The Ryen Russillo Podcast - Colin Cowherd, Plus NFL Backup QBs | Dual Threat With Ryen Russillo (Ep. 2)

Episode Date: September 5, 2018

Russillo is joined by Colin Cowherd to take a hard look at the SEC, Texas football, the Big Ten, and the business of sportscasting. Then Russillo shares a few thoughts on Colin Kaepernick's Nike deal before he runs through every backup QB in the NFL. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

okay the number one podcast in america well at least for a week dual threat i'm ryan rossillo i'm your host uh really excited about this guest for this week colin cowherd from fox sports is going to join us a guy i worked with for a long time in Bristol, across the hallways. Offices were next door to each other. My office at one point was next to Mike and Mike and Colin, and then it was me, but I was the only one that was in there all the time. And not because those other guys didn't work hard. It was really more of an hours thing,

and the tourists used to come by and just open the door and take pictures. Anyway, we got a couple things going on. I'm going to do the Cal Hurd interview, and then I'm going to do this thing that's super nerdy and dorky on backup quarterbacks and backup quarterback depth from around the league because I spend a ton of time doing it I find the backup quarterback stuff

really fascinating so we're going to do that anyway but in order to support our show we'll need the help of some great advertisers and in order to find great advertisers we'll need to learn a little bit more about you. So just do me a favor. Go, if you could, please, to podsurvey.com forward slash dual.

That's dual for dual threat. And take a quick anonymous survey that will help us get to know you a little bit better. That way we can show advertisers just how great our listeners are. Plus, once you've completed the survey, you can enter to win a $100 gift card from Amazon. Again, that's podsurvey.com slash dual. That's D-U-A-L. And just check it out, man. Thanks for all your help. And one of the other things that we're going to ask you to do, because we got big things going on over here at The Ringer. My fantasy football draft is up. We have a keeper league with all

my buddies. And the deal is, it's really frustrating to me because everybody thought they didn't want me in the league because I worked at ESPN. But the thing is, they all live together at Martha's Vineyard and I'm not there. And they make awful trades. This one guy makes all these trades where he gets everybody's. He got Todd Gurley for like, I think, Jordy Nelson. So it sucks. So I need you. I need to get involved with this.

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the leading daily fantasy optimizer trusted by 100,000 daily fantasy sports players. So what's up, neighbor? We're probably going to set some sort of bandwidth record today. I'm not sure. You better make sure you got the right connections with this stuff, because this is what they'll call in the industry, popping. I think it's going to pop. Yeah. Yeah, I think people will be excited about it.

I was really excited to promote it and go through two of my favorite pictures of all time is when you autographed the 8x10 for me. Yeah. And then. Well, I always like to leave my former coworkers a little something special. Maybe they can sell it in hard times. You know, that's just kind of the way I roll. Right. Because if things hadn't worked out, I may have been able to get something for that on eBay.

But for those that don't know, Colin and I are neighbors now. And we've actually hung out a few times. We've gotten along well. I think I want to get to some of the kind of just where we're at now and career stuff with you a little bit later. But we both love college football. We loved talking about it when we were on the air together at ESPN. We loved talking about it, you know, in the hallway conversations were probably as much fun as we ever did anything on the air.

So we got one weekend in the books, and I want to start with something that, it was something we always get accused of at ESPN, being in bed with the SEC. Right. And, you know, I think it was always kind of funny that you were like, go Big Ten once you went to Fox, and you kind of understood the joke there. But everybody loves what the SEC is,

at least after the first weekend. But give me kind of your overall, and we'll just kind of take this in a bunch of different directions, the angst about the SEC, where they're at now, what's real, what isn't, and kind of now being on both sides of it? Well, I always felt they had the best athletes, but I did think in the previous several years, four or five, the coaching's deteriorated.

And, you know, it was Saban and hopefully one of his coordinators popped, and a bunch of gym teachers. But I never doubted the quality of their athletes. Now, Mississippi was paying for theirs, but nonetheless, that's not the issue. I just thought the Big Ten finally spent some money because of the Big Ten network, and they were paying assistance and assistance. In college football, I almost bet the coaches more than I do the teams. So I just think the Big Ten has really good coaches. I think Scott Frost is a home run.

Urban. Nobody likes Harbaugh this weekend, but Harbaugh, Paul Crist. Dan Tonio, who doesn't get enough love. Yeah. So I think the Big Ten caught up largely because of about a four-year run, the Big Ten caught up largely because about a four-year run, James Franklin, of crappy SEC

hires and elevated Big Ten hires. But this weekend watching, the SEC West looked great. The SEC, I mean, listen, I don't think Ed Orgeron is a great coach. They ran Miami out of the building. I mean, that's a testament to how deep they are. So,

you know, I think the SEC, I did think they dipped. I mean, that's a testament to how deep they are. So, you know, I think the SEC, you know, I did think they dipped. I mean, like I always say, when USC dominated the Pac-12, the conference was a disaster. I mean, UCLA was a mess. Stanford, Chip Kelly wasn't there yet. And, you know, people were like, oh, Pete was amazing. Pete would get 15 of the top 20 players on the West Coast every year. Listen, Saban has feasted on a lot of gym teachers over the last seven or eight years, but I do think Dan Mullen's going to be a big hit at Florida.

I do think Kirby Smart's terrific. And, you know, Orgeron, if he's smart, he pays his coordinators a lot of money, and they look really good this weekend. So I think the SEC, it felt like they're back, maybe not as good as they were seven, eight years ago, but it feels like they're, they're back. Yeah. That was always kind of my argument, at least like how it, how it all developed, at least for me. And I was always joke, like trust guys like Cowherd and I, or trust me, because I went to Vermont, we didn't even have football. You might be a little biased with

Eastern Washington. Right. Um, but you know? But I would always watch all these guys that played somewhere and have these awesome careers and jealous of what they get to do in college. But I'd be like, dude, at the end of the day, I can tell you just hate the SEC or I can tell you hate the Big Ten or you're going to pick against this team or you think this team stinks. go seven years in a row and win titles and you do it in this it's not seven years of Saban it's four different teams Auburn gets a title in there with Chizik who nobody thought was any good and it was Gus right Urban had it rolling at Florida it's Saban less gets one in that group and so it's four teams and Auburn plays for another one And then you have Georgia as a 15 playing for a national championship. Like people can be mad about it. And what happens is, is every fan base is so tribal. They're going to make excuses.

And now the new one is the SEC only plays eight conference games. The big 10 is acting like they've been doing it for a hundred years. It's been two years, big 10 fans. You've been playing nine conference games. I just don't know. And I agree with you. It has dipped from what it was when it was that

seven straight years where I'm like, I don't even want to talk about it. Don't even bring it into discussion. I've had some years where I thought maybe the Big Ten would have the best conference. I thought maybe the Big 12 sneaky was deep and I was wrong about that. The SEC is still the best, but it's not what it was. We'll see how the rest of the season goes, but it's hard for me to go five deep in any conference where I'd say, hey, that team won a national title, and I wouldn't start laughing hysterically. Yeah, I mean, there's no question. I mean, listen, the ACC didn't have a good weekend. I think the Pac-12 is basically, you know, three, four teams.

I think every conference is largely garbage by about the sixth team. I do think Scott Frost is going to make Nebraska as good as they can be in 2018, which to me will be like a top 15 program. They'll become very much like Wisconsin. You think they'll be as good as Wisconsin? Wow. Because I love Wisconsin. I don't know if Nebraska will ever be Nebraska again.

It's never going to be what it was in the 90s. No, I don't. No, I don't. That's what I'm saying. They'll be Wisconsin. They'll play in major bowls. They'll have a great saying. They'll be Wisconsin. They'll play in major bowls. They'll have a great staff. They'll be able to go to Texas and Florida and get that great

back and receiver. They won't have the depth of Alabama, Clemson, whatever. But they will be a force. And they'll end up 10-1 and 11-1. And they may not win a title. But when you play Wisconsin, you are in for a 27-24 fistfight.

And so, I mean, if you told me five years from now, I would say Penn State may dip and Nebraska may rise because I think losing that offensive coordinator to Mississippi State, Joe Moorhead, like that's like Chip Kelly leaving Oregon. Like that guy is so respected in coaching. I mean, I have NFL guys are like, yeah,

they're clever. You know, all my college guys, my coaches are like, Oh yeah, that guy, that guy's great. So,

you know, I just, I think conferences, it is somewhat cyclical, but here's what's not. The South has more great high school football programs. Yeah. That's always the thing.

When you start off the conversation with the athletes, like for a while you could go bowl record and then it would be okay. Well, the bowl record for the sec is incredible. And then it'd be like, well, look at the location of the bowls. You're like,

all right, fine. Um, and then it would be, oh, they all cheat. And I'm like, well,

we've had a few programs North of the, uh, Knoxville gas stations get busted for stuff. So, you know, um, then it's, then it's,

then it's, then it's, then it's, then it's all like, it becomes a bunch of different excuses. And then whenever, like, I felt like I was pointing out being like, I don't know, dude, I've been all over the country now for 10 years traveling around this stuff. And I feel like, like people outside of the SEC and, you know, look, Cannell hates the SEC. He can say whatever he wants. Um, he's, he's very anti any messages they've ever had. And when they came out with a campaign of like, it just means more, it drove them nuts. I'm like, dude, you're getting mad at like a bunch of marketing people that just had a, they run an ad on CBS every Saturday.

Like who cares? You know? And it used to drive them nuts. And like, look, he's an ACC guy. He's a Florida State guy. So, you know, and I think they may even been, well, you know, when, when you think of, of who we'd be rooting for at least this time through, but no one could ever counter the athlete argument.

Like, so the NFL, like, right. Like when you start tab, like when the sec West had more draft picks by itself in a division than any other conference, like I think it doubled up every other conference from one division. You just go like, dude, there's no counter to that. There's none. And you know, people will say that they cheat and all this.

Yeah. Old miss was the televangelist with four yachts. Like, everybody knew it was a scam, right? Like, I had multiple guys on that staff I knew, and Saban and his people every year, there became a point with Saban, he wouldn't recruit a Mississippi high school player. Like, if they didn't have him locked up with two months to go,

he'd just drop because it would be like, you don't beat Mississippi on signing day. Stuff transpires. You know, Ole Miss, obviously, and it was the worst. I remember going on ESPN years ago, and I'm like, listen, there's an SEC school basically paying players big sums of money. You'll hear about it in a couple years. Well, my sources were all, you know, from Alabama. They were complaining about it for years.

So, but take Ole Miss out. The SEC watched the games, watched the speed, like Auburn and Washington played. Auburn, look at their athletes. Their front sevens just

do. And Washington's got five or six NFL guys. Gaskin's really good. They've got a safety, Rob, who's excellent, and the gains on the defensive line. But, I mean, Auburn just, my eyes don't lie to me. Auburn's got more NFL body. Yeah, I was really impressed with Auburn's talent, but I still haven't given up on Washington at all

because they bring back so many of those guys in secondary. And, you know, it looks like they may have some depth at receiver after being worried about the loss that Browning's had to the NFL the last couple years. But when I look at the Pac-12, the two things that jumped out to me, Washington fans can be sitting there going, oh, a million things went wrong.

Well, Auburn's probably thinking in the first half they should have had 27 points themselves. Oh, of course. That's one of those games where it just depends on who you're rooting for. You can talk yourself into how you got screwed. And by the way, Washington, Washington in the red zone, the reason they failed because Auburn's defensive line overwhelmed Browning in their offensive line. It's not like, you know, Washington was sitting back there with time and just fumbled the Auburn. Auburn's athletes overpowered Washington up front in the red zone and Browning,

you know, hyperventilated and made a mistake. So, you know, it's not like it was just magic. I mean, Auburn's power created a huge turnover. I do want to follow up a little bit, though, before I jump to like just Pac-12 stuff. I do think it's sometimes annoying when I hear schools like I always felt like whenever I met somebody on the road that worked for a school, it was a little bit like when I went to Greece, I read that book boomerang by Michael Lewis and every chapter he talked about a financial disaster and every chapter is amazing. And there's one chapter on Greece where basically they just felt culturally like they didn't feel like paying taxes. Just like, like, we're just not super into this.

And it was super corrupt. And then people that would come and hunt you down for your taxes, you just bribe them and then you were good. So when I went to Greece, I'd always ask everybody, I'd be like, Hey, you know, what's up with you guys not paying your taxes? And every guy I met was the one guy in Greece that paid his taxes. No one else did, but he was the one guy. And I've always felt that way when I've talked to certain, you know, college football people over the years that they're the school

that's not cheating but then they tell me about everybody else. So people listening to this are going to be like, what do you mean about Alabama? Because the Ole Miss fans are so mad about

all the accusations because I think they landed in that one class and it was Laquan Treadwell, it was the tackles, it was Kim Dietschy. They had five number one guys at a position.

And then Ole Miss fans are like, so wait a minute, we can't cheat, but everybody's going to call us out. Like, wait a minute, what are the rules down here? And that's why they always felt like it was a little bit worse. But then again, Hugh gets caught with doing all the stuff that's happened and it was going on forever. The Tunsil one I almost felt bad about after the fact,

because I think Tunsil, the tackle, got mixed up with with some people and the school and the staff were actually trying to help him out a little bit. Um, but yeah, I mean, never, that's the one thing is like, whenever somebody gets busted, cheated, cheating, I never got really worked up or called anybody out about it because, you know, I can't imagine being a fan going on message boards, being like, you guys cheat when it's like, dude, I don't know. I think business is done a certain way especially with a lot of the college programs well it's like it's like tax evasion it may be one thing if if i mean we have companies in america like respected companies that are doing things on islands you know in the caribbean uh and saving 11 like apple you know you hear these stories about, well, they moved some things

and they saved $14 billion in taxes. So whenever I hear like an individual, like, you know, Pete Rose didn't pay taxes, I'm like, listen, it's just levels of, you know, it's levels of illusion. Evasiveness, yeah, right, right. Yeah, I mean, it's like, okay, there's countries, there's cities,

different tax levels. There's a lot of things I just don't think, just don't get that worked up about in college football. By the way, when are we going to talk Texas football? I was thinking about this. Go. Just go. Okay. So you know how, like, certain times there are brands that are, like, overvalued? Texas went from the mid-'s to the late 90s.

And they were not a top 10 program in the final poll. But if I say a Texas football, the cool helmet, you know, the uni, NFL guys, can we just all acknowledge? It's like Elon Musk, that company, SpaceX. It's like, oh, it's worth 10 billion. I'm like, they had a crash two years ago or three years ago. He's crazy. They have small margins to begin with.

It's the rocket business, okay? Isn't it the battery business? I thought it was the battery business. That's at least what I bought on the day. It's right around the corner from my house, and it's got like 10 stories on it. And I'm like, I think their valuation's a little high. He's crazy. They had a rocket blow up, cost them 300 million. And it's like, it's not a big profit margin business. The brand is Elon Musk brand is better than his business. And I'm like,

Texas football, maybe it's because Austin is so cool that it's not like life or death. Like when you go to Oklahoma and Norman, if you don't win in football, it ruins your week. If you don't win at Austin, it's like, well, Sixth Street's jamming tonight. Let's get some good food and listen to music. Like I feel like Texas football is just not as important as it is in Lincoln or Norman or Auburn. Like I watched them this weekend, and I'm like, I just don't feel it.

Even their stadium, when you go and it's beautiful, it's not, it doesn't feel like the horseshoe. It doesn't, it doesn't feel like a touchdown Jesus. It just doesn't. And I watched Maryland again, cut through them for the second year in a row. And I'm like, when are we just going to come to the conclusion that Texas football, not a, it's not a top 10 program?

It's not. It just feels so weird, and I'm not ready to dispute you because I buy into the coolness. I've been down there a couple times. I love it. I love it. Like, I couldn't imagine being Colt McCoy, okay? Your name is Colt McCoy, first of all. You grow up baling hay on a farm. Your dad's

your high school coach. You get to, I don't even know if the hay part's true, but I'm just, just work with me here. And, um, he sounds like a gun manufacturer. Colt McCoy is a company, right? But Colt McCoy also moved out to like Pasadena in the late fifties. And then he got on the show gun will travel and he got like re-signed and he was like a huge deal and they wrote a book about him and it's on netflix right like colt mccoy is a superhero and then to be the texas longhorns quarterback like that's still it feels it feels like it should be more than what you're saying despite the fact that there's gaps with them that maybe other programs like we look at their them being a tier one thing.

We look at the revenue. They bring in any, they bring in, I believe the athletic department brings in the most revenue of any program in the country. So like, I'm just like, do you think if, if Texas, if it were the Texas Longhorns and it was just reverse and they were located in Norman, they would have a better program because I've been to Norman too. And it's not awesome. I think, no, I mean, I, I really believe this. I always said one of the advantages to Norman, too, and it's not awesome. No, I mean, I really believe this.

I always said one of the advantages to my former employer, there's nothing to do in Bristol. So you stay an extra hour and a half and get work done? Because what are you going to do? I mean, it's Connecticut. Like in Los Angeles, it's 415. Well, there's a lot of stuff to do there, pal. There's a library in West Hartford.

Trevor's a great restaurant. You know, I just, well, go ahead. But I think that's something in America, like where you're located matters. And I,

if you start looking at the really great college town, Athens, Georgia, Austin, Texas, Los Angeles, California, um,

Madison, Wisconsin, Ann Arbor, Michigan, like football's big, but these are great places to live. And it's not like you're not as desperate. It doesn't ruin your life.

And what is that, you know, how does that manifest itself? Well, you work quite as hard. You put in the extra hour a day. Is there that fear, that urgency? I mean, you get those fan bases drive a lot of the passion. I'm out in L.A. You live in the same neighborhood I mean, you get those fan bases drive a lot of the passion. I'm out in L.A. You live in the same neighborhood I do. Okay? It's like, oh, USC lost.

Well, we got the Dodgers, Rams, Lakers, Clippers, Kings, two soccer teams, Mountains, Beach. There isn't a ton of urgency. People are pissed for about an hour after they lose, and then they move on to the next thing. And, you know,

you can talk recruiting in Tuscaloosa 12 months out of the year. You can't talk about that stuff outside of one day at USC on the radio here. So, I mean, I don't know. I just, I think it does matter. I think Austin's almost too great of a town to create this sense of absolute urgency within the program. And it kind of feels, it always kind of feels casual. It is a different experience at the stadium. I've been there twice. I'm actually going fairly soon here in a week and a half for the USC game.

I hadn't been to Austin in a while. I wanted to see Herman, and I wanted to watch him play. I know everybody can make a ton of jokes after another Maryland loss, but I do – look, Austin's great. Everybody knows that, but I do like that Texas thing. I think there's a similarity there too, though, with Michigan, because when Michigan looks in the mirror and I remember doing this segment on the radio years ago and it was, it was good. It was, let's look at college football programs. And when they look in the mirror, who do they

think they are and who are they actually? And I feel like Michigan looks in the mirror and they they see ohio state they see usc and they see oklahoma or alabama or whatever and you know you could make an argument the michigan brand is probably maybe even more overrated than the texas one and i don't want to make this just because texas lost to maryland and harbaugh because you and i are big harbaugh guys and fighting this fight now where everybody seems to be completely out on him as if he's this terrible coach without an amazing resume. So this isn't an anti-Harbaugh, anti-Michigan thing, but if you're really talking about those select few programs, there's more groups that think they're in that or deserving of that recognition without nearly, like not even close enough of the same resume.

Well, I mean, think about Michigan. Last 20 times they've played Ohio State. I don't have it in front. How many times have they beaten them? So I went through it because I have this big Harbaugh thing I'm going to do that's planned. I spent way too much time on it, but they've beaten them once. Michigan's beaten Ohio State once since 2003, and that was in the disastrous Luke Fickle season when they went seven and six. So that one doesn't, that doesn't even really count. So like for people, and I don't know if it's Michigan people, but it feels more like the media that just sick of Harbaugh,

because you know, if you're going to announce yourself with his kind of presence, then you have to back it up. You better be like quiet and unsuccessful than to be loud and unsuccessful. Right. And when people are like, oh, he's not beating Ohio state.

And I understand too, it's like, oh, he's not doing Michigan. You guys don't beat Ohio state. No matter who's the coach, you don't beat them. I mean, that's, it's like, oh, he's not doing it again in Michigan. You guys don't beat Ohio State no matter who's the coach. You don't beat them. I mean, that's a joke.

The only time you've beaten them since 2003 is the 7-6 Luke Fickle year. That was way worse than I thought it was when I looked it up. Yes. And again, Ann Arbor, Austin, lots to do, progressive campuses. I don't know. I'm not making excuses for it, but I just do. I do think sometimes a brand is bigger than reality. And I think, you know, I think Michigan and Texas are great programs, but I kind of feel like five teams have separated from the country in college football, Bama, Clemson, Oklahoma. I talked to Lane Kiffin yesterday.

He's like, let me tell you something. They are unbelievable everywhere. Did you ask Lane about that Fox feature on him where the camera shot was like, can you get both my zits and my double chin and just a general bloatedness? Can you have the camera be underneath me so I just look as bad as I possibly can? That was a bad – I felt bad for your guy on that pregame with our man Feldman. Yeah, no, he – it lames out. It was a great day. In fact, he texted me today, and he's like,

people don't know what they're doing if they just don't get how good Oklahoma is. But I kind of feel like Bama, Clemson, Georgia, Oklahoma, and maybe every other year Ohio State, kind of feel like they've separated from everybody else. And Auburn's still great and can beat Bama, but Auburn always ends up with three losses. And LSU can beat Auburn, but they all end up with three losses. I kind of feel like college football, there's five empiricals,

one Northern, you know, Oklahoma, and, you know, Clemson and a couple of SEC teams. And then there's about 12 teams beneath that. Auburn, Washington, you know, Wisconsin, certainly capable of winning a big game. Penn State. But I don't feel like they can go toe-to-toe to toe-to-toe, weekend-to-weekend-to-weekend-to-weekend

and go 3-0 against great teams. I mean, I kind of feel like we're in two tiers in college football. I mean, those are the top two tiers, and there's obviously a bunch of junk below it. Yeah, I think you're going to put Ohio State there. I think we're being a little bit too... I think I do, yeah.

Yeah, Ohio State has to be in that group with Clemson. By the way, their quarterback, their quarterback... Haskins, yeah. He's good. Yeah, he's good. Like, I had an NFL guy this morning text me, like, hey, this guy can play. Like, Urban's had a lot of these. JT Bar this morning text me, like, hey, this guy can play. Like, Urban's had a lot of these.

JT Barrett, you know, you kind of love him for a weekend. Then they're like, yeah, they're not going to really play at the next level. That kid at Ohio State, like, that's the kind of kid that can win a national title at Ohio State or two. He's special. That's actually something we were texting about

this weekend, because if you think of how many teams that just said, you know what, screw it. We're giving it to the true freshmen. Like this is happening at a rapid pace. I feel like it's – I know. There's been true freshmen here or there. But like it was a big deal.

I went through it. I came together with like a list of like 15 guys at major programs that just go, you know what, fine. And we're even seeing it where somebody may not even last the half. They just go, you know what. I know with UCLA and Chip, Spate got hurt. But when you watch Dorian, the freshman, you just go, you know, this actually looks a little bit more like a Chip thing. Actually, I'm not even going to couch it. It looks way more like a Chip thing than Wilton Spate running Chip Kelly's offense.

And look, they lose to Cincinnati. Cincinnati even made a change. Their quarterback thing. But you have two of the probably, like if you had to do one tier i mean dabbo's got clemson up and running to a point where i almost want to include him with urban and nick but i'm just not going to do that because he doesn't have the resume that those guys have okay so right if i put nick and urban in this in this tier by themselves which i think is totally fair here's urban who doesn't play haskins last year where i know i got annoyed with all the ohio state recruits

saying bench jt barrett when jt had done what he'd done for the program. But he just wasn't throwing a good deep ball. It was going on for two freaking years. It wasn't happening. And yet Urban stayed with JT because he trusted him. And Nick, and we've watched Tua now at the end of the national championship game in week one. And we've seen who Jalen is. And despite the one loss record, like that's not a Jalen Hurts one loss record.

That's an Alabama one loss record, and it's great he played in two national championships, and it's weird that a guy like that would get benched, but we saw some limitations with his read and progressions through an offense. And so here are the two best coaches, and they seem the most reluctant to make the change to the talent that looks exceedingly better than the guy that they trusted more, which I think is really odd because we're talking about the two best guys in a game now that doesn't care and has no patience and just goes with the young guy.

And I also think, Ryan, what's happened, we've had a cultural change. All these high school kids, JT Daniels at USC this weekend. I'm sorry, but he looks like a junior. I mean, he just doesn't, you know, I mean, I think the kids are just more prepared and that's just the reality of there's money in this elite 11 quarterback stuff. And it's just, it's a, it's a cottage industry. So I just think, I think most of these kids come in and it's getting bigger every year. And I, I was like, you, I watched this weekend and I'm like, man, there are a lot

of good freshman college quarterbacks. I mean, a USC kid, he throws a better deep ball already than Sam Darnold. Now, he's not Darnold,

but in terms of throwing the ball down the field, I'm like, oh my God, he's got a hose. He's accurate. He's poised. He doesn't even look

like a freshman. It's like, what? So I think it's just we have a cultural change. It's happening. It's almost like, it's almost like if you look at the culinary business, I have my stepson in the chef.

And because we've had this 10- to 15-year explosion of these cooking shows, it's been an educational process where kids now at 22, if they're serious about it, you get really good chefs at a really young age that you didn't get 30 years ago. You had to be the late Anthony Bourdain where you really went through this 20-year in the kitchen, the grind. Kid, there's more books. There's more quality equipment.

There's more TV shows. There's more instruction. There's better academies. You get kids now at 22, 23, and if they're really embedded in this thing, they're great. They're fantastic. And so I just think we've had a cultural change. There's too much money in quarterback. The Elite 11 camps, you know, it doesn't even matter the state.

Like every Texas, Florida, Georgia, California, Arizona, the quarterbacks are everywhere. Same thing with fighting. UFC is more popular, more kids end up fighting, and then I go on Instagram and some kid's getting into a brawl at a Senior Frogs and the next thing you know, a dude knocks out another dude with a switch kick and you just go, you know, you can't, you can't be getting into fights anymore now because you're going to mean dudes, all sorts of dudes are getting into this stuff. Uh, that was good, but you know, I want to talk

about, uh, and it's, it's not really, I don't know. I don't think you do a ton of the media stuff. Um, and I, I've always, look, I get asked about you all the time. Um, I think we are friends now at this point. Uh, I don't know that we were ever not friends. You just, I'm a weird guy to get along with probably. Cause I'm, I'm Northeast and I'm very, very difficult. Um, and you know, I look, I got to work next to you and alongside the whole time. So give me, give me the thing that you would most want to tell everybody about you and your business that maybe you've just never said before something about it that you go, I wish everybody understood this, or this bothers me, or people should know this about me. Well, I think I used to have more of those earlier in my life.

I get frustrated by fans. But, you know, I think as I've gotten older, I just have come to terms with it. It's like even the social media. It would be very easy to read social media and be like, oh, these people are terrible. They're crushing me. But I actually look at social media like my friend. I'll give you an example. My audience needs to win sometimes because I'm sitting up here on a podium barking at the moon, right? So I win all the time. But Twitter allows people to come in, rip me. I don't respond to it. But when they go to Twitter and rip me,

and then they go and have a beer with their buddy, they feel like they beat me. I get into the carriage, grill, I crushed him. Doesn't matter that I don't read it. My audience feels like they win. And that's why I've always said, have super strong opinions as long as you believe them. Because if you're wrong, that's not the worst thing in the world. What's bad is indifferent. So, you know, to be honest with you, it's that my career is like, you know, whatever arc it's at now. I've kind of come to terms with what the business is. I don't let the crappy stuff eat me up. I don't let the frustrations affect my content. And I even think the criticism's really healthy. It's not like I've never read a critic and thought, I think it's a pretty good point. It's not like I've never read a critic and thought, you make a pretty good point. So I feel like I'm at a good place with the business where I like it.

I like helping people. You know, I like, like, it really, it matters to me. I like helping you or Doug Gottlieb or Nick Wright or, you know, whoever. And I'm not, listen, I'm not, it's not like I'm, you know, Robin Hood and, you know, people are following. I'm just saying I just feel comfortable where I'm at. And that has led me to be a better teammate. I mean, I'm always like, you know, I don't want to get too much of this on the air.

But, you know, you and I have kept in contact. I get real happiness out of the business and success. real happiness out of the business and success. And I don't want to be one of these guys like that's 80 miserable barking, you know, at people and not helping people. So I don't have, I don't have a ton of frustrations. I do think the media, the people that do are,

you know, like the critic media critic, what do you call media critics? Yeah. Because you admit like a lot of them haven't been good to you. Right? Like, a lot of them don't, like, I would say more, like, like media critics have, have liked me, and they, they, they bashed you, and you're more successful. Well, I think sometimes they're disingenuous, but even then, like, even with the disingenuous critic, and there's plenty of them out there, I understand what they're doing.

Like, people don't like power. You know, they don't like authoritative. And so once you get more powerful, like people used to, you know, Rick Riley. Rick Riley was the 11th time sports writer of the year. Rick Riley is the best sports writer outside of Jim Murray, arguably in the country's history. And guys covering the Arizona Red Dogs of a central hockey league are on message boards crushing him. He's a target. Even when you become

a target, it's actually a compliment. It's like, listen, stuff I say matters. It gets feedback. I don't know. I think I'm in a good place. I think you're in a good place. When I listen to you, you seem happy. You do your homework. You found your groove. I think it took me until I was early 30s to kind of find who I was.

But I like where I'm at. I'm comfortable with being disliked. Did you feel this way, though, when you were at ESPN? Like, did you feel the way you feel now? I did near the end. I think I did near the end. I think I'd never been syndicated. So I went from local to national.

In the first five years, it was like, who are these people? But then I came to the realization, I'm like, well, Jesus. I mean, it's almost not even a badge of honor. It comes with the territory. The more prominent, the more I always kind of felt like I would say stuff, and a coward believes this coach is bad. How can he say it? They're kind of saying your words matter.

Your broadcast matters. So, I don't know. I think my last four or five years, I was at a good place. I had good friends there. I don't look at my ESPN term negatively. It's like I don't. I have friends, and I've tried to help people, and gotten calls from a lot of people that are interested in, you know, moving on.

And so, you know, but I do think, Ryan, I think everybody's career goes in stages. I mean, look at your career. You're more confident now. You're being offered jobs. And you're like, I mean, both you and I are, we've been given opportunities, and we've said no in the last five years to great opportunities. That's a great place to be. Like, I know some of the opportunities that you would not talk about on the air that you've been offered.

And you've said, no, I'm going to pass on that. And it's the kind of money and opportunity that people would go, are you crazy? But you're comfortable enough in your talent, in your options, that you're only going to do what works for you. enough in your talent, in your options, that you're only going to do what works for you. And I think very few, if broadcasters get to that space and you're in it, and I feel like I am, you won. Like you won because a lot of broadcasters can never say no, will take any job, will do any, you know, assignment. And I'm past that. And I think you are too. Speaking of money, do you think the gap in our ability is commensurate with the gap in our current salaries?

Clearly. I am really special. Yeah. Money is such a weird thing. Like, you know, like I'm not a big spender, you know, like I just bought a surfboard and I really sweat. Wait a minute. Wait a minute.

We just were talking about this. I told you I took a lesson and I loved it. And you said you needed a hobby because you're not doing TV now, which is an awesome move out of you. You, you end up, you find a way to get paid more and more for doing less, more than anybody I've ever worked with. And I, we, we have meetings about you and say, what did he do now? We have to figure out how to do this. How does he hypnotize these people? But does that mean you're going to try to surf? Well, I body surf and I've tried surfing. I bought a board.

And so I kind of believe, like, it's always been, well, it's always been easier for me not to do things. Like if somebody said, don't eat cake, I'd be like, all right, no more cake. It's much harder to say, all right, run for the next nine straight days. I'd be like, that's a commitment. I'm a good, okay, I'll just shut this off. Like I got like about three years ago, like this nutritionist lady's like, you can't eat yogurt. I'm like, I love yogurt. She says, yeah, it's really bad for your stomach.

And I'm like, all right, I haven't eaten yogurt since. And I love yogurt. But to do things, I can get lazy. So if I buy a board, it will motivate me to do something because I'm frugal enough where I'm like, geez, I paid blankety blank for a board. I got to go surf. How big is the board?

I'm looking at it right now, rainbow colors. What does that mean? Bigger than me. Yeah, I mean, it's pretty Santa Cruz. It looks like a board would look if you were a good surfer. So I'm just worried because if you did something that's a little too small, it can be really, really tough. But then again, the cool part is when you get it down to a little bit smaller,

you'll be fine. You're an athletic guy. You still stay in shape. You ski, right? You ski all the tough. Oh, I love to ski. Right. So love to ski. It's my, it's my, if I, if that's my, everybody's got a hobby. You're, you lift a lot. You're very, uh, you're a lifter. Yeah. Yeah. I, I like skiing. That's my thing. Yeah. I don't even know. It's my person. Yeah. I'm not even sure why I do it anymore, but it's too late now. Do you think... I'm a loner, so it works for me. Skiing is great because I can put in the earbuds or go with my son.

I like jogging. Jogging and skiing. And surfing. I'm not a big... I like to kind of be in my own thoughts, so those sports work for me. Tennis can drive you crazy because you'll be by yourself, even though you're playing against somebody else. Yeah, I have to rely on somebody else hitting it back. That's why I've never had

a partner in radio. I don't want to rely on somebody having to hit it back. What about free climbing? Because a lot of people are scared of that. Oh, no. No.

No? Just chalk up the hands and some Daisy Dukes and get out there? No, I'm not really a climber. I'm not interested. In fact, two nights ago, a light came down uh in our backyard and i'm like not really interested gonna call somebody to come over and fix it it's like nine feet in the air not that interested was that the earthquake we had

yeah you know i've slept through three uh heard a couple days ago we had a 2.6 we did not feel it listen i didn't feel the cocktail if the ice Did not feel it. Listen. I didn't feel it either. When I'm having a cocktail, if the ice doesn't move, there was no earthquake. Ice didn't move. Okay, you said that's why you're solo. And I've said all along that I think solo radio is the hardest thing to do. And you anchored. You were a news anchor.

You've done that stuff. Yeah. Nothing is harder than solo. And for me, it was always frustrating because I felt like, all right, I'm solo a week. I'm not solo for two months. I'm solo for a week. And it's just like, I'm never going to figure this out the way I needed to. And I would agree with you that once you kind of get to a kind of fuck it stage in your life where you go, Hey, I'm good. And you know what? I'm just going to be good at this now. And that's, that's what I think you have to do to really become great

in radio. If you had to have a partner though, if you had to have a partner, though, if you had to have a partner, who do you think would actually be able to work with you? And by the way, I know it's not me, so we don't even have to pretend like you're being nice. Well, you know what I think I would do? I think I tend to be, and again, I'm self-analyzing, so stop me if this gets, I think I tend to be pragmatic. Okay. So I would need to work with somebody who isn't. So I would need to work with somebody who is very much a character, a little off, and then I could bring them back down. So for me, the dance partner would have to be somebody that fills in spaces I'm not, and I could bring them back down.

And I, you know, like Chris Russo, sometimes I'll listen to Chris Rus not, and I could bring him back down. And I, you know, like Chris Russo, sometimes I, you know, I'll listen to Chris Russo and I'm just laughing. And he just talks himself up to the ledge constantly. And I think it's really talent. He's a really talented guy. That would be funny because I would be more pragmatic and he would be crazy. So you're not, you're too pragmatic. You're, you're data driven like me. So you would need a crazy person. And I, that's what works in radio. You need the-driven like me, so you would need a crazy person. And that's what works in radio. You need the yin to the yang. And so somebody that was just a little goofy, a little crazy, a little out there, easy laugh, not too intense.

I mean, I don't take this stuff that seriously. I mean, I take my job seriously, but I don't want to get worn down by, like, you know,a just takes himself so seriously that you got to be able to laugh at yourself. So I think those kinds of people I could work with, but I, you know, I think at this point I just do what I do. And if you like it, great. I probably won't be a tandem guy. Okay. Top three hacks in the business. Go, you go first. No, I'm just kidding. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. Nobody wins with that. By the way, it's your buddy, your buddy, uh,

talking about people in our business. Uh, your buddy's birthday today. Van Pelt? Yeah. It's his birthday. Yeah. Uh,

he's had a successful run. Three years on the show. Yeah. No, I know. I'll send him a text. Yeah. I checked.

I DM'd him the other day to say something to him. He does a great job. People are like, how come that sports center works and the others don't? I don't know. Maybe he's good. This idea that if I run a sport... It's so funny. People are the reason you watch. MSNBC, all the sets look the same, but I watched Maddox.

I think he's smarter, you know, on, you know, you go to these networks. I've never once in my life watched the show. Cause I was like, you know,

I really liked the set. It's all overrated. Do I like the person? So it's like, you know, they're trying to figure out how do we make all the other sports centers work like that one? I don't know.

Clone Scott Van Pelt. That would help. help so it's like whenever i hear executives like the one espn spent like eight billion dollars on a new stat remember that thing yeah i mean it's like the digital center it's gorgeous it's freezing you know and it's it's it's massive it yeah but it's like all right well who's in it because Because that's going to be who I watch. You know, for years when I was there, I used to watch the guys in the morning. My schedule was different. Dan Verrett and Neil. I watched them because their chemistry was great.

That's why I watched them, not because the set was impressive. So, you know, Van Pelt's one of those guys. He's a real talented guy. That's why I watch. I do like, I know I said I was going to let you go, so you just tell me when you've got to go. I'm, you got kids, you got stuff going on, but I do want to ask you about this. Cause I have kind of a long form. Um, and it's not about politics. It's about politics and sports. Cause you know, when you started, you were there a few

years before me, but you know, look, there's, there's only so many guys can kind of talk to each other about this business that did it for, you know, you're on a couple of decades. I'm a decade and a half. I don't, you know, I don't want to cut you short here or anything. So if I screw up the resume, just correct me. But you know, there's just like one of the reasons I think you and I have become friendly. It's just not a lot of people you can talk to about this that, that get it in our own, you know, narcissistic ways. Then also our own insecurities at times. Cause you kind of, you can have like a combination of a lot of things going on. It doesn't make us bad people at all. I think a lot of times we're compassionate people because this is really hard. Um, and it's, it's not the hardest thing in the

world, but it, it, you know, I'm trying to give these qualifiers here, but the job changed so much in the last few years that I was like, man, this is really not, you know, I was bartending 15 years ago going, man, I'd love to get into sports. It wasn't like, man, I can't wait to talk about Kaepernick for another season. And I'm really surprised at how, and I'm not surprised at how many people I work with that are, that are liberal leaning. Um, and a lot of that's background. A lot of the stuff, if I were different, it came from a different area or look different. I I'd probably be more liberal than I am now. I think I'm pretty moderate, but I am surprised at how often that everybody seems to be in a rush now where when you would do a segment on race, it stood out and it was good because

you're smart, but because you didn't do it that often. And now when everybody's doing it all the time, I think there's a little of like, Hey, I can really stand out by having this great segment on some social issue. When I think the guy in his car, like, I think we've, I feel like the industry is doing a bad job of remembering, you know, even if you agree or disagree with the guy in the car listening, you got to remember that he's still there and he still wants to turn you on. He still wants to hear if Andrew Luck's going to be ready to go week one. Yeah. I always tell my staff is that sports is the interstate.

If you're going to take an off ramp or an exit, get right back on. You're never as smart or as funny or as interesting as you think. So I used to be more political. And then I came to Fox, Trump became president, and I said to my staff, I'm going to do no politics

because now everybody is in politics. So I said, what's the value to the audience? We're so divided. We're in no longer the information era. We're all in the affirmation era. Nobody's interested in data. I could literally go out and give you data, and it wouldn't matter. You voted for who you like. You hate the other side. So once affirmation takes over and information is less consequential to a lot of people, I'm moving off politics. So when I hear radio hosts move into politics a lot, what it's telling me is,

you're not really interested in sports. Like, I still love sports. So it's easy for me to come in and talk about sports for three hours. There are hosts out there that, it's like catnip. I saw the Kaepernick story, I'm like, oh, good God, that host will be on sports for three hours. There are hosts out there that, it's like catnip. I saw the Kaepernick story, I'm like, oh, good God,

that host will be on it for four hours. They're not really into sports. Well, listen, I'm not saying you can't talk politics, but I've never turned to Chuck Todd for football picks. He's biased anyway. He constantly complains about the refs. I followed him and I was out.

And it's not even personal, Chuck, but I followed him for a little while. I was like, you're just going to bitch about the Hurricanes calls the whole time? Like, hey, maybe it's your squad. Maybe your squad's not disciplined. He's a man for the Canes, Homer. No, but it's like, I've never turned to Chuck Todd for sports, although I think it's cool. He likes it. I just think the market's been oversaturated with too much politics. And so I've gone the other way. You know, I used to be a, you know, Van Pelt was one of the people that was in the gambling. And so was I, when I came to ESPN, I told them during the interview, like 15 years ago, I said, listen, I taught gambling. And if you don't like me,

don't hire me. They're like, oh, no, that's good. But then DraftKings came out. I got seven ads I'm reading about DraftKings. And I stopped giving college football picks. And I'm like, I don't want to be a gambling show. Everybody now is doing gambling. Now the Supreme Court has ruled it legal. Everybody will be doing gambling. So I'm less inclined to do gambling now. So I'm always kind of, when I look at this business, if you want to stand out, now. So I'm always kind of, when I look at this business, if you want to stand out, don't follow lead. I mean, I'm getting at business 101. And so I just think politics now, everybody thinks they're an expert. I don't think, and I'm just over it. I, when I turn on, it's, you know, it's funny now I turn on a show today and they weren't talking Kaepernick. And I was like, oh, this is so unique. This is so refreshing. Everybody was talking Kaepernick. I just wonder sometimes the people love sports.

It's so I could talk NFL for three hours for the next six months and never go off it. There's so many stories if you love something. So when I hear somebody not talking about it and it becomes catnip, I can literally drive to work and say that host will be on that story all day. And I'm not interested. I feel the audience has told me what they want me to talk about. My numbers are up 35% this year, 49% last year, and I'm not talking politics. So clearly they want to hear my sports takes. I still do too.

want to hear my sports takes. I still do too. And, uh, I'm, I do, I do feel, uh, really cool about, you know, getting to know you over the years. And even though I think we do the job differently and like, you know what I mean? Like there's times where I'm in the car, I'm like, what the hell is he talking about? But then I would be able to go into the hallway and be like, what are you nuts? And I kind of envied your ability to go, ah, who cares, man, whatever next segment, let's go. And I would just be like, yeah, you know what? So, uh, anyway, I could have done this. Your dad, you told me your dad liked me on the air one time. Yeah, that was the worst. I shouldn't have done that. Huh? Cause cause my dad's like, no, what did your dad tell the audience with audience? But your dad said, I think it had to be something about you that you will. You remind me.

Cause I think I know what it was. It was almost having that closer mentality of like, who cares? Let's just move on. What was it? Was it something like that? No, you came to me.

You said, you know, my dad said to me the other day, I call him coward. A good storyteller. I was like, props to Mr. Ruffalo.

That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. You forgot it. I didn't forget it. I forgot it. No, he also liked because I would explain, you know, and I spent a lot of time, as you know, I get frustrated about things.

He's like, oh, you think Cowherd's as frustrated as you are about this? I said, well, you know, Cowherd's in a slightly different tier right now. I think things are going a little bit better for him. He'd be like, alright. So he's like, yeah, but he wouldn't worry about it the way you were worrying about it. I'm like, alright, you got me and there'd be no counter to it. My dad's a fan.

Hey, let's do this again sometime if you want. I won't keep you as long. I could talk about all this stuff forever, but the cool thing is I can call you up and we can see if we're right about Harbaugh in a couple weeks. Yeah, and let's go have a beer. Sounds good, man. Colin Cowherd, Fox Sports. We'll check in with him from time to time, and now

we have to figure out if he learns how to surf, because that's amazing. He literally is taking serving lessons because we had a couple vodka sodas at a steakhouse two or three weeks ago, and I said, yeah, I took a lesson. It was great. Just check it out. He's like, really? I think I'm going to do it, and he did it. Okay, check it out, though. SeatGeek. There are guys. Getting tickets

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I just love it. I love talking about it. I don't know why, but I just do. And I think it's fun to kind of be like, oh, that guy, that guy's in the league. Or who the hell is that guy? I'm a sports person professionally. I should know who he is. Well, you know, hate to break it to you folks, but not every one of your friendly

neighborhood sports guys knows as much as you think they may know. But I went through this stat my man Field Yates at ESPN had where he said week one starters in the NFL, 15 of 32 teams have a new quarterback from their week one starter in 2017. I thought that's insane. Now, granted, things are impatient. We're impatient with coaches. We're impatient with each other. Probably how many TV series have you at least watched? What? Episode two, like if you didn't like the pilot, you go, you know, I'm going to stick with this and give it another shot. Of course you don't. I remember DJ AM. Everybody was like, man, this guy's amazing. All he did was, well, he was good. I'm not saying he wasn't great. So I don't want DJs. I don't want the DJ community to come after me for this, this, uh, this opinion.

But the point is, is that like a lot of that stuff was just, Hey, I'm going to play stuff a lot shorter. And then you go out now you're lucky to get 60 seconds of the song that you want to hear and it works and it's cool, but it's, uh, I think another sign of sign of our general impatience in life. And I thought, is this this thing that I've always been thinking about? Because whenever I hear, oh, there's just not enough quarterbacks to go around. Well, you can't say it every year, because then if that's what you're saying all the time, then that means that that's just what it is. And then you have to accept it, that this is not actually some quarterback dip in the quarterback stock market. And for the most part, I actually think the quarterback thing has been a little stronger than people present it.

But then they'll say, well, there's no backups. Well, if you go through the 15 teams that have new quarterbacks from week one of last year, I did it. I went through it all this morning, and I was able to do it. So if I make a mistake here, I did it from memory. But Philly is because of the injury to Wentz, so that's not really a change. Cleveland is a change because of Tyrod. Colts is a change. Well, it's because Luck is back from injury. San Francisco's Jimmy Garoppolo, but that was because of a trade in the season, so I think that might be a little bit different

than just moving on from C.J. Beathard. Minnesota is a change. Keenum to Cousins. Houston, Watson, remember Savage was ahead of him last year, and I know people crush Bill O'Brien for that. Like, how could you ever? Well, I think that happens a lot, man. I just think it happens a lot with a young QB. You're like, let's see what happens when he's actually out there. And you go, okay, you're right. You know what? There's no reason to not play Watson. He's back from the injury.

Fitzpatrick is playing for Tampa, but that's because Winston suspended three games. Buffalo, Peterman. You guys saw those posters. You're hyped, too. Don't hide it. Mahomes is a change. Denver is a change by necessity because Keenan was available. Washington is a change with hide it. Mahomes is a change. Denver's a change by necessity because Keenan was available. Washington is a change with Alex Smith. Bradford is at Arizona.

Mitch Trubisky, because he didn't start week one, is Chicago's guy. Darnold with the Jets. And Miami is Tannehill because it was Cutler last year. So yeah, about half of them are real culture changes and all that, but it's a little different when you read it and you go half of the league has a different quarterback week one than they had just one year ago. That seems like an insane number. It is, but it's, I don't know, maybe it's misleading. Yeah, I think it's misleading. All right. I said it. I think it's a little misleading. So screw field Yates. No, I'm just kidding. All right. So backup quarterbacks, because the ESPN depth charts were, the depth chart stuff is always a little nervous. It makes me nervous

because I went back and I looked at it and I pulled up, I pulled up the depth charts this morning that were, that were updated as of the taping this podcast. So I think I'm going to have this right. But whenever I look at backup quarterbacks and you go, wait a minute, there's kind of like three tiers. Maybe there's four tiers. There's the tier of guys who have done it somewhere and have played, have been a starter, and they may actually not be any good, but they're just, they get to be backups for a really long time because they started a bunch of games. Matt Schaub's in that group. Matt Castle's in that group. Chad Henney's in that group. Then there's the group that's, well, we don't know if this guy sucks because he hasn't actually played. You's the guy in the meme just tapping to his noggin going, see? And if you think of those quarterbacks, it's just that guy's never played, but he's who I'll never understand that one for the life of me. It's like 25, 30 million in guaranteed money.

And we have no idea if he can actually play. And there's nothing funnier than last year than when the JEP chart came out and it was Bradford, Daniels, and Wentz. That's two years ago, excuse me. Bradford with the Eagles, Wentz. The Bradford, the Eagles had spent all of this money on all of these quarterbacks

and then still traded up for Wentz, right? And then they traded Bradford and it was like, hey, Chase, sorry, but you actually weren't really the backup. Wentz is, and now he's going to be the starter. And now Chase is the backup for the Bears. That's right. That's right. Okay. So I've gone through every team here, and this is the rankings in one of the football previews where they ranked the depth of the quarterback position overall from 1 to 32. New Orleans was number one with Breeze and Bridgewater. And Bridgewater now, I think he was inducted into the Hall of Fame this preseason. I'm not.

Somebody, research may have to check on that. But I think Bridgewater is actually one of the only active members while still playing because of how well he played in the preseason. Philadelphia, it's Foles behind Wentz and then Sutfield, who I think they got Sutfield because he just looks in body type similar to the other two guys. Brian Hoyer, so New England was ranked third, and granted, New England's ranked third because it's Brady, but then it's Hoyer. Hoyer seems to be the guy that everybody really likes until he has to play. Green Bay, they got rid of

Brett Hundley. We'll get to him a little bit later. So they're four and that's with Kaiser. And I imagine Kaiser's the kind of guy where they're like, that Browns thing was a disaster. We liked him out of Notre Dame and we're Green Bay and we're pretty good with backup quarterbacks. So we're going to go ahead and do that. And hell, we got Matt Flynn paid a ton. Remember when you guys thought Matt Flynn was going to be the starter of Russell Wilson? Boom. Five, Matt Schaub. Yeah, that Matt Schaub. He's had two starts in four years. So that's kind of that category of like, man, didn't he almost win the MVP with the Falcons in 87?

Nope, it wasn't that long ago. But Matt Schaub's the backup there. Seattle, Russell Wilson plays all the time. Brett Hundley, though. I feel like Hundley's this dude that people kind of like. When Seattle brought him in, like, oh, that's smart. I can see that. Do we know that about him?

He was 3-6 when he was in for Rodgers, and Rodgers was hurt. The defense wasn't great in those losses. They got smoked by a bunch of teams there, and they beat some bad ones. But when you shut out against Baltimore and you throw three picks, that's not going to look good. So I don't even know if Hundley's any good. But I feel like he's still in that group of, like,

the group of hope, which may be an entirely different backup tier altogether. Detroit, there you go, Matt Castle in that group of like the group of hope, which may be an entirely different backup tier altogether. Detroit, there you go. Matt Castle in that job category. Castle hasn't really played since 2015. He actually did start a game last year for Tennessee. And then of course, Castle is always the answer to the moronic system,

Brady guys that don't think Brady's any good. I can't believe there's still like seven of you out there because of the 2008 New England season where they won 11 games, which is one of the most overrated seasons ever because their divisional cross rivals in the NFC and the AFC that year were train wreck divisions. The divisions were terrible. I think it was a 7-9 winner and won, and then 8-8 with San Diego and the other one in the AFC West. The Chargers, not the Clippers, as I write LAC, that's Geno Smith. No thanks. All right. Minnesota is

with now cousins. They have Trevor Simeon, who remember for a little bit, we're like, maybe they got something here. This guy's got a good head on his shoulders. I actually think I still have Trevor Simeon's cell phone number. Not real relevant to the conversation, but I've got it. In case he becomes a star in Minnesota, we can send him a text if he wants to come on the Ringer dual threat pod, and he can decline because it'd be the start. I'd be young and be like, look, I've already gotten blown out of one franchise. Pittsburgh. This one's really interesting because they got four guys, Roethlisberger. So at this point, the pre, I think it was ESPN magazine, but it was Pittsburgh was 10th in depth at the quarterback position. And yes, that's Ben. Maybe it should

even be higher, but they just promoted Josh Dobbs over Mason Rudolph, who they just took as a rookie QB, and they cut Landry Jones. I went through social media. I got caught in about a 15-minute maze on this. I apologize in advance. Dobbs, very spiritual, got as a plan, on and on and on. Apparently, Landry Jones did reach out to Dobbs and congratulated him, so it looks like everybody's just kind of at peace overall here. I'll admit, though, Dobbs is one of those guys. If you told me a good NFL franchise after watching him at Tennessee, that he would then be a backup on a good team. I would have never thought that it's a little like the Dennis Dixon thing, which ironically enough was also with Pittsburgh. Dixon in 2007 was with the ducks when chip and the thing first got it rolling and chip by still ZOC. Then that's when they went to

Michigan and horrified all the Michigan boosters. And they immediately paid Rich Rod a ton of money. Cause they're like, are the people, what are they going to do? Run the spread? Is that what we're talking about? So this, this Oregon thing looked pretty impressive when they came in here and Dennis Dixon, had he not blown out his knee against Arizona may have won the highs. And he still came in fifth that year. So I don't take this the wrong way. I love Dennis Dixon, but when Mel Kiper, I remember, you know, I'd been at ESPN a year or two, was like, Dennis Dixon's a pro prospect. I was like, really? He is? That's weird to me. And back then, like spread stuff, it just looks so weird. I wasn't quite sure. So even though I

love Dennis Dixon, I never could really understand how that was going to work. Dennis Dixon started three games. You know, what, when are they going to work? I don't know that he's going to get a ton of opportunities. The whole reason I said all of that stuff is that it's not me hating on Dobbs. It's just when I watch him in Tennessee, I'm really surprised that he's a backup. I like the promoted backup and they not that I didn't think Landry Jones is going to be any good. I saw him in person a couple of different times and he just doesn't move very well, which doesn't mean a ton, but you have to move in the pocket well too. And I just never saw that at Landry. So there you go. That's me really breaking down the Pittsburgh quarterback depth. We still have a bunch of teams to go. Dallas, Cooper Rush. You're like, what? Wait a minute. I drafted that guy. He the Rams wide receivers, the backup for Dak Prescott. I just drafted my fantasy league. No different white Cooper. Don't worry about it. Cooper Rush, Central Michigan. And then you go, Mike White? Who the fuck is Mike White?

Shouldn't I know who that is? Well, of course you know who he is, silly. He transferred from USF, went to Western Kentucky, lit it up in 2016, 37 to 7 touchdown interception ratio. Also wasn't bad in 2017. But yeah, I'll admit, I went, oh, that's right, Mike White. I didn't remember him either, so don't bad in 2017. But yeah, I'll admit, I went, oh, that's right, Mike White. I didn't remember him either, so don't worry about it.

Carolina, Cam and then Taylor Haneke, who we had on the show back with Van Pelt and I. He's that Old Dominion guy that you're like, oh, he threw for like 400 yards against Rice in 2014. No, he threw for 730 yards against New Hampshire a couple years before that when they were still in the FCS for Old Dominion. 2014. No, he threw for 730 yards against New Hampshire a couple of years before that when they were still in the FCS for Old Dominion. So that's who Taylor, um, Henneke, Heineke. I think

I said Henneke and I'm not a hundred percent sure, but that's kind of how it goes for backups. We did have them on the show. So I can promise you this. When we had them on the show, like six years ago, we did pronounce it correctly. Then Washington has the greatest human being in the world as their backup. And that's Colt McCoy. Enough said. Oakland, A.J. McCarron. You let me know when you know what Oakland's doing, and I'm not even just talking about the Khalil Mack thing, but to cut all the guys that they have at the quarterback position.

The way they've invested, and I'm not even talking about this regime, but historically over the years, Oakland is really bad at what they do with quarterbacks other than nailing it with Derek Carr. All right, the Giants. Alex Tenney and Kyle Lilletta. Yeah. I don't know either. All right. Tennessee, Blaine Gabbert. If I told you that Blaine Gabbert had a career 44 touchdown, 43 interception ratio, would you be surprised? The answer would be yes, but he does. Tampa Bay coming in at 17 quarterback depth. That may be high. Winston, remember, he's suspended for three games. And Ryan Fitzpatrick, you may have heard, he went to Harvard. And then Ryan Griffin, Tulane, undrafted in 2013, hasn't had a stat in five years. And he's on a roster.

Foster. The cults here, Jacoby Brissett, who everybody seemed to like. And if you want to have a really bad talk show segment, ask them whether or not Brissett is going to take over for luck at some point. And I'm leaving out the caveat of luck were to be heard again. Cincinnati, Matt Barkley, they IR'd. I love being able to look this up. And Jeff Driscoll, by the way, the backup. Speaking of Driscoll and Brissett, this works out perfectly here. Will Muschamp, who I've met a bunch of times, absolutely loved the guy, and the Florida stuff just didn't work out. To be number three, and I think they lost to Louisville in the Sugar Bowl years ago, was like, hey, is this really who they are? The offense stunk forever. They kept changing the staff all those

times. But if you're telling me at one point you had Brissett and Driscoll, and they're good enough to be on NFL rosters, and you couldn't move the football at all? That's not very good. That's not good. All right. The Rams, Sean Mannion. Yes, I still think he's all right. And Allen from out of Arkansas. Houston behind Deshaun Watson. It's Brandon Whedon and still a little Joe Webb action because more often than not, the teams, and this is an old Danny Connell stat, which is amazing. And it was really good insight because when Danny was still trying to get a paycheck from an NFL team, he was like, man, don't you need a third quarterback? And I think it was Mike Shanahan that pulled him aside and said, Danny, look at the numbers. The third guy never, ever plays. And starting last year, week one,

technically, because there's a little bit of the roster transactional stuff that can make this number wrong. But technically last year, 19 of the 32 teams started week one with only two quarterbacks on their actual 53-man roster, their active roster. So Houston's going to go with three. Denver, they're trying to figure it out. Paxton, who I've never understood why they drafted in the first round, it didn't work out. People love beating up on Elway now. I still feel like if you get to one Super Bowl, or excuse me, two, and then win one of them, it doesn't mean you're a disaster as a GM, but he's really struggled building a consistent quarterback post Manning there. And even, you know, that last year, but it wasn't like, you know, Manning was bad that year and they ended up winning the whole

freaking thing. So, yeah. So Denver's got Chad Machine Gun Kelly there and Kevin Hogan, who really looks like he has to wind it up to chuck it. But, you know, it's something about those Stanford guys seem that people seem to like San Francisco, CJ Bethard. That's a guy that I'll give McShay love for. He kind of sneaky over the years will tell you, this is somebody I think is good. And I'll go, good? Like he's going to be a starter? And he'll go, no. Somebody no one's talking about that I think could be in the NFL for 10 years and is smart

enough to be a backup, maybe a spot start here or there, you know, game manager type of guy. He said that about C.J. Bethard, who you may not have thought that when you watched him in college. But I'll give McShay some credit there. Baltimore, RG3 and Lamar, maybe Lamar RG3. Arizona, it's Rosen and Glennon still behind Sam Bradford, which means one of them will play. Cleveland behind Tyrod Taylor. It makes sense that it's Baker, but still Drew Stanton. Jacksonville, Kessler behind Bortles. Chad Henney, who I thought was the backup of Jacksonville Kessler behind Bortles Chad Henney who I thought was the backup of Jacksonville

forever he's the backup of Kansas City behind Mahomes the Jets after Darnold and moving on from Bridgewater have another great dude it's not that I'm not going McCoy McCown here it's just I've met both all right they're both nice guys. Chicago, Chase Daniel, everybody adjust that. Brock Osweiler puts the O back into your offense, rounding out Miami, and then number 32, in-depth, overall, at the position in the NFL,

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That's code DUAL at DraftKings. Minimum $5 deposit. That's not a lot. Eligibility restrictions apply. See DraftKings.com for details. I was going to start this segment or this whole podcast as I close up here. I was going to start with like, in the next 90 minutes, I'd like to talk about Kaepernick and the entire timeline. Because I've made it known for the last year or so that I'm really over this topic.

And it's not even specific to Kaepernick as it is to some of the stuff I talked about with cow herd. And I have this kind of longer form podcast thing about whether or not the media is liberal and sports and is it liberal and what does that really mean and how the dynamics have changed? Cause I've hinted at these things. I've gone on rants about it before, but I've never really done like 30 and 40 honest minutes. And I think it may piss some people off, but I'm going to do it because I think it's important. And if you really listen to what I'm going to say, uh, and I'm not sure where I'm going to do the podcast. I don't know if I'm going to do it here. I don't know if I'm going to do it on the ESPN one. So, uh, but I just think it's, I just think it's something that

should be done and going like, this is how we've come to this place where, uh, it is, it's full-on politics immersed in this stuff. And I remember like one time I was about to go on this TV show at ESPN and they were like, hey, will you come on? Will you do this? I go, I don't really want to do that. The guy's like, well, you better get with the times because that's what the job is now. And I went, is it? I still feel like I need to resist that a little bit. And maybe I'm going to end up being wrong. Maybe everybody just wants politics all the time. But you know what I don't want to do anymore with this Kaepernick thing is fight about it. And I know when he first decided to sit and

then eventually kneel because of instructions, Nate Boyer, a guy that I've known military NFL, you know, Texas more so than the NFL. But he, you know, everybody about this, like when it first happened, I was like, oh, come on, man, you can't stand up for the flag. And for those that just want to like, oh, well, how stupid is standing for the flag? Like that's putting politics in sports. You know what we could, you know, it'd be awesome to do as go, you know what? Can it just be kind of nice to have a national anthem and look up at a flag? Like, can it be, can we just make it that simple thing to look up and go, you know what, this is something that's kind of nice that we do traditionally. And some people are completely opposed to that. And I don't think I'm even being political. Like it seems absurd to

me that it'd be political for me to even suggest like, you know what, just stand up and do your thing. But as time has passed since then, I'm less offended by it. It doesn't bother me. And if Kaepernick silently, nonviolently wants to protest something that he feels very strongly about, social injustice in this country, and essentially the way police officers treat black people, then I can disagree with how he got there. I can disagree with his conclusions. I can disagree with his information, his data, but I still kind of, at the end of the day, have to go, all right, I got to respect the fact that you're allowed to do this. And it's not, it's not the end of your life in this country. Now, some would say it's the end of his career. When this stuff was first happening, I talked to

one team and I checked with a second team because I was like, what is the deal? And the word around the NFL was that when Kaepernick was then looking for a job after his run in with San Francisco and those that want to say, well, he opted out of the San Francisco contract. There was the only way that he could really make that work because he wasn't going to get any of that money anyway. So I know a lot of people that hate Kaepernick love to point out that he opted out and that's his own fault that he lost all that money. Well, he wasn't going to get any of that money anyway. So I know a lot of people that hate Kaepernick love to point out that he opted out and that's his own fault that he lost all that money. Well, he wasn't going to get any of that money anyway. But what I had heard was that Kaepernick was looking for money that was commensurate with starting quarterback money.

And teams are like, eh, we just don't even think you're that good. So we're not going to do that. And as this thing played out more and more, if there's one thing that I've always known about sports is that guys don't want to deal with this stuff, meaning coaches, meaning locker rooms, and certainly owners here. Does this mean that all 32 owners, and we know that demographically all 32 are not the exactly same, not exactly the same guy, but it's, it feels like a lot of those guys, like the unpopular thing of, oh, the old, you know, out of date white guy, billionaire, like, oh, the old, you know, out of date white guy, billionaire, like, oh, that guy, you know, none of these guys will let Kaepernick in. I'm surprised he doesn't have a job. I think he deserves a job, but the only guy who has improved in his ability more

than Kaepernick being away from the field is John Gruden. So every time that there's an incompletion by Nathan Peterman, or if Tyrod Taylor Taylor struggles or if Patrick Mahomes, you know, I'm just trying to think of like all of these guys because it's really more of the backups. Like once the backups start playing week four, week five, it has some injuries. Then Twitter becomes up. Kaepernick's not better than this guy. Well, here's the thing. Maybe he isn't, but even if he is, I think all of us could understand from strictly a sports and distraction standpoint that teams don't want to deal with this stuff. So it's a combination of some people having some really harsh thoughts about Kaepernick. It's a combination of his ability, which isn't nearly as good as everybody on Twitter seems to want to make it

out to be when there's a backup in on a Sunday game. And the fact that I think in the beginning, he thought that he was going to get more money and make up the money that he lost in San Francisco. And I may be wrong about this stuff. I was certainly wrong about thinking he eventually would end up on a team. And I do think he likes to be a martyr at some point. But when this Nike thing comes out and we turn into this fight of like, ooh, what does this mean? Like those dopes out there tweeting that because Nike was down two to three percent the opening day of stock after the Nike announcement that Kaepernick was going to be doing endorsement deals for them. You don't know anything about stocks. You know nothing. Or you know something and you refuse to realize that it could be

completely irrelevant, that they aren't connected. Let's see how the stock does over the next quarter. Let's see how it does the rest of the way. And like a lot of this social media stuff, Nike owns social media. Nike's reached $43 million worth of buzz and endorsement from just how much people talked about. That stuff to me is so fake because we move on quicker than ever before. But you know what is real is some of these arguments that make no sense. Because if you're one of the guys listening going, I hate Kaepernick and look what I found. I found a black guy that doesn't like Kaepernick either. And now I'm going to retweet his tweet. So I win. And then you're on the pro Kaepernick side and you go,

oh, well, guess what? You want some? I just found a vet. I found a Marine who was in Afghanistan that supports Kaepernick. So guess what? Get some right here. And I don't understand that stuff. You extremes, the people that endorse all of that stuff, you bore me to death. You bore me to death. And anytime the Kaepernick thing comes up, it's the same arguments where none of you have evolved or changed any of your minds. I shouldn't say none of you, but it seems like very few of you have. So yes, in summation, I think the guy should have a job. I think it's more than just kneeling for the anthem, but I could also understand if I were black, I'd be like, wait a minute,

kneeling for the anthem, but I could also understand if I were black, I'd be like, wait a minute, like this dude kneels and he can't get a gig. So I wanted to do it because it was the Nike thing, but I see the reactions in the fight on social media, like the burning of the shoes. How many is that total? Is it five or is it six? Is it six guys burning Nikes? And you're a clown for even doing that. Like that worked up about an endorsement that you're going to do that to burn your own shoes. Or did you just want to go viral that day? And then by the way, be on the other side of it, where you could do attack the guy burning his shoes, acting as if that's some massive majority. So yeah, that's why I usually don't do those segments because I've been, it's pretty predictable. The arguments are extremely predictable. Subscribe to dual threat from the ringer podcast, family of podcasts here. I'll be back doing it every Tuesday, Wednesday,

and getting ready for the first, well, look, how great is this going to be? Now you're the smartest guy in the room about your backup quarterback situation. I don't know if that was a great segment or not, but we did it. But next week we'll have NFL reaction too. So it'll be great. Enjoy the week one.