The Ringer-Verse - ‘Ms. Marvel’ Episode 4 Reactions | The Midnight Boys

Episode Date: June 29, 2022

Charles, Jomi, and Steve hop on the next flight and land on their latest reactions to 'Ms. Marvel' (02:30). They talk about Kamala's big trip to Pakistan and what adventures await her. They also discuss some secret societies throughout fiction as well as the exciting action that this episode provides! Hosts: Charles Holmes, Jomi Adeniran, and Steve Ahlman Social: Jomi Adeniran Senior Producer: Steve Ahlman Addition Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopal Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's up, guys, Rachel Lindsay here, and I am teaming up with your favorite Ringer podcasters to deliver the Bravo drama and news that you've been craving on morally corrupt. It's the show about all things Bravo. From the Housewives to Summer House and everything in between, we'll be mentioning it all every week. Check it out on Spotify and the ringer.com. For adults with Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis symptoms, every choice matters. Trimphia offers self-injection or intravenous infusion from the start. Tramphaya is administered as injections under the skin or infusions through a vein every four weeks,

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This episode is brought to by Paramount Plus. Beth and Ripper back at a new series, Dutton Ranch. Kelly Riley and Colehouser returned, and this time they're taking on Texas. As Beth and Rip build a future together, peace will have to wait as they face corruption, danger, and a ruthless rival ranch, willing to protect its secrets at all costs. Legacy is a beautiful thing, but only if it survives. Dutton Ranch starring Colehous, Kelly Riley, Annette Benning and Ed Harris, now streaming on Paramount Plus. into the ringer verse the ringers nextest podcast feed for all things fandom we are steve the cuddly july fourth bear we are jo mean the explainer a dinner on and i am the man formerly known as coke baby chuck and together we are the midnight boys and you guys are probably wondering where the hell is van well van is on a world tour okay He's out there. He's in these New York streets promoting the book. Make sure to check him on the Daily Show. My man's in Hollywood now. He's yet to tap out for a little bit. But that's why we have mid edition here to help us give you an instant reaction to the latest episode of Miss Marvel.

Programming reminders before we begin tomorrow. The House of R will be giving you their deep dive into Miss Marvel. Then on Friday, the House of R returns to the upside down to give you their thoughts on episode 8. of Stranger Things season four. And then coming up next week, The Midnight Boys are back to give you our reactions to the latest episode of The Boys and Miss Marvel.

Make sure you stay tuned for that. But now, we're about to get into some instant reactions, okay? And I'm not like Van. I'm not like Van, guys. I don't care. If you guys got Matt at us for the spoiler warnings,

I don't give a shit. I'm not going to make you feel bad about it. It's fucking fine. Steve. Oh, Charles, you're not going to make somebody feel bad about it. something. Stop the cap. Stop the cap.

I'm not allowing that. Guys, guys, Autumn of optimism, okay? Relax. Autumn of optimism. It is definitely June, my brother. It is June 29th. You're really prepping for the autumn of optimism. I'm the King of Fall. Roll those spoiler warnings first, Steve.

All right. We're getting ready to talk about Miss Marvel. You're listening to a reaction podcast. The spoilers are coming. All right, before we get into the latest episode of Miss Marvel, we've got to do a midnight manifest.

Yo, Steve, can you play some more music for me? All right, episode four of Miss Marvel, seeing Red, directed by Charmine Obad, Chino, teleplayed by Sabir Pizada, AC Bradley, and Matthew Chauncey with a story by Sabir Fazzata. We begin, Kamala and Maniva travel to Karachi to visit the matriarch of the family Sana. Sanaa confirms Kamala that she is a gin and retells the story of how she was saved by a trail of stars during the partition. Carmala, in search of more answers from the vision she shared with her grandmother, goes to the train station. It's there that she gets into a fight with Kareem who believes she's part of the clandestine. After the mix-up is sorted out, Kareem takes Kamala to meet Walid, the leader of the Red Daggers, an organization that's meant to protect our people from threats of the unseen.

Walid explains that the clandestine come from a separate dimension and are trying to break the veil of the Nor, which will help them take over the planet. Walid also shares that Kamala's human and Jin biology is most likely what allows her to build Nore in the human realm. The clandestine break out of damage control's custody to hunt down Kamala, but leave Kamran behind for betraying them. The clandestine find Kamala in the red daggers. A chase begins, and Nama kills Walid in the conflict.

The Nama attacks Kamala's Bengal, which transports Kamala back to the vision of her She's been seeing for the bulk of this season. And that's your Midnight Manifest. And now we're going to get into some instant reactions. My brother, Jomey. What'd you think of seeing Red? You know, I say this a lot, but I had a lot of fun watching this episode. It touches on some heavy themes.

And, like, as an hamburger myself, a lot of, like, you know, some stuff I can relate to. So I was, like, doing the Leo pointing me. And some of it was like, ah! But just another thing. another really fun, really well-done episode of Miss Marvel. I'm really having fun watching this series, guys, to be honest with you.

I'm having a ton of fun. All right, all right. We have one in the pro column, Steve. Don't disappoint me. Well, I can do nothing but disappoint you, Charles. I feel like the best ways that Ms. Marvel has found its footing are in those

first two episodes of, like, having unabashed fun and making this a sort of like teen high school family drama with a superhero setting in it. And I think this is probably the biggest departure from that theme. I think it's still for the good because we got a lot of like globe trotting family backstory and insight here along with some really intriguing action. I wouldn't say this was my favorite episode, but I'm still very intrigued as to where this is going to go. So I am going to go out on a limb and say that this to me was the weakest episode of all four.

Right. When I was talking about Moon Night, I always was bringing up the fact that sometimes when a show has so many tones going on and has so many genres going on, it's a little bit hard to wrap your arms around it. And I think, to your point, Steve, what I fell in love with early on with Miss Marvel was the fact that it's so much a coming-of-age story.

It's so much reminds me of the Tom Holland Spider-Man films of what it means to be young. and in high school and finding your way, especially when you're a superhero. And I think to me, episode four almost felt like a pilot episode again because you have to think, we've only gotten three episodes of Kamala

and her friends and her family and getting to know them. And with seeing Red, it's immediately like, okay, stop all of that progression in the story. We're going to Pakistan. We're meeting a whole new group of characters. This is a whole new setting. And I think that to me,

while I get why they did it. This almost felt almost like something you do in season two, not something that you do in the middle of your first season. We're still trying to understand Jersey City, when we're still trying to understand how Kamala fits into, not only the MCU, but specifically her world and what that means. So that's not me saying that they shouldn't have gone to Pakistan. That's more of me saying, like,

do you guys think it was maybe a misstep to do it so soon? because there's so many characters we just do not see in this. I would kind of agree because it feels a little bit like that like that modern day Star Wars rule where it's like, okay, it's been like 10 minutes we got to change planets and like

get a new setting going and like a new set of stakes. While I don't think the show is like inherently suffering because of that, you do kind of feel like there's like this like perpetual motion that like is pushing something forward outside of like, well, we can kind of stay in terms.

Jersey City, the whole show, and still have a good time, but like, we got to, like, make it a bit bigger. We got to make this a bit more fleshed out and more movieified, ossified, to quote the great Ben Lindberg. It's interesting, but I don't know if we necessarily needed it. I think it's, I think it's 100% necessary in terms of what the story is trying to do. It's all about, you know, Kamala connecting to her roots, you know, on the service level, you know, because to figure out her power, but also to figure out, you know, where she's from, who she is, right? And so the show is basically saying, like, hey, we're going to take you through, you know, her whole history from Isha to her grandmother, her mother and her, like, all the way down, you know, and how the Bengal informs all of that, all of their relationships, all of their, you know, lives up to this point. And so her going to Pakistan, you know, like watching the episode, especially the ending, I'm like, okay, so this is where this is going.

Like, we're taking all these years of history, all this, you know, generational, you know, Disney's in a big generational trauma moment right now. Like, we're just going from, you know, mother to daughter on this whole thing from turning red, unconto. Like, they're in a real kick right now. But that's, I figured, like, that's where we're. going. So I was like, bet. Like, I'm, I'm here. I'm with it. I'm going to pitch you guys on an idea that I had and you guys can call bullshit. All right, this might be a little controversial. The thing that I've noticed about the MCU, especially when they're trying to introduce heroes of color, is that they do this thing that I see with a lot of new writers. Like, if I read a new writer for

the first time and they're like reviewing, I don't know, like a Drake album, they'll immediately go, all right, let me take you back to the beginning of hip hop. In the beginning, hip hop started with the DJ. And you're just like, how is this a Drake review? And they just like, they start from the beginning of recorded music. And then like the last couple paragraphs are about Drake. And I was just like, whoa, like, start with the meat of the subject. And I've noticed with like all of the, all of the heroes of color in Marvel,

because they are the first, because there's not that many of them. So many of the stories are like Black Panther. we're going to start with Africa and Black Panther is of a lineage and this is what happened in Wakanda and now we're in the present and I'm just like all right cool cool cool and then Shang Chi

a thousand years ago in China and then we get Shangchi and this is similar with Ms. Marvel where it's like partition and I'm like all of those things are important I'm not saying that those stories don't need that I get why they're important but sometimes I'm like

Spider-Man isn't like the beginning of a Spider-Man movie he isn't starting at Ellis Island with like Peter's parents like come it's just like that's literally sometimes what I feel like these things are not in a bad way but in terms of like sometimes I want

to know about who that character is first like I want to fall in love with them and like in the present with their stories before we start being like okay here are is all the generational trauma and all of the history of their people of their race of the religion

and all those things which are important But sometimes I'm like, damn, sometimes I just want a superhero to be a superhero. And especially in a coming of age story, I want it to be a coming of age story before it becomes a historical epic. And I think if Miss Marvel was a movie, that would work a little bit better because it's just Shang Chi, Black Panther, things like that, bigger budget. So you can get that historical context in fast. It looks expensive.

It looks dope. In a TV series, sometimes I'm like, this seems... weirdly small for what it is. Like partition is a big subject, and this seems very, like, smaller than it needs to be. And maybe more complicated than a TV show that's on Disney Plus can really unravel.

Am I being a hater? I don't think you're being a hater, but, man, it's tough because all those things, like The Black Panther and Sean Chi, like, all those things inform who the characters are, who like, you know, their backgrounds, you know, what, what fuels them? You know what I mean? Like, for Spider-Man, like, nobody cares, you know, where Spider-Man's parents came from.

Nobody cares, you know, where all these, you know, white characters, their backgrounds from. Like, even if, like, unless it, like, impacts a story, like, we're not really worried about, like, what Peter Parker's grandparents are doing. But wait, but, why is that? Let me interrogate that. Why is that? Because, like, again, it's, they.

It doesn't have to inform the story the same way that, like, for example, Kamala is, Kamala's parents are immigrants. She's a first-generation Pakistani that living in America, right? So when we want to tell her story, right, we have to, and with how connected this is with her parent, her mom, who immigrated, who left Pakistan halfway, went halfway across the world, like she said this episode, to get away from her mother, who knows about to be. Bangle. These stories are interconnected. You can't tell the story of Kamala Khan Emma Bangle without talking about her grandmother and her great-grandmother, right? And so

you need that. And I think that the creators are taking this opportunity and saying, like, bet, okay, for changing the character. Let's go, let's go all in. Let's go all in on what the partition, you know, as a historical event. Because, I mean, I'll be honest, you know, when they were teaching us about this part of history, they just put on Gandhi, bro. U.S. television. Oh, yeah, they definitely put on the fucking

Gandhi system. It was terrible. Right? They just put on that bankings the Gandhi and said, cool, good luck. Yeah, this is all y'all needs to know, right? Not true at all. Like, as I'm learning, like, I left us up and I hit the Googles. I was like, hey, you know what I had. It's partition. This don't

seem. Like, oh my God. This seems, seems awful. Like, if you, you know, do some rain, it's like, oh, my, oh, my gosh. You know what I mean? And, you know, she has the conversations with the grandma, like, out the terrace where it's, like, you know, hope, like, a lot of us got separated by the law of an English man. And I'm like, dog. Like, these are these things, like, you know, like, clearly, you know, we know by history, but seeing it, you know, in like a big, like, a big, like, a Marvel television show.

You're like, yeah, man, like, this is important for people to, you know, for people to understand and people to know. And so, I'm not mad about it. I can't be mad about it. I feel like this is, this is a moment. This is, like, there should be more

stories for more people that don't get to have them. Oh, no, I'm actually, I agree with you in terms there should be more stories. And I'm not trying to I'm not trying to diminish partition or what an entire episode of Miss Marvel going to Pakistan means. I more so think that, like,

there's always this anxiety I see in these films with creators where it's just like when you're making the first black hero who has a movie for the MCU, there's this fear that you're never going to get another one. So it's just like, okay, we have to pack in so much of black history, so much of African history, into this in case we don't get it.

Same thing with Shang-T. We have to pack in so much of Chinese history and the Asian American immigrant experience all of these things in it because we may never get it. And I felt that anxiety with Miss Marvel of like, if we never get another season of TV, we need to do it all, which may be a little bit sad where I'm just like,

hmm, if this, if we knew that there was going to be a second season, maybe the story wouldn't feel so truncated. And maybe wouldn't have been, I wouldn't have felt like watching the whole thing. I was like, oh, man. this is an important story. It just seems kind of like rushed in terms of like a six episode series.

But I also want to know, and I'm going to turn to you, Steve. Kamala meets her grandmother, an extended family. How are you enjoying, like, the family drama, the backstory of it all? Is this something like you're into?

That's actually something that I really enjoyed throughout this entirety of the series. And when I know that the show is performing its best, it's of those two things. One of those things is when family dynamics are at play. When we get to know more about Kamala's dad, about how much he met his mom at a Bon Jovi concert about how, like, how that kind of fraught relationship between Kamala's mom and her grandmother are, which we see a lot more in this episode. I genuinely love that.

When they met in the airport and like her grandmother is like fawning over Kamala because he finally gets to see her granddaughter for all this time, And then she just turns to Kamala's mom and, like, it was like, your skin is all dry. Like, like, are you on one of these weird diets? Like, I, like, and I've seen that happen. I've seen grandparents fall over grandchildren and then just immediately be those weird, you know, condescending parents to their kids. And like, that happens at any age. And I was like, that's, that's real.

That's really, really good. Like, that's the part of the show's, the show that, like, really hits its strength. And occasionally when we get to see the, like, teenage drama that, ensues when she's in high school and interacting with friends. I think that's great. I think sometimes you get a stumble when you have those ushered in superhero plot lines of like, okay, we have a secret society who's going to give you all the info about the gin and how we're protecting different dimensions and all of these other things. Like, we have to get that download because that's the download that we've, the MCU's been giving us for so many years. But when you get those little tiny bits of

personality when it's about her family. It's about her friends and all those things. That's when you see really bright rays of sunshine in this. And that's what I really, really love. I loved it. Oh, I honestly, the conversation between her and her grandmother should have happened like in the second episode, because it was so funny, be like, yeah, you're a shame. But it's so funny because she's like right up here in FaceTime where like she's just

eating the camera. I got the bangle from your great-grandmother. Just come over and I'll tell you about it. Like that's, that was great. And it was just so funny her grandmother just being like, yeah, your Jen, get over it. Like, stop freaking out. Right. Like, it was just like so, like that is what a grandmother would do.

It's like what? In any culture, which I found so, so heartwarming. But for you, Jomey, I know you got cousins showing me. Jomey. Tell us about your cousins. What's the most awkward encounter you've had with the larger Adiron family? I got to say it was, it's probably one of those times. I honestly, there isn't so many

I can't remember. But it's one of those times, like, so my sister, you know, she's a big shot lawyer, you know, so she's left us to do her loring business. Loring business. You know, so because, you know, she was like, I'm going to school. I'm going to get educated, you feel me?

And I was like, you go do that. I'm going to just hit these tweets. Like, that's what I'm going to do for a living. Right? And so it's one of those things where, so she's the, she's big head honcho, right? And I have older cousins, but most of my older cousins are in Nigeria. A lot of my younger cousins are here, right?

So, for example, we went to Texas a couple years ago to see family. And we've got all these cousins, right? My brother is 18, 18, 19, or 17 to 18 at the time. I can't remember. And all the rest of my cousins are like, you know, 15, 16, you know, around like that age. And so there's like a whole bunch of them. and I'm the only like person who can drink in that in that group right so just me and a bunch of children right and the adults are doing their adult thing kids doing their thing and I'm like hey man

there's no uh there's no like 20 something like oh you're still at the kids table you still the kids table did you throw on avatar the last airbender to entertain the children dog no dog you don't be you know I did y'all want to be really honest I put on iron mad too Oh, right. Of all, of all the movies. Listen, they're upstairs. You were mad that day. You were annoyed.

Check this out. They're upstairs doing like playing like, you know, Xbox, whatever. The adults are outside having, you know, talking about Nigerian politics. You know what I'm saying? Like, what do you want from me? Brett. Tell me what you want me to do. I would intently listen to Nigerian politics.

No. You don't want to, you don't want, listen. Let me put y'all on some game real quick here in this ring of verse. Let me help you all. Please tell me about Nigerian politics right now. In the kidding, there was Nigeria. It's not, I'm not going to give y'all a history lesson. All I'm going to say is you do not, under any circumstances, want to be pulled into a conversation with grown-ups talking about Nigerian politics.

It's not what you want. Especially, like, I mean, I don't understand nothing in terms of, you know, I know. American politics is like in the dirt right now, in the mud. I, dog, dog, Nigerian politics. It's just corruption this, corruption, net. You became restoring. You need to be like, is this, is this real life? Like, is this how we're supposed to live?

Like, how we're supposed to succeed? You paid what for who and what now? Oh, that makes so much sense. No wonder you have no scruples about taking all the checks from Mr. Michael Mous. Listen. You've been listening to the grownups who are like, this corruption sounds good. There is no under the table.

It's just the table. It's like, oh yeah, yeah, you for show getting paid. Somebody for sure paying you, bro. It's just not fun. It's no fun at all. You're just like, and this world sucks, bro. Like, you just come away very nilish. So I'm like, no, I'm not doing this, man.

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and abdominal discomfort. In addition, now that we're talking about corruption, let's talk about another, another currency. I'm introducing a quarter flip, okay? Oh, boy. Oh, no. Steve, we need, we need an FX, like a quarter flip. I've been, I need to be on that.

It's been too long since we had a quarter flip. So, quarter flip. How the fuck is it so easy for the clandestine to escape from a Supermax prison? Like, it was, like, I mean. Well, it's like a Supermax. How Max was that Super Max? Yeah, right? It's like a supermax the same way.

James Brunson is getting a supermax. You know what I'm saying? Like, what are we doing here? Like how, like, it was. Yeah, it's not even... It's a super size, but not a super max. You're not even like kind of easy. It was like walking the park, playing God of War on, you know, story mode.

You know, it was soup. Like, there are Mario Kart levels harder than escaping from prison. It was just basically walking down a Freddie Kruger hallway with, with your change like this. And apparently, like, that's it. That's all the protection. I'm just like, wait, there's superpower beings. I needed to know, well, because it's clearly not the raft.

Like, we assume Supermax in MCU is the raft. So, yeah, I'm pretty sure that the people like that can probably get out of prison. But even so, they walked out the front door. Like, they walked out, they just strolled. I'm like, there's no guards outside. And they were having a conversation outside. I'm like, how easy

is it to escape this motherfucker? Like, where's the thing, right? And this is both really bad for that supermax prison. Because if the clandestines can get out of there, like it's a walk in the park, like it's a Sunday, Sunday league football match, I cannot imagine what like actual superpowered individuals would do. Like imagine trying to arrest abomination. Or like, or like literally anybody else. But that's actual supermax. Like the scale, power scaling of prisons is different.

But here in the MCU. You can't call it a supermax then. I'm pretty sure they should call it super. You can't call it Super Mac. This is like what? The mid-level exception? This is an exhibit 10 two-way contract. This is no super base.

This is a summer league deal, bro. The way they got out of there. They packed up. Like you said, like the hallway was for show. Like they were for some reason taking them like in the tunnels or whatever. And they was like, no, we good. Bye, blah, bop. We out of here.

I'll see y'all next week. Like, nah, man. That's a week. That is a week. That is a weak. That being said, they're also thousands of years old, so they probably have some experience with escaping. All right, that is fair.

That is fair. Maybe this isn't their first escape from a quote-unquote supermax prison. But let's get to the Red Dagger's. Kareem, we're introduced to this hero, Kareem, who is from the comics. Jome, Explaner, can you add any insight into who Kareem is in the comics? Because he is the Red Dagger. But in my research, I don't know if the Red Daggers are an organization in the comics.

No, as I've been up all night. No sleep trying to figure this out. No, but for real. So he is the Red Dagger. Kareem is from Pakistan just like Kamala's parents. And just like the comics, Karim's mother and Kamala Khan's maternal aunt have a connection. So, you know, we don't know the exact connection between Kareem and Kamala yet,

but it seems to be going in the same way of the comics where Karim's, you know, parentage and Kamala's parentage relate. And at night, he protects the people of Pakistan as the red dagger. He part in the, now this is in the comics. We won't know if those are happening in the show, but he becomes a transfer student and goes all the way to a little known town in New Jersey called Jersey City. In the beginning, there was a little bit of a town.

Jersey City. And lives in the Con residence. So, you know, that's something that we may, I don't know if we'll see it this season, but that's sort of keep an eye on. He moves halfway across the world.

All right. Here's one thing. Kamala, like, I see you. She's like Lori Harvey out here. She got the roster. She got three men. Bro, first of all, brother Bruno not getting no play, dog.

But here's the thing. Here's a thing. Sitting in Jersey City sad. Just like. He's the autumn of. optimism, okay? This is not a Coke baby chocolate take. But another thing that the reason I was saying, like, what this have made more sense in a season two is I'm like, all right, we've already in the first three episodes been introduced to two love interests, Bruno and Comron. And then they give

us a third one in Kareem. And I'm just like, what am I supposed to feel about Kareem? Like, what am I supposed to feel about Kamran? What are I supposed to feel about any of these men? It's only, her having three love interests in four episodes. I'm like, we have not spent enough time with any of these boys for any of them to make any lasting impact or make me interested in who Kamala may or may not fall for. And once I saw Kareem, I'm like, dog, come on. Like, what are we, what are we doing? What's the power of shippers, man? You only need one episode. Listen, it's a hot girl summer for our girl Kamala.

It is. It is. Good, good for her. We stand. Truly. I'm just saying the way Kareem and Kamran and Bruno are, you know, running around. year it's just like Kamala you could learn from Harvey. It's not how many people you have on the roster. It's the qualities. And I don't know if any of these people are franchise players. I'm going to be honest. They're Scruff.

Bruno's franchise. Come on, man. He made that whole suit. Listen, listen, I did some research on Bruno this past week. Because I was talking cash. I was like, that's my man's, bro. Like, Bruno, you're going to go Wakanda. He's going to kill it.

Apparently, Bruno is much more of a nuisance in the comics than in the show. Right? People were like, man, I was really way to hate on Bruno because Bruno in the comments again on my nerves. I was like, yo, he's like that.

No, like that was my guy, right? I thought, you know what I mean? I was like, dang. But even without that, like, let's be very clear. Bruno's, he's running bronze right now. Between Cameron and Marine and Bruno, he's running bronze right now.

He need to step up. He need to get that 40, time. He's not bringing a lot to the table. Also, no clutch factor from Bruno. Now, this is the autumn of optimism, guys. This is the autumn of optimism. But I have to bring it up. I have to bring it up. It's a fight choreography

between Kareem and Kamala a little lack. I don't think that they've really mastered this like 3D platforming power that Kamala has. Because you can get really inventive with this, but so far she's just done like

Super Mario jumps so far. and I think that's about it. Like, I want to see some crazy, like, do you know the video game, like portal? You know that? Yeah. Yeah.

Like, I want to see some crazy, not that she can make portals, but like, I want to see like multi-platformed, like, when they were getting chased in the streets, I'm like,

why don't you just like make a little like step ladder up to buildings and rooftops to like get away from them? Like, why don't you like do some of that? That's my thing. It's like the green lantern thing where it's like how, if this is really your imagination, like we can think bigger.

Like, because here's the thing, if Kamala is always drawing, if she's always, her fantasy world. I'm like, what is the only thing Kamala can do is make fists and make platforms? Like, Kamala, I need a little bit more from you. I need a little bit more. I think that's probably what she gets in doing the finale when she's like, I can, like, it's power of imagination. And then she'll, she can do crazy shit. But also, when we're talking about the actual fight of

those two fighting, I was like, I get that Kamala is not trained in any martial arts. So I'm not expecting the fight to have that type of feel. But even in the way it's shot, I've been feeling lately, like some of the Disney Plus shows, I'm like, why does this is a fight? Just not, why is it not shot well? What does this not look good? Like it doesn't, it's not a visceral. It looks bad. I think it's, it's just like it's, you know,

not, doesn't have that kind of panache. It's, it's, it's, it's power Rangers level in terms of like, like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Okay, Charles, Charles, we need to have a talk. No, no, no, you haven't seen enough power ranges. No, no, no, it's time. Listen, Charles, Charles, I spent my formity of years watching power ranges. As I'm not that old either.

I love that. Time Force, you know, wild force, light speed rescue, Dino Thunder, my brother. How young are you? I am a child, dog. I don't know any of these downregers. RPM, Power Rangers, Operation Overdrive. Don't worry. I was on my mighty morphing tip, you know what I'm saying?

Mighty morphing? Turbo? Nah, nah, not turbo, not aliens. I can't talk to you. You know what I'm saying? Not Zio, I can't talk to. Not Zio. See, you see what I'm saying?

When I was on Netflix? way back in the day. Like I went back and I was like, hey, yo, look, like I didn't, you know what I'm saying? I don't want to hear you talking

about your new fangled Power Rangers shit. You ain't watching Monty Morphine, I tapped it on Mighty Morphan. I tapped it on Mighty Morphins. Long story short, I went back this year.

They had, um, they had Dino Thunder on the, on the YouTube. They had the whole series on YouTube. Wow. I had that on bed in the background, dog.

And I was watching that thing. I was like, hey, man. Like the story kind of fire, you know what I mean? But the action? Woo boy. as a kid you take a lot of liberties man

you just let that tick slide like you're not really thinking at this definitely look like they had $12 in an afternoon you know what I mean that's the disrespect that you just put on Miss Marvel you gotta apologize I didn't apologize

I'm not doing it I'm sorry man that's that's foul if they actually if they actually made a fight scene like Power Rangers where they're just like doing like somers and then like you slash somebody with a sword and it's just sparks I would love that.

I would actually. I would actually love that. They would shoot the gun behind them. Right. And then just go. It would kick off. They would jump. Have some respect, Charles.

I would actually love it. If a Marvel show did that. I'm with Steve. You're right. Jomi, you're right. You called me out. This is what I need. I need you guys to hold me accountable.

This is the autumn of optimism. I was not being optimistic. I take it back. Now, going to do another quarter flip. Fing. all right the red daggers as a secret society

here's my thing immediately I was just like was this COVID related because I'm like how big is a secret society it's not much of a society if it has two it almost seems like a duo

I'm like there ain't even like no other red daggers around I was a little confused I was like is red daggers just two people or is this it's hardly a society

for a secret society so far yeah I was just like where is everybody else yeah dudes in a in a country club it looks like it was listen that's a nice spot though it's a nice spot it's a really great spot

here's the thing I was also mad because I'm like damn that's like that's like a nice nice two bedroom apartment then the clandestine come and fuck that shit up if I mean the walking is kind of tough it's in a dirty kitchen oh that's cool that's actually cool can you imagine a shawdy being like hey yo welcome to my crib shoddy and you like push the

ovens he's like damn he would get really his interior decorating is skills are dope. No, that's some serial killer shit. I actually did think that when Kamala was like following this man she just met behind an oven, I'm like, really not smart. I'm like Kamala. He was trying to kill you

and it's like, come with me. Yeah. That's the other thing. That's my issue. That's my storytelling issue. I'm like, here, come on. You are in a country where you are technically from, but like grew up in Jersey City. Okay. Why are you following this man

who was throwing knives at you 15 minutes before to a secret location where no one knows. And he's just like, all right, yeah, we just got to go behind the oven. I'm like, stranger danger, Kamala. You have a real problem. What, two episodes ago?

She was hopping in Kamran's car. Not asking no questions. I think this is an issue. This is an issue with Kamala. I think she's just a little bit naive. Like you said, she's like a teenager. So she's just like going out of vibes, right? Like, remember, I mean, last week.

These old people came and was like, hey, you know, we're the gym, with the condescist, that a da-da-da. She was like, cool, yeah, I'll help you. You know, not really like a thought going through the brain, you understand? I'm saying. No thoughts just vibes from Kamala, which makes sense. Like, these powers and do, this whole thing is new. She's like, she's taking it all in.

She's just kind of like absorbing it all. And then she'll form her own opinions in another two episodes. Exactly, right? She's like, improv. She's just like, yes, and. All right. What? Let's go.

All right, let's go. All right. I mainly joke. Like, that's probably not to say that she doesn't have any agency or any actual thoughts in her in her mind about what's going on. I think it's just more like there's a lot being brought to her and she's kind of just just along for the ride for this event. She just, I need her to be a little bit more inquisitive.

You can't just keep hopping in strange men's cars and going behind in strange men's apartments and who want to kill you. Like, Kamala, we need you safe. Your national treasure also want to bring up. Okay. How do we feel about the whole exposition dump about the gin? Because at this point, I'm in. I'm like, I get it.

Like, I'm just like, I get who the gin are. cool, like, don't got to tell me. Then while lead is like, back in the beginning of time, the gin had their own dimension, and it was the veil of nor, and you have nor powers. In the beginning, there was the gin.

And I was just like, all right, once her grandma says your gin, don't worry about it too much. I was being like in, don't have to explain anymore. And then while Lee was just like, and your powers, you can use the nor because you're a human engine.

And I was like, oh, like, here we are. again wrap it up I like this for two reasons I think that it actually is like a fun contextual thing of like every culture every walk of life has these weird ways of explaining the unexplainable it's just where those things sort of happened

that kind of dictate what they're called or what they ascribed to be like he says you know if Thor would have landed in the Himalayas they would have called him a gin but instead he landed in Scandinavia And like that's, that's a, like, I think that's an interesting context to load that, like, these things happen all over the world. And we just have different names for them. And like, they're just as, you know, unexplainable, wondrous and all those other things as any of them, any of the rest of them. I think that was cool. What about you? What about you, Jomi? I know you liked it. Mr. Positivety over there. Well, I'm Mr. Positivity now. So I liked it to. No, I had a, like you said, I had a fun. time watching her like you know learn more about you know i know we talked about a lot in episode

three but episode four was like hey listen this is why you're able to do this thing with this bangle you know we got the we got the heads up on the inscription what you are seeking is seeking you and i was like bruh that's deep but in all seriousness the lore behind the nor and where her great grandmother comes from and what would happen if she uses the bangle to bring that dimension to earth? I was like, okay, the stakes are higher now. She

helps the clean distance. The world is gone for good. And so here we are. Back at it again. The world is ending. We're back. This is Marvel, baby. The end of the world is upon us. The stakes couldn't be the same. They could not be more like every other stakes that we've ever seen. Yeah, see, my issue with the stakes is that going back to, like, the first episode,

I was like, I like this show because it seems so small. The stakes seem so small in like a good way where it's like they're very teenage stakes of like, oh, does this boy like me? Does this, am I going to be popular? How do I save my small Jersey City Town? And with the, we have to save the world from the gin. I'm just like, oh, man, like, it was so much more interesting to me when like Kamala's concerns were like Jersey City,

which is just kind of like, I'm from Jersey, where I'm like, who wants to say fucking Jersey? But that's part of the appeal. I like to add a slight addendum to what you say with small stakes. I like to use the term intimate stakes. Yes, intimate. That's way better.

If it's like, because they could be big for her, and I like it when it's just big for the character. The consequences of those stakes being like the world ending, I like that to vary. I like, you know, maybe a, you know, a block would blow up. rather than, you know, the rest of the world or a country or the pyramids or something like that. But the consequences being intimate for the characters that reflect them, like if it deals with family,

if it deals with a friend, a loved one, that's where we actually care about. And that's what gives it weight. It doesn't matter how big, you know, the boom is, if that makes sense. Yeah, and that's why I don't think it's a problem for me. Because like I've said, you know, if you listen to me, like, talk about this problem. The thing I've always said is like this show feels so alive. Every single character that I meet, I'm like, I want to spend more time with them, except for the cousins who like just leave Kamala in the street, whatever, like in the foreign country.

That was wild of them. That's nuts. You can't do that. Also, that's a. You can't do that. That's a cousin, no, no. Because here's the thing, if I was that age and like my cousins from out of town came in and I just left like solo, dolo, I'm cooked.

My mom would beat my head. She's like, I'm cooked. Like, I can't come back home. I cannot come back home without three of us leave two of us come back. Hey, where's your cousin that's not from this country who's never been here before?

Oh, she at the, what you can call it? She, we don't know. I'm cooked. I'm done. You know what I'm saying?

No, but every single character means something to Kamala to the show. Like, everybody feels so lived in, so alive. Like, it's one of the things that really makes this show special. And so if they're going to put those people in danger, I would feel some type of way. I would be like, hey, yo, even if the stakes are like the world is and da-da-da, if they make it about, oh, nah, mom, my dad, something happens to pops. I'm going to be sick.

Do you understand what I'm saying? Those stakes would still resonate with me, I think. Fair enough, fair enough. I do, I do agree with Steve, though, about intents. mistakes and I think the show can still get there. One thing I love about the Holland movies is that it is a friendly neighborhood Spider-Man. His problems are so much about Queens and his school. And I think, I think Miss Marvel can get there. It's just like the whole gin of it all when they showed the hologram of like, this is what'll happen. I was like, yeah, okay, sure. The more important

question for today is, if you guys could only join one secret society throughout fiction, which one would it be. We're going to start with you, Steve. You can only pick one. That's so... You made a good list here. I don't know. I had a few...

I really... When I actually read the comics, I don't think... I think the movie is unfairly maligned, but I really, really fucked with the League of Extraordinary Gentlemen in the comics. I thought they were so cool.

Wait, what... Like, that's a team. What would your extraordinary skill be? Like, what would joy... I love the invisible man. I love being the invisible man. No, but would you just be Steve, the producer? Is that you just like...

He produces the pod for the League of Restordinary Gentlemen. Oh, that'd be great. Oh, you know they got to it. Hey, welcome to the Leg. Pod, the League of Extraordinary Gentleman podcast. I'm your host. Nemo.

And joining me today, as he does every Tuesday is The Invisible Man. Say, What's Up? Invisible Man. Day, I shot us for producer Steve Harmon. You know, Summer Steve. They still call you Selma. Even in that podcast. That's true. They still call you Selma, Steve. You know, that'd be fun.

That was a good choice. That's a good chance, Steve. What about you, Jovey? I already know which one you're going to pick. I already know. I mean, it's not even, come on, man. Of course, bro. I'm joining the order of the White Lotus dog.

Come on. Yeah, of course. All right. What era? What era? Oh, bro. I'm, nah, see, because here's the thing, right? Core era.

Them dudes was weak, bro. No, but just that, is that here? Nah. He was sending them dudes to hell. Each week. Each week it was a new pack. Each week I was a new pack. That man.

Hey, listen. Aira special, but you can't go all like that order of White Lotus. I'm sorry. Now, like Steve said, I could go back to Kiyoshi times, but, you know, Kioshi's my girl. I love Kiyoshi. Right. But Uncle Ayra was my brother. You know what I'm saying? That's my guy. I want to be on his team. It's more of just like, do you want to live in a time with an awesome avatar or when the White Lotus was popping off? Which is probably when the White Lotus was popping off. Yeah. Honestly, speaking of Avatar, speaking of Avatar, the thing that I'm worried whenever we do our avatar draft is how do we make it fair? Because I feel like

the number one pick overall would probably be A in terms of just like Avatar, love him. See, you don't know how I draft. I probably would because I know that he's going in the first round. He's going in the first round. He's going to the first round. So I'm not even worried about it. I'm not worried about it.

I think Ang is a first round pick. Well, here's the thing I was wondering. He's not a first round pick. Because I think Avatar has to be its own category. Okay. Here's what I was thinking. We're getting to our, we can't get too deep on it here. No, no.

Here's the thing, right? And I legitimately thought about this. It would have to be a whole pod. Like no B, A story, no B story. Oh, no, no. Yeah, no. Yeah. And it would legitimately be like 90 minutes minimum because you need an avatar.

You need an airbender. You need a water bender. You need a firebender. You need an earthbender. And you need a nonbender. You need six categories. And then wild card for like animals. What about animal?

Bro, see, we're going to be, see, we're going to be in the weeds now. An animal. Not the weeds? Not the weeds. A wild card. No. How many people do you need? A villain?

A villain? Like, like, I mean, we could do eight categories. We would just be here all night. It would be a three-hour podcast. Let it run. Run the tape.

We would be arguing Pabu over, over, over, over, uh, Opa, no, there's no,

there's no argument. There's no question. Appa's here. It's mostly, it's Momo, it's Momo, but like, Momo two,

like that's second. Come on. Naga, we would be here literally, the entire entire day just being like I can't believe

you pick Ty Lee like bro you know what I'm saying like they had so many soccer still on the board that sounds like my pick I pick Tyley over Soka bro Steve

Steve first pick gonna be Cabbage Man Saka I would never pick Saka in the non-powered category that's nuts that is nuts that's nuts how would you even say that

why would you even say that he's the let me not let me not reveal my drafts that if you can't we really can't I got a trivia you're all pod now

We'll be on here all day now. I got a draft board. When I tell y'all, y'all not ready, I'm cooking, I'm cooking, y'all. Like, it's a pack. I'm putting y'all in a pack. I went to my guy. I said, I need Steve. I need Charles Van, to some extent.

I need, I'm going to pre-order these packs. Because when it comes time for this avatar draft, hey, Steve right here, insert the little Wayne Flickr, the puff. That's going to be y'all. Hell no. Hell no. You don't need to have the strategy, y'all. You don't even think of it.

about the board, like I'm kidding about the board. We need to get back to Miss Marvel. All right. So, wrapping up a little bit, Kamala seemingly is transported back in time to the era of the partition and is trapped there. What do you think we'll find,

how will she get back? There seems to be, to me, at least, this shadow of her great-grandmother, the shadow of what type of person was she? It's almost like, do you think I'll ask you this don't mean.

Do you think that they're going to pull the trigger that maybe her great-grandmother was actually like the first Miss Marvel or like a proto Miss Marvel? I don't think so. I think I mentioned it the last time we talked about this, but I think she ditches that. Right. She says, I could be like a hero. I could be a savior, you know, with my nor gifts, but I would rather be with my family. Like that's what I would rather do. And so that's what she decides.

Again, we got no idea on to speculate. But I think that would be an interesting, an interesting thing to see. Steve, I want to ask you, these series, we don't have to belabor it. I think we all potentially can agree that these Disney Plus series kind of start and end in similar ways where it's like, first episode, we're on board. Middle episodes around maybe like three, four, five were a little bit like, a little rush, don't know what's going to happen. can you land the finale? And then the finale to vary and extent

have been good to kind of bad. Are you feeling confident in this show's ability to deliver the finale? Because they still have a lot to land in the next two episodes. I believe so.

I do. Rarely has there been like a colossal letdown of an MCU show finale? And I don't think that I can even really even the ones that were even slightly disappointing weren't even that bad.

I think we're in like that little like gray area where like we're kind of going to be either going to be getting like some really interesting and pivotal episodes coming forward knowing that she's seemingly trapped in time or trapped in a you know pocket area vision whatever we have I think that that can be very interesting I want to make sure that we're like getting back to those intimate stakes rather than just grandiose nebula stakes where like it's just more of an assignment rather than about her I think that can carry it because it's about family. I'm confident that we're going to be going forward pretty well here. What about you, Joe? You know, I've always said, like, the penultimate episode of these Marvel shows is usually, like, one of the better episodes. So I am excited for next week. But after that, we will have to see it.

I do think that this Marvel show has the ability to stick the landing. And like I said, like going on the, in on the partition. next week is going to be, it's going to leave so much, you know, about, we're going to learn so much about Kamala's history and what motivated Aisha, Aisha, sorry, and her whole family going forward. And that has the ability to propel the story into, like, you know, into, into a, into a realm that really, like, you know, we don't know yet, right? And so it just really matter. It just really it really depends on how this next episode goes. And I think if they nail it, which I have full confidence that they can, then we'll be in for a treat for episode six. I'm going to surprise y'all.

I'm not worried. You want to know I'm not worried? I'm not old Charlie Brown anymore, okay? You guys can't fool me with the football. All right? I'm not kicking that shit. I know what happens. Fool me once. Shame on me. Okay. I expect nothing. Some are no expect. leading into the autumn of optimism. I don't. That is the logo for the summer of no expectation. It's just Lucy and Charlie with the football. Yeah, it's just like I just, I have no expectations because I'm just like,

will this probably end like every other Disney Plus show? Most likely. Do, does anyone learn the lessons? Never. That's fine. I don't learn my lessons either. All right. Charles.

What? I'm being optimistic. Oh, that's optimistic. That's optimistic. Guys, you are my friends, okay? My partner's in crime. And it really hurts my feelings that you. can't support me on my new journey of

No, first of all, okay, you got to No, this is foremost. You keep saying autumn of optimism, like it's not a hundred degrees outside. Like, I don't know what you're talking about. It's autumn of my soul. It's the autumn of optimism and my soul, Jomey, okay? It's not, it's not a, it's, it's,

what you're saying is, it's, it's something that it's internal, right? Like, it's not, it's a mindset. It's not an actual thing. It's a mindset. Autumn of optimism. Hey. And that mindset is where I, Matt. So Miss Marvel's going to be the best show to ever be released on TV. Okay. The finale is again. Jesus Christ. There's nothing, there's nothing wrong with superhero. Superhero movies or TV.

They're the pinnacle of creativity. Okay. Actually, I can't say that because y'all need to tap into the bear on FX. I saw y'all tweets. Perfect show. I got to tap in. You got to tap episode seven. I was about to have a heart attack. I was too busy going back and watching episodes of Victorious. So now I got to watch that's how I know you young, Jomey. That's how I know you talk about Nickelodeon shows. And I'm like, what the fuck? No, no.

Jome, get on this bear life because I know you love to cook. I probably would. I probably would enjoy there. If you think Uncut Jems is stressful, wait a see episode seven of the bear. Uncut Jems was not stressful. I don't understand. How are you? Uncut Dems was in no way stressful.

Here's the thing, right? Are you trying to smoking Newports after each pod? Like, what the fuck are you talking about? Here's the thing. I knew what was going to happen in that game, right? Because if I recall correctly, that's a, playoff series between the Sixers and the Boston Celtics. Right?

From, let me say, what was that, 2014, 2013, around that area? right and so in my head I'm like hey man I know how this playoff series goes if my mind is correct like they lose right yeah but there's no way spoiler alert spoiler alert

you have not seen uncut gems like fast for 10 seconds there's no way you saw my man getting popped in the head like I was just like the fuck but that was a stressful like that was shocking but I wasn't like ah I was like oh day he got got what's the not the not the dude from um succession not the uh the burney uh guy from succession but the other dude shot him right or my trip yeah and i was like yo that's nuts but i wasn't like oh my god all right fine stop stop bragging that you didn't think uncut gems is that

tense joan i know ball that's really what it is i just know well if you if you're anywhere near a kitchen you'll know that this this this show's fucking intense it's the bear's great tapping to that show. And that's a wrap today. All right. That's a wrap tomorrow. The Hasavar will be back to give you a little deep dive into Miss Marvel Friday. House of Ar, coming back, returning. Just the upside down to give you their thoughts on episode eight of Stranger Things season four. Next week, the Midnight Boys got more of the Boys and Miss Marvel goodness for y'all. All right? Producer credits. Our producer Steve Aldeman doing his best as always, Jomea Denneron. Hashtag Jomey's burning on social media.

Wait, wait, wait. Excuse me? Explain that one, Steve. Jome is burning. Oh, it's Jome is burning. I was just like, does he have some type of? Jome is burning. Yeah.

I'm like, do we need to take him to urgent care? Like, what is that? That's what I'm saying. A Joe, hot Jomey summer. It's a hot Jomey summer. He's burning with desire. That, no, man. Burning with romantic passion.

Steve, he got a man of exquisite passion. You got to run these by me, brother. I got it. A Rome is burning. Hashtag Jome is burning. Jomey's running. What is that meat? Brough, you're going to be, hey Jomi, man, we got a clinic, right down the street.

There's no paperwork, no nothing. They're just going to get you when you telling your symptoms. They get you a pill. You see him in that button down. You're trying to set me up. And the, and the Hoochie Daddy shorts. Like, man, Jomey is burning. Jome is burning, guys.

An additional production from our Juner-onkapal. And with that, we are out. Wait, I have to. Actually, Steve, Steve, since I was the host. Steve, give us an old sign-off. off, all right? Jeez, okay. Miss Marvel was great.

The world keeps on turning. Do not finish that. Yes, I will. Finish that. It's a hot Jomey Summer, and you know Jomey's burning. Jesus Christ. I can't do this.

I need to litigate something about the cousins, okay? The cousins that we meet in Pakistan. This is a question for Jomi. Unfortunately, Steve, you cannot weigh in. Now, on social media, there has been a lot of discussion. There's been a lot of discussion about, let's say, you know, you go over to your baby mama's crib. Do you bring food for your kid and not for the rest of the children around? Okay? Like, or if you're out with an auntie and an auntie gets her kid food, are you going to feel some type of way? if she don't get the rest of the little cousin's food too.

Jomey, I'm going to give you the floor. You have to buy food for everybody. And here's the thing, right? It becomes an issue very, very quickly. There is no, nobody's going to look at the side and be like, oh, he didn't bring me food. He only bought food for that one person. Okay, for sure.

Like, nobody's going to take that easy. They'd be like, hey, man, where? Anybody else going to eat? So this will be brought up. This, 100%. No, it'll destroy the family. There is like, like, Thanksgiving, Christmas, we're bringing that shit up.

We're like, oh, so you don't buy, like, food for all the kids. Because here's a thing. It's a blanket rule. There's a blanket rule. If one kid's eating, everybody's eating, everybody's eating. Everybody's getting a happy meal. Everybody's getting a happy. Everybody got to eat.

It's just happening. But now, my other question to you, cousins, now, Jomi, because it's a hot Jomi summer. So you would know this. Yeah. if your baby mama has other kids and it's Christmas and those kids don't get any presents, are you going to only buy your kid a present or do you feel obliged to get presents for everyone else? You got to get presents for everybody else.

Again, like, see, now this is what. No, no, no, no, here's the thing, Steve. I know I'm not, I know exactly what you're doing. And this is fine. I'm fine with what you're doing. What do you mean? I'm not doing anything, dog. This is just legitimately how this thing operates.

The precedent is what you're doing. It's not setting a precedent. This is how these things work. You can't not. If you show up empty-handed, that's all they're going to remember is this man right here didn't show up with the goods. He came up empty. That's the only thing that goes sticking their brain.

Is that what you want? Is that the legacy you want to live? When it's time to come up clutch, when they needed a bucket from you, you came up with nothing? Nah, bro. Not me? Not me. No wonder, Joe.

he's so broke. He's by everybody. I know. He's like, that's the thing. He's making a sales pitch. He's like, I will buy these kids. An Xbox. Girls, shut over. Shottie's out there. Just let you know. Jomi Gotti. He's going to get everybody a president. I actually agree with Jone. Here's the thing. Of course. I agree to.

I'm just like, everybody needs to get a president. Like, I'm not going to be the dickhead. He's like, only my son's getting it right. I'm like, no, that sucks. Now, what you could do was you could be like, I, like, the kid got to come over to my house. So then you show the presence there. That's how you play it. The presents in the talk, keep them here.

And then you go to family and you're just like, do not talk about shit. Don't bring shit up. I will take it away. What's the difference between butter and butter made from real California dairy? It's the real California farm families behind it. Real people. Real care. Real intention.

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