The Ryen Russillo Podcast - NFL Draft Takeaways With Booger McFarland. Plus, Jimmy Butler’s Big Game 4 and ‘Warfare’ Codirector Ray Mendoza.

Episode Date: April 29, 2025

Russillo starts the show by sharing his thoughts on Jimmy Butler's Game 4 performance (1:21). Then, he’s joined by Booger McFarland to break down last week’s NFL draft. They discuss their favorite picks, what they expect from Travis Hunter, why Shedeur fell so far, and whether 100 men could defeat a gorilla (22:22). Then, ‘Warfare’ codirector Ray Mendoza comes on to explain the real-life events that inspired the film, what it was like being in war, and how people reacted to seeing the movie (1:07:31). Plus, Life Advice with Kyle (1:38:45)! Did I pick the correct choice in a couples massage? Check us out on YouTube for exclusive clips, livestreams, and more at https://www.youtube.com/@RyenRussilloPodcast. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Host: Ryen Russillo Guests: Booger McFarland and Ray Mendoza Producers: Steve Ceruti, Kyle Crichton, Mike Wargon, and Jonathan Frias Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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We've got Boogaloo Farland talking draft, talking to a hundred men against a gorilla. Somehow that worked its way in. Maybe even a little golf, but we'll do a lot of draft as well. And Warfare, one of my favorite movies I've seen in the theater in years. It's still out now. Raymond Doza, the man behind the story who wrote and helped direct this movie

is gonna talk about his background in the military and what led to getting something made in Hollywood and life advice. Two games last night in the association and we're not going to spend very much time on Cleveland dismantling the Heat. By the way, in these four games, I mean, just so impressive from the Cavs, not even playing Garland in two of these games.

I mean, I could sit here and do some sort of obit on Miami, but it's funny when you watch Miami and Atlanta play in that game towards the end of the season. Like, this is a really good game. That was a fun, entertaining game. And it was kind of like going to junior high wrestling. Like these guys are pretty good. And then it's like, okay, now you're going to play a really good team. And it was a disastrous series for the Heat.

So I don't know what it means. I mean, I guess if I were doing local Miami stuff, I could get really bad out of shape about it, but it's not like any of those thought direction played with Cleveland in the series. It's just the historical part of it. In the four game sweep, Cavs outscored the Heat by 122 points, the largest margin of victory in a four game sweep in NBA history, and it was that ugly. So we could talk about what is BAM actually,

what is Hira, I just don't even think, honestly, all of us are gonna forget how bad this series was. We'll forget about it pretty quickly, and then maybe it'll be mentioned at the start of next season, 25, 26, and then we'll forget about it again. So it's an ass kicking, but if it goes to six games or they got one extra, one of the losses was closer, does it really? It's just embarrassing. It'll be the kind of embarrassment though you're going to be able to get over as a fan base because most everybody naturally is going to forget about this. What I because most everybody nationally is gonna forget about this. What I won't forget about is Jimmy Butler last night.

That was all time stuff from him coming off this pelvic contusion injury where you could clearly tell he was hurting. So I'm gonna get to Butler at the end as I run through some of the stuff from last night's game. So 13-2 star for Golden State really quickly. Houston turnovers, I'll admit watching it. I was thinking like, is Golden State

just gonna run away with this one? Is Houston just not up for the moment? This younger team, despite Van Vliet's playoff resume, Brooks being through his own battles, but needing a lot from Shen Gun and Amin Thompson. Jaylen Green, who was terrific in game two, but then it's basically hitter. I mean, the variance on his games is alarming.

So maybe we'll spend a little time on Janelle Green, but probably not a ton. So the point is, is that it's a bad start for Houston, but they righted the ship, especially if you think of the talent level between two teams. This isn't Miami and Cleveland here. I think the talent level is very comparable here,

but you're just wondering if Golden State being a little bit more battle tested was what we're seeing beginning, and it wasn't the case because then Golden State goes through a five for 25 stretch. Adams checked in at 5.50 in the first quarter. Golden State was up 16-11. He checked out at the very end of the first quarter.

It was 28-24, and it was a 28-26 first quarter score in favor of Golden State. Houston's offense, which has been the second worst of all of the 16 playoff teams only ahead of Memphis, is also the worst shooting offense in the playoffs still, even after last night's game. They outscored Golden State 31-22 in that second quarter. The defense of Houston is so impressive at times, just because of these dudes that they have everywhere and look, Van Vliet, if you think you're going to hunt

him and it's going to work, he stout, the deflections numbers for him throughout his career are always like, you have to look at him again and be like, God damn, that guy's on it. Brooks is somebody you don't necessarily want to switch into. Shungun, you probably would like to try to attack, but you could see, especially if they went with the Adams lineup, it's like even if you think you get some kind of angle here, Adams is just big enough. And this whole Adams story's incredible

because when he first started getting regular rotation minutes with Houston, I was like, I don't know, man. Like, how are you going to play this guy? The playoffs, everybody's playing off of him this much. Well, he's impacting these games in a really big way. And it's a credit to Houston for experimenting with this, staying with it. When I thought there were some early games where I maybe didn't understand the point and it's just getting him ramped up, getting them back out there.

And he's had a real big impact, which then led to a later Adams decision for Emey Udoka, what he wanted to do. So Houston much better in the second quarter. The on ball defense again, I think is worth mentioning just because even if Golden State scoring, Pajemski had a big night, Butler had some stuff and Curry was, he just had a, I mean, he was bad last night. Uh, the on the ball defense by Houston makes the ball handlers for Golden State get stuck at times in ways that you just you don't want to get stuck and you would think NBA players

like why would you get stuck over there how come you let yourself get into this situation or why did you pick up the dribble there it's all the credit to what the Rockets do on the ball and and these guys are just on it which we knew so the offense works for him as well in that second quarter and then Curry on some of these turnovers he had three just bad turnovers in about a minute of game time to close out the first half. So Houston has all the momentum now. Start of the second half, Golden State out of the gates, getting buckets. They're up 68-58. Adams checks back in at 721, leaves with 19 seconds left of the third quarter. The score is 80 a piece.

So the plus minus stuff for Adams, even if it's not always pretty. At one point, I thought Houston was better off when they went with the Jabari-Shinguin-Adams lineup, like have somebody be a driver and even if they miss at the rim, you're probably going to win on the rebounding margin. So that might be one of your best plays, but Van Vliet was terrific. Finally got going from three, eight to 12 last night, 25 points. That's eight to 12 on threes. He was six to 29 from three in the first three games.

And then with Draymond having the five fouls, we'll get to Draymond here in a second. Shingun, when I wrote it down, it's like, hey, this guy's unstoppable right now. The shooting splits do not present the case of somebody being unstoppable. He was 12 or 28 last night, but he was one and six in the first quarter. So that's 11 and 22 the rest of the way. Probably too many misses in the fourth quarter. I'm going to go through those fourth quarter shot attempts, but there were two plays that I thought were really special from him where, you know, at one

point when Shingoon was missing everything, you start projecting out like, okay, you know, at one point when Shungoon was missing everything, you start projecting out like, okay, what is Shungoon like long-term? Because Sacramento, I give them credit and I don't think they should have moved on from the general manager because I do think that they've done a better job than they've been given credit for. But Sabonis is great as he is, stockpiling the assist and having an All-Star vote every year and me wondering like, look at those numbers, you know? And then you start doing all NBA and you're like, look at those numbers. And then you see certain matchups, it just doesn't work.

Because if you're a big who is not giving you any rim protection and can't stretch the floor, then what do you have? And Shingun when it's bad is a guy who provides zero rim protection and can't stretch the floor. But when it's good, especially when Tremont's out because of his foul trouble, you can run your offense through him. His passing is terrific. I thought maybe I was giving him too much credit for how many good looks and how many good situations he was getting himself into, because there were probably too many misses in the fourth quarter to write down that he was

unstoppable. But he was such a mainstay of the offense as they were battling this thing out that I still felt good about Shingun. In the down moments, I'm like, man, what is going on with him? So I know the shooting split overall, 12 to 28, that's not exactly going to get you any all NBA votes, but I'm just going to give him more credit than maybe the 12 of 28 would show you the next day of the box score. But yeah, two plays. He had one play where he got Gary Payton into a switch at the three-point line, and he backed him all the way down. And then Moody has a men Thompson in the corner, and he doesn't help off of a men. And it happened again with Butler later on, same deal, a men in the corner. So I don't know if they were worried about a men on some kind of drive. Really, if I looked at the plays again this morning, I think you have to crash down on

Shungun and if he kicks it out to a man, then you'll deal with whatever that is. Especially with the size advantage that Shungun had in some of these switches. He was trying to just get Post to retire at one point because Quinton Post, although having a nice night making some shots, just isn't going to hold up right now defensively. So Draymond comes back in with five fouls at 7.51, Golden States down 91-90 and Shingoon had one make from the time that Draymond came back in. And that was on an offensive rebound. So once, and you go through the misses here and they weren't all on Draymond because there were some other switches there.

It's just the fourth quarter stuff for Shingoon. I think out of the nine shots, eight of them, or I think it was 10 shots, there was only one that wasn't great. And that was the game winning attempt that we'll get to a little bit later. So we went through some of the defensive stuff that I didn't love from Golden State against him and just helping out. The game winner that he tried against Draymond was 10 feet out. It's a one-handed push kind of floater. It's a really tough shot to begin with, but you just knew that Draymond was going to hold up and be better positioned. At that point, he's not worrying about the sixth foul because that's kind of the game. Now on Draymond, we could ask why was he even

in the game? He had already gotten a technical earlier. I think there's a lot of I love the rough stuff. I'm going to sound. A little. Critical here, but I think some of the rough stuff is just unnecessary. I think it's just guys deciding like oh, this is the playoffs. I'm supposed to get pissed off. I'm supposed to grab somebody and everybody sick of each other after playing multiple games against the same team.

But I think some of it just becomes like, I'm just going to show how tough I am and I'm going to be in the mix and I'm going to do some of this dumb shit. Steph got a technical earlier because he taunted Dylan Brooks for getting his second foul for knocking him down after a man had been crushed by Draymond on a screen. I don't really know if that was dirty or not. And then it turns into this whole thing. So Draymond already has a technical from this. So then he gets stripped by Tarii Eason, he's pissed, grabs Tarii Eason, then his legs swing over and hit the back of Tarii Eason's head. We can, it's a really easy thing to say it wasn't

deliberate. I never know what Draymond, then Draymond grabs his jersey while Tarii's over him. And then actually this was kind of lost. I thought on the broadcast, he went to kick Tari with between the legs, but he misses or he actually somehow finds some composure where it's like, maybe I shouldn't be kicking dudes

in the legs. The last time I did this, we blew a three one lead. So they gave him a flagrant. Then it was funny too, because later on Draymond's line of the free throw line, and he was telling Tari like, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to kick you in the back of the head, which means that Draymond clearly has more respect for Tari than he would other players because he would go out of his way. And then a man came over and thought Draymond was getting into it. And so as Draymond was trying to apologize to a player, which felt rare, he still found

a way to get pissed at somebody else because of men Thompson, I think was just third man in didn't know what they were talking about. He shoves him, then yells at the refs and like, it was just kind of chaotic the whole time. I think because he had the first technical, they weren't going to give him a second technical and because they gave him the flagrant, whatever. But, you know, this is a theme here with Draymond, not just because of some of the playoff stuff, but his fouling at times has been atrocious in the worst possible time. If you go to the playing game against Memphis, a minute to go, Golden State's up 117-111, Memphis is inbounding the basketball,

and he fouls Bain on the inbounds. It was a terrible gamble, and it was his sixth foul, and Memphis shoots two free throws with no time coming off of the clock That game still in the balance last regular season game against the Clippers Dreyman's got kawaii There's 17 and a half seconds left on the game clock But nine seconds left on the shot clock kawaii gets him going to his left a bit and Dreyman fouls him and at the time They were like, oh that was smart because it's not free throws

It's like no it isn't because there was three seconds left on the shot clock. The differential was eight and a half seconds. So you were forcing Kawhi into a really tough shot. And then you bail them out of the possession shot clock resets. They're going to close with the last shot. So it was actually the way they played it out defensively. He would have been better off just letting him shoot, um, because he had Kawhi at a disadvantage and foul them.

So the fouling stuff for Draymond needs to tighten up if this team is going to go far. Because there's also a moment as I'm watching last night's game, as Golden State struggling, Curry's just everything about the defensive priority and he's not being able to fight his way through it. Butler, Pajemski, all these other things. I'm watching that team going like, hey, as much as I like these guys, this is a really good story and it looks like they're going to close out Houston here up three one. I do think these teams are fairly even. Do you watch Golden State through these four games

and go that they can beat Oklahoma City? I mean, I don't know if too many people are trying to sell you on that out there, but man, that seems impossible for Golden State to go through some of these offensive stretches to be able to keep pace with a team like the Thunder. All right, Jimmy Butler. Now, look, I'll always be skeptical of the guy that has the baggage, the

bullshit part of it, and Butler has a lot of it. You could talk me into a couple stops where I would take Jimmy's side. There's a couple other stops. I'm like, you know what? This is a dude who can turn it on and off based on his own happiness and essentially the financial commitment that he seems or would deem worthy of what a team should be doing for him. And that's not necessarily a guy I would want in my foxhole, right? Dunleavy though, to his credit, Anthony Slater shared this with us when we talked

about them acquiring Butler. He was like, look, sure, all of those things are on the table when you're discussing Butler. I don't know that it was like a hundred percent approval on the table when you're discussing Butler. I don't know that it was like 100% approval on the Golden State side of like, let's get this guy in here. Butler didn't even want to go there until it was this only option to go there. And they gave him the extra year on the contract for a massive number. But Dunleavy, I think kind of nailed it. He's like, fine, okay.

And I'm paraphrasing here a bit of what Slater had told us, but what are we really disrupting? This team got off to a great start. It was depth. It was defense. The offense is falling apart. It's Steph running around and nobody else can be counted on every other night is the number two.

So if we bring Butler in, like, are we actually derailing something that's really awesome? No, you're not. So let's go for it. Let's give it a shot. Uh, because all of it's irrelevant, at least right now, um, the Butler part of it towards the end of when his contract is expiring and him feeling unwanted and all that stuff.

It's probably going to happen again. Maybe Golden State finds a way through it, but again, all of it is irrelevant because of who this dude is in playoff games. His effort, his intensity. He takes three shots in the first half. Again,

that eliminates some of the free throw attempts as the field goal attempt is not tracked. He was 46 in the fourth quarter. He hits the three free throws when it was 104-104. Dylan Brooks putting his hand into his hip and just an awful foul. If you want to talk about bad foul decisions by players, that was a trick like let Butler take the three. He's not necessarily great at it. He's in the corner. You can't give him the three free throws because he's great at the free throw line on top of everything else. And then as Shen Goon goes up for the game winner, Butler grabs the biggest rebound of the game.

And I love the replay of this rebound because Butler is just on it. He's sizing it all up and he's got a clear landing. Granted the ball's going to go his way. Uh, and he's able to grab the board and step up offensively in a night where Curry did not have it. So look, we could talk about, there's a lot of like different things in here. The Adams substitution patterns, E-Mate taking Adams out when they were going to start hacking him, putting him at the free throw line. It's easy to say, hey, they should just leave him in there. But if he's at the free throw line missing a million free throws easy to say, Hey, they should just leave them in there.

But if he's at the free throw line, missing a million free throws, I think social media is like, I can't believe he kept him in there. Um, I think he had them on the floor when they needed a three at the end. That's not great. That seems like just a mistake and not staying on top of your substitution patterns. It does feel like the Adam Shungun Jabari lineup is probably their best bet. Um, even though a men Thompson has had moments early in the series, I'm thinking, is there enough polish there?

He was so good on some of those drives. He had three plays. There was one left side bank shot. I can't even believe he took it at the angle he was at. He had another drive from the top where I thought, this is the problem with Quinton post, there's just no rim protection. It wasn't even post fault. It was a spectacular athletic move where Amin looked like he was going to release the layup in front of him and then somehow still was

gliding through the air and finished behind Post. Then Post had to be like, what the hell just happened to me? And then there was a side euro step against Draymond, who he basically froze Draymond as a defender because Draymond was like, what the hell is actually happening right now? And Amin hits that one from the left side. So I don't know if it's Van Vliet, a men from perimeter defense, and then those three bigs, it feels like you only have one really true ball creator you can trust. But a man showed some things last night that maybe email will feel better about. Because the problem is once again, Jaylen Green, and we can have this story about

how Royal Ivy in him manifest the idea that he's a top five shooting guard. It's a top five shooting guard. It's a really cool story and anecdote to share during the broadcast after he has 38 points, but like there's too many games like last night and you can tell E-May just wants to pull the plug on it because he's just not getting enough from him. So look, the last point that I would make about Butler is a good reminder of, you know, me sitting here talking about these players, right? And the guys that piss me off at times.

And not because of makes or misses, but because of, you know, I do think at times I've looked at the lack of commitment to a team and wondering if guys are about the right things or the wrong things. You guys already know, you've heard me talk about a lot of these players. Butler certainly, I think, of his own doing falls into that category. But I remember a year ago, Bill and I were doing a pod. It was like, it had to be one of the Sunday pods.

We had just probably watched Clippers, Mavs, and Harden was making some plays and Kyrie's out there making plays. And look, I think Westbrook at that point had ended his tenure with the Clippers. But it dawned on me, uh, as we talked about, I go, you know, for all these dudes that you just get kind of like, ah, why would anybody want this guy, right? Why would anybody bring that guy in? Why would you want that in your locker room? You know, like, yeah, because they can get buckets that other guys can't.

Like that's why, that's why there'll always be a market. There will always be a market for the bucket getter with some baggage. And Butler proved it again last night. The Ryan Russo podcast is brought to you by Fandual. The NBA playoffs are finally here. And if you think you know how it's all going to go down, then make those predictions pay off with Fandual and their same game parlay profit boosts. Just build your perfect parlay, activate the boost and lock in your bet.

If it hits, that's a bigger payout for you at no extra cost. All right, let's get into it. All right. Clippers at nuggets. Right now, the line is Clippers minus two total 20805. Let's stay away from a 208 total. So I was gonna do Clippers, Jokic to score 30 points, Norm to score 10 or more points. Norm is heated up here after a slow start, but he's been over double figures every single one of these games.

Jokic you feel good for 30 because they're gonna need that from him. But if you still like the Clippers, so if you like Clippers minus two, that's plus 294. So that is our official release. Now, if you want to avoid a side, which keeps you in it the entire time, and we're just rooting for Jokic points and Powell points,

how about first team basket score? Because if I throw in Jamal Murray, maybe they try to get him going, run some sort of action where they get him off the ball, get done off of him. He's currently, I can see it right now, he's left side, pull up bucket. So you're gonna have to figure out Denver Clippers

in this one. You just need Jamal Murray to have that first sucker go in. Plus 705 if you're feeling a little bit more motivated. But you know, the downside, you know pretty quickly where you stand pretty early in the game and that's not as much fun. So yeah, we're gonna go with Clippers minus two, Jokic 30 or more norm, 10 or more around plus 300 right now.

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The PC Insider's World Elite MasterCard, the card for living unlimited. Conditions apply to all benefits. Visit pcfinancial.ca for details. Had a couple days since the draft, but I wanted to recap kind of everything that happened and just talk with our good friend here, Booger McFarlane, ESPN, part of the draft coverage

all weekend as well. What's up, man? It's good to see you. What's up, bud? How we doing? I'm good. I'm good. There's a lot to get to here. Let's just start with something simple. Who's your favorite player in the first round? Who's the guy you're like, I love that dude. I would put anything on him being a stud.

Jaylen Walker. I'm always partial to the undersized guys, the guys that don't necessarily meet the measurables, but they're really good football players. And, you know, he's 6'1", 230 pounds, 40 pounds. He's kind of an undersized edge. He kind of reminds me of James Harrison. Remember that guy who used to play for the Steelers, number 92, defensive player of the year, candidate forever, undersized edge backer that made his living, had a great career. I think Jaylen Walker is a better version of that. If you have any, if you have any, any, I guess, question marks about who he is, go back and watch the Texas game and watch how he dominated Texas.

Uh, I think that'll tell you everything you need to know. That was my favorite pick because he didn't meet the measurables, but he dominated like he was the biggest guy in the draft. His interviews apparently were incredible too. I, we've not talked about this, but I've been on the Jaylen Walker thing, the entire process. And I still think that Texas, that first half, what that unit did is, is the most dominant 30 minutes of any unit.

I think of college football the entire season long, uh, and they reckon, reckon NFL guys. Uh, and again, it was, it was like three dudes with Georgia. I wanted to ask you a question, cause I don't know if it was like this for. You, when you were at LSU, but if you're, you know, at Ohio state, you think all the NFL talent that Michigan had on its roster last couple of years for Michigan

to have that many players go that high. And if they had just had a quarterback, like what their season could have been like when you start looking at some of the higher end talent. When you know you're at an NFL factory, how much is the NFL draft process even discussed as you're trying to win games on Saturday, but knowing that a lot of the coaches either worked in the NFL already and are telling a guy like you, like, okay, this is what we're doing, here's the game plan, but here are the other things that you need to be thinking about because we think you're a first rounder. Here's what happens is that everybody knows where we are what we're doing, here's the game plan, but here are the other things that you need to be thinking about because we think you're a first rounder. So here's what happens is that,

like everybody knows where we are, we're Georgia, LSU, Ohio State, these places, so you know that's kind of like in your back pocket, like the NFL is in your back pocket because you know what kind of place you are, you know the level of athletes you are, you know what type of competitive nature that this program exudes on a day in and day out basis,

so you're trying to win a national championship. And if you get to a point where that's unattainable, I think then you go in your back pocket and you're like, okay, now I can start getting ready for the NFL. But everybody, you're like, you go to these places to win a championship. You're not going there to do anything less. It's win the SEC. It's get into the playoff. It's win a national championship. And at the moment where you're Georgia and Notre Dame's got you by the short and Curlews

and you realize you're gonna lose that game, at that point you're like, okay, now it's time to start thinking about the NFL. But the guys who know they're going or have a chance to go, you always have that in your back pocket. It's not something that you parade around because there are a lot of people in that same category, but you know it's in your back pocket. and at the right time you pull it out and

it's time to go to work on it. When you look at O-line prospects, what's the first thing you look for? Movement. Football is a game of movement. You know, years ago, football was a big man's game. It was the bigger you are, the better your chances of succeeding were. You know, guys like Makai Bekton, guys like the big kid from Ohio State that went to Cleveland, his name,

he was like 6'8", 350. Like it's no longer a big man's game. I want athletes. Now you have to be a certain size. But for me, like offensive lineman, if you're 300 to 315, that's big enough. Can you move? Because football is now a game of space

and it's about getting your best athletes in space. Think about the best people at each position, Trent Williams. What's made Trent Williams a great left tackle? His ability to move and block defenders on the second level. Think about some of the best guards we've seen. Think about Zack Martin, his ability to move and get up to linebackers and displace people.

Think about the best quarterbacks. There are guys that can move now. So football is a game of movement now, and linemen are no different. That's why Aaron Donnell can play defensive tackle. I don't know if you saw that article, and I think it was GQ or Essence. He said he played the Super Bowl against Cincinnati

at 260 pounds. 260. Now he can bench press 500 so he can get away with it. But my point being is, you don't have to be a guy like you, Rusilo, where your thighs are exploding out of your shorts. You don't have to be that guy anymore. All you need to do is you gotta be able to move

at some point, big guy. I'm working on the wrong things. Yes. Who was your favorite tackle then? be able to move at some point big guy. I'm working on the wrong things. Yes. Who was your favorite tackle then? Favorite tackle? Obviously, I'm biased. I've known Will Campbell since he was 18 years old, man. The kid grew up 35 miles from where I grew up at.

I've known him for a long time. People said he couldn't play because his arms are too short. The kid has football character. And what does that mean? That means that his competitive nature when he gets on the field is that of a player in which is not talented. So imagine a try hard guy, but now he's got supreme talent.

That's what football character is. Like he's gonna do his best to finish first. He's gonna do his best to give everything he has on every rep. That's what football character, and he's got it. And he's got it at 6'6 and 3'15. He's going to do his best to finish first. He's going to do his best to give everything he has on every rep. That's what football character, and he's got it. And he's got it at 6'6 and 3'15. So I'm partial to him.

I liked the kid out of Ohio State, two Simmons. He tore the patella. Now, full disclosure, I tore the same patella. It's about a year before you get back. And I know Kansas City took him and he took a flyer at the end of the first round. I don't know if he's going to be ready by training camp, but by all accounts, his movement is that of the best tackle in the draft. But it's tough to take a guy that high coming off a torn for telling you hadn't seen him work out or seen him move. This edge class was loaded. Thinking

about how close you are to the college game, because you covered it all season long, was there, I don't want to put you in a spot to be like dogging somebody, but at the same time we're talking drab, was there somebody that went in the first round, one of the edge guys that you don't think matches up to maybe the first round projections? Well, everybody will say that Shamar Stewart

out of Texas A&M, because he's 6'5", 267, ran four or five, like he's a freak, but the production wasn't there. And it just depends on what side of the side of the tracks you fall on. Are you a trades guy or you're a production guy? I'm a trades guy, man. Like I like the guy, because here's my analogy. I like driving fast cars.

I'd rather drive a Mercedes than a pickup truck. Now, it doesn't mean that I'm gonna drive the Mercedes 120 every day, but if and when I wanna go 120, I wanna be able to get there. When you got a pickup truck, you can wanna go 120, you're not getting there. So I'd rather have the guy that with the traits

and a good coach that can get it out of him at some point. Like all the guys that win the first round, man, like James Pierce, you know, Atlanta, I thought, put the expectations on him that he's gotta be a double-digit sad guy. When you give away a one to come back into the first round and take James Pierce, who, by the way, has got a lot of character stuff on his resume,

that is a bit rich for James Pierce. Not that he's not good, but the expectations in which you put on him are now magnified. So we'll see if he can live up to that. My thing with Pierce is I just feel like he didn't show up enough this year after last year. I watched a lot of Tennessee games

just because they were in the mix as a playoff team. And I kept looking for it. When I'd watch South Carolina's edge guys, I'd be like, there he is. There's that dude again. I know it sounds really simplistic, but based on where Pearson, maybe I was looking at him with too tough of an eye because he was projected as a top 10 pick and all that kind of stuff. And I don't know if the character or film has more to do with him dropping, but I get the intangible, um, you know, speed, you know, I know he's a little undersized and all that kind of stuff, but I just felt like there was a lot of Tennessee games. It's like, man, I haven't, I haven't heard his name called in too long of a time.

Yeah, I'd agree with that. And that's why I think when you say, okay, not only are we going to take him in the first round, we're going to trade back up to get him. Um, it's putting a lot of pressure on that guy. You know, you talk about those South Carolina guys. Um, I think the best one is still there. The freshmen, you know, we can talk about Sanders, the three technique that got drafted, uh, canard, but I think the best one is still there. And I think he's going to wind up being, and i think he's gonna wind up being um he's gonna wind up being a top 10 pick when it's all said and done yeah i i look i can't wait to watch them again because uh i know some of those guys are gone but all right um let's let's do this

the giants yeah if you like Jackson Dart that much, great. What is that going to be like? Have you been with a team? Well, you, you had like a really good run. So whenever I ask you these questions, maybe I don't get the answer that I want. You've never been in a team where you'd had two guys that think that they're the one between Winston and Wilson and then Jackson being the first round pick. that they're the one between Winston and Wilson and then Jackson being the first round pick,

it doesn't make a ton of sense as far as reps and development. I think it's inviting a more challenging scenario in for a guy that probably doesn't need it. It does, but if you look at this, always follow the money. All right. James Winston, I think is making- Five. Four or five. That's backup money. I think they gave Russ What 11 12 something went 20 maybe something it was no, it's 11 guaranteed. It was announced as 21 Okay, so okay, so there's your starter money So Russ has started money Jamis has backed up money and now you bring in your developmental guy as the three So I don't think there's any plans for Jackson dark to play this year. I think what you hope to see is something very similar to my homes. You want

the rest of the team to be really good. You want, you know, the defense to be dominant, the offense to be average to maybe to a little bit above average, and maybe you get seven or eight wins and then you get to the end of the season and you play Jackson Dard a couple games, and you go tell the ownership, hey, defense is ready to go. We got our quarterback of the future, and Brian Dayball and Joe Shane are hoping they get an opportunity to see it through

since they did choose him. And so that's what you're hoping for. Now, the thing that could derail that plan is if they're two and 10, and like, they gotta show a little bit more improvement with that, especially when you're gonna go with Carter and Burns and Dexter Lawrence and the guys that they have in their defense, they should be,

they should be really, really good on defense. I like Brian, Brian is one of the, he's one of the five or six coaches in this league that if your quarterback, if your son was a quarterback, Rosillo coming into the league, I would say send your son to McVeigh, Shanahan, O'Connell,

Dable, Liam Cohen. Like send your kid to those guys. Those guys understand how to develop the quarterback. And so I have no doubt. The only only question is are they gonna get enough time and the rest of the team? Has to buy in the time to get to the quarterback if that makes sense People were not happy with your post about the almond latte with you and greenie Yeah, what what what was going on in Green Bay People felt kind of sensitive about the big city folk coming in.

Yeah. Well, you know, Greenberg grew up in New York. He's a New Yorker. And so we go to Green Bay's version of IHOP, which is called the pancake place. And so this is a down home local spot where you're going in there to get a really good breakfast and we sit down, great people, the most friendliest people ever. And the first thing the lady says, can I get you guys some coffee?

And Greenberg goes, yes, I'll take an almond milk latte. And so I look at him and I said, hey, big guy, do you really think they have an almond milk latte in Green Bay? He says, you're probably right. And the lady said, how about some coffee? And she was like, he was like, yes, do you have skim milk? I said, okay, let's back down a little bit.

I said, they don't have almond nor latte nor skim. She was like, he's right. Would you like some 2% milk? He was like, I'll take it. And so he found that to be the most hilarious thing ever. And so he posted it. And then he proceeded to order a pancake as big as your head, eggs over hard and some ham.

And I'm like, hey, big guy, let's just stick to the basics. Eggs, bacon, pancakes. Let's not go above that. And so for three days in a row, that's what we had. We had eggs, we had bacon, and we had pancakes. And the nicest people in the world in Green Bay fed us. Yeah. I think people missed the reasoning behind that is that that was Greenie poking fun at himself, which he's done his entire career. And some people in Green Bay took it as if, oh, I mean, you're about as country as it gets. Despite those fancy suits and all of your investments and the way you can carry yourself in any room. Uh, the idea that you'd be some sort of big city coastal elite is, is like the furthest thing from the truth.

I was surprised how sensitive. Again, it's not all of green Bay. So, you know, again, the polling of one, uh, theory on this, but it felt like there were multiple people that were really upset about, I don't know. I thought everybody loved it. It felt like everybody loved it. And for green that were really upset about, I don't know. I thought everybody loved it. It felt like everybody loved it. And for Greeny to be upset about coffee not being there, it wasn't that he was upset,

it was Tim pointing out his fancy tendencies. Exactly, you're in Green Bay, Wisconsin and you want almond milk or a latte. I said, big guy, it's just not gonna happen. But they offended us so much that we went back three days in a row. That's how, like that's the thing that I'll so much that we went back three days in a row. That's how, like that's the thing that I'll say.

Like we went back three days in a row and they couldn't have been nicer. We took pictures with the people, they posted it. It was a great time, man. What do you think Jacksonville will do with Travis Hunter? You know, Roussillo, here's the thing about Travis, man. I get it, he's a unicorn, he's different. And we as a society,

we tend to over sensationalize things we haven't seen. And as soon as one person jumps on it, everybody jumps on it. It's like this thing I'm seeing lately, a hundred people versus gorilla. Okay, like let's be real. Okay, but you know what? All it took was one person to come in

and now it's gone viral and everybody wants to talk about it. Here's what I, and was one person to come in and now it's gone viral and everybody wants to talk about it Here's what and I'll get to that in a moment as it pertains to Travis Hunter If I ask you, what does he do best? What would you say? I? Think he's a better receiver than corner. All right. He's a better receiver at 6 foot 185 190 at best Tremendous ball skills. I don't know at best. Tremendous ball skills. I don't know. Do you agree? Yes and no. I don't know. It sounds like no. That's fine. Right. You know, I've seen games where he was a better receiver. I've seen games where he was a better DB. I just want to see him go against the best

corners in football and to see can he handle the physicality. My one question against him or about him is the physicality in which he's gonna receive. Can you see him lining up at corner against Chase, Jefferson, Nico Collins, Diggs, like some of the top receivers in the league? It just seems like right physically, he's got some work to do physically, not that he can't do it.

Now with that being said, I, he's got some work to do physically, not that he can't do it. Now with that being said, I think he's got every opportunity. I just need to see it. I don't think it's a home run as much as everybody does, okay? I just don't. And maybe I'm in the minority and it sounds like I am. I just don't think it's gonna be slam dunk.

Oh, by the way, Jacksonville gave up a lot of stuff to get it, a lot. There's something that happens with basketball. And it was funny because I was thinking about contiguous Caldwell Pope the other night watching him play. And it's like, look, at some point, like when he came out of Georgia, he could handle, he could attack. Uh, I think early on in his NBA career, he was somebody that you

could trust on the ball a little bit. And then you start to get stuck in the corner and you provide spacing and he's a really good defender. You're not going to have the ball a lot with Jokic. I don't know if the NFL has a version of this, but there are a lot of dudes that came into the league expecting to have the ball in their hands and it just doesn't work that way. If you're not a one or two option, you're going to spend a lot of time off the ball. And so if you're not doing anything in game, you can kind of lose your on ball talent. It's crazy. It happens all of the time where you'll look at a player

and go, remember when he used to do this or do some of these things. But now he's been in real NBA games for multiple years. He's not asked to do with any of those things. So I don't even know if that talent is. I give you a guy. I give you a guy like that now. And tell me from right. Jabari Smith, Jr. I think I see him the same way.

I love it because I worry about who he'll be because look, he wasn't a great ball handler at Auburn, but the idea of the best version of him was can you get this guy the ball in his hands at any point? Can he develop into being one of those dudes? And now he's a defender and a stretch three. And so you're putting a real cap on like what you can be as a player. Look, hell, and people are going to tell me I'm wrong on this. I saw it. Ray Allen went from an on the ball, running screens, pull up all this stuff to. He like lost his handle at the end of his career.

And it just seemed crazy to think, but he had had this, he just went from somebody who always had the ball in his hands to not having the ball in his hands. So the reason I bring any of that stuff up, because it's a real thing is the Travis Hunter corner thing. I think it's six one and his physical traits like six one in a corner. You don't necessarily have to be able to jam Nico or some of the bigger dudes, but you go up there, you can test.

I think his anticipation and his ball skills are terrific. So he definitely has a chance. And if you told me he's more valuable a corner than he is at wide receiver, then I'm totally for it. Even though I think, again, this is me also trusting the people that do this for a living. There's too many guys like Daniel, Jeremiah and McShea who are just like, look, I think he profiles better as a receiver.

Uh, if you come out of the gates, you're like, we're going to worry about him being a dual threat guy a little bit later. That might be the worst thing you could do of the idea of him playing both ways. You probably have to get him out there getting snaps and reps immediately. And I hope it happens. I like the pushback on the idea that this is never supposed to happen because it's too physically taxing. But maybe that's it. Or maybe he ends up having to find a way to protect himself in the game, which, you know, does that become a liability on the defensive side of the football?

Does that mean he's not running every route the way he needs to be running routes? So you could be trying to do both and actually diminishing the special things that he does. But I hope they try it. It's just, if they slow play it, then that doesn't really speak to developing him getting to an NFL level

on the other side of the football that's not a priority. I would agree with that. But again, it's one of those things that we're going to find out based on because when you're Jacksonville and you put the haul in to go get him, you have to have a plan. I'll give Liam Cohen a lot of credit. He turned Baker Mayfield's career around in Tampa. He had his two best seasons down here in Tampa. So he's a part of that offensive guru-ish type class. So he's got to have a plan for him. I brought something up. I need to get your opinion before I forget about it.

What's your take on the whole 100-man gorilla thing that's been going around? Because the first thing I said is this, two things. Number one, the first 20 dudes are really sacrificial lambs. They're going to die. It's the morale of the group has got to be great because 20 of you know, you're going to die and the other 80 have to figure out a plan to actually hurt the gorilla.

And in the end, I think all a hundred men die. So what's, what's your take on this whole thing? That's kind of taking the internet by storm. Uh, I think this is about, you know, the hunted, the hungry. It's all about mentality. You're absolutely right. To watch the first 20 go down, it may be like Patrick Ewing

in the NCAA tournament with Georgetown, where even though they were goaltends, it was like, dude, I don't want to go in there. And it can really damage morale. Because is the fifth wave going to be able to finish the job and you know, it's like any fight, like how mad is the other guy? How mad is he? And does he actually want, does he like to do this stuff?

If I have a hundred guys that want to kill the gorilla and not just win a bet. If they're like, it's time we take it out on this guy. It's all about the mentality. And I'd like to think if you had a hundred guys with the right mentality, they would find a way. But I don't know. I don't know if you could get. Hey, big guy, you can have 100 guys with a mentality of the guy Russell Crowe from Gladiator. They can all have that mentality without any weapons whatsoever. As a matter of fact, I don't think it's going to last long, Rossello. That's the whole thing about the internet just jumps on it. Everybody thinks, do you have any idea? And it's, it's, I don't actually, cause I've never watched a gorilla fight.

A lot of guys, you don't have to watch him fight. Have you ever, you've been to the zoo before big guy. Have you seen horrifying, horrifying the reach? I mean, people getting on Will Campbell. Thank God this guy's not playing defensive end. Uh, it is, it is horrifying watching physically like what they are capable of, but a hundred guys, I mean, I might, I don't know, again, I'm trying to have an open mind about this, like Travis Hunter playing both sides of the ball. You can have an open mind. You can have a game plan. As Mike Tyson said,

everybody's got a plan until they get hit in the mouth. When you see the gorilla hit the first dude and knock him 25 feet in the air. If that happens and we have a group that's second guessing, then it's, then it's a mopping. I need guys. I need it to be a bit like, okay, we're grabbing a hundred guys from prison. And if you win, you have years taken off of your sentence. You need Jon Snow.

That's what you need. You need Jon Snow leading the charge. Yeah, but if he doesn't have a sword, he's too small. That's not going to do much for you. What if, I mean, if you had 100 absolutely juiced out of their minds, Lyle Alzeitos. Tony Mann, I'll give you 100 Tony Manns. Yeah, I think I need somebody meaner. I think I need, I think it might have to be special forces. It might have to be like MMA stuff. It's not that I'm thinking like Lyle Alzeitos, the toughest guy

of all time. What about like a hundred boss routines? Yeah. Okay. Now we're talking. Okay. Yeah. So like he goes, the first 10 boss routines are going, I just love saying his name, but if he says, okay, the first 10, all we're doing is we're going low. We're going low.

We're going to try to get him. I don't know. I mean, that first, that first wave is going to be destroyed. Van Lathan had an unbelievable post, our guy. He posted a whole whiteboard breakdown of how it would happen. And he was like, the first wave of 20 is just all Vince Wilfork types, just mass.

Just as much mass as possible, it could take the blows. And then he kind of went with like John Jones types as the finisher at the very end. But here's why, at least like wonder, there's a number where you go human, right? Okay, what's the number that you'd be willing to put that nice little view you have right there to the ocean on? What's the number?

Is it 150? Is it 200 men? There has to be a number where it becomes overwhelming. So that's, I think, what we're really trying to figure out here. If a hundred gets thrown out and then we all are just married to the idea that it's only a hundred, okay, that's fine. And then everybody shoots it down. And it probably is the gorilla against a hundred, but there does exist a number

where it becomes too much. So that's where I allow, allow it to be gamed out a bit more. I'm gonna say I would feel comfortable. I would feel very comfortable at around 175. Okay, 175 is the number. Okay, speaking of stupid conversations, there were a few theories suggested about why Shador wasn't selected until the fifth round.

Yeah. You know, we spent some time on it on Sunday night. Some people were really upset. Some people were reasonable about it. I don't know. I think it seems pretty clear to me that Shador and Neon played this wrong. Their approach was the wrong approach for somebody that wasn't an elite, top-tier quarterback prospect. Your thoughts?

So this is a very nuanced conversation and I've probably had calls from people I hadn't heard from, former coaches that coached me in college and a lot of them have been asking me just point blank, is this racist? Is this colluding? And it's a nuanced conversation. And here's how I start the conversation. If you go back to October, November, December, here's the first part. Dion comes out and this is, these are facts, not my opinion. Dion comes out and says, hey, we're going to pick and choose where we go. All right. When he says that we're going to pick and choose where we go, to me, he's saying to the NFL that guess what?

We're choosing you, you're not choosing us. And for me, that kind of turns a lot of people the wrong way in the National Football League. That's number one. Number two, let's look at the entire job interview, which is what this process is. The combine. He goes to the combine, doesn't work out, doesn't do anything, no big deal.

Other guys do. He goes to the East West Trine game, where the NFL has said, hey, if you come to the All-Star game and you come, you need to participate. Well, he came, he didn't participate. You look at some of the interviews. Again, I listened to McShay, all the people in the know,

I heard what McShay said. There are people that says he wasn't rude, he just act as if he didn't need to be there. Okay, that's one thing. The Giants go work him out, Dayball gives him some concept for plays to learn the night before. Day of, he doesn't have the things to memory

where he can actually go out and rep it, blah, blah, blah. That whole thing falls apart. And I say all that to say this. There's a lot of fault to go around. Number one, from the standpoint of his dad, I think Dion deserves a little bit of fault also based on that comment. Number two, I think the media deserves a little bit

of fault also because we had the entire country thinking he was gonna be a first rounder when the NFL scouts didn't tell us this. We were told this from Jeremiah, Kiper, McShay, everyone said at worst he was the second round pick, at worst. NFL didn't think that way. The sc worst. NFL didn't think that way. The scouts and coaches didn't think that way. Thirdly, I think the kid has to realize that

there was a little bit of arrogance and cockiness about his approach to the whole process. And when you couple all that together, Rossello, when you put all those things together, I think the combination of all of that turned some of the teams off about a guy who they deemed to be a backup quarterback. And here's the real kicker that nobody wants to talk about. 32 teams that need a quarterback, all right? You're really only talking about five to seven teams that needed a quarterback.

Well, Tennessee took theirs, all right? New York had a decision to make. New York chose Jackson Dart. The New Orleans Saints chose Tyler Shuck. Mike Tomlin chose Aaron Rodgers. All right. So when you start thinking about the teams that needed a quarterback, they chose other people.

And I think the combination of all the things that I said is the reason why. And I think our society wants to put it in a certain category. It's collusion, it's race, it's the owners teaching Dion a lesson. I don't think it's any of that. I just think it's a combination of things that came together

where the kid wasn't as talented as we thought he was. And the NFL says, okay, we don't really like how your persona or your attitude or whatever fits with what we have going and they rather not deal with it. And so when you get to the fifth round, I don't know how much guaranteed money that's there. He's in a position now in the fifth round where if he goes into Cleveland and he doesn't do the things exactly the way they want to, they'll cut him.

And I think that's the position these teams wanted to be in with him, rather than be in a position where he's the first or second round pick, and they owe him something and he's almost forced to be on the team. That's my take on it. Yeah, I knew you were gonna do a good job on it. And maybe I'm looking at it because we agree.

So, you know, I came into this on Saturday, I was still pretty shocked. He hadn't been drafted. I think a couple of guys went ahead of him. So then it's like, okay, so if he wasn't, cause it's also, it's probably the biggest gap between the mock speculation and where a player who's drafted, I can ever remember.

I don't know that we're ever gonna have something like this. Cause people can kind of do the, that now you know, like play the result part of it. It feels like a lot of people now are saying, wow, he never really was a first rounder. Like, dude, I give Quincy Avery a lot of credit. He came on this pot a couple of weeks before the draft, was like, look, if he's Shador Williams,

he's a six round pick. And I thought he was like being a little too harsh on the whole thing, but he was breaking down specific things to his tape. And then he said on top of everything else, because you know, if it doesn't go well, then you've got Dion using his CU press conferences to shit on the NFL staff

because it's not working out for his son. So if that's part of it, I don't know that that's necessarily a lesson. I think it kind of speaks to everything. And you said it, you add all of these things up. It's not a great pre-draft process. It's not the best tactic game plan. Like, Hey, what's our strategy? We're going to do all these things and we're going to do it with somebody who's

probably getting more second and third round grades. And then maybe the third to fifth round drop was the tax that can seem personal. It can seem unfair, but these teams can kind of do whatever they want. And if there was one of the 32 that thought he was really special, they'd be able to get over all of this other stuff that left him falling. Think about this Ryan. We have put people in this league that have killed people.

The NFL is about winning. There have been people that have killed people and played in the league. So the NFL will tell you if your talent is great enough, we will tolerate a lot of things. So they just don't think your talent is great enough, we will tolerate a lot of things. So they just don't think his talent is great enough to deal with everything we're discussing. I mean, we've seen it time and time again, unfortunately,

and teams will justify any of it. I mean, I remember, like, do you remember that story with Leonard Little? And then it was a photographer and it was his wife and they actually interviewed. And I mean, it was such an unbelievably heartbreaking story that you have this photographer who was basically like, I just asked that I don't have to show up to photograph the games that he's in. And it was like, yeah, I think that's a fair request. So, you know, I don't know, you know, like, I don't think anybody's necessarily going to change their mind on this stuff. You know, I always try to wonder like, okay, what could I miss about it? I talked to Van about it a little bit on Sunday, where, because I saw a lot of like, well, his confidence,

I've seen that from NFL media members that I like, I would consider people that I've gotten along with and it's like, oh, his confidence, if it's a confident young black man, then society doesn't like that. And I can look, I can kind of understand that conclusion with some things, but when it comes to football,

Cam Newton's one of the most confident human beings I've ever seen in my entire life. He went number one, you wanna know why? Cause he probably had the best college season I've ever seen at quarterback, depending on, I'm talking about like how much his team relied on one player to win a national championship. So, all right.

If you're telling me that there's maybe not, maybe there's just an inherent, a subconscious part of it where if you're white, you're like, am I reading this one wrong? Is there something to this that I'm oblivious to and that I'm not understanding? Is there an older guy who's a decision maker who sees Chidor and sees the tape

and sees him feeling himself and sees him how he carries himself? And he's like, I don't like any of that. Is there something else there that's really nefarious and that anybody pushing back has a really good point and I'm arguing something that I can't see. Like I wonder all of those things

as I've thought about it the last few days. And it's like, yeah, but we have dudes that are feeling themselves at that position all the time. All the time. And if they were good enough, the teams had no problem handing in that card. Dude, I completely agree with you. I do think now, like even with all that being said and done. So think about this, if Cleveland takes them two, everybody's happy. It's a big party. Well,

Cleveland got him in the fifth round, but he's still in Cleveland. And he's still got, I think, a very favorable situation. Deshaun Watson most most likely is gonna be out for the year. Joe Flacco's 90 I don't know if he can hold up through an entire season Kenny Pickett, you know to gloves He couldn't make it in Pittsburgh. So now you're you're literally if you're gonna look at this fairly it's a quarterback room of Dunn Gabriel at 5 10 and a quarter and Shadr Sanders and Kenny Pickett wearing two gloves. If you go- Does two gloves really bother you, huh?

I mean, they bothered him evidently because he couldn't make it in Pittsburgh. If you ask Shadur Sanders pre-draft of any situation you could be in, where you could be in the most favorable situation, where not that you could start week one, but that's your future, you could see your future aligning

at this particular organization, you'd probably choose Cleveland. Cause Stefanski is one of those dudes, right? Stefanski is in the, he's also in the McVeigh, Shanahan, Liam Cohen, Kevin O'Connell bucket. Like he's there. He's one coach of the year twice.

And so if you're Shadoor, and once you get past the butthurt of having a three-day draft party and all that stuff, and you get to the point of you show up in Cleveland, which by all accounts, I think he got there today, and you just go in and work, we could look back two years from now, he could be the starting quarterback of the Browns

and be on his way to a nice career. I think at best he's Kirk Cousins and Andy Dalton. And people are going to say, oh, bud, go look at how much Kirk Cousins and Andy Dalton have made. Kirk Cousins is close to 270 million. Andy Dalton is over like 140 million. I take Kirk Cousins and Andy Dalton right now. And I think in his best situation, that's what he is. And I think he has an opportunity to have a really, really good career. I definitely thought he was better than a fifth rounder. There's some stuff that I like from him. There's other stuff where I don't like, but I love his toughness and I love that it felt like

he rose to the occasion and he did it behind an old line and a lack of running game for two years that, you know, if you're a franchise, like, hey, we don't have a good old line. Like, well, this guy's used to getting the shit beat out of him for an hour out there. So you're a franchise like, Hey, we don't have a good old line. Like, well, this guy's used to getting the shit beat out of him for, for an hour out there. So, um, you're right though. Like if you're as good, if you're going to tell everybody that they're wrong, like what a great opportunity to beat out everybody else. And it may not be week one, right? But you're going to get a chance with that group in front of you because

Flacco is not part of the plan. And if you're, if you're getting good reps in practice and they're gonna give you that chance I would think I mean I guess there's a bunch of different scenarios like hey Pickett makes less mistakes and he's been exactly we want you know I don't know I mean there's there's a way he plays there's a way he doesn't play but it's not like there's some massive roadblock in his way where the team felt like okay even though we've taken a guy in the first round five years ago, he's clearly our guy for the next five years, but Sanders was too talented,

had to go ahead and take him at the fifth round, like this is ridiculous. If he's stuck behind somebody, then maybe we don't even get that kind of answer. But if he's as good as he says he is, his father says he is, then here you go, you're gonna get your opportunity and you can prove everybody wrong.

No, and think about this, they declined the fifth year option on Kenny Pickett. So Kenny Pickett is in the last year. Deshaun Watson, he's got one year left and nobody wants him in Cleveland. So I mean, everything is lined up. He's going to get an opportunity to shoot, to prove that there's a future there and that's all you can ask for. If Dillon Gabriel starts in games and then throws a late pick though, I am bracing myself for the Dion commentary. Cause it'd be nothing easier than just saying, Hey,

my guy would have done it better than right. That's where it's going to be nasty. That's where Dion has to be the dad and not the coach of Colorado. And, and I'm saying that the right way because the coach at Colorado has a press conference and you get to talk to the masses. A dad can make that comment to his buddies. It's okay for Dion to think that he just can't say to the press conference. He's got to say that to his buddies and he's got to do his kid a favor and not create any undue pressure. Well, look, he's already started. I mean, he had a quote the other day where he was

like, I'm not going to give you more headlines. I'm going to keep it. It's like, oh, really? Did you want me to write that down? This is the part where you're going to say that you're not going to talk about this because you're not going to give him any headlines. And then he sent out some other tweets. So whatever, man. It's unfortunate. I think that the kid, even though when I say kid here, but pro athlete, it's unfortunate that Shador, as much as he brought it on himself, I think also paid a heavier tax because his dad's saying, this is how it's going to be done. And when they started saying, hey, there are certain teams, it's like, you've got to be really special to pull that shit off. All right, last thought, are you worried about Bill Belichick? I'm trying to put this as politically correct as possible,

but there's really no other way. There was a man who told me years ago, he said, son, very few things in life are certain. And he simply said this, he said, that thing between a woman's legs is undefeated. It's undefeated, it's never lost for so long. And regardless of how great we think Belichick is, and he's the hoodie, and we're on the Cincinnati,

big guy, it's undefeated. It's never lost for Cello. It hadn't been tied. It hadn't even gone to overtime. Now, all seriousness aside, I think Bill is in a situation where Bill has found a companion. If he likes it, I love it. It seems a little odd to us, where Bill has found a companion.

If he likes it, I love it. It seems a little odd to us, somebody in his situation having a 24 year old kind of dictate things and maybe it is odd. But again, I think he's on the right to do what he wants to do at 70 plus years old. But just notice, it's undefeated, brother. It is undefeated.

Well said. Booger McFarland, ESPN. It is undefeated. Well said. Booger McFarland, ESPN. Hey, by the way, hey, listen, I'm gonna give a couple of basketball takes really quick. Number one, I think the Luca LeBron partnership, it's amazing how it's come back full circle. It was gonna be for the future and then we got tricked into believing it was for now. And as we see now in the playoffs, it's for the future because they got no shot at beating Minnesota. That's number one. Number two, everybody talked themselves into the Clippers being a team that can make a

title run. I don't think they can, because I think when Denver, if Murray and Porter and Gordon and Jokic are on the floor, I still think they have championship DNA. They got to be on the floor. Orlando, I think Orlando, in two years Orlando has an opportunity to be really good. The Wagner brothers, who else? Okay, see, I worry about a team that if you said,

let's take away SGA and I'm going to make the other four, the other team, the rest of the team, can the other team beat me four out of seven? I'd be willing to take that chance. SGA is the MVP, but I'm gonna make the rest of the team beat me four games out of seven and I'll tip my hat. Cleveland, Cleveland's got a bunch of parts. And the best thing that Cleveland and OKC do

is use their youth. Play fast. Houston's the same way. When you're the younger team and you got more athletes, play fast. Play faster. That's all Minnesota did to the L.A. Just make them tired as hell. They can't keep up with you. There's my NBA takes on the on the podcast. That was incredibly efficient. That was joker level efficiency.

You just got it all out there. You're a hundred percent right on the Lakers thing though of like, all right, well, this is 25s of wash. It's like, no, they're going to win it with the West because nobody respects. Okay. See enough. And you kind of dissed them a little bit there too. I would submit to you Chet Holm Grins third quarter against Memphis the other

night as a reminder of what he can do. And Jaylen Williams is I think one of the most underrated. And we'll see what happens when it's a real opponent in the playoffs, but like I'm watching Golden State, okay. See, or excuse me, I'm watching Golden State Houston. I said this in the open and I'm thinking about like, okay, Golden State say they get through Houston here. Heck.

How's that offense going to stabilize enough into seven game series against the Thunder beat them like that's that's not going to happen. I liked a lot of what you said, though, because the Lakers full circle moment like we're right back to the first 24 hours after the trade. Like, OK, well, you know, it wasn't really about this year. Like when they went 18 and three, it certainly felt about this year. Thank you so much for the time, man. And when are you out in L.A.? Never. 18 and three it certainly felt about this year. Thank you so much for the time man and um when

are you out in LA? Never? No I'm coming out because I'm coming out to play uh LA country cup. I want to get on the south course. I want to play and I've been listening to a bunch of podcasts. I heard you took a trip to Pinehurst. You're a big golfer now so I'm a 14 handicap. That means I can shoot 82. I can shoot 102 you and I have to get on the golf course And we're gonna play I can't wait. Here's the only rule. I have a plan. We're playing don't even worry about it Yeah, here's the only rule I got if you wear the shorts that you recorded the mix a podcast in I'm not playing with you because according to reports. It was a lot of thot me showing I'm not playing with another man that shows thot me on golf course. Not doing it. I'm just letting you know.

Yeah. I got to figure out where all these people that comment on anything I wear and everything I do, whether it's international documentaries or- Nine inch shorts, brother. Stay away from the seven inch shorts. Nine inch. Nine inch shorts. Look, the ones that I wore in part of my take at my house a few years ago for that thing, I blame myself, right? Full accountability. This is sort of my joke about like, I'm doing my favorite athlete thing when it's

like the person only can be blamed. It's like, you know what? Hand up. That's on me. Like no shit. It's not, you know what, hand up. That's on me. Like no shit, it's not on anyone else. I'm just surprised how many people haven't sat in a chair before.

At 230 pounds, when you sit in a chair, if you wanna say I'm fat, you're gonna think I look fat. If I'm wearing shorts. We're 230 now, by the way? Yeah. I thought you was like 210. When did we get to 230? No, no, 210. What are you, I thought you was like two 10. When did we get to two 30? No, no two 10.

That what are you talking about? I've been, I've been in the two 20 to two 30 range for a long time. Okay. I mean, you wear it well. Thank you. Appreciate that. It's the nicest thing you've said to me today. I just think if you sit on a couch for two hours and you're entertaining people all over the world,

the shorts hike up a little bit. And I hate that couch. That couch came with the house. The leather, it's not super comfortable. I think it's a custom thing, and so it doesn't fit anywhere else, but I gotta talk to my couch people. Speaking of, yeah, I gotta say goodbye to you now.

This is awesome. Golf's on, can't wait, buddy. Golf, it's on. No question whatsoever. And by the way, I can't wait buddy. Golf, it's on. No question whatsoever, I can't wait. And by the way, I don't get mad, I have a blast. I mean, I would like to play better than I'm playing, but just so you know, I know what the scouting report would be on me.

I go, if I'm not playing well, hey, we'll get them next time. There's always the next hole. I have a great mentality now for it that I didn't have when I was younger. If it takes me longer than 3.45 to play 18, a problem like that's not I'm that's all I'm concerned with. Some people say I play too fast like hey you might want to take a little bit more time to set up this next shot so that's that's what we're working on now. You're the best. Thanks man. Later.

The all-new all-electric Can-Am Origin motorcycle takes you everywhere. Sleek power for the streets, deep adventure routes for the trails. Discover your origin today. Learn more at CanAmMotorcycles.com. Warfare is one of the best movies of the year. I was lucky enough to check it out in theaters. I would urge you to do so as well. Joining us now, director and writer of,

again, a great film, Raymond Dozo. Ray, thanks for doing this. How are you? My pleasure. I'm well. There's a few different things that I clearly want to ask you about to reach out and talk about the film, but if we can just go into your background a little bit little bit and when you first entered the military and what led to being stationed in Iraq. Yeah, I always wanted to join ever since I was a little kid. Maybe some of you argue

that Hollywood had something to do with that. Growing up in the 80s, some of the best movies that went up in it, Commando, Predator, Team Stone, you know, you could go to all those terminators. I don't know, it was something that was always attractive to me, like serving. Did you know what I wanted to do? Wasn't sure. It was a lot of information on the SEAL teams then, like there is now, or any really soft component.

Always loved the water, always loved the beach. And so as I got older, it was time to get out, I graduated high school, it was just the SEAL seemed like a good place for me to go and try out to see if I could do it. My chances ended up being kind of a perfect fit. I kind of dovetailed in with the mentality there. I grew up playing sports, always very competitive. So it just really nurtured that, something that was already there. Yeah, I showed up and they're like, I have been through training, had a few hiccups

here and there, but eventually checked into team five. Uh, did three pumps there. Um, was a communicator right off the bright way. Uh, they say it was just by chance. They just needed a communicator. Um, I was the first guy to check in and like, you're going to communication school. I was like, I don't know shit about radios. Like, well, that's where you go into communication school.

Really cool. Everybody had to be in a good fit for me. Just, it puts you at the center of all information that gets disseminated, which the character, the guy who plays me in the movies portrays that somewhat. Yeah. And then, you know, obviously the war kicked off and just Iraq was just the insurgency, you know, typically we're, we're, we're kind of farmed out. You know, we're not big enough to have our own battle space. So it's easy to get, we're attached to some army or Marine Corps

battalion or some arm or Marine Corps brigades. Then we were used accordingly as this very surgical tool. Um, yeah. Yeah. So that's kind of my history and how I joined and ended up in Iraq. So I'd like the answer I'm for a few different reasons, but you end up working in Hollywood as a stunt coordinator, post serving. And yet even as a little kid, like the two things that have motivated you, the attraction of the military, but then also being like, hey, you know, from LA and the movie part of this. So after this experience, which is the story that we're going to get to, I mean, had you been, had you been working on this knowing deep down that you had this story,

like you may have wanted to tell it, but did you feel like your story in this mission was something you were like, I think there's something here. There's something in this that I would like to tell if I ever got the opportunity. Yeah, there's a lot of components to how I came to this, to that, just wanted to make this way to your, to answer your question. It's, I think it starts with how I got into the movie industry, which is with active valor, which is like the Navy's essentially attempt to grow the SEAL teams at the time, at 2000, like right after Red Wings with Marcus. We were losing a lot of seals, whether that's them getting out or just dying.

So we were gaining, I think, once a year at the time. It wasn't enough to expand the seal teams by any means. So it was like, we got to get the word out. We need people to join the Navy. So yeah, it's active. That's where I got introduced to filmmaking. I met stunt coordinator, Scottie Wall, Nassim Coy, stunt guys turned movie makers or the directors. Met them, met a bunch of other stunt guys, other producers. Yeah,

started like day playing as a stunt man. Then Lone Survivor came around, Mark is a trial, gave me a hoot. He said, hey, I'd love for you to train the cast. And that was my first experience behind the camera, which that's like a whole different world. When you're in front of the camera, especially for active valor, everyone's catering to you, you don't really understand how things work. But on this, I saw how it all just like dovetailed together. And what was very attractive to me was these, the structure, which was

multiple department heads working in kind of concert with each other to achieve one thing. In their case, it was a movie, in our case, it's typically a mission. Um, and so, uh, like just that was a cycle. This is very similar. There's like the pressures of time. Someone having to make a decision for them, maybe making time is money. We're talking millions of dollars. Um, some people don't like making those hard decisions. Uh, I do. I'm like thriving that shit. Uh, I want to be the guy to make the big decisions. It's awesome. I love this shit. So yeah, it was like just a cool medium to tell stories.

That's probably where, you know, so then this is 2014. When Elliot, when this first happened, Elliot doesn't remember what happened. So when he woke up, I would see a lot of questions, no matter how many maps we drew, uh, and I haven't tried to re answer his questions via email. It just almost raised more questions. I think because he didn't have that core memory visually, uh, it just raised a lot of questions from big picture, big picture questions of why, what to the little questions of like what color things were. Um, so, you know, after Lone Survivor,

that's where I think that first seed was planted. It was like, well, maybe one day it'll, you know, I can just do like a 30 minute recreation of what happened. I never could ever think it would be a movie on this scale. So I just started to learn the tools and there's like other as you start, I started, my name started to get around, I started working on other films, was day playing some guys and all the different shows in LA and just learning more. Sorry, between jobs, technicalizing jobs, because at the

time nobody knew me, I was a PA in camera department. I worked in production and I sat in editing rooms. So I was just kind of really learning how to speak this new language. Because I didn't want to give it to somebody. A lot of great film directors and who have done war movies. I just felt they always miss something, whether they misrepresented the culture, because they weren't there. And so I just felt like it's all anecdotal for them. So I was like, one day, I think I'm just going to keep acquiring the skill sets and the tools to do this myself. And a lot of things had to be in line. The people who are funding it had to let me, because I didn't want to change anything.

Anyone involved, I was just on board with, it'd be very, very factual. There was going to be a recreation for Elliot and I didn't want to do it any other way. If it wasn't going to happen that way, then I just wasn't going to do it. Yeah. And it's very clear. And I think, you know, hooking up with Alex Garland and civil war and then having somebody who has that resume, um, if anybody is ever trying to get anything done, it's like, okay,

cool idea, cool script, but now I need somebody who's aligned. And I wonder as you went through the process and kind of sticking to these rules of building out the story, it feels like Alex was a hundred percent aligned with you immediately. Yeah, sorry to interrupt. Go ahead. Yeah, coincidentally, when he was editing Civil War, I built out, I don't know who's seen them, have you seen Civil War? Yeah. Yeah, so there's like that whole White House piece externally, eventually making its way

into the corridor to the final corridor of the Oval Office. So I built all that out for him. I just created this kind of 360 freaking playground for him, which is pretty fun, it's pretty awesome. So things are concurrently happening. He's like, no matter where you point the camera, Alex, something's happening. I just created this 360 amusement park for you. I said, yeah, he loved it.

But in editing that, I said, yeah, it was just, he loved it. Um, but in editing that, I think he saw something he saw with all the other directors. He saw the, you know, I like to use the watch analogy, which Alex saw all the little cogs that are moving your bus right. You just see the big cogs in the watch. He saw like every little moving part, all the connective tissue. the watch. He saw like every little moving part, all the connected tissue. And I was like, interesting. Because I was watching how he shot it and what he was focusing on. And I was like, shit. And that stuff has always been there for all the other guys. They just didn't see it. So yeah, editing it, he kept it in there. I think he noticed this weird

verite kind of grounded just really almost like you just documentary style of action that he really liked. So he gave me a call. It was like, okay, I'm editing this thing and it's fucking really, really awesome. I would love to do like a full length movie like this. It's going to be minute by minute real time, no time compressions. If it didn't happen, it's not going in the movie. We can only slide the window. We can't expand it or fragment it. Do you have any stories? And, and I have, you know, I know there's a lot of stories, um, but it also had to be like a bunch of check marks, uh, based off the budget.

They need to be somewhat contained, uh, which this story was. And so, uh, I had asked my friends and I asked myself, I was ready to do that just even just like motionless. Um, and I knew my friends were gonna have to be involved. So I needed to make sure they were on board. And the only way we were, like I said, the only way we were gonna do it was we had to represent it accurately as possible

because it was so what gonna be, it was my only chance. I'm not gonna get another chance at doing this. And so Alex was like, that's the way I want it. And I was like, perfect. And they were like, let's do this shit. Maybe because it's Alex and in a 24, because I just was, as I was watching it, I can only think of like how pitches work. Right. I'm really like, oh, here's what we're going to do. It's this one objective and it's essentially one room and then some outside shots and it's only going to take this long. And there's no love interest. There's no third act conflict. I guess the resolution is getting

the guys out, but was there ever any part of you was like, maybe they're not getting this, right? The ups and downs of getting any kind of project done because it is, I mean, that's what's so special about it, I think, is that, hey, this is what happened and here we go for 90 minutes and we're never gonna let up. You're never gonna feel relaxed as an audience,

which I really appreciate it because it's not just a really great story with effects and great acting, it's an experience for those 90 minutes. And I could just see so many people thinking like, okay, well, this doesn't work. This actually isn't what the audience always wants. So can we actually pull this off? Yeah. I mean, I think I've talked about this a lot and, you know, with lacking narrative, lacking dialogue, where, you know, I would argue that I think every character has an arc. They treated them like they had an arc. They had arcs. But yeah, I think I really wanted, we like to treat and even myself, when I go and watch the movie, I like to be treated like I have some intelligence. Like I'm not an idiot. Um,

I don't like being spoon fed stuff. So there's a lot of subjects in the movie. Sure. Um, so I think, but I think we wish why don't treat everybody like adults. Um, and it wasn't so much on the why, you know, why the war had happened. You can go down a rabbit hole on why, on why you think the war happened. You can go down a rabbit hole on why you think the war happened. From oil to weapons of mass destruction, you name it, government corruption. I read, heard, seen it all. But that's not for you to make that decision. I don't need to throw my hat in the ring on why. Because it doesn't matter why, nobody gave a shit about why

when we did it. But now they care about why when I make a movie. So for me, it was more about the what. What is combat? What happens after stuff like this? What happens when you're young? It's your first time and you get a grenade thrown at. So it was more about the what.

What does it feel like? What does it feel like? What does it sound like? And that was kind of our focus. And if you wanna know why, then go yeah. Internet's a powerful tool. You should go look up why you think we were there. What's that moment like and not in the movie and being in that experience in 2006 and knowing that everybody's life is on the line and it's like, okay, I wanted to be in the military.

I wanted to prove my toughness. I made it through SEAL training and now I'm fucking here and like, this is bad. We don't know if we're going to get out of here. What is that first moment like for you and your team members of going, like, I have no idea how this is going to go? Yeah, that was, I think, when we all, when we, after the ID and I drug Elliot into the to the house there. That was right for me about the time I was like, yeah. If they wanted to rush this building, you know, we take a few of them with us,

but yeah, we'd be done. We all knew that we were, our position at that time was crippled. If they wanted to, yeah, we were done. And I remember, like, we were done. And I remember like, we all think the same cause we're always, you know, we were put, when we train, we, you know, we simulate a lot of these, uh, there's no way to predict two guys getting a bone up. Oh, you know,

we do these, these down man drills and we do mass casualty drills and, uh, you know, how to prioritize and execute. These are the priorities if you have a mass, multiple injuries in your position, compromise, here's what you're supposed to do. And a lot of that is just this theory. Because you don't know what the enemy is gonna do. So you can train so much,

and we train the failure in a lot of things. And they're like, all right, what'd you learn? We do it again. And then they'll add something new. So we were constantly training the failure to kind a lot of things. And they were like, all right, what'd you learn? We do it again. And then they'll add something new. So we were constantly trained to failure to kind of anticipate those things. But there's just something you can't anticipate, which is like being concussed.

Well, yeah, I mean, you can have a checklist, but if you're concussed, now we're talking about a physical attribute that is not opinion-based. It's just like it's a very physical injection of something. Something being inserted that's physical that you can't manipulate or power through sometimes. So when you realize that in a moment of being concussed, half your force has been cut down with one explosion. You feel this real sense of vulnerability. And yeah, other than just like, hopefully the

movie describes it, I have a hard time describing what it is, which is kind of why I made the film. Some people paint, some people write poetry, some people write songs or write a tune on a piano or guitar. For me, I like doing it. I can do it in movies. I can convey it through pictures versus talking about it. I can talk about it, I guess, and I could handle it. I just don't have the words to describe it. It's just too specific of an event to describe how I was feeling. And it's not just one emotion, it's fear, anger, regret. Like, fuck, I should have worked out harder.

Damn it, I can't drag Elliot up the driveway. And he was like, I can't do anything about it now, but now I have regrets. But I should have, should have more on leg day type thing. So yeah, you know, it's a lot going on there. Okay, but I think I realized something though, and I've been talking to you about it, and you know, as you talked about each character's art,

that I do think you do a great job of that, where, okay, it's the overall shot and it moves so fast and there's all this stuff happening, but you, you kind of allow the audience to see what's going on with each team member in different, different moments where we check in on them for a second. And then we check in the guy playing you where you're concussed. Yeah. You're still trying to communicate. And I think the thing that I always wonder about

is you can go through all of this, but you don't really know how everybody is going to respond. But you're also trying to take care of yourself. And when you think about that moment, I just wonder how you balance like, okay, I'm fucked right now, but that guy might be more fucked than me. And then now we have two guys that have maybe fatal injuries. Like, what is it like trying to be part of a team, yet still wondering how you're doing as you look around the room? Yeah, I mean, there's there's some things that like, there's

like basic, I think operations that happen in your magazine changes. I'll give you an example. Magazine changes. I don't remember doing magazine changes, but I did that. At the end, because they had me three magazines in there, and I was like, I don't remember going through this. So there's like things like that mundane things that you do, because you've done it thousands of times. So your brain is like, okay, you're operating on a low bandwidth right now. I'm taking over. And you're just on autopilot. You're doing some of those basic things and you're not even aware that you're doing. So now you're just focusing on the things that you normally don't do. Like

I'm not a medic. While everyone was doing live t-shirt training, I was probably dropping bombs in some desert somewhere doing some training on aircraft. So I just didn't focus on that. I got basic stuff. So now I can't worry about all the other things. I'm trying like remember what I learned you know a year ago about tourniquets and morphine packing wins and stuff like that. So yeah it requires a lot so but I think there's times where and where we're all

concussed and we're all going through these ins and outs. That's the beauty of a team is I think there's times where I was blacked out one minute I'm nailing the next thing I'm standing and like, I don't know what happened in between that. Uh, but someone else is doing something in between that. And I think they probably noticed that was passed out or just like, who knows, who knows at the point that was in. Um, but we're all kind of helping each other and we just need lots of you see like And so it's very much a team effort. It's, you know, like I said, a lot of it's autopilot stuff, but there's just things that you just notice. And so it's very much a team effort.

And so it's very much a team effort. And so it's very much a team effort. And so it's very much a team effort. And so it's very much a team effort. And so it's very much a team effort. And so it's very much a team effort. And so it's very much a team effort. And so it's very much a team effort. It's a lot of autopilot stuff, but there's just things that you just notice. We got the... It's what's ingrained us. It's like always finding work.

Always finding work. Even as I put it, I'm trying to get out or apply pressure on to Elliot's leg, Joe's leg. I'm trying to make combs. I'm trying to make Tom, I'm trying to add to the, you know, being additive and not be dead weight, so to speak. Pete Slauson Did a guy really shoot himself in the thumb with morphine? Tom Jones He did, yeah. Yeah, he really did. Everything that's in the movie happened. Pete Slauson Yeah, I mean, now that I've read enough prep on how you went ahead and told the story, I think there's something else I want to ask you about.

You can read some books and whether you go back to historic wars, but I was reading something about World War II and shipping off all of the equipment to Africa and basically the things they needed to get the jeeps off, they packed onto the ship first. So just logistical shit of the ships are ready to unload and like we can't get these jeeps off because the ramps are all the way in the back and they should have been the last thing that was packed. And then you read it and go, okay.. Then look, I've read all the modern stuff and I think there's a lot of, I don't know if it's, oh, well, once you're out there, the bureaucracy of it all and logistical stuff and there's all of these communication headaches. I remember, I think 20 years ago when I was working

in Boston and I was at the small radio station and there was a guy that was active military, but he was coming by the radio station because one of the hosts was like really cool about it. He'd have guys in active duty come on and talk Red Sox with us and stuff when they were back. And I was asking him about it and I think we're probably about the same age. So I grew up like in an era of this world of golf war, like that's only going to take a few days, you know? And I remember asking him, I was like, what's going on over there? And he's like, the way we're fighting this is going to take us 20 years. And it was amazing that he ended up being almost to the year on it. He's like,

this is going to take us, the way we were doing this, this is going to take us 20 years. Is it as simple as that your experience was that leadership has different things that they have to answer to, but that actually gets in the way of the most efficient way of executing these missions for guys that are on the ground. Yeah, I mean, I think, yeah, there's definitely a disconnection from the top Yeah, correct. I mean, there's definitely a disconnection from the top and how and what decisions are being made for to the person who's executed on the ground. 100%. You can find examples of that in every major company. The person who's in the trenches working, I'm sure they get a sense of like, the guy who runs this thing has no idea what's happening.

And that's like the culture of it. But the why again, we're getting, we're trying to get into the why. So yeah, the why I just, I don't question it too much. I think you, I couldn't at the time. I can now, I can look back and say, okay, let's see one, why it started, two, why did we stay there so long? Could we have been out of there? Could have more people have been saved, 100% yes. Can't argue that. With the ROE's constantly changing,

the restrictive ROE's, and it's all optics. As a JTAC, we have some of the most accurate, like the amount of money we dump into our munitions and how accurate they are. And they're worried about collateral damage. You're like, but that's why we spend so much money on these damn munitions. So why these contractors are getting all this money

to design these awesome weapons. And we can't use them because optics because so you know, we bomb a school. They weren't any school children in it. But the optics is we bomb a school. Well, the insurgency took over the school. Uh, there were people in the school because they don't allow kids, those women and little kids go to school. So there's always any students there. There's just like optics and things like that where you're like, you know, and instead we end up throwing a man gun around through that thing and the building collapses anyways. But just because the optics was dropping bombs on somebody looks so bad where

instead we just run it over with tanks. It's the same end result. It's just the optics. I guess dropping bombs from an airplane looks bad versus like sending a main gun around to collapse the ground to collapse. It doesn't make any sense. So when you're on the ground, you're like, they don't care that the school drop down, they just care they just care how it was dropped in the optics. So that's kind of like the sense that you get. The flip side of that is, uh, you know, we're not animals, man, like we there's a lot of things we did once you're're there and you see that there's an insurgency, which they're not local Iraqis. They're, it's called an insurgency for a reason. You know, they're,

they surge from other countries and oftentimes, uh, you know, they would force some guy who had a family like, Hey, you're going to go plan an ID. If you don't, we're gonna chop your wife's head off. So he does and then we shoot him. Uh, we don't know. We don't know that that guy was forced to do that. He probably does not want to do that. Whatever said he doesn't. I know he doesn't. Uh, so there's like these like situations you start to discover. Get in there. All right, cool. All right. So now that we know this, uh, there's the you start to discover that there in, all right, cool. All right, so now that we know this, there's the, you start to discover that there's these people that need help.

It doesn't mean like we're their savior and we're trying to like, you know, show them to Jesus and it's like, no, you do see that there's this insurgency that's coming in, they're doing things to little boys and girls and women, forcing, you know, men to do these things. And they're evil people. And we helped as many, you know,

we would put on clinics for women that were beaten to death of kids that were taken advantage of, you know, and we try to help them out. Cause we have the money and we have the facilities that do it. So we would, nobody told us to do that. That was just us contributing. We're also living in their towns and their cities.

And if we can help, we would. But simultaneously, there's a lot of evil people. Frankly, I don't think we killed enough of them. So I think that's how you, that's how you, I think, just not justify, but just yeah, the selfish way. It's like, I think we're doing some good here and it may not last forever, but you did it. ISIS came in, created a vacuum and then ISIS came in.

But for the time we were there, I think for the bad stuff that was going on, some of the decisions you have to make on the ground, quick decisions too. Sometimes guys live with those guys that have taken their lives for those decisions they made and some can't live with them. You have to try to find some sort of good. I think we did. I think obviously you have your friends and things you do for each other. But we really, you know, there's a lot of effort

that goes into helping the local people. It just never gets reported. But I've witnessed it, so. In a lot of ways. What was it like for you the first time the guys from the team saw the movie? Talked about it. Oh man, I was nervous. Yeah, that was like the first time the guys from the team saw the movie. Talked about it. Oh man, I was nervous.

Yeah, that was like the first gate essentially had to go through. That was the most important one. I actually care less what I do care about. Yeah, some people are like, your movie sucks. Whatever. It's not for you. So, but yeah, so they, yeah, the guys who helped with it, they did the interviews, but also some of the guys that were just in it, other OPs with a lot of guys

came to watch it and did it like the same kind of same reaction you had. A lot of those people have is just super realistic, immersive. Um, and, uh, Elliot was there as well. He watched it for the first time. It was like a rough edit. So the sound design wasn't what, what it was now. I mean, they, they since then have seen a updated version, but at the time it was a pretty rough time. But we all ran Elliot and we're just like all right man you now and we all agree this is about as close as we're going to get. So each

guy was just like yes that's what it felt like. I felt I was represented well. So as accurate as you could represent me. So as accurate as you can represent the event that day. And in the spirit of it, you know, Alex says this a lot, if there was GoPros in this house, it wouldn't be exactly the same thing as the movie. But I felt, yeah, I was told by Ali, like, hey, that's as far as accuracy is gonna get. So you now know what we know. Hopefully that fills that gap in your memory. As far as accurate, that's it. Most people don't get that. It was great seeing Elliot at the end too. And look, man, I just, I know how hard it is. I know what it must feel like to have it be

this personal and then to complete something like this even once is an incredible accomplishment man so thanks for a great movie. No, thanks sir. Thanks for having me. Thanks for watching and sending the support as well. Thank you. You want details? Buy. I drive a Ferrari. 355 Cabriolet. What's up? I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork. I have every toy you can possibly imagine. And best of all kids, I am liquid. So now you know what's possible.

Let me tell you what's required. The email address is lifeadvicerr at gmail.com. We have Kyle back in the mix and Wargon here too. So Saruti's going to be out for a while now. So we're just, you know, whatever the lineup is, we're adjusting and I feel like the heat. No, I don't feel like the Miami heat, honestly. I should say it the other way around.

To do that against the heat without Garland for a couple of games, Cleveland just doesn't care at all. So yeah, I feel like Cleveland right now. We're just going to, whatever pieces we have, we expect to dominate. It's good to see Kyle. How are you? I'm great. Rested, rejuvenated, feeling awesome. Crown Jewel was perfect. Spring just started when I stepped off the plane. It was awesome. Real spring? Yeah. Wow. That's great. How long were you gone? Two weeks? Yeah, two weeks. Two weeks. We didn't even check in with you once.

Yeah. I was like, uh, you know, does she miss me? Does she, I guess she doesn't miss me. I don't know. I was like, I'll just check in when I get back. Yeah, I don't know. I think it's important if you have time off to actually give you, I know what's super easy to just stomp on a zoom and, and do 20 minutes of life advice. So we've certainly done it in the past, but I don't know. I just feel like if you're off, I see, I don't want to say that because it could be another time where we do ask you to come on. Don't commit to it. Yeah. Right. I don't want to commit to it, but when Sarutti brought it up, I was like, let's just, I think we'll be fine and we'll just see how it goes. I was hoping maybe there'd just be a

Wargon Rossello special at some point, but- Just what, like all worked out that no one was around and it's just, uh, you could just, we all get to know Wargon a little more. Wait a minute, Wargon, did we have one with just you and I or no? I don't think that ever happened. I think Serene, Serene hopped in when Kyle was out. I gotta say, I liked the three box a lot more than the two box. Okay. Yeah.

There wasn't just a Wargon because I think I was wondering as it was mapping out, like who's going to be around. I'm like, I'm doing it. I mean, obviously we'll give it a shot. And of course war gun, I think is more than capable. I just think the idea of war gun and I hanging out for 20 plus minutes, just the two of us, I don't know if I'm ready for that. I'm not saying I don't want to do it. I just don't know if I'm ready for it.

I don't know what would happen in that, in those 20 minutes. Well, it would be, I wonder what would happen in that, in those 20 minutes. Well, it would be, I wonder what would happen with the awkward silence. Would you ask him like our loaded question? And he's just like, nope. We're like, all right. Yeah, right.

I mean, all possibilities. I mean, we did get, maybe I'll read this one because I did flag it when it got sent to me. Because- Are we to save a little time talking about your draft somewhere in this. I just I was unplugged and think work on was out. So we neither of us really know what happened with you guys. Your little draft party. Oh, gosh.

Yeah, that was happening. No, uh, McShay wasn't going to ask me to do any of that stuff. Actually, there was no way to even do it, but I got a call during the week. We did a live show at my house, McShay, Steve, Mitch, and it was just a live broadcast to wrap up kind of the last few rounds, but then cover everything. And so McShay had asked me over a month ago, and I am really bad with long-term

scheduling. I mean, I'm a Hall of Famer when it comes to just being absolute dog shit at the process to the point where I end up saying no to stuff that I probably would be able to go to or would want to go to, but I'm just so afraid of like, look, everything changes. Sometimes I'll wake up and think I know exactly what my day will be and then it'll be something entirely different. So when somebody says like, hey, can you do this? Be like, I don't know. I don't know if I can or can't. So if I commit to it and then tell you I have to cancel, so I'm better off just telling you I can't even do it. So McShea, because we're so close and I wanted to try to help with the draft a month ago, he was like, will you do this live show? And I said, you know what? Fine.

Um, but I thought it was going to be a bit more straightforward, just like, Hey, we're going to tape something at your house and we're in LA and it's not that big of a deal. So as the week starts to work itself out towards that Saturday, I realized I'd committed to fish on Friday and that there were three playoff games on Friday that I was going to have to catch up on while there were four more on Saturday, knowing that there were four more on Sunday, and then we go live with Bill and I.

So, you know, this time of year, it's just what the job is. And so for me to say yes to fish, which I normally would have said no to because of the playoff games, then I get a call from one of our behind the scenes guys being like, we need to show up three hours. We gotta load in, dude.

Yeah, they were like, are we gonna have parking? What is the elevator access? We have a couple of cams, light, sound, and I'm like, what the fuck are we doing? Filming stuff. I did see a photo, I was like, wow, there's a lot of shit in his living room there. Good thing he didn't have to move much to get it in.

Right, so I'll admit, I started MFing myself. There was no one else that I was mad at, except for me, just sitting there for the couple of days of the realization of why would you have said yes to this, knowing that it's a brutal time of the year and on top of everything else. Like I thought I was doing myself like as the last, I'd say years. So I'm trying to say yes to more stuff that I just defaulted to no one always because of the job and not say, Oh, I work so hard. All that kind of stuff. I just, I really am like, Hey man, find a way to get more stuff done that has nothing to do

with work. Um, because you know, the, uh, the years are flying by here. So get some more experiences going. Um, have you considered breaking your day into three days like that guy? Yeah. No, that's, I can't tell if those are, when I see those videos, I start getting anymore, who knows what to say anymore. Is it not? I saw some French teacher beat up three kids and I'm like, this guy's a bad ass.

And then I was like, I think this is fake. So anyway, yeah, it was a lot. It was a lot and it was great. The show was great. I had a lot of fun. Everybody behind the scenes, I hadn't worked with a lot. They were just awesome, efficient, right on it. Showed up with a dozen donuts.

Because they knew. I think everybody had a vibe of like- Because they knew you weren't putting shit donuts. You know, cause they knew. I think everybody had a vibe. Cause they knew you weren't putting shit out. Well, I think he knew, it felt a bit like they were like deep down, Rasoola may absolutely regret that he said yes to this. So, and I wanted to be like, look, now that I understand what it is, the show is the show,

let's just have a great show. But I was, I was spent and then Fish was like, that's about the tamest fish show. Imaginal. Cause the whole time I'm thinking about like, I'm getting texts about your Sanders on like, Hey dude, I'm waiting on Piper. All right. Not worried about this right now. Uh, so yeah, a little recap.

Do we have anything else to get to? I don't think so. I don't think so either. Okay. Yeah, there's some people who are concerned with the way I'm treating Wargon. I can't find the email. Nice, nice.

Wargon, do you feel like you're being treated differently, unfairly? Like you're picking on him? Like the soft jabs between us early on? No, I kind of feel like you're being treated differently, unfairly? Do you not like- Like you're picking on them? Like the soft jabs between us early on? No, I kind of feel like I'm an adult. I can like do something if I feel that way. Good, good.

Spotify has great HR, I've been told. Yeah, I only kind of feel like I'm an adult though. Not 100%. If it becomes anything that's like on the cusp of HR, could you just give me a heads up? And then maybe we can work it out. We'll just hash it out on my device. Yeah.

Yeah, we'll just tape it. We'll make it a segment. Okay, all right, I can't seem to find it, but there were some people that were a little upset. Okay, somebody wants a fish check-in. Maybe we'll make this quicker because I feel like we already sort of did it. Skipping stats to get right to a very important question. What the hell was Rosilla doing at a fish show last weekend? I went to my first fish

concert or should I say experience at the bowl, Hollywood bowl on Saturday, which is just an epic venue, man. I mean, every single time I get to see a concert there, I just kind of look around and appreciate appreciate how special that place is. While I had an idea of what I was in for, it was still way more than what I expected. For those who've never been, you first walk through a parade of people dressed from the plate, Joseph in the multicolor coat,

while seeing and smelling every substance available. As you get settled in and the sun goes down, the experience begins. I found myself surrounded by a generation who only grew up with black and white television, doing what can only be described as a Caucasian rain dance. Black and white television is a bit aggressive, but I will admit, I did look around.

I was like, God damn, is this an old crowd? And then I went, you're not wicked young, dude. Anyway, as the air was filled with Pope Parise-scented smoke, I found myself asking, what the hell does Rossello do with these shows? Does he get a seat in the corner all the way by himself? And people watch as he partake in channeling the weather and the leather skinned fishies.

I don't know about that. It sounds mean. Yeah, or does he simply lock in on the 25 minute vibe sessions? I would love to hear what draws him to these shows and how he experiences the carnival that takes place. Also exiting the show and seeing a mile long flea market of people peddling ice cold balloons of nitrous is also a first time experience for me.

Last thing for Friday feedback, you should consider doing a Wargon deep dive session. I don't know. I think everything's on the table with Wargon. Yeah, look, my first show was in 1992. I was in high school. I've told the story before, but I, you know, when I came back at that point, I was, I guess, considered cool in high school. And then I came back and, you know, it was a pretty typical high school question.

Like I was like this outlier, because I was like the first guy that went to a fish show. I was like, oh my God, you know, went to a fish show. So we're kicking it and guys are like, how fucked up did you get? You know, went to a fish show. So we're kicking it and guys are like, how fucked up did you get? You know, this is what you care about. Although you'd be shocked at how much later in life

people will still ask the same question. Even though when you're a teenager, you're thinking like, this must go away at some point. Definitely more cache that when you're younger. Yeah, right. Like, did you hear about how screwed up fill in the blank at that concert? Yeah, guy's awesome.

I didn't even drink anything. I mean, granted, it wasn't even legal, dude. So that's its own topic. But yeah, I didn't even want to drink. I was just like, I was into it. And granted, because I worked in a restaurant and I had access to music that I would have never had access to because of chefs.

Like whatever you want to say about chefs. And I think there's a lot of interactions with chefs that later on in life, I'm like, oh, wait, that's what that guy was all about. But at the time you don't realize, but they're really good for opening up the doors to music. And I do just absolutely love music. I have a pretty wide variety of tastes, but. And insults sometimes.

They get creative. I never heard that one before. Oh, chefs? Yeah. Oh yeah. I mean, I could do an hour on chefs in a kitchen and I'm glad I did it and I'm glad that I had the experience and I'm also pretty happy that that ended up not being

what I wanted to do, but good for you if that's your deal. It's just a different working environment. I mean, talked about the construction working environment, but a kitchen is its own thing. It's just hard to explain unless you've worked in a kitchen. But yeah, when it came to the music and I would hear stuff and being like, what is this? What is this? And at that age, I'm super impressionable. And so yeah, I think there's certain music that all of us have. If you really love music that the first time you hear it and you just start thinking about things, you're just so inspired. Because again, I think it's kind of cool, even though you

are super impressionable about everything at that age, like there are things that it is cool to be impressionable about. So fish was definitely one of those things. But then when I got to Vermont, it was more like, wow, you guys really like them. I almost felt like I wasn't, I wasn't, I was like, I do not aspire to be this into them, even though I was still very much into the music, saw them a bunch of times, but not like a staggering amount of times. So for them to get back together and then to get to see them three times in the last year and a half or so, I just enjoy it. And so I thought Friday was, was a fun show, but yeah, like if you want to make fun of it, I'm not gonna argue with you about it, but I think the important thing is you get older.

And I've kind of felt this, why would I care if something's fairly harmless if people enjoy it? Why would I care? Why would you care? You can make fun of a ton of it. And yeah, the dancing isn't great. And it might be the whitest thing you could go to.

Like, Van texted me about Shador on Friday, and I was like, hey, I'm at the fish show. Where are you sitting? And he liked that one a lot. So yeah, man, I mean- The nitrous is a little weird. I mean, I've been around all types of stuff. You know, I could identify certain things by smells

that aren't just weed, you know? But I gotta say, there's something jarring about seeing like the can of whatever. I consider myself pretty liberal and I'm not like, doesn't upset me, but it certainly throws me off. It's just like a new thing, I don't know. What is your experience?

You guys have any experience with nitrous? No, no, not at all. I do. An energy drink that went out that came out that was like, I know, remember the orange bottle? And I thought that was pretty cool. Paid for that a couple of times, but that was, that's about as close as I ever got. Wasn't that a little bit more Fast and the Furious than say Fish? Yeah. Yeah. That's some marketing right there. Like, hey, if we can figure out a way to just translate that button that dudes get to hit on their car. Did you know anyone in your town

that had nitrous in their car, Kyle? It was like one of those rumors things, like my cousin's got it. It's like, sure. All right. My girlfriend goes to another school. I'm like, okay. All right.

My girlfriend goes to another school. Like, OK. Yeah, we're got any car or balloon nitrous experience. Literally nothing. Yeah. You don't see anything walking through the park these days? Just the people on the e-bikes, dude. Hate them. Can't stand them. OK.

Take that shit somewhere else. Not having it. Yeah, look, I couldn't believe the balloon thing because I remember when it was in the mix and it was kind of like, you know, hey, a guy's got a tank or a guy's selling balloons or whatever, nobody really cared, but they still sort of cared.

And then walking to the Hollywood Bowl, walking up, I was like, oh, this is just a free for all. I'll admit too, it's just weird when you get older and you're looking around and you're like, oh my God, look how old these people are. You're like, well. Well. News flash, buddy. Yeah, right. I just appreciated people were firing darts because it's a smoking generation. I haven't seen this many smokers in one place since the bullfights. So I was like, this is just a lot. I was like, okay, that makes a lot of sense because everybody from my generation

on still, they're not smoking now, but for fish, you get a few Indian, you're like, hey, you know what, let me try one of those marble lights. What are those yellow American spirits? That's gonna take me 10 minutes. So I had two Mick ultras and I'll admit that probably during what's going through your mind set two, I yawned a couple of times. So yeah, but.

Karini in the light, you know, there was some stuff happening there, Piper Piper brought me back to life. So, uh, there you go. Cool, man. Thanks. Thanks, Kyle. Glad you got out there. Such a busy weekend. And then I, I'll admit that when I woke up the next morning, it was like, how are

you going to get all this shit done? You haven't even watched Lakers Timberwolves yet. And you love the Timberwolves. So. Okay. Slow start. Almost feels like a Monday pace right now. All right, I'll do better.

No, I'm talking about myself right now. But do you have any experience with the juggalos? Kyle, have I asked you about this before? Yeah, you keep doing this. Should I stop wearing black? I'm trying to figure out what it is that's got that in your head. I don't think it's a crazy question. Listen, I heard there was one song that I heard back in the day and I was like, that's

kind of crazy. And I think I laughed because they were kind of funny in it, but it was, I don't know. It's kind of unsettling music to me. But, uh, yes, you've asked this. I think we're probably up to three strikes at this point. So, uh, I don't know. Yeah. I've asked many times, but I think I saw a clip of it the other day.

And I was like, see, you're, you're too mature now. But I think a few years ago I said, if I give you all expenses paid per diem, I'll even, you hit me with an hourly, you know? I'll just pay you. Will you go and document? I don't know if I get a weekend of you at the gathering, but I'm tempted. I'm really tempted.

There's gotta be a number. There's gotta be a number and you could be a correspondent for us. Yeah. Maybe if I could bring like one of my friends, just to actually see seeing your crew in action, I would hope you would. You'd spring for that? All right. Yeah. All right.

If you spring for that, then we could talk about it. Could you tell your wife, like, hey, it's content, it's for the show? Yeah, Ryan made me do it. I blame you for stuff like that all the time. Totally fine. Wargon, any interest if Kyle doesn't wanna take this? Not even sure what we're talking about.

That's maybe better. Okay. Maybe better. A little more in our lane here. A girlfriend sleeping with her boss, 32, five, 10 bench three 15 comp. Poor man's Jerry Sheesting. Love the Sheesting shout outs. About a week ago, my girlfriend photo attached revealed to me she's been seeing and sleeping with her 40 year old boss for the past two months.

A little bit of backstory. We started dating in February of 23. Uh, after I came out of divorce where said ex-wife cheated on me as well as got pregnant with the same guy. Sure know how to pick them. Fast forward to now, the most recent ex and I were initially up and down, made it official fall of 23. So they started dating February 23, official fall of 23, had a brief breakup in there between about two months,

but have been together since last summer. In December of last year, I made the very idiotic mistake of having a very drunk one night stand with a woman. Told my girlfriend and was honest. It ate me up, as you can imagine, made me and still feel horrible as I should at that moment. I got a second chance. I do everything I can to try to redeem myself. In February, I began to notice a shift and something was off. Little did I know what the fuck was actually happening. Details aside, the why has so many variables. Quote, it just happened.

We have a lot of common. I did it out of spite. She told me she's looking for a new job and currently it is no longer occurring, but we aren't together. So she is free like me to do what she wants. I know this is a hard situation to come back from because obviously you don't continue to do what she did

if there isn't an emotional connection, which she does have feelings, but not in love or wants to be with a guy. She's told me she still wants to be with me, sees a future with me, and wants a life together, and I feel the same. In the end, I have no fucking clue what to do and what to believe, and I realize that the weight,

that this isn't a random person, but her boss, I have no fucking clue what to do and what to believe. And I realized that the weight, that this isn't a random person, but her boss, she sees him every day, has feelings. And so that connection doesn't stop overnight. What do you guys think I need to do? Trying to do no contact, but that's going about as well as KD. And Phoenix, I want to ultimately be with her,

but am I an idiot to do so? Am I naive to think this can be salvaged? Should I just leave it and move on? Truly just a lost guy, appreciate the show as always. And he sent a picture of her and she is hot. So they are not together. That's the part. They're not together.

Grasping right now. They maybe stay that way for a while. Well, it sounds like you've got a nice little backstory to a main character in a TV show here. Uh, I mean, look, we don't know you. So that goes without saying. Um, I would wonder, do you not want to get back through together with her for the wrong reasons? Right?

Would the wrong reasons be, would you be judged? Do people in your circle know this? Do your friends, do your family know the deal? What is it about her that makes you think this can all work out? Because I would tell you that is some incredible maturity if everyone involved here can all get past all of this stuff and move on. Do you have a pattern of always having shit going on in your relationships? Now, maybe you just shared two with us that don't seem to be great, but are you attracted to chaos? Are you always in relationships where there just always seems to be something that is disruptive, right? How bad is the trust going to be? Because I think even if you get through this

and make promises to each other, human nature is that you're still always going to kind of wonder a little bit. And because of what you've done, she's still going to try to wonder a bit. And I don't, you know, it's pretty childish to be like, Hey, you did it. So I'm going to do it, but I can at least understand getting there. So I think what you really have to do is figure out like what it is about her. That makes you think that this can still work. What is it about your pattern and who you spend your time with if it's not just the two that you share with us, but this also happens?

Because you may have grown up in a situation where you think chaos is kind of normal. So then when you're in a relationship and it's chaotic, it's ups and downs, you're taking breaks and you get back together and all this shit, like it's amazing what will happen once you're in a healthy relationship. You're like, oh, this doesn't have to be insane. Like, you know, so I, I'm a little concerned that maybe all of these challenges in relationships are normal for you and you think it's kind of normal.

So you're expected to just get back together because this is, this is how some of these toxic relationships work. So again, credit to you if you can get through the whole thing. expected to just get back together because this is how some of these toxic relationships work. So again, credit to you if you can get through the whole thing. So I'm not going to sit here and say, hey, no way, dude, she cheated on you because you cheated on her too. And it's not even about taking sides.

It's just sometimes you can have two, I'm not saying you're broken, but I'll use that term in a loose way, not specific to the email. But sometimes people that are kind of broken are so attracted to other broken people that they just kind of go through this cycle. And then the next thing you know, it's like years before they have any clarity whatsoever. So I would be really like, if you're having these moments by yourself, you're like, what should I do? What should I do? Like go over your own history, figure out what you're attracted to, and then understand, are you really going to get over this?

Or if you rack together in the next bad stretch in eight months, does it turn into Armageddon when you guys start letting these things fly back and forth because no one's ever gonna forget when it's this serious. Yeah, you mentioned a while back on this show, as you've gotten older, you're like, I'm starting, I can see how people navigate these complicated feelings when there's

some sort of infidelity. Because I think we had talked about it before, when you're younger, it's like, oh, she kissed another dude, that's it, I'm out. And then as you get older, you can sort of see how people are like, well, all right, well, we're just, we're just going to split everything in half, whatever. Like you, you see as people get older, how maybe it's a little more complicated, not as cut and dry where, you know, your high school girlfriend cheated on you and you're just like,

all right, well, I'm never talking to her again. Or so I think that's probably part of growing up. You need my jacket back. Yeah. Right. But yeah, I think you're right. You just have to ask yourself a couple of these questions, right? I mean, it doesn't sound like they haven't been dating that long. It's not like you're moving out and looking for a new apartment. So you're like, if we get back together and this happens again, like you just you wonder when you're like setting up a foundation of a life and you're like, God, is this, you know, is this going to get washed away by the ocean?

How close to the beach are we? I don't know but and then also like like you said with your family It's like is your mom gonna have a couple of sangrias on the 4th of July and it's gonna come up I mean who knows how many people know do they know you did the bad thing? Do they just know she did the bad thing? Is this is this all shit that is gonna amount to a happy life? So, I don't know. I think maybe I would The band-aid's kind of ripped off your he's saying he's trying not to contact her I think the longer you do something the easier that's hard the easier will become that's what everyone says about running and lifting weights and everything so maybe

Maybe another month of this you might feel differently. I don't know I just feel like it doesn't sound like you have a solid foundation and It sounded like you weren't together long enough that you know You're deciding who gets dogs and cars and who gets to stay in the place. So I don't know. I think there's totally someone that you could enter into a relationship with where there isn't ammo on either side.

We're like, well, you did this and you could just have a clean slate and hope for the best. I don't know if you can hope for the best anymore when you both are thinking like this. So I don't know. Yeah, I think you gotta pull the cord on this one. It's done. Like you've both cheated on each other, your adults sort of move on. Like you said, it's only gonna get easier.

Weird pattern though that you've gotten cheated on two times in a row. Maybe you gotta look inward on that one. I don't know. Whoa. Yeah. You ever been cheated on work on? No. Thank God.

That's my guy. Yeah. Yeah. Not that I know of. Fair. Fair adendum. Okay, couples massage. What is the right matchup?

This is good. Monster fan of the show. Wow. It's huge. I've had this thought. I don't even know what the email is, but I think I've had this thought as well. I was at the 23 live show in New York City,

had an absolute blast. Awesome show. Please do another one in New York. That was the best one. It might maybe one of the best ones, but in my opinion, it was the best one. That was an awesome show. The Chris Paul part of it was just,

I couldn't have gone better. Allison. And Elizabeth, also pronounced Elizabeth. Here we go. Please do another one in, should you get up to the New York Athletic Club for pickup run while you're in town? Little worried about the hoops game right now, to be honest with the audience. For context, 26 years old, 6'2", 195, solid numbers in the weight room can throw up 225 for a few, but nothing crazy depending on the competition. My player compass can swing between Eric Dievendorf. This is the second Dievendorf shout out that we've gotten on the emails today. Dievendorf with some lava type takes on Shador

Sanders not getting drafted earlier than the fifth round. And Nate Lubbock. Is it Lubbock or Lubbock? I forget, Big East. I'm one of the better guys on the floor, pulling confidently and spinning into traffic, trying to get to the rack. If not, I'm setting hard screens, moving the rock, crashing the glass and yelling,

good luck after a miss to keep morale high. Good luck. I like this. I didn't even need to the comp here. I didn't love how long this was taking until we get the good luck part of it. So now I'm all the way back in. Here's the situation my girlfriend gifted me,

I guess both of us, smart move, where they spa day just outside of New York City, high end place, great amenities. The package, she got included a couples massage for us, which I had never done before. We're greeted by a man who brings us in the massage room where he and a woman are standing next to massage tables. They each subtly indicated which bed they'd be working on.

Kind of you pick who goes where situation. My girlfriend casually mentioned, it might be weird if I had the male masseuse, but I started thinking, masseuse, just the masseuse industry in general, if any of you are listening, you must be like, hey, are you guys still doing this? Like you can't have a dude massage you.

But again, when I did a couple's massage, I picked the girl too. So I don't know, I don't have to tell you. They each subtly indicated which bed they'd be working on. We recovered that. But I started thinking, would it be weirder if the woman, if I had the woman and she had the guy and I'm just lying there four feet away with my head in the donut pillow. So I zagged, I ended up going with the man,

figuring man? Figured it might make more sense in the context, but now I'm second guessing the whole read of the situation. What's the right call here? Is there a known strategy for couples massage matchups? Did I overthink the switch or make the right assignment? Would love your take. Thanks again.

Yeah, I mean, was this a bad switch? Like I get the point. If we're all being childish about this whole thing, it's like, wouldn't I rather have a man assignment. Would love your take. Thanks again. Yeah. I mean, was this a bad switch? Like I get the point. If we're all being childish about this whole thing, it's like, wouldn't I rather have a woman giving me massage than a dude? Um, right? Like, I don't think I'd have to explain that much, but if you're right next to your gal and

Sven is over there just working the moisturizer from that little hip pack pump thing that they have just dangles. Yeah. He didn't describe the physique of the male masseuse. That might influence me a little bit. Yeah, that guy looks like the dude from White Lotus. I'm probably, yeah. Yeah.

I don't, like, where are you in relationship? You like the other emailer? Who fucking knows? Right. Or instead they'd be like, hey, so who's your team, right? I think. Yeah, right. Like I took somebody on a date for a surf lesson. And the next thing you know,

this fucking Brazilian surf coach is getting her phone number at the end of it. You know, he was like, Oh, this is a hypothetical or are you telling? Oh no, this is true. Yeah. No. Oh no.

I was sitting there, I was like, are you fucking serious, dude? So I don't know. But sometimes, you know, the ball community, we understand this or shaped head. It's like, you just assume that it's this fragile. Just gonna do this right in front of me. Anyway, what do you got war on?

I think I'd go man. You know, if I'm getting a massage, I want like the extra force, you know? I had that thought as well. I got those big muscles. They got to get through them all, you know? Yeah, runner's body. There you go.

Yeah, it's not the same. I told you I went to a chiropractor and this guy was tiny. And I just could tell he wasn't getting around me the way he needed to. And I think he was like hurting me. And then he basically just told me I was good. And I was like, no, I don't really know feel any better.

He's like, no, no, you are. You look, see you were slanted before, now you're not. I was like, no, I don't think any of this worked. It's like, if you're paying for the service, you want the best job possible. Yeah, and he's not gonna, you know, the masseuse probably isn't gonna be realigning me, but you know.

Big boy. Yeah, all the massages I get are from my tiny wife. I really wonder what it's like. Haven't been picked up off the ground in a while. Wonder what that's like. I'm just saying maybe it's worth it. I think I like it. If she, also though, you went against her.

She was like, it might be weird if you got the dude. Maybe you just like opened up. She's like, oh, this guy's like open to things. Cause you went and took the dude after she said, maybe it's weird for you. So maybe that was the right move on a couple of levels. It was like, he's totally secure. Have either of you guys ever done the couples massage?

No, never, never got on. I've done like a facial. I need more context. Yeah, we were in Puerto Rico, I guess. Dominican Republic. Just like shoulder massage, stuff on the face. I was so burnt, hurt so bad. Bad decision. Like chemicals we're talking?

No, like sun. Oh. Sun burnt. You were burnt prior or the facial? Prior. I thought they were gonna see the burn and be like a little gentler. No. No, couple's facial.

Interesting. Yeah, couple spatial. Interesting. Yeah, the couple's massage, depending on where you go, it is pretty awkward. And it also depends on where you are at in the relationship when both masseuse leave and be like, feel free to enjoy the serenity of our room as we pour a hot bath for you. I do love a good spa though. Those are nice.

You have 15 minutes. Anyway, let your imagination run wild with that one. All right. Thanks to Wargon. Thanks to Kyle. Sarudy, he'll check in again. He's just watching. He's got one more magic game to go, I guess.

But I mean, come on. They can't score. Jonathan Frias want to thank him as well, because I know we had just to want to make sure I get all the credits right here. Check out our podcasts on the Spotify app and as well all of our stuff up on YouTube, the Ryan Russell podcast. Bring your Spotify. They were going to name me Michael Jordan.

My dad was like, I don't think he can live up to it. So they named me Michael Jared. 21 and older, present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus and present in DC gambling problem, call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com. Call 888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org forward slash chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24 seven support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE-NY or text HOPENY in New York.