The Ryen Russillo Podcast - Ohio State–Oregon Preview With Stanford Steve. Plus, Mirin Fader on the Life of Hakeem Olajuwon.

Episode Date: October 11, 2024

Russillo is joined by Stanford Steve to get his lean for Ohio State–Oregon, learn what it’s like working with Nick Saban, and try to figure out what’s going on in the Big 12 (0:37). Next, Mirin Fader comes on to discuss her new book, ‘Dream: The Life and Legacy of Hakeem Olajuwon’ and shares what makes his story so compelling (30:40). Finally, another edition of the Alliance, and Kyle and Ceruti join for Life Advice (57:01)! Should everyone stop randomly knocking on people's doors? Check us out on YouTube for exclusive clips, livestreams, and more at https://www.youtube.com/@RyenRussilloPodcast. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Host: Ryen Russillo Guests: Stanford Steve and Mirin Fader Producers: Steve Ceruti, Kyle Crichton, and Mike Wargon Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Okay, today's show we had a tape before Thursday Night Football. I apologize. It doesn't happen, but we had to do it that way. Stanford C is going to join us. We're going to talk college ball little saving stories, but especially taking a look at Oregon hosting Ohio State, maybe the biggest game in the history of Otson. Mirren Fader has a new book, she's from The Ringer, it's on Akeem Olajuwon, I can't wait to get into this book.

She is gonna join us and talk about that. We've got life advice, the Alliance, and couch money research. It's the Ryan Rosilla Podcast, presented by FanDuel. Football is in full action, and FanDuel's highest rated sports book is the best place to bet at all. Here's why I love Fandel.

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gambling problem call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com. Miller Lite. The light beer brewed for people who love the taste of beer and the perfect pairing for your game time. When Miller Lite set out to brew a light beer, they had to choose great taste or 90 calories per can. They chose both because they knew the best part of beer is the beer. Your game time tastes like Miller time.

Learn more at MillerLite.ca. Must be legal drinking age. Joining us from ESPN, you see him every Saturday on College Game Day and my guy, Stanford Steve. What's up, man? How are you, bud? I'm good. Where are you? I'm at home currently and headed to one of our old, I think our first favorite spot. When you first got to Eugene, you're right.

I think your eyes kind of lit up that I hadn't seen before. And it does help. We were there for some, some monster games and monster nights. It's, it's funny because the first thing I think of for the rest of my life Will be on a late-night drive home after a game and you stopped at 7-eleven and it was Halloween weekend And you were in between you were in between Chewbacca and Super Mario by the tin

As we had to drive back to Portland. Uh, but that's, that's my, uh, that's my, that's first thing I think of all the time, but you know, you know what happened. Yeah. Yeah. Now look, I think I, obviously my first SEC experience was Auburn and that was the Oh eight season and it was pretty cool, you know, and then we did SC and that was just so weird, you know, can compare to some other stuff. But LSU is probably the first place I fell in love with.

Texas was kind of underwhelming, but I loved all of the different things. But the problem with Oregon is like, it became this thing that we kept missing out on. I think we kept missing out on it in 08. Like all year 08, we kept thinking we were going to get a chance to go and then something would happen. And then, you know, that what was fun about game day, even on the radio side is you would get done with the show on Saturday and you were kind of like figuring out based on the outcomes, mapping out where you were going to potentially be that next Thursday.

And so we ended up making their it out there after like a couple months. And if you look at the history for Oregon, at least for us, we had a that next Thursday. And so we ended up making it out there after like a couple months. And if you look at the history for Oregon, at least for us, and people are talking about this being the biggest game they'll ever have at Autzen. I mean, number five USC came in that year, Oregon was number 10. And Oregon absolutely put it on them. I think Barkley was a freshman that year too. Remember he had said like, I don't mind when it's loud. And that at that point was so incredibly loud because if you're on the USC sideline,

the way the design of the stadium and everything, like there's SEC loud, but I would say pound for pound, 60,000 plus at Otzen, it holds up with kind of everybody. But I don't know, like when I saw the highlights, or excuse me, when I saw the headlines of people saying this is the biggest game in the history of Eugene, it kind of is. Like I don't think I can put that SE game out of it.

So how do you see it? Yeah, I'm there with you. You know, we talked about it on our call, and Reese was the guy, of course, that brought it up, and just had the numbers. You know, first time two versus three there. You know, it's the monstrosity of Ohio State and what they bring.

You know, it's first top three matchup and the first time two teams in the top five have met there. Oregon's, you know, first top five matchup on campus. And then you factor in Ohio State. It's monstrous. It's cool because we had it circled like this is one that everybody had planned like Ohio State's gonna be undefeated when they get here. Oregon's gonna be undefeated and everybody else last week you know Falters and those two guys are standing here. So when I think about the matchup I think people

would agree I think Oregon would agree, I think Oregon would agree they haven't played up to their liking. And it's been a lot of self self-induced mistakes. You know, missed assignments up front. Gabriel careless with the ball in the red zone. I think it's three, three picks inside the 11 yard line. You can't do that against this Ohio state team. I don't even know how many opportunities you're going to get down there. It's funny, Herbie and I have been going back and forth all year about who's secondary they think that we think is the best. He's taking Ohio State. I still stand with Notre Dame. I just love the way that group plays, but they're going to be

tested. You know, Oregon's guys that, you know that your Tez and the James kid last week really showed out who was going to be the next Bucky Irving, who was going to be the next receiver. So Oregon has not played up to it, but Lanning will have his guys ready. The depth on the defensive front, I think, is big. And our guy, Tom Angle, I'm stealing his words he's monster Ohio State fan and he's like I'm watching him he's like if chips deck of cards is 52 cards he's used about three of them so you know you know you got some stuff coming out this week I mean they've been so good they're getting

better and better so I definitely believe Ohio State has the advantage but you got to go out and do it. And as we talked about, this place will be on one for sure Saturday night. Yeah, the Ohio State point by angle is perfect because I've watched a good chunk of it because they always kind of land in the spot. We're like, all right, I can watch more Ohio State here.

And even though the matchups haven't been great, and in theory, Iowa is supposed to be the biggest test at this point. What I'm so impressed with them is they're not even playing that well. and it just, one of those five guys gets their hands on the ball and then there's just this huge play. Like you have to figure out a way to contain it.

And hell, they've gotten off to slow starts. And then you look at the final score part of it. So stats overall can be like really misleading. You look at like Ole Miss defensive stats. I'm like, okay, that's a cool stat, but I don't know that that's necessarily who they are, even though I was impressed with them on the bounce back after South Carolina.

I think the scariest part of Ohio state is you watch them for 60 minutes and you may not even like 30 of it and it hasn't even mattered. So I'm definitely leaning Ohio state in this one because I just, I can't imagine this program not being super up for this. And even though Oregon's fixed what we think is the rushing attack is Jordan. James has been great.

They're carrying the ball. The average carry now is a lot better after those two weeks. They're not giving up sacks like they were in those first two weeks. I don't, I don't think their offenses is bankable against a great opponent. The way I would kind of bank on Ohio States, even though it hasn't, they just hasn't mattered, man. Like it's just, Judkins gets it okay, done. Smith gets it done. Um, on and on and on. So we'll see. We'll see. But you think it's like, are you going to be shocked if Oregon wins? Uh, I'll be surprised. I wouldn't be shocked. I would be surprised because

that, that's a tall, like you just said, the idea of what they are for 60 minutes, you got, but you got it on the other side, you got to be better than them, for a longer period of time. And Oregon just hasn't done that against bad opponents. And the other factor is, while everybody just wants to talk about Ryan Day and having to beat Michigan,

you know they had this thing circled with the get-back. None of the guys really matter that played in that, you know, CJ Stroud and all the other guys that played when they when Eugene went to Ohio State in one. So I just I just feel like it's a big spot where Ohio State where you know you want to talk about how motivated are they, they have the biggest NIL, all this BS. Uh, these guys will be jacked to play in this atmosphere for sure. So I expect the house state to play well. That's that, that's the other factor of Oregon.

I I'm not picking them. If you were voting, I mean, would you vote Texas one? I would because I've seen him in person. Um, and what stood out, what stood out in person that we don't see? The complexity of their offense and how on page on point they were with viewers. I mean, when you go back and watch them, Ryan, you don't realize it in person, but they're rotating offensive linemen series. They're giving them series, you know, and they have two freshmen that they're rotating in and you don't even notice it while you're

there in person and you go back and it's like, whoa, this guy's doing this. But the the idea of how good shark is, you know, top play caller in the sport, in my opinion, but the way he goes about it and they don't I mean, Michigan Michigan has NFL guys, I mean studs on their defense and you couldn't pick them out that day. You couldn't do it in their defense. Talking to guys there. They've really felt more comfortable this year because last year they played off of those two monsters inside at the tackle and then just, you know, they had the blitz to get pressure. Now they don't. The

freshman Collins, I'll tell you what, he's next level. The kid from UTSA, who was their big passer, should have gotten the portal, hasn't really produced numbers wise. But the way that they're better team as a team defense, I think they're second in scoring. Ohio State's won there.

Yeah, they're at seven points a game. But the idea of what they are and their speed, their speed on defense is really, really good. And then in-person tackling. I know Michigan's not a dynamic offense, but the idea of just getting guys on the ground and Mullings is tough to get down. So it was, because I saw them,

I could easily flip it this week after seeing Ohio State. That's another Oregon. And I have not seen Penn State, but everybody else is there and I do believe Texas deserves to be won. So after all the upset, Steve, we're kind of left here like trying to make sense of all, I mean, in a million years, you never think Bam was going to lose to Vandy,

but watching the game, like they beat him. Like it wasn't flukey. It was, it was weird. This defense that I kind of found a way to love. And I didn't love it against USF. No one should have Wisconsin. I was like, okay, this is starting to remind me of things that I saw. And then the Georgia part of it.

Then does it mean that we'd learned something in the second half? Um, they're, they're too good, but this is, this is weird. This is really weird for the aspirations that they would have in Tuscaloosa every year. Do you think it's just an emotional, stupid moment for a, for a group with new leadership after the Georgia win or something else? I think it's Vanderbilt Ryan. I mean, everybody has to talk about Pamela because it's number one losing.

I get it. But the idea and that game plan that they had, they made Alabama play slow because they didn't know what the hell was going on. And if you go back and watch the tape, they keep using, you know, an inside zone play to see how Bama is defending it. And all that stuff came off all that's all, you know, that one play, then they start getting the cross motion. Then they get the downhill guys. And then it was an exhausting eyes game for a defensive player because you're just waiting to go,

am I going to guess wrong again? And, and Pavia just owns it. Cause it's the same thing that he was running for all those years in New Mexico and, and the way Alabama is, you know, that the oldest kid now, he's not going to play. He didn't play in New Mexico. And the way Alabama is, you know, that the Otis kid now, he's not going to play. He didn't play in that game. They don't have a lot of, they're good up front. They don't have a lot of depth. And when I go back and I watch the Georgia Bama game, I'm watching that Georgia's defense is on the field in the second half, 55 snaps against that.

I mean, that thing was as hectic as Helter Skelter as you could be. So now you come in, it's Vandy. Okay, what are they? We don't really, you know, they're off a bye week and the execution of Vanderbilt was just sensational. You know, I hear people say it's not flukey. It's not, they executed enough.

I mean, you think about all the times and coach Saban talked about how, you know, having to do it, you know, time and time again, no matter what, week after week, he never lost that game. Never. He never lost it. And it's a credit to him. And now the fallout is all right. What happens next? Well, guess what? You got your offensive line wasn't great against Vanderbilt either. Your right tackle probably had his worst game of the year. And now you got those maniacs on the defensive edge for South Carolina coming in. So you got your attention right away. And that's, that's what's interesting that now with Bama, you have plenty of, you know, opportunities

to go, you know, their personnel, I think is fine defensively, but across the board before the season every single coach I talked to what are you most worried about your roster depth on the defensive line every single one except one guy and that's the guy that's doing it down in college station uh elko in that defense uh I got to go to practice down there he is he's awesome. And that guy could flat out coach. But every other, Georgia, Bama, LSU, all the top teams, that's their concern. And it shows out and now you're in it. And what do you do to adapt? We'll see. What's it like working with Sabin? David.

Now that it's been over a month, the total level of everyone around, you could tell their accountability has raised because of the expectations he brings to the table and what he thinks it should be, whether it's topics on the show, video, his film room stuff. So it's, that's been awesome when he speaks. No one says a word. Everybody's tuned in. He's nailed almost every off the field conversation we've had.

When I'm trying to take notes during our meeting and do things and I find myself week two, I'm like, put the pen down and just listen. You're gonna remember this stuff. All time stories, you know, driving from Oakland to Berkeley, you've done that drive, it's not a pleasant 15 miles and he's in the car and he's just looking around like, you know, dumbfounded. He's looks, he says, how the fuck do you recruit here? I think I said like 13 years ago when I was right.

The first thing he says, um, but no, it's, it's, it's been great. He got me pretty good last week coming off the top rope with the girlfriend comment. And that was based off a three minute conversation at dinner the night before, you know, he's just sitting there and he's looking around, you know, cow, we're staying at Cal's hotel and you know, he's getting bombarded obviously with the selfies. And so he takes a chair inside the restaurant. I just, I'm standing there at the bar. We where we're BS. And he's like, you ever come over here and hang out with this, this stuff. When you were at Stanford, I'm like, I actually did.

I said, my girlfriend, you know, went here and then he takes that and spins it. And that he of a moment when I try and have my moment with the cow crowd. It was awesome. It's awesome. He's, he's been great. And like I said, I mean, we went to his house when we were at Bama Friday night and him just sitting at the table telling stories. It was awesome. Awesome. And it's just about how I mean, because he's been in so many scenarios, Ryan, and not being afraid like there's no there's no more governor. You know, you talk about it all the time.

When we got coaches at ESPN, it was like, I don't really want to have him on. He's not going to say anything, right? You know, he's not coming back and everything's out of the bag. So the way he's thought out and lived things, it's, it's I just how smart Everything is and it's helped me a ton like just watching tape and and just being able to you know Pick what you know people are asking you know he's called man. What did he call it the? Relief syndrome that that's what he's calling Alabama you know that that's his saying that's a saying he had to his team after a game like the Georgia win and So we'll get we'll get into that this week. His film rooms are awesome. I got a chance to go to A&M and go to practice when I was there.

And so Elko comes over and we're BS and how's Nick this and that. I said, he's actually he's fired up. He wants to draw up your third down defense and how you disguise it. He's like, man, he's like, he's had a guy reach out to me from his staff every single year going back to when we beat him when I was at A&M. And I said, I said, well, now he doesn't have any excuses. He's, he's doing what he wants. Like that's, that's phenomenal.

So, um, yeah, the stories, the stories are just legendary. Let's run through some of the other teams here and I'll just kind of like, throw it your way. Um, Ben State's been this, they're fourth in the AP and I know you listen to the podcast, so I don't have to worry about it as much as others, kind of understand. My Penn State position-

Yeah, your bamalove is strong. My Penn State position is not really even about Penn State. I heard it. It's great. It's just at the end of the year, let's see. And Drew Allerstat's are significantly better. He looks better. The touchdown interception split last year, let's see. And Drew Aller's stats are significantly better. He looks better. The touchdown interception split last year, I actually

thought was alarming and you saw it in his play. It looks great on paper when you watch them play. So like, let's see what third and seven, third and eight look like against Ohio State. And that's all that's going to matter. But there's a handful, five, six guys on that Penn State team because they always play early. It's always on.

I'm like, okay, this all looks better. But yeah, I still don't think they're better than some of these other teams. It could be wrong. It could be the Ohio State benefit. How do you see him? I think what Codel Nikki has done, the offensive coordinator has been monstrous for them

because like you've watched them, they bring in a tight end Warren and they run like this wildcat package. That's just another thing a team has to, you know, prepare for. And so what that does is it takes time away from, you know, it makes the team prepare for more options. Whereas now it's like, Hey, we got that on tape. They got to worry about this. Let's get back to doing stuff in other circumstances. And I think you've seen that in the past game. It wasn't as creative in years past. And I was on the field for the Ohio state game last

year, first third down, he gets rocked out of, out of a disguise blitz. And he was done the rest of the day, holding onto the ball and even worse in situations where he needed to, he gets rid of it. But he's grown up a lot. And I think that offense has helped him. There's so much side to side. I mean, we talked about it with Vanderbilt, the eye candy that these good offense coordinators give you now, man, I'm not want to play to have to play defense because it just screws with all your keys. And then, you know, say you're on the road and you're not communicating, are you getting the final call after what it should be? Because they most should two guys instead of one. And who came across the formation. So I believe they are better. That's the one thing I go back to, you know,

I try and keep in mind who's better than they were last year, just cause you know, you know, you have a feeling in it and a basis for teams. I expect them to go out to SC and really play well. I think they can manhandle as he's offensive line. And that's the first step that'll. That'll be a good stage for them. It's not great. I think it's one in eight big 10 teams when they've had to travel more than two time zones. So the only one that won is Indiana at UCLA.

We know what those two teams are, but I expect a big day from Penn State. I do believe they'll be in the big 10 title game. Yeah, I was looking at, you know, Saturday's reaction for a bunch of different reasons because it was just so remarkable to have the five teams in the top 11 lose. And then it could have been six for the Miami. Did you stay for the entire Miami Cal thing or did you get out of there? No, I got out of there.

I had to go to Kansas City. So. Yeah, that's right. Oh yeah. For Monday night stuff. So there's no way you're going to be able to spend the entire day there. So I'm watching cam ward, who I think going into that week was he and Millrow are the Heisman favorites. the entire day there. So I'm watching Cam Ward, who I think going into that week was he and Milro

were the Heisman favorites. And Cam is probably one of the only quarterbacks that can bring his team back and do that. And I love their receiver group and the whole deal. But he also, he's for a guy that's really good. His willingness to risk the possession is beyond everybody else. And I don't know when he's going to grow out of that, maybe never. But then it turned into like a bigger conversation of like, okay, well we're seeing all these teams lose because of the NIL and the transfer portal and all these different stuff.

And like, I'm just like, look, we get to see it happen a couple of years before I'm ready to start expecting like NC State to win the ACC just because everything's more level now because I'm not there with it. But when I look at, Clemson took all that shit because of not taking in any transfer portal people and Dabo and the whole deal after they get stopped by Georgia. And they've righted the ship. So now they don't have to hear it all.

But by the way, the transfer portal thing with Clemson, what's so silly is if you have an established brand that's like in a recent established brand, the idea that you wouldn't want to use that as an advantage to bring people into the transfer portal, like forget your coaching one-on-one stuff. Like you're one of the few destinations, Clemson, that would actually get some higher profile guys because you've had this really great run going back,

not that long ago, knowing that it's dipped there a little bit. So anyway, fast forward to kind of like the Georgia part of it. Like I'm just taking in all the quarterbacks that were like at the forefront of this conversation. And I keep coming back to like, what has Carson Beck done to even be in these conversations that he was a part of? Whether it was projected to be the number one pick

for the 25 draft, where he was in a lot of real mock drafts as the number one overall pick. He was basically tied with everybody else as the Heisman favorite with like five other quarterbacks before the season started. I thought his first half against Alabama was disastrous. I thought he was so bad. I think the final numbers actually could have been a little worse.

I imagine the film was terrible and you know, fine, cool. They righted the ship a little bit against Auburn, but he was thrown in a conversation that I'm starting to realize like, why was he ever in this conversation in the first place? It's a great, it's a great point because he is when you see these names and, you know, you mentioned the Heismans and, you know, the moments that people have and what people remember from a Saturday, it's Cam Ward, it's Millrow. And then, you know, Carson Beck is there.

And when you go back and watch the tape, you know, the, the, the, the Alabama, you know, the screen early where it's just where he's trying to throw a slip screen, it just goes in the Bama defenders. The receiver never gets to check. He's checking the play to the receiver. Um, I think it was Aaron Smith. He's looking right at him. He never gets it. It was to change it from a slant to a quick screen. He throws a quick screen. Aaron Smith runs a slant and you got to pick in the places. Bananas. It was not great. Communication was a huge issue. He got antsy. You know, you saw that on the, on the grounding call and his own end zone, but to be able to come back and that's where I'm not out on, on Georgia. You know, I go back to last year where they

go to Auburn and Auburn plays their best game to date. Payton thorns, running the ball. They added that. I believe it's the first game, you know, Hugh took over play calling, but in that atmosphere, and you mentioned how much, you know, we love Auburn back, got it done. And he was excellent in that second half of that game. And they're trailing in the fourth quarter. And it was great. Now he had two great pros in, in Bowers and McConkey. And that's where I think, you know, I talked to guys that go to practice at Georgia. They love they they're like, we have the receivers. They we watch them every day and they do it.

And then the first half, the combination of communication, some MAs up front with the offensive line, you don't see it. I mean, Aaron Smith made one of the biggest plays in their in their year two years ago when the DB for Ohio State falls and it turns the whole game around. So I think it's just more being comfortable. You know, they, they, they were really fired up about ETN, getting them from Georgia. He gets to get suspended the off the field stuff looks like it's, you know, hanging a, you know, a cloud over the team. And I just think it was about getting on the same page. They've had a bunch of guys, you know,

mix and match on the offensive line. But I can't wait to see what they look like in Austin next week when we go there. Because that's, you know, you had your brutal half. Kirby talked about, I'm so proud of you guys. You know, you came back against Bama, which is still astounding to me and made me think differently

because like we talked about the Alabama defense, like they got exposed and then you saw that against Vanderbilt. So what Georgia brings to the table in Austin is going to be a major factor for me and what I think because they do have to play everybody. You know, you still got this trip to Austin, Oxford, and then you get Tennessee coming in. So they're nine and three. As long as they beat one of those, it's going to be a hell of a lot better than other teams. And that's, you know, with, with the big 10 looking the way it is, and now, you know, Miami looking the way they are, ACC is going to be one big,

these non-SEC people are not going to be happy when they see how many teams, SEC teams are going to be back in even though they all lost last week. Yeah. I mean, that's probably, I mean, as soon as these teams lose, like I would have loved to have been sitting there the same way I was Ohio State when they'd gotten smoked by Iowa. And Joel Clad is aware of every time I bring this up. So his friends will listen and we laugh about it. So we're cool. We get a lot. I think he's, I think Joel's awesome, but I remember being at home being like, how could you be this dismissive of the Iowa loss by Ohio state?

Like, what are you talking about? I wish it were still four teams just to hear. Like if Bama were to win the SEC, but with a Vanderbilt loss and arguing, arguing, saying undefeated, you know, whoever knows, you know, I don't think the other three conferences are all going undefeated. So Bama winning the SEC would probably be in if Vandy actually like is, is a six and six team that would also kind of help their cause too.

I guess it just was, I was just a little frustrated being like this thing doesn't even matter and shoot, they could lose, they could lose to somebody else. They could lose the LSU and if they're 10 and two and win this, they're going to be, they're going to be in the playoffs. So it doesn't even matter. Um, do you have any, any read on the big 12 whatsoever? Cause I gave up, I gave up a couple of weeks ago. Reese nailed it as he always does before the season when he said, it's not the

deep, it's not the deepest league. It's the widest. And you've seen that because, you know, you have a team trickle up because they start, what was it? Three and O and UCF, and they got manhandled by Colorado. Oh, you see Colorado go play an out of conference game in Nebraska, manhandle, uh, Utah plays, you know, like crap at home and Arizona goes there and wins. Uh, I really fired up to see the Kansas state, Colorado matchup because if Colorado wins that game, they're in it. They are, they're in the mix

in this conference and going back to your sec thing for a second, what's really going to be interesting is how we judge the teams that lose conference title. That is going to be a monster factor down the road. But as far as the big 12, I mean, I think I've picked five different teams, five weeks to win the league. Iowa state is in a brutal spot this week, going to West Virginia for a night game. You're undefeated. West Virginia has already been humbled a couple of times, bad losses. You know, what do you get out of that? That hurts the conference, I think, if West Virginia beats Iowa State,

because you don't have that top dog. And you need that going forward, as far as the presumption and thoughts that people have on your conference. So yeah, good luck trying to figure it out. I still think Utah, if rising is gonna play, is the team. Yeah, we're on the same page with that. I mean, if rising is gonna play, is the team. Yeah, we're on the same page with that. I mean, it really comes down to it

because like the K-State part of it, to see them lose, they could have lost the two lane game. Yeah. I just, I've watched them enough to go, how am I supposed to like, think you can ride this all out? But because it is so wide, it's probably a two loss winning team. Texas Tech is actually in first place right now.

Nobody's even mentioning them. No one. And BYU doesn't get any love on top of everything else. So like you, when you see, I already know what we would do. We'd go neutral field rising. We just go, we're just going to take Utah over everybody because that's what I thought going into the year and the buy-in to Whittingham, but Keith, he hasn't been as much of a factor as I thought he was going to be coming back. And Zach Wilson's brother, you know, they were able to pull out what? The Oklahoma State game, but then Oklahoma

State's already lost three times. So. Yeah. And then I just thought it was fascinating because you saw Whittingham was built on culture and defense, just toughness. Like what they did in the portal. Then when they got all these receivers, you know, I was like, okay, cams. And you talk to people spring game, they're throwing it all over the place. You know, cams going to throw for a bunch. It's going to be a different look. Cause for the first, I didn't have a running back. It was going to be running back by committee and we haven't just haven't seen it. So do we see it? Hopefully. But I think that would be the measuring stick.

It would be Utah with rising in that conference. Enjoy Otson. Say hi to the boys at Taylor's. It won't be Halloween, so it won't be peak Otson. But you are going to probably one of my three favorite campuses in the country. I cannot wait for this game on Saturday.

The goal is Bama LSU. Hopefully we can get there for the show and rendezvous. Yeah, I'll be there. I'll be there, not working. So we'll do it. All right, that is Stanford Steve, Steve Coughlin, Magna Cum Laude, Stanford class business. You'll see him on game day every Saturday with all the guys.

Thanks man. Method of First Touchdown, and so much more. Just visit fandel.com slash Ryan, R-Y-E-N to download America's number one sportsbook and kick off every college football Saturday with a boost. Must be 21 and older and present in select states or 18 plus and present in D.C. Opt-in required, bonus issued is non-retrofable, profit boost tokens, restrictions apply, including any token expiration.

See terms at sportsbook.fandel.com. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com. You won't win in the Superbowl, but your fundraising will support mental health, suicide prevention, and prostate and testicular cancer research. And if you don't want to grow a mustache, you can still walk or run 60 kilometers, host an event, or set your own goal and mow your own way. Do great things this November. Sign up now. Just search Movember. Our next guest is Miran Fader from The Ringer.

She's a terrific author. She did a piece on Giannis Antetem Kupo and now her new book on Akeem Elijahwan, Dream, The Life and Legacy of Akeem Elijahwan comes out next week. What's up? Thank you so much for joining us. Thanks for having me. I appreciate it. So let's start with that before we get into the book and some of the fun stuff that I learned about Elijahwan through this. cause you and I had talked because you'd done the Yanis book and I thought, okay, you know what you were like, well, the next project's. Akeem and I went, okay, well, I'm, I'm, I can't wait because I do feel like he gets lost in history a little bit, depending on where you think he ranks

and all that kind of stuff, but your motivation for going, okay, this is the person I want to spend this amount of time on understanding this subject. Like, why was it Elijah for you? I just felt like he was criminally underrated. Every time somebody would say, who's the best, who's the top, whatever, he's just always left off of these lists. And it's crazy for somebody that was so dominant,

still top 10 in steals. Like, I just think it was crazy. And so if you're under 30, you don't really know how amazing Dream was. But for me, when I pick a topic, it's got to have human interest elements. I just thought his return to Islam and how really he was the first pioneer, the first African superstar. He very much set the table for Yanis and Joellen Bede. He was almost my window into this current generation of superstars. Yeah, I love the answer about Giannis and Embiid,

and I'll probably get to that a little bit there, but let's go to his origin story. Because you knew, look, I'm trying to go back to like my first Akeem Olajuwon awareness moment. It's probably the NC State game, but I still was so young that I didn't really understand his backstory. But when you read it play out in the book

and you're kind of going like, okay, well how many years is this from when he first touched a basketball? Like that part of it's absurd. So let's kind of start with that timeline of him learning about this game and then ending up in college. And then I feel like,

it feels like 10 years should have gone by but that's not the case at all, right? It's barely a year. And he is not a quote dream when he starts. In the words of one of his teammates, he couldn't dribble. He couldn't do anything. And he didn't even want to play basketball. So imagine being 17 years old and you're like the tallest person in your neighborhood. You're damn near seven feet tall. And everyone's like,

Hakeem, you got to play basketball. You got to play basketball. He's like, I have no interest in basketball. He wanted to play handball, which if you all are having flashbacks to PE, this was actually very competitive. It was a hard game and he also did football. And so he always wanted to do everything else. And his coaches, his basketball coaches had to literally stalk him to say,

yes, I will come to a first practice. So even when he joins basketball, like at age 17, he's still playing handball. He still has to be transported on the back of a car to his handball and basketball tournament, sometimes leaving mid-game to make the other. So this was not the story of a person primed to play basketball, a person determined to play basketball.

It was honestly an accident that he turned into this amazing basketball player. So when I'm reading about all the stuff from Africa, like it feels like it's going really fast but is the competition like everybody realizes like, okay, this guy could be really, really special, but this there's no background for it. So I'm wondering like he wins MVP of some tournament very early on in the book, but what kind of level of basketball are we talking about?

So at the time, Nigeria was not a competitive basketball place. The other countries in Africa, primarily those that were formerly under, French colonization, they were way more advanced. And so basketball didn't even really get going in Nigeria until the 1960s. And so basketball didn't even really get going in Nigeria until the 1960s. And so he was playing against people

that were not necessarily the best competition, but they were very physical. Like his teammates were in the Nigerian army. So it was a very, it was tough in the physical sense, but in the skill sense, not really. So he could dominate, but he didn't even really know how to do a drop step or anything like that. So the competition, well, it was really seen as prestigious,

honestly, to our standards, it really wasn't. And so his first taste of like actual competition is 1980, only about a couple months after starting to pick up a ball. He, um, is playing in his first international tournament in Morocco and coach like barely plays him. It's really, really tough for him. He's riding the bench, he's seeing the older guys get out. But it's his first taste of like, okay, there are really good basketball players out there

outside of where I live. And so for him, I don't think people truly understand for him to then somehow play in college in America less than a year later, make the team somehow become a starter a year after that is crazy. It's actually crazy. It really is. And, uh, you know, you loosely know, you're like, Oh, what an incredible story. And he'd go, no, no, no, no. Like, and that's what I love about the beginning of the book,

cause it really puts the timeline in. I kept thinking, okay, well, how much further along are we? And we're like, no, no, no, no, no. And that's what I love about the beginning of the book because it really puts the timeline in. I kept thinking, well, okay, well, how much further along are we? And we were like, no, no, this is from when he started playing for this club team and then everybody's trying to grab him. And then they want him to stay there and it feels like he is a pioneer. I mean, he's a pioneer for a bunch of different reasons,

but he connects with one guy that apparently is gonna figure out a way to place him in the States. I had always heard the St. John's story that, and I never knew that it was true. I grew up a St. John's fan, so you'd always heard like, oh, actually, Elijah Wan was supposed to come here. I mean, I've heard those stories about so many different players,

so many different players, places, players. What is actually true about like what could have happened, why it was Houston? Because it sounds like he just gets off a plane and then that's it, which seems super unorganized. Okay, so this is why the book is called Dream, his nickname is Dream, everything is posited as a dream, a myth, a fantasy, too good to be true, right?

Because it is. So the one story that you're alluding to that people think they know is, allegedly this white American coach named Chris Pond happened to be coaching in Africa. He was coaching the Central African Republic team. They played against Olajuwon's Nigeria team. And so that's how we first saw Olajuwon.

And this is just a random American coach. He's from North Carolina. His brother played for NC State at the time There wasn't really this international recruiters that we have now But Chris pond was almost like one of those early guys the first one that really wanted to be seen as this like all-world recruiter And he tells a large one. Hey, I think you could play in America And so the fairy tale is they meet the next day there at the embassy And so the fairy tale is they meet the next day they're at the embassy

Somehow he gets a lodge on papers and then he says you're gonna go to st. John's first. They're expecting you I'll see you over there, you know fly to New York and then a couple days later we're gonna visit Houston and we have a tour of other schools he lists a couple other schools and Everyone says that the funniest part of the story is that he gets to JFK. It's so cold. He feels a chill down his back. He's like, No, I can't go to St. John's. I got to go to a warmer climate. So I'm just going to go along to Houston a couple days early. Land's in Houston, match made in heaven. They go to the final four, five slam a jamma. Yay, everything is great. The problem is it's true um, I did a foyer request to look deep into chris pond and Um the papers at the time suggested that he worked for the state department turns out he never worked for the state department

Um, he could have been a freelancer what they would call like a contractor But he was not a quote state department official, which is what a lot of people said at the time And I talked to the St. John's coaches. They said they never recruited him. There was never a visit in place. Obviously, emails were not a thing at the time, but there was no phone calls. There was no visit in place. So whether Chris Pond wanted to embellish himself as this all world recruiter, and make it seem

like he had all these destinations for a Lajuan to go to. Can't tell Chris you know Chris Pond has passed. I talked to his only surviving sibling. She said he tended to embellish. So essentially what you have is the St. John's myth story just isn't true and he actually was supposed to go to Houston all along. I don't know what Chris Pond expected. If he did go to St. John's would he just knock on the door and they'd be like, who are you? So wouldn't that have been funny? I don't know if that would have happened. But yeah, it wasn't this fairy tale that people think it is. It's a nice

story and people liked it because it went with this sort of mythological, ooh, look at this player from Africa. But it wasn't true. What he gets to Houston, the other part that I love is I would say the other underrated guy that I defend quite a bit. Although, you know, look, I can't keep my top 20 list updated every single day, is it Moses Malone. I really wonder what the Akeem story is

if it isn't for Moses playing with him in all these pickup games while he's at Houston. Because in the beginning, it seems like, okay, physically we get it, but this guy is not a division one basketball player. Like he does not have the skill. And Moses, instead of just being dismissive, which I'm sure a lot of American players are like, what are you doing?

Don't even waste your time. Moses immediately, because of the Houston connection, seems like he's like, I'm gonna invest all of this time into you, which I just loved hearing. your time, Moses immediately, because of the Houston connection, seems like he's like, I'm going to invest all of this time into you, which I just loved hearing. I know. It really speaks to this idea that generationally basketball is a brotherhood. And Moses did not have to invest in him the way that he did. But every single day, he would play with him all day, one-on-one. And it isn't even a sense of like taking him to the side

and like teaching him a lesson or sharing wisdom. It's just when you have somebody like Moses Malone digging in your back, the elbow is there, you have to find a way to score on him. You have somebody like Moses who is talking trash and you know, Moses was intimidating. People don't know, like he was such an amazing rebounder, like relentless, just the guy was a hell of a competitor.

That is the best education you could ever have for a young guy like Elajuan. But the other thing that people spoke to was that Moses was a giver. So he would give him hand-me-down clothes. He would pay for his meals. There's so much stuff that Moses did behind the scenes for Hakeem that people don't realize. And you know what? I think it was because of Moses' deep mentorship

of him that Hakeem so internalized that lesson of always helping who comes next. I don't think it's a surprise that Hakeem would mentor LeBron, Kobe, Yannis, all these people that came to him. And I think it's because he saw the way the older generation, people like Moses invested in him. So things start getting better and then it turns into what is this guy, three final fours, you know, the disappointing national championship loss to being the number one pick.

And at that point, you know, people can revisit it all, but I'm glad the way that you talked about it, you interviewed so many people for this book that, and it's really easy to play the results after the fact, but 40 years ago, nobody thought Michael Jordan should have gone ahead of this guy, even though he's still a project. And this is still, I think, years before the NBA

is like an upside draft. Yeah, have you ever heard anyone say the Rockets should have drafted Jordan? To this day. I just love that- No one's serious. Right. Yeah.

Right. The respect, I mean, you will see the article, what if this had happened? But the respect that people have for Hakeem is that to this day, they are happy that they selected him. That is incredible. And Jordan himself could not have been more complimentary about Hakeem at the time and now. It was so interesting talking back with Rod Thorne and Mike Thibault, people who were

intimately involved in the Bulls decision making. They're like, no question, if we had the number one pick, we would have gone with Olajuwon. It's hard to remember because that arrow was so different. Like you could not, this idea that you could win with a guard, it just wasn't a conception. You had to get a center. You had to get a post. And even though Olajuwon didn't necessarily have the offensive capabilities that he'd have, right? He was not the dream shake, you know, persona that he developed. He just was a really good defensive player and shot blocker. And that was enough to make him unanimous number one.

Yeah, but it's also like you're going through the game logs. And I remember that 86 Lakers series because I remember the Ralph Sampson shot. And I remember the Celtics being like, we're not playing the Lakers. How did this happen? And it's something that, you know, I think about a lot with the story arc of a related character in a movie or a TV show. Well, the story arc of the NBA player, and I talked to John Butcher-Gross about this this week was that, you know, Anthony Edwards right now, his approval ring is the highest ever been. You know, Giannis had this super high approval rating and then he wins. And it's like, man, like I can make an argument that I think Giannis' ring is like the most important ring

for any of the so-called stars because the stuff that he would be dealing with, if he doesn't have that ring, if Chris Paul stays healthy, that's just me making my Chris Paul statement. You know, like Anthony Edwards is probably going to be on the downside. Like I try to remind these people of this all the time. Like at some point when Minyama, people are going to start asking questions about him on TV shows.

Okay. It just is going to happen. Hakeem went through a really weird timeline in that it's all so impossibly ahead of schedule. And then they get through the Lakers and then there's this void. And this takes like almost another decade. What was it like kind of trying to figure out what that was? So many years removed of like how he felt about his place going back, revisiting the criticism where the approval rating was and then ultimately like him almost leaving Houston before they were able to win some championships. Yeah, I don't think people realize that it was one player away from him going to the clippers.

Like he, it was from the top to the bottom. Like he was like, tell me where to shoot. About a year before, a year before the title? About two, two years, two seasons. Yeah. So right up, right up before that. And it was, it was so sad because like the series that you alluded to in 86, they're playing the Celtics. Hakeem is looking like the second coming. He is going at Robert

Parrish, who is like an amazing interview for the book. And Parrish, the first game, Hakeem just walks up to him and is like, What's up, Big Chief? Like you're just walking up to Parrish, like, What's up, Big Chief? You know, like he just was not afraid at all. He did not care about the floor, the weird things that the Celtics would do. Like he just didn't care. And the Celtics respected that about him and it looked like they were going to be this dynasty and then it just like all fell apart.

There were drug issues, there were people just really weren't, honestly, he did not have a good team around him. And it was very hard for him because he felt like I'm in my prime. I need to win a championship. The critics are saying that, you know, will my career feel incomplete if I don't win a title?

I'm not so young anymore. And I'm not getting better players. I pass out of the double team and they miss the shot. What do you want me to do?" And so it was this really dark year and people forget. Hakeem himself had a temper. He would get ejected from games. He was not the peaceful man that we all know today. So it was a very tumultuous time and he was like, I'm done with this. The owner basically accused him of faking an injury. And he was like, that's it. Like, you're not going to question my integrity. I'm a competitor. I'm happy to

play on the Clippers. And Sterling really loved him, really wanted him. And it was almost a done deal. And it's just one player. It didn't go through. So Hakeem has to stay in this franchise that openly criticized him, that openly said he was faking an injury, and he's got to make it work. But a lot of things had to go right. He had to get Rudy Tomjanovic becoming the head coach. They had to actually trade for really good players, and he had to learn that it's okay to pass out the double team and trust your teammate,

and they can knock down the shot. So that's why I think the first title was so miraculous because it seemed impossible. Like I genuinely never thought they would win a title and nobody else did either. Yeah, to go from being that close to being out, the contract part of it that you go over

and now I remember this stuff, but I don't remember it with the detail certainly. So you going through all that and you're thinking if the Clippers had just been a little bit more forceful, it sounds like their deal was waiting to be done because that deal is compared to other potential rumors where it feels like your sources are kind of dismissive. I don't know that there was anything there. It sounds like if the Clippers had just called back and said, okay, we're going to do, I don't know if it was a price thing, but it sounded like there was a deal to be

made there. And considering it's the Clippers, then Hakeem's, he doesn't have two rings. He doesn't have two rings with the Clippers. There's no way. Right. And you think the Toronto final year was sad. Can you imagine if Hakeem would have went to the Clippers and the way that career would have? I mean, I just can't even see it. No, I hate the imaginary version of this. I mean, we can go over like the rest of the Houston roster and what's so impressive about that first title team

against the Knicks is like, there's some really nice role players there, but this is not some stacked team. The way we're looking, we had a run, I would say through the teens where it's like, tell me who your third hall of famer is before I take you seriously. And I like how they went kind of one in four out

with Tom Janovich and, but you know, Sam Cassell's hitting shots, Ellie's this young guy. Like that's not, that's not one of the all time great teams and he's at the center of it. And of course they smash a really young magic team the next year. You know, the other thing, I'm just gonna go with it because I'm sort of meandering through the topic

of Elijah one, because I'm excited about it. I hated whenever Jordan fans would be like, well, the only reason Hakeem got the two is because Jordan would have won eight straight. And it's, I actually, when I was younger, I'd be like, yeah, I don't know, maybe. I mean, it's hard to ever argue against any Jordan hypothetical.

But when you watch the last dance and how emotionally exhausted all of those guys were going in for the second three Pete, there's no way they were going to win eight straight. It was just, so somebody was going to get one and maybe it would have been an Akim in a different year. Maybe if it's not 94, then maybe it is in 95 or something like that because those guys were exhausted on the third part of part two in that movie. I don't think you would have been able to maintain

that kind of focus and competitiveness for eight straight seasons. I think that's a massive, massive assumption, even when it comes to somebody like Michael Jordan. I agree. And I think all of your Houston listeners are giving you a round of applause right now because they are so used to that argument.

And you know what, this is what I hate about sports media. Like it's, we are so quick to discredit. Like why, why can't we appreciate Hakeem and what he did? Why is it always a qualifier? Oh, if Jordan would, you know, like, and I think that is really like how his career is talked about It's always an asterisk and I don't understand. I understand why but I think it diminishes How good he was for the very reason that you just talked about he was not playing with all-stars They were just really scrappy and determined. I think that says more about Hakeem as a leader and his skill

It does we totally agree on that. Like when you start going through some rosters of like who won titles the last 20 plus years, like that is not some great team. It just isn't, it's just how special he was. And maybe it's because whenever there was like the David Robinson, Hakeem debate, even back then, I'd be like, I don't even wanna hear it.

Like go outside with that one. Are you kidding me? Um, because I also thought when I watched them up against each other, I was like, there's, there's a guy that's another level than the other guy. But you know, before this first title, before them finding a way, I don't even know, I think they were just sort of forced to continue to be in a relationship because there wasn't another option. Um, but you do spend some of the book talking about his, his return to his

faith and it feels like it, it happens kind of out of nowhere and yet it completely dominates his path and how he's going to carry his life out. And I was wondering, do you think he gets the rings without it? Cause I I'm probably so cynical that I'm like, yeah, I don't know, he's awesome. He's probably still got a title somewhere in the mid nineties for him. But there's an argument certainly to me

that I think you present that he becomes so more well rounded or so more focused with the stuff away from basketball that maybe that makes him a better basketball player. I tend to think that. And especially from just talking with everyone that was pretty much around him that had been with him pre, you know, returning to Islam.

And then after the difference, it was like a different person. And so I personally don't think that, you know, he would have won those titles. And honestly, from a purely basketball standpoint, part of that is because he could literally stay in the game. He was getting so many ejections prior to his return to Islam. He just had this temper and he himself said, I have a really quick temper. Robert Reed, former teammate, was like, I mean, dream was hell. And it wasn't that he would purposefully go after

people. It's that they would go after him because they couldn't stop him. Like one of my favorites was Michael Cage being like, yes, I purposefully got into fights with Dream because I could not stop him. And so you take all of this sort of the fighting and the ejections and all of these things, the Rockets were terrible during those years. So when he starts to have more, you know, a calm about him and a focus outside of basketball and a discipline, those become so less frequent. And that's when he's really able to also connect with teammates like Kenny Smith, great interview for the book. He was like, people didn't talk to dream. Like we didn't, we didn't talk to him like he was

hard to play with. And you saw dream really begin to open up to his teammates, become friends with them. And so the camaraderie that that team had, I just don't think he would have had that team chemistry had he not had this major epiphany and transformation. Yeah, you did a great job with that because you're sitting there, you're rooting for Elijah Juan throughout the entire book,

even though you know the ending, because if you bought the book, you like them enough, I was excited about it. But then there's these moments, I'm like, did I not realize that he was actually a really difficult teammate or he was so challenging? But it didn't feel the same way as other challenging teammates were.

I think a lot of it could be driven by selfishness. With him, I just think it was this standard that he had for himself. Yes. That he wanted others to have. I mean, sure, it sounds like there are plenty of times where he was frustrated with other people around him not making shots, but then we can start just going back

to some of the roster construction stuff that we touched on here a bit. Can you blame him? Yeah, but he... Yeah, I think when I got done with the book, I'm like, I look, I knew he was just a really special player and all this stuff, but to think about how fast he went from, I don't want to play this sport to number one pick to two time NBA champion, it's just, it's not supposed to happen.

It's not supposed to happen this way. It'd be one thing to come into the league, like role player defensive five, maybe we bench him at the end of the game, or maybe we play him. Like, no, at some point he's gonna be the best player in the league. And that's, again, I think kind of to the point

that you made about the title of the book, it's why it's very fitting on top of his nickname. Right. Yeah, and the other thing is that he doesn't get better by himself. I think this book, I really want to give flowers to all the people that made him into what he is. Carol Dawson just passed away, former GM of the Rockets, incredible big man coach. He's the one that mentored him, Moses Malone, this Nigerian player, Yomi Sangodeyi, which I discovered the dream shake really comes from him.

It's just a community, Rudy Tomjanovic. People made him into what he is, and that's why I think that this generation loves him so much because they realized so many people helped him, and he helps others, and you never hear about it. The only reason people know he worked out with Giannis is because Klips surfaced on the Internet, which Hakeem is not on social media advertising this. He gives because he cares about the game and giving back to the

game, not because he wants a photo shoot like a lot of these other retired players do. Pete I don't have a question here. It's just an observation because I like that you started the introduction with this because it has driven me crazy for years because I actually think it's insulting that we'll watch a player have trouble with his post. Now we don't even care because nobody plays in post, but there was LeBron moment, he needs to go down to the Keam camp for a week. And it's like, so you expect, and as great as LeBron is, as great as these NBA athletes are, you expect that you can spend like three to four days with the Keam and his little barn down there and do two days,

and you're going to come back. do you know how incredibly dismissive that is to the skill that Akeem developed in a way that we had never seen somebody with that body type? That you're just, you know, NBA player, we're gonna learn a couple foot placement things, and then you're gonna just come out like this awesome post player? Like, no, no, no, no.

We were talking thousands and thousands of hours, but it just was recycled all of the time. And then when the intro started there, I just kinda started chuckling because I was like, I'm glad I get to ask her about this absurd, absurd premise that you're just gonna hang out with them for three days and leave like, you know, Kevin McHale or something.

So, I don't know. Right, look, it's like when your mom gives you a recipe and she tells you exactly what to do and exactly how to turn on this and that and do this and that and then it just is like never as good. Yeah, that's Hakeem. I, I, it's a secret sauce. Again, dream the life and legacy of Hakeem Elijah. It is out Tuesday from Mirren Fader. You can pre-order right now. Great work on this and thanks for the time.

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The Alliance, uh, let's recap it. What did we do last week, Saruti? Uh, two and two, you and I lost Kyle and we're going one. So, um, yeah, you know, what Kyle's leading the way, actually Kyle and we're going to lead the way at four and two, Ryan, you're three and three. I'm two and four. So not, not great for me, but we'll bounce back. Okay. I expect you to bounce back.

Um, so the board who wants to go first on this one? Do we all have separate? Cause sometimes we may all want to do the same game, but then it comes out a bunch. All right. So, um, go, let me just start because I'm last. So I'll just go, I'll just get my out of the way here. I'm going to go South Carolina, Alabama over 46 and a half Bama off a loss. They might just want to beat the crap out of somebody at home this week.

Uh, last time Bama didn't score 40 points to you by the way, it was last week against Vandy, they scored 35. So I think they're going to be in the thirties in this game. I think South Carolina struggled. I know last week against Ole Miss, but I think they could score Bama struggles with running quarterbacks. So I like both teams to score Bama probably wins comfortably, but I think there'll be a lot of points in this game Okay. All right. Well, I really wish I could take the pats in this but this is college football

So I'm gonna keep the good vibes going and I was thinking around this time last year. We were in Oxford That was a great time Van popped up so I'm just gonna I'm taking then laughing only Taking Ole Miss. I'm taking Ole Miss, uh, minus 160, which will keep the odds gods, uh, as well as Saruti happy, I think we'll be hitting our spot. So I'm just taking Ole Miss money line, um, versus LSU. Okay. I can jump in.

I'm taking a Minnesota outright against UCLA heading out a West Minnesota beat USC last week, close game against Michigan the week before that the odds were they're going crazy They was like minus 200 earlier last night. It was like minus 180. So I'm not sure what's quite happening But I like Minnesota to pull it out Okay. Yeah, row the boat hadn't heard that in a while They're rowing the boat this week and then we heard about some sort of like brain inducement soda that was going on out there So love it. Keep it going.

Go first football. All right, so what's available? What are we at right now? Because did no one do all spread on anything, Saruti? So now I feel like- I did the all total. They took one line of favorites. So you, you know, the world is your oyster.

There's a lot of games here. Did you want to do, or you do- I know, but I didn't want- The house, the Oregon? Want to be able to be the guy that got the alt spread favorable here on this one. No, you're not. You can take whatever you want.

Take whatever, we're in a good shape. Okay, all right. So what can I do with Ohio State? It's minus three and a half right now at Hudson, correct? Do you want to take Ohio State to win? Yeah. So what are we at? If I go- That's minus 160.

Okay. So if we put that in, that's actually almost plus 500. So this is our biggest pot of the season was. Oh, wow. Okay. Back up the trucks, call your accountant. This one feels great. That is this week's Alliance on Fandool. Check out the latest odds.

Fandool.sportsbook.com. Okay, couch money research this week is gross. Couch is getting destroyed. I knew I'd probably come in last, but I didn't think it'd be this bad. We're gonna give you the Titans, which opened at a point and a half dog to now giving two and a half at home to the Colts.

I don't like it either. All right, the next pick, let's give out Carolina plus six at home against the Falcons, the public all over Atlanta. I don't like that either because it's gross. And then the research pick is the Patriots plus seven at home against the Texans. So enjoy that one because I know it's not going to feel very good. You want details?

Fine. I drive a Ferrari, 355 Cabriolet. What's up? I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork. I have every toy you can possibly imagine. And best of all kids, I am liquid. So now you know what's possible. Let me tell you what's required.

Life Advice, the email address, send them on in gang. Life Advice, rr at gmail.com. We've got Kyle, we've got Steve, let's get right to it. This one, dry run, didn't even read it. It feels like it's an observation more, but let's go for it, it's late. 5'10", 160, my basketball compass, Clay Thompson, if he started playing pickup at 34.

I like that, I like that. Can you guys see that? Can you pitch in it? No? Okay. A lot of variables there,? Okay. Keep reading. Tonight a realtor came to my door at dinnertime and said, hello, Mr. Smith, which is not my name,

but that's really what he said? Oh, well, Jesus, that's even worse. Are you looking to sell your house in the next year? As my dog barked like a banshee, my two-year-old threw food around the kitchen. I said, probably not. He wished me a happy holidays. It's October 8th and see you next year.

As I shut the door, has anyone ever been like, yes, actually, I'm so glad you stopped by what's my house worth? Anyway, he left. I realized that I really hate people coming to my door. This includes even friendly neighbors who are dropping off fruit, but mostly realtors and solar panel salesmen. As an aside, my wife, who is a solar energy researcher, cordially engages with them, listens to their BS,

and then happily mocks them after closing the door. Man, solar panel guys listen to the pod. The last couple of weeks are just like, take it easy, dudes. I just as an aside, actually, I had a couple of weeks are just like, take it easy dudes. I just as an aside, actually I had a couple of solar guy come over a couple. You're looking into it. I had it on the old house and might on this house, listen, they're giving away for free in Connecticut. So I might as well do it, but I had a guy that got it.

Literally not nothing out of pocket. So what's up? Uh, but that's not the story. The story is the guy that came over to try to sell me on this, he was telling me the story of like on one of the canvassing things, he got like attacked by a mulled by a dog and like bit his arm, bit a leg. I was like, damn, like I didn't know what to say to that.

I'm like, all right, sorry, dude, like that's a bummer. But he was telling me kind of his life story about how that happened. And I was like, I don't know if this is making me more or less likely. Yeah, I don't know if this is gonna make me more or less likely to choose you, but like you have me thinking. I gotta be honest.

I guess I just remember this girl I was dating who was a little down on her luck. Maybe that's why she's dating me. And she was to a point where she was inquiring about solar panel. And I was like, you are going to regret this big time. And she went in and interviewed and the guys were like, just hire her. And she was like, I don't think I want to do it. They were giving off kind of creepy vibes. I was like, you do you think they were giving off creepy vibes a little bit

of the down as the old solar panel trailer. She's like, they said I'm hired. I was like, what do they pay? I was like, I wouldn't, what the fuck? I was like, you're just, it's not. And then they, once she kind of came to her senses, she's like, I'm not passionate about solar panels. I'm not passionate about the workforce.

And they gave up super creepy vibes and it sounded like they just wanted an attractive girl to be around the trailer all the time. They wouldn't stop calling her. They wouldn't, they were like, hey, yeah, right. About solar paneling. Yeah, right. Yeah, are you sure you don't want to work in this? So anyway, solar. Hey, let. About solar paneling. Yeah, right.

Yeah, are you sure you don't wanna work in this? So anyway, hey, let me just say this to clear all things up. To the real solar panel people out there, you're doing good stuff. Yeah. Yeah. So I just don't wanna be bothered at home. So I guess my question is,

shouldn't we be in a post-door knocking society? Is it unreasonable for me to expect to be left alone at my house? How do you react, deal with unwelcome solicitors at your door? My gut instinct is usually just not to answer, but given the aforementioned commotion inside my house, this always feels really awkward. Thanks for life advice. All right. Yeah.

I guess, um, they got signs for this, man. I know it doesn't look great on the front of your house, but they got signs for this. Can't do that, Kyle. You can't do that. Can't put a sign up, no solicitors. People are gonna think you're in there. It's like Halloween, you have a don't come over sign on your front door.

What are you doing? You got your shortwave radio set up in the basement? Like a weirdo. I don't think you can put a sign. What about a clever doormat? What about a doormat that basically says that, but it's not posted? Yeah, not go away, because that's almost a joke.

You're like, oh, they don't mean that, but you gotta get like maybe an oddly specific doormat. But it's not like it's on your house, you know? It's on the floor. Did you have a sign up at your house, Kyle? I'm starting to wonder. I told you my mom was a sign lady, and it was kind of embarrassing when we were in a part, but we were in apartments really.

So it wasn't, she would just put signs up for everything. Anything she was passionate about, she'd make it, order it, put it on her truck, put it on the mailbox, community mailbox. She was a big no lady. I think you're on a something though. Community? Community mailbox?

Well, we lived in an apartment. So it was like the big, you know. Yeah, but I'm saying she would put a sign up on that if it was a cause she was fighting for or just something that said, hang in there. I told you we were trapped in the back and she started a whole movement. That's true. I think you are onto something though, Kyle, real quick. What if you just did like the beware of dog sign, you know, and then people are going

to be afraid to come to your door, the dog situation, because that's like a little more believable and it's not, and then you're not being a Dick either could be true. I don't, I don't like to sign thing. I actually, maybe I disagree with the emailer. We're pretty disconnected right now as a society. People are lonelier than ever before. People aren't meeting the way that they traditionally used to meet. And if they don't meet online, it's the same, same girls, the thousands of dudes

are just trying to reach out to so now they feel like They're being rejected and there's just a lot of stuff going on right now What's wrong with a guy knocking on the door and because you know, it's not gonna fix any of that stuff Some guys trying to sell you something at your door Like that's that's not did you ever have to solution did either of you guys ever have to sell anything door-to-door? Yeah, I used to canvas for, I interned for a politician back in the day, I won't say who, but yeah, I had to go asking like,

hey, have you registered- Is he in battle now? Independent voters, it is not, and it could be surprising, it would be, but I'm not gonna say it. Damn, Greenspan? Nope, nope, but I would have to go to independent voters and be like, hey, would you consider

who you're voting for and talk to them? What the hell led you down that path? Woof, dude. A passion? I told you guys, I'd spent a lot of time in DC. I thought I wanted to get into the political game. Glad I did not. Yeah, I used to like do the, hey, rock, get out and vote thing and now I couldn't really care less.

You rocked the vote? God, you got some Danny Egan vibes to you. Well, it didn't work out well for me. So yeah, I took the LSAT and everything. I thought I was like going to DC and it's going to be a big shot. I don't know. Lobby or whatever lobbyist.

Maybe those guys make a lot of money. Glad I didn't do that. I can see it suited all the time. I could see it. Senator's assistant. So I got pretty close to the finish line with the cutco thing, but I don't know. I just saw a couple of people like selling knives

and stuff kitchen knives. And I was just like, I don't think, I don't know, doesn't sound good. I think there was some sort of like money that was coming from me too, and I was like, this doesn't sound right, and I don't know, I just, I couldn't really see myself doing that,

but I was like a teenager thinking about like door-to-door knives salesmen. It's like, you know, I think I could just do something else. I'm old enough to remember like when they had tough war parties and then when it's like Wikipedia, Britannica sales guy would come by. It was funny, like my parents- Crash the Tupperware party?

No, he came by. It was like my parents called Inquirer as like me and my sisters were getting older. And then my father was just like, you know, I think they'd leave you like A. It's like you're gonna get hooked on it, like crapped or something. I need more, yeah.

Yeah. Like, dad, I'm at Aardvark, are we ordering this thing or what? And I just, my father, my father was like, we're not doing that, it's a fucking joke, it's way too expensive for us. It's like, you know, the poor guy would, I think, stop by, follow up.

Yeah, it was just a different time. The emailer brings up a really good point. Should we be in a society where no one's ever knocking on anyone's door anymore? Because he's right. Like, has anyone ever answered the door? But see, this is kind of the old Brett Farr thing. Like, that picture had to have worked at some point

for him to think that that was a good idea ever. So I operate under the premise that all the signs that are on the most destroyed electricity pole and the worst part of town that's like, we'll buy your house for cash, somebody has to have called that number and been like, will you buy my house for cash right now? Because it can't be a zero success rate or none of it would ever work. So the guy knocking on the door, somebody, like I get called all the time on something I don't even own anymore.

And I'm thinking like, what kind of terrible, these are not the Glen Gary leads. Like what is this guy operating with to be calling me years and years removed from a transaction? Cause he just found something in some like log book. Hello, I have this number. I have the contact. Hey, do you want to sell this thing? It's like, I told the guy one time I was like, I don't even live in the country anymore, which is

obviously not true. But he was so confused, he couldn't figure it out because I got sick of the calls all the time. Should we be to the point where no one's ever knocking on the door? I think it would be approved. I think it would get a high, high approval rating. But I'd say for the guy on the other side hustling, trying to figure out if somebody wants to sell their house, somebody must say yes enough for him to continue to keep doing. You know, it feels like the cable thing, right? Like plenty of people still use cable, but they're all like in their 50s and 60s and like it's a dying thing.

I'd imagine door to door knocking, like that's probably going to be a thing that doesn't happen. Something's going to, like in the next 30 years, I'd be surprised if there was as much people like canvassing going door toto-door selling stuff that's just not like what I feel like younger people are into there already isn't as much as there was right so you're totally right there yeah because who's selling vacuums door-to-door now right that was a thing but I'm not gonna tell the door to the guy listening right now saying like stop doing it right right? Right? Yeah, right. Maybe you have a backup plan, I don't know.

I'm pro, no, don't knock on my door though, don't. I have dogs, it's a pain in the ass. Got a kid just napping sometimes. Hey, I'm not pretending, I'm just thinking about that poor encyclopedia guy who came back a second time to have my dad be like, we're not doing this. I didn't even get to charge mileage on that.

That sucks. He thought he was in, he thought he had a couple. I didn't even get to charge mileage on that. That sucks. He thought he was in, he thought he had a couple. I mean, think about it. Your families would order home encyclopedias because there was no internet. He'd be doing book reports, you know? And then he was like, you just go to the library, not paying for that.

Was right. Yeah, but that was the thing. It was like a lot of houses with the fancy kids. He'd go over and be like, do you see our catalog? Our leather bound books, yeah. You know, they come over to my place. It was like, you have the first one? Like what happened?

Like my dad changed his mind. He didn't wanna do it. I was like, yeah. Yeah. Like those, the recitals are poor. They only have the A. All right, let's see. Like those, the recitals are poor. They only have the a, uh, all right. Let's see.

We touched on this last week when Saruti, I think people listening to Surrey say that I'm off putting at first, uh, would, would make people think that it would bother me. It, it did not. But when we did the confrontation, yeah, we did the confrontation recap. Um, please have we did the confrontation. Yeah, we did the confrontation recap. Please have more Ryan confrontation stories. I hope I have zero more confrontation stories, but Saruti seems to think it's just all in the recipe.

This pass pod and the golf course stories were great. I now ask myself what would Ryan do when confronted with people like this? I think we had some followups to the Rivian truck guy, and I also think it's important to point out that I'm not big enough. I'm not at that size of a person where somebody would go, well, I'm not getting out of the car

against him, right? There's another level. And I think I'm clearly, well, I know I'm clearly under whatever that size is where it's just, I'm not messing with that person. So that's why the guy was, well, he actually never got out of the truck, but why he maybe was willing to, if I was like, yeah, get out, let's do this right before I go to the beach. This will be fun. Beach your ass and get in the water.

Yeah. Yeah. So I don't know, probably not an email there. Nevermind. Okay. Um, do we do a fantasy one? And how about this one? Successful coup at work?

God, this one's long. Say, uh, yeah, we don't have enough time for it on the taping schedule today. We're under the gun today. Just so you guys know. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. All right.

How to stop unsolicited gym advice. So we had the golf advice last week. Here's the gym advice. 32 from England, six foot four, 190 stones. Just kidding. That would be massive. 190 pounds. That's fucking great. I don't know why that was so funny. NBA comp. Kyle's laughter sometimes on these episodes makes me leave and I'm just in the best possible mood. I'm like, maybe I am funny. All right, Joakim Noah, Draymond Green, surprising rebounding stats are my size, a good vision to distribute from the high post,

but the jump shot comes and goes and defenders tend to sag off a little by the third quarter. I had a few trait or trials for the youth national team. Oh, I had a few trials for the youth national team in England as a teenager. I don't know how that translates to high school level, but I assume the British accent automatically

makes me last pick in any pickup game. Likely. That's good observation. Yeah, this guy's good. All right, not been a regular at the gym for several years, so I asked my gym going friend to estimate an added 10% squat, 220 deadlift, 260 bench, 130. Gonna have to work on those bench numbers. All right, wanted to ask Ryan, the czar of gym related disputes, for some advice on behalf of my partner.

She was at the gym yesterday doing some exercises given to her by her physio. When a 60 year old overweight guy stood right next to her facing her saying nothing. She then stopped and looked at him, but all he said was, I'm not waiting for the machine. She carried on doing her exercises, but he didn't move. He then asked, are you doing that exercise for your arms? And she told them that it was for her shoulders. You replied, ah, right. Because if it's for your arms, you need to stand

close to the machine to get the full benefit. Her physio is perfectly happy with her current form. So I don't think she needs advice to some guy who watched Pumping Iron on Netflix once. That guy sounds like he'd probably watch it more than once. What's the best way for her to shut down unsolicited gym advice or does she just need to

wear a t-shirt that says, if you don't work here, don't tell me about my form? Um, well, it sounds like she ran into a creeper. He was 60 and, uh, it's not going to happen that often. I mean, there's definitely going to be guys checking her out if she's attractive, that whole thing, but there'll probably be a little bit more clever about it and usually the more expensive the gym, the more clever the lurking becomes. So, um, I don't know, this sounds kind of like a one-off.

I thought this was going to be about you getting back to the gym and just tips in general. Being at the gym over the years, you still rarely, rarely are going to see at nicer gyms, a guy go up to a female completely unsolicited to be like, hey, let me help you with your form. Yes, I know women are gonna be listening to saying it happened to me.

Not saying it happened zero times, but it's just more often than not, people that go to the gym enough understand that. I mean, you talk about the golf part of it. This is way worse. Like the gym advice, like I'll see guys about to destroy themselves doing something wrong, and I still won't say anything for the hesitation of just, this doesn't even make any sense. The only time I've ever done it in the past was just with younger dudes who were skinny, and I'd see myself being clueless in there and not really know what I was doing, potentially

hurting myself long-term by just being stupid and not what's going on. So that's the only time I'll ever step in like a younger dude where I'll be like, Hey dude, let me just, you know, walk you through a thing or two here. So look, it's such, it seems like such a one-off guys. I don't really know that it's worth really dissecting. Yeah. I wouldn't dissect that part, but since we just, that last episode, we were talking about golf and how I'm into golf tips, completely feel the opposite about gym tips because golf is like this mystery thing. It's like, I'm doing it and it's not even remotely what it's supposed to look like. And that's like, you know, there's a real like art to it.

Not saying that it's not for weightlifting or whatever, but it's like, I don't know, it's just a way easier to grasp the concept of weightlifting. So I don't know, it's just more offensive for somebody to be like, you look like you're fucking lost here, pal, than it is at golf where most people that I'm around are like, I just can't figure it out. So I just think I feel completely opposite the way I welcome golf tips. I would not be interested in somebody stopping me in the middle of my thing and be like, hey, hey, let me just tell you, unless I'm actually like, you know, gonna hurt myself.

Yeah, under no circumstance should you be giving anyone advice at the gym, unless like they're on the verge of physically harming other people at the gym. Leave people alone, I think is mostly, I mean, at least in golf, you know, like you're locked into a foursome, like you have to talk, like there's gonna be small talk if you're locked into a foursome. You have to talk.

There's going to be small talk if you don't know the people. It'd be weird if you didn't say anything. So there's going to be some interaction. You don't have to interact with anyone at the gym. Put the headphones on, get in, get out. If you have a partner, that's great. This isn't a thing where, hey, I'm going to go find my buddy at the gym today or I'm going to go correct people.

It reminds me of those, I forget, it's the insurance commercial where they talk about becoming your parents and it's like- The general? That person, not the general, that person has green hair. That's really good, yeah. Just leave it alone. You don't have to say anything about it. Just leave it alone.

You don't have to acknowledge it. It's fine. But this is that situation. Just because somebody's doing something you don't think is right, if it's not harming anybody, leave them alone. Don't acknowledge it. It's fine. Side note, they really have struck gold

with those commercials. It's hard to find like a non-stupid, good concept of commercials. And I just, I think they've nailed it. Good job by those people. You could also just, with the earbuds in, once you see, cause like a lot of this stuff, it's not solved, but it's just going,

you ran into a bad one that day. That guy's got to touch us something. He's got to touch us something, whether he's mad at the world, or he's just not maybe processing things, he can remember birthdays. I would say, why not touch your earbud and really loudly be like, I'm on a call. Just be so obnoxious to that person. I'm on a call. And they deserve that. They deserve you being absurd and making up something

because the guy standing there, I don't think he would have done that to a guy. I don't think he would have done that to a guy, whether it's his own misogynistic, I'm just gonna be an asshole guy thing, or it's him being like, I wanna stand closer to this girl on all these different things.

But I strike first, strike hard on everything. That's kinda how I look at it. Just why? Where's the lip-buy? Yeah, why even discuss it? Why even email us? Just be like, hey, get away from me, fatso. No, I mean, I'm not making fun of fat people,

but just whatever, like just really cutting stuff. Do you wanna get weird? All right, let's get weird. It solves it. I like the meeting thing. In this day and age, I like the meeting thing. Who knows when you're in a meeting or not? That's totally better than be like, what?

Sorry. Just like, I'm actually in a meeting. It's awesome. This is the new world. This is the new world. Everyone could be in a meeting. Great life. Then he looks at the phone,

he sees the Spotify video of Dua Lipa. Yeah. It's called multitasking, dude, figure it out. Yeah, I'm on with her. She has a huge food benefit. All right, that'll do it for the show today. Thank you to Wargon, thank you to Kyle, thank you to Saruti, check out our YouTube page

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