The Ryan Hanley Show - Concussions, Ozempic and Leadership Through Crisis

Episode Date: June 10, 2024

Became a Master of the Close: https://masteroftheclose.comWhen a brutal hit during my senior football season left me grappling with the reality of concussions, I knew my life would never be the same. This personal journey led me to a deep exploration of head injuries in sports, and I’m thrilled to be joined by Dr. Tom Mayer, the medical director of the NFL Players Association. ✅ Join over 10,000 newsletter subscribers: https://go.ryanhanley.com/ ✅ For daily insights and ideas on peak performance: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryanhanley ✅ Subscribe to the YouTube show: https://youtube.com/ryanmhanleyConnect with Dr Thom Mayer:Leadership Is Worthless…But Leading Is PricelessDr Thom's WebsiteTogether, we unpack the advancements in concussion protocols, the introduction of position-specific helmets, and the invaluable role of unaffiliated neurotrauma consultants. Dr. Mayer also sheds light on the broader impact of concussions across various sports, including the often-overlooked issue in women's soccer, and the relentless quest for safer athletic environments.Transitioning from the high-stakes world of sports injuries, we address the challenge of staying physically active in an increasingly sedentary lifestyle. With practical tips like utilizing stand-up desks and incorporating regular stretching into your day, we emphasize the transformative power of treating exercise as essential medicine. Our conversation highlights the importance of leading by example in personal health, showing how taking initiative can inspire those around you. We discover that the true joy lies in the lasting impact of helping others embark on their own health journeys.In the latter part of the episode, we delve into the significant influence of medications, hormonal balance, and systemic inflammation on overall health. From the powerful effects of GLP-1 agonists to the benefits of reducing inflammation through diet, our discussion underscores the interconnectedness of various health factors. Dr. Mayer also shares insights on the importance of maintaining optimal testosterone levels and the holistic approach needed to achieve overall well-being. Wrapping up, we celebrate Dr. Mayer’s latest book, his dedication to advancing medical knowledge, and his upcoming adventures, leaving listeners with a wealth of knowledge and inspiration to optimize their health and performance.

Lifespan, healthspan, joy span. And joy span is not just how long and how well you live, but how joyous you live, how creative you are, how cognitive you are of your horizons and where you are when you're working. So if you look at any of those factors, concussions or not, single most important determinant in all decades of life with regard to all-cause mortality, as well as brain health, is VO2 max. And, you know, it's really technical. No, it's not really. It's really exercise. Are you able to get some form of exercise around three hours a week? Doesn't have to be the most intense. Doesn't have to be, you know, sprinting, running, cycling, climbing a mountain, you know, just walking, walking up inclines, walking and building your cardiovascular strength, insulin resistance, importance of sugars, as you say, pre-diabetes, not just diabetes, but type 2 diabetes, pre-diabetes.

You know, what's your insulin resistance? What's your lipid profile? How can you manage that? So as you might guess, it all pulls together in these wonderful ways that if someone says, well, what's most important? The answer is yes. Yes. All of the things that i just mentioned are critically important and for an audience like yours that are you know entrepreneurial people uh whether they're building business ventures whether they're building a family whether they're building their own life their own capability and creativity and ability to think, act, and innovate, as I like

to say, in creative ways, all those things are going to be fueled by a healthy body, which drives a healthy mind, which drives the ability to think and make connections, almost epiphanous moments that you wouldn't see if you weren't able to do that. Plus, as you know, you're an athlete, both a current and former athlete. You know, there's a almost zen-like state that you get from exercise, a reflection and ability to think clearly about what's going on in your surroundings and how you adapt to your surroundings. So it's mystical, but it's also highly scientific. Like a lot of people who were former or were athletes in high school or college, you get into your life, you get into the more sedentary work

life, office life, et cetera, whatever your career is. And you start to let the habits slip that kept you in shape during the times when you were more athletic. And you look in the mirror and you, you start convincing yourself that you're still an athlete or you're still in shape, even though what you're seeing in your reflection doesn't necessarily say that that's the case. And in 2017, I had this moment where I was so riddled with inflammation from eating like crap and drinking too much and not working out enough and traveling without a good plan for, for being on the road and all these things that, uh, on the second day of a conference that I was, that I was putting on, um, I literally couldn't finish, could not finish the conference. I was the MC and I, and I couldn't go back out and it, it changed

the entire course of my life since then. This was 2017, lost 25 pounds, got, got all these things. Okay. So one of the things that I come across a lot with the clients that I coach, uh, they come to me for business related things, but oftentimes their physical health is so out of whack that starting to dial in on some of the mental habits or mental frameworks that I might want to teach them from a business perspective, it's almost irrelevant to talk about some of these items in a business context because their physical health is so out of alignment. When you come across these people or just your, your best guidance for what this might be, how do people get started? How does someone who has let themselves start to

fade away? What are some of the small things that they can do? And I know you're not necessarily like a health coach or whatever, but obviously dealing, being in the NFL, seeing what goes on and then getting to know so many of these guys after their careers, right? How, how do you, how do you start to get this alignment? And what are some of the, what are the 20% things that are going to give you the 80% results for a, for a working professional? Excellent question. You know, first of all, when I talk about the different distinction between leadership and leading, leading being what we do, not what we say. Leadership is worthless because it's what you say and anybody can say anything. Leading is what

you do. So I always tell people the leader you're looking for is you. The answers are not above us, they're within and among us. And the answer is it's never too late. It's never too late to start. The time to start is now. The person to start that process is you. And, you know, I always tell my patients, my colleagues, treat exercise like a medication because it is a medication, stronger than any medication known to man, stronger than lipid-lowering drugs, than antihypertensive drugs, than GLP-1 agonists, the ozempics, rhabelsus, those kinds of things, all great medications. But the strongest thing that you have is yourself. And begin when? Begin now.

Doesn't matter what shape you're in right now. Any exercise is good exercise as long as you don't overdo it. Sure, you want to be out of breath. If you have chest pain, then that's a different story altogether. And it can start as simply as get a stand-up desk. Work standing up instead of sitting down. You know the old saying, you know, sitting is the new smoking. Because for a lot of different reasons. It's bad for our posture.

It's bad for our muscles. Our hamstrings tighten up. Most people who complain of back problems, it's not their back. It's their hamstrings and their hip flexors. You know, stretch three to five times a day at work while you're at work. And so movement matters. And it doesn't matter when you started, it matters that you started and no one can start it for you. Other people can help you by saying, hey, did you get a chance to work out today? Hey, did you ever get that stand up desk?

You know, hey, are you planning on having healthy snacks when you're at work you know you don't have to be some kind of psychotic uh out there trying to convert the whole world yeah convert your world yeah and and that begins as as you do very well with your podcast to you know henry adams said a teacher affects eternity he can never tell where his influence ends yeah and i would say that's what you do with your podcast is you affect eternity you don't know how many people you're affecting but you do it i presume um to help others and in hopes that um most of your guests probably excluded, are trying to help others. That's why they are so passionate about what they do. So, you know, the answer to who is you.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I will say I started this podcast because I realized about a decade ago, I was having some career, I don't want to say struggles because I was successful a decade ago, I was having some career, I don't want to say struggles because I was successful by measurables, but just wasn't feeling satisfied. I realized that I get more pleasure out of watching the light bulb come on for other people than my own success.

And that's why I became basically manic in creating and sharing and trying to take big ideas and break them down and connect with wonderful people like yourself who are willing to share their expertise because you said it, man, like one person, one person hears something you say and it clicks over for them, then all the work was worth it. Like literally all of it. I mean, that's, that's, that's why we do these things. So, yeah, you can't make this up. I just finished a book, as you may know, called leadership is worthless, but leading is priceless. And one of the things I talk about

in there is my beautiful and brilliant wife, Maureen, and I had three boys now, young men. And when they were younger, when I used to take them to school, anytime I was in town, I drove them to school in the morning, I always said precisely the same thing to them, which is one more step in the journey of discovering where your deep joy intersects the world's deep needs.

I swear I said this to them. They prefer to take the bus, as you might guess. They don't wanna to hear dad say something like that. But you have to start with your deep joy, not the world's deep needs, because the world's deep needs are unfathomable. They're infinite. And I find a lot of people who are unhappy, who are depressed, who are burned out because they have failed to follow their deep joy. So I get asked as you do, what's your deep joy doc. And it's helping other people find and express and live and embrace their deep joy. So I think we're saying very, very similar things in terms of,

of what drives us to do what we do. I love it. Um, I want to ask you a very technical question just cause I've been getting asked it a lot. Um, you know, I'm 43 years old. I'm six foot four, uh, 190 pounds in pretty good shape. I work out quite a bit. You try to eat well. And I get, people will ask me if I'm on Ozempic or if I've taken Ozempic, which I have not. Uh, I have friends that are on it. And what I found interesting about Ozempic in general is almost to a number, every person I know who's on it doesn't really know what it does, doesn't really know why they're on it,

but their doctor recommended it or someone recommended it to them. They somehow got on this thing and it's quote unquote working, but it's, it's like they, they're not overly informed in it. And, and maybe just because I think it is a hop on item. I think there are a lot of people who are either considering this drug or recommending it and, or being recommended it and you brought it up. Maybe you could just give us a couple of minutes on, on Ozempic and GLP-1 drugs in general.

Yeah. So this is, I don't mean to be on a tirade, but medications are great. And GLP-1, glucagon-like protein or peptide agonists, meaning they act that way, can be very helpful. And the primary indication for that is insulin resistance, you know, glucose built up in the blood. Fortunately, we can measure that not just with a fasting glucose, but with hemoglobin A1C, which is going to give you a 30-day, you know, blood sugar, fasting blood sugar is a Polaroid. It's a snapshot. But at that

moment, in that time, at that day, your blood sugar was X. But hemoglobin A1C gives us a 30-day shot of, okay, this was what you averaged over time. So that's the way to think about it. And I know that Ben Greenfield and Peter Attia and Andrew Huberman and I and others, and I don't put myself at their level in any way, all say the same thing. It's a great medication for the purposes for which it was designed. And what concerns me is, you know, somebody's taking, saying, hey, what about GLP-1s, whether it's Osempic or anything else? And my first question is, how much do you exercise? You know, what do you eat? How do you eat? You know, inflammation, massive issue. Are you taking B6 and B12 in your diet to help pull

inflammation? People think of inflammation, probably a whole different episode as, well, that's just local inflammation. Well, there's no such thing as local inflammation. It's all systemic body-wide inflammation. So for the purpose, you know, if somebody's taking it strictly for weight loss, what they're going to be able to do is look in the mirror and say, wow, I look a lot better. And people tell me i look a lot better and that has a purpose but what's inside what is your vo2 max what is your cardiovascular health what is your blood pressure which is elusive for a lot of people uh what is your insulin resistance uh you you know not hemoglobin a1c alone but it's your total insulin and issues like that so you know, not hemoglobin A1C alone, but total insulin and issues like that. So,

you know, fan of the drug in context, in the context of movement, of cardiovascular, of muscle strength, you know, the older that you get, and let's just say you told us your age, and I would say I'm not. I won't say how old i am but i'm not uh like you as an athlete the longer ago we played the better we were exactly it was a lot better but that sense of movement you know put it all in context what you eat you know how you exercise how you move what's your muscle strength are are you getting enough protein, and don't just use a mirror test of, boy, I look better, I've lost weight, people tell me I look better, but what's your true, not just cardiovascular health, not just your insulin health, but your

brain health, your ability to move and feel productive uh the joy span aspect we talked about yeah the journey that i went on in 2017 was all about inflammation i went and saw a doctor um just my just my my general practitioner at the time explained to her what had happened at this conference and we did some blood work and she came back and she's like, your inflammation numbers are off the charts. And I can't remember exactly what the number was, but that was, those were the words that she used. And I had had, um, it's not going to really translate in the, in the video if people are watching, but if you're listening, I'll try to explain it. I had so much scar tissue and built up inflammation in my right elbow from playing baseball for so long that literally I

could only get my right arm to like a, to like a 220 degree angle. I couldn't straighten it all the way. So I went and saw a specialist and we went on a, uh, Annie and I basically just went on a diet that was all about any-inflammation, removed anything that caused inflammation as much as I possibly could from my diet, uh, except for coffee. Cause I was unwilling to give that up, but I figured fairly negligent, uh, impact in general. But, um, and what I've in a month, I felt like myself in six months, I felt 10 years younger a year later, I felt like myself. In six months, I felt 10 years younger.

A year later, I felt like I was in my 20s again. And I was bouncing around the house and running and lifting seven days a week. And my brain was on fire. I don't know how to describe it to people. It was like, when I say on fire, it was like when you were a kid, it was like being all the way back to just thoughts, connecting serendipity, creativity, problem solving, uh, endless energy because I just removed, I, it was just inflammation. I went back, my inflammation numbers were like down at the bottom, you know, like 95th percentile, I think. And, and that alone was this enormous

game changer. Um, I want to ask you one more health question. And then I have one more question about leadership. So I'm going to just the inflammation piece and, and to give people just backing up what you just said. I lived that the other things I've never tried to Zempic. I haven't focused too much on a glucose levels or anything that hasn't really been a problem for me, but just that simple thing you were talking about with inflammation changed my life. I recently found out, uh, over the winter, um, that I just wasn't feeling like myself. And I had some things happen with work and life and, you know, all these messy things. And I was like, it's winter time. I live in upstate New York,

like, you know, we're all vitamin D deficient during that time and miserable anyways. And, uh, you know, whatever, but I just, I've lived this, you know, I've done this cycle 43 times and this one was different. So I, uh, did some blood work. Actually, I was listening to Huberman on, uh, I think it was Rogan and he was talking about the impact of testosterone on male bodies post age 40. And he recommended this service called, uh, service called Maximus. I'm not recommending them for anyone at home. He just, he mentioned that name. So at home blood tests, whatever. I was in the sixth percentile for testosterone for men, my age. I had what I said. I don't know what the, what the thing was. Right. But I had 77 micrograms, that's way low yeah way way low so i started taking uh an

oral that they recommend before you do any kind of like uh supplementation um in terms of like injections or anything you know this is kind of step one in their process they don't like to go right to injections and four months later i i'm not all the way back, but it's insane how much better I feel workouts, the whole thing. So I would love if you could help, you know, cause it, cause a lot of our audience tends to be 35 to 55 is like our primary range. We tend to skew a little towards men, but a lot of women as well that listen to the show. But for that group, particularly for men, I think I've talked to a lot of my friends since this happened and I found this out and none of them know what their testosterone

level is. They don't track it. They don't work on it. They don't even think about it. They just assume they have it right. Cause they're guys. And like, maybe just talk a little bit about the importance of it, how we can track it, how we can, how we can keep, you know, keep our testosterone levels up, or at least at a healthy range, because I feel like this is something that just from what I've read, just from what I've heard, it feels like a bit of a, I'll use the word pandemic for men in particular, that we're just operating at low testosterone levels and we don't even realize. Yeah, there's no question about it.

And, you know, but I will say it's both men and women. And so let me start with women first. Strangely enough, you know, you don't have to be a postmenopausal woman to to understand endogenously what the effects of hormone imbalanceances like and the this well-meaning studies on hormone replacement therapy and in women post-menopausal women uh did a huge disservice to them you know there are a lot of them that had depression a lot of them had uh you know anger issues uh had physical issues uh when i see a woman in the emergency department, I'm an emergency physician, in addition to sports medicine, and she's got frozen shoulder,

you know, she's a postmenopausal woman who, yes, I can give her a steroid or PRP injection and just open her shoulder up like that. But what caused it was hormonal imbalance so whether it's testosterone creams you know there's a whole uh suite of solutions and and forward-thinking physicians uh yours must be very good because she was interested in if you're in flamazon for lack of a term but also uh the the hormonal balance that you're in because as as you say, most people don't even test it in the first place. So there's all these things are opening up and more and more physicians, primary care and otherwise, are beginning to say, oh, yeah, this is there's a real need. I mean, you and people look at you and I, we're quintessentially male looking guys that you would

just assume, well, our testosterone must be fine. Well, no, let's measure it and then let's see, okay, how do we get there? So, you know, I was not just a linebacker, football player, but I was a theology major. And so, which is a pretty interesting combination. Yeah, yeah. But how wonderful that the more you know about science, the more you realize these things are all tied up together in serendipitous ways, to use a term that you used. Thomas Walpole wrote that original story. And yet, logically, they make sense. They may be epiphanous in the way they come to us. But once you absorb them and think about them and see how your life changes as a result of changing

those hormonal balances, you begin to say, I look better, I feel better, I move better. I've moved better. I think better. I'm making connections that I didn't see before or wouldn't have seen before. Even in, I grew up in the Midwest. So like you, I know that Persephone is the goddess, not just of winter, but death as well. So, you know, understanding that seasonal affective disorder, so-called SAD, red light therapy, all kinds of pieces. And I realize to some, probably a minority of your audience, they may say, this guy's kind of wacky. He's got all this, you know, broad medical trying to pull in all these things that traditional medicine doesn't think of. Well, bad on traditional medicine for not thinking of these connections and how they affect how we view life. So I think we're, thank God, medicine's changing. People have become much more forward thinking in terms of how these connections interconnect and what they mean. Well, Doc, I thank God for people like you, Huberman, Atiyah,

these medical professionals who 20 years ago, we'd never hear from you guys ever. You guys would not be out front on podcasts, in media, sharing these ideas. I mean, people love to take shots at Huberman, but the number of people that he has at least exposed to ideas that have helped them, you know what I mean? Like, I think it's it is it is, you know, the Internet, the broadness and massiveness of information can be overwhelming. But at the same time, it has helped me in so many ways personally be able to find things, get exposed to ideas. And particularly why I love having individuals like yourself who are more health and fitness related on the show is because I have told my clients, I've told every team I've managed, your health is a competitive advantage in business. Now, obviously it's

incredibly important to what you said, joy span, health span, et cetera. But if you're simply just a pure capitalist type a driven, make money at all costs type of person, which I have no problem with that either. Your health is a competitive advantage in that space. And you know, I look at, I, when I sit down at a business meeting and I look across the table, if I'm negotiating with someone and I see that they're out of shape, they're sweaty. I know I can outlast them. I simply know that I can outlast them in that meeting. And there will come a point when they become tired, frustrated, irritable, because they're not in good shape. Their fitness is not together.

Their mind is foggy. Maybe they're hungover, et cetera, that I can just beat them in that place because I know I can just be more present and more focused longer than they can be. And for that reason alone, guys, take everything that Dr. Tom is saying incredibly seriously. We can't leave our health simply to our physicians. I think physicians are amazing and I am not knocking them in any way, but I think we need to take more ownership as well.

Yeah, to be clear, I mean, my father used to say, my dad was a World War II veteran and not a traditionally educated man, but full of wisdom. And he used to say, son, you can teach Sunday school and make money. There's no reason you can't do both. There's nothing wrong with either one of those. So I do believe in purpose and joy span and a sense of deep joy to which we connect our lives. But I've had multiple entrepreneurial businesses, both in healthcare, in ambulance companies. I continue to invest in opportunities that I think will help broaden horizons for other people.

And so you used the term competitive advantage appropriately. It's ROI. It's return on investment. You know, build into your schedule the exercise and the eating habits we're talking about, the testing to determine what is really your baseline, because it is competitive advantage and it's a return on investment. It's a way of being able to say, I can't. One of the things that's most important is, first of all, I always tell people, number

one, every person is a leader. Lead yourself, lead your team. Number two, every person is a performance athlete, no different than my 2,500 athletes in the NFL, involved in a cycle of performance, rest, and recovery. Performance, rest, and recovery. Performance, rest, and recovery. And we have badly neglected rest and recovery. And then third, the work begins with that. If we're going to reform our systems, we have to reform ourselves to have the energy, the wherewithal, the joy span, the brain health to be able to come up with those creative solutions because

the way we're working isn't working or it isn't working well enough. It could work better. All right. I have one more topic that I want to hit with you. I appreciate your time so much. This has been amazing. Slight pivot, but you were part of the crisis response team for the anthrax attack back in 2001. And you can go into that detail as much as you think is necessary. What I'm really interested in are your thoughts, particularly black swan event that we did not see coming that has drastic, severe and urgent, um, requires urgent response. How, how do we approach this? What, how do we make sure that we are present in the moment? We do not become overwhelmed. How do we handle these crises? Cause you see them on TV and we all armchair quarterback, the decisions people make, but for anyone who's ever been involved in one,

and thankfully I've never been involved in anything quite so dire as what, as that situation. But to me, it just doesn't seem rational to think that we would all make these perfect decisions afterwards. And, and so how do you approach these things? How do we be the, the, the leader, uh, that, that you recommend in your book in, in these moments of severe and urgent crisis? Well, it's a great question. Um, starting maybe 10,000 feet and coming down leadership is worthless because it's what you say. And anybody can say anything they want. Leading is priceless because it's what you do all day, every day. Everyone is a leader, every business owner, every entrepreneur, every CEO, but also every person within that organization, within that team, every single mother, every mother and

father within a family are leading the team of their family, and their actions matter, a great deal. Figure out your deep joy and attach our confined, constrained years of life and the health that we are investing in, as we talked about before, in feeding that deep joy. Because we should all be leaping for joy going into work, not just going home for work. Leading from the time we wake up in the morning and swing our legs out to say, how will I lead today? How will we lead our team today? So it's very much in the active voice. The boss, and I always capitalize that, is someone who's quite convinced that he's the most important person in the room. But the leader is someone who knows that her job is to make everyone else feel that they're the most important person in the room, that they have

agency for their lives and how they act will determine the ROI, the return on investment in their life, whether it's a business, whether it's an interpersonal relationship, whatever it is that they happen to be doing. And I would say there's no, I happen to have dinner, my wife and I had dinner with Sully Sullenberger and his wife. She asked, you know, what's your philosophy on this? You've been leading in times of crisis your whole life. And my answer was, I don't think there's any leading except in times of crisis. And she laughed and turned to Sully and said, you guys have been talking. I had no idea what they were talking about. Sully laughed and said, well, I've always said, you're not really a pilot until the engines go silent.

Well, what are you until then? I said, just a driver, just a very expensive, very well-trained driver. And that's true in our lives. You know, what are we before we're leading in times of crisis? We're just drivers and that's no place to be, you know, where we want to be. But you don't have to live the life I've lived. You don't have to have been at the Pentagon on 9-11, led the bioterrorism attack, the concussion crisis, the COVID crisis, going to Ukraine. Next week, I'm helping escort 60 D-Day veterans back to Normandy for the 80th anniversary. Just blessings. Everyone faces crisis. We live in times of crisis.

We're in what I would call the perpetual whitewater of change. We go from change to change to change to change to change. And the question is, are you going to be the author of the change in your life? Or are you going to let somebody else be the author of that change? Are you going to proactively say these are the changes made? Because innovation does not occur at the speed of intelligence, creativity, or genius. It occurs at the speed of trust, the ability to trust others. Because if you're serious about innovation, and we all should be,

you innovated your life when you learned what your testosterone levels were, what your inflammation levels were, and you chose to make changes. You chose to innovate within that in the midst of that crisis. That crisis is no different maybe in location. I would say it's not actually in magnitude. The stage is different. But, you know, lots of folks, as you know, just keep doing what they've been doing. And that's not going to work. We've got to be able to understand that most people don't mind change. They mind being change. And that's why I say the answers are not above us. They're within and among us. And so that imprimatur to be able to say, who's the leader you're looking for?

The leader you're looking for is you. One follow-up question to that. I'm going to use the both positive and negative response to Jordan Peterson as a benchmark for this, but it feels to me like there is a large portion of our population that is just dying for anyone who will help us be more personally responsible and accountable. And there's an, an, another enormous and maybe smaller, but certainly just as vocal portion of our population that's seeming. Close twice as many deals by this time next week. Sound impossible? It's not. With the one call close systemclose system, you'll stop chasing leads and start closing deals.

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