The Ryan Hanley Show - RHS 004 - The Secret to Scaling Trust with Brian Fanzo
Episode Date: September 20, 2019Became a Master of the Close: https://masteroftheclose.comInternational keynote speaker and social influencer, Brian Fanzo, joins the podcast to share his thoughts on scaling trust and future of busin...ess. Get more here: https://ryanhanley.com/Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
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Today I bring you Brian Fanzo and while I wanted Brian to be on the show because of
his career journey, which is very much a ground and pound, he's worked for every inch of success
that he's gotten.
He has earned it just through putting in hard work and being focused and doing all the things
you need to do. This episode takes a turn in terms of some of the topics that we get into, into things
that are very near and dear to my heart, in particular, how we treat each other online
and how in the coming months and ultimately leading up to the 2020 election and all the anger and hostility and division that is inevitable with an election like the one that's coming.
How we can focus ourselves to stay positive and hold love and compassion in our hearts even when we run up against people that we may not enjoy
their perspective.
I think it's incredibly important for us in life, and it's certainly important to us in
business.
So I am incredibly pleased, honored to bring you Brian Fanta.
It's good, man.
It's good.
You know, trying to find my legs um it's it's an interesting it's an
interesting situation you know whole new industry uh don't know anything about basically most of
what i'm doing so i'm just you know it's interesting how much i'm what i'm learning is what the network that I had in the insurance industry meant, one.
Two, how little – once you learn the basic principles of growing a business,
marketing a business, selling, like the core principles of business in general,
how little like intrinsic industry knowledge
actually means to early stage growth.
That's basically it.
Oh, interesting.
Yeah, I think middle and late stage growth,
having the knowledge of the intricacies
and nuances of the marketplace
to separate yourself are very, very important.
But early on, it's what's your value proposition?
Can you sell it?
Can you reach a market? Can you tell a story based on what you're trying to value proposition can you sell it can you reach a market can you
tell a story based on what you're trying to do and who you're trying to help and that's going to get
your early adopters that's what's going to grow the business in the early stages and you know I
think eventually that you have to dig in you have to know what the space that you're operating and I
think that's very that's core but it's been interesting that knowing nothing about fitness,
not having one network connection in the fitness industry,
how far we've been able to get already.
So that's, it's a fun test.
You're going to have to like write some freaking
or do some crazy, like just story about that side of it.
Right.
Cause I mean, I, when you said that originally,
I was like, holy, like, holy fucking pivot. Like like I've heard like I know lots of people that have pivoted
like that's like a legit pivot um in many ways but uh that's kind of fun to hear because you know it
is one of those things you don't know until you hear people like yourself that have done it because
I you know I wouldn't even have thought of that you know in many cases but you're also right like
part of it's like you're good at conveying trust, the trust what's underneath the trust, there's a little bit of a layer of like, Hey, I can trust
you no matter what you're working with. And then once we figure that out, you know, we better
deliver on the backend. Right. Yeah. I think, you know, I was listening to, um, have you listened
to, uh, Naval Ravikantz? Um, he did a podcast based on a tweet storm that he created. It's called how to,
how to get rich or how to be rich or something. It's like a, it's a, it's a clicky headline,
but what's underneath it is absolutely amazing. I think you dig it only because it's just an
interesting format as a podcaster. It's basically like it's two minute episodes, like two minute
to three minute episodes. Oh really? Yeah. He basically takes each tweet and he's got another guy that's with him.
And the guy like gives them the core context of the tweet.
And that's his, Hey, can you explain this?
And the, and he just goes into and like no five minutes, an episode, basically what he
was thinking about.
So there's like 50 episodes make up this oh wow podcast and um it's really
really interesting right here yeah yeah and oh yeah huh yeah so it's it's super interesting one
the content is tremendous and two just the format and how he launched it and got it out and like
what he was trying to do with it and since, he's added more of these kind of short form episodes.
But it's really, really cool.
Yeah, I'll have to check that out.
I just put up the website.
So that's super cool.
Yeah.
One of the, you know, the point of my bringing him up is one of the sections in there that he talks about is trust in particular. And he basically says like,
um, it, you know, as everyone knows, like it takes being around for a while to build up trust. And then once you have that, you can make a move or two, but there is a diminished return. And
eventually if you hop too much, people stop trusting you because now you just, you move
around too much for them to to to trust you so
it's it's it's it's interesting but uh yeah long story short i think it trusts me once you know
trust you twice and then like wait a second i gotta reevaluate that trust right like i think
that's yeah oh that's cool yeah i'm gonna check that out i'm always looking for i love creative
ways of formatting especially podcasting i think like podcasting is such an interesting medium and
sense of like even for what people are doing today or still haven't even like really ventured
into like all the different ways you can use audio formats you know just even like you know
documentary styles and stuff it's such a fun fun meet i wish i had like the time and resources like
a teams to like do that kind of like testing and research but not to check that out for sure yeah i think
that will come as monetization comes to the platform you know like like you just said like
right now there's no no one's going to come to you with a with an amount of money that that will
allow you the time to go out and actually put that project together or at least it's rare
yeah and when they do they usually handcuff you know because the medium is so weirdly like i just
did i'm gonna write a blog post on it but i just did a presentation at a military uh influencer
conference this weekend i was on podcasting and i said you know i've garnered six figures of
podcast revenue in the last 12 months without sending download numbers once and everyone's
like what the hell i was like because i don't sell downloads because i couldn't figure out how
to sell downloads like yeah i Like I sell like alignment with brand
and I sell like direct business value.
And I sell like, hey, I'm gonna drive this many people
to whatever your initiative is,
but you need to give me the bandwidth and time to do it.
But part of that's because like
when I was trying to sell the other thing,
the medium, the monetization hasn't hit the platform
in a way that is scalable or relates to like different,
like trying to, I worked with three different Adobe teams,
and all three different Adobe teams had a whole different idea
of what podcast advertising was and how it worked.
And I was like, I ended up convincing all three of them to do it my way,
but at first it was like, God, I could never work in this medium.
Yeah, and it doesn't translate to what they're used to.
It's different languages.
That's for sure.
But all that being said, I appreciate you being on the
show, man. And, you know, one of the reasons that I wanted to have you on this show and,
and we'll just kind of get into it. Um, you know, it's another, it's a, it's an interview show for
sure. I'm going to do probably a lot of other stuff besides just interviewing. It's really,
um, I guess the thing that drove me to make the pivot that you initially asked about was my desire to help people find peak performance in their everyday life.
And whatever way, shape, or form that means for them, like, you know, whatever that means for you, how do I, I like helping them find the little hacks, sharing things that I found, mistakes that I made, articles I found, whatever it is.
It's kind of a menagerie of concepts and ideas with the idea that one of them might help you get a little bit better.
Find that thing, you know.
So in watching your career and we've known each other for a while now in terms of just being in the same ecosystem.
Yeah.
You know, the thing that's always impressed me about you was kind of your ground and pound methodology.
You know, you didn't, you just started doing the work, showing up, turning the Facebook live on before anyone else was,
or before it was kind of, I mean, I guess Facebook live on before anyone else was, or before it was
kind of, I mean, I guess still people aren't really using that platform. Well, I guess you
could say, but, uh, you know, you just kept doing it and kept grinding and kept pushing and kept
telling your story. And, and if you go back in the archives of your work, which, which I did in
getting ready, you know, for this, for this interview, um, you know, it just kind of brought me back to some
of the things that you were in watching the evolution, like it's just so iterative. And
with each, I don't know, episode or era of your development, it gets a little more refined and a
little more tweaked. And then you can tell you kind of, hey, I'm going to shelf this idea for
a while. And now I'm going to attack this.
And I guess my first question for you or what I'd love for you to kind of kick this off on is, you know, early on, like what you just said, like you just said,
hey, I made six figures in podcast revenue.
Like for most people, that's the headline.
Whack, you know, there was a day when it was zero. And, you know, that's the headline whack. You know, there was a day when it was zero
and you know, that, that's taken you a long time to get there and you've earned every one of those
dollars. Um, what, what kept you going in the early days? Like talk a little bit about, you
know, everyone kind of starts, but I'm not so much interested in the start as I am the dip and what
got you through the dip?
So, yeah, you know, and for me being, you know, like we were talking a little bit about your pivot, you know, like I went cybersecurity to a data center to digital marketing.
Right. Like and like in like the weirdest way, I think the more I reflect, the more I realize that collaboration, like the element of collaboration is the root element.
That is the thing that links everything I've done since, really since high school. High school, it was, for me, you know,
I was the only one, you know, like my family owned a frozen yogurt shop. I was a lifeguard.
I tried out for plays as a thespian. I was a baseball player. I played hockey. I was like
the only one that kind of like was the surfer dude that was also the sports dude that liked
computers, that also worked at a family business.
And then that kind of transcended into college where I was the only one that was a fraternity guy.
The only one was computer science major and the only one on the hockey team.
Like no one on the hockey team was majoring in computer science and nobody majoring in computer science is going to join a frat.
And I think for me, like being able to bring groups together was always like, man, it was the thing for me.
Like it's always been like the root piece of it. But you know, I worked in a government contracting company,
giant 25,000 person company, left to go to the data center, which was at the time 250, I was a
256th employee. And then within two years, we had 612 employees, like we were hiring like 12 new
hires a week, it was insane. And then I went on my own. And I think the interesting piece for me, I guess like the dip was like, I always knew I wanted to do something bigger. And I love
how you kind of put that out there, like, understanding that, like, for me, it was like,
I always say, like, I want to connect great people with great people to do great things,
right? Like, but there's no monetization on that. There's no like business, there's no like,
how do I package that? And I remember, you know, Jay Baer, a good friend and mentor, like one day, and this
was probably four and a half years ago, where I was kind of like, I don't want to be an
agency, but I don't want to be a consultant.
And like, where do I fit like who I am?
And like, how do I put some, you know, monetization around it?
But also how do I like grow and learn this space?
And I remember Jay said, he said a statement to me, and I don't think he knows how like
much it stuck with me.
But he was like, Fanzo, I love what what you're doing everyone I talk to loves what you do my problem is I have
no idea what you do or how I would sell you and I was like yeah that sounds like a problem like
you know and like for me like I think that was part of like that piece of it was um it was and
you know and I would read things like you have to package things, or maybe you need to sell stuff online.
And I had this love for building community without the desire or need to monetize the community.
Like in my weird big picture, like I remember I tried the agency thing after the data center.
Didn't really like the agency model.
I just wasn't an agent.
Like I deliver, I over deliver, I ground and pound.
I'm a, hey, what's our goal? We're going to crush it. And the agency model just didn't really agent. I deliver, I over deliver, I ground and pound. I'm a, Hey, we're going to,
what's our goal? We're going to crush it. And the agency model just didn't really fit that. Right.
I kept my, uh, the one that I was working the agency with, you know, we were business partners.
He's like, dude, everyone you bring on, they work with us for six months and they move on. And it's not because they're not happy. It's because you've solved so many goals and help them do it. Like
they don't need us anymore. And I was like, yeah, that's what I'm good at. And, you know,
and he was like, well, that's going to be a, we were going to turn
into a business development team more than anything else. And so I think like, for me,
like it was this weird piece where I remember saying, people would say, well, what do you want
to be when you grow up? And I would say, you know, and this was, this was within the last five years.
And I was like, well, you know, I was successful in everything I've done, but there's not one of
these things was a path. But I would always say like like I want to be a CEO of my own company I just
don't know what that company is I don't know what the I don't know if it's software I don't know if
it's hardware I don't know if it's online if it's offline I'm gonna be and I was like because I knew
that I was like I'm gonna build community from the seer's sake of shit of caring about people
and engaging as as much and as hard as I can. And for me, that was like, well,
I got to try out every medium, like from live video to podcasting, like I had to figure out
what worked. Like I can say, like, I never thought of myself like, wow, I'm gonna try out live video
because I want to be a live video expert. It was, ooh, is live video going to give me an opportunity
to build community, not only stronger, but, you know, kind of allow me to scale. I think the
hardest, the thing I've always known was scaling trust and scaling community was always been something that scares me because I
really do like, I love the idea of like, you know, intimate groups and I love connecting great people,
but I've, I've learned over time that, you know, as those groups grow and I can go everything from
business to church group, to sports group, whatever it may be like that scale is really hard. And I
think, so for me, that was a big fundamental piece. And then because I didn't want to monetize this
community I was investing in, I was like, well, how do I how do I make money as I'm going through
this? And when I say I didn't want to monetize, I didn't want I didn't want people you know,
it's the Gary V jab, jab, jab, right hook, right. And Gary made a joke with me via Twitter a long
time ago, he was like, fans, oh, you remember the right hook part exists because I was really good at jabbing and giving
people things without like having that right hook. And part of it was because I kind of learned,
and this was something I think was one of those things that got me out of that lower,
I say that entrepreneur stuff that I was in was that I could monetize and work with enterprise
sized companies and big brands because they would want access to
the community I have without having to tell my community to buy an online course or buy my book
or to hawk some webinar and so when I think when I found that out I was like oh well that's my
whole background like my background was enterprise tech and I was like well now I can tap into this
network from a business perspective while still growing a community with my underlying goal of reaching kind of the masses. And for me, that was like that, that that's been
like the path that's got me where I'm at today. But there's definitely been like, it's taken a
lot of, I can tell you self-awareness is the, is the thing that I, I just, I would always say,
I'm confident, I'm proud. I would say be yourself. I would. But in the last three years or so,
and really a lot of it had to do with my divorce. I was like kind of forced to become self-aware.
And now that I'm becoming more self-aware, I know what I'm not good at. I know that I'm good at,
but I'm also been able to look back at my decisions and realize, wow, if I'd only been
aware of why this didn't work because of who I was, I would have made so many different things
along the way. And so it's been a heck of a journey, but I think that hopefully answers the question
on that. We both have a very interesting, I'm going from a crazy different careers,
but I think there's also that underlying element of what drives us.
You know, it's really interesting. I think without really knowing it until you just said it,
that might be
one of the things that has always enamored me to your work is I've struggled with that same thing
my whole life. I always say to my wife that I have a job to support my willing, my desire to create,
you know what I mean? Like I've never, I love, like, I'll tell you what I love more than anything.
I wake up at four 30 every morning and I write an Instagram micro blog
every single day. We'll call it six days a week. I it's the 2,200 word limit. I sometimes I fill
it. Sometimes I don't even come close, but it is whatever I learned the day before, whatever I came
in contact, whatever idea I think can move people forward. I do it every single day. And I don't
know why that platform, I just like the constraints of the 2200 characters or whatever. It kind of gives me
something to work towards, which I could easily duplicate someplace else. But, um, and like,
I have said to my wife before, and this is probably even this is probably before I,
the job I have today, but like, she's like, why do you, she's like, you like to do all this other stuff, but then you do this work over here. And I'm like, because that work pays for me to be able
to do this work because I have no clue how to monetize this work in a way that just like you
said, isn't courses and eBooks and, you know, paid webinars and all that nonsensical stuff that,
that truthfully, I, even when it's done
with the purest intentions, I can't stand it. Like I just can't, it just rubs me the wrong way.
As soon as I see the sales copy, I just start to barf. And, and I know that that, you know what
I mean? Like it's, and I know that that's a weakness in my marketing game. And I'm not willing to go copywriter, even though I can do it.
Like, it just makes me feel weird.
So I never, yeah.
So it's funny.
I never heard you say that, what you just said to me before.
But as soon as you said it, I was like, wow, that sounds super familiar.
I've had that conversation in my head before.
It's funny, too, on that element of like that weird, like there's a sales element, right? Like, like I have no problem convincing people to give me the money that I know that I'm
worth, right? Like that doesn't, that doesn't, has never bothered me, but selling something like
this idea of selling something, you know, either a forced way or, you know, it's, there's a, it's
a skillset. And I was also, there's a skillset or a mindset of the people that purchase those
things. Right. And when you're neither one of those, like, which I think both of us kind of fall in neither one of them. It is it's like,
I love the marketing space. And I despise both, you know, and I used to get so mad at the people
that were the marketing in that way. Then I started like, flip my brain. I'm like, well,
if no one was buying it, they wouldn't keep doing it. And then I started to get like,
trying to like psychoanalyze that that layer I loved, I really studied like the human condition and what makes us do those things.
And I realized like, oh, it's just not my personality on either side. But you're right.
It's a funny mix because there's kind of the beauty of the world we're living in. Like you
can find your own ways. But when you kind of jump into a space where you know the short,
easy way is this way that like everyone's
doing it can get extremely frustrating that like and to your point like I mean like I've done
Instagram story every single day since Instagram stories was released and it's like my favorite
thing and you and you you like feed copy I love like I wake up and I start the day and like I
kind of go through this like weird programmatic thing in my head of okay what does my beginning
start middle end look like and then I'm like what should I show or how should I show
something to educate people or bring them along on my journey and I don't do like written out it's
like this it's just like weird process and I can feel it I can feel like sometimes it hits me like
10 a.m sometimes it hits me at noon but like you like I I mean I've invested so much time and and
I and you know and I study the analytics.
I love the piece of it, but at the same time, like nothing about my Instagram stories is monetizable or like, like I'm not using it to like, and everyone's like, oh, you have
the swipe up feature.
And I'm like, yeah, I usually use that for like an article or a podcast.
And I'm like, don't use that for gated content.
I'm like, I don't have gated content.
I'm like, what?
If you're a marketer, it's just, it is, it just kind of in different ways.
Yeah. Yeah. It's funny. You know, so one of the things that you, that you talked about too,
in there was, was scaling trust. And this is one of the topics that I've written about. I've
talked about. It's something I think about all the time.'s I think it's probably the reason that we are
neither the person who buys the fancy copy course or that creates the fancy copy course is that
um I feel like um anytime you inject um uh mad men style copy into advertising, which I think that's what the break in that is.
You're going from trust to convincing, right? You're kind of almost bullying someone into it.
You're bludgeoning them with reasons to trick their brain into clicking a button versus,
hey, you trust me so much that I'm just going to tell you what you're going to get and you can
choose.
Like those are two different things for me because, you know, Seth Godin sells courses on Akimbo.
He's the farthest thing from a huckster marketer, even though he is a brilliant copywriter.
So talk to me a little bit about how you scale trust. And really, I'm interested,
maybe start with what that actually means to you and then how you scale trust. And really, I'm interested, maybe start with what that actually means to you,
and then how you do it. So I think this is one of those areas for me where I've never looked at,
like, you know, and I think it has a lot to do with my personality as well. Like when someone
tells me what to do, and my poor parents, like I'm the guy, like, I mean, even if I wanted to do it,
and they're telling me to do it, I've always pushed back. And I'm not like the fight the system guy.
I've always just kind of been like, Hey, I want to like,
let's come together and do this or let's, let's work in like,
in this similar path. And I think when I look at like, okay,
in this digital world, I never looked, I remember like,
and I've thought about this a lot. I, you know,
I've always looked at social media and digital and like the internet as a
whole,
as this vast opportunity to become connected no matter where we live,
no matter what our background is,
no matter our sexual orientation, no matter what it is,
like you can find your people.
And I think it had a lot to do with,
like I moved in third grade from Pittsburgh
to Virginia Beach, but my like, my roots are Pittsburgh.
I believe black and gold sports.
We still had season tickets for the Steelers,
but because of my dad's medical condition,
we had to move out of the cold weather and like the internet came and it was like this like oh
my goodness the people that think sports like me I'm connected with right I remember it being like
this like this pure joy and I wanted to be a sports center anchor then I realized you had to
know journalism and I was like or be good at grammar and like it wasn't my thing um and
then I kind of like pivoted to computer science and I think really computer science for me
even like if I look at that element where I was like I like I like result oriented type things
I also loved trying things out right like and I was like oh well nobody that's done this could
do that I'm the person that does it right like I really like that piece of it I think when when I
started like in this digital space putting myself out there and I know the dates that does it. I really like that piece of it. I think when I started in this digital space, putting myself out there, and I know the dates because on the day I started on social media, but it was a date, November 2 like, well, it took me an hour to write. And she was like, what? Like, you don't spend that much time on, like, what? You didn't spend an hour total on your homework.
And I was like, well, I wanted to make a this, this, and this. And she said, like, you know,
the basic words of, she's like, well, Brian, I hope you remember what's made you great and
who you are offline. She's like, you're unapologetically yourself. And she's like,
and it's been something I tried to change as a mom. And then I just kind of realized
Brian's going to walk his own path and do his own things.
And people are going to, for the most part, you know, take it or leave it.
And those that leave it, I have that desire to please everybody.
I'm going to, you know, I'm going to try to kind of come back around and then for them to see that.
I think when I, when I, when my mom said that, I mean, it was like a, I got hung up.
I was like, sure, mom, of course I do.
And I hung up and I just like sat there and I was like, oh my goodness.
Like, I am not, like, I didn't have a hat on in my profile picture, right?
I was, I had like this like weird persona.
And I remember always being like, what do other people want to hear from me?
Rather than saying, what can I share to help other people, right?
Like that little ducks.
And for me, that was the, that was that moment of like, you know what?
I'm going to be myself.
I'm going to put myself out there.
And those that judge me based on my appearance or judge me based on maybe the way that I come about things,
I'm going to build trust with them over the long term of caring and being a positive person.
I don't inject negativity in anything I do.
I don't support negative people.
Like, if someone screws me over, you know, I don't post about it publicly. I just remove them from my circle, right? I don't amplify their things. I don't
talk about them. Even like going through my divorce. My ex was not one that was on social
media posting publicly. And she posted 32 times publicly about our divorce. And I posted zero.
And it was because it was like, well, hey, she's a great mom. She is still a great mom. My daughters
are great because of her. Because of this of this you know disagreement of who we were we
we kind of grew apart and whatever that may be like i've always looked at it with like
i can grow i can grow trust through being very transparent which is what one of like my core
pieces of and i would say like transparency and oversharing are two different things right like
oversharing and airing dirty laundry about my divorce and things that people didn't really need to know um would have been the
other one right but being very transparent and who i am uh you know what i've gone through and
then i've also kind of looked at things and said you know beyond like transparency i'm gonna care
about other people just as much as i want them to care about me and i'm gonna do it at like
maximum that i can right and i think when i looked at like what that meant like online was just the easy path
for me right like I know that you can put me in a room a networking room and
as extroverted as I am I don't like a forced conversation like you know it's
the dad's like birthday party and all the dads are standing by the grill like
that's five gives me like the creep i hate i hate forced conversation i
don't even like it on the airplane but like put me in a room with a bunch of people i don't shut
up like i don't mind talking like um when it's not forced and i think when i looked at all these
pieces i was like wow i can do this online and share content my conversations who i am and i
think caring is so easy online right like i mean retweets cost nothing amplifying you know calling
someone else it's all it's like it's so easy to do and yet so rarely done still that it was like, okay, well I can do that in a
way that builds trust over time. And I can tell you like some of my biggest, I would say haters
or those that like maybe we had a biggest disagreement with. I just recently had a phone
call with somebody that was like the first person I ever blocked on social media. I remember being
like,
wow, like this was bothering me. And it's come full circle. That person not only has apologized,
but made up for the person alienated that really turned me off. And we ended up having a great like 45 minute Skype call. And it was like, it was like, man, Brian, I do have this like,
please every one mentality. But I think there's also that idea of trust is like,
I don't want to force you to trust me. I'm not going to tell you to trust me. But if you have a mindset or you're open perspective enough to, you know, learn from me or
just listen to who I am and what I talk about, I believe you will trust over time. I think that's
that element of, you know, I think that when people say like trust is a long-term game,
that's true. But I think there's also an element of, it's a long-term game with someone that is
going into it more often than not, not wanting to trust you, right, but, but for those of us that
approach a lot of relationships very trusting in with, trust can be an immediate game if you have
your, if you, you know, created your network and your community to kind of enable that, and I, and
that's kind of what I'm trying to embody now, and I'm testing it, right, like, you know, as a full-time
speaker now, like, that's my full-time revenue, know it's a it's a business development game nobody really hires you back to
back years so everything is like okay you have to trust to see me at the trust to work with me
well my speaker agent is like Brian you've been running this business speaking for four years
you know without a CRM without all these like back-end things like as a team of one
and I was like yeah I work hard on establishing trust today so that
they might be able to hire me a year from now and that's how I've always done it and I did it as a
team of one right so I started sharing articles for events that I wanted to speak at two years
from now I started sharing them today so that when it comes about in that event they asked me
six months out and go Brian you've been in our network sharing our stuff I got to know you
would you like to speak at our event I'm like like, oh, matter of fact, I would. Little did they know,
like that was my strategy, you know, two years earlier in the process. And I think that's kind
of like the fun of how this all works. Yeah. It's almost like what I hear you saying is that
trust almost has like a, like a compounding effect. As you build trust with one community and become kind of seen as a trustworthy person,
more people are brought into that and maybe they're willing to trust what you have to
say and who you are quicker than they would as if they hadn't heard from you or you hadn't
established yourself.
So it just kind of compounds over time.
And I think that's where I always look at the difference between like a
community and a network. And I, and I,
and I think that's always like a fundamental piece for me.
And I can't really remember who even like kind of opened my eyes to this.
And maybe it was a couple of different people, but I was like, you know,
like a community is our people coming together because of a shared purpose and
a shared passion or not connected via one individual. Right.
And a network is the, is the idea that you are invited in because of the people purpose and a shared passion. They're not connected via one individual, right? And a network is the idea that you are invited in
because of the people that you know.
And yet, if there's a couple people
that are removed from that network,
your attachment to that network
might no longer be there
because the person removed.
But you can remove people oftentimes from a community
and the community is powering on
because they're joined by that purpose and passion.
And I think that's also why the words like monetizing community don't go
together. Right. Because it's like, wait a second,
like we're bringing people together. And I think in the online space,
like we can build followings on social networks, very, you know, Hey,
we all know how that works.
But I also think building a community that will follow you where you go is
where the magic happens. That's, that's the beauty. But there, I mean,
there's no recipe, there's no online
course, there's no like one, you know, one hit wonder to make that happen. And I think even,
you know, you can use the extremes, you know, using Gary V is like using Apple and technology.
There's only one of him and he did his own his own way. And I don't like using him as an example.
But there's lots of people I think are that are understanding this idea of building through trust and those relationships and putting their passions out
there and ultimately that community ends up doing the storytelling for them and it's amazing because
it sometimes people will call them a podcaster or like wow they're a youtuber but if you look at
like the fundamental core it didn't matter the medium they were delivering their message on
it was more about the message that they were delivering it just happened to be that that medium was the vehicle
to get it to the people yeah one of the things that you said in there was um you know retweets
and and sharing of other people's content has become rare now i remember you know i was active blogger, content creator in 2008, 2009.
And that was the currency of the internet.
I mean, that was how anyone found anything was,
you know, I know you, I know the stuff that you like,
you retweet someone else's stuff and now I get introduced to somebody new.
And I'm with you, like that doesn't happen anymore.
Like people just do not they don't link to other people's work in their articles they are not retweeting other people's
work they're not sharing articles into their feeds from other people anymore even stealing
people's quotes and not putting people's names under the quote like this is like this drives me
nuts what you just said this drives
me nuts is quote from someone alive with a twitter account on twitter and then not at mentioning them
onto i'm like it drives me crazy and the worst part is it does you more benefit like the the
idea and i think this is that weird you know and this probably goes back to a whole other piece where we lived in a mentality and a life.
And I think this was a lot to do with, let's say, before the internet boom and just the lifestyle that a lot of people are living in was you hold on to what you know.
And if you get hit by a bus, everyone else is screwed.
And you are defined by what you know, and you are rewarded, and the salary you have.
And we no longer live in that
culture right and that culture is completely but there's still like fundamental little pieces that
trickle in and when i see people do that right they don't mention the person that quote is um or
they're stealing quotes that majority of us know are from someone else and then i'm putting that
person's name underneath it and i immediately are like wow it's it's this idea that if i put their name underneath
it it somehow devalues what i i currently own it's like actually no it now connects us with
someone else that we can be inspired by and if that person ends up being someone we trust
we we now have upped your level of trust by like wow i was connected by that person by that person
right like it's it's so weird that we kind of got away from that i think there's also i think a lot of people are still looking for that shortcut right
i think in like you said the early blogging days the early social media days even you know twitter
let's say twitter five years ago i don't think the shortcut was the answer right no one there
was no shortcut successors therefore there was no one to be like oh we're gonna find that out and
then like this idea like growth hacking hacking and then like all these like
weird things where you were getting rewarded for vanity metrics.
And all of a sudden people started trying to like make excuses for these bad
behaviors. And, and I, you know,
and it's weird cause like my dad's given me so much amazing business advice.
And for the law,
for there was a good period of time that I was like, dad, that that's great but I worked on digital and like you hate internet and you don't
like email and you sold peanuts he sold peanut brittle he owned a peanut brittle
of a global peanut brittle company that he owned and like now when I circle back
I'm like man everything my dad told me about business and sales and trust and
your word and you know over delivering that he was like
ingraining me through everything that I shunned is the is the core values of what still works
it's just that you know unfortunately some people still see an easy button they're looking for that
shortcut and you know I think that's been I mean if I don't like look at anything for me
I'm like what keeps me going to which I think was like the first question you asked me was like, I've never looked at anything that I do today as a need or desire for it to be short term, immediate success.
Like that, I almost like, like immediate success almost like scares me because like what happens when that goes away?
Like you fall, like building this like long journey and path that we're building failure does not scare me
because I won't settle for it and I got plenty of things to roll back on that I
that are in my life and in my journey and so I think it's I have like kind of
like the flip but there's a lot of other people that are like oh my goodness I
could get that million dollars tomorrow I could could go viral or I could do it
you know I could be interviewed on this show or whatever it may be and I've
never had a desire to I even look at it and say if interviewed on this show or whatever it may be. And I've never had a desire to that.
I even look at it and say, if that's a show I want to be interviewed on or I want to be
up on the podcast, let's just say something like that.
I'm like, you know what?
I'm going to earn my keep.
And if I get on it in five years from now, that to me is so much more powerful than me
like, you know, going around some back door to get something that i want like
immediately i think that's that is such a unique value that good news is i feel like people are
getting exposed today at a much higher rate like we're finally at this like pivot point we're like
taking it to making it selling unicorns and rainbows and not you know having actually the
products or the services that you've been promising yes they, they're still winning right now, but they're,
they're starting to get exposed slowly. And I think the people that are like,
you know, 10 years behind us are like, wait a second.
I might not want to follow those people that are now kind of, you know,
including like the me too movement.
There's so much of those things that were like, Hey,
this is just the way things were done.
And now thankfully we're at this pivot that are kind of changing our society,
which let's hope it changes sooner than later.
Yeah. Well, there's, there's a lot in there that I want to unpack. You know, I, I, I, you know,
for me, the trust isn't a zero sum game, right? Trust is, trust is there. You don't, me showing,
putting you on a pedestal or having you on my podcast, it doesn't decrease my trust and increase your trust.
The whole pool gets bigger, right? And I honestly believe that there are many people that just
intrinsically do not understand that idea, that your win is their loss. It's that scarcity mindset.
You know, Seth Godin calls it the lizard brain. You know, there's all, everyone has their own, their own way of describing it, but it's such a, it's such a toxic mentality because it does get
you chasing that short term. And that isn't to say that everyone doesn't have moments of it.
You know what I mean? Like, it's not like I don't look at my Instagram stats and go, you know,
what the hell? I didn't, you know, I mean, that happens. I mean, obviously
you, you have these moments, but it's being able to come back to the idea that, um, you know,
there's a, there's a, there's a group in the insurance industry and, um, they, their whole
slogan is better together, better together. Everything they've been saying that for years.
And to be honest with you, when I first saw it, I was jealous. Cause I was like, that is a hundred
percent. I had to, it was just the perfect, it was the perfect way to describe what I believe is exactly
how we have to operate. You know, and it actually takes me back to something you said that I wanted
to comment on or and then get your feedback. You said, you know, the internet is a great place
for you to find your people. And I agree with that at face value, but I actually think that
the internet, I think that what I hope, and you kind of alluded to this, in the next wave
of the internet and as the next generation kind of washes in and some of the mentality of the
non-internet world kind of washes out of the
internet is that it's not about finding your people. It's about understanding that everyone
has a piece of you in them. And because, you know, I, I, what I, I got a piece of advice from
somebody because I do not comment on politics, but I do keep an eye on what is happening. I try
not to participate in the negativity because it's almost just tough to get away from, but I do
follow it. And I had someone say to me, you know, I just was talking to them offline about a couple
things that were bothering me. And they said, you know, it might do you some good to follow people who at face value, you don't know if you agree with them or not. So like at
face value, you may say, you know what, I don't want to follow that person. I don't agree with
them. But what this person's advice to me was, was if you do that, over time, if you actually
give them a chance, yeah, there's always probably going to be some things that you don't align with.
But there may actually be some things that you do align with. And if our mentality could be could go from what it is today, which is if you disagree with me on one thing,
you're against me too. If you agree with me on one thing, we have a chance. And I think that that
shift is really what I hope happens. And I don't, that just triggered that
thought in me. But I feel like as we roll up on this next election, holding some of those ideas
in our head is going to be more important than ever. And I mean, I think like that to me,
kind of embodies what like, like my life's worth. Like, like I use the phrase digital empathy,
and I don't think digital empathy is kind of like the, the piece of it. But what I always
looked at that was like, you know, removing toxic people or negativity and hateful people
out of your life is important that does not mean you remove the people that disagree with you right
and I and I've always believed in this and this for me has been a huge one you know I was diagnosed
um ADHD at 31 years old so later in my life and the first time I shared that on spade I mean I
remember the day I remember the day I
remember the lady. I mean, I had a lady come up bawling and she had me FaceTime her son and her
son was struggling with an illness. It wasn't even ADHD. And it was just like the fact that I put it
out there in front of these thousands of people that like connected me. And it was like, the more
that we realized that our vulnerabilities not only become our superpowers, but they're the things that link us in so many ways that like we as humans are
so much more aligned. I think this is where that,
I love the way you're saying it's right. It's like, Hey, I disagree with you.
You're out of my life rather than saying, well, we agree on this.
And I think this is where like, it's a skill.
I tweeted this out this weekend and it got a lot of play.
And I was talking about this idea of compartmentalization and this,
this idea that if you can compartmentalization and this, this idea that
if you can compartmentalize certain things or prioritize, deprioritize how you evaluate them,
it allows us to kind of open up new doors and things that we maybe have always just siloed off.
But at the same time, I also believe in having kind of like a backbone and your own morals and
ethics. And like, for for me like i'm very
i i have a few that are just like things that you know and it's and it's weirdly it's like the same
thing like when i got suspended from school um my my high school year i can't remember my freshman
or sophomore year and my mom was just like so mad at me and she's like you're finally turning things
around and i remember my mom being like she's like what happened i was like mom i have like
three things that i just if these three things happen i i don't have rage i'm not a person that wants to fight but i have
like three things that like it's just at my core that i don't settle for i will not back down i
will not stay quiet and it's funny those three things still like are existing today right it's
like i don't want anyone that attacked my family i have a defense mechanism anyone that bullies
anyone from a place of power has always been a thing for me.
And then anyone that hits a woman, right? Like, and those were like my three, like,
and at their core, like they've expanded at a higher level now where, you know, I do a lot of
work in the LGBTQ community. And I have a lot of passion for this idea of treating everyone equally,
as long as that person isn't harming other people, right? I don't care
what their love or beliefs are. And I had like, that's at my core. But you know, I also grew up
right wing Catholic, right? And so like, I had to learn, like, how do I bring this along? And like,
trying to get my dad to like, come on board with me in high school on some of these thoughts that
I had, like beliefs I had, was a lose lose battle. And I would bump head with my dad,
and I would realize we get nowhere. But over the I realized well I'm gonna have him introduced to my friends he's gonna
get to know these people and then slowly he's gonna realize that like some of his beliefs
that these people fall into were things that he just wasn't exposed to right and wasn't and
and it's been like an amazing thing where my dad has come that full circle but I think it goes back
to this idea of like compartmentalization in the sense of like, you don't have to agree with the other things.
If they're not like part of that moral compass of yours and they're not like
stuck in stone, you can kind of like, Hey, I'm gonna,
I'm gonna let that person have that,
but I'm going to agree with them on this side. Right.
And I think it's like that weird alignment of a brand and mission and
message. And I think it's important too to always
reevaluate that because you know i mean marcus sheridan you know our mutual like i mean like
i had three and a half hours with him at the airport uh two weeks ago uh and we we joked that
we we literally talked 500 um words a minute and like well at one point we looked around like the
entire restaurant and the airport bar like could hear, because we're just loud and fiery.
But we spent the three hours together, and the majority of that three hours was our passion to worry about society a year from now, right, at the next election.
And it had zero to do with politics.
I don't think either one of us brought up Republican or Democrat.
It had zero to do with that.
It was more about the divisity and the toxic elements
and how we as business partners and leaders that have been aligned for years
that are all of a sudden going to have to,
are going to quote unquote be forced to pick a side
and what that's going to do to startups and businesses
and things that are going on.
And I think we both were scared. We're both passionate to figure out ways to not allow that to happen in the arenas
that we live in but to your point like on the idea where it's like you know it's that one thing
that bonds us and I think the more and this is probably part of my whole empathy thing is that
like my slogan is that empathy starts with me but but I mean it was backwards. And what I believe is that like,
we can't make the world a more empathetic place until we start putting our
story out so that people can be empathetic towards us.
And part of that is like realizing that there's people on cultures and
beliefs that like were not open to me.
And so I started sharing some of these other things and all of a sudden
connecting at these core values.
And you're like,
I would have never thought of myself as someone that would be connected with a
Buddhist monk and someone that was,
that was truly in this like spirituality, like moment,
like in their entire life is that yet we,
we connected on something else that we both agreed on.
And all of a sudden now he's opened my doors and my life.
This is Jared and he has his great podcast noetic uh
noetic no matter what is that name of the podcast um i'll have to give you the exact one but um
it's all about theory and we connected on like our love for podcasting only to share our stories as
intimate as you could have ever shared uh thanks to you know a couple uh you know adult drinks
and all of a sudden it was like this worlds that were open up to you know a couple uh you know adult drinks and all of a
sudden it was like this worlds that were open up to us and our singular bond you know like we
started to realize like wow we both grew up completely different worlds but this we have
these same beliefs and i think that's why when i i say it on stage every time i believe we're
living the greatest time in history that's hard to say when you have mass shootings and as you know
this is we're recording this on
september 11th uh you know on this day you know 18 years ago what you're like but i truly do believe
unity is the byproduct of where we're at we just have to get to that that pivot point or you know
whatever whatever you know whatever uh slogan you want to say um and hopefully we get to it without
it being something that destroys us so much that it
takes too long to kind of rebuild.
Yeah.
You know, I have a lot of thoughts on what you just said.
I think I completely agree that we are living in the greatest time in history.
We're also living in the most equal time in history.
We're living in the safest time in history.
We're living in the best time in history. We're living in the best time in history.
That being said, it's far from perfect. And I think, I think what I, how I, how I would rather
frame the people who, who, who would stand and say, you know, this country is, is, is, you know,
a lot of negative things. I, I, I firmly disagree with that vantage point. I wish that I
understand their frustration and wish that it could be framed in maybe a more positive way.
The problem is, the media doesn't write stories about positivity. So unless you're, you know,
blasting, you know, blasting the president or blasting someone else, you know what I mean?
Like, or, you know, someone on his side blasting back, you know, no one, no one picks it up. That all being said, what I think it's
important to remember two things from my perspective on this topic is that a lot of misconceptions
are formed based on signaling. When we're trying to signal the tribe that we would like to be part of, or that we feel gains
us the most points, that creates a lot of misconceptions in the world about who we
actually are. So I would just, anyone who's listening to this that cares, I think we need
to be very careful about how we signal in the world and why we're doing that
there's a difference between having a belief structure and feeling the need to signal that
structure into the world for for a given reason now i think and i may jump in on you on that but
like that signal oftentimes either we don't realize that we're doing it or we don't have a desire to
do it yet we feel based on like cultural norms to do it.
Right.
Like,
and to me,
like the easiest way to link this into like the business world is I've been
very blessed.
I get to interview a lot and have conversations with a lot of CMOs,
CEOs of really big companies.
And I'm also the guy that wears a backward hat,
crazy shoes and doesn't wear a suit and tie.
Right.
Like I have,
and people,
I mean the amount,
and this has happened a lot more recently with like, Brian, like, I'm starting to figure out
like how this works for you. They're like, you treat everyone with the same amount of respect
and trust. They have a title or they don't have a title. And the people that are, that have the
title, when they see that, they respect that at a deeper level than us signaling well i'm just as equal as you and
trying to either it's not even pissing but it's more about this idea of like this idea that i
have to prove to you that i belong to be able to have a conversation with you of meaning or
to be a part of your business or life and it's amazing for me where i connect people i like
i mean and these are high-ranking executives, and I'm connecting the dots.
And the biggest piece of it was like, well, Brian, you hung out and talked to me as if I was a normal person, and I built trust with you the same you would have built with an entry-level.
And so I think that is that piece of like, you don't have to signal or you don't have to become
either something that you're not, or even weirdly enough, feel the need to be something that someone values right and
there are people that there are plenty of people in the world that value title and value a lot of
that stuff but those aren't people that i'm playing the game with and if they are i quickly
and this is probably one of the other fundamental principles i think in for me and this is one
like i call myself a change evangelist and it was a title that one of my ceos that i used to work
for one of the smartest guys i've ever worked for my entire life he gave it to me because he was like brian
you can't you're not a technology evangelist that's the job title i pitched him and he gave it to me
and we put it on business cards and he hated it he's like you're not he goes because people assume
that you want technology in all these places he goes you remove technology just as much as you
install technology he's like you will identify a problem and look at it and say does technology make it better or worse and if it makes it worse you have no problem
removing technology of the equation which he was right and i think that element of like quote
unquote change evangelist of what um i looked at is one of the things that i think we also make a
mistake on and i'm guilty i was being guilty of this many times in my career is that you can't
change the game unless you're playing in the game. And oftentimes we're like, well, they're not going to agree with
us or they're wrong. And I think, like, I hate putting generalizations out there, but the
millennial generation, for all the stereotypes the millennial generation has been given, that's one
that is probably the biggest one was, well, they don't understand us. They don't, they're not,
they don't live in our world. Like, screw're not there. They don't live in our world.
Like screw them. I'm not going to play in their game.
And I was like,
that's quickly how we just become two worlds that are working in two
different arenas and no one's kind of crossing over.
And now like kind of even funneling into that compartmentalization thing,
there are plenty of conversations groups that I'm a part of right now in the
sense of knowing that me being there might just change
one person or one narrative. But the fact that if I'm not showing up there has the opportunity to
change nothing. And changing nothing in things that I'm passionate about scares me more than
anything else. I think that's such a fundamental piece of it. And one of the most popular tweets
I've had this entire year was a simple tweet that just said, if your social media feed sucks, it's not social media's fault.
It's people you're following.
And I said, embrace the unfollow, the block, the mute button.
And that was my tweet.
It was just a simple tweet.
And a lot of people took it and ran with it and they loved it.
And then there were a lot of people that were like, and I had to end up putting a second tweet.
And I was like, hold on a second.
This does not mean you remove people that disagree with you. It does not mean that people that have
a different opinion or sharing. I was like, I actually believe to be empathetic, to be well
rounded, you must understand all vantage points, right? And I think that's, I mean, we look at
politics, that's the problems on both extremes is like, neither extreme is willing to stop
to understand even the place where other extreme is coming from therefore they just keep making it more diversive but i think for me that's where
like this kind of come back to and i was like no you remove toxic people that are attacking
and that are saying hateful things that are full of negativity but by by getting rid of them now
you have some people that you can get your mind be open new possibilities you'll have all these
new things i think that's where you know not being part of the game like saying like oh my god i hate
social media or blaming social media for like the me too move or all these things that exist like
no wait a second society and mankind have been bad for a long time social media has exposed it
we can either blame social media and continue to live in a society that allows these things to
happen or we can fix society and amplify the good with social media and i think this goes back to you
and i like on our core beliefs of like there is this element that together we can you know the
tide you know rise the tide but in this world we're living in it still is um unfortunately
rare in the in the space we're at but But I believe the businesses that are doing it well
are the ones that see that. Yeah. I actually think, and this is, I think, a good topic for
us to close on because I want to be respectful of your time. I actually think that the negativity
is the minority. And when we see the hardcore negativity, what we're hearing is a very small
portion of the population on both sides, who their identity is that negativity. And that's
just the role they play. And what I hope that we hold in our minds in all things, when you're
having disagreements at work, or disagreements with your family, or friends or in your things, when you're having disagreements at work or disagreements with your family or friends or in your community, is that the loudest or most negative voices in a conversation are
often the vast minority. And not that we shouldn't hear them, but we certainly shouldn't hold them up
as the banner for what that, quote know, quote unquote, side of the argument
actually believes. Because I know a lot of, you know, pro-gun who are also pro-gender rights.
And, you know, if you were to, you know, if either one of the far extremes were to hear that you were
one or the other, they both would kick you out. And then where do you go? And it's like, that goes
for every disagreement. You may be
pro hierarchy and work, but also want your people to step up and question what you do.
And it's, it's this, you know, I think it, the easiest example is always,
is always, uh, in pots, I think for this particular issue, but, but the idea transcends
every aspect of our life. When you're disagreeing with your spouse or your partner or someone in your family, your friends, if you're having any particular, I think this is
coming more and more into work as people get into these, you know, uh, you know, I just had a
discussion the other day with someone about flat structure versus hierarchies. And I firmly believe
in a hierarchy. I just do. I believe that you have to have a hierarchy to get things done.
That being said, it places
more intrinsic responsibility on the leader to allow their people to be value adds all the way
up the chain. Now, that may not with a with a weak or a selfish self oriented leader, that system
falls apart, which is what why people say hierarchies are the problem. hierarchies aren't
the problem. This is I'm way off on a tangent, but I don't believe hierarchies are the problem. Hierarchies aren't the problem. This is, I'm way off on a tangent, but I don't believe hierarchies are the problem. I believe shitty
leadership is the problem. So, you know, so we go back and forth and ultimately I think we both
understood their sides. And basically the person I was talking to side was, how do you know if
someone's a shitty leader, you know, and once they get to that position, how the heck do you get
them out? And I said, that's a fair point. I think that's, that's what we have to work through. But
I guess my point is like, you if you can if you I don't ever
think we should shut anybody up and I don't believe in in in banning people um because
I just I I unless they're really unless you say really hateful whatever but but I think we need
to hear what the extremes are saying I think we just always have to hold in our mind remember
exactly who they are and why they're doing it.
It's like you signaling as a Pittsburgh Steelers fan and me as a Bills fan.
It's part of who they are is hard to one side and negative.
And everybody else is in the middle.
And those are the people that I hope they just find one thing in common
because when you find one thing in common,
everything else seems to fall into place. And you'd be amazed too, if you like looked
at, you know, cause you do have extremes, like you said, and, but I think if you looked oftentimes
at negativity that is in your life or in your feed or in our world today,
the negativity is rooted in a desire to know that their voice is heard,
not the negativity that the message is carrying. And I think this goes everything from kneeling on the football field to, you know, there's
a fundamental principle.
And there's also, there's a difference here of knowing that I'm heard and knowing that
you have to listen to me, right?
Like there are two different worlds.
And I think we have this like weird thing where if we acknowledge someone that, hey, we hear someone, that means we ultimately have to do exactly what they're telling us.
And I think that's complete false.
And that's, you know, the amount of times I've had these conversations with leaders on social media and then coming to me and Brian, putting vulnerabilities out there and doing all this stuff.
But yet, how do you respond to this comment or this statement?
And I was like, well well you have to acknowledge it like
there's no i don't i don't you know i don't bet and i you have to acknowledge and like
what i'm like because the lack of acknowledgement will now just spur the hate and the and the
the increases more right and this idea of like hey i hear you i'm gonna i'm gonna take it for
the value that it has but i'm gonna decide how it's gonna be implemented but i do hear you right
and and it's amazing where i think even to your point with your, the friend that
you had a discussion on the hierarchy, right? Like if you weren't willing to listen to the
fundamental, like, Hey, this is what you were arguing. Wait a second. Like you argued that
you're an idiot. No, you're already there. And then the root comes out to be, Oh yes,
we realized that shitty leaders have been rewarded for a long freaking time. it's really hard to get rid of two leaders and how do we
prevent shitty leaders there's not really a recipe I think this is where I
think the need exciting about where we're at because there is like find that
one commonality but at the same time also if you don't see the commonality
but they won't stop chirping and they won't stop making sure you hear them
maybe it's time to take a different perspective and a different mindset to
what they're, who they are and what they're talking about.
Like, and I think that's where that,
that one piece comes in like some of the coolest moments in my life,
I feel like are, you know,
and it has to do with a group of speakers that opened me to this,
this world of people that are doing the same profession to me,
just do it differently.
They have like different passions and goals and they've come from so many
different lives than I have. And then there's like these core things that like,
I mean, I feel like in the last two years,
I've become a much more well-rounded human. I don't, I don't,
and this is like, you know, not saying I don't judge everything,
but I don't judge. I look at every opportunity you know not saying i don't judge everything but i don't judge i look
at every opportunity as a learning opportunity i'm willing to listen and oftentimes people look
around me like prime why did you just why did you keep listening there and i was like because i
they have that passion that's rooted somewhere and if i even if i don't agree with it but i
understand it better by listening i improve and maybe I can help them improve even tell their story.
And I think that's, I think that's where you and I even agreed.
I think part of the route where you and I connected with early on was just
like our desire to help people,
but also a desire to realize that like everything's building to a performance
level that we can always grow on. And you made the statement before.
And I just literally ordered these shirts yesterday.
I have a shirt coming out that just says, we are greater grow on. And you made the statement before and I just literally ordered these shirts yesterday. I have a shirt coming out that just says we are greater than me. Betterment time because if we can embrace that and realize that we're all connected by those one things,
the world's gonna be a much better place. My man, it is always a pleasure to spend time with you.
Thank you so much. I know you're traveling. I think life is hectic. You're an in demand speaker
and you got places to be. So I appreciate this time. It is, it's definitely been fun for me.
And, uh, you got my mind going and I got a page full of notes, which is always amazing.
Um, where is the best place for people listening to this? They want to learn more about you. Maybe
they want to hire you to speak. Uh, they just want to be part of your ecosystem and kind of
take in more of what you do. Where do they go to learn more?
So, you know, I'm a big believer in, you know, consistency.
Consistency is extremely important.
Probably one of the most underrated things online today.
So I'm iSocial fans.
So iSocial, F-A-N-Z or Z at the end on every social network.
So I always say, don't follow me everywhere.
I create a lot of content, a lot of noise.
Follow me on your favorite channel.
I would appreciate that.
And then I'm speaking, you know, my new speaker site is brianfanzo.com.
brianfanzo.com is where all of my speaking stuff kind of goes through there.
And if you want a podcast, I think that probably relates to your audience the most.
I also have a weekly podcast called FOMO Fans, where I try to cure your fear of missing out
around entrepreneurship, marketing,
business, technology. I'm a solo podcast. Literally, it's me talking to the microphone for
30 minutes. But it's definitely my passion project where I just love being able to share
what's on my mind. And I think I rolled out episode 118 this week, so it's a lot of fun.
But yeah, anywhere and everywhere, Ryan, it's a pleasure for me.
I tell you what,
I love that we can come
from two different industries
and walks of life.
Social media was the link.
We ended up having
some mutual friends
that kind of united
the trust we have together.
But I've been cheering for you
as you were pivoting
and I think we've both
been cheering for each other,
which I think is
a whole lot more fun
than just the conversation
that I was giving you about.
So thanks, everyone.
Appreciate you, brother.
Cheers.
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