The Ryen Russillo Podcast - Colin Cowherd and Bill Simmons | Dual Threat With Ryen Russillo (Ep. 14)

Episode Date: November 28, 2018

Russillo breaks down the Baker Mayfield–Hue Jackson post-game interaction Dick Wolf–style before talking with Bill Simmons and Colin Cowherd about Aaron Rodgers vs. Tom Brady. Cowherd sticks around to discuss the latest CFB playoff rankings, and Russillo shares some parting thoughts about Ohio State. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, what's up, everybody? I'm Ryan Russillo. You are listening to Dual Threat, our podcast where we talk both college and pro football. We have an interesting guest list today. I did about two hours with Bill on the NBA, so that cut into our cowherd time because we had a longer cowherd thing scheduled. And then Bill was like, I want to stop by. So these aren't complaints. These aren't complaints. These are strictly just pointing out some of the editorial decisions we had to make on today's podcast.

Because then we have a three-man roundtable with myself, Simmons, and cowherd on Aaron Rodgers and then Brady, which, holy shit. Kind of came out of left field. Right? I mean, you know, was the Rock not available? He might have not fit in with three just mega personalities. So, yeah, we're going to talk with Cal Heard about that, and then Bill will leave, and then we'll talk some college football with the rankings just coming out.

So I'm going to get to the rankings with Cal Heardd and then I'm going to get my thoughts on the rankings. Ohio State fans already preparing to be pissed off, which I totally get. But because I think Oklahoma should be ahead of you, it's not because I don't like Ohio State fans, even though some of you have been absolutely brutal in the past. You just have, man. What do you think I'm making this stuff up? So I can do a quick I always think the Titans stink thing, but I'm not like I started writing it out. I just, it doesn't matter. Somebody was like, Hey, you know, the Titans are 10 and one. I'd be like, Oh, they are. I'm like, I don't think they're any good. Are they? And then last night I got kind of an NBA thing going and they were up

early and I go, man, are the Titans good again for Abel Mariota? He just, I was like, I don't think Mario is ever going to figure it out. And I don't know if it's him being hurt. I don't know if it's a change in court. Like, I don't know if I'm being completely unfair about the Titans. And then they smoked New England, which also should make me think, like, I think I'm just going to go ahead and say it. New England's not going to the Super Bowl. They just aren't.

So despite what they're capable of doing and beating Kansas City, to see them lose games the way they've lost this year, there has to be some sort of stat out there that I didn't feel like looking up because I wrote out this whole Baker Mayfield thing, where I don't know if New England, and who knows if it's even a final score thing, but if they had three games in the same season where they look like they had no chance, like they did against Jacksonville, Detroit, and Tennessee, that's three games with another good chunk of the season to go where I've watched New England and gone, I don't know. So yeah, I'm just going to go ahead and say it. Fine. Do it. I'll be that guy once again. I don't think New England gets to the Super Bowl. Is this the end for Brady? I don't know if

I'm ready to do that. I think I may have done that segment on radio about 10 years ago, when they made the last Super Bowl, 2007. Like, odds are, you know, this run will probably be over and I'm never playing another Super Bowl. And then he played in, like, three more. Four more? I think four, yeah. Yeah, four more, actually. Yeah, Seattle, Atlanta, Philly, and then the second Colts,

or excuse me, the second Giants won in Indianapolis. So that's four. Yeah, so that one didn't work out. But, I mean, more often than not, like, that's how you grow up with these dudes that are legends. And you go, yeah, this is probably going to be it. Like, he's probably never going. The safer money would be that it's really hard to make it to these championship games,

and he's probably never going to be in one again. It's kind of the LeBron thing right now. What's the safer money? That he plays in one more NBA Finals, or he never plays in another NBA Finals? Never's a long time, but if you're mid-30s as a pro athlete who's out to jump playing big minutes at 18, I feel like the safer money. Yeah.

Kyle gets it. How is Kyle doing? He's great. He's great. I stuck around for Thanksgiving. I feel good about it. You do? You know what I always think is funny with Bill is that there's all these stupid things that Bill wants to do with me.

He wants to talk about my personal life. He wants to talk about me living out here. I told you guys that I could be potentially looking in an apartment. I don't know if that made it in. Well, that didn't make it in the podcast. We never do it. We never do any of that stuff.

It's awesome. It's fucking awesome. Because he goes, I don't want to do that stuff yet because I want to talk all NBA. And he makes a good point. Like, don't do a podcast where you spend 30 minutes getting to the point. Like, well, have you listened to me? So anyway, speaking of getting to the point, Cowherd Simmons, then me on the college football playoff rankings. Really the only drama there is going to be Oklahoma, Ohio State.

To break that down, we have Chris Fowler trivia. We had the research department work on this one big time. have Chris Fowler trivia. We had the research department work on this one big time, but I'm going to do something new here, which is really sort of the origin somewhere else where I started saying I could defend this. I'm going to try to present both cases for Baker Mayfield and Hugh Jackson, and then we'll pick one. I'm going to make a ruling. All right. So I don't know if we have a title for this yet. Creative's on it, but it's, I don't want to do like a who you got or whatever, but I'm going to have to just go ahead and make a ruling on who's right in the beef between Hugh Jackson and Baker Mayfield.

And I've spent hours sorting through all of the evidence. I'm fucking hyped. Yeah. And I need a little Law & Order sound. Shout out to Dick Wolf. Before we get to the rest of the stuff, I want to thank the good folks at Belvedere, a big part of our successful live podcast out in Vegas at Caesars Palace. Belvedere is that kind

of drink where if you order a Belvedere, every single person is going to check you out. That's not the right read. I felt like it's a really good vodka, but that felt like this is a borderline cocky. Snake oil. No, no, no, no. Here's the deal with Belvedere. Produced in one of the world's longest running distilleries, Belvedere vodka is the world's finest all natural vodka.

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wouldn't be the end of the world. But then there's another shelf. And that shelf up there, that's reserved. Every house got a pool. You may even send your kids away. Because the people that are drinking from that shelf are choosing Belvedere. And they're living right. And then I make a Belvedere and I end up marrying that girl.

And almost that entire story is true except for the last part. Enjoy a delicious cocktail with Belvedere vodka today and remember to always drink responsibly. Perfect. Perfect. Okay, so that's going to be the theme of this whole thing. And we'll get to all those guys coming up a little bit later. But I want to talk Baker Mayfield versus Hugh Jackson. And then I have to make a ruling because there's a lot of evidence here.

So right now what's happening? We just saw the game where Baker and Cleveland, they were up big on Cincinnati. So the final score, you know, whatever, Cincinnati got to 20 there with Jeff Driscoll after Dalton, who's now out for the year. But the real story was in the game, we saw an ex-Brown pick the ball off and hand it back to Hugh Jackson, which we've now learned is

I think is condescending a move as you possibly could have, which is what it felt like right away, but you're like, I don't know, maybe did somebody on the Browns really love Hugh, and that's what it was, and then afterwards, we got the audio and video, not just the video, but the audio part of Hugh Jackson going

Baker, Baker, because that's what you're supposed to do, right? You're supposed to go out to the middle of the field, say hello to everybody. And it would have been weird if Hugh didn't go out to say what's up to Baker. And he went in for the hug. Baker wasn't having it. It made it even worse with the audios of Hugh going, Baker, Baker. And Baker notices him, and then he puts his hand on his head. But then after the fact, this is where we know.

Because when I'm watching it, and this is kind of one of the stupid social media things where I tweet, I'm like, I'm having a hard time not overthinking this because I pride myself on not overreacting. Not everything has to be a thing, but this felt like a thing. And then I'm watching the later games and I'm not locked in. I'm not going to watch Baker Mayfield's postgame presser. I'm going to watch the other games because that's more important to my job. So I didn't know, as I had said that people were like, well, wait a minute. Did you see his post game? And I did. And in the post game, Baker was asked about Hugh and he said

this, quote, left Cleveland, goes down to Cincinnati. I don't know. It's just somebody that was in our locker room asking for us to play for him and then goes to a different team. We play twice a year. Ooh. Okay. Does Baker have a point there?

So he's mad that Hugh took a job with a division rival, essentially in the NFL terms, down the street. Not down the street, but pretty close. Both located in Ohio, for those that struggle with that sort of thing. Now, I've seen people crush Baker because, wait a minute, you transferred. My man, Damian Woody, who we should have on the podcast at some point. Woody was like, no, no, no. He's like, dude, you went to Texas Tech.

Like, that's ridiculous. And then Baker went back at Damian Woody, and then clearly Woody got in the crosshairs of all the people that love Baker Mayfield. I don't have a problem with Baker, the brashness thing. I think it can bother us in the moments, the planting of the flag at Ohio State. Him grabbing himself against Kansas, that I thought was all a reaction to what the Kansas guy, like freaking Kansas football, not shaking his hand at the coin flip. So I think anybody that gets on Baker's case for that thing, it's like, nah, man, those

guys kind of started that stuff and they didn't want to do it. Unless there's some other thing from a Reddit board that I didn't catch, which I'm probably, somebody's going to tell me there is, um, the Oklahoma Ohio state game. I get the brash of the video of him being arrested and trying to run away. Uh,

you know, if you don't like Baker, you're going to keep bringing those things up where I would say big picture. It doesn't really mean a ton if people think he's talented enough and if his teammates always love him. And that was always the big thing with Baker. So when teams started asking around about Baker, they're like, this guy is as high of approval rating in all walks of life. Like everybody, all the different position groups, they really love this dude and they ball for him. And they love the fact that he's got dispassionate. So I've heard that people have defended Baker and saying, well,

he needs to change the tone for the Cleveland Browns. That's what he's doing. Okay. Yeah. That's, that's a great version of it, but he also, and I'm not holding all these things from his past against him, but he also could be just prickish at times, right? Like, I think that's a reality. Like there's a possibility in five years from now, we could be like, you know, who's just kind of like really nasty, you know, go at dudes is Baker. And here's the thing. If you're going to be that guy, it only works if you're really good. And if you're really good, then we'll say that it's a positive and that you have this ornery mentality and that, you know, you just, you take no prisoners. And remember when he called out Hugh Jackson?

Yeah, that's great. Like we will play the results on this. Like we do with all of this stuff where if Baker's terrific, we will point to this moment this weekend and be like, that's when he proved that Cleveland was his team and that he was the leader and that he wasn't going to take anything from anybody. And man, you know, you want that in your guy. If it doesn't work though, boy, are we going to torch you for this? We're going to say, oh, immature, can't let things go, you know, can't move on, bad decision

maker, all this stuff. That narrative, even though I hate that word, the narrative is waiting to be written. I'm giving you the only two versions that exist, and that's exactly what will happen with Baker. I'm giving you the only two versions that exist, and that's exactly what will happen with Baker. And I'm going to get back to successful and how that helps so much in applauding no matter what you do. Like, you can be the worst guy, but then when you're successful, we're like, oh, never lost focus. Like, okay.

I feel like I'm getting ahead of myself too much here in my conclusion. But if we're simply debating the point of Baker Mayfield being mad at Hugh Jackson for taking a job with Cincinnati, I feel like I'm leaning Hugh. But then it's like, wait a minute, am I really going to lead with Hugh Jackson? We're talking about a guy that went 3-36-31. He went 1-13-1 in the AFC division. The AFC North. He went 1-15 and then 0-16.

And he actually said after the 1-15 season he'd jump in a lake if they were worse. And everyone's like well that doesn't mean much he went 1-15. They were worse. And he did jump in a lake if they were worse. And everyone's like, well, that doesn't mean much. He went 1-15. They were worse. He did jump in the lake and they got shared. Okay. Now some people have said, well, there's another part of this story. That Hugh Jackson didn't start Baker Mayfield, started Tyrod Taylor, and that's why Baker was

really upset. Baker can be upset. He can look at his situation as only his situation. But what I would have told him if I were an agent or anybody and be like, you know what? Let's be realistic about how this works out. They bring in Tyrod Taylor, trade from March 10th. What are they going to tell Tyrod? They want to bum him out. Hey, what's going on? You know, that'd be like getting, it'd be like going out to dinner with your ex who you still like.

And then she goes, hey, just before we even go into the restaurant, I want you to know that this night is not going to go the way you want it to go. Okay. So you can't tell Tyrod when you trade for him. Hey dude, we love this Baker kid and we got the number one pick.

We're probably going to take them, but have a super positive attitude for the next month or so. All right. No, you tell Tyrod, Hey, it's going to be your team. And here's the thing.

Be like, well, why would Hugh Jackson make that mistake? Really good coaches. All of these guys. It's just the way business is done. Sometimes from the outside, it is very hard to understand why these guys make these decisions.

If there is one common thread through all NFL coaches, good or bad, great organizations, terrible organizations, is that they just have this thing where they don't want to play the young guy right away, or they play the vet. And a lot of times it is because they signed the vet in free agency before the draft, wanted to tell him all the right things. They don't want to feel like total liars to that vet, but then they end up going ahead and bench him because that vet was even available in free agency or in the trade market to begin with, because he had screwed up somewhere else. And if they have this high pick

because the quarterback stunk before they brought that guy in, that means they're probably going to 50-50 even be looking for a guy because they're pretty sure the free agent that was even available has enough of a track record of proving that he's not really a guy that they have to draft someone anyway. Okay. So this is all very predictable. Just like when Rosen sat at the beginning of this year with Sam Bradford. Okay. And now he's getting his, you know what, handed to him. Just like Josh Allen, who actually sat week one for Nathan Peterman, who had a 0.0 QB rating in that first game, then was the starter. Just like Lamar sat, although that one's different because it was an incumbent guy in Flacco who all, even though he's been actually like legitimately bad for four

years here, you could understand Lamar taking a little bit longer to actually get that gig. It's a gig now. I don't care who Flacco is or what he's meant to that organization. At this point, Lamar should be the guy moving forward, even though I've had my questions about what Lamar will be with his accuracy, but they got the two wins, and that seems to be the only thing anybody pays any attention to. Deshaun Watson sat behind Tom Savage.

Why? Because Bill O'Brien's a moron? No, Bill O'Brien's a moron? No, Bill O'Brien's a really good coach, but he does seem to fall in this category. Everybody wants to believe he's stupid all the time. O'Brien's terrific. That team's on a roll, but yeah, he played Savage. He played Savage. And I've heard other people be like, oh, Bill O'Brien, look how dumb he is. No, he did what everybody else did. Just like Andy Reid sat Mahomes out for a year. Would the Chiefs have been a little bit better with some Mahomes mistakes than with Alex Smith's non-mistakes last year? I believe they would have, even in a rookie year.

But he sat for an entire year. So not every situation is the same, but the same theme is that a guy who gets drafted, no matter where it is, usually sits for a little bit. They always start. They tell us, oh, he's going to take a year. We want him to groom him. This is it. Now you guys,

you guys can't help yourselves. You say all the same things and then you break the rules every single time. But the one rule that is a constant is that you sit Mitch. He sat behind Glennon golf, who I didn't realize that his nickname on football reference. And I love basketball, baseball, football reference,

because it actually keeps track of all these nicknames.'ve never heard anybody ever called. Jared Goff's nickname is Mr. Perfect. Who calls him that? The editor of the page? Goff sat behind Case Keenum until week 11, and Carson Wentz was going to be the third stringer, was labeled as the third stringer right up until September, the beginning of September when Bradford was traded, and the oddity of that was, as I tweeted out this weekend with Chase Daniel getting the start for the Bears in a win, still don't know if he's any good.

Chase Daniel was listed as the backup to Bradford. And then Wentz was third string. And then they traded Bradford. Hey, Wentz, you're the starter. And Chase, like,

no offense, but you weren't really second string, dude. We just, you know, like the other guys are rookie. Everybody likes you. You're a good dude. So we just, look, we're going to keep you at second string. The difference is the guy in front of you is no longer here. And the guy that was

third is actually going to jump you. Is that cool? Be like, Hey dude, whatever. Can I just sign for another seven, eight mil and never have to throw a pass. I'm down with that. So Baker, he can feel like it's personal, but it's the way business is done the same way. Anybody that's listening, that's worked in any sales department in the beginning, when you find out what the commission cuts are and what the guys above you that feel like they're mailing it in all the time. And you're like, how much does that guy make? And I'm making this. Well, that's the way it's done. Junior, you know, you know, like that guy did all that stuff and he made it through all the wars and he's been with the company 10, 20 years. And he just, shit's going to go better for him than it is for you because you've,

you just bought a suit at men's warehouse and you got two of them. And guess what? They're always two for one. Okay. You didn't hit it the right fucking weekend. They're always two for one and they throw in the shirts and ties and it's a good fucking look. All right. It's a good look, but you didn't just go there the right day. It's like 365 days a year. They just assume you're not going to be back there next week. So can Baker really be upset about that? I don't think he can.

Now, if we really examine Hugh Jackson, though, this is somebody after, again, he went he went three 36 and one said this after he was fired, literally days after he was fired and is on everybody's TV show. Quote, I thought it was a little premature. Guy coached 40 games, one three. He's like, you know,

I got to tell you, I think they rushed it a bit. I actually admire, instead of being upset by the quote or offended, you should admire any human being who can win three out of 40 games and suggest in all seriousness on a fucking TV show that management may have jumped the gun. I actually want to be friends with Hugh Jackson.

Okay. I want guys like that in my crew. I want them talking to other people about me that have this mindset about themselves. This guy's a closer. He's an opener and he's a closer for other people around him. Obviously, the quote continues,

obviously, I wish they wouldn't have given, obviously, I wish they would have given me an opportunity to finish it out, but they didn't. And so, again, I have to respect their wishes. Okay. Okay. He also said, and this is pretty interesting.

He's like, Gil, look, last year we had a rookie QB, rookie tackle, all these different things, wide receivers off the street, and our offense is just as good as our offense this year, which is a direct shot at Todd Haley, which plays into a theme that people have said about Hugh that he does blame some other people. Okay. This is one of my favorites because this is not specific to Hugh. I've brought this up before. He says to everyone willing to listen, This is a tough job because we passed on three franchise QBs. This is his quote. We passed on three franchise QBs the first two years in Wentz, Watson, and Mahomes.

We played with a QB room with zero wins in the league. We played with street free agents and practice squad players, yet our offense was the same or better than we were doing this year. There's no way that should happen. So, again, the direct quote there is about the offense and Haley, but the real important thing here is that he's doing that deal where it's like, hell, Wentz, I loved him. Watson? You kidding?

Mahomes? I saw this coming. Well, we did a little digging. Mike Silver, NFL reporter, longtime guy. Many have said that he's very good on the Hugh Jackson stories because he's plugged in. Mike Silver's tweet from 2016, quote, I talked to Hugh Jackson about Carson Wentz many, many times pre-draft. Jackson never disparaged his ability, thought number two was too high to take him.

That does not look good for Hugh. You just said on a TV show a couple weeks ago, you loved Carson Wentz. The guy that has really good Hugh Jackson information because you're saying in the tweet, Mike Silver, a quote from Hugh about that quarterback two years ago was that two was too high to take him. His 205 winning percentage is the second worst of all time in NFL history. Behind who? You know I got your back. Burt Bell. Burt Bell, the Eagles. I don't know if you guys

remember him, 1936, 1941. He did not win a lot of games. He was also the owner, I believe. So there was a very anti-Hugh Jackson article that I read today that was like, well, he was the second worst, but he's actually the worst because the other guy was the owner and coach. I'm like, man, you really hate Hugh. Brett Bell's winning percentage was under 20%. So

with all of that information out there, okay, it still comes back to what Baker is using as his defense for not wanting anything to do with Hugh. If you want to say that Baker is mad, he shouldn't, he should have started earlier. I don't, I don't think that's good enough argument. You want to tell me that Baker's trying to do it his way. That's fine. But like I warned, okay, you better be great. You better win games because if you don't, everybody's going to think you're petulant.

You know, the Steve Jobs book is great because everybody that read the Steve Jobs book decided they just wanted to be a dick to everybody after the fact. Okay. They're like, oh, this guy's amazing. He just says, no, he's impossible. He's a jerk. And look how successful he is. Well, it's funny because I'm now reading another book.

It's called Bad Blood. It's about this company. It didn't work out. All right. I'm not all the way through the book, but there's all these people that are these Steve Jobs disciples that just want to start companies and be dicks to everybody. Okay. Here's the thing. The only way the Steve Jobs thing works is if he also does all the good shit that he did with Apple. Okay? Like your first thing starting a company, like I'm going to be a CEO. We're going to make furniture, but we're going to be really successful because it would be impossible to deal with.

And just an outright dick 24-7. Well, nobody's writing, hey, this is a really good idea until after the furniture becomes this groundbreaking company. And maybe it does. But that's all we hey, this is a really good idea until after the furniture becomes this groundbreaking company. And maybe it does. But that's all we do, man. We only tell you it was successful tact. It was only the right personality to have if you're successful first. You know, anybody that's going, oh, look at this guy. He dropped out of college.

Tell your parents if you're younger. Sorry for swearing. But tell your parents, you know what I hope to do? Go to Stanford for like a year plus and then drop out because look at all these other people. Yes, there's a lot of people that dropped out of really good schools, Stanford being one of them, MIT, Harvard, okay? And we hear these success stories. Oh my God, look at this guy. He dropped out. You know what the rest of us kind of need? That college degree, All right. So worry about comparing yourself to the dropout that revolutionizes social media after you're done. And I know some of you are so brilliant that you

don't need the degree and you feel like you're wasting your time and that's fine. And some of you still will be successful, but for anybody to argue that Baker, this is the way it needs to be done. The only way we'll ever give him credit is if he wins and there's a chance he could have won without this approach. So, Hugh's resume is bad. He blames other people, takes credit for stuff that he hasn't done. But it's the NFL. And if he wants to be a coach and doesn't have many options, it's the NFL. And if he wants to be a coach and doesn't have many options, and you think he's just supposed to sit out the year, when these dudes love Sunday, they love preparing all week. It's all they've known for most of their adult lives. It's being around the guys. It's feeling like you're working towards something, being competitive. You can make all the Hugh Jackson

jokes you want, but I don't have any doubt that that's something that still drives this guy. And that because probably the one other team that would have offered him any kind of role this season happens to be because his best friend coaches the Bengals and Marvin Lewis. I'm ruling Hugh. That's it. I'm ruling Hugh Jackson, despite plenty of evidence. But if we're staying to the absolute case, the case being that he did something wrong by taking a job with Cincinnati, I think Baker's wrong on that one. We'll get to Colin Cowherd and Bill Simmons. That's going to be fun. And then Chris Fowler trivia at the end of the show. This holiday season, instead of buying an ugly sweater for just an uncle, buy something to treat yourself. Buy Bespoke Post's Box of Awesome. And seriously, I know we have to do these reads,

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themed boxes for guys that give a damn. All right. We got Colin cow heard some football reaction here in a minute, but Bill Simmons in studio. Yeah, we just finished. I just kept my headphones on. How are you?

Coward. Good. I always bring your ring of people on. You got the NFL guy. I love Kevin Clark, Kevin Clark. Yeah. He's great.

You still haven't changed your set, though. You still have the Willy Wonka set where you're like three times bigger than the guests. I changed it. You should. Yeah. I got chairs instead of a couch and I lowered my. Well, I didn't. The construction people.

You physically didn't do it. We actually have to watch the show. You know, we're on the move, man. I listen to it. I do not watch it. Do you watch it, Rossello? No, I mean, is this going to get contentious here? I thought this was going to be like a fun little three-way thing,

and now we're talking about set design. I didn't realize he fixed the set. I wouldn't come on his show because I didn't like how he pulled a power play with the desk. He was like, come on. I'm like, I'm not coming on. I don't want to look up at you like you're a judge. I listen to it all the time. I listened to it today. He was talking to Van Der Esch. He was like, come on. I'm like, I'm not coming on. I don't want to look up at you like you're a judge. I listen to it all the time. I listened to it today. He was talking to Van Der Esch. It was good.

I was, yeah, late in Van Der Esch. So what else is up, man? Good to see Bill. Is Bill going to talk with us too? I'm staying for like two minutes. He's not a huge college football guy. That's okay. He's an interesting idea guy. I like those. Interesting idea guy. I like those interesting idea guy

I like idea guys when did you feel like the Rogers situation got to the point where it had to be a hot take one way or the other

because I went on my podcast on an angle I have been on this for six years yeah everybody now is like you know

Rogers is difficult I had a coach tell me inside the Packers five years ago, he's Jay Cutler, except he can play. It's like, I've been on this thing for six years. It's like, he's difficult. When your brother calls you out, when your dad calls, if your brother and dad were calling you out, Bill, I'd like, Bill's difficult. So you're team Jordan on the fire relief thing? Did I say what? You're Team Jordan on the fire tweet?

No, I don't like it, but, you know, it's the drip drip. At some point, the dam breaks. We got like nine guys now who have like said, yeah, he's Mr. Michael Finley, Greg Jennings, the brothers, dads. After a while, it's like, I mean, we all have sources. After a while, it's like, yeah, we got a theme here. He's really

difficult. Some of the issues in Green Bay are Aaron issues. That is a good point. When the people leave and they have nothing to lose, and if it's somebody who's like a good guy or great, they'll always keep talking great about them afterwards, right? Even

with Jordan, who sounds like he was the worst teammate of all time. But all those guys respected him. They might say after, it's hard to play with. They're almost afraid to criticize him still. They don't even play him anymore and they're afraid. Rodgers, it is weird how many people lob grenades after. Bill, by the way,

when I worked with Randy Moss, I asked him off the air, I'm like, tell me about Brady. He's like, best teammate ever. Yeah. And that's when they froze him out on that last game at Miami. He's like best teammate I've ever had. Like Randy struggled, you know, Randy can be, you know, difficult, nobody bad mouth Brady. I mean, like you can't find a coach. They're all like, Oh, he's the best guy ever. I mean, at some point, if you know,

we all have sources at some point of seven people say the same thing, then I believe that's a thing. My thing with Rodgers is just, well, it's three things. One is the record about him in close games is completely misleading because if you go through them all, there's so many times where he brought the team back, went ahead or tied it, and then the defense blew the game, and then that's on his resume as if he can't close out any close games. That's a real thing. But I will agree with Colin in that I have guys that have played with him

that I just would see the talent. I think he's the best thrower of a football I've ever seen in my entire life. And then when guys are like, eh, I don't really like playing with him, and it's not just one, it's two, it's three dudes, and you just go, oh, wow, like maybe this is a thing. And maybe that becomes as important as how you throw the football because everybody has to look at you that way. But I don't think that team's done a very good job with him.

And I think the further frustration is that, like, Colin, if you sign off on a guy, do you feel like you have to kind of then indirectly dump on the other one? Because I think Brady's great. I think Rodgers is more talented. But I think the Brady-Rodgers thing has become, let me pump up my guy while I dump on the other one because I think Brady's great. I think Rogers is more talented, but I think that the Brady Rogers thing has become, let me pump up my guy while I dump on the other. And I just don't know that either of them deserve to be dumped on at any point. No, no. I mean, I, I said, I think, I think Aaron's becoming far first nine years,

first 10 years in the league far had nine good years. So did Aaron. One off year. You know, both won a Super Bowl, both six Pro Bowls, won three MVPs, won two, both iconic, both beloved. And then at about year 10 to 11, Favre started getting a little rigid, a little stubborn, a little less coachable, a little flakier. I'm retiring, not retiring, retiring. And I think Aaron's come to that point. He's becoming, you know, nobody wants to ever say, we all want to be different than our parents, cooler, hipper, smarter, more successful, but we all become our parents. Favre and Rogers would deny they have anything in common, but they're sort of becoming each other.

Like they're both, here's an incredible stat. There's a two greatest quarterbacks ever that are mediocre on the road. How's that possible? And my theory is Brady and breeze are better on the road because Brady and breeze play within a system, not system quarterbacks play within a system and they're incredibly coachable. Rogers and Favre are ad libers and on the road, you go on the road, you stay within the system,

you keep your head down, you don't gunsling, get the hell out of town with a close win. Like, Rodgers and Favre are too good to be mediocre

on the road. Peyton Manning wasn't mediocre on the road. Brady's not mediocre. Elway wasn't mediocre. So I think Favre and Rodgers are kind of becoming

each other. Top 10 guys ever, but, you know, they deserve some of the heat, too. Do you think Rodgers and Kobe, becoming each other, top 10 guys ever. But, you know, they deserve some of the heat too. Do you think Rodgers and Kobe, there are some parallels? Like a little bit of the seeming upset? You were talking about it on your recent podcast, Bill,

about how like Rodgers looks sad face. I think he looks like that all the time. Like do you remember doing the body language stuff with Brady 10 plus years ago? Yeah, but two years ago when they were making their run and then they were in the playoffs, everybody was like, Aaron Rodgers, Aaron Rodgers. Oh my God, this is amazing. He was carrying himself with a different kind of swagger,

which, you know, I think Kobe goes on those runs too where he's like, I don't care who's on my team, we're winning. It's just easier in basketball though. It is. This front office hasn't done, like some of the years where you go, who's in the secondary? But it's like Seattle's team? I said this the other day.

Is Seattle's team good? Why does this not affect Russell Wilson? I feel like I'm sticking up for Rodgers. Russell Wilson has a different personal DNA. Russell Wilson had a game-tying drop against the Chargers a month ago in Seattle.

Within one second, he was angry for a snap second, boom, out of it, done. That would have been an Aaron Rodgers eye roll, an Aaron Rodgers stare down. It's like that's his DNA. And for the record, it's just like stars, actors, quarterbacks, everybody's different. Manny Machado is the opposite of Derek Jeter. Machado's, he's antagonistic. He's not respected by teammates. Jeter's the opposite. It's okay. I mean's, you know, he's antagonistic. He's not respected by teammates. Jeter's the opposite. Like, it's okay. I mean, what Aaron is, all I'm saying is Aaron's different than Brady, but let's just acknowledge that Aaron is different, a little arrogant,

kind of condescending, difficult as hell, and not very coachable. I'm just saying it's obvious. I'm not ripping. I don't feel like I'm ripping Westbrook when I say he's hard to play with. I think it's been established. He's hard to play with. I don't think it's criticism. I think it's accuracy. If I was saying, you know, it's hard to play with Seth, then I'm just, that's a hot take. Yeah.

You know, that doesn't make any sense. Who's the most Westbrook type personality ESPN? Oh He's not answering that No that was to you Bill Who are you asking me? Oh I thought you were Feel free anyone

just a brown table here Who is Who is hard to work with Who's the Westbrook of ESPN? Come on We can't get Well what if it's a funny answer? I never work with Simmons WhyPN. Come on. We can't get... Well, what if it's a funny answer? I never worked with Simmons.

Probably Simmons. Come on. How dare you? We did some stuff together. We did some radio. Came on your show for like an hour. I don't... I've never really worked with a jerk.

I never have. I really never have. All right. Okay. That's a good answer. Good answer. Good diplomatic answer. I work with talented people. I work with talented people that are more difficult. All right. Okay. That's a good answer. Good answer. Good diplomatic answer.

I work with talented people that are more difficult. Do you think, all right, based on your theories, do you think that Russell Wilson gets over breakups quicker than Aaron Rodgers? Oh, this is interesting. What do you mean? If they were dating. Not each other. But if Russell Wilson were not married and Aaron Rodgers, you know,

just what you said, like Russell Wilson got over a bad drop quicker. He might be great to break up with. If you're a girl, you're like, okay, you know, that guy's not going to be parked across the street watching me. I have something that bothers me, and then I'm going to go. Okay. I don't like the Rodgers-Brady thing. The Brady thing was done when they came back against the Falcons and he won yet another Super Bowl.

And the resume that he's had and the fact that he's done it on a team that over and over again has not built the team around him. Because it's always like, oh, Brady or Belichick, who's better? Who deserves more credit? But I look at it the other way. Brady's really never been in a situation except for maybe 07, where the team was like, you know what we're going to do this year? We're building everything around Tom Brady, screw everything else.

Belichick just won't do that. Brady's always had to fit into whatever the infrastructure was. And yet all he's done is succeed. But after the Atlanta Super Bowl, this was over. He's the GOAT. How is this even a discussion? I said this a month ago on the air. The minute Brady won Atlanta. This was over. He's the goat. I haven't even a discussion a month ago on the air. The minute Brady won Atlanta, it's over compare Rogers, the big band.

Let's compare them to break a breeze like that. That put the Brady Rogers, like at some point we chose Elway over Marino. Cause of the hardware. Yeah. Right. The trophy. Okay. That, that argument's done. Like the Rogers Brady thing. It's the hardware is too overwhelmingly in one favor. If you want to compare, there's a lot of Favre-Rodgers, Big Ben-Rodgers,

Breeze-Rodgers. The Brady's up. The only guy competing with Brady is, to me, Peyton, Joe Montana, and then I'm C-Crest out. Nobody else counts. Right. And sometimes with athletes, especially later in their careers they'll hit a point

where if something really good happens it tips it over like MJ nobody thought he was the greatest player ever until the 97

but then the 98 when he basically wins the title by himself and then after that everybody's like MJ's the greatest this is it

that's exactly it and the Brady thing I thought that was his moment with Dan Laner. I was like, all right, this is it. Let's stop talking about it.

If it's not that, then what the hell, like, what is he supposed to do? Like, well, he has never three-peated. And you know, you just sit there and you go, all right, well,

give me a freaking break. He's 41. He's going to be the two seed. When you're producing shows or when you're doing what we do and then when people would come in after the Monday and they go like,

all right, what does this say for Brady now? Or like after he loses, he loses to the Eagles and be like, were we too quick to anoint him? Like, you know what? Like, no,, what does this say for Brady now? Or like after he loses to the Eagles, they'll be like, were we too quick to anoint him? We'll be like, you know what? Like, no, no, no. The line that he passed was something you couldn't then take away from him.

Yeah, it's over. And I think, you know, look. It's like, oh, the MJ and the Wizards. It's like, oh, I don't know if he's the greatest now. Do you realize how good MJ and the Wizards actually was? Yeah, it was good. That second year was incredible. It's a bad sports documentary I've always wanted to see. Just MJ and the Wizards actually was. That second year was incredible. It's a bad sports documentary I've always wanted to see.

Just MJ on the Wizards. I have to go. I was at Michael Jordan's last Wizard game in Portland. And Portland was always like a second home to him because of Nike. He was easily, and that was a good Blazer team, dysfunctional but good. He was easily the best player on the floor. I think he scored 42. You can Google it.

But that was his last year in Alaska and Portland. And he was markedly better than guys who were like Bonzi Wells. Good NBA player. Significantly better. Dominated the game. Thanks for having me. I gotta go. Are you leaving? Yeah, I have to go.

Let's do this more. This was really fun. I had a good time. We went too long with Bill and I and the other thing. So I got, I'm going to jump in my car. Now we can talk college football. I know I've told you guys about the hopsy deal back at my pad. I couldn't believe how nice it was when it showed up.

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and membership in the monthly beer club. That's tryhopsy, H-O-P-S-Y dot com slash dual, promo code dual, to get a subhome draft machine, two mini kegs of beer equivalent to two six-packs, two hopsy glasses, and membership in the monthly beer club. All just $99. Terms and conditions apply. Okay, so we said goodbye to Bill here. I really liked your Ohio State thing after they blow out Michigan. You and I have both defended Harbaugh. I still feel fine about everything I've said with Harbaugh.

But there's something about Ohio State that you think geographically doesn't match with everybody else. Yeah, I said basically, Ryan, that I'm watching that game and I'm watching Ohio State. And I said, you know, they look like LSU. And if you just took Ohio State and put them in the Clemson, Oklahoma SEC category

and look at Ohio State's record against the Big Ten, Clemson's record against the Big Ten, and then like the SEC, you see a pattern is that we have two divisions in football, Northern powers, Southern powers. And if you just take one Ohio State and put them South, all the Southern powers just have better players. And so Harbaugh, like the last five Michigan coaches, he's just out-athleted. They're just not fast enough. They're not long enough. They're not deep enough. They have an occasional receiver, one good corner. But Ohio State's going to their fourth receiver, and he looks like LSU. It's a conveyor belt of NFL bodies. And so I just, we can bang on

Harbaugh, but I'm sorry. Name the Michigan coach the last one that had his way regularly with Ohio State. Name the last Big Ten team. It's been like 20 years. No, you're right. I mean, that's the thing that I used to kind of laugh about with the Harbaugh thing was like, he doesn't beat his rivals

and I was like, well, he fits right in because nobody beat Ohio State. They've got like, it just, you know what I mean? So like he got Michigan state this year, he got Penn state. I'm not very high on this conference. The Ohio state stuff is frustrating. Cause I look at that game and go, well, how, how would I pick Oklahoma Ohio state? And then we start doing all the resume stuff.

But I, I actually think the big 12 for all the hits they take for the lack of defense and these games that get out of control. at doing all the resume stuff, but I actually think the Big 12, for all the hits they take for the lack of defense and these games that get out of control, I like the conference better than the Big 10 this year. And the way the rankings came out from the playoff committee, it's Bama, it's Clemson,

it's Notre Dame, it's Georgia 4. We'll see what happens there. But if it comes down to that fourth spot for Oklahoma-Ohio State, I think it's really close. And maybe Ohio State is the better team, but their loss is worse. And I just like the Big 12 better this year. I think the Big really close. And maybe Ohio State is the better team, but their loss is worse. And I just like the Big 12 better this year.

I think the Big 12 depth through six maybe is better than the Big 10s. No, I completely agree. I think the Big 12 over the last 10 years has had better quarterbacks and receivers. I just think they have. And I think they've had more kind of progressive, offensive-minded coaches. You know, when it comes to Oklahoma, Ohio State,

I'll give you this example. Everybody always looks at wins. My wins are better than your wins. But everybody wins. Iowa State has two big wins this year. Arizona State's got an impressive win. Baylor's got an impressive win. What I look at is losses.

You can't overcome a 29-point loss to Purdue. In the last 28 years, only three national championship teams have had a double-digit loss. And they've been to, like, Virginia Tech, Florida, Auburn. You can't lose to Purdue by 29. It's like, Ryan, everybody in life,

even a loser gets a good job briefly, right? Everybody has wins in life. It's avoiding catastrophe that separates people. Think about this. If you interviewed for the CEO of Amazon and you did an hour and a half interview and you were great, but in your last 30 seconds, you're like, by the way, I love, love having relationships with married women. They'd be like, check please, thanks for showing up. You'd blow the interview with a bad set. Right.

And that's my whole take. Everybody's like, wins. My win's better than your win. I love moms. Everybody beats good teams. But it's like, you can't lose. You can't have a catastrophe against Purdue and play for the title.

You're out. Okay, so let me do this then. What if I did the best wins thing? Because the loss isn't even comparable. I mean, a field goal loss, neutral site, Texas, is not as much as having Purdue roll you. Right, right.

The Ohio State argument is, well, you'd be kidding me. Where are all their wins when their only win is a field goal win at West Virginia where Ohio State on the other side, the TCU thing doesn't really matter. I don't like when fan bases do the ranked at the time

and not ranked currently, but they're going to go and say, we beat a top 10 team on the road, Penn State, and we housed what was supposed to be the best defense in the country. That goes against, I'm doing the devil's advocate thing here, where at least some people just sit there and do the argument where they go, well, wait a minute, give me your wins, though.

And I would say beating West Virginia and West Virginia is tougher than beating Michigan at home because Michigan played two decent teams and lost to both, and their defense is up there based on a bunch of wins over Northwestern. Find me the NFL quarterbacks they faced. Oklahoma beat Will Greer. That's impressive. Like, they both struggled against a bad team. Buckeyes struggled against Maryland, and Oklahoma struggled against Army.

They both won those games. But again, you can go back and forth on wins. I say beating Will Greer in West Virginia is tougher than beating Michigan at home. Why is Michigan good? They played two teams, lost a boat. They made their hay against non-NFL quarterbacks and slow

Big Ten offense. Michigan State can't throw. I'm sorry, but show me all the Ohio State wins I'm supposed to be blown away by. Michigan at home? I'm not blown away by that. I started looking me all the Ohio State wins I'm supposed to be blown away by. Michigan at home? I'm not blown away by that. No, that's fine. And I think when I started looking through all the strength of schedule stuff and all that,

and it's very close. I mean, if it's Texas at eighth in strength of schedule against UCF at 107, then we can have a conversation. But when it's 10 or 15 slots strength of schedule, I can't get super worked up about that. And I understand teams and the politicizing of this thing. They're going to start arguing all those deals. But just eye test alone, if Oklahoma played Ohio State neutral site tomorrow, who are you picking?

Oh, I think Oklahoma would be, I think Oklahoma would beat Ohio State. I mean, I think Ohio State showed me once for about three hours this year they could play really high-end football offensively and defensively at the same time. For the I think Ohio State showed me once for about three hours this year they could play really high-end football offensively and defensively at the same time. For the record, Ohio State's defense, 51 to Maryland, 39 to Michigan.

Let's not make Ohio State's defense the 95 Bears here or whatever. So, again, Oklahoma showed me one thing throughout the year. They dropped 50 on everybody. They were a consistent 50-plus offense. What did Ohio State do consistently all year? Wasn't offense, wasn't running, wasn't defense, wasn't pass rush. What did they do all year consistently great? Nothing.

Oklahoma dropped 50 all year offensively, outside of like one bad weekend against Army. That's impressive. Hey, I know you had to make time for us and we called you late, so I really appreciate it, man. We'll do a longer one maybe a little bit later in the season, alright? Hey, I liked your surprise guest thing. I'm really a fan

of surprise guests. I enjoyed that. You know what? We'll try. You know what? Maybe we'll keep that a theme. We'll have you on in a month and we'll try to surprise you again with somebody else, alright? That would be a nice theme. I like that.

I like the way you're thinking. All right, man. Okay. You can check out Cowherd Show nationally. I listen to it every day. That's nine to noon Eastern. No, it's nine to noon Pacific. I'm just kidding.

I'm just messing with you. Hey, man. Thanks a lot. I'll talk to you you. Hey, man, thanks a lot. I'll talk to you soon, all right? All right, buddy. Underwear has been different. This isn't even in the script, okay? I'm just going to go ahead and tell you. Like, I've got buddies.

We're all in our early 40s. I feel like I'm running down a bit, but I'm not technically. I still am. I'm 43, so we'll just put that out there. Right, yeah. So, I don't know. But, like, that means next year I'm not going to be 43. just put that out there. Right.

Yeah. So I don't know, but like that means next year I'm not going to be 43, but whenever I'm not around my buddies from college, new to ton lately, but if we go on some sort of trip, you know, and you're in a hotel,

you may catch a peak and be like, what are you doing with your underwear? Are you aware of what technology is out there? Like, what is wrong with you? Like cotton baggy boxers. Do you want to struggle? You didn't have to do this. And then I know my friends, like I do have a group of friends that the email loop of guys that we have, I feel like I just go to this, like, I just want to find out what happened two weeks ago.

That's why I stay on this email loop. But some of them haven't upgraded their underwear. And if you want to upgrade it and not be one of these guys, like, what the hell is wrong with you? You know, maybe they're not even going to like the way I do this read. But I'm trying to give you the hard sell because it absolutely annoys me when guys are not aware. It's like driving. It's like bringing a horse to work. So anyway, task performance was brought to life in 2009 with one goal, invent revolutionary fabrics to reinvent performance apparel.

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So we just talked to Cal heard that was quick. It was going to be a little bit longer there, but you're going to see, as you know, there be the massive, uh, NBA pod that, that Bill and I did that kind of moved, uh, some things around. But I got to the point there. And the point was that I want to do this Ohio State thing. And as the rankings come out, and that's kind of the point of this whole thing, we'll do one more rankings podcast. I think that'll be for us. What is it next week? Kyle, can you research that? It has to be one more next week, right? Let's see if I can get Rob Mullins on more time when it's all said and done. I think that would be cool. Ohio State fans. Okay. To be fair, you've been the worst fan base that I've dealt with nationally for over a decade.

And here's the thing. I actually sympathize with you early on. When you were playing the national title games and you were getting smoked, Florida and then LSU, you were treated unfairly. You became this national punchline where every other fan base from all over the country wasn't even close enough to play in their own, back then we didn't have conference championship games all over the place, but not even good enough to play in a decent bowl is making fun of you for once again getting back to a national championship. And so that's just what happens. As people are watching Ohio State for the only time the entire season. Mr. Football left and right.

Right. But they're not watching you on Saturday, but they're watching the national championship game. They watch you get smoked by Florida. They watch the LSU game and then they think you stink and it pisses you off and it should have pissed you off. And it was unfair. And I would have been resentful if I were a Buckeye fan, too, because I'm like, wait a minute. So let me get this straight. Like, we're some embarrassment because we keep getting in the national title game and you can't get into it?

Which is also funny, too, because one of those years, when you start factoring that loss and have everybody lose in front of you, then you get your spot back into a BCS championship game. The same stuff happened with Ohio State back then that everybody complains about happening with Bama. So, Ohio State fans got really, really mad about it. And then you had the Jim Trestle stuff with Terrell Pryor and the tattoos and the selling of stuff and this stupid non-suspension for the integrity of the Sugar Bowl suspension stuff that happened. I mean, there's just a bunch of dumb things.

And everybody kept making fun of you. And at that point, I was always kind of sticking up for you. I actually, once on the radio show, I go, I want Trestle to not get fired. And they tried really hard to not fire him three different times. And then finally they're like, all right, we'll suspend you without pay. Then we'll suspend you two games, then maybe a couple other games. And then, oh, damn it. Like there's emails. We're going to have to fire you. And I loved how defiant Ohio State was that they were just like, I don't really want to do it. So that's why I brought up that whole Trestle story

when we were talking about Urban Meyer earlier this summer, probably before this podcast, where I'm like, you know, I don't know in today's climate, like anybody feels like could lose their job for something like this. I don't know what you exactly pin on Urban, but, you know, Ohio State was very much like, hey, we don't really want to fire Trestle. He wins games.

We win, you know, We win the Big Ten. So let's see if we can ride this thing out, ride the PR storm out. And that's really what they did with Urban. And they never fired him. And I'm not saying that they should have, okay? Even though clearly mistakes were made. I'm trying to do this kind of neutral thing because that's not really even the point that I want to make. But this has been going on now for over 10-something years where Ohio State fans have felt like they've had this

national target on them and the origins of it were entirely unfair and completely frustrating. So now when I say, when I look at this whole thing and I go, all right, well, here are the rankings. Bama's in. And by the way, like, doesn't it feel like if Bama loses a close game to Georgia that it's going to be two SEC teams in this thing? It does. I think if Bama loses a close game to Georgia, they're in. I think they'll be four or maybe three. Bama, Clemson, Notre Dame, Georgia, and then Oklahoma, Ohio State, and that's your whole conversation.

When Ohio State won against Michigan, I go, okay, we know that they're going to jump ahead of LSU. It had two losses. Then LSU loses in the seven overtime game. It was just painful. I watched the entire game. Michigan, they're going to drop behind them. UCF, they're going to jump them. And then of course, Florida actually moved up two spots. So it wasn't like they were jumping them, but we knew that Ohio State would be no worse than six. like they were jumping them, but we knew that Ohio State would be no worse than six. But the committee right now is telling you they favor Oklahoma over Ohio State. The resume, as we talked about with Cowherd, the strength of schedule and all that stuff, I could do something where I could really dig into it and make a really cool three-point argument about Oklahoma,

and then I could do the exact same thing with Ohio State. But the thing I can't get past is if you're arguing Oklahoma doesn't have the wins, how do they cancel this thing out? Again, I'm not talking about the biased people here, but what would the math be to try to cancel out the lack of not having a dominant performance against Michigan? Should a dominant performance against Michigan like we just saw from Ohio State, should that mean more than the West Virginia win that we just saw from Oklahoma? Should that mean more? Is it greater than the negative side that would take away from whatever,

like some total you have and some perception of these teams? Is that really enough to offset the Purdue loss? Because Oklahoma's loss is so much better than your loss. Like, can you really sit there and say, well, okay, but Oklahoma doesn't have anything nearly as impressive as Michigan. Like the only person saying that is the Ohio state fan. And the only person saying the other side, like, ah,

Michigan weren't even that good. They were totally overrated. Like, you know, like I say, all season long, you're going to rank somebody. Okay. And for people that were upset that Ohio state was ranked 10th at the time, as if we were supposed to just expect after a month of looking very below Ohio state standards that I would have as a fan, as any of us should have as anybody that just watches this game, almost lose to Nebraska, Michigan state game, whatever, almost lose to Maryland. That one goes to overtime. You know, we, and that was a month that started or a stretch that started

with a loss of Purdue that was 49-20. I mean, you got smashed by them. So you see a month of those games, you go, you know what's going to happen here? And for the rivalry and the history, but then to say, yeah, they probably put up 62 on Michigan, probably put up 62 on them, even though they look like, that doesn't look like Ohio State for a month. So that's the other thing. What are you supposed to do? Just keep ranking teams up there? If you were to do this thing where you go, well, wait a minute, Georgia's favored.

Georgia could lose the SEC title game, and Vegas would probably still have them favored over Notre Dame. They'd probably still have them favored over Oklahoma and Ohio State. But then eventually, my point of, yes, we can talk about four best teams, but there has to be some penalty when you lose some of these games. And one loss usually isn't enough if we really like that team. So that'll be the hysterical thing because a chance to play Texas in a title game for Oklahoma when they're already ahead of Ohio State versus Ohio State with a chance to play a Northwestern team that's average.

I mean, this thing's a wrap. I don't think there's going to be really any debate about Oklahoma and Ohio State. I don't think any... And in the moment, you never know. Could Ohio State win 80-0? No. But you know what I'm saying? You see that kind of thing and then the Texas game is close.

I just feel like other than just absurd scores where public you know, public opinion, we just freak out about some sort of result that we see. I don't – if Oklahoma wins, they're going to be in the national playoff. I think it's pretty simple. We'll get to Chris Fowler trivia next. Just a reminder, everybody, to subscribe, rate and review Dual Threat,

Ringer Podcast. That's a big part of what makes us successful. Your reviews, your rating and subscribing multiple times. I don't know, man. These are the rules. I don't know what to tell you. I don't know what's going on with Google Play. Are we, is that happening?

Is it Spotify? Are we just. We're on Google Play. We are? Yeah. All right. It's over. When's the last time you got a tweet?

It's a good question. That's on me. It's probably, but my guess would be it's been a couple weeks. I blame myself for that one. Okay, here we go. Chris Fowler trivia. This Electrons. you