The Ringer-Verse - ‘The Boys’ Season 3, Episode 7 Reactions | The Midnight Boys

Episode Date: July 6, 2022

Van, Charles, Jomi, and Steve are back to give you their thoughts on the cartoon bloodbath that is the seventh episode of the third season of 'The Boys' (04:06). They weigh in on the Butcher's origin story (17:07) as well as the twists and turns that happen in the hunt for Mindstorm (33:23). Charles also takes a look at a few of Van's bad takes at "The Bad Take Table" and puts some hot-button issues to rest (63:46). Hosts: Charles Holmes, Van Lathan, Jomi Adeniran, and Steve Ahlman Social: Jomi Adeniran Senior Producer: Steve Ahlman Addition Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopal Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

From the host that brought you to Coding Westworld. And Westworld, the recapables. Comes the Ringer Prestige TV podcast on Westworld. I'm Joanna Robinson. I'm Danny Hyfitz. And I'm David Shoemaker. Welcome to Westworld Season 4 in the Prestige TV podcast feed, where we're going to break down every episode of Westworld season four.

Every Monday, the day after the show comes out on the Prestige TV podcast feed. Wherever we get your podcast, but get them on Spotify. For adults with Crohn's Disease or all, ulcerative colitis symptoms, every choice matters. Tramphia offers self-injection or intravenous infusion from the start. Tramphia is administered as injections under the skin or infusions through a vein every four weeks, followed by injections under the skin every four or eight weeks. If your doctor decides that you can self-inject Trimfaya,

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Enjoy the fresh flavors of spring. Save at Whole Foods Market. Into the Ringiverse. This is, of course, the Ringers Nexus podcast feed for all things, fandom. We are. Cudley, Steve Almond Joy, the summer lover bear.

We are. Jomey. Dinner on. That, cut that. Under no, sir, cut that. Cut that. We're not even, we're not even a minute in. 38 seconds into the recording.

Welcome back, Van. Come on now. Nah, Joe, you got to. What are we doing? Where would buy, Joan? No. You've got questions. He's got answers.

I'll beep it. We are. Old man, Van, he of the receding, non-existent hairline, here of the sore body, played too much basketball. We are. Co-baby Chuck the 24-car closure together.

We are known as of the Midnight, boys. Ab-Boo! Ah! Okay. Tomorrow, the House of Ar will be giving you a little deep dive into the penultimate episode of Miss Marvel. Okay. We will be talking about Miss Marvel's finale next Wednesday.

That's all we're going to say. The Ultimate on the House of Art. We're going to talk about Miss Marvel next Wednesday. And Friday, Midnight Boys are going to give you their instant reactions to the latest MCU entry, Thor, Love and Thunder. L&T, baby, TL&T, TL&T, we're going to do the movie. TL&T, it's going to be great. TL&T, we talked about it a little bit on the pre, and you know, we're excited to talk about it, T L&T. We excited

to talk about it, everyone. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Autumn of optimism. I'm so, I'm so excited. It's not, it's fucking July, dog. It's autumn in my soul. Would you guys leave me the fuck alone? I don't understand. I don't understand. Thank you, Jomey. What the hell?

It's July. Like, look, Steve comes up with the different summer calls. Summer of no expectations. You know, Steve came up with that. It was a hot Jomey summer. Hot Jomi Summer. Out of Thiber Nation. Yeah.

I think we might come up with that one all collectively. I'm not sure. But definitely Steve or Steve comes up with the, you can't just change the season, Charles. See, this is your problem. I can do whatever I want. Yeah. Are you trying, are you trying to tell me what I can't do?

Geez, money changes people. You go Hollywood and all of a sudden, like, it's all right. I'm just trying to say that it's not autumn in July. But you know what? That's fine. be whatever you want to be, Doc. I love you. All right, today's show,

we take a look back at the latest episode of the boys. And before the superlative start, it was another banger. What the fuck? All right? Like, we're enjoying the show.

We're enjoying the show. How about that? How about that? The Midnight Boys don't like anything. Well, guess what? We like this. God damn it, Steve. Give me the spoiler one.

And I'm sick of it. We're getting ready to talk about the... You're listening to a reaction podcast. The spoilers are coming. Chuck, Wagon, put us on something you need to know with the Midnight Manifest. It happens in the dead of the night. Charles gives you the information.

It's at 12 a.m. midnight to the manifest. Give it to me, Chuck. All right. This is the Midnight. Manifest for episode seven, here comes a candle to light you to bed, directed by Sarah Boyd, written by Paul Ray Long. Vaugh immediately goes into damage control after Starlight's IG live from last episode. Ashley and Homelander both tried to tie Starlight to a human trafficking ring that is not real.

Homelander and Victoria agree to work together while Ashley reveals that Aitrain's heart was replaced with Blue Hawks. Now in Maven Homander Corner, Homelander reveals that the only reason that he's keeping May of Alive alive is so he can use her eggs to make an even more powerful super-powered son. Now, for Black Noir versus Soldier Boy, we find Black Noir at Buster Beaver's restaurant, where through hallucinations of cartoon characters, we understand more of Black Noir's past. We learned that the hero was physically abused by Soldier Boy during the Battle of Nicaragua. It was Stan that requested Black Noir's help in handing Soldier Boy over to the Russians.

Then Buster tells Noir that it's time to face his feet. and take out Soldier Boy. Now we go to Butcher, Huey and Soldier Boy Corner, where they regroup at the legend's house. The legend reveals to Huey that Soldier Boy never fought in World War II, and his entire legend was concocted by him and Vaugh. Butcher and Huey then agreed to help Soldier Boy track down Mindstorm before the older hero assist them with killing Homelander.

During the search for Mindstorm, the three-hour ambush, and Mindstorm puts Butcher in an infinite memory loop. Butcher then relives painful memories of his past and how Butcher's father, Sam, was abuse it to him and his younger brother Lenny. Through these flashbacks, we see why Lenny committed suicide and the way his butcher's relationship with Huey is continuing the cycle of abuse. Huey is committed to saving Butcher and through a series of events realizes that Soldier Boy is a fraud. Ultimately, Huey's successful in capturing Mindstorm to free Butcher, but is caught by Soldier Boy who kills his former teammate. Then Soldier Boy figures out from Mindstorm that he's the

father of Homelander, which he reveals over the phone to Homelander. And then in Kimiko, French and Starlight Corner, Kimiko asked Starlight to give her the permanent compound V. Kimiko reveals that she wants to regain her powers because French, she is her family now and she wants to protect him. During her breaking at Vot, Starlight finds out that Tempt V will kill its host after too many doses, and Homelander almost catches Starlight, but Starlight puts my man on the IG live screen during the middle of one of his rant, which allows her to escape, and that is the very long Midnight Manifest. I love it. Why do you have to talk about the fact that it's very long? The Manifest has a lot of chunk in it, because they,

there was a lot in this episode. Instant reactions. Chuck, what did you think? I think I'm still really amazed at the fact that kind of what makes the boys special is so simple. It's just a good TV show on a fundamental level. You care about all of the characters.

The plot makes sense. When a twist happens, there's weight to it. There's emotional weight to it. Everything connects. You look at the screen, you're like, oh, of course this is where they were going. I just think that every single time I watch the boys,

I kind of marvel at the fact that, like, on a fundamental level, it's just good TV. And it follows all of those rules superbly. So once again, great episode. What about you, Venn? I have a word, an adjective to use, I guess it's an adjective. Sometimes I don't do grammar well. And I just posted something that said Americans are by far.

you know, struggling with literacy, so maybe I'm one of them. You have to attack this and address it. Boys is inspired. It's inspired. The difference between the boys and some of the other fare that we get,

and I'm not pointing out one specific thing, okay, or like holding up one specific. I'm not talking about, oh, this is the problem with Star Wars, this is the problem with the MCU. I'm talking about this other, shows period is the boys has something to say the show has something to say there is an intense narrative um and commentary on what it means to be human on what it means to be broken

on what it means to be damaged and what the journey of making yourself whole again entails. There's a specific commentary on power who has it, what real power is, and how you wrestle that power away from people that might not be using it responsibly. There is another commentary happening this season and in the show as a whole

on what power does to people, on how it corrupts, on what it takes to fight something from the inside. The Boys is talking to you. It's not always a perfect show, but it comes from an era of more traditional television where this, to me, where a TV show or a piece of art

actually had a theme that it stuck and it adhered to and it wove its story around that. And because of that, every single time you watch it, all of the superhero hijinks you get, all of the effects, all of that stuff is icing on the cake because what you really came for

is the fucking sermon. And this show is cooking in its narrative. It's cooking in its design. It's cooking in plot. It's cooking in performance. It's operating right now. In my opinion, on as high a level as a television show has operated in a while.

I mean, I'm impressed. I'm the fucking man. Nah, nah, you don't want to be effusive in your praise because. What are you talking about? I was abusive. I'm just not going at the best TV show in forever. I didn't see what I'm saying.

It's pretty good. I have a problem with what you just did. This is my problem. Who said forever? Who said for? I didn't say forever, the best TV show and forever. Niga. All right.

You said the best TV show in a war. you. That's like me comparing it to Bonanza. Forever is a long time. Oh, is the boys better than

Mash? Can we get this back on track? Because I want to ask you something sincerely, man. I'm sick of what you just did. Can I ask you something? Do you think part of the success

of the boys is the fact that weirdly because it is not, it doesn't have to be a fork watch and show in the way that like a DC movie or Marvel movie or Star Wars thing

where it's like those those properties have to kind of do a bunch of things. Whereas like the boys, ironically, they're speaking towards it where it's like, oh no, this can be as violent, as political. It can have this point of view. And because it's a mature show, because it's on Amazon, because they have so much leeway, when I watch the show, I'm like, oh, I'm watching someone with the point of view.

Even if I disagree with it, even if sometimes it's hard to watch, even if I think that they went too far, I think it's free. I think it's freeing to watch a show where it's just like, oh, this doesn't have to be for five-year-olds, 15-year-olds, 25-year-olds, and 55-year-olds. It can be an adult show that is operating for adults,

which is kind of refreshing. Of course, you're absolutely right. And I would compare it in that vein to Daredevil Season 1. Daredevil Season 1 comes out on Netflix and you don't have to make it for the kids. You're telling a gritty New York crime story with a guy who can do flips. All right.

That's what you're doing. So gritty New York crime story, even in that show, very, very clear through line in terms of what they're trying to do, how they're building one of the best villains on television history. Wilson Fisk, as played by Vincent Dinoffrio. It's fantastic. It's fantastic until they put him in that cell phone picture. Then he wasn't so great. But, like, he's fantastic, even though Hawkeye was good. But yeah, absolutely, you're right.

And that's kind of the, you get some other shows like Moon Night, which Moon Night has to be violent and it has to be aggressive, but it can't be as violent or aggressive. So it ends up not being enough for the kids. In my opinion, Moon Night was cool. It ends up being not enough for the kids and then not enough for the adults. And it's hard to stick the landing on stuff like that. And this is a problem that a lot of the Disney stuff or even the Star Wars stuff is going to brush up against. Remember, Rogue One, how they want, Rogue One still ended up being great. But they wanted Rogue One to be a lot different.

And they couldn't do it. They actually got pissed off when they screened it for the people. They're like, what the hell are you guys doing? This is way too violent. We're like, what are you doing? So your point is an astute one, but the boys is free. And you see free creatives creating freely. And that's why we can't keep up with the show.

The show is ahead of us, which is great. The show is ahead of us. It's amazing. But we were, I heard, I heard it in our prepod, Jomi was saying, fuck y'all, fuck your a few of praise for this show. I hate the boys. I'm joking. Jomey, I'm joking.

I just wanted to know what you would see felt. What did you guys think of the show? Well, I mean, I love this show. I've had so much for watching this show over the two plus seasons. Like every time you think, like to advance point, every time you think, I beat the case. Like, I get what's about to happen. Like, psych! Takes a left turn.

And it's always for the better. And for this episode specifically, learning Butcher's backstory and seeing what really happened to Black Noir and Soldier Boys relationship, there's just a really great episode of TV and I'm really rocking with it. Like, it was awesome. episode seven, I'm assuming we all liked it. Yes. Let's get a vote. Steve, what did you think?

Loved it. Absolutely loved it. I think there may be like a couple of things. Like, I don't know if we really needed the deep in this episode for like one scene. But there were a couple things. I was like, it was great. It was funny. I like that.

The deep is a piece of shit. He remains a piece of shit. It's not that he's a piece of shit. The deep is a sick fucking ass. He needs hell. He needs help. The deep. But LeCashu a question about the deep, though.

This is my question about the deep. He's attracted to aquatic animals. Can't help that. You know what I mean? It's consenting. He, you don't know whether or not you would be attracted to a whale if you could talk to one. We are on a path. Oh, I'm not.

I'm stopping this conversation before it goes. Wait a second. Let me tell you something. The deep is kind of a fish. you know, because he's got gills and that's what happened. I think that we're, wait a second, guys. Your Honor, it was at this point

when Van Lathen said that he was kind of like a fish. No, so look, here's the problem. You guys don't want to have the conversation. That's a problem not just here on the Midnight Boys podcast. It's a problem in America. So, we judged it. No, I'm not letting you cook with that, man. We ain't letting you cook out of here.

Get out of here. We ain't having the fucking. Fish conversation. Can we please get back to the show? But like, I guess, but, but, but my situation is I trust the deep when he's dealing with fish. It's the only time I trust him. I thought that's something.

Oh, what do you guys feel like? I don't know how to talk about it. This is probably why I didn't even put the deep in the outline. It might have been of consequence, but here we are. Oh, my God. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

What was the standout plot line? to you guys in this episode. Definitely not the team. Definitely not to see. Standout plot line to me, to me, the standout plot line for me is, I don't know if it's so much of a plot line as it is a thread throughout the episode

is knowing how we got Butcher, knowing how Butcher was created. I mean, you could probably guess some of this from the interaction you've seen with, between him and his father before, but I think it helped me really understand the character a little bit more. Boucher, I didn't think anybody was going to go with that one.

This is interesting. Not that I didn't like it, but it wasn't the primary one that I was invested in. Right. I take one look at Butcher and I certainly don't think, oh yeah, that guy grew up just fine. Like,

I never thought about that. Like, I never, that was never a question. For me, it was a great parallel between him and Huey's relationship, right, and how he sees a little brother. in Huey and how, you know, he doesn't want the same thing that happened to his brother

to happen to Huey. So even as, even with Butcher's problems, even as he's like pushing Huey away, Huey coming back reminds him of what happened in the past. Now he is trying to rectify that. And so it opens your brain to why he's so protective of Huey. Whereas, like, you know, Huey's not mother's milk. Huey doesn't offer the same things that French he does, but he keeps him around. because of what happened in the past,

and nobody wants to fix that. And that, like, gives you another look at but you're like, oh, you know, you suck as a human being, but, like, I can kind of see what you're trying to do here, and you almost want to, you know, you want to say, oh, I feel bad. Like, you do feel bad. You guys are missing it so off your asses again.

To me, that's not what it is at all. How was Homelander reared? How did they raise Homelander? They raised Homelander. They got Homelander out of tube or whatever. They put them in this place where there was no love, only aggression, structure, and incitement, right?

What did we just figure out? That's exactly the same thing that happened to Butcher. The only thing, the way Busher was born, the way Busher was raised, was in a place where someone was trying to stamp him out and lean on him every single moment. Now, with Homeland, there was at least purpose in what they were trying to create. But with Busher, there was somebody bigger and stronger just beating on him every single time. And it gave him something to protect.

He lost his humanity the day he walked away from his brother and turned his brother onto his father. on him, like, onto his father, let his father basically just have his way with him. He lost his brother. At the end of this episode, Butcher is faced with the question about whether or not he tells Huey

that Huey, that the V-24 is killing them. And you know what he does? He abandons Huey in the same way that he abandoned his brother because he chose to be less of a human being the moment

he stepped out of that door and stopped protecting him. He became, after that, the aggressor and not to protect her. And that's what we're learning about butcher. Butcher doesn't want to protect anyone. He wants to kill things he thinks needs to be dead. And the reality is he is not that much different to Homeland, we've said it before, and that's what this backstory showed me. They're both can be true at the same time.

I, to the point of like both of them going up aggression, like with aggression and, you know, always need to fight something like yeah that that's that is true right but i think the reading of qi not like he doesn't need to protect you i feel like that's the reason they're gonna go get the v in the in the finale right because any calls and he's like hey y'all y'all you all you're gonna die this tem v will kill you and instead of having to tell tuey that he's like no we're gonna go to go to the vaught tower right we're gonna we're gonna we're gonna set this thing straight once for all. Right? And I'm thinking, at least the way I read it was, he's like, oh, crap, I almost got

this guy killed, right, because of my dealings. I got to go now and try and help save his life. That's what I read to me. But maybe I'm tripping. I mean, but if you think about, like, if you like, think about this episode in the macro, if you think about this thematically, what I think is genius about this episode is this is an episode about abuse. And each storyline has two people in it, where it's like, there's butcher and then there's Huey. And you see the ways that the person who has the power is abusing the lesser person. You have Soldier Boy and Black Noir. Black Noir is literally reliving what it was like to be the one with less power and to be afraid of Soldier Boy. And then you see Homelander

in Mays where it's like, Maeve doesn't have any power in this situation. And even as Homelanders flailing, he's still letting Maeve know like, hey, I can control you. Like you have a know, like, I'm going to do my best to take all of your agency away. And I think that that's the powerful. It's like, you see, it's not just that you see the people, the abusers in this. You see the people like who are, who can't really do anything, or at least feel like they're backed into a corner because there's all of these people in their lives who are doing their best to rob them of something that's so human. And I think that's kind of the genius of this episode. Because my heart broke for Maeve because

Maeve during this whole thing is like, oh, like she's literally symbolically trapped. She's not only in jail, but she's been trapped ever since she joined the seven and that hurts to watch. And a beautiful thing that she reclaims from Homelander in that small scene is that like even though I'm here, this is still like a top three day for me because I got to see the person that's doing

this to me scared. Like that was fucking incredible. And that's actually one reason where I, I think Homelander lied in that situation where he's like, I'm keeping you in this cell because I'm going to steal your eggs, I'm going to make this child. That might be like what he's telling himself

and what he's telling Maid, but the genius of that scene is I'm like, no, you're keeping Maeve around because Maeve is actually the only person in the world who's being 100% honest with you. She like sees through you. She's been in a relationship with you, and she's the only one to be like,

oh no, you're scared. You're scared and you're acting like a little bit of, you're acting like a little child and I'm going to point it to you and show you your darkest self, which I thought was like an amazing scene for me. Like I was just like, fuck yeah. Also in this situation, as Homelander, I'll be honest with you. As Homelander shifts further and further to the right, we have to talk about it, guys. I'm sorry, I know you guys don't want to get political.

You're sick of me. Just give me my superhero show. He's like fucking Colin Kaepernick. I don't want to talk about it. just want to watch superheroes. They're doing it in the boys. We have to discuss it. As Homelanders shifts further and further right, what we're seeing is, in my opinion, a commentary on that faction's treatment of women. He is holding Maeve in a cell and taking her bodily autonomy away from her. I'm sorry, guys. I don't know if they timed it up that way. I sincerely doubt

that they did. But to me, the criticism is sitting right there is that what Homelander is what wants to rob from Mave in that scene is her ability to choose whether or not she wants to be a mother. He's telling her, she has no choice in it. He's telling her that, look, look, I have a need and I have a design on your body. And my worldview matters more than what it is that you want to do with your body. You can't leave. You can't go anywhere. And God damn it, how many of our sisters in society right now, here in America, really all over the world are feeling that way right now.

So what we are seeing is homelander becoming the force of fascism and oppression that happens when you become an autocrat. When a dictator starts to rise, when a demigod starts to rise. We know that they're doing this. There was a homelander rally

that was akin to a Trump rally in this episode. Look, you guys, the Midnight Boys is not a political podcast, But the reality of the situation is we got to talk about it. I would disagree. Fuck the Supreme Court. Like, I don't give a fuck what anybody says like, fuck them.

Like, come on. Like, come on. Fuck them. Wait, before you continue, now, can I ask really quick? I'm doing it. No, I really want to know.

I'm not happening. Wait, you don't even know what I'm going to ask. Hurry up. We got to keep the show movie. What are you like? What are you doing? Do we feel like the, the Trump of it all is getting very not subtle?

Like, they're like beating us over. the head. They don't fucking care about Soto. What the fuck you're talking about? A guy called to another man's dick and exploded him. It wasn't subtle five episodes ago. Yeah, it's not subtle at all. That was my issue where I was just

like, no, I get what you guys are saying about Trump, the rise of fascism. I get it. But we've had so many episodes of it. The rally was just kind of like, I'm like, why are we doing just a Trump rally with Homelander in the front? Why is this happening? This seems like overkill

at this point. That weird like angle of spin control where he's trying to have a handle on the previous Instagram live that she did where she's like, well, she's online they're not reporting on the thing. I get the whole like, oh, just say there's human trafficking online so we can just like rewrite history.

Like, I get it, but the joke isn't really a joke. It's just kind of what's happening in reality, which makes it weird to watch because there's not really anything deeper you're saying. I'm just like, yes, we have lived through all of this. We're still living through this. I don't think I get what you're saying and they aren't being subtle about it. I don't think I understand the

point to a degree because it's clear this is what they want to say. They are telling us that we're living in this world without actually having superheroes in it and they're doing it pretty outright. I mean, look, if it's, if it's, if it's bothering you for whatever reason, you know, I'd like to see, you know, then portrayed in that light, then I can understand if your personal politics are being in the sale. No, uh, Trump supporters. I can see if that's, if that's, I think I'm at the point.

I'm going to be honest. I don't give fuck people get bad at me I've had so much Trump where I don't need it in my art anymore I'm like okay we've we've said we know it like we've said it

I couldn't disagree more I think we need I think we need to see it as much as possible because these motherfuckers aren't getting the goddamn clue wait so you think that they're going to get the clue

in the boys sometimes watch the boys like man well You know, Charles, why I'm not talking about the rational people? I'm talking about everybody else who feels a certain way and isn't motivated to get up and do something about it. I'm not talking about the other side because they're indoctrinated. I'm talking about anybody is fucked and we got to keep talking about it.

I don't want to get, I don't want to do that. And guess what that side is going to literally tell me, I guarantee you they're all going to tell me in the comments. Like, Charles, well, maybe you should just go vote. I'm like, hey, maybe this is so broken that voting to source. Charles is disenchanted. And I understand it. I thought there was going to be a point. No, no, Charles is disenchanted.

And I totally get it. I'm not in any way. Man, she's seen enough. I get it, bro. I'll fucking get it, dog. This episode is brought to by Viore. When it comes to close, that score high in both comfort and style,

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Exclusions apply, visit the website for full terms and conditions. Todd gets the shit kicked out of him. Hell yeah. Because he takes Janie to a homelander rally. I wish a motherfucker would, bro. Fuck you, dog. It's fine. Fuck if it's fine.

That's nuts. That's so nuts. A couple episodes ago, Mother's milk went to the crib and was like, hey, I don't want her watching this. Like, can you do this? And then, you know, he got sidetracked. But ultimately, like, he let her know.

He does not want his baby girl watching anything Homelander fought related. And old boy had the audacity, the gall. the cahonis to take Mother Milk's daughter to essentially like, you know, like one of them, you know, one of them white people rallies, one of them, you know, wild things, you feel me? And so, yeah, Mother's milk wasn't having it. And honestly, he got off luck with one punch.

It would have been teching out there. I would have been in combos on you. Incredible restraint from Mother's Milk. Like, from the jump, like the second that she's in the house, I would have been acting pretty ridiculous. but like the fact that like he's like still shouting at her be like, listen, you do whatever you want, don't bring her into this. And constantly, and like he just loses it after like,

well, somebody's got to be your dad. Like that's really fucked up. Wait, can I keep a 100 with y'all? Like, real quick. What's up? Janie went out so sad. Like, she looks at her dad like, how could you resort to violence?

I'm like, Janie, if you don't throw up a fucking black power sign like right now, like throw up the fist. Like, what is like, come on? It's a kid. I'm letting her slide. Yeah, because she's, She just turned 10, right? The 10-year-olds out here are radicalized.

They like, yeah. All right, okay. They were able to turn down the republic. Like, come on. I'm going to let a 10-year-old slide, Charles. I don't know about you. Yeah, what are you talking? This is 10 years old.

I'm going to let a 10-year-old relax. Yeah, like, what are you talking about? Charles, child soldier homes? How good you beat up the stashes, dad? I'm like, Jamie, if you don't start curbsters. She's like, baby, that's not used to seeing violence from her dad. Swole ass nigga. I should call ass right now.

She's not used to see violence from her father. She's scared, man. Like, you know, the violence was completely appropriate. She wasn't scared at the white power alley. If I was at that, well, I was like, there's too many white people. She probably thought it was just the fair.

Yeah. She doesn't know. She's being brainwashed. Oh, wait. Also, we can't skip past it talking about the White Power Alley. Dog, I know that this man heals and shit, but there's nothing more disgusting than Homeland are just drinking straight milk from the teeth. Just bacterious women and all that gal. No. Not pasturized?

Nothing. Just straight from the bucket? Wait, in that scene, Nadia shows up. But remember, he's about to choke her out. But he slides, she slides in some paper. Hey, you need this. I have no idea what's on the paper. Do we know what's on the paper?

Did we find out that show? Did I forget? We don't find out. But I am 98% sure that that's Ryan's address. Oh, interesting. I think that's got to be it. That's the only thing that she could slide him that he would be like, okay, cool, we can work together. That was like my first thought.

But again, I don't know. I haven't seen the finale, so I've got no idea. That's a good one. Jomi, I hadn't thought about that. Give a, give me some kind of sound effect for Jomey. We need a sound effect when, when the explainer explains. We need some sort of sound effect. Like, we'll figure it out.

Like a myth busted. Like a myth busted. Jomey explained. Jomey explained. Okay, soldier boy, is it okay if I move on to Soldier Boy? And not two of guys, does anybody have anything else they want to add real quick? Well, actually, I was thinking about, no, shut the fuck up. Excuse me.

I'm shouldn't have said that. That was not. soldier boy the hunt for minestorm mine storm scary scary to put somebody in their mind and made them stay there until they fucking starve

that's like nuts that's so sick yeah how do we feel about soldier boy and Huey as a team it's like a surrogate homelander somebody else who doesn't give a fuck about him chuck wagon oh I think I think that storyline was beautiful

because what it illustrates and what they've been trying to illustrate throughout this season is how Huey is not immune to the effects of power and he's not immune to like toxic masculinity and wanting to be more like butcher, wanting to be more like Soldier Boy, even though we think that he should know better. And I think when he's talking to the legend, and the legend is like, hey, this is what America does. America builds symbols and tells these stories whether they're true or not. I think you start seeing that Huey's like, oh, everything that I'm chasing is a lie,

this ideal of American exceptionalism, this ideal of like the great generation, is manufactured, it's marketed. And I think it was just kind of beautiful to see how Huey realizes in the woods, like, oh, damn, I'm actually following someone who has no idea, really of what they're, of the world that they're living in,

They're trying to uphold a world that should be gone already. So I just thought pairing them was beautiful. I agree. I thought it worked. I thought Soldier Boy made Huey confront some things. They were getting to the crux of what it means to be a real piece of shit. And Huey's more, Huey's still got some civilian in them.

You know, when they come up on the two people and Huey still's looking for the good people and Soldier Boys like, now sometimes you got to kill. And also Soldier Boy's fraudulent sort of side, his inauthenticity, is rubbing up against Huey's pure authenticity and who they are. And I like the back and forth the dynamic. Me, guys, what'd you like? What'd you think?

Can I quarter flip for a second? Oh, you got a quarter flip? All right. Here we go. New quarter flip sound. Ooh. Damn sense. That's sexy, Steve.

I like that shit, Steve. I like it, baby. That's good. So, so Huey multiple times makes digs at Soldier Boy because he's, he's on the weed.

And he's like, oh yeah, are you high? Are you smoking? Huey, my brother in Christ, you are taking compound. You're taking temp V. How are you going to sit here and be like,

I don't know about these drugs, man. I don't know about this. medicinal marijuana when you're out there pumping your blood with an experimental, highly dangerous drug that gives you superpowers. You're not the one to be talking, pal. I don't think he's trying to be hypocritical. I think it's more of just like, you know, old man who's never had weed, you're paranoid right now. Like, that's why you're not hearing things that aren't there. That's nuts. That's what he's not. That's what he would do that. John, I mean, to jump, my man was rolling in Russia, like out of his,

mind. So, yeah, he is throwing stones in a very, very glass apartment. Okay. I think it's more logistics. Like, you know, the reason that you're hearing us say things that we're not saying is because you're high right now. Also, wait, what type of weed is he's smoking? Like, it's got to be trash. It's got to be trash. Look, I once saw an uncle, I witnessed this, criticize a family member of mine who was going to her prom because her dress was too short, but he was high on crack. I just remember looking at him going, I just remember looking at him going,

he's like, uh-huh, kids out there, ain't got no morals. I just remember being like, this is not for me to come at anybody's addiction. The guy had a problem, but I just remember being,

I'll just sit this one out. You know, how'd you let her go to the prom and her hot-ass prom dress or whatever? Just let her go to the prom. We don't judge you. We accept you. I'm about to take 50 cents right now

and go around to the store. store and try to buy you a beer, I have to put the rest of the money into it. Don't talk about her. So what I'm telling you is sometimes people don't look at things the way they should be. Sometimes the perspective is off, Jomey. And in that situation, Huey's perspective was a little off. He thinks what he's doing isn't wrong. And he thinks Soldier Boy is all wrong.

He's taking Tim V for a reason. He wants to save everybody. He thinks Soldier Boy is a weapon. Hate Soldier Boy. Do we hate Soldier Boy more than Homeland or no, right? Not even close. Not even close? Not even close.

All right, here's the thing where Social Boys kind of like that old white man who's like, says some racist shit where it's just like, I get mad but then I'm like, dog, I didn't actually expect anything of you. So like, fine, cool. What's the cutoff year for that?

Cut off? I think... What's the cutoff year? So sometimes when old people say racist shit, like back in my day, we have the pretty, It's, oh. Is that a direct quote?

Like, do you remember this from a memory? I don't want to talk about it. But the reality is like, but the reality is what's the cutoff year to where you just go? Ah, fucking, why should I? You know, like, I'm not going to ruin my days. Cut off you.

Take it. What's the cutoff year? You know, I'm saying the year that they were born. The year that they were born? All right. Here's the thing. If you were, if you were born with the love generation, there's no excuse.

There's no excuse. I'm going to go. What's the love generation? 1960s, right? Like summer of love generation? Yeah. Okay, yeah. It's before day.

To me, you have to, it has to be before the 40s. Before the 40s, really? Before the 40s and I'm not going to trip. If you were born in the 40s, you have no excuse. 40s, 50s for me is kind of like where, if you're born there, I'm just like, all right. I was going to see. My hard cutoff was going to be the Civil Rights Act passed in 1968. So that's like the hard.

cut off. Anything born after that, you got to be on the up and that. God damn, what the hell? But, but I'm, listen, listen, listen, listen,

right, listen, listen, I'm still going. I'm still going. I'm still, can I continue to go? Can I continue to go?

Right, that's the hard line. That's the hard line. Okay. What the fuck are you talking about? Okay. Right. Like, anything after that, that's for real. Like, you,

you have a problem. You're actually racist, right? can't use that excuse, right? But then, like, you say, like, the 40s, like, I want to say, like, 45, like, World War II, you know what I'm saying? Anybody before that, yeah, they, you know, you know, all they knew was racism. So if you was born in the 40s, you get, you get no love because. What about the 50s?

The 50s. But that's what I'm saying. But see, think about it, the 50s is my mom and them, right? I can't give, my mom and them is the generation that, like, changed the world. Like, they were the, they were the feminists that, that, thought they changed the world. And then like the, the generation right before them.

So I really can't, they know what's up. But if you were born in life. Yeah. That's why there's like that gray area where it was like, ah, like you could be cool, but you might not be. That's why I put a little thing on. I feel what you're saying.

But like if you were born in like 1933, what am I going to bother you for, man? You know what I'm saying? I'm not about to bother you. You know, like you was watching the Ed Sullivan show and all of that stuff. waiting for the Beatles to go. I don't know. Anyway, that's actually, that would be later for you.

I like that little tangent. It's fun. Do we think Butcher is going to take all the compound V for himself in the end? I don't think that he's going to take all the compound V for himself again because the reality of the situation is that he didn't tell Huey about the compound V. I feel like if Butcher was going to take all the compound V for himself, that he would have told Huey, don't take it. I'm going to take it.

I think he wants them both to take it because I think his, I think his, his, his focus is not on the compound V itself, it's on mission accomplishment. And so, he's going to do whatever he has to do to get to Homelander, and that is take the compound V and make sure that Huey takes it to.

I don't, I disagree. I think, I think I'm probably a little too optimistic, but I think that's probably, he just probably said that to get Huey on board with what he was doing. I, I think that we don't have an episode of that kind of introspection from butcher without him trying to at least make some sort of a sacrifice play here.

I think that he would want to take all of it and just bar Huey from actually taking it himself. Interesting. I'm going to have a wind horse moment. Not only do I agree with Steve, I'm picking my shot, okay? I find it interesting that potentially we learn that Tempe can kill you. So I'm thinking, what's the worst thing that the writers could do to butcher? and it's not him dying from the tempth v. I think he's going to take the final dose, save Huey,

but then to save Butcher from dying, the worst thing that you could do for Butcher is make him a permanent superhero, give him permanent powers. And I think that, like, my prediction is that he's going to be on the verge of death. Hughie Star, like, someone is going to inject him with, like, permanent V.

And then the entire next season is going to be what happens when a person, who hates superheroes has to live with being one for the rest of his life. That's what I think is going to happen. That's where I'm at. I'm at the same way.

I think both of them, because like I said in the beginning, and it was like, you guys are going to die. This temp V is going to kill you. And the only way to save each of their lives is to take the actual compound V. And so I think that's where we end

this season. I think that's where... I think I know how the CLEMEC is going to end. I think the season is... I know. I think the season is going to end with a butcher driving away in a limousine. And then the limousine partition is going to go down. And we're going to turn around and see this actually one of Bush's other personalities that we've been waiting for to show the entire show. All right.

Let's go to turn around with the gun and the silent. No, you don't tell me when to move it along. I fucking move it along. And I'm making a Jake Lockley joke. And we're going to fucking stay on it right now. I like Jake Lockley. You are so. What's got to need to you?

You're so tired. today in Craby. I'm not tired. You know what I am? I'm inspired, baby. They're tired. You know what, you know what, guys?

Adjective of the day. You know who we are, guys? We're the fucking midnight boys. That's who we are. The fucking four of us. We don't get fucking tired. You know what? If this was a real situation,

we would be the boys. And we would fucking take people on. You know what I mean? and we would fucking fuck people up and we would do all kinds of differences. We're the fucking greatest team in the history of fucking podcasting right now to fucking Midnight Boys.

We don't get tired. We get inspired, kick fucking ass. This episode is brought to by Paramount Plus. Beth and Rip are back in a new series, Dutton Ranch. Kelly Riley and Cole has a return and this time they're taking on Texas. As Beth and Rip build a future together,

peace will have to wait as they face corruption, danger, and a ruthless rival ranch willing to protect its secrets at all costs. Legacy is a beautiful thing, but only if it survives. Dunton Ranch starring Colehouser, Kelly Riley, Annette Benning, and Ed Harris, now streaming on Paramount Plus. This episode is brought to by Borris Head.

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they dance. He gets put squarely in the friend zone. Tough. Whoa, that's not the friend zone. Stop. Put in the friend zone. Be mature.

No. He got put in the friend zone. No. He didn't. He didn't. He didn't. She said, we're more than that. You know what?

Y'all? So she kissed. They kissed. She said, I didn't like, I didn't like, the kiss wasn't bad, but we're more than that. We're family. She enjoyed the kiss. She said she enjoyed, telling you, I'm looking at three friend zone all-stars here.

And the reality is, you got, you got, you got, you got, you got. And you're just thinking about this. No, I'm telling you, as, he got put in the worst in the friends zone. He got put in the friends and family zone. He's on the friends and family plan.

Great tickets to the game. I'm wrong about this. Tell me why I'm wrong, Steve. I mean, first of all, the friends zone's bullshit. Second of all, I, like, Friends zones bullshit. Clearly, Kimiko is like, valuing Frenchie for the help that he's giving her and not, like, just a pure romantic thing. Like, everything that they've been through this past season,

like, she sees a lot more than that. and it doesn't have to exactly manifest in a romantic way. Like, here's the thing. Kimiko is doing the ultimate act of love. For this entire, the entire time we've known,

Kimiko, she's been like, these powers are a curse. I hate these powers. And then the minute that she sees that French, she's almost about to die, and she feels like

she's helpless and powerless in that scenario. She's like, I want these powers again because you are the most important thing in my life. If I lose you, I lose everything.

family. How's that putting someone in the friend zone? That's the opposite. Yeah. She's like, I want you in my life forever. He's on Love Island. I just, I feel like, I mean, because I saw that conversation on the internet, I was like, what did I watch a different scene?

You know, because she, like, this isn't about protected mother's milk or Annie or Huey or Butcher. It's about squarely her and friendship. Like, hey man, I'm rocking with you. Whatever. I need you to protect you, I'm gonna do it. That's how much I care.

That's how much I love you. You don't do that for your homie. You feel me? I got homies. Hey, Jomi, I need you take V for me. Nah, I'm good. I see you. Can I give you a question?

Do you do it for your brothers? I got one from your sisters. I got what I might think about. Okay, so let's get back to not what you guys are conjecturing. Let's get back to what was actually said. Okay? Let's get back to what was actually said. So what was actually said was, we're more than that.

We're family. So you guys are all talking about friends, right? What she said was, I did not not like the kiss. So we're more than that. We're family. So you do it for your brother. You do it for your brother. Steve, you're an only child, right?

No, I have a sister. She said, we're more than a kiss. We're family. I have to protect my family. That's friend zone. You just said family, family, family, family. How is that friend zone? Friends and family zone is what I said before.

No, no, no. I don't got friends. There's not a friends and family zone. The family zone is actually a higher level than the friend zone. No. You're like a bonkers. All right, can I ask, can I ask the mid-addition in the question? What year do you give the cutoff for people who make dumb jokes about the friend zone?

Here's my answer to that. Van is old. You know what? Never mind. It's going to get personal. I don't know where you're going with this, buddy. Yo, you're wild in this episode, man. The friend zone is real.

The friend zone is real. All right. I like the little dance. It was good. Oh, look, I thought one of the most interesting situations in this entire episode was Black Noir's vision. Charles, do you like Black Noir? Do you like the fact that this was Black Noir finally got some run in this episode?

I liked the plot in theory. Like I was just like, oh, this is really, really interesting. Part of me was just like, was this like a budgetary concern where like you want episode seven? We got a lot of shit to get through. Like, let's just draw some cartoons in. Like the cartoons were cool. But part of me was like, it would have been cooler to see like Soldier Boy like legitimately.

handing it to all of his teammates. Am I being, like, am I being a negative Nancy about that? I think that, like, it's kind of a fair and unfair criticism. There's a clear artistic choice as to why they did the cartoon flashback, and it's like how he can literally only process what's happened to him. No, I understand that. Not only because it's like a deep emotional trauma, but, like, he's been beaten in the head severely.

I liked it. I think it might have just, I think the, like, the sting of it might have, been lost a little bit plot wise only to make it much of a bummer for black noir. Can I also ask this? This is a question for Van. How would you feel? Like, I would actually burn down the whole world if I

had the chance to be in Beverly Hills cop. Oh, shit. Brough. And so you, though. Such a good question, Doc. Such a good question. Like, what would be the movie for you where it's literally like, if your boy stopped you, you would be like, all right, we're throwing hands. White man can't jump.

when I was a kid I wanted to be Sydney Dean bro I thought Sidney Dean was so cool and looking back on that motherfucker couldn't play ball at all Wesley was fucking Okay but like Are you gonna get that mad if somebody said

I'm sorry then You might not be Wesley Snipes You might not be Wesley Snipes You might not be Sydney D that was my Because when he said that I thought Jesus How does Black Noir's life change

If he's Axel Foley And Beverly Hills Cop That's nuts Like everything is totally different. But could he carry the movie? Like he's not going to do what Eddie did. No. It's not going to be Beverly Hills cop.

Probably not. But that was funny. And look, the animation was Kalika's favorite part. And I think it worked for me because I understand your perspective, Charles, because I felt like that initially as well, right? Like, I would like to see this. But maybe people's schedules or whatever, something happened. whatever. But also, I think it perfectly

serves the... Number one, it tells you something about Black Noir's character. Yeah. The fact that he's been so damaged by this that he is remembering this throughout the animation or whatever. Okay. And that's the way he's perceiving the world. So it tells you a little bit. It's actually a character development for him. And it's also, it's a cool storytelling point. You know, we've seen the boys drifted to some musical stuff. We've seen them switch it up a little. little bit. They're not just giving us A plus B plus C plus D linearly, the mirror scene and all of that

stuff. So I feel like it fits with the tone of the show and some of the narrative chances that they take. But I do, for something that was maybe that important, there's a part of me that was like, yeah, man, wouldn't I want to just see kind of how that went down? You know what I'm saying? So I feel what you're talking about, though. I do. What do we feel like it's going to happen with Black Noir? Oh, he's out of here. He's out of here. He's out of here. He's got to eat his one. right but he need his ones right so he's gonna pull up on soldier boy and we're gonna have to see I mean I

I think I agree with you Stephen Charles I think it might be Pac Watch but he's gonna give it his best shot and we gotta respect oh you feel like he wants he wants the one-on-one fade with soldier oh yeah yeah for sure he won his ones yeah it's time it's time I think that's probably like

to make that alliance again with like butcher and Huey and block how the fucking soldier boy gonna go up against homelander and black noir at the same time. I feel like that's a soft team up between Homelander and Soldier Boy. If we might,

like that could be a heel turn. If that's a kid. So Homelander's Soldier Boy. Yeah, we haven't even talked about that yet. Homelander Soldier Boy, wait, you feel like they're gonna team up together? I think it's gonna be Black Noir and Homelander against Soldier Boy.

Where's Butcher fall into that? Yeah. I have no idea. I mean, Homelander is Soldier Boy's son. he felt no type of ways about that. He's like, fuck you, oh, man. Well, I mean, I don't know, right? Because Homeland is, you know.

Yeah, I don't know that. His whole, he's looking to be loved. Yeah. Exactly. His whole mental thing is like, I, man, I wish I had, you know, somebody to love me. And if Soldier Boy even presents an iota of somebody. He's probably eating out of the Palmer's hand.

Exactly. Right. But Soldier Boy seemed like he's not because Soldier Boy told him, he's just like, yo, if Vought would have told me back then, like, hey, I'm going to have a son. He'll be, like, the most powerful being. I would have stepped away. Like, I would have been like, yo, cool, like, cool, a son. It seemed like that was an implication like Soldier Boy is like, because they did me dirty,

your Vought boy, I'm taking you out. It's too late. No, I think, you know, I think, because he, I mean, it was a weird like parlay conversation, right? Because that's what Mindstorm tells Soldier Boy, right? I was like, hey, there was going to replace you. They had a son, whatever. we had to get rid of you, da-da-da, kills him, goes back, makes the calls like, hey, pal, you're my son.

And that turns Homelander's world upside down. Because, again, I think it does too. Yeah, it's got to. All right. You guys might be right. You might be right. I think it does too. I think that we've set up a dynamic where Soldier Boy is searching for, excuse me, a

homelander is searching for some sort of connection. And the connection that he's searching for is always, it's always broken because the people that he has looked to for that connection have already proven to him that they can't provide it, right? So whether it be Madeline, whether it be the guys from the facility he was with, they've already failed him. The only person that he has an inherent connection to that hasn't failed him yet is Soldier Boy. Like, Soldier Boy is probably not going to be dad of the year, but he might be. You know what I mean? And so I think that homelander in that situation is probably a little confused as to how he should move on and handle that because, you know, everybody else, they already fucked them.

But in this situation, you have a guy who didn't know he was his father. They might be okay. And if you're somebody who wants to be loved and we know that more than anything he wants to be loved, then are you tempted to take a shot? that maybe your father will love you after all of this time, you know? And who knows what kind of power play Soldier Boys playing? Yeah, you know, who's Soulja Boys probably, you know,

and now does this change Soldier Boys? Soldier Boy, to this point, has had no opinion of Homelander other than he was a means to an end to get to the rest of payback. Now that you know he's actually your son and there's a tie to you,

does it change your opinion on him a little bit? Can you kill your son? I mean, This is a universe where people fuck over their kids all the time. This is one of the most redeeming things about Nadia that's care so much about our kids. So I guess the question is like, do you, can you do that? You know, like who, how does this change things? And I really, I honestly don't know. Like, I honestly don't know.

What's your prediction for the finale, Charles? I think now that I'm talking to you guys, you guys are convinced me, I wouldn't be surprised if it's going to be Black Noir versus Soldier Boy. homelander is stuck in the middle because they threw out that thing where like, Homelander is like, yo,

Black Noir left? Like, how could you? And part of me is just like, does Homelander stick with his homie? Or does Homelander say, actually, fuck you, black noir. Like, we're starting over the seven.

I have somebody back in my corner, my father. But part of me is like, does Soldier Boy make it out of this season? Like, Joanna made a good point a couple episodes ago where she's like, typically the villain, the mini boss,

of the seasons don't make it out. You know what I mean? Yeah. I mean, you're right. I mean, that's the thing, right? They bring somebody on to the show for a season and we know they're not going to survive to the next season. Does that change with Jensen Ackles and Soldier Boy this year?

It's too good, though. He's too good to only use one season. Yeah. You got to put him in like the Steve Harrington thing where you're like, we was going to kill you, but no, you fire. You got to come back. I think this is the first shot. for the boys to do something really, really big. I won't go as far as to say like the death of butcher or the death of

Homelander just yet. But I think so many of those big pieces are coming to a head-on collision that I think something is going to be a major. The power dynamic in the boys' EU is about to change for. I will say it's Packwatch for Black Noir Noir number one. And I think Starlight might, it might be. I be curtains for Starlight? Here's my thing.

She's too powerful. And like part of me, this, I was just like, oh, she's really just running circles around Homelander. Like,

I don't know. Like, it's scary. I don't want anything to happen to her. It's just like story-wise. I'm just like, there's only so many times you can embarrass Homelander

in the series before the writers. So great scene, though, when she knows how to fight him. She fights him in his image. They're like, like, he's doing his,

this whole thing, admitting to the crazy shit that went on with Supersonic. And she puts them on live. She knows how to his kryptonite is his perception. It's his, what would it be? His kryptonite would be, it would be the fact that he needs to be loved. I'm trying to feel a more concise way to say that. But when have I been concise? Oh, look, before we go, there's one more thread I want to talk about.

I want to talk about the creator of one of the greatest video games I've never gotten to play. It's a Middle Passage video game. Oh my God. Oh. You guys, I'm serious. I made a couple calls.

No. You might see, you might see, I made a couple calls. Ubisoft presents Middle Passage. Ubisoft, I would go with Rockstar. Rockstar, it would be. be so nuts if Rockstar did the last video. Oh, my goodness gracious.

Wait, actually, this is... First off, first off, Rockstar got to make GTA 6, so relax on that one. They don't need to. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. What if GTA6 was the Middle Passage game?

There's no... You can't grant theft auto across the Atlantic, then. You can grant theft auto a ship, baby, pirates. Like, think about that. What if GTA 6, GTA... We have assassins... read black flag. Actually, you know what? This is the perfect time because I've been meaning to do it for the same for the end of the episode. I need a van to come to the bad take table because you've been whiling on Twitter in a way that is like my boy, is everything okay. Well, first of all, we have to talk about before we do this, we have to talk about A train. Real quick, Charles, I want to know, I have to ask you. I'll do that. I'll come to the bad takes. Bad takes. Charles, what do you think about A train getting the, getting the heart of Steve?

Here's the thing. fine what was worse you know they catch that why he said he got the heart and Steve he said Steve is black heart

or blue hot that's foul but here's the thing fight back what makes it worse is like imagine you like you realize you got a the man who like

has crippled your brother this racist you have his heart that's bad like that's bad what's worse is asking

turns around and be like, oh yeah, we're making a movie of your life. Instead of your brother, we got Tom Hanks. I'm like, don't like, come on. That's so funny, bro. That scene was so hilarious, bro. It's rough. That scene was so hilarious. By the way, this puts A-Train.

That's why I want to talk about this real quick. This puts A-Train back into the rotation. A-Train is now officially a soup again because he's gotten a heart transplant. So the question is, because we've seen A-Train have a small come to Jesus moment, every time A-Train, we think A-Train's come to Jesus or come to whatever. it's a it's a colloquialism guys it's like a fucking saying okay i'm not trying to push religion on you but every time we see a train have this moment um he backs out like he he he we think he's going to be okay but then he the question is now that he is fully souped again he can run without

a fear of fear of death or risking uh death does a train join in the fight against homeland or what does a train do does i already know what's happening I already know. I can predict it. Tell me, bro. Fucking, I love when you do this prediction shit.

I would not be surprised if they gave him his powers back in the penultimate episode because we have to go back to hero-gazom when him and Huey have that disagreement.

If you think about what would be the worst thing for Huey to experience in a day, one, it would be to lose Starlight. The second would be what happens if

A-Train has to end up saving Huey, where it's just like, Huey can barely stand it when Starlight saves him. What happens?

when the person who murdered his former girlfriend has this change of heart and it's like, I'm going to save Huey. I'm going to do this selfless thing. If I'm Huey, I would not know how to feel. I'd be like, fuck A-Train. I definitely think something's going to happen like that.

I'll be honest with you guys. All of y'all predictions this fucking show have been on fire. Like, every single thing, but I'm serious, man. Every single thing would be great and amazing.

makes sense within the fabric of the show. And I'm telling you that's because the narrative of this show is so tight. It's singing. This is a good fucking show. Like, yeah, like the narrative is the show site. We're not going,

hey, maybe we'll see this. Whatever. So Charles, bad takes. Give it to me. Yeah, I need to take you to the bad take table.

I agree with my brother, Jomey. The first one is this isn't the word. This is a lukewarm one. Man, we don't need a Dr. Doe movie. Like,

just put that man in the fantastic floor, like come on. Just put him in the fantastic floor. Like, being cute about that shit. Like, you was way too excited, man. Like, come on. Do I get to make my case for it?

You can make your case. This is the first one. It's not the worst one. Or you're just kicking my ass, putting your whole shoe in my butt. Do I get to make my case? Make your case, dude. So this is, this is what I make my case. First of all, I'm surprised at this take, and I'll tell you why.

I'm surprised at this take because the reality of the situation is with so few characters that people give a shit about it. I'm sorry, guys. To make movies about right now in the MCU, I'm surprised that one of the most consequential villains, I one of those consequential villains, because to relegate Dr. Doom to just being a villain or to just being a part of the Fantastic Four story is such...

We're not saying that. Hold on. Hold on. Wait, wait, wait, wait. Hold on. Hold on. Is such a reductive way to look at that character. Secondly, secondly, with... the character that is that important in the Marvel comic book universe and then could be that important in the Marvel cinematic universe, I think having a movie where his character gets totally fleshed out and then meets the Fantastic Four is a lot better of a storytelling

device than having to put Doom who is equally as important in the Marvel universe to the Fantastic Four, maybe more important to have their own movie. I think it makes sense from a storytelling standpoint. I think it makes sense from like just a movie making standpoint. I don't see why Doom

wouldn't get his own movie. I think you need as much backstory on Doom as possible, which is why they haven't gotten Doom right, because he's too big to be an also-ran B-plot character in a Fantastic Four movie, and I think it's a fantastic I'll ask you this.

No punitated idea. There's a thing. You want to know what makes Infinity War so great? That's a Thanos movie. That's a Thanos movie. That is not Doom. Doom is so much more important and consequential to tomorrow. As a villain,

is you understand what makes him tick by the people that are going against him. My problem with a lot of these villain movies is that when you try to make the villain in the center of your film, it's not saying that you can't do it, It is a very high bar to clear because you learn so much about villains by who's opposing them. You can learn way more about Doom if you establish him in a fantastic four movie.

Now, if they want to make a fucking Disney Plus show after that, they want to do a spin-off after that. That's not true. That's 100% true. Give me an example. Give me an example of a villain movie where we learn too much about the villain. I just want to know. No, I'm not saying you learn too much. I'm saying that it is very hard to establish worthwhile stakes because you're literally like dog.

I want an example. I'm not going to. Here's what I'll say. The best Magneto we've ever gotten on screen is I would imagine first class. And the reason first class works so well is because you have the dichotomy of Magneto and of Charles. Right. You see, you learn about what happened to, to Magneto in, in the Holocaust. You see what happened to him afterwards, trying to find all the Nazis that, you know, made his life a living hell.

Understandably so, right? And then you get to Charles like, hey, we, you know, we can team up, man. We don't have to be doing all this. And then at the end, you see there split, right? But that movie works the way it does, right? Even with all that spent time with Magneto is because you have the flip side. of the coin between him and Charles. We don't have to have just a Magneto film to make that work.

Like, you can have heroes and villains together, learn about the villain, and still be like, oh, right, this movie, this film worked. I understand. Like, we don't have to have a Doom movie to understand Doom. There's a couple of, there's a couple of assumptions being made here, all right? The first assumption is that there wouldn't be any heroes in a Doom movie, which I didn't see that said. Like so that's the first assumption that's being made.

I don't know if the Fantastic Four would necessarily be in it, but I don't know how they would do it, but there's assumptions being made here. The first assumptions that there would be no heroes. I haven't seen that. I haven't seen that set, you know. Obviously, in a movie where we learn about Doom, I would argue that your first class point actually cuts against what we're talking about

because that movie, in my opinion, is more about Magneto than it is about Xavier, right? And it's an origin story for both of them. And it was an origin story that was necessary, or at least they thought it was necessary, to move on with the characters in a way that pays equal service to each of them. In the first X-Men trilogy, or whatever have you, Magneto was clearly a secondary issue to Xavier

because they didn't really feel like they needed those characters to be on equal standing. In this particular situation, moving forward, I would argue that in order to go forward and perhaps get God King Doom, that you might get in a Secret Wars movie, right? In order to get as much doom as is going to be possible in his next, you're going to need a big chunk of the character to understand him,

even more than what we got from Thanos. So he can't be the second on the call sheet in a Fantastic Four movie? Like, I'm just saying, why didn't Morbius work? Why didn't Morbius work? Well, I'll tell you why Morbius didn't work because it wasn't a good movie, right? The reason why Morbius didn't work is because it wasn't a good movie. I guess the question I can ask you is why did Venom work? All right.

Venom works in terms of entertainment, but there is a better Venom movie with Spider-Man in it. Like, if we're just going to be real, there's a better- There's actually a worse Venom movie with Spider-Man in it. And then we have- What are you talking about? Spider-Man 3 is the worst. All right, well, that's bad because of a lot of other issues. That's a bad. Well,

hold on for a second now. This is where arguments that are being conjectured, like, this is where arguments that are being conjectured like fly out of the face of reality. We're talking about what actually happened.

So, so, so, so, so, so, so, so,

so, so, wait a second. I like, you, like, you brought up Morbius. Venom is a movie that people liked.

You said it's a better views. Venom was in Spider-Man, and the entire story of the symbiate and all of that was crammed into a little piece of the movie and it didn't fucking work. I'm not saying that they needed to make a Vennem movie. I'm saying that Vennam was portrayed better and more cleverly and more expansive in his own movie than he was in Spider-Man 3. And I'm saying that just because you have a movie that is centered around a villain does not necessarily mean that the movie itself is going to be lacking. All right.

So then I'll put it to you. Is there any villain movie that has been made in the superhero genre that you would put up. as like the top tier of what the genre can do. No, because they haven't made enough of them. But the track is not looking great. But they haven't made enough of them. But what I'll say is though, they've also never had in any of these, in my opinion,

in any of this stuff, a villain like Dr. Doom. They've never had a villain like Dr. Doom. No, now here's the thing about the Joker. The Joker movie to me is not my cup of tea. because the movie itself is the movie itself is aggressively and made in a way that's not for me. I don't like a movie that celebrates in sales.

So like for me personally, it didn't work. But can you make an interesting movie about Joker? Yeah, what? Like they gave Harley Quinn a movie. I liked it a lot. No. Y'all didn't like Harley Quinn. Birds of prey was great.

So what the fuck are you talking about? They know, you're not doing it. What are you talking? Black Canary? What are you talking? So what I'm talking about is like I, I respect the opinion that Jomey has. I respect your opinion. I disagree. And I think a lot of people probably was. It's a long episode. You can tack this on. My last one is there's two, but we don't have to talk about the second one. I recast Tachala, man. We got to put it on ice, bro. Like, you love yourself. Like love yourself, bro. Like, I love you too much to see you arguing about this shit.

It's why. It's nuts. You got a fact that I want up, pal. Come on, man. Okay, so I haven't going to pack it up, but let me tell you why. I don't know. I'm a pack it up. But let me tell you why.

Let me tell you why. And I want, and I'm sorry to say this the way it's going to be said. But this is my issue with the recast the child of thing. Black people can't have nice things. Y'all. Damn, bro. Let me explain to you. Let me explain to you what I mean.

Let me explain to you what I mean. Let me explain to you what I mean. This is what I've noticed. Let me explain to you what I mean. Tachala, first of all, there is a cognitive dissonance that's going on with Tchala. People are saying, why do we need Tchala to be Black Panther when we can have all these other people be Black Panther? Shuri has been Black Panther. You can have, Bacu will be Black Panther.

Nobody's talking about Black Panther. We're talking about. Tchalla, right? So we're talking about what essentially would have happened if Robert Donnie Jr. would have passed away after Iron Man 2. Right? So, so like, we're talking about Tachala, the character, not Black Panther,

who somebody could come out as to be Black Panther. We're talking about Tchala, the character. A character with as rich, a history, a character who we haven't even scratched the surface of what he can do. We don't have a concept of Tataa's intellect, his diplomacy, he hasn't grown into the king that he was going to be, he hasn't had to lose at all.

The character that Tachala represents to the Avengers and to the larger Marvel universe, if you are at all familiar with the comic book background of the character, is central and important in a way that nobody in Wakanda comes close to, and it's a fact. And that's just the reality of it. And it's a reality that 99% of the stories

that involve Wakanda, that involve all of that stuff. 97 involved Tachala, because Tachala is singularly one of the most important characters in the history of the Marvel universe, especially lately. Lately, in what he represents in Wakanda and all of this stuff.

The thing between Namor and Tachala is as much a personal thing as it is actually about Atlantis and Wakanda. We're not arguing. Here's a thing, though. Can you save it for Wakanda forever? No, no, let him for the trust. Wait, wait, wait, wait.

So my point is this. Us as a people, we, and I'm going to talk to the people that I've talked to. We love Chadwick Bowesman. We love Chadwick Bowesman. I love Chadwick Bowesman. My dog is named after Chadwick Bowesman. We love Chadwick Bowesman in a way that a different culture community might not love Chris Evans. They might not love Robert Downey Jr.

Because the movie itself played on so many personal things about us, right? Played on so many identity things about us. And we connected those things to Chadwick Bowman, right? I understand that and I get that. And I understand how hard it would be to move on from Chadwick Bowman, ask to Chalachal for his friends. What I'm telling you is for me personally, and nobody has to agree,

and it doesn't make sense to discuss it because he gets too common. convoluted, but there's something there that's even more important than one guy. And the thing is how we approach and tell the stories of our heroes. And when I say our heroes, I'm talking about the heroes that have mattered to us. And we can pretend like Shuri or Killmonger or any of these people have mattered as much as Chachala, but they haven't. They haven't. So the reality is, just like different actors play different roles throughout history for all of these other things because people understand it's important

for you to get a new take on Spider-Man, for you to get a different take on Batman, for you to get a different take on Superman, because the character matters. To Child is the same thing, and it doesn't become less important because we're emotionally connected to the actor who portrayed him,

and that's just the way it is. I don't think that Chad with Bowesman will want this. I do not think he would want this at all, the character to die. I know that his family doesn't want it, and it's, to me, a futile argument to have now and it just like,

it makes me sad to keep thinking about our brother who we lost and to be talking about this movie so I'm not going to do it anymore but the fact that because and the last thing I will say about it is this seriously, no, I want to say this because no, you guys just like

here's a thing I just love you. No, no, no, no. The last thing I want to say about it is this is there something uniquely, there's a pain here that's uniquely black. We lost, Chadwick Bowman at 44 years old to a disease that affects us, we lost them to a health issue too soon. Like Robert Downey Jr. kicking strong. The rest of these guys kicking strong, we lost our hero.

We lost our hero at 44 to a health disease. This is what happens to us. The only way we can honor this is not to kill Tachala along with our brother. We get to write how we want Tachala to live. He gets to live forever. He gets to live for fucking ever. We don't get to live forever. We got to die a weird shit. We got to die by the cops. We don't get to.

Tachala gets to live forever. It's not fair. I'm sorry. It's not fair. I don't agree with it. I'm about to fucking get upset. Like, it's not fair. And I, and I, and I, because no, I, I agree with you, right?

Like, everything she said, like, makes sense. but for me, and this is just really simple, the people behind, you know, the scenes, the people behind making this character come to life, aside from Chadwick, you know, the actors, the producers, you know, Faggy, all of them, they decided that it was too hard for them to come back and do this thing

and have a movie without Chadwick-as-Tich-Challa. and I respect that. Like that's really it. It's just I... Fair enough. I understand. Like, how hard is it to come in and say, like, you help build this character with this person.

And now, like, you, like, Ryan Coogler having to, like, write to Chala, but it's not Chowahua. How much that would hurt him and how the actors and actresses would have to come in and call somebody to Chala who wasn't Chowick? They're emotionally invested. And they're like, I don't know. They can't do this. I'm like, cool. I understand. If they can't do it,

I don't, like, that's fine with, that's fine with me. Y'all go ahead and make the movie that you have to make. Like, that's really it for me. I'm empathizing with the people who feel like they can't do this without, they can't do Tchala without Chahua right now. But I still think that in the future, I don't, you know, with the multiverse, you know, we'll probably get a Tachala from a different universe, whatever, da-da-da.

But the 6-1-6-Tichala, the one in this universe being dead, and them saying like, hey, we can't, we're not willing, we're not ready to just call somebody else a child just yet. I am cool with them thinking that. And I, I can, I can understand. I can understand. I tend to agree with Joe Me and all I'll say is like my black brothers on the Midnight Boys. I just want us to table this discussion until Wakanda forever.

Because if it's cheeks, we're going to have, we're going to have it out. We're like, we're going to talk it out. It's just, I don't want to keep arguing with it. No, either, you know, I won't, I won't, I'm not. I'm off it. But either way, I respect their decision. I respect what Jomi's saying. I don't think Chachala is theirs to decide whether or not they want to give us more

Chala or not. I don't think that he's their character to do that with. But I respect that. And on a human level, I understand it. What I'm saying is, I'd like to hear a plan. Like, I like to hear a plan. I think that's fair. I think that's fair. I think that's fair. I've been

reading this motherfucker since I was nine years old. All right. Well, that was the bad take table. three fucking Peter Parker's in one fucking movie. God damn it. All right. Now's the bad take table.

The other bad take that we don't have time for is the Wolverine one. We'll get to that later. I think we should do it. But the reality is Wolverine is fucking fine Hugh Jackman

was perfect as Wolverine. All y'all being weirdos. All right, I want Wolverine to be played. No, you can't be six four. You can't be six four in the club telling us telling the short kings they don't deserve Wolverine. Come on, man.

I want Emmanuel Lewis as Wolverine. Yeah, it doesn't matter at this point. It's high he cares. The watch tweet you got that was comparing like, well, if Storm, I'm like, whoa, we are not comparing shortness to blackness now. That's nuts, bro. Like, we ain't doing that shit, bro. I will say this on the Wolverine thing. I will say this, though.

They did point out a bunch of shorter actors that could play Wolverine and body Wolverine that I hadn't thought about. So if you have the short actors, I mean, why wouldn't you use one? I was just getting tired of people just fucking arguing about that. I really did it to get off the Tchala thing, to be honest. I wanted to get off the T'Chala thing because I just want, I don't know why, Charles, you're right, I'm not having a T'Chalal conversation anymore.

Seriously, not, no. Because here's the thing, everything you're saying, like, emotionally I get, I'm just like, why is it being arguing on the fourth, on the fourth, like, we get about this shit, right? You too damn rich. I'm not rich. All right.

That is it for us. We're going to come back. Miss Marvel. Tomorrow, the House of Ours, going to give you a deep dive in the penult to the mid-episode of Miss Marvel. Charles, tell people how you felt about it.

Oh, we ain't doing that. Out of watching. We're going to be talking about the Miss Marvel finale next Wednesday and then Friday, the Midnight Boys are going to give you their reactions to the latest MCU entry Thor,

Thor, Love, and Thunder. You don't want to miss that. You don't want to miss this conversation of the Midnight Boys, Thor, Thor, Love, and Thunder. I'm telling you right now, you don't want to miss it. I fresh off.

I saw the movie last night. A shout out to the homies. We saw the movie. We're going to have a nice spirit of discussion. We might give you two hours on Thor 11th, I don't know. I don't know. Probably not. Producer's credits.

Our producer is Steve Almond Joy, the cuddly summer lover bear. Jomi, the explainer. Jomey, the theorizer, the dinner on, on socials. Hashtad, make this. house into a joan on social media. All right. Okay.

Okay. We need to have a discussion like as a team. Like off, off air. I got one every week, guys. Every week. After we end this podcast,

I'm laying into you. What is this? No. What's going on? What are you trying to do? You got to win it. That's so fucking funny, Steve. That's not for,

who's laughing? I'm not laughing. I didn't see that until just now. just ridiculous additional production from our I'm glad you guys I'm glad you guys having fun

Charles Charles take us out The boys is the best superhero show out that shit is smooth as silk but I know my man six Steve

is drinking Are y'all milk drinkers? I know Steve is. Are y'all? Like, are you? No, you know what? No, finish that thought, man. Why?

Why? Why? Like, I never understood that about white people. I was at my home boys. I was at my home boy's crib. I was a kid. His mom made lasagna. Bomb-ass lasagna, right?

She's like, you want something to drink? I'm like, yeah, what's your guy? She's like, yeah, let's have ginger ale. Bring me over with ginger ale. I have lasagna, ginger ale. Taste go together. We eat lasagna and this motherfucker gets a tall glass of milk with the lasagna.

Yeah, let's have it. Disgusting. I'm like, what the fuck, dog? Like, you may mean I want to have my lasagna no more, man. What the hell's going on? And I already know Jomi's not a milk drinker. I can look at him and tell. Is this a toss-up for me?

Could be, but you probably not. You're probably too angry for milk. I don't drink cows milk. I have never drank. Here's, I grew up around a lot of white people. They do do that shit where they'll be eating meatloaf and then they just have a whole glass of milk. Again, I don't, I do not sign for this. Like, this is not me.

I would never do that ever. And here's the thing. If we're rating milks, I'm a big almond milk drinker, big oat milk. Oat milk is the shit. Oat milk is the best. Everything else. But yeah, I'm not doing the, I'm not doing the, I will. I will say that I do like dips.

stuff in milk. Yeah, cookies and stuff. Cereal. Cuts or a piece of cake. Let's back up. What else are you dipping in milk besides like a pastry or a dessert? Pastery. So like it's not like anything else besides that. But it's like, it's like, I was like to think

you were going to be like a hot dog and I'm like, yeah. Jesus Christ, this is disgusting. Just Steve. How much, uh, how much milk do you drink? Like, so little. Like I have not had, I don't think I've had cow's milk

in years. Like actually you haven't had it in years? No, yeah, for sure. Like I commit some stinky crimes.

Yeah, you got to, you got to play, uh, stop the cap. No, absolutely. I'm not,

I'm not, I'm not, I'm not. I'm not. Absolutely. Play the music. Absolutely. No.

Play it. Play the music. Play the music. That's three against one. You got to play the music. I'll take a picture of our fridge right now. There's a,

there's a milk in there. You were laying down with the girl, y'all watching Selma. You got up. He's like, hey, girl, you want something to drink? Feels like every product claims real protein these days. But real doesn't start on a label.

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