The Ryen Russillo Podcast - Let’s Have the MVP Discussion, Plus Greg Olsen on Calling a Super Bowl and the Tom Brady Situation

Episode Date: March 9, 2023

Russillo shares his thoughts on the recently un-fun NBA MVP discussion (0:35), before he is joined by Fox Sports' Greg Olsen to discuss his journey from NFL player to broadcasting the Super Bowl in a span of three years, his reaction to the news of Tom Brady's Fox deal, the unique former player perspective in the broadcast booth, draft day stories, and more (15:11). Finally Ryen answers some listener-submitted Life Advice questions (48:43).  Host: Ryen Russillo Guest: Greg Olsen Producers: Kyle Crichton and Steve Ceruti Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

okay on today's pod i'm going to finally talk about this mvp discussion which has just become a real bummer this year i'm not sure how we got there greg olson who called the super bowl uh we're going to talk about that and the peculiar situation that he's in with brady getting ready to take his job at some point. A little story time and some life advice, especially if you live in Utah and you're thinking of changing jobs. We went deep.

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region. See app for details. I'm going to talk about the MVP race today. I didn't really want to. I've been avoiding it for probably a week and a half, but now it's just impossible to avoid. Not only is somebody who cares about the award has a vote now, it's my second year as an MVP voter. Seeing what's happened with this, I don't understand when it ever became this unfun because it's unfun right now. Whether it's TV, radio, podcasts, It's unfun right now. Whether it's TV, radio, podcasts, certainly social media,

it's just a mess, right? It's a big, big nasty fire. And then Kendrick Perkins came over and pissed jet fuel all over that fire. So we got a lot of stuff that we have to talk about here. To suggest that you think Jokic is in the conversation with Embiid or that Giannis might be the winner,

which I'm leaning towards last week, I'm still not sure what I'm going to do. We still have a good chunk of the season to go. Because if you take whether it's Giannis, Embiid, or Jokic, and you stack up their stat profile with all the positives, and you look at it on its own, you're like, oh my God, I can't believe what this person is doing. Which speaks to how amazing the top of this MVP class is, that we have three all-timers happening all at the same time, which means somebody's going to be left out and people are going to take it personally and think that there's something other than just that's the way

the vote broke down. I know that nobody wants to come in second. It's not cool. But this isn't Talladega Knights, right? And Harden, who, when you look back at his resume saying, should he have had the extra one in 17 instead of Westbrook, people that voted for Harden certainly feel that way. Going back and trying to figure out how we should have voted years later can be a little problematic, which we will get to again in more depth. But when Harden retires and he'll have five top three finishes, that's a big deal. I know he wants one more. I know he thinks he should have multiple more. That's fine. It's not really what the debate is. But to be able to say, I finished in the top three five times is a really big deal. It's a lot like the Heisman finalists where you didn't win. I get it. But you flew to New York, you sat there in your suit, you three other guys, and you had your moment. You didn't win, but you were a Heisman finalist. You were invited to New York. It's a bit like for people, the final four, where it's not winning a title, but I've always likedcaa tournament because you have this other thing that

you can accomplish where your fan base especially if you're not a blue blood being like man we made it to a couple final fours think about butler so coming in second actually isn't the egregious thing it's being presented as as if it's the most disrespectful thing you could do is have somebody finish second behind somebody else and it's going to happen where two of the top dudes that we're talking about are going to feel totally left out so So let's go back to the perk stuff, which I didn't really want to do a ton. I've worked with him in 2019. I thought he was awesome immediately. I was like, he's got something to say. He's got all the personality you'd ever want on television. So Rudy worked with him pretty closely regularly. He loves the guy. And this

is not a Skip Bayless thing where I would tell you people that have worked with him can't stand him. So, you know, I mean, none of this is breaking news on Skip. You know, it's personal for me and I'm not going to talk about him all that much because he didn't talk about me ever, but Perk went there multiple times. And the first thing that he said was that why is there a double standard when we were talking about Russell Westbrook stat padding, but we don't do the same thing for Jokic. And we know that is about race. And instead it's kind of packaged where I'm definitely making this about race, but you can't say that I did because I didn't necessarily say that exact word, but it's not even about that because I think anybody that's ever watched basketball, which is so surprising because Perk played, like think about the

accomplishment of actually being somebody who gets to do this for a living and was paid for over a decade to play professional basketball. And you would watch the way Westbrook plays and you watch the way Jokic plays and feel like it's the same, but the criticism is different. There's not the same. They're just not same uh and if if you disagree with me then we can we can never talk about anything so that was like the first sample that was the appetizer to it all uh then it got a little bit more intense when he went back and did some research on the three mvp winners who did not finish in the top 10 in scoring it was jokic dirk and steve nash uh going all the way back to steve nash I don't think anybody's sitting here 15, 16 years later

being like, wait, Nash didn't score a ton of points. He was 33rd one year and I think he was 61st in the year before that when he won the first MVP. If you think in 2006 Kobe should have gotten it, I'm not going to tell you you're wrong. Again, that's kind of the point of the intro to this entire monologue is that whoever comes in second probably still has a really good case. The MVP winner, it's not supposed to be unanimous. It's

not supposed to be a landslide. It's not supposed to be somebody finishes in first and the next guy's 10th. But for Nash in the moment, I think we understood why he at least had that momentum and the story of him completely turning the Suns into something different especially in that first year uh the second year the seating wasn't as good dirk when he won it they went they won 67 and 15 but he got bounced the playoffs early because they were one seed and it was funny too because i think draymond brought up something recently where he said you know the euros don't face as much backlash as the american players do are you fucking kidding me dirka called every name in the book and it was actually like, okay, for all of us to call on those names. I started to have doubts too after those series being like, what's up with this guy? Is he actually a one? Can he be that dude? By the

way, him not finishing top 10 in scoring, he was 0.4 points away from being 10th. So it's packaged well where you're like, wow, that's kind of interesting. His perk onto something here. And the problem is when he threw out the Jokic stat, one of them was wrong, so he deleted the video after he said, I'll let it sit there and marinate, which again was about race. So he decided to double down. Maybe it's triple down where he talked about

the MVP voters being overwhelmingly white. He said it was over 80%. It's not. ESPN admitted that they were like, yeah, we screwed that one up or PERC did. I looked at the votes. Again, it's 100 voters. And the hard thing where the NBA is never going to give you the precise demographic is that there'd be some assumptions made on ethnicity, which the NBA is not going to do and then put themselves in a position where they could get it wrong. So let's put it this way. I think it's over 50% white voters. If you want to

tell me that's too much, I would be fine with it. I'm like, all right, cool. I would agree. But I don't think that's why we had Nash, Dirk, and Jokic all win MVPs, which is what Perk was accusing the voters of doing. And then he did the thing where it's like, oh, I see people are in their feelings. Yeah, you know what? Like, if you're called a racist, you should be annoyed by that. I think that should be something that does bother you.

Somebody should feel a certain way if you're voting for players and then being accused of voting for them only because of the way they look. So there's something about first take

and it's not even, this would be unfair to So there's something about first take and it's not even, this would be unfair to say it's only about first take. I was only in the show a handful of times, but I understand the TV business, I think really well. Okay. When you have people on TV, you have to have them say something where you get a reaction. It's not, hey, I watch your show because I love everybody. We all would admit we probably watch or listen to content. I know there's this one fucking guy I'm watching on Instagram. I hate his videos so much. I can't stop watching them, but I hate them.

Where you will hate watch, you will joy watch, you will agree watch, you will disagree watch. The end game is that you're watching. And I remember a couple times the first take, they probably were desperate. They'd wander over to the radio department and they'd go, hey, we doing this thing and um kind of wanted to get your perspective on this and i knew what they were hoping i was going to say is like oh yeah i don't think that's racist and be like all right cool you're gonna be in the b block do you have a tie um and a couple times i was like yeah i think that's actually kind of messed up i think i think race plays part in that so yeah i don't really have much to say like i'll go on and they were like you could just see the look on the

producer's face like super disappointed god damn it rassilo actually does think it's racist yeah we can't put him on but yeah it's a bummer yeah he agrees he agrees that the bad thing is bad sucks uh then there was one time where they came to me and they were like hey did you hear about this yaki way thing tom yaki used to own the red sox pretty bad record historically there um with some stuff they were Tom Yawkey used to own the Red Sox, pretty bad record historically there, um, with some stuff. They were like, John Henry wants to distance the organization from his history and change it back to Jersey street, which is really what the street was named. This sort of pedestrian street that, you know, becomes a kind of walking area before the game start. You know, you can drive your car when there isn't a game.

And I was like, yeah, I don't know. I'm like, what's, uh, sure. They could change it. I don't really know why this is that big of a deal. Like who cares? Like changing the name of street doesn't change, doesn't change the bad things. And they were like, Hmm, eyes light up. Will you come on and say that? Well, I come on and say what that I think it's kind of pointless to change the name of the street as if it's going to solve any of the big problems. Yeah. Yeah. Would you do that? Yeah. All right. I'll come down. And then I went down and said it. And again, you probably forgot or never knew that they were changing the street name of Yakiway because it means dick. It doesn't mean anything. These stupid things that will be set out. We spent a day on it like it was this big thing. And I'm sure everybody involved in that show doesn't even remember. The only reason I remember

is because I did it and I was on there so infrequently. So I think what you have to watch out for when you're doing the shows is like, am I doing something only for the reaction? Okay, fine. But if you're doing something only for the reaction, or maybe you do truly believe it, but some of this stuff is just inaccurate. So then it's like, how are you putting together your facts? You can't then get mad at people for getting mad at you, right? You can't go out there and say, hey, this is happening and this is the reasoning behind all these MVP results. Oh, well, you guys can't handle it. Like what? We can't handle inaccuracies based on data that comes back? I'll admit, I'll admit the one time I let race probably influence my perception of a player,

I let race probably influence my perception of a player, somebody I was rooting for. I was seven and it was Chris Mullen. And I said, dad, I can't believe he's good. We're not usually good. And he's like, yeah, no, he's pretty good, dude. He's pretty good. Since then, I like my track record. So let's bring a full circle because as I said, when you go back and start relitigating these MVP awards, it's really complicated, man, because there's two things that happen. I've said this plenty of times. Right after a championship, right after a Super Bowl, we're kind of bad. We're bad putting things into perspective. If I started a podcast or titled it saying, hey, Monday recap, eighth best Super Bowl I've ever seen, you'd be like, eighth best?

What the fuck is this guy? I want to listen to his show? That's the 12th best World Series ever. This is one of the top 30 seasons I've ever seen from a small forward. Nobody cares. Nobody cares. The goal is to get people to react, but in the process of getting somebody to react, you can get a little dangerous with it.

I felt like this was borderline irresponsible the past week, and the facts kind of backed up. It was like, what's going on? Why is the MVP conversation turning into this? Why is Steve Nash supposed to have one less now? And maybe he deserves one less. The Dirk one, he deserved it that year. The Jokic ones, I know, especially last year,

there's a ton of debate over it, all right? But I also know that whether it's in the moment our perception can struggle, which maybe you could say, hey, the MVP voting gets out of hand and people fall into these storylines and the voting just gets on this runaway train of momentum. And then we look back and regret it. But there's also plenty of times that I'll look back and I'll know who a player looked like in the playoffs, in basketball, a quarterback in football. in basketball, a quarterback in football, back when I was super locked into all the baseball stuff. And you go back and look at numbers historically and go, man, those numbers look way better than the guy and how I felt about that player at the time. So the current day perception

can be misguided, but just as misguided as going back and looking up stats from 15, 16 years ago and thinking, you know, exactly in the moment, how things felt. And both can be right, both can be wrong. But there's no definitive answer on the whole thing. I guess it just kind of gets back to like, people can listen to this and go like, Oh, man, why do you care so much? Because I do care. Because I should care. If I have a vote, you should know that I care. And when you get accused of a bunch of bullshit, you should also want me to care about that too. This March, take your first shot at College Hoops with FanDuel Sportsbook.

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or text HOPE-NY to 467-389 in New York, 1-800-522-4700 in Wyoming, or visit 1-800-GAMBLER.NET in West Virginia. He's Greg Olson. It probably still sounds a little weird to say like the voice of the NFL for Fox, but I guess it's true still. So that's awesome. What's up, man? Yeah, doing well. It's true sounds a little weird to say the voice of the NFL for Fox, but I guess it's true still. That's awesome. What's up, man?

It's true for at least one more year. Did I frame it that way? If it's being taken away, I didn't mean to do it that way. You're not the first. We all understand. It's good to be on. I'm actually a big fan of yours. I've listened to a bunch of your pods. I've listened to your

post-Super Bowl pod when you guys broke down the game. I've been a fan and listened to a bunch of your pods. I've listened to your post-Super Bowl pod when you guys kind of broke down the game. So I've been a fan and listened to a lot of your stuff. So I appreciate you having me on. Okay, that's interesting. What did you think about what Brian Curtis and I had to say about the Super Bowl broadcast? I thought you guys were on it.

I'm trying to remember exactly what your points were. I think your points were right. I think you guys talk about how do you... It's chicken or were right. I think you guys talk about, you know, how do you, you know, it's chicken or the egg. How do you sound like it's a big game when people are used to hearing the same names? And then, you know, I thought your point was valid. It's like, listen, if these guys call the next 10 years and

10 years from now, we'll say, hey, this sounds like a big game because they're the voices we're accustomed to, you know, to hearing. I thought he had a couple interesting takes. Some of it I agreed with. I'm trying to remember exactly what his points were. I was like sitting in the carpool line. This is weird because now I've never started

an interview this way. What did you think about what we said about you? But then obviously you didn't mind too much if you said yes to the pod coming on. I think it's very unfair for anyone new in that seat is the point that you're telling me that I was making about because I would still hear Musburger and look, we all grew up with it, but he wasn't super locked in towards the end. But when it was Saturday night for college football, it just felt like this

big thing. And it's the trick of the familiarity. And that's where I think you and Kevin, yeah, to your point, like if you had done the next five, no one would ever say, hey, this sounds a little different because it was just new is really what it was yeah and and exactly right it sounded new and it sounded different because it is i mean people people have obviously heard kevin for for longer than me he you know he's been doing it 10 plus years or whatever if you know outside unless you watch the you know a bunch of dallas cowboy one o'clock games last season or you know philadelphia eagle one you know we were getting those like doubleboy one o'clock games last season, or, you know, Philadelphia Eagle one, you know, we were getting those like double headers where we'd have pretty good size

audiences, but we did no playoff games. We did like two primetime games on NFL network, but our crew, obviously last year as the B crew, you know, we, we weren't calling four 30 green Bay Dallas with 40 million people. We, you know, it just wasn't our game time. So I think people this year, a lot of them just heard us for the first time. So I think people this year, a lot of them just heard us for the first time. And yeah, to your point, it's voices that you weren't accustomed

to hearing. You were accustomed at 4.30, turning it on and hearing Joe and Troy for 30, 25, 30 years, whatever it was. And it just becomes ingrained in your mind. I remember as a kid growing up and you hear Madden, you hear Summer like you just hear the voices that you're accustomed to hearing and over time you just say okay those are the games that I when I hear those voices I just automatically relate it this is this must be a big moment exactly yeah and I think that's where some of the value in it and the long-term play and some of the stuff that I want to get to but you know go from a couple years to calling a Super Bowl what has surprised you about the job? You know, I thought going in, I never thought it was going to be easy.

I always knew it was going to be a challenge. I think anytime you tackle something new, you know, this was something that prior to, you know, 2015, I went in and did a dry interview out in L.A. with the Fox execs, you know, just in a studio, just calling like an audition game, you game. Never saw the light of day. Called the game in 2017, called one game on my bi-week, same thing in 19. It wasn't until I did the XFL,

which sounds crazy, like the XFL 2.0. Kevin and I were partners back in 2020. We called the first five games of that season. So until that point, I never was in week after week after week, right? You come home on a Sunday,

you regroup on Monday and you dive back into next week's prep and get ready to go back on the road. It wasn't until that five week XFL kind of stint that I saw like the monotony of the week after week. And you come off the high of, of calling a great game. And it's just like, as a player,

it's like, okay, tomorrow that game is over. You got to get like, as a player, it's like, okay, tomorrow, that game is over. You got to get ready to do the next one. So I don't, that was really the first time that I saw, like this is something that you don't just prep for one time. You check the box and you move on. And you know, then now these past two seasons, you know, last year, obviously calling the 18 week, the 18 week schedule.

And then this week, I think we call it this year. We called like 23, 24 games. So I mean, it was... So I think that's the aspect of it. Calling the games, preparing for the games, that was a blast. I always loved that part of it. But I just think, you know,

you have to really come to grips with if you're going to do it, you're going to do it right. This is a full-time gig. This is a seven days a week, 24 weeks in a row. You're on the road every weekend. And if you're not prepared, and if you're not into the game, especially in today's world,

people can tell and they know and they're not, as you know, they're not shy of telling you how they feel. Is there anything that you look at differently now? Because, and that was the best way to answer the question. And if I were a better host, I would have just stopped there and let you go. But I'm going to give you some examples and then ask you after, which is not the way you're supposed to do it. Knowing that, like, one of my biggest frustrations about the job is that I can think I know, but there's all these times you're like, you know what actually happened with that guy? You know what actually happened with that team? And you're just like, my God. And a lot of that stuff never, ever gets out.

And so all the years you played high profile player, and I'm sure, you know, like I just said, all the examples of being in the locker room and be like, I can't believe that's what they're saying. Like, that's so not what happened. And yet now you're, you're still close enough to not feel totally removed, but just by your job title alone, you were removed. How does that make you look at Sundays differently? Yeah, I think it's a great question. I think it's one that all former players kind of wrestle with, right? We all know what it's like being on the other side of that conversation.

We all know what it's like when Monday morning, the radio host is crushing you and he thinks you're the one who ran the wrong route on the pick. And then everyone in the locker room, like to pretend guys don't realize that stuff is just wrong. Guys know what's being said. Guys know who's saying it. And they're reacting, whether they react publicly or not and address it head on is not. But it's being addressed amongst the guys. So I always said going into this, I was never going to, you know, tiptoe around it.

Like if I felt strongly about something, I'm going to say it. My only caveat, I had two rules. I was never going to make it personal. I was never going to attack or question how much a guy cared or how much they wanted to win or how hard they work. I don't know the vast majority of the guys on that intimate level to really know their motivations and to really know how much time they're putting in. I think that's where guys can get a little reckless.

I think you start calling into question the integrity and the work ethic and all that of an NFL player. I think that seems always to me very personal. I never was going to be personal. And I also take great pride that I'm going to study it. I'm going to call people around the league and study different coaches and different defense,

the elements of the game that maybe I didn't experience firsthand. When I watch routes and I watch route concepts and I see depth, I have a pretty good idea how that route was supposed to be run, what was the depth supposed to be, did he break his route off flat enough? I have a pretty good feel for that.

I'm pretty confident what I see in that aspect of the game that I can pretty much interpret what was supposed to happen. Some of the defensive stuff I've really had to go outside my, you know, kind of my experience level and ask the Luke Keeklies of the world and some of the best defensive minds in the league that I've gotten to know and really pick their brain and say, okay, teach me, like flip the game around now,

instead of me seeing it from behind the quarterback, put me at the Mike linebacker, put me at the free safety, teach me how you're being taught coverages and alignments and down in distance calls and checks, like teach me that. So my hope is at any point in the game, if I do the research and I continue to study the nuance and the changes of the game, at any moment, I can speak as the left tackle. I can speak as the quarterback.

I can speak as the strong safety, the coach, the special teams coordinator. It's my job to take the viewer into the mind and into the play from a bunch of different perspectives. And my thought is if I'm going to do it, I got to make sure I know what I'm talking about because I don't want to come across as a know-it-all, but then all of a sudden I get it wrong. And listen, I've probably gotten some things wrong in two years of doing this, but

it's not for the lack of the effort and understanding that I have a great responsibility of getting it right. Because if not, I'm misleading 30 million people in some weekends. Has anybody gotten upset with you? I haven't. I have not gotten that call. I have not gotten that text. You know, man, you did me dirty. You said I stopped the route, but I have not gotten that. I'm sure there's been a couple of locker rooms where guys are like, can you believe Olsen said that shit? He doesn't know what he's talking about. I haven't gotten the personal call yet. I'm sure that's just a matter of time.

But listen, it's hard. You talk about not really knowing, right? And I think that one of the coolest challenges, but also one of the more difficult ones of calling the live game is

we prepare all week. You know the depth charts, you know the game stories, you know the injuries, you know their game style, whatever. But just like as a player, you can do all the prep you want.

When that ball kicks off, you're following a live game that you don't, you really don't know which direction it's going to go. And that's why we work out all these contingencies. You work out all these different storylines. If this game goes this way, then what? If this game, if Dallas falls behind, now they're playing from behind. What does that do? Like you're playing out all these different scenarios.

So that way, if the game takes one of those paths, you've put some forethought. You have an idea of now where you're going to take the conversation, where you're going to bring the viewer, because you have no control over the game. For three and a half hours, you are reacting to a live football game, and you have to be prepared wherever it goes. And to me me that's the

exciting part right the unknown no different than as a player okay uh speaking of contingencies nice segue you are a professional you are a professional i think those of us on the outside were like okay he's really good you know a couple years later he's already doing the super bowl because that's how it fell in the fox cycle. This Brady contract gets announced, massive money. And Brady's like, I am retiring. No, I'm not. Now I am, but I'm actually not going to work this year. And it's like, all right, we got Greg Olson. I don't know the full details of it. I wouldn't be dumb enough to think that you'd be like, yeah, this actually is pretty fucked up. Because if I'm your agent, I would say you're really good and it's all going

to work out. And we may not know how it's going to work out, but it's going to work out, which I think would be the accurate and perfect advice. What is this like for you though, knowing that it's kind of maybe not really going to be your job at this level in the future? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there's no question that it was a weird start to this stage of my career. I think last year, I had the luxury of just getting my feet wet, called some good games. Me and Kevin have known each other for a long time. I couldn't have asked for a better guy. I mean, we've known each other since I was 15 years old in high school. So I mean, there was such a comfort and such a level. If I was going to get into this industry, it was the perfect segue. It was the perfect ease into this world.

And then this year, it was very different. There was a lot of attention on our crew for a lot of reasons. Me and Kevin were new. The Joe and Troy news of the offseason shuffling of the chairs of all the top eight broadcasters. Obviously, all the contracts that had been given out. And then, of course, the speculation of who was going to replace Joe and Troy. They hire Kevin. Then there was speculation of who was going to replace Troy, Tom, his contract. But he's not going to take it.

Everything you just mentioned. So there was a lot of attention on us going forward. And I thought, obviously, it would have been great to just get the job for the next 10 years and put it all through. But that wasn't the reality. So I really had only two choices. The first choice was to just cut off my nose to spite my face and let my ego and my pride and say, this is bullshit. I should have been elevated. And I really would have just been sabotaging my own future. I would have just been for my own pride and my own vanity standpoint. That wouldn't have been a very good professional move.

The other option, which is the one I took was, you're not going to win the battle against Tom Brady. But you know what you can win? You're going to get a year of a crew, primetime games, big time markets, Thanksgiving, NFL playoffs, and oh yeah, you're going to call the Super Bowl. You're going to check all those boxes in one year. Don't worry about anything else. If you go out and just crush it and you go out and you just embrace the moment and don't let it crush you and don't let it outshine you, everything always has

a good way of working out for people that are good at their job. So I've said from the beginning, my only hope in this world to survive amongst the quarterbacks and the guys from the Cowboys and the guys with Hall of Fame jackets, my only way to survive, which is why I took this route versus some of the desk stuff, was to be good. Being good is the greatest differentiator in this market. Because at the end of the day, when people want to listen to you call the games, they don't really give a shit about the other stuff. They might in the beginning, but over time, it wears away. They want a guy who's good. And that was my only option was to just dive into this,

pour everything I had into my preparation, learning, calling everybody I knew in the industry, my crew, everyone, and just saying, listen, I don't know what I don't know. Tell me. I want to just teach me. Show me. I can do the football part. Teach me the rest. And that was really just my approach. And I'm going to try to take that approach for as long... Until they call me and say, hey, Greg, that's it. This is the end of the road. That's going to be my approach because A, I really enjoy doing this job and I really enjoy working with my crew and we had an absolute blast.

How could you not? And then B, it's in my own self-interest. It's in my own best interest. If I want to do this for the next 25 years, keep showing people that you can handle big games. And then when that time comes, we'll see how things settle out. It's the only way I know. And again, there's a lot of similarities and parallels that I've drawn from my playing days. I've been tried to be replaced before.

And young rookie who's cheaper and faster and bigger muscles and did more bench press at the combine. But screw that guy. I'm going to beat him. And that's just the only way I know. Yeah. It's really, you know, I always think everybody has great advice for everybody else, you know, where again, that's part of what we even do on the podcast. Right. But where you're like, man, that kind of sucks. And it's like, well, what do you want them to do? What do you want them to do? Be like, Hey, that's it. I'm out of here. And you i'm out of here like okay it would have you could have screwed yourself out of decades plus worth of big money on the tv side by doing something that i'm i don't know if you'll admit it to us but i'm sure there might have been a moment where you're like it's kind of like are

you serious like i kind of get demoted but you know long game, there's a lot of guys that are tough guys with other people's money is my point. No doubt. And I think you're spot on. I think there's the human element to this. I'm not going to sit here and say I'm a hero. I'm not a stoic where I'm able to just separate and live all these virtuous lives. We all have our initial reactions. We all have our initial human emotions, our own egos. We're not used to being told you're not that good. We're hyper competitive. We all operate in that same sphere, which is why we all get to do pretty cool stuff. So I'm not going to sit here and say there was never a moment and I was always clear-headed

and level-headed. No, it took my wife and people around me to be like, are you listening to yourself right now? Pull your shit together. Quit feeling sorry for yourself. So I'm not going to sit here and say those moments didn't happen. But at the end of the day, I always try to make sure that my emotional response doesn't get in the way of what needs to be the real response. And for this moment, to work with this network, with this crew, just across the board, I can go on and on about what an experience this was and how I can't wait for it to start again. We had that much fun as a group.

Why would I want to jeopardize that and jeopardize years of doing this? At any particular level, I'm getting ready to call NFL football games every weekend and come into the houses of millions of people and talk ball and people seem to respond to it and enjoy it. Why would I jeopardize that just because my feelings might have been hurt? It's just... I don't know. It's just not how my brain works. No, and it's the right move.

It's absolutely the right move. And back to it, I'm not just saying this. I'm not trying to kiss your ass because you came out on the podcast. brain works no and it's the right move it's it's it's absolutely the right move and you know back to i'm not just saying this and i'm not trying to kiss your ass because you know came out the podcast or anything like that you're good you're good and when you're good in this business and you're young and you've got four networks competing over live rights now which only expands out you know it was a fifth it could be a six who knows where all this stuff goes like your agent and i'm sure this agent is telling you this like you just just play it the right way be the good soldier now and all of

these opportunities are going to be there for you if you decide to say hey fuck this because the other thing that sucks even if you were right and being like hey i shouldn't have to deal with this i'm really good or whatever then the next place is going oh we heard that greg olson's a little difficult exactly and that's just good business, right? It doesn't matter if it's in TV, if it's in the real world. I don't know. It's not good as a player, right? Again, these are all lessons we all learn, sometimes the hard way.

There was times as a player, you let your own ego and your own stat sheet and your own, I want to be paid as much. But at the end of the day, for the for the vast vast majority of guys who take those you know i don't want to say selfish but those like self-centered stances on tough situations most guys end up losing for every guy who held out and did all that and got the contract and came late to training camp for every guy who went on to have an all pro season most, it did not help them in the long run. That's always... I always like looking at guys like you with the resume, right?

You played Chicago, you're playing Charlotte. And then there's always... I feel like a lot of you dudes that were really good always get this last stop check somewhere. And that, for you, was in Seattle. Is there something to that? Am I on to something where it's like every dude who had a big-time gets like one last paycheck from a place where they as the player know like, yeah, I was probably done before I even got there?

similar experience or maybe slightly different. But for me personally, I had a hard time stepping away if I knew I could still play. Just knowing myself and knowing how long I've been doing this from the time I was a kid, I knew I would have regrets if I left stuff in the tank. There would have always been the what if? I could have done one more year. What if I had done two more years? I didn't want to go into retirement with any height of any looking back and saying, man, I think I could have done it one more year. I didn't want to walk. I knew I was going to do TV. I didn't want to walk into an NFL stadium on a Sunday morning, getting ready to broadcast the game and walk through pregame warmups and have my entire mindset being, I should be in a uniform. That should be me. I didn't want that. I wanted to walk away from the game, wave goodbye, go home and have no regrets, have no moments where I'd sit around looking back and say, I didn't want that in retirement.

So I think specifically that last year, I wanted to go to a proven winner. I wanted to go to a team that had proven success and make a playoff run. And I knew in my heart of hearts that I could play. This was not just... And I said it to every team who brought me in. I said, if you're bringing me in to just be the guy in the locker room

who the rookies come up to, and you want me to hold a team meeting, and you want me to be the rah-rah guy, don't sign me because that's not my jam. Like if you're signing me, I'm coming to play and I expect to play and I might not play like it's 2014 anymore, but I can still play.

And, um, I knew coming off the 2019 season, um, I was healthy. I missed two games with a concussion, but like physically I was healthy. Um, and I knew, I knew I had more left in the tank. I felt great when I went out to Seattle. I missed two games with a concussion, but physically, I was healthy.

And I knew I had more left in the tank. I felt great. When I went out to Seattle, I honestly thought in my heart of hearts, I'm like, I'm good enough that in the right situation, I could have 700, 800 yards. In my mind, that's how I physically felt. And it just didn't work out.

I ended up then rupturing my plantar fascia and my foot, which was a pain in the ass. But yeah, it just didn't work out. And ended up then rupturing my plantar fascia and my foot, which was a pain in the ass. But yeah, it just didn't work out. And again, I have no regrets. I'm glad I did that last year because I think if I would have went out after the 2019 season, we fired Ron Rivera, there was a lot of turmoil,

a lot of change. The way I was let go by the Panthers, I think if that would have been the end, I think I'd still be sitting here with you right now saying, I wonder what another year or two would have been like. So I think a lot of guys are just trying to empty that tank. It's a lifetime effort. It's a life of just work and effort. And you don't ever want to say, man, I could have done a little bit more. And I knew when I got on that plane in Seattle and flew home, there was not a moment where I was thinking,

I wonder if I could do this again. I was done. I got it all out of my system. I was ready to get home to my family. I was ready to start a new chapter in my life. And that's the way I wanted to start retirement. And very few people have the swan song that we all dream of. And my ending was what it was

was that answer for the audience or was that answer for Brady that's well said yeah I guess you could it wasn't intended to be to Brady but I will get it to him we'll get it to his people they said what do you think he's got like five more years left

I wouldn't full I thought his arm looked juicy. I thought he had some... Anyway, I got a couple more things before we let you go. How's Keekly doing, man? How's he doing? He's great, man. I'll tell you, I see him a lot. He lives by me here in Charlotte. He's building a house not far around the corner from me. So we're going to be kind of pseudo-neighbors. you know we had a blast together i don't know if you even knew this

but this fall my my 11 year old son he played tackle football for the first time so like pop warner local i saw the videos and luke luke coached it with me so i think in the beginning luke was you know look wanted something to do to stay busy and whatnot i think the idea of coaching youth sports sounded fun. Dude, by the end of the year, we're on a playoff run. Me and him are meeting in local restaurants with notebooks. And we're diagramming stuff and we're game planning for practice. So we end up coaching these kids.

We start in July, summer workouts. We played our last game in December. We went all the way to december we went down to florida for the pop warner national championships and made it to the semi-finals before we lost but he he'll call me like hey when are we gonna get the kids together for like some off-season workouts i mean he is like full throttle youth football coach um has no kids on the team just volunteered his time and we had an absolute blast coaching these kids. So he's doing great.

Hunts, fishes, coaches, youth football, guys living the dream. The side's still good, the sideline to sideline as a coach, because that was my favorite thing about Keekly is that, again, of all the great linebackers, they're kind of built the same way, but when you would watch him on any play and you would go he runs it out to the end like very few defensive players do and you know he was one of my favorites man he's the best you know what the best part is i think he and again it's it's young kids but i still think like him coaching i think he gets sometimes frustrated because he's just like

just just do that and like he did like you can't even say like, hey, Luke, what did you do on that play? He couldn't even tell you. He's just like, I just knew he was going to run that way. And I knew that guy was going to block me. So I just started and ran behind him. And then I just ran four or five and chased him down. It's like, yeah, well, okay. How do I teach the next guy to do that? You can't. So I think sometimes he'd be working with the linebackers. He'd be like, how did you guys not see the backside guard? He's pulling the kick out. I'm like, Luke, they're 11.

You know what I mean? He was so into it and did such a good job with the kids. He's very patient. He's much more patient than me. So we were a good kind of combination. The kids would always go to him after they got yelled at by me or my dad. Luke was always like the comforting one.

So it worked. It was a good combo. But he's great, man. He's as good a dude as there gets. Living here in Charlotte, living the dream. The guy's a stud. That's good. That's good to hear.

I have two things then. So I think I've told you this story because I remember when it came through and our booker was like, oh, do you want Greg Olson? I was like, yeah, absolutely. But I think I've talked to you about this before. Do you remember? I'm sure you remember your draft day, right? And you were with Rosenhaus, correct? And he had different cabanas for the different clients. Was it the Shore Club in Miami? Shore Club, yeah. Right. I think I've told you this, or I've only told the story, is that I was working at ESPN then, again, this is years ago, right? 2007 draft. 2007, yeah. And so that's, I think, my second year there.

And I was going to be doing the late night wrap-up guy for the ESPN, for the draft. And the draft wasn't on Thursdays then, so I think it was the first round was whatever. So I was going to be on in the middle of the night recapping everything that was happening. But we had cameras set up at all of these different draft locations. And it was just to have B-roll for when the person actually would be drafted. But that means the audio and the video is up the entire time. So they had a camera in your cabana up for the entire time with the audio and i had a feed of it just watching you guys hang out it now looking back on it's the most dangerous thing imaginable because there are guys back at espn we had them on the raw feeds like it wasn't on tv but we had them on the raw

feeds so i would like dial you up and be like what are these guys talking about here what are the and then as i was thinking about i was like was like, this is like poor Trent Edwards is there for like four days in his living room. Holy shit. But you got picked at least soon enough. But it was just so like it's actually fucked up thinking about it now that like I just I was going on that night. I would have never, ever said like, hey, I heard this guy say this in his cabana today. Like I would have never, ever done that. But you don't even realize it's just the equipment set up, but it was actually live.

And the feed was being fed to us in Bristol. It's crazy. Well, I guess you could, you could have probably sabotaged a lot of people's careers. If you wanted to, you could have held them, held them ransom. Um, I'm sure I had whispered a few things under my breath that day. The biggest thing I remember about that day is yes, we were at the shore club, had the whole family down there. I'm in this gigantic suit. I don't know why I was either really fat or I wore really baggy

clothes because my suit from draft day, I still have it. I could fit my whole body in one leg. I don't know why I wore my clothes so big. But anyway, it was 1,000 degrees in Miami. So hot. You guys were all dying. Because there was other clients in different cabanas. Right. Oh, yeah.

Lawrence Timmons from Florida State who got drafted by Pittsburgh. Drew Stanton, the quarterback for Michigan State, got drafted by Detroit. Yeah, there was a handful of us. But what I remember the most is that was the last year that there was 20 minutes before each first round draft pick.

So, you know, at the time, it was Oakland. that there was 20 minutes before each first round draft pick. So, you know, so you got out, you know, at the time it was Oakland. The Raiders are on the clock. They picked Jamarcus Russell. And then it's 20 minutes. And, you know, everybody... They put six months to prepare

and they take all 20 minutes. But they still have to take all 20. It used to drive me crazy. You don't think the Lions were like sprinting up to draft Calvin Johnson? Like that was a 20-minute decision? He was picked four months ago. But anyway,

but what I remember was, so I'm the 31st pick. So you do the math. It started at noon. Back then, it would start on Saturday at noon. So I got drafted at 6 p.m. Eastern or whatever it was. You just sit in front of the TV

for six hours, sweating through my jacket. And then it gets past the teams you're thinking of. And then every negative thing in your mind pops up. It's like, I'm not getting drafted. I should have went back to school. Why am I so stupid? And finally, I got drafted by Chicago. I never even heard from Chicago during the draft. They sent a scout and maybe an assistant, I don't remember, to my pro day. And that was it. I never met Jerry Angelo, never spoke to lovey smith until the day they called me on draft day but i just remember and then the next year they changed it to i don't know what is it 10 minutes now or whatever

the time but yeah they kept scaling it back and now it's just you know the first round it's all they're smart they built it better for tv but i remember and i remember a long day i remember drew at the time, like you weren't giving him a hard time, but I could hear Drew talking to you, where Drew would be like alright, I think we have a chance here, and then they'd pick somebody else. He'd be like, ah! And you were young, so you're like

I'd be like, shut up! Don't say another word. Hey, you had a cabana at a South Beach club with your agent there.rent edwards was in cargo shorts where by the time he got picked up everyone had left his living room he may have been playing it would have been call of duty then maybe siphon filter and he's just sitting on his couch watching and i still had the feed up and like one of our boys stanford steve who was a stanford guy would

come in and be like is he still sitting sitting there? I'm like, this poor guy, like somebody's got to pick him soon. Everybody left his party. The results? It's a long day, man. It's draft day for as exciting as it was. It is a brutal, just

I don't know. I don't even really know how to describe it looking back. It was a long, that was a tough that's a tough day. Well, it's worked out. The career worked out. The second career has worked out. I don't even really know how to describe it looking back. It was a long... That was a tough... That's a tough day. Well, it's worked out. The career worked out. The second career has worked out. I think you're terrific. And I can't wait to see where this all goes. But before we let you go, I know you're also working with Ryan Khalil and obviously Vince Vaughn. You guys have an audio group that you're putting together.

So I know there's a little bit more specificity on it. So share that with us. Yeah. So it kind of started from this idea we had where I lived my whole life here doing youth sports. We were talking about it before we jumped on the show. I got three kids. I'm coaching teams. And obviously, we just talked about coaching football and doing baseball now. And my daughter's getting into sports. So we're just racing around. And my wife and I then sit up at night, like I think millions of people around the country do. And we're like, are we doing this whole thing right? Is it too much? Is it not enough? Do we need to push our kids harder? Not as hard. What is this whole youth

sports experience supposed to look like? And how are we supposed to parent them? So I came up with this idea to do a show based on youth sports. So it's called You Think. And we had our first season back in last year in 2022. We had about 40 episodes and interviewed coaches, parents, players from all over the sports landscape and just tried to get best practices and best principles of not only navigating the youth amateur sports scene yourself, but also parenting it. And it was an awesome experience. So from that idea, I was having lunch with Ryan and Vince who live out your way in California. And I was pitching them this idea. I said,

Hey, a couple podcast networks are interested in this. And they're like, No. Let's keep it ourselves. We built our own. So from a random lunch and a random pitch on my show, I had an idea for... We launched Audiorama, which now we've produced multiple content pieces. Not only my show, Vince did a Christmas Chronicle show, which was really cool around the holidays with Peter Billingsley, who was from A Christmas Story, who hosted and gave people behind the scenes of some famous Christmas movies. Yeah, I saw that. It's the kid from A Christmas Story. Right. Yeah. The kid from A Christmas Story. And Ryan did a joint venture with Audiorama and Amazon around Thursday Night Football

called Block Forever, which was centered on offensive linemen and their perspective. It was a cool show. We have some really cool things down in the pipeline. So yeah, we started Audiorama probably about a year ago, March of last year. And we've had some cool projects, some cool partnerships

with some other groups. Just trying to come up with really cool stories, really cool concepts that we're passionate about. And obviously, Ryan and Vince out there and with what they do, obviously, in Hollywood and the stuff that they've been able to make. Obviously, we all know what Vince has been able to do. And Ryan has a really successful movie production business alongside Blake Griffin, White Man Can't Jump. They just had their first Apple show that just got released on Apple Plus. So they're both obviously heavily involved in that content creation and TV world.

So it's been a fun partnership and seeing where it goes. Well, hey, man, like I said, I can't wait to see where this goes for you. Thanks for the time and looking forward to the 23 season with Greg Olson. Appreciate it, man. Thanks for having me on. This was fun. You want details? Fine. I drive a Ferrari. 355 Cabriolet. What's up?

I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork. I have every toy you could possibly imagine. And best of all, kids, I am liquid. So, now you know what's possible. Let me tell you what's required. Before we get to life advice, yes, I'm aware Durant's going to be out for the rest of the regular

season, it looks like, with this ankle thing. I wasn't going to do an open on it. I'm disappointed. Moving on. Life advice, lifeadvicerr at gmail.com. Saruti, Kyle, in the mix the mix okay the idea of my wife joining the gym i'm 39 years old 59 195 505 deadlift 450 squat okay join crossfit at 35 best shape of my life quick backstory after i got married i relocated from long island to a much slower

section of new york keep in touch with most of my good friends, but now live a little further away and get together. Uh, get togethers are less frequent. No shit. Joined a retro fitness, but I really wasn't feeling it. Tried CrossFit, get hooked. So I go six days a week, relatively small gym, about 50 members, lots of attractive young females. And I really enjoy the atmosphere there. Here's the issue. My wife is in her late forties and completely fell off the exercise wagon since COVID. So he's got a wife about a decade older than him. Not judging, just want to point that out. So since COVID, she's not working out. She was pretty active attending Orange Theory four or five times a week. I've casually mentioned the possibility of joining again, but it's pretty much been ignored. I bought a Peloton, but she only rode it a handful of times and not in two years. It sounds like we've got a guy in Long

Island willing to move a slightly used Peloton. My gym is half a mile from my house. Do I consider pushing her to join? I know if she does, she'll be the type to go all in. However, this place is my sanctuary, my one hour a day when I get to leave the house and enjoy my surroundings.

Do I willingly, all caps, allow my worlds to collide? Thanks. P.S. We have a similar build and I suggest... Oh, I thought he meant his wife. I was about to say, that's interesting. P.S. We have a similar

build. He means me. I suggest you stop wearing undershirts and undersweaters and collared shirts. Too bulky and looks messy. I don't know if we needed that. A little life advice on the end of a life advice. Okay, wait. This guy's 5'9", 195. We have't know if we needed that. A little life advice on the end of a life advice. Okay, wait. This guy's 5'9", 195.

We have similar builds. Uh-oh. Good luck, man. Scorched earth, buddy. Here it comes. Next email. I don't think he's wearing any cashmere numbers. All right.

28. Possibly 29 by the time you read this. A Chris Paul stan. Curious on your guys' thoughts on the situation that I find myself in. I'm a restaurant consultant in Maryland, self-employed. I help new restaurants get open via recruiting, training, menu design, cocktails programs, et cetera. I basically help you open up your restaurant. A few months ago, I posted on Facebook about my plans to open up my own restaurant in the near future and a girl, does he use her name here? Let's change it anyways. He did. He used her real name.

All right. Let's call her Shelby. Okay. There was a girl that we knew named Michelle that was a stripper and her stripper name was Shelby and my hammer buddy called her Michelle B.

To her face. Did not go well. All right. I clicked her profile and saw that we were actually oddly friends already. Classic Facebook. My post mentioned I was looking for help with certain

positions in the restaurant. So shot her a message and asked her how she thought she could help. She told me she works for, again, dude, he told us where she works. And this is actually like a pretty, she works on a side of the restaurant business. All right. And would love to handle that aspect of my business once we got off to the ground, got off the ground. I responded and said, for sure, I will reach out. But I also stated that I knew a ton of local restaurants. If you can beat other payroll companies, well, there you go. I could possibly hook you up with some deals. I asked her to grab lunch one day

to meet in person. I wanted to know I could trust her to be a good sales rep. This was true, but she's also gorgeous and just my type. Kind of wanted an excuse to see her. We had lunch and she talked to me about her new boyfriend. He seemed like someone she was trying to fix. Previous issues, rich family. We chatted

about the services she can provide the business, our personal lives, and I left feeling good about the business side and content to leave the personal side alone. Over the next couple months, we did two different deals together. All right. Success. You want to collab on anything? It actually happened.

Met in person a few times chatted on the phone by text and developed a good friendship at one meeting we discussed fitness and she said i had a quote perfect body perfect body from this dude he left out his stats that's weird i mean if he's getting called perfect body when she normally like feel good and throw that in there right yeah even in parentheses there. Yeah, she always offered to set me up with one of her friends. I never took her up on it. Flash forward to today.

Is it fast forward or flash forward? I guess they both work. I think either one would work. I would accept both. Yeah, alright. We have plans to meet for dinner, drinks this week and discuss a possible new deal she has to reschedule the meeting because of a work thing but says i should really come by and see her new place she could use my help with some things let's go i wouldn't say i have feelings for her but a crush

should be a fair way to put it i think we all were on the same page here i also just find her extremely attractive i don't take the invitation as anything more than a chance to hang out, but I do find it odd she would invite me over. We really don't flirt, and I made it a point to never even hint at anything like that with her as a way to respect her relationship. I said I would go, but now I'm having second thoughts, afraid I could either develop feelings, end up in an awkward spot, or have an opportunity to make a move I feel like I shouldn't.

Thoughts attached below as a screenshot for proof not of her that's all right you know it sounds like creeps but okay uh let's read this from her shelby okay how is wednesday actually i'll be in the area tomorrow if you want to meet shit today's going to be hard actually that's what she said i have people coming to get furniture also i'd love you to come see the new place. I know it's kind of far from you, but you're welcome over any time. Sounds like that boyfriend had a couple more problems than we thought. Rehab, maybe? Out of town for a month?

Anyway, we could try. And then he says we can try for tomorrow or just find a random other day too it's no big deal and it's not that far ha ha sentence I'd love to see your place or help you with anything

if you need it separate text you're my friend could have done without that one. OMG, you're the best. I could use your opinions on some things. Boyfriend has zero decor inclination, and I can't ask his opinion because it's shit. Ha, ha, ha.

He's around. Right. Okay. I mean, most guys will fuck this up and do what they want to do because she's hot and you're getting attention and all of that. You said a couple different things where you're like, I'm afraid I could eventually have feelings for her. But then you said I might be in a situation where I'd make a move.

I don't know. I mean, this is the weird part of the game where you're like, I don't know what you're doing. You're clearly like, you sent a separate thing. You're my friend. Like telling yourself that, buddy. orphans a little bit like maybe she's looking for you to make a move because she doesn't she's afraid to leave this kind of like deadbeat boyfriend and she kind of like needs a sign from you and you're giving her the friend zone like maybe you're actually fucking this up for yourself i think that's in play as well i think i mean let's there's also where i love when people like maybe it's the normal version of events where she's just actually super friendly the boyfriend would be totally cool with it and she's just asking for some help um do we think the boyfriend would be totally cool with that i don't know too

many dudes all i know is that if i were if i were living with my girlfriend and all of a sudden a dude was there helping her move furniture when i came home what it's not going to go over well yeah yeah and she knows that i don't know man i feel like i feel like she's trying to open a door here and you're you're kind of like being too cautious. You walk in the hallway, you look at him, you're like,

perfect body, my ass. Right. What's up above average shoulders? Uh, I don't know. I mean,

we don't know where her head's at with this whole thing. I mean, you know what I think you need to do? I think the emailerer do we give him some credit for at least presenting as if he wants to be respectful and then he's actually not going

down this road so i think we do give him some credit there where i think deep down like you like the attention but um i don't know i wouldn't i don't know that i would show up to her house in this vague like if it was a long-term friend right like? Like if I go to Sarah Walsh's house and I'm there, no one thinks that's weird, right? Because it isn't weird. If I went to Chris's house, like none of that is weird. If it's somebody who I've just met and I'm over there, I mean, I guess you have, I don't want to say guys because that's the wrong word, but hey, this is somebody who I have a business relationship with and you've already done deals with. It's not like I just fucking,

it's not some dude I had come by and get a pre or post-workout smoothie at my house who I just met, right? Yeah, I think you're right. I think this guy kind of just needs to know which way it's going and then make a decision from there, right? I just feel like going to her house is there's no,

what's the harm there. What's the, like either something happens. No, no, no, no. I mean,

obviously like this could be like the first step of the rest of your life, but like if she makes a move on you at the house, that's not your, that's not your problem. You could turn it down if you feel uncomfortable or it could be like this thing that opens a door. I don't think it has to be this like really awkward situation like i just think it's like a it's kind of like a fine it's it's a perfect figure out what the situation is event that you didn't even plan so it's not even on you yeah he's not gonna turn it down because

as much as he said i'd i want to be like respectful or or don't you know don't want to make things weird he's he's also said just as much that she's like my type and has is gorgeous. Like he's mentioned that three or four times. So that's going to overpower any of his like good guy energy that he's going in there with, I think. And, um, you know, I would just only because you're, he's a business owner, I would be a little more careful. Uh, if you were, if you were just like an employee and it's like, Oh, get shit's weird at work now. Like like we've i think we've all done that but just because you're like an owner i would just i would think i would think like a little bit use a little more brain power on this one uh here's what i

like i we don't we can't guess where the emailer's heads at right he's mentioned she's hot twice like he's made that very clear um and again my history i would say my experience of understanding the male female dynamic is that guys will break a lot of their own rules totally for somebody that's hot uh and it sounds like he's fighting with these rules a little bit but have you all right like have you ever sent a picture of yourself with a dog to this girl? Right? Have you ever sent her a picture of yourself like after a workout? Have you ever sent her a picture of yourself? Like, have you ever of hit her up in a way that you could say, oh, man. It's not work-related, though. Yeah, whatever. I remember there was a guy at work that sent one of the makeup girls a picture of himself with a dog and she showed it to me and I was like, that poor bastard.

Because I'm definitely not the last stop on this cell phone tour somebody else is gonna see this yeah and because it was like you know i was like is this that dude trying to get smooth she was like oh i don't know i don't think so and then she was like he did send me this picture him and a dog and i was like yeah i was like that's pretty good chance pretty good chance. He would be interested. If you invited him over to the house to move around some furniture, even though you live with a boyfriend, if you made a move on him, he'd probably be pretty good because that's what the dog picture was

about. So, I like this, though, for the emailer. I like the anxiousness of it, right? This is good anxiety. It's fun. It's exciting. Right? Like, all right, let's go. I would go over there, but if I were the boyfriend, I wouldn't want you over there. But maybe you go over there

and if it's totally on, because there's also a business part of it where you actually want to be, like you don't want to seem like you're thinking about all these things in your head because what if she is straight friend zone and she has no interest in you whatsoever and it's not flirty and it's only about business

and she thinks that you're somebody i mean she's hanging out with a guy who sounds like he's a loser who has a ton of family money maybe she's like this guy has his shit together look at his facebook stuff he's opening up all these restaurants he's able to do all these different things so she could be playing that angle so you might be thinking of these things that she's not even thinking about because she's only thinking about it from being smart and networking and the future possibilities and all that kind of stuff. And if you get that vibe, when you go over there, you kind of have more of your answer and you can kind of put it behind you. But I think whatever path this goes down, I think you just need more clarity because I mean, you asked us, right? Can I ask you an uncomfortable question?

Yeah. We've all, I think, been on record on the pod saying, like, you shouldn't be a cheater. If you're a guy and you know that this girl has somebody else, just don't do it. But she said multiple times, this guy's a shithead. Does that change the equation for you guys? Yeah, a little bit. I would agree. Maybe that makes us bad people. It really comes down it really comes down to like how much you care about the person

well i don't care i mean even if i didn't know the guy no no i met her i met her okay like do you care about her you know yeah i just think it's kind of like a again i think you go there and if you you don't have to put the first move out there, but you just, just see what happens. It's just, it's, it's okay for you to go there and see what happens. That's just my, that. But although dudes are notorious, notorious for the open relationship rumor. Like, oh yeah, it's kind of like an open. She gets it.

She totally gets it. Women are out there being like, yeah, I think it's like 40% of marriages are open from the guys I meet. Yeah. And married women be like, wait, but think it's like 40% of marriages are open from the guys I meet. Yeah. And married women be like, wait, what? It's less than five. Yeah. Yeah. Five total.

Good luck. Enjoy the butterflies, homie. Yeah. I'm with you. I think these are good butterflies. Yeah. So. I hope he doesn't.

I want to follow up. That's all. I'll leave it at that. Okay. We got another one here. All right. Hi, Ryan. 5'11", 165.

No idea how much I venture squat, but I'm a huge Warriors fan. One of your rare female listeners who loves not only the life advice, but the sports segments too. Okay, but you said it so you can get away with it. But when we say it, like I just know what the audience is. And I know when I walk around now and I get recognized, there went from the girlfriend or wife saying, I hate you to you're the only podcast we can agree on because we both like Life Advice. So you said it, I didn't.

But then sometimes it could be spun into, I'm dismissing that we have female listeners that like sports, which I get. We do. We have that too. It's fucking awesome. But I also know what the day-to-day is like. And this segment's just, it's got a little i also know what the day-to-day is like and this this

segment's just uh it's got a little something for everybody so here we go uh kyle do you have anything to add to that do you like that uh i would just say women but uh yeah go ahead thank you well done kyle international women's day yesterday i mean god it wasn't like fucking two months ago but whatever dude i should have gone to you earlier today man sorry all right uh i have a question for you about joining the sports industry and whether it's worth it okay that's oh boy that's all right um but she makes it more specific so this is good i live in utah and made it out to your live show last month thanks for coming out to see us you looked awesome don't know what these pictures are about she didn't actually i did that i had that in it uh you mentioned in the show how cool it was to walk

the halls of espn and how it took you several years before you were ever ready to leave yes true story it got me thinking yet again about working in sports i work in data analytics for a health care company that pays really well 100k plus a year lets me work from home has amazing flexibility work-life balance i'm doing work that makes me feel good trying to improve outcomes and cost of health care for kids that is very good. Kudos to you. But I'm just not very passionate about it. So you don't like kids? I'm just kidding. I don't hate my job, but I know work is work and not play. But I've always wondered about working in an area I do have a huge passion for, which is sports. I played college basketball at Lehigh University, coached high school basketball, and now just generally feel

at home and happy when sports are involved. I took a shot last year going down this path and applied for a revenue sales analytics position with the Utah Jazz. Not exactly a job where I'd be involved with actual basketball, but a star. I even got offered the job, but it paid all caps half of what I make now. Welcome to working for a team. My wife is awesome, and she said that we could find a way to make it work. But with a mortgage and us trying to have a baby this year, I couldn't quite do it. I don't regret turning down that position, but I keep wondering if I should one day make the jump. So I wanted to ask you, is being in the sports industry really as cool as it seems? Is it worth giving up the salary and

flexibility other industries offer for the perks? Are there actual perks of working in sports? Or should I just keep my good career and get my sports picks through other means i appreciate the help love the show and i've listened to every episode uh and by the way she says her mom is a huge listener and she liked the iceland pots well thank you to everybody involved on that side of the family no look i get this a lot uh it sounds like you working on the non-sports side for a sports team isn't going to do it for you. And that was my biggest problem. Again, some of you have heard this before. But when I decided to take the gig with the minor league baseball team, when I flew down there, I was doing insurance consulting, sort of.

consulting, sort of. And I failed the exam because my buddy who co-founded this consulting firm was like, dude, it's all common sense. And I was like, yeah, for common, like people who work in insurance, like I was coming straight from bartending to be like, I didn't even have, he gave me some note cards and I got like a 60. You were like reading a script. Right. Then the partner was like, I have to meet and see if the guy we hired is an idiot. And then he was like, what did you study? And he's like, I don't know. He told me, your partner told me it was a lot of common sense and I would be fine. It was like, no, you actually, there's stuff you have.

So he gave me the books. We had like, he gave, he tutored me. He was actually nice enough to me, but he was like, why do you want to do this? Like, what else are you trying to do? And I was like, I'm trying to get into sports. And he looked at me, he was like, nah, there's no money in that. You know, and I kind of looked around. I was like, what do we got?

21, 22 hundred square feet here. Like, all right, fucking take it easy, guy. I, you know, I said something like, well, what if you're awesome? What if you're awesome at it? Then you'll, then there'll be money in it. So the reason I say that is then when I went to interview with the Trenton Thunder, I'd gone through what I thought was sort of a real life work experience, but that insurance consulting thing was not real life at all, not even close. And then the state of Vermont had me fired because I'd never sold insurance before. And they were

like, maybe if you're going to be a consultant, you could work in the industry before you're just a straight consultant, which I actually think is a good rule. Seems reasonable. Yeah. Like, you know what? Not even mad. So it wasn't like I really got fired. They were like, you're just a straight consultant, which I actually think is a good rule. Seems reasonable. Yeah. Like, you know what? Not even Matt. So it wasn't like I really got fired. They were like, you're not even eligible to have a job that you've had for six months. And those guys should have known that. So not great prep on that side. I think they sold that company for like 10 million bucks, by the way. Yeah. So when I went to the Trent Thunder, the first thing I did when I walked in is they were like, okay, we have one internship left. I'm like, I'm out of here. Are you fucking kidding me? I turned 27 this year. I can't take an internship. I thought it was a job. I applied. I had a cover letter. You're just telling

me, oh, throw them an internship. So I was like, I'm out of here. And they actually liked that. They liked it. I was like, I'm out of here. But they had said, you can do sales. And I go, well, then I'm out of here again. I'm like, it can't sales. And I go, well, then I'm out of here again. I'm like, it can't be an internship. It can't be. Here's the deal. If I'm going to work in a job that's the same as any other job, but it just happens to be affiliated with a sports team, that doesn't do enough for me. Getting tickets, it's going to get stale quick. And the other problem, when you're in, not at the top, let me be fair about all this. If you're a younger dude or a female or a woman,

and you're like, I want to work in sports, okay? But you're not going to be on the air, and you're not going to be making basketball decisions, in this case, in the front office, right? That's the different path. But you want to work in sports, there's a really good chance you're going to be making way less for the privilege of working for the franchise because they have so many people that think it's so fucking cool. You're going to be making way less than you would be making somewhere else that's not affiliated with the franchise, right? And that's why when I was at the minor league team, I'd be looking around going, I can't fucking believe some of you guys do this job. Because I was like, if I'm going to do sales, if I'm going to do something like that, then I'll go do sales and actually make real money, not selling. I didn't come from some awesome school where it was like, wow, we got the guy from UVM. Nobody was doing that. But I cared so little about what they were offering. I had the balls in the moment to go, I don't want to do any of this. What do you got for me? I'm applying for sports jobs to work in sports. And I think a lot

of people feel that way, but they don't say it. And I'm not asking for credit. I was such a loser that I was like, at the end of my... I was like, I don't even care. If I blow this, I blow it, but I'm going to tell them exactly what I want to do. So as you send in this email, the reason I'm going through all that stuff is that, what do you really want to do? Do deep down, you actually want to work in basketball, basketball, and you think you'll side your way over from like sales analytics stuff? Not impossible. Certainly not impossible. We're going to be hard. I don't know how old you are. If you're older, you have to be realistic about your window. I met somebody the other day who was in their 40s and she said, I still haven't given up on the hope of being a sideline

reporter. I was like, I think you're getting pretty close to getting ready. Is it tomorrow then? Because you should be getting real close to giving up on that one. Not saying it's impossible. We're not here to shit on anyone's dreams, but there's also numbers that make sense. If it's about

a basketball thing, it could be your side door in. You know, it happens a lot with on-air people, right? And I'm not calling out Sruti because Sruti is the only fucking producer I think I've met who doesn't want to be on the air. And there's a lot of producers that go, wait, well, maybe I can find a way if I'm on at ESPN, like running the board and get to jump in every now and then that'll lead to something else. And if it does great, good for you, but it's not the best plan. So you're probably going to make less money if you're younger or who cares about maybe the age thing isn't the most important factor. Cause I would tell some other people be like, if you want

to be, if you're 25 and you're going to work for a team and you're working in like something that's, you know, you're not making enough for what the market would pay you if you weren't working for the basketball team. Are you so career oriented that you're like, I don't care. This is my career because that's the part that can be really cool. And it isn't just punching the nine to five, that there's an element of this that is cool, that is better. I can maybe set myself up for whatever your five to 10 or plus year plan is that maybe I could even, who knows, I could be vice president of business affairs and then it starts to become a really fucking cool job. But not everybody gets those and you have to be determined enough and willing to suck it up in the beginning.

Because most people, you're not going to work out. That path is going to happen to you. As far as the perks on air and that kind of stuff, I don't know that we had a ton of perks, to be honest with you. At ESPN. There really wasn't. Sales guys kept all the fucking tickets. They let me go to the Masters once, which is a huge favor to to them let me do that and taking four of my friends i also think it's because they thought they're going to lay

me off and they were like yeah we'll hook them up once here on the way out um yeah all right so honestly kind of worth it though yeah actually at the time i was kind of over it anyway enjoy the three-hour sandwiches with silla had they said hey here's your severance and four passes to the masters in the double legal club i think you know what sully would have been like you didn't take as Russillo. Had they said, hey, here's your severance and four passes to the Masters and the Double Eagle Club, you know what? Sully would have been like, you didn't take that? All right, so Kyle, jump in here. Jump in here because

I don't know what your long-term career goals or any of that stuff. I mean, her working for the Jazz in a front office capacity that isn't really front office. It's not identical to what it is that you're doing, certainly, but I don't,

I just want you and Saruti both to chime in here. I mean, I just, I forget how old she was. Cause, uh, we don't know. Email started so long ago,

but, um, I'm just kidding. But, uh, I just like, I wonder, I just wonder if it's like,

is this going to be like a, is this like a pursuit of happiness situation? Like, are you, is your changing careers, like buying all those fucking detector machines that Will Smith bought? Like, you know, you said you got a wife, you're trying to have a kid and you're like, now's the time to, oh, wow. And, and it's like, now's the time to, to change everything.

Like you're kind of, you guys are starting a life path. I don't know how cool she's going to be with you being like, you know, it sounds like you're pretty much going to have to accept a way less money, or you're just going to have to have like a hobby and start writing articles about basketball or starting to do a podcast that nobody's going to listen to about basketball. Cause that's the only way that I think, unless you know somebody or, you know, that you're not going to totally take half your salary. And I'm not sure how your life partner is going to feel about that when you're, you know, talking about having a kid and like doing other stuff. So, you know, it just, it might put a lot of, a ton of stress on the relationship that, you know, like, you know, Ryan always talks about, like, I didn't do shit. I just, I grinded, I did, I made no money and I had no free time. And, you know, the only reason that really worked is because I put it first all the time. I don't know if you can even do that with the stuff that this person is looking to do. right? Especially, and that could even just be like,

hey, I'm bringing in half the money I was going to do before for a job that isn't super promising just because, you know, it's what I want. So I don't know. It's just have to take stock of like, you know, the other half of your life with all this. I wish I knew how old you were too. Yeah, it's tough to say because, you know,

if you ask me, you know, I'm 34 now. When I started at ESPN, I was part-time. It was 2011. So I was what? I was, you know, you ask me you know i'm 34 now when i started at esbn i was part-time it was 2011 so i was what i was you know one year out of college so i was probably 22 23 20 yeah then 22 and you know i'm part-time i'm working overnights you know i have no social life um and you know i had friends being like dude what the hell are you doing like you're not even like are you you're not even on the air like you're not even doing? Like, you're not even like, are you, you're not even on the air. Like you're not even doing show stuff. Like you're, you're producing like scan,

which is on tape. Uh, what, what, what are you doing? Like, what's the end game here? And I don't know,

like it definitely bummed me out, but I was like, all right, you know, like I, let me just see it out. Let me just see how, like what,

what, you know, a few years go by and it's still shitty. Then I could always pivot and try to do something else. It's fine. I, I took the LSAT. I thought I wanted to go to law school,

which was, it turned out to be a great decision. I didn't do that because I don't think being a lawyer right now is the most lucrative thing you can do because everyone wants to be a lawyer and law schools are packed. So I ended up working out like a year or two later. I was like part-time on SEP and Rosillo

and things started to kind of snowball and work that way. I was part-time, I think, too. Yeah, you were part-time. We were both part-time working on the... Added up to one salary yeah uh now i will say well let me just finish that point if you ask me at age 34 now like would i want to go and redo that again i mean the answer is absolutely not like i just wouldn't it was it sucked and especially with all the things that i have like i just had a daughter obviously i'm

married i got a house i got bills to pay i I couldn't imagine doing that again. Not that my social life is crushing it right now, but I couldn't imagine throwing that into the mix. I have a buddy right now who is going back to school and his life is kind of miserable. It's obviously going to be for the better when he's finished, but right now he's absolutely miserable. But he also hates his job, so it's kind of a different thing. And it's so he can get paid more in the long run. If you're going to do all that stuff and be miserable and take half your salary and the question mark of what the end game is going to be is out there. I can tell you from a personal perspective, I don't know that I would do that. I will push back, though.

Like, Ryan, I think I think we did get some pretty good perks. I mean, we got to go to like a ton of LSU games, college football games. Like there were some cool things about that. Now, if you're working for the Jazz, you know, I don't know what know what those perks necessarily are i mean you're going to be able to go to i guess whatever games you want um you probably go to games already like is that is that a big enough perk for you to be like yeah this is worth taking the half salary cut probably not so i don't know like as kyle said i wish i knew how old you were because if you were like in your late 20s i'd say all right like let's say 30s let's says. 30s is really on that line. 30s with a wife.

30s married, trying to have a family. I don't know, man. I'm not trying to tell you. Follow your dreams. If it's still in the bag, go for it. I don't have to sit here and tell you no. But I know me personally, I'd have a hard time knowing what it took to get to this point, doing that all over again for something that I don't even know what the end game is going to be.

All right. Let's try to summarize the pros cons. Sorry, Kyle, I cut you off. You finish. No, I was just going to say,

if you told Maddie, like, Hey, I'm going to be a law clerk. I'm just going to get my bearings now. And you know, it's going to be great. I've really,

it's been driving me nuts working with Rosillo and Kyle and all this stuff. It's like, I just, it's not me anymore. I'm going to be a law clerk. She'd be like, no, are you fucking kidding me?

Absolutely not. She'd be like, are you, she's like, no, you're not giving up Spotify benefits. That's pretty much, that's pretty much what you would tell me. Right. Exactly. And I'd be like no are you fucking kidding me absolutely not she'd be like are you she's like no you're not giving up spotify benefits that's pretty much that's pretty much what you would tell me right exactly and i'd be like okay i will not do that i'd say just start a podcast or something i don't know start right okay so let's let's do a summary pros and cons as we finish this

episode i think the pros are there is something exciting being connected to a franchise that matters, right? And being around it, the juice of the moment, right? Feeling like there's a goal, right? To be a great franchise. And I know it may not feel like you're doing any of that stuff in a non-basketball position, but I do think there's a real part of that that can make you feel, I don't know. I mean, sometimes I think about that. Like, wouldn't it be great to be showing up every day to work and pulling in and thinking about, like,

we all have one common goal here. Now, granted, you know, the basketball people, it's going to be a little different than the salespeople and that kind of stuff. But I do think there's something true to that. Perks-wise, yeah, it would be pretty localized to different events around the Utah Jazz and maybe some NBA thing that you would get to do

in some conferences. I don't know that world that well. If I want to really reach on the pros list, I think the NBA does the best job of the major sports leagues of trying to hire from different backgrounds. So if you have a basketball background and you kick ass in the sales job and it's an analytic element to it, and you impress the right people and you express on a non-annoying timeline that you have some interest in maybe shifting over to the other side and that's really your goal, then that might be the biggest pro out of all the ones. Although the odds of that one,

I don't know. But I think the NBA with the way that they push to make sure that the hiring is a better representation of the country. That would be the one thing. Now, I'm not trying to trick you into doing it because I don't even know how probable that is, but the fact that it's even a possibility has to be put on the pro list. Cons would be you're entering a stage in your life where you probably want a little bit more stability, more certainty, probably some more freedom. It sounds like you have all that freedom. There's also weird stages in life where you're like, okay, I can make less money here, but I can't make less money there. I've had a couple of times where I'm like,

I'll take less money for this knowing that I should make way more later on because I'm doing this thing here. I also wasn't bringing a kid in this situation and engagement rings for the most part, you can return them. So I think there's a lot of really good pros, but it comes down to one simple thing. How practical of a person are you to take that leap? And considering where you're at in your life, it's not impossible. There's a really good chance it could be awesome for you. But what if you do make the change, you're making less, the. There's a really good chance it could be awesome for you. But what if you do make the change? You're making less.

The family dynamic's a little more stressed because you have less time. I don't know what it's like for the nine-to-fivers on the business side of things with teams, but I imagine you still have to go to games. I mean, remember in the minors, that was a very normal thing. If you worked for the team, then you would also be at a lot of the home games too. normal thing like if you work for the team then you will also be at a lot of the home games too um and what if the basketball part is not being that thirst isn't being quenched at all because you're just drilling numbers away on sales number you're never getting any kind of opportunity not talking with any of the right people so that was a matt i don't know that answer shouldn't have

been that long but i think we i think we covered it the other thing too really quickly is you know you're you're in salt Lake working for the Jazz. That's probably awesome. Yeah, but you're kind of locked into that one franchise. If you want to move up around, you've got to probably go to different NBA cities. If the Hawks give you an offer sheet that's better, are you willing to move your family 3,000 miles across the country? I don't know. It's another thing to think about.

I don't think she plays for the Jazz. No, no, no. I'm just saying. No, but if you end up getting into a point where you could get to a mid-level or even upper-higher level part, sometimes there's just not room for you at whatever franchise you're at

or whatever job you're at. And in the NBA, it's not like you can just get a job down the road. There's one team in town. There's only one thing you're doing. I mean, I guess you can get a job at Real Salt Lake if you like soccer. I don't know. But pretty much your options are limited as far as one NBA team in town. There's only one thing you're doing. I mean, I guess you can do a job at Real Salt Lake if you like soccer. I don't know, but pretty much your options are limited

as far as one NBA team in the city. Hey, you also have to try... There's way more sports media out there too, right? I mean, you might be better off in a sports media thing. I don't think that's what she was doing. I don't think that's going to happen. If she's going to sports media, she's starting at like zero. At least with this job and your background. Yeah, definitely don't do that.

Yeah, we'll get you on a new cricket pod as it comes out Monday mornings. At least with this job. Definitely don't do that. Definitely don't do that. Yeah. We'll get you on a new cricket pod as it comes out Monday mornings. You can also just do it for a year and then go, hey, this was a huge mistake. Now I know.

Yeah. And now I can just go back to the other thing. If you're good enough with the other thing. We don't need to go any longer than we already have. Thank you to Kyle.

Thank you to Steve. Prime Resolution Podcast for your podcast. Thank you.