The Ryen Russillo Podcast - Lamar Jackson’s Contract Problem, Worst Take, Plus Chris Fowler on 'GameDay' Stories and His Career

Episode Date: September 14, 2022

Russillo shares his thoughts on Lamar Jackson and the Ravens not reaching a new contract (0:33), before he is joined by ABC and ESPN’s Chris Fowler to discuss the U.S. Open, the unique approach to broadcasting tennis, meticulous college football prep, stories from his many years on 'College GameDay,' his start in covering sports, and more (15:14). Then Ryen debuts the inaugural segment of Worst Take (1:10:12), before answering some listener-submitted Life Advice questions (1:24:10). Host: Ryen Russillo Guest: Chris Fowler Producers: Kyle Crichton and Steve Ceruti Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

today's podcast is one of my favorite interviews i've ever done we got chris fowler on his career espn stories uh i think he's so good at what he does and you're gonna know why after you listen to this interview the facts about why lamar jack Jackson doesn't have a contract and we'll look at a little history with other quarterbacks. Worst take podium nominations. Our first ever and life advice. Enjoy. This is something that I wanted to do Monday

but was going to do that for the first week of the NFL and all the college football stuff. I want to talk about Lamar Jackson's contract. Alright, the headline is Lamar doesn't have a new contract. There's multiple theories on this. The headline could be Ravens make offer. The headline could be Lamar wants

historic contract, but we know right now the season starts, terrific quarterback, guy has an MVP, he doesn't have a new contract. So what's going on? Multiple theories on why that is. One was that he doesn't have an agent. We're going to get into what the offers really are and what was reported. I don't know that that's necessarily the case. For some people, there's times where I don't like to compare my experience with agents

to somebody who's an NFL MVP. So maybe I just don't. I don't know. There are times, though, I think if you're a person that has representation, you're in a field that has representation, there's times where you probably didn't need one and maybe you're paying too much for it. Sometimes you're definitely paying too much for it. And then there's other times where you're like, this is this opportunity that comes along where you're like, oh, this is just better. I also think there's something too that is just to your advantage by having somebody else argue your position,

because as somebody who's not had an agent at certain times so i guess i actually am doing this um it's just weirder when you're telling the person who's in charge of paying people why you should be making more than other people people just don't really like that uh i've been told that straight up my face like why are you comparing yourself to other contracts just like because that's literally what everybody does and i would just be paying somebody else 10 to do the exact same thing um and in this case, Lamar Jackson is comparing himself to other quarterback contracts because that's the way business works and it's what Lamar should be doing. So I want to go back, as always, and try to sit through all these different theories and land on something that I think is fairly obvious. Because there was another theory too that it was like, wait,

is the team maybe on the fence about him a little bit? I am a big, big fan of having an opinion on a quarterback and then when the team does something with the quarterback I either love or don't like, then I can feel validated. I'm on an absolute heater, by the way, of quarterbacks and how I felt about them. And then the team ultimately does something that reinforces everything I thought about the quarterback. Jimmy Garoppolo getting benched for Trey Lance. I feel like that's a W. I know this hurts for Rudy, but Alex Smith got benched twice for Kaep. I feel like that's a W. I know this hurts for Rudy, but Alex Smith got benched twice for Kaepernick

and then Mahomes. You could say, wait, are you kidding me? He got benched for Mahomes. Okay, fine. But he also got benched for Kaepernick. The Kirk Cousins stuff in Washington. Not many of us respect anything that Washington's football team has done over the years.

But I'm going to get to Cousins a little bit later when we start talking about franchise tags. I love that Washington was just like, yeah, you know, you put up some numbers. but we just don't think you're that good. And we don't want to pay you. And we're not. And there you go. It also worked out for Cousins.

Did not work out for Washington. But those are quarterbacks where I was like, wait, is there my right to be hesitant? Will the team do anything that confirms that? And those are just four transactional examples that I can give you. And there's a lot more, but I'm not going to get hesitant. Will the team do anything that confirms that? And those are just four transactional examples that I can give you. And there's a lot more, but I'm not going to get caught getting into all that right now. So let's go back into history and try to figure out what this means. So all we have to do is look at Dak Prescott's contract negotiation. Before we get to any of the Lamar numbers, Dak, I think, is a good template for trying to figure out Lamar's

situation. So Dak and the Cowboys were working on a contract, working on a new deal in 2020. Ezekiel Elliott had just gotten a six-year, $90 million deal in 2019. I remember as that happened, an NFL source telling me that Zeke's agents knew there was one place that was going to do one of these old-school running back contracts, and it was Dallas. And they did it. And they got their money, a lot of guaranteed money in there for running back. That contract has been a disaster. Zeke, oh, it isn't even close to being that dynamic anymore.

And, you know, if you say they're the only team that would have done it, to be fair, the Rams gave Todd Gurley a contract that made zero sense at the time as well. So there was a motivation from Dak's camp to go, wait, if they're going to give Ezekiel Elliott running back money from, again, not the total number of money, but prioritize him like a 1990s running back, then we can probably do all right. But at the time, there were multiple theories about why Dak wasn't going to get paid.

Chris Sims, who we've had on the podcast, at the time reported that Dak had turned down five years $175 million. That was a $35 million average annual salary. Now, Rappaport, great lighting, refuted this later, but it was refuted based on the tweet that I saw. Rappaport was saying his agents refute Chris Sims or whatever. It got kind of turned into this stew of who's right and who's wrong. on that podcast in 2020 in the fall as you were again talking about Dak we're like yeah I'd heard he turned down actually like over a hundred million dollars in guaranteed money and there's a big dispute over the fourth year versus the fifth year and that Dak wants the shorter deal

and he wants more guaranteed money and he wants to get closer up one of the top guarantees that we've seen in the NFL at that position I felt really good about that we shared it top guarantees that we've seen in the NFL at that position. I felt really good about that. We shared it. And this isn't one of those, you know, we need to all do a better job of like the layman reaction to like, he turned down a hundred million guaranteed or Lamar Jackson turned down how much guaranteed he turned down.

These are special people. Most of us are not. So whenever you're like, oh, you know, you know you could just pay you know just give me the 100 million you're like no because no one's offering it to you no one's offering to you all right so no new deal for Dak in that 2020 fall reports about what he'd actually but it was very clear he turned and it was clear to me based on what I talked about in the pocket he had turned down a nine-figure guarantee but it wasn't enough because he wanted a shorter deal. So what happens with Dak?

He plays five games, breaks his leg, and it was a bad one. If it was an arm, we wouldn't have cared as much. Breaks his leg, everyone freaks out. Dak, Dak, Dak should have gotten paid after the season, March 21st. He signs a four-year deal, $160 million, puts him above everybody else on average annual salary behind Mahomes, and signs for $15 million less guaranteed than Patrick Mahomes. Everything worked out for Dak. All the theories were wrong. He broke his leg and still got paid the second highest quarterback contract at that time of all time. Because if you

cycle out the timing, which has a lot to do with how quarterbacks get paid, the newest guy, it's not the better guy, it's usually the newest guy gets the better deal. You can see the way agents will do these in some of the announcements. Let's look at Kyler Murray's deal. Kyler Murray's deal was July 22. He had five years, $230 million, $185 million guaranteed. Kyler Murray has the second highest guarantee in NFL history. And because there was a weird clause in there that didn't make a ton of sense, people actually felt bad for him on Twitter. All right.

Russell Wilson signs in September. And guess what he does? He does five years at 242.5 million because Kyler's number said a previous number. And the reason Kyler got 230.5 is because Watson got 230 million, but Watson got an unprecedented and what makes a lot of people feel bad about the first ever $230 million guarantee because Cleveland wanted him that bad. All right. So let's go back to what we're looking at here with Lamar. Lamar reports, before we found out what the numbers were, that he wanted a fully guaranteed deal. So he wanted five years, and whatever his number was going to be,

he wanted that to be just like Deshaun Watson. He feels like, look at me. I've been in the playoffs. I've got the MVP. I think in a vacuum, more people would prefer Deshaun Watson, the football player. That's all I'm talking about here, the football player. But I can understand Lamar's position on this. I'm going to be doing my deal later.

All these other guys have gotten paid. I want to keep it moving. Pay me the full guarantee because now we have a precedent for so chris mortensen adam schefter reported that jackson turned down five years 250 million so we're going to push that number way beyond the 230 million but only 133 million guaranteed now because of lamar and the way he plays i've seen this argued well of course lamar wants the guaranteed money because look at the way he plays, which I do think ironically is an argument to not guarantee him all that money. But $133 million guaranteed, forget what the average annual salary is, okay? Forget what that is.

$133 million isn't going to cut it anymore because as we look at the recent deals, Rogers, he got all $150 million of his extension guaranteed, whatever, but that's still north of what Jackson would be. Wilson got $160 million of his new deal in September guaranteed. Jackson's under that. Kyler, again, $189, $190 million of his deal. That was in July guaranteed. Watson, as we mentioned. And then Mahomes' deal is just weird.

He's 10 years, $450 million. His average annual salary is now below like five other guys. That'll clearly get reworked. I don't know that Kansas City would mess with their quarterback and say, hey, we gave you a deal where we all decided that it would get torn up later on, but actually we're going to use that low number to negotiate against you because now we have leverage. I don't think they're going to do that with the best quarterback perhaps of all time. Again, that's a little early. He's got some resume work to do there. If Lamar wants to turn this down, that's a little early. He's got some resume work to do there. So if Lamar wants to turn this down, that's within his right because here's the problem for Jackson. He can turn that down. He is worth more, but it's not like Lamar, man, that team doesn't like them.

Are there doubts? What's going on? What kind of theories can we come up with? Why is Lamar Jackson isn't being paid? Well, it's because he wants way more guaranteed money than he's being offered, but the Ravens are smart and making the headline part of it be like, wait a minute, it's 250 million. Hey, it's all going to work out. And hey, we're going to do all these different things. He needs more guaranteed money. And that's fine. But the reason the Ravens can offer this is because they have the tag leverage. And that's why I hate the franchise tag, because it prevents true free agency. The non-exclusive tag for Lamar for next year will be 32 million. That means another team can offer him a deal. The Ravens have five days to match. The more likely exclusive tag where you can't do anything except keep him for the one year is 46 million. That means another team can offer him a deal. The Ravens have five days to match. The more likely exclusive tag where you can't do anything except keep him for the one year is 46 million. Now the tag can work out for the player. They don't like it, but it can work out for the player. You get tagged with 46, you play it out one more year, and then you hit free agency again, unless they wanted to hit back-to-back tags, which is actually what Kirk Cousins did. Kirk Cousins, because Washington kind of liked him, didn't love him,

is actually what Kirk Cousins did. Kirk Cousins, because Washington kind of liked him, didn't love him, they didn't want to give him that long-term deal. So in 16, they tagged him at just about $20 million. The next year, they tagged him again at $24 million. And then he was a true free agent because they couldn't do it again. And Minnesota paid him three years and $84 million, all of it guaranteed for, I believe, the first time ever, setting a new precedent. If you look at all the years from 2016 to 2023, Kirk Cousins is going to do eight years, $229 million, where the average annual salary actually dips a little lower than you expect because the early tag years drag that average down. So there's a version of events here where Lamar gets tagged and then hits it again. But this is just very simple. The guaranteed number is too

low, even though the new big number would be the biggest ever, and that's how it would be announced. I don't blame Lamar for turning this down. I don't really blame the Ravens for having that leverage. Sometimes you think, do you really want to mess with your quarterback? But that's all this is, and it's just like Dak. And it's probably, if Lamar has a good season, or even if he gets hurt, just like with Dak, he's probably going to get paid. But the Ravens, and apparently Lamar, not in a hurry to get something done that they don't want right now.

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Tennessee Red Line, 1-800-889-9789. Tennessee, 1-800-522-4700. Wyoming, or visit 1-800-GAMBLER.NET in West Virginia. Our guest today is somebody I'm really excited to have on the podcast. Everybody knows that I'm a huge fan. I think he's one of the most talented people that works in media. I got a chance to kind of, I wouldn't say shadow or travel. We were just in the same area for College Game Day on TV and radio and from ESPN. And coverage of the U.S. Open as well as Chris Fowler. Thanks a lot for doing this, Chris. How are you?

It's my pleasure, man. I'm a fan, so it's good to talk to you. Nice to reconnect. When I watch the U.S. Open, I don't plan my day around it. But then when I turn it on, I go, I'm not doing anything else. I love it. I'm lucky enough to have gone live. on, I go, I'm not doing anything else. I love it. I've, I'm lucky enough to have gone live.

And, you know, we had a, we had a new group, which historically when you start thinking about the big three guys and how long they, like some of the stats that came up, I go, I can't believe how dominant these three players have been. What is it about tennis? What is it about the love for the sport for you? Yeah, I, I went to one of the few sports that actually had some skill and talent in as a kid. So I played it when I was younger. And I think I was drawn to the sport in the early 70s. Jimmy Connors was coming along. It's weird to work with Chrissy Everett because like these younger guys are starting to have their way with some of the legends because I could relate more to younger players. So in the early 70s, I began to follow the sport, got lucky enough that we finally got enough tennis at ESPN in the early 2000s that they let me do it, go off of basketball, join tennis sort of on a full-time basis in 2003, and just been covering majors since then. I've actually called way more tennis matches than football games and enjoy it equally. But yeah, it's just, it takes you great places around the world, as you know, including New York City and Wimbledon. And yeah, I feel a genuine enthusiasm for calling a first-round match at some small tournament as I do calling a big final or a football game. I've just always gotten the same kind of pleasure.

I love the people we work with. The tennis team is awesome. So there's really nothing I don't like about it. Yeah, the longevity of the sport is like some of the things that we're seeing with brady or lebron james like you're just starting to see different things i think on the female side too like historically some players have longevity others completely burn out so when you look at somebody like serena with that resume and to finish in new york city and to have like every moment for her felt like you were watching history again. What's it been like following her entire arc that

is as impressive as any single player? Yeah, it sure is. I mean, on the men's side, you get the big three, but Serena sort of stood alone on the women's side since she emerged from Venus's shadow. Yeah, I was down there in 2003 at the Australian Open, had no business really calling women's final. I wasn't experienced enough at that point, but they asked me to do it. And Serena completes the Serena slam by beating Venus in the final. So I feel privileged to have been ringside for a lot of her great moments. Also called some bitter disappointments, which have happened later in your career. But there's an energy about her that comes through the screen, that connects across the landscape, not just tennis not just sports fans and that was never you know more pronounced than at this u.s open where her matches just became events and the buzz was incredible i wish she could have kept going

a couple more rounds got to call her first two her third match i was in columbus getting ready for ohio state notre dame when she lost and i was thinking oh if she just got that one more could have come back sunday and picked up the story. But it had to end at some point. But yeah, I mean, so, so privileged, Ryan, just to call her matches. What a fighter, what a symbol, what an example, just a source of strength and empowerment for not just women. I try to make this point. It's not just women, it's not just people of color. It's everybody who tunes in, I think can gain strength and inspiration from her example. All the years of college football, you know, and, and I don't know if ego is the right

word for some of the head coaches over the years, but there, there can be some similarities. And then when we realize the differences, it can be just as fascinating because you'd be like, no, every coach thinks he can do it somewhere else. Every coach wants the next challenge. All of these athletes, like they doubt themselves the least when we're feeding them with doubt. So when you think about Serena's personality and getting to know her again, this is almost 20 years for you. Are there more similarities that you see with her or more things that you think stand out and make her different? I mean, similar to other players or great athletes? Yeah, just great, great figures in sports like she is. I think she's got it in common that she's been fueled by doubt of other people. I mean,

she gains strength from that. She always thinks of herself as being an underdog, which is ironic because she's the ultimate favorite. She's always expected to win every time she takes the court in her prime years, for sure, which is about 20 years. But she sees herself as a girl from Compton who grew up playing with Venus on the public courts and came as an outsider and sort of imposed herself in a sport that initially wasn't that accepting. And so I think she carries that with her in the way that Jordan did, many other athletes, even though they became incredibly successful and dominant in their sport, they still saw themselves as being doubted and fueled by, you know, Michael, you know, missing the cut in high school basketball. I think he never got over that. And the fact that

Serena was in her big sister's shadow and watched Venus succeed earlier and watched Venus drum her when they played head-to-head. I think that's part of it, too. You can't discount the fact that she was always the younger sister who was fighting and striving to catch up to Venus, and that just continued to fuel her. But it's hard to really put into words because I don't think there's a lot of athletes that are in that category at all in any sport. So to say that she's got things in common, yeah, but she's got them in greater degree, in a deeper reservoir. And it is physically amazing. I mean, she mentally lasted after 40.

She won Grand Slam while pregnant. She came back after giving birth and being a mom and playing in four more Grand Slam finals. We don't see that. That just doesn't happen. happen there you go that was exactly the answer that i wanted that's why you're just so good at this uh calling tennis call you are terrific on laying out it's an instinct it's one of the tariko things that he told me when i first got started he goes the times you don't speak make the times you do speak that much stronger. The points you make versus the points you don't make. Don't try to make 10, make two good ones.

How have you developed the instinct to know when to let the crowd tell the moment? Good question. Thank you, by the way. Part of it is it's hard to yell over the crowd. Good question. Thank you, by the way. Part of it is it's hard to yell over the crowd at the U.S. Open. I mean, it is so loud that if you try to talk right after a point or when they're going crazy, you just get smothered. That's part of it. Wimbledon is very different. Wimbledon, we're in a glass booth. It's not open air. So when you're yelling, you're yelling in a very small room and it feels a little weird. But I think with tennis,

if you want to get weedy for just a second, how you do it, football is a see it, say it sport. So is hockey, basketball. They move so quickly. When you see it, you have only a split second to filter it. You're picking your words very much on the fly. In tennis, when you watch a point unfold, if it's a lengthy rally, you might have 10 things pop into your head. What am I going to say when the rally's over? But then it continues, and you see some other shot, and forget that. And you're constantly editing in your head. And sometimes you end up saying nothing at the end of a point. You shelve all of it because the point speaks for itself.

We had a lot of that in the last few rounds as Carlos Alcaraz was making his run to the trophy. His matches were electric. There wasn't much to say. You know, it's also like one or two in the morning when people are watching, so you don't need to be screaming at them. I think that the crowd largely speaks for itself

and the pictures speak for themselves in tennis. So I enjoy that piece of it. You know, you begin to think about what am I going to say to frame this match when it's done? And you can't script that ahead of time because it changes 10 times in the course of a three or four hour match. Right. So there's a lot of that thinking on the fly, editing and then having the sense to shut up and not say anything quite often. And John and Patrick are very good at that, too. John was in the booth. Patrick McEnroe was, was on the court. So it's an interesting three person dance. They have good chemistry, obviously hardwired as brothers. And it's, it's a challenge

that all three of us take on to, to share the oxygen in the, in the broadcast and also not, not drown it out. So, you know, you said something in the beginning when you were like, hey, in 2003, I probably shouldn't even be calling a final, you know, and you're thinking, okay, when a guy's been at ESPN since 1986, like why, and knowing you, you know, we're not, I think I know a little bit about you, that you're holding yourself to a standard, and that has more to do with what you think about the job that you're doing,

whereas when I watch you on game day, I'm like, this guy is so locked in, no teleprompter, all the prep and all this stuff. It's just if people truly understood it, and I didn't understand until I worked in television, worked in radio to go like, okay, this guy is doing something different. What kind of standard do you hold yourself to under college football? Because a little bit later than the Saturday night game became your game, the big bowl games, and of course, the national championship.

What did you do to get better at it? Because I'm sure that's kind of how you looked at it and evaluating yourself. I think you always have to improve. I still want to get better at it. I still think I can. I think I need to. It's not just, you know, it's a wish. It's essential to continue to want to improve. I felt it's been tough to improve in football the last few years because we had the COVID year with empty stadiums, no energy, no access to players and coaches like we had before. So I really felt like it was impossible to meet that standard. I had to sort of modify it a bit. 21, we got a little bit better. It's totally different than covering tennis. Tennis, you prepare not having to really learn the personalities or the names. Obviously, there's two people on a court, so you can take a deeper dive.

Football, I think college football, firstly, is the most challenging sport to call. Others might dispute that. I've done only two NFL games, but the roster size is smaller, Ryan. We know that. The tempo offenses in college have made it different. We can't have a broadcast sound like Keith Jackson sounded or, you know, Kirk Gowdy or the great, even Brent. I mean, things have changed so much

that the audience has changed. The tempo of the sport has changed. It's gotten faster and louder. I don't just mean the broadcasters. So adapting to that and then still trying to to layer in, prepare better, be more efficient. Like, I didn't meet my standard at Ohio State Notre Dame. Just wasn't good enough.

Was bothered by it. Part of it is that you, you know, no excuses, but you are doing tennis for four days. Serena's matches take a ton of energy. It is the first time I've done that particular job in about nine months. So I thought I sucked in certain places in that game in ways that you hope not too many viewers notice, but I certainly noticed. I don't know if Kirk felt to that degree, but I think we felt like it could have been a lot better. And so it was cool to be able to go back the next day and call tennis, just cleanse the palate. Football, when you don't have

a broadcast that measures up, when the game's a blowout and you waste all this time preparing and you don't use any of the stuff because it's a 30-point game in the second quarter. We had a whole season of that, by the way. Every game we did was like that. And then you've got to wait a whole week to try to meet your standard again. So the rhythm of the sport is tough when you're not feeling good about how things are. But, again, I think I can do a pretty good job. It's just, I'm trying to meet my own standard and that's really what matters to me. Not, not any kind of pundit or critic or you gotta pay attention to your customers, whether

they're satisfied or not matters, but, but they're never going to judge it as harshly as I am. Wow. Okay. Did you watch or did you just know, did you go back and watch any of it? I didn't have time to watch it. Typically I would, but we were right into the second week of the Open. Usually it feels a lot better when you watch it back than when you felt when you watched it, you heard it live. I just, you know, there was a couple of calls. It just wasn't a good night that I wanted it to be.

And, you know, then you see the 10 million people watch the game. Okay. That was one of the higher watched regular season games in a while. I wish i'd nailed every call um we we got we we got the plot lines basically right it's just that the mechanics of the job right so um i feel like you're on a tightrope a lot when these tempo offenses you're just trying to balance um the the speed of of which you you're sort of calling things and again, not trying to sound frantic,

which is hard when you get two up-tempo offenses going against each other and you just have to be disciplined and pull back and offer less. A story might be a great personal interest story. Might be one line. You might have to have a one line version of that ready. Then you maybe have a two or three line version ready if you get a breath. And then you have, okay, if something really happens, we have a stoppage of play. I can tell the whole story about his grandfather or this or that or whatever the story is. But often you don't get time to do that. So I started in play

by play, which is a joke because I had never done it. And the minor league baseball team was like, you have a deep voice and no one listens. And when you said it's baseball, see it, say it on radio, I didn't quite understand the advantage that I had. Because if it's on radio, make sure you get it all. And then you can tell everybody what happened. And nobody's going to know the difference. But I prepped like crazy because I was insecure. I prepped like crazy. I was insecure i prepped like crazy i would be like all right two two foul the way well he was a rule five draft pick and dot dot

dot dot and it's like when you're young you go well i prepped it i wrote it down in my notes i have to use it at some point and as you get older you get more experience you realize like you might use 10 of this it's there to be there but it's not there because you have to use it and then i did a couple nba games which is insane that i ever did NBA games, but it was only because I was at the affiliate and that was free. I wasn't going to cost him anything. So I never, I never quite got it down, but the storytelling part of it is, is great because in blowouts, you're going to have to have the story. And this is what I like about you and Kirk so much. And I've said it to Kirk. So he knows this as well is you've been a part of the college football world now for decades

and you intertwine the game with the important stories as well as any broadcast team going right now, because you know, not to like, Hey, I have the story. I need to use it. If it doesn't fit with the story that's happening on the field, then we don't need it. And let's, let's intertwine it. And the other thing that I like about you, and this is because of the experience, because I noticed it this weekend with lesser experienced teams is those production meeting moments where some of them are great. Some of it is an incredible insight and some of it is just absolute bullshit peddling. And they want you and Kirk so badly to talk up what this program is about now

or what this new coach has instilled and how they're aggressive and there's just a different vibe. And you two are so seasoned that you're not going to fall for that, I think, the way others would that aren't in the college football world as long as you have been in it. I know exactly what you mean. I listen to a ton of games. I screen a whole bunch of games.

I'm not going to disparage anybody specifically, but I know what you're saying. It's very evident that they are compelled to be mouthpieces for the program, for the coach, for the player. And that's normal. I mean, you get enthusiastic about a program when you're around it. It's hard to not have that happen. I mean, look, when you're very impressionable,

when you're younger, you're not around it as much. It's hard to resist that. So go ahead mean, look, when you're very impressionable, when you're younger, you're not around it as much. It's hard to resist that. So go ahead. Yeah, no, you're exactly right. And I think also, too, you know, let's say you got some I do dive into analytics. I have a person that I hire, a young person specifically to go around the databases of pro football focus on our databases. We take a lot of it in. You can really ruin a broadcast by overusing it, but I like to

have it there. If a DB is getting picked on in this game, I like to know whether that's par for the course or that's the exception. If a guy is not run blocking well, I want to know what his grade was. Is this an off night for him or is this a problem area for this team? You don't always get that from the coach. That's another example. There's the production meeting stuff. There's what you see at practice. There's what you see on tape, which generally is more the analyst world. I mean, Kirk is tremendous at looking at tape. And a lot of what you're going to hear in a broadcast comes from his own eyes. He's going to value that way more than the data or what a coach tells him. So, you know, there's all these different things that sort of compete for your bandwidth. And then, as you said, a small amount actually gets

on the air. So I always tell young people who do this, I don't think you can over-prepare, but you can absolutely overuse your preparation. And, you's, if it's Keely Ringo making a pick six to seal, I still get goosebumps thinking about that moment. That's one of my favorite things I've been able to call. And the story about his mom having cancer, we didn't get that in all game, but he just, it just didn't fit. And the game was frantic and the game was close and it's in doubt, but he makes a pick six to steal the championship and he's overcome as he would be and just have just knowing that story by the backs of what his mom had had to do struggling to get to his games and how much her example of strength meant to him eventually found its way in at the

very last minute of the game but we had it there and it fit. It's just you often hear, and I've been guilty of it many times, until you figure it out a little bit better, you smother a game because you want to just get stuff in, get stuff in, and it takes a lot of restraint. What's your favorite game that you've called? I mean, your national championship run of the Clemson back-to-backs and then the Georgia first Bama one with the Tua comeback and all that. What's the one moment that resonates with you the most?

I'll give you three examples. The two Rose Bowls, the USC-Penn State, the wild game when it was Saquon and Juju going crazy and there's a touchdown, I think on four or five consecutive plays. It was crazy. That's the Sam Darnold one, right? Pardon? Sam Darnold, quarterback. Yeah, USC held on late win, but it was McSorley and Saquon. They're two amazing offenses.

And the Rose Bowl, it was just an exhibition game. You just, that's sacrilege, but it wasn't a playoff game. And then the next year, we get the Georgia-Oklahoma OT playoff game at the Rose Bowl. So the setting of that place elevates whatever happens on it so i always have a special feeling for calling rose bowls those two games stood out even more than than the championship games i was sick as a dog the georgia bama game in atlanta i had like a fever i probably would have tapped had it been a regular season game or at least you you know, considered it because I really had no business working. And so that game was a total

blur. Like the one that Devante Smith catches the touchdown and win. I mean, there's pieces of that game. I don't really remember. I had to go see Scott, our buddy on the set. I was like shivering. I was, I was just really sick in that game. So that was not a favorite game, even though calling on a walk-off touchdown to win a championship, I might never do that again. But that wouldn't rank there. People are surprised just because I felt like shit the whole night. And there's one other game, Ryan, which was a regular season game, which hardcores will remember. It's the Tyler Trent game at Purdue when Purdue upset Ohio State. Both guys were a huge favorite. We were very dialed in on Tyler's story. Both Kirk and I knew him, knew his family. And man, I get emotional thinking about it. He shows up there at the game. Somehow, he was suffering big time. They got him to the car,

they got him to the stadium, they got him to the press box. And he had the one wish as he was fighting cancer, which was to see Purdue upset Ohio State, for him to be there to see it. And it was just a magical night. And Ohio State was much better, but Purdue couldn't lose. Rondell Moore was making plays. There were a lot of great touchdown calls there. And I still am, I'm getting slightly, I'm fighting it off, but I get very emotional thinking about that game just because of what it meant. Cancer has touched so many of our lives, mine included, in terms of loved ones. And it was just powerful, man.

I knew that I probably would never call anything like that again. And sometimes on the anniversary of that game or Tyler's passing, you know, they'll get reposted or I get messages about it. And, man, that's right there because I don't think I'll quite experience those emotions ever again. When you were on game day, I loved that I knew that you could go

toe-to-toe with anyone on the information part of it. You know what I mean? Really. We had a couple moments on the road. I never forget a and m it was the rematch manziel against bama you know game two that was a college station and we were we were in the hotel lobby i think there was live music and i came in from a dinner and you know we didn't screw around on friday nights because you had a show to do the next day and i see you in the lobby and you've got all these notes out and i sat down I had a beer with you. And this, this, you know, again, it meant a lot to me this moment because I was like,

what's going on? You know, and you were kind of your own way. And I'm also that way. So in the beginning, I didn't really know, you know, like I didn't expect we were going to be best friends. I remember asking Billy Fairweather about you one time. And Billy was like, okay, I can't wait to hear what he has to say. He goes, well, fella, you know, he's, uh, he's living in Aspen. He's living in New York city's in Manhattan and, you know, he's living in Aspen.

He's living in New York City. He's in Manhattan. You know, his wife's into fitness. You know, he's wired a little different, kid. He's not going to give a shit about you. So I was like, you know. That's a good Boston Billy impression, by the way. For people who don't know what he sounds like, that's pretty damn close.

Yeah. Well, I've spent some time with him. i we've been able to get it down so uh you know you're sitting there with all your notes out and you're getting ready and i you know i'd heard i remember fitting being like you have no idea man he's he's an alien he's an alien like he's not going to use he's not going to do any of these things how did you how did you define the way you anchor game day which i don't think is going to happen anymore? I don't know if that host, but I'm not afraid to be an analyst here when I need to do it. I don't think that exists.

And of course, I've tried to do it. And I just don't think people don't like it. And in television, I don't think it's going to happen. I think people have tried. I don't think that's ever going to be repeated the way you did that show. Well, the span of the show, Ryan, was so it grew and changed so much. So in 1990, we're in the studio. It's me and Corso.

Vino was there sometimes. It was a half hour and nobody watched the game after that. It had no footprint. It was on life support. So we nurtured it a little bit. I mean, the core group of people. But then if you're sitting with Corso, how can you not play analyst? He's going to say some of the craziest shit that has to be checked.

You have to counter it, you know, the same way. So I think of college football being such a sport driven by opinions, it lends itself much more to that kind of a host role than maybe NFL, NBA. I don't know something else. When I was doing horse racing, I was not offering opinions that would counter what Jerry Bailey and Randy Moss were saying. OK, I knew my lane and I've done plenty of things like that. X games, NASCAR, there's going to be no opinions from me because nobody cares. I'm not qualified, but football, you got to have an opinion if you're going to sit in a seat.

And it was such a small task that I, now you got like, I looked at game day, there's six dudes on the set. I think Reese's role is different when you've got five other people up there. Certainly, you're much more point guard and less two guard in that role. Or you use a quarterback who gets the ball out of their hands very quickly and lets the playmakers do their thing. I used to scramble quite a bit. I enjoyed that. if you want to beat the analogy up, I think that I do come from this planet, by the way, I wasn't dropped off here and I'm thoroughly human with all the foibles and all the weaknesses. No, but it's funny. Cause I, when I met you, I mean, I probably gave the impression that I said that I don't give a shit about people. I did feel a huge responsibility when I was doing that show and it all came to a head on Friday night because it is unprompted. It is unscripted. And it changes a lot. And as you know, in this sport, information comes flooding in late. You get stuff on Thursday and Friday. And as the show grew, it got longer. It got denser. The audience got way better educated. It got longer. It got denser.

The audience got way better educated. I don't want to tell a long story, but when I started doing game day, you couldn't have access to read out of town newspapers. There's a website called e-cola.com where I could go read the paper in Eugene to see what's going on with the ducks. But few people knew how to find that. And that was what the audience was like when we started doing game day. Well, now, of course, I mean, they're so informed. They're so bombarded with information on ESPN all week and other places. You had to try harder. You had to dig

a little deeper, try to be a little smarter than you used to be because the audience was. So all of that stuff i think i felt as a burden i mean tom ronaldi took me aside one time we did game day outside wrigley field which i grew up going to games i'm a cubs fan from birth my grandmother introduced me to sports and the cubs to have game day there was a special thing and he kind of like metaphorically like shook me by the head and said are are you not enjoying this? Because it doesn't look like you're having that much fun. And, you know, and he said, you have to show your gratitude. You have to show your appreciation. He didn't say it that way,

but that was the message. And he's absolutely right. It was an important conversation because when you're in that position, other people do look to you. And if you're not showing your joy, they're probably not feeling it. If you're in a bad mood, they can be in a bad mood. There's responsibility when you host a show like that. As accomplished and as great a people as they are around you, they still look to that position regardless of who's in it. So I was, for years, very wound up about the burden and the responsibility of doing game day. And Kirk writes in his book about Fowler was intense, brushing his teeth. He was a man. You know, I'm not like that all the time. I'm like that around game day for a period of most of those years. I grew out of that. I'm certainly not like that now. I'm nowhere like that when I'm away from work. I'm actually pretty chill. I have a lot of interests. I'm not, you know, chewing on data 24-7 over here. But I think what I gave off was someone who was uber intense and didn't have time to enjoy Friday nights out on a college town.

I went to Sidelines when I was younger. That was different. I enjoyed the hell out of that. I wasn't carrying the broadcast. I had very little responsibility. And then, you know, I sort of learned, and now calling games on Saturday night, I have a hell of a time on Friday night.

I'm not, I'm not locked in my room in room service. I'm out enjoying life. And that's what I, I don't miss about game day is the wake up calls and that burden. But that's probably what you saw. And that's what a lot of people have talked about who are around game day. And I'll say this too.

On my podcast, Kirk came on with the bear. We told some old stories. There were a lot of years where, and viewers shouldn't have any idea behind this, but it was pretty intense behind the scenes. It wasn't a love fest. It wasn't kumbaya. There were some clashing personalities.

I've talked about this, not at length, but there was a lot that went into getting that show to where we got it. It was just hard-ass work, clash of personalities, strong-willed people and egos. I don't even mean the people on the air, but the putting together of that show was super challenging. And that was reflected in how, how much I felt I had to put into it and how I didn't enjoy life that much. Yeah. That's really interesting, but not surprising. But again, I only have like, I don't pretend to understand all the inner workings, but you know, when you're on the road with it, I used to go watch your show live before I did mine to be inspired, to be energized. And I wouldn't say I'd ever done that about anything else. Cause I would

see it and I would see how control and you're right. It's different. It's a different show. Now that it's bigger, the information, like for me, when I was in college, I had to watch that show before my Saturday started because I was going to learn mountains of information because the access to information really changes the way a lot of the viewing works. One of the things that I and I don't know if this is funny to you or not funny. I think it's 02. I remember watching the selection show for college hoops. Whenever I think about certain things, I have to think about like what my couch and tv setup was and i'd be like okay that's when you were doing

play-by-play my first year so how do you remember the o2 selection show man well i don't i could be off on this i could be off okay but i remember because i liked indiana and i picked indiana against duke in the bracket that year and it was one of the rare times where i tried to do something different it worked out and vital is picking he can't believe all the teams that are being left out and he's just saying it's a tragedy this team's out this team's out and that led to the when you and this is this is different not many anchors would have done this you were like dick you know somebody's gonna be left out and that was the mr fowler when he's just started he got so mad was I don't know if it was the Mr. Fowler. But he's just started. He got so mad was, I don't know if it was the O2.

I could be combining things. We got mad at me plenty, right? I, I have stories about my dad. We, of course I love him. I love,

I know that. Yeah. We were very, very close friends, but I, I, he also, I screamed at him off the air.

I would throw barbs on the air. Cause it was just sort of fun. He could, he could throw back and he, he didn't have a glass jaw. I don't like working with people that are too sensitive. And with Dick, you could throw haymakers and he would just come right back at you and he would be fine.

And that was important to me. But no, he would drive me crazy. I mean, because he wouldn't pay attention. Again, those selection shows, the shows in the NCAA tournament that we did around the games. And we even had the early round games way back then too. So it was a lot of fun to do those shows in the studio, but it was a super challenge because you had Digger, Phelps over there, Dick, they would be clashing, different people. I mean, and Dick just wouldn't

listen to the producer. In the commercial break, he was talking, oh, where's my luggage? Where's my lunch? It was everything but the segment to follow. And that's the only time we had is a little earpiece where, you know, Billy Graff, one of the producers there was telling me,

Mideast region, highlight, bracket, look ahead, tonight's matchups. Then we go to the Southeast and you're trying to take notes and remember it. And that's all you've got.

And he spent the entire commercial grab-assing and talking to people. And it just absolutely boiled over one time. And I don't know, can we say there are any words off limits on this? No, we encourage all words. Forgive people, hide the kids. It has to be told this way

to actually have the impact. Finally, and I had bronchitis, blah, blah, blah. I couldn't, I was coughing. Dale Brown, the LSU ex coach was over here. He and Digger, they're clashing. Vitale's going nuts. This is a super demanding show with a guest analyst. And I was just, I would, I get, I shouldn't have been doing, I shouldn't have been working. I was that sick and he Dick was making life miserable. So finally after the 10th commercial break, he just wouldn't be quiet.

Forgive me, folks. I turned to him. I said, motherfucker, would you shut the fuck up? And he looks at me. And it was like, now, pin drop. It was chaos in the studio. Now it's silence. And it was like, now Kendra.

It was chaos in the studio. Now it's silence. And they're counting, like, seven, six, five, back from commercial break. He goes, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. Takes his live audio mic. He picks it up off his tie. He's going to throw it down and walk off the set.

And we're like, three, two. So at the last second, sits back down, puts the mic on. And he's going, he's giving me like the malocchio. So I know we second, sits back down, puts the mic on and he's going, he's giving me like the Malochio. So I know we're going to have to have a situation. The next commercial, we're going to have to sort this out. In the meantime,

he's a total pro, gets through the segment and he wasn't even bothered. By the end of the show, we're fine. But I sat at his house one in the morning a couple months ago

when I was there for his charity event telling that story. It's my lowest point in broadcasting, the most embarrassing thing I've ever done in front of 30 people in the studio thankfully it wasn't on the air but but that's the sort of that's the sort of uh moment that that duress brings on when you're dealing with a lot of the characters that I've dealt with I've never told that to Corso, though. I've never used those words to Corso. See, I thought when I was watching him, because he didn't want any teams to be out.

And then finally, you got so sick of it in the selection show. You were like, some of these teams have to be out. Then he got mad at you. And I was like, hey, that's an extension of me. I'm on the couch going, hey, we're at 64. Somebody's going to be left out. That story. Every year, the little guy, the champion, the little guy.

Okay, Dick, we're going to exclude Syracuse. No, no, no, no. Syracuse, Jimmy Bayhug. Somebody's going to get excluded. He also, Dick loves to have his correct picks praised. So shows like this, if you didn't say, hey, you got your bracket right. You know, you had Arkansas Little Rock coming through. Awesome job, Dick. Awesome job. You know, if you didn't do enough of that, he would get a little bit bent out of shape. And so we did a show where Dick,

Digger and myself on one desk. And then in the same studio, like right across there is Reese, Jay Billis, and maybe, maybe Brad Doherty or Clark Kellogg. I don't remember who the third guy was. And Reese was handing out bouquets. Spot on, Jay. Great analysis. And Dick had noticed that. I wasn't doing my job praising his picks.

And he let me know that on the air. I want to go over there. I want to get some love. I'm going to go over to that side. I want to go over there. I want to get some love. I'm going to go over to that side. And so I was very, actually very proud of this, Ryan, because it, you know, when you make the crew fall over laughing, I said, well, Dick, fortunately your chair has wheels on it. And you can just, and there's, their problem is solved. And he just like, he just, it just stopped him cold. He had to laugh. The whole, the desk was laughing over there. The crew was falling over. It's just one of those things. I'm not necessarily proud of being a smartass in the moment, but that's why I think fans kind of like those shows, the unscripted free-for-all nature of them.

There's less and less of that. They're getting shows in general, not just to the ESPN. They're getting cleaner, more antiseptic. That kind of thing doesn't happen as much i would i would say um and there are examples of yes i don't mean like the um the opinion driven shows the first take there's plenty of that going on but in terms of the selection shows the the wraparound shows the ncaa tournament the football wraparound shows i think there's there's just less of an appetite for that maybe maybe there should be uh there's too much turnover. The chemistry that is built over time is irreplaceable. You can't fake having that kind of stuff. You know, the radio show with Scott and I, I know it was great.

I know it was something that people really liked. It didn't really turn a corner until like year three. And, you know, this is probably a little different, but I think when the management structure has its own turnover, management will decide, hey, these are my people, and no, no, these are my people, and that person that's aligned with you is out, and now all of a sudden. And so, I don't know how you replicate any of the chemistry that you had, not saying everything

is perfect, but I always feel like at ESPN, there's kind of this OG class that is protected and forever. And if you notice, that group seems to be able to work and kind of jump into different things more seamlessly than when you're asking people that haven't worked together and haven't been challenged in a bunch of different ways,

and then you're making a decision. I'm not even critical of the decision of whatever opportunity it is. It's more of what do you expect when it's such a short timeframe that you're expecting the results that we've seen historically in other shows that had years to develop this stuff. Yeah, that's exactly true.

I also think, too, it's harder and harder for people to remember to be themselves, be authentic and organic. The people I'm talking about, that's who they are. They're not trying to impress. They're not trying to be someone else they've seen on the air because, look, that gets rewarded. That dude's getting paid. He's getting promoted. He's getting sniffs from other networks. I better aim for that. And there's a ton of that at a lot of places in broadcasting. But just the sheer numbers of people we have, that's been a factor too. people we have, that's been a factor too. And then you can't blame them. You're trying to stick out from the pack. You're trying to rise to the level you're talking about where you do have some security. And how do you do that? Well, in some cases, you try to emulate other people that have gotten there. And that might mean you're stepping out of your own lane or not being authentic. I have two more things that I want to get to here.

But I remember Scholastic Sports America, you know, junior high. I'd be like, hey, this guy, I'm 13 evaluating you, Chris. I'm going, this guy's locked in. Like, I know they're using him on some of these high school showcase stuff. But that might be something today, a younger person with an ego and some idea. I mean, like, what are you talking about? I'm going to cover what? Now, take me from Colorado intern to wait two years later, you're at ESPN. But what people don't realize is going from indoor to ESPN in 86, maybe isn, it was not the worldwide leader in anything. I don't even know if it was. I mean, it was seven years old. It broadcast some decent live events. Sports Center was certainly, for sports fans,

it was a godsend that it was an institution. But I thought they were going to be calling me to do Sports Center. And I was a year out of school. I looked 11 years old. When I did that high school show, maybe 10 and a half. I mean, I was so young looking at that time that the idea of putting like Doogie Howser anchor on SportsCenter would have been laughable, but I didn't know why they were calling me. Then I found out it was a high school sports show and people said, oh, don't take that. You can't do that job. ESPN?

Eh, I don't think so. Go read scores and these are actual places where I could have gone and worked. Wichita, Manchester, New Hampshire. The third guy in Cincinnati. I was,

I was fortunate enough to, we flew around, did some auditions and actually got some offers. I was working at a top 20 market. This was in Denver, was a big TV market.

And I was doing stuff on the air, out of school, not anchoring. But I had a tape. ESPN got the tape, called me. And I thought, oh my God. No, no, it's a show called Scholastic Sports America. It's not live. It's weekly. It's a startup.

Your office is going to be in a trailer out in the parking lot. We don't even have space for you in the building. And that was it. And we were on the road for 40 weeks, flying way behind the curtain at Piedmont Airlines to go around to these places. All these airlines that we used to fly are defunct. But that was an invaluable experience, man. You can't be afraid to strain. that's a used word in sports a lot but i think that you know yeah i got the gig early but it was really hard work and very unglamorous fun but man i just i just gave myself to my job for about the first i don't know six or eight maybe even 10 years at espn going from that to sidelines in football,

to basketball studio at the same time, and then eventually jumping into takeover for Tim Brando and Bob Carpenter on game day. They were the initial two hosts of the show in the late 80s. But there were a lot of times when I felt underused, underappreciated, damn sure underpaid. But that's all part of the process. And I think that just because I did work, I was extremely fortunate to get the job at a young age there. But I'd have to work my way up. And I did pay my dues. And it was frustrating.

It's like more or less the OG guys, Berman, Bob Lee, Tom Meese were helpful, but at the same time they see a kid is like, what, what, I got, I got mistook for a high school student when I was working at ESPN in the hallways taping features on high school kids. Because I would just dress in jeans and a sweater or a polo or something. And they thought I was a high school student. Asked me for hall passes. I'm not kidding.

The crew would just die laughing. I was like, no, no, I'm, where's your pass, son? You should be in class. No, Mr. Assistant Principal, I'm actually like a college graduate that, you know, big time TV. So that's how young I looked. That's how preposterous, Ryan, it would have been for me to get a major gig then. I mean, I still look baby-faced when I started doing studio stuff, but lucky to have the gig, but it wasn't like now. It wasn't like getting an ESPN job now

a year out of school. Everybody thinks that there's some magic formula, as you know from being there, that is far from the truth. That's kind of exactly what I had expected. But to have the instincts to go, no, no, let me get under this umbrella and here we are all these years later. I tell this to people, listen to your gut. That's the only thing that told me to go to ESPN. And the reason why is it felt fun. The energy was good. I respected the hell out of the company as a sports fan. I knew they go to the bar and I was with them sometimes trying to learn from them and just trying to be, you know, a junior member of the sports staff. And I, I, I didn't want my life to look like that. I mean, no, no disrespect. I just wanted something else. And so the non-traditional approach did it.

But if you listen to well-intentioned people who are wiser than you, more experienced than you, you'll still get a lot of bad advice. If it counters what you feel inside, I tell kids this all the time. First of all, clear away the status. Your gut's not always going to be right, but there's a better chance of being right if you can just take ego, money, all that stuff out of it. It was never about exposure or money for me. It was simply what is going to be more fulfilling and more fun. And it seems stupid to say that I made decisions based on that,

but that's really what it was. I did the high school show for two years. They wanted me to go to LA and be the sports center, the first ever sports center LA Bureau guy. So now you're covering pro sports, USC. How could this guy not want to do that? Being young and single in LA over Bristol, and you do a high school show.

It just didn't feel right. And so I said no, and they were stunned. You often don't get away with that in this business. When your employer wants you to do something and you say, eh, I'm not feeling it, that can be fatal. So maybe you didn't realize that at the time, but it was a risk. And I said, no, I don't want to do that.

Thank you. A month later, they called and said, how about doing sidelines to college football? Yes, absolutely. And features on game day. And so if I'd said yes, totally different path. We're not here talking. I don't know what would end up in college football or not. So those moments, if you're lucky enough to have them, to see at that time, the crossing the road and this path just feels right. For some

reason, you don't even know, but it feels right. I'm a big believer. I preach that ad nauseum on Instagram and other places about making your own choices and clearing away the static and listening to your heart and your gut or whatever you want to call it. Because those are really important guides in life, I think. Yeah, you're right. I mean, the times were, you know, when I would tell somebody who doesn't understand it, be like, what did you do? I mean, the times were, you know, when I would tell somebody who doesn't understand, they'd be like, what did you do? You know, like, you left, you left, or how much did they offer or whatever? And again, you know, like everybody's money neighborhood is different. But I still think based on your talent that we eventually learned about that things would have worked out for you. You mentioned Instagram, though.

And the jeans and looking like a high schooler in your mid- mid twenties. I don't know if we can share this with everybody, but I know, you know, not that long ago, a happy 60th to you. Yeah. And so I, I like you believe that, that heavyweight training is the fountain of youth. And now that you've shared these theories with people, it's you, I'm, I don't know't know if espn if if building four is worried about your next contract negotiation knowing they're gonna have to deal with chris fowler the influencer or just you know the personal trainer because now everybody wants to know everything people are buying trap bars because of your videos uh no they're not but thank you no i i think it's that's an that's an original passion of mine is fitness. And

unfortunately, I mean, not forever. I abused myself, didn't sleep enough, drank too much, ate the wrong stuff, and didn't train often enough. But I'm way fitter now than I was in my 30s for a lot of those years, which is only possible if you're not very strong and fit in the 30s. Because if you weren't, it's never too late. I do believe you can be fitter and stronger. I mean, we're pushing the envelope with the big six. So certainly in your 50s, as you know, you can get old man strength. You can train the hell out of your body and have it do things it couldn't do before, as long as you weren't an elite athlete.

If you were an elite athlete, guess what? You're not going to get back there at this stage. Yeah, really, really what we're doing is making up for the fact that you can slow the decline. You can make up for the fact that you were a shitty athlete and didn't take yourself seriously when you're younger. But now I just figured I do think longevity is a piece. Way more important is overall wellness, mental health going and going very much hand hand with with physical health for me and training so those are the reasons it's not i think i can say look into this camera and say honestly it's really not about aesthetics i mean everybody likes to get compliments but it's really just about

feeling good man and i i with that big six oh i don't care what you say it's daunting like it's it's a number but it's a big ass number. So you start to think about that as it approaches. And I did all summer and I was out in Colorado, hiking my ass off, climbing mountains, went to Iceland for my birthday, climbed volcanoes, did a whole bunch of stuff with my brother. And really on the day that Milestone arrived, felt phenomenal. I just felt very healthy, felt great. phenomenal i just felt felt very healthy felt great um and that that helps ease the burden that and a little bit of tequila which i will never stop but i think that you know that that piece going forward i mean i i i am not an expert in fitness man i mean we all we all know what works for us i try not to tell people you got got to do this, you should do that. I just sort of offer

encouragement and say what works for me because I am qualified to say that. I always say, talk to a trainer. There's way smarter people on Instagram. There's a thousand things you can do to improve your mobility, to get up and move, to figure out proper form on lifts so you don't get hurt. The other piece of it too, Ryan, is I've been injured a lot. So by making mistakes, by not training smart, by taking my mind off of my form on one rep of a set, and that's enough to heal up. If you're not careful, if you're lifting substantial weight, or even if you're not, you forget to flex your core, now you tweak your back, and now you're on the shelf for two weeks. I've done that a million times. I mean, but you learn hopefully over time and by having the pec tendon ripped off the bone on the right side and then the left side,

like a year and a half later and surgically repaired and having to come from five pound weights back to benching more than I could before, more or less, you know, is really hard work. But so that's why I'm like a soapbox guy for physical therapy, for getting the best that your insurance can afford and you're able to afford and getting someone who will challenge you and challenge yourself because injuries will happen. You get, you're not the same age as me, but you know what I'm saying? It's just a reality of working wear and tear injuries, not even doing something reckless. But if you've worked out forever, these things were just wear and tear when the pec tendon rips. I've had four knee surgeries. I've had all kinds

of things go on, but that doesn't have to ruin your life and fitness. You can bounce that stronger than ever. If you work hard and smart. I didn't even get to my Iceland notes. I also went this summer. Oh, isn't that amazing? That place is on like, you want to stop every 20 minutes. Like what I describe it to people,

I go, there's all the things that you want to see, but there'll be other times like, wait, that's not a tourist attraction. That thing right there. Like there's nowhere to park and to look at this. I would post pics and go, is that like a green screen?

That's real life, man. And I was asking myself, I'm sure you were too. Is this real? Like, is this actually this vivid green moss on this volcanic rock and the shapes of these things things and i'm we're walking i'll just tell you one story i do highly recommend anybody go to iceland it's a very quick flight from the east coast but we're we're driving around this big rock formation on this black sand beach which is like a half mile wide and there's no signs it's not really a tourist attraction there was not no one was around my brother and i were driving this four-wheel drive through the Black Beach. We come around the corner and we see this circle of stones, these big stones.

There's no way that's random, okay? And come to find out later that that was a Viking ceremonial spot. I would say very mini stonehenge. The blocks are maybe, you know, three or four feet tall. They look like headstones in a perfect circle at the base of this amazing cliff on the sea. Like that's what's around every corner in Iceland. That's what's cool about it.

Like we were just blown away. Yeah. I saw some old Viking stuff in the fjords and you'd be like, what is this? And if you just shot it right, you would have no idea what year it was from. Like you just, you know,

if you kept the street sign out of the background but like saw this area and you go how old is this thing all right you said something once that i'll never forget and it was you were talking about your career and you were talking about your goals and you said you know i just want to be part of i'm paraphrasing here a bit but i want want to be part of history. I want to be part of chronicling history. I was like, man, do I need to do more? Cause you wanted your voice to be in these moments. Yeah. Yeah.

I think calling a grand slam final, I see that's every one of them is a piece of tennis history. Um, everyone is Serena's matches near the end. Uh, it was, was, was a piece of tennis history,

a big football game. I mean, not, maybe not your, maybe not Miami at A&M this Saturday, but the championship games, the bowl games, I think that's just what I mean by that. And I like to be able to have the presence of mind to know that what you're watching will live in the sport and you're lucky enough to be able to call it.

Yeah, I agree. But there's little things along the way and you know, it's, you continually kind of sharpen yourself, which I think would surprise people. Cause I think others in the industry, Hey, I've got it made. I'm good to go. I've got everything I need to do. And I just knowing you and talking with you for this long, like, I think it helps to kind of define, like, you're still peaking. You're still trying to reach this moment, which is trying to get better. I don't know. I'm still, I still think, as I said, improvement is necessary in all phases of life, not just how you do your job. I like to, I think, um, you know, to me just, I'll get semi deep for 15 seconds. The meaning of life is just to live it, but the purpose is just constant daily improvement.

And I think in some small way, some incremental daily improvement in some way, whether it's your job, how you deal with people, whatever is really what it's about for me. Before we let you go, a little trivia on the way out, putting you on the spot. Uh-oh. How many active head coaches have national championships?

The answer is five. Now you're wondering, why did I not give you a chance to answer that? That is payback for all of the Saturdays from when Bear offers up the trivia question, and because you're so studied that I'll be on the couch being like, you didn't give me 10 fucking seconds, Fowler. Well, that number's been growing. I mean, I think there were fewer, you know,

and then Kirby Smart gets one and, you know, Dabo's got his few and Jimbo had one and obviously Saban's got more than all of them combined. But I think, yeah, well, I always fear. That's just payback. Sorry. I appreciate everything you did for this podcast. Because like, wait a minute.

I mean, Bear asks this one every week. I'm not really a trivia expert. I would not say I can't go toe-to-toe with you or probably a lot of people listening to this in terms of like sports trivia, because at some point I figured out the hard drive has to be incrementally erased to, to keep adding new stuff in there. I don't think we have an unlimited amount. At least I don't,

there are, I know people that think like that, that have that kind of mind and that just doesn't matter what else happens. They can just add onto their photographic memory. And that hard drive is endless. I don't feel like mine is endless. I have to, I have to let some stuff go.

I didn't expect even to get an hour with you, man. I really appreciate the time. I can't wait for the rest of the season. This was a lot of fun for me. I hope you had fun. I had a blast. It went by really quick. I didn't even know it was an hour. I wasn't watching the clock. You do a great job. I appreciate the

different things we got into. Hope others did too. Anytime, man. Hopefully, we'll into and hope others did too. And anytime, man. Yeah. Hopefully we'll see you on the road soon. I want Iguodala. We talked about it before the season got started. So we're just trying to get to that first week. This is Worst Take. Podium nominees, as you can hear, Max Kellerman coming in,

who we did ask about the Iguodala thing, to be fair, but that one's not eligible. It has to be a recent one. And we all have, I think we just have a bunch now, Saruti, that we're going to go through, then we'll decide the three that are on the podium. And the plan is that each week we'll nominate one. Each of the three of us will nominate one and see if we collectively think any of the ones on the podium should be replaced by something new.

And to be honest with you, I like that we're kind of easing into this. I mean, there's a few good ones out there, but I don't need a Florio-threatening retirement one because that one, if we got that week one, we don't deserve it yet. And that would just stay atop of it. The game would be ruined because it's such an aggressive one. I don't know that anything would replace it over the next four months. I would argue we have a pretty aggressive one that I don't know that's going to be beat that we can get to in a little bit. Also, pretty shocking. We don't have a Florio nominee yet.

So kudos to him for keeping it locked up. Or maybe not. Maybe shame. You're right. I don't know. Maybe exactly. Dudes were, I think, are gunning. Because immediately after we announced this, there were like four or five takes, whether

it was ESPN or Twitter or whatever, that it felt like it was a direct response to us introducing the segment. It was. I think guys are pretty excited. Yeah. And girls. True. Yeah.

All right. What do we want to do? Do we want to... So I've got four clips, and then I've got a couple other just like takes that we could do. So why don't we just mix them in and we'll just kind of we'll play them all. And then go for it. And at the end, we will figure out what we'll vote on with three. All right. We'll start with an audit. You know what? Let's just start with let's just start with I think this is the earliest one. This is a very good one. They actually could play together.

And if Russell Westbrook has the right mindset, Patrick Beverly and Russell Westbrook actually could be the most dangerous defensive backcourt in the NBA. Fire. Yeah, I love Perk, but I'm now, it's on my own personal mission now to hold people accountable for suggesting Westbrook's any good on defense. It just doesn't make any sense. If you've played, if you watch, there's no version of events over the last I don't know how many years, five, six, seven years. All of his instincts are wrong on defense.

So yeah, he's athletic. He sucks on defense. He's been terrible. He makes so many huge mistakes late in games. We've already covered a million of these things. I love Perk, but it has to be done. For anyone that's played, when they start talking about Westbrook's defense, we just need to make it. We're helping the community here by doing this.

This is not criticism. This is assistance. We really are. We're just trying to hold people accountable. That was Kendrick Perkins, by the way, on first take. Let's get to another one. This was Stephen A. Smith a couple days before the NFL season started. We've got the best division in football here.

Chiefs at Cardinals, Raiders at Chargers, and Broncos at Seahawks. Stephen A., which team in the division will score the most points in week one? I'm going to go with the Chargers. We'll dive in deeper here. Raiders, Chargers. Who are you backing to win this one, Stephen A.?

I don't know. I'm going to go with the Raiders. I'll just go with that right there. What a day, everybody. What a time to be alive. Goodbye. Probably won't make the podium. I just love with that right now. What a day, everybody. What a time to be alive. Goodbye. Probably won't make the podium. I just love that one so much.

That's like a cheat code to make the podium. It's so good. It's so good. And honestly, like, I'm not even, this isn't even making, like, this stuff happens. They're doing live TV. You just, you know, like, this was right one after another. The music changed, but I just cut off a little bit. But it was basically right after another.

He forgot, man. He forgot that he said the charges were going to score the most points. Yeah, I don't even like... I don't like that one as a nominee just because I've been there. This has got you journalism. I don't like it.

Yeah, yeah. Now I'm already scared of the segment. That one... I cannot express how many times when you do this for a living and you're talking live for as long, especially when you're doing it every day for multiple hours, you're just going to have a few, you know, you hope to not have a million. So everybody's always pointing them out, but you're going to have a few times where you're

like, you know, I've years, I've tried to be a credible person and be like, that guy really puts the time in. And then you just completely whiff on something. Cause you forgot because you're on the air and it's just, you know, it's like sending an email to the wrong person does it mean you're horrible at your job no but i mean every now and then something's gonna happen where you're like i want that one back that one is funny but i think it's a little it's not a podium one anyway i'm spending too much time on this go ahead that's fine that's fine all right why don't we do this uh this is this is a contender this is a good one uh is again this hasn't yet to be proven wrong, but this is Bart Scott on Get Up.

What do you think about the Kansas City Chiefs this year? I mean, I think they're going to take a step back. I think this is kind of a reset year for them. Playoffs? I don't think they make the playoffs at all. I mean, I'm not even trying to be like tongue-in-cheek. I'm not trying to be like hot takey. I just look at the division.

Now look at the quarterbacks within that division. It's no fear of patrick mahomes last year if they're if the chargers defense wasn't so bad they should have beat him twice they always have a drag out fight with the raiders and now you have russell wilson and he's saying let's ride let's see if the broncos will follow him did any re retire that's what i was just wondering i think any re got fired for a reason That's what I was just wondering. Andy Reid got fired for a reason. That was a long time ago. No, you've gone too far.

You were doing good. Greeny at the end is incredible because he's just egging him on. He's like his biggest chewer. He's like, no, no, no. You went too far. No, no. First of all, the way that is set up, they already knew what they were doing.

I can tell it. I can hear it in Greeny's voice. He's like, you believe they're going to take a step back now. And it's like, fucking go. And if that take is like one of those peppers that you see kids and videos where they take a bite and they're like something tingly's going on and then they're running around the backyard dumping milk on their head uh that no one's afraid of patrick mahomes you know i'll say this a lot to anybody that does this for a living. The number of people that will have a take and they'll use two or three good examples to back their take and then they decide to throw in three that are terrible.

Yeah. Then it's like, wait, I was kind of with you a little bit. Now you're reaching so much that I don't trust you and I think you're trying to prove your point so much that now you're just layering on shit that doesn't even matter um yeah it's kind of like when there's a coaching change and somebody's like oh they've had four coaches in 21 months like well you're counting the interim coach because four sounds better than three like somebody had to show up to work on week 17 so it wasn't like they fired a third guy throughout of all of it uh that one is that one's huge

bart is not bart's got a flamethrower sometimes so well that's what i was gonna say because we've got another honorable mention from him i don't he's got two in the first the inaugural worst take he also did say i don't know if this is on first take or get up that he had jamis winston winning the mvp this holy shit Holy shit. Which is incredible. Which is just great. So I don't, probably not as hot as the, like Andy Reid got fired for a reason. Chiefs, nobody's afraid of Patrick Mahomes,

but that is a really good one too. Is he talking about Andy Reid though, leaving the Eagles and then he's bringing that back around? It has to be. Yes. After he won a Super Bowl with a new team and went to two of them? Yep. Yeah.

Yep. Got fired for a reason in Philadelphia. Good times. A couple other really quick ones before we get to what is basically just going to be the juggernaut. David Aldridge at The Athletic said on his podcast that he believes Kyrie Irving would be harder to replace for the Nets than Kevin Durant. That doesn't get enough credit. That needed more. I didn't know that one. That one needs more attention. Depending on what the annual bet is, okay. He's easy to replace because it's all you've had to do since he's been

there. It's a good one. It's a good one. And then really quickly, Desmond Howard, his college football playoff before the season was Texas A&M, Pitt, Baylor, Michigan. So, no Alabama, no Pitt, Baylor, Michigan. So no Alabama, no Georgia, no Clemson. I know you had A&M.

Yeah, I had A&M. And they might get off to a disastrous start here. The offense is so bad. I respect people going for it on their college playoff picks. So I would never put that on the podium. Because I hate just going chalk like everybody else does in the beginning, which is clearly the right way to do it with the lack of parody in college football, the recent years.

But although he does kind of ruin it with the Homer pick with Michigan, but I, I respect guys trying to do stuff, even though Pitt almost lost the West Virginia week one. All right. Um, before we get to the, to the juggernaut,

some people were suggesting that your to a tape from the last podcast about him being a backup should also be on this list thoughts i could be wrong i could be wrong about that and it was more of a hey this is what i'm thinking and normally i wouldn't ever do this especially after week one but i uh i'd always ask anybody this like if you're critical of that is it because you want to or to be good because emotionally you feel better? Then I don't want to engage in it. My argument is based on watching.

There's no emotional reward or disappointment, I guess, for me, one way or the other with this one. It's I don't know that it's to that level, but that's fine. I liked it a lot. The funny thing was, how many people it's uh i don't know that that's it's to that level but that's fine if you get i like to if

you want if you want the funny thing was you know how many people don't listen to the pod that only watch the video it's like oh but you like mac jones like so you didn't listen to the pot i think the patriots may legitimately stink and i have a belichick segment brewing in my head that's not that yeah well i'll take that day off. Yeah, maybe I will. I'm sorry. All right. Well, let's get to the one that's probably going to be here for us throughout the season. This was Gilbert Reyes talking about Giannis on his podcast, No Chill. They try to shorten this gap like it's this like, oh, he's the best player in the league. Not even close.

Just stop. Just stop. This gap is so big. But you're trying to always replace the next person by putting it back. I can look at his game and say, he doesn't understand basketball yet. He plays the sport. He won a championship. Cool.

He doesn't really understand how to be great, how to be better, how to train his body. So I listened to Gilbert with Camlin AD, Antonio Daniels on NBA radio, big fan of the show. And Gilbert came on and said, Giannis is the second best player in the world. I had a really hard time with this one because then I listened to the entire interview. I was like, wait, the longer it went, the more confused I was about the entire thing. I also think there is a massive American bias

towards any of the foreign players that is deep-seated in a lot of this shit. Because, you know, like, you don't see Giannis... Do you see other guys go up to Giannis the way some of the American guys go up to each other after the fact? I mean, I'm sure there's video of another really great American player giving him love

or something like that. I remember LeBron used to draft him in the All-Star draft because he would hope that deep down, Giannis would be like, man, he selected me number one for his All-Star team. I will leave Milwaukee and play with LeBron. Which, you know, It's not what happened, but it's why I took him.

I don't know. This one confused the hell out of me. You know what I mean? I listened to the entire Arenas interview, and still, after that, I was more confused than the initial part of it. But it is a big-time one. It's a big-time one because I get Gilbert's point on some of the skill stuff,

but after what Giannis has done in the last two playoff seasons you kind of have to just go yeah his skill is just being more dominant than you sorry i mean doesn't know how to take care of his body like if anybody knows how to take care i mean that guy is he just exploded with muscle over the course of like what you know since he came to the league till now the guy it's like a dwight howard like transformation it's unbelievable. I don't know about that. Dwight was bigger than Giannis coming in, from what I remember, those shoulders. His shoulders were so wide.

18 years old, Dwight Howard's shoulders deserve their own wing of the Hall of Fame. He went on to say, too, and I didn't put it in because it's just a longer clip, that LeBron played 37 minutes as a 37-year-old and Giannis is only playing 34 minutes. Are we going to pretend that the minutes are the same?

Like, that's, there's another, what I'm saying is there's another layer to this that I didn't even play, that got even worse. I don't know. For me, this is a shoo-in for the gold medal initially. All right, well, all right, so let's go through, then, what we think the three nominees are, right? Yeah, I assume we all have Gilbert in.

Do we want to just rank them one two three yeah gilbert to me is a one i would agree kyle get the uh well it's football season yeah definitely totally it's football season but yeah he's he should be number one all right so wait there's a little okay so you like i think you can make an argument for the bart scott one like i think there's an argument to be made there. I think it's Gilbert one, Bart two, and then Perk on Pat, Bev, and Russ three. Yeah, because Bart had a weird opinion

and then he topped it off with some crazy sauce on top of it with the whole Andy Reid thing. He already had sort of a weird, like, why would you say that? And then it was like, I've gotten into a drunk argument with my girlfriend and said something about the end. She's like, wait, what the hell?

It doesn't have anything to do with what we're saying why did you do this now you're totally like lost credibility so i think he should be there yeah i think that's the right ranking that's one two three yeah okay all right so that's the first one so now we have to come up with nominees each of us have to has a nominee that we potentially use to replace any of the three that are in the podium yeah correct yep everywhere i I'd like to crowdsource mine. I don't want to watch all the shows. I'm just glad Kellerman, if Kellerman had done an Iguodala one now, I would have been like, let's just end the segment

since it's over. Maybe he'll give us another one. Maybe he'll give us another one. Maybe we'll give out the annual Max Kellerman trophy to whatever person wins this thing at the end of the season. That'd be perfect. You want details?

Fine. I drive a Ferrari. 355 Cabriolet. What's up? I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork. I have every toy you could possibly imagine. And best of all, kids, I am liquid. So, now you know what's possible.

Let me tell you what's required. Okay, it's lifeadvice, lifeadvicerr at gmail.com. Hey, fellas, 30, 6'3", recently lost the ability to dunk. Well, if you're 30, that means you can regain the ability to dunk. I almost don't want to answer any. If you've already decided you're never going to dunk again at 30 years old when you could and you were 6'3", then do we even want to talk to you? But we will. We'll continue. Anywho,

I got married four and a half years ago and leading up to the wedding, my wife and I decided not to invite a friend from college. Let's call him Charlie. This guy sounds like a wild card. To give more context, my wife and I both met at college, had a large group of mutual friends and probably invited somewhere in the neighborhood of 20 college friends to our wedding there was one

person however who we chose not to invite charlie at one point i would say charlie was one of my best friends but after college he kind of lost control we tried to hang out but he's usually too fucked up to really have a good time my wife and i moved away and i hadn't hung out with charlie in probably two years before the wedding. All right. I felt a little bit weird about it at the time, but he seemed like a wild card. There he goes. He used the word. And we weren't actively talking much during that time.

Fast forward almost five years and he seems to have gotten his shit together to some degree. Parenthetical. And is kind of in the mix again. In the mix. We're planning on moving back, and I'll probably see him with some regularity. Honestly, I feel really shitty about the whole thing, and I don't have a lot of regrets in life,

but not inviting him to our wedding feels like a dick move to someone I once considered one of my best friends. Question, do I ever address it with Charlie? I don't really know how to say, you were a fuck-up, so we didn't invite you, but at the same time, I think I messed up, and it was a bad friend move to have not invited him and it's weird to ignore that i'm seeing him multiple times a year all right uh first of all if this is like a big big haunting regret then it means

like you've had a pretty clean life yeah all right this is not for you yeah this is like i don't know a tier four regret on the scale of tears regret tears so i think it's cool that it does bother you you know what i mean because it's somebody who wasn't invited to weddings that were potentially like core groups and it was strictly because of an ex in a situation like that and they were like we're just no one everybody was like don't invite him because it's you know it's not it's not going to be great and we're closer friends with a new boyfriend and whatever fuck them it hurt but i got it i got why i wasn't invited and of the two weddings that i wasn't invited to a couple years, one pulled me aside and said, hey, I want... Of course, the husband would always go, I wanted to invite you.

My wife was like, absolutely not. Because he's going to get really pissed. And he's already still mad about something that happened. And it wasn't like a drunken fall through the tent and rip things down. It was like, knowing Ryan, he'll probably say something, you know, he might say something early, he might say something late, he might say something on Friday night, he might, you know, but he's probably not just going to sit there and take it because he feels like he was wrong. And so I, when the guy said that to me, it meant a lot. I was like, yeah, man, I appreciate it. The other people never addressed it. And trust me, I've never forgotten it.

And it's funny because then that person has asked me for favors as my career took off. And I've gone like, oh, for the 12 favor requests. Because I do think I am more get it over with, talk about it, get it out there. Now, to specifically your email, if Charlie was that much of a screw up, he has to take the ownership. That burden is really more on him. He wasn't invited for a reason. You weren't doing it just because you were like, I don't like you anymore. Now, you also weren't talking to him for a while, although sometimes the math on college core friend, you get a pass on how often you're even talking or seeing each other,

certainly on the seeing each other, but if you didn't talk to him for two straight years, all the facts to me in this case are totally on your side, but I do think it's admirable. I do think it's the way men have a really hard time. They just do a bad job of like, hey, this is why I feel this way. This is why this happened. I want you to know that. And boom. And if Charlie has turned things around, I don't know what level of screw up

we're talking about here. If he was a guy who every single weekend it was something, and now he's not that guy anymore, it's likely that if he's matured, again, you kind of said like mate somewhat. So if he's still fucked up all the time, then maybe he's not going to be as open to this. But if he went through a period where he was constantly fucking up and it's now straightened out a bit, he'll likely be like, hey man, I kind of get it. I kind of get why I wasn't invited. It was like you were the only person that didn't want to hang out with me during the beginning of those post-college years. So it's fine. I totally get it. Thank you for saying something. And I just have a hard time believing that this conversation goes in a way where he's like, yeah, actually, I wasn't going to say

anything. But now that you bring it up, I'm pissed off all over again. I don't think there's a way for him to be more mad after you bring it up. So if it truly is bothering you that much, just say, hey, look, we're younger, we hadn't talked in a while, you can blame the wife a little bit. I know some people don't like when we do that on the podcast, but I would gladly, if I were the husband and it was easier

for my wife in the transaction, I'd be like, just put it on me a little. I don't give a shit. I think that's part of one of the great things about being married. Yeah, just blame me for that one. I think your head's totally in the right place. I think all the facts are on your side. If it's really bothering you that much, I would bring it up.

Of all the scenarios that I've played out in my head, I have a hard time believing that there's multiple versions of it where you end up feeling worse after you talk about this. I mean, I think if the goal is to make the guy feel better and not so that you,

it's not like you're going into a confessional, you know, like in a Catholic church or something. If the goal is just to make the guy feel better, you could say whatever reason you want, right? It's a wedding. You're like, hey, listen, it was a wedding. It was the first time I, hopefully my first and only wedding.

I didn't know what the hell I was doing. We had a list of 20 people that had to come off, you know, I don't know. There's, there's like a bunch of different ways to do it. You'd be like, listen, it also wasn't totally, you know, it's not totally my day either. So if you could get a little wife blaming in there as well, and just be like, listen, the guest list was the guest list. It was, you know, it wasn't because you're, you're a crazy asshole. It was because, you know, I invited, you know, a bunch of people and and i had to start you know you make a list and you start crossing names off and hey man your name wasn't the first one crossed off i can promise you that you know i'm sorry i was you know thinking about who who talked when

and and you know got a big family aunts and uncles had to come there was a lot of people that had to come and then once you get all those people on the list you got to figure out who you want to come so i i tried to get you on there man you were on until like the the fifth round of cuts or something you know you don't have to be completely honest and say it's because we thought i don't i don't know that you need to give up that much information give them a list of your frontiers yeah we had you as the first four out well be like i don't know i just think like there's a way for you to not be like yeah i thought you were a fucking crazy asshole and also just like man weddings you know so it's like after the creighton loss to be like,

after the Buffalo wild wings thing on a Tuesday, we put you, we moved you down to the plan. I don't know. I'm going through it right now. So, you know, I've,

I've, I've made a mistake and called and like texted people and then be like, Oh wait, now I guess, I guess I've told them about this wedding and now I'm looking at the list and it's looking a little lengthy. And these guys are like first round, uh, mini camp no. I guess I've told them about this wedding, and now I'm looking at the list, and it's looking a little lengthy. And these guys are like first-round minicamp cuts.

So I don't know what I'm going to do about that. I guess we'll pay more. When I showed my fiance the updated list, she was like, what are you doing? So I don't know. I still feel bad about Saruti's wedding, but then again, I didn't know that we were going to end up becoming this close after it. I was like, whatever. I was like, that was a good run at espn i'm not going to

talk to that guy that much anymore so we're saying nominee right there no it's terrible that's all right you know you've been held accountable multiple people have been mad at you about that and not me i'm not not no no there are people i was like wow people are really saucy about this one but the problem is i put way too much into saruti knowing he didn't care so i was like perfect he didn't because i just been there and i had to go back and i had like all these and i was like i gotta go back three weeks and i was like just write a nice check which i did not asking for credit for it but certainly a distraction for not showing up but now that we've become closer and poor saruti has to deal with all my phone call ideas all the time um i wish i had

gone so there you go yeah i i it's no harm no foul it's fine uh reverse charlie it is weird though because you know there were definitely when i got married there were definitely some some people i felt bad about and you know there were some work people that were in there there were some long time friends that i you know just again that you lose touch with kind of similar to this situation it's like a larger scale version of like your myspace 8 and it's like just in real life and it's like really hard to like basically be like hey like you know you're i this person knows you're getting married they're kind of on the cut line and then they get the chop i mean there was this one person who you know his friends

one of my best friends throughout all of high school and kind of became earthy crunchy started listening a lot of npr we just kind of grew apart and you know all of our other friends was invited so the guy once he locked into NPR just he went from like a 7c to a 12 there were there's a lot of factors that was one of them I mean you know it's just but we also didn't talk we didn't talk so it was like okay all the other groups you know friends from that group were invited and it's like this one person I'm not going to invite. Like, I felt like a dick, but I didn't talk to them. Like, you know, like we weren't friends anymore. So what do you want me to do?

And we honestly was the right choice because we haven't talked since. So it's fine. But the other thing you could do is, yeah, like how you kind of alluded to this, like what you can do if you don't want to blame your wife is you could just blame the guest list number and like, hey, like my parents are chipping in or our parents are chipping in like they gave us a number and we just can't go over that i'm sorry man like this is it is what it is uh and if they're been mad about that then i guess you're probably not gonna be friends with them for much longer anyway i don't think the number thing i i get it from but the outsider doesn't ever see it that way they'll be

like wait so what's the number 12 you're like no it's 120 and then in his head because he's just selfish he's not going like i couldn't make the top 120 and then you're like dude things add up a lot of cousins a lot of my friends too yeah my dad's got a lot of brothers and sisters as a mayor as i'm not trying to do the as a married guy thing but like i will never get mad at anyone ever again if i don't get invited to their wedding, knowing how weird and difficult that process was. Who got my spot? I don't think it was an empty seat.

We left an empty seat at Adnan and Will Kane's table. Could have been fun. Yeah, that's fucked. It's bad. It's all good. You missed a good time. I know. Nothing to say about that except I screwed it up. This does make me think that we should put together a bracket of people

and just seed them and then move it around. I couldn't do friends. I'd be lucky to get a lead eight. Workshopping. Workshopping this. Maybe a vacation. Maybe if I go to I don't know,

Mallorca, we'll do this. All a vacation. Maybe if I go to I don't know, Mallorca we'll do this. Alright, never mind. Okay, email. This one's more for Saruti. 21-58-162. Only been working out with 20 pound dumbbells for the past few weeks because that's all the gym in my apartment has. That is not why I said this one's for Saruti. I was about to say.

There's a reason. And by the way, if you go to got 20 powders yeah he wants to be quick dude yeah back off i want to be rock star rip that's it i want to be big are you ripped though no not at all yeah not even close you have no abs that show correct i have no muscles i'm you know like bam pal used to say skinny fat like i wouldn't go that far but you know i'm not a terrible shape but i don't have great jawline howline. How can you love Stiles and Chalamet and all these fancy European soccer players and not want to have abs?

Because I like food, and I don't like working out as much, I guess. I think my 20 minutes on the Peloton every other day is probably not going to cut it. I try, but I like pasta. What can I do? I learned on Instagram that abs are built in the kitchen.

You don't see it a lot. You don't see it a lot. You don't see it a lot. Heard that. Yeah. What are you doing? Oh, I moved out to LA. I got an Instagram page, a lot of fitness, different things. I got a post up the other day.

I got like 1,200 likes. It said abs are built in the kitchen. Like, oh, you're the one that did that? Okay, so here we go. Recently college grad from, we're going to leave this out because this guy gave us too much information. Big Ten school just got offered an entry level job at ESPN

and will be relocating to Bristol, Connecticut or maybe Hartford. Don't really know. This is a job I could have never dreamed of getting. I'm over the moon with excitement, but thrown off by Bristol. Aren't we all?

What are your thoughts in living in a random city town after college? I live in a major city with my parents right now. It's going to feel weird to uproot that and move to somewhere like Bristol. No offense to the place and its residents. This guy wants to make sure that everybody likes him coming in, which I guess are my future coworkers. Any recommendations on food or bars in the area? I know it's been a few years, but I imagine you know the place well. I don't think this guy's focus is in the wrong place. You're going to figure it out.

You've got a phone and the internet. There's going to be places to eat nearby. Although J. Tim's wings, not that far, but they still to this day are the best wings I've ever had anywhere. And they're in, they're so good. And the weirdest thing is I remember one time we got them and I got them to

go and I was like, this is so stupid. It's going to take way too long. And they actually still were good later on, which is, you know, I'm pretty fussy about the reheating part of things. So,

all right. I said, Rudy, let's just talk to this guy about like the do's and don'ts of what he needs to do because i'll just share really quickly it isn't about bristol it isn't about harford it isn't about where you live it isn't about all the opportunities the restaurants the bars and all that stuff maybe some other people prior to me espn could have been on the bad side of fucking antarctica and i would have worked there and lived there for years if it was

the best for my career i would suggest that if you care about this and this is what you really want to do and you want to be in sports who gives a shit where you live all right bristol isn't a great time all right harford isn't a great time these are not secrets but when you work at espn there's this odd concept from the outside it's like oh what's it like i wasn't walking around downtown bristol five days a week all right i got off the highway I pulled into the security lot. I did the show and then I left. And so granted at the entry level, the apartments and things that are going to be available to you,

you probably still could actually find something in Hartford. I don't know that you're going to find something in West Hartford. I would, I would probably try to do that. I don't know what your financial situation is. I don't know what the assistant part of the, the family dynamic is there, but I would not worry about your're prioritizing this for one reason and that should

be your career. Who gives a shit where you live? All right, my rant is over. No, I'd like to know what the job is. Is it like your normal nine to five or is it like a production job where you're going to be working nights and weekends and it's not going to matter anyway? Entry level? Isn't that like the PA program? Well, yeah, I assume it has something to do with production right there's no way this is like an accounting job uh i mean maybe it is i don't know but like those are two very different things because you know you're not going to have a life probably early on uh because you're going to be working all the shitty hours that the new people work right and so you're probably you're like you're you're you're going to be going out

on monday tuesday wednesday nights as opposed to friday sat like your nightlife isn't going to be what you think it's it should be or could be. So just know that going in. But the other thing I'll say that's really cool about ESPN and like there are annoying things or whatever throughout our time there. But there are some really cool stuff. And as like a young PA, so I started when I was, I think, 22 or 23. I was pretty I was like a year or two out of college. There is like a college vibe to not only the campus itself.

So, like, yes, it's in Bristol, but you're not like, it's all fenced off. Like you're in, you're on the ESPN campus. You don't know that you're in Bristol. It could be literally anywhere. So that doesn't matter. And two, when you're not working, there's a bunch of other 22 to 25 to, you know,

maybe even late 20s year olds living in West Hartford or living around in the area. And you're kind of going over each other's houses. You're becoming friends. Like it's actually this really kind of cool post-college, but also similar to college vibe. So I would say, yeah, West Hartford might be tough to swing a solo apartment there these days. I mean, I know there are some housing boards where you can potentially live with some other people. That's how you meet some new friends there. But some of the best times I had were in West Hartford when I lived with two or three other people that worked at ESPN.

And we would just go out because we all had shitty similar schedules. And it was a ton of fun. We'd go out on weekday nights and have a great time. And I didn't really worry about it. And again, I'm from Connecticut. So it's different for me. I'm probably biased in this. But I just don't really think it's as bad as people make it out to be. West Hartford's fun. There's good restaurants. It's not going to be New York City. It's not going to be Boston. But it's still a good time with a bunch of other young people who also want to get after it, who are also still thinking about their careers. So I don't know. I just always thought the Bristol thing in Notkin, Connecticut was so overrated.

But again, I'm admittedly biased. The Bristol part of it's true but irrelevant. You're not hanging out in Bristol? You're not in Bristol. It's, you know, people that I meet, you know, they'd be like, Oh, you live in Bristol, huh? Like, I've been on TV for 10 fucking years. Like, no offense. You think I live in Bristol. It's, you know, people that I meet, you know, they'd be like, oh, you lived in Bristol, huh? Like, I've been on TV for 10 fucking years. Like, no offense.

You think I live in Bristol? Yeah. Like, you know. Yeah, Van Pelt and I are over at the Y at Bristol. Bucci comes over. We all do calisthenics together. You know, it's a living. It's a grind, but it's a living.

You know, and you're just like, it's not the way that it works. And honestly, when you're younger, you're going gonna be in a shitty apartment in a major city so you know it doesn't i i could i could not agree more though on like i'd meet people from you know weird parts of northern florida and they'd be like ah this place sucks i'm like are you kidding me west hartford blastonbury you know not Farmington has some downtown, but Avon's a gorgeous town. Again, if you're in your early 20s, you're not hanging out there necessarily.

New Haven, great town. It's a little bit further away, but incredible college town. Go to Toad's Place. It's awesome. Great pizza. I was over it for a bunch of reasons. I even lived in Hartford when I first, first got there. And Hartford's not a civilian city.

It's just, nobody lives there. And I was in one of the few residential buildings that were there. And it's just a weird, you know, I remember that one time I came back from, I take a Texas A&M game and I landed early enough because I was able to get to a major airport to get back to Hartford to get to work on Sunday for Sunday football stuff. And there was a parade going on in like the fall and it was a cold fall Sunday day, and no one was watching it. No one was there. Do you know how scary that was? It was like a horror movie.

I've told that story before, but I remember going like, wait, this is actually like a real parade that they're doing today, and no one showed up to watch it. That's a great shot in a movie. Anyway, there's way more that we could say about the whole thing but we don't know the person's dynamic but i to me i don't you want to be at espn you said it's a job you're never going to get before maybe you just thought we're going to say hey this restaurant's good this one isn't i mean you're going to figure all that out pretty quickly yeah there's like five of them yeah You just rotate them all. It's fine. This isn't TripAdvisor, man. Unless it is a specific

Icelandic podcast. We had a bunch of parents chiming in on the swearing thing. A lot of different theories on how to do this. We had one guy suggest you just tell your kids their grown-up words

and they can't use them until they're older yeah so are lighters lighters you're not supposed to you're older either that doesn't work yeah Kyle how old were you when you bought your first lighter bought one I don't know they were around got one family's families were smokers on both sides it's just like I'll just take this one and you'll just think you lost it. The power of having a lighter under 10 years old. I mean, that's yeah. Burning bus seats, lighting the street on fire. Yeah.

Leaves, whatever. You don't see a lot of young girls that love burning shit. Yeah. I'm not, I didn't come across any, I think. All right. So this guy says huge fan of the show. Tough one. Uh,

we certainly don't condone our five-year-old swearing, but I've known to drop an F bomb or two every day. Last Thanksgiving. He was four. He comes in the adult room with all the family and goes, have you guys ever tried root beer? It's fucking amazing. Everyone laughed game over.

We tried to reprimand him, uh, through the laughter, but it was impossible because i thought it was hilarious yeah that's the other thing too is that sometimes sometimes your kids will swear and sometimes it will be funny so all right okay that's a podcast thank you thank you for everyone for joining us today please subscribe rate review the ryan rossolo podcast we be back on Friday. Do we have a guest for Friday yet?

Feldman? Oh, yeah. We haven't had Bruce Feldman on yet for college football, so we'll do some college football. Probably another magnificent open. 3-0 in our picks,

by the way. Don't worry about it. Oh, that's right. 3-0 in the picks. 7-2 in the year. So off to a hot start. Hot start. Ryan Rosillo podcast. We're here on Spotify, talk to you Friday Thank you.