to move forward a little bit because I was kind of getting tired of people coming to Heron Hall or her being like... Yeah, Heron Hall sucks. Heron Hall's white. Heron Hall sucks.

I like Amin, I like Alice. I do not know what it is about Heron Hall. Obviously, story-wise, in the structure, it's a cursed place. But narratively, every single time they go to Harrod Hall, I feel like the story almost like stops. I think they're doing that on purpose

because I agree, bro. Like, Harrahall is dark, it's dank. It has no life to it or whatever. I think that they're purposefully like drawing a narrative sort of cloak over the place to make you feel when you're watching it, just

how suck it is to be there. Because I agree. Every time they go there, I'm like, we got to go back there. You see the, you see this type of shot. You're like, ah. Fuck, bro. Like, it sucks. And that's why Lair is A-Gon.

That story lied, they out into wild. They are. It's so funny. I do think that the episode probably needed them a little bit because they're just, that chemistry is so fucking. That scene was great because it does, and we see this in media all the, like a bunch where we saw last episode, Larris read Agon for filth.

Hey, you sucked. Always sucked. You had opportunities. You didn't do nothing. with it, your loser. He asks Jason or Tywin, whichever Lannister, twin that is. Hey, big dog.

Have I been from a solid dude? He's like, eh, you know, we're all, we all make a mistake. And he was like, bet you're not going to tell me the truth. I'm rocking with Larry. Can I be honest with you? I'm glad you brought that up. You guys, that is such an important thing.

Great scene. But even more so, it shows, that deep down there's more to Agon than we think that there is. And so, like, him, that scene showed that he's now to a point in his life where he is seeking legitimate counsel, which means he's actually being introspective.

The worst thing about niggas with yes men that love yes men, the worst thing even about being a yes man, which is the worst thing in the world I ever end up being. I end up being a no man because I'm so afraid of being a yes man, right? The worst thing about it is that people that have yes men

have no interest in self-improvement. They have no interest in the journey of life. They want things easy. They want people to always tell them, yes, that's a gigantic sign of weakness. Just a gigantic sign of weakness is something that you wouldn't want in a ruler or a monarch or even in a decent person.

And so the fact that he actually now finds value and people playing out the things of him that he needs to work on is like a very huge step forward for the character. So anyway, but back to cool this. All right. So Corlis gets got

got, right now we're just looking at, if we just look at the game board because we only have, I believe, two episodes left. Corliss is captured. Let's see. On fucking, on Reneer's side, she's sent

Allison off to Heron Hall. To do God knows what. So we also have, who else do we have either capture or dead? I guess Renier's side did get Sir Kristen Cole out of here. Yeah. I'm not, that's the thing was funny, man. But there's no more gold clothes.

There's no more gold closed. So the math is really, like, Tumbledin is the main thing, right? Like, at some point, Renier is going to have to deal with that problem. Yeah. That's going to have to, that's going to be something to dealt with.

They're out there. They're occupying places. It's bad. We have Allison going to Haren Hall. and then Damon trying to figure out the murders of the gold cloaks and now Corlis has been captured. And we have two dragon writers that on this point I'm like, they got one foot.

They're like they not, they out the door almost. And the show was doing this dragon myth like cleverly. So I was like, man, y'all got one dragon. They got six. It's tough. If they flip off and, uh,

and who you, it's four dragons to three. That's not, It's the best matchup, but it's a little more even. I'll just put it this way, too. So, Sunfire, so if you flip, there's sunfires out there? And it's, and Sunfire are long in the dying.

Right. Sunfires out there, Darren's Dragon is out there. Sheathsler's still on the board. She's still on the board. I'll even talk about her. Oh, the veil. Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

That was brutal. Hey, yo, I'm just saying when, when old girls slap, right? I was like, we can't, we can't, we can't do that, bro. I didn't like the optics. I didn't like the optics out. However, was it deserved? Probably. But,

but... Jomey, you're telling me sometimes it's deserved when a black queen gets slapped. Jesus Christ. This is crazy. Don't even... Don't do that,

don't do that. That's enough. That's enough. You got to go down. Listen, Jomi. All right, you go. Touching off. Okay.

You guys, that is enough. The show's cooking. We didn't even talk about whether or not we liked the episode or not because oh yeah it was great it was assumed we got right instead of incest

I saw Christian Cole die man they tried to give him the iron iron hide moment where he had to kill eight dudes by himself he's like yeah he don't get that you haven't earned that fuck out of here

they got to give it to him they give it to everybody well he did get to get busy in the one before I think the where they came upon a battlefield and everybody was

seemingly dead I thought that was awesome he did get to get busy a little bit yes sir Okay, we are done. Stay tapped in to Talk to Thrones every Sunday. The Midnight Boys return with their instant reactions

to Spider-Man brand-new days coming pretty soon. Stay tapped in and Talk to Thrones every Sunday. This Friday, Midnight Boys return with their instant reaction to Spider-Man Brand New Day. Producers today are Leia Zanaris, Jacob Cornet, Devin Brody, Joni, Joni, Me Adiron, Adiron, hashtag Joni's odor sensitivity. Hmm, tough.

Additional production from Arjuna Ram, go Powell. Chuck, take us up. Are a piece of Kristen Cole? Reneer has a lawn on her plate. And if you see Jomey in the streets, make sure you prostrate.

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