The Ryen Russillo Podcast - The Knicks' Epic Collapse, MVP-Voter Face-Off, and the Free Throw Merchant Debate With Howard Beck

Episode Date: May 22, 2025

Russillo starts the show with a deep dive into the Pacers' improbable comeback (1:22). Then, he’s joined by Howard Beck to learn what it was like inside MSG last night, debate whether Shai Gilgeous-Alexander deserved to win MVP, and have a conversation about players drawing fouls (21:27). Plus, Life Advice with Kyle (1:09:25)! How do I stop my boss from ordering for me when we go out to eat? Check us out on YouTube for exclusive clips, livestreams, and more at https://www.youtube.com/@RyenRussilloPodcast. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Host: Ryen Russillo Guest: Howard Beck Producers: Steve Ceruti, Kyle Crichton, Mike Wargon, and Jonathan Frias Shopping. Streaming. Savings. It’s on Prime. Visit Amazon.com/prime to get more out of whatever you’re into. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You're listening to the Ryan Russo podcast presented by Fandul. America's number one sportsbook has made it easier than ever to get in on the action during an NBA playoff game. Even after tip-off, just look for the live SGP tab on the Fandul Sportsbook app and build your bet slip. Then sit back, relax, and track the outcome of your parlay right in the app. And if you don't already have it, download the Fandul app today to make every moment more. The ringer is committed to responsible gaming. And if you don't already have it, download the FanDuel app today to make every moment more. The ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available.

And listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Must be 21 and older and present in select states. Gambling problem? Call 100 Gambler or visit rg-help.com. And all time, game one come back by the Indiana Pacers. I'm going to run through the game and run through the Niesmith 3s. I'm going to point to some things that I actually like for the Knicks and then we're going to talk to a man that was in the building, Howard Beck, his thoughts on the game, what this means for the rest of the series.

A couple of really good stories in there, his thoughts on the Western Conference finals. We both have MVP votes. We both voted for different players. We'll talk about that and the free throw concern that is out there in the streets. And we've got life advice. What's better than a well-marbled ribeye

sizzling on the barbecue? A well-marbled ribeye sizzling on the barbecue? A well-marbled ribeye sizzling on the barbecue that was carefully selected by an Instacart shopper and delivered to your door. A well-marbled ribeye you ordered without even leaving the kiddie pool. Whatever groceries your summer calls for, Instacart has you covered. Download the Instacart app and enjoy $0 delivery fees on your first three orders. Service fees, exclusions, and terms apply. Instacart, groceries that over-deliver. Rarly. Will, I watched a game like last night and know that I've watched it like all of

you. I imagine most of you watched the Pacers win against the Knicks at MSG and over time, and then get up the next day and read about the game. And then I went back and watched a bunch of the late possessions. And throughout the course of reading about it and seeing where this comeback stands historically and actually watching the plays and thinking. The Pacers might still lose this game. Even though I watched it last night and already know that they didn't lose the game, that they won in this incredible fashion, something the Pacers are making a habit of

here in the 25 playoffs. So to put this Pacers comeback into perspective, and we just got flooded with these facts, so I'll give you a few from last night down 14 or more points with 250 left in regulation teams were 977 and zero, 977 and zero. Now there's a one down nine plus points in the last minute of regulation minute of regulation or OT since I believe 1998 teams were 1,414 and zero. And now that is a one. Neesmith hit six threes in the fourth quarter of a playoff game.

That had never been done. And he hit all six of them with 447 left to go in the game. His first three of the fourth quarter again, uh, at 447 left to go in the game. His first three of the fourth quarter, again, uh, at 447 left. That was his first three point make since 457 was left in the second quarter. So he basically went two full quarters of game action without even making one and then make six of them. So if we go to the end of the game first, because there's a few things from this game that I want to kind of look at like the series

and not just the result of last night, some of the thoughts that I had about how this matchup might go, if we look at all six of the threes, look, I shut down. I wasn't playing, but the Knicks shut down. And honestly, I don't really blame them because it's like all of these things that I'm going to run through here. You're like, okay, we're actually not going to lose this. Like, oh, that guy made another one. Whatever. And we've got this and look, the Knicks just did not play with the crispness, the intensity,

the intent that you would expect, which is part of why we have some of these results every now and then as human nature kicks in and you just don't think if you're on the Knicks that you're actually going to lose this game, you think this thing's a wrap. So at 1 13 98, uh, the first three for knee Smith Brunson gets caught on a screen and it was actually really interesting the way they ran this play cause Halliburton had the ball but then they set something for Neesmith to get to the top

of the key and Cat should probably have come over but Cat's already thinking about Halliburton with the basketball. So this one wasn't really like a blame on anybody. It was just nice that they ran some other thing once they had Halliburton with the ball going to a side where it looks like he's gonna attack Kat and try to figure out what he wants to do,

get him caught in some kind of a switch. But really what they were doing was having Neesmith come underneath it. And then Brunson gets caught and then there's no help off of that. And it was just mass confusion. It's just this little simple thing and extra little wrinkle, believe it or not.

And that's the first three. All right, no problem. How about the second three? Down 116, 102, 323 left. They screened Bridges, Cat is late. You know, he's gonna be late on some of these. He's a big guy. And you could make an argument at this point

when they're down 14 and there's less than three and a half minutes to go, drive them off. There should have been contests to drive the shooters, in this case, Neesmith off of the three point line. Like I don't care if he blows by me, but I need to get a contest. And again, cat was late there. Neesmith three, number three down one 19, one Oh eight to 11 left. Uh, this was a scramble.

He was wide open on the side. That one to me wasn't necessarily on anybody. Brunson was trailing him late, but it was kind of one of those weird scramble things. Number four, down 121, 112 at this point with 53 seconds left. Watching it this morning, I'm like, they lost this game. There was a little bit of a dribble handoff to the left side.

OG was late. He was late on that one. Number five, they're down 123, 115, 36 seconds left. Nie Smith basically gets screened. Nie Smith is working on a screen here where like, Kat is screened. Cause it's a part of the game where like, Kat ends up with Nie Smith, all right?

So Kat gets screened off of Neesmith. OG's like five feet below the three point line, but Neesmith's like five feet beyond the top of the three point line. So I could sit here and be like, OG's gonna do better there. Neesmith's pulling up from 30 feet here. So that's one of those where it's like,

sure, me watching this morning like oh you should have done this this and this. It's like yeah, Nie Smith should have also missed that one. Number six, it's 1.23, 1.18, 24 seconds left. There's a down screen Nie Smith left corner coming up against Hart. Hart actually gets around the screen but he stumbles after that and so on this one it's not so much to contest, it's that Hart stumbles and Neesmith hits another beauty here. So that's 18 points for you. And he also had a couple free throws.

So looking at that, when the team is still up two with 22 seconds left after that, make New York misses two free throws, OG missed one, Cat missed one, Neesmith had made two. And then you have the Halliburton shot, where again, like everybody, we thought it was the game winning three, and it was a tie, and then they had to do this thing

all over again, and the Knicks actually early on had like a nice stretch in overtime, like they're going to survive this, and maybe we'll forget about the Neesmith threes. Maybe we'll forget about the Halliburton shot. We won't forget about the choke sign, because that thing would have been mean to death. If I send you this, it means I thought I was finished. Right.

I don't even know if that works. You can let your kids know. Um, so look a couple of things here. When the Pacers were up 138, 135 and overtime, Carlisle did not want to fall. And, uh, I'm going to give Stan Van Gundy credit on two things that he mentioned, uh, in the broadcast last night. One was that he's like, you know, he doesn't always like to foul in this spot. So that's a coach who was coached against Carlisle, knowing the tendency of the opponent there and using that kind of like Ulysses S.

Grant also pronounced Ulysses S. Grant. Um, so the Knicks got off two really good looks. The Brunson look is contested on the left side, but they were like, all right. I couldn't believe it. I was like, you went through all this, you did all this work and you're not gonna foul now. Brunson gets a shot off. I can understand like a little bit of a hesitation

knowing Brunson and how crafty he is of not wanting to rush to foul him. I still think the move is to just sprint like you're fouling the guy and then let him think he's going to get the shot off. And then he takes some horrible three and then you just pull back. Psych. Off of that Brunson miss, offensive rebound and

Cat got a great look. I actually thought that one was going in. It did not. Game over. Fourth quarter. I'm going to go back to the fourth quarter here. At 10.05 of the fourth quarter, New York is up 95, or excuse me, 94, 92. Brunson had committed his fifth foul. All right. And so Brunson actually committed it at 94, 91, 94, 92 was the first, I think TJ McConnell free throw. So it's 94, 92 and Brunson is out of the game. And I'm thinking, all right, this is where the Pacers have a chance. We even had the mic'd up audio of Halliburton saying, Hey, the non Brunson minutes got to win these non Brunson minutes. I mean, all that stuff sounds really good.

But it doesn't mean it's like, hey, yeah, now let's play hard. So I'm thinking this is, this is the Pacers chance here. They're right in this game. It's the fourth quarter. It's back and forth. At that point, like I probably liked what New York was doing consistently more than what the Pacers are doing. And I'm talking offensively. But I'm thinking, all right, no Brunson. It changes a lot of stuff, right? It changes what five guys have to think about on the floor defensively here. And so this should be a little bit of an easier stretch and maybe that effort will be paid off on the offensive side here for the Pacers. But a funny thing happened. The Knicks went on a 14-0 run. OG immediately a quick five points. Cat gets fouled on a three.

After Miles McBride was fouled on a three, I think they ended up getting five of those six free throw points. And so this stretch where I'm thinking, this is the Pacers chance, they give up a 14-0 run to New York in two and a half minutes all while Brunson is watching. He didn't come back until like five minutes.

So that's when I'm like, all right, the Pacers lost. This will be where the Pacers, if I was, you know, again, writing this for a paper, that would have been something I focused on there. This moment that you thought was just handed to you on a platter, you did nothing with it and then kept fouling from the three point line on top of all the other makes and the offense that wasn't clicking for you at that time. Some thoughts on Siakam. Last night's game is why I'm not the biggest Siakam fan.

I know, you know, you're going to wake up today and see that in the box score. It says he had 17 points. He had, I think, six assists. There was a few there from Neesmith, who was just handing him a basketball and he was hitting threes. But yeah, 17 points on seven of 16 shooting. Hey Ry, what's the problem? I counted two shots that he got on his own.

Like a couple were layups. One was underneath the basket where no one was defending him. But it seemed like it took forever for him to actually initiate offense on his own. Was a complete non-factor. And that's the thing with him sometimes in playoff games, where I've noticed it before. He got a post up against Mikhail Bridges, then he hit a post on a switch against Miles McBride. He were like, if he doesn't take this shot against Miles McBride in the post, granted, Miles rejected him at the too, on that other dunk. It really wasn't until the end one where they were down 14 where it felt

like he was actually taking some initiative on his own with the ball. He'll likely have a really good game in this series at some point, but I need to see more offensive initiative with him and you know, there's times where they need it. Halliburton can't do it all.

Nemhart wasn't really much can't do it all. Nemhart wasn't really much of a factor at all. He'll probably have a really big game because that's kind of who he is. Matheran, I mean he was kind of like, I love Matheran, but he had a hard time like remembering any Matheran moments. Many offensive Matheran moments from last night.

So look, he also took zero shots, meaning Siakam here in overtime. The funny thing is on the overtime position where Toppin got the tip back dunk on the offensive rebound, Siakam not shooting there led to this. And I think that was the other part when I thought about Siakam's game last night that was alarming overall.

Nemhart drives left side, corner pass to Siakam, right corner scheme last night. That was alarming overall. Nemhart drives left side corner past the Siakam right corner, wide open. That's the play. OG was playing off of the corner to help on the Nemhart drive. Siakam has a very clean look at it.

He does not want to shoot. He swings it to knee Smith, who then swings it to Halliburton. Halliburton takes the three. What's crazy about top and even being able to grab this rebound against Mitchell Robinson, all people is that Mitchell at some point sees Halliburton at the top as they rotated the basketball.

Everybody's scrambling defensively here. Mitchell has like the it's like an endearing thought he's on the block. Sees Halliburton and then takes a step towards Halliburton as if he thinks he can cover 24 feet and contest whatever it is that Halliburton is going to do. Like his heart was in the right place. The problem is, is he kind of even has this moment of like, what am I doing? And in that movement and then hesitation, he allows the lane for Toppin to get in there and get that dunk, which was huge. Cause at that point, you know, it's a one point game. New York was up 133, 132.

Miles Turner, he's a problem on defense for the Pacers. We ask, and I've talked about it, what we ask the centers to do now in this like contest, no, do you drop off the screen? You have to like trail and stay in front of the ball handler, but you also have to defend the lob depending on what their center is capable of doing. If he's not a shooter and he's just diving down, you know, it's just, it's a lot to ask of these guys. Having said that Turner looks like he's in cement on some of these plays. I mean, it's, it's bad. If you don't believe me, ask where Carlisle,

because he took him out with 718 to go in the fourth quarter and then really wasn't back in the game until it was some of the sub in for offense, sub out for defense stuff. He also took him out with 224 to go in overtime. The Knicks should feel good about Turner defensively. The Pacers used four defenders that I counted. Maybe there's a couple other possessions, miscellaneous stuff against Brunson defensively. It's Neesmith, it's Mather, and it's TJ McConnell. The Ben Shepard minutes were brutal last night for Ben Shepard. Van Gundy did call that. He was like, I think he was trying to be nice. He's like, I'm surprised. Shepard does not meet Brunson with the same physicality as the other three guys do. And I know, you know, look, it's always the concern.

It's the free throw stuff, but Shepard is just inviting him in on the drive. Thomas Bryan had one of those against Brunson as well, where it's like, hey, I'd almost rather you just stop and make him have to go around you as opposed to you just retreating and matching his straight line drive stuff with that. So that's something I'll look for there again, because I too, Stan, was shocked that Carlisle didn't pull the plug on the Shepard on Brunson matchup. Brunson and Catt combined for 78 points. This is in Boston's defense so they got to feel pretty good about this. Now look, in closing here, I don't know what this is going to mean for New York.

I think a weaker team would devastate it. It's a lot to say about professionals. We're talking about the conference finals. It means they've probably done some pretty good things to even be here in the first place, but, uh, man, maybe a weaker team, we'd look back at this result and go up that's where it ended for them in their 25 playoff run. I don't think the Knicks are a weak team. Um, I don't. So, you know, who knows if they had won it over time, we, do we forget the knee Smith threes?

Uh, probably. Yeah. Who knows if they had won it overtime? We do we forget the knee Smith threes? Probably yeah, I mean, cause if you look at the film today, you look at those knee Smith possessions and you're just like, you know, dammit. Like can we get one contest on these? And he's as he was making them last night. I'm sitting there going like,

well, this is cute. It's like oh, he made another one. Yeah, look, I thought that game was over. I'm sure a lot of you did as well. But now the Knicks, if you want to talk motivation, they're going to have a painful reminder to not let up. And that reminder should be able to carry them through. I'm not saying necessarily they're going to win this series.

I picked the Pacers. I thought this was a coin toss series, but there should be a reminder in those tense moments, maybe you're up six or eight in one of these other games where there can be no let up. I mean, you can say that, you can think that and be like, hey, we never let up, but you know how people can be. You just had this result. So that should be in the back of their heads throughout the rest of the 25 playoffs. And if they lose this series, this is going to be a lesson that's not just going to stay with them as a basketball team.

Like it's going to be one of those results. It will be a lesson that will stay with them for a really long time because the Pacers are nine and two now in the playoffs and three of those nine wins to run through the scenarios again. Game five against Milwaukee down 118 111 with 35 seconds left. Won the game game two against Cleveland down 118 111 with 35 seconds left won the game. Game two against Cleveland down 119 112 with 47 seconds left won that game. And of course, last night pick which, which lead that was blown.

You want to have here. How about down 121 112 again, just over 52 seconds left. And they've won all three of these. I was reading something this morning about this next team and it said, you know, again, the positives and there are some positives from last night you know we shouldn't ignore the positives because we're talking about a series now and not just the result of game one but that the Knicks should feel good because they're the better team they're the better team that's totally yeah all right that's fine but I remember saying that when the

Celtics are down 2-0. FanDuel's turning your bets into bigger wins with a parlay profit boost. That's right, build the same game parlay or parlay, and you can boost your winnings by 30% with a profit boost. You pick the teams, player stats, all of it. FanDuel just adds a little fuel to the fire. Okay, let's take a look at the board. Minnesota still getting seven and a half points in game two. Honestly, this game one off the game seven previous series thing,

that's always a pretty good way of looking at things that has not worked out this year. Huh? And it did not work out in game one. I felt like Minnesota was in it and then they weren't and they missed a million shots. And there's a bunch of stuff we could point to in that game. I think defensively the approach against SGA alarming the ease with which he got downhill as opposed to how Denver with less talented defenders again going to some of that zone stuff that we've been talking about all week. So here's what I'm thinking about doing. Divincenzo did hit his two or more threes. He consistently is getting great looks throughout the playoffs and he's not making enough of them

even though he did get, I think, three in that game in game one. So we're going Divincenzo threes. I don't like going first basket, but if you want to make this really spicy, we go Chet Holmgren first basket. My guess would be the first play's not gonna be an SGA thing.

So it could be an SGA drive and then kick to check the corner. I don't know. Jalen Williams, 19 points in game one. He has certainly hit 20 multiple times throughout the playoffs here. 18 shots for him, only two from three, only four free throw attempts, but he's gone for 26 times in the playoffs, including game seven against Denver where he had 24.

So if we want to build this thing out, we could go, hey, DiVincenzo two or more made threes, Jaylen Williams 20 plus points. I'm just a little freaked out on the seven and a half again. I'm tempted to take the seven and a half and go with Minnesota. Um, more so than the laying the seven and a half points. That's always kind of the way that I go. So if you go Moneyline here, Oklahoma city, Devenchenzo, Jane Williams, Oklahoma city, that's plus one 95. Now, if you take out, well, actually let's just put it back in.

Let's put in the first basket thing, even though I usually would hesitate, um, to do this and I'm talking first basket thing, even though I usually would hesitate to do this. And I'm talking first basket of the game, Chet's 550, he's plus 250 for OKC. So let's do that. Let's go plus 250 OKC. That's paying out at plus 918. Again, the safer, the more fun one.

So you can be in at the entire time and not be out of the game 45 seconds into tip. Deven Shenzeth, two or more threes. Jaylen Williams, 20 more points. Oklahoma City, money line. So really it's a better way of betting OKC on the money line by adding into things that I think are well within reach.

So that's how we're looking at tonight's game two. Whether you're betting three pointers, home runs, goals, or birdies, FanDuel's got markets across every sport and every game. And the best part, when you win, you'll get paid instantly. So go check it out. Fandual's where the parlay gets paid even bigger. Head to Fandual.com slash Orion RYE to get started. Fandual, America's number one sports book, must be 21 and older and present in select states or 18 plus and present in DC. Optum required. Bonus issued as non-retributable profit boost tokens

restrictions apply including any token expiration and max wager amount. See terms at sportsbook.fandal.com gambling problem call 100 gambler visit rg-help.com Howard Beck was in the building. He has a piece up right now on the ringer talking about the chaos era of the NBA. And considering we had a result like we did last night, perfect time to have him on. Good to see you. Good to see you. It's nice to be right occasionally about stuff.

It's nice to write the word chaos and big ass type right before we get more chaos in the NBA. I love it. Yeah. Look, I mean, this is one of the all timers, much like Reggie Miller, I know exactly where I was when he did what he did in just about eight seconds against the Knicks. And of course, there's that huge fourth quarter game that was in the series where New York was able to come back from that. So I think there's some themes here, some resiliency, but just to kind of put it in a perspective,

to be one of the lucky few that were in the building last night to see this. Because as I had said in the open, like I was watching it happen going, okay, but this isn't actually going to happen. Then you have the Halliburton shot, then you have overtime, which is still really competitive. But at what moment was peak insanity inside of MSG? So one of the things that hit me, by the way, is that I've gotten to see some really incredible moments, right? Like I was there for Derek Fisher's point four, which was preceded by Tim Duncan hitting in a crazy shot that was literally right in front of us when we were sitting courtside.

He's falling to his left toward us. We thought that game was over. Fish hits the point four. There's a whole other story there involving me and a career turn in that same span of time. So I thought of that and I thought of like Robert O'Reilly hitting his three after Vlade Divac just tip out in the Western Conference finals in 2002. Like I've just seen some stuff that just blows your mind where you just can't process it

and you're almost laughing. Like what the hell just happened? Ryan last night with about four minutes to go in regulation and it looking like the Knicks had this thing under control, the press seating for most of us is up in this auxiliary area that's referred to as the chase bridge. When you see the perspective of where the TNT inside the NBA crew was way, way up there, that's about the same level as where we were. It takes a while to get down to the press room and then down one more level to get to where the locker rooms and the press conferences are. So

a lot of us and our buddy, Zach Lowe mentioned this without naming names in a tweet last night. We'd all cleared out. I'd gone down because if you don't leave your seat and you wait for the buzzer, and especially if it's a Knicks win and Knicks fans are just like fucking Partying in the stairwells and everything else. It can take you a long time to get down I thought I was doing the smart thing as a seasoned journalist who's covered this league for 28 years and made my way down I'm now in the press room in the press work room Rachel Nichols Chris Mannix a bunch of us are sitting there James Herbert I'm trying to remember who else we'd all come down and we're watching as the final minutes of regulation are ticking away and Halliburton hits that shot.

So the roar, the other thing that happens here is you're in the press room, you can hear inside the bull, you can hear the TV separately because it's a few seconds behind. So what happens is you get this double explosion. If it's a Knicks great, something great just happened, you know, it's about to happen on the TV because it's a big roar. If something terrible just happened to the Knicks, you were hearing the, uh, or just the air go out. So you hear the air go out before the air

goes out in front of us on the TV. But when Halliburton hits it, we all thought as he did that it was a three. So even the press room where we are pretty self contained, no cheering in the press box, everything else, but somebody hits a shot like that. It's the same thing the human reaction for us as anybody else like, oh, and we're all like the whole press room just went oh, like it didn't matter like where people were from. It was just like, holy shit. And you thought it was over. Zarbah goes to the

monitor. Wait a minute, what? And then, yeah, real quickly, like the TNT was right on top of it, and the show, you know, his toes on the line. Oh my God, he threw up the choke sign. It is not over. Eee. Um, so there's a lot of, like, the same thing you're going through on your couch was basically what we were going through in the press room,

and the shame of it, of course, is that I was in the fucking press room watching it on a monitor when I had 10 feet away from the fucking bowl because I walked the three flights down from the chase bridge trying to beat the foot traffic. Yeah, so then I watched the rest of overtime from the press room. It wasn't worth going all the way back up. But incredible, insane. One of the most amazing shots I've ever seen. And by the way, wasn't it just like three weeks ago that Aaron Gordon threw down the dunk at the buzzer in a sequence that we've never seen. So we are like the fact that any given night we are still seeing things that you and I, having watched this league for decades, that there are still things we can go, I've never seen that exact thing before versions of maybe, but holy crap. Like I still, I was trying, I was going through as many replays as I could this

morning of everything, just trying to, to get my brain right. But, um, wow, insane. What did Halliburton say to you after acknowledging, throwing up the choke sign as an homage to Reggie Miller, but then realizing, okay, I have to, because in that moment I'm thinking, all right, they just spent 10 seconds, 15 seconds just emotionally unloading. And then it's like, no, now you need to mentally reset and get ready back for this deal with overtime and you're still on the road. And then it's like, no, now you need to mentally reset and get ready back for this deal with overtime and you're still on the road.

Like playing that, I mean, I know Halliburton has a lot of fun, he's got a big personality, but there had to be some moment where he's thinking this thing's gonna live in infamy if we don't pull this thing off. So I'm in New York, of course, and I'm surrounded by Knicks fans. And I have a lot of friends who are very big Knicks fans

and they fucking hate Tyrese Halliburton and they have for years already, predating last night, obviously, predating whatever happened in the playoffs last year with him. There are some people around the league, fans in general who just don't like his swagger in general, just like he's, the guy's got some showmanship in him and just like with tray young that can that can go you know cut both ways. And i'm one of the things i have loved about halibut from even back when he was in sacramento like i like this game anyway but i like the way he carries himself i enjoy that and i also enjoy the guys who don't mind showing some personality so to the point of the choke thing. Pre fucking audacious, period. And the potential for that to have just backfired on him was huge.

One of the things I appreciate about Halliburton is that I think he would have handled this the same way either way, win or loss. It was easier in the win, naturally. But when he was asked, I can't remember who actually asked him the question about like, it's a joke sign, but well, you didn't win. He was like smiling and like, yeah, like admitted, like, yeah, maybe you know, that could have backfired basically, I can't remember what his exact quote was. And then he referred to something called aura farming. You and I are the same generation. So I don't know if that threw you it threw me I had no idea what the hell he had just said. I didn't know until I saw somebody had transcribed it because I didn it threw me I had no idea what the hell he had just said. I didn't know until I saw somebody had transcribed it because I didn't know what I had heard. Then I had to go look it up.

I'm sorry, folks. I'm old. I am like, what can I say? Like I he didn't want to be accused of aura farming by doing it or then having to maybe do it again. So he can't break it out again, because then it looks like you're trying to be cool and you're trying to cultivate something. I don't know. I have never farmed an aura. I have no aura to farm because I'm cooked. But I love that he met that question and that concern with just a little bit of humility, like, yeah, uh, you know, maybe, maybe too soon, maybe the wrong moment, but who could blame him? It looked like a three, by the way, he had driven into the lane and turned around and came back out. Like even that part of it, which gets lost amid all of this, because

there's a whole other time after like, and I don't think he was asked about that part. Like there's, there's just so much that happened. But, um, Halliburton being a garden villain is awesome. Halliburton being a garden villain who counts Reggie as a mentor, who he texts with daily. He told me this last year when I asked about it, cause he came to the coo when they closed out the Knicks and game seven last year, Halliburton came to the press conference with a t-shirt on with Reggie's choke. And that seemed very intentional of course. And he said it that night and he probably said it before. They text daily. So that he counts him as a mentor,

that he's carrying on this legacy in so many different ways. They're very different players, but even the Knicks killer aspect of it, garden moments, garden villain. This is awesome. Like we don't have rivalries anymore. There's just not enough of this going on. And as somebody whose early career for me was a lot of Shaq and Kobe, and Shaq playing it up and saying that NBA stands for nothing but actors. And that it's all you know, Shaq would just say he would say all the time, it's all just marketing, brother. Like the he would, he loved stirring it up. Sorry, it's a terrible Shaq impression. Apologies to Shaquille. But he loved to play it up. He loved getting into that stuff.

Halliburton's got that spirit of like the 90s and early 2000s where it's like, yeah, the game is the game but the showmanship matters. And it's actually kind of cool if we're all pissed off at each other a little. Okay, first of all, not the worst Shaq I've ever heard because Van Pelt and I years and years ago interviewed Dwight Howard and he basically just did a Shaq impersonation for seven minutes, eight minutes for this phoner that we did for the radio show and it was

so bad we just didn't even run it, which is insane to think of the time you're like a top five NBA player, the rarity that you can get those guys on. And then we taped it before the show and we looked at each other and it's like, was he just doing Shaq for eight minutes? And then we were like, I think that's almost unrunnable. And they're like, Dwight, like we can't run up like a, you know, he's in an MVP conversation. I was like, it's really bad.

It's a bad interview. The problem is Dwight was doing some aura farming. That's the problem. See, good use of that. Good use of that. I get the Halliburton part of, if I wanted to try to think of something like, there was a coolness to Kobe, right?

There's a coolness to MJ. And I think Ant, whatever that prime coolness is, he has that. Where Halliburton feels a bit more like Carlton, where if Carlton, like an NBA player, and I look, and I'm, I'll just give you an aside. I don't know that I've, I think I shared this once. I'm a Halliburton fan for something that he did for me personally. My father went to a Celtics game.

Um, and he went by himself and he was, you know, where we live. So getting to the hospital isn't always the easiest thing and it's not the most convenient. So I was a little pissed that he ended up at the hospital by himself. And since he was stuck in Boston for two days dealing with something, I got him a Celtics ticket. And so because he was by himself, it was a good ticket and whatever his ticket was, he kind of had like access and he was by himself, it was a good ticket. And whatever his ticket was, he kind of had like access and he was right near the Pacers bench and my dad's really tall, he played basketball. And so he ended up talking with Halliburton for like 15 minutes after the game

was over. And Halliburton like legitimately engaged him, not just, hey, nice to meet you, whatever. Like they talked, he asked my dad if he had played and the whole thing. And so then my dad sends me a picture of he and Halliburton. Like Halliburton took my dad's phone, handed it to a fan and then said, hey, let me take a picture with this guy. And then my dad sent it to me. And I was really like kind of blown away to think of like today's NBA players of just taking the time out of doing that.

And I didn't think he knew, you know, I don't even know if he would care if he knew that it was my dad or something like that. So I think there's a, you know, my biggest thing on your personality is if it's at least genuine, I'm gonna probably like it. Because at least I would rather just know who you are. And the clear lesson in all of this,

regardless of what happens with Halliburton last night, is there's this, we try to find these players,urton last night, is there's this, you know, we try to find these players, especially in the sport, when it's all on you and you have to have this confidence that you think you're going to succeed every single time. And some people wear that confidence in a very forward way, where sometimes I think we overrate players because they're so intentional about proving to you that they're the man in these big moments where it doesn't even matter if the shot goes in,

it just matters that they took it. And they're excited to say, hey, that that's on me. There's a belief that this guy has, again, we're talking about Halliburton, there's a belief that this guy has that is just off the charts. And he has some of the results to also show some of this in a very short span, at least alone here in the playoffs.

So let's talk about some good Knicks things here too, because as absurd as that game is, and maybe again, you can go wherever you want with this, I felt like this morning watching some of it again, I'm like the Knicks actually have to feel like, okay, one, we don't have to play against that Celtics defense anymore. There were some things that I think defensively are actually alarming here for the Pacers and for all the confidence and swagger that clearly the

Pacers have right now led by Halliburton, I think this kind of result would really, I don't know, devastates the right word, but the best way to put it is, I think this Knicks team is a very tough and resilient team and I would not expect them to be shattered emotionally by something as bad as it was last night. No, listen, the thing we learned about this version of the Knicks a year ago, when bodies are just dropping left and right

and it's just a war of attrition and they finally succumb in a game seven where Brunson goes out and they, you know, OG and Anobia had come in to make like a two second appearance and they had no Randall and I think no Mitchell Robinson. Like the amount of fight in the Knicks, that was their personality and that was what was so endearing or engaging, admirable about them a year ago. And I wondered if it would last when they swapped out, not directly, but you lose Hartenstein and you trade DiVincenzo and Randall to get Kat and you get Mikhail Bridges. And there were moments this season where it didn't look like they had that same kind of indomitable will. Like the defense had slipped,

like it was exactly what you would expect on paper almost. You swapped out some defensive guys for some offensive guys and oh hey look you're better offensively and you slip defensively. Like exactly what you would expect but you hope that the resiliency is still there and I think that that's embodied mostly by Brunson and Hart who were still there so you know and Ananobe to an extent so that's that's that's fine but there have been times in this postseason or she's been there were times earlier in this season where it didn't look like it was there.

And then you saw in the Celtic series, like coming back from 20 down and back to back games, everything they did in that series is like, no, these guys are fucking tough as hell. They are resilient as hell. They're not daunted by anything. I saw some of the Pacers press conferences last night post game.

I missed the Knicks press conferences, so I don't know exactly what Brunson and company said, but my guess is that they, especially Brunson probably looked and sounded exactly as he always does, because he's pretty monotone anyway in these pressers. It's a game one at home, you lose home court advantage in a pretty devastating and dramatic fashion, but I don't think that this is going to be the kind of thing where like the Knicks just like collapse from here.

Like hell no, that's not who they are at all. And I do think that there's a lot for them to walk away feeling pretty good about, including the fact that, you know, Kat had a pretty dominant game. There was some gaffs late, but like he had a pretty dominant dominant game brunson at a pretty damn good game. But i think both teams could walk away feeling like this thing you know a correction here there like how many paces. Mrs at the rim where they're in the first half alone it felt like or even just a regulation seem like the mr at the rim. The next of mist free throws. There's just like a lot of little things that this turned on. I think the Pacers do have to concern themselves with how to defend Kat going forward. I don't, aside from the obvious, which is the Pacers can walk away

feeling really good about stealing home court advantage and in such a wild fashion, I'm not sure that either team can walk away feeling like there's any conclusions to draw about how the rest of this series is gonna go. Is there anything you think the Pacers provide, maybe other than the obvious, what you think? I mean, there's even some stuff in the win that I'd mentioned in the open where I was like, I don't know that I like this from the Pacers moving forward. Do you see something that the Pacers do in particular

that you think is a problem for New York? I don't know if there's anything they do that's a problem for New York? I don't know that there's anything they do that's a problem for New York specifically. The thing that I've admired about the way the Pacers play, offensively in particular, is like this is a very high ball movement team, right? It's a very unselfish team. And I think to the extent that the Knicks

were so so defensively in the regular season, but were stronger so far in the playoffs, it's been against a Pistons team and a Celtics team that both tended to be a little bit more static in their offense. And I think it was easier to kind of like, all right, we're going to hone in on Cade Cunningham. We're going to hone in on Jason Tatum until he went down. Like there's not as, they don't keep you off balance the way that the Pacers do. And I think that the Pacers pace, um, you know, the tempo that they play with, how quickly they get up and down the court, um, and their ball movement. So I do wonder, like this is, we don't have some major age gap. I don't want to make it sound like the Knicks are an old team.

They're not, they may be old relative to the Pacers. I haven't looked at the average ages, but like the Pacers could wear you down on an every other day series. The Knicks don't normally play at that pace and they're having to match it. And what are the Pacers made their first nine shots or whatever it was last night? It was just insane. I think if there's anything it's broadly, it would be that can the Knicks play at the Pacers pace? It sounds ridiculous

to say Pacers pace. Um, and, and with all that ball movement, um, and having to defend multiple actions every time, is that going to, to wear on the Knicks at all? Yeah, there were some similarities at least. And again, New York already understands this that typically, uh, teams are going to default to like, let's get cat in the action, right? Let's get this guy trying to chase us around a bunch. But I think Boston is so deliberate about it. It's like, hey, we got the switch. We got the switch. And then the other four guys are like, all right, cool.

Good luck. You got the switch. And now we'll see, we'll see what happens. And I think what the Pacers do a good job of, I mean, there's one Neesmith three where Kat's worried about switching into Halliburton with the ball. Neesmith cuts underneath them. But then there's another screen where Neesmith is trying to get the one knee Smith three, or cats worried about switching into Halliburton with the ball, knee Smith cuts underneath them. But then there's another screen where knee Smith is free and

cats still thinking about Halliburton, but actually cats like so late. And it's really, it's not one of those you're like, Hey, cat was late. Because there's a bunch of stuff in some of the knee Smith makes where you're like, Oh, geez, late. cats late here. Heart fights really hard on one, but stumbles a bit. And I'm sure of Tibbs is watching it. It's, you just know this part of it.

They thought they were gonna win the basketball game and are like, some of these theories are ridiculous. But what I like about what the Pacers do is even if they're being, well, I shouldn't say deliberate here, but they're deliberate in their attack, but they're not deliberate once they get the switch. There still feels like there's something else for the Knicks to have to think about.

And I would say like in some of the hunting stuff that I've complained about with Boston is that, okay, fine, you're hunting this guy. He's a bad defensive matchup. But when you consistently ISO against one guy and then everybody understands what you're doing, it's easier for them to help. And you don't really win the matchup

probably as much as you think. It reminds me of football in a sense where it's like, oh, this corner is terrible against this receiver. It's like, yeah, but all of these other things still have to go right for you to be able to, you can't just throw it to that receiver 10 times in a row because I don't know that you're gonna be rewarded that way. So the Pacers do make you play out the possession.

I don't wanna call it peak warriors because I don't know that we'll ever be lucky enough to see that again. But just making a team think about where they have to be defensively for the full possession. It's kind of a rarity and it's really hard to stay in locked in defensively. And maybe this is the kind of game where they might have more of a wake up call and more of a lesson where if they had won the game, maybe they're not as tuned up. And, you know, I really think this series is going to be one of those deals where it's, you know, the next result is going to be based solely on how both

teams feel about themselves from the previous game. Yeah. I mean, there, there can be a little bit of a hangover. I tend to think with, again, I don't think the Knicks will come into game two tomorrow night with this still on their backs. I'd like to think that the Pacers, though they kind of strike you as kind of like a little young and giddy and whatever, like you could see them maybe being too high on themselves.

Rick Carlisle is their coach. I don't think he's gonna let that, like the number of times Carlisle in the post game last night said the phrase 13 days, which is a reference to the that like the number of times Carlisle the postgame last night said the phrase 13 days Which is a reference to the length of the series. This is of course is assuming that it goes Seven games. I love when coaches do this by the way. It's one of the great lies that coaches tell well It's a long series guys. It's a long series. Not necessarily It's best of seven it actually can end in four. That's how the math works It's not necessarily a long series.

And if the Pacers were to win game two and you're now up two, oh, going home, it's probably not gonna be a long series. But Carlisle's messaging to us was the same as it was to his team. Cause I heard Halliburton then parrot it later in his. 13 days, it's 13 days. And so he's really trying to hammer home the idea

that like, this is, this is a long battle. It has just begun. I don't think Carlisle is going to let them be too giddy for too long before tomorrow night's game. Let's do it this way. I want to talk Western Conference finals, but I want to talk MVP was announced with I don't think much surprise that SGA has won his first MVP with Jokic coming in second. SGA received 71 first place votes and Jokic had the other 29 first place votes again, 100 voters. You and I both have a vote. Who did you vote for? What did you think?

Voted for Shay. I was not necessarily as tortured about this as a lot of people were in that vote based on just the framework that I always use. And that's not a no disrespect to Jokic, what he did. The dude is incredible. And he had a phenomenal season. But you know, I've been doing this a long time. And at some point in time, you try to establish some sort of consistent approach I don't want to bore your listeners with all of this but like I

Have settled on long ago the approach that wins matter and they don't always it's not always the most decisive thing But it matters because what's the point of being MVP? Let's go to the extreme because everybody agrees wins matter they just don't agree on the scale that it matters. So if Jokic had all the same stats, but they had been a 40 win team, there'd be less support for him. There would have been. Because some people would have been like,

oh yeah, but they were kind of sub 500 or just at 500 maybe. 68 wins is freaking ridiculous. Like there's a handful of seasons in NBA history of a team doing that. And and she had a lot to do with that. So I've always said it comes down to this. There are two components to MVP, individual excellence and team success. I want you to check both boxes. That's the platonic

ideal. It's not a rule. I'm not saying it's hard and fast. But I try to be consistent with it because in a year like when Westbrook won it, I voted for Hardin that year and there were people who were hardened supporters who were very upset that you guys changed the way you do this. Wins always mattered and now you're voting for Westbrook and how could da, da, da, da, da. And I could feel at least good on an individual level that I could say, no, I'm staying consistent with this. And statistically Hardin and Westbrook weren't that different. Anyway, Westbrook had, I think more, uh, maybe two more assists per game or two

more rebounds per game, whatever it was. Hardin was way more efficient. Hardin's team won more. Thunder fans come back with, Oh, but Westbrook's sporting cast sucked, which by the way overstated point being. If you're going to have a consistent defensible approach to voting for MVP, you need to have a framework that you can say, I always view it through this prism.

So that's how I looked at it, Ryan. I, to me, um, Shea was dominant individually box checked, Yokech dominant offensively box checked. Carve it up a million different ways in terms of historical aspects of their of their seasons. Fine. But the point of MVP is that your individual excellence, your individual dominance has to matter at a high degree. And the higher degree, the more the more important it is.

That's the V. That's the valuable. So long-winded way of saying, after saying I wouldn't bore your listeners, but in a way I probably now have, I voted for Shay and I did not struggle with it that much. I voted for Jokic and I also did not struggle with it. So we saw it differently, which is why, you know, I think fans get really upset to your point.

It's like, oh, you're changing the criteria for this. It's like, well, you may have heard two different voters look at it a little differently. And so, you know, I'd heard the SGA argument as far as, you know, they won that many games. I mean, who knows if they won to win 70. I've said that before, they probably could have won 70. I do think it's really funny though,

that Thunder fans that would use that argument in 25, it completely contradicts the argument that they were using for Westbrook. Um, I, you know, again, I don't have a polling of, or I don't have like historical records of every comment from that time, but doing a show and talking about MVP every single day. I remember what it was and it wasn't about standings. It was about supporting cast. It's like, so I guess you want me to vote for Jokic this year based on your

passionate defense of Westbrook years prior. Look, I think Westbrook won that, that year because it was him staying when Durant left and it was a celebration of Westbrook and his loyalty. And I do think that writers like stories and it was a really good story. I'm not like putting you in the crosshairs here because you voted for Hardin, but there are moments where I think we get really caught up

in the story and I don't think people were caught up in the story with SGA. I just watched that Thunder Nuggets series and even in the games where I felt like Jokic, if I'm holding them to this impossible standards of like you needed to be a little bit better in a couple of these spots, watching the two go at it, there was never a second where I thought SGA was the better basketball player. And that was what I'd felt all season long, despite the gap team wise. And that's fine. And I totally accept all accept all of that and the fact is and I try to stress this a lot when I talk

about this to people about the voting. First of all the voting pool is not the same voting pools it was ten years ago certainly not when it was when it was 20 years ago or 30 years ago. At one time the voting pool was up to a hundred and twenty five hundred and thirty people it It's now consistently one hundred, but it's not always the same one hundred. So not only do we have a hundred of us with different viewpoints on how to define MVP or how to process all the data and stats that we have, the results, wins, this, that, all this stuff. It's a hundred people with a hundred different versions of this potentially. We're not in a room hashing this out behind closed doors in a smoke-filled room. Everybody's

in their own home filling out a ballot at some point in early to mid-April. And again, the voting pool itself is not the same as it was when Malone beat Jordan in the year that everybody always disputes or when LeBron lost to Derek Rose in another year that everybody disputes. It's not even the same voting pool. I don't know how much has changed since the year that Westbrook won, but it's probably changed pretty substantially even since then. And so when people try to draw broad sweeping conclusions about what the voters do or what

the media thinks, realize that it's not the same voting pool pool over time, realize that we're not in the same room. I mean, I might bounce some stuff off of other people. I know who are voters. Like that happens sometimes because we're just. I do the same thing. Right. Call on the defensive stuff. I'll call teams, uh, just because I never feel good about the arguments for

defensive player of the year, and then ultimately coming up with 10 guys. And then there's some years with the rookie voting where I'm, this was one of them where I'm like, second team. I'm like, man, this is, this is tough. All rookie team needs to be, needs to just be five guys. Like we didn't forget the second team, all rookie.

By the way, it's probably the least predictive thing that there is. Like look at the all rookie teams over time and then look at how those careers have gone. Like, I just, there's a part of me that gets defensive as, you know, a 28 year NBA beat writer and I haven't voted for all of it. The nine years I was at the Times, we weren't allowed to vote, but I voted mostly preceding that and since then, I get a little defensive on our collective behalf when people are doing a lot of mind reading. Well, the voters thought this and then they thought that,

like, the a hundred people who are all very individual and have their own views of this. Like, I do think that in this era with social media, there's maybe potentially a little more group think because you can see which way the wind is blowing. I think the total pool of people who get a vote, one through five, right? There used to be a lot more stray fours and fives.

And I feel like it's now you only get like seven people got votes at all or eight people, right? Like I feel like there's a little bit of that that's happened because nobody wants to be have the outlier votes. Our ballots are public. That's only been the case for the last about a decade. They didn't used to be. That has probably changed things a little bit

and maybe caused people to be a little bit more conservative or go with the flow. So there are some forces at work here that I think you could examine, but the mind reading that people do about, well, the voters did it this way because they thought this, even the, I know you and Bill have talked about it a lot and I will always push back against it.

I do not believe in voter fatigue. I read a whole thing for GQ sports a couple of years ago about the myth of voter fatigue. There is like one or maybe two examples in history that are actually valid, but we could debate that some other time. Anyway, I should stop rambling about it. I did notice, I think maybe I- I think I talked way too much about it. I struck a chord on writers liking stories and you kind of gave me a look. So maybe that's all connected to some of the fatigue thing. Yeah.

I guess I would disagree a little on just that I think there are maybe more examples, but if you researched it, maybe I'll go back into the archives and you know what? Let me go back and read that before I make a fool of myself and present a dissented argument. I'll send you the link to the you know what? Let me go back and read that before I make a fool of myself and present an accepted argument. I'll send you the link to the GQ piece I did. Yeah, look, every year I send in the ballot, you know, you're like, are you done? Did you get this right?

And I take it, I'm really like, I feel this great sense of pride that a few years ago, somebody would ask me to take on something that's this important, but there's, I don't know how you could have the vote and then just hit send and be like, nailed it again this year. I don't know who that person would be.

I mean, we have, by the way, Harding got a fifth place vote. I think the most shocking thing, because I was not surprised that she won. Yeah, Janice not getting all 100 third place votes, because he didn't get a second or first obviously, but that there'd be 12 people that wouldn't have them third this year. I mean, Yannis is going to put together this MVP result run here. That is like incredible.

And I guess I always feel like I've, I've over the years, maybe voted him a little bit higher than the, no, you know, his, how, where he would finish average out on the 100 votes. For the most part, this thing's pretty buttoned up and I would say the NBA probably feels even better about this, but it's a bit like the college football playoff committee where it's like, well, we three years ago, you guys did this. It's like, yeah, and then this year we did this. And there are different people that are on the committee and whatever the standard is and whatever the history is, there's just like the whole point of us being in society. There's just no way there's a hundred people that are going to see this the same way. So if you want to find those inconsistencies,

congrats. You found them because they'll always be there. And I will just say like, it's okay, folks, like it's okay for us to still have the debate. It's okay to have some doubts about it. It's okay for us as the voters to maybe go, ah, it was really close. I went this way. But as long as you've gone through a good thought process to get to the results that you got to as an individual voter, the fact of the reason you have a hundred people is there's a consensus in there somewhere

that kind of makes sense. Maybe right. Every ballot's not going to look the same, but at the end of the day you have a hundred people and you hopefully you as a group got it right collectively. But are there are there years that we go back and we still look at and go like, maybe maybe they got it wrong that year. Sure, that's fine. But that's that's fine but that's

that's just fucking sports man like we debate this stuff to to the end of time and sometimes it's not even a matter of right and wrong sometimes just it's a judgment call um you know I again I'm not in the heads I will not mind read my fellow voters I don't know what everybody's thinking but I would like to believe that everybody who's got a ballot in their hands treats it as seriously as you and I do that this is a responsibility and an honor on some level. And there's historical weight to this and you got to take it seriously and you have to consider everything you possibly can. And I didn't want to be too flippant about it earlier. Like I did anguish over all of this, right? Like I, even though I had been leaning Shea

and when Bon Temps calls about or texts us about, you know, his polls, I had, I had voted Shea in the straw poll, you know, a month or whatever it was before the season ended. So I was already going that direction. But one of the reasons I don't like the straw poll, but I do it anyway, because I liked him and I'm, I want to help him out.

I don't mind it. I don't want to get calcified in my, in my view of this, right? I always try to, should not get too dug in because then you start to try to justify your choice. So I think about that a lot too. I check myself at every, you know, moment here. And I did before I filled out the ballot, I didn't just reflexively do it as Shay. I knew that's where I was headed. I listened to everybody else's arguments about Jokic and I still came down where I came down and I'm fine with it. Um, I also just think last thought, I keep saying last thought, like, yes, Jokic is the best player on the planet, but that's not the award. The award is not best player on the planet because of that were the case. Michael Jordan could have won like, you know,

13 of them and LeBron would have won 15 of them or something like it. It's never that, um, you know, Rachel Nichols once proposed, uh, we've debated this about maybe we need to a most outstanding and a most valuable player because that way the most outstanding would be the LeBron, the Jordan, the Yoke, it's the guy who's clearly the best player of his generation. And year in year out is the guy that we all agree is the best player on the planet, but that's separate from the season award, which is who had the best season in, in, in the way that we all agree is the best player on the planet, but that's separate from the season award, which is who had the best season in the way I look at it,

the best season for a team that really mattered and had that kind of impact. So anyway. I hated that idea, by the way. Yeah, I didn't mean it. Let's go with this, because I have a couple more things that I just wanna get a little West in here.

Sure. Is Minnesota in trouble? No. things I just want to get a little West in here. Is Minnesota in trouble? No, I think that game was so freaking weird. By the way, Eastern Conference, Western Conference, game ones, different sports entirely because it was such a slog in game one of the West until the Thunder just said, okay, we're taking over now. The answer to are they in trouble, the Wolves, the yes version would be the Thunder are so freaking good defensively and can just absolutely disrupt everything

that you wonder whether there's enough there for Minnesota to just get going. Can Anthony Edwards actually find any gaps? Can he actually keep the ball in his hands long enough without having it be poked away? I sat there, this was when I was watching from the couch and I was sitting there almost like feeling like every time any member of the Timberwolves had the ball

in their hands for too long, I was like, you need to get rid of that. Do not hold onto the ball. Stop dribbling with your back to the defender. He's going to poke it away. Like I'm like jumpy on the couch on their behalf because the the thunder just you never know where it's coming from. There's an arm, a hand, a limb is somewhere that's about to come in

and disrupt you, poke the ball away. Just they're incredible. The thunder. But the Timberwolves have had a really strong season. I'm not going to dismiss them after one game. And it was really like whatever, like five minutes of one game like that it turned in the fourth. So we're the third.

This is this is the problem of the haze of the playoffs. By the time we're two days later, I'm already like I can't remember minute markers. But but but it was a burst late and Minnesota was hanging in pretty well up until then. Yeah. I think that's one way of looking at this. I mean, I was a little surprised that it felt like, uh, the odds and some of the talk around it was, was a little too dismissive of Minnesota, but you could argue, Hey,

Minnesota get a Lakers team. That was an awful matchup, meaning Minnesota, an awful matchup for LA. I think everybody understood that. And then you get Golden state who had its own limitations with Curry without Curry. So you run through those games. Like maybe that was the wake up call. I mean, Minnesota played what looked like a, a really competitive half. You could see the things you thought were going to work.

I mean, Randall was incredible, but Randall has been so off the charts. Like, I mean, this isn't really who Julius Randall is. Even if you're the biggest Julius Randall fan, what he has done in these playoffs, you're like, is he going to be this good? You almost like wonder if there's a bit of a correction on Julius Randall, which doesn't necessarily mean that he's going to be bad. You know, one of the bench things I always think is really interesting, and I'm guilty of this. I'll look at bench scoring.

I'd be like, man, look at how good that bench is. And it's like, well, they might just have bench guys they play, like the Pacers are a good example of this, but did the bench guys win the actual bench minutes? Or did they have more guys that play on the bench? And for the bench from Minnesota, we've seen this a couple of times before, just disastrous shooting from that entire group.

They hit a couple late that made it look a little bit better on paper, but the defense that's going to collapse on Ant and you know, those moments when you start turning the basketball over and it's just a layup line for the Thunder. And I'm totally with you. Like that Randall kind of take a little bit longer, spin back dribble. He lost one of those. Ant had one in the first half.

It's like, you guys can't do this. Like you can't do this against this group. And then it was very clear that SGA love not getting to see his own. He's like, this is now we're talking. I get back to me and I think Finch was even trying to figure out like, is there a non Rudy lineup here that's going to work? And then he saw a couple straight line drives. It's like, I think I got to go back to Rudy in here. I don't think they want to play zone. Um, and you know, I want to talk free throws here. Uh, it's not necessarily my favorite topic and some of the free throw conversation the last couple of days makes me want to think like, Hey, does anyone want to take Angel Reese?

Um, but I, you know, when SGA has seven attempts at 730 left to go in the first quarter, it impacts the game beyond free throw attempts. I've seen all the arguments and at one point I thought it was pretty interesting because I wrote it down at 86-77 when the Thunder were up, Minnesota was actually leading in free throw attempts at that point, 21-19. It was just like, okay, that's, that's one that you would argue for the SGA part of it. Um, but I think the part of it that kind of just gets lost because there's not necessarily the number for it is that a few of the calls with SGA, it's not about. Again, points and free throw rate and where he stacks up historically. Cause I saw a lot of that stuff.

It's like, okay, but now what does Jayden McDaniels think the next time he has him on some kind of drive? It's the same thing with Brunson. It may not be free throw rate for Brunson, but it's knowing like, I can't really try to close off any angle here. I've got to just sort of backpedal and then hope I get a contest because one he's great at drawing the calls. And two, it seems like any tie is going to the the ball handler not the runner in this case.

Also not for nothing but we've spent a lot of time over the last year and a half talking about how you know the you know shifted some things in the way that they're calling things and so more contact being allowed and especially in the playoffs usually more contacts people so if that's the case across the board or broadly it stands out even more when one guy with marginal contact at times or contact that he's initiating is able to just kind of bounce off a guy and just the mere brush of his arm against somebody's hip is like, oh, well, you bumped him and that's a foul. And so I would, you know, coaches and players, the one thing that they want is consistency, right? It's never like we don't like this kind of call. It's like, if you're going to do it, do it both ways, blah, blah, blah.

And yeah, does Shea seem to get more than his merchant stuff, but like some guys are just really good at drawing contact, initiating contact, bouncing off of contact and still making a shot. Like there's still, there's a skill to not, it's not just that you're quote unquote fooling the refs. There's a skill to being able to initiate contact, have it throw you off balance or have it impact you physically in some way while still having the wherewithal and the balance to hit the shot or to get off the shot sometimes maybe you're not always hitting

the shot. Shea's just really freaking good at it. I understand why it drives people nuts. Yeah, I cringed at some of those calls too. Of course. Referees aren't perfect. I'm fine with that. The game is not officiated. Adam Silver's not happy with it.

I don't mean about Shea. Adam Silver wants perfection. Adam Silver wants replays till the end of time. I would love to just abolish coaches challenges and replays tomorrow. Fuck it. Human error is fine. It's just in the game. But we do have it all. And we do all have high definition televisions now where we can see absolutely every little detail. And yeah, it makes it more frustrating, I think, when you can see, oh, that was marginal at best contact, or that was a flail, or that was just a guy falling down. Yeah, we're constantly seeing the officiating having to adjust to some of the stuff and I feel like, you know, too often over the years, you know, players are smart, um, they had to like correct the three point contact because certain

guys, when they were being contested would land like Harden would land forward on a three point attempt when he was contested and when he was wide open, he went right up and down. Unfortunately for me, because I'm in it every single day, I think it becomes less about the free throws and more about the arguments. I'm talking from media members and people, and I'm not just going like randos here, but you can't defend the Brunson free throws and then hate the Trey Young ones. Okay? Right? You can't be a Sixers fan getting mad about Brunson free throws and then hate the Trey young ones. Okay. Right. You can't, you can't be a Sixers fan getting mad about Brunson's whistle. And if you're a Knicks fan, you can't get mad about Embiid's whistle.

And I'm sure there's a lot of Oklahoma city fans and people that have been defending the SGA stuff. And look, they were going to win the game without a couple of calls. Uh, SGA is terrific even without it. That's all understood, but I'm sure they didn't enjoy any of those hard years. So it becomes this defense of something that we all hate. Like I'll see somebody go, oh, you know, did you find some data that tells me historically this SGA stuff isn't that bad? Okay.

Do you have any data for sucks to watch in a huge spot when he falls down? And you could tell that's when Alexander Walker was like losing his mind. And I think the official was mad with Alexander Walker's emotional reaction. So when he made the foul call at the sideline, he's like pushing the back and then, you know, gives them like looking at him a bit being like,

and then you watch the replay and you're like, you just, you let this guy fall down. I am worried. I'll just tell you now, I'm pre-worried about an SGA Brunson finals. And I think there's some lessons too with the SGA stuff from game one. And I don't mean this as a gatekeeper like,

ooh, I'm so cool. I watch all these games, but it's a little reminder sometimes of how many eyes are on the product that aren't really locked in or watching much of the regular season. And then they see some of this stuff. So, I mean, it's a bigger picture thing where I don't want to turn into a complaint because I'm completely aligned with you. I'd get rid of all the challenges.

I get rid of replay. I would just say, Hey, let's go. Because if you're searching for perfect, you're going to be searching forever. This game will not allow you to have a perfect game. And there's going to be some stuff that doesn't work out. But if you are allowed as the offensive player to gain the advantage by initiating the contact and the stuff the player can do to flick the defender off them with a bunch of different things, either something really physical

or keeping that arm tucked in, you can't then also reward him for that contact if he wants to embellish the contact that he was hoping to get separation with in the first place. So the only way, and look, this isn't going to be solved these next couple of weeks, but I would say there needs to be something where if you want to fall down, I'm going to give the defender the benefit of the doubt and maybe I'm going to miss a few, but if I'm missing a few in favor of him, maybe guys stop doing it less and then just that part of the product is better. Rant over. No, amen. There is absolutely a quality control aspect of this and a watchability aspect and you needing this, especially at this time of year when,

yeah, a lot of more casual fans are watching. There are more eyeballs. That's why there's higher ratings in the playoffs and the deeper in the playoffs you go. That's what you want as a league. You don't want people to come to it and go like, what the hell was that? You know? So I'm with you. I think that I think that's right. I think that they've tried.

Listen, they've made any number of measures in recent years trying to crack down on this, right? On various aspects of flopping, initiating contact, validating, whatever. But at the end of the day, you've got three refs who are human, who have the same eyeballs that the rest of us do, trying to do this in real time, which is a lot harder from where they are than where we are at home watching on TV in high def. than where we are at home watching on TV in high def. So, but it's difficult and you can't get all of this out. Can they do more? Maybe, I'll let Monty McCutcheon figure that out.

Check out Howard Beck's piece about this age of chaos right now, this era of chaos in the NBA. And it was just a great call because we had chaos last night. Enjoy the game twos, man. Appreciate it. Appreciate it, thanks for the solo.

Appreciate it. This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. When I get into something, I go deep, like seeing how I can improve my sleep routine or finding a TV show that I can get lost in. Prime helps me find everything I need plus offering fast, free delivery. Whatever it is, Prime helps you get more out of whatever

passions you're into or getting into. Head to Amazon.com slash Prime and follow your obsession wherever it goes. You want details? Fine. I drive a Ferrari 355 Cabriolet. What's up? I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork. I have every toy you can possibly imagine. And best of all kids, I am liquid. So now you know what's possible. Let me tell you what's required. We have Wargon back in the mix.

We have Kyle, life advice, rr at gmail.com. That is our email address. And even if somebody doesn't listen to the show, form the address and say hey do you got a question who knows maybe we'll read it on the show we're gone good to see you. Thanks man. That's it. Alright. Had some kidney stone issues. Oh god I was hoping you were gonna cause I have questions I'm glad you admitted it. Can I say this one now? I wasn't hiding it. Can I leave the pod? I hate hearing about it. Alright, alright, alright. Do you have questions for me about kidney stones?

Yeah, I mean is it just, is it terrible every time or is it, you know? This is my first time, not fun. Not a good time. I was in a lot of pain Monday night. Ah man. So, they gave me all the drugs, somehow better. Did you pass it Monday night, or was it like another? No, no, no, I still got it. Oh, really?

Yeah. Oh, so with like, does it like whittle it down if you just take your medicine? That's what they say. Okay. It's not even medicine, it's just water. It's, I mean, the pain medication and water, that's what they've given me.

Wow. Yeah, I have Percocet and water. So not technically advanced as I thought, okay. No. Got it, okay. No. Damn, you sitting up a little straighter advanced as I thought. Okay. No. Okay. No. Damn.

You sitting up a little straighter today? I can't tell. No, it's not. It's like a discomfort. Monday was rough. Now it's just a little bit of a discomfort. All right. Yeah.

How do we get Ryan back, you think? He just left the room. Hey, we're done, man. We're done. He's gone. This part's over. He'll figure it out. There he is.

I had earbuds in the whole time. Oh great, so. So that's his update. Are you doped up now? No. No, no, no. For the show? How could I? I'm gonna change the topic here.

I bought some fancy pens that are heavier and I felt like that way I wouldn't lose them, but then I would have to replace the ink cartridges constantly. I don't know if it's the salt there, you know, each like there's certain, there's certain taxes on this that people don't understand. My rogue, some of the bolts on my rogue squat rack just cannot handle the briny mist. And so I went to the pen place yesterday to be like, hey, I'm having some issues with these pens. The guy was like, you know, I didn't get, I don't think I got their number one ink guy. And so I saw a box of picks.

Hell yeah. Remember these? Hell yeah. Like this was the high school pen. I got 60 of these for $6. Yeah man, that's the way. It's like every time I think I might be a Zippo guy, just it's not worth the hassle. Totally not worth the hassle. I'll just go, ironically enough, Bic.

Give me a 10 pack of Bics and I'll just think about this next time I run out. You know, with all the complaints about everything that's going on economically, the fact that you can buy 60 BIC pens for $6, I didn't even know this was, you know. Yeah, I guess that didn't really hit me. 60 is a lot. And look, I get it. I know Trump's not for everybody, but. Yeah.

No tariff on these BICs. Yeah. Why don't you go pen shopping? Oh man. Then get back to me. All right. Okay. We have some housekeeping to do potentially here. Let's go with a couple here because we're all in a good mood and we're thrilled Borgon is back. Update on the roommate shower situation. I think everybody remembers

this one. Need a quick refresher. Three dudes, one guy's overseas, the overseas guy for a couple of weeks apparently has the sickest shower ever. It was a really well-crafted email and the other two roommates are like, are we wrong for wanting to shower in it once? And they even added, we're not even sure if you would care. I think the thing was we said, go for it, but be careful because then you have to go back to your shower. So six, three, 180 pounds. I don't know if those have changed at all since the email a couple of weeks ago. Michael Porter, Jr. Cobb, never seen a three I didn't like. Both on and off the court, Kyle.

I am the roommate who went to Ireland and the other two are definitely using, oh, I am the roommate. Oh no. Small world, dude. Yeah, sometimes people fire in these emails. I imagine this guy knew or they all listened because of a certain age.

I am the roommate who went to Ireland and the other two were definitely using my bathroom all week while I was away. I could tell instantly things were out of place and then there were empty toilet paper rolls in the trash, even Q-tips on the floor of my shower. Wow. Didn't really bother me that they used my bathroom,

but they did not attempt to hide their tracks and sort of made a mess. I didn't know the extent of what they were doing until I listened to your pod and pulled the real life little Sasquatch meme. That's a good meme. Attached to this email for reference, I knew it. One of them, we'll call him Andrew,

is gone for a week later this summer on the West Coast trip and I want to return the favor. He did a good job of underselling his bathroom in the last email. As his is the only with a true en suite bathroom, the only true en suite bathroom we have. I stood in there a while, he was at work one day and I can comfortably say his is bigger than mine.

Buy square footage. He has the most privacy in his bathroom and now I can't stop thinking about how peaceful it must be to do your business. I wanna leave a few hints that I was in there to subtly fuck with him, but nothing that would start a conflict. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Pay it, PS is player comp, Warriors, Andre Iguodala, a little bit of a stretch. Plays more like Tony Snell. If you know, you know, other player cop was close enough. All right. This is screwed up, man. Yeah, it's like we're living with these guys. I mean, the original email was like, should we do it?

Should we not do it? And then they did it. And then also trashed the place that they were like, worried if they should even like be in there for too long. They're taking dumps, they're using all the toilet paper. There's Q-tips on the ground. I mean, what's the difference between Q-tip in your ears and your bathroom and someone else's, I thought they were going to do the big money thing, which

was check out the shower and they're taking dumps. I mean, this is the Q-tip things. Disgusting. Come on. You took an inch and then you took a mile. It's, it's not right. It went without saying that if you were going to use it, you had to like treat it. Well, I thought, I think we understood that

because they were so apprehensive about it. But then I guess they decided to just go, but if these guys are in their twenties, they think it's hilarious. They didn't do anything wrong, I guess. You know, I remember early twenties, again, those really dumb years right after college and you know, some of these girls who were friends with

that were like, they had their shit together. They were actually really cool. And every one of us had at that point pretty much ruined it. Um, but we were still friends. They allowed us to still be in their circle as friends. And then, you know, years later, you're like, you know, it could have locked one of them down. Dad's got a place.

Rosemary beach. Like, uh, maybe could play this a little different, a little different. Anyway, good for them. But look, one guy cleaned out his ears and thought it was like the funniest thing ever because he hadn't bought Q-tips in a while and it was like just repulsive and then left him just didn't even like, he threw him in the, the waste basket, but I don't know, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. because he hadn't bought Q-tips in a while. And it was like just repulsive and then left him

just didn't even like, he threw them in the waste basket. But I don't really understand a lot of bathroom waste baskets, like the ones without liners, like why would you throw away garbage in your kitchen with a liner, but then in your bathroom, considering some of the stuff that also could be thrown away in the course of daily bathroom use that you're like, no, we're good. It's just a plastic bin. Be like, you rinsing that thing out.

Probably not enough. Or those wicker baskets that women like where it just kind of piles up and then you dump it out. So this guy went in the wicker basket with like two used, used like, it was like he had gotten out of desert storm and then decided to clean his ears there. And, um, he left him, he just left him. He didn't even think he did anything wrong. And then one of the girls went to use the bathroom.

They invited us over, new apartment, post-college, really nice part of Austin. And then the girl comes running out. She's like, oh my God, oh my God, like who, like congrats on cleaning your ears. But also, and then he was like, what are you, you know, what are you talking about? I could see how that guy wouldn't get it at all though.

Yeah. I could tell that's where it goes, right? I mean. He's like, I'm out of Q-tips, I saw him there, you know? And then she was like, you're supposed to wrap the used Q-tip in tissue paper, then throw it into the, and he, you know, it's like, you want me to hide the evidence?

Yeah. Yeah. So, all right. We spent too much time on this already, but I think we have another one that we needed to address. Yeah. Just a quick gym thing. Got so many emails here. We are so cool.

All right. Am I counting wrong at the gym? So we were talking about counting, right? And the mind-body connection. And when the body is being told by the mind that we're almost done, then the body shuts down sooner than it should. This is not, I'm sure smarter people have talked about this.

I think Nick Saban has actually. Anyway, our email here is asking, am I counting wrong at the gym? Does everyone else count their reps backwards down to one? This seems like insane behavior. Is there something I'm missing that makes this a better way to count? Well, I wish this guy didn't include his weight. So I would know. I like to count down. I don't like to go one to whatever. I like to count down. I don't like to go one to whatever. I like to just pick a number and then count down. I used to do five.

I used to do five and then I count. I was like, well, I made it to the, I thought I could trick myself, sort of like what you're saying, be like one, two, three, four, five. All right, five, four, three, two, and I don't know. I don't think it ever helped, but mine was a little unorthodox as well, I think.

We're gonna have any marathon correlation here? Not really a big lifting guy. I got nothing here. But what about miles? Do you tell yourself like, I'm only gonna go this far and then you maybe, do you do it differently? No, nothing. No, nothing.

No, not really. It just sucks the entirety of the way. Yeah. Look, not everybody- What I suspected about running. Not everybody is counting down, but I know I'm not the only one. How about that?

I would say most people are going, but I don't think it's insane behavior. However your mind works, whatever you can do to optimize your effort, and for me, it works better counting down. There you go. Count to five twice. I don't know.

Who's the same? Yeah. Who's, I mean, that's like you did two sets in one. Two set Kyle. Dude, I'm like, uh, I've expanded my day. Like you can't believe. Yeah, right. I have three days in a day.

And Kyle's like, I have fucking two sets in a set. Over the course of a year, I'm gonna kick your ass. They're like, hey, can we get you on our pod? Do you wanna come to Austin for an all men dinner? Yeah. Some people will get that Austin reference. Most of you won't. All right, six foot one Denver guy, game like Cory Brewer.

All right, so this guy's talking about buying a new flat screen. Streaky cutter with a white t-shirt under the Jersey to hide my noodle arms. I did that. I was in St. John's in Georgetown, those big East teams t-shirt underneath the Jersey and I was like, this is great. Good. We've got a couple of veins with five fingers hanging off of them.

All right. 33 years old, about three weeks away from proposing to my amazing girlfriend. He calls her Haley. So congrats. Yeah. Congrats, Haley. Hopefully you don't hear about it from the podcast first. I guess she is MVP. I have a ring and proposal situation all set up. The future in-laws have enthusiastically giving their blessing and I know she's going to say yes, no matter what happens there, your boy is golden and extremely lucky all right feel good six foot one Denver guy no no wonder 33 been in the game a little bit little seasoning but now ready to settle down at the right age probably that was not personal only problem the engagement is

a surprise we hope so but she's getting impatient. Hard to blame her. We've been dating since 21. We've seen several friends get engaged and married before us. I probably should have prioritized saving for an engagement ring earlier too, but our relationship is strong. We're nowhere near having kids

and all that's gonna be taken care of. On June 13th, I'm fine with waiting out another three weeks, but our main TV broke right before game seven of Nuggets Thunder. I, being such a rational money person, wanted to immediately drive to Costco and see which 75 inch bad boy we get for around 1200 bucks. Who knows? Maybe there's a little gift card promo going on there. Soundbar next. I like this guy's style. You don't even have to try to read this one. This is great. No, but it's kind of like this needs to be done immediately,

but it also needs to be done right. Yes. It's like crashing your car and being like, what kind of Land Rovers you guys got while I'm down? All right. My girlfriend shut down the idea, said we have other things you should be saving money for. I propose getting something like a 50 inch TCL

for $400. You can't. Morgan, you got anything on TCL? Damn, you know, I got a 50 inch TCL for $400. Morgan, you got anything on TCL? Damn, you know, I got about a 50 inch TCL I'm looking at right now. You got the job done. How do you do it? How do you do it?

It's unbelievable. How do you do it? You're not real, dude. Dude, I got two TCLs, one in the living room, one in the bedroom. You're a TCL brand guy. They're great, they're cheap. Oh wow.

Holy crap. It's not about, it's just, I don't deserve you, man. Crazy. You know what we gotta talk about? Hold on. I went to Lion King last Thursday. I'm in the store buying candy.

Yeah, I know. We needed our Broadway Minute. Can you have that for us? I know, but we're doing it right now, no? Okay, yeah, yeah, here we go. And by the way, when you edit this in, can we hear some sort of generic Broadway music? This is, hey, don't worry Denver Guy, we like you,

we're gonna get to your TV thing in a second. But yeah, give me a little music intro and the Broadway Minute. So I'm in CVS and I go to text my friend, hey, I got candy, you don't have to worry about it. Totally fine. Intermission, I get a text from Ryan and it just says great. And I'm like, what's this guy talking about?

I go into my text and I texted him by accident. I got candy and he just responds. Great. I knew it wasn't for me. But not even the wrong text, not even wrong text to save him some trouble. No. Great. Great. Well, if I had known you longer, I would have been like, awesome, dork. Like, you know, and not even a war guy, just because it was a random out of nowhere that night,

hey, I just got some candy, and I'm at home going. Great. Awesome. Give us, that's not what I care about though I care about your your right yard with stadium prices at Broadway huge bigger than stadium price I would say my friend got a thing of wine large 50 bucks one thing of one thing what's the thing when he would it was like a symbol head and like a cup head it was like a regular-sized cup but it was pretty full. But 50 bucks was insane.

The show was good. They sat us. I didn't get anything. Yeah. With the prices like that. Yeah. We had a bunch to drink the night before. I think it was Nick Celtic's Game 5.

Carriage over. Can't quite remember. But I don't think I need to be drinking heavily twice during the week. Were you hungover on Broadway? I wasn't hungover, no. You worked it out, you ran it out. I feel like at my age, once during the week is enough. The show is fine, good seats on the lottery, can't complain.

There's your Broadway Minute. I might want more depth next time you see a show. Feedback's always good, yeah. But I like where this is going. All right, so that's the first ever war gone Broadway minute all right so girlfriend shut down the idea we that's what led us to this whole thing TCL we stopped at TCL yeah I told her buying one of those TVs is the reason we're currently without one and investing it is something I guess we're not getting sponsorship from

them anytime soon investing into something sturdier we're not getting sponsorship from them anytime soon. Investing into something sturdier was worth the extra money and since I use the TV more than her, I offered to pay for more than half of a nicer TV. I could tell this frustrated her more, but she wouldn't really elaborate outside of quote should we really be spending that much on a TV right now. I'm 99% sure she rightfully thinks I'm about to blow money on a TV. They should be putting in a savings for an engagement ring. But Haley wants to get a new TV soon too, just a shitty one that no self-respecting

ringer bro would tolerate. How do I maneuver this one? Do I convince her to wait on a new TV and put a damper on the NBA and NHL playoffs to try to persuade her to buy a nicer one or should I just buy one and deal with the heat until proposal day? Thanks, love the pod and table wings. All right. Cool. Really nice job with, with the, uh, what's it called with the, that TV is why getting a shitty

TV is why we're in this situation. Probably not true. You probably would just have a shitty TV for as long as most people would have a TV, but I really like getting out in front of that. It sounds like she didn't buy it, but that would have probably been my first, that would have been my first pull right there.

It was like, wow, that's why we're in this situation. Yeah. Yeah. I kind of wish I hadn't said the brand because I don't think that's fair to do to any brands. Um, too late now. Anyway, uh, look, man, um, I remember I bought myself a Rolex right before I thought I was getting engaged.

Cause I was like, let me, let me bang these out. It's my first Rolex. And I'm like, I was, that was already picked out the ring. The whole deal was like, this was not the other failed one. I couldn't have bought a pack of Rolos back then. But yeah, ring picked out, ready to go, the whole thing. But I started actually, because of our guy here, I started going, whatever those luxury items were,

there's a couple things that I've always wanted, I better get these fucking done now because I don't want somebody telling me I can't do it, especially when it's my money too, which is again, either you think I'm awesome or you think that's a major problem. I'm okay. I'm okay with all those things. And then guess what? It didn't matter. Didn't get engaged, buy all the Rolexes I wanted. So I know where you're coming from here. What I'm telling you to do, because it's gonna suck that I don't have a TV. Sounds like it's a pretty big part of your life.

And it sounds like she's sort of taxing you for not already proposing to her. And you're telling me everything's great about the relationship, but this is kind of the stuff that I don't really love is that you're right. She would like to watch it from a nice TV, but since you haven't put that ring on her finger, then she's, you know, to all the points that you're, you're laying out here now. It's like, should we really

be doing it? It's just code is like, where's my fucking ring? As if like the TV delays the ring by six months because you're supposed to be saving for this artificial representation of love in the first place, which we can get into. We'll do that another time. Imagine if dudes were like, hey, where's my $20,000 gift before I'm taking this seriously. Right, dude. Imagine if you were a guy, like after dating a woman for two years

and you came home to your shared apartment and you were like having a tough day. And I'd be like, well, to be honest, it's not even about today. You haven't got to see Todd coming with his new tires, talking about them. I mean, you can't buy me just a bass boat with a little like 20 horsepower, Evan rude, like, I just don't know that I feel like I'm wasting my time. All right.

Uh, that's going to go over well with some of the audience. Anyway, the point is you have the ultimate out, my man. You have the ultimate out. Would you rather watch the NBA and NHL playoffs with a degree of tension for two weeks, knowing that once that ring comes out, like you said is happening here shortly, it doesn't matter.

This tension was all make believe. Just a part of the timeline in Mesopotamia that we can't even see anymore. Like who invaded who that year? I don't know, it's all shoved together now, thousands of years later. So you might deal with a little stuff, you'll be dealing it while you're watching Edmonton,

Dallas, right? Because you know, you know, like all of it is temporary and it's not real because you already have the ring and you're already gonna do all this stuff and it's good to go. So I would rather put up with that stuff for a couple weeks, knowing it's all gonna be gravy here pretty soon

because the other side of it is not put up with that tension and not be able to watch the games. So- Dude, count the days backwards. That's basically what this whole pod's about. Break me into sets of five. We're counting down from 16 and that's how we're doing it. You don't even have to make it through three full weeks.

You're not even, like, it's three sets of five. Yeah, that's right. There's one after another. Count to five three times, there you go. Count it backwards, this is it. We're all, you have to get the TV. We're all on the same page, right, Mike? Brother, there ain't nothing wrong with a TCL.

That's all I'm gonna say. Yeah, but if you don't like TCL. I'm glad you said that. If you don't like TCL. Spend your money on the TV if you want, but with the TCL. That's all I'm gonna say. Yeah, but if you don't like you said that if you don't like TV if you want but love my TCLs. They're like it's another two dollars to see Lion King Otherwise, we got to go see cats. You're gonna go see there's nothing wrong with cats Yeah, weird fucking show it's a weird fucking show exactly, but you've seen it right I haven't no okay. I know the music though You've seen it, right? I haven't now. Oh, okay.

I know the music though. Got it on Spotify? Yeah. All right. Get the TV, man. You're right. Countdown. I mean, you guys are married, so well engaged and married, sorry.

Kyle, I sense you got a little bit more heat, perhaps, than War Morgan did. With the TV thing? No, the timeline. Oh, with the timeline. Yeah. Yeah, I screwed it up too. I like, I like to drop too many hints. You know, my jeans were too tight. You could see the fucking box in my pocket. It was like a dead giveaway by the time we, you know, even left.

Almost missed the boat. It was like, but... I like you in tight jeans. It looks good. Thanks. Yeah, I think it was the jig was up before we were there, but she thought it was sweet that he was like, oh, he's we're getting on the boat. We're going to Catalina, blah, blah, blah. But the element of surprise was gone. I probably would have tightened it up a little bit if I had another go at it. So, you know, stay strong.

I mean, you might wanna like, in the midst of the tension being like, it's already taken care of and ruined the surprise. Just don't, don't ruin the surprise. Don't even drop a hint. I wish I could have taken a hint or two back. I just can't keep secrets, man. Especially when I know she's gonna be like blown away.

You know, I don't think I've given her a birthday gift on time in a while. It's like, you know, immediately it's like, I know something you don't know. Fucking nailed it. Then two weeks earlier, I'm like, ah, here it is. So I'd say keep the cap on that engagement if you can. Another email.

Life advice, boss ordering for me. Hey guys, what's up? 28 year old. I know, I already hated 19562. I wish I had an MBA comp, but honestly I was a sixth man on the three and three team in college. Not great. Bench 225, all right though. I changed careers at a pharmacy last year.

I've had a lot of success early, winning the sales comps nationwide, major imposter syndrome. My boss, let's call him Bob, is about 20 years older than me. My career is in a pharma sales last year. I've had a lot of success early, winning the sales comps nationwide, major imposter syndrome. My boss, let's call him Bob, is about 20 years older than me. Solid dude, really helpful when he works with me. Bob leaves me alone and trust me, so I have a lot of freedom. He travels to my territory and will work with me maybe once or twice a quarter for a few days.

When Bob is here, we go for dinner and drinks. Bob is pretty socially unaware of a lot of things, but really enjoys hanging out with me given I'm one of the only dudes on the team. So here's the weird part. Every time we go to a restaurant, even breakfast, Bob picks two things and asks if I want to split those with him. That's brutal, dude. Bob is adamant that we share two things he likes and not just order for ourselves. It's always on the company card, So honestly, he could just order both for himself. I personally don't care, but it's just overall uncomfortable, but it's free food and drinks at nice restaurants. If Bob wants the steak and ribs, he orders both

and splits the plates and gives me one. I try to push back the first time. Yeah. I guess really, but I don't want to have your steak. Come on. Especially because like on a steak too, if it's a ribeye or something, like there's gonna be one side that's better. Oh good. I try to push back, I guess unless you split it lengthwise. When you're there. That don't even look right, bro, I can't. I try to push back, really confused why I didn't participate

in this and started hard selling me on all the dishes he wanted to split. Maybe he doesn't even like you, dude. You're just the only guy that's doing this. How about that idea? Just blow your mind. We've even split two different omelets he wanted at breakfast.

I have a pretty good thing going and I like my job. What would you guys do? Just keep putting up with the weird restaurants thing not to ruffle any feathers or try to change this. I think it's time for you to start making up some allergies, buddy. Yeah, he said he pushed back in the guy's adamant, right? Like when he said-

Can't understand it. Right, he can't understand it. And so this was like 20 seconds of him pleading his case and then he was just like, all right, the Cajun pasta it is, like what? I guess I'm having a hard time understanding how much he actually tried because that's what we all want to know like how far have you taken this pushback and And when are you retreating is that what he looks confused when you're suggesting ordering your own things and you stop it there

I guess it's it's been unclear to me How hard he's pushed this because this is eating away at him and it would be eating away at me too. Quarterly, what's, I mean, that's four times a year, right? So this happens, you know, every couple of months he's got another go at this and he's thinking the whole time about wanting to order. He might even like the thing. It's now it's about the principle

of having to split with this man. I'd maybe push it a little bit further. I'd maybe push it a little bit harder. I'd maybe push it a little bit harder. Just try to stand on your own two there. I think you sort of swerve into this. Next time he's there and he suggests two dishes, you say, actually, I really want dish one just for myself. I don't really want to share, but you pick one of the dishes that he suggests, I

think, to sort of make it your own. I don't know. It kind of seems like a win, but it also kind of seems like it's, you know. You didn't get the full, you didn't pass the full stone to put it in perspective. I think you just got to get it out of the way once. Once you do it once, I think you're out of the woods here. Yes, I agree. Yeah.

I think this is a great example that we should all just fuck with each other way more, because it would just be awesome if the emailer like tells his friends and like he tries to pull this to the next breakfast. The omelet thing's gross too. And just go, hey, I'm getting pancakes. If you can't handle it, you can fucking fire me right now, Bob. It's gonna alter the relationship.

Bob's just like, no problem, we'll split them. I just hate food pushers, man. I mean, it's a bit like the free throw merchant thing. It's not so much I hate the bad calls. I don't like those. I don't like the rewarding of some of the stuff, but I hate the defense of the stuff way more than the actual act itself. And I just don't like food pushers.

I hate it. I hate family style. I'm always hungry after family style. And, you know, people could say, oh, that's because of like some social thing. No, it's because I know I'm not going to be able to eat enough and I want to be able to eat enough and I can pay for it. So why wouldn't I want to order the thing that I want to eat instead of sampling like 60% of things I want. And then it's like, oh, you don't want the squid crudo?

And I'm like, I don't, I don't actually. Like I'll try a fucking bite, but I'm not craving it and I don't really want it. And I've eaten plenty of squid. It's just, you know, I think people are honestly like, all right, yeah, cool man. Squid, I'll get the fucking chicken tenders. No, I'm not eating chicken tenders at dinner,

but I'm just, I remember one place we went like it was an agent thing. And then he just decided he was going to order for all of us and on top of that family style. And then on top of that started making our plates. And it's like, man, I think I switch agency soon after that. And it was like, I never want to have, you know, and there's, I think it's kind of like an

upbringing in the social, the family part of there's, I think it's kind of like an upbringing in the social, the family part of it. Like I can appreciate what family style means to like some people, but if it's like some fancy LA restaurant and it's 10 people, you're just not, and I'm sorry to the person who's listening to this right now that knows what I'm talking about, but he'll laugh about it. Anyway, I just don't like people, like think how insane that actually is. I'd like to share a meal with you, but I want it all on my terms. So the tendencies of maybe one of the paths sociopaths psychopath, I don't know. You know, I think this is about though, I mean, I would ask the email or like,

what's your track record with this kind of behavior? You're so non-confrontational that, you know, you're just letting this happen. No way. I mean, this has gotta be on the guy, on the guy, the perpetrator. There's nothing about you that would give off like, yeah, this guy would like me to order for him, I think.

No, but I do, well, I mean, look, we've all been there in certain work situations where you go, I'm, I don't wanna do anything, right? I don't wanna do anything that could jeopardize. Cause you go, I don't want to do anything, right? I don't want to do anything that could jeopardize. Because sometimes you're just dealing with these people that are decision makers and they're so unhinged on, I'm not talking crazy, crazy, but just they're processing of normal everyday activities. And you'll be like, you think that's normal? I mean, again, that's very, all of us probably have something where the masses would go, that's how you do that or whatever. But mean, again, that's very like all of us probably have something where the masses would go,

that's how you do that or whatever. But like in this case, I think the exercises for the email are to learn it. Like I'm a little worried, like are there other things where you allow this kind of stuff to happen to you over and over again? Again, it's Bob's fault, but the exercise should be for you. You have to be determined to find a way to alter this course. Think of like, yeah, just straight up and go, you know what? We've been doing this a little while, Bob. And you know what? It's more like, you know, again, if it's your boss, you can't say, this seems like a better transaction for you. You get to have the two things. Like we had a roommate like this in college. There was a place that did an awesome chicken parm. They did an awesome meatball sub. And then he was always

looking for somebody on the other end. He's like, who wants to go six and six? Like, does somebody want to go meatball, chicken parm, meatball, chicken parm? And finally, after a while, we're like, no, if I want a fucking chicken parm, I want the extra six inches today. And if I want a meatball, I want the, I don't want it, yeah. There we go, tight jeans, full circle. Uh. Anything else on this? I'm with you on the family style. I was just saying.

I took out the pen and started making a note there. I wonder what that was. Well, this is a, this is a. I was talking about Ryan. You golfing today? I'm thinking about it. No, I thought about something else entirely. It has nothing to do with anything we've just done

for two hours and I wrote a notation note. That's your curse, isn't it? Yeah, I was just gonna say, family style just stresses me out. I'm like, it's a numbers game. There's always gonna be one or two of the items I'm not into, and I'm like, did everybody get the potato skin?

Is, I don't know if she looks like she's not a potato skin type of person. How long do I wait? It's like, when do you go for seconds at the top of the table? I don't know. I don't know how that works. And I just like to not be involved if I could,

but I don't know. There's some family members of mine that really enjoy that sort of style of eating, and I'm just playing a numbers game the whole time. It's like that Galifianakis thing with all the numbers swirling around. I'm like, I think he likes the green beans more than I do. And I'm pretty sure that that cauliflower dish might be a little too fatty for his taste. So maybe I can maybe I can do that

So I'm just I can't even focus on I'm having a good time when it's family style. I'm always like Just trying to get get what's mine, you know If you think about it family style is the most selfish way to eat If you think about it, family style is the most selfish way to eat. That'll do it for the pod today. Thanks to Wargon. Thanks to Kyle. What a bar. Who else do we have on the pod today?

Was Friis with us? Yeah, Friis is here. Okay. You want to say hi? Fixing a post. Hey guys. What's up, man? All right. Cool. Cool. That'll do it for us. I'll be on with Bill on Sunday, our Sunday pod. I don't know what time we're taping that one now.

I got to look ahead of the schedule. So again, check us out on Spotify apps. You can watch along. You can also, of course, please subscribe to our YouTube page. Maybe Kyle and I just do some sort of YouTube thing here because Saruti's usually the one that's in charge of that. And that's lacking a bit. And as always, thank you for subscribing

and listening to the Rhonda Ristel podcast right here on Spotify. They were gonna name me Michael Jordan. My dad was like, I don't think he can live up to it, so they named me Michael Jared. ["The Last of Us", by The Caps, playing in background.] Must be 21 and older, present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus and present in DC gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com.

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