The Royals with Roya and Kate - How to do a state visit with style

Episode Date: July 10, 2025

All the stops were pulled out for a full-blown state visit for President Macron so Roya and Kate go behind the scenes at Windsor Castle to bring you all the news from carriages to canapés as well as speeches and sparkling (British) wine. the Princess of Wales attended her first state banquet in two years, and stole the show. King Charles and the president both delivered messages of post-Brexit unity and Roya and Kate discuss how important the royals are when an Entente Cordiale is upgraded to an Entente Amicale! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to The Royals with Roya and Kate. I'm Roya Neekar from The Sunday Times. And I'm Kate Mancy from The Times. Today we revel in the splendour as King Charles rolls out the red carpet for the state visit of President Macron of France. And there joining the King and President Macron at the Royal Banquet at Windsor Castle was you and I Kate and the Princess of Wales, her first state banquet in almost two years. So we're going to look at what was said, what was eaten, what was worn and what it all means for the palace and the Entente Cordiale or should that be Entente Amical? It's had a bit of an upgrade hasn't it? And we'll get a little sneak peek to the King's Tours exhibition at Buckingham Palace. So turning first to the three day state visit from France's President Macron and his wife Brigitte, which kicked off in earnest on Tuesday

with all the bells and whistles of all the King's horses and the carriages. All the King's men. All the King's horses and the carriages, all the king's men, all the king's men and the state banquet and some speeches after a very long speech in the House of Parliament. And this wasn't just pettitry and pomp but a declaration that despite Brexit, Britain and France are bound by history and purpose. This idea that the countries are going to continue to have a glorious relationship together despite Brexit. And this is the first visit by a European

leader since Brexit was instigated. Not since the referendum, but since it was instigated. Which Macron kept reminding us after didn't he, that Brexit was a bad move. So he says – He was not a fan of Brexit. Not a fan. Yeah. Not a fan. Yeah, that's right. Which he made very clear during his 45 minute speech in the Houses of Parliament, much longer than the one you and I had to sit through in Monaco Gate. And it's a different tone, wasn't it?

I think there's a real awkwardness between Stammer and Macron. And this is where, da da da da, in comes the king to make it better. More of a lovin'. More of a lovin'. Much more of a lovin'. More of a lovin'. Much more of a lovin'. Very touchy feely, very tactile. They were patting each other as arms and hands. And despite the fact this is a state visit,

and normally there'd be quite a lot of engagements with the king and queen, this three day visit is very government heavy. It is. We all know why Macron's here. It's to flesh out a deal with Stammer and tackle some of those thorny issues like migrant crossings in the channel and how to develop a relationship or keep that relationship going post-Brexit.

So before he arrived at Downing Street today for that lunch and that summit, it was the king's job and the queen's job and William and Kate's job to butter him up as much as possible. Literally with a banquet. And make him feel as warm and fuzzy and appreciated as possible. And I definitely felt like watching him yesterday and you and I were there all day as those carriages processed through Windsor, swung into the quadrangle at Windsor Castle and he was doing that garden of honour inspection and then watching him process into the state banquet and just looking at his

face as he was taking in the surroundings of St George's Hall, you could tell it affected him. You could tell it had impact. Yes. He looked quite emotional at points as well. I mean, mostly thoroughly delighted. Absolutely thrilled. When Jack Schirack came over in 1996, he had a wobble beforehand because he thought that the carriage procession would look outdated and really antiquated. And his wife and his daughter and his aide kind of talked him into it and said, no, no, you've got to do this.

This is really important. He did it and he loved it. And Schirach was there kind of blowing kisses to the crowd and the late queen looked quite bemused sitting next to him. But I don't think Macron's ever had any qualms like that because he came into power before his sort of election campaign in 2017. In 2016, he kind of set aside his stall as the king that France didn't know it needed. And he's always presented himself in quite a regal fashion.

Well, Brigitte was picking up the Jacques Chirac blowing kisses from the carriages theme because she was blowing kisses at anyone who would look yesterday from the carriage. But it was very warm, wasn't it? And I think you could see how much he appreciated the warmth, the genuine warmth of the welcome from not just the King and Queen, but from William and Kate, who obviously went to meet them at the airport and escorted them to Windsor. And there were all the diplomatic touches straight off. From the moment we saw William and Kate go to RAF Northolt, there was the princess in a dusty pink Dior outfit. Of course, French designer, French fashion house with so much history, often worn by the First Lady herself.

And earrings from the late Princess Diana who is still very well thought of in France. Absolutely. And then when they came to Windsor Castle and we started to see the interaction and then they had their lunch. After lunch they had this wonderful show of, which they always do on state visits, items from the Royal Collection Trust which speak to the French UK Alliance over the centuries. There was poetry that, English poetry that Napoleon had read and sent to one of his relations, which I loved because one of the wonderful touches at the state banquet last night was that the Waterloo chamber where musical performances

were supposed to take place and did take place was renamed for the night into the Music Room. We don't mention Waterloo around here, which happened actually before when Sarkozy was here. And I just think that's a brilliant diplomatic nod. Don't mention Waterloo to the French. Don't mention the war. I think that's, yeah, there were so many touches, weren't there? The King made a point during his speech about the wine list, the fact that they were drinking English sparkling wine, but actually it's been created by Tattenshire here in the UK.

I thought that was quite punchy to serve English sparkling wine to the French president. It's okay, I think, if it's made by Tattenshire. Yeah, I love that. It's a bit of a fudge, but yes. There was that and then we had Raymond Blanc in the kitchen. So we were told he was preparing the starter and the dessert and the castle chefs were preparing the main chicken supreme for the main course. This was the first state visit we've had at Windsor Castle for quite a long time. Of course, Buckingham Palace is going through this major renovation, the spruce up.

Sarkozy was the last one in 2008. It was, very long time ago. But it was quite extraordinary. You and I got to walk in and see St. George's Hall and do a preview of the state bank, going to see it all laid out. It had taken six days to lay that table. There was a lot of glassware and a lot of candelabra. And I have to say, walking into St. George's Hall was absolutely a sort of just vision and an assault on the senses with the flowers, the settings, and from every bit of the sort of walls either side, those suits of armour. So I think as far as pomp and pageantry and bells and whistles go, state visits at Windsor Castle from what we saw yesterday, during the day as well as the state banquet in the

evening was pretty, it was a bit of an extravaganza wasn't it? It was everything you'd want it to be. It was very glamorous, it was very glitzy, it was very formal. You can't get much more formal than white tie and tiaras, but there was just something about the history and the splendor of Windsor Castle being all dressed up. The oldest inhabited royal castle in the world. And the twinkly lights, everything's sort of candle lit in the evening and they put tiny little lampshades over the candlesticks. I loved seeing, because we were in the Queen's Gallery, which was, I have to say, as holding

rooms go for the media, pretty, pretty extraordinary. There was a large chandelier hanging from the ceiling and plenty of gilt mirrors and beautiful ore paintings. What I loved was peering out of the window a few times and seeing guests being driven up on little golf buggies from Henry VIII Gate all the way up past the round tower up to the quadrangle to the entrance. That rather wonderful. Yeah, well William famously whizzes round on a little electric scooter doesn't he when he's there? I really must ask to get my ride on a golf buggy when I'm next to Windsor Castle. I'm made to walk Kate. That's just not acceptable. Don't they know who you are? Working on it. Also it's the hall

which burnt down in 1992 in the great fire of Windsor Castle and had to be completely rebuilt and when they rebuilt the roof they actually made it taller or the hall which burnt down in 1992 in the great fire of Windsor Castle and had to be completely rebuilt and when they rebuilt the roof they actually made it taller or higher up and they had to learn how that roof was made because all those kind of skills had pretty much died out. So it's historic, the king made reference to that fire didn't he in his speech and you know likened it to the Notre Dame Cathedral fire. And Stammer will be thinking, Macron will be thinking, how do we rebuild that relationship from the ashes of Brexit? But it's interesting, there was definitely this sense of, you know,

things haven't always been great between us, things haven't always been great in our respective countries, or even in the room that we're sitting in. But let's move forward together. And he talked about the Entente Cordiale becoming the Entente Amicale. It's had an upgrade. It's had an upgrade. It's gone from business class to first class. We're now the Entente Amicale. It's been rebranding. Rebranding. And he talked about them not just being friends, but family. And I don't think you can get much warmer than that. I don't think they could have done much more to show,

not just Macron, but the world and the rest of Europe. Look, we can have these relationships. We can have these friendships. Despite Brexit. I thought what was really interesting about those two speeches, obviously the King spoke first and then Macron replied. There was a lot of humor, a lot of warmth.

It was the first time I can think of that I've heard a speech from the king during a state visit where he hasn't mentioned his mother. And you know, when we went to France, we went to Germany, there was so much reference of Queen Elizabeth in those countries, the mutual respect and admiration from other heads of state and those long relationships brought up with her. What was fascinating was Macron mentioned her almost immediately at the top of his speech. He paid tribute to her and he used that wonderful phrase again, he redeployed it, which he used when she died, which he put out on social media saying, to you, she was your queen,

to us, she was the queen. And I thought that was, it was wonderful. And it was very, it was a memorable moment at the beginning of his speech. And it sort of laid that sort of outlook, as you mentioned about family and how important, you know, the bonds are between France and us, even though we haven't always been the closest of allies, how we want to kind of make that much closer now. This morning, actually, when they said an official goodbye to them at Windsor Castle, again, the late Queen was brought sort of into proceedings because there was a sort of show of some carriages, but also this wonderful horse that Maton had given Queen Elizabeth a beautiful dapple grey gelding

and he was brought out of his stable and... Yeah, we haven't killed the gift. Still got it. And it turns out that Princess Anne has been riding him privately, not on trooping, still on naughty noble on trooping, but we're told he's a bit of a bit of a bit of a nibbly boy, but very well behaved. And there's Charabanc as well, a historic Charabanc that's been gifted from the French years beforehand. But it was a proper love and again when they said goodbye there were you know it was very warm lots of kisses, lots of seemed to be a plan being hatched between Brigitte and Camilla to meet each other privately and maybe on you know on the side. Yeah it is I think it's genuine affection

there it's not just for soft power diplomacy. Yeah, that's it. I mean, we should speak about the King's bloody eye yesterday. Now that looked really quite bad. Now on his right eye, essentially it was filled with blood, completely bloodshot. And Panas was saying, as a birth blood vessel, saying it's not related to any illness or treatment that we currently know about, just one of those things. But obviously you can't get away from the fact that he's still having weekly cancer treatment. He's still doing an awful lot. You know, the courtiest I saw in Buckingham Palace this morning, all really shattered after just yesterday and all the events that have been coming up. And

the King plows on. You do wonder whether it sort of takes its toll on him. And then you see something like that. Had that been the late queen, you know, it would have, and it has been the case, you know, when Prince Philip had black eyes and he has had sort of bruising around his face

as he got older, that became a kind of huge story. It seems ridiculous, I suppose, but it's not so much now. But it is interesting to note it, because it was just so obvious. Yeah, it was. It didn't seem to slow him down. No, nothing seems to slow him down, does it?

Even though Macron appeared to be a bit late. And thank goodness that it was only 10 minutes of speech in the evening. Well, why do we think that was? Because his speech was so long, he doesn't know how to make a short speech, does he, old Emanuel? Last night was 10 minutes, wasn't it? Yeah.

Now, the other very notable moment and moments of yesterday in the optics was that, of course, the Princess of Wales, who we've seen at state visits previously, and we saw her at the Qatar state visit, but she just did the arrival for that. She didn't do the state banquet. We haven't seen her at a state banquet since the South Korea state banquet in 2023. We had her talking just last week about how she doesn't always feel great, and everyone has expected you to be back on form once you finish chemo, and that's not the case.

But I think it was welcome and encouraging to see her take part in the full day and be at the state banquet looking fantastic in that red dress didn't she by Givenchy. Sarah Burton her wedding dress designer. Sarah there's a. Who's now at Givenchy yeah. Yeah you get in a room like that and she really is you know the celebrity that everybody's looking at.

Not a celebrity she's a member of the royal family of course but in a room where you've got Sir Elton John, Sir Mick Jagger, Kristin Scott Thomas, Mika, you had Mary Earps, the female football goalkeeper who plays for Paris Saint-Germain. Anthony Gormley, Sebastian Fokes, it was a very starry affair. I was speaking to someone at the Palace today who was there last night and they said, yeah it was going great, I was speaking to some really interesting people and then somebody sort of saw Sir Elton John over my shoulder and they were off like a flash. I didn't even say goodbye. Oh, yikes.

Yeah, and Mick Jagger, he keeps popping up at French State Bank, didn't he? He was there at Versailles. He'll be ambassador for the King's Foundation before you know it. Has he got the time? Well, I did joke with somebody about whether David Beckham would be there given his Paris Saint-Germain connection. State banquet too far having done the last one. He's done quite a lot. And also then you get Princess of Wales in The Love Is Not Tiara and it's a kind of a red Givenchy caped gown.

It's a bit of a show stopper. Yeah, she is. Yeah, she is. She is the Princess is the ultimate trump card, isn't she? I think that they play and there was no great surprise. We saw her sitting next to Matt Cromper table. Yeah, Matt Cromper was in between Princess of Wales and the King. As seating plans go, it's not a bad draw, is it? How was your draw last night, Emmanuel?

Yeah, it was all right. I had Charles on my left, Kate on my right. And that was the nice thing as well about the way the tables were done at Windsor last night. Normally at Buckingham Palace, they all sit on top table, don't they? Whereas here they were split up. So Macron was next to the King and Kate.

Brigitte was next to William on the other side. Well, we probably should talk about William because he was mentioned in the King's speech and talks about previous Williams in the royal family and saying, you know, my son's decided to make his family home here at Windsor, at which point Macron seemed to kind of give a little wink, didn't he, to William across the table.

He's talking about you. When he walked in and arrived and they sort of took their seeds, he winked at Brigitte. He just sort of looked around to glory and he was winking as if to say, can you believe this? Can you believe this is all for us? this, can you believe this is all for us? So obviously there's the tiaras, this proper white tie occasion and the senior members of the royal family wear the royal family order. What's the royal

family order Kate? Royal family order is in the gift of the monarch, it's a little picture of themselves set in an oval with diamonds. Used to be on ivory and now under the king's throne he has it on polymin which is a synthetic sustainable very king-like fabric I'm told. I haven't got one if it's in the king's gift. I haven't got one. No you have to be a senior member of the royal family I'm sorry so that kind of it's just fine print. It's a tough club to get into. Who does them? Who designs them? Who paints them? So I spoke to Elizabeth Meek who is a miniature portraitist and she is...

What's interesting about her was she's completely self-taught and she was a nurse for years, was told she would never amount to anything by her art teacher and difficult family background, bought a book for five pounds on how to paint miniatures and said to herself I think I can have a go at that. She ended up as part of the Society of Miniature Portrait Painters, of which the King, then Prince of Wales's patron, got to know him, painted him at High Grove and when he needed his family auditing, he thought of her. And she said he's got a memory like an elephant. He remembers people and he remembers what they can do and commissioned her to do it and she was terrified of course because she thought oh gosh maybe I can't

do it. But she did this tiny little sort of three by four centimetres portrait of him and it took her a hundred hours and she sort of barely stopped when she did it and nobody seemed to know why. I mean it's not to say that she wouldn't wear the late Queen's family order on another occasion. Yeah. Now, Roya, what would a state visit be without a shower of gifts? What do you get the man who's got everything? What did the king give President Macron?

He gave him all sorts. All sorts. He gave him a sapling, didn't he? A sapling oak tree from one of the Windsor nurseries, which is going to be planted in France and will grow and hopefully grow and grow and represent the growing warmth between our two great nations. Loves the tree, does he? He does love a tree. Good on him. What else did he give him, Kate? A set of 12 placemats featuring watercolours of Scotland and France painted by... The King! The King! Here's some of my work. He's done a painting and had it made up into placemats because there's websites where you

can do that. So he's done that. I love his watercolour show and tell. I do that with my kids art. Do you think they're going to have their official show back in Paris? I do that with my kids art for my parents at Christmas. Do you think the King, who isn't the most tech savvy monarch we've ever had, let's be honest, do you think he, choose your prince, chose his

prince and then do you think he went on the computer and like put them in? I think he didn't. I think someone said, your majesty, what might be a nice idea? And he probably said yes. So do you think they're going to sit there and have their croissants with their placemats and go, well, of course, this is the picture done by the king. I'm thinking... It's quite an icebreaker over lunch or dinner. Let's find out. But, okay, what did Macron bring the king? Macron brought the king.

Apart from his joie de vivre and his charm. Macron brought all of those things. A trumpet. Because nothing says, thanks for having us, like a trumpet. What are you going to do with that, Charles? Do you know what I think Charles would like to play that to be honest? We've seen him play a carrot. Anything is possible. I think the gift he brought that he's going to love was a hamper of produce from the Alice

Palace, including homemade honey. Because we know he likes honey. Nice. So he brought him some honey. That's well thought out. Yeah. And he brought him some beautiful, original, very old score of some music by Debussy, who again we know that the King is a huge fan of classical music and is a big fan of Debussy, so it's very well thought through. I love the idea that there's a meeting, you know, by the French government heads of state

and ministers about what should we get the King. And referencing the other gift that they were given, the place of mass, Charles's watercolors, Brigitte and Emmanuel gave him a set, a watercolor set, special wooden watercolor set that was inscribed, and we'll have to see whether the king takes those out and uses those for his next watercolors that he paints. Anyway, they're very thoughtful gifts.

But another big gift we're getting from the French on loan. It's a biggie. It's been promised before and not delivered. The Bayeux tapestry, so if you've got Deja vu, that's probably for good reason. This is, of course, the famous tapestry that illustrates the battle of Hastings of 1066. And we're told it's going to return to the UK on loan for the first time in more than 900 years. Now, we've heard this before because it was promised under Theresa May's government and it never appeared.

There was a bit of politics going on. I think France didn't get a few bits and pieces they were asking for in return and so it did not come. But we are going to lend some treasures from Sutton Hoo as part of this. This is this is a different kind of French exchange, isn't it? I think it'll be grand. I saw it once when I was very young on a school trip to France. I remember thinking it was very dark where it was displayed as obviously it would have to be to protect it. And it's obviously quite a big deal part of the state visit because it was mentioned in Macron's speech.

With great flourish, yes. Yeah, he went on for quite a while about that. So I think it's fair to say, Kate, that it was the full bells and whistles yesterday in terms of everything you can throw to state visit and more. It had all the trimmings. We're going to have to see what other trimmings can be pulled out and stuck on when the Donald rolls into town in September because he's going to want extra Yorkshire pudding trimmings, isn't he? Yorkshire pudding trimmings. What will they serve? He loves burger, french fries. He loves burger. Maybe the tree will be a maple tree.

Don't mention Canada. It's going to be brilliant. It's going to be a fest. It's going to be beautiful. It will be the biggest. The most beautiful US presidential visit we've ever seen. It will be the biggest, most beautiful one that we've ever seen. I think that's, yeah.

We'll be there. Now moving away from the banquet hall, reluctantly, and Windsor to Buckingham Palace because earlier in the week, Roya, you went around to have a look at the new exhibition in the staterooms. I did. This is the new exhibition that's opening the King's Tour artists at Buckingham Palace for its summer opening in the staterooms and there's a selection of around 70 paintings that are in the King's personal collection that have been painted by artists over the years from the 1980s to the present day by artists who have accompanied the King and now the King and Queen on overseas trips. And these are ones that he's chosen personally

from various portfolios that hang in various royal residences privately. I know you were there today with the King. Yeah, I was there with the King and Queen today as they went to meet, they went to meet the tour artists, they were sort of standing by their paintings which was rather nice. I loved seeing, there was a work there by John Ward who was the very first tour artist who went to Venice with the then Prince of Wales in 1985 and I'm always very fond of seeing John's work because John actually painted both my parents. Did he? He's very famous as a portrait artist. Oh, I'd love to see those. Yeah, we have them. And so I was very intrigued to see some of his work

that's not portrait style. And so it's interesting what they capture as well, because it's not just a kind of vanity project that they go and do portraits of the king and queen. They're allowed to sort of free reign to do whatever it is they want. And I was perhaps under the misconception that the king was following some sort of historic protocol. But actually he sort of came up with the idea that someone should just come with him and paint. I'm sure Queen Victoria had artists and things in residence.

But he is such a patron of the arts and that he's pushing them outside their boundaries. Free reign during their art. They have free reign. What I love is they're not... They're not told, paint that, paint that. They're not given a strict protocol. We spoke to a wonderful artist, of course, Susanna Fiennes, who accompanied the King to oman the Falklands and Hong Kong, that historic handover of Hong Kong back to China in 1997. She's got some wonderful anecdotes. I'm not going to say much more because we've recorded

a wonderful special episode which will come out in early August and you can hear some anecdotes from her and we walk and talk through the exhibition. It's rather wonderful and you'll be able to listen to that and watch it on the YouTube channel. But it is a very wonderfully sort of visual part of bits of trips that we go on and see but they capture what we don't see and they capture what the cameras don't see as well. Just the kind of, the sort of brilliant chaos and fun of it all. It's a wonderful tradition and it's well worth,

if you're in London and you fancy a trip to the state rooms, it's well worth seeing. And also you can, at the present moment, you can also see, as part of the summer opening, the two state, Coronation State portraits. part of the summer opening the two state coronation state portraits. Yeah, I'm looking forward to that episode. Well, sadly, that's all we've got time for, Roya. I better go off and file a story.

Off you go, Kate. Good luck with that. Au revoir. Happy end to you.