The Science of Flipping - Episode 150: Interview with Gary Boomershine – REIvault | Direct Mail | Cold Calling

Episode Date: August 30, 2019

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Welcome to the Science of Flipping Podcast. I'm your host, Justin Colby. Hey, what is up, boys? Welcome back to the Science of Flipping Podcast Podcast. If you're in the Science Flipping group and watching this live, congratulations. I'm going all technology on you guys. So good work. If you're not a part of the Science Flipping Academy group, and you're listening to this on iTunes, or you're watching it on YouTube, or you see it on social media, or maybe Mr. Gary Boomershine shares it, whatever, make sure you join the Science of Flipping Academy group. It is a closed group, but it is completely free. There's no pitching, no selling. It's all about giving you the best engagement contact experts like my man, Gary Boomershine. So get over to the Science of Flipping group. Join. I have to approve you you but you will be let in so mr gary brumerschein what is up man justin colby what's happening brother dude i uh as you can see i'm uh on my this is actually four shots of espresso here and i've already had two cups of coffee so no big deal little amped up here little amped up hey uh i it's funny because i was just for everybody that's here i completely

missed the calendar i looked at email i was at the gym and just finished out an awesome workout and uh anyway i looked and it says gary boomerschein and i are going live in 10 minutes so i'm like oh man i texted you i'm like man i totally forgot it so unshaven i'm a little sweaty but uh, man, man, you look great, dude. Listen, it's Saturday morning for all of you out there. Yes, we work on Saturdays. Yes, we work seven days a week. So appreciate you just making the time, dude, because you could very easily been like, Hey, buddy, I'm out. So yeah, it's great. I'm super excited. Great. Love what you do, man. You got a great following. And, you know, just for everybody, Justin and I are in boardroom together and probably got to know, sharing what's working. And so I've gotten

tons, tons of value from you. I know you're also coaching some of our REI Vault Real Estate Investor.com guys. And I get nothing but thumbs up on everything that you do. So thank you. Thank you. I appreciate it, man. Appreciate it. Well, so let's talk, you know, again, you and I have gotten really close. And a lot of that stems from when we're in that mastermind, all I talk is marketing. Like, like I almost don't say anything else about anything is I just firmly believe this business. I don't care if you're a wholesaler or a flipper, right? Like if you have no homes to buy, you're out, right? I don't care if you're a buy and hold guy, if you have no homes to buy, you're out. So marketing is such the life blood. And you know, I am now flipping homes down in san diego i don't know

if you know that i think you and i caught up on that and actually shameless plug sunday baby sunday that's the company buying homes um so i'm down there and it's a different market it's a different beast but one thing remains the same you need to be marketing as much as you possibly can. And part of that is, you know, we do direct mail. We're calling, we are PPC, but part of it also is going to be the networking. But trust me when I tell you the craziest thing is direct mail still works. And I don't care what market San Diego is such a different market from Phoenix and San Antonio and in other markets. But by the way, it just only still works, right? And I know you know that. How many mail pieces have you sent out now? I mean, you spent out 37 million. Oh, that's all? Cool. I was hoping you actually knew what you were talking about.

No, I was actually, I was on Joe Fairless's podcast and I went and pulled the number. So 37 million pieces, we've tracked every response rate and we're doing that for about 260 agents and investors around the country right now. And this is another interesting one. We've done over a million outbound seller calls. So just for all of you, one of the things with direct mail is, you know, somebody actually has to have a conversation with the seller. There's a lot of kissing, what I call kissing a frauds to find, Hey, the, the, the people that want to sell you know, are they, are they reasonable sellers? Do they want to sell? And so we built a phone team that's, you know, scripted, super professional, sharp as a tack, that schedules appointments. And so we've done over a million outbound calls. And I'd love to share some things that are working

with your group, whether they're interested in having it done for them from a company like realestateinvestor.com, or if they want to do it on their own, I'd love to share. One thing that you just said, that direct mail, a lot of people say, I saw this from Chris Chico. I love Chris, but he says, direct mail doesn't work. Cold call, just today it came up. Facebook, no, what did he say? Cold calling doesn't work. It absolutely works. It's a return on investment. Sp, you know, spend a dollar, make, you know, $5. So it's the return on investment in some markets has decreased. So I know in Dallas, the average has gone from like $1 to $6. It's probably closer to one and four. And so it's a response and you have to be very,

very tight on your process. You've got to be, you know, you can't just go in like you did a couple of years ago. Um, and you know, expect to have one of a one phone call close. There's a lot of followup and you got to be really tight on the sales process. And the people that are doing that are crushing it right now. Would you agree with that? Agreed. And that's the, the biggest part is it's unfortunate that some of the gurus or whoever talk about like the strategy of closing a deal,

but they don't actually talk about what's really important, which is going to be your follow-up, which is going to be, how are you actually, you got in front of them, good job, which is marketing, right? That's the direct mail. That's the cold calling PPC, door knocking, whatever that's. But very rarely, especially in an economy like today where it's still on fire. I don't understand why or how, but it's still on fire. Very rarely are you going to come across that one call close or that one conversation close because A, sellers are way more knowledgeable now because of how long the market has been going in an appreciating way. And then B, you have everyone and their mother also mailing them, also calling them, also texting them, also door knocking. So now you have to figure out what the sales process is.

And it changes for each. Like my cold calling leads, and I know you're going to agree with me here, are massively different than my direct mail leads. Not even in the same game, right? My follow-up technique on direct mail is different than my cold calling because cold calling, even as the name says, is they are not ready for you yet. Like they didn't reach out to you. When direct mail hits, they're calling you back. So there's already a certain level of engagement that they're going through personally to say, I want to go talk to Justin or Gary about selling my home, see what they have to say. When I'm calling Gary cold and saying, Hey, do you want to sell? You may have been thinking about

it, but you're also thinking in your head, who fuck are you like maybe right so it's the process of the sales process is so valid or very important because all leads aren't the same ppc is different direct mail direct mail is different in cold calling they're all different than each other um so you have to have nailed down your process and and i respect chris Chico the same way you do. Like none of them are dead. It's whether you have the ability to actually follow up in fortunes in the follow-up. Like what does your database look like? What does your sequencing look like? How are you reaching them? I just had a conversation with somebody. You got me off on a tangent right now because I just had a conversation with a personal client. You mentioned I work with clients personally. They were talking about this email sequence that they laid out for the first 30 days,

and I almost lost my mind. I was like, the first 30 days are your hottest time. You're not emailing them. You are calling them, potentially going and knocking on their door because that is when they are ready to make a decision. You use email when they've been in your database for six months. Fine. You email drip them. But like that first week, I'm calling them three times in the first week. The second week, I'm calling them two. The third week, I'm calling them one. By the way, I'm also emailing them, right? So go ahead. A couple of things. One is I really want people to say direct mail sucks. Direct mail doesn't work. Cold calling doesn't work. Why? Because we really want to reduce the competition. The reason that

direct mail is right, why it's getting more competitive. Three or four years ago, nobody was doing it. When the market turned direct mail, we just all turned it off back in 2009, 2010. And the reason is that we were buying, all of us were buying homes from the MLS. We're buying bank owned REOs, right? And everybody hated, real estate was the dirty word in 2009. And so people that started doing direct mail, it was like fishing of the hungriest fish, right? With, and no competition. And then all of a sudden start, people started hearing about it and talking about it. And then the next thing, you know, the late night TV commercials, you know, I went in and I love Stan Merrill, but I, you know, those guys at Fortune Builders and Dean are, you know,

they're holding up our postcard, right? It's like, hey, where'd they get that postcard? That was ours, right? Yeah. So when it starts to become competitive, now people are starting to do cold calling. A year ago, they weren't. So here's the reality, everybody. The reality is you need to have a mentality of all leads suck.

Regardless, I mean, this is classic sales. And if you're flipping, you're wholesaling, it's a business just like any other business. Sales and marketing is key. A, you've got to drive the leads. Then the mentality of all leads suck means you've got to talk to these sellers. I can't tell you how many people will get 40, 50, 60, 100 leads. They won't even talk to the seller. You's like a live, you have to, and you don't want to be a douchebag either. At the end of the day, you need to come in, you need to differentiate, you need to be a problem solver

with the seller, right? If you're just coming in and giving them some crappy, you know, low ball, you know, disgusting offer, you know, in this market, it doesn't work, right? So you got to come in, you got to build some rapport with the seller. I'll give you a perfect example, Dallas, one of the most competitive markets in the United States right now, San Diego, Arizona, Atlanta, Denver, but Dallas, two guys. So Tyler Ambern and Jennifer Ambern, she was a former cheerleader for the Dallas Cowboy cheerleaders. The cutest couple met at a church group, you know, in high school. And they've been dating.

That's amazing. Total, total kind of like, you know, wonderful couple. And I've been helping them. Here's their numbers. Just,

I just, I just got them from Tyler. Tyler, for every dollar he's spending, he's getting $8 in profit. So he spent $17,000 in marketing since March, since April 1st, and he's closed $160,000 in net profits and still working those leads. He's closed six deals, averaged at $17,000 per deal, 800% return on investment. You talk to other guys in Dallas and they're like

it doesn't work right and why you know Tyler goes in he meets with the seller they love him he tells them right up front he goes look I do this full-time here's my family I've got Clark who just you know he's here's my baby here's my wife I was a pilot for an airline and now my wife and I do this, and I might not be the best solution, but I'd love to help you. And if it works out, that would be great. So all of a sudden the sellers open up to him when now another competitor comes in, right? And they're just crappy. They're not buttoned down and they look like a scam artist. And so Tyler's winning deal after deal after deal. And so you have to change,

you have to change up your tactic. The other thing is when a seller says no, there's a thing called the sales Bible. Gitmore, Gitmer, I've got it sitting right over there. The sales Bible, it says that sales doesn't start until the customer says no. No, right. Right? So, and most people are like,

they take no and it's like, oh, it doesn't work. You know, this business sucks. It's like, no, that's actually a good thing. That's when the salesmanship starts, which is great. We'll start following up with them. I told Tyler, I'm like,

Tyler, you know, he just had a seller. They want to sell, but they're not really sure. They're kind of thinking through it. I said, hand write a little thank you letter. just a little thank you letter, and then follow up with them. Just say, you know, dear Diana and Robert, that were their names. I helped him. I said, you know, hey, it was wonderful meeting you. I know that you've got a, you know, your mom is actually sick and you're going to be spending some time with her. Just wanted to tell you,

thank you for taking the time. And if there's an opportunity down the road that you're looking to possibly sell your house, I'd love you to consider me or maybe refer me to somebody that you know. And he put a little picture of his family in there, right? Because that works. Nobody does it. No, in direct mail for me, I put a picture, kind of funny story. So one of my assistants slash employees years ago is actually a buddy of mine's wife. Okay. And I was single at the time. So I was like, hey, can you come take a picture with me? Because we're going to put it on a direct mail. So it's me and my buddy's wife, who's my assistant slash employee, as we are looking as a couple.

And the irony is he's also here in Phoenix. He's also a real estate investor. And I'm mailing him because he owns his home. So I'm just blanket mailing. He's like, bro, can you take the picture of me or you and my wife off my mail piece? I'm like, nope. It's crushing. It's crushing. And that's because there's,

you know, I'm a big advocate of this. I'm really glad you brought this up. Like, care about the seller. Like, I know there's so many people out there that all they want is the deal and they want to hit home runs. They want to be bajillionaires. And I got you. But the more you care about the seller, the more you come off genuine, authentic, heartfelt, like you give a shit, you will win. People will resonate with you. They'll want to do business with you. I can't tell you how many deals anymore that we are a lower offer than're doing it, how we're helping them. And that needs to be communicated through your direct mail too. And your phone and your cold calling and your PB, like you need to make sure they understand that you're in here for them as well. And the like salesy, you know,

let's renegotiate all the time. Like that's just not it anymore. I get it. Some people still do it, but that's not it. That's not what it's about. Like you will win more if you become empathetic to that homeowner on all of your messaging, by the way. I take it a step further. It needs to be genuine. Yeah. Oh yeah. And, uh, because you know what, at the end of the day, the, the, the seller is going to, they're going to read through the BS. And so if you come in desperate, right, and you look broke, and you're desperate to buy the house, they know it. Yep.

And you know what, you'll close some deals. But you want to make a lot of money, be in this business a long time, get massive referrals, you should come in on every deal and solve a problem in exchange for making money. Because there's a lot of things that we can do that nobody else can do, right? That realtors cannot do. We can come in and Tyler, actually, I'll give you a perfect example. Made $40,000 on a property, Dallas property. I helped him with this.

The seller lived in Kansas, okay? And both her parents, she had a bad tenant in the property. It was her parents' property. And both parents, actually, one of them was going into hospice like that day. And so we got on the phone with her and had a conversation. She was very stressed out. And we just, we basically said, look, you know what, we will take care of the tenant if that would be okay with you. And she literally cried on the phone., look, you know what? We will take care of the tenant if that would be okay with you. And she literally cried on the phone. She goes, you know what?

You guys are awesome. I'm so thankful that I found you. You guys have delivered over and over again. And so I told Tyler, he closed that deal. I said, jump on a plane, fly to Kansas, go hand deliver the check with her that day and get a video testimonial. I said, and you'll be able to share that day and get a video testimonial. I said, and you'll be able to share that over and over again with other sellers and differentiate yourself because there's a lot of scumbags in this business, right? That come out of a seminar,

they're dead broke. They've got, you know, they're looking for the first opportunity. They send a postcard, they have no ability to deliver, right? And then there's a bunch of people like us, right? A lot of people that follow you, follow me that are genuine and actually have a real business and something to deliver. So differentiate, come in, be the problem solver, right? There is a massive amount of money to be made. But if you come in and you're looking for, hey, what's the problem? The bigger the problem, the more the opportunity to make money. And many times I'll tell the seller, I'll walk through them and I say, you know what? I think you fixing up this property and putting the $50,000 into it and then putting it on the MLS,

get a great realtor. It might take you four or five months. That's, I think, a really great solution for you. And I walk them through it. I'm part part of the solution with them. And, and I'm like, if I help at all, I'd love maybe a thank you, you know, card, you don't have to do anything else, or maybe a referral. And you know what, a lot of those sellers come back and say, Hey, we've thought about it. We want to sell to you. And I'll tell them, Hey, as long as I can make a modest profit somehow, some way in exchange for helping and maybe solving a problem for you, that I would love to be your solution. Because my word is my bond. My bond is my word.

I do what I say. I can actually pick up the phone and call. We could call some people together who have worked with me, right? And that's how you win, right? And that's, by the way, that is classic salesmanship. The worst thing a seller could tell you is that you're a good sales guy, because a good sales guy is a great listener, right? A great problem solver. They're empathetic. People buy and sell to people that they like, trust, and respect. Rule number one of sales,

right? They like, trust, and respect. And people buy and sell first to their friends, then to their friends, third to their friends, third to their friends, fourth to their friends in the reality. So anyway, I think this market has changed. The order takers from a couple of years ago are gonna be out of the business. The guys that are doing it right, right, are gonna make a fortune in this business

and give the business a good reputation too. Yeah, and I wanna get to what a lot of people know you for, which is going to be direct mail. And the reason why I want to bring this to light is because I've played with direct mail a lot. Like I've done. So the beginning of the year, I decided, okay, let's go back to the handwritten, legit like handwritten envelope. Let's see if we can get a higher percentage. So listen to what I found and would love to hear what you found. This is what I would argue also would be the same thing as postcards. Okay. In my head, I'm thinking you will have a higher open

rate because literally we put a real stamp on it. It was not both. I spent more is my point. I was like, let me spend more. Let me have higher quality, real stamp, not. It was not bulk. I spent more is my point. I was like, let me spend more. Let me have higher quality, real stamp, not bulk, handwritten. Okay. So my thesis was correct. I got a better open rate and I got a better callback ratio. The part of my thesis that was not correct is I did not receive more valuable leads. Okay. So I started this back in January to start the year and I've been running it all the way. We're still running it, right? We're still dropping mail for this month, just like this, right? Because I'm a firm believer. You don't react quick. There's no knee jerk reaction. Remain consistent, right?

The other mail that I've been doing for years and years and years and years is your typical white envelope, printed out letter, picture of me. and again, my assistant that's doing it, right? And it has all, like, it has been so consistent, it's unbelievable. Like, to the dollar. I'm like, all right, 20 grand's going out. This is the return. Like, I just know it, right? And you can bank on it, which is really good for a business to be able to be, have longevity.

So I was like, you know what? Phoenix is such a difficult market. We, we basically move this into, um, let me see, let me see if we can actually start to move the needle in a certain respect. The callback did increase by double with double callback. We had percentage basis. Our percentage of leads became way less because our callbacks were way higher quality of leads, right? So like an MQL, a qualified lead remain the same. It did not move my needle. So I spent more, less mail was going out because my

budget didn't increase just because I was trying something new. And the qualified leads remained the same. And that's that it was a big eye opener for me. Now, would that remain true in every market? I will, you know, ask you, but the same idea when people send out uh postcards the idea is you have 100 open rate because everyone will at least flip it around right like every postcard i've ever gotten my lifetime i do this and it's throw it away or it you know provides me interest um but i would guess if i went back to postcards also i'd have a higher callback ratio but i'd also i don't believe it moved my needle for qualified leads because of this fact i would get so my answer my results became more fus

more take me off your list more not leads with the same amount of qualified leads i would guess a postcard since i haven't used those in a long time probably would equate to about the same what do you what do you think about that because yeah postcards are the easier way for those entry guys it's a lot cheaper like I was spending a dollar per postage because postage real postage and handwritten you know the cost of the people writing the right so all that came to about a dollar per um what's your thought about all that? What I just said to you? So we've mailed out over, or I shouldn't say over, real close to 400 different mail pieces. So I think we've done more split testing than anybody in any real estate niche,

real estate agents or investors. So over 400, we've done offer packages, right? We've done handwritten letters. We've got a new one right now that we're testing out that actually came from a very large company in another niche. That's an offer letter like open door, but it's handwritten and we're testing it. It doesn't even go in an envelope. It looks like it was somebody that dropped off a proposal and we're testing that. We've done lumpy mail, right? Back in the day, we'd put trash can little things in the mail or whatever. Yeah. So at the end of the day, what we're finding is that postcards for the bigger list, the less motivated list will always for the initial call from the seller outproduce dollar for dollar. And then there's two approaches. There's what's called one step or two step or blind copy,

like a lot of the blind copy Dan Kennedy and many of you know us from doing that for the third notice or the expiration notice. So it doesn't say really anything about buying the house. That is different than saying, hey, I'm anything about buying the house. That is different than saying, hey, I'm interested in buying your house. And I'll tell you what we're finding. The blind copy is about one in 60 leads. If you've got a sales process, meaning you're doing the follow-up and you can close and you're actually talking to the sellers, because some people get 60 leads and they're actually not doing anything. So 160 leads on that blind copy and then one in 45. And this is if you're kind of marginal at selling. One in 45 leads should close. About one third of

45 are going to be net leads, viable, good, where the seller says, yes, I'd be interested in potentially selling. Right. Right. So 45 turn into 15. And of the 15, maybe half you make offers to and the other you follow up. But that's just a numbers game. It's a numbers game. Right. Yeah. And that's across the market, by the way, that's across. So what was the one in 45? So you said the not you call the term one in 60. We're live. I'm going to show you. I'll give you an example. I'll give everybody example. These are the two. A lot of us have seen these. So, so you got a pink one over here.

This is what's been a lot of people know as the pink doodle. This is, I think Joe Taylor actually came up with this, but this is, this has been out there. It's kind of a handwritten looking thing on pink paper. This is, I think Joe Taylor actually came up with this, but this has been out there. It's kind of a handwritten looking thing on pink paper. This is, everybody says, oh, this is killer. And then you've got this one on the left. We've tested, by the way, pink, the one on the left, white, the canary yellow, and pink. And believe it or not, the white outproduces.

And this piece on the left over here uh this by the way this is brad chandler from express home buyers sorry it's my my uh my thing just locked up hold on really quick no problem so you're talking about the white one is brad chandler yeah brad this uh brad express home buyers they're one of the largest wholesalers in the country. I know that for a while he was doing at least a million dollars a month. It's probably more. But this came from him. So good copy on the left outproduced three to one right now.

So this is averaging, the one on the right is averaging like 1.2% response rate. And this on the left, Brad Chandler, the white one, is getting about three and a half. All right. What's interesting in direct mail, the response rates across the board three years ago to today is about half. So what we were doing three years ago, we're getting about half the response rate than we were doing three years ago, we're getting about half the response rate than we were. So what it means is you've got to be a lot better at working those leads and following up on those leads. I know talking to Tyler, Tyler's like, gosh, Gary, you guys have been hammering this follow-up. What does

follow-up mean? It means, hey, a lead comes in, they get text message. Hey, if, you know, text message, ringless voicemail, a phone call. And then, you know, that doesn't stop, you continue to interact with them, because most of the profits are going to take a bit of time. Here's a statistic 97% of all sales don't happen after at least after a month, only and this is a national statistic, even car dealers that sell cars, insurance salesmen, this is a national across all the niches, but only 3% of deals come in off of the first initial call. 97% take follow-up and less than 10% of anybody do follow up more than twice. So, you know, I love it. I love the people that do direct mail. They spend some money and

then they give up because, you know, and I love when people are saying direct mail doesn't work because we want to refine it. Like, I don't want, I don't want the late night TV guys talking about direct mail, right? Right. No, I love it. Yeah. No, I, the more people that do something, um, uh, you know, the more competitive it gets. And so you just have to be better at it. But anyway, postcards, postcards, we're finding out we do, we do live stamp. We do the indicia. I'll give you the example on this one here.

I think these are, there's even a please recycle on the left hand side. This one's what's called an indicia. It really doesn't matter. We have not seen the live stamp, the handwritten out produce. It's really the copy. It is really the copy. The paper makes a difference.

So you truly want to be on four by six. A lot of these print houses to save money, they'll put it on a little smaller. So you want it to stand out. The words, if you look at the words on the one on the left, I believe the reason this crushes it is I recently sold, it's the wording that Brad and his marketing team, I recently sold a house in your area. I'm looking to purchase another one with the proceeds because a lot of people are tired of the riffraff of people coming in and having no money and saying that they could buy and close on it. So this has been producing really well.

So typically yellow paper, it's called canary yellow. It does outproduce than anything else. For some reason, this one on pink over here, we've done yellow, we've done green, we've done white. The pink does work. It's just the weirdest thing. And by the way, unless you're sending like 10,000 pieces minimum and you're testing the response rate and you're testing the conversion rate, you don't know. So a lot of people will go and they'll say, oh, this thing is great. They tested it on 100 names and addresses and then the rest of the world if you really have to split test you got to test and it's not just the number of leads that come in

it's the quality of the leads as you said right yep so i would say you know in the next part is um percentage basis so if you send out 10 000000 of these cards, either one, choose one. I don't, maybe they're different. Maybe the same. What type of lead volume are you getting? Right? So if 10,000 mail pieces go out, I can tell you from my mailer very specifically that you get a full blown 1% callback ratio.

It does actually end up to be 1%. So 1% of 10,000 is going to be a hundred from that 50% of that 1% are viable leads, right? Um, meaning they want to sell, right? So now I'm down to 50 out of that 50% are actually homes we would buy meaning the other 25 right have like tire shops and lots of land next to a tire shop and you know whatever else right like they're they're leads they want to sell but it's like some arbitrary thing that right so where do those postcards stand? So 10,000 go out. I get 25 viable leads, by the way. That's the end result of what I'm talking about. Motivated, qualified leads. That's what my mail is performing at. How do those postcards perform? And what I'll tell you about that is we close

roughly one in every 18, not roughly, that is our number. One in every 18 leads that come through that are qualified, we close. So I send out 10,000, I get one deal. So it's very easy math for me. Let me guess. So you're getting a 0.75, less than 1%. So I would imagine you're getting 75 leads in order to get the 25. No, I get 100 callbacks, right, which are not leads. Right.

Which brings down 50 become actual leads. So 50% of the 100 total callbacks become actual leads. So now I get 50. Okay. I'll tell you on average, you know, the national average, this is from Dan Kennedy. If you've got a postcard that gets a 1% response rate, you've actually achieved success. Okay. Now, our stuff, I can tell you, our stuff is typically like the one that I just showed you.

Like it's 1.2, 1.4. I know we're getting a higher response rate. I just did this for, you know, Rafael Vargas. He has a $3 million a year business. Love those guys. They're out of Tampa. We're working to get them started up with us. But they just showed me their results.

I think they sent out almost 300,000 pieces, I think, in the last six months. They spend $74,000 a month on direct mail, but on eight markets and about 1.1% response rate, right? 1.1% response rate, those guys, you know, did $3 million in transactions last year. So you can do it. I think if you look at those guys, they're very, very tight on their follow-up process. They're looking at the leads. They know the numbers. They know exactly what they expect. He was just telling me they expect 200 leads a day. So they're like, hey, we need to know, can you guys deliver 200 leads a day? Because they know that those are going to go to their team. Some are going to be low-hanging fruit.

They're going to close right away. And then the rest of them, they're going to be really great at building rapport and following up with the seller. It's a no-seller-left-behind model. And I know that I'm harping on that, but guys, this one little change, right, realizing that the leads suck when they come in, you've got to talk to the seller, you've got to follow up.

The early leads that come out, we even consider them bluebirds. It's like really the work is just going to take some follow up. But imagine if you could actually follow up five, six, seven, eight times, knowing you're going to make a big fat deal, right? The value of doing that, you know, your return on time with follow up, you could send a little text message if, if you don't have a system like ours or a investor PO or something like that. There's a lot of systems, the leads come in, they should automatically send out text message, ringless voicemail, right? Push it over to the phone team. If that makes sense. I mean, that's, that's, that's what we're doing. You know, for REI Vault members, realestateinvestor.com members, is the leads come in and they get text message. They get put on what we call a long-term drip campaign and then pushed over to a professional phone person,

you know, an inside sales agent who's actually going to call the seller, get them on the phone, and screen them, right? And then we continue to follow up with them forever, assuming that on the phone and screen them. Right. And then we continue to follow up with them forever. Assuming that it's a property we want to buy and, and, and it hasn't sold to somebody else. Yep. No, I think, listen, I think you're harping for the right reasons and it's the same rate. Like I'm glad you're doing it and I'm not doing it because I say the same thing. Right. And so I think a lot of my, you know, science flipping tribe has heard me say this. So I'm glad you're doing it. And your volume same thing. I think a lot of my science flipping tribe has heard me say this. I'm glad you're doing it. Your volume of mail and cold calling and marketing expertise, that's why I'm having you on this. I firmly believe it's a marketing business.

Just for the sake of time, it is Saturday and I usually try to keep these condensed. Obviously, you have REI Vault, realestateinvestor.com. This is going to be in the group. If you want to even just send a link over guys, I know I spoke to Gary before this. He said he's going to, because you're part of my world, he's going to hook you guys up. Gary, you don't need to give a number right now. But I'd tell you is if you get ahold of Gary's team, REI vault, realestateinvestor.com, mention you saw this podcast, listened to this podcast. So, Gary, let them know where to go. Obviously, feel free to put any links into Facebook, or if this is on YouTube, or not Instagram, but iTunes. So, let them know where to go if they're

interested in knowing more. Yeah. So, I think the best place to go would be rei vault.com forward slash vip reason we set that up specifically because there's some uh some some extra tools that i think may be helpful a lot of people like we've got some sample postcards that are working really well i believe this one is one of them that i just showed you uh we've got the script it's the it's the script of what to say to the seller when you talk to them. And it's a proven script. If you don't have one, or maybe you have your own VA, and they're not like turning over leads properly, this is time tested. So I'm giving you that. That's the same one that our sales ninjas that we do over a million outbound calls use. So reivault.com forward slash VIP. The other thing I will share is we're not like, this is not a vendor model for us. You can't hire us.

This is a, and I did this where we take 15 people a month and we vet them. We want to make sure that this is a fit for you, right? There's no free lunch. There's no get rich quick scheme. And a lot of people are out there looking for some, go to bed broke and wake up rich. And that is not what this is.

No, are you sure? That's what happened to me. I just went to bed and woke up and said, yes. Right? It's like, it takes work, right? Somebody has to get on the phone and build rapport with the seller and by the way when we're doing direct mail a million pieces a month we want to make sure it's not some you know you know how should i put it we don't want somebody that has not been vetted

by us that's talking to sellers coming off of our marketing at the end of the day. So it's a fit assessment, making sure we're a good fit for you and you're also a good fit for us. We want success. There are people that fail in our program for sure that do it and spend some money and they're not successful. And it's typically just got somebody that said, hey, you've done everything on your side, generated a massive number of leads, but we just realized we actually just don't want to talk to the sellers. We're not going to do this business. Okay, so I'm just saying that if you go out to REI Vault, you'll actually see what we do. If it's something you want to explore with us, you'd fill out an application, we get on the phone, it's a real conversation. There's no sales cycle, you're not going to be harped and said, hey, if you sign up today, we give you X, Y, and Z. I want to just say that because it's important.

This is a great market for the right people that are trying to scale and build a true business, sustainable business, and hire people, right? A true real estate investor is somebody that has money who buys and holds, according to Warren Buffett. Most of us, they're wholesaling and fixing and flipping. It's a business. So you got to run it like a business. And so that's, we love taking on people and delivering for them. But anyway, I just wanted to clarify that

because some people come and we turn them away and then they get a little frustrated because we say, hey, we don't think you're a fit yet, but here's where to go get the list. Here's where to go do the mailing. And so I just wanted to set those expectations with everybody. Yeah, absolutely.

And if you are a fit, again, tell them where you found me or not me him uh podcast here um i know he he mentioned he'll hook my tribe up so appreciate you being on dude i know you got a whole day to go crush man so thank you again i really appreciate it um see you soon i'll see you in san diego uh for the mastermind If you're not a part of the boardroom mastermind, you need to ask me about it. Ask Gary about it. It is the best with the best investors in there, but I'll see you soon.

And that's it for the episode. Peace. Awesome.