The Ryen Russillo Podcast - Danny Kanell, Plus Cleveland Browns Upheaval | Dual Threat With Ryen Russillo (Ep. 10)

Episode Date: October 31, 2018

Russillo is joined by Sirius XM radio host Danny Kanell to discuss the College Football Playoff rankings just after their release. Then Russillo talks about the Cleveland Browns firing head coach Hue Jackson and offensive coordinator Todd Haley and concludes with another edition of "This Tweet Pissed Me Off." Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

what's up i am fired up i'm on the road and i'm headed to baton rouge in just a couple days and the whole point of this dual threat podcast we started off was do some nfl do some college and be uh ready to go as soon as the college football rankings came out, so the playoff rankings came out. I actually was texting with Rob Mullins, the playoff chair of committee, or playoff committee chair, and he's going to join us at some point.

So he's not going to do it tonight. Instead, a special surprise, a reunion of sorts. I don't know if we're going to argue and complain the whole time about each other. But Danny Connell, now with SiriusXM and CBS Sports calling games, still talking college ball a ton. So I actually am really looking forward to going over the rankings with him now that we have them out because I'm sure we're going to see things differently. And as of right now, the top four in Bama, Clemson, LSU, Notre Dame,

and that 5-6 Michigan, Georgia, all the way down. So we'll go through and spend some time with Connell coming up in a bit. And then I have some NFL thoughts after another week in the books and the exciting trade deadline. Huh? How about that for dual threat? The trade deadline. I don't even know if I'm going to break any of it down.

I'm just happy that we have more than like one trade. This league for decades. Like, oh, we can't trade anybody. It's ridiculous. No one will ever understand the system. Yeah. And I understand systems take a little bit longer to figure out, but you get the point.

It's nice to see some trades. So we had some receivers traded. Before we do any of that, though, do you want an edge over Vegas? Yeah, I do. Download BetQL, the app you need to get an advantage this season. Discover value bets, line movement, and find out what bets the public backs with BetQL. The best part?

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Okay, Danny, the rankings are out, and you and I have disagreed for years about everything. And at this point, I don't really have much of an issue. I don't know that any of this is a surprise. I mean, maybe there was a thought that they would like Michigan more. I think there's a good argument for Michigan. I think if you want to be difficult, you could argue against Michigan, almost like you could a surprise. I mean, maybe there was a thought that they would like Michigan more. I think there's a good argument for Michigan. I think if you want to be difficult, you could argue against Michigan, almost like

you could a little bit against Texas, and then lose to Oklahoma State. So they're sort of out of the picture here now. But the initial reaction to the top four, I can't imagine there's that many issues. Right? No, I mean, for me, it's LSU over Notre Dame a little bit, but I mean, how upset are you really going to get considering if LSU

plays Bama and they beat them, then they're probably number one next week. Like, it's not that big of a deal. And yeah, I can look at Notre Dame a little bit, but I mean, how upset are you really going to get considering if LSU plays Bama and they beat them, then they're probably number one next week. Like it's not that big of a deal. And yeah, I can look at Notre Dame schedule and you could nitpick and say it. All right. But for me, and you know me, I mean, I've kind of stuck with the same script is that I value the fact that Notre Dame has a loss over LSU losing to Florida. So I like that for me, but it's not a huge deal. I tell you what the surprise to me was, was Washington state kind of still being in the conversation. I think Washington state sitting at eight actually gives the PAC 12. Now granted it's a long shot, but I think they're kind of in the mix, which I didn't think they would be. I thought the PAC 12 was done. And the fact that they're at eight in this first poll, I think, you know, I think the committee is completely ignoring their

non-conference schedule, which is something that has mattered in the past. But I think they're looking at some of their wins in conference and saying, all right, maybe we'll give Washington State a shot. So overall, I'm trying to tell myself, don't get too worked up over it because it happens every single time. You could really nitpick some of these, but overall, the big picture, I don't have a huge problem with any of them. Yeah, the easiest thing is we've always done this, but you can't really do the radio show that way every day. It's like, oh, it'll all play itself out. Join us for three

hours as we tell you to not worry about any of this stuff because we want you to worry about it. We want because we worry about some of the things. The Washington State thing and writing off the Pac-12, that's why I don't like, say, four weeks in when somebody goes, oh, well, you know, Pac-12 is done. why I don't like, say, four weeks in when somebody goes, oh, well, Pac-12's

done. You go, well, we don't know that. If Clemson had some terrible loss, the ACC could be out of this thing. If the Big 12, now it's a little different with Texas losing, but it depends a lot on the West Virginia games for both Texas and Oklahoma. As

we dig through all this stuff, what if a Big Ten West team won the Big Ten title? And I don't think that'll happen. I think the team from the East will be a two-touchdown favorite in that conference championship game. But you can't just eliminate entire conferences four weeks in knowing that the lower the tide is in a way, the more they're all back in this. So I think it's right to what you're saying with Washington State. The strength of Rector is pretty good. I know you hate the FBI. They're not

as great in the FBI. I think there's times of the FBI where I would never use it as my entrance into an argument. It may not even be the fifth or sixth point that I would make. So I think we're more aligned on that than you realize. The out-of-conference for Washington State, Wyoming, San Jose State, Eastern Washington. I guess you could make a little bit of an argument about a field goal loss at USC. You know, I think Utah is a good team. You know, I kind of thought Oregon was a good team. I'm going to have to apologize for thinking they were good because then they lose to Arizona. Stanford's not Stanford of the past, but I mean, good luck finding 25 teams better than them. I,

you know, I think on any given Saturday and I guess the more I look at it, I think the depth around all of college football, there's so many similar teams in that middle section that some of these wins can still be good. But you're right. If it comes down to Washington State winning a Pac-12 title, it's going to be really hard to argue them over somebody else who's a one-loss conference champ with that terrible out-of-conference schedule. Well, do you remember that Washington almost

get left out? Remember Washington almost get left out? That was the year they lost to Alabama in the semifinal. And there was a very serious conversation. That was another one where I was like, how can you leave a team out that's a one-loss Pac-12 champ? I just thought they were good. I argued for them. Yeah, I watched them and go, I think they're good. I'm sorry. And so that's why i think the difference is with washington state and i think they're pretty good too like we all know what mike leach is going to bring to the table on the offensive side of the ball and gardner minch who's just the latest guy who's lighted up putting up these monster numbers but if you look within the pac-12 they're actually at the top of most

defensive categories which is something you never think you would say about a Washington State team. But I do think that that conference, and I've always been a defender of the Pac-12, it is a complete disaster. And I honestly don't know. I think they have a major problem on their hands. It's just, and especially you look at the last game that was out when Washington State was playing this past weekend.

I don't know if you saw it. I think it was Stuart Mandel put out a photo of the game at Stanford, like five minutes to kick off. And there were like 3,000 people there. And it's like, I think the Pac-12

has just a disinterest. That is no doubt about it. I mean, I've been there enough to know the farm as great as it is. I don't know if they're just trying to pitch startups

down the street because they don't go to the games. Well, they always blame traffic. It's always traffic fault, but I do. Don't you, you don't feel like there's a lack of interest, the back half of the season and a lot of the, I mean, USC doesn't exactly have a home field advantage. It's kind of like Florida state. If USC is playing Notre Dame or if they're playing UCLA,

when UCLA is good and maybe they're for the, you know, for division title, then it's a good crowd. But I think the PAC 12 as a whole, just, there's a lot of lackluster interest in football as a whole. And I think it's hurting them. You don't, you don't agree. You think they do have like, cause I think that's the one thing that SEC does have going for it. It's not even close to the advantage that teams have. And Oregon, I know when Oregon gets going, that can be an incredible home field advantage, Washington when they're're good. But now that all these teams have two, three, and four losses, I don't think it's that big of a deal. And I think it hurts Washington State.

This is an entirely different conversation that I would agree with you about. Because you put such an emphasis on just a BCS title back in the day and now maybe just the playoff. And some of these teams that win conference championships, they do an eye roll. And if it's a team that's been winning conference championships, the fan base is like, yeah, OK, whatever. We're still not playing for a national title. And you go, you know, there's still nothing wrong with going 12 and one and winning your conference. Like that used to actually be really cool. And I still think it is. Oregon's always a great home field. And I don't I don't know what it's going to be like now after eight games. The Arizona loss for them, you know, the Washington State state game i actually was impressed with the way they came back i've been down 27 nothing or 28 nothing but i i

don't know they're just they're just not as good as i thought they were they and i for a while i thought they were pretty good but you know you just you have that happen at arizona where you get destroyed um you know i'm over it cal has been kind of a mess for a little while. Oregon State, same deal. I don't know. I used to argue that I felt like their toughest outs were tougher than... Excuse me, I should say this. I always thought the Pac-12 kind of at the bottom, other than maybe some of these Oregon State years, I always felt like it was a conference that there were still tough matchups and the coaching was getting better. And this is, for your argument, for this year, I think a snapshot year in 2018, you're right.

But I always thought, like, in a way, other conferences had easier Saturdays than the Pac-12 did. Even some of those SEC years where the East was a disaster, where you're just like, what? You know, like, some of these teams stink. Well, I was going to say, it also, it's one of those years where they, you know, the nine-conference game schedule always makes it different because they have to play one of those good bottom rung teams every year. But when you look at this, Ryan, do you think from, from like, who can get there?

Like I'm looking at this poll and I've been doing this for a few weeks, like, cause we're whittling down the teams that still have a chance in it. I don't like for Washington state, if you had me projecting ahead, I would not put them in. I just don't know if I'm a believer in them all the way through winning the Pac-12 championship. So like you go one to seven and I think all those teams have a legitimate chance of making the final four, but how deep would you go? And I don't know.

Ohio state, I think has something wrong in that locker room. I just, I don't, I think there are a bunch, I think there are a bunch of guys. I thought, you know, I don't want to rip Nick Bosa because I don't have any problem

with his decision to go pro, but I think the fact that a team captain was willing to forego the second half of the season and just say, see you later, I'm going to go prep for the NFL. I thought that spoke volumes about the locker room culture that's going on there with Urban Meyer.

But when I see teams, how deep could you go? I don't know how deep I could go past Oklahoma. If we're doing the Ohio state thought to finish, I don't have a problem with the Bosa thing because I think the timetable for his injury return was so late in the season that I don't even know that it would have really mattered. So if he's prepping for a draft with a weird core injury,

knowing that his family kind of knows how this deal works. I, I know what you're saying as a captain, but him being in a zip-up, cheering guys on, I don't really know that that matters. Like, Urban's been around long enough that that shouldn't matter. I think if you're one of these great teams, and at the beginning of the year it looks like Haskins is this incredible talent,

maybe better than all the other guys they had there, and now they can't run the football, which doesn't make any sense. I mean, the only stranger team not being able to run the football would be Stanford. That's something I never, ever imagined would happen ever in college football. And Ohio State has to throw it a million times against Purdue. And that Purdue loss, when you watched it, you're like, dude, Purdue's just kicking the you-know-what out of them. So that was weird. And I don't know. I hear certain things. I don't know if it's just the coaching thing or all the stuff that was going on in the offseason and going into it, if that's lingering. I mean,

we're really good at finding why things affected the team after the fact if they don't live up to our expectation. But here's the thing. Ohio State beats Michigan. They're going to beat whoever comes out of the West. They very much can be right in this thing. You know how much

as much as you fret about Alabama and the brand, Ohio State benefits the exact same way. So if they're a one-loss Big Ten champ, they're back in this thing, despite all of our concerns about them and how one-dimensional they may be in offense. Agreed. And they'll also have the resume because if they beat Michigan, who's a really quality team, and Michigan State on the way there, and then wherever they play at the conference championship,

I think their resume would be more than, you know, uh, justified. I think the thing that's interesting is that Notre Dame has completely thrown a wrench in this thing as far as when the math comes down to it. And for the remainder of their schedule teams that at the beginning of the year, you thought, you know what? It's nuts, right? That could be a tough out. I mean, think about how many tough games.

Yeah. You go, okay, Michigan. All right. So they beat Michigan. right that could be a tough out i mean think about how many tough games yeah you go okay michigan all right so they beat michigan i actually thought they were better than the one touchdown against michigan watching the opening of the season but you know now it looks like it was a touchdown game um they go oh man you got to take on a top 10 stanford team and the only reason they were top 10 is because oregon pissed it away the week before but then it's a dominant win against stanford but they're not the same then okay well you know you're gonna go out in a lane stadium that's's not going to happen.

That's not going to be easy. They roll Virginia Tech. Now, granted, you know, they were on another quarterback, but that wasn't close. You know, Northwestern is kind of, I don't want to say fake good, but if Northwestern's in the Big Ten championship game,

maybe that would hurt the Big Ten, and they would go, yeah, 12-1-1 at Ohio State or Michigan, but man, it was only Northwestern. Florida State, we know that that's a disaster. And then at USC, all of these, I think it's a great point because on paper, Syracuse at one point, because after the Stanford game, I was at Penn state for the Ohio state win. And I tweeted out, you know, this is, and it wasn't even an anti Notre Dame thing. It was a, Hey, if they go 12 and oh, they're in the playoff, but now it's like, yeah, they're going to go 12 and oh, and are they in the playoff?

And there's an argument to be made that Syracuse could be the toughest part of the second-half stretch, even though Northwestern is the team with the record. Oh, for sure. I think Syracuse is absolutely their toughest out on there. Dino Babers, I mean, that's been kind of his MO, is like playing the role of spoiler. But I don't think that's the case anymore. I think they're just a pretty good team.

That was one of the things I was like, oh, good to see that they got recognized in the first poll coming out with 19. That's a really strong record, especially for Syracuse. I mean, they go fast. They're just a tough out. I think Dino Baber's probably going to be

masked up by some bigger program sooner or later, but I agree. I think Notre Dame runs the table. I think it'll be interesting, but I think they're, I think they're a lock. They run their table, no matter what else happens around them.

And the thing that's kind of weird about it, remember the season when they got in and played Bama and got smoked. You remember the game that everybody was referencing was the pit game. And ironically, that's another one where Notre Dame looked awful when they played against Pitt and only beat them 19-14. But man, I think Notre Dame is in a much better place now than they were because they have been getting better on the offensive and defensive line,

as evidenced by two first-rounders last year in the draft on the offensive line. I think they're getting better, but they still probably get whacked by them in a first-round matchup. Yeah, Book was the right call. He's just more of a complete guy. And I talked to some people close to the team about the losses on the offensive line. And they were like, look, those guys are studs. But the cool thing is it wasn't that it was guys that weren't talented enough. They just hadn't played.

And we felt pretty good about it. So you lose those kinds of players and you think, well, we're screwed. But we had guys that were really good. They just hadn't played. And then once they got in there, we're good. And having the jobs that we've had where we did it every day and we heard every argument

from every inch of the country, it just becomes this classic, like no one's ever played anybody at the end of the year. And I can make an argument against Michigan, but I'm not gonna, you know, I, I, I've been very pro horrible. There's, there's still weeks where I go, I don't know, is this really like a playoff team?

But then you think, okay, can you come up with four that are better than them? And if they beat Ohio state and they win the big 10, that's going to be really weird. If it's basically the tiebreaker against Notre Dame going all the way back to week one when they were trying to figure out what offense they were possession by possession with Shea Patterson in his first game because that was still very clunky for them in that loss to South Bend so that's that's the weird part for the Big Ten here it's like wait a minute if we have Michigan as the Big Ten champ in at 12 and 1 are they just going to lose out to Notre Dame or look LSU could be eliminated this weekend too, so we don't know. Right. Well, I think what gets really tricky for the committee,

let's say Notre Dame loses, not to Syracuse, because I think that'll destroy them. But let's say, even though USC isn't very good, let's say Notre Dame loses by a field goal and it's a close game and Notre Dame plays good, but USC just kind of puts it all together. And Notre Dame is a one-loss team that finishes the season pretty impressive, but they finish with a whimper with a loss to USC. And then Michigan is a one-loss Big Ten team,

but they beat Notre Dame head-to-head. I think that could present a real problem for the team because they always bring head-to-head. I would probably lean toward either... I'm about... Man, that'd be a tough one. I would probably lean toward, man, that'd be a tough one. I would probably lean toward Michigan because I think Notre Dame should stack up and join the ACC. That's what I think. And I think it will hurt them eventually.

And I've always believed that, that that will hurt them one day. The fact that they're not a member of a conference and the committee has said, well, see, but unless it's Alabama, they don't have that extra data point. They've referenced that, you know, Hey, you need that 13th game for a championship. That's a difference. I think that actually would hurt Notre Dame. And I think Michigan would get the nod and I would be okay with that, even though, and I think there is something to be said too, about how different Michigan has looked as the season's gone on. And for these transfer quarterbacks, I don't think anybody understands how complex it is and how hard it is to get comfortable in a system. And I think that's a big reason why two teams, Michigan with Shea Patterson and LSU with Joe Burrow, they've gotten better and better as those quarterbacks have gotten more and more comfortable within those systems because they're still brand new.

You know, like they just came in the spring. It's not like it's not like they've been there and they've, you know, redshirted, got to learn the entire system. They're coming in last minute, especially in Joe Burrow's case, where he played the spring in Ohio State and he's really getting the game plan last minute. Like he hasn't done hardly anything. And so I would actually look at that and be like, you know what? Michigan is a better team now

than they were in that first game. I would put Michigan in and I don't, you know, this is where every fan base freaks out is because you are only using the points for your argument that help it. Okay. So if, if say that happens, I'm doing the same thing the committee does.

And by the way, as we talk all this out, if, you know, when we have a loser of Alabama-LSU, although if Alabama were to lose a close one, LSU wins the SEC title and then other stuff happens, Alabama still has a really good chance of being that second team. And we'll get to that in a second because I know that drives you crazy. Clemson being clean. Maybe Washington State ends up there,

but people just kind of go, I can't really do the resume. Oklahoma's still very much in this thing. ends up there, but people just kind of go, I can't really do the resume. Oklahoma's still very much in this thing. But I'm okay with the committee saying, yeah, head-to-head's important, but it always means dot, dot, dot, up and to a point. If we think these two teams are absolutely equal on the final hours before we have to submit what the actual real four teams are, we can say it's important because they're not going to ever say, yeah, head-to to head is actually not a big deal. You know what? Conference championships

aren't a big deal. They're always going to say that those are important, but only when they see the teams as absolute equals. And when they set out to do this years ago, they said the goal was the best four teams, the best four teams. And we're never going to agree. It's 13 people in a room that aren't going to agree. If you did it with computers, we'd never agree. So there's never, there is no other perfect solution to this, despite everybody's angst about it all the time. But I would, because I still, maybe I'm wrong here, but I still believe beating Ohio State is a tough team to beat at their place, that that would be a really impressive win. And then to win the Big Ten Championship, like I would be more likely to lean Michigan

over Notre Dame. But as I say it, they could both be in, and it may not even matter as you spent like seven minutes on that. Um, I, I want to ask you, cause I've noticed your Alabama Clemson thing and you feel like Clemson is flying under the radar in comparison to Alabama. I'm that surprises me when you tweet that out. So what's your point? So, so you disagree. You think that you think that Bama is head and shoulders separated from the field as well? Um, no, I think Clemson's nasty. I really do. I think the talent's there, but I think week in and week out that conference is so bad. It's even worse than we thought it would be that I'm not quite sure how tested they are, but they've

been kind of tested a couple of times. So I think that's the difference where if somebody wants to go, well, Bama hasn't played anybody. We know who they are. We know who they've been. And I know we're not necessarily supposed to do that, but we can't help ourselves. They look like they have the best draft prospect ever at the position, which is unfair, it seems. And at least the best quarterback prospect they've ever had is Alabama. They're destroying other teams. I mean, this isn't even

competitive football. And so I'm okay with somebody thinking Alabama's head and shoulders above Clemson, but I would still put those two on a tier together because a lot of the benefit of the doubt stuff I give to Alabama, I'm still going to give to Clemson, even though Clemson was challenged against Syracuse. And even though Clemson could have lost to A&M, Bama doesn't have those two minor blips that still ended up being wins, is my point. Agreed, but what's the major difference in those two games? Trevor Lawrence was

knocked out of Syracuse, didn't finish it, and in Texas A&M, he was still putting stats. But look, Alabama's offense is stupid. I have never seen... It's close to perfect. When you watch Tua, and just look at his stat line, and it looks... He's going to break Baker Mace. So Baker Mace like when he watched Tua and his I mean just look at his stat line and it looks I mean he's going to break Baker Mayfield so Baker Mayfield when he was at Oklahoma set the

career you know set the year single season uh passer efficiency rating his junior year then he comes back he breaks it again his last year at Oklahoma Tua is like 20 points above where Baker Mayfield was and I thought Baker Mayfield was one of the best college quarterbacks we've ever seen so I am not this isn't about Alabama's offense. For me, it's about their defense. And that's the thing that I think is funny in all this is for the last decade when Alabama has been had their run of championships in their dynasty, I'm sitting there saying, well, hold on.

They don't have a balanced attack. And everybody's like, well, that defense is unbelievable. And now that they actually have the offense, I think their defense, they're good. I'm not saying they're not deserving and they're anything like that, but I think that's where Clemson actually has a significant, significant edge is on the defensive side of the ball with those three first rounders on the defensive line.

And they've got some depth. They're starting to get better in the secondary. And statistically they're better in almost every defensive category. And it's not close. And I know their schedule isn't great, but Bama's isn't that great either. And I think it'll be, I think they're closer than people think. Now look, I, to be fair, I thought Ohio state was in that conversation for a long time too.

And it was like, Oh, there's three teams are separating themselves. And then they go to, you know, to Purdue and they get smoked. And it's like, Oh, they were a total fraud. I don't think Clemson is that I'd like if you had me say, all right, you know, here's a hundred bucks, which teams are you going to put in there? I would put, you know, probably 70 of it on Bama, but I would still put 30 of it on Clemson and say, all right, there's, they're going to get in there too, especially with their schedule and playing in the ACC.

And I think if they played each other, I think Alabama would on a neutral field. I think Alabama would probably be a four or five point favorite, which is less than it was when Clemson beat them in the national championship game. I think that was a touchdown favorite when Alabama lost to them with Deshaun Watson, who was the quarterback at Clemson. So I think it's

close. I hope people don't feel like I'm trolling Alabama, even though I know that's what I would get pegged as. I just think that Clemson is really good. I mean, let's not, let's not get her. I do remember you had a big 10 East SEC West before the season started tweet. We were like, are you kidding me? And you just like went the top five teams as winners.

You're like, it's not even close. I was like, eh, I don't know. I was the only one saying that. You don't, you don't, I wasn't the only one. No, there was, there was a shift. There was a shift. Like, yeah, that's fine. There was a shift that maybe, hey, there was a couple of times the last couple of years

where I thought before the season started, I go, I don't know if the SEC is going to be the best overall conference. And then it just sort of would happen again. And look, they don't have the depth or they, they hadn't had the depth the last few years. I'm not sure if it's as deep. It's not as deep as it used to be. That year, Arkansas, and I always reference it years ago, when Arkansas went 7-6 and came in last in the West.

I was like, this team is going to be kidding me. But, you know, I don't know if Kentucky's really good. And they're ninth. Florida, I know their defense is sick. And Felipe Franks, I think, has been a little bit better. My expectations for him were pretty low. But I thought Georgia was going to put it on them, and they did. So, you know, they still love Florida, apparently.

And they have them right in front of your favorite Florida team, not Florida State, UCF. Were you upset at all about UCF being 12? No, because it's not surprising at all. Like when I look at UCF, too, here's another thing. I would never. And this is where you see a fan because they love me.

I should run for mayor. They do. I think you do it by the way, but they would they would impeach me if I didn't. If I if they heard this, I don't think they belong

in the top four ever. Like, I just don't. But I like the fact that it messes with the system, but I think the system is broken. Like that's the thing where Danny White gets involved. Have you noticed by the way, that that's like the thing to do now is the troll UCF by, you know,

whether it's the entire game day crew, like mocking them or, you know, Joel Klatt, like mocking them and saying, Oh, you guys are a joke and you don't deserve that, which I think is kind of messed up.

But here's the thing with UCF. I think they should be able to have a seat at the table, and that would be an 18 playoff, which I know you've had nausea about. We've talked about that with you over the past few years. But if you're not going, and like Bill Hancock, he's lying when he says they have a chance. And that's what bothers me, is that we can have this facade and say, oh, well, maybe they'll get up there. And even tonight's ranking show, they're like, oh, they're at

12, which is higher than last year. Maybe they can get in there. They have zero chance to get in there. Even if they're two-loss Big Ten, two-loss SEC, two-loss, they are not putting UCF in. And I think that's wrong. And like, the thing that the system has messed up where you say, oh, well, you can have a

New Year's Six Bowl, and you can go play Auburn or any team that's going to say they didn't want to be there when you beat them. Like what kind of what kind of system is that? Like if you're not going to go to eight teams and have a group of five playoff like and have them have a champion where at least those players feel like they're playing for something legitimate as opposed to having to go out there and name themselves co-national champions and, you know, become the basically the joke of college football is what they've become like from all the national landscape is, Oh, they're not really any good.

When I actually think they are really good, like they have NFL talent on their team. And I do think they could, and look at like for, for all the, for the Bama fans ago, they would blow out. They would, you know, Bama would wax the floor with UCF. Bama would wax the floor with a lot of teams in the top 10 and a lot of teams in the top 15 that we actually consider for the playoff. So that's like my thing on UCF is not like, I don't, they don't belong in the top four because playing an American is different than playing in the SEC or ACC or big 12, whatever conference you pick from the power five. But I do think they deserve a chance, just not in our

current setup. And my biggest thing is, and I don't care who a chance, just not in our current setup. My biggest thing is, and I don't care who you are, it's not even specific to UCF, I just have a hard time, even at 12-0, buying into you in a non-Power Five conference. It's just the way I feel about it, and if it's a chance to play for an actual national championship, yeah, I'm pretty much to the point where I don't know that I'd ever be convinced that a non-Power Five deserves to be in the playoff. And that may seem entirely unfair. And I would agree with you that Bill Hancock shouldn't go on and say that stuff. But he's been saying stuff for years.

And they run on the BCS. I mean, he's the guy that told us that we couldn't go to 12 games because of class. You know, I mean, so this is good. I hope they don't get in. I hope they don't get in. So maybe we could see history made for the first time in college football history. We could have back-to to back co-national champions. There you go.

And you could order another t-shirt. Exactly. I, I made the Boise state example last podcast where I said, you know, when they had, they finished in the top five in the AP, the prior of 2009 undefeated,

and then they beat Virginia tech is a neutral site, but it was way on the East coast. And so you had like a nice non-conference beat a big boy thing. And then they beat Virginia Tech. It was a neutral site, but it was way on the East Coast. And so you had like a nice non-conference beat a big boy thing. And if they had run the rest of the table, then it might have been that time. Like it may have happened. And as much as each year and each week, we're supposed to rip it up and start all over again. It's just not the way the brain works.

And it's going to be hard to convince anybody in there. Anything else? Jump out. I saw NC State still alive. I know you were pumping up NC State. That was 100% tweeting about the SEC bias in the rankings when you were doing that before they got swiped by Clemson. Yeah, right. They hadn't played anybody.

So I don't... But here's the thing. If they're playing in the SEC and you don't play anybody, it doesn't impact you. You're still going to be in the top 10. I was not, and that's where it's like lost in translation on Twitter, which happens all the time. I was not projecting NC state saying, Hey, look at them. They're going to make a run. They're going to go to the playoff. I was saying because they're undefeated, they play on a power five. They weren't getting the same

like a recognition that you would get from if you were in the sec or if you were Kentucky, or if you were any other team, uh, that was in the SEC that was undefeated. So therefore, when Clemson beats them and smokes them, it doesn't look as impressive. Like they can't claim that as a top 10 win the way that LSU claims Auburn is a top 10 win, even though we've seen Auburn become a complete disaster. So that was. Do you think Auburn is the same as NC State, though? This year? Yeah, you do.

For sure. I absolutely do. Like, I think NC State is clearly better than Auburn's the same as NC State, though? This year? Yeah. Yeah, you do. For sure. I absolutely do. Like, I think NC State is clearly better than Auburn. You think NC State would be Washington? They're pretty good. They're absolutely pretty good. Ryan Finley's a good quarterback. No, I know he's good.

They've got to dominate that way. I think they have some good defensive guys. But I just felt like... Like, I think their ranking now is probably fair. The committee actually had them at 21, so I think it's probably pretty fair. Yeah, I guess back-to-back weeks, I was surprised in an ACC that's down.

The committee tells us they don't worry about the conferences. That's ridiculous. The reason they tell us that is they don't want to tell us what conferences are ranked where. They have to go... At some point, someone in the room is going, you know, the ACC is really down this year, other than Clemson. And that's why when you had mentioned, tell us what conferences are ranked where like they have to go. Yeah. At some point, someone in the room's going, you know, the ACC is really down this year,

you know, other than Clemson. And that's why when you had mentioned, you know, between Clemson and Alabama, the tier or whatever, I would put more money on Clemson making it to the playoff because of who the rest of the ACC is then say who I think Bama is.

I, I know that you want to get mad at me for that. No, no, no, we're good. We're goodder at me for that. No, no, no. We're good. We're good. Because I thought that broadcast.

Those back-to-back losses are good losses. Like, I know Syracuse is like, but they're good. They're a good football team. Yeah, they, Babers, you're right. Like, back to your original point. I think the biggest thing that I've always argued with you about is that you think all these SEC teams get the benefit of the doubt. And what I would say is there's more, but there's more teams that have been good recently that we get that get the benefit of the doubt, but just like Ohio state gets the benefit of the doubt, just like, um, you know, I know it sounds like Oklahoma's Oklahoma's

always going to get the benefit of the doubt. Even Penn State. Okay. Penn State. Let me find this here. Penn State right now is 14. Okay. Penn State's coming back with Trace McSorley. And when you look at them throughout the weeks, you go, okay, App State almost beat them week one.

They had that weird game with Illinois. They ended up crushing. I should stop bringing that up. They went up by 21 or 29 points. I was at the Ohio State game. They could have won that game, right? But then they lose to Michigan State and then they almost lost to Indiana. And then the Iowa game. So they've had weeks here where they could have four losses. And yet the committee still after some of the stuff, they not the committee, but just the AP voters, they still were on Penn State. And Penn State started top 10.

Like, I'm okay. I just think there's all these teams that still get the benefit of the doubt. Even your Florida State team, the year after they won the title, we both watch them every week and we talk about it. We go, man, they're just not as good. Like, what's wrong with them? Well, they're defending national champs and Jameis is still there. So I agree that the SEC teams get this carryover thing,

but I think there are teams all over the country that get this carryover thing, and I think you always ignore that, and I think you make it just about the SEC. Because I don't think there's any, like, listen to the conversation when it's Kentucky, and Kentucky is ranked ninth right now. If that was an ACC team, like, because Duke has been good before,

and Duke has played for ACC championships. If Kentucky beats Georgia, the narrative won't be, oh, man, the SEC East is bad. Like, what a garbage. Like, Kentucky's playing for the SEC championship. Man, what a great – Kentucky must be awesome. Like, Mark Stoops might be in a good job. But if you have Duke playing for an ACC title, people are going to say, oh, the ACC must be having an awful year.

There's just – there is a narrative around that. That does happen. No, that does happen. Right. But I totally agree with you. There is absolutely brand bias, and it's not exclusively the SEC. It's everywhere, like Clemson, Bama, Ohio State. You mentioned them all. They absolutely get the doubt. It happened

with Texas and Florida post McCoy and Tebow. They kept just, oh, yeah, this next guy. And it just happened. And it happened, and those teams wereoy and Tebow. They kept just, Oh yeah, I mean this next guy and it just happened, you know, and it happened to those teams were disasters after the fact. Yup. Totally agree. Like it happens across,

but I do think there is an sec brand bias too. I mean, it's proven out like when the polls come out, is it the best conference though? Again, right now. Yeah. Right now for sure.

It is, but I don't put, see, here's the thing. The margin, I don't think is. But I don't put, see, here's the thing. The margin, I don't think, is that much better than everybody else. That's always been my thing. When we talk about them being the best, yes, they're the best conference in college football this year. But I don't think that it's this huge gap.

Kind of like I don't think there's a huge gap between Alabama and Clemson. You know, I just think if you went up and down, yeah, they'd be favored against teams from the Big Ten or the Big 12. But I think, you know, they'd be interesting to watch play out. And I don't think it'd be that against teams from the Big Ten or the Big 12, but I think they'd be interesting to watch play out, and I don't think it'd be that much of a difference. How about we do this? If Kentucky beats Georgia, I'm not going to say Kentucky's awesome. You know how bad

I want that to happen. I still think Georgia's really good. I do. I thought they were going to give it to Florida. i got a ton of heat from georgia fans because i said before the season i said i need to see them back it up i can need to see them justify what they did last season and then they go into lsu and they look completely kind of overwhelmed like a little bit stunned a little bit it was also weird to see lsu have like four or five huge offensive plays in the same game and not a season yeah oh for sure and that's the only that's the only way that they

have a chance against Bama but I do think for them to get Jake from like I was really worried about Jake from saying oh man are they going to start playing just field or the is Kirby smart going to start messing around with a two quarterback system which I think you know is a disaster waiting to happen I just don't I'm not a believer in, but for him to come back and be almost perfect on third down and to come back to bounce back game, you did against Florida team. I'm back in on Georgia too. Like I was questionable with them saying, all right, where are they? You know, are they going to be able, I still don't think they can go toe to toe with Bama,

but I don't think that's disrespectful because I don't think, I really only think Clemson is the team that can do that and really hang with them. But again, I don't, Bama disrespectful because I don't think, I really only think Clemson is the team that can do that and really hang with them. But again, I don't, Bama has not been tested that much yet. And I think that's a great barometer for them will be LSU at Baton Rouge at night against that defense. Like I actually,

I think in the back of Nick Saban's mind, he kind of is like, I want to see my team get tested. I want to see how they respond. And I think they'll pass. I think they'll pass the test, but you just never know until you've been in that situation. Yeah, I would agree. Cause I don't, I don't know why you'd never want to see how they respond. And I think they'll pass, I think they'll pass the test, but you just never know until you've been in that situation. Yeah, I would agree. Cause I don't, I don't know why you'd never want to be tested. Um, because at some point if you are saying the playoff and then your kids haven't done it for three months, you're just going to react differently if you haven't done it. Cause the Kentucky thing real quick, and then I'll finish with Bama LSU with you, uh, as we've already done it here a little bit, but you know, you, if you want to tell the good story of Kentucky, you go, hey, man, they won at Florida.

They beat a Mississippi State team by three touchdowns. But then you go, wait a minute, so they lost to A&M. I think A&M's a good team. And I know that's not the best week to say it after losing to Mississippi State. It was a strong argument for A&M's not going to just fold in front of you. They're going to play you tough.

And two of their losses, part of the Mississippi State thing, are against the top two teams in the country. They very easily could have won that Clemson game. I was so impressed with Clemson, even though they're supposed to smash everybody. I thought that was a really nice win by them going in there. Have you been to Kyle Fieldhouse? That's a wild place. It's weird. It's not an easy place to go in. I was there for the Clemson

game. Oh, all right. Well, there you go. That place is bizarre. But then Kentucky, a touchdown against Vandy, this weird win this past week against Mizzou that has led to arguments four days removed from it. Okay, wait a minute. If you're really in Georgia's class and playing in the SEC title game, all right, we'll take it out

on them. And even though it's at home, we'll see. All right, so before I ramble, because I want to say I'm headed there, as I said at the top of the pod. My feeling on Bama is that even if your defense is as talented as LSU is, it's so hard with the release and timing and understanding the precision of what we're seeing from two in the passing game.

And the fact that like it took you four weeks ago. Okay. So Bama's got three stud receivers and kind of a fourth and a tight end. You're going to mess up with those guys multiple times a game. I don't care who you are. And that's why I just don't know if LSU can, if it's a shootout, I don't know that Burrow's going to be able to keep up with those guys. Because this team, this game could,

I've seen weird games there where no one can score the voodoo in the air, a turnover here, LSU's in it, they're going to win it, they're going to win it, and then they don't. And I've been to games where I go, man, this isn't like the Leonard Fournette game at Tuscaloosa a few years ago, where they try to run it right at them. And you were just like, this isn't going to work. So I've seen, I've seen every version of this game. I just have a hard time believing you can

contain all those receiving options for Tua. Yeah, I I'm with you. I don't, and I like, look, you know, I've picked against, I think I picked them against here. They have Leonard Fournette. He got shut down to like 23 yards rushing. And I was mad at myself. I said, I'm never picking, uh, LSU to beat them again, unless they have the formula. And I do think there's a formula which helps you contend. I don't think it's automatic, but I think you do have to use tempo. I think you have to have a quarterback who can run around, who can escape because that's like how you take advantage of Bama's. When things break down, you can buy time because that's when like a perfectly schemed defense gets thrown off, you know, thrown off what they do. And that's, that's when like a perfectly schemed defense gets thrown off,

you know, thrown off what they do. And that's, that's the way to have success. And Joe Burrow, as good as he's been, like he's had the intangibles, he had the great drive against Auburn. He looked great against Georgia. I just, there's still something about him where I don't know if he's an elite passer and he's going to be able to just pick apart Alabama's defense. So I just don't see that. And you're right with Tua. He knows where to go with the football. I do think if they could create some pressure and knock him around a little bit, but that's the one thing we haven't seen Tua deal with much.

Yeah, but he's Samoan, isn't he? He's going to be fine. Right, right. It won't faze him at all. But he does know where to go with the football. And he is an elite passer of the football. So that's where even if you were able to kind of have this more, if you were able to have run this offense, that puts up a lot of points, they're at points.

They're actually built to go toe to toe with that. And I don't, and LSU clearly doesn't have that on the offensive side of the ball. I am with you. The only way that LSU has a chance in this one, that's where the reason that's a 14 point spread is if Chua has turnovers. Because those are the times they lose. You know, Ole Miss, when they had five turnovers against Ole Miss a few years ago. They still had a chance to win.

I know. Right. And you never see that happen with that many turnovers. That's the only thing that we haven't seen. It's like we haven't seen Chua have a bad game, really. And that's the only thing that would really give LSU a chance. And I wouldn't bet on that happening, considering how perfectly perfectly he played the position. So I hope it's close. I hope it's a close game, but I could easily see Bama going out there, maybe close for a half. And then I could

see Joe Burrow getting sacked and a strip fumble and, you know, they walk it into the end zone. And then all of a sudden, you know, Bama's up 21 and your game's over. You know, I could easily see that happen. That's probably the most likely scenario. Yeah, the Jalen Hurts game a couple years ago, you know, I was there and it's like, hey, they're in it, they're in it, they're in it. And it really never felt like they were in it, even though the scoreboard said it. And then, you know, Jalen had a big run there late and you go, okay, you know, and LSU couldn't, they just, they just couldn't move the football.

I mean, that was the, that was the zero, zero point game, right? Yeah. I think that's, that's what it was. They got, they got shut out. Unless, unless, do you think LSU can run and slow the game down and keep it away? Because they did run the ball really effectively against Georgia. But that plays right into Bama's wheelhouse if you try to run against them. I know.

I just think those receivers are sick. I think because people keep turning off Alabama games or they go, this is no point. I don't even want to watch that. I feel like if Alabama had had like a Saturday night, primetime game against somebody and it was close and people saw Judy waddle and rugs, they just go,

Oh my God. And that might be this Saturday. It might be this Saturday. People realize, like, do you guys know how insane they have three Calvin Ridley's? That doesn't, that doesn't seem fair.

What they've cooled off a little bit, but at one, I think it was three weeks ago, I was looking at some stats, they had four guys that were averaging 20 plus yards a catch. Like, that's insane. They are so deep at that position. And that's what they can do. That's why people are saying that's the best big statement team.

It's clear because he's got this offense, which is insane. It's like playing a video game. It's almost not fair. Yeah, as of now, Judy's at 25 with a catch. Waddle's 22. Ruggs is 19. Devontae Smith is 20. I mean, this is

stupid. And it's not like they're Georgia Tech receivers where they get three catches and they're all like, no, they have 30 catches, 20 catches. They're getting a lot of balls. They're just taking them deep. They're taking them to the house. It's unbelievable how deep they are.

The tight end, he's big, and he's a New Orleans kid, Irv Smith there. He had 14 catches of his career coming in, and he's got 22 for 384 now. I'm looking at this now. It's actually still right where you said it was, and it's even more absurd because I haven't even mentioned the Smith brothers may not be related. Did you put in the request for the new helmet they wore that night time? The one that changes colors? Did you get a request for that yet?

You know, I don't have a show anymore to put the helmet out. So, you still have a man cave, I'm assuming that, right? Yeah, I don't know. The square footage of Manhattan Beach is a little tighter than it was in West Hartford. So, I don't have... We don't have caves out in LA. Get one for me then.

I know they'll give it to you. They would never give it to me. They definitely won't give it to you. Do you know when I tried to give them Ursula Canel t-shirts, they didn't want them? They crumpled out my name, I thought. I was at a dinner with all the LSU guys and I go, hey, I got some Ursula Canel shirts. And they're like, I'm not wearing that. And I was like, you really aren't going to wear it, huh?

Before I say goodbye, I just wanted, you know, how are you doing, man, with everything with Sirius and talk about the podcast for a bit and get a promo in there because I don't know. Do you miss it? Do you miss doing the show with me every day? Yeah, absolutely. I do, man. I miss it all the time. It's bittersweet because I still get

people. In fact, today there was some dude that said something about the book club. I think I put, cause did you see the video of the committee when they were walking into the room, they put their hats on the hat rack, all business. Yeah. I love it. Are you serious? This is the corniest thing ever. And a dude actually said, no, your book club idea was the worst idea ever. That was the corniest thing, which was actually pretty good. But like that stuff, like book club idea was a good idea. Yeah. I should have let you do that.

That's my fault. But then like that stuff is when I miss it. You know, like that's the stuff when I miss like people that were involved and they cared about us and like that interacted with us. That's the stuff I miss. I miss getting yelled at, you know,

all the time with you for three hours and then the pre-show meetings, get my ideas shut down. I miss all that stuff. But now I got my man Raja. You got to get Raja on here sometime. I know you guys do football. You got to get him on maybe on your other pod too. Because Raja is unbelievable. He's really a talented dude.

I've met him. We did a bunch of game nights together. His stories, NBA stories, are up there with anybody I've ever talked to. He's incredible. And he doesn't hold back. He doesn't hold back. He's not going to have a filter either. So, doing stuff with MSCBS Sports HQ. We have a podcast too. It's Off the Bench with Chanel and Bell.

So, if anybody's listening, maybe I'll check it out too. Alright. Well, hey, man. Are you going to make it to Baton Rouge? Are you trying to? Are you afraid to now after I told you about the t-shirts? I got to call a game in Murfreesboro. Make sure you tune in for that one. Middle Tennessee State against Western Kentucky Friday night. It's not that far from Nashville.

You guys should come over. That could be your Friday. Are you guys going over to Baton Rouge Friday night? I'm going Thursday, dude. Are you kidding me? I'm not sticking around here. Oh, there you go. You're going to go see Brandon, see the boys at Walk On.

Make sure you tell them. I think Brandon likes me. I feel like I have a pretty good deal for him. Brandon's a businessman, so he knows. Because if you blow up, he wants to be able to say he's in there. He's set it up, man. I got my buddies from Colorado coming in. May have a couple other surprises rolling through.

And it's my favorite weekend every two years because I only get it once every two years. It's going to be great. Have fun, man. Enjoy it. Hey, thanks so much for the time. We didn't go at it as much as I thought we were going to, but maybe that just shows maturity or calmness on my end. Yeah, we're getting older.

You were more mature than I was. All right, my man. Thanks so much, Dan. I appreciate it. All right. You got it. Take it easy, Ryan. I'll get into some NFL thoughts, the Browns in particular.

I could probably go do another hour on the Browns, although I don't know that I've done a minute really, but I'm going to do some stuff on the Browns, and then we'll see where it goes, see where it takes me. But I want to remind you about my guys at Hotel Tonight coming in huge once again for your boy on the road, had to find a room in Baton Rouge, not easy. So a little insider travel secret from our friends at Hotel Tonight. There are tons of empty hotel rooms out there just waiting to be booked. That's the great thing. If you go someplace packed and you go, I don't know, I'm just going to ride this out for a couple hours. Hotel Tonight's going to

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We don't care about that, but women do. So pay attention to that stuff. Get better. So to start scoring amazing deals at incredible hotels, go to hoteltonight.com or download the app now. Before we do a tweet that pissed me off, I'm going to just talk about the browns for a little bit so they fire hugh jackson and they fire todd haley the oc okay and this is a really

interesting i'm going to make a couple analogies here as i try to do any of these stories but the hugh jackson thing it's really easy to be like yeah you you were two and a billion your record was terrible you deserve to be fired i actually felt like well if the front office is tanking and they had this takeover there even if you feel like there's signs of incompetence, that's a tough one, right? Cause I could talk myself out of that too. I could say, well, wait a minute. If you're starting fresh and you have a new quarterback and you're taking them number one and the front office is different from the coaching staff, then why, you know, why would you even want anybody around him? I mean, he might be part of the long haul,

but at the same time, I don't think Hugh Jackson owns that record in the way somebody else would when the front office was doing what they were doing to acquire as many draft picks as they possibly could. Okay. So I think both sides of those arguments are pretty fair. Now, what Jackson had said publicly recently, like as the season was beginning, um, and then it kind of carried over. So, I mean, this is kind of a constant theme since the start of training camp to all the way to the last week was that he wanted to be more involved in the offensive meeting rooms, but nothing had changed in the last couple of days. And that Jackson hadn't been involved in the teaching, building or game planning the offense all along was a result of giving Haley the autonomy that he was promised when he was made the OC. So that's really on and it gets back to ownership and Haslam and his tenure with Cleveland has been a disaster. It just, I mean, it'd be hard to say, Hey, I'm going to buy a team and try to have a million people work in the front office and have a head coach. But then when it's

bad, you just keep firing everybody all the time. So at times I think it's, it's really easy to beat up on any organization, any college football program, even NBA teams would be like, well, look at all these guys they brought in here. There's no security. Well, what are you supposed to do? Just keep the awful guy for six years to prove that you have patience. Like that doesn't make a lot of sense either, but let's face it. If I had to go into a courtroom and defend Jimmy Haslam against the argument that he's been an, you know, he's been a terrible owner and I have to argue he's been a great owner. There wouldn't be a ton of evidence and I would probably plead. So whenever you look at the

beginning of this, you know, and I'm looking at Albert Breer stuff from SI.com, the MMQB, and he said, basically, look, they put together Banner, Mike Lombardi, Ray Farmer, Mike Petten, Sashi Brown, and then Jackson. And now that Dorsey's in there and then he inherited Jackson, all of this stuff, it does kind of start with you as the owner, even if you're not the hardcore football guy to go, I need guys in the building that are going to be able to get along together. And let's face it, Todd Haley doesn't get along with anybody. I don't know what the issue is. Clearly there's something about the way he sees offense that is good enough to continue to get him these jobs, but going back to him being an assistant with Parcells. And this is really, I don't want to say unfair because it actually happened. Remember like Haley was arguing with the ref and Parcells pushed him back. Well, more immediately, Chris Mortensen was like, that's like a father-son relationship. That's those two guys.

And Haley can be super abrasive. But we saw this going back a really long time. Then he's with the Chiefs. It doesn't work there. And then Roethlisberger, who's not exactly my favorite guy, they can't get along. And then you're sitting there where Hugh Jackson, who was an offensive guy, first and foremost, I didn't know if he was terrible in Oakland or not, because that was a disaster. So we're still sitting here looking at Hugh Jackson's resume going, all right, maybe he isn't

good. And maybe there were signs and hard knocks watching the TV show. You're like, this guy's an NFL head coach and all of those things can be accurate and can be fair, but to put Haley with him and then say, by the way, Haley's calling all the shots and you stay out of it. And then reports where Corey Coleman, who's only been on 30 teams since he was cut by the Browns, went to Jackson to try to find out why he wasn't with the second unit because Haley had designated him as a backup. There were just all these little things. And you can't do that with any quarterback. Forget a rookie quarterback. And when you took one that, let's face it, a lot of people didn't think was going to happen. So I think the two lessons out of this the most are that if you're Hugh, are you wrong for potentially being a leak about this stuff? Because there'll be one argument that is, you're a football team, you're a family,

you're in this together, do not leak information that even if it helps you, hurts the overall organization. I would like to think if I had a job like this, and I'm not going to be an NFL coach, but if I had a job that was in the public eye and was important, and yes, the perception of me is very much dictated by the media, that I still at my core would want to do the right thing

for everybody so that we could all move in the same direction. All right. But there's other arguments that are, if you're Hugh and Haley's boxing you out because of an agreement with the owner and it makes you look weak as the head coach and you need to explain this for your own self-preservation to maybe keep your job in Cleveland or at the very least now change the perception, change the story about you moving forward so you can get another job and he'll get another job as an assistant at some point. But no one gets can and goes, Hey, Hugh Jackson isn't walking around today going,

Oh, I'll never be a head coach again. He's going to be like, how can I be a head coach again? So a lot of the stuff that was coming out, people felt like was a Hugh Jackson leak. I don't know if it was or not. I could understand why it was. And I think some of you listening now are like, that's the wrong thing to do. You can't do that. Forget the noise, eliminate the noise. And I think there are other people listening go, wait a minute, man, this is about survival.

This is self-preservation. This is what we're all doing every single day. Look out for number one every day. Okay. You know, I'll take care of my wife, take care of my kids and everything else, but it is only about me. And I think you can be that way to a point, but I don't know that. I mean, if all of us were doing that, if everyone in your office, if everybody in your sales staff was only about themselves all the time, isn't that just as toxic? I think there's always this argument.

I don't know if it's selfishness that we have now. Uh, I feel like there's more stuff that I read where I'll read someone saying, well, you know, you got to do what you can to protect you. Well, yes,

but can you go too far with that? I worked with somebody long time ago and I never talked to the media blogs. I just didn't. Um, if somebody called me on something and got my number and it was outlandish, I'd be like, look, that's not going to happen or whatever. But for the most part, I wasn't ever saying like, Hey, my show is doing really well. Um, you know, I'll give you a little bit of this and this is what happens. You trade a little information, right? Like if a GM is talking to somebody or an assistant GM is talking to somebody, especially like an assistant coach or assistant GM, a lot of times they're talking to somebody in the media so they're hoping that person in the media, when a GM job becomes open, names that assistant GM or names that assistant coach as a viable option as a GM or head coach. That's kind of the horse trading that we're all doing here.

But for me personally, I wasn't one that would call a blog and say, Hey, I got some dirt for you on something that's happened at ESPN. Just remember next time you start talking up people who's great at radio, who's great on television, who deserves more of a shot at this or has, you know, that's, that's what some people in my business do. And there was one person that did it and they did it all the time. And I know who was, cause I would read something and go, oh, oh my gosh, like that's word for word. What I know came from this other person in my industry. And every time there would be some mention of an up and comer or somebody who was really changing sports and media and television, this person would always be mentioned all the time.

and television, this person would always be mentioned all the time. And I go, my God, like all these blogs love this person. Like, this is incredible. And some of us at work would be like, man, did you read about so-and-so that person? And I'm trying to be super vague about this. Cause I don't, you know, I don't think anybody would ever really figure it out, but it was just one of those things where we kept, we kept reading about how great this person was over and over again. And we realized the blogs are only writing this about this person that we worked with because this person was feeding them information all the time. Like you guys know me well enough, especially from the ESPN years that, and I don't know that everybody loved it. And sometimes when I was really honest on the air about how stuff was going down, people appreciated it. They liked that I did it the way that I did it. And I never

really was, I don't know that I was, I was probably more open and more honest than other people were about it, but I just wanted the listener to kind of know where I was coming from and everything was going down. And I did a really extensive ESPN podcast when I'd re-signed just saying, hey, here's the timeline events, here's how it all happened. And that's what happened. Maybe some people didn't like it, but I could have just given that all to a blog and then said, all right, argue my side of the story, make me look great. And then down the road, I got your back on something. And maybe I should have done more things like that. And maybe that's what Hugh Jackson was trying to do. And some of you were probably listening to go,

what happened to that other person? Well, that other person's career absolutely took off because every time that that person was being written about, it was in glowing terms about how great they were and how creative they were. And it was on and on and on. And like the rest of us at ESPN, we go, my gosh, like you keep reading this stuff. And by the way, I also know that it hurt me by not doing it because there were certain blogs. You know, when I re-signed with ESPN, when I had a dual contract with, with the ringer and ESPN, which is basically unheard of a couple of blogs, didn't even touch it. Not because it wasn't interesting because it's really unprecedented, but a couple didn't do it because I never have called them back. Like when I was first leaving the radio show, I got this long email from one

of the blogs being like, Hey, we heard there's a chance you could go to Fox ringer bar stool, or maybe even start your own podcast. I'm like, well, dude, that's not a source. That's not info. You just named like the four places I'd probably ever work. Like that's not, so I didn't even bother with it. And guess what? By not bothering, not emailing back, not playing the game a little bit more feeling like I'm not giving this person any information. I don't even know who they are. And they're totally guessing. Then that place has never hooked me up. It's never written anything nice about me ever. And then I realized that maybe the other guy had it figured out. Maybe the, maybe the person who was constantly leaking stuff all the time and, and crafting the

story the right way about themselves to self-promote is playing the game the right way. Because there's so much of this stuff after this huge action firing where everybody's like, what, wait a minute, who said this? And who said that? Or do you say that? Is he trying to do this whole thing? And it's something that I don't want to call it a struggle. I'm not trying to be that dramatic about, but I think all of us that want to grow and want to be successful in what we do, you go, okay, to what cost? And let's face it. I mean, there's not, not everybody has a media thing covering their job, but you can be all about yourself, I think, and to a point. And then once you cross through that point, it's like, okay, well, you're beyond.

This isn't about you. You're taking this too far. And I'm not even sure that he necessarily even did that. Real quick, before I get to the Fowler trivia, I wanted to point out Lincoln Riley being brought up to come in for Baker Mayfield. I would not, if I were Lincoln Riley, take the Cleveland Browns job. I would rather be a 10 year guy at a place like Norman or 10 other college football stops and be the king of a college campus for 10 years than I would want to sign on with the NFL, especially if I'm as young as Lincoln Riley. Now he can say he wouldn't want to do it right now. Everything's a negotiation. You know,

he can say what he wants because you may just get a bump out of it, a few extra million or tacked on another year to your contract because there's a threat of you going, Charlie Weiss, anyone. So if any coach wants to be vague about their intentions, I totally understand that part of it because that's the way the game is played for that. But I would like to point out the top five, or excuse me, top five NFL coaching salaries compared to the top five college football coaching salaries. Belichick, the reports are between 10 and 12 and a half million a year, depending on what you read. So he's at number one. Gruden's

10 mil, a hundred million. And by the way, if it took you a hundred million dollars to get Gruden out of the booth, there has to be a point where you go, you know what? Let's not pay a hundred million to John Gruden. How about that idea? What's be a point where you go, you know what? Let's not pay $100 million to John Gruden. How about that idea? What's he want? He wants $7? No. He want $8?

No. He want $9? No. He wants $10. All right, $10 for $5? No, he wants $100. Can we not do that? Do we have the option to say no?

And that's where the Raiders are a disaster. So you got Gruden second, Carroll's at $9 million-ish, Sean Payton's at 9 million. Ron Rivera, who knew that? Who had him at number five for top coaching salaries in the NFL at 7.75 million with a new extension? Andy Reid's like 7 million, so he's kind of like six. It depends on what you read.

I read a bunch of different stuff. Multiple sources. So those are your top five guys in the NFL. Belichick, Gruden, Carroll, Payton, Rivera, between about eight and ten to, say, twelve million. Top five college coaches, Saban's eight and a half, Meyer's seven and a half, Harbaugh's seven and a half, Fisher's seven and a half, and Gus Malzahn's 6.7. You just gave them that extension

after you wanted to fire him, and now you all want to fire him again. Side note, Fisher has a 68 million dollar buyout Jimbo does down at A&M. That's absurd. Saban and Meyer are both about 38 million. A bunch of guys in the $30 million there. Harbaugh's is a little less. Pac-12 doesn't pay their guys as much. Chris Peterson's about $4.5 million, depending on what you read. Pac-12 only has two of the top 25

coaches. The reason I'm bringing all those things up is that I could understand if I were a football coach, ultimately, I'd want to test myself against professionals and do that. But the job's entirely different. Some people love the idea of free agency and dealing with adults. Even if guys screw up, there's not that many of them. They're not kids. And that's how you run your business. And you're coaching on Sundays.

Totally understand that. I think there are other people that go, I don't have to worry about free agency. If I'm one of the brands, we're going to recruit ourselves. And if I'm really good at recruiting, I can go out and demolish it. And maybe I just liked the college atmosphere a little bit better. I've always thought Saban would want to try to go to the pros again. Um, and ironically, the rumor used to always be that Cleveland was going to offer him so much money. He couldn't say no, but now he's making the money at Alabama that people thought he would be offered at Cleveland years and years ago. If I'm Matt Campbell and Matt Iowa State, that's an entirely different situation.

People arguing he doesn't want to leave. How do you leave Iowa State for... Well, you leave Iowa State for the NFL. Sorry, Ames, but that's kind of the way it works. I do think there are a lot of these guys, the Lincoln types, as I mentioned before, Kingsbury, if you ever lost a job at Tech. But Tech's actually pretty good, even though they're loss to Iowa state, I actually think they've been

better this year and it's in Lubbock. So, you know, the leash is going to be a lot longer for Kingsbury because he's their guy, but all of these young dudes are going to start getting offers in the NFL. And I wonder how many of them that are getting paid a lot of money in college would actually think the job is that much better because I don't think it is. I think there's some jobs there where I go, you know what? I don't I don't know that I want I can be competitive. It could be my dream. Maybe I prefer the NFL, but if it's not my dream, even though I'm competitive, I think there's just so many so many great jobs in college that I think, do I want to go and see if I can be 9-7 in the NFL?

And that's what the Browns are going to be facing. I want to remind everybody that Dual Threat with Ryan Russillo is brought to you by Burrow. Burrow makes clever, uncompromising furniture for modern life at home. And as the days get shorter, the weather gets colder, and football, NHL, and NBA are in full swing, you know you're going to be spending more time at home on the couch. Make sure that's time well spent with a sofa from Burrow. Burrow sofas are handmade in North Carolina with sturdy, sustainably sourced hardwood, scratch-resistant fabric, and a built-in USB charger. This is amazing. Burrow is designed for comfort because you know how there's always a

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B-U-R-R-O-W.com slash dual to get $75 off your order. Thanks again to Burrow for supporting the show. This week in Chris Fowler trivia, how many of the top five defenses are in the playoffs today in the NFL three? Chicago, Cleveland, Baltimore, Seattle, Houston. Those are your top five defenses. Chicago's in, Seattle's in, Houston's in. Cleveland, Baltimore would be out. Tweet that pissed me off. As we mentioned earlier with Connell,

benefit of the doubt is human. Benefit of the doubt is real. And if you're saying Bama hasn't played anybody, we don't know how good they are when they've destroyed teams. And yes, there's conference schedule hasn't been strong. They're out of conference schedule was bad and they're going to have another bad non-conference game, but they've been doing this for a decade. And you're just, you really aren't just a hater. You're just a hater if you're doing this. hater. You're just a hater if you're doing this. And you could even argue that Clemson's schedule isn't even that great, but they're out of conference is A&M. Like that's a real tough, you know, and they're going to play South Carolina, you know, so when, when it's all said and done, I don't want to hear about Clemson's schedule not being good when the ACC was down because they went out and they tried to schedule a couple of teams here. So this is from a guy who chimed in and said, the problem with your argument is that the strength of schedule

is used against all teams except Bama. So Bama, who has proven to be a championship team in the past few years, doesn't have to face the challenges of more difficult schedules, i.e. injuries out of conference road games, etc. If Bama's not good, we'll find out. Against LSU, maybe not against Auburn, because I think Auburn is one of those teams that's really talented that isn't even close to being what they thought they were going to be,

and those teams sometimes are easier to beat on Saturdays than lesser-talented teams because their expectations were so high, and Stidham's back, and defensive guys they have, and some of these younger running backs who I love. They're a talented team, and they don't have it. Those teams are really weird to play at the end of the year, but you think Auburn's going to get up for that one because it's Auburn-Alabama.

So if you're watching Alabama on a Saturday destroy another team and you go, well, we still don't know yet, when they've been number one for 11 straight years at some point in the AP rankings, then you just hate them. You just do. You hate them. And that was the original point of the tweet. Please subscribe to Dual Threat, rate and review. Subscribe again. Tell your mom to subscribe. Tell her what's up. That sounded creepy. Probably shouldn't have done it that way. Anyway, on the road, I'm not going to be on the road every week, but we will be ready to go right after the college football playoff rankings. Rob Mullins, the chair will be joining us. Hopefully I want to do it next week.

I'm putting him on the spot here because we didn't talk about any of the ranking stuff. If any of you are worried about that, we didn't, but we will on the podcast and he said he's going to come on. So that's cool. He's awesome. And I don't know if he can't do it next week. We won't do it next week, but we will do it with him at some point, at least once in the season, because I think that'd be a lot of fun for everybody. Have a great week. I can't wait to get down to Louisiana. I will update you on all that. Uh, at Ryan A. Brasillo, I'll be at the Nissan Heisman house at some point on Saturday in Baton Rouge saying, hello, I'll take pictures. I'm not gonna throw up any gang signs, but I'll just, I'll maybe a thumbs up, a hearty thumbs up

for me.