The Ringer-Verse - ‘Lanterns’ Season 1 Finale Instant Reactions, Plus a Talk With Chris Mundy | The Midnight Boys

Episode Date: October 5, 2026

The Boys are back and they have new haircuts! With the end of the beloved first season of HBO’s ‘Lanterns,’ the boys are giving you a packed episode! First they discuss their thoughts on the finale and the season as a whole, then they welcome ‘Lanterns’ writer-showrunner–executive producer, Chris Mundy, onto the show! (0:00) Intro (8:16) Spoilers ahead (11:05) ‘Lanterns’ Season 1 finale instant reactions (1:13:49) Midnight Meter (1:21:49) A Chat with Chris Mundy (2:00:17) Outro Hosts: Van Lathan, Charles Holmes, Jomi Adeniran, and Steve Ahlman Guests: Chris Mundy and Rachel Lindsay Producers: Jamie Yukich, Devon Baroldi, and Aleya Zenieris Additional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopowell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Now more than ever, quality matters, but so does price. At Marshalls, you don't have to choose. You can get the good stuff for less, the stuff that lasts, because there's no point in tightening your belt if it's just going to break when you do. Get the good stuff in store at Marshalls today. Welcome into the Ringiverse. This is, of course, the ringer's Nexus podcast fee for all things. Fandum, we are Steve, the architect, almond, the builder and tinker of things.

Jomi, the explainer, adenoron. You've got questions. He's got answers. Old Man Van. He of the resurgent. Gardner, hairline, Coke, Baby Chuck, the 24-carat closes together. We are known as,

I thought of Midnight Boys. We'll be right back after this. All right, follow some socials at the Midnight Boys pod on Insta, and TikTok, at Ringiverse. Yes. On Instagram? Yo, guys, we're really excited. I mean, just want to thank you guys for following us

through this Greenlandre coverage. You guys have been really, it's been really incredible to see what you guys are saying online. Man, the biggest needs to get off our nuts. Clipping, clip in the podcast and all that stuff. Sharing it. Sharing it, man. We need to get off on us. What happened?

What I miss? Oh, you're not on Twitter anymore. No, what happens? No, yeah, you're not on Twitter anymore. It's bad. Why? They took part of the conversation we have with Vanessa and Justin. It's like this.

It should be it. The Kamala Biden. Okay. Conversation. Oh, y'all put that. in a group chat. Yeah, what they say, I didn't see it. Oh, they went, they were going crazy.

It's bad. Who's going crazy? You know, the Twitter sphere. You know what I'm saying? That right wing section of online where they like these people and then. Suck our dicks. You know what I'm saying? Yeah.

There's points. Vanessa and Justin are on the show. And they're great. They're awesome. Phenomenal writers who are a part of one of the best superhero shows to come out in a long time. And you're not. Let them talk about what's going on. You don't have to be a cuck.

You can have your opinion. but any toxicity will be met with commiserate disrespect. Yes. Any toxicity will be met with that same amount of disrespect. When are you coming back to Twitter? I'm never coming back. Are you off threads too? Basically, yeah.

Okay. Never. That was a very short stint on threads. Look, I might go there every once in a while to post about tailgate or something like that. But I cannot live in constant reactivity. I have to be able to think and formulate things that are building. So I can't continuously be. on anything to where somebody says something

and it immediately triggers an emotion in my body. Can't do it anymore. So I understand that being a part of the conversation on there and the news breaking on there is still bar none. I'm not trying to be like whole other than now. But just for me, period. Living my entire life in a state of reactivity makes me less curious.

And it makes me more like, think about me going on all Reddit and leaving long-ass things talking to the people. That's their at it. So like for me, I don't need to be in. in that space. Like, I don't do well with that. I fucking love this. This is John Stewart leaving the lantern in the way.

You like Bluske? You on Bluski? No, I mean, look, you might see me pop up on these things to promote something or get the layer of the land, but, like, being online like that, I got too much shit that I want to accomplish. We're on YouTube. Like, comment, subscribe, share. You can watch every Midnight Boys and House of Art episode on YouTube.

Dot com backslash at Ringoververse. Thank you, like Jomey said to everybody that's running the YouTube going crazy. That's amazing. We're going to keep that going by continuing to feed the beast on YouTube. Programming reminders. A Monday House of R finishes their deep dive lanterns coverage. They have been absolutely phenomenal. There's a lot of show that lanterns gives us, and our sisters over there are doing a fantastic job at contextualizing all of it. On Friday, ButtMash covers Valor Mortis and Forever Ago. Steve? Yeah, Valor Mortis, I think that's a that's a Souls-like game And Forever Ago, that's like a, it's an indie road trip You don't know. I don't know.

I don't know. I'm not saying like 80 games. He said Soulslike, I'm like, I'm out. Ben's putting me to work. I'm playing like 20 games with Ben. You lying, bro. Oh, but no, he's right, though. Valor Mortis is a Souls-like action. What's Souls like?

Souls like, it's like, are you familiar with Dark Souls? No. No, all right. Well, it's a very, like, difficult. action adventure game. Well, what is it, though? It's, it's like a game formula. It's a very hard game where they kind of like,

they just stole you in there and you have to kind of like learn by yourself. Like it's like Elgin Ring before Elgin Ring. Yeah, you know Eldon Ring? I know if you die, you're all of your stuff resets and you got to go out and get more stuff. Yeah. Eldon Ring though, for the time that I got into like Eldon Ring, there was Eldon Ring, but there was a different one though. There was a game that came out and is, I'm telling you guys,

I played the game. But I could not, I can remember the name of the game. now I had to play it for for Cybernet. Okay. And it was a game like Eldon Ring. What was it called? Skyron? Was it called?

Skyron? I don't think it was Skyron. Elder Scrolls? Elder Scrolls. Elder Scrolls. Oblivion. Ah, yeah. That's the name of it.

It's classic. Yes. And like I kind of got into Elderskroll's oblivion for a little while. That's just great. That's for y'all. Y'all, y'all got it. Give me my scent trails and my yellow markings. Yeah, blue, green paint game right there.

Give me my yellow paint, bro. All right. New York Comic Con update. Who? Update, motherfuckers. We will be hosting a meetup in New York. It is Saturday, October 10th at 8 p.m. Mm-hmm. Okay.

I head to Hill Country and go downstairs to the bar. Okay, listen, I say that again. Head to Hill Country. Hill Country Barbecue. Hill Country Barbecue. And go downstairs to the boot bar to find us. Yeah, the boot bar. No badge needed.

No, if you are 10. No, bad you need it, guys. New York Comic Comedy. Con come to our panel to Java Center that is on Saturday, October 10th at 4.30 p.m. Okay. Then later on, go to Hill Country Barbecue and go to the boot bar. Come see us, man.

Boys at the Boot Bar. And y'all better act right, you know. We're not having no San Diego shenanigans. Right. Hopefully that guy don't got a I mean, he just flew to be cheese. It's the same guys. This one guy. You can't come. But if you in New York, if you're in Philadelphia, if you in Baltimore, if you in D.C., if you were in Jersey, come through come see your people

come hang out with us bro yeah man it's gonna be funny when y'all see that nigga in comic con next year nah we got it no we will not be saying yeah it was potter with you bro we can't security we will flip the table no he gonna be at the raft Bill Reeve or something like that

they can't contain him Arkham just got out just got out can you imagine getting parole from Arkham no because like so here's the thing Arkham is only for like the worst super criminals though right

Yeah, but also there's prison bricks every other week, so it's kind of like... But, like, I feel like it's, that's like a, there's a gen pop in Arkham, right? There's not a Gen Pop. I don't know. It's an insane asylum. So I don't know. Yeah, but like, there's not, like, they don't have like 50 jokers running around there. They only have one.

They might. They might. Right. They have, there's another jail, right? Well, Blackgate. Blackgate is the jail jail. Blackgate is for, like, the, you know, the regular people. You might be, like, one of the goons might be in Blackgate.

Yeah. Right? But the head guys, you take them Arkham. Yeah, but you could have less criminally insane people and also go to Arkham, but you're not like the Joker. Nah, man. I mean, you're not scared. And it's not, Batman, not using it. It's an asylum.

It's not a prison. Yeah. So it's less people and more more care. Yeah, okay. Like you said in Victor Zaz to Blackgate or are you sending him to Ark? Who? Victor Zaz. He's in Arkham.

He's in Arkham. If you're in Batman's Rogue's Gallery, you're in Arkham. But like, Deadshot would be like. Blackgate. Black Gate. Yeah. But the problem, specifically with Arkham, it'd be breaking out every week. If Batman was a real one, put your money over there.

Bruce Wayne, give him a couple of them. Bruce Wayne, don't give a fuck about mental health. Yeah. Clearly not. He doesn't care about his own. Therapy could help him with what he's going through, but he chose not to. All right, okay. All right.

On today's episode, that's a neat little tangent. You guys, please come visit us in New York. We're going to be there having a great time next week. But on today's episode, it's actually this week. It's actually we leave. It's actually this weekend. On today's episode, we react to the season finale of lanterns. There's been so much talk.

There's been so much speculation, so much discussion. But now, where are we? The end of this season, at least. Got to get into it, give the streets what they want. In order to do that, we have to spoil some shit. It's going to get spoiled, everything's going to get spoiled, and everything. All right?

Steve, run a spoiler warning. getting ready to talk about you're listening to a reaction podcast. The spoilers are coming. I'll also like to say that stick around because after our discussion,

we are going to have an interview that the four of us conducted with showrunner, executive producer, and writer Chris Mundy. Yeah, fun time. Your boy, creator and creator of Ozark. Clear of Ozark. Big deal. You love Ozzy. does love Ozark, love Ozark.

But we still have to react to this. In order to do that, we need the Midnight Manifest. The only person who can give you that is Chuck Wagon. Chuck, take it away. All right, this is your Midnight Manifest for the season finale of Lantern, Season 1, Dirt and Stars, directed by Alec Sakharov, written by Chris Mundy, Damned Lindooff, and Tom King. The finale begins with the love story between Hal and Carrie.

The sheriff picks Hal up from prison and they begin their life together in Rushville. Things take a turn for the worst when Howe's house is attacked and he's burned alive. Noah saves Hal and rebuilds his skin using the same machine that his grandmother did on John. The star quarterback reveals to Hal that he's a manhunter, but demands the disgraced lantern not inform his mother that he's been aware all along. Back in the present, Senescho reveals that Noah broke him out of prison. John waterboards Sanestro in the Fear Lake until the villain reveals that he made a new lantern for the manhunter to use with Howe's decommissioned ring.

John takes the lantern by refuses to charge it, fearful of any booby traps Senestro might have laid into the cracked and yeowing lantern. Noah ambushes John in Rushville and takes back the ring. He admits to killing Hal and asks John to help him with an assisted suicide before his Manhunter programming turns him into a genocidal weapon. John doesn't believe him and forces Kerry to admit that she was Howe's real murderer. When Howe confronts her about Noah, she panicked and killed him. Instead of turning carry in, John says that's not what the real Hal would have wanted.

John calls Guy Gardner and informs the Green Lantern that he'll be taking over the jurisdiction of Earth while he can have the rest of the sector. Howell Graham says he loves John before disappearing and Stewart finally charges his or reciting a new oath. That has been your midnight manifest for Lantern's season finale, throwing about to you, Van. Muted finale that I thought was fantastic. Okay.

I don't know what I expected from a finale. Obviously, I expected to get answers about the remaining manhunters and wherever they might be, who killed Hal Jordan. But I don't think that I thought the show would be able to successfully wrap up all of its conclusions and storylines in such accessible way. There weren't very many moments in this show

where I was like, Jesus Christ. Yet and still, it completely flowed, it completely worked. It all came together seamlessly and beautifully, and to me, put the finishing touches on one of the greatest seasons of superhero television storytelling that I've ever seen.

So can I ask, because we've been doing this for a while, this finale kind of circumvents our expectations of what a superhero show finale should be. Absolutely. Oh, yeah. What are the finales since we've been doing this

that have worked when they're bombastic in that way, when it's a big shootout, when it's a big villain? Because it's like... Loki. Loki Season 1, but that was just them talking, really. That was the finale. Yeah, but like, that wasn't a big... That wasn't a big fog.

So the times where they have had, they have gone big, you'd say Wanda Vision, which is the weakest part of that season. Yeah. I would say Falcon and the Winter Soldier. That was the weakest part of that season. I mean, they tried to do the whole talking thing at the end, right, with him doing big in the speed. Yeah, but he got the suit, and then there was all the kung fu and all that shit. And it wasn't the best part of that season. Well, that's because this show avoids something.

And we talk about the Serf Dracula thing, which this show kind of does. But this show avoids something that those shows didn't. this show, he gets the ring, and then he flies away, like, at the end. Yeah. This was a Daredevil Season 1 finale. Well, even in Daredevil Season 1, you're right. Well, he's got unconscion and he's fighting people.

And he fights. He fights. There's the big showdown with Kingpin. But that season, like this season is very much, if you had to boil it down to a sentence, we are making this character turning him into Daredevil. Right. And this, I was like, oh, by the end of the episode,

I was like, this was always John's story. This was never going to be the thing where John gets the rate. Because I can't lie. Deep down in my heart, I wanted John to get the ring and get busy. I wanted him to steal the ray from Noah, starts slinging that shit around. And they went for something that I think was,

I'll put you this way. I ended up liking this season finale because Kyle Chandler and Aaron Pierre are so electric and the chemistry so much. By the time they had, admit that they love each other, I'm like, this is kind of what TV is for. Yeah. So, so I totally agree.

Let's think about what the purpose of the season was, like what type of hero they were trying to make. We're going to talk a little bit to Chris Mundy about this when he comes on at the end of the show. But with Daredevil, if we compare it just to that because that is a finale that really works, even though they do the big fight theme. With that, he finally has the suit.

You know, you have seen Daredevil throughout there entire season get cut, get out cut up the hand, cut them all up, and you're like, he's not going to be able to do what he's doing unless he adds a couple of layers of protection onto him. He's not going to be able to face off against Kingpin and all of this stuff unless he's the fully formed

daredevil that we know him to be. This story is about, like, what makes John a hero? And when you think about it, what makes him a hero is breaking the programming that he got, the programming, raising, whatever you guys, in the comments again, I say what I said,

and I believe what I believe, and even he believes it, because him becoming a fully formed individual is what had to happen. That is what made John Stewart. He can already work the ring. He worked the ring and made a big fucking drill episodes ago. He can already do all of that stuff.

What he couldn't do was think for himself, make decisions for himself, and worry about only being a hero from his point of view. And once everything happened in Rushville, everything happened to Hal. He had to make decisions on his own by himself. That is what entitles him to be the Grand Lantern of Earth. And that is what is completely driven home and tied up with a bow at the end of this season of television.

This was the first time that John didn't pull the trigger, where since he was a kid, he's always had a weapon in his hand. And he always had to shoot the apple. and it was interesting when he's talking to Noah and reveals that Zoe wanted a mercy killing. And I do think it was, it's a controversial choice. I don't know if I fully like it, but story-wise, it was satisfying to be like, oh, to be the Green Lantern,

he has to do the one thing that Howe couldn't, which is realized, like, who am I without this ring? Who am I without this weapon? And I thought it was very, very interesting that for John, he has to make the change, choice of letting Noah live and being, because he sees himself in Noah and I was like, oh, that's fabulous.

Like he has to trust and he has also learn how to pick his battles. Yes. To fight his fight. Not somebody else's fight. Not how, not his parents, not the guardians. Being a good soldier for John Stewart is not now nine months

mission critical, never leaving until that ends at something disappointing. It's the way he feels what he needs to do and what he thinks is right. He let the ball go, right? John or Howe was incapable of letting the ball go. It's what got him killed.

Yeah. Was that's, that's Kerry's son. She's not just going to let you, like, mess around with him and get him hurt or endanger himself, whatever. For John, he realized, like, the kid really don't want to, he don't want to do nothing bad, man. Yeah. If I leave him, I trust Kerry to make it work.

It's a done deal. I walk away. He let the ball go. went Hal didn't, and it got hell killed. Here's the thing. I am killing the kid, though. If I'm John, I'm like, hey, bro, I've seen Terminator. I don't know how this goes.

Yeah, but... You've seen Terminator. What Terminator got to do with this? You mean? You've seen Terminator. A fucking killing machine? Yeah, so it's a reverse... But it's not, but this is different, though.

How's this different? Well, I'll say, okay, number one, well, I mean, which version of Terminator we're talking about? Let's be precise. I feel like this is T2. He'd a liquid one. Okay. The liquid one is not...

That's not... It's not... He wasn't raised by no nice white family in the breast. It's C1. It's definitely T1. If it is T2, you know who it is? It's actually Schwarzenegger's character in T2. It's him.

He had enough programming to end up being like a good father to John Stewart and stuff like that. And he had to make this decision at the end of it, another chip in his head. He had to get in a liquid lava or whatever like that. I mean, my dad, we both did like that. Like when he did, it was very upsetting. But like, to your point, I think there are going to be a lot of people who go, got to kill a killer robot. And got to put carry in jail. She killed a human being.

I was going to stay on Noah. We have to be real. This little boy broke out Sinestro. At that point, I'm just like. You got a lot more red on your legend than you think Noah. John wasn't really breaking down. How craft do you have to be? I'm giving John some bail here because the name of the game is.

anybody, I mean, he mentioned it. He could have called guy, overpower guy took guys ring, right? He could have been, dude, done that, you feel me? I feel like, he's like, look, if anybody going to take out Noah, it's got to be me. I'm the only who could talk to him. I'm the only one who can, like, see where he sees.

That's why at the end of the day, he's like, yeah, give me the ring. I'm going to charge that thing because, like, I'm going to take earth. Because if guys show up with the Manhunter, it's not going to go well. I'm the only one that I trust to deal with this man. hunter business.

Right. If it does indeed come back. What happens if Noah gets a little freaky and now we got a bunch of fucking Manhunter children running around fucking Earth? Well, John said that that's gonna be his problem later. He's a manhunter. He's a manhunter. Yeah.

He's half. He's half. So like now, I mean, the Manhunter vibes, they just go down. The biracial manhunter? Yeah. By rites. Y'all know how it goes back. You know how you get a court.

Put them on the manhunter list? Jesus Chris. You know. The manhunter list. But. But no, so, you know, this is a chance, and that's another thing. Like, John operated with such certainty in other aspects of his life. He almost had to be certain in order to do stuff, right?

This is uncertain. Like, the only thing that he knows is that he wants to try to be a Green Lantern under his own rules. Everything else, he's kind of taking a chance. You're taking a chance by letting Kerry go. You're taking a chance. You're letting carry go. That was... I mean, again, who cares?

I'm serious Like the town don't care Town doesn't get Like Howe's dead Nobody told anybody the How's dead Except only people knew how's dead Are Carrie John

Noah the town And what's his name And Carol Ferris Yeah That's it Nobody else Can't have a conversation With How

Like hey how Now killing him Like She didn't even use An act of passion I think that was Like the weirdest Part of episode

To me Because I had to watch it a couple times because I get why she would kill him, like in that moment. But to be driven like that to kill him? But to be driven like that, just to be like one, I was like, dang, man. She just seemed very stressed and then just innately shot him. That's your guy.

I thought they would talk about him some more or something. Yeah. Or he'd have an ultimatum or something. Yeah, that scene was interesting because she has been trying to protect Noah for his entire life, right, against people knowing and everything that's going on. And John, it is, excuse me, how. It is in Hal's directive, in Hal's makeup to want to take him out. So the question is, who was going to act in that situation?

But also, I want to shoot Hal some bail. He saw what happened to Rushville. He saw what happened when you let a Manhunter gain too much power. So there is a part of me where I'm like, it's not like, how could have easily called up John or a guy and be like, did it, oh, there's a manhunter. He tried to do it a different way. And that's, maybe that's what got him killed. He knows how dangerous manhunters are, period.

Right. Not just Rushville, but in terms of like the kind of havoc that they wreak wherever they go. So for him, it was always going to be existential. For her, it is existential. And she, at this point, you know, when you think about it, normally in this entire show, Hal already always has a trick up his sleeve. He can always, his gut always lets him know that something is going to happen or somebody's not, what they're going to do or what they think they're going to do

or what they're really thinking. And at this point, I don't think he knew she was capable of that. No. I think that he didn't think that his gut maybe the one time they betrayed him. He did pick him up out the pen. That's some beer. Draco sees him to book bag. Trach I got a little kickback.

Do you think Zoe? I was like, was Zoe fucking around a little bit? It did this on purpose because, Because Carrie was acting like it was an accent. And I'm like, it seemed like Zoe purposefully put a man under. In you. I mean, she definitely knew. Yeah.

So, yeah, it probably was. But Carrie didn't say it. Like, did I, am I misremembering this? No, well, Carrie. I mean, it's immaculate conception, right? Basically, she banned her to Jesus. Right? She had to be.

She's rebuilt other people and they didn't end up pregnant. Yeah. Well, that's what I'm saying, right? Like, literally. Who else was she with? She was nobody. She said she had like got pregnant hadn't been with anybody in a while.

Yeah. Right. So yeah. No, I'm agreeing with you. Yeah, but she was in the, she was in the, like, this is what I don't get. You were in the fucking machine that gave you your finger back and you just pop out with a baby. Zoe definitely was like typing in a like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, like.

Maybe. Because she couldn't have, she couldn't have kids with, uh, old dude. Right. And at that point, she would have indoctrinated her to be like you will be the vessel of carrying on the. I'm wondering more so why. Because at the end, first of all I was like, Billy,

why are you fucking out here? Like, what did Billy know? Billy was just like... Billy, I think, was an instrument and a tool for the writers to throw us off.

Probably. Billy does not have a lot of utility in this show. But he's always there. What is Billy doing? Why Billy's popping in? Billy's popping out? Billy was a way to throw us off.

You know, early on, me having the wherewithal and the genius... Oh, God. Right. I'm just joking. It was really...

But, like, Like, if you had that feeling, the other characters around Noah were the ones that were going to kind of distract you a little bit from the fact that it seemed like Zoe took extra special care of her grandson that, for whatever reason, she had the same type of bond. It didn't seem like it was a step-grandma, but they did not look like each other. So there was some stuff that was going on. There was always a lot of mysteries surrounding the kid, and then it ended up being the kid. How do you feel like that was actually reconciled? The fact that it was Noah all the time, do you feel like it was too obvious at a certain point?

I think it was very obvious. I think there was a reason why we were like, you got to keep Noah on the board. And when it was finally revealed, it made story sense. But there was a little bit of me. It was like, this is very convenient. Like, it, part of me is like,

oh, the show felt like it was missing a big bad because the big bad, because of the mystery, it kind of kept moving. And that's, I think, where I was like, oh, this was a muted season finale because everything that John was fighting is an internal battle. Like, it wasn't an external thing.

I was like, oh, he's going to start slinging the ring at the football game. And I'm like, oh, no, that's, that shit's not happening. But that's the disorienting thing about this season because, like, we're built around this being centered around a big bad and that ended up being Zoe. And then once we got the 2026 timeline, we're kind of re-spun into disarray.

with even the big bad, though, because the reveal of John being like, she wanted me to kill her because she did not want to repeat the same genocidal act she did on the other alien. I agree. Like, I don't think so. And so that's why I'm, like, really interested to see, like, what the reception is to this episode. Because there is no big CG.

We say, like, we don't want a CGI boss battle. Then when we don't get one, we kind of feel like, huh? Oh, interesting. I think this episode does a really good job of, like, ending the show, like, threading the, any of the threads of these characters in a way that feels fulfilling,

even though there's, again, no big C.Gi. But even as I'm watching the episode, I'm like, once, like, Noah puts the ring down and gives it back to John, I'm like, oh, they really not going to fight. Yeah. Okay. Let's see how they do it.

And I think they did it well, but I'm interested to see. Now, this was an ending of a Naruto episode. You know, friendship solved everything. Well, I'm going to be real. Like, I think this is kind of, sometimes my frustration with us. because, like, not just us. I mean, us as a fan base.

Not just us, but us as a fan base. So if you have a big bad, you have to have the CGI fight. Yeah, sure. You have to have it. If you do something more nuanced, then you don't get the big CGI fight. What you get is characters like resolving story, which is essentially what makes great television. Yeah.

We sometimes cannot be satisfied to join. point. It's like if there is a big bad, if we end up having a if Sinestro's pulling the strings on how all of this and then we get a big Sinestro fight and well, does everything have to end in a big CGI fight? Well no, it doesn't. There's another way to do it which is the way that they did it.

While it is definitely muted I think it's interesting to explore a world where you don't have to have the fight where the characters have learned to like solve these conflicts in a different way.

And so I think that that's actually, for me, not just satisfying, but it was almost liberating. Yeah. Like, it was liberating to know that it can't go that way. I mean, but also if we think about it, the reason why, even if this wasn't my favorite episode of the season, the reason why the season as a whole to me is a success is that we got Obi-Wan. We got, like, we got everything that we said we wanted and we were still bitching. and I think a lot of times with like these superhero or sci-fi shows, we were talking to Monday,

we've talked to Justin and Vanessa about it. To me it's more interesting to have the Green Lantern be something that not only is hard to use, but feels special. It feels like a lightsaber. Where it's like the minute you have a thousand lightsabers, the minute people are backflipping,

like, oh, this feels a little less, yeah, it feels, yeah, a little less special. And with this show, I was like, the Green Lantern rings still feels like something you can earn. It still feels like something that not just anybody can wield. And we know that John is going to be in Man of Tomorrow. We're going to get John flying around and doing all of the big stuff.

Is that actually what you want to see on TV? Because usually it's not done well just because the budgets can't be what they need to be to make it look how we want it to look. And what it can do well is wrap up that story. I think the one, like, even less so than that, I think the one like slight gripe that I would have had with this episode is that like there was a lot of very very fast table setting in the beginning of this episode only to get us to that end i think like when senestro has to explain like second and third hand to hal agram and john yeah what hal did with noah to set up

what we're going to eventually get to i was like okay that's like a little feels a little rushed and only just to use senestro for that purpose is odd but then again we're we're back on track i think that if to get that scene in the car where him and noah are resolving those things are is all worth it because that was one of my favorite scenes in the entire season yeah i guess i don't know i don't i don't mind like seneschial needed a utility right sure so like who broke him out why he did that in episode three right he's always like thing about synchievous he's telling the strange he could be and it could be bullshit he could be lying he manipulates how he minutes how many times did he tell how you got to kill you got to kill uh john

You got to kill the kid. He's always trying to move stuff at the table. I was going to say he's bad at. He's actually not because he actually did Influentile in like the first, but he didn't get John in this one, right? I think like Sinestro's utility was used pretty well in this episode. But I do like that conversation with Noah and John and the conversation that John has with Carrie,

you guys are like, man, you should have turned Carrie in, man. I don't know, man. She was being a mother, man. Yeah. You know, at the end of the day. Carrie is a fucking murderer. Yeah, she killed how it's tough, man. We all make mistakes, right?

She feels guilty. She's going to have to live without the rest of her life. It's all good. It's always different when a white woman kills somebody. People act differently. Ben? Later it would have been like Lettisha or somebody like that that I kill her. The slammer, okay?

It would have been slam. Kling! Slammer. Fox News. News at 11. Cop killing black women. like goes crazy in Nebraska filming it like today on Hannity.

This was the Zach Fox. This was the Zach Fox tweet. Because they was all hugging at the end. Billy was just like, oh! And by the way, by the way, shout out to Carrie, man. Carrie looks at him like, I guess I'll turn myself. You know he wouldn't go turn you in.

He wasn't going to turn you in. He wasn't going to turn it. I'm telling you, bro, sometimes as brothers, we go further for these white ladies than we do for our own since we got a van. We got on a name Shroom. This was an episode of

healing because John he's just like, hey, yo, Kerry, I forgive you. He walks through his own house.

Okay. Everybody who was mad at us, how do you know that his brother was a rapper? How do you know his brother was a rapper? That digger had all the fucking

I mean, how do we know his brother was a rapper? He said it. Oh, no, he could have been a singer is what they did. Oh, okay.

That didn't look like a rapper. What do you know? Rap to me? Look like rap to me. Um, look. Can be the R-B? Can we talk about?

It could be R&B. It could be Afro beats. Niggas is rappers, though. I don't know what to tell me. It's like the treat or so shit like that. Bruh, it could have been me. He was there. You know what?

The brother is a classically trained opera singer. That's what he's doing. He's putting out. He's the three tenors featuring him. So, look, how do you feel like this episode attacked or addressed the love story between Kerry and Howe that kind of preceded

all of the stuff that happens in this episode. We go back to 2016, Howe getting out of jail. I'm definitely allergic to this wig. How getting out of jail, right? And then we get to see a little bit of how they came to have feelings for each other. How well was that executed for you?

I think it was executed very well. The dinner seat was hilarious to me, though, because I was a little bit like, come on you are you are ruining everybody's Friday night like if this man done killed like a dozen people yeah fuck you in your garlic bread okay yeah yeah he's like I would have been like hey I feel what you're saying hey my brother died yeah so I'm missing a leg Gary was essentially like get over it yeah get over it but you know what shout out to the people they wasn't having that shit yo they traded him burn his house down they treated him exactly like they would have treated

John, if John's family would have moved into the neighborhood. Oh, God. Yeah. Like 1913. At least 1960. Maybe even. 19- fucking 75. No, this was remember.

It was like, hey, yo, fuck you. Fuck you. Boom. Go back to where it came from. They pooped on his front lawn. Yeah, pooped on his front long. But then I'm talking about the fire bombing. The firebombing is crazy.

They were like civil rights arrow. That's why I said. That's evil. It wasn't just one. They was like, get air. He was like, yeah. Check it. every window, burnt up everything,

no thought or regard for Earl, which, by the way, who's looking after him? That was heartbreaking? That was crazy, right? Wait, was Earl okay? Yeah, we saw him. Oh, yeah, it was. Also, John not shit because he dropped Earl off with his parents. And then his left. He's like,

yo, take care of Earl. Y'all got him. And then come back. Okay, hugs. So, um, but I thought that they kind of got us into their relationship and made us really kind of believe that these two people, there was always some sort of attraction have found something special in each other,

particularly after Rushville was obliterated. The scene in the bed was really touching when, you know, she's like, don't look at me. He's like, no, come to the game. I'm like, man, he really did this thing. I got to call a foul and I play as well. Now, this is your son. This is game, whatever.

I'm not trying to see you bring your new man to my fucking game who don't kill half the fucking town. No one not. Like, this is not about you, Gary. This is not about you. No one not, no one not done, man. Come on, man. He knows what going on.

Yeah, no, he don't have them same hangouts. He's a man. No, this is baby boy. Right, you know, I keep y'all. That would be funny. Baby boy. Baby boy, grab him. Young blood.

Remember he licked his head? Didn't. Bing Wrenles. John Gellon. Licking know his head. Hey, huh. The, bro. Why would you do that?

Rest in peace, John Singleton. Big up, Ving, Rames, and Tyrese. I remember being in the movie theater when he walks away and then he, ah, youngster. Then he walks back and he grabs him up. I'm like, oh, shit, this nigga in trouble. He's thinking fun.

Like, Ving Rames was crazy. I remember that? Rue was going crazy. He was hitting himself. Baby was one of my favorite movies all time. Baby boy is dramatic, man. Baby boy was... If they do a Noah's spinoff of a baby boy

spinoff with Noah, I will watch that shit. Like when Noah is the Trouble Kid. Because one day Noah, how can you raise a manhunter though? What if you tell Noah, hey, Noah, I don't know. Fuck you, man. You want me to take over this whole bitch? Wait, when did Noah learn that he was a manhunter? I think, I think Zoe told him.

Because Kerry was under the impression that he didn't know for a while. When? Right? No, no, no. She, when she's talking to How, she's like, yo, like, she tries to play it off. And he's like, no, he knows what he is. She tried to, but she's like, I tried to protect him from that, hoping that I could raise him.

in a way. Nah, I think she tried to protect him from his potential to do harm, but I think his grandmother... No, that's what I'm saying. Yeah. Like, back when, like, in that first episode, do we feel like Noah at that age

was like, I'm mad on there. Well, the only reason why I think that that could be the case, and you guys can tell me if I'm wrong, is because when all of this stuff happened in Rushville, she was so forthright with him about it, and she was basically saying,

like, this is the kind of thing that I told you was going to happen. Right, remember that, yeah. Right, and so I think that she had already let him know what he was and what that meant and how people would come after her so she had to protect him. Yes, I think

that's right on the money. If we can pivot to like just comic book lore shit when Sinestro makes the fucking lantern that has all of the cracks of yellow in it, I was wondering, I'm like, okay,

they did not show us this in this episode. Is how a green lantern? Is how it going to a yellow lantern? Right. Or is he going to be a green lantern that literally has basically a dark side in him?

Yeah. Like I was like, I tried to be like Mace Windo. Yeah. I tried to look at like any comic precedent for that because I'm like, can the yellow lantern charge a green ring? And like they didn't really, it didn't happen that often.

But I love the idea of that there's like this seed laying. Because there's a couple of things that this episode does that's like table setting for either another season or whatever we have. story-wise with John, that the idea that there's a technically yellow lantern charging a green lantern constantly is fascinating. I mean, because, like, I was wondering when John shows up in Man of Tomorrow, is that something that we get a little bit of that? Or is this completely lantern season two territory?

I think the big idea is, like, I think the lantern is a metaphor for the whole season, which is, like, you don't have to be afraid of fear, right? like household thing was that he's fearless, he's fearless, he's fearless. At the end of the day, like, it got him killed, right? Like, if you find a way not to, like, not be afraid per se, but to, like, channel your fear into a way that's productive, right? Like you said, like being fearful is like a, it's pro-evolutionary, right? Something that you, like, have to be to survive, right?

And so you can't just ignore it. You have to use your fear in order to, like, you know, overcome something. I think that's, like, the big idea of the fear. in the lantern at the end. Also, and this is like the thing that I was bugging me for talking about

comic book lore stuff. Guardians, top, top one worst organization ever, right? Because guy come down, guy see the ring,

guy see the lantern, and guy's just like, I guess I gotta go explain this to the folks to Owa. Brother man, take the lantern or take the ring,

take one of the other and like go make a call, big dog, take him to OA, like, handle your business. Guy doesn't want those problems. Yeah, John really stared him down there.

Well, Guy, guy for some reason, I thought that that was actually sort of almost like, hmm. The fact that Guy didn't just straight snitch and try to assert his authority on John made me like Guy a little bit more. Not that I necessarily had a huge problem with Guy, but when you think about it, you know, guy's got the Loritech logo on his chest. He's kind of a corporate green lantern. You see him in, you know. You think I'm your Aaron Boy?

and all of that stuff like that. So the fact that he didn't narc him out or try to like dominate him in that situation because he had a fully charged ring and John didn't, that actually kind of made me respect guy a little bit. Wait, but do you think part of this is the fact that like, if we look at how, how is basically discarded by the guardians

by the time he's in the last few years of being a green lantern and guy is basically getting corporate money. So this part of guy probably is just like, yeah, I am kind of just a messenger for them. Like I have had to kind of sell my soul to be popping on Earth. But you wouldn't stand up and be like, actually, nah, man, I'm the big dog here. Like, I'm going to cook a little bit. Yeah, I got brand deals, clearly. I know you, you wouldn't just take that, bro.

If you were to Green Lantern Earth and a dude came up was like, yeah, man, actually, this is my spot now. You got to go up in space. You'd be like, hell now, little honey. First of all, yes, this wouldn't happen to me. I'm not letting fucking Trader Joe's ghost. fucking talk to me crazy. Right. You know?

Like, no, I'm the real fucking Green Lantern. Fuck you. I kind of, where was that for guys? And I do love the fact that they don't like each other come the end of that interaction.

But look, look, here's the thing. That all could be true. But in that situation, it's interesting about his character that he did not lead with ego. That's all I'm saying. I'm saying it's interesting

that he didn't go, oh, you're the Green Lantern, I'm the Green Lantern. Because really the whole show is about the fact that the worthiness of that, the worthiness of that mantle is kind of synthetic. Like, there's not a right way to be a Greenlander.

You're not right if the guardians choose you. You're not right if your parents choose you. You're not even right if the ring choose you. Because that's not what makes you a hero. What makes you a hero is understanding the intricacies and the vulnerabilities of human nature and wanting to help. Right. And, like, trusting yourself and, like, having your own moral compass

for what you believe is good, any organization or group of people that have to make decisions about heroism, probably has an agenda that's anti-humanistic. So, like, to me, when he's standing there, I think that not only is he, probably, to y'all point,

a little scared of John for whatever reason, but I also think that he probably thinks he's got a point. Like, he's got a point. He's around the guardians. He knows, he's got a point. There's a lot of red in his ledger already. There's something

about God that went, huh, I get it. I mean, but also, and this is what Monday brings it up. This show was always litigating. All right, if the Green Lantern Corps is real and we have a Green Lantern on Earth, they say in one of the previous episodes, there's not, this not the army. There's not a bunch of Green Lanterns running around on Earth. All of this shit, to your point, is fucking made up.

So it is like, for John, I do think it's like a very, very interesting and smart choice to be like, no, I'm going to be the green lantern of Earth. Why would I give a fuck about the other sectors? Right. Like, I know what I want to protect. And I was like, oh, that's interesting because like, yeah, why would John give a fuck about the rest of the sector? Yeah. Saturn.

I mean, we've only been to one other planet. Earth first. Yeah. Oh, God. We're Earth first. We're Earth first here. We're not adventuring all around the galaxy to try to build that green wall. Hey, hey.

I didn't say that. I didn't say that. What do you have against John reinvesting in his own hood? I don't have anything. Well, Earth is his hood. That's what I'm into. I'm the Earth is his hood.

We got to buy back the block first. What are you going to say, Steve? No, and he wouldn't give a shit about that because, A, we've only been to one other planet this entire thing. And John wouldn't care about that since, like, he's kind of still getting his wings. And, like, if he's bopping around other planets, the Guardians are going to catch wind of that.

Well, they said he's, they said he's, going to send an army. And I was just like, hey, first of all, because like, he kind of was like, hey, bro, not only do I got the battery from Sinestro, I feel like John's like, I could kill you. Like, I could kill a guardian. Yeah. Maybe. But my thing is like, to God's point, like, when you go to O and you're like, hey, I don't know if y'all

know this, but John dug up Howell's Ring, don't ask him how he got it. It's crazy story. You're not going to lead us. But he also has a power battery. So there's just another green line on Arf. I just feel like somebody's got to make a call. Like, hey, yo, John, man, what's going on? I thought you didn't want this life.

You know what I mean? But the one bit of leverage that he has over the Guardians is the fact that he knows that they were covering up Manhunters because with the search their hearts line. What difference do that make? I don't know. I just feel like, I think. I mean, and that's like kind of where I landed on ultimately.

That felt flimsy a little. I don't think it felt flimsy. Really? I just, no, no, because he's going to be like, they're going to know he killed a guard or he killed a manhunter. He's not someone to be. Metropolis with, hey, man, maybe we just let him be.

He already, like, he learned from the best of the best, which is how. How's already probably, you know what? If I'm John, though, I'm going straight to Metropolis. I know where Superman is. I know where Supergirl is. I know where Crypto are. What the fuck the Green Lancer? Like, I've seen these batteries, they can't hold the charge for shit.

What the Green Lancer Corps really going to do when they come to Earth? That's true. What you mean? You're going straight to them into what? No, I'm saying, he's like, oh, an army will come down to you. I'm like, we saw what the. the ring can do? It could barely do shit. Like, this shit, like a Swiss army.

Hold on a minute. We haven't seen John really yet. Cook it with the ring yet, brother. I'm just saying, if it's Superman, Supergirl, crypto, a couple, oh, motherfuckers, metamorpho. We got hot girl. Hot girl. Like, I'm taking them over the core. I mean, nobody is going to, if you have Superman, if you have two Krimonians, you're fucked, right? It's going to be

tough. It's going to be hard. Wait, how many Green Lanters do you think it would take to take down Superman? I mean, how many of you got? Like, I mean, are we, are we, are we power scala? I mean, I mean, Are we, we're at a place with a yellow sun? Yeah. You're fucked.

I think, no, whoa. Well, it depends how much willpower. I think how John Guy Kyle could, in the right circumstances, get Superman. At least this, this universe is Superman. Maybe this universe is Superman. You saw, he was not carrying his weight. But also, to be real, this universe is Green Laner. Yes, significantly less power.

Sure, sure. If you take those four guys against Superman, and the comic books is done. If you take those, they're fucked. Like, yeah, there's, but the whole core could take down Superman. Maybe. Maybe?

I mean, I don't know. It's like, Mogo is a planet. I know, but like, what I'm trying to say is... How many are you in the court? Like 50?

There's 200? No, it's a lot. I think there are thousands of girls. Thousands, hundreds of thousands. Yeah. The universe is, yeah. So, I mean, I guess if you had all of them,

I mean, the question is how they got eye on, you got my, but I'm saying it's going to say that all, But I'm saying it's going to take a lot of, there's nothing that they can do to Superman. Nothing, what are they going to do that's going to work on him? Could you create, like, kryptonite from the ring? Maybe.

I mean, if you could do that, perhaps, I'm sure there's been some comics somewhere where the Greenlander was able to. But, like, Superman's going to destroy any of the constructs. They're done. Like, what can you do to them? Interesting that Superman can beat up Greenlander, but Batman is where we draw the line. What?

Batman's where we draw the line. Psychologically, Batman has a different set of skills. Is it used a certain set of skills? That's the crazy part. Every other word we're like, yo, Superbad, like the floor. Now, no, no, no, man, hold on. Hold on now. We got to talk about it.

But here's the deal, though. This is the difference. No one thinks that Batman is going to roll up on Superman and square off and be Superman. That's what we're saying about the Green Lantern. No one thinks that Batman's going. But if Batman has time to plan, if Batman has time to plan, it's going to be tough, we've already seen it. Okay. So, no is the manhunter.

John Stewart's your Green Lantern Guy Gardner gets cut out again Guy Gardner is now off of earth It seems like We'll see how much he honors that We'll see how much he honors that How do we feel like The Rushville

Reparationist gets her back Okay How do we feel like everything in Rushville Was tied up? This is a community that's experienced Devastation There was just a murder And now there is

Someone with the soul of a killer alien leading their team to a state championship. Which, by the way, shout out Noah. He only didn't make the decision because the scouts could take a look at his other bullshit online. When they did that to be like, yeah, see, this Manhunter got a heart of gold, he tried to put his dickas on. I'm like, all right, y'all. He does. Those kids are going to line.

Shut up, Florida State. Here's what you got to do, though, if you know it for real, right? There's got to be one guy. There's got to be one dude where, like, it happens with, like, brothers and things like that. But it's going to be one dude like, yo, man, you put the Nebraska head on. You're like, hey, listen, man. Like, I really do want to come Nebraska. I really do love this.

But you got to take my homie, too. He needs a scholarship, man. Oh, you know what they did that with? That does happen. They did that with Romeo back in the day. Remember that? With DeMarre de Rosen at SC, it did. There was a package deal with Romeo and Demar de Rosen at SC.

So you got to take my mom's with you. All right, let's say we're in Rushville. Mm-hmm. And you got the kill shot on Noah. The minute he's put in. his fellow teammates on not picking the school, you're like, this is why I'm not going to kill him.

Well, I mean, you've known Noah since he was a kid, right? So there's something else that you've known knows. You don't know him. If I'm being honest, I mean, you knew him as a kid. John fucked his grandmother, got a little over attached to the family.

By the way, talking to do what needed to be done. I'm going to tell you something right now, man. If I'm like, all right, I got this shot lined up, I got to kill this kid playing football. And I see him spin out of a tackle. you know, go across his body and throw a dot to the tied end for 15 yards. We might need that.

I'm gonna be like, hold on. Wait, we might need that. Hold on to Colsey, the quarterback, man. You might need that. No, I'll be like, no, you can receive this. I'll be like, I'll least put the gun down. I'll see what he got. You're gonna shoot the husband?

Yeah, like, you might need that. Hold on. You're not making it out of the truck. I'll say this. Okay, so a couple of things that happen. Number one, I don't think that John can let Noah live if we find out that Noah kill house. Because at that point, he's given it to his nature.

As much as he did do, because he did whoop the shit out of, like, a couple of people. As much as he did do. He broke the nestro out of jail. I know he broke the nestro out of jail. I would have really loved to have seen that. But even that, even that, like, that was a means to an end. There is an idea here that you can't indict him yet for the evil that he hasn't done yet.

Exactly. And that's a really interesting thing to explore in this particular show, because this show continuously delves into how much your nature, how much of your nature should you be held responsible for? The moment that we learn that this brash, arrogant,

filled with microaggressions, nature that Hal Jordan has is something that's not just a part of his lineage, but that is a part of his formation and his programming. The question is, what can somebody be if you free them of their programming,

if you free them of what they're supposed to be? Or if they choose to want to fight it. Right. Well, they already are, Are you allowing if you're John Noah to go into politics? I'm like, you gotta. No, I mean, but that's why he takes the ring, right? It's ultimately like if something happens with this kid, yes.

I'm gonna be the one to deal with it. But if you probably side major, I'm like, nigga, go be a teacher. Yeah, you go talk to him. It's like, if you say, if he's there and you see him, he's a turning point, you're okay now. You just flashed the ring one time. You see Noah all campus somewhere. Like, nope, got to come to him. Like, nope, got to come to him. Like, no, like, John flies right down.

You're like, now listen. I thought John come down. Hey, you better go take some basket weave. What the fuck is wrong with you? You're not supposed to be doing this out here with these people? Or here's the thing with the programming. I can't say it. No, I'll say it.

Hello, Ringiverse fans. I regret to inform you that due to the initiation of Deep Shaddle Protocol, this bit had to be edited out of the pod. I know. I'm just as disappointed as you are. Thanks as always for listening. And the Midnight Boys, Poo Poo Poo! We'll get back to you short.

That was one of the deepest shadows that we've ever done. So Devin and them, I want to make a note. We're not going to take that whole part out, but that little part, that is a deep. I want, we're back, well, we've been back for a second. I want you guys to know what Charles did was the deepest of shadow. Oh, yes. That'll never come out. Nope.

What's wrong with you, man? That's tough. Yeah. That's tough. Slip him 100 in New York. Maybe he'll take it. Oh, my God. You want to know what?

I'm censored in Silas on this podcast so much. Hey, bro. Guess what? If you want to rock with it, be my motherfucker. Yeah. I would love it. Because you're two for two. Guess what?

Band are back on Twitter. Because you're two for two in jokes that were devastating. But that week, that other one was one of them ones. That was amazing. That was crazy. You're two for two. Can't have it. But I wouldn't have been no tours of the office had that.

come out. You're two for two. If you wanted it, well, I can't, I would love it. That was some shit. But no. So, yeah, so I think kind of trusting the community around of Carrie to a degree trusting Zoe, which you don't have a lot reason to trust her,

is kind of something that John, this is a part of what John has chosen. Really quick, though, it was a very bold choice. and I'm so glad they stuck with it, they don't give Hal an easy out. I feel like a lot of people I saw like, oh, maybe Hal was the clone, maybe he didn't do,

like, oh, right, yeah. Till the end, they were like, no, Hal and John are culpable in what happened in Rushville. And that's why I'm like, I am not, even if this was a mutative finale, I'm like, oh, they didn't take the easy way out. No, yeah, yeah.

Can I galaxy brain this also in a way that, like, I'm sure the writers weren't intending? Okay. Okay. to John doing what he did with Noah is essentially what you would have to do as a superhero. Like the nature of human beings and who we are is so uncertain depending on where we are, the type of environment that we've come from, like the trauma that we've undergone. And so if you are a superhero, then part of your job is to believe in the uncertainty

of calamity, evil, but also of good. And so you're legitimately monitoring human beings for the time that they go bad, and then you step in. If you can't do that with one person, how are you going to do that with everybody? How are you going to trust everyone to do that? That's the difference between like Superman and Batman. I believe in the good in people.

Like Captain America and Iron Man, I believe it. And those heroes always have to learn. that free will and the ability to make a choice and letting people do that and then acting is like what a belief in humanity actually is. So he legitimately demonstrates a belief in humanity by believing in a robot.

Basically, or half of his humanity. Or half of a robot. I mean, but even what I think the writers and creators did such a good job of is they were constantly asking what would happen if these rings and these aliens came to Earth and at every single point, whether it was John's father, whether it's Carrie,

you are seeing people in real time have to create, like with moral and ethical dilemmas, that would happen if aliens came to Earth. It's not as easy. Like, in the comics a lot of times, it's like, oh, we got the ring, everybody's used to it, I'm flying around, and you're like, oh, no, Carrie had a life before

she ever ran into a manhunter. John's father, of course, this is something that is going to have echoes and reverberations to his entire fucking lineage for years and years and years and years. And that's where I'm like, oh, the show was successful in kind of building a scaffolding for the DC universe

where it's like, oh, this world is still trying to come to grips with what do metahumans mean, aliens, demons? And I was like, oh, like, this is a really good job. But it's not, it's not just on a, like, global, immediately, at least, on a, like, global, like, what are our Socovia accords? What are, like, broad sweeping, like, humanity level,

against superheroes. It's just people in small towns reckoning with those levers of power that are way beyond their imaginations. I wish the MCU, because I feel like because the MCU didn't have the TV shows at first, they could only really be macro.

And to me, I'm like, oh, it's so interesting. I hope the DCU does more of this where I'm like, the DCU, historically in the comic books, everybody has a city. So you're used to these heroes, like The Flash or Batman dealing with problems that

are a little bit smaller and I kind of want the DCU to stay here for as long as possible where it's like it was very smart to pick Rushville as a place. And I'm like oh, wherever these other things go it's a really smart choice for John to be the green lantern of Earth. Since you brought up the MCU

so I watched, I went to the theater to watch Encore, right? What did you think of it? I had a fantastic time. You know, had a great time. The new scenes or whatever, the cut scenes, they were whatever. Like, I get it. Like, it was whatever. I have notes, yeah.

Huh? I have notes. Yeah, it was whatever. But I went to the theater to see Endgame again. And the thing that's still a triumph about Ingame is just a tremendous amount of care that was put into wrapping up everybody's story, right? And the fact that they could do that, that movie is dense, though. That is a dense, dense movie.

that movie has time travel multiple versions of people that movie has a homicidal maniac going around killing people it has like every time you don't think about it until you're on the big screen every time you think you're at the point that that movie has stopped the movie in it movies some more yeah and then at the end of it you get an old ass version of steve right that's a lot of movie i think the emcee you sometimes felt like they had to give us that experience with everything that they made yeah like that they had gotten to a point to where they couldn't slow things down just a little bit to have us focus on really examining why we love these characters so much. They always had to be an equal amount of spectacle for every tear or laugh. And that's the stuff that didn't work on television. But they're getting back to it in terms of Spider-Man, Wonder Man, Thunderbolts. I totally agree.

The things that are the most successful are when it's like, okay, even if lanterns people might be a little bit like, damn, we didn't get the big spectacle fight. I'm like, they gave us Kyle Chandler and Aaron Pierre. They literally helped birth a new hero that people are invested in and want to see going forward. That's not nothing because most of this shit for the past, like, decade could not do that.

And I'm like, I would rather you start slow and build than try to be like, all right, in one season, this is going to be the hugest fucking shit you ever. Yeah, the MCU is constantly impatient. with itself to want to give us something that they know we would like to see but is constantly unearned. Like, I don't think Seneschra should have gotten

the yellow ring in this. I feel like it would have been rushed and it would almost be like Sinestro was so good in this finale and throughout the season. It gives the universe somewhere to go. It's not a Thanos level event, but you are

like, damn. He's there. He's there, what's going to happen. He's stuck on Fear Planet with nowhere to get out. Stuff. He earned it. What did Sedestro really do, though, in this universe? He killed the Guardian. I don't know if you can quibble with that that much.

It seems like they're kind of bullshit. We didn't see them anymore. No more Guardians. Lord Lenny. Did you expect to see more Guardian? I think we needed to see the Guardian. Did we see Lenny? We had to see Lenny come down, but like, hey, man, so this is how you really going to do it?

okay, like we're not going to stop you. Well, then we don't need guy. Poor Canelo's dose. You know what I mean? Like, he goes to Oa, he snitches, and then Laura's like, hey, man, what you did was kind of crazy. I'm not going to hold you, but you are kind of right, though. So here's what we're going to do. You don't say nothing. I don't say nothing. We good. My guy. All right. I'm going to see you.

Yeah. Like that would have been nice. But ultimately, I mean, it's all right. Like, if you see Philean say that to Laura Lennie being like. I need Philly in a fly off and then Laura Lennie comes down. as a bird or whatever, it's like, hey, listen, you say no, right? However, you did kill a guard and you did do me a favor, so I'm going to just turn a blind. Little, like, edit to that final shot, you see, like, just a bird fly across the sky? Yeah.

But, I mean, at the end, I mean, that's, like, good point to the end. Like, him flying at the end, because we talked about this last week. We got to talk about that, yeah. We talked about it, like, one of the things that's going to have is he's going to fly. I think that moment is really, like, poignant in the sense of, like, he let all his stuff go, man. He was two-way down by all his baggage, man, with his family, with Rushfield, with Howe, right?

So when they have that final moment in, I love you. I love you, too, Jr. And he finally takes the ring and flies off. I'm like, he's finally free. I've been too positive. I needed to see John, at least, in the suit. Where was he going to get a suit? He just became Atlanta.

He constructed. How should have been, how, is. Because, like, how I was watching him, like, that was his favorite football player. He should have been like, hey, junior. I left this for you. No, I really need to see him in a suit. I wonder how, I didn't need to see him in a suit. Him flying was good.

I, when it happened at the end, there was a part of me that was almost hoping that it didn't happen, that they just did something where he grabbed the ring and he looked up and then just to piss you out off. No, I didn't think he needed to fly. He needed to fly. He needed to. Come on. I needed more ring slinging. I just did.

Like, I needed to see John get a little busy. We don't want it, but then again, it's just like, if it was even a missed out, too much. I need just a little bit more. So here's the thing, though, right? Remember, first trailer came out and was like, hey, man, anybody started slinging them rings. I was like, yo, you're going to get some ring slinging, don't worry.

And we, I'm not going to act like we didn't get no ring slinging, right? Episode five was a ton of ringsling. But outside of that, man, it was kind of light on the green. All right, so here's the thing. I agree. This isn't. All right, let's have the debate. I don't think this is a full surf trackula.

I feel like this has always been the show that they wanted to make. Right. Like if you watch it from episode one to episode eight, I always, I always felt like they are making a grounded universe, and this will never be the show where the constructs are the point. Right. With that being said, in a Green Lantern show, do we need more Green Lanterning?

I agree. So this is my deal. I don't need anything in the show. So do I understand the criticism? Of course. I don't need anything. The only thing I need in a show. There's only one thing I need in any show

is I can't wait to see the next episode. That's the only thing I need. If the show delivers on that, then there's some reason why I'm into the show. I want a second season. And that to me is the success. I've watched a lot of things. shows where I'm like, I don't know.

I don't know if I can get all the way behind that in the sense of, again, speaking to, speaking at MCU Daredevil, there's a Daredevil show and Daredevil not fighting the hand. Like the original Born Again thing was like, he's going to be in, doing a lawyer stuff. He's going to be a lawyer for episodes.

He's not going to fight nobody. You're going to be like, all right, man. Yeah, but here's the thing. Daredevil to me is different because I agree with you, but Daredevil is just a fucking ninja. That lends itself to team. and choreography and everything. We remember Secret Invasion.

We remember when DeNaris had all the fucking powers and it looked fucking crazy. Respect Gaia. Respect Gaia. Respect Gaia. All I'm saying is we say we want this shit. We say we want Anthony Mackey in the suit and then we see the suit and we're like,

yeah, that's what I'm saying about the ring sling. Like if it was even a little bit too much or not executed the way that you would have wanted, you would have complained. But that's the paradox of all this stuff. Yeah. Is that we have been, I think ultimately what it comes down to is we've been conditioned in a superhero story.

At the end, it's going to be the good guy versus the bad guy. They fight good wins or maybe sometimes evil wins. But at the end of the day, there's still, they got to get the hands. It's all how you do it, bro. I loved Smallville. It was a Superman story. It was great. There was no suit.

It was no cape. There was none of that until the last, you talk about Serf Dracula. The very last 17 seasons, by the way. I would argue, I would argue that, you know, I mean, it's a rice thing. They was never going to. Batman never showed up on the show because they're not going to put Batman on those.

No, I'm not talking about whether or not they could or could not do the thing. I'm talking about the fact that they didn't do it, but it was as much of a Superman story as anything I've done. I love Smallville. It was as much as a Superman, of a Superman show as I've ever seen. And, like, there was,

remember the episode where there was the teacher and she was too fine? And he started getting his heat vision. Shit like that is just inspiring to me because it's like he a freaky-ass young man and that's what's making the heat. It's inspiring because, you know, the story of when did Superman's heat vision first manifest itself?

Like how can you take something that we already know and love and make us interested in it in a way that's very, very grounded and accessible? He's a god. And watching his power was mad because I think that lady in that episode was also like some kind of demon. Because she had Mary Lex Luthor. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, she was like some kind of like the meteor had given her some kind of power. And just to take that mythology that we all know and make the meteors the source of all these crazy happenings and small.

So move Lex Luthor and Luther Corps to small. All of that stuff is not about what you have to have. It's about how well they do the thing that they are doing. I mean, also, if we're going to be real, the constructs, to me will always kind of look goofy in live action. So you have to be very careful of how, like, the coolest thing that Hal did this entire Cizia had nothing to do with the constructs. It's like, point junior, and he just goes, boom.

That to me is way cooler than, because I was just like, oh, so I give a little bit of grace because I'm like, they still have not gotten the green constructs right to me. And I don't know if you can just because it is. It's a common good thing. And technically they were answering the whole time because how was the construct the last? three episodes. Let me ask you this. Do you feel like they got the come,

before we get to the midnight meter, do you feel like they got the constructs right in Superman in the movie? No? It was fine. It wasn't bad. It had this kind of like marble texture to it, which looked kind of cool.

But then again, like in contrast to this, which is like just a little bit of a shade of green on it, but like you can make tornadoes and stuff. Like I could have gone for a little bit more than a bubble from Hal. He's a big fan of the bubble. I thought that guy, was cool in the, um, in, in, uh, man, in Superman.

He's making baseball bats? The way he was just boom. At the end. Yeah. Smack the finger. With the middle finger down. Like, that's cool. Yeah.

But it's still, but the contracts itself still looks a little goofy. We're like, oh, there's no real way to make something big and fucking green. Yeah. Look dope. Damn. The Hulk just cried somewhere. But even with the Hulk, if you think about it, the Hulk didn't stop looking cool until that nigga was basically gray. He was like

puke cream. When? That first movie? Not the, not the Engley joint. You're talking about Eric Banna? Yeah. No, not the Eric, that's Angley. No, Edward Norton. Edward Norton. He wasn't his super fucking green in that shit. He was like dirty brown

green. I can't remember. Cig I was tough in that movie. I like the way he looked in the Avengers. I think I think he looked better in the Avengers than he did an Incredible Hulk. He did. But I don't think he looked. I'm not I think he looked best in Spider-Man.

He looked great in Great New Day. He looked great in Great Bread New Day. Oh, by the way, just to let you guys know, we're living in a Spider-Man world. We're watching the entire movie of Endgame. Spider-Man comes on the screen. This is the Battle of, not the Battle of New York.

This is the way of-Earth. The Battle of Earth. At the end, when Spider-Man came on that screaming encore, that audience went fucking crazy. In 2026. Have you guys seen it?

That, Encore? Yeah. That, Spider-Man swings onto the screen. He takes this thing off. Spider-Man!

They went nuts. Your crowd went crazy, too, man. At every point where, like, when you watch it the first time, when there was a moment somebody to go crazy. Catching the hammer. Portals open.

Catching the hammer. Crazy. Portals open. When Chadwick showed up. Everybody in my... I'm about to cry now. Everybody started crying. Avengers.

Avengers assemble It really It really was like That was a one of one feeling It really was Okay midday Wait really really quick

Is it bullshit That they were like The little hammer clink From Tony at the end of the original End game they're like That was always Tony Making the doom mask They did it in the movie

They did it in awkward I know Oh yeah I was like all right yo Don't act like that was the plan talking about scenes. We're talking about those scenes real quick. Yeah, rank them real quick.

By the way, spoilers for Avengers Encore, apparently. If you haven't seen the spoilers, if you haven't seen that in the spoilers, okay? Can y'all rank the four joints we got? I'm a dead last. It's like barely not even seen. He's just clinked.

Yeah, that's dead. That's last. Third is the, the scene with Loki and, and Cap and Peggy. That's what that was dumb. Well, it's not one of it's dumb. It's just like, you could have done that later. Loki could have showed up at any time.

You don't need to do that the second that they're dancing at the house. You don't have to do that, right? You could have, like, have them come later, right? Second is the scene with Hulk and Doom because not only does that propel you to Brand New Day or from Brand New Day to Doom's Day, it's just like, it's cool to see Doom.

Now, the problem with that scene in particular is that that should have been in Brand New Day. It should not have been in it. But they weren't going to do that in a Sony joint. They could have. It would have been fine, but, like, for whatever reason they was selling. But the scene that actually, like,

enjoyed the most was a TVA scene, with Morbius and Casey. Which is the one that you could tell, which is the one that you could tell, all of those scenes are oriented around. Because to me, that's the longest one, and that's the one where it honestly feels like it holds actual, the other ones are breadcrumbs.

That, like, actually feels like dessert. After seeing encore, because, like, I feel like Marvel is trying to do this thing where they're like, oh, no, this, we were planning this, don't worry, blah, blah, blah, after seeing that TVA scene, are you kind of feeling like, hey, you guys don't have to convince us that

end games connected to this or whatever? Just make your story. Just tell you not. They didn't. They really didn't. I mean, obviously, we would have gone to see it either way, whichever. They're really trying to do some, like,

what's it called them? Some backlog in. Yeah. All that kind of stuff. Yeah. Which, like, I kind of understand the end of today, brother. You could give us that TVA scene.

I would have got it. I didn't need, like, all the other stuff. So the only thing I'd say about it is, hey, everything has a, have a point and a purpose. And so being that we're going to get this whole multiversal thing, I think, or

these incursions, I think it does make sense to show us like how the TVA is looking at it. I mean, they've taken the entire, it's like, it would be like that would be like if the movie had taken this entire time to build up

a bunch of lifeguards and then something 's happening in the ocean and then we don't fucking see the lifeguards. Right, yeah. Right. These guys are the lifeguards of this. So I didn't have a problem with, like, seeing their deal. We know that there was a meeting in 2023 where they got together and decided to pivot to doom. We read it and puck.

Okay. So, like, we know that that's what happened. Right. So do they need to backfill some story? Yeah. But to you guys' point, they do have to be careful about how much time they spent doing it. True. The funny thing about, like, the opportunity they see.

So, like, they confirm some universes get destroyed. And universes, I least confirm. The Eric Bannahoek verse, the 2015 Fantastic Four verse. Daredevil. The X-Men verse, allegedly. And you guys' favorite, the Wadeth verse, gone. All of it. Tough.

All of it. They all got to incurred. Encourage. You incurred a debt, a penalty. Encurs. And you see what happens. But this is about lanterns. And so we have to do the Midnight Meter.

All right. Y'all know what it is. The Midnight meter, 1 to 12. One is the worst. 11 and 12 are reserved for true game changers. I will start with you then. where are you going. 11.

It feels right. It feels right. An 11. It's an 11. Speak on it. It's a truly, truly immersive, culturally resonant and impactful season of television.

I give it an 11 both on the quality of the show, but also the fact that this show, this show occupied the Sunday night on HBO slot. Very true. And lived a lot. up to that slot. Wasn't supposed to do that. That's supposed to be a slot,

that Succession buoys, that Game of Thrones bullies. This show did Sunday night on HBO and lived up to it. That is cultural relative. It is the follow up to House of the Dragon. Post-supergirl

motherfuckers was digging a grave for DCU. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. It kind of... I did not expect lanterns to be the thing where people were just like, Okay, we're back in.

I would not be surprised if when we go to see Man of Tomorrow, John Stewart gets the biggest applause. Oh, he's going to get a pop for sure. I got to go 11, too. I was between like, I was between 10 or 11,

but I think there is a level of game-changing this in the show. To your point of this is what, this was the culture feeling, you know? Like, people were really rocking with this show for the last eight weeks. And yeah, to your point, man, And John Stewart is like, you're going to see him a man at tomorrow where you get where I don't mean.

When we talk to Monday, you're like a bunch about like whether it's season two or not. But there's no way you don't bring this. You're bringing this character back, but you got to bring this character back in either in his own movie or his own another TV series. He don't only, him and Black Panther are the only two black superheroes standing. They got Blade out of here. They got Wonder Man out of here. You know what I mean? So like, yeah, I got to go to 11 for this one.

I'd say 11 as well. And it's also the, I also. of the, I also got like the alien earth feeling of this where not only were we talking about the show itself, but the bigger ideas that the show is clearly like chewing at and like

consuming us with the discussions around it, but like we got so much substantive talk around this show and what it meant to be fearful, love versus programming, all of this stuff. It did the canon of comic books like amazingly well.

And this show had it ending, unlike Alien Earth, one. Very true. Very true. Here we go. What you got? Let's rock, Chuck. Let's see. Before you say... For those new here... Before he says it, what do you think? I think he's going 10. A 9 or 10. I think it's a 9.

I think he's giving 8. I will have to award Lantern Season 1 a very, very strong. Seven. Nine. Okay. There we go. All right. Okay. Very strong 9. We take those. We take them. It's always minus two. Chuck tax is a very good story.

The Chuck tax is always our score minus two. Now, I'm going to say this. At least. What did Chuck give Shugan? 12. But y'all say that he's not a weed. Okay. I gave Android 12.

Like. We saw it. I'm not going to lie. If this show was, say, Japan, I would have given it. It's the same show, but in Japan. You know what one of my least favorite modes of conversation is? You got to see this. Nig, I went to Sweden now.

And when I went to Sweden, and that's great. The 7-Elevens in Sweden is what I'm talking about. It's cool. They have fresh baked cook. When I went there to 7-Eleven in Sweden, the lady behind the thing, she was like a kindly old bar keep.

She was there. It was like a completely- Give you a quest. But I did see your video, though, black people not doing the head nod. It wasn't fucking with it. What? No.

They weren't doing it. That's us. That is a uniquely American tradition. Now, y'all are saying this right now, but I have to tell you that a lot of people was mad about this. A lot of people were saying that I was being like a typical American expecting everybody to do.

We do. It's interesting. I'm going to say this and I'm going to let it go. Sometimes it's difficult for me because sometimes it feels like people want to have shit both ways. I'll tell you what I mean. What I mean is, yes, I realize that I'm a black American and not all customs and stuff like that, like escape America.

I get that. I understand that. But at the same time, if I were to say that I'm a black American and this is black American culture and blah, blah, blah, then you get pushed back where people go, hey, we're all black. Black is the same. It's a black diaspora. It's all of this.

It's all of that. I understand that. We all black. We together. All I'm saying is if I'm walking through the grove where it's a lot of, of white people and I see a black person. I look at them. I do like that.

They look at that's a lot of you, you're good? And niggas. Come here. Come here. That's, I was like, who? What's that? Rachel, come here. Rachel, come on.

Rachel, come on. No, come here. You got to do. Come on. You got to come in. Now, Rachel, come. Rachel, come. That was.

No, Rachel. That was. Lantern. This is. This is. Lantern. This is. Rachel.

Now, Rachel. Rachel comes in down. Because you were also a sweet. I've always wanted to be one of the midnight boys. Rachel's here, guys. Give it up for Rachel. Rachel, Lizzie. Yeah.

Thank you guys. You were also a sweeten. What did you think of the 7-Eleven and or black people not nodding to other black people? I didn't see black people like that to be even being. I mean, I nodded at advance. Yeah, we nodded at each other when we saw. I didn't see black people like that. You didn't see no black people once in the street?

Like just walking on the street? Yeah. I maybe saw two. But look. Two? But I'll say this, though. I'll say this though. It's not a.

See black people in Sweden, but there were mad black people that reached out to me. Like on Instagram, I was like, hey, if you're going to be in Sweden. Like, hey, my come straight to the black side of Sweden and stuff like that. So maybe they're not in Stockholm. Yeah. This would have been great for you in Sweden. Yeah, it would have worked. This is.

It would have worked. It would have worked. Like all of the, it would have worked. Did you like the 7-Eleven of Sweden? I looked at it. I didn't go inside. It was beautiful. They had a salad bar.

You too good for 7-Eleven? No, no, no. I just, I, I wasn't that curious enough. I asked the question. I knew it was, I knew that they were nicer there. I was impressed with the salad bar. Then I just kept it moving. No, we can't do the salad bar.

Did you do a salad bar? I did not, but I did, what, it's the story we have to go. This is probably post-crates. But what I did see, though, is I was walking down the street. I told this story before. And I saw everybody had a hot dog. Oh, man. And so I was like, I was like, yo, where the hot?

I mean, like, where a hot? You were gobbling the glissies? I was not. but everybody got their hot dogs from the 7-Eleven. Oh. Everybody, like, I'm coming down the thing. Everybody got a hot dog. And when I'm saying, people standing around

and they dressed up in like Hugo Boss. And they like, these are people they're having a hot dog. I'm like, oh, my God, is there like a street fair somewhere? They was going into the 7-Eleven to get a hot dog. The 7-Eleven. I mean, it's so clean, so clean. I also appreciate the white man got up, gave me a seat. Let me sit down with the boys.

I'll be on this podcast for three years and not that way. There you go. Selma Steve is back. Selma Steve is back. All right, Selma Steve is back. All right, that's post-created. So let's close out the show. So Steve, come see.

Okay, bye, guys. Bye, Ray. Good see you, Rachel. Yo, guys, the guest keep a flowing on the Midnight Boys. We were honored to interview Chris Mundy, executive producer, showrunner, writer of lanterns extraordinaire. Please stick around. We ask them all of the great questions.

All right. The season is over, but our conversations about lanterns. are not over yet. We are here with writer, showrunner, and executive producer, Chris Mundy, to continue the lanterns cowbell. Before we do anything, three, two, one, you gotta give us a pew, pew, Pugh, Chris.

That's what we do. Three, two, one. All right, we'll get right into it right now, man. I'm getting right into it. Okay, before we even talk about, like, the show itself, tell me about the how and the why. The Greenlandon is a character that we are so familiar with that is part of the fabric of the DC universe

and really the overall superhero universe. This was deconstructed. This was humanistic. This was story first. Like, why this approach to this character? And how did you get it done? Well, I don't know how we got it done. You guys can tell me.

But, I mean, the idea from the beginning was just like, okay, let's take this at face value. Let's take it that these people have these jobs and they live in the world and they're real people. And what would that look like and feel like? And so, you know, if you're the Green Lantern, how Jordan's the Green Lantern, he's doing that job a short amount of the day in a way.

Do you know what I mean? So we just talked about them as people and then we talked about what would happen. Like, what do you do as you start to like age out of job, you know? It's like, what does that feel like? Because it's also, it's your identity. And I think all of us can relate to that in certain ways. And you watch it, you definitely watch it in sports, you know, all the time, but we have it in our own job. So we just started there and said, like, let's talk about these people as these guys as people and see where we get. Yeah, it's interesting.

Like, uh, I got this from my dad, but like, my father used to say that athletes are born twice and they die twice. Like, you're born, your regular self, and then you get reborn as magic or MJ, and then you legitimately die in front of everyone. You go to something where they unveil a statue of you. Yeah. Or like you go to a professional funeral.

It's like, didn't you used to be? Didn't you used to be that thing or that person? And then like, and that he goes, that afterlife is like hard. That's why you see people struggling stuff like that. And it was interesting to see that happen on screen to a superhero because we never get that. side of their life.

Was there any pushback from attacking it like that because a lot of people aren't used to not looking up at superheroes and looking at them like that? Yeah, I think because we went in, there was buy-in from the beginning. It was like, this is the way we're going to try to do it. And so those things kind of happened before it. So then it just became about, okay, how well are you doing the thing you said you wanted to do? You know, I was saying when we were talking before this, it would be like, my thing on the show was always, okay, if this is a good idea about the way to do it, I think we can do it well. You know, but the question just is like, oh, was this a good idea?

You know? And then you go from there and you cross your fingers and you work as hard as you can. So with the finale, I feel like I was surprised because this entire time I was like, okay. John's going to get the rig. Everything's going to explode. He's going to be making all these constructs. And in a way, you guys sidestepped that a little bit. So in the beginning of the process, where you always like,

something radical happened where it's like, John is like, I'm the green lantern of Earth. Guy, you can be the one in space. Was that always something in the beginning where you're like, this is the story we are telling? It was pretty close. Pretty close. I mean, you know, you put up like tent poles in the storytelling,

and then things shift a little bit. But the big ones were always kind of like, they stuck, you know? And so we knew at the end, John is going to take the ring. Then the existence of guy that we were like, okay, what do we do? We were about, I don't know, a third of the way through breaking the whole thing when all of a sudden we were like, it's more of like a, he's almost like a ronin in a way. Do you know what I mean? And once we did that, we're like, okay, good, we're going.

We know we'll get there. and we trust that we can get there in a meaningful way. But like it helps to know where you're heading. It was interesting as well in this episode because we see the new lantern that Sinestro creates. We see the yellow cracks and fissures in it. And to me I'm like, oh, this opens up so much storytelling possibility. How much of that was a push and pull of like how much do we reveal? How much do we save?

Because as a comic fan, my mind was going. I'm crazy. Well, I'm a big believer that, like, in any season of TV, you need to end your story because it's like, you need, otherwise it's like you made a promise to the viewers and you didn't fulfill it. So, like, we needed to answer our mysteries, but at the same time, there needs to be things that you know you can build on or go back to it. And some of them could be like, oh, that lantern looks suss, you know?

Or it could just be emotionally, shit's going to go down between these people in the future. and you just, you know that there's possibility and it's always, it's always part of your world. Then you might get back to it in a season two. You might get back to it in a season three, but it's, but it's there. So you build that stuff to have places to go that are organic and are always inside your story,

but hopefully you end your story too. You know, the thing that people started, because it's like you're asking for people's time, you know? How does that work, though, with knowing that your character has to go on to exist in a larger, universe. I mean, when you're doing Ozark or you're doing a different

show, you're telling the life stories of these characters sometimes with this devastating brutality that they have to go through. So remember the scene where she, remember when she flips out in Ozart? I was like, shit.

You know what I mean? You're existing through that. You're fucking mad. I knew when they killed that boy, I'm not going to get that okay. But with this though, you're taking care of your story, but also, we know that John's in Manna Tomorrow. Yeah, did you know John was going to be in Manna Tomorrow when you're breaking this season of TV? At a certain point, we did.

Not initially, like when we were writing the pilot and started in the room, but we knew that part of our job was to launch John as a character. Right. And we know that world exists. So, I mean, like, you know, we're not dumb. We can do that. So how do you split the baby on that? in terms of ending your story,

but preparing him to be useful to somebody else's? You know, I really, we just tried to end our story and then say, here he is. Go with God. Go with God. And if there's any problem with it, let us know if we need to tweak anything, but we didn't need to tweak anything.

You know, but it was really just like, okay, trust that we created hopefully a character that's a 360-degree character, And then, you know, it's storytelling. It's like, okay, your turn. Like, I want to watch that. You got to launch John, right? Like, the whole point of the show is to launch John into this larger universe.

But part of that, you give him his own oath. Right? Like, in the comics, like, multiple characters have, like, different oath. So that's not new. But, like, what was the thought process in, like, this is going to be John's oath? Like, why was it written away that it was written? It's funny. Like, Justin always said in one of our writers that it's like, okay, we're not rewriting,

we're just remixing it. But it's like, John's whole path to it wasn't the same as anybody else's path. The ring didn't choose him. You know, he got interviewed for it, but then he needed to choose that he wanted the job. He turned down the job and then came back and needed a want it on his own terms, not his parents. You know, not just because of the guardians. And we'd sort of, we talked so much about fear, obviously, because it's a big part of the mythology and the canon. and we really landed on,

there's a line in the finale. It's like fear is actually just emotional intelligence. You know, show me a species without fear. I'll show you something on the extinction list. It's like, it's true. So it's like you can use it. You want to be fearless, but like you want to be intelligent too. Fear is pro-evolutionary.

Exactly. Yeah. So we're like all those things. We can't put him through this thing and have him learn all this stuff. and then just say an oath to people that he's not entirely pledging allegiance to at the moment in terms of the guardians. So we just want him to be his own man,

but at the same time, it definitely nods toward the original oath. We don't want to disrespect it, but we just wanted John to be his own man. I'm curious how you, because it's reflected very well in Hal's final line to him, don't be afraid to be afraid. The growth and like,

slight regression of Hal as he's giving this mantle to John. What was like kind of the best balancing point that you needed to find after Hal passes and yet giving John the how he needs post-mortem? Yeah, it was really, it was really tricky. It's like, you know, you can write to it, which obviously tried to do, but it's really part of it is just like what Kyle's doing because there's not like, it's, there's a warmth an openness to the halogram that there wasn't to Hal later.

So we just tried to find those moments where all of a sudden John glimpsed Hal as an open and being like, oh, God, well, he ended up this other thing kind of beaten down a little bit by things because it's a hard job and it's lonely. And I don't want to glimpse my future and be a little beaten down.

And does that answer the question? It does. Because I'm just curious about like the idea, like, were you ever afraid to know that he's getting this catharsis effectively from a ghost or somebody that isn't real, that isn't really how. Yeah, no, we did. We wrote right to it in seven.

That numbers changed at one point. But on the boat, and he was like, you know, John's like, I want his apology. He's like, I said, I'm sorry. He's like, I want his apology. And some of the heartbreaking thing in this is that he doesn't quite get. He comes to understand how. so in that way there's some closure

but I think there's a sadness in the fact that he didn't those two actual characters didn't get that moment in your head canon for the Green Lanters I'm so interested now because Howe's ring seems a little bit different from Guy's ring it seems a little bit older

he has all these tricks you don't do all of the comic book stuff where it's like oh the suits are actual weather and stuff like that So when you are making this world, how are you guys trying to figure out what to take from the comics, what to keep, how to keep it grounded, but also expansive? Yeah. Oh, God. It seems like some shit.

No, I mean, really, I mean, we wanted everything to feel like a tool. Okay. The ring is a tool. The lantern is a tool. The suit is a tool in a way. even things like the gun that shot that Anton uses that shoots the memories into John's head, we wanted to feel like an actual thing that would be in someone's like, you know, tool shed. So that like you always felt that like the job and the mission of it in that way.

We always felt tethered to things. So we really just leaned in that direction all the time. Do you know what I mean? We wanted it to be like, this is a job, and it's like, it's a cool job and you're a superhero, but like it takes a toll and the suit gets scuffed up, you know, and the lantern gets scuffed up, and the ring gets scuffed up, you know, because we wanted to believe it as much as we could. Why didn't John get a suit, though? Did you guys ever have conversations where you've got to see him in the Green Lantern suit?

We did, at the beginning, I mean, yeah, there are drawings out there in the world, that's for sure. Oh. Yeah, we talked about it a lot at the beginning, but just by the evolution of the story that wasn't, when we could have had him get a suit at the very end, but it felt more like him flying on his own, as his own man, mirrored Hal in a way. That doesn't mean he won't have a suit. But like, in where our story ended, that just felt like the most potent. Yeah. I'm so glad that Vanessa in them in the room too because the bad version of that is that like

he gets his suit and his suit be like Fubu. Oh, right. You know what I'm saying? But look, I've asked you something just about Hal. I actually have a couple of Hal questions before we move on to John. Number one, have you guys decided what manner you will resurrect Hal Jordan because you will. And then number two, Hal Jordan is an interesting character because he is a classic comic book character that still has enough anonymity that you can do different stuff with him. Like if you guys were trying to do this

with Bruce Wayne or with Clark Kent or with someone like that, they'd have been pitchforks out for you guys. Totally. There was some of that with Hal, with people going, that's not my Hal Jordan, that's not my Hal Jordan, that's not my Hal Jordan. But how did you guys decide

just how much you could take this character and challenge the audience with it? We wanted to, we just tried to find things that were interesting to us and the things that were real things you could talk about, about real people that aren't perfect. There's nobody that's perfect in this show, do you know, every, you know, it's Hal and Carrie and John and John's family. I mean, everybody, you know what I mean? It's just like kind of like constantly, they're just people, you know what I mean? So they're all flawed. So we just wrote what was interesting to us.

and waited if there was pushback from the people that we were making it for, they could tell us, and we'd respond. But, like, I mean, Damon and I used to talk a bunch of just, like, we're the, like, in the tradition, someone does their comic, and then they put it out in the world, then the next run, somebody else does it. Yeah, and it changes. And, like, so, like, we're super aware that, like,

we're the keepers of this story for a minute. Mm-hmm. And then if some of this sticks, people will take some of it and run with it and change it and I'll be psyched to see it, you know? I think that's what's kind of cool about the forum. It's like it's shared storytelling, you know what I mean? But you all killed Kyle Chandler. Like you, you aren't getting the daily. You're like, fuck, we kill child.

Like, they're going to be so. Is this the last that we've seen of Hal Jordan? What? Is this the last? You heard me. Is this the Specter? Is the Specter? I'm sorry.

Is this the last we've seen about? I have absolutely no idea. You don't know. Okay. Hey, you're thinking of season two, so you actually... I mean,

there's a million what ifs. That's a good thing about fiction, right? You didn't not allude to some of those things in this finale itself. Like, we have Sinestro talking about bringing him back to life for real. And the idea that, again, we know that he's in Man of Tomorrow.

Is there any sort of, like, idea in your minds of, like, are we going to table set for a possible season two? Are we going to have something that, like, is going to, like, at least allude to some other ideas? Because you see that a lot in other shows that are almost too reliance on waiting for a second season to kind of give us, like, some big, oh, shit moments. We didn't write toward platforming for a season two. We always wrote, assuming there would be a season two. Do you know what I mean? We didn't think of it as a limited series.

We thought of it, this is a show that's going to keep going on. But it wasn't like, like, we were just trying to. we're trying by the skin of our teeth to finish this season, you know? It wasn't like, oh, we've got a great idea for two and three, so let's layer in. Some of it is just you take a look at what you made

and what's interesting to you and what's useful and then you go from there. And hopefully you created characters that you could do different things with and put them in different situations. Let's talk about Noah for a second. You know, we were early adopters in that Noah was a man hunter.

Like the man, I wasn't. It took me a second. But the Manhunter ratings... He even had to carry thing. Peeped it from the first scene. The moment that he walks over to him and teaches him how to throw him the ball, I was like, watch that kid's the Manhunter. I have to convert them.

Yeah. You don't have to convert me. I took them on a board. They were on it. It took me a second. And they have the conversation at the end with John that's like really poignant. And he's like, you got to kill me. I thought it was incredible.

But what I really want to ask is, why did you give him an old line like that, bro? Oh, my God. Like You know You switched it though Because in the actual game 64 was something Y'all had some Biss up in

So all I could say about that It's, I mean it's lucky he's a manhunter Because with that O line He's not getting out of protection Like That's I wasn't on set that take I will just say

I will just say It's unfair to our incredibly talented lovely Russian director who I don't think ever watched a minute of American football. When they put the extras out there, like one was like, one kid was like

5-9, 1-30. And he was like, number 29 and number 40. I was just like, oh, shit. And you can't really cut around it. Like this. I'm just like, he's scrambling for his life. Like, go. Reshoots just for this?

Yeah. Yeah. I don't feel like we, I feel pretty good and we didn't mess too many things up. But like, it's so funny. You said that because we've been talking about that internally forever, like in the editing room,

I'm just like, oh, God. I'm telling you work, though, because in the last episode, man, he's running for his life. He is running for his life. That's all he's going to have to play again. Yeah, exactly. No, but, like, as him as a man, and, like, you guys are, like, seating that plot line,

and you get to that conversation with John in the car, and I can't remember the actor's name for the life of me right now, but he, like, really sells it about how... Shee, who plays Noah? Yeah, yeah. How he's, like, I want to be a normal kid. I want to play football. I want to do this, but I have...

this like deep inside of me that wants to take over the world like when you are creating that character again we don't we're not supposed to know this until episode eight how do you like thread that needle so when we get to that moment in the car we're like oh snap like this is a kid who just wants to do good but has this these internal demons inside yeah we i mean we tried to like have like tiny little hints at it you know what i mean it's like the the day when all the shit goes down in rushville and zohy comes over to him and just like remember everything i told you like those kind of things. But then we also, you know, and him, like, I'm interested in politics when, you know,

that first night the John comes over to dinner. So we wanted those little things, but you don't, if you layer in too much, then everybody, I mean, and Vancea not coming from the beginning, but like, but like, then everyone sees it coming. And they're like, why are we looking at this kid? I'm like, oh, we're looking at this kid because he's the murderer in the end, you know? So it was a little tricky. And for me, we talked so much about parenthood and nature versus nature, nature versus nurture and programming for the Manhunters, but also John's upbringing and like what's me and what's just what my parents want for me and what's the difference and all those kind of things.

And so for us, some of what layers into that conversation that he did such a good job on in the car is knowing Carrie and knowing, like, is knowing like she raised him. And he's part human and he's part that. It's like, oh, she says the line in the final scene with Hal. It's like, I just thought if I loved him enough and like, is that enough? And it's the gamble that John takes at the end, you know? So I was kind of hoping you'd see a little bit of it from Noah, but then you'd feel the other from Carrie. And even her fear for Noah mirroring Bernadette's fear for John.

and John's realization of like, oh, my mom was like scared every day of my life. You know what I mean? Like she was teaching me to be fearless, and like she was terrified about what she was doing. So we wanted it to kind of live inside those two moms in a strange way. That's an amazing balance.

I'm very curious because like to orchestrate that level of narrative precision between characters, it's a lot of time to make sure that you're spending it adequately. There's not a wasted scene. Was there anything in the development of this that you're like, I unfortunate, we don't have time to lay this groundwork for something else. Like, maybe not so much a storyline, but like, were there any beats that you missed that you wish that you could have had?

No, there's actually a scene. No, not for the most part. Do you know what I mean? Like, there are a couple scenes that we shot that aren't in that were, there's a scene with another scene with Noah and John that preceded that dinner scene where he talks a little bit more about that. and he talks about maybe going to the Naval Academy and all these kind of things.

That we were afraid might have just tipped it. You know, and there is a scene actually in the finale where Carrie's there with a, to pick up Hal. Right. There's a scene where Bernadette's there too

in the script. Oh. And there's a whole scene between them and then Bernadette's, because Bernadette didn't know the carrier's going to be there and sort of said so she leaves and then there's Carrie. And that we thought was going to help explain the Bernadette Howell thing because it's a weird thing, like, that they're friends, you know. And it's all off.

You've just got to take our word for it because I'll have enough screen. So we had that, but it just felt cleaner on the emotional line with just Carrie and how. In true detective fashion, you know that detectives change. I got to ask, kill a log, Kyle Rainer, Simon Baz. you know, Hal is dead right now if you had to choose who are some of the lanterns on the board that you're like, I would like to play with these people. Vanessa's been talking a big kill-a-log game for a long time.

A long time. You know, it's funny. It's like we've tossed out a lot of different things. I mean, again, we want to treat it all, you know, we won't be back in Rushville, most like, unless something crazy happens in Rushville, you know, every 10 years. But like, but you're going to be, it's going to be an earth-based story that we continue most likely.

I mean, we've shown that you can leave the planet, so that's good. Right. But because of that, we want to make whoever's here as sort of grounded and real as possible. Our idea was just to like ground everything and then layer on the other layers.

It's like, okay, are you with us? Great, we're going to layer a little bit more in. You know what I mean? It's like, even in the pilot, in the constructs, it's like the first thing Hal uses, it makes us a $20 bill. and then he makes, you know, a bottle opener. And by the end, he's like stopping that explosion.

But it's just like, it's like, okay, are you with us? Great. Now we can expand. And it's the same thing with introducing like all the other, all the other lanterns and stuff. Is it still John's story? Is John the character that you're like, this is still what kind of grounds us in the world is around him?

Yeah, I mean, I think all of them. But yes. I mean, I think so. You know, it's like, I mean, we set out to make a story about John Stewart, and we set out to make him a fully dimensional character. You know, there's a reason why the origin episode is John. Yeah.

You know, I mean, you get a glimpse into Hal at the top of seven, but like, and he talks about it. So hopefully we added a lot of depth to Hal too. But like, we worked really hard to try to make John a real, fully fleshed out human. So for John, in a way, to create him, the entire archetype of a superhero was subverted, right? Before he becomes a superhero,

you could argue that he is at least partly responsible for the deaths of dozens of people. Before he even ever makes a save, right? It's almost like you guys subverted it. You really leaned into this guy starting off as a guy, as somebody who has his own vision and version of what his destiny should be, and then he will become this thing. Is John Stewart of this world even a superhero?

Is this even a superhero show? Because what we've seen recently in this mythology is people grappling with things as human beings and stuff like that. And so I'm wondering, do you see John Stewart? Yeah, it's a really good question. a superhero. I mean, yes, but like, but I also, and this is not me like evading the question, but like I see superheroes as people too. Okay. Do you know what I mean? And so like, so I think absolutely yes. I don't think you can be someone that has that power and puts that

power and can use it, you know, but like, okay, well, how do you use that power? You know, and those are very human decisions. You don't like get blessed with. clarity the day the day you get the ring. Right. You know? So I think it's really interesting. It's like how do these real people deal with these real powers? But I think

absolutely he's a superhero. To that point, I don't know if you know this, but he's black. So he is a black superhero. And there is a lot of tension within even our community,

the community of nerds, about the idea of black superhero and black heroism, right? The reason why Superman and Batman almost look like they could be brothers is because when America conjures a version of a hero, that's what they see. Right, right. This guy got a fate. A crispy one at that. You know what I mean?

So we've obviously had brilliant people from your writer's room on this show, Vanessa and Justin. What did you guys think of the challenge of, introducing a black superhero to the world? I mean, it's sort of daunting because it is like it does feel like a responsibility and it's a real responsibility for whoever's going to play it. You know, it's got to own it. So, I mean, we talked a lot about, it's weird,

he's a hero, he's a superhero, right? But we also wanted him to be, we didn't want him to be perfect. Like we didn't, he wanted him to be able to, like, make mistakes. I mean, it's like, even, like, sleeping with Zoe and the pilot. That's not a mistake, brother. That's what I said. You got to get busy. Sometimes you got to get busy, Chris.

I don't know if you get busy. It was a long day. Yeah. Did you guys see that John, he likes some milk. He likes them older. This seems like a great place to put this character. Yeah, well, we were just like, okay, we want him to make a very human, like, maybe mistake, maybe not mistake.

It's like something complicated. Something complicated right away. And then we could use it and call it back and it could be funny and all those things. But like from the beginning, there was a lot of talk about like, it's like we don't want to. And I would talk to Aaron about it. It's like, look, you're a Marine, but Marine is a job, not a personality. You're also an artist. You know, you're also an architect.

And all those things are in there. So, like, you know, and so we wanted him to be, we wanted to get into making an imperfect person, but you also, it was a real trick in the pilot especially because it's, you've got Kyle who's, you know, a guy in his late 50s and a white guy, this guy, and John, who's like 30. And John's very, yes, sir, no, sir. And there's a real danger in that, like, right off the bat. Right, because of the power dynamic. By the power dynamic. And it's in the Marines, but you also wanted to be able to be like, like, it's why I had him say, like, how come every time you say, yes, sir, it's down and more and more like, fuck you?

Like, it's, you have to find that balance in there and you always felt like you could sort of like trip over it. Well, the microaggressions that some people are perceived coming from Hal to John, real. Do you see Hal Jordan? Because this is a big deal about any time you, there's a racial dynamic in the show, people are going to ask is race a factor here? Race is always a factor. Right. So do you, from Hal Jordan to John Stewart, do you think part of the reason why he was a little

bro in him is because there's something inside of him is this character a racist? I think so. I think probably. I don't think he's a racist. Okay. But I think he's not fully educated in terms of how Jordan probably wouldn't know what a microaggression was. Right.

Do you know what I mean? And I think would have go to dinner with all his black friends and have a really good night and not think anything of it. But also like doesn't understand, you know, if you've had privilege, you just accept it. You know what I mean? You don't think it's weird. It's default. Yeah. And so, you know, Hal needs to be talked.

a little bit just about, you know, it's not his fault, but like, but also learn. Yeah. You know what I mean? Let's like listen and learn. Like, you know, and like even in the writer's room as we talk about this stuff, I mean, I have ideas about stuff and Damon has ideas about stuff and Bree has ideas about stuff. Vanessa and Justin are both black people in the world.

If they say something, it's like, oh, no, that's what you think. But I think this. It's like, oh, great. I just learned. Like, just listen. You know what I mean? It's like, it's like it's sometimes, I mean, it's not that simple because of course. You know, but like, but some of it is just like, we all listen to each other and the character like how like I think hopefully would evolve and listen a little bit more.

Because I think he's got a good heart. Yeah. My last question for you is like you guys started this process, I believe, two and a half three years ago. And superhero culture, superhero movies, things have changed. obviously this is a big hit. What have you kind of learned about what it takes to make a show that maybe avoids a lot of those pitfalls that other superhero shows or other superhero media might fall into?

I don't know if I would. I don't know if we learned anything. That's a terrible thing to say. No, but like I think for what I learned is what we thought going in, which is like we're not making a superhero show as much as we're making a show in which their superheroes walking around inside it.

And so just think about it, like eight episodes that tell a story about these people, and inside it, all those other things exist. But, like, we're just trying to tell a story about people. I mean, I know that sounds silly and stupid,

but, like, that's what we tried to do. And then we're smart enough to know that we're inside this canon that has all these things, and, like, you can do all sorts of cool, weird things with it, and we're not so dumb that we wouldn't use them. But people like Tom King and stuff were in the room.

So like are you guys having that dynamic where it's like, okay, what are the things in this world that we can use? Is this too much? Because you have the Green Lantern movie where it's like, that's a whole different thing. I was just never going to happen. You know what I mean? Like, I mean, I don't mean just in the movie, but just like there is never, it's never like, oh, let's get all the stuff. It was like, what's our story? Yeah.

You know, I mean, it's like, I mean, we would talk about like, if I talk about really, ring charge another five minutes in my life. I'm gonna like open fire as 7-11. That ring was never charged. Well, just how it looked like the kind of person is like gonna be upkeep on the ring charge? I'll tell you what, though I will say about that ring

is it holds on to that 1% better than my phone down. Yeah, yeah. Because I'm like, it's like we got seven minutes left, 20 minutes later, use the ring one more time. But no, but I actually appreciate the fact that the story was grounded. I think the last thing for me is

the last thing that how John says to Hal is, or at least, you know, version of how is I love you. Yeah. And then Howe says, I love you too. Like, and I had to watch it, I had to watch that scene like three or four times to get it. I'm like, he's tricking him into saying that, right? And even in death, his craftiness is still there. When you guys, like, when you're like, this is the last time, we'll see how.

But I mean, like, I mean, we talk about, like, they killed it. They kill him. He's dead. He's, uh, his hologram, like, you know, vans. It's not there. When you're like, after everything you've dragged these characters through, I would, I couldn't have imagined them at the end being like, I love you. I love you too. Right.

When you bring it to that like apex in your head, do you like, are you like hopefully the audience understands what that means? Or are you just like they going to say it let's let it fly? No, we want to like we wanted to have earned that. And even like in a little way like it the whole time the Hallogram never called him junior. He always called him trainee. and that last line is I love you too, Jr. And so it's like

the closest thing he's going to get to real Hal in that thing. And to us it's like crazy comp, but we talked about the movie Ghost a bunch. Really? Yeah. And because in Ghosts there's like literally like it's a love story

between Demi Moore and Patrick Swayzee and like, but by the end like he's gone. Yeah, he's still. You know, we didn't have them make a pot together. You know? Right. It's like, I think, in the second act, maybe at the end of the first. You know, ghosts, you know, how Jordan is the specter in the comic books.

Oh, here we go again. A visiting spirit. So I've heard. So I've heard. We just love Kyle Chandler, man. Like, that's what it is. You can't leave that one. I mean, how can you not?

How can you not? I mean, we also got, especially, like, with Hal being a little grumpy, like, if Kyle wasn't so. likable at his core like you couldn't get away with it exactly I mean he's he's so good and he's also like I think just because he's Kyle Chandler

and he's like oh yeah he's just like you just forget how good he is yeah and how much skill he has you know but but some of that too is just like oh like because it's like he can be a bit of an asshole John because like in the end like you know he's kind of playing he's kind of hazing him but it's

also like Kyle just like does it perfect Chris, we're going to get you out of here, man. We really appreciate your time. And also a thank you to you for creating a world where a white woman can kill her partner with absolutely no consequences. Man!

Shot him right in his head. She's got brunch at the cafe on Sunday. The police. The cops, boy, I tell you what, man. You get some good, you get some bad. Thank you. We appreciate your time. We really appreciate the show.

I'm so glad you guys appreciate it. You guys have been so thoughtful about it. Like, it's incredible. Like, for real, it's like, it's cool. You guys, like, really get inside it. And, like, it's awesome. Well, thank you, Chris. Thank you so much.

Thank you so much. Thank you, brother. All right, Monday was fantastic. By the way, shout out to the cast and crew, not the cast. We haven't had none of them niggas on, so I'm just, no, just joking. Shout to the crew of lanterns and everyone

who's been really, really involved in this conversation. We have really enjoyed covering this show. Yeah. And not because of any, relationships that we have with anyone just because this was good television. It was really good. I actually like, we didn't know that lanterns was going to become what it became. I don't want people to think like, oh shit, we were so.

I was like the show and people were reaching out. Best seasons of Super Real Television ever? New listeners, though. One of the best season. Oh, new listeners. Guys, if you found us for lanterns, we should give them a little bit of a taste of what we doing for the rest of the year. We got Dune's Day coming up.

Dune's Day. Vision Quest. Yeah. Playface. Street Fighter, maybe. Street Fighter maybe. Why not? Street Fighter on the bubble.

We actually got a lot of content. A lot of content coming and you guys are more, more than welcome to revisit any old episodes. If you're new to the Midnight Boys and you want like an idea of how this all got started, which episodes did they listen to? The Black Superheroes. The Black Superheroes draft. The Black Superheroes draft, number one, go back. That was our origin story.

Those are surfed Dracula. They are out there. Is that on YouTube? Yeah, I think that was our first. That was our first video. What a debut. First video pod.

We appreciate all the support. And this show was hugely successful for HBO and also for us on videos. Oh, yeah. Okay. All right, program reminders on Monday, the House of Our continues their lanterns coverage, which is going up.

He's going up over there. Easter eggs, Brett Kerms, theories, all that stuff. You're not going to want to miss the finale as covered by Mal and Joe. Wednesday, Rear's recommends his back. Big Cah Limber.

Big Cah limber. Big Cah, Lembert, putting it down. Big Cah. We got to check in. On Friday, Buttmash covers Valor Mortis and Forever Ago. Yeah, that's that weird one. Yep. Valor Mordis and Forever Ago.

I cannot wait to play forever. You're not playing that. You're not going to play that. Galactic racer, though. Galactic racer, I will play. You are going to love that. Yes, very true. Our producers today are Devin Brolde, Jamie Eukits, and John

Jones, Jomey a dinner on, on social. That's the old one. I was going to go production from Arjuna Ram Gopal. Hashtag. It was going to be Bob and Weave, Jomey. Ooh, Bob and Weave Jomey. Oh, Bob and Weave. Hoseachey, Bob and Weave. There you go.

Little Bob. Chuck take us out. We're not going to do the Oaf? Oh, God. I think I'm not doing it. We didn't talk about that. Fuck that new oath. Don't want you. You're not a special, nigga. Just say the regular oath, dog. Well, he can't say the regular oath

because he's not a Green Lancer. You didn't like his new oath? We didn't talk about it. We should have talked, but it's actually a hold in the show. You didn't like the, you didn't like his new oath? Nah, nix trying to remix shit. Like, just don't be special. That's what we do.

We make it our own. He is special. He's not, he's, he said that old, the contract. He's wrapped fucking outcast. Right, so you didn't like the oath. Can anybody remember the oath off the top of the head? I can not up top of my head. I wrote it down, but I don't have it off top of my head.

Okay, what was it? In Black as Day and Nick a Night. No white man will ever steal my light. Hey, you do it. Wait a minute now. Wait a minute. Finish it. Bring it home.

Bring it home. Black as day and nigger night. No white man will ever steal my light. Let all these crackers that think they write. Whoa. Wait. Wait, wait, wait. Wait, wait, wait.

Wait, wait, wait. Wait, wait. He's got a one more verse. One more verse. Let all these crackers that think they write, beware of black power. Mother fucking right.