The Ryen Russillo Podcast - Trent Dilfer on the Rams' Super Bowl Win, Stafford’s HOF Case, Kupp vs. Donald for MVP, McVay’s Future, and the Future of the Bengals

Episode Date: February 14, 2022

Russillo shares his thoughts on the most memorable parts of Super Bowl LVI, and why Aaron Donald is his headline (0:32). Then Ryen is joined by Super Bowl champion Trent Dilfer to discuss the Rams' Super Bowl win over the Bengals, the key points of the game, why Trent believes the Bengals' title window has closed, rumors of Sean McVay stepping away from coaching, Matthew Stafford's legacy now that he is a Super Bowl champion, and more (9:54). Then Ryen recaps some of his Super Bowl weekend festivities before answering some listener-submitted Life Advice questions (51:01). Host: Ryen Russillo Guest: Trent Dilfer Producers: Kyle Crichton and Steve Ceruti Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

a super bowl monday recap podcast we got it all with trent dill from why he liked the ram still running the football what it means for stafford and the job mcbain this front office did i'm going to praise aaron donald for as long as I possibly can in the open. We also have some Super Bowl recap from the nightlife. A little nightlife with famous TV people and life advice. The first thing that I want to touch on is Aaron Donald. Because what Aaron Donald did last night is something most defensive players cannot do. He got his ring, and I'm thrilled for him. I don't know about this retirement stuff, but whenever you are one of the greats,

and I'm a huge Aaron Donald fan, but I would say even the players that maybe weren't my favorite, if they were going to go down as one of the greats, I always want them to have a ring to kind of solidify because you're just not allowed to go ahead and do it. And not only did he do it as a defensive player, where a lot of times you'd be like, yeah, the quarterback still had to do a lot of stuff. What Donald did in that second

half last night just doesn't really happen a lot. The way he impacted the game. I'm not saying no one else. You see that he could change that game in the second half as a non-quarterback. It's a very hard thing to do in this sport with 22 people flying around on the field at the same time. Let's run through Donald's resume one more time. He's been in the league eight years. Rookie of the year 2014. He's got the Super Bowl now. Eight-time Pro Bowler. Seven

times he's been first-team All-Pro. Three-time Defensive Player of the Year. Made the 2010 All-Decade team. PFF has given him a 90-plus grade every single year. That might be... Now, again, I know we can argue about grades and all these different things. That just doesn't happen very

often. He's only missed two games. And I really think he should have been the MVP last night, not Cooper Cup. But that's fine because Cup had the huge fourth quarter. In the first half, he did a pretty good job. The game plan is to prevent Aaron Donald from wrecking your game plan. Second half, he destroyed everything. Think about this. Burrow sacked once in the first half six times in the

second half and the other thing that i noticed too not only because again mentioning chris long 100 times in this podcast but i ask about donald the world text about donald there's something will happen with donald and i go what's up with him and chris has played with a lot of players all right and if you play defensive end i think for for a decade plus, you're usually closer towards the tough guy phase. I ask about Donald. He's like, no, he's the guy. He's the one before anybody else. That's how tough he is.

It's all real with him. I noticed a play last night where Burrow, it ended up being a sack for Donald, but Burrow's going out of bounds, and not only did Donald push him out of bounds, he pushed him in a way where I was like, look how strong that guy is. Because most players in that play, yeah, all right, you divert his path, he goes out of bounds. He chucked him. And by the way, it was totally legal. Burl's in bounds, whatever. So just because the quarterback gets tossed to the sideline, somebody has to come across and kind of get in your face and talk shit with you. And that's what happened with Donald. And Donald immediately arms out like ready to go

MacGruber on dude's throats. And then he was pissed off. And just like I've talked about with guys that have played with him or Joe Thomas who played against him, who was on this podcast very recently, talking specifically about Donald, who is always great on every play, but the next level that he takes it to once he's pissed off. And I think that's what happened after that play. We always say you never want to tug on Superman's cape. And that was the truest thing you could say about Aaron Donald because he was

always giving great effort. Right. But there was an extra level of hatred that he would bring out if you did something to him that he didn't like. So you were very careful not to block him longer than the whistle. You were very careful not to cut him too far on the side where he would get a little upset and feel like that was a dirty play. Because the last thing you wanted to do was give Aaron Donald a little extra motivation to try to kill you. Because if you do, you will die. There is nobody on the face of the earth that Aaron Donald could not kick their ass, especially in between the tackle boxes. So Burrow's sacked six times in the second half for 35 yards.

We can get into Dilfer, what the overload really was or wasn't on the defensive front formations that was debated a bit there. Then we come down to that last drive where Cincinnati's trying to figure out a way to tie this thing up with a field goal. Remember, about a minute plus left. They still have their two timeouts. It's Joe Burrow.

Two plays stand out. P. Ryan, third and one. Donald reaches out, grabs P. Ryan, and P. Ryan stops moving forward. You could see the physics of it where you're like, wait, it looked like he ran into something. And Donald wasn't square up in front of him. He was to the side of him, and Pirine all of a sudden just stops. And I noticed that was great.

That had, yeah, rewind it, Donald. A running back that strong, because Piran's a bigger dude, just stopped moving forward. So Donald makes the play on third and one. Fourth and one, who makes the play? Aaron Donald. He finds a way. He gets through the pressure.

He's off the ball quick. He's peaking at the right time. Now, I always say how much I love basketball, because basketball, if you are that special player, you can find a way to impact the game immediately if you're that special and you're wired that way. Baseball, a lot of things, a lot of factors. Football, other than the quarterback, just a million factors. Even sometimes the quarterback, there can be other stuff that falls apart. It's the great team sport, but it's also at times very difficult to stand out as an

individual. Donald did these things from the defensive line. It's not like he's wide out the entire time against some completely overmatched tackle. He's moving around. They had to figure that out, and they shut them down

in the second half. Burrow now sacked 19 times in the playoffs, the most in a postseason in the last 20 years. No one's been sacked more than 12. This game was 20-13 with 10 minutes to go in the

third quarter. Cincinnati then had four punts and then the final possession, the turnover on downs. So Cincinnati actually kind of fell apart here offensively. Now the Rams had their kind of what the hell is McVay doing moment, which I can't wait to talk to you about as well, where after the Rams had a 52-yard drive for a field goal to make a 2016, they went three and out six yards, three and out three yards, three and out minus three yards. Now, during that stretch, they had four rushing attempts for a total of two yards, and then pretty much other than an acres run on that final drive that was 15 plays for 79 yards, which was the go-ahead TD,

they kind of just bailed on the entire thing. The Cup numbers in the fourth quarter are incredible. In the playoffs, staff for the Cup, 12 for 12, 208 yards, two touchdowns, nine first downs. The play that Cincinnati fans are going to remember forever, the Logan Wilson penalty for holding on third and goal at the eight, because at that point,

you're trying to figure out, okay, well, how are they going to play it out? They're down four. They'd missed the extra point. Are they going to be able to... They're going to have to go for it here on fourth down. I thought that was a pretty weak call. We can get into all sorts of finger-pointing of who's called or what. The Ramsey face mask was terrible. You got to call that. You can't make that play if you're a corner.

Yes, the false start by the entire offensive line. But I think as far as holding calls go, that one was pretty weak. Usually if it's a jersey grab, you're going to go ahead and get a call. I thought that was pretty weak. But again, there's a lot of stuff out there. And Cincinnati offensively did not have much happening on offense. The final TD drive, though, that second and seven throw to cup for 22 yards, that for me is the Stafford throw and why we've been fawning over his abilities for so long. Stafford went 0 for 3 in playoff games in Detroit.

His defense allowed about 32 points per game on average in those losses. We know that his combined EPA of the defense and special teams, I think over that time in Detroit, was in the 20s somewhere in the NFL. They never ran the football. He did have Calvin Johnson, but I just think it's a very reasonable thing to say,

hey, he's a really talented guy who didn't have a lot of support. This rush to now he's overnight a Hall of Famer, I guess that's the way it works. The Super Bowls, I'm not going to argue against it. I think there's some guys where I just go, look, you're in a different group, so it maybe takes you a little bit longer. But that touchdown drive and that throw specifically, that was the moment where I go, this is why we spend so much time talking about his arm ability and all these things.

I thought that throw was unbelievable. So I'm happy for Stafford. There really wasn't anybody involved in this game that I was rooting against. There was no take I was super invested in. Before the season started, I picked the Rams to be in the Super Bowl. So as this one played out, maybe it feels closer than it was, but the Rams couldn't run the football too. I think the sneaky part about this is that Cincinnati defensively probably held up a little bit better than you would think at times,

considering how the game started, how the Cincinnati Bengals looked on defense during the regular season. But they needed a couple more stops. It's just things weren't working out for them at the end. If there's any kind of confirmation, the headline isn't McVay confirmation. It isn't Stafford confirmation. Aaron Donald already had the confirmation, but I love those three-plus hours for that guy. This was his moment, I think, more than anyone else involved in last night's game.

Not that he needed this. I would say, hey, you know who's pretty good is Aaron Donald. But I'm thrilled that the best defensive player of his generation got his moment to show off on the biggest stage. Super Bowl winner, Trent Dilfer. Another visit and the best time to have Monday after the Super Bowl win by the LA Rams. I'm going to defer to you on this one.

What's the big takeaway moment as you're watching the game as things are playing out, the thing you'll remember about this game? Yeah, I think there's two big things. To answer your question specifically, the takeaway moment, the drop the mic moment for me was Rams get the ball five and a half minutes-ish. They got to score a touchdown you really think they had three timeouts so they could do it in two drives but you kind of felt the urgency that this was the drive um and they have this fork down what was it on their own 30 i think and

they find a way to get cut the ball and they convert. And then from there on out, it was two players and a coach, really a three-headed monster, maybe four if you had Kevin O'Connell, the OC to this, four guys finding a way to make sure that two guys were playing catch and throw. Your two players that needed to play their best in the biggest moment showing up on that drive again and again and again and uh it's what great players do remind me of the nick saban story that he tells about where he learned one of the most valuable coaching lessons in high school as a player about getting your best player the ball in the biggest moments uh it's almost like mcveigh was thinking that nick saban interview like I have to find a way

to get cup the ball. And I'm guessing, I don't know this. I haven't talked to Sean this morning, but I'm guessing that some of those plays were drawn up in the dirt that that those were adjustments made on the sideline or they were plays that may be for certain coverages. You'd go somewhere else, but Stafford and Kup just decided we're going to jam this thing in there. We're going to make it the two of us that takes this thing home. That's what greatness is. Greatness is making difficult things look easy.

Greatness is showing up when everybody needs you to. And there's a lot of examples where that doesn't happen. There's a lot of examples where really good players try to do it on their own at the end of games and it backfires but in the biggest biggest moment of your life as a football player um to make those types of plays were incredible then you can say the same thing about aaron donald on the other side of the ball like it was obvious that he, people say wanted it more, but he showed it more than anybody else. Uh, in that second half, I mean, he was literally unblockable. Um, and he was creating havoc and allowing his teammates to create havoc. You know,

a lot of those sacks that other guys got were because of what Aaron Donald was doing. His, his effort, his relentless nature, relentless nature was second to none. So it's the great players playing their best in the biggest moment to me was the drop the mic moment of the Super Bowl. Before I get to Donald, which I spent a good chunk of the open of this podcast on, the second and seventh throw, 22 yards to cup by Stafford.

And as I watched it, for all the shit Stafford's taken and I, you know, look, some of it I'll, I'll allow other times I can kind of tell when somebody doesn't even want to be fair about what Detroit was or who he's been. That throw is just understanding. Like he hasn't been in enough moments, Trent, not even close in his career for us to understand how he would apply his talents to those moments. Right. Because I think there are quarterbacks that are so risk averse, they don't understand to raise risk. And that throw was so like, that was the throw where his talent was there for him to raise

his level of acceptable risk because of how bad they needed it. Like that. I'm glad the overall numbers were great. The second pick wasn't on him. The first pick wasn't very good. But that was something where you go, okay, this is why we've been talking about this guy for a decade, perhaps in frustration, some fair, some not fair,

because of that throw. Well, let's dive into this, because you said a couple of things there that got me thinking. Number one, the second pick was on him, 50-50. It was an anticipation throw on a crossing route that you don't let go low because when the receiver's coming out of his route and he doesn't see the ball, which that throw was to the other receiver, I forget his name, the kid from Notre Dame.

Smronik. Smronik. Spironik. When you come out of that route, and any receiver that's listening is going to be, heck yeah, Dilfer's supporting this. When you come out of that route, you're looking at a level with your eyes as you're coming out of the route. When that ball is low and out in front of you, you're naturally going to do what that receiver did,

which is kind of bat the ball up in the air. So you're taught on that throw, that ball has to be eye level. And again, not all crossing routes. Crossing routes that are thrown before the receiver comes out. So let's use that as context. Then let's talk about the throw you're talking about, the second and seventh. So he's throwing the interception on that. Whether you agree with me or not, he owns part of that.

And there's a little demon on his shoulder saying, I'm throwing two interceptions in this game, and one of them is on the exact throw I'm about to make. And he makes the same exact throw to cup with an extra defender underneath. And he throws it with total conviction and he throws it where eye level right as cup comes out of the break and it's just people don't understand i think you do have to play the position to appreciate how hard it is to make that throw after you've made it earlier in the game and something bad has happened on that throw. So, uh, and then I'll dive into this. The one thing I always defend

Stafford on in Detroit years is this. He caused a lot of his issues with being reckless with the ball and always being behind and playing a very difficult way to play quarterback. Right. But then he dug himself out of a ditch as much as any quarterback in the league. I mean, he was a guy that even when he wasn't making Pro Bowls, he would be on that list of top five guys you want with 90 seconds left in the game and four points down. I think his career fourth quarter comeback show that too. I mean, I think he's still on the upper, the top of the list in terms of those final drives. And he did not play very well from the intercept. When he throws the interception in the end zone,

by the way, is a terrible interception. Collinsworth justifying it as a punt. And I, Chris is unbelievable. Hall of favor. Incredible. That was a terrible comment because they're on the 43 yard line and if he gets an eight yard completion that's three points instead he chucks and ducks it into the end zone doesn't make a very good throw and it gets picked and that cost them points so that was a terrible interception really from that moment until the final drive he does not play very well he's missing open receivers on third down. He's not getting through his progressions. Even after that graphic that NBA NBC showed about him getting through all his progressions. He's not, I think they went five or six possessions

that were brutal possessions. So he put all that in. Now he has this final moment and he's unbelievable on that final drive. And he does it with this boy cup. I loved how they talked about 6 a.m. meetings all the time they spent together when Matthew was interviewed after the game. How do you do that? And he says, this is a lot of hard work because that's the reality of this. Like what shows up in the fourth quarter in the Super Bowl and the games on the line started on a Tuesday morning at 515 when your alarm goes off and the rest of America is still sleeping. And you go in and you walk into that facility and it's dark and the only people there are the security guards.

And you meet your boy Cooper Cupp, oh, who, by the way, has a little kid. So, you know, wife's doing the wake up feeding, all that. You're in the office. And it's 6 a.m. to probably my guess is 8 o'clock, probably a two hour stretch. They're grinding out third and four coverages, third and seven blitzes, run adjustments, rotation changes, bracket cover. run adjustments, rotation changes, bracket cut, and they're going through all this boring stuff that isn't getting posted on social media, that isn't getting talked about on podcasts, that isn't getting talked about on NFL Live, that gets no glory, no celebration.

But that's what they're doing. And some of these other quarterbacks might not be doing it. They're doing it. And you know where it pays off? Pays off last night with five and a half minutes to go. So any young person listening, the gold is in the boring crap. It's in the monotonous stuff. It's in the stuff that nobody celebrates. And you get to hoist a Lombardi or a state championship or a football playoff trophy or whatever it is because you do that stuff. And that's what I love about that final drive was it was a culmination of stuff that most people aren't willing to do.

And it showed up when they needed it the most. Okay, so let's back up then from the interception that gives cincy a field goal i mean those are their 10 points and then that was it for cincinnati so they get the touchdown um which really you know look i mean it was an unbelievable play burrow to higgins but it was a massive face mask on ramsey and for all the shit ramsey's taking today like i get some of it but you can't have your face mask pulled away from you if you're a corner and expect to still make a play.

And look, part of it's Jalen's personality. So people doing victory laps on him, but they still won. I mean, Eli Apple's getting crushed more than maybe anybody I've seen. I get the sense too, Trent, that Eli Apple talks a ton of shit on the field.

Yeah, you can see that. And I've seen other times where he's come over to celebrate somebody else doing something. So now everybody's kind of going at him in a way that it's like, all right, this is on you. Because, I mean, he got burned himself a couple times. But there was a moment last night, and I'm with you on McVay, but it's after they get the field goal for the Rams to make it 2016. The Rams go three and out, three and out, three and out, and they're running the football

and it's not working and everyone can see it. And it's not that I always want to agree with the mob on this one where I'm thinking like, is he still, because at his core, he still wants to have some of these run concepts that you have to stay honest with. But at this point, it feels like wasted plays. What were you thinking of what

McVay was doing with the offense during those moments? I'm a run first guy, so a lot of people are going to disagree with what I'm about to say. I think you have to call runs. It's one of the hardest things I have to do as a coach. You have to call runs. You want your offensive linemen going forward more than backwards. You also have to call runs because they're going forward, which will allow them to make it easier going backwards. And what I mean by that is if you just decide you're going

to throw the ball every down and the defense senses that, they feast. They start playing fronts that are virtually impossible to block. They start running defensive line game stunts that are very, very hard to block. You saw what the Rams did, start creating some A-gap pressure with linebackers, create one-on-ones for pass rushers. So you got to keep it honest. I always think that's the best way when analysts talk about it. You got to keep the defense honest. And I think that's why you call runs. Here's where I thought they could have done a better job explaining the fault with the run game is the tight ends were getting killed. The actual, in the first half, they were back filling the run game and it was giving the offensive line problems, but the offensive line fixed that. They were really absorbing, capturing, and getting hands on the front seven.

It was the backside player who was the tight end who ended up getting benched. They disguised it as a shoulder injury, but he got benched because the backside tight end was getting killed. So as Sean's calling them, he's calling them into looks that him and Kevin O'Connell and the offensive line coach are saying, hey, these are good looks. Our offensive line is capturing them. If we just get this block, these are four to eight guard runs. So I understand that part of it. But even if you don't care about all that football dork stuff, at the end of the day, you do have to keep the defensive line honest.

And I think, was it 16 attempts? It's not like it was 28 attempts. Like a lot's being made of this. And I'm like, it was just 16 attempts. At last I checked. Maybe the quarterback sneak made it 17 or something. I looked at the final box score. But it's not like it was some giant number.

And I know it was like 1.5 yards in attempt, but I think most offensive coaches, you talk to Josh McDaniel, you talk to Kyle Shanahan, you talk to whoever you're, Andy Reid. Andy may not fit into this. You talk to most of your great play callers, and they're going to tell you, yeah, you have to call a certain volume of runs. Otherwise, the rest of your offense doesn't work. So long-winded answer to why I didn't have a problem with it.

Yeah, there was 20 carries, non-quarterback carries. So Stafford had two. Kup had the one on fourth and one, which I thought, I like the play call. I try to say in the moment, how do you feel about this? Don't play the results. See, I didn't. I didn't like it. I love it now. I'm like play call. I try to say in the moment, how do you feel about this? Don't play the results. See, I didn't. I didn't like it. I love it now.

I'm like everybody else. My wife and I are watching. I can't watch the Super Bowl with anybody because I'm taking notes, and I'm not fun to watch with. Some of my friends want to watch it with me, so it's just my wife that has to endure it. And I'm like, Sean, no. You're going to give them the ball and field.

I'm doing all the coaching conservative stuff. And then he gets it. I'm like, yeah, you're going to give them the ball and feel, you know, I'm doing all the coaching conservative stuff. And then he gets, I'm like, yeah, what a great call. But I didn't like it at the time, but what courage it showed. And I love that. Now I would have hated it. Even if it worked, if they would have given it to the back or if they would have thrown it to anybody, but cup, I thought they needed to do something different. They just give it to acres.

Cause at this point, they had to give it to cup. Like that ball had no matter how they did it, had to get to Cup in that moment. That I appreciate about it. Okay, let's get back to Donald. Yeah. It is rare for a non-quarterback, I think, to impact. And this is kind of what I said in the open a little bit.

The basketball player impact in football, where you just get to say, all right, enough of this. Like I have to do something. If you're a corner, a great safety, the ball just might not get thrown your way. The receiver, you might not get the ball running back. Maybe you don't block the extra guy, all these different things. I mean, the quarterback can still control the most of it. He controlled the game like a quarterback in the second half.

What were they doing with how they were kind of overloading sides? Cause there was some argument on the terminology of what they were doing. So why don't you set that straight? Because at this point we just disagreed. So let's just go ahead. I get what Chris is saying and I can see the football like super geeks out

there. Well, that's not an overload. So an overload typically is more people from one side than you can block. So basic NFL terminology is they have three blockers. We're going to bring four. They have two. We're going to bring three. That's overload.

And Chris kept saying overload because of a front. I know what he was saying. They were taking a typical under front, over front, which is a tilted nose, two guys to a side and then bringing the nose with him to the other side so yes they were overloading the defensive front and it's done to force your line to do something like you have to make concessions up front and incorporate your back or somebody else to to get to it all um and i could get why the dorks out there were like, oh, it's not overload. I even told my wife, I'm like,

I think he might be using some polarizing terminology here. But they were creating a problem, and that's what Chris was saying. They were tilting their defensive front to create matchups that they wanted to create. And actually, the Bengals did a pretty darn good job fanning to it, sliding to it, incorporating the uncovered to get to it. Really it incorporated a four man slide. Sometimes again, most people don't care. Uh, what was genius and Chris did a great job of pointing this out was when they started walking 50 up into the gap. Now that was,

that's a problem because now you have no choice, but to go five Oh, big on big. Now you definitely create one-on-one matchups. Now you give up something, you give up some middle of the field throws, which you saw them attempt a couple of times. Higgins dropped one. I think chase caught one, but didn't get, you know, a ton of yards after the catch. Um, but then you're going to give up some throws in the middle of the field. But it was worth it because all of a sudden, in a matter of – I mean, it's like I blinked my eyes.

I finished my smoked salmon and crackers and goat cheese. And the next thing I know – yes, I'm trying to eat healthy. Next thing I know, they have five sacks. I'm like, whoa, how'd that happen? I mean, it worked. I thought that was the best adjustment in the game. The two best adjustments in the game to me were

doing the Mike Mugg linebacker deal to create the true one-on-ones and then whatever they did on the sideline to make sure that Cup was the primary on every single play in the fourth quarter. And by the way, Ernest Jones, number 50 there, linebacker,

was a rookie. Nixon got him good, and he still recovered. That's big-time stuff. Yeah, the shed on the cup block where he gets back up and gets a sack, that's a big-time play. And it goes we'll talk about Jones, but also Donald at the same time.

One of the things the Rams do and it's probably because how uh, and what it's probably because how they practice and it's probably a temperament that Aaron Donald sets is the counter move. So a lot of times all lovers of football, you, you, you come, you get blocked and you try to kind of fight through the block, but you're like, Oh, you got me. The Rams are relentless with their counter move. So they make a move. The offense tries to block that move and then their counter move on top of it. So often that's the one that finishes. And I think that's why they're better finishers defensively than most people is because

the work they probably put in to that counter move. I remember this was a big Dungy money Kiffin thing, you know, back in those great Tampa defensive days, they would be on them all the time of, yeah, great job, great effort, way to do what we told you to do, but don't stay blocked. Like the real greatness, if we want to be great, it's all the stuff after you get blocked. It's running to the football. It's the counter move. It's the grinding out, running your feet, moving your hands. It's like all this stuff that doesn't get celebrated. That's what really makes you great. And that's what you see from that Rams front seven is just a relentless effort for their counter moves

and their triple moves and just never stopping until they finish the play. Okay, you said something else earlier that I want to get back to. You sound very dismissive, not only since ending the game, but moving forward. I am, and I'm not trying to poo-poo this thing. I love Joe Burrow. In fact, me and you talked last time offline, right, about Joe,

or we were on the phone or something. We were on the phone, yeah. I love the dude. I just couldn't love him anymore. Jamar Chase could not love him anymore. So this has nothing to do with their greatness. And both of them probably have incredible careers, but I almost think of it as the dolphins with Moreno. Like everybody thought

they were just going to go back every year and they didn't. I could see them struggling in their division. I mean, do you think Baltimore is going to get worse? No way. I think Baltimore had just a brutal year, man. Yes, injuries. I mean, everything could have gone wrong for Baltimore and went wrong for Baltimore. They're one of the greatest coaches in the NFL. They have a great front office. They have a generational-type quarterback.

They got all the keys. They know how to draft defense. I mean, they're going to be better. Pittsburgh, again, one of the great coaches in the NFL, a franchise built on consistency. And I love Ben, but they're going to get better without Ben. Now, I don't think they're going to get better unless they go get somebody, but I think they're going to go get somebody.

And if they go get somebody, they're going to be better. Cleveland proved to be kind of that team that nobody wants to play. I think of Cleveland as my teams in Tampa like in 97 and 98, before we really got good in 99 and then ended up 2002. I was gone, but they won a Super Bowl. Cleveland's that team that nobody wants to play. They're really good defensively. They run the football.

They beat you up. Even if Baker ends up just being pedestrian, there's still no, you know, nobody wants to play them. So you have a brutal division. Oh, do you think Kansas city's going to get worse? Oh, and by the way, if you're not a Bengals fan and you're listening to this right now, and you think the Bengals and the chiefs play 10 times, I'm guessing you think the chiefs win nine times. Like I believe. I think the Bengals got them the one time out of 10. So the Chiefs are only going to get better. So are you going to beat the Chiefs? Oh, what about the Raiders? I think the Raiders are going to be pretty darn good. I think there's

other teams the AFC is going to be. Oh, we haven't talked about the Buffalo Bills. You don't think they're sitting at home going, that should be us. So to think think that the bangles because they have a generational type talent a quarterback and a dudes it's just a dude and one of the best receivers in the nfl you think that's enough no it's not you can't just flip snap your fingers and get five new offensive linemen right their defense played really well okay so they play i don't want to take anything away from how their defense played, but playing consistently the next year and then the next year after that. You've got to fix a lot of stuff here. I honestly feel like the Bengals,

this was their shot. I don't think they're the team you just shot pencil in next year as a team that's going to contend with the Bills and Chiefs and Ravens and the other powerhouses in the nfc i think it's going to be tough sledding for them and they stunk in this game i mean they offensively they were terrible they made one play to chase ramsey guess isn't an incredible catch by chase good throw too throws it out there let's go get it they'll play to h. I mean, it's just a best call. And all Joe really did was step up to his right and kind of chuck it.

Like, it wasn't like it was a great throw. Higgins didn't make some spectacular play on the ball. He cheated. Pulled Ramsey's face mask and caught it and walked in. They ran the ball decently, but they couldn't do anything else. Joe did not play. Joe will be the first to tell you he didn't play his best game.

First third down of the game, he's got a wide open guy in the flat. Wide open. First read, 100% of the time, high school type play. It's a little backside hinge route with a flat route. It's wide open. It's going to go for six yards on third and two. He tries to force it into chase. He dirts the comeback in the fourth quarter.

It's a big big or third quarter i think it was it's a big big throw that's a bad throw but at that point i think he's hearing you know he's feeling great yeah not knock i love joe burrow and the dude is tough in a i mean he redefines tough nothing bad to say about joe but he would tell you he didn't play his best game um so again i i i know, I know how this plays out. It's a soundbite. People think Bengals stink. I'm not saying that.

I just think it's going to be tough sledding. And I think if, especially from all the people that bet these days, I wouldn't be betting on the Bengals next year to get to the Super Bowl. AFC is going to be really tough. I mean, even with some of the Baltimore stuff, you go, okay, where's Lamar right now in the quarterback rankings? There's guys ahead of them at this point um but i'm with you that baltimore is going to be better i would like let's see what happens here with pittsburgh

and the quarterback part of it but you saying hey they're probably better with somebody after ben if they get a decent person yes because i think at this point ben was holding them back um you've got herbert you've got mahomes've got obviously Allen. And it just keeps on going. It's not like the Pats are going to stink. And then we haven't even talked about the one seed. It was Tennessee throughout all of this, even though I didn't love them. It's a team that's still really well coached. They're tough.

And so there you go. And I know Cincinnati has all the cap space in the world. Look, good luck getting it. I saw a story this week that absolutely blew my fucking mind, was basically the Cincinnati's front office is streamlined now because they're in the Superbowl. They're not cheap. They're not cheap. It's streamlined, right? The daughter, the daughter changed everything, I guess. Right. So the first Superbowl appearance, like the first in 30 something years here. And it's like, no, no, no, no, no. This, this is, this is streamlined. And I mean, while every single one of you guys

that I've talked to for 10 plus years would all go that's the organization that nobody wants to go to so maybe that changes the burrow maybe they're able to use all that cap space and and they're good but i like them this year i like them at their their peaks like a lot of teams the lows i'm like what's going on they're 10 and 17 whose defense actually played better in the postseason and their offensive line is as bad as it was in the regular season the cumulative effect on burrow i think is is the difference i mean it's amazing they got to the super bowl if you really think about where they were at some point this season even though i do really like this football team i'm gonna go on a tangent real quick i'll

only take 45 seconds do whatever i don't care i think it's fascinating this is how the cycle works we're going to talk about this game for a few days, and everybody's going to start talking about quarterbacks. That's the way you guys get ratings. It's the way everybody's going to do it. I remember my days at ESPN. It's as fast as we can get from Super Bowl to quarterbacks. That's the formula.

Ratings, ratings, ratings. What they should do is they should just breathe for two days and talk about all the teams that lose the Super Bowl. Because the teams that lose the Super Bowl. Because the teams that lose the Super Bowl end up going into the abyss a lot of times. And in these drive-by comments that get made because everybody's too scared to say, oh, that team isn't coming back. Because you kind of want to celebrate them a little bit. It is very common that you lose a Super Bowl and you get your

butt kicked the next year. That is not uncommon. So I am not, I don't think this is any different. Like I'm from this old school way of listening. There's only one team that's happy at the end of the year. And the team that wins it holds the crown, and they deserve all the accolades. And everybody else is thrown into the same 31-team pool, which is fight your ass off, go try to beat that team that won it last year. And I think too many people start going, oh, that team, oh, yeah, they showed us so much, and they got this player and they got that player. Maybe they just got hot.

And they're not as good as we all think they are. And that's where I'd put the Bengals. I just think they got hot. And the quarterback is special. He is just flipping special. But it takes more than a quarterback. It takes more than a quarterback wide receiver. Are you surprised by McVay potentially retiring and going to TV?

I'd heard it a couple weeks ago. I didn't know what to make of it because I was like, man, that doesn't – then it was explained to me. And I go, all right. But what I would caution any of these guys, if you're getting a little burnout, I get it. But when you finally have your franchise kind of like rolling, you know exactly what you have in the roster,

you know your own personnel personnel ownership is signing off. You live in a city where you'd want to be. I, why, why would you, I got all of us screw with our own heads about, you know what I'd love to do. I love to go and do something like this.

And he's so young. I'm sure ESPN would back the truck up for him. Cause he sounds like Gruden and he's the new shiny toy and ESPN loves new and unproven more than they love older and proven. All right. I mean, there's, there's nothing like the way that company just will trip over themselves for the guy who just retired without any fucking clue if he can do the job or not. And they love it. All right. So that's why I would tell people close to McVeigh. I'm like, they're going to give him whatever he wants because he's a new thing. I don't know if he's going to want to do the job the way it needs to be done to truly be one of those great guys on television. So I've heard about it. You know, and people can be real cynical and say, oh, no, it's just contract contract. I don't really think that's what it is for McVay. If I'm his friend, I would say don't do it. You have plenty of time.

I'm his friend. I would say don't do it. You have plenty of time. I mean, the guy is growing up in a coach's NFL front office family. He's knowing nothing but the grind as a player, as a coach. He'll be miserable if he leaves. I'd consider him a friend. I'd tell him that.

The TV thing, as you can tell your fan base and all, to everybody, is not what it's made it out to be. I mean, if you want to be really good at it, it's a grind. It's a different type of grind, but it's a grind. It's shallow to a certain degree. You know, when you've been a coach, when you've been an influencer, when you've effective lives, when you've helped guys reach the mountaintop, it's, you know, yeah, your NFL countdown show that I was on, that feels like a team. I'm not taking anything away from it. Your Monday night cruise, Susie, Ray, Steve, and I, we felt like a team.

It's not the same. I mean, you're trying to recreate something that you've already done. And I think most coaches, players that go into TV, it's a great format. And it's an awesome living. It's a good lifestyle. But when you're a grinder at heart, it's not enough of the satisfaction of the grind. There's no wins and losses. You know, coaches, players thrive on the W and the L.

And there are none. Ratings aren't it. I mean, that doesn't matter. Um, maybe your salary, you know, maybe playing that game gives you a little short-term satisfaction, um, but it's not going to ever replace what he's got out of coaching. I frankly don't think he'll do it. Uh, but to give people some perspective from two of us that have done it, it's not the same. Um, and he'll learn that real quick. Sean, you know, Sean Payton will learn that he'll be back. Most of them will go back.

Dungey's an exception. Um, but he was older than these two as well when he left. Um, Vermeule even went back, right? I mean, Dick was a successful coach, did a really long stint in TV and he went back. So, um, Madden was an aber an aberration, and he was also a generation of TV where he kind of invented his role and did it better than anybody will ever do it. And he's different. You can't compare anybody to Madden. So I think that's it.

It's an intriguing off-season conversation. Maybe it'll eat up 5% of the quarterback talk that everybody's about to do. Brady's going to garner the most attention. Roger's second. Deshaun Watson third. The draft, then we'll go into that cycle. What I will say about McVay,

I don't want to leave without saying this, and you can cut this out when you edit this, but I think it's the most important thing. I think Sean McVay may have just finished one of the great coaching jobs we've ever seen. And I'll give you some context. What they did as an organization, him and Les Snead, is so countercultural to the NFL way. They mortgaged the future to win now. They did not buy into the narrative that you stockpile draft picks, you save draft capital

for future years so you can set up for consistency for future years. Instead, they said, no, this is the year, let's do it now. And that may in itself not seem like that's that dynamic, except for when you live in the NFL in the inner circles and all your peers are ridiculing you. NFL in the inner circles and all your peers are ridiculing you. So everybody in the NFL has ridiculed the Rams for doing, which is so different than they all believe in. Because if it works, it's going to make the rest of them look foolish. The Browns, all I heard is the Browns are set up for a long time because all this draft cap, they're sitting at home. Might be sitting at home next year. There's no guarantee just because you have draft capital

that you're going to have a chance to play in this game. The Parcell, the Barcellian way wasn't this way. The Belichickian way wasn't this way. The Walsh, this wasn't the 49ers way. This wasn't the Cowboys way. It wasn't the way of any of the models that have worked before. So if you're Les Snead and Sean McVay, not only taking some heat from the media, but you're really taking it internally from your friends, your peers, the guys that you've

grown up in the business with, and you're an outlier. Like you took a huge chance to do it different than the NFL does it. Basically, you did the NBA model, right? You're an NBA junkie. They took the NBA model to win now. And that's a lot of pressure. Oh, and guess what? They're going to week 13 and they're seven and four. So everybody's saying, oh, they're wrong. We're right. See, this way doesn't work. And then I think this is the biggest challenge he had with all that going on. He also had the challenge of these giant personalities on this team, the superstar players and salary eaters on this roster.

And he had to somehow in modern day NFL, which is tricky, create a college high school vibe of togetherness and selflessness and camaraderie and do it for your teammate and celebrate your teammate. And everybody goes, you know, Pete Carroll used to get made fun of for doing these things, but now it's a little more popular. It takes a younger kind of cooler guy to do it. And Sean's that guy. He brings in guys like John Gordon and all these speakers and team building guys. And he gets a bunch of superstars to buy into something that really doesn't happen in the NFL that much. And what I found awesome was after the game, usually I just turn the game off. I don't care. My wife and I sat there and watched it. And here's what all the comments

were in the postgame press conferences and on the field and from the coaches. It wasn't, we had better players. It wasn't, they didn't talk about the stars. They talked about chemistry and brotherhood and togetherness and selflessness and cheering for their teammates and toughness and winning ugly and grit. Like all these terms came up that were true team building terms, true things that develop culture. And Sean's the catalyst for all that. The burden was put on him to take all these stars, all this stuff, and somehow in a short amount of time, bring it together and do something special with it. And they recognized it enough, not just to buy in and do it, but then to celebrate it after the game.

Oh, and by the way, he did all this with social media. Those other guys didn't have to do with social media. Belichick's first five Super Bowls, like he didn't have to deal with everything you do. You fart in the office and it's on social media. Like it's the pressure and the attention and the rat poisonous Saban calls it is at an all time high to do the opposite

of what you're trying to do, which is bring a bunch of guys together and buy in to something that's bigger than you. OBJ was disgruntled prima donna diva wide receiver until he got to the Rams you think Sean McVay might have something to do with that like it is remarkable when you sit down and I went to bed thinking about it woke up this morning thinking about it and was knowing we were going to do the show like that's what I want people to know is the greatest challenge anybody had in the NFL this

year was what Sean and Les went through particularly particularly Sean, and they won the flipping Super Bowl with all that stuff, all that pressure, all these dynamics going on, and they found that secret sauce to get it done. Stafford legacy now completely changed. We're allowed to say certain things about him, but there is something about being a Super Bowl winning quarterback. Now it's different. The guy's going to end up top 10 in a bunch of important stats.

I think the NFL, or at least the Pro Football Hall of Fame, almost weighs the Super Bowls too much, where now when you get one, it's like, okay, now you're automatically in. This is a small fraternity that you're a part of too. What do you think back on when you go back now almost 20 years here, well yeah, 20 years, when you won one with the Ravens? What do you think about to when you go back now almost 20 years here? Well, yeah, 20 years when you won one with the Ravens. What do you think about to the start of that game? Well, one, I don't know why I didn't shave my head earlier. I was in that hold on mode. So all the videos that come up is brutal.

Oh, so bad. I'll say this first on Stafford, then I'll give you some stories. I think he's a Hall of Famer, but I think outside, and I'll probably miss a couple here, but I think besides myself, Brad Johnson, Haas Stedler, there's a handful of guys. I think if you win a Super Bowl, you should be in the Hall of Fame outside of the group I just mentioned. I think Brad would say the same thing. Brad and I are friends. We talk about it. We're proud of our accomplishment, but we don't think we're Hall of Famers by any stretch of imagination. But I do think most of the guys that win the Super Bowl, if you also are

highly productive for a long period of time, arbitrarily, let's say 10 years. If you're highly productive for 10-ish years, and you win a Super Bowl, and you're one of the reasons, not maybe the reason, but you're one of the reasons you win the Super Bowl, you should be in the Hall of Fame. Eli Manning, to me, is a first ballot. I know people roll their eyes at that. To me, he's a first ballot guy. Because you do so many other things that don't the common fan doesn't understand. Now, again, I'm taking myself out of it, hostile out of it, Brad out of it, a couple others. But most of these guys do phenomenal stuff and deserve to be in the hall. That would be my comment on Stafford.

As the fraternity goes, it's not like we get together and have a party. I think there's a respect. There's a deep, deep, deep appreciation and respect amongst us for each other. And I think I get to feel the benefit of that probably more than any of them. When your Aikmans and your Youngs and your Montanas and your Warners and your Bradys and your Patons, when they admire you because of what you were able to accomplish and what you endured on that road and the hidden value of how you play the position,

that that was probably the most affirming thing for me as an ex-player is when my Super Bowl-winning quarterback peers, guys that were much better than me, guys that were way more productive than me, guys that are in a different stratosphere than I was as a player, when they recognize and admire you, that's, I think, what makes this group special. Doug Williams and I cannot see each other for years. And when we see each other, there's an embrace,

like there's this mutual respect. So I would say that, you know, if you want to get deeper, but that, that to me is this time of year. I always say it like this time of year, I always say it, this time of year is cool because I didn't do one thing for the Super Bowl except Monday night in Panini. I didn't want to be in LA. I didn't want to be any part of it.

I just don't need to do that in my stage of life. However, a text here and this and that, just from that group, is always special around this time of year because we know there's only, what is there now, that Stafford won, is it 38, 39? I mean, it's not a big number of starting quarterbacks that have won the Super Bowl.

I used to love it when Brady, every year when Brady would win it, I would just, that next morning, text him. He'd always laugh. Thanks for winning it again because it keeps the number of quarterbacks that have won it lower. So I can live with it that we added one more to the list. But I'm all about repeats, man. Like, I want Aaron to win the next five.

So that number stays as low as possible. I don't care if I'm the worst on that list. I just want that list to stay really elite. Hey, man, this has been great all season. Terrific, as always. Can't thank you enough. And we're going to talk around draft time if that's cool all right awesome can't wait and you can check out trent dilfer in more in-depth conversations with a bunch of quarterbacks he played with and against beyond the x's and o's trent dilfer

you want details bye i. I drive a Ferrari. 355 Cabriolet. What's up? I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork. I have every toy you could possibly imagine. And best of all, kids, I am liquid. So, now you know what's possible.

Let me tell you what's required. Before we get to life advice, no Monday Super Bowl podcast would be complete without a super bowl week recap all right so um as you know i live out in manhattan beach which isn't really los angeles but it is los angeles and every year although it still felt like even though it was la and there's a million things to do, back in the day that whenever you would go to the Super Bowl, and the first ones I went to, I think were 04, 03, 04. And then I went again in 09 with ESPN and I'd gone every year with ESPN until I think the last year I was there when they were like, hey, nobody's going. None of the radio shows are going. And I was like, are you sure about that? And then guess what? A bunch of other

radio shows were going. So that was another little sign there. Things might not be working out. You get in the weekend before you do your shows Monday through Friday. ESPN did handle it first class. They wouldn't even want to go to Radio Row. I used to do Radio Row for the early bosses. The point is that every night, especially when I was younger, even a couple of times where I'd have friends with me or something, they'd be like, OK, what's the game plan? All right. Tuesday night, we got this. Wednesday night, we got this. Thursday night, we got this. Friday night, we got this. Saturday night. And then some of the people would stay through Sunday and then try to fly back. And, you know, as you got older, you'd go, you know what, I think I'm out of here on Saturday.

And then you'd be like, maybe if it's this town, I'm out of here on Friday. But there was always a deal. There was always a big party, probably two. Who's getting in? And you'll think like, oh, it must be easy. No, it wasn't always easy for me to get into stuff. Certainly not. Not at all. But there'd be a warehouse.

And if you had a couple of friends with you, even if you could talk your way in, I mean, just the whole thing, you're standing outside or somebody with a clipboard and it's just going on and on. You're texting people on the inside. Hey, they're good. This guy isn't good. And after a bunch of years of that even though it's kind of exciting when you're younger like this is fucking boring like it's just and then you get in and then you're like i'm in and it's 2 000 people and it's like a free-for-all

and it's not actually that amazing the parties themselves are not that amazing so as you get a little bit older you start to go hey let's all go meet up. We're all in town. Let's just meet somewhere and kind of take it from there. And those always ended up being the best night. So this time around, I had one thing that I did on Wednesday in Hollywood and I did a lap and immediately regretted being there. But I had to be there for a business reason and then met up with a smaller group. And then from that point on, I was like, the only time I'm going to go back into Hollywood would be for this one dinner. And I went to the Wheels Up dinner on Friday night. Rios, unbelievable. Wheels Up and Rios do this thing all the time. And really the only reason I went is because Van Pelt speaks at it

and we haven't seen each other in forever. Sanford Steve in town, same deal. A couple of guys from Big Cat PFT came out with us as well. But I was like, look, if you guys want to do a night out, just go back to Manhattan Beach with me. It's easy. We're not going to have any issues. We can get as many people in as we need to get in anything, even if things are packed. It's fun.

Trust me. And it'll be good to go. And the thing is, is everybody that comes to Manhattan Beach for the first time, they spend a couple of days here. They'll go, okay, I think I kind of get it now. a couple of days here, they'll go, okay, I think I kind of get it now. So Friday night after the dinner with wheels up and trust me, there's, there was a bit of a buildup to this, but I just want to share with you what's one of my favorite observations going out with my man, Van Pelt. So we get a car back down to Manhattan beach. Of course, he's like, how far is this? Are we going to Mexico?

I was like, wait, this isn't your first time in LA. You realize that where I live is not LA. And if you want to stay in West Hollywood, none of us wanted to stay there. This was the move. This was the only move. And there's this kind of social club here that it sounds a little bit more private than it is. You can kind of get in, but you can't get drinks unless you have an account. There's only so many members and whatever.

Everybody that wants to be, for the most part. It's not like some massive screening thing that you can't get into it. All right. And Van Pelt, for those that don't know, when he goes out, it sucks for him in a way that doesn't suck for other famous people. Because he's so tall and he's been on SportsCenter, this incredibly popular show, and he's great at it. He's been doing it for 20 straight plus years here. And because he's so likable on TV, and he's also likable in real life, that there's this almost like you're not intimidated like it's some athlete. You're not intimidated like it's this famous actor or actress. There's like, oh, that's Scott, because I feel like I know him. I've been watching you for 20

years, the radio show too, and his personality. So he gets approached in a way where the person has like less reservations around him. And that doesn't always work out. So Steve and I have been around it for a while and we're watching it all kind of play out and we're kind of sitting down and everything's good and people are starting to fuck with him already. And he's like, all right, you know, can I find a seat? We're like, yeah, we'll go sit in the corner. That's fine. And then there tends to be a pattern where some people who are big fans and it's very exciting kind of want to watch you talk to each other.

We're like, hey, isn't a fucking live show here. I haven't seen Scott in person in a long time. He's here for one night. I haven't seen Steve in person in a really long time. He's here for one night. I haven't seen Steve in person in a really long time. He's here for one night. Steve stayed with me. This isn't like, you know, but again, I can kind of understand it's flattering

that people would care enough that they want to sit around you and listen. And I'll admit too, you know, being younger and you can't really get it unless you're on the other side of it. I may see somebody and I'd have a few drinks to me because you'd want a few drinks in you to kind of break down those. You know, that's why people drink a lot. It's going to break down the inhibitions about going to approach somebody else.

But you only kind of get like this one window, right? You get this one window to prove you're not a raging dickhead. And that window lasts about 15 to 30 seconds. And I failed the test myself. Okay. to 30 seconds. And I failed the test myself. Okay. But now I kind of understand the test a little bit more because I've not only seen it in the rare occasions with me, but with people with a much bigger profile. And so there's this one guy, he walks up to Van Pelt as we're sitting there, we're talking to each other and he had his line ready, man. He was ready to make a joke

and everybody's going to crack up and he was going to get invited to hang out with the buddies and we're all going to have a great time talking college football. Who knows? Who knows what we would have talked about? But he failed those 15 or 30 seconds. He failed them.

And he just goes up to Van Pelt. And the other thing Van Pelt hates is when you touch him. Don't touch the animals. Okay. This guy whacks him in the shoulder so hard, like kind of like a backhand slap into his shoulder. He's like, hey, SVP,

when are you going to start buying some fucking beers? We were like, oh, and Scott's face like, what the, like, who what? And then Stanford Steve jumps up to the rescue and Steve just goes, hey, you, and he like swings his finger across and it's

so scary when Steve actually does get mad. He has bouncer vibes. He does. Yeah. No, Sanford has major, major bouncer vibes. And then we found another area over there. And then there may or may not have been a guy

who I know from a couple business transactions who started screaming out interest rates to us. And then Van Pelt just looks at me and goes, there's seven people in here right now that could be deemed the drunkest person in any town. And they're all here at the same time. He's like, what the fuck is this place? And I go, I don't know. It's a lot of older, successful people that want to have a good time. And this happens to be a very small slice of that in one

room. Now he had a blast, sort of, I think, by his standards. And then everybody said their goodbyes. But watching this person who thought he was absolutely going to nail it and see him, he didn't just fail. He like, I can't say he didn't even show up to take the test because he did attempt

to whatever it was in that short amount of time. But to just see it all go down and then the rest of us kind of put our head in our hands going, oh, my God, what is this guy doing? And he picked the wrong, he picked the absolute worst person to do this to. And he thought he was so funny. And he wasn't. The next time we get Van Pelt on, I want to ask him, in that situation, is there anything that some random can say to him that's going to make him want to strike up a conversation? I think there's nothing that's...

This goes back to the life advice from a couple months ago, the guy trying to befriend Carmelo Anthony. There's just nothing you can say. You can rehearse a line in your head. You could have the best line planned out. You could have the funniest thing ever. And I don't think anything in that scenario, Van Pelt is going to take the bait on it. I'm not the right person to ask because I would think I could probably think of a couple,

but I've also known him for a really long time. Your best bet would be, I don't think the gap between Duke and Maryland is that big. That might be the only one. See, I was thinking that, but it's too simple. It's like, all right, yeah, buddy. I don't know. But again, he does argue with random people on Twitter, so maybe he wouldn't entertain that conversation. Well, he might be excited. He might want to actually have that conversation. You go, you know, maybe you're right. Maybe that is a possibility.

And then it was sort of chaotic there for a little while. It got a little chaotic. And then some younger guys were trying to buy us shots nonstop. And it was like, no, nobody wants those, man. You're just going to get to a certain age. You're going to understand. You'll remember this conversation that we're having with you right now, 15 years from now. Like, you can't understand it right now.

And the thing is, is when I was in my 20s, look, I failed the test a few times. I still remember this one time with a football player. I was like 26 and I wanted to make it work. And I, you know, I drank too much and I was fucking annoying. I just, I just was. What did you say? What did you say what did you do i was just like no no you and then i was trying to compare him this other guy and he was like yeah dude i got it i got it and then he wasn't really drinking and then there was a couple of his other friends around and knew me and then he was just like i was like no no no and then he's like dude i got it i got and i just i kind of looked back on it i didn't even realize it was

that bad until now i look back on it well i knew fairly soon you know years removed from it but i was like yeah you just you didn't handle that one great um you know i can even see there's times where if i'm going to something like where i'll go oh i know this guy or i've had him on a couple times like i have an opening but as you get older you just go like you probably don't want to talk to me so why even push he's got his crew yeah you got your crew yeah yeah so why like oh cool now we're gonna be friends and summer together no we're not gonna do that so kyle we really could have used you because then it got a little aggressive but stanford steve shuts it all down pretty quickly he just he kind of has this look you're right very very good call surity on the bouncer vibes

did stanford steve make it the frolic room k? That was the rumor going around. Buddy, I don't know. I forgot to ask, but I told the bartender Troy when he got there, I was like, is there any way his first beer could be on me? I don't care if it's like 1942 or if it's Pappy or whatever. Is there

any way his first order could be on me? He said he's coming right from the airport. I felt like maybe that was just posturing. I don't think he did it. No, he was at my house in front of the airport. So there may have been an incident with another guest who was thrown out of showbacks late, not for anything. Well, he lit a cigarette inside, frowned upon. Sometimes you forget where you are.

Respect it. There are laws that have been passed in a lot of states. Sometimes the only thing you want to do is just just start so right it wasn't you know it wasn't hostile and it was very like hey what are you doing and the guy was like oh yeah sorry and then i was kind of trying to clean up clean up the mess a little bit there may have been somebody who left a person of the year award at a dive bar as well. I have to go fix that one up for somebody else at some point this week. So I don't know if you guys have any more follow-ups. We can just get the life advice. Well, the irony, I think, for you is that you have great self-awareness. And I remember from the times that we've traveled, I remember the

time of Wando's when a couple of dudes were coming up. And with you, it's usually one question. All right, one question, a quick conversation then kind of move on and as soon as like that person doesn't move on you don't have the patience to be like to entertain the conversation you're just out and then there are a couple times i'll like dip in i'll start talking to the guy and trying to get him away from you but some dudes are just persistent man if you've had a couple of drinks and you're like they're five minutes just doing all the talking to a semi-famous person or famous person you You got to have the awareness to just walk away. Right.

But I'm telling you, I have screwed it up. So I have some sympathy for when it's happening. And with me, it's just if I'm with somebody, I don't hang out with many people. So if I am with somebody and I'm out, it's probably the person that I want to hang out with. And it's rarely going to be a situation with a dude where you're going like, now you introduced yourself, you'd like to show, now we're going to hang out for three hours. That's tough to pull off.

I couldn't pull that off with somebody. Is there an example when you did nail it and you ended up befriending some famous dude? Was it Chris Long? No. You know what? The Vince Vaughn one at a wedding I i was at it went pretty well but i'd already interviewed him a couple times so i wasn't coming out of nowhere and he knew you

he knew who i was okay right but he wasn't like totally oh this is you know this is a guy i want to hang out with and the thing is is i actually kind of fucked it up for him i fucked it up for him because we were at the drake hotel is a big fancy wedding and it was a massive like it was the kind of like a socialite wedding and there was a side bar away from the main you know reception room i guess and i went off like the uvm guys classic like hey let's just go off to the sidebar and goon out for an hour while all of our wives and dates get pissed at us. And then as I was over there, I was like, oh, shit, that's Vince Vaughn. And, you know, it was him, his wife and another couple. And I was like, oh, whatever.

I've interviewed him a couple of times. Let's just go say hi. And we actually started talking college football. It was like a sincere conversation. But then because I did that, then a bunch of random wedding party started coming over and I it's open season on Vince that's a bummer right and then his wife did look at me because they got up and left like I ruined it they were in a private area ouch and then the wife looked at me like hey asshole cool you guys you and Vince got to talk about college football and we had a

private area we were good to go and no one was going to come up to us and then they thought it was and I was kind of like well look you're right but i didn't tell everybody else to come over here and then she's kind of like yeah right yeah like i'm new here by the way this sidebar was happening vince or no vince lady so we were going to be at this bar anyway yeah we were already here we were here for the wedding sorry vince or no vince the sidebar was happening for us. So. For this group.

Moral of the story is though, Van Pelt had a good time. He got out of the house. He didn't stay in his hotel room. He had a good time. Correct? There could be arguments that during the time

he wasn't having a blast. All right. He just couldn't believe certain things he would see. There was one point where this guy just kept yelling out rates and he kept looking at me be like what is he is he quoting the yield the 10 year like what is this guy talking about i was like i don't worry about it no we're fine and then he'd be like what's

going on with her he's like do you know her like yeah actually yeah that's you know whatever so and so he would just be like what's going on with her i'm like i don't know i don't really talk to her and he was in amazement he was like this place is really amazing like i love this place but i can't believe what is going on so whatever life advice is life advice rr gmail we have a follow-up to the guy that wrote in about his cycling instructor flirting with him and he didn't know how to handle it i don't think we have any follow-ups from him well kyle double check that so this guy has a take on it or i should say a spin on uh great on what went down in that email he goes hey guys just listen to the pod in the situation the female instructor quote flirting with our buddy who wrote in.

I thought I'd write it in. I'm a spin instructor who's been teaching for around five years and none of what he said in that email was flirting from the spin instructor. Wow. Wow. Okay. I'm in. A dart between the eyes right there. Don't want to take anything away from him.

Bad job. If that was your goal. But honestly, as an instructor, we are literally told to do all of those things to clients in and after class. Uh-oh. For example, if someone told me they love Taylor Swift, guy or girl,

and I played it in class, I would 100% every time call that person out by name. This is not flirting. This is the instructor trying to make an experience for someone. Oftentimes, a client will mention they love Drake or some artist, and I'll message them prior to class to ask them what their favorite song

is. This isn't flirting. I just know it will all make their class more enjoyable. I'm sure Saruti has heard this on Peloton when they call out the person's account handles. It's true. It's true, but they don't do it. Yeah, it's not the same, but yeah. Also, staring at someone and calling their name in class

may be the furthest thing from flirting. And I think confirms to me that you're fine here. We were told to call out people's names in class. I often memorize the names of clients before class and try to call them out periodically. I don't do this for any particular clients, just those whose names are easy to remember or I recognize. Also, I'm sorry, but you're likely also the token guy in the class.

I always have maybe two or three guys in every class, and they're the easiest to call out. Lastly, coming up to someone after class and asking about their weekend is not a move. What else are you supposed to ask someone after class? It's honestly the only talking point you have other than, how did you like the class? Also, we often try and get drinks or coffee with students after class.

It's part of the job to build your base. By the way, as I'm reading this, I'm thinking about the 20 women that think this guy has a thing for them. They're like, oh my god. He takes me out to coffee. You have to be a cyclist and an escort.

That's the only way it works. That's the only way you're successful in this business. Is this guy just gaslighting all the women in his class? Bang. Twice in a row. Now that we know what the word means. I'm hitting you with one on Wednesday. I'm hitting you with the gaslighting on Wednesday. Sorry to my guy

here for being harsh above. Maybe this instructor really is into him and is going too far. Who knows? Last thing I'll say here is that every guy that goes to spin class or fitness class thinks the hot instructor is trying to hit on them and this is purposeful we are actually taught to do this exactly uh-oh what is going on with this industry and also do things like engage with clients after class and try to build community i agree with kyle on this one and try to just to go with it and try to enjoy it what was it take it for the dudes taking it for the dudes and by no

means bring your girlfriend to class if you want to come back. That being said, if you did bring her, the instructor would be nothing but friendly to your girlfriend after class because the instructor is not hitting on you. She's just trying to get a loyal client. I heard some grunts and groans in the background from Kyle on this one, so I'll let you take the lead. I mean, all I was going to say is that's crazy. That's crazy. Like, we're trained. It's like you sound like you're like a bottle girl or something.

And that's, that's kind of crazy. It's like, you know, we don't get the tips unless we, you know, unless we come pretty close to them at the bar, you know,

it's just, it just sounds like there's a lot of psychological stuff that beyond just like pushing you to be your best, like involved here. It's like, we got to ask about their weekend and, uh, we got to point and weekend and uh we gotta point and stare and uh and learn the names but only the ones who are there's just they're all over the place and i just i don't believe you it sounds like you work at the uh the craziest cycle spot around

although i've never been to one so i could be way off base i just think i don't think if we pulled like nine out of ten dentists wouldn't agree with what you're saying it's all i'm saying nine out of ten though i do you think five out of ten dentists i don't know i don't know it's always nine out of ten like there's always one person they couldn't get on board and she seems like the one i don't i don't think i don't think she's the nine the guy going that's all i'm saying crest is all right we're a Colgate household over here, by the way. All right, so Rudy. Now I kind of want... He made some good points. Those are all accurate things. They call people out. I'm sure they want to get people engaged. They want to get people calling back. I would just like to give

our original email or the benefit of the doubt that he knows the difference between what's happening, like tactics and her actually hitting on him. And yeah, all right. Maybe he's the only guy in the class and she's doing like tactics and her actually hitting on him and yeah all right maybe he's the only guy in the class and she's doing that to him to point him out or whatever and it's not actually like a thing that she's into him but i like to think that he'd have the common sense and the knowledge to know that this is a little bit weird so i think the only

explanation now is i think his what i think his girlfriend's wife i want to i want her to go to the class i want to go to class yeah i want to see what happens that's how we find out what the you know that's how we get to the bottom we can't call this life advice if you want his girlfriend to go to class. Yeah. I want to see what happens. That's how we find out what the, you know, that's how we get to the bottom. We can't call this life advice. If you want his girlfriend to go to the class. I'm interested in the actual answer to this. So I think that's the only solution we have. He's got to take one. It can't be.

No, no, yeah. Can't be like, no, this is like home records is what this is. He has to do it for all of us. Everyone for the dude.

We need an answer. Yep. And the female audience. Let's not forget that too. I think the guy wrote a bunch, just like you said, Sruti, I think there are a lot of good points in here.

I also love the bottle service call out deal because the bottle service girl usually isn't that into you unless you are the main attraction in the group of dudes and, and something that really brings the juice to the table. Or if you're maybe in a smaller market, you know, a triple A market. And then the move with the bottle service girl

is that you're paying and you shit on every one of your buddies that screws up to her. That works sometimes. So that's just life advice. That's just extra. That's just on top, free toppings. I think this guy brings up a ton of good points,

but we don't know. We don't know because I would think if I were the previous guy and all these things were happening, I'd go, all right, fine. So, you know what? I think this guy brought a lot of good information to the table. But I think it's still – I don't think we have a conclusion on this.

I don't think he's wrong. But I think he really seems dedicated to his job and is probably very good at it. I don't know that this applies to our original emailer. I don't know that. We don't know. And just you saying it's not that he's wrong is probably infuriating to him because it is his industry and he's explaining. He's like, idiots, I just wrote you an email

about what exactly the job is. We gave you credit, guy. We said you brought up some good points. It sounds like a unique cycle house is all I'm saying. It sounds like he brought up his specific trainings and they tell us to touch them. You know what I mean? We are told, try to make out a ton with clients. But it's just building your base.

It's not a big deal. There are a handful of guys right now listening to this whole thing go down that are like, wait, is my instructor not in today? What's up with this guy? We're going to have a lot of dudes sign up for science classes. I just re-upped for six months god damn it I know today was supposed to be a cardio day I might put it to the test

see what happens just dying five minutes in alright hey Ryan big fan listening to you since NBA today those are the real the only people that are pre-NBA today OGs are the guys that'll say I don't think I've ever had anybody go

loved you on the Trenton Thunder Games. Boston. We'll get a couple of those right now. Alright, 5, 9, 2, 10. Get back to the gym. Recently cut down. Early 30s. Married. Couple small kids. During the pandemic, changed jobs. Moved my family across the country. I'm in a business-to-business sales role with a relatively well-known company in the South.

I can't bring myself to say y'all yet. When you get there, just tweet about the halftime show, the Super Bowl. Be like, y'all crazy. If you don't love this one. Y'all creeped up into the Northeast. It's everywhere. It doesn't. It's everywhere. That's what I mean. Yeah. No, it's not even a cultural

thing anymore. It's just people on social media. By the way, it's halftime show. I thought Kendrick Lamar was the highlight of it. I thought 50 Cent was not the highlight. Is's a halftime show. I thought Kendrick Lamar was the highlight of it. I thought 50 Cent was not the highlight. Is that cool? Shot at Kyle. That's fine. You're entitled to your opinions. Yep. Alright, so our man comes

into the sales job with a comp plan that included a $30,000 base salary with unlimited earnings cap, but my expected range was $60,000 to $80,000 annually. I started out earning my first year and was on track to make 115,000. At this point, our comp plan changed with some reasons for my bosses about fairness to other sales teams. And some of my team set to make more than executive leaders. It also went from being a

mildly complex comp plan to very straightforward and predictable. However, this ended up cutting my paychecks basically in half to the expected original rate, even though I'm still killing it month to month. I talked to my boss and his boss expressed concerns. I talked to my boss and his boss and expressed concerns politically talking about team morale, BS, et cetera. They said they'd like to take it into consideration and get back to me. It's been a few months, no word on any changes.

I like the company and my team, but the principle of the whole thing eats at me daily. I get it. Comp changes happen everywhere. Should I keep sticking it out to see if anything changes or take a risk on a new company with potentially the same issues? Love the show. Looking forward to your thoughts. All right. So my understanding here is that you thought you were making 115K. They make the comp changes, compensation again, if anybody's struggling with that. They make those changes while you're in this cycle. And so basically you made half of what you thought you were going to make. And so this changes the whole projection of why you thought you were going to work there.

The scary thing is they may have known this before and you took the job. So that part sucks. This would eat at me all the time. We had an agreement as far as what I was going to get paid. And now I'm not getting paid this and I'm just supposed to be cool with it.

But then as you said, you like everything else apparently about this. If you're this good, then you can get another job. And the fact that they said, let's give it a few months, and they didn't say anything to you, that was kind of a corporate fuck off.

That's really what it was. So that's going to bother you even more. So some people are okay with it. Some people go, hey, you know what? Everything changed. That kind of sucks. You know what? I'm just going to deal with it because i like the job find out if there's another

job because if it's eating at you enough to write an email it's probably only get worse and then you're going to start thinking of things retroactively about like oh they fucked me on this one and all this happened and oh here we go again i mean honestly i'm sorry but i do it too often where then i start adding up all the things where I go, wait a minute, wait a minute, this happened, that happened. So I would, uh, I would look to move on, but I would make sure you have a good option instead of just, you know, fucking Michael Scott quitting and then realizing like, Oh, actually I don't want to do that because I didn't have any kind of backup plan whatsoever. Yeah. I mean, I would say no, like this, this is one of those cases where I think

it's totally, they can't stop you from looking for a job while you're still working at this one. And so that's all, all of the, the stuff that makes you sick to your stomach. When you think about how this all went down, you could just, maybe that could take the edge off of you. Some of your energy to find a new job, because if it was like some sort of like you were passed up for a promotion thing, or you were, you know, your vacation days didn't work out or something happened where it's like anything that isn't literally like messing with your entire paycheck, like everything else line of work is this sort of model, then maybe you stay. But I mean, you're never going to be okay with this until you find out if that's the truth. So yeah, I totally would agree with you putting a lot of time into seeing what else is out there. Was he firm enough with his employers, though? Should he be like, hey, he obviously brought up the complaints that I'm not super

pumped about this. Time has gone by. They haven't said anything. Should he follow like, hey, he obviously brought up the complaints that I'm not super pumped about this. Time has gone by. They haven't said anything. Should he follow up and say, hey, guys, I was just looking for an update. I don't know if this is going to work for me long term. Kind of push it along a little bit. Make it known that you're unhappy. Make it known that you could potentially leave. And maybe they'll be like, well, shit, we can't lose this guy. He's really good. Maybe we'll give him a bump.

Maybe they'll give us an emergency. I think that would work. And I think Kyle's advice as well, always be looking for something else. That's just a general life thing. Be motivated about it. Go, okay, you're going to do this. And then, I mean, you could, I don't know. I mean, the weird thing is if you're really that good at it

and then you do get something solid somewhere else, they may say, all right, well, we'll change the compensation around. But just to wait it out, go, hey, we'll give you, I mean, they gave you a fuck you. did yeah you gotta follow up we'll give it a few months they're not motivated to resolve this or talk about it as you are so the longer you ignore it they're happy about it i mean they're hoping you're more comfortable enough to be like all right fine or you're just not confrontational and And then you're just going to go, well, I'm still waiting. Some people will be like, oh, it's been a year.

They haven't got back to me, but maybe at some point. Meanwhile, you're making half of what you thought you were going to make based on the email. All right, another one. This one's specific. It's complicated, and it's a little different. I love it. Hey, guys, 6'1", 180, 315 squat, 295 deadlift,

155 bench, long arms. You're also not that strong. Sorry. It's not just long arms. No, I mean. Emailing in from Canada

where I work at a fitness and recreation center with a bunch of basketball courts. Huh? Three weeks ago, I lost one of my sneakers. I don't know how I lost it, but I went to the gym bag. One day, one of my Kobe's was gone. Oh, man. I was devastated.

I kept checking the lost and found at work. They'd be keeping the back room, but the shoe never showed up. But, after about a week of checking, a sick pair of LeBrons that looked barely worn appeared in one of the lost and found bins naturally I had to see if they were my size

which they were I left them alone though I just lost a sneaker I knew the pain and suffering it caused I wanted the rightful owner of the shoes to have a chance to get them back they've now been there for two weeks I check in on them frequently

to see if anyone has picked them up. But they're still there. Yesterday, I tried them on for the first time. They fit like a fucking glove. You did a great job reading this, dude. No, I mean, I don't want the guy to be totally anti-me after the bench thing, but this is a really good email.

I'm tired of popping into the back room to lust over shoes. My question is twofold. Firstly, is it weird to take someone else's shoes from the lost and found? In my mind, it's no weirder than buying shoes from a thrift store. Obviously, I will clean and wash them before wearing them, but is it still weird? Secondly, have I waited the requisite time period before taking these shoes? I feel like I've given the owner ample time to claim them. And at this

point, he's probably just charged it to the game and moved on. I don't want to wait so long that one of my other co-workers will just swoop in and take them. Please help me as playing pickup hoops in my old Nike Runners sucks. This is a real dilemma.

Alright, let me start by saying this. As somebody who's had his car broken into a million times, had shit stolen from him, had a nice watch stolen from him, had credit cards, debit cards, that whole shit. Like it just sucks that there's so many people out there that would take other people's stuff

and they're just okay with it. That's not what this is. But it's leaning towards it. All right. My answer today was very different from my answer in my twenties. Not that I was just out fucking taking everybody's stuff, but my priorities are different and I'm probably more sympathetic to things than I would have been when I was younger. So I get it.

You lost your shoe. Here are these other shoes. You want to take them. You probably took them already and you're just writing the email this way. I thought about a solution to this one. Even though I think there's more of the audience that's like, just fucking take

them, dude. They've been in loss and found two weeks. You like them. They're nice LeBrons. And the other thing is somebody else from work is going to take them. So that's some of those weird things you start doing where you're justifying it where it's like I'm not totally clean in this but somebody else is going to take them so why don't I be the guy that goes ahead and takes them what I would do because I know you're going to take them well let me put it this way I wouldn't take them I'd leave them there go ahead whatever somebody else wants to take them that's fine but if you want to try to give yourself some moral out, you take them now, put them in a bag,

and you wait another two weeks. So that way, if the person was like, hey, I lost the shoes. I had no idea where I lost them. I finally realized after three weeks that this is where they were or, hey, something happened and I had to travel or something at home happened because you're going to feel like shit if you kept them, kept them. And then you go to the guy and you pull them aside and go, hey, here's the deal. Somebody was going to take them and it was going to be me. But I put them in a bag and I put them aside and did nothing with them until another couple of weeks went past. And now you're still inside that window.

Because then if it's a lost and found, you're coming back four months later for your sneakers. At that point, like you said, you charge into the game on that one. I feel like Kyle's going to have a slightly different take on this, perhaps a bit more aggressive. But that's what I would at least do. Some of those mental gymnastics make yourself feel a little bit better about taking a guy's used basketball shoes, which you've clearly justified used part in your own head. You're processing these things that leads to what I already know is you taking these shoes. Yeah. What I would say is you came to the absolute right place. I don't know which way Cerruti is leaning on this. Ryan's leaning in my direction and I'm just going a little bit further.

That's all. So you came to the right place. You're getting what you want, unless he really completely doesn't want 80 on this, which I don't know. Maybe he would. I was going to say two weeks. If you're a good person, if you're the version of me I was 10 years ago, two weeks wasn't happening. But now and even a couple years ago... Would two minutes happen?

I mean, we'll clock out. I think we're clocking out and if it's still there, it might be game time. I don't know. Um, but you know, even as, as recent as a couple of years ago, I would be like, all right, two weeks is the minimum. That's what, you know, you know, two weeks is what happens. Um, so I, and now I would wait a little longer than two weeks because that's the bare minimum. And you're clearly, you know, you clearly have a conscience and you clearly are worried about this. So yeah, I would, I think, I think your thing is actually right.

It's like, yeah, put them to the side. If you're really not sure what kind of characters you work with, or maybe you are sure what kind of characters you work with, then yeah, maybe put them in a bag somewhere off to the side. And then you can, and then you can feel fine.

I think a month, I mean, come on, I've been boned by the lost and found so many times as well. And I even in freshman year, I left something in my locker the day after that was supposed to be cleaned out, leather jacket. My mother never let me forget it. And it made it all the way into the janitor's custodial lost and found. I went there the next day. She dragged me there, went there, wasn't there. It's just the loss and found, it's really a toss up. You can't expect anything for the loss and found.

So I'd say if you wait a month, even if you do it and you're a little way that nobody else who doesn't deserve them doesn't get them, I think that's totally fine. So I was gonna say, I was gonna say wait a week, but I think, yeah, wait two weeks. We'll put them in the bag so that you know nobody else gets them in an ill-gotten manner only you so you're saying the two weeks after the initial two weeks like what i think two weeks is a bare minimum yeah i think two weeks is a bear i was gonna say we're at two weeks we're

at two weeks now and i was saying you could take them off to the side because really this isn't even about the original owner right now this is going who is going to break down morally first who i work with what kind of man are you this is what the competition is it's not with the original owner it's with everybody else you work with yes so that's how you can start to selfishly process these things you know it's like we all kind of do like today i wouldn't take i just i just wouldn't i would hope the guy would come back but you know they're not gonna last if they're nice lebrons anyway so i'm surprised they were there this long wait it was the guy was he in canada yeah yeah all right well that's shit it's it's a decision that he's already made and he wants validation on. I'm not a big LeBron shoe fan, so I wouldn't take them personally.

If they were a different shoe, it's a different story. I would probably take the Kobe's. No, it is relevant. But if you like the LeBrons, and depending on what kind of LeBrons are, they can be pretty expensive. My biggest concern, though, would be if you... Because how is this guy going to reach you reach you and be like hey i lost my shoes like and you have them in a bag i've been holding them for you like my biggest concern is like after a month if you put them on right you start wearing them in pickup games and he goes hey those are my shoes dude like what do you say

at that point you just say hey you know he's like they weren't in lost and found i checked two weeks ago like maybe he'll check tomorrow and they're not there and then a month later you're wearing his shoes i don't i don't know that shoes. I don't, I don't know. That would be, I don't know. I wouldn't have a good answer for that. I think that'd be kind of a problem for you, but man, what, what could happen in those two weeks? Like, why would this guy not have picked up his, his LeBron's? I don't know.

So I just, I just laid out a bunch of make-believe examples of what could have possibly happened. But Cerruti brings up a really good point. Cause if the guy who works at the facility also like is running full court all the time and then a month from now the guy's like hey did you find those here and now you have to lie and if there's a chance he saw you bench pressing he's probably not afraid of you like who knows yeah my my one of my best friends lives in used to live in medford mass just outside boston and he ordered a pair of shoes to his door and they were getting a bunch of stuff stolen from their from their porch and his shoes got stolen he calls like the postal service like you know we dropped them off here's the picture and they just weren't there a couple days later he sees

his neighbor wearing the shoes he ordered and he confronted him about it and he was like nah like they're not my shoes so you could just play that route and go I don't know I had these I had these these are my shoes I don't know what you want me to say dude unless there's like a marking on them that would like you know make them unique or something but that would just be my biggest concern is this guy comes back and goes why the hell did you steal my shoes then you're kind of in a weird spot where you're like yeah i took them out lost and found and it's kind of a dick move sketchy move but like i you know somebody stole my shoe like you know a month or so ago i don't know it sounds like this guy lost his own shoe

yeah that's a really good point though because that conversation could happen and you know the chances are reading this email the guy's sitting there listening to the podcast and a pair of slightly used so he's lacing those up but he's putting new laces in here okay that's life advice life advice rr at gmail.com thank you to kyle and steve for all of their help on the rhino risolo podcast please subscribe ringeringer and Spotify. We'll talk to you Wednesday with Mark Wahlberg. you