The Ringer-Verse - ‘Lanterns’ Episode 5 Instant Reactions | Midnight Boys

Episode Date: September 14, 2026

The Boys return to break down the crazy twists and turns of 'Lanterns' Episode 5, and this time they’re joined by special guest Chris Ryan! The guys and CR give their reactions to the big Manhunter reveal, discuss John’s arc as “The One,” theorize about what else can happen in Rushville now that it’s been largely destroyed, and so much more. Finally, they end the show with an update to their possible Manhunter rankings.(0:00) Intro(6:38) Spoilers ahead(9:35) ‘Lanterns’ Episode 5 instant reactions(1:24:37) Outro(1:27:00) Post-creditsHosts: Van Lathan, Jomi Adeniran, and Steve AhlmanGuest: Chris RyanProducers: Devon Baroldi and Jamie YukichAdditional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopowell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome into the Ringiverse. This is, of course, the Ringers' Nexus podcast fee for all things, fandom. We are Steve, the architect, Alden, the builder, and tinker of things. Jomi, the explainer, a dinner on, you've got questions, he's got answers. Oh, man, Van, he of the receding resurgent, hairline, and sitting in today. Chris C.R. Ryan, the Prince of the Ringer, together we are known as, I thought midnight, boys. We'll be right back after this.

quality matters, but so does price. At Marshalls, you don't have to choose. You can get the good stuff for less, the stuff that lasts, because there's no point in tightening your belt if it's just going to break when you do. Get the good stuff in store at Marshalls today. This episode is brought to by Uber Eats. You can get almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Sorry, you can't get a beach delivered, but you can get a peach.

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Order a minimum of $30 required. Valid on grocery, convenience, retail, specialty foods, or flower delivery orders only. Terms and conditions apply. Chris, that was a good Poup. Thanks, brother. I was wondering. I was wondering if you're going to get involved. If I was going to do anything, look, I'm glad it's the nexus of fandom because I'm a fan of you guys.

Wow. I am curious why I got drafted to fill in for. for Chuck this week. You guys want to answer? First name on the board? Was I? Absolutely. Yeah, 100%.

I mean, you know what's happening at the company, right? You know what's happening. Okay. All right. So, files on socials. At the midnight post spot on Insta and TikTok. At Ring of Verse on Insta, Twitter,

Facebook, and TikTok, Jomi. I'm actually glad you brought that up because it's a really important conversation that we've been having on this pod for a minute. Van came out. said that he deserves to be third chair on the big picture. He didn't say that. That's true.

And you, most people would claim that you are the leader in the clubhouse. Then is Tracy Letts and Van is in the mix somewhere. Van's in the mix. Would you respond to his claim for third chair? Sooner or later, the third chairs need to talk about whether there's like a different stage for us to be on. You know, why are we putting all of our effort into being the third chair of somebody, somebody else's pod. I like this.

Why aren't we maybe teasing three chairs? You know what I mean? Like you meet Tracy? Three chairs? Our third chair podcast. And then we actually go at them.

The people are looking for a replacement for Comtown. They've been talking about it. Right. Like they want us to be. But I say we do it even more direct. I say they drop a conversation about the movie

and then we drop one two hours after. There's exactly. Just some Drake Kendrick type. That's right. A lot of subliminals in there. It's like, oh, you know, there's another podcast that called the End of Endgame Blue Bar. If you're not going to get that on here on three watch chairs. I think there's room for everybody to hang out and talk about movies.

I'll tell you something. Here's a deal. This is what I liked about it. That was just my James Tala Rico. I get it. You came back there, like, wow. What I like about it is that you challenge the establishment. Yes.

You challenge the establishment, but you also challenge the establishment because you got to get up to Tracy. Tracy challenged the establishment. Yeah. All right, we're on YouTube, like, comment, subscribe, share. You can watch every Midnight Boys and House of Art episode on YouTube.com backslash at Ring Reverse

and also on Spotify. Programmer Reminders! On Monday, House of OurR continues their lanterns coverage. Landowners is being very good to us. It's the gift that keeps on giving over here in the Ringiverse. Have you experienced this on the watch as well?

Yes, if anything, I think we have undercovered lanterns. A couple of times, there have been other shows or events that have forced us to be like we have 10, 15 minutes for an episode. Yeah. I'll tell you the truth, though. I feel like I'm coming at lanterns from a little bit of a deficit when it comes to my knowledge, my ball knowledge.

I'm not a DC guy, right? Like, I'm more of like a Marvel dude, if I'm anything. And so my relationship to the show is kind of in the tenant zone where it's just like, don't overthink and just feel it, you know? Yeah, it's my guy. So it means the show makes no fucking sense to you. Well, I'm actually quite happy to be here today because this episode in particular I found very moving. and somewhat confusing. Oh, great.

We'll get into that entire thing. Okay. You know what? Before we get into that, just on that note, this show, even the DC stuff might be a little out of your depth, but as far as like the show,

show of it, this is CR coding. Oh, yeah. It's Chris Mundy who did Ozark. The very first scene of this episode felt very Ozark. Damon Lindelof did Watchmen Leftovers Lost. Oh, yeah.

And Tom King, who I know is like a great comics writer. So it's not, It's all that. It is also true detective with a fucking super ring. So I get it. Like, it's awesome.

In that regard, do you think that a lot of people who aren't into comics? Is that why the show you feel like is reverberating so much? Because people can enter the show. You don't have to give a fuck about the Greenlanders. I think you can be, it is one of the few things I've seen achieve that like equilibrium of like, it will satisfy people who have been reading DC for decades.

It will satisfy people who are like, what is on Sunday night on HBO. Yeah, let's hold that because I got something to say. I have a bold proclamation to make. Bold proclamation make later on. On Friday, Buttmash gives their reactions to Resident Evil,

the movie, the Resident Evil movie, which, I'd be honest with you guys, was such a gigantic announcement, and I feel like it's kind of flying under the radar since everything is that.

I know that this movie's coming out like a couple of weeks, right? Yeah, next week. Right. I kind of feel like we raced here. This is a big fucking deal. It's been a crazy summer. It's crazy summer,

but, like, this was, like, announced late and, like, nobody's really seen it or like there's been no real word of mouth about it? The word of mouth is very good. It would have to be. It would have to be. There's always no way he can miss.

But it's interesting that they're doing the Resident Evil title as if it's your standard horror movie that gets released. Why? But then sneaks up on everyone because the word of mouth is so good. They didn't like lean into the, oh, there's a video game movie. Interesting. Well, I mean, because like it's, it is a video game movie, right? It is based on Redis Evil. But it's not like Leon.

Like there's not like, it's not based off like the game game itself or like the characters from the game show. So it's kind of a little, it's a little different in that regard. And also an update on ringer quest, Steve. Yes. First of all, thank you all to all who watched and enjoyed the latest episodes. It was a privilege to get to do it again. And we're very, very excited to do more. So we had two come out in sequences of a week or so.

And we're going to be shooting a little bit more at the end of the year. And we're going to be having some more come out. this year, so look forward to that. D&D on your motherfucking ass, bitch! On today's episode, we react to the fifth episode of lanterns, the fifth episode,

which I think, I'm just going to let you guys know, it's a masterpiece. I fucking loved it. I loved it. All right, but we're going to be spoiling the show, spoiling everything that happened in this show, everything that happened in past shows. We're also going to be spoiling stuff that has happened in the comic books, all kinds of different stuff, spoiled landers, green lanterns, fucking Ryan Reynolds,

whatever the fuck you guys want. We're going to spoil it all. Steve. We're getting ready to talk about you're listening to a reaction podcast. The spoilers are coming.

All right. To begin our reactions, guys, this is about to be a fucking adventure. To begin our reactions, because Charles is not here. Charles, our fucking leader is not here. Charcles. We want to. bring you the Midnight Manifest.

It's going to tell you all you need to know, or are you going to get all of it? I'll try. Let's, Jomi, the explainer. It's going to explain this show to you. Jomey, take it away. All right. This is Lanterns, Episode 5, directed by Greta Van Vesant Patel, and written by Justin Britt Gibson. We start in 2007.

Carrie's car breaks down in Rushville while she's on the run, and when the Gotham goons catch up to her, Zoe changes, or saves her life in exchange. for a loyalty. We'll get back to that later. Fast forward to 2016, Hal tells John that he crashed a car in order to get him off the board, you know, with them being a snitch and everything. Hal then meets with Anton and the aliens from Rousseau, too, and convinces them that the Manhunter is making so he can apprehend Zoe by himself. Speaking of Zoh, she lets John get blown up and explains her plan while offering a similar deal that she offered to carry in 2007. She heals John's wounds and then puts her plan in motion. Soll starts blowing up Rushfield to lure out

how and deplete his ring while John escapes the hospital. She's making us the distraction, but Anton sees right through him and kills him. Howe gets her cornered, but she escapes. Howe goes back to the motel where John is waiting for him. As they're douged out, Zoe blows up the motel with another one of her suborbital lasers. When the dust settles, she finds Howling in the rubble. But where's John? He's perched up at the sniper's nest and one shot Zoe with tears in his eyes.

He goes back to take the evidence of her death with the heart and confirmation that she is a manhunter, takes the ring and the lantern from Hal and goes to meet the Guardian but instead of taking the oath and becoming the Green Lantern, John leaves the ring with the Guardian and walks out and that's your man I matter fresh for episode 5 I'm gonna say yes to that

I'm gonna say yes to that. Zoe doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. I'm gonna say yes to this. No Charles but you know. Hey, you fucking held it down. No, no, no. Nice job, man.

No no. No self-deprecation. You explained this shit out of that, Jome. I did what I can't do. Doing your thing. All right, we're going to start to show in a different way this time. Let's go to

CR's casual corner. You said that you were confused. That's why I just wore a sweatshirt today. I was like, let's keep it cash. What were you confused about this episode? I think I was a little bit confused about the sacrificing of the town

by both John and Zoe. So John is essentially looking... I'm sorry, not John. Hal and Zoe. Hal is looking at this as his opportunity to save his own job. I think I understand that part. Right.

So he is like, I am going to misdirect Anton, I'm going to misdirect John, John, and then I get the prize, which is bringing the last Manhunter back to the Guardian's lifetime contract, Shohei Otani, right? Yeah. Zoe,

who has essentially developed a tender loving cult among the people of Nebraska here, because she has gone around saving people's lives in various ways, then sacrifices all these people to deplete John's

ring, right? Like you said, so that She can What? Like what's the end game for her? So I had this same This same question And I actually had to ask Collega this

So she knows that they're eventually coming for her She knows that they're eventually coming for her And so she's been training these people For decades to do that For this This she believes If she can destroy The if she can defeat this green lantern

and destroy this alien foe. She believes that this will get her safety in some kind of way. That after this, there'll be either a new Greenlander because she also makes the deal with John Stewart and that he won't hunt her anymore because he'll be under the same deal

that the rest of the town is under, or that she'll make such a mess that the aliens that were coming for her will leave her alone. So I think her thing is to end it now. Now, I don't know, and this is an interesting part of it, I don't know, and you guys can check my work on that.

I don't know how she would have known that when the guardians eventually sent the lanterns at her, that there would be the opportunity to corrupt or swing a younger lantern that would then replace the older lantern and give her a way out of that. That is the only thing that I, because a plan to beat the lanterns and never have them come back, either have to like, you'd either have to kill all the lantern or you'd have to kill the Earth lantern or you'd have to know that there was some deal or maybe she was going to use Hal. Maybe she was going to give Hal that same.

Well, if I recall correctly, nobody knew that she was on Earth. It wasn't until the aliens started dying in episode one at the football game that we were like, okay, that Hal realized like there's a Manhunter. Those were Anton's guys. Yeah, those are Anton's guys, right?

This alien race, and we do find out also, and we could just, Yeah, we mentioned things in the episode. We do find out that Anton and Zoe had children together. Well, Anton was, Zoe's a Manhunter. Anton was one of the first people that she gave this deal to. Yeah, yeah, right. And then obviously did to them what she did to the people.

Exactly. Same thing. I think her manipulating John was just a stroke of genius in the moment. In the moment. It was just something like, boom, I can do this. Remember, Anton says part of the Manhunter's thing is to go. and lay with the most, yeah, with like the most powerful person in order to, like, you know, assume power.

And so when he's like, Makin is the bad guy, and he's like, so you're saying that you were sleeping with, with Makin? Yeah, yeah, you know. That was a great line from Hal being like, you know, you've been all over the galaxy. It's not a little preference.

It's about an opportunity. I want to dab them up right there. Oh. Oh, okay. That's really. That's really great. That's real. You see some shit you never even thought of before.

up there. Alright, let's start back at the beginning then because I think a lot of people had that question, by the way. She's like blowing up the whole time. I'm like, what the fuck is she blown up the whole town for it? And she's blown up the whole town to deplete the ring, but also these people, just like Macon, knew that this number was getting called. Yeah. Like, theoretically, could, I guess the other

thing I don't know, is there any limits to Manhunter's power? Does it have to be within the realm of like the town that they've colonized the plant? Like, could she have just gone to like Omaha and started blowing stuff up and then like, Hal's going to have to come here because his oath is to save people. or protect people.

I think they've kind of laid the groundwork of that because like also to kind of like constrict the actual like scale of the show to make the manhlers be like they have to start from like the smallest and most like desolate parts of a society in order for it to grow. Sure. Which is a good metaphor. And that was her outsider. Exactly. But you also want to maintain some kind of control, right? If you're going to doing in Omaha, then the FBI and Marines. No, no.

I'm not saying she should brainwash the people of Omaha or or have them all signed this contract. No, no. I'm saying she could have had it. This destruction could have happened anywhere on earth. You could use the sub-border relationship anywhere. I know, but my point is if you go and you do it in Los Angeles or if you go and you do it in some gigantic place. Lioness team comes for you.

Lioness. It's going to be crazy. This is something she can relatively control. Yeah, right. And, like, she can know everybody. And she had all the Rube Goldberg machines, like, with the water tower and everything. Exactly. Right.

So let's start at the beginning. This was very Ozark. The DNA of this scene was all over. Ozark's DNA, Shassay, is all in this scene. We have Kerry escaping Gotham. And we see in that her Faustian bargain. Almost not Faustian, though. Faus doesn't really save you, right?

The devil doesn't really save you. But in that, I thought this scene was genius for two reasons. Number one, just a little bit of a narrative Easter egg to our Gotham. The fact that this is where the fucking criminal is a place that you will run away from. It's a place that you would put yourself in this whatever this Witt Pro type of situation she was looking for, this personal wit pro, and

that she looked like she really wanted to leave it behind. So it's very important for world building. It's a good world building scene. Yes. Also a scene to where it both built intrigue and answered some questions because in the episode before we were wondering if Zoe was really the manhunter. And they go

right away, she's really the manhunter but that doesn't end the mystery's other questions. No. And then that it propels the episode for it. Right. And I think we can get into our like Manhunter projections later on. But like to me, I think that the Manhunter mystery is still relatively unsolved as to what we have another timeline now to arc through. It's the most soft thing that we've ever been solved. I agree with Steve. You guys are not serious. No, I am serious. We have a whole other who killed Hal Jordan. Why is the ring gone? Like there's a lot of questions. We'll get to it later. I think we know who Manhunter is.

Yeah, but we don't know what else left me. I agree with Steve. I think they're could be a second manhunter, right? It's not, I'm not saying it's not above the realm of possibility, but I am saying that it would be, it'd be a stretch because she says an episode, it was just me, I was the only one that survived, they blew everybody else except for me, I'm the last one. And then we see her die.

And so, I mean, you could, I think the real thing is y'all, y'all keeps thinking the boy is the manhunter, the all-state varsity quarterback. Leave that boy alone. He just want to throw touchdowns, man. He don't be killing. He don't want to be comfortable words.

I think that that was the last Manhunter, but I think the bigger reveal was that the Manhunter was a Guardian's creation. That the Manhunter, then that the Guardians were like, we basically started this whole thing. We tried to flip a switch to turn it off. And this is, we've made mistakes.

So, like, is there going to be any accountability for them, right? Like, or are they such supreme and superior beings? I actually don't know the answer to this question. that they're outside of justice. Like, do you know what I'm saying? I do. Yeah. Now, from comics canon, that wasn't a reveal.

That the Guardians created the Manhunterners. That's known. That's known. So from comments canon, that wasn't a reveal. I don't want to jump too far ahead because I want to talk about this. But I have to. I'm sorry. There's something that has said in the show.

When Kerry says, I owe her, she gave me a gift. I think people think that she's talking about the freedom after she ran away from the guys in Gotham. I don't think that's what she's talking about. I think she's talking about her son. A miracle. She said she gave me something. She gave me a miracle.

I don't think that she's talking about the freedom of the run. I think she's talking about her son. I think that's definitely like, I would not bet against that. And I don't know, but what I'm, I did like, the fact, first of all, it's just really good writing when you're like, this entire show has been about taking the ring off of somebody's finger. What do you open this episode with Carrie's finger? You know what I mean? They just, these are guys and Justin Brick Gibson worked with Damon

on the Ray movie that never went for Star Wars. He is like an accomplished screenwriter. Like, he's very good. The guys in the top of the room are very good. They're just going to sprinkle this show with stuff. It's a faint. It's a misdirect. To Steve's point when he was talking about like what do we have to find out next and how much we, the remaining mysteries, one of the things that's a hallmark of Lindeloff stuff is like,

the thing you think is going to be in the finale or two seasons from now, I'm going to handle that in the third episode. Yeah. Because it's like... This is the finale of a show that was only about Nebraska. Yes.

But now we have three more episodes to figure out a whole other, we got a whole other shows worth of stuff. The thing about the show is we all thought it was the origin story of a green lantern. It's not about that. It's really not about that.

And Lindelof does this every time. Every time I think I know what the show is about, the show is not about that. Did I expect for John to at some point reject the Green Lantern core as it exists right now? Certainly. I expected that. But what I did not expect was the death of Zoe in this episode,

the death of the Manhunter. I didn't expect them to take characters off the board and then leave more story on the board with, was it, three episodes like? Yeah. You think this is like a penultimate episode. Right. Maybe in a finale.

If we do this in episode five, we still got so much game left to figure out, like, if there is a second manhunter. They got eight of these, right? Yeah. Yeah. Or how, like, obviously, John said, I'm not taking the ring. So then how did guy get it, you know, and how does he fit into the story? There's so much left on the table, and I can't wait to see what happens. Okay, so let's go back a little bit.

So we come out of that, and, you know, we're back with Hal and John. Hal is almost getting in this show a little bit drowned. His character is almost getting a little bit drowned and overshadowed. He still has some tricks up his sleeve. The trick that he pulls with Anton, with, I don't think Anton ever really believed him. I just think he had to go check it out. But it feels like right now, Hal Jordan is completely overwhelmed by the depth and the scope of what's happening in Rushville. I don't think he's overwhelmed, but I do think I was disappointed in Howe.

I'm not going to lie to you. because we saw what happened in episode four and Sinestro's like, here's what you do, you make the kid look silly, you kill the manhunter, you come back to Oya, you're a hero.

And I'm like, man, how better than that, man? How smart than that, man? How not going to fall for that? His mission is superficial. So it's going to feel like he is starting to feel like a hollow character because he's not...

There's no meaning to it. He's not trying to act out his oath. He's trying to act out, I need to have job security. Exactly. That's the most important thing. All these people are getting vaporized. There are bombs going off.

There are, you know, all this stuff is happening. I've got this kid who's training with me. I'm basically like gaslighting him into like, you know, God knows what. And what he's doing is only trying to keep that ring. But that makes it interesting to me that he lied to Anton. He lied to him. He knew that Zoe was the manhunter. He could have given Zoe of it.

He could have made an actual deal. He could have made an actual deal to turn. turn over the actual manhunter that would probably fuck John too because that motherfucker is laying there at that point or some point right after that with no skin on his body burning John Stewart alive in this show is so interesting like they burned a man alive he went through a lot so I'm still wondering because you're you're right yeah how's mission is shallow but Johns is too they're both they're both trying to satisfy a personal goal when their whole deal should be for a collective greater Trying to save somebody. Yeah. Yeah. And John on a quest of personal agency, like, is kind of, it was projected from the beginning because, like, to deprogram himself from the training that his parents put him through

and to, like, choose himself over something that is obviously a thing that's been indoctrated into him since his birth, pretty much, versus Hal, who is now trying to, a, fight for job security, but also proved to himself that he can still be Green Lantern. Like, there's, like, a personal aspect of this where it's, like, this probably wouldn't even, like he's probably thinking right now this wouldn't even have been this fucked up if John wasn't here in the first. I don't think he thinks in any way that he not up to the job. I think he. I think he overly believes that he could still get it done.

He thinks he's the only one who could get it done. Yeah. I think, yeah, I think he believes that part of his belief, part of the reason why he is who he is is because he thinks he's the only guy I can do it. When he hits him and he says, you don't deserve that ring, what was his response? Don't deserve. It chose me. Yeah. Like he's like, like, don't deserve.

Like, how could you say it's not about deserve? It don't matter. That's like somebody walking up to you and being like, your wife, you don't deserve your wife. Dog, I asked, she said yes. So I don't know what to tell you, bro. I mean, you might think you're better at it, but like take your shot.

It's like, it chose me. And you literally have to rip the ring off of his finger. Why do you guys think he lied to Anton? Because of her to get the credit. He lied to Anton so he could keep him distracted. have him and Macon be like off the board. Kind of how he did John. Crashes, he puts John out of commission.

If Anton is chasing Macon and vice versa, that means whenever his Sentinel spot Zoe, nobody will be there. He can snap Zo. I mean, how you talk to do that? Zoe, who cares? I just want you to say it right, dog. I don't care.

You don't care. You don't care about her name. I don't care. Oh, so you don't care about her name? I don't care. So she has a name. She's turning herself. You don't care about it.

New drop. My name is Jomey. My name, I hate women. You don't like it. And by the way I gotta bring this that drop back This is worse because she chose her name It'll be one thing if her parents gave her name

Yeah And it's one thing But this is like saying It's like calling her Cash is Clay Tough You cash is clearing the shit out of her Tough Speaking of the thing she chose

Amazing monologue with her in the hospital While she's putting back together John About like how my Disadvantage is the biggest advantage Like how What did you think of that? No No?

Did you not like that scene? You didn't like that? I liked the scene. Conceptually. I liked the scene. I loved this show. I liked that scene. That wasn't my favorite monologue of this season.

How so? Just because, okay, that seemed like nothing else in the show has. But that seemed like a scene from the studio. Really? To me, That seemed like, okay, we have to make this, that seemed like reaching your hand out.

It was a little, it was a little pandery to me. I just like, for me personally. I love that scene. We get the job done type of stuff. Well, kind of like, you know, we know that y'all are good people. And I've said this before.

Yes. Sometimes just do the show. Sure. Like, you know, and the, there's, you can't, I feel icky saying this, because you can't have too much of it. You can't have too much of a reminder that there are people in these rooms that are writing shows. You also have to think about, like, how many, 10 million people watch this show. Right. They're not all going to have, like, the reps that you do with storytelling, but be the sophistication you might have with, like, identity politics and everything else.

You know what I mean? So they'll probably be like, damn, that is a good point. Powerful. Yeah. They'll probably be like powerful. She's been right now. But for me personally, it was like, you know, whatever. I do like the idea.

It was a hat on a hat. Like, you see those two people. Sure. There's like the incredibly striking image of this black man who's had his skin burned off and is begging this person, do not make me lighter. Like, it is like a pretty stark striking scene. And like, there's like cool storytelling moments. And then on top of that, they're like, let me tell you.

why I had to be an outsider in the first place. By the way, the rationale makes sense. That's why it's not like, because every, as long as something works in story, I'm not gonna mind it. So the rationale in story makes sense. And I think this spoke to like what I was kind of

thinking about when like the Guardians couldn't perceive of like race or racism and how humans treat race. And it was purely like, this is how an alien would talk about a society who uses race in a certain way. I think it's The thing people bump on or, I know, I have found myself bumping on,

I think she's an amazing actress, porno jagging anything, but like I thought it was like, it worked at the end with her sacrifice of herself or her like essentially like basically like saying like I lost, you know, at the end when she takes the bullet. But in scenes like that, the diner scene, the skin replacement surgery scene, the hospital scene, I was like, I want this character to emote more. Like, I want this to feel like a more of an emotional, passionate moment, even though I know that I'm watching a robot alien super killer negotiator way to survival. I have to say two things.

One is that it's interesting that the guardians have no concept of race, or at least they're feigning like they do, and the Manhunter's, are all too familiar with this. So the Guardian's creation that has had to live amongst different people and has not been able to sit on high and judge and pick and choose understand just the intricacies

of what it means to be a person in skin. That, in a way, is another thing that humanized the drama happened in Rushville and, to me, push the Guardians further away into isolation. There's something else I have to say that I have to say that I noticed here. Said that twice. So we know that Zoe as the manhunter,

Zoe. Zoe has had three lovers. Anton? Anton? Mm-hmm. Makin and John Stewart. Two, she lets get killed. One, she lets kill her.

That tells me I know who killed the pussy. Okay. Jesus, man. That was such a long climb up the mountain. We took a long walk. I really thought you were going to say something. Macon. Macon.

Was not throwing it down. Anton. Was not throwing it down. Yeah. Right? One of them, she turned around and said, I won't you hate it when you have to gun down your intergalactic situation ship? Right on the forehead.

Right in the forehead. Can I ask, though? When she's like, okay, Carrie, I cut your finger off, you swear allegiance to me. Now, let's go grow you a new finger. Right now, I don't know whether that is like her lasers or whatever.

But the one thing that was distinctive about what we saw between her interaction with John and his recovery is that she squirts a little bit of blood. I do not know if every single person who is recovered from cancer escaped their snitched dead dad in

Gotham, whatever else she did for other people in that town, Do they all get the blood transfusion? Is there some sort of transference between... I mean, John has manhunter DNA or tech in his bloodstream now, right? His skin was grown by the technology of the manhound. So I would imagine so then, right? If that's the thought...

Well, I thought that the skin was repaired by her special lasers that also go around efficiently butchering cows. See, here's the thing, though. It would make sense... I think they, aren't they? It would make sense if all of them had had. that. Yeah.

Because that type of thing would make them feel bonded to her. It's a blood off. Yes. Yeah. It's like, that he immediately breaks

by killing her. Unless that is what she wanted. Because she knew that her spirit, what have you, would live on in him. Or that or there's somebody else

that she is trying to protect. Yes. That there's something else because when she's talking to the son, I'm not let going on my son theory. I don't, I don't, talking to the son.

They have spent way too much time on that kid. On Archmanning. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. Like I'm like, another Sports Center segment on this fucking guy. She looks at the son and she says, everything I told you.

Yeah. Been preparing him for whatever is about to happen. So there's some significance. Again, good writing, echoing John and his parents. Absolutely. Yes. Everything seems to have been put forth and set for him. And then there's something,

another character. Jason Ritter's character. Filarious. Like, why was he, why did he flip out like that? He flipped out, he really wanted to get busy, right? Then they would not let him get busy at all. Yeah.

So he was really, really going for it. Like he really was animated to get out there and do something. He had to do something. I think they got a Manhunter's Norwalks situation. Okay, give it up. Like, they have like the designated survivors of if this town goes to shit, we have to siphon

off like a couple of surviving man hunters. He's right. He's right. There's no fucking way, Zoe who had a laser beam blow up her own truck and then in the next episode or two episodes from then is just like, I'm good, you know, took a sniper shot. Yeah. She may have been like, checkmate, you got me. I thought you were going to be in the rubble with Hal. Right. But instead, you're like some far distance away already. but the way she acquiesces to that situation leads me to believe that you guys are correct that there is another.

They expect one of us with the records, brother. They expect one of us with the records, brother. I love that scene, you know? Because like, let's say that Bain tells me that. I'm going to be like, okay, cool. Is there, are we going to draw straws? Like, are we going to flip a coin? It's like...

I'm just surprised they didn't have that talk before they had jacked to play. No, that guy just, because he might not did it. Right. That's what Bain's fucking up. guy just went, oh, okay, cool. I'll die now. Now, that dude was horny to die. The fire rises.

The fire rises. I would have been like, okay, cool. Like, what are we going to do? Let's put this nigga in the records. Like, there's a couple guys already dead. Anyway, whatever. I never, every time I said that. That is true.

A couple guys were already dead. Yeah, a couple guys were already dead. It did not have to be me. Yeah. There's a couple guys already dead. I could put them in the records. All right. Back to Hal.

So, shallow hell. Shallow hell. Shilled a gal. Chipped off his ring to do the century mode. What is that? I don't know what that's about. I don't know what that's about. So I'm guessing, like, when you chip it off,

it, like, kind of just flies around because it's, like, a projection. It's still a construct of the ring. But, like, it has the ability to, like, fly or Hal can, like, concentrate it to fly around the town. When they popped up at the beginning of the... Yeah. At the beginning of the season,

Stewart didn't do that. No, but it came out of the ring itself. Right. He just showed up, exactly. So, I mean, I think his character is really interesting because, number one, I'm almost certain that he's not dead. That's his century.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I'm almost certain that he's not dead. Or that the Manhunter has taken form and it is him. But if that were the case, if what? Because the kid would be growing up by now. No, no, no, no. The kid is playing high school football.

The kid's playing high school football. He asked about it. Yeah. John asked about him in that episode one. Well, you can't do both? he may be maybe she said he's all state so you know he's probably a manhunter out there

fucking manhunting it up on the fucking for the goddamn huskers he's out there Dillan Riola got beat out No one told us we couldn't have a manhunter You show me We're here at LSU We're gonna put the best people on the field

A lot of aliens Heders don't want us to have manhunterers They don't want us to have manhunterers on the game That's actually you raise a good point Like in the NIL era Right in the future No because back of the date He's going to Nebraska

He's a cornhusker for sure. Tom Osborne, signed sealed and delivered. It's not even close. He's running a triple option. This new era. Matt Rule has dedicated himself to keeping... What three hats are on his death where he picks it up?

Texas A&M for sure. They got the bag. They got money up there. I feel like he also feels like a little bit of like a USC heritage QB. And Lincoln Riley's like visualize it, man. You know, like... You can see it. Yeah.

The mat liner. This is to me. He's a man. Because they have to have that mentality. Maybe Miami. Miami. Maybe Miami. Maybe goes down there.

I could see more last year of college, like fifth year quarterback. Fifth year transfer going to Carson Beckstein. I guess my question is, if he goes to the team and he's, you know, a manhood, does he have to fuck the coach? Because the coach is the most powerful, you know, that's the problem. Oh, you don't want to do that. Interesting. That's probably, you can't do that. That's probably different.

They're different. Oh, for the, um, athletic. The athletics department. You go to the dean. This was our most action-packed episode. Easily, yeah. Yes. A lot of lanternin.

Uh-huh. Questioning, where's the lantern in the show? People complaining about it. We got great shit. I keep thinking about the idea that a lantern has to be fearless when I was watching. I kept thinking about that when I was watching this episode. Because, I mean, obviously, it's not a hard and fast rule. I don't think you lose your ring the second you express any fear.

It's a job interview question that they basically ask you. He was scared in that fucking car. He was scared of that fucking thing. Yeah. He was like, yo. what the fuck is she doing? Yeah. And he seemed annoyed,

but when that beam first went off, I think he met some fear out there on that battlefield. But did you guys get that? Right. I don't know about like fear per se, but he was scared when he was in the car getting ready to burn.

Oh, you're talking about John or... Oh, you're talking about John or how? I'm talking about How. I think for sure, yeah, John was like, yo, I don't want to... He was definitely scared. But Howe, I think Howe was more like, He can't believe that she's doing this to her own people.

He's like, yo, she would go this far for this. And so for John, John was absolute. Are you kidding me, bro? Yeah. You sitting there, you can't get out. You start a line on fire. You see in his eyes, we talk about, you mentioned this last week, Aaron Pierre and how, like, he's able to emote with his face and his eyes.

In that moment before the whole thing blows up, you can see, like, yo, this is somebody who, like, as much as we've seen him be built for, like, all this going, sitting there for nine, months waiting for the guy, whatever, this whole thing. This one right here, death is still scary, man. There's no preparing you for that. Damn. I also, I...

That's true. I think that they're... Hug your family. I want to get back to the action sequences. John specifically was going through a real like Neo-Ark for me on this one. Burned, resurrected, comes back.

We even say more powerful because he, you know, pretty much whips Hal's ass in that hotel room, even though Hal saves him from the laser beam, then has the foresight to go trap Zoe. At the end of the episode is like, I've now transcended this idea of like what you guys wanted me to be. My parents, the guardian, puts the ring down

and is like, and here's your fucking crystal heart that you wanted back so badly. It feels like they're setting him up to be like a reform, an agent of revolution or reform. Like, you know what I mean? And like he is like the true job interview, the true test was for me to understand the actual, what does this oath that we take mean thing. Yeah. Do you know what I noticed?

He never put shoes on. Yep. This entire time that he's going through all of that, he's literally walking across. Broken glass, rubble, dead bodies, the entire thing. Brian Winhorse. Why is that? Why would he do that? Why would he do that?

Why would he do that? Why would he do that? He walks in there. You know who else who's barefoot? Jesus. Actually, he probably had sandals, but at times, at times, definitely was. Not walking the sand, though. Right.

Walking through the sand. So he's like, he's, he walks across broken glass. He walks back to the store, grabs the same gun that he didn't need before. Right. Yeah. But he needs it now. Yeah. I'm mad at hell, mama.

He needs it now. He's already paid for the gun. He's already invested. into that. All of this is investment. This is ROI for John Stewart, everything. The gun, he already invested into it. The fight with Hal Jordan

already invested in it. Parents. The parents already invested to it. Joey, the Guardian, Zoe, see, Zoe. Zoe, the Guardians. All of this stuff for him is stuff he's already laid the groundwork for. He knows it now and he knows it enough to

say nope. Yep. And when he gave the heart, to the guardians, what did he say? It was like your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, what was the line? I can't remember. Yeah. Yeah. We can't evade the, we can't, like, we can't evade our consequences.

No, no, no, no. He's, like, what is this? He goes, what is this? He goes, that's your, like, your sins and your consequences. Sins and consequences. She thinks it's a trophy. Yeah. But it's a resignation letter.

Yeah. Right. It's a, just a phenomenal scene. And she has the tabarity, because it'd be like, everybody makes mistakes. Right. I'm like, it seems like

the whole point of being the guardians is to throw a perfect game. Right? It's like, that's the image you project out, you know, when you're going around

deciding who's worthy of having this job or that job. Yeah. So then how are you, how are you not flawless? I mean, the religious, the religious illusions,

the religious iconography of the show is just kind of powerful in this episode. I just, I keep thinking back to, like to know that this is this is where we leave this. And now we have 2026.

And all of the things that we need to now either address or figure out for John, because if the end game here is John is a green lantern and we have 10 years of him not being one and we have kind of the entirety of his life being fine with not being one, what gets us there in three episodes? What gets us where John doesn't want to be a green land? where John gets to be a grand venture by the end of this season. Imagine it's Hal dying. Either it's Hal dying or we don't get there in this season.

Which would be a really really... We have to get there in the season because he's going to be in... They don't make TV like that anymore. They might not. This whole sort of Dracula thing. Or maybe he becomes Greenlander in Manor tomorrow. I don't know. That wouldn't make very much sense.

But I mean, but remember now, a lot of things have to happen in the Green Lantern structure. Because we've already been introduced to Greenlander. In Guy Gardner. Guy Gardner, yeah. So for there to be another Greenlander. But is Guy Earth's Greenlander? Or is he somebody else? No, he's Earth's Greenlander.

Yeah, sector 2-814 is Greenlander. Now, in Greenlander and lore, you actually get to a point where they decide they need more than one Green Lantern. Yeah, they're giving out right. Yeah. But I don't know if we're there yet, or if Guy Gardner dies in this show, or if he dies in Manna tomorrow. I can never see Nathan Philly and I don't think that one happened. James Gunn executive producer.

Yeah, no, they're using him every time they get. Did he die the suicide? He may have, but I just meet in general. Right, yeah. It feels like these two dudes have been waiting 25 years to get this shot. They're not going to be like, guess what, you died episode six of fucking lanterns?

One scene I definitely want to talk about Macon and Anton. Awesome. So sick. Say more. It's because, They begin that conversation in an alien tongue, and it gets, like, rather, like, it's as if they walk into the room and they know each other, seemingly.

And both of them know what the score is. And it's just a guy, like, it feels like a finale of a Vince Gillian show where, like, the guy who knows he's going to die and knows that all of these consequences are coming to him. And what do you have to say for yourself is basically what? what the scene is like trying to do. And it's about like, she gave us everything that we wanted. We couldn't conceive. And I'm here to die for everything that I believe in.

And this is, and he's like, I'm here to kill you to make sure that I know that it's right. And maybe you guys are right about the Manhunter and the kid, because I think the most important thing that happens in that space, it's at the end where he's like, you answered all the question correct. You did everything you were supposed to do. But the one thing that betrayed you is, is your willingness to die. It's the same thing that happened to Herman.

And apparently, like, Manhunters, like, they will do whatever it takes to survive. They're about survival, yeah. They're all about survival. So if you're willing to die, that means you either protect them or you got nothing else to lose, right? And Macon, at that point, was protecting Zoe.

Yep. So Zoe was willing to die. Well, maybe she was all out of options. Maybe he was protecting somebody else. Exactly. Exactly. Right. And I think he lied when he said we couldn't conceive.

Well, when he said we couldn't conceive, that just makes me think that maybe they couldn't conceive. Maybe it was Anton, but the Manhunter maybe wanted to conceive with someone. So wait, let's just be on the same page. You're saying quarterback QB1

is Carrie and Willie's like Jason Ridder's son. Or are you saying it's Zoe's son? So either, well, that is, that is supposed to be their son. Yeah. I know that that's what they're, but the conception part of it to me

was just an incredible wrinkle and layer to their relationship. It makes the betrayal, not only just like this civilization wipe out that she pulls off, but also like this was a love affair. He was obviously betrayed by her at some point. But I was just wondering whether or not you were saying like, what is the miracle here? So this is what I would say.

If the, if she did a miracle for her, that would lead me to believe for Carrie, that would lead me to believe that the son is that miracle, right? Or it's possible that the offspring of the Manhunter is actually Macon's son because she was married to Macon.

Either way, maybe she gets there, Zoe can't have kids, or they're having trouble conceiving in some sort of way, whatever she gives to her, part of it has to do with either one of those characters to me. So Macon had Willie with somebody else. So like a Manhunter in vitro? It could be either way.

I'm not sure. I'm actually not sure. It has to do with one of those two characters. Personally, I think it makes more sense if she has found, as all humans probably do, a group of people with enormous vulnerability and an enormous, like, debt that they feel like they owe. So they're like, carry on the run is on the precipice of being executed by these guys. They're going to chop her up and take her back to Gotham.

And out of nowhere in the last second, and a diner in the middle of nowhere, Zoe shows up and breaks one guy's neck and then sends the other guy walking out the door. The same thing goes for making the Garrett Dillahunt version where he's dying with cancer. She gives him X amount more years. What does he say?

I loved every moment. You know, whatever he said. Gives him a new lease on life, understands what it's all about. And I don't know. I think it's more about like the Manhunter goes around and finds the thing that you need and gives it to you and then in return you give

them your field to you. There's only one thing, I agree with that. There's only one thing that gives me pause is that Carrie is rebuking her. When? Throughout the whole show. Like, Carrie is rebuking her. I think she knows the

danger that she brings. But I also think that she has something more to live for. She has something in the future to actually protect. She's spared from all the shit that happens. But she also has a kid. Like she has something more to protect. Like the rest of them can just give up the ghost.

Like even with Makin, making, he said, when he died, what do you say? He said, thank you for the extra years I lived. I loved every minute. Yeah. Like the extra years. I'd already committed myself to the fact that I was going to die, but you gave me extra years.

And so I'll give you this. The gift is this. I think even in the scene, the show keeps doing this. The show keeps doing something where two people are talking to. each other and one person is trying to figure out if the other person is lying. Yeah. It echoes throughout the entire show. First time we get it is in the interrogation.

We get it again with making an Anton. It just happens over and over and over again. So I also, I think it's such, I mean to cut you off, Jones. I was like, it's such an incredible portrait of how power actually works, and in this case, superpowers to some extent, where Zoe could theoretically cure cancer. Zoe theoretically could get health care for all past. You know what I mean?

She is a super being. Like she evidently can help people live through like great calamity. Yeah. What does she do with that power? She uses it as a bargaining chip to get people to do her bidding and protect her. Yeah.

It's not like she is like this benevolent figure who shows up like Superman and is just trying to help everybody. You know, she is doing this in a transaction. It's a loving dictator. Yeah. That's great.

And that is something else that if we want to talk about stuff that I think the show is talking about, she's a benevolent dictator. Yeah. She's a loving dictator that demands nothing short of your life and your future and your family to protect her because she gave you something. That's crazy. The carry thing is interesting because there's a scene where Hal pulls up on her

and she starts shooting him, but she's like, she can't hear us, but she can see us. I have to do this. So that does lead some creators. That's what I'm talking about. In that scene, she, it feels like anybody, else in the town would have actually either tried to kill Jordan or been like, hey, Jordan's here. She doesn't. She, for whatever reason, feels indebted to her,

but also feels compelled to move past her. And help John. To help John and help them figure it out. She realizes she cares about the town. She's found safety in the town. Maybe it's because the town has offered some respite for her from Gotham and all and stuff like that. It's a community.

It's the thing that she always wanted. Yeah, it could be all of that. But I just, I think, and maybe I'm galaxy braining this, just with all of these things on the, on these players on the table, these pieces on the table, I think there's something more. I've never been, man, this show is fucking cooking, but I'll tell you guys something right now.

This is the greatest superhero television show of all time. Can I ask for? It's the greatest superhero television show of all time. Better than Watchmen? Huh? Better than Watchmen? I don't think so. Agent Carter. I don't think so.

I don't. They in humans. Full marks for lanterns, but we're watching just incredible. I think I like this slightly more. Really? A lot of game left, guys. A lot of game left, a lot of game left.

Can I ask a lore thing or like a detail? One thing I've been fascinated by has been Laura Lenny's performance as the guardian. We're 100% sure she's a guardian. No. So no, but the man, it'd be really tough to swing it if she wasn't, because you have to remember

episode three. We see her from behind. She morphs her to and the only person who's just like Laurelini as a guardian is his mom. Right, right. He wants nothing more in the world than for him to be the Green Lantern.

Exactly. And notably, guardians, not tall. Not tall, but here's, but John goes to the test. They give him a ring at the test. Right? He does the watch thing and then he gets zapped back to the thing with Laura Lenny. Right.

Right. It'd be really hard for a Manhunter or somebody else to orchestrate the ring like that if not a guardian. Sure. So which makes me go into my thing as I was talking to you about this beforehand is why the Manhunters are colluding with Sinestro. Because Sinestro,

former Lantern, could have had access to a ring either before or after he went to prison. Okay. Given that to the Manhunters to possibly help them engineer a lantern that Sinestro could control, which is kind of the mission that he had

with how. Okay. Just feels real, it'd be, it'd be really tough. That's a lot to get through you. It's a lot to get through. That's what I'm saying. Yeah, that's a, but like, that's the kind of, that's the kind of thinking that the show has got me going on because that, that black hole thing that John goes through, same black hole that we saw the cow go through in the slaughterhouse. Yes.

Like, there's a lot of visual cues that this show is giving us that aren't just coincidence. That can't just be coincidences. But also it's a sign of a good show. Oh, yeah. we are litigating every little thing, which is why I want to talk about the scene at the end, the fight to how being completely incapacitated, to John showing up, to John shooting Zoe.

Okay? So, first of all, Jordan, I give Jordan a lot of credit, man. Jordan was out of his weight class. He was fucking with a guy. I don't know if you guys know it, with this guy was a Marine, a jiu-jitsu expert. They've never told us that one hand, any weapon.

Brand new information. You don't get the reference. Rebel Ridge. Rebel Ridge, baby. Pace. He's on the Wikipedia page. You don't remember that scene? No.

She was so, dog, fuck that shit. What is he saying? That's like, acronyms. Accronymes. We got all your acronyms. That's me coming in with my bag of money. Contingencies. There it is.

Like, you just. Just a shit. So look, real quick, y'all go watch Rebel Ridge. There's a scene in Rebel Ridge where Don Johnson is outside with Air Pierre's character. And the inside, the Wi-Fi is slow.

So they're trying to Google his tattoo to see what the tattoo means. He's outside with Don Johnson. The Wi-Fi is going slow, but it pops up just in time for the woman to see that this motherfucker is one of the baddest motherfuckers in the entire world.

He trains the, the Marines how to fight. He trains them. He is the guy that trains them in this specific martial arts, which means you should not get close to him or fuck with him in any way. And she goes, yeah, MCAT, whatever the thing is, that's probably the medical shit. But she goes, whatever, she goes, oh man, he's on the Wikipedia page. Like, he is the guy that does this. And then he starts fucking them up. Yeah, yeah. And after that, I knew that this nigga and me was going to be on the screen and in the theater together for a long time. I fucking love that movie.

the fight with John Hal is getting beat up by Rebel Ridge Yeah he's getting beat up by Rebel Ridge He's getting Rebel Ridge Yeah You know what's really funny though I give Hal credit

Oh yeah I give Hal credit He stood his ground Hal stayed in that fight Yeah As long as he could And you know what he did do He saved

The 5% left on that ring Yeah To save them Yeah Yep he did He did He never went Boop you know like

Like he could have just put it up to his ear Could have He could have bubbled himself. Oh, yeah. Could have bubble of himself, but he saved them both. I think that fight and him snatching the ring is finally going to be the thing that makes him totally respect John Stewart as a peer equal. Yeah. Well, he says that to Zoe.

You can't say a lot about it, but he doesn't lack courage or whatever. That boy, he ain't no coward. He ain't no coward. So why? Bates, she turns around, gets domed right in the head. To the point that we were talking about earlier. do we think that he killed the manhunter? Yes. Zoe?

Not that she's not, not that Zoe's not dead, but that that manhunter didn't like upload its consciousness somewhere else. This is where you get into like, that's so speculative that like, yes, like I wondered why she so readily took the bullet, but perhaps what she understood

was that her greater mission to pass on her, her legacy to this QB1 has been accomplished. But there were a couple of things I wanted to ask you guys about this fight scene

and then the aftermath of it. Right, right. One of the things that I thought was so striking about early in the season is when John is able to basically manifest the bird without the ring. Right.

Which suggests some sort of level of like skill or whatever. He's able to maintain the bird without the ring. Yeah, he's able to maintain the bird. He's going to maintain the burden. But he's, he, this goes back to the Neo, like he is, it's him. You know what I mean?

Like, this is the guy. It's not just because he got trained really well by his parents. Like there's something innate inside of him. I was wondering whether or not the watch he picks up off the ground in the rubble to give to the kid is his dad's watch. Interesting. The one that he makes in the interview. Right. What is his dad's watch?

Not that it's the kid's watch. What's the watch he has to make in the job interview? This is his father's watch. Then there's a watch on the ground The Tweety Bird Watch That's just a tweetie bird watch That's just a tweetie bird watch That's just like him being kind

But I think the watch though Has some kind of significant value to him Because for him to have to recall his father's watch like that He had to remember every single thing about it I mean we see again with the bird At the end of this episode The Bird on the Rubble he's like I have to take the ring

The thing about John specifically That makes him like special Versus How in this particular series is the willpower, right? How has crazy willpower, like that's why he's one of the, the greatest Green Lantern of all time, but the reason why he's able to keep that bird alive

despite not having a ring is just his innate talent, his willpower. I mean, again, we see an episode he's trained from birth to just be like that kind of guy to just like keep focus. He could stay nine months on a single target. Yeah. Like, that's what makes him special.

And his ability, like, we see it, in, particularly in the design of the watch. He creates every component, like the gears, the thing, one by one. And so he's not just thinking about the construct as a whole. He's thinking about piece by piece. And that makes him really special, really up-depth with the ring. We saw it a little bit with the drill.

Hopefully we see it more in the future, but not. All that stuff is amazing. I just didn't know whether there was in play at all that this guy is so powerful he can be himself. He can do that. Oh, he can make the constructs throughout the ring? Yeah. Oh, yes.

I mean, everybody comments about it like, yo, you're not supposed to be able to do that. Yes. Especially somebody who hasn't really used the ring like that. This is crazy. Yes. You might beat a man. Yeah. And it's nearly a stretch for, like, comics can because that's all, that's, that's been, like, done, like, a couple of times.

Okay. And, like, not getting into, like, the nitty gritty of, like, comic book rules of, like, how the ring works. But, like, there have been times where, like, you can only, like, hold a construct, even when, like, the ring has no charge or anything for, like, a certain amount of time. We can get to nitty-gritty with CR. Hear about Larklees? No, exactly. LARFLEAS. It's an orange lantern.

There's multiple colors. I want to read you guys something. In other media from the Manhunter's Wikipedia page. Right. Okay. Well, this isn't going to just going to solve it for us. He's on the Wikipedia page. It's on the Wikipedia page.

Shut up. Apologizing. All right. The Manhunters appear in lanterns. Prior to the start of the series, Abinster crashed on earth with the seemingly last surviving manhunter. Yes. What word sticks out seemingly?

Seemingly. All right, man. Just saying, I'm just saying that there can't be more than two land. So, Zoe. You do it on purpose now at this point. At this point, who cares? Zoe, I don't think she, it would have to be the boy. It would have to be the kid.

Yeah, of course. There's two manhangers. It had to be the kid. Because it can't be, as much as I love Jason Ritter. She's not sacrificing the whole town for Jason Ritter. Right. No, I guess the only alternative would be Kerry. Yeah.

But I think we found that Kerry is not a Manhunter. Like, she existed. They said that, but then that would throw us off the trail. Was Zoe being, Zoe killing Avincer a revelation to you guys? Was that? No. They hadn't mentioned that before, had they?

I hadn't mentioned it before. No. But it was, it was, though. Like, this dude saved you and then he, you had to kill him because he's the only person who knew where you were. It fundamentally changes,

like, the origin story of the Green Lantern. Like, the, Abin's sir wasn't murdered. Well, the whole thing was, it wasn't like,

like, Abin's sir was doing her a favor. Mm-hmm. Was being kind. It was like, I'm going to keep you here. He was saving her. Yeah.

And she was like, well, if you change your mind or somebody gets into you, you are going to, you can stitch on me. I got to be proactive, snip, step, kill, kill, which then gives how, or John's dad the ring, and he's scared, and then gives howl the ring. So it literally sets this whole story in motion.

So it's important, yeah, I think it was like, I think it was a bit of a revelation. Was a bit of a revelation. In the flash forward that happens in the first episode, when they're driving down, when you're driving down the street, we talked about this. The rebuilt Rushville, right?

Well, yeah, but part of the town was destroyed, right? Like, you had you passed by the ranch. It was like, it was destroyed. You could see that it was destroyed. There was ruins of it or whatever, whatever. Nobody, I guess that land is worthless. Nobody wanted to get the ranch back on. There's a data center at it.

That's actually after the data center. Yeah, that's what it looks like that. Or we get crossover, right? We get Yellowstone, Nebraska. That's right. Oh, there we go. I love that. So,

they're about to buy Warner Brothers anyway. So look, now the rest of the town is destroyed. I'm interested in what can continue to happen in Rushville. We have three episodes left of stuff happening in Rushville. Rushville's decimated. There's a lot of show left. Well,

I think we have to find out what John did for the intervening 10 years, right? So we leave Rushville. I think, well, I imagine, like, Like, the show, I think, has been very judicious where it's spending its money. So I think that there are times where I can, I'll see something and I'm like, oh, if this was like a $400 million, like, this is Andor. Like, and they just were like, there is no limit to the budget. Like, it would look a little different. I think they spent a lot of money on outer space.

Oh. And so, right. To me, the stuff that took place, the flying out to go meet some Astro stuff, I was like, that, that was. that was a lot of money. You know what I mean? So I wonder whether or not there's some more outer space coming. I did comment that like that prison

did look like a community... The prison looked like a community college. But like the shot of him flying out of Earth and going up to the space studio at jail. I was like, that looks pretty decent. You know what I mean? Right. So then in the next episode we would expect if it's not like... Because you never

know, the next episode could be like a Hal Jordan's first mission. Well, the next episode is going to be like there currently is not a... a green lantern guarding Earth. Right. There's no green lantern guardian Earth. We got a banged up Hal and we've got a John who's like, I don't want it. That's a good point though. Like how

John gave the Guardian in the ring, right? He didn't take the oath. Technically that's still howls. But I think at this point, the gardeners are like, they don't deserve it. They're pretty flimsy, it seems like it. Like, they'll take it away. This is where Guy comes in. Yeah. And this is now the most interesting part of the show. It has to be.

Not only is this a marriage between the current DCEU that we know that seemingly is forced upon the show, but I think that this is an amazing runway that leads up to Guy Gardner's addition to a cinematic universe and a

television show that's been in development. I was always in the impression that Phileon was just, like, Guy Gardner was just going to be like a cameo in this. Right. He might be. But like it's kind of a crux of the story. Yeah. And at this point, at this point he might be, he might be just a cameo, but there's

so much open space, there's so much green grass, you'd wonder if he's not at least somewhat significant in a narrative, why would they put him in at all at this point? Because he just seems like adding out another character, he's just jumbled things. Well, if we could imagine that he's just been the Green Lantern since 2016, since Nebraska happened, that he, like, okay, so they found guy in the intervening years, and he's been Green Lantern since. Like, what connection does he have to the Guardians post-HAL, post-Nabrasca? I'm starting to see it. You're right. You're right. The Green Lantern, Beckelter becomes Green Lanter

2016 after Nebraska and you've got Hal and John who are still out there and this is the end of True Detective season 1. And I can imagine Hal's on a fucking bender for 10 years not having that ring. Where Woody and Matthew, even though they're like older now, they can't give up the

Yellow King and they have to know like what happened. So these guys are like there's something that doesn't sit right about what happened in Rushville and Hal won't give up the ghost and the Manhunter probably takes Hal out just like Avon Sir. because he's like you're the only one who knows. You're the only one who's figuring him out.

Y'all, man. I keep coming back to him, man. I can't imagine Arch Manning, man, putting one into HAL, bro. That's tough, bro. Arch doing it, man. But, I mean, Archmanning, Hunter? He's at the stadium. The kid plays football.

What if the kid just fucking straight drilled him with the fucking 90 yard or right in the face? That's what happened to Percy's. Just threw the bullet? Perfect spot. That's what happened to Percy is. Actually, it's not what happened to Percy. He's killed his grandfather, Greek mythology. Right.

His grandfather was told that... It would be cooler if... If this kid was, like, a free safety. And it was like he was just dropping Steve Atwater, like bombs on dudes. But then he's gonna go... By the way, I'll finish my Percy's story. Okay.

Very much. Don't breathe. We learned this quickly. I would rather he'd be Cam Chancellor. You know what I mean? I'd rather... Percy's killed his fucking band-bag by throwing the discs into the crowd.

After it was prophesied. No, that'll be, I mean, look, it seems like Rushville is still a town. They're still a high school. They're still playing a high-level football. They still got all-state athletes out. Oh, you know what would be really cool? What? Is if in the absence of The Manhunter, like Rushville is kind of decayed.

It become like another forgotten American. Oh, yeah. Rust Belt type of shit. And it's just like fentanyl, fucking corruption, whatever, dollar stores. But like back in the day when Zoe ran. that because the hospital will be full now. Or even if if

Rushville is still thriving then there's got to be a man owner. That's right. It did not look like it was thriving. It didn't look like it was thriving. No, it looked that's because that kid plays that for LSU. Yeah, he's gone. You don't know what Baton Rouge looks like.

The crazy part of that in particular is I mean we saw so we saw this at at a Comic-Connor. Right? The guy Gardnercy? Gar-Garganer scene. Yeah, he comes to the police station. Oh, you saw it.

Yeah, well, he didn't, so. You saw Guy Gardner, Nathan Phillyen came out. He expected kind of a bigger pop. And he's like, Nathan's, damn. Jesus, crap. He's the man. Uh-huh. Philly is awesome.

Except he wasn't in that moment. Yeah, he just, I don't give a fuck. Well, no, he, he's a man. He's awesome. I just think that people were so, like, on edge about everything in the show. Yeah. I think a lot of those Comic-Conn audiences this year were, like, except for, except for the Marvel.

Except for the Marvel. Because they were camping. for three days. Yeah. So he came out and then they showed it, but all they really showed was him coming to the... Landing at the sheriff's office

with like some technology, like a little... It looked like a detector or something by it there. And then he walks into the cell where John is sleeping and then it cuts. And that's all we see. But like, he's gonna be...

We obviously know he's gonna be a cameo, but, or at least make an appearance. I don't know if it's a cameo or it's a longer-form thing. I would imagine Fran to bring him out there at Comic-Con and have him like for a came-y, if she showed up for one episode for 15 minutes and then dip, I don't know if you bring him out at Comic-Con for that.

I guess he's already there, but still. Is Anton dead? Anton blew up, he's gone. Okay, got to be. Yeah. I just didn't know if he got, like, sucked up into a tornado? I'll say the alien hit squad guys, tough.

They got aced out the whole pretty easy, bro. Tough. Yeah. They didn't bring no technology. They brought nothing with them. They just got the suicide vests on them and that was it. So they know how to detonate themselves and do all of that shit. But when it comes down to it, it is just chappas.

Also, why are they all driving like Kias? Yeah, it's weird. But you know what I'm saying? Like, get some cool of shit. Get some Yukons. Right. You saw the office building. They were working out of.

They don't have a budget. Nobody's storing Miadas where they're at. Are they working on budget? But I don't, they can't restore that. But I don't understand them, no. They didn't have. That would be amazing if, like, there was this episode. This was like a 22.

episode season and it was all about like aliens restoring cars that they bought on like a lot of t-tick-tok they don't have like they didn't they didn't have no type of actual technology except the genocide memory gun they had the genocide memory gun but it's all choppers with them they didn't really have they have no hands for real they didn't have no hands for real they didn't have a good strategy actually to take the manhunter down there obviously where was the nuke that they were like we're going to just nuke this whole town if you don't I don't seem like I think it's just the collective we all explode at the same time. Yeah, I think we all at the same time in the same place, yeah.

But I also think that Anton, for whatever reason, they, Anton wanted to kill the Manhunter, but Anton did not want to kill the Manhunter before he had a chance to have that discussion with the man. Yeah. Yeah. Number one, he wanted to make sure that they were killing the right person. But number two, that motherfucker has some shit to get off his chest. Yes.

Yeah, clearly. I thought his death was pretty unceremonious. If there was something that, like, did not work about this episode for me, is that Anton runs in there to nuke everything and how tornails him away. Well, he already had this moment with Mankin. That really was.

But it was a fake moment. He never actually got a real moment with the man. I mean, to your point, though, Homeboy laid it down. So he deserved to have that moment with Zoe at the end. You can't really do like a two-for where Anton has his moment waso and then gets killed.

And then John has this moment. It's not like this antagonist's owed catharsis for that. I'm just saying to me like if there is one thing in the show that has kind of been pushed in a little ham-fisted is that alien hits. Well this is an interesting

difference between this show and perhaps watchmen but I think specifically this show and maybe is to the point I was making about like sometimes feeling like I can feel the budget limitations is 15 years ago if this was a movie the alien

genocide that the Manhunter takes, executes would be shown. That would be like, Zach Snyder. They didn't just show them when they had to think up to John's head.

Yeah. And instead it's just like everybody just do the acting and then you have to believe that this guy's been on a galaxy-wide quest to find this person. You know, you have to believe that what John saw

changed him. And I think it did. I think when he saw what the Manhunter did and then found out that the Manhunter was the Guardian's handiwork I think he was like I don't think I can work for these people.

I love the show because it's like it has such a great way of camouflaging expository dialogue in every single show because like there's so much groundwork that everybody does via dialogue through like the first three episodes of this and then really only in this episode

and the last one did we have like some real like action like plot momentum. But there's a lot of that dialogue there's action in it. Yeah, no. So if you take the interrogation scene, that is the way you do that. Exactly. Back and forth.

Yeah. There's- The diner scene the same way. There's dialogue where you just sit there and you give the whole thing. But then there's- That's what you're reacting to with Zoe and John when he's getting a skin replaced. Is that she's standing there just being like, I was blah, blah, blah, and then I did this and then I did that and I felt like this. But I had to do that.

Every show or every movie's going to do a little bit of that. You just can't. You have to. It does. But like with the hit squad, like, for their... their plight, that was perfectly, I think, executed for like the way that, like, he was, like, describing this to how and then making sure that he saw that in the genocide gun memory, whatever. That scene was fine. That scene was fine.

Their presence, to me, was always something that was just to sort of ratchet up the intensity of stuff that was already happening. Yeah. I personally... Yeah. I personally never like that. But if you do it, I always feel like those characters need a little bit more to bite on to.

But this show has so much more. It's a very tough thing. Like, I know it's a trope in fantasy superhero sci-fi or whatever, the shapeshifter, whatever. But it's, as we saw in Secret Invasion, it's hard to dramatize that. You know what I mean? I'm going to be honest with you, man.

Shout out to everybody involved in Secret Invasion. Shout out to everything going on. Everything that has happened or will. happened and what people got going on in their families and their dreams and their careers. Shout out to all of it. Shout out to, you know, y'all worked for a long time. You went to film school. Shout out to every other SEC. Yeah. Try hard.

Every other. Shout out. Oh, man. Shout out. No, fuck them. Shout out to everybody. Right. Just extend grace. It's grace to everyone. To Oxford. To, hey, man. Everywhere, brus. Yeah, man. College Station, bro. Austin. All, man. All right. All right.

Whatever. But I'll say this, but I'll say this, man. this is kind of the intensity scale and scope that you were expecting. Oh, yeah. Yeah. From like something like, it's kind of uncanny at this point to know how much. Wasn't there self-detnation and secret invasion too, right?

I believe so. Wasn't that like a big? Yeah. But it's kind of a candy. They created the strongest motherfucker in the world. We never have a burger again. Well, yeah, because it was terrible. Nobody wanted to see that.

Yeah. I mean, it's a better secret invasion. It's kind of a better Falcon and Winter Soldier. Falconville and Social I was best place in I don't know what what's like level sub-basement

of 4-you Twitter I'm on right now but in the last couple weeks I've seen we've been trying to revive Ultron like in terms of like critically revive Ultron

they're now there is like actually Rise of Skywalker have bars no yeah there's no there is

I mean I'm sure it's like clipping bots accounts or whatever and I'm like they're gonna come for the Marvel TV universe soon and it's gonna be like

actually We've been high on Falcon Winter Soldier. No. I love Falconer Soldier. This particular podcast has been, like, higher than most. I remember. I remember. On Falcon Winter Soldier.

Yeah. But you guys have not dipped into Secret Invasion. It was actually good. We're never going back. No. We has been lost. Season 1 and season two. Wanda Vision.

Parts of Moon Night. Hawkeye. Hawkeye was a phenomenal show. Not phenomenal show, but a good show. Falky Winter Soldier, and that's where that's where we've got. We're Wolf by Night. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

We're World Fight Night. That was by night. All right. Look, I'll tell you guys something. We continue to cook. We're not doing Manhunter rankings. It's over. Let's do it.

Fuck it. Here's the board. Here's the board right here. Hot damn. Noah, five. No, no one's shooting right up. I guess now. So what do we do with Zoe?

Because obviously she is a manner. Do we take her off the board? This is what we do. Or do we put her in golds. We do. We do new Manhunter rankings because she is definitely a manhunter. The Manhunter rankings now. are second Manhunter Ranking.

Second Manhunter Ranking. Okay, so give Zoe off of the board. Boom. So we only have to do four now. Right, yeah. We don't have to be here. We could add a fifth. We could add a fifth.

Who's number one? Who's gonna five manhunter ranking? I mean, number one is Noah, right? Yeah, from the discussions that we've had. So Noah goes to number one. Noah has gone from five to one. Yeah. And now second Manhunter rankings in one week.

So number two, we have to have to number two, to be Billy. Yes. Number two have to be Billy. Number three? How about John Stewart? Ooh. Okay.

Split. Hybrid. Hybrid. Hybrid. Hybrid. Hybrid. Hybrid. Hybrid.

Biracial. Ooh. Has, is not the same John Stewart that started chronologically this show. Sure. He is not. I would say, he is running through. Is he a broken class with a manhunter zeal it? Or a manhunter, like, I have some manhunter in me.

Okay. Damn. I would put Howell's Dead Body at 4. House Dead Body at 4. If anything, John's 2 at 3, How's Dead Body at 4?

Nah, How's Dead Body is the construct. So. The century? The century? I feel like Stuart would have known. It's possible. The only thing is that, like, I don't know what.

Maybe he did. Maybe he did. I don't know the physical properties of the century. Because, like, nobody's actually touched it. I don't know if you can just put your hand right through it. Oh, right. Like, is it a projector? Or if it's a polygram.

Yeah. It's hologram. But remember, he. He looks for the ring. He looks for the ring on the dead body. Can we put hologram Tupac on the list? That would be good. Was that like the first time that we were just all like, holy shit, this is real.

Justice. They got it. Justice, guys. He got it. Yeah, finally, man. Nothing wrong with that case. Okay. Nothing wrong at all.

Okay, so then, all right, so then if we go, Noah, Billy, John Stewart 3. That was just, that's, I'm a guest. You don't have to put it. No, no, no, no. We don't go crazy. That was a very long, pronounced shot of her dropping blood into his eye and his eye changing and his DNA changing. I'll tell you something about that real quick, just to let y'all know.

That right there is something I was warned about my entire childhood. The blood and spaghetti. You don't eat nothing red from a woman's house. This is spaghetti story again? You don't eat nothing. That's what they said. Is this hoodoo stuff or is this? This is hoodoo.

You don't eat nothing red. You don't eat no red sauce. You don't eat no spaghetti. See how Jomey knew it? Because they're doing this in Nigeria too. No. Don't wait. Don't put that on me, Ricky Bobby.

You don't eat no red sauce. You don't eat no red sauce. I don't just say it. I'm just saying. That's what you did. She did the, my mom and my son, my mother. Y'all don't have to understand. Y'all have to understand something here.

I've talked about this before. You know, I say she's lit like this and you guys look at me as if I'm fucked up. This, I didn't make this up. They told me this. Right, yeah, yeah. And so I will be going to go to a girl's house. I'd be like, oh, we're going to go to study. My mother would be like, oh, okay, cool.

Don't eat anything with red sauce at her house. I'd be like, man, shut up. She goes, I'm being serious. If I find out you went over there and you ate spaghetti from that girl's house, what fuck you up? Don't eat it. My dad would be like all of that witchcraft

and my mom would be like, worked on you. All right, so look, ring chose me? Yeah, so, okay, so cool. So then three, so then four is, Who? How's dead body? How's dead body? How's dead body?

And then Carrie's like basically like fifth but like we're just because she's already up there. But yeah. So carry is fifth. Okay. Carry it all the way down. The guardian off the board. It doesn't, it doesn't make it. It would be a stretch for the guardian to be manipulating all of stuff.

I also think for casual viewers, they would be like, this is annoying. I have to take some things in this show at face value. I shouldn't have to know. Right. What like shade of blue, a guardian. is or how tall they are. Like, I just want to watch this. You cast Laura Linney.

She can't possibly be like, it can't be a fake out like that. Are we all on board, at least kind of on board with the second manhood theory? Yeah. Yes. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Second manhood theory. And we got this.

All right. We got here. C.R. man, thank you, brother. You're welcome. Thank you for sitting in, bro. Appreciate it. Hell yeah.

The question is now, who is subchair? Is it Rob? Is it CR? Oh, am I in the Met? The sub-midnight boy. Sub-midnight boy. Anybody that's been on is a midnight boy. I don't think you made that decision.

Gender-usual time, by the way. Late-night boy. First of all, like 11-pm Club. First of all, that is not a, you're not the king of the midnight boy. I'm not saying you. You just did. You just did that.

You just did. We've talked about this. What is you talking about? What's wrong with you? You need to stop. You just, no, it's not. You just did that. Oh, last question.

Do you think Charles like this episode? Yeah. Let me tell you something. Charles is somewhere gritting his teeth because he's forced to like stuff. That's not how my- Not by society. I mean, he just like he likes this show, right? That is how my, let me tell you how my boy is, my guy.

We all went to the Dodger game. We sat at the Dodger game. It was 90,000 degrees. We were like dissociating. We were like staring at just like. C.R. We all got to the Dodger game. Jomey came through with the tickets.

We all went to the Dodger game. Shout out my guy, Clinton. Shout out Clinton, man. Clinton, that's the man. We all there. And we get there and we go, this ain't so bad, man. And then niggins start eating hot dogs.

Just, I just start going. People start doing the wave. Like, since it's happening in the game. Yeah, we're like that. I remember, and then all of a sudden, I take my little jersey off, whatever I got to think. I'm like, yo, I don't know.

The game was crazy. The Dodgers went like 13-0-1. Yeah. So they were scoring runs. and runs and runs and runs and runs. He was cheering. You're getting up. You're cheering.

And then all of a sudden, I looked up. It's the fourth inning. It's 8.30. I look at the screen at the doctor's day. It's 92 degrees. Yeah. There's not a single piece of breeze in the air. No.

Nothing's happening. Yeah. You're swimming through it. And so like, Mookie hit a homer. Muncie hits a homer. We get to a point, Charles goes. Right after the stretch, Charles goes. He looks so defeated, bro.

Charles was up. He goes, guys, I ain't going to lie. I can't do it no more. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But the Dodgers were up, was after the 70-in-stretch, we had a time. I said the long time, it was great. Kyle Tucker hit a home run, man.

Man, Kyle Tucker was going crazy at night. I kept, every time Kyle Tucker got up, what did I do? Point it in me, man. I encouraged him. He was like, yo, Joe, Joe, you guys. Like, that's our guy. Kyle Tucker, we believe in him. We believe in Kyle Tucker.

Do you believe in your baseball team? Yeah, sure. You believe in Crawford? Crawford. Oh, that's your. We're bit with me. Yeah. I mean, like, we've moved on.

Do you believe in Sanchez and Bush Hover? Yeah, I think we're fine. This is a Red October thing. Oh, is it? So when it happened, when the playoffs roll around, we are either hitting, we're going yard or we're not. And if we go yard, who knows how far we could go. I'm telling you. So Justin Crawford is having an amazing power season.

Uh-huh. This bit again. I feel like you're sarcastic. He's having a great year of power. This is the antagonism that happens right before the end. He's got to him, bro. He's a great player. He's young.

We went to the game, which the weather was lovely. It was actually kind of cold when we went. Yeah. And San Francisco was fun. You went to San Francisco apart. You know what it's funny about that game real quick. So we went, we're all sitting down, right? This is funny.

Shout out to Craig, man. Shout out to all the face football guys. So we're all sitting down. And, you know, somebody hits the ball out to center. I'm like, wow. in San Francisco, it's really deep in center. Yeah, you got to hit the bus. And Craig goes, yeah, that's where Willie May has made the catch.

I was like, I don't think that's true. But he's from Northern California. He's from there. So I was like, okay. And then I'm like, this is one of the only times in my life where I've done this. You've rejected him. It's not true. I don't know enough.

Yeah. So I'm like, I don't think that happened. But then, like, literally, 10 minutes later, Craig goes, oh, wait, that's not true. Yeah. Were they still in New York with that happened? I think they were still in New York. And also, where we were is not what candlestick used to play.

No. Yeah. No. It would, when I thought about it when I was walking back, it would almost be impossible because they played at some place before they got there. Do you remember the whole family in front of us and the dude was watching at LSU baseball? They're from Baton Rouge. Yeah.

The whole family in front of us from Baton Rouge. We just find each other. Stick you together. All right. Thanks for having me, guys. No problem. Amen. Anytime.

All righty. Got damn to you. That is it. On Monday, the House of Art continues their lanterns coverage and on Friday. But Mash gives their reactions to the Resident Evil movie.

Thank you, CR. Our producer today are Devin Brody. Jamie Yukits, John Jones, join me a dinner on on socials. Hashtag, rings within rings. A lot cool needle drops. Only fair, baby.

A lot cool needle drops. Also, a lot cool ring stuff. You see the hotel room blinking, rings. rings everywhere. Cable, HBO. They had cable HBO. Cable HBO.

I remember that back in the day. I remember back in the days, be like, you go there. We have HBO. You can watch Rome. You can watch Roam. You guys laugh about that. But I was in,

I was in Missouri for my sister's graduation. And I was like, man, I don't get HBO at the crib. I'll turn this on. They had to depart it on. Cable TV is the best. It is the best. Just tell me what to watch. Additional production from Arjuna Ram Gapal.

Jomi. Do you want to take a shot at taking us out? Oh, man. Yeah, I'll give it a try, man. This is what Charles usually does? Yeah, this is what Charles does. It's harder than you think. It's incredibly hard.

Thanks, CR, for coming on. Oh, my God. It's the two-rhyme structure. It's the two. It's not like that. it's the limerick. It's like, it's a, B, A, C. Thanks Chris Ryan for coming on. Actually, I don't think I have that rhyme.

Correct. This is hard. I know how Charles is a He's a savant. Yeah. He's in a spot. He's a backpack rap. Thanks for seeing him. Manhunders are are lost in space. Thanks to you are for coming on. We appreciate you, Coke. This is so tough.

Thanks, C.R. for coming on. The Rushville Hospital is the cleanest. And shout out to John Stewart for serving that manhunter the black penis. It's crazy. I've always wanted to ask, like, CR and Vann, you guys had the internet. Like, from my childhood of the internet,

it was, like, E-Bomb's World Something Awful, where, like, kids were just, like, making like weird cartoons and shit that were like just like either too edgy and like they were just making unbridled creativity and stuff like I didn't know what that early 2000s internet was for like somebody even slightly older like for you guys in college. For me it was message boards. Yeah. I didn't actually have like blogs and stuff.

Write on them. I wrote blogs but I didn't write message boards but I'm right message boards but that was where I would like hang out all day. It's just go to like hip hop infinity or hip hop DX or whatever. Like, and download the music, it was like, Yeah. Not everybody was participating in the internet quite yet. You hadn't really found your way to actually participate in it.

And there wasn't any incentive. Like, you had trolls, but there was no incentive to make people insane yet. Right. So people were just like, you were just like, you would be like, oh, I like this band. And somebody would be like, that band's terrible. But you would just be like, all right. You know, like, that's too bad. But they wouldn't be like, you should kill yourself because you like this band.

The longest threads, I remember when we'll get to the show, I remember when Renegade dropped. And Eminem was on the record, and the record dropped, and niggas on this message board just could not wrap their mind around how Eminem Savage's Hove on the record. Right. Right. And, like, it came out, it was like Eminem, new Jay-Z and Eminem Reneges.

It dropped before the record came out, just before it came out. And, like, I'm on there. I saw one dude go, man, I ain't all. lie, bro. White boy kind of wash, hove on there. And then it was 15 posts in a row of damn, I don't want to say it. And that led to

175 pages. It's like legendary message board. And every post is like, damn, I didn't want to say it. Then this dude's avatar, which is like Bugs Bunny holding the gun. Right. You know, then his avatar has like six quotes. You know, where you can find him.

Oh yeah. And like the bottom header. Yeah. It was like The most janky version That's what it used to be That's like gifts on the bottom Yeah It was what Twitter used to be But it was just like this guy

Some guy working at a circuit city In Boulder, Colorado Be like damn, Hove got washed Somebody being invariably Somebody comes out and go Y'all niggas just some coons Y'all want to see Eminent wash hole And they were like nah

Then somebody put The Royce the 5-9 version In there And niggas was like like, this bitch is better too, man. It's like, whatever. But that's what it was for me.

And then really, MySpace changed everything. MySpace is the first time I participated in the internet. It's also MySpace was the first time that you had to like pretend to be. To present something. You were like, my five records or whatever. Like people are going to judge me for that. And this is how I'm trying to present myself. Your page song and all that.

Before you could just be like, I like this. I don't like that. What's up to people today? Hey, but like I was literally a consumer of the internet. like just reading stuff on there and stuff like that. But even the stuff that I read on there, it was only stuff that I didn't want to read.

What's up? Okay. Oh. Even that, it was just stuff that I didn't want to read like before like I didn't want to read the newspaper or something. Like so, but it wasn't a real thing.

Yeah. You know, anyway.