The Ryen Russillo Podcast - Top NBA Duos, Bears' No. 1 Pick, and QB Movement Updates With Jeff Darlington. Plus, a Salt Lake City Recap

Episode Date: February 28, 2023

Russillo takes a look at the best NBA duos among the contenders and ranks them (0:42) before he is joined by ESPN's Jeff Darlington to discuss some potential huge NFL QB moves, including Aaron Rodgers and Lamar Jackson, how the Dolphins will move forward with Tua Tagovailoa, what the Bears will get out of their no. 1 overall draft pick, and more (14:32). Then Ryen, Ceruti, and Kyle catch up for the first time after their live show in Salt Lake City, Utah (46:54), before answering some listener-submitted Life Advice questions (1:14:20). Host: Ryen Russillo Guest: Jeff Darlington Producers: Kyle Crichton and Steve Ceruti Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Loaded Tuesday pod on the new schedule Tuesdays and Thursdays Sundays with Bill we will talk top NBA duos more about the top two guys maybe the top three we're gonna talk Jeff Darlington he's got a ton of stuff on all the quarterbacks the the offseason stuff. As this starts to ramp up in the NFL, we do probably 30 minutes of story time recapping all the timeline events of Utah and a body shaming thing that we're dealing with right now. Pod being supportive of each other.

And then, of course, life advice. This episode is brought to you by Uber Eats. Winter is here, so be prepared and get almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. What do I mean by almost anything? Well, you can't get a ski slope, but dish soap, definitely doable. Sunshine, that's no. A bottle of wine, yeah.

And a snow day, again, no. But blueberry muffins with the delicious crumb topping, total yes. Get almost, almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. We have a lot to get to today, but I want to start with some NBA stuff.

We are in a phase now where we really need to stop ever wondering if we're going to have the big three again. It's not death to the big three forever. It will happen again. But we were accustomed to it because that's how business was done in the NBA. Going back to that Celtics team, we go back even further if you really wanted to. We go like the last recent

years here, the 08 Celtics. You got three Hall of Famers. You got Garnett, you Pierce, and Ray Allen. Then off of that, the Lakers' third guy with Kobe and Gasol felt different at different times, so it wasn't as definitive as Boston's and it certainly wasn't as definitive as everybody going to Miami with LeBron Bosch and Wade. And then you have Golden States, which people felt a little bit better about because it was homegrown until it wasn't homegrown. And then Durant jumped in for probably the greatest starting five that we've ever seen in NBA history. And then on the backside of that, Cleveland's like, okay, LeBron's going back. Kyrie's already in place, but we got to go ahead and grab Kevin Love. And the reason I bring this up is because it was really interesting in that Lakers run when they won the title, it was, well, who's their third guy going to be? That was the standard that we

held any team that actually thought they were going to be competing for a championship and ultimately winning a championship. It's like, you can't do it unless you have the third guy. And over that decade plus, that was true because you were also like, that's what you were competing with, right? Certain times we judge success or failures. It's like, okay, but what do I need to do to compete? And at that time, the amount of talent that was on the very, very top teams was extremely concentrated. And we've actually had to shift away from that. And the lesson in that Lakers title was that being here in L.A., it was the constant like, well, who are they trading Kuzma? And can you move Talon Horton?

Like, he feels untouchable. You know, who's the third guy? Who's the third guy? And then they never got the billboard third guy. They just were good enough to beat everybody else and win a title. And there you go. So up until recently, let's say right before the trade deadline and Phoenix acquiring Kevin Durant, it felt more like it was about the top two. And if I run through the league, I'm not going to do all 30 teams here, although there's probably a couple of playing teams

where I like their top two guys better than some of the teams that are actually now in the playoffs today more than their top two. I was looking at it as like, you need to, it's hard to win a championship without the established top five guy,

top six guys, kind of how I feel like it's six guys. But you don't need the third guy because you're not necessarily competing with the other team out there that exists, like in so many of those previous years that had that clear number three. You could even do the Toronto thing a bit

where Lowry, after some major playoff struggles, played better. Kawhi led the whole thing. Siakam is far better now than I think he was. The role was different. He's become a terrific player, but I don't know if he was the truly third guy. By the way,

if it weren't for injuries to Durant and Klay, then that team's not even winning it anyway. So I know that with Milwaukee and Drew Holiday, you could say, hey, maybe that's more

of a current three, but it doesn't feel that way now. So in the absence of like getting to Phoenix as probably being the answer to this, I want to run through all the top twos and then try to figure out

the best top five, maybe slash six of any of these teams because that feels like the new standard. That's the lesson maybe that I'm taking myself through and sharing with you in that looking at the top duos in the NBA is really what you're looking at and I wonder if that's a predictor of success here in the

playoffs. All right, Boston. I actually felt like I had the best two with Tatum and Jalen Brown prior to Phoenix adding Durant. Giannis and Drew. By the way, real quick on that Phoenix win by Milwaukee this weekend, there are two plays defensively from Drew Holiday at the end against Booker because that's who they were looking to go to. Booker actually hit a shot on one of them, but Drew cut Booker off.

I love Booker. And Booker couldn't get by him on one of the plays. And then there was another one where I wish teams did this more often. Booker was trying to run a switch at the top, getting Drew off of him. And Drew was like, no, I'm just not allowing this to happen. And the screen wasn't that great. That can also be part of the problem too. But there's just so many times where teams get bad switches

and just allow it to happen. Drew Holiday wasn't going to allow it to happen. And the stuff he does defensively on big possessions is so good. He's putting up huge numbers. where teams get bad switches and just allow it to happen. Drew Holiday wasn't going to allow it to happen. The stuff he does defensively on big possessions is so good. He's putting up huge numbers. Until Middleton is more established, because I think Middleton was the answer as the number two guy to Giannis as the number one. Right now,

it's clearly Drew Holiday. I don't really think there's much debate about that. Top two for Philly, pretty clear, Harden and Embiid. Cleveland, it's Mitchell and Garland. New York, it's Randall and Brunson, who have been awesome. That was a really nice win by them last night against Boston.

I know there's no Jalen Brown, but that game was like all New York from start to finish. Kind of annoying watching Boston being so frustrated the entire night, but whatever. Brooklyn, doesn't matter. They're one and four since the deadline.

I'm not going to do all 30 teams here. Miami, Bam and Butler. I was looking up some of the Bam clutch numbers. Nice win by them against Philly last night. Turnovers again. Late offensively for Philly. Did you like that last two minutes, Sixers fans? Did you? You didn't. Although Miami's

offense isn't anything to get too excited about. Bam has a plus 18 net rating in clutch games or in clutch time. Every clutch moment that he's that last two minutes score within five points in those scenarios, he's plus 18. Atlanta,

it's Trey and DeJounte. For Toronto, it's Siakam and Fred VanVleet. I think we probably like Barnes better long term. OG gets a lot of love, doesn't play enough. But VanVleet's our second leading scorer. He is under 40% from the year from the floor, but that's actually kind of right around where he's at career-wise.

Washington, this one's kind of interesting because Przingis actually is the leading scorer, and he's only missed nine games. But it feels like it's still kind of Beal and Kuzma. I could be wrong about that. I mean, Przingis has had a nice season here. Washington also is in this interesting group. I'll save that for the Portland point later about how many 20-point scores you have on a team.

I would argue that I'd take Orlando's Franz and Paolo show. By the way, how about those two last night? Paolo, three dribbles, or excuse me, three jumpers off the dribble late, late in the game to seal it offensively. And then Brandon Ingram couldn't get by Franz. He hit one shot on him that was like a desperation to end the shot clock. Franz's defense on the pruner, man. I love those two guys, but we've already talked about that, so we don't need to keep repeating it. So that's running through kind of the East contenders.

In the West, by the way, if you look at the standings in the West, the Western Conference is like the NFL outside of the Tier 1 teams and the bottom tier teams. It's like all those other 20 teams. The number two seed Grizzlies, all the way down to the number 13 seed Oklahoma City Thunder, every one of those teams, two through 13

in their last 10 are either 6-4 or 5-5 or 4-6. It's like the NFL. Denver, it's Jokic, Murray. Memphis, it's Jha and Jaron Jackson Jr., even though Bain is second leading scorer, 42% from three here again. I thinkokic, Murray, Memphis, it's Jha and Jaron Jackson Jr. Even though Bain is second leading scorer, 42% from three here again. I think defensively what Jaron Jackson does on top of everything else makes up

for the offense being behind Bain. I mean, we could get into it if we wanted to. The other thing with Memphis here, since Adams went out on January 22nd, their offense has been 24th. The defense has actually been better, but they're 5-8, but they're still hanging on to this two-seed, 2.5

up on Sacramento. The West road records, because that's one of the things that people knock on Memphis. 11-18 is a two-seed. Are you serious? I don't know what to do with Memphis during this run because I'm not going to write them off like so many other people are. I'm just not. There's other teams. Phoenix's

road record feels a little misleading because of the massive gaps they. I'm just not. And there's other teams. Like Phoenix's road record feels a little misleading because of the massive gaps they've had injury-wise. Dallas stinks on the road, 12-19. I mean, Golden State's now a 7th seed. They're only a game and a half

back of Phoenix at the 4th seed. I feel like everybody's writing Golden State off now, too. But they're atrocious on the road, 7-23. But what's real there as we wait for Steph's return? So, back to the duos.

We covered Denver, Memphis, Sacramento, it's Sabonis and Fox. By the way, Fox, keep checking these clutch numbers. 5.6 points per game in clutch situations. That's 1.3 points better than number two in the NBA, who's DeRozan. And then we have, I'm going to skip Phoenix

here, Kawhi and Paul George. Kawhi is insane again. Great win by Denver, by the way, the other night against the Clippers. Paul George, still, it's not like this is new to me, but he'll have little stretches during games where I'm like, damn, this guy is so good. But some of the dumb turnover stuff with him where it's like, what the hell are you doing?

He threw it out of bounds on one of those weird plays. He threw a bad lob late that didn't make any sense. Just some bad plays. He's had a few of those recently. Dallas, Luca, and Kyrie. Golden State, it's Steph and Klay. Steph's numbers, January and February, he's 26 a game, 44% from three. I know it doesn't always look Pete Klay anymore, but he's putting up some massive numbers for two straight months. Utah, it's Lowry, Clarkson. Clarkson's scoring has been terrific. Clarkson plays every night. Minnesota, I guess I'll just say Ant and Carl Anthony Towns, which then will lead to me feeling like I'm contradicting myself

in New Orleans with Ingram and CJ. Because if I put Cat there as the duo, then why didn't I do it for Zion? I don't know. Two weeks ago, we still heard we were weeks out from it. His last game was January 2nd. I know the Towns thing has gone on for a while here, but I think because at least I have the C.J. Ingram option,

I'll just save that for now. But clearly, Zion would be in this. But here's the headline. Don't worry about it, Pelicans fans. They're not going to be in my top five, so it doesn't even matter. New Orleans covered Portland. Dame and Simons, Grant. How about this? All three guys

are scoring 20 points per game for them. I thought, wait, how many teams are actually doing that? Well, Washington is with Beal, Kuzma, and Przingis. Miami, oddly enough, has three guys scoring 20 a game. Golden State does as well. New York would if R.J. Barrett were up from his 19.5 a game. Golden State does as well. New York would if R.J. Barrett

were up from his 19.5 a game. Philly would because Maxie's at 19.5 and Charlotte of all teams has three 20 point game scorers if you round up Oubre's 19.7. Then I also, just as an aside here, looked up 20 point scorers. This season

right now rounding up from 19.5 up, we have 46. 46 players are averaging 20 points per game this season. 10 years ago, using the same rounding up, 11. 10 years ago, 11 guys scored 20 a game. This year, 46. Finishing out the list, LeBron AD. The injury on LeBron sucks for a million different reasons

because I don't want to see it end like this. I know he's under contract. He's still going to be good next year, although the decline is real. That's why older guys are going to keep getting hurt. AD's been really good now here for a good stretch. He's 23-14

this month, two blocks per game, playing 33 minutes a night. i wanted to see what would happen because as much as i've been like i don't know you know jared vanderbilt who i fucking love this has been great for lakers fans getting a sense of this now russell's hurt i don't know if he's going to play on tuesday night with his ankle injury but lebron's now going to be out for a while i wanted to see what would happen because even though a healthy prime AD really makes them scary, I felt like there was a massive media rush to now anoint them as the true contender in the West.

I was like, they still have a lot of work to do here. Honestly, OKC with SGA and Giddy, I would take probably over a lot of duos. So what did we discuss here? It's Phoenix. You want to get in the injury bet? We've been talking about it all season long. I don't know how to do any of this NBA stuff without talking about

who's the better bet health-wise, players, teams, and all that kind of stuff. You're just going to talk yourself into circles. So the Phoenix health bet historically would not be great with KD Booker and Chris Paul. But the KD Booker combo at its peak, that's the best the NBA

has to offer. It does. I really don't think it's debatable. I put Boston 2. I'm putting Milwaukee 3. And then it kind of gets into this Denver-Murray thing, where who would you want Murray over? Would you take Murray over Donovan Mitchell? No.

I wouldn't. Would I take Murray over Donovan Mitchell? No, I wouldn't. Would I take Murray over Booker? No. Would I take Murray over Drew Holiday? I don't think I would. I don't think I would. Now, like we're doing for the next five years? Sure, I'll take Jamal Murray.

So that's kind of how I use the tiebreaker stuff here because I put Denver forward. At some point, you have to have Jokic in there. So I Phoenix, Boston, Milwaukee, Denver as my top four top twos. And then it came down to kind of a Clipper, Golden State, Philly thing. I can't believe I'm doing it,

but I'm putting the Clippers there. Probably just because Kawhi's been this good for this long. even doing it, but I'm putting the Clippers there. Probably just because Kawhi's been this good for this long. And I like that better than the gap between not Kawhi and Steph, but it's really

easy to do this. It's also part of some we're seeing people writing off Golden State. Can we watch them play with everybody again before we're saying it's totally done for them? That seems impossible for a lot of people to do here. But that's it. Yeah, I'm going Phoenix, Boston, Milwaukee, Denver, LA, Golden State.

The only one that feels like it has that top three based on the standard that I talked about at the beginning of this open is Phoenix. But even then, I would imagine with this version of Chris Paul that there would be a ton of pushback for even suggesting that, that maybe the Harden-Philly-Maxie one is a better three. Or if Middleton is healthy again, then that's your three. The point is that it's about the twos more than the threes now with the way the rosters are built for this season for the contenders.

Jeff Darlington of ESPN joins us. We're going to talk some NFL offseason stuff as you're getting ready. The news is already out there. Already my least favorite story of the offseason is Aaron Rodgers. The updates here that there's not a ton of conversation that's going back and forth. You had a tweet. I'm not going to read it. So just you start us off and kind of where we're at right now.

It was such a captivating tweet. It was such a captivating 280 characters that you can't even read it. No, I mean, look, honestly, the tweet said exactly what you're saying. And that is that it feels very much like these conversations are to navigate how they get out of this, as opposed to how they continue down their path together. Every conversation I keep having, you know, I feel like the Packers are sort of laying it out there like, oh, yeah, we, you know, last year we did this deal where we committed to each other for this year and next, and we expect Aaron to be back. And then you hear Brian Gutekunst, though, at the podium at the Combine saying, well, Jordan Love is ready to be a starter in this league. And Aaron Rodgers is great, but we have to have conversations before we know which way we're moving. So it's like, all right, where are we headed here? Because it sure feels like we're headed toward a point where everybody's tired of each other. So it's like, all right, where are we headed here? Because it sure feels like we're headed toward a point

where everybody's tired of each other and maybe it's just time to all move on. Yeah, I mean, it feels so much like the Favre thing. It feels exactly

like the Favre thing. It's unbelievable that you would have back-to-back quarterbacks from the same franchise play out in the most dramatic fashion ever where, you know,

if you're Favre, you feel like you have a lot of equity built up. But when you keep fucking with the franchise every offseason, the equity starts getting chipped away. And it's kind of like seeing a couple where you're like, I feel like you have a lot of equity built up, but when you keep fucking with the franchise every off season, the equity starts getting chipped away. And it's kind of like seeing a couple where you're like,

I can't believe they got, you know, they got divorced and you're like, yeah, but you're not, you're not living with it every single day. And now it's playing out the exact same way with Rogers where Rogers, I think,

look, had a bad year by his standards. I would bet on him having a really good year again at some point. I think he's still terrific. I actually think he loves football, to be honest with you, where there's some other dudes where you go, does this guy even want to play football? That's not a question for me at all with him. But I don't know. It's this relationship where it's like, how do you think you can be this self-centered in this dramatic every offseason? You just don't want to do this again anymore, man. So the lack of conversation

is kind of part of the playbook with all of this. And if they move on, I wouldn't blame them at all. At all. Just by saying like, this is because we're just going to do it again next year. We're just going to do it again next year.

So what's the point? This is three years in a row too, Ryan. And if we think about when the Packers decided they were finally comfortable with the idea of moving on from Favre, it was when they felt like they had a plan in place for the future. And everybody I talked to, look, I get why we would have eye rolls about Jordan Love at this point, but they feel so much more confident in Jordan Love right now than they did even a year ago at this time. And certainly two years ago. And you believe that, by the way, you don't think that's any kind of public. No, I do believe that. I will say that

I'm navigating, um, what I believe in don't believe right now. Uh, you know, you want to just believe everything that comes out but in situations like this you've got people's jobs on the lines and they start to say wonky things that you kind of have to be like okay what does this mean but i do i do believe privately and publicly that they believe that jordan love um see i and i do that because the logic behind it, that is their starter week one. If it's not Aaron, it's Jordan at this point. Like I don't see them necessarily going out and playing this carousel that's existing right now and finding someone other than Jordan love to be their starter.

So if you're willing to move on from Aaron Rogers right now, and you recognize that Jordan love is behind door number two to me that says that they feel pretty decent about him and that backs up what I'm hearing okay so then where do you think he goes what do you think happens what's the value so the Jets uh the Jets are absolutely in play 100 percent um they are even during their visit with Derek Carr, they remained intrigued with Aaron Rodgers. Doesn't mean that they don't like the idea of Derek Carr. They do. But I think that rightfully so. They're fascinated by a future Hall of Famer potentially being a plug and play quarterback for a good team. The Raiders, I think, Mark Davis's perspective makes sense.

It's the same way. Mark Davis was obsessed with getting Tom Brady. He wanted the splash. He wants the franchise guy. He wants to sell those tickets. He wants Las Vegas to become spoken about as a true NFL organization. But I don't know that Josh McDaniel, while I think respects Aaron,

I don't know if he will be as committed to the idea of going down this wormhole that the Packers find themselves in now. And then I think that there's going to be a third team. I think there will absolutely be a third team in the mix. What team that is, we'll see. Okay. Pricing-wise, any read? It can't be more than a third team in the mix. What team that is, we'll see. Okay. Pricing-wise, any read?

It can't be more than first. From a compensation standpoint, I would say because of the leverage Aaron holds in the contract that he did last year, it's going to be tough for Green Bay to hold any team hostage

for a ton of compensation. For me, I don't think that that's going to wind tough for Green Bay to hold any team hostage for a ton of compensation. So for me, I don't think that that's going to wind up being a hiccup in this equation. Okay. And this is one of those deals too, where it's all figured out ahead of time. Like they're not going to just be able to trade him where he doesn't want to go or because he has the contract. No, he's going to, that's the other thing like let's just throw out um i'm trying to like so so san francisco let's use san francisco as an example kyle shanahan is there matt laflora is there you know perceived great friends and all that backstory i don't necessarily see Matt Fleur wanting to trade Aaron Rodgers to, to boy, Kyle Shanahan.

I like, I can't perceive that, but I think it's the kind of situation where ultimately Aaron holds enough leverage that if he wanted to go there, he'd find a way. Um, and I think that that would be the case really for anywhere Aaron wanted to go.

It's going to be crazy if it ends up being the jets and then, you know, everybody can make the Vikings joke a year later. That's a good point. I think the Bears would be that joke this time, right? I mean, I understand the exact parallel, but

the Bears feel like what the Vikings were to Favre. The Bears right now feel like that's the team you could never imagine Aaron Rodgers playing for. So that's the team you could never imagine aaron rogers playing for so that's the team i picture him playing for in 2024 all right let's pivot to the bears because early returns this is playing out exactly the way i thought it would because this is what you have to do like you you tell everybody you're open for business you don't know if you actually are

um you have to play this delicate game of well, maybe we would take a quarterback because that's the driving price. You even maybe get a team to move up from two to one, which I think sometimes can be a waste. But it's a tough bluff. If you're the team at number two who likes the quarterback who's going to go number one and you

don't know who else is bidding on it, you hate the idea you have to move assets to just move up one spot for a team that may not even take that quarterback, but you're really bidding against everybody else that's in that position. So the public part of this is playing out very predictably. I can't even come close to telling you how it's going to end. I'm expecting to hear a variation of vagueness about what they may or may not do, how they feel. They have to be positive about fields, but they can't be so positive that they're completely dismissing the idea

they take a quarterback to keep that bidding going. So this is all very predictable, but I can't predict an end. No, and the closer I think, Ryan, we get to the point where we hear that there's more than one team interested in the pick is when the Bears can be like, yeah, by the way, we love Justin Fields,

you know, which may be behind closed doors. They're like, Hey, Justin, you got to roll with us on this. We love you. We're keeping you. We're not drafting another quarterback. We might say some things that might make you feel otherwise, but we're doing this to get biggest hall possible. I don't know if you do that or not, or you feel like you need to. But the second you have the Colts and the Texans and probably even more so a team that's really would have to move up like Carolina and like really start to give up assets. Once you have that, you've got all the leverage you need. You no longer even need your own facade that you could draft another quarterback so and i think we're almost there um they stand in an unbelievable position

though don't they like they could in theory i think it was kuiper who was saying they could in theory trade out of one to two and then they could trade out of two to four or somewhere else. Because if you have three teams looking to get two of those quarterbacks, I mean, you've got yourself potentially two big trades in a row that could ultimately also wind up with Chicago getting a defensive player that they cover. It might be the best first overall pick um you know in a draft that's pretty good but top heavy with quarterbacks that uh that i can remember yeah then you're really starting to talk about you know adding all these other assets and

then if you look at the overall rankings like when you look at the evaluation of the players whether it's shaman carter will anderson those are the two players that go back and forth with the highest overall grade. Right. And the fields thing, I don't know. I don't know. I think it was kind of weird last year where it was so much fun. It was so exciting that then on social media, he kind of turned into something where I was like, okay, but to me, it's still an unanswerable question. I don't know the other part of it.

And the fact that he kept getting hurt. He was getting his ass kicked, too, because he was so competitive and he was so physical and he was so good at running that then I started worrying about that. It would be weird. I mean, if you're the Bears, imagine what it's like, though, if you're evaluating this saying, going, hey, we love Bryce Young. We think he's 10 times better than Fields. But we're going to make this decision because we feel like we can't move off of Fields this quickly. That's the part of the job that gets really tough. And most of the time, you start second-guessing yourself like that. That's when you end up getting replaced anyway. Except, again, the Bears find themselves in a great spot because no matter how much you find yourself falling in love with Bryce Young, it's not like you're looking at Patrick Mahomes physique or Andrew Luck or one of these guys that look. Luck is the right one here, because if it was the luck type prospect, then you go, hey, we're just taking them because we're not. You know what I mean? You don't know when you're going to be in position to do it again. You could do it if it was Trevor Lawrence, honestly.

I think that no matter how much you fall in love with the potential of Bryce Young, you can look at your quarterback last year getting his ass kicked and say, we're not in a position to even put Bryce Young on this team without the assets to build around him. And if you can justify that in your head and move off of it and convince the fan base of that, it's a win-win anyway. And here's the other part of it. So you collect all those assets, right?

You don't need to spend them all this year. So you get like two, three first round picks in this. And now next year, you find out Justin Fields works or not. And then you can decide from there. So again, I think that they're in a spot where even if they are not fully committed and fully in love with Justin Fields, you can keep him. You can defend your decision there as opposed to your point. You go take Bryce Young and you ship Justin Fields off and Fields works out and Bryce doesn't, you're fired. You're done.

You are searching for a new job. And as much as people don't want to consider that, these are human beings with million-dollar jobs in these general manager positions, and you better believe that they are thinking about self-preservation. Yeah. And to be entirely fair to Fields, which I feel it's necessary for me to do, because I sit here and talk about the uncertainty. They didn't do him any favors. They did him none. Not all the sack numbers are on the offensive

line there, but I cannot fathom when you have the free quarterback on the rookie contract, get him a one. It's like you have an extra cap number that nobody else has. It's why I love what Philly did with did with hurts and they go we're not screwing around like we're going to figure it out with this guy and i i just don't know how it's kind of like the new england

chicago thing like how do you not have that number one guy that you can pay for now and help get some confidence from the guy that you're hoping to run your franchise for 10 years. But it's the beauty of what, again, what the Bengals did. Brandon Bean in Buffalo kind of took what was perceived to be a jab at the Bengals for being like, yeah, but they got a wide receiver and a quarterback. We don't want to be in a position where we can take a wide receiver that high. They got a wide receiver and a quarterback in Jason Burrow on rookie deals. The Bears now find themselves in that spot. They can find out what they have in Justin Fields in a way that you can't always do. I agree completely. You got to get the one, but you could do it the way the Eagles did with A.J. Brown and Devontae Smith too. I will say this. The other side of this is everybody's like, well, Justin Fields, look at Jalen Hurts. Justin Fields is the next Jalen Hurts. Just because Jalen Hurts worked out does not mean that Justin Fields will. And I feel like that's starting to become a narrative that exists to the point where it's like we need to slow up a little bit. Jalen Hurts is a bit of an outlier what happened to him this past year it doesn't mean that you know

a quarterback who struggled one year is all of a sudden just going to automatically like make the leap to next yeah one of my all-time favorites ever is the peyton manning thing where every quarterback that throws a million interceptions in his first year they're like well he had 26 touchdowns and 28 interceptions you're like okay cool now you just have to turn to Peyton Manning now the Hurts thing is it's it's weird because the Hurts development is incredible you know like the doubts that I had early on I think were fair I watched him at Bama then in Oklahoma like everybody's putting up these huge numbers and I felt like the early version of Hurts was kind of the guy that I thought Alabama had and I was like I'm not sure. And now it's like, it's done.

It's awesome. And it's a credit to him. Guy's fucking awesome. You're right. Like the next dude who's not good. Every fan. And this is really. Right, right.

It comes back to kind of like the thing that I find myself becoming more and more annoyed with. Is your argument. Because no fan base ever wants to think they have the wrong guy. Like no one wants to go. Yeah. We took the wrong guy. You're going to constantly argue in favor of what's beneficial to you and the franchise.

So, all right, we'll move on from that. Um, Tua. Speaking of which, what's going on? But I mean,

there's a great example, by the way. Um, I'm down here in South Florida and, and you talked about like a fan bases, Speaking of which, what's going on? out there that like, yeah, everybody wants to see Tua succeed. Great dude. Does it the right way. Good leader, all that kind of stuff. I think it's okay to also wonder if, and beyond the concussion thing, if he can stay healthy, if he can stay on the field. If you go into this season with Tua as your starter, and I do believe that the Dolphins are going to do that. Talk to enough people in the organization who I thoroughly trust, who are like, this is who our guy is in 2023. That you potentially get to the point middle of the season, just like this past one, where your season gets held hostage by an injury to to to it. And that sucks. But it is a possibility. And it does make me wonder, I guess we'll find out, you know, again, I thought that

this past year was the year you find out. But I guess we'll find out once and for all this year if that's the case. So what happens here on the contract part of it then? I mean, I don't think they extend them. It's probably going to wind up being like a daniel jones situation where you uh a little different because they picked up you know yeah they're not going to decline the option right no but but a scenario where all of a sudden it's like okay we're gambling a little bit here we might have to pay him more as a result of not extending him but

feels like a decent gamble same Same thing with Daniel Jones. Pretty good. I mean, yeah, it played out because you got the right coach, but I understand that gamble. It doesn't always make the most sense. With Dak Prescott, it felt like you could have got that deal done sooner and avoided maybe overpaying a little bit if you just kind of found a middle ground. With someone like Daniel Jones and Tua, I would go into those situations like, we're not even thinking about it. We've got to see more. It's a business. Sorry if you're offended by it. We've got to know that this is something that's for the good of the long-term of the organization. I sense that's going to be the direction they take, but I don't know that for sure.

And for the math on the TUA option, they don't have to make a decision on the 2024 option where you get that huge spike until May 1st anyway. I mean, nothing's changing between now and then. I don't foresee that anyway. I shouldn't say that. Shit. I say Lamar Jackson is all of a sudden available like do you consider that okay well great great transition

let's talk about lamar uh we i i think i've talked with like three or four nfl guests about it uh this is uncharted territory perhaps um here's here's my kind of overall the nfl could have always had guaranteed contracts. And when I was a kid, I'm like, yeah, you can't have guaranteed contracts. Guys get hurt all the time. All right. And then you start understanding the CBAs a little bit more. Granted, I'm a little more into it because I cover sports for a living and talk about it nonstop. And when I really started thinking about it and I would talk to somebody, I'd be like, you know, you just would structure everything different. You know, you wouldn't have these fake four and five and six year part of the number. You would have a

signing bonus. The cap is far more malleable with the NFL than I think people realize year to year and how you can work around it. Maybe that part of the flexibility would go away. Yeah, I guess. But when you look at the way contracts are done for a lot of the players, especially the guys that matter, it's like, okay, what's the cash? What do you make in the first three years? So I think bidding for some of these players. And so there's still all these advantages ownership in the front office have like, like not having true free agency. And I'm all for like, I always do like, Hey, if Andrew Luck had been, cause he was coming up and he got a ton of guaranteed money, but look at all the guaranteed guaranteed money like we're getting closer and closer to that with the quarterbacks and so if lamar wants to be a pioneer for this i don't know what he's willing to risk to be this kind of pioneer uh maybe a little nba

in him which i think is what we're gonna which we've already seen from quarterbacks going you know i'm just gonna start having an agent sniff around which is a little different for lamar because he works a little differently here going hey look, look, I'll sit out the year, but I already know this team's going to give me all the guaranteed money. I think this is the direction we were heading in. I'm just wondering what Lamar would be willing to give up, whether that's sitting out an extended period of time to get what I think he eventually would get. What's so funny about it is the guy, the thing that he already did, which is the polar opposite of what we're talking about, is what makes me think he's willing to do what we're talking about, which is last year,

he wasn't even returning calls. Steve Bishotti came out and said, literally, everybody kept asking, are they going to extend Lamar? And Bishotti said, it's not the job of the general manager to keep calling the quarterback and asking him if he wants the extension. Lamar wasn't even returning the calls last year. It wasn't even getting to that point until much later in the offseason.

And he was all along like, I'm playing. If you don't extend me or not, I'm playing and I'm just going to get closer to free agency. Because he's a guy of principle to a degree that maybe people can't necessarily understand. When it comes to a guy fighting the fight for the guaranteed contract at this time, coming off the heels of the Deshaun Watson contract, Lamar Jackson, to me, is the perfect person at the perfect time for the Players Association to make this unprecedented step.

I don't know how it ends. I really don't. If they put the non-exclusive tag on him, do I think a team is more than willing to give up two first round picks? Hell yeah. No problem. That's nothing for Lamar Jackson. But are they willing to give him the contract, the offer sheet, the guaranteed money that the Ravens are then not willing to match? And is that going to make Lamar Jackson happy? That is the most fascinating storyline, more so than Aaron Rodgers, by the way, of the next, I guess, month. Lamar Jackson has the chance to set a new standard in the NFL, Lamar Jackson has the chance to set a new standard in the NFL, turning what Deshaun Watson is as an outlier into what Lamar and Deshaun would be into a trend. Right, and then what every other quarterback at a certain level, certain status would expect.

And here's the other thing that you said. If you put the tag on him and then you go, okay, well, how do we structure an offer here that discourages Baltimore from wanting to do this. If he hadn't missed a good chunk of games the last two seasons, then I think it's a no-brainer. It still may be a no-brainer for another team to structure something here going like, we don't have an answer at the position, and we're getting somebody who at worst is in that second tier of quarterbacks. What's the holdup? Also, by the way, I do think, I would love to know, I mean, I'm not, this is not like an accusation of collusion,

which I know people are quick to make when it comes to guaranteed contracts. But I would love to know, I'd love to know what the owners think about it. I would love to know if owners are like, hell no, we ain't doing it. We're not going down that road. And if they really were as pissed at Jimmy Haslam, because it feels like they would be. Is it to a state of collusion or is it just like, you know, they're all like, that's just not a good idea for our organization. But my point

there is Lamar Jackson is a blockbuster. He is a ticket seller. He is a franchise changer. I mean, is he not, right? Like, is he not one of these guys that can change the dynamic of an organization, even if you have to build around him and do all the things that are maybe complicated from a football standpoint? Well, yeah, I definitely think that there are

some minor challenges with Lamar that are different than, let's say, the clear top five guys. Ryan, I think they're major challenges. But then I always think of, well, we're on the same page here, though, because then I always think of everybody's quarterback decision is influenced by their previous quarterback relationships. Yep. Everybody's quarterback decision is influenced by their previous quarterback relationships. Yep. And so if, if you're one of the franchises that goes,

we've got a rock star coming in here. Yeah. We're going to be worried about the health. Yeah. We have to change over the offense. It'd be nice to get him a couple of fucking playmakers on the outside. Cause you know, Baltimore didn't seem to be super interested in that.

And maybe that speaks to where they wanted to prioritize the roster build with somebody like Lamar. But again, it's just nice to have a number one that you can trust all the time. You know what I'd love to see? You know what I'd love to see him? Honestly, this is the fan in me. This is not

the reporter. I don't know. I haven't talked to them about it. The Dolphins. Can you not imagine? I mean, is that not the perfect way to potentially... Like Tyreek Hill, Jalen Waddle that offense the speed mike mcdaniel and like you talk about if you are if you are in the back of your head like is two of the long-term answer do we need to move on remember when tim tebow was with the broncos and everybody's like we love tebow how could you get rid of them the pittsburgh

steelers hey by the way, Peyton Manning? Oh, see you later, Tim. Bye, Tebow. You know, Peyton Manning comes in. It's the kind of guy, Lamar Jackson is that kind of guy. The question is, does an organization, are they swayed by that? If they are, that's the type of situation

where I think you suddenly have a team saying, we'll give them the guaranteed money. We're good with that. I'm rooting for him to pull this off. I don't know how it happens. And so you think, by the way, on the tag thing, like if they franchise them, then we're talking about somebody who just goes,

well, then I'm out, which would pay him. Like the franchise tag for the money to the player, even though I've already talked about how much I think it's way worse than people realize. know you can kirk cousins it where you can also use it to your advantage if you're out there playing all the time but you know again i still don't like the mechanism especially not for lamar and it's totally different than kirk no but i mean but the exclusive non-exclusive part of it can we just because i i think that's important to kind of clear that part up so so real quickly without diving too deep in the weeds the exclusive tag is more money like 13 million

dollars like 45 million that's uh it keeps any team from being able to come in and negotiate with your player the non-exclusive is 32 million dollars uh but it a lot it opens the door for another team to offer up two first round picks. They would have to give up and then put in an offer sheet that the Ravens would have a chance to match. So, you know, the question here becomes, are the Ravens willing to pay the $45 million to get the exclusivity? To which I say, you shouldn't even be worried about how much the tag costs. Like I wouldn't even be thinking about the idea that Lamar Jackson is playing on the tag for me as an organization.

And for him as the quarterback that he's kind of shown us to be, it's either a long-term deal or a tag and trade. So to me, it's not about the money and we sure as shit know we ain't going to play under $32 million non-exclusive tag. So I think basically what you have to ask yourself is, maybe we want to see what other teams are going to do. Maybe we want to see if a team's going to come in.

Because if no teams do come in and offer him the kind of contract that he's expecting, maybe Lamar Jackson suddenly understands what his market is. I think that you could get more than two first round picks if you put the exclusive on him and then do a tag and trade. But I guess my point to all this, it gets a little nuanced and a little in the weeds, but the Ravens really do have a really interesting decision with those tags. A lot of pros and a lot of cons on each side. Yeah. And reading between the lines towards the end of the season, Harbaugh either was just being competitive meathead about it.

And I think Harbaugh's a really good coach, by the way, too. You too. But he gets pretty emotional. He's very emotional. And it was weird. And it felt like this was a franchise that was calling out their guy a little bit. And I don't know what the injury was or wasn't. I don't either. So I don't know if that's where that was coming from and then again if you're like critical

saying maybe lamar i don't know if he was hurt or not so i wouldn't suggest i mean lamar whatever you think about him and you probably know this because he's a florida guy like he's just everybody likes him he you know i'm telling you man he is the ultimate like i get well i i understand people might see all this contract stuff and the fans get nothing turns them off more than this stuff lamar is like the the best he made the most authentic genuine person like i've been around him in some context where i'm just like dude you you you, you, it's almost like adorable. Like he's just so like authentic and genuine about, like, I remember him looking at a stat sheet one time in the locker room after a game and be like, damn, I did that. Like, he was like, I did that.

It was like this humble, like he was awed by himself in a way that felt humble. And it was, you just see these moments with him where you're like whatever you think him to be when it comes to this contract stuff that he doesn't hire an agent and all that i think he's just a man of really deep principle who's saying i can live without it but i'm gonna do my damn just to live with it okay last one you are the brady whisperer any chance any chance i know i mean no i do not think there's any chance what i think it was like coming from like new england all of a sudden that like you know maybe robert craft was trying to get people to think that he could get tom back like that i mean it's not happening i i could never imagine brady

going back there to be like he's not going back to first of all he's not going back to new england um but like where where i think any of that was coming from where people were like maybe he will come back he's not coming back i think his attempt to put in the retirement papers people were like yeah but that doesn't mean anything it's like whatever you need to do to move on um i mean i it's funny to me because everybody wants to be like, time for Brady to go. And then he's gone. Everybody's like, is he going to come back?

But Tom Brady is retired and will stay that way. That is Jeff Darlington of ESPN. And you can follow. Did you feel how nervous I was saying that? What, about the Brady part? Yeah, just. You've been on it, man. I mean, you caught a ton of shit in the beginning when you said before everybody that he was leaving.

And then you had the retirement. A ton of shit the whole way, Ryan. Yeah, and you were right every time. Yeah. Was there something you were wrong about that maybe I did? Okay. Yeah. I don't remember.

I don't remember you being wrong. No, because the craft thing is just as close here. The craft angle was really funny. Like, think about it, that it felt like when Brady was on his way out of New England, craft was somebody close to craft. Maybe it was just Robert. I don't know. Right. It was like, is there any way you can just sort of post that I had nothing to do with this?

Yeah. Dude. like is there any way you can just sort of post that i had nothing to do with this yeah when he went when he went back up to new england when tom went back up to new england for the uh patriots bucks game biggest regular season game ever and craft had like he had like the camera crew on the field like waiting for brady to to go out there and greet him and he had like the whole crew around him and brady like kind of caught wind that the camera crew was out there and greet him. And he had like the whole crew around him and Brady like kind of caught wind that the camera crew was out there. He's like, we're not doing that. Like we'll, we'll meet up in the, in like the locker room area. Like Kraft wants Kraft. They have a great relationship. They love each other deeply, but like,

that was never going to be enough to overcome the rest of it. Like he was not anytime you ever heard anything this past year about potentially him going back to New England, I can tell you matter of factly, that was never a consideration whatsoever. Well done. Yeah. Thanks, Jeff.

Always a pleasure. Thanks for having me. Thanks for having me. It's been a while for the boys, so I figured we'd just sort of catch up. We have a few stories to tell as well before we do life advice. So, you know, if you don't want to listen to this part, just go to life advice. What's up, guys?

Good to be back. We've been off for a while. Yeah, we have. We have. It is good. We are Tuesday, Thursday. I know people were concerned on Monday morning. So let's just get to it.

What's up, Kyle? Kyle's got some stuff to get off his chest. Great trip, really. Was laughing the whole time. Was it? The boys. Yeah, yeah. For me, it was, I think.

Besides the skiing. I was terrible at skiing. A bunch of bruises. I fell off the trail once. Snowbird. That's not a joke, Mountain. Yeah, that's big time skiing stuff. So, yeah, I don't know. I, you know what? I trusted the guys, my gut at the bar when they

were talking about, we'll make it a, we'll make a trip out of it. Maybe we'll ski once. And my gut was telling me at the bar, like, don't go skiing. But you know, peer pressure got to me and I was like, I want to be able to say yes. It would feel good to say yes. Yeah. I'll go skiing with you, man. Um, it was, it was terrible. I was walking down the mountain it was like uh i kept putting my skis on falling and uh you know some old people were trying to teach me how to ski on the fly that wasn't had you ever skied before yeah i think i was probably like 12 last time and i was like i remember that pizza wedge that's that yeah that should be fine um yeah i was falling backwards which people had never seen before like how'd you fall backwards on skis man usually i've never seen that i had the had these weird uh bruises on my hands from

not letting go of the poles when i was falling so i just i just uh it was it was crazy which day did you ski monday after the show oh so you rode that out how many nights were you in utah um friday night saturday night sund Sunday night, Monday night. So yeah, we left Tuesday afternoon. When I was hanging out with Kyle Saturday night after the show and after all the festivities, I think you had said what? Sunday was steak day? Yeah.

And then Monday was ski day. Yeah. Steaks on Sunday, skiing on Monday. So it sounds like a great time for you. Yeah, it was. What did you think when you showed up on Fridayiday to the to the frolic room crew at bongo lounge uh it was exactly the bar that i thought you would you would bring me to essentially it was you know i was a homely place i'll say that they have what three dollar fifty bud light

350 bud lights eight dollar pictures no windows it was it was a good spot some guy ordered late night del taco um yeah that somehow smelled terrible i didn't understand like i actually love del taco but it smelled awful i don't know what the bar smelled bad too though that's what it was but it was a good spot and you know yeah we i think we're out to like one or so i was a little bit i was feeling a little bit weird the next day because i had drinks with ryan in park city we can get into this kyle i don't you know i don't want to you know i don't really want to make anybody pissed off but had a couple drinks in park city with ryan then took the 40 minute uber to kyle at the bar like a friend lake city so like i saw everybody that night but i don't know kyle like

we're how are we feeling right now because i know there were you were kind of in your feelings again a little bit on saturday night just to just to timeline it just to timeline it before Kyle goes off. I got to Utah on Wednesday, right? Was it Wednesday? Wednesday, Thursday? Yeah, Friday. Because I paid for two nights on my own. No big deal. I skied for the first time ever, really, in my life.

I just said, fuck it, I'm doing it. I took a lesson, afternooned it. Woodward, very in and out, quick, easy to Park City. Not Snowbird. I wasn't ready for that kind of stuff. And then we taped Friday because I remember I was kind of getting kicked out of the hotel room to switch and then I ended up staying at that one,

which is another issue. And then Saruti came out to dinner with me on Friday because Kyle got in so late on Friday. All right. We had a couple of drinks at the no name bar. We went to, oh, shucks with Rudy where actually there was one night I actually hung out there years ago. A.K.A. Shucky's Shuckles. What do you call it?

Shuckers. Yeah. A.K.A. Shuckers. Not not these two bars. By the way, I mean, these two bars back to back next to each other, like the people watching in no name is unbelievable. Fantastic, yep. And then, oh, shucks, had Kyle written all over it.

And so I was like, look, big show on Saturday, big show on Saturday. We had not a great dinner, by the way, and then shut it down, ready to attack the the day win the day on saturday and then did the show which we can get into and then kyle i was like all right tonight's the night and then i can't believe it i couldn't actually believe that that was not the night and then it was not the night i went home and then i even went to park city was like am i gonna grab a beer i'm here like go and i go nope after 40 minutes in the Uber, I was like, I got

on the gold and I was, I was in bed by, I don't know, 11. I just, you know, again, it's just those nights when you get older and you're like, I'm in, I'm in, I'm in. And then you're like, no, I'm not. And there it's, that's where we are. Kyle and I have not spoken since this. And I know there's a lot of bad blood. So take over now, Kyle. That one, I couldn't believe that one. I could not believe. So Rudy could probably see, I mean, I had been drinking since probably, I don't't know an hour and a half after the show that day so I think I saw Rudy at like I don't know what like nine or something I was I was walking to the ringer NBA show yeah I randomly saw you and then I randomly saw Kyle and his buddies

outside of this bar and I'm like dude what are we doing and he's like I'm like yeah we're still going home early and I think think you were bummed. All over my face, dude. I was devastated. I could not believe it. I was like, maybe we'll see Ryan at the show or maybe after. Like, when do you think we would see Ryan?

He's like, oh, newsflash, dude. Ryan, Ryan's not coming. And I mean, you know what it was? It was really, I think it was the that's how I found out sort of deal. You know? I could have told you after that show wrapped that Ryan wasn't going to be out that night.

Yeah, well, I just, I don't know. I was having a great day. And that just sort of like for everything to a screeching hawk. I was like, oh, the cherry on top of this day is going to be beers. Denver style at a bar late night or Utah. Well, it was Denver style. That was really the only time I've actually hung out with you was Denver when we went to whatever that place was. And after the show with your buddies, Herb's. Yeah. So I was like, out with you was Denver when we went to whatever that place was after the show with your buddies. Herbs.

Herbs, yeah. So I was like, that was great. Looking forward to that. This could be a great topper on my day. Herbs didn't know what to do with us that night because they were like, wait, why are there 20 plus deep dudes hammered? I will say what's going on? A lot of people were

tweeting because Ryan tweeted out the photo of when we went to Chick-fil-A, which was like 20 miles outside the city because we just couldn't find anything to eat before the all-star game people like oh classic they left kyle at home again that was not our fault okay kyle had some plans you were doing things during the day so like don't i don't want to be blamed for kyle not getting the invite to chick-fil-a or not chick-fil-a to uh raising canes which was well worth it by the way but you were busy most of the day so it's not like we were going to see you during the day, but it was all kind of like running to, alright, we're going to hang out that night.

And then, you know. I would have taken a day hang, to be honest with you. That would have been fine if I knew that's what I had to do to get you before Ryan escaped to Park City. Like, that would have been fine with me. But, you know, I just trusted that later would be the time. If you were like, hey, 4 o'clock, let's go somewhere.

We don't even have to drink. And I'd be like, fine, I'll put, pump the brakes on drinking. I'll take a break, uh, go bowling or something.

I don't know what you guys were doing, but, um, yeah, it's all right. Uh, there'll be more shows, I guess.

And, I'll just have to keep better tabs on, uh, on Ryan before I go start having fun by myself. My question is, why do you want to hang out with me that bad? Because I hang out with most of my podcast dudes. Everybody that I produce,

it's just a nice element. It's sort of like a comedian getting material. I don't know what it is. It's just something I do with people whose podcasts I produce. I don't know. Just forgive me for having a process here. No, I don't think it's weird. I don't know just forgive me for having a process here but uh

no i don't think it's weird kind of gumming up the works man with you i i but see here's the thing you had an awesome weekend the entire time so i was gonna add to that you have your goons roll in and you have a goon squad with you like this crew is it is it's like my denver guys are like what's going on with kyle's crew and i was like i don don't know. I was like, originally, I thought they liked the podcast. And I was like, it has nothing to do with me. It has nothing to do with the podcast. These guys, they just mount up. The one guy's never heard it. Yeah.

The one guy's never heard it. Cerruti, the dude who fell down the stairs night one, never heard the podcast. That doesn't surprise me. He might listen. So nobody went, no one from the crew went missing this time, but a guy fell down the stairs the first night. Immediately.

He found Bongo Lounge. He showed up at like, I think before I even took off, he sent a group of texts like, I found this awesome place by the Airbnb. It's called Bongo Lounge. It's Frolic Room 2.0. It's great.

And then so I get there at like 10 o'clock that night because I got in at like eight. I probably got there like 45 minutes before Cerruti did. So I get there and I see the guy's still got his fucking bags on the floor, like his bags from the plane still on the floor of the bar. I was like, oh, my God, you didn't leave, huh? He started getting like by the time Cerruti got there, he was getting a little Jack Sparrow. He was doing we called him Jack Sparrow because he was doing the hand things and the, why is the

rum gone? He wasn't making a ton of sense. Now I'm bummed out I missed this. It actually was a great time. I go back with Cerruti. Where's the rum? We called him Jack Sparrow because he got very handy with his...

Sure. I go back with Cerruti to the hotel, probably like, I don't know what time that was. It was... The bar was going to close, I think. And then I just... The next morning, it turns out, he fell down all the stairs.

Like, after they put him... They put him to bed. It was like one of those, like, you had to be put to bed nights. They put him to bed, and then they're all sleeping. And then you just hear this guy fall down a full flight of stairs. Then they put him to bed nights they put into bed and then they're all sleeping and then you just hear this guy fall down a full flight of stairs uh then they put him to bed again uh and then i think he was

like up randomly fully clothed again at like four in the morning standing over somebody so he had a he was just there for a long time uh but then then he he got back on track and uh this is probably the first time he'll ever listen to this podcast because he was like uh what uh what are you gonna say about this so that was his first night he found bongo lounge and now his new nickname is bongo the clown yeah saturday was was like all right got to the show everything worked out both kyle and sruti were awesome on stage by the way so uh big time like the fact that you know even though you're talking on the

podcast and everything it is a different vibe when you're in front of a few hundred people and it's like all right here we go and you guys were both terrific man so i was i was pumped that everything went so well and then there was really high vibes very positive after the show because we all felt really good about it the marketing thing worked out that was great we'll get to some of the criticisms here a little bit later but i uh although it was there was a slight mystery that was like somebody brought me um some gear and somebody stole some of it which was weird one of the crew was stolen one of it because who else is back there right then it wasn't so much that i couldn't replace the gear it was weird. One of the crew must have stolen one of it because who else is back there? Right. Then it wasn't so much that I couldn't replace the gear. It was the

fascination of who would have the balls to go. I'm actually just going to steal a piece of this. It was a hoodie and pant combo and they only stole what? The hoodie? Yeah. It matched and they stole the hoodie. So then I was kind of like, good show, great crowd, very happy. Who's the person

that stole the hoodie out of this group? I just don't think Laurie Markkinen's crew would be the ones that would steal it. So that kind of left like, I don't know. No one knows. We'll never know. And I can replace it very easily. So anyway, then Cerruti and I are trying to find a place. We go to Raising Cane's because it's All-Star Saturday.

It's going off. Everybody, the city's packed. You're not going to just walk into a place and sit down we went to two places it was a joke it wasn't going to happen Kyle was with his crew uh was not going to the stuff and then Saruti and I grabbed the media passes and then go in and I think whatever happened to you Saruti in Toronto where you just sat down with Adnan and got to watch the three-point contest and dunk contest and that that was just going to happen again I'm going to tell you I think you may have had like a moment there I was bummed right so Rudy's walking around like let's find some seats I'm like I don't think it's going to work that way we only have the option of going up to the media area which is the

halo of these arenas where when you're up there it actually sucks to watch anything so we just milled around the concourse I wasn't going to walking, looking for seats that I knew I was going to be kicked out of again immediately. Saw Verno. So we just sort of hung out. Saw Verno for a while. Yep. Saw Verno. We saw a bunch of different people. We grabbed a beer there. And that's when it started turning. Because I was like, now I'm just standing in the concourse having a beer

with Cerruti and another friend. And I'm not watching any of this stuff except for on a TV monitor of the stuff that's happening there because we don't have anywhere to sit. We don't want to go anywhere. So then it started turning. And then your boys started getting a little old. And I'm like, man. And then, by the way, Bill hits me up and was like, are you ready to go tomorrow for Sundays? Which I told him I was good on Sunday.

But then he wanted to do it. When I got off the plane in L.A., I was podcasting less than an hour later. So once that started kicking in, I'm like, I was podcasting less than an hour later. So once that started kicking in, I'm like, I'm definitely not going out. I have to fucking prep in the morning and on the plane, and I'm taping it like one o'clock. It's out. And the funny thing is I was like, man, I'll feel a little guilty if I go out in Park City tonight after I just blew off everybody but then when the guy was pulling into this like i put in you know main street and i was like just take a left here and that was it that was it and i was watching i was watching the boys sluicing on discovery within five minutes of walking in

the door all right that's i i forgot i basically clocked out when i walked off stage and hit stop on the recorder i basically clocked out until sunday yeah like two days ago so i and we were definitely in different in different modes i didn't i didn't think about that the sunday thing definitely when i knew i was like oh we're not even doing it you know because again the work comes first and uh you know what without the sunday pod i'm not gonna lie to you though i not going to lie to you and say I want to meet up with all these guys who've been ripe all day long. Saruti and I

are going to have one beer and it's by 1030 and then going out in Salt Lake. You liked Utah way more than you thought you would, correct? Yeah, I'd like to see both Denver and Utah not in the wintertime. That'd be cool. You are Mr. Utah. You're Sundance Kyle. I only go cool. Oh, wait, you've been, you are Mr. Utah. You're Sundance Kyle.

I forgot. Yeah, I only go during Sundance, but I never been to really Salt Lake before. It was, so I've only been to Sundance when, you know, it's sort of like the circus comes to town and that's not what I think Park City is normally. So, uh, you know, all the streets are closed and there's barriers everywhere in Park City. And so, uh, Salt Lake seemed like a little bit more of a normal place. It seemed like I was in like a fucking fantasy, like adventure park or something. Both times I went to Sundance. So it was nice to see like real hung out with a lot of real Utah old guys at Bongo Lounge.

That was cool. Got to see the regular type of dude. Talked a lot about the weather, stuff like that. It was just I felt like I was I felt like I was part of the real Salt Lake there. So I liked it Well the good news is Met the governor Yeah the governor of Utah big fan

Big fan the good news though for you guys Is this is not the last chance I mean I know you guys Live in the same city but You know we've got potentially some Stuff in the hopper maybe Baton Rouge trip in the Fall maybe some other college football stuff so The stars will align. We'll get Ryan and Kyle to hang out at some point.

I'm sure it won't be at Baton Rouge. Ryan knows too many people there, I think. No, I think the shellback show is going to happen. I think it's just out of sheer respect for Manhattan Beach and what shellbacks is. Because the setup, when they did site surveys for it, every site survey came back. This is years ago. They were like, it's not the greatest layout because it's this kind of one shot. And here's the thing is I think that's part of the attraction to it is we're not going to be able to sell that many tickets at all.

I just think it needs to be done. I think it needs to be acknowledged. And I'll talk with them about it. I think they'll be fine, especially if you're doing it early. And, you know, again, I'm not making a decision for them on this podcast, but we need to just do

the Manhattan Beach one again and do it at a place that everybody wants to go to when they come to town. So wait, that place that we did it a couple years ago with Bill and Cowherd is no longer there.

It was Shark's Cove? Yeah, the place is gone. The place is gone. That was a good place. Okay. All right. Well, perfect for that kind of venue perfect for that kind of setup um but they uh got taken over by esperanza which is terrific by the way if you are in the area and one of nice restaurant although they had this

awesome upstairs deal and i guess it's been closed because they don't have an elevator which is weird because when it first opened like that that was, that was sort of the spot up there, but whatever. All right. So, uh, a couple other quick Utah things we need to clean up on here. Um, I've seen the videos, I've seen the angles. I look fat as shit. Oh man. I, again, it's a bad, it's a bad, bad look bad look two things i had the same reaction looking at myself on the stage uh apologizing being peer pressured into apologizing to laurie markinan so i thought i looked a little bigger and i was like you know what maybe this is a camera as 10 pounds thing maybe that's what it is uh but the other thing is what i've gone back to a million times is the shirt.

It's just like, it's a, it's just a tight, small fit shirt. If you wore like a little bit of a looser shirt, I think we would be avoiding this problem. It's a cashmere number that I was excited about. I don't doubt that it's a nice shirt.

I just think maybe like one size up would have been the, would have been the move there. I'll tell you the James purse. Usually all that stuff runs really big. Is that anl or l no they they do their sizes in a kind of a weird way it's like one to five yeah no it's not even that it's it's like weirder uh and that's a four you know sometimes your boy fits into the threes five i don't know who buys of james purse five never met that person i don't know who they are

because they're monsters and yet on that one the mountain game of thrones yeah yeah mountain right on that one so uh jeremy scott who's our fitness guru uh here for the pod he saw it and he even said if you need me to make some sort of statement on your behalf because he was like that's not you because i worked out his facility in scottsdale he's like i'll i'll talk you up like you don't confirm the lifter stomach yeah a little lifter stomach little just i don't know bad look shirt underneath the sweater the whole thing uh but what i've learned is how much people want me to be fat. They want deep down for me to be like, you know what?

This guy's actually a fucking fat fuck that does some shoulder shorts. He just does curls. The percentage of people listening that, that want that to be true is way over 75, 80% because it makes, it's just like, Oh, cool.

Actually he's, he looks like shit too. So, um, I don't know so I don't know what to do about it other than maybe not wear that again or what if it's what if when I look in the mirror

I'm seeing an accuracy you know that happens right what if I'm in the weird case where I think I look awesome and I don't and this whole time and that the truth was actually told on that stage in Salt Lake that night. It really is, though, like an angles and camera lens or whatever or whatever mirror you're looking at thing.

Because I was talking to my wife about this the other day. Every time I go in to get a haircut, I look in the mirror and I'm like, am I that ugly? Like, do I look that bad? And because in my mirror at home, I look I think I look OK. I don't know. Say good. You were going to say good. I look OK. I home i look i think i look okay i don't know i'm like say good you were gonna say okay yeah i look okay i don't look i don't look and i go and i get a haircut and then what for whatever reason my guy's mirror i look like a four maybe a three and i'm just like

why do i look like a funhouse mirror depending on where i am and she's like oh no that's every mirror so i don't know maybe again i it might have been when i saw you in person i hadn't seen you in a while i don't think you looked any different than the last time that I saw you, which is probably what years ago. So maybe it's just the camera thing, man. Maybe the camera does that 10 pounds. Wait, that's the first time we'd seen each other in person in years. Yeah.

When's the last time we saw each other in person? I didn't go to the Denver show. Remember, I was in L.A. I left. You left immediately. Classic. Immediately. Actually, I'm gone that.A. I left. You left immediately. Classic Ryan. Actually, I'm gone that weekend. Okay, cool.

I don't know the last time I saw you before. I was trying to think about that. Yeah. Have I seen you since I started at The Ringer? I don't even know. I don't think so. I don't think so. Yeah.

Terrible. I've seen you, though, since I left Connecticut, right? That's not possible. We got dinner in West Hartford once. No, we got dinner we got we got dinner and went in West Hartford once but no we got dinner no no no I got we got dinner for the because the Sharks Cove show was still an ESPN show wasn't it no but this was when I was working with Scal we got dinner in West Hartford you were in Connecticut for some reason I remember uh oh yeah yeah that's that was like that was 2019 so I still came back i did sports center with van pelt uh for the draft in june of 19 so that was maybe that's when i saw you that was my

last time on espn's campus and that was that was actually kind of funny because i'd had like five i had a bunch of aaron rogers brett farbs with espn where i was like oh this is probably it and then it wasn't and i was like this is probably it and then that one was scott i was like this is it i was like i'll probably never be here again all right uh i think that covers it i think i have i got i gotta say i guess it doesn't say one thing no no it's just i promise this guy he's been really bent out of shape since denver the afraid to fly guy who went missing he did great on this trip i just wanted him to know i'm not gonna name him but he really the whole time was like you better tell everybody that i fucking nailed this trip he he just wanted him to know. I'm not going to name him, but he really, the whole time, was like, you better tell everybody that I fucking nailed this trip.

He brought it. He dropped us off at the mountain. He transported some. He did not fly this time as well. Says he's not afraid to fly. He just likes a good drive, he says. Made no sense. Made no sense.

I love that guy. Great dude. But he was like, I just like some alone time. I'm a father of two, man. I like some alone time. I was like, you can't just put some headphones in on a plane just like some alone time and i'm a father of two man i like some alone time you can't just like put some headphones in on a plane and have some alone time and not drive for eight hours through the middle of the mountains i don't know i got that just didn't seem logical i love it

i love it now i love that it's not about afraid to flying because serena and i were just talking about this the other day i think when you're from new england like three plus hours for me i couldn't do it when i was younger when i'd have to go burlington to the to woods hole four plus hours in a fucking boat ride i'd'd be like, oh my God, it's the fucking worst. I don't know what happened to me the last few years. I have no problem driving. Iceland the last day was 10 plus hours. It was the worst, but it was totally... On paper, I'd go, I'm really going to do this today. And I did it and I had a blast. It was totally fine. No issues whatsoever. Being in Hawaii this past week, I would just drive to the other side of the island

constantly just to try to explore and figure out like stay in some new town or find some new beach access thing. So now it's something happened to me now where people from the Midwest, like it used to always blow my mind. Like, wait, you just go from like St. Louis to Chicago. You just drive there and that's not a big deal. Or you'll drive from here or people in Nashville go here or Texas big deal or you'll drive from here people in nashville go here or texas or louisiana i'll drive to houston actually i don't think that drive is that far but um people outside of new england have way less of an issue and i didn't really realize it until i started driving like when i did the la to vegas drive and i stopped in palm springs and that's a drive that people do though that's like it's like it's like driving

from new york to florida It's like somebody's like, what the fuck? Why are you doing that, man? I don't know. I still think he is afraid. I think I remember him saying he was afraid to fly, but I mean, he's just enjoyed. I think he's enjoyed the... I think he was deflecting. Yeah. He was definitely deflecting. I'm not afraid. I just like to be alone. All right, man. Again,

he was a good dude. So Rudy kind of grilled him on it. He's like, yeah, but why, dude? Because it didn't make sense. It didn't make any sense to me. But again, good dude. The other thing I want to get to really quickly was was the jacket, the Bane jacket and the idea that

people thought that it was an insult to you that they, oh, he looks like Bane. Like that's the, that's like the, what other, what bigger compliment could you pay Ryan than he looks like Bane from the Dark Knight Rises?

Yeah, a lot of people got something to say about everything. So I posted that video wearing this corduroy velvet line deal. That's from Vince. I love that jacket. And anytime, you're right. Like it was Bane left and right. And it was the nicest thing anybody said to me.

But that's a really, you know, it's a tale of two cities, tale of two wardrobe malfunctions because it was the Bane compliment. And then it was like, as soon as I took it off, oh, this guy's fat as shit trying to do stand-up comedy. And so... He's fat and he thinks he's funny. There you go. Yeah.

Fat and he makes some observations. Did you? Did you ever... Did you ever realize... I did see a funny tweet, though. Somebody was like, it was funny that ryan did the bit about like what people think it's so weird to go to utah it's not that weird then we had the guy

come up on stage and be like so i've never had any alcohol before in my life what should my first beard be it's like all right yeah maybe that is a bit of a contradiction and then we hit him with liquor instead that was awesome yeah and then kyle gave him a jack and coke and he hated it right yeah he did try to give it back to me. It was definitely people were like, that can't be true. That guy tried to give me the drink back. That was definitely his first drink. So that's a good point. He took a sip of it and then handed it back to me. I was like, you don't know how this works. That's actually a good point about the difference between doing life advice on the stage and doing

it just like here when it's just the three of us. And then we don't even know who the hell's listening to this. I wanted to bring up like, should you just should you just start with a white claw but i didn't know if i'd be laughed off the stage so i didn't say it so but i'm gonna say it now because it's just the three of us like why wouldn't you start with a white claw so if you like that work your way up to a beer like i don't know i feel like the white claw is the first step start with the tastiest and then work your way up yeah like a little grapefruit grapefruit action yeah i remember my first sip of beer and i was like you have to be kidding me this is what you got yeah i'm good for like two years what is are you fucking do you hate yourselves

like this is and then there'll be like some weird kid that like the dad would give him a sip and he'd be like a little kid at some fucking big gathering he'd'd be like, yeah, he actually loves the taste of it. His favorite is Oktoberfest. His favorite is Oktoberfest. Big IPA kid. Alright. Good times all around. Yeah. It was a good weekend. It was a good show. And you guys are awesome.

I don't think I need to do the Maui. I think we did so much on that. We'll just be adding to it. Maybe we'll do it Thursday. Yeah. I lost to a 12-year-old playing hoops in Maui and I want to tell that story because I was there a couple days. I have a couple stories from it. I also surfed, I would say,

I don't know what the hell's going on. I'm even worse now than when I wasn't even anything good. Although I've just had such a bad run with instructors. Awful run. One guy fucking robbed me. Not like a gunpoint or, you it was i pre-paid and the guy fucking blew me off all right you know we'll save this for later we'll talk about my my surf instructor history one time it was a date and then the guy fucking asked i know asked out the girl after because it was like oh here's my venmo. And then she's like, that guy

hit me up. What a move. Yeah. Wow. He was foreign, though. Fucking foreign surf instructors. Get away with anything. Yeah, it goes, I mean, next thing you know, your mom's dropping him off at fucking grad school. Yeah, we'll save that for later. We'll do life advice here because we've gone

pretty long already. You want details? Fine. I drive a Ferrari. 355 Cabriolet. What's up? I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork. I have every toy you could possibly imagine.

And best of all, kids, I am liquid. So, now you know what's possible let me tell you what's required okay let's do life advice life advice the email life advice rr at gmail.com i love this one and it's not too old okay sometimes i mark ones and then we just get flooded with newer ones and then i'll think like oh that was a while ago. I didn't read it. All right, here we go. 5'9", 157, 43 years old and a five time Ironman finisher. Damn, that is impressive. I play

guitar in a Grateful Dead cover band. Listened to a lot of Dead this past week in Maui. A lot of Dead. Really enjoyed it. Also tried to get in the goose a little bit. Had a couple friends being like, you're going to really like him. Saruti, any goose buddies in your crew?

No, I'm not a grateful dead guy, to be honest with you. I feel weird saying that. You don't like the jam bands? I don't, which is weird because I really like John Mayer. Silence of the jams over here. But John Mayer, he's a big dead guy. He tours with them all the time. And it's like, should I go see Dead with John Mayer? But I just don't like the music. i don't know anyway yeah i would say

don't then definitely don't probably not a big john mayer i'm not a big drug guy either so it's like i don't know yeah not a big drug guy not a big drug guy not a drug guy yeah a lot of non-drug guys on the pod uh almost entirely yeah yeah now you think about it all right so here we go all right uh plays guitar for the dead cover band nothing too serious just some bar gigs 50 hundred Yeah. Now that you think about it. All right. So here we go. All right. Plays guitar for the Dead Cover Band. Nothing too serious. Just some bar gigs. $1,500 each a night.

We're all pretty serious musicians, but it's more about having fun and a little money on the side. I think this is fucking awesome. I love it. Again, if you're in your early 20s and you're debating about playing an instrument, do it, man. Do it. Guitar is crazy because you start trying to figure out some stuff. You're like, I'm hopeless. This is never going to work out. And then you wake up the next day and it's like,

wait, it's a little bit easier. And then the day after that, it's a little bit easier. Then you get stuck and you're like, put it down. And then you try the next day and then your hands magically work a little bit more. I've been going through it the last year. It's kind of fucking crazy the way it works. I would add having a bit of an ear may help. But the point is, is that just think about that excuse of getting out of the house. You know, dive bars, dead covers. Who would want to do that? All right. So we recently added a new keyboard player to the band.

I posted ads online and a local musician responded. Turns out he was a successful record producer that had moved back from L.A. in the last few years and is a fan of the dead. Was surprised he was interested in playing in a local band, but assumed he was just looking for something fun on his side. He gave me some more intel that I will not share with the audience because he asked me not to share it, but this person is a real person. Okay? So that's sort of an odd dynamic to begin with.

I know I wasn't exaggerating his resume because I was able to research him online and found interviews and pictures of him. He came and practiced with us once and the music sounded really good. He doesn't normally play keyboards, but he's a really good musician that can navigate the songs even when not playing his primary instrument. We asked him to join the band and he happily did. First practice after that, he seemed a little short tempered, but everyone can have a stressful day. So I didn't think too much about it. Second practice, the other guitarist asked him a really innocuous question about what he was going to do during a part of the song, and he got really mad.

Started firing things back at the guitarist. It was all really uncomfortable. To skip band talk, imagine you ask someone what time they were going somewhere, and they get mad that you're implying they can't tell time. That's the equivalent. Very good analogy. After an awkward five minutes, we moved on. He got mad at the bass player a little while later for not being clear enough about the format of a song. We have a gig on Saturday. First one with the new keyboard player. We'll see how that goes. All right. So please let us know. I actually do want to follow up on this. We don't have

another gig until April and then it's a really busy eight weeks of gigging. We can play without a keyboard player, but the music doesn't sound as good. Dude, anybody gets that that's into the dead. Plus, Grateful Dead keyboard players are really hard to find. Not sure if we just get through this gig on Saturday and then tell them it's not a good personality fit or try getting through the next few months and see how it goes. The music sounds good with him, and he seems like a chill guy, but with bursts of a temper that seem a little unpredictable.

If this were a relationship, I would say you run from early drama as quickly as possible, but not sure if it's better to see through this the next few months. It seems like everyone else in the band is on the same page as me. Again, being from the outside, as almost every time we read these things, it's only going to get worse right and if he has this resume which is a pretty established resume a resume as a producer like if he's this willing to be confrontational this early it's going to get so much fucking worse and part of that well really all of it is on him um i don't know why he's back

in this town are things going that bad? I mean, no offense to the town, but you could be dealing with him at the very end of the fuse of a bunch of shit that hasn't gone his way if now he's playing for 50. Maybe, man, maybe he just loves the music. All right? There's always that possibility.

But there's also a real possibility here that he's now in a situation that he never imagined he'd ever be in. So he's fucking pissed off at the world about that. And you are just the people closest to him in those moments when you're practicing. And then I don't know how this gig went. So, yeah, it's cool that you found somebody this good in this band and you like the music and all that part of it. But if he's okay being this confrontational this early, history tells me it's only going to get that much worse.

And based on this and kind of based on seeing where his story's going, this has nothing to do with the rest of you. So if this is something that's fun and starts to turn into something you have anxiety about or start to dread, then especially when you have a bunch of gigs coming up in April, all crunched together here, I don't see how this works out, even if you feel like... Because then he's going to start doing shit on stage, too. I would imagine. If he's this comfortable being this combative,

these people, this stuff always gets worse. I don't think it ever gets better. I think you guys should give that energy back, especially if you're on the same page. You said you talked to the band about it. And then maybe he'll quit on his own and he won't. But I can see you not wanting to

kick a dude out that's hard to come by and that you like. Maybe you guys would care less about all the conversation if you would just be like, hey, shut the fuck up, Greg. I don't care. I don't care that you're mad. Maybe that's... Call him a virgin. Try that. shut the fuck up, Greg. I don't care. I don't care that you're mad. Like, maybe that's... Call him a virgin. Try that.

You could try that, maybe. Whatever, virgin. Unless he could kick all your asses. There's probably like four of you and one of him, right? So I think if you guys all just get on the same page, he'll either change his ways

or skulk away or whatever. I don't know. But I think instead of kicking him out, you should try to give him back what you're getting. There's four of you. The follow-up email. So we took Kyle's advice and we beat the shit out of him should try to give him back what you're getting. There's four of you, the follow-up emails. So we took Kyle's advice and we beat the shit out of him at the last practice.

Two guys have assault charges. We got a lawsuit, yeah. Turns out he has a great lawyer. Turns out he's a sick fighter, yeah. But the music is still really tight. I just mean, I think you should give some of that energy back instead of feeling like you're getting punked by this dude

and you just look around like, wow, that was weird, huh? I think you should really just. No, I was going to say. Wait, Kyle, Kyle, Kyle, finish, finish. No, that was it. I just I think you should just try. Just try giving that energy back and just be like, hey, shut the fuck up, man. I don't care that you're mad that I asked the question.

Yeah, I said Craig, but I don't know. You said Craig. Yeah, I totally agree. I was going to say exactly what kyle said you gotta like metaphorically punch him in the mouth and then he's either gonna change or be like okay yeah i'm actually a dick i'm sorry like i respect you guys he's not he's not this guy was killing it at one point it's gonna be like fuck you losers you're making 50 to 100 bucks yeah yeah you can't even play bertha right i don't even know why I laughed at that.

That was funny, though. I assume that's a... He's like, you guys open with touch of gray? Sorry. None of these jokes are going to be... None of these jokes are going to work on you guys. I'm going to assume those are songs I don't know about.

Yep. Yep. Okay. All right. Sounds good. Let us know. All right. It's not Let us know. All right. It's not.

This is PG-13, but, you know, just a heads up to the parents. Maybe an earmuffs deal here or the virgins. No, it's really nothing. Is it the Joker

and his chorus? Was that it? Was that the end of it right there? Okay. No, I think I'm pro all the time. All right.

26 years old, 6'1", 190, 215 bench, tight hamstrings. Okay. That's a good one. I like that. Used to be sneaky athletic, but now I might just be sneaky. Player comp is Kevin Herter, but look more like Kevin DeBruyne. Is that how you say it? I fuck up his name every time.

It's all right everybody which is too bad because i he's my favorite soccer player i'm a huge fan i watched all of his games i'm currently coming out of a two-year relationship so dating again is like swimming for the first time at first every day i feel like i'm drowning and then i remember to breathe and utilize the breaststroke i've taken my time to let the previous relationship settle deal with the emotions and then do what's best to move on. I've been on a handful of dates to get back out there and be proactive, but there hasn't been any major sparks right off the bat for anyone or anyone that I've really gelled with. So insert, let's call her Jackie.

Jackie works with my sister-in-law, and my sister-in-law thought we'd be going to match and set us up. She first cleared it with Jackie before filling me in to make sure she was interested. She showed us pictures of each other, gave her my name, told me she bartends on the side of the bar near my apartment. Boy, I went on the night she was working, but she was assigned to a private party in the back,

so I never got to make an intro that night. I found her Instagram, slid into her DMs. Classic, I know. Grandkids will love that one. As a bartender, the, hey, come down and see me, and then it's busy. It's, I can speak from

recent experience. It's a tough spot to be in. It's just that, I'm just telling you kids, there'll be a story one day. It's a tough spot to be in alright we texted for a while

and then set up a date I'm somewhat of a romantic but since my last relationship I've admittedly become a bit cynical about relationships and love Jackie has seemed

to change that in me again and I feel the fire hotter than Joan of Arc little history we go out for sushi we had an amazing time great conversation we are alike a lot of ways find the same things funny than Joan of Arc. A little history. We go out for sushi. We had an amazing time. Great conversation.

We are alike a lot of ways. Find the same things funny and value the same important things. Hard work, family, friends, having fun, yada, yada. I find, or I had her laughing the whole time. She had me laughing the whole time, but there was some good,

deeper conversation as well. I'm starting to feel like this is fake. It's just so like... Perfect. Yeah, it's just so well written. I don't know. The days following the date, we're checking in with each other from time to time. My sister-in-law is telling me Jackie's talking about me at work, co-worker, showing pictures

of me, all the things girls do about somebody they like. I find myself doing the same, which guys don't normally do. I take this all as a sign and push for a second hangout and we set it up. But the second hangout approaches and she gets sick. Totally fine. No worries. There, we reschedule.

Now we live in a snowier Midwestern state, home of a certain delusional, now overpaid quarterback. Okay. Pretty easy. And as the day of our rescheduled date approaches, there's a snowstorm twice. So we reschedule twice more. It's been a while

since our first date because of it. So I'm getting excited to see her again. And we rescheduled twice more. It's been a while since our first date because of it. So I'm getting excited to see her again. And she seems to be as well. It just keeps getting delayed by no one's fault. So the thrice rescheduled day comes. We had planned to cook dinner at my place and hang out when she texts me at 3.30 that she actually had surgery the week before and doesn't think she can make it.

Surgery the week before. Don't think she can make it. The text the week before. Don't think she can make it. The text was actually a bit alarming, saying things in congruence with breaking it all off and that that might not be the right time. I think rightfully get a little confused for being let on and canceled on so many times, but I don't react emotionally and send a supportive text back. Great job out of you. Hours later later she replies by saying she actually had a boob job the week before but was too embarrassed to say anything to me it all comes full circle for me then in that moment and the air is totally cleared between us i love boobs and i definitely

want to see her again yeah this is great exclamation point like you're gonna talk about this is like one step up above her getting her braces taken off when you're the new boyfriend right that happened to me once the ex was like fucking you got your braces taken off i dated you the whole time with them it's like we were a lot younger than usually braces in your 40s doesn't really happen a ton but i i shout out the confidence to do so uh this is great uh i confirm it with my sister-in-law to make sure I'm not being lied to, and she does reassure me the boob job happened and that Jackie is still interested. She just didn't know how to tell me that she underestimated the recovery.

Jackie herself ends up telling me this as well. She tells me that she will need some time to recover, but definitely wants to hang again. She was really sweet about it, said she wants to continue to get to know me. I put the ball in her court and I told her that I hope she does not reach. Wait, I put the ball in her court and told her that I hope

she does reach out once she's feeling better. That would have been a massive misread by me. My question is, where do I go from here if anywhere? Is she truly interested? Boob job recovery per Google

is no joke and I totally understand that part of it. By the way, anybody listening that's experienced being with someone post-op, it's a tough one, man. It is tough. So, yes, she's not lying to you, and neither is Google. I really like that Jackie and I, I really like Jackie and think we could have something pretty nice. Do I send flowers and a card saying, quote, hey, hope the boobs are doing well?

Maybe just a text after a few days or weeks. Or do I just put confidence in the connection we made and wait for her to reach out? I'm a proactive person, so waiting around is hard. Would love your insight on this one. I think you're in a good spot here. I actually do think you're in a good spot. It makes total sense. I mean, unless it's the most fucking manipulative series of lies to ever be told

but again you're going to kind of have confirmation about whether or not there were surgery here at some point right uh unless we're just talking about some nip and tucking but again different topic so i think uh i think you're in a good spot i love the flowers move i love the card uh you know if you're you know the great thing when you do in a good spot. I love the flowers move. I love the card. You know, the great thing when you do make a connection with somebody is like the jokes, right? If you get each other's jokes, even if you're not funny, you know what I mean?

Like what your lane of humor is, it's such a great connection where you're like, oh, this person gets the joke, you know? There are times where I maybe met somebody and they saw some of my posts on instagram where i'm standing on a private jet and i was like just because it's just because you fly private doesn't mean keep it a secret and if somebody doesn't get that joke then i'm making

fun of everybody else who fucking post their private jet photos like it's some major accomplishment um and they think that's real and they're like oh oh, he's kind of a dick, huh? And they're like, oh, you didn't get to chill. We're probably not going to like each other. Weed him out. Yeah, there's just, there's going to be a bunch of stuff where you're going to be like,

what did he say? That wasn't funny. Like, I don't know. Maybe it was to somebody else. So I think you're in a good spot. Recovery is brutal. You got snow storms. I mean, I don't love the

oh for three thing here, but I think what you do is you do something like that. Send something to show her that you're a little bit more than just the check-in guy. If you want to make the joke and you feel like you're going to get away with it, that's great too. Maybe you want to soft sell that one a little bit. I don't know.

I don't want to get in your head here about it. But that way, if it doesn't work out, you can say, hey, I did everything. And by the way, if it doesn't work out, it's sort of that weird timey thing. You left her not with a great first impression. You left her with a great last impression where maybe then a year from now, she's still in bartending or whatever. And things aren't, you know, maybe you haven't met anybody, whatever yet, you've still made this last impression, which can be overlooked, that is super important. So it's like, oh, maybe that guy, you know, like maybe that, you know, I fucked that

one up or whatever, you know, again, life, we're just out here planting seeds, right? Planting seeds. And I think that would be the right move. So I think everything you've said here checks out, even if it's a little frustrating. And I would encourage you to write something in that note that's good, because if this email checks out, you did a great job. Like the email itself was just a series of twists and turns. that's great. I mean, worst comes to worst, it's another line in the water. As long as you don't get upset and say something mean.

So that's, that's great. And yeah, I think if she's cool with you having your address, it sounds like you've only seen her once and you've texted her and you didn't go back to her place. So, I mean, I guess you'd have to,

you'd have to see if she's cool with you having her address, which you probably don't have now. Right. So, um, other than that, I was like, yeah,

I mean, yeah, fine. If she's cool with that, if that wouldn't be weird, get, get, take the temperature of that with her but um yeah i think that'd be great maybe some soup you're i know you're laid up send you some soup you know a great chowder place or something you know it's like i know you're sitting at home chowder yeah i don't know something that's and flowers but you know something something that's kind of funny as well

yeah i don't know you never know with dietary allergy now though you may want to just go something real basic maybe some sorbet sure yeah although flavors could be tricky i don't know tough scene oh come on if you don't like lemon sorbet what the fuck's wrong with you get her some italian ice there you go uh yeah i again i think i don't know the scraping i like the the scraping part of it. You use these muscles when you do that. Yeah, I know. That's definitely the chest muscle. Could you come over and scrape this?

I'd love to. I'm not worried about the addressing. I mean, could you just text her too and be like, hey, I just picked up something for you. I'm going to drop it off. I don't think that's weird either. And if she says no, then you kind of really know where you're at.

And then if she says yes... I wouldn't do that. I'm not sure. Your heart's in the right place, Cerruti, but i think you have to have more of an established relationship before you do let me drop off stuff at your house just say i have something for you i just want to get it to you i could you know we can meet up at some place or whatever like you know and then you kind of know like if she's if she's really into that then you know where you're at and if she's really she pushes you off again then you kind of really know where you're at so i kind of think that's a good litmus test on kind of how she's feeling

about you right now. I wonder if some people listen to this and they're like, Hey, well, snowstorm, snowstorm, sick job. You know,

she was sick before. Yeah. Sick snowstorm, snowstorm. Yeah. Good job. But real good job. That's confirmed.

Snowstorm. Yeah. None of this stuff is, yeah, exactly. None of this stuff is like, it's a legitimate thing to not go on a date for. So I don't think she's just stringing you along here. I don't know.

Yeah, you know what? Like I said, just do something that makes you stand out a little bit, shows that you care, shows that you're interested. And if she were sincerely interested and remains interested then it's actually going to work out for you right this is a layup good guy move you get to do something cool here that isn't out of nowhere it's not too much it shows that you're thoughtful it shows that you're easygoing you know we're just way

too in the beginning we're ways we're so fucking hard on each other at the beginning of relationships where you're like, whoa, what the hell is this? Or what's that? Like, it's almost like we all need to be desensitized to each other

where there's just always going to be stuff about the other person that doesn't exactly, like, align perfectly with how you see shit. Whether it's your opinions on things that are happening

or just, like, your day-to-day it's like wait you do that you put your q-tips in the toilet like fuck you know like you know i'm saying you're flushing chicken you're flushing chicken breast all right i think that's good thanks to kyle thanks to steve ryan was still a podcast or your Spotify. you