The Ringer-Verse - ‘The Boys’ Season 4, Episode 7 and ‘The Acolyte’ Episode 7 Instant Reactions | The Midnight Boys

Episode Date: July 11, 2024

The Midnight Boys dive into the penultimate episode of Season 4 of ‘The Boys,’ discussing how Sister Sage loses Homelander's trust, why the show’s shock value has grown stale, and the overall quality of the season as we get closer to the finale (07:13). Later, the boys break down the penultimate episode of ‘The Acolyte.’ They dive into the overall success of Disney+ shows from the 'Star Wars' and Marvel universes and what this show has to say about police as it pertains to the Jedi (52:49). Hosts: Charles Holmes, Van Lathan, Steve Ahlman, and Jomi Adeniran Producers: Aleya Zenieris, Jonathan Kermah, and Steve Ahlman Additional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopal Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Yeah, you'd be pretty happy about those WeatherTech seat protectors. So just to be clear as the mud, you're inevitably going to step into the summer. You don't need WeatherTech unless you plan on doing summer. Visit weathertech.com today. Welcome into the Ringiverse. This is, of course, the Ringers' Nexus podcast fee for all things fandom. We are Steve, the architect Alman.

The builder and tinker of things we are. Jomey, the Expladeron. You've got questions. He's got answers. We are. Old Man Van here, the receding resurgent hairline. We are. Coke baby Chuck, the 24-carat closure.

That silence was. And we got the Midnight Collective rocking with us. Alea, no nitnames. Nairus. Nope, nickname. No nickname. I'll tell you something, this is the last weekend, the last week with the last show with no nickname for a later.

I don't even believe you. I swear. Okay. I've been taking suggestions and the people have had some great suggestions. Also, we have Arjuna, the Watcher, Ramgapal. And making his return, oh, the Chaco Taco Taco, Mr. Midnight, Count Honkula. I'll take that one.

I like that. Jonathan Kerma. They are the collective. We are known as The Midnight Boys. Woo! False on socials. Insta, Twitter,

Facebook, TikTok. For now, save Yomi Jock. We're almost on 30K on Instagram. Oh, wow. So y'all hit that follow button. We talked about,

me and Steve talked about this earlier. If you guys get us to 30K, Steve's going to rap, not like us, the entire song. Yes. All the whole thing. Mm-hmm.

Musard on a Bho, D, Bo, he a rep. Not until 30K. 30K. And you can look forward to. At 30K, you're going to say, Nick? It's going to be his 70K by the end of this pod.

Bro, can you imagine Steve turns into Quentin Tarantino? What? Damn. Steve's saying, now 30, okay, 30K. Hey, you heard of here folks, folks, go follow. It's funny. All right, we're not on YouTube. You can watch every midnight boy's house of our

Talk to Thrones episodes on YouTube.com backslash at Ringiverse. Like, comment, and subscribe. Also, the Ringiverse will be live at this. El Ray Theater this summer in L.A. We'll be there on July 17th. Check out ringer.com backslash events.

For more info, guys, it's going to be a fantastic show. The Ring of Verse, the House of All, the Midnight Boys. Also, Jomey's birthday. Oh, Jomey's birthday.

It's Jomey's birthday. And for Jomey's birthday, we're going to find, because we're going to party for Jomey's birthday that weekend. club after the live show? Yeah, yeah. Post, yes. I didn't realize

then the live show. I didn't realize that like they do have all nude strip clubs in L.A. They do. Did you think they didn't? I didn't know that. I, okay, so

even for me, going to a strip club where you're sober is an odd thing, right? Okay. You start wanting to minister

to people. Going there sober. You got the pamphlets. You got like the little like new tech. What type of sober are we

talking of? about. Well, there's no liquor. There's no liquor at where? At an all-new strip club in Los Angeles. There's no liquor. That's not allowed? Wait. You guys, see, see, see, this I know. You guys are like, oh, they have them. You guys don't know the fuck you're talking about. No, no, I don't. I don't know. I'm so glad that I don't know what I'm talking about. So, you're so glad that you know, what is. In this regard, yes. I'm glad I don't know what I'm talking about. So it's, so it's, it's dirty to go to the strip club. No, it's. So why? So why? So, it was. So why? So, So why are you glad you don't know what you're talking about? Like, why are you, why, what's, what's, what's, because if anybody will educate me on this.

Got you. I'll do it right now. Yeah. Okay. So in other places you go, like, you go to Miami, they don't care. You bring a gun into the strip club. But here in Los Angeles, there are all nude strip clubs. They stay open all night long, basically.

It's like four in the morning, but they don't serve any alcohol. Mm-hmm. So you're essentially no alcohol. Right. So you're essentially in there watching women dance, all nude, but you're drinking pineapple juice. Right. You're drinking cranberry juice for $20 a pot. Is there a buffet culture in strip clubs in L.A.?

Because I know that's Portland. There is a buffet culture. You got different types of foods. I'm bricked up sober just to see some ariola. This is insane. Sober. The sober thing makes it tougher. Because the sober thing, you start.

That's the love of the game. That's the love of the game. If you're not. The sober thing makes you go, man, you got your whole life ahead of you. Oh, man. Like, God. And there's nothing wrong with doing what you're providing the services. But what do you want to do after this?

You're trying to save these women? I'm not trying, I'm not saying when you're drunk, it's like, oh, yeah. But when you're sober, you're like, I wonder if I could be like a helpful mentor to anybody. Right. It is 3 p.m. It is 3 p.m. I care about people. I'm like, are you safe?

Before this dance, are you safe? You doing okay? Yeah, I'm okay. And starts crying and then the ruin the whole night. So I don't know how we got on that I don't know either Every Tuesday and Thursday House of R will deep dive into

House of the Dragon and Acolyte Every Monday the Midnight Boys will be giving you their reactions To hot D next Tuesday We'll be live at 7 p.m. Prime Party on YouTube Live Live! All the stuff we have to cut out. You guys, the Midnight Boys will be live

on YouTube on the Ringerverse channel At 7 p.m. Primetime Charles is fucking raring to go. going to be there. Reaction to the finale of the Acklein. There will be wonder. All right. And next Thursday, we'll be back for the Boy's season four finale.

You guys, we are serving it up next week. Next week is crazy. We got the live show. Excited for that. We got the Boys finale. Not excited for that. We got the Acklech finale. Definitely not excited for that.

Got a lot of stuff going on, baby. Every Sunday Talk to Thrones will be up. right after the latest episode of Hot D. That show's cooking with grease, Charles. You'll admit that. With grease? With grease. It's cooking.

But not with grease. I got to see. I got to see. Here's a thing. I got very, very high on the Acolyte Supply. To think, everything's working. No more.

I'm just, I'm taking every episode as it comes. Every episode as comes. Yeah. Cool. All right. Spoiler warning for the boys and all Star Wars content. If you've read it,

if you've seen it, if you've been a part of it, we might talk about it. No book spoilers for Star Wars. No book spoilers for Star Wars. Yo, guys, the universe kicked me in the goddamn nuts. What happened? I was a dragon's road on Twitter.

Dang. Yeah, the whole shit was, I was like, I was reading the tweet. I was like, oh, that's what happens. And I was like, well, I mean, yeah, it's been out there for a long, long time. Yeah, it's, you know. It happens. It happens, Steve.

All right. We're getting ready. talk about the boys. You're listening to a reaction podcast. The spoilers are coming. Okay, we have to put you in the know before we talk about the boys. The only way to put you in the know is the Midnight Manifest. The only person who can do that is Chuck Wagon.

All right, this is your Midnight Manifest for the Boys, the insider, directed by Katrina McKenzie, written by Paul Greylong. Sage realizes she's been pushed out of Homelanders orbit after the DeVille. back at the right wing party. She's now replaced by Firecracker and her breast milk. The boys learn that Homelander and Newman are planning on killing the president, but also Mother's Milk informs the team that he's quitting after his panic attack and leaves Busher in charge.

Butcher reveals to the team that he kidnapped Newman's baby daddy Samir to make more of the soups virus. Butcher plays a newly freed Frenchian Kim Koe in charge of getting the virus up and running, but Samir outsmarts them and escapes. A-Train pushes Mother's Milk to rethink his decision about leaving the boys behind. Tired of Butcher and his team, Holander sends the Deep and Black Noir to kill them. But A-Train and M.M. Help Save the day.

The Starlight is kidnapped by the shapeshifter who also steals all the dirt the team has on Newman and Homel. That's for Midnight Manifest for the boys. Just real quick. You say debacle? Tobacco. It's guys, fuck off. Fuck off. I don't care.

I don't care. Charles. I don't care. I'm on edge. Charles. Charles. Charles, why? What's going on, buddy?

Like, what's talk to us? You're with your friends here. Not just us, but them. You're with your friends. What's going on there, buddy? Talk to us. I was so hardbroken last night. I was like, I'm about to sit down,

watch the act like, this is about to be great. And it was like the Homelander scene when he's in the movie theater where I was like, what did I do with my life? Like, what decisions have gotten me to this point? You're on a different show.

Stay focused, Chuck. What? No, no, no, because the boys had it too. I turned on the boys right after I'm like, well, you know, the boys, you know, quality programming, we'll see what happens. And then then puppets started singing about Antifa, and I was like, all right, man.

I like that. Charles, guess what? I got bad news for you. I like the episode. I know you did. I like it. I know, because you're a whole liar, bro. You're a whole liar.

I like the episode. Which one? Let me tell. The boys? Both of all right. And let me, Charles, hold on real quick. Hold on. Let me tell you something.

Now, let's just stick to the boys right now. I think this episode is exemplary of what the boys should have been this entire season. I can agree to that. I think that this episode had in it stakes for individual characters. It put individual characters in situations where they had to make decisions that were consequential to the plot of the show. And I think it showed how the relationships between these characters, their expectations, their desires, their desires, and their expectations and their wants from each other, how they can all be used to make meaningful plot stuff.

The stuff between Newman and Huey is stuff that's been built. The stuff between A-Train and Ashley, where you don't know what's happened, A-Train's turn, Starlight and Huey, the reveal at the end, Mother's Milk, like, seeding control to butcher, and then coming in and saving the day, being the voice of reason, figuring out his role,

I personally think that this season would have been a much better season had we gotten to this type of episode a little bit sooner. I thought this was one of the best episodes of the season. All right, you got it. Unsurious. I agree with serious.

Yeah, same points all around. And I think you missed the most important connection, which was Butcher and Ryan. No, butcher and Ryan. Yeah. Like that meant some. That meant some. I might change Jomi's name.

Jomi might be Jomi to cook a dinner on. Yeah, I mean, the cook is good. Y'all aren't cooking anything over there. I mean, cook. It's his thing. We spent a lot of the season worried about Butcher and like how far would he go? And his entire thing with his wife, seeing his dad wife, was like, Ryan, you got to say, Ryan. He's between like, I know Ryan's your son.

I know you love Ryan. I know we have. that connection, but Ryan's a soup, what am I supposed to do when push comes to shove? And he tells, you know, the imaginary cussar, he's like, I got to trust that Ryan's going to do the right thing because of, because my wife is like, I know the, the lesson she would impart it to him. I have to trust that he's not going to turn to another homelander. I can't kill, I can't risk killing him and turning him to another homelander or something going wrong if I just go, start killing soups, doing a whole genocide. For him to see it on,

the TV, like, yo, Ryan, like, by himself, no prompt and no nothing. Just like, look, this whole thing is crazy. We can't do this. It validates Butcher's entire thing with seeing his wife. Like, his whole ethos is like, all right, cool. I can't do the crazy stuff I've been trying to do all season. I got to get on the right path. And then, like, you know, dies kind of.

But it meant something. If we've been watching the whole, I guess we've watched a whole series, it means some for, butchers. you to be like, yo, I finally put faith to somebody and was rewarded for it. For a guy that wants, you had two hero turns in this one. You had A-Train talking about the fact that he had become a hero.

You see Ryan, actually, for someone who likes emotional stakes, the show did a lot of mining, a lot of mining to put these characters in different emotional situations. And I feel like this episode paid it off. Steve. Yeah. I think Huey's arc as well is actually something that's kind of getting more interesting

now that, again, not to know that the business with his dad was a big drag on the season, but that was a big emotional point that was isolated, but now that he's back into the fold, I really like that him and Starlight's arc is actually going somewhere. Finally, we got Starlight doing something, which is pretty great. I'd love to see that.

And really, I think on the Homelander front to know that he's actually taken a back seat in this episode at least, dealing with webweaver and everything was gross and pretty nasty. But to know that we can actually stop spinning its wheel, the show

can stop spinning its wheels, a tiny bit for the sake of Homelander to take a back seat and that everybody else gets forward momentum in one fell swoop. It feels great. It feels great that we're getting it like a little bit later in the season, but you know, to know that we're bookended with some good momentum is very encouraging.

see some for momentum for the plot and the characters. Like, it was nice to see. You didn't like it, obviously. I think this episode illustrated probably my biggest critique of the boys, just as a series, which is it's always

the illusion of change and always the illusion of momentum. And I just felt like I had seen this penultimate episode before. I had seen the beats of this before where it's like, I got excited when the deep and black noir go to fight the boys. I'm like, all right, something is happening.

We are approaching something. And then it's like, oh, well, we really can't hurt anybody and everybody's going to walk away from the fight fine because none of our main characters can die. Similar to all of the A train emotional stuff, it literally reminded me beat for beat of what I've seen in seasons prior of like the Queen May stuff where I'm like, how many times can I see a member of the seven realize their humanity, realize that family is important and become the mole and all this stuff. There is just, there are like plot points where I'm like, oh, this is kind of like a wash and repeat. The characters are different.

The dialogue is different, but structurally it's the same. So like nothing to me really changed in this episode. One of the biggest kind of sins for me in this entire episode is just Frenchie popping up. And they're like, all right, we got French. He's here again. And I'm like, wait, then why put him in?

Why have him in prison in the first place? Like, why even do that whole storyline and sideline this character for two or three episodes? If you're just like, well, he's back now. And now him and Kimmecoe are going to be good because she's going to tell him, like, the big mystery of her origin. That's not that interesting. It, like I said, there's Eric Kripke and Co. There's always a base level of quality with everything that they're doing. But it does seem like, A, there was not enough story for this season to make sense for

me and just every single time something happened, even when you're supposed to feel something when the Deep's octopus lover dies. I'm like, well, I knew this was going to happen because I know the Deep is a piece of shit. Do you think you were supposed to feel something? I think you asked too much, like you ask, sometimes I think you put too much pressure on yourself. When the Deep's octopus lover is dying, it was just a kooky, funny scene. I mean, it was like the deepest cucky and funny, the octopus dies like three times in a row. I don't know if that was supposed to be

like an emotionally gut-wrenching raw moment. And you putting pressure on yourself to feel something from a deep octopus. I don't think it's put up to pressure on myself. It is quite literally, at this point in the boys' existence, how many more times can I watch a member of the seven

turn away from this and be surprised? At this point, how many times can I be like, oh, the boys are in peril and then all of them walk away unscathed. And that's not me saying people have to be mortally wounded or hurt to progress the narrative, but there does have to be some level of, all right, what are we marching towards? Because it does seem like they're doing that thing. Like, well, we want you to think all these characters are in danger, but they're not because we have a whole other season to go.

And I'm like, all right, womp, who cares? There's no consequence follow through for any of the things that. For anything, or even some of the ways that they're acting sometimes. I'm just like French, it only took one conversation with Kimiko for Frenchie to just be like, all right, I'm back. And I'm, that whole storyline to me

is a waste of my time then. All right. I need a bar put at the bottom of the thing because I got to say something about this criticism. This criticism is kind of basic. And let me tell you why. So the reason why I say that is, if you didn't like the episode,

you didn't like the episode. None of the boys are going to die because they're the main characters on the show. And if, and then even in the villains that are going to die, right? Like, how can I put this? There is, there's, what you're saying is not wrong, but it's not wrong at all, but it's sort of an odd thing. It's like reading a Superman comic issuing,

an issue out waiting for Lex Luthor to die. They're not going to kill him. Or waiting for Lois to die. She's not going to die. Like Jimmy Olson is going to be okay. Yeah. Perry, maybe. Okay.

Perry, very. Like Perry, maybe. Those people are going to be okay. If you're, if you're reading the book and every single time you're waiting, oh, shit, when are they going to take out one of the characters? When are they going to take out somebody? When are they going to rip someone who's in a, or maybe even not integral

to the fabric of the show out of the show okay when is one of the Avengers going to die like we get all the way to we got to get all the way to end game or Infinity War

to like lose one like when a like unless you count quicksilver which I don't but it like when is one of the Avengers are going to die

like when is it's Marvel got criticized for killing their villains too much right so like in this situation the deep is not going to die. But I told you, I did say, I'm not saying that I need any of these characters to die or be more than a need. So what did you need?

But I do need to feel that when they make decisions, there's consequences for these decisions that makes sense and makes it worthwhile for me to like watch something versus shit just kind of keeps happening. Everybody walks away unscathed until the next episode. And I'm like, all right. Then what am I? You didn't feel consequences for Sister Sage being kicked out of the seven because she didn't tell Homelander. Would that scene have been better if he'd have laced her to death? No, I'm glad he didn't. But there hasn't been enough work done with Sister Sage for A, for me to think that she's the smartest person on this planet.

And for B, for me to even care that she's kicked out of the seven. Because to be quite, like to be honest, like her and Firecracker to me are just like, they're just placehold. There are another two new characters, and this does happen with every season of the boys, really, is that, all right, we're going to introduce characters for a homelander to bounce off of, characters that can, like, push him in different ways, and that's fine.

But in this penultimate episode, I'm like, well, Firecracker is an idiot, and she really didn't do shit. And then Sister Sage just kind of, like, walks out of the building. She'll probably be back in the season finale or whatever. I'm just kind of like, I don't, I'll put it to you this way. are you hankering for more Sister Sage and Firecracker? Like, are you on the edge of your seat being like,

I want to know more about these characters? Because me, I'm like... It's an odd question. Why? Because those are not the questions, those are not the characters that you're supposed to want more of. Well, I think, here's the thing. I think good television shows make you care about,

at least not all of the characters, but if we're giving this amount of time to them, I should have some level of investment in what happens to. So Succession. You like Succession. Yes. You watch Succession going,

I can't wait to see more Mattson. I was, he was a good enough character where it was just like, I was wondering, yo, what is he going to do and how he plays off these characters?

Like, I was, there was points where I'm like, oh, he can hurt them. I was like, he was cool when he showed up. When he showed up, he was cool. And he provided enough

of a counterbalance to the characters that you cared about for you to be like, oh my God, there is their foil, there is their villain. He provided enough of an emotional thing for when Roman goes off on him and does the whole thing for you to be like, hi, that makes sense. But if Mattson showed up in the episode or if he didn't show up in the episode, you didn't give a fuck because it's not his show.

It's not the show where he's supposed to be on. there driving the drama and you're supposed to care about everything. It's not Firecracker Show. It's not Sages show. Those characters only matter insofar as their relationship to Homelander, to Butcher, to Huey, to Eminem to the rest of those characters like that. I don't think that's even fair because like we just got done talking about the boys. It's like a good show.

I didn't really give a fuck about Tina until we get an episode where I'm like, oh, this episode is. You're talking about the bear you mean. The bear. Yeah. when you see the the Io directed episode about Tina, you take a character that I did not have that much investment in and you're just like, oh, you did so much work with her. I'm looking back at the seasons.

I'm looking at different things. I'm like, oh, this gives me a deeper appreciation for the show and her where it's like I haven't gotten that episode with Firecracker or Sage. So when anything happens to them. Because it wouldn't make any sense. You want a whole Firecracker episode about her. I'm not saying I want a whole episode about them. I need moments within the same.

season for when something happens to them for it to mean something to me. Because right now it's just like the kind of chess pieces that are being moved around. And I'm like, when they pop in and pop out, I'm like, all right, who gives a fuck? Like, I don't care. It's just, okay. And we'll get the men boys in here. Because this is the way I look at it. To me, this is, well, okay, first of all, I'm trying to think of how I say this without,

because I'm not trying to defend what's been a lackluster season of the boys to a degree. maybe slightly above average. I like this episode. But like, I'm trying to understand because, like, I've read comics my entire life, right? Mm-hmm. And they've been, like, off-brand Avengers. Yeah.

Remember, like, Jack of Hearts? What was his name? I do remember Jack of Hearts. Okay, you know, Jack of Hearts pops in, fucking... The best thing about Hickman was he was able to take, like, molecule, man, and make him, like, essential to... You know, Jack of Hearts, guys like that pop in, and they'll pop in for random things.

They'll die. Remember one time the Avengers Mansion got burned up or something like that. And the reality is that these characters it's kind of like a... The old Star Trek joke. You know, for... Huh?

Richard. Yeah, the old Star Trek joke. I mean, would it be great if you really, really were invested into Firecracker's store? I mean, if they gave her a whole... episode or if they gave Sister Sage a whole episode, what those people are, they're really plot devices.

I think you're telling me that characters are plot devices, that's actually the problem. Because like, we don't say that about Andor. When we look at Andor, we're just like, oh, there's even the smallest characters on that show, you're just like, oh, I feel for them. When they died, they might have only been a handful of episodes, but you're like, I understand their struggle. I understand their strife. I understand what they're fighting for and against.

I'll be honest with you. Not plot devices. I'll be honest with you. I think that's overstated. I think, I think, I think that's overstated. I think that Andor does a good job. I know that Andor is the, the end-all be-all of,

of sci-fi series glory. But I think that there are many characters right now in Andor that I could describe them to you and you guys wouldn't remember their names. You wouldn't know. And if they died, and if they died, I think maybe put it to you like this, if I was to give a little ground here. I think the overall world of Andor was created to where the situation seemed so desperate

that when there are a bunch of guys that are locked in a prison. Yeah. And those guys are willing to break out of that prison. And some of them are willing to jump off of a huge platform to their freedom. I think connecting yourself to that overall archetype makes it easier for you to care about an individual or somebody fighting for freedom or somebody that's in that. I think so.

But I think individually, the characters themselves in that show or any other show, most of the characters that are in a show serve to drive the hero's journey or the narrative journey of the characters you're supposed to care about. But it shouldn't be plot devices. They are plot devices.

If we even look at the boys, like I would say like Soldier Boy, I wasn't rooting for Soldier Boy. I didn't want him to win, but his story was compelling enough and interesting enough and revealed enough about other characters, whether it was butcher or Homeland or whatever, where I was just like, all right, I'm following him.

Whatever happens to him, like I'm scared of him, I'm invested in this character. It is giving a propulsive, a propulsive force to everything that's happening in this show. And I just think in this season, because I don't think there was enough story to go around,

a lot of the characters just kind of feel like they just are existing in space. That's why I think people are complaining about Starlight. Starlight doesn't have enough to do. And I'm just like, well, yeah, because she really is not, she's not a part of the boys, she's not a part of the seven, and there's nothing really left for the, there's really nowhere left for that character to go that's as interesting as evil Superman going up against Butcher.

There's just not, and I think the boys used to be very, very good. Like, even last season, not to compare it to last season, I wasn't the biggest fan of last season, but even like what Black Noir was going through. You know what I'm saying? You're taking a smaller character. You're flushing him out. I'm just like, all right, man, this guy is out of his mind.

He's seeing fucking cartoons. Like there's all these little things where I've just... He had been around for two seasons, though. So to do that, so this is what I would say and we can get off this because I don't want to be overencumbered. Like to me, I've seen a new hope a bunch of different times.

When Kenobi dies in a new hope, it doesn't do anything to me. No, you're right. Right, because Kenobi's purpose in a new hope, he's not even in that much of the movie as a live guy. I guess he's in more of you think or maybe 45 minutes on.

No, he's it. He's in a millennium balcony. He's fighting. Canobie's, like, when you look at the cast, you're like, that motherfucker are not going to live, right? You're like, Canobi's purpose in a new hope. And we care about Obi-Wan Kenobi. He matters. Yes.

Canobie's purpose in a new hope is Luke. That's the purpose. And there are going to be some characters in some shows that they, so when he dies, when he gets cut through and Vader's like, what the fuck happened to this, nigga? Like when he, like when he dies, you're not thinking, oh, my. God, what happened to Canobi?

You're thinking, oh, my God, what's going to happen to Skywalker? No, but I'm thinking even emotionally, to your point, like, Obi-Wan Kenobi's not in that much of the movie. When you first see the movie, I'm like, I'm interested because he's an old, kooky guy in the desert. But when Luke is all beat up, he's just like, oh, my gosh, this was my mentor,

the guy who gets me off this planet, I feel for that character because the other characters care. as the boys in the season right now, I don't even think the characters in this show care about the new people. And it's not just the new people. I think a lot of the characters are in the show. They don't care about the new people.

You know, Midboy, settle this argument. Oh, man. Thank you for that. No, all right. I think it's propping up to be like, all right, what's the apex of what the boys have been? Are we calling that season three, season two? Probably season two, I say it would probably be...

I can only judge the show on its own merits. I can't talk about what like more grander successions in Star Wars of the world can be because that's honestly not the story that it's telling. When I think that the boys are, is at its most propulsive, I think every character works in sequence with a bigger plot that informs every other character. I think the worst that this season has gotten is to win we've lost the plot for 80% of the people on screen and we're only working towards some nebulous objective that we know is, coming at the end of this season.

The better parts of this episode are when a lot, I'm seeing the ratio of people clicking and in succession with each other is more than it is not. And that's been working. When it works, it works. I don't think that when we separate these characters in a vacuum from, okay, the seven is now reduced to the, what, the four now, A train's barely there. Sister Sage is reluctantly trying to, coerce Homelander to her side, even though that he's clearly in the

throws of whatever firecrack things that he's got going on with Firecracker, we got to work with that. And for the most part, that's working. Because even now Firecracker's like, oh, I'm in over my head the moment that I think that I've got this guy on a leash. And that's compelling still. That, to me, is still what makes the show work. To know that Butcher is losing grip of the, you know, people in his head to know that he actually has to work with the people in front of him,

that still works. And to know that like, okay, when Eminem is finally receding control. You guys keep saying Eminem. Is that wrong to say Eminem? Mother's milk. Yeah, you've said Eminem. Maybe.

I think it's Y'all-M. It's definitely MM. Okay. It's not mothers and milk. Yeah, mothers and milk. Mother's and milk. You could say Eminem, though. You think, you think, Homelander, if he knew,

does Homelander know his name is, like, they call him Mother's Milk? I knew his name is. Marva Milk. Homelander's a milk guy. Would Homelander suck on Mother's Milk's Teets? That's what I'm saying.

And that's your question. When Firecracker... You never had the chance. When Firecracker sprays, have you ever... Would that be like your overall top situation? The answer is now. Because of getting milk from the milk? The answer is no.

I'm not Josh Hart. Don't do me like that. You sure? Yeah, I'm not there yet. I don't know. I'm not that woke. I'm not... Are you sure, bro?

I'm sure. Because when I saw it, when I saw it, her spray him I thought wow that's Jomi's deal right there that's the first thought that you had on the couch Then you have Jome Hinklyko were there I was like

Hey Jomey you saw that The Jomey would dig this shit I'm not gonna Why are you like just admit that you'd be like You'd be like in I I kind of feel like you know Jome me rate the spray right now Zero out of 10

Like you gotta think about it Imagine you having like like a The worst day of life man You went to the party and the whole thing I messed up. You got embarrassed in front of everybody. Right. And now this Truboni coming here, trying to tell you some whatever. And then, boom, you got milking your eyes.

Hold on for a second. Let's go back to this worst day of your life. Jomi, what have you been through? To make that part of the worst day of your life. I want people to hear it. Sometimes people's trauma leaps out. Charles, did you hear that? I was like, I was like, I was, I was like there.

Like, wait a second. Wait a second. What is that, Kermie, did you hear that? Jomi, Jomi says, think about the worst day of your life. You go to the. party. No, incorporate.

You get embarrassed in front of everybody. For Homeland or that was pretty, he hated that. Yeah. That was not the word. All right. So it's a more

annoying day. You're telling me you would not, it's the worst day of your life, like party, whatever you have it is happening. And then a beautiful woman just shows up and she's just like, I'm going to scorch you with milk.

You're just like, this made my day worse. That's the last thing I want. I'll be honest with you. I think there are more women that could spray. you with milk, then there are women who couldn't spray you with milk.

I think you could get, I think that, I think you get sprayed with milk. Also, in L.A.? In L.A.? Like, come on. I don't know. In a way. It's like, come on, man.

I would probably put it more like 15. 15% could spray you with milk. 15%? All right. Niggins just lying. I know, I'm lying. They lie. What would you put the percentage yet?

For me? In L.A. Of being, I mean, I'm down to try it, basically. I was about to say it's like 75%. Seventy-five percent. Dog, you walk out of your door. There's beautiful women everywhere. What are you talking about, Jome?

Here's what it is, man. Y'all not from L.A. L.A., you know what I'm saying? Y'all don't go south of 10. Yes, I do. I go there all my time. You for show, don't. Oh, you definitely don't. Have you been around?

Oh, this is a good question for you. So you've been in L.A. for a second. You're ranked top five party boy of L.A. right now. I am not. You are. I see on Instagram. Yeah. Street's talking.

Top five party boy at Instagram right now. You definitely are. No, yeah, absolutely. Have you actually been to the places in L.A., the GS Sports Lounge, places like that? That's what we're going to. Shout out to the GS. That's what we're going Saturday.

Hold on, hold on. I swear, Saturday, the four of us, GS Sports Lounge. The GS is, I want to see how you, I want to see how you move into. I don't know, man. You looking it up? Yeah.

I want to see how you move into GS. These plates aren't looking too healthy. Yeah. Nah, what are you talking about? Food. Just go to orange theory. Yeah. You do it after.

I try to act like the place is going to be. I want to see. You put me anywhere on God's green earth. Come on. I know you can do your thing. But I want to say you haven't done it yet. You've been in a lot of the lakes, but not a lot of the woods.

The Silver Lakes, not the Eagle Woods. Oh, these are. Okay. You guys are right. Charles of the woods. You've been in some of the parks. but you haven't been anywhere where you've seen somebody do like this at the door.

Yeah, yeah, pull up Naruto signs there. Because sometimes you'll be at one of these spots and somebody will see their homie and they'll be like, what's up! And then do jih Tzu's in front of you. Yeah. And you'll be like, I hope everything goes okay.

My man, what's up with you? I don't even like where this is going. Y'all are doubting me. I don't like this. Oh, no. I'm with, I'm not. Look, I've seen you at Hallwater Cornbread. So, so, so, so I'm not, I'm just saying you haven't gone out there yet.

Plus, I need to make some calls for you anyway to make sure that you're good in different places. Because what's going to happen is Charles is going to meet somebody somewhere. This is what happens. Jomi knows. Jomey knows. He's going to meet somebody somewhere. And then, you know, because Waze doesn't care. how you get to where you go.

Right. Waze is a sci op. Wait, like, Waze'll take you. You'll be in this picture. Ways will, hey, Waze will have you stopping at stop signs and niggas be asking you, hey, you know where you at? And I'll be like, I promise you it's the app.

I wasn't trying to drive through your streets. I promise you was the app, bro. Whatever you want me to do, I'll claim that shit. Charles has got like six. flags when it comes from one way. Charles about different hats. He's like, oh, this block, okay. This is where it's nice to be African.

I just be like, no, I'm not, I'm not from here. I'm from, I'm from Africa. I don't, I don't, I'm saying. Get it with the little, uh, no. Can we get off this, guys? I'm not part of here. I'm a good, humble man. I stay inside every, I'm not sure.

Um, it, it, this is good. Y'all Hayden. I liked it. No, that's, all right. I liked it. Let's be real. Because your motherfuckers would be like, damn, this season, I don't know. I don't know.

You get one above average episode. You're like, hey, man, season's great. Everything worked out. It's not what we said. That's not what we said. I just said the season is average to slightly above average. I thought this episode, look, some of the things that you've called out before, this episode is still falls into those traps.

Let's just be honest. Sure. There's still some really, really. really heavy-handed political commentary in the show. And I'm wondering what the decision was to really lean into that stuff

as much as they've been leaning into it. It's always been, like I said, around the edges of the show, but it's never been the actual meat of it. Now it is just such an overbearing part of it. Like the woke song at the beginning. The puppets were funny, but like the Antifa stuff,

the calling, all of that stuff is just, It's a little over the top. Like, even when the deepest talk to her, it's like, me too is over, you guys lost the whole nine. What are you going to say, Jumby? Like, so there's a joke when they're talking about Cameron Dying and they do the little like vaccine. Like, it's just like a really cool.

Yeah. Like that's like, that probably would have been more funny if like that was like the most edgy at got or like the most out there. Right out of the joke would have had. I get it. But when you surround like the literally like, it's erection, January 6th.

A puppet show about Antifa. It's like, brother, I watch the news. I got it. I think that's the worst part of the season, for me, frankly, is like just the... They keep hammering. It's like, brother. Like the Marvel jabs were at least fun.

Yeah. Do you think it's just a... Because I even felt this way where it wasn't political, but the webweaver shit when he was just like... It got to a point when he kept shitting the webs where it was just like, I was like, all right. I was like enough. Yeah.

Like it does seem like the show is getting to this point where it's like wowed us and grossed us out and done shit that we just never had seen before in superhero stuff for years and this season especially feels like them being like how can we top ourselves? Yeah, don't you remember when like, oh my God, what was the big event in season three?

Hero Gasm? Hero Gasm. Like that was like, that was like it's red wedding in some ways where we're like, oh my God, this was the craziest thing that this show could ever think of and it was supposed to be this like, like perfect apex moment of like meeting the juvenile edge lordy moments of the boys, both in the comic and the show,

to where the full satire of what it's actually going for meat. Like the gross out and all these things are welcome and we can accept that and have a good time with it. Now we're like, I feel like we're doing this for the sake of just being edgy or being biting or being like this way where you're like, okay, I guess. To that point, this is the first episode I've ever had to

fast forward through a scene. I couldn't watch her get her leg sawed off. It was tough. It was tough. Legs sawed off was nuts. And I think I agree with everything that you guys are saying and that criticism for you as well. I think that they maybe

miscalculated one thing. The boys has reached to your point a spot where some of the stunts can't be topped. Yeah. The way that they can really end the show on a high is to

deepen, to Charles's point, which I don't think is a bad point at all, is to actually deepen the meaningfulness of the show. That's what they could do. But my point is, they can only do that through their main characters. It's not going to be a character that's going to come on the show at this point in it, that we're even going to be, you his mom popped in this show. Nobody cares. Well, can I ask then why?

Well, then why introduce a lot of these characters? Because if I'm being actually, like, positive about this episode. Because you got to change it up. It's the same reason why you introduce, when you drop a new character. Same reason why the Avengers fight somebody different. Like, in the comic books. No, I get that.

But it's like, it's taking away for moments where it's like, I think the best part of this episode was the last, the last scene with his, like, wife and then A-Train and kind of, that was really good. Like, realizing finally, when he's talking about, like, this took my grandfather, this took my father, I'm done with this. I was like, I love that scene because I was like, finally Mother's Milk kind of gets to say, like, the quiet part out loud, which is like, why are we doing this? Like, this cycle of like soups and, like, us fighting them. But where I felt like it fell flat wasn't even in the acting or the writing, it was like, of course Mother's Milk is going to go back to the boys.

where it's like that seemed like something honestly you save for the last season because now I'm just like well he's going to go back to the boys and now we're going to have a whole other season probably of him being like should I be with my family should I not and I'm like that's the stuff where I'm just like oh we have a whole another season of this same thing with kind of where French he is where it's like Frenchie is coming to terms with like who he was and all the killing he's done and him and Kimiko have this really really heartwarming scene where she's just like yo

I can relate to this, but there is a level of like, by the end, they're just like, hey, we're the boys. We've done more with less. We're all back together. And sure, sure. We're doing it one more time. I just guess I have less patience.

I think because I know the end is coming. And if I'm being fair to the creators, I think that's always difficult. We've experienced it with the bear as well. I think when you know something is ending, you start getting a little antsy feeling like, are they spinning their wheels? What is happening?

Did it do da da. I know this is about to end. And this penultimate, I feel like other seasons, the penultimate was like, oh, it's going off. Anything can happen. It gave me that wow.

And this just kind of gave me where I was like, oh, okay, sure. So this is where I, once again, I think this penultimate doesn't really stack up to past penultimate of the boys just because I think that

you know, when you watch this, when you watch this season hasn't been as good as past seasons. I thought that. that this was a good episode because it kind of reset a lot of things and it reorganized the show a little bit.

Probably too late. Probably too late. It probably reorganized, like I said, this episode should have probably come a little bit. I actually feel the same way about the accolades. As a matter of fact, this episode should have probably come a little bit sooner because we were getting to a point

to where it seemed like a couple of things in the show were working and to reorganize the show around the Starlight and Huey thing, which would have been super dupe, fucking interesting. Had it been done in episode three or four.

Had it been done in episode three or four and we didn't know that Starlight was the actual Starlight or she's chained up somewhere or whatever and there's a mole

inside of the boys would have been a super fucking interesting thing. Now maybe it lasts through the finale and then on into next season. We don't know what's going to happen. But that ended up of itself is a perfect thing.

But that might be something else to where they know they have another season and they're trying to give us a really interesting kernel or nugget to go into that season. The only thing I was saying was about this particular episode. I think we have different expectations about what we want from supporting characters and shows like this. To me, the way I look at it is this. A lot of the reason why A-Train makes the change that he makes is because of his uncomfortable, inside of Vaught.

A-Train as a character has been bought in at certain points. A-Train as a character has been removed away from the boys at certain points. He finally reached the level of uncomfortability to where he didn't feel safe inside of the seven anymore. Safe. Not whether or not he was going to get the big movies or anything. He didn't feel safe, and that's because of Sage. it's because he couldn't feel safe around her because deep down,

we know that she knew and he knew that she knew. So he couldn't feel, like he didn't feel safe around there anymore. He really felt like to a point, not that they just wanted to be a hero, he had to have another way out because there was somebody there that was smart enough to see through his bullshit

and to see through the fact that he was cracking. So to me, if the character's kind of not in there, that turn from him doesn't make as much sense because he's done so much. Firecracker is just, to me, the way that we found out that Starlight had an abortion and all of that stuff and somebody else that gets close to Homelander

and has then disgusted by him because when she rips webweaver apart. I don't know. I think the sister sage of it all is actually kind of, it was kind of, of intuitive because there's a scene in episode three where there's an alleged mole inside the what's it called the analytics department or whatever and as soon as she was like yeah took a call with with starlight boom laser in the face right and so stage's like well

if I start telling him like who I think the actual mold is it's going to kill A train we need him to get information to the folks you need to like be able to put people in position. If she's honest with them, he's going to kill A-Train, that's going to mess up the whole thing. I can't, I can't tell them. Now, the show doesn't tell us that, right? We have to infer that, but I think they've done a better job at characterizes and you're giving it credit for it. Although, to your, it is kind of muddled. To your point, they don't tell you that, but I do think you can intuit this stuff.

It's tough to infer what the smartest person in the world is thinking, unless you are explicitly shown that as the audience. Yeah. Because other than that you kind of have to just guess what she's thinking. Or just be surprised by what she comes up. In terms of her and A-Tray? In terms of just her plot in all of this. Because she's supposed to be too much. I mean, there was a point where like she walks in,

she sees a firecracker and homelander, and it's dawning on her that she's kind of like been pushed out. And I'm like, you know, Sage, you're the smartest person in the world. A, you let a firecracker run circles around you. And B, like, you didn't, like, you didn't realize at any given point, like, A, I don't know she was lying or not. But I'm just like, if Homelander finds out that you was doing some shit under his nose, he's going to be pissed off. So, like, either you need to be more buttoned up. Like, there's been, I'll put it to you this way.

There has not been one plan that Sister Sage has had this entire season that has seemed like the smartest person in the world plan. It has seemed like the dumbest person in the world plan. Unless it's some late act reveal in the finale where they're like, aha, but my plan really was, yada yada. If you could get Greg Popovic to coach some fifth graders, they're not going to run the offense like they're supposed to. Right? It's just a whole bunch of idiots out there.

Like, she can do whatever she can. I can put anybody in any position. If you don't got the brain sense to do what I tell you to do, it's not going to work. And guess what? Some of the greatest coaches, they look at that team. They like, talk, I'm working with A, train in the deep. They're like, hey, Homelander.

I can't do anything for you. Like that was my whole thing. She wouldn't have been in the show. But I'll say this. The thing about Firecracker and Homelander is actually, and we can move on after this, we got to get an Akely. But the thing about Firecracker and Homelander

was actually really interesting to me. Do you know why? Because Firecracker appeals to something so basic in Homelander that it doesn't matter how smart sage is. Yeah. I mean, and that's the thing, right? Like the character of Homelander has such basic, basic needs. It doesn't really matter how smart.

Yeah. Sister Sage would have been. If you pop out the tities and you shoot the milk in his face, you got them. Like that was savvy by her. And it gets back to kind of the underlying theme of the show. The underlying theme of the show is that like all of this stuff is not as complicated or deep as what we make it. even as Homelander is surrounded himself around sycophance, the reason is is because he's desperately insecure,

which obviously mirrors other people in politics. He desperately wants connection. He desperately wants to build a pseudo family of people who he feels like he can rely on and he'll be there for him. And if he can't do that, he'd rather just subjugate everybody else. I just spit all over time. I mean, if you're the smartest person in the world.

If I'm Sister Sage, you know, you can't get some, like milfs with some nice tities in there to just like be like it is we're gonna play what I'm saying if you're trying to control a homelander I'll tell you what the funny I don't know if the show

I don't know if the show still has this basketball but one of the funniest things that happened in the episode is when Try Crackers like you know he's like yeah you gotta go and she's like you sure you don't want of him and he's got that look you like he sits to the side

and he's like that that was funny that they need this episode is brought to you by Spectrum Business. Fast, reliable internet means everything for your business. And even this podcast, that's why I trust Spectrum Business. They keep companies of all sizes connected with internet, advanced Wi-Fi, phone, TV, mobile services, plus 24-7 U.S.-based support. Millions of business owners already trust Spectrum Business. So visit Spectrum.com slash business to learn more. Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas. This episode is brought to

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Back on Brenda. Back on Brenda. Brenda, Brenda. It's time for the acolyte to begin our reaction. We once again bring you the Midnight Manifest. Chuck Wagon, take it away. All right, this is your midnight manifest for the Acolyte choice, directed by Koganada, written by Charmaine de Grades, Jen Richards, and Jasmine Flournoy. If I got any of those wrong, I'm sorry, guys.

Much respect to you. But in a flashback episode on Bren Dock, we learned that Sol and Dara, Torbin, and Kanaka for investigating a virgins, a powerful massive force that has helped like dived on Bren dock after a hyperspace accident. When Sol finds the Covenin Twins, he senses that, is meant to be his Padawan, but the Jedi Council deems the girls too old. The Jedi discovered that the twins' metaclorian count is absurdly high and along with some other space shenanigans.

It's revealed they're artificially created beings or one consciousness split into two people. Torben, obsessed with leaving Corrassant, races to the Coven encampment, realizing that the twins are as key to the council letting the Jedi leave Rendock. Sol follows the young Jedi, hell bent on saving the twins. A fight ensues where Sol kills Anaseya, the witches take over Kalnaka and have him fight his allies before dying for some odd reason. And soul faced with only being able to save one of the twins, decides to save OSHA.

And Dara tells the other Jedi they should keep what really happened on Brenda from the council to save OSHA, the heartache. And that's been in your midnight manifest for the Acolyte. Let's get to it. Thoughts. This was a very divisive one in the Ring of Versa group chat. In a vacuum, if we're just talking about the 43 minutes of television, I liked it.

I liked it. I thought the action, like the show, Cool. Whoever's doing the lightsaber action. Great. Like, put them in charge. Mm-hmm. Like, you got it, buddy.

You got, like, Torben doing a thing with the arrow, stop fire. And then the fight, the choreography is hitting, right? Right. Then, you know, then you got to, like, outside the 43 minutes, when you think about the show and the context, like, this being episode seven, it's not really what it's supposed to be. It's not really doing what it's supposed to do, unfortunately. I think, I mean, you can talk about, like, you can talk about, you. like a bigger, bigger picture later. But just this being a rehash

of episode three with like a different perspective for things like we kind of figured already. Like they do have like the moment of soul choosing OSHA over May. Right. I think it's important but I kind of feel like you could have just like put that in another episode. We called it. You know what I mean?

But at the end of day it did it did cool things. But where did like with all the context probably not the episode. You want to like have be the same. second to last one. Yeah. I'll probably be a little bit lower on this episode. I think my biggest problem with this and probably the series as a whole so far is structure because this episode probably of the actual plot developments that needed to happen or at least needed to be shown to

us as an audience. I think 30% of it needed to be there and then the rest of it didn't. to know that this is what Soul is just telling May as she is held captive on his ship we know a good 50 to 60% of this story already because we saw it three episodes prior and the context of which Soul is narrating this story seemingly is painting him in a disastrous life which is interesting but the effect of which needs to be

like him telling this story in context to May but us as an audience is only observing it from okay three episodes prior here's the other side of this coin that we had seen 45 minutes of already more or less the fights were cool that's been the consistent throughout the entire series that's really great

I think that soul painted as to me an obsession with OSHA that really weirds me out to an uncomfortable degree is interesting but could have been done way, way better. Charles?

I want to go or you want. So, first of all, I want to give the creators of the show props for having the balls to do, in this climate, to do the cops accidentally killing somebody. Okay.

I'm not just saying. You know, you're not. Hold on, hold on, hold on. I want to get, right, two black girls. I want to give, that takes balls. I want to give the creators,

because there was nobody in a writer's room that went, nah, man. Yeah. We can't. They're like, they're going to love this. Like, we can't do, you know,

Ferguson on Brenda. Like, we, you know what I'm saying? When I first saw it, I was like, fuck, that's a tough one.

What was that? What was the fucking photo of the black kid crying? And hugging. the fucking cop. That was this episode. That was literally this episode. Wow. I don't know. It was, it was, I just be honest with you. There's no way

for me to watch that whole episode and go, yo, the cops came to the place. One cop had it on his mind. But he was preoccupied and he ended up killing somebody that wasn't doing nothing. A black woman. There's no way for me not to look at it that way. Okay. There's no way. It's a, it's really bad

for soul. Right. Okay. It's real. Now, I'll say this. We've talked about the make-or-to-break-it episode of, who's we? It was you. That's all you. A lot of people have. But we've talked about the maker-or-de-break-it episode for the Acolyte. And I do think this was it, and I think it's a break-it, right? However, I do think that this was a good episode.

I do. I think this, I enjoyed the episode. Yeah. I enjoyed the episode. This is what I'd say. The fact that this episode didn't hit is more of an indictment on the entire show than it is this one particular episode, like Jones said. I will agree. Because, number one, we had to go back to Brendat and we had to spend a whole episode on Brandeat because we had to see what we did. What? No.

We did. No, we didn't. We did. I don't know if it had spent a whole episode. No, we didn't. We did. We had to, like they, we had to because we had to see everything that happened from the Jedi's perspective. Because remember, three of those Jedi are dead.

Uh-huh. And we have to see why they died. We have to see why it was okay to kill. The first thing that happens in this show is Indara dies, Torben dies, and Kilnaca dies, right? that's like what gets the show cranked off. May kills two of them. Kind of kills Torbent, but basically does. May kills two of them.

And our relationship with May at this point is still sort of ambiguous. It's still, May is not a villain. May is not a hero. In Star Wars lore, almost anybody that's ever killed a Jedi is a villain. but this show is asking you to not look at her like that. Right. We got to know why. Right.

And the only way, hold on. The only way to, the only way that we can know why is to get into the heads of the Jedi, why they're there, why they approached, how all of this happened, what Torben did, what Indar did,

what soul did, what you have to spend a lot of time there or else it doesn't make any sense to have led the show with the deaths of these characters. And just to show it in clips, oh, this is what Kanaka did. This is what else. It doesn't paint a full picture. We had to go back there. The question is, almost like the boys, that we have to go back there in this way this late?

Should it have come earlier? Or could they have spliced it in throughout the entire season? Yes. Maybe. But I think the questions that needed to be answered were too robust not to have relitigated that episode in a full episode on Brenda. Because because the witches do stuff in this situation that we even know they could do. Like when Torben gets taken over or whatever happens, that's a split-second scene in the other one.

Right. And to know everything that had happened there and to know that scene makes sense once you see that Kelnaka goes completely crazy at the end and attacks everyone. So to me, that episode had to happen like that. Like you had to have it. But the question is, should it have come sooner? What are we doing here? Like, no, absolutely not. This is, sorry if I'm going to be long-winded.

This is a 10 episode series. So to devote two episodes, one fifth of your season, to flashbacks, both of the flashbacks are essentially the same place, relitigating what we had already seen, I think is a massive gamble. I think the way that the characters acted, the choices that they made in this episode, I was confused.

There was a point when soul stabs and asses, and Asea, where I, like, I was like, wait, did I miss something? Like, I was like, I was like, wait, what's happening right now? Those are two separate criticisms, though. No, no, no, I'm going down all my criticism. So, like, my criticism is, A, structurally, that was the first one, like, having two flashbacks that are depicting the same thing is just like, for that to work, you have to be firing on all cylinders, which this episode wasn't.

The characters are making decisions or even the way they're blocked and shot where I was just like, wait, but what? Torbin's whole thing about like, I want to leave. I want to go back to Corrassant. Motherfucker, you've been on this planet for seven weeks. What is happening right now? When he hops on the speeder and just races away,

I'm just like, I don't know enough about Torbin to understand this, but he seems like an idiot, and this seems like something that, like, I know Padawan are supposed to be in training. But once again, why is he making this decision? Yeah. Even with the witches,

you're telling me that all of these witches, we don't know their powers and nothing has been explained about this world, about their culture, and in the fucking dark. You're telling me it takes all of these witches powers

to take over Chubaka and then Indara comes over and she's like, and they all just die and we just, no one says anything. She had done whoa, whoa, whoa. And even thematically to your point,

it takes a lot like, and I'm being so harsh because I've seen stuff on this show where I'm like the creators are way too talented. I've seen things, ideas that they've had. that I'm just like, this has potential.

But thematically, for you to basically do a cops kill innocent story. Like, honestly, a colonialism story of like these people in power coming to a planet, not realizing that the planet is inhabited, meeting this culture that they don't understand. Everybody dies. Doing the Sophie's choice of it all. You know what I'm saying? Maybe I was clued into this more because, like, I worked in, like, the charter school system. was serving black and brown kids.

So I saw how people would treat, let's say, black kids where it's like, and Dara sees the mark on one of them. He's like, oh, what's that mark? Did it, da, da. And then you see the other one who has the potential, who wants to be a Jedi, who wants to be this. And soul come and be like, I'm going to save you, you have more potential. And may, I'm sorry, sacrifice.

Like all of these things, these are weighty, weighty, weighty, weighty topics. for you to introduce all of this this late, and they had been teasing a little bit like this, you just have to pull it off. And I just feel like a lot of the story decisions were rushed and sloppy. And I'm like, you guys are better than this. Would you agree that a lot of the themes that the show is presenting, at least are worthwhile and on paper work in the context of all of these?

Worth while and work. But it's like the rest of the rest of the, of the season has not done enough work for y'all to be able to pull some of this shit off. I don't know. I mean, yeah, probably. But to your point of, like, characters making bad decisions, I mean, that's how these things happen.

No, no, not bad decisions. Characters making nonsensical decisions or decisions where I'm like... That we aren't informed by why they made them. Yeah, like, soul. Like, we see who soul is as an older man, right? And we see the type of, like, decisions he made. how important the Padawans are.

But even less, he has a new Padawan, the girl that just died. Yeah, Jack, Jackie. If this motherfucker loves his Padawan so much, I haven't seen him shed one tier for Homegirl. And meanwhile, we turned back and all of a sudden it's like... He's a Jedi. And he was pretty bent up. Like, you killed a child.

Like, you know what I mean? But he's a Jedi. He's not supposed to, like... He's not supposed to form attachments. Yeah, but he's clearly driven by his emotions and attachments from the beginning of this show. Even the most emotional Jedi we've ever met. He's making decisions where I'm just like,

we have not spent enough time with Young Soul for me to be like, oh, he's doing all of this because he just really, really wants a paddle. That's... So this is my deal. What's happening? This is my deal. The thing with Soul and his connection to OSHA,

that is absolutely odd. Yeah. It was just like... It was just... It's not... I don't want to make it... I know, but it's to the degree that all of these bad decisions happen.

He feels... And you also have to remember something. else. There are a couple of things here that I don't feel like the show did well enough, like explaining their specific power in the force. Like they represent a virgins. They are specific force creatures. So his connection to her might be kind of artificial. Yeah. It might be more about not who she is, but what she is. The fact that she has such a high, metaclorin count, the fact that she is a specific force being, he might be feeling pulled. And to be honest with you, what we've seen in Seoul moving in the past is that there is some

darkness in him. Yeah. So there is a passion in him that we've seen reflected in these past prior episodes. And I think the pushpool between Soul and Indara is Indara saying, hey, yeah, you feel this connection to this person. these two kids are special in what they are. But it doesn't matter. Don't mistake that for their needs.

Was that they want? Well written enough and well acted enough. And this is like, these are great active. Because I left that. I was just like, wait, let's. I'm not doing, I'm not holding any water from the show. Like, if it didn't work, it didn't work. And it kind of doesn't work.

But the only reason why I feel like it doesn't work is because there was a tone that this show was supposed to strike. and it's never really gotten there. Yeah. Like, and so they... It's flirted with it several times. There was a tone only when Mani Jacinto was on school. Yeah, which is crazy.

He's not in this episode. But he was never, but here's the thing. I know, I know. He was never going to be. I get it, but like after episode four and episode five and episode six, we're like, we're feeling it. But he was, but the thing he was,

that's why he was never going to be in the episode on Brindock. He wasn't there. Yeah, but also, but we're talking about what the show was doing then, why we have gotten to the point where Ocean May damn near, especially

OSHA, hasn't done shit. So you're sidelining your protagonist in the penultimate episode. Mani, who is like, comes in and gives the show so much force and wait. I'm now looking around, be like, what the fuck does this motherfucker have to do with any of this?

Like, it's like, well, you'll find out next, you find out the next episode. To wait that long though. Yeah, but then, but why should I care at this point? If you don't care, This is what, this is the point that I'm trying to make. Right. The point that I'm trying to make is if you are going to do, the show in my opinion is it's trying to have its cake and eat it to.

It's dipping its toe into the waters of being a sexier show. Yeah. A more sinister show. A show that shows you dead Jedi. A show that shows you a sedent. deductive scene between a Sith Lord or a Sith apprentice or whatever he is and his prospective apprentice, a show that shows you that type of sexual energy that goes to the next level.

That's a little bit more violent. That's a little bit more sensual. That deals in passion and betrayal and all of that. It's trying to be that and still be a kid show. and still be a show that appeals to the four quadrants of the Star Wars audience. That to me is the mistake or the inconsistency that's stopping it from being accessible either one way or the other. If you look at it, you have a hot guy coming out of a thing. He's naked.

That's a different Star Wars show where all these Jedi are being killed. We've seen so many dead Jedi. a different Star Wars show to where it's a sleek, noir, murder mystery, where you don't know who to trust. That's different. You can't play that with the same sparkle in the eye

that a lot of the other Star Wars content comes with. And so I think that this episode that had a lot of cool shit in it, that had cool fights. It's cool fights. The Kenknocka fight was back. Okay, you don't like Star Wars.

But it's like, it's it's fine. That was objectively cool. It's a, it's, it's, It's fine. It was goofy. It felt goofy. You don't like someone. When Kel Naka suit, even the way he was moved, everything, I was just like, all right, come

on with the CW nonsense, bro. Like, come on. So what I'm saying, but, but, but, but, but to this point though, it's got to feel more evil. It's got to feel more sinister. It's got, and that's the tone that the show has never been able to strike. And it's, it, it can't make up its mind about the show that it's trying to be because every other episode, we're doing something else.

But this is the criticism with all of this stuff except for Andor. Andor said, fuck it. It's depressing. It's not for everybody. I mean, it did. No, yeah. It said, fuck it. It's depressing.

It's not going to be bright. There's not going to be no lightsabbers. No one's coming to save you. And your main character, you saw him die. So that's the only show that's been, fuck it. No, because I think that's unfair where it's like we've gotten shows like a Loki or a Mandalorian where it's very much they're like, hey, if it's Mandalorian, this is a monster, not a monster of the week, but this is a very like, Mandalorians for kids, huh?

Mandalorans for kids. No, no, no, it is, but I'm saying like, it knows what it is. It knows what it is. Loki to me isn't necessarily for kids, but they definitely like sat down and being like, okay, this is the show that we're making and we're not going to deviate from that and it's not going to be for everyone. To your point, I agree with you, where this is, I'm like, it doesn't know if it wants to be a kid show, a murder mystery show, a very second.

see thriller type show. So what are you disagreeing with though? I'm more so I think that you like this episode in a vacuum which is like fine but to me this episode does not make sense and I saw a lot of people complaining about this where it's like

why would you just rehash a bunch of shit that we already know? I think that is something where it's like for a mystery. Yeah like if this episode was just soul telling this story and you saw like maybe a scene or two from his perspective and then May is challenging him about this narrative

and saying, no, you fucked up this. That didn't happen this way. This is what I saw. It's the same episode. It isn't. But it's the fact that like this is all hearsay from somebody else's perspective from a thing that we saw three episodes prior. There's only like 30.

Like there's a lot of the scenes are already scenes that we've already seen, but they're from soul's perspective, which I'm like, that's a choice. But that's not that interesting to watch. It's like, are okay. But do you know why that's not interesting to watch? It's not, it's done all the time. The only reason why.

it's not interesting to watch is because it's not about this episode in and of itself because the Torben scene is totally new. Them being but they're there for. Them being on the planet, totally new.

Kallak, totally new. Almost nothing that happens in the Brendock episode happens again. Nothing. When you really look at it, even the part where she sets the fire, you don't really even see it. She comes out and then you see from her point of view, like how he kills their mom.

All of that stuff, not an episode. Almost everything that happens is totally new. The only reason why it doesn't really work is because if we're being honest, the show hasn't hit. The episode falls into the same pit that the show does. It's not quite sinister enough. It's not quite devastating enough. You didn't leave the episode.

And they thought that it was. When, I'm serious, when this episode ends, there is kind of a silence coming out and then it drops that awesome kind of a banger song. It's a great song. It was a good song. Genomey, right? Who is that? Who's that song? He was Ginolemane.

Yeah, it drops kind of a banger song. You can tell they thought this was their Empire Strikes Back moment. They thought this was, oh shit, we fucked them up with this one. But the thing is, they more scratch. And itch, right? Because we wanted to know what happened on Brandeck. But once we knew, it was kind of like, all right. Right.

Is the central mystery that has been driving the season interesting enough? And that's what I kept asking myself, because they kept, when you do that thing where it's like, we're not going to tell you yet, we're not going to tell you yet. And you wait until the penultimate episode, the mystery needs to be interesting enough. And at this point, the mystery, the mystery. Right. Victoria Monnet. The mystery that they revealed isn't even like, all right, you're not really saying anything

that wild about the Jedi? Because I'm just like, was this a mistake that the Jedi made? Or was this a mistake that two or three idiot Jedi made? Like even the reveal of the witches where it's like, all right, if you're going to go back to Brendok, make me care about the witches. Teach me something new about their culture. Like, I want to know about their powers. Everything.

There was even this kind of sinister moment where men. is talking about how her mother has taught her about, like, sacrifice. And what I thought is I'm just like, oh, are they sacrificing these children for some reason? Because the witches are all like... Well, the best perspective that you got on that was in episode three was from the kids' perspective. From that. It seems like... If episode three didn't do the witch's culture for you, then it wasn't going to happen.

But here's the thing. The witches are doing this thing in the episode where they're like, oh, oh. And then, like, they just dropped dead. And I was like... I just liked that they mentioned a great hyperspace disaster. That's some deep legend shit right there. Yeah?

I'm glad you had that, man. It's fun. Re-candidization. Yeah, like, all of the fucking... This is why we can't have anything nice and Star Wars. Legends came out of the... All of the ships in hyperspace came out of hyperspace at the same time. There's some glub shit of shit.

Like, come on, bro. It's fun to me. But, I mean, look, once again, when I watched the episode, I was like, hey, it was, it was fun. I had fun. But then I was like, oh, man, the acolyte's not going to get there, is it? But to be honest with you, we all knew that the acolyte wasn't going to get there. Okay.

I don't know. Home Springs a turtle, first of all. Wait, wait, look, I'd just be honest with you. It's their still finale to come. The acolyte has been, the acolyte has been just fine, right? The acolyte has been just fine. And it's just, it's not a show. that the failing of the show

will be that in the end it wasn't good enough to justify it being made. But I'll say this about the Jedi. I'll say this about the Jedi. The Jedi in the show have been so dysfunctional prior to this and they've almost been plot divide. The Jedi in this show

haven't succeeded in anything. I think we might have to have a come to you this one. moment with the Jedi at this point. And they just might have always sucked at all points in time. Oh, I believe that. I'd be, I'd be, I'd be after that. And we have to accept every time we see a Jedi on screen, they're going to do some, some, they're going to mess up.

Separation in church and state. We got it, we got to get them out of policy. Because at this point, at this point, like, I don't, I mean, from the P equals, and then they don't, they pretty much don't exist in the other films, clone wars and this, every time Jedi show up. If Skywalker doesn't become a Jedi, the resistance doesn't win the Galactic. Yeah, I mean, shout out to Luke for doing what he can.

But, I mean, prior to that, it's just all been like every single time they're going to mess around and do some dumb, something dumb. And we've got to go around like, no, but the Jedi were cool, they know, no, no. Thousands of years, they, this piece in the galaxy.

It's the same. To me, to me, as a Star Wars purist, it was, there was. It was. I mean, to me, as a Star Wars. Who told you that story? Was it the Jedi? As a Star Wars peers?

Is it the Jedi? As a Star Wars peers, I do think that we're starting to over litigate whether or not the Jedi are good or bad or whatever. Because right now, it really seems like it's almost better to be a Sith. It seems like Sith have more fun. I might get shirts made. And this is the most frustrating thing for me about the entirety of this show is because every time it just scratches the surface of an amazing idea that could be put forward in Star Wars, it loses its focus and tries to do something else. And then it just kind of gets there and then it's undercutting.

Guys, this show, as it was pitched to us, was supposed to be about how the Sith basically rose up while the Jedi were not paying attention. And so far through nine episodes, I'm like, not only is that not what this show is about. So I'm in seven episodes. Seven, whatever. You're telling me this episode,

you're telling me just this series is as interesting as that logline. That's not the specific logline that it was but like we're supposed to see this is supposed to be the first Sith in ages and so far we've gotten like what some flashbacks to Brendok and like fucking our main character

not doing shit and then one really really good episode with a sit. We'll always have five and six episodes five and six. I'll say two great episodes. But once again though, once again, When you look back, I personally think that there's a constant here. Okay. The constant is too much story for a movie and not enough story for a series.

And they need to choose one sometimes. Yeah. If you're looking at Asoka, it seems like Asoka would have made a kick-ass movie. Yeah. Oh, yeah. But when you, when you, you know, extrapolate Asoka over X amount of episodes, you go, I don't know, man. I don't know if the highs it is have me coming back to it every week. Even if it was a movie that was just for Disney Plus.

And with this one, also, it seems as if this might have made a decent movie, if they could have distilled this down into something they could have told, in 215 or 145 or two hours. Over the course of, because then if you do that, you don't need a whole episode to go back. If you do that, things pop a little bit more. And you can get a little bit crazier, right? To me, when you look at it,

there's a similar feeling, even going back to Mando season three to where on a lot of these Star Wars situations, a lot of these Star Wars projects, they just don't have enough story. They don't have enough story. Also, but I think the other thing that I'm realizing is their ambitions in TV are too, like similar to your point, are too big for TV,

where it's just like Asoka, you got Ezra coming back, you're introducing all the rebel shit, you got what's his face, blue motherfucker, I'm blanking, Oh, Thron. Thron. Introducing Thrawn on a TV show to me is hard. In terms of like live action

and everything that Thrawn means to the fans. And I think similarly with the Ackleite, you being like, we are going to show you how the Sith rose up. I'm like, that's, I don't know how you're going to do that on TV. And so far they haven't done that yet. And I sometimes wish that I'm like, either tell a smaller, more contained story that you can pull off Or if you're trying to tell like this generation spanning story

that's going to mean something important to all of Star Wars and its legacy and everything, motherfucker, don't put that shit on Disney Plus. It's like... I mean, look, the Disney Plus experiment, and we could go even to the MCU for this, the Disney Plus experiment, maybe we'll have a longer conversation about this,

is it's such a mixed bag with all of the stuff that we've gotten. And the only things that have really, worked are things that are sequels to stuff that we've really already gotten. And characters that we already already know. And we love.

Like Wanda Vision, Wanda Vision works because we're invested. Loki works. The Mandalorian did work. I'll give that one credit. Andor. Andor worked. Andor worked. But we're getting thrown back into these worlds

that we've kind of already been familiar with. creating new worlds in these situations, although I will give Loki some credit for creating a new world, even though we did have Loki around. Yeah. Creating new worlds seems to be hard for some of these creators.

And, you know, it might be that our, not our expectations, it might be that we're used to watching television in one way and they're giving it to us in another way. Can I, this is my last question for you. Do you think that part of this just on the Star Wars front is, I want to be real, like we bring up Andor a lot.

And I do think sometimes it's unfair because like, it's always unfair. Most people are not, Tony, Tony Gilroy has enough cachet in the industry where he can walk into a place and be like, take it or leave it. I'm doing what I fucking want. Where it's like Leslie Headlin, like, she's done a lot. I don't know if she's given the Tony Gilroy treatment where it's just like, so my question for you, do you think that Star Wars is almost hamstrung by it can't, the acolyte can't be fully what it wants to be? It can't be as sexy as it wants to be. It can't be as

sinister. It can't push the story as far as it wants to. Because I feel like this about a lot of the series that they, that they create, where I'm like, even Obi-Wan, it's like, there was stuff in Obi-Wan that we liked, but it could never really be the thing that we all wanted it to be, because I think internally they're still really, really gun-shy. They're scared. They'd rather give us something that is middling to just okay versus something that is like either super amazing and blows our minds but is risky

or is risky in the other way and we all hate it. They'd rather give us the middle. Here's the thing about Obi-Wan. That should have been movie. Number one. Yes. There was no story to tell. Yes.

Tells what true. Okay. That's the thing about Obi-Wan. sometimes there's no story to tell, right? There was no story to tell with Obi-Wan, so Obi-Wan just got lazy. I like, I like, as much as anyone, as much as anyone, I like planning hits.

I like Darth Vader, capturing ships. Of course. I like Darth Vader. But Obi-Wan didn't have a real story to tell. If we're going here, I could argue that 90% of what they've made in the Disney Plus era, there's not enough story to sell. Just depends on which parts of it you feel like, you want to know more about, huh?

I mean, here's the thing about Boba Fett, and I'll be honest. It's a story you think that you want, right? Even Solo is a story that you think that you want. And then when you get it, you're like, well, you got to execute, right? And you think it could be good.

Like, you got to execute. It's a story you think that you want. Quiet plays day one. Much easier. Much easier, right? You know, do you want to know what happened the first, day the fucking blind aliens that cruise on asteroids that came here.

Do you want to know what happened the first day? You don't think it matters, but it kind of does. When you leave the movie, you go, oh, wow, well, I'm deeper in this world now because I know how things got popping off. I know how things happened. And it was a good story, first and foremost. Almost no story. Right, but it was good.

It was done well. Yeah, but Hollywood's in a prequel trap. Like, Star Wars especially is in a. a prequel trap where it's just like, we're going to tell you everything that happened before this more interesting thing. And I'm just like, prequels are hard to pull off because I'm just like nine times out of ten, whatever you show me on screen is going to be way less cool than what I thought about. Let me ask you a question. Yes. What are you interested? I think everyone should answer this question. What are you interested in knowing about Star Wars right now? I can't. Well, here's the

thing. I thought that I didn't need to know about Cassian Andor's origin story. And then we got Andor. I didn't think I needed to see some nondescript, uh, mandolian looking dude until we got the Mandalorian. Anything that they give us that we, that is good and we can deem that like is worthwhile can be worthwhile. We can be given the acolyte and it could match all of our expectations. And we could love it if it's done well. Book of Beauvettes. Same thing. All of those things. If it's worthwhile, it should be good. Yeah, we don't know what we want until it's given to us.

I know what I want. No, but like, I mean, how many times, like, I guess it's hard. Yeah, you want the Asoka thing. You want the great origin story. You would love to see so-and-so as a kid. How many great TV shows and films are you sitting there you're watching it?

You're like, oh, I'm watching something special for the first time. Yeah. Right. It's not common. It's not common. No. You know, so to expect, like, man,

this shit is going to change my life. It's not, you know, it's not sitting down watching Game of Thrones episode not watching Rains of Casimir for the first time. Right. Right. It's not how these things go usually. But even Game of Thrones shit the bed. And look where

we got us. Like you're not watching going to theater, watch the godfather part one part two. Sure. You know what I mean? Like so for these for all these properties, I'm going to be there. But at the end of the day, if they not if they're not changing the wheel,

if not reinvented the wheel, it's not the end of the world. Right. Like they have to do you have to show me something? before I'm like, yeah, that's what I'm talking about. Yeah, but here's the thing. It's like, I don't think it's actually, I think it's hard to make this shit. I will always tell.

It's like, it's hard to make it. Like, I could see how much they're sweating on the Acklite, being like, half of this is just like, making basically like three movies is always just going to be difficult. Yeah. But I do think that I'm like, I don't feel over at Star Wars or Marvel, any of the creatives,

feel empowered enough for me to see their vision. The Ake of Light seems like half of someone's vision. It seems like you were bringing this up. I want the version of the accolite that's on 100. Is as sexy as it thinks it is? Is as sinister as it thinks it is? Same thing with Boba Fet.

If you're going to make a crime boss show, make a fucking crime boss show. Don't like half step and do the do da-da-da-da. Like getting like mate. Or the two episodes of Mandalorian in that show? No. You know, like if you're doing an Asoka show, do the Samurai Asoka show.

Do the like, oh, Asoka the White. It's a lot of half measures coming out of here. Yeah, it's a lot of like, they get right up to the point where they're about to try something new, and they're like, we're going to anger too many people. And I'm just like, anger them. It does not matter. You got two guns shy from Last Jedi.

I'm not about to say. No, for real. Like, Last Jedi pissed too many people off. Solo pisses off too many people. And we don't get Star Wars movies anymore. They're always pissed off. No, no, no, no. But you need them, you, like you, okay, so this is what I'll say.

To me, Andor is not about casting an Andor's origin story. No. It's not. So the empire is the worst thing in the world. They're terrible. And we learned this. Let's say you had only watched the movies. You really wouldn't know why they were that bad.

Yeah. You know, if you had just watched the movies, you'd see, hey, you know, Darth Vader's an asshole. And Palpatine is an asshole. But you never really talked to, like, regular people. Yeah. So you really wouldn't know, like, what was so bad about the empire.

And even moving forward, When you're talking about different stuff, you know that they're bad because they got red lightsabers and because they choke people out. Yes, and they use lightning. And they use lightning. So you know that they're evil and they want to have power and all of that stuff. You know that that's bad. If you read a lot of Star Wars, comic books, EU books, other stuff like Lens, all that stuff, even Canon stuff. Then you would know some of the stuff that was going on, right?

You'd know some of that stuff. But it's on the screen. How bad is the empire? to me, the first property that gives you that knowledge is Andrew. It answers a fundamental question in Star Wars lore. What was so fucking bad about these guys? And then you see a dude who's on a fucking planet trying to get away from some shit

is incarcerated with no trial, put in a terrible fucking futuristic prison, and then made to build parts for the Death Star just because they needed the labor. You see authoritarian police state rule. You see it, you feel it, you smell it. Like, that answers a fundamental, even it's not just about fun.

It's like, well, shit, somebody had to put a stop to this shit. Yeah. Like you, and even when Scarsgarg gives his whole deal, you go, yeah, it don't matter what you got to do. Someone had to stop that. And it actually makes the whole, Hoth Battle and Jedi and Empire. It makes all of that stuff better.

Even if not a ton of people watched Andor, like it wasn't the biggest deal. It makes the rest of it better because it deepens your understanding of it. You're like, shit, man. And not only that, but it gives agency to people who didn't have no special powers. And to people who weren't around people

that had special powers. It gives more agency to them. Now, if you read a lot of Star Wars, you might be familiar with all of those stories. That's why the story works. But also what Andor does is something so simple. When Andor's like we're going to prison for like two or three episodes, it's like a prison movie. Even structurally, everything that they're doing, you're getting those pleasure centers of like, I've watched so much prison content. This is like, these are kind of like the beats that you just need to hit or aesthetically, this is how it needs to look.

Take something like the accolate where it's like, we've always been like, what's the tone? what's this? Because then some Muppet shit happens. Because it doesn't know what it wants to be. And I think that's like even with the Boba Fett show when we are making fun of the Power Rangers, where it's like if you're presenting the Boba Fett show as he's trying to be a crime boss, then everybody who's working on that show like tonally and thematically and like the cinematography, visuals, everything has to be like, all right, are we making sure the audience like knows this is a crime show?

It's mature enough. It is like it's that. And I think a lot of. of this Star Wars content isn't even doing the simple thing where it's like, all right, we are telling a prison story, we're telling a crime story, we're telling a murder mystery, and at every single point being like, are we hitting this? Because a lot of times it's like, all right, now we're just going to throw in some shit for the fans. So like, even if they're mad at us, it'll be like, oh, hey, bubble guts, motherfucker, they just name dropped him. I love these shit.

Once again, I think more of it has to do with- That's what's dangerous body under the I think more of it just has to do with just a little bit of half-stepping. Just tell your story. And at this point, there's really not much to lose because none of it's really working anyway. So it's like at this point, just do some crazy shit. Yeah, man. Just do the shit. Star Wars vampires.

Let's go. You know, just do something. Star Wars time travelers. Yeah, man. Oh, that'd be nuts. You know what I'm saying? But they don't ever want to do time to break. Long long time ago.

so many. We have a thing too, and the acolyte does do it. When Mani pops on the screen and he's flying, if we saw a flying motherfucker and that shit looked terrible, we'd all be like, fuck this show, but it didn't. It looked crazy. We're just like, this is, and I'm like, oh, the show has. That's why

I saw, we saw Leia fly in The Last Jedi, right? She was in space, though. Oh, it's different when you couldn't. I'm saying, so there's no gravity, so maybe she was just moving herself. You're not flying it. You can't just pulling, there's no gravity. Yeah. You can only fly when there's gravity. Can't you interesting?

Do you ever worry about gravity just giving out? No, no. No. Have you ever been thinking, like, why? Why does gravity work? We're on vitamin number seven for van, by the way. Look at it. What if one day... It just didn't do that.

How about we change this whole part? Gravity's not fucking real. I mean, gravity... It was made by the white man. Y'all trying to go viral. But when you're anxious as a kid, this is the kind of stuff that would make my... dad go, what is wrong with that boy?

I'd be like, I'd be walking around. Yeah, I'd be walking around moping. Van, what's wrong with you? Dad, what if gravity give out? Get your motherfucking eyes in there and clean that room. I'm talking about some fucking gravity. Crystal, get this boy that psychiatrist. Okay.

We got to go. Interesting, robust conversation. This was kind of a Midnight Man episode. Yeah. People are going to be, they like, fuck Charles. but a lot of people hated that. Y'all are going O-T. These are two episodes

that I don't think were very popular. And by the way, I get it. I get it. I just had to keep it real. I watched it twice, and I wasn't. I didn't have a big problem with it,

but I do understand why I didn't work. It's because the show's not totally working. Yeah. It's not. Can't wait. We all Laurel's rest on next week. And we're going to be live, baby. We can't know.

I'm not doing this live. I spoke up that they told, that they turned soul into Derek Chauvin, though. Oh. Oh. Oh, right. You've got, come on, man.

Let's get, let's get out of here. We're not doing that. Let's get out of here, man. You're saying. So he's never going to recover. There's nothing he can do. Soul's cooked. Soles cooked.

I want to get Ben Crump out there. I think, I think, I think the galaxy need Bencrump. I think, I'm not going to explain what he said, but it's kind of crazy. That soul's whole thing was, man. You know, I saved Osha instead of May.

Ah, my chest, I did a bad thing. Brother, you just murdered an innocent woman. Also, by the way, you're telling the story to the woman you chose not saying. I hate Sinema sins. Why couldn't he was like holding up both of the bridges? Didn't have enough power in the force. Clearly.

I was just like, why couldn't he just like hold up Ocean May with the Force? Probably, probably also. What makes Superman fly faster? Also, probably was a little disconnected from the force. Because he was wilding. It's probably also probably all the same. same reason why he couldn't tell that it was

May and not OSHA at first because he was disconnected from the force. This motherfucker was reading minds from miles away. This episode, I'm like, and you can't tell which one is OSHA in May? Couldn't do it. Can't do it. Wasn't locked them. Couldn't do it. Real dumb. It had to be locked in. It wasn't locked in. Couldn't do any of it. Ended up

fucking up the whole thing. So, one of the worst Jedi. Next episode, we're going to do top five worst Jedi. I mean, how much time do we have? Souls up there, bro. He let May die. It's crazy. That's a wrap. Every Tuesday and Thursday, House of R

will deep dive into House of the Dragon and Acolype every Monday the Midnight Boys will give you our reactions to Hot D

next Tuesday we'll be live at 7 p.m. on YouTube reacting to the finale of the acoly Yeah! Get into it,

Jomey. And Thursday we'll be back for the boys season four finale. Every Sunday Talk to Thrones

will be up right after our latest episode of Hot D. Do not forget you guys July 17th at the El Ray Theater

Jomey's B day. Jommies B day. Let's go. Got to do it. we also have to talk about the fact that we got a lot show on the one motherfucker that's right go to where you go where they go ringer ringer yeah ringer dot com slash events ringer dot com slash events get your tickets motherfuckers um

a producer is steve the architect almond Jonathan chocolate taco taco mr midnight conuncular chocolate bear chalk man chalk man dark chocolate chocolate chucky chucky There's four black folks on this show. Yeah. Whoa.

Cocoa Mellon. Cermon. Cocoa Mellon. It's insane. A lay in those nickname to theirs. Last week. Last week. Jomi.

Explained Adderon on socials. Hashtag Dairy Dynasty at Dineron. That's the fuck I'm talking about. I like that one. This show production from Arjuna, the Watcher. Rangapal. Chuck, take a sound. Jedi Lives Matter.

My skin is off the cell. And if you're coming to Jomey's B-Day, make sure you bring some of that mother's moon. Be-hoo! Before we get into this, guys, come on. Professional. What's you mean? We got fucking, we got wallets. Keys and on here's all out here.

Come on, bro. What are we doing? We got the badge. People about to steal your identity. It's a lot going on. Get the badge on there. What's going on? Badges, pills, man.

This is the animal pack. All right. Beat that out. No free ads. Beat that out. No, no, you put it in there. This is, well, this, my vitamins. I got to take my vitamins.

Yes. Old man, van. Why can't we take the vitamins before the pod? Why can't we, he's got a steady the flow? Well, why can't you drink the coffee before the pot? Whoa. Get your coffee off the table. My, I'm so close to quiet quitting this entire podcast after the last two episodes of what we

watch. Do not push me further. Hey, it ain't going to be. Don't be quiet. I'm on it. Don't quiet quit, nigga, loud quick. Get the fuck. Yeah, loud quit.

We've only known you to loud anything. Get the fuck out. Don't quiet quit. Your, Charles' protest. Hey.