The Severance Podcast with Ben Stiller & Adam Scott - S1EP9: The We We Are (with Jon Stewart)

Episode Date: January 16, 2025

Ben and Adam welcome Jon Stewart — a borderline obsessive Severance superfan — to unpack the suspenseful Season 1 Finale. And he is here to demand answers. Jon talks about his visit to the set, the challenges of taking creative big swings, his constructive criticism on season 1 (spoiler alert: it’s all about wingspan), and The Daily Show’s very own version of a waffle party. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This episode of the Severance Podcast with Ben Stiller and Adam Scott is brought to you by Confluence by Atlassian, the connected workspace where teams can create, organize, and deliver work like never before. Set knowledge free with Confluence. Do you have a seat belt on that chair? Over the shoulder, strapped in, boys. Okay, great. Bring it. Here we go.

Hey, I'm Ben Stiller. I'm Adam Scott. And this is the Severance Podcast with Ben and Adam, where we break down every single episode of Severance. And wow, Ben, we're here at the finale, the season one finale, the We We Are, written, of course, by Dan Erickson and directed of course by you ben stiller how you doing i feel i mean it's first of all we've gotten through all nine episodes of the first season it feels like an accomplishment kind of i think and it's been a lot easier than i think when we were making the episodes right it seems like it went a lot quicker, but it's been really fun. And I feel like you and I have kind of,

you know, we're like starting to get a little bit of a feeling of like what it is to be a podcasting team. Yeah, it's been super fun. It's been really interesting going back and going through the episodes from the mindset of, I'm going to need to talk about this, rather than just cringing and hiding, watching through my fingers and being freaked out about watching it. But really, after not having watched it for, the last time I watched it was before we

started shooting season two. And then on set, we would go in and look at things to refer to if we needed information or whatever, but really just sitting and watching full episodes. It had been a while. Yeah. And it's interesting when you work on something, you know, you're editing it and just living with it so much. And then all of a sudden you have a break of like a year or two in this case. And, you know, I was saying the other day, like sometimes you look at stuff and it's like, oh, all right, that was pretty good. And then there are other, other times you look at it and go, oh, I could have done that a lot better. Or you remember the pain of that day of

shooting that one thing or what you couldn't get right. And, but overall, it's a totally different experience watching it when you're disconnected from it, when you're severed from the experience of having actually just made it. And so it's been fun. It's been really fun. You brought it back full circle there. Thank you. Yeah, I like to use the terminology whenever I can.

But I think if I were to sum up our little chat here, A, it's an enormous accomplishment that we've made this podcast, perhaps a bigger accomplishment than making the show. I think we could maybe retire after doing this podcast yeah we've done it all now b it's much easier to make a podcast than the actual show it is it is easier than than making the show but it's and it's as fun though because making the show is fun it's just like it's more like a long-term fun project where you work at it for a long time and the work is fun. Yes. I love making the show. And another component of re-watching it is it makes me want to get back and start shooting the show some more to start shooting it again.

Yeah, definitely. Definitely. The other exciting thing about today is for our finale episode of the first season recap podcast is that we have a huge guest on the show. Oh my god, do we? Yeah. I mean, I have known this person for a long time, but he's become a television legend. And I was honored to learn also is actually a Severance superfan which just i was you know it's so funny when you're working on this stuff and then all of a sudden somebody you really respect and now reaches out and says hey man i love that thing it's like so i'm so into it it's it's such a great feeling

but the person we're talking about is john stewart ladies and gentlemen oh my god oh my god guys i thought you were about to introduce Letterman. I was listening to the intro, and I was like, oh, my, I can't wait to meet this person. But, John, you have graduated to those ranks. Oh, God. You have. And I got the grace to prove it, man. We all do.

We all do. You've put the work in. You've spent the time. Yes. I've grinded you have you you know you've become someone that people i think look to uh you know for for guidance and humor and relief and uh sort of you're you're and you're just smarter too or to angrily yell at by the holland tunnel that also happens i will say i remember the moment you reached out to Ben about Severance. Ben, you texted me that Jon Stewart likes Severance. It was a huge deal. Doesn't even like Severance, obsessed. There was an obsession. And it's the same way that I found

out, and Ben had told me this, that you were filming an episode down near where I live. And so I was able, Ben was kind enough to let me come on the set. And it was this episode, actually, I believe, Ben. Is that correct? That is correct. You came by while we were shooting the heli sequence for the last episode at at lumen at the bell labs building which yes you're in the vicinity of i guess i don't want to give away too much and that might be what those drones central jersey yo what's up we can put your address in the show notes not a problem

yeah as we as we speak there's a drone issue New Jersey, and I don't know if that has to do with it. Yeah, sorry about that, guys. It's a new business I was starting of giant drone swarms. I just thought. I didn't realize people would get so freaked out about it. Yeah, exactly. Whenever I see a report about that on the news or on my phone or something, I literally feel like I'm in a Roland Emmerich 90s Independence Day movie or whatever. No question. It feels like that's a scene from the movie where the reporters start talking about these drones that nobody can identify and people are being told to relax.

They're told to relax. Listen, everything's fine until they get lasers. And then the whole thing is – Oh, yeah. And they've just been hovering every night. So you came, yeah, but you came by and it was really fun. Our cinematographer, Jessica Lee Gagne,

I'm just going to out her and say she's a big fan of yours and was like, and she doesn't really get impressed by a lot of people and she got very quiet and was sort of like, oh my God, Jon Stewart's here,

Jon Stewart's here. No, I made sure to stay really far away from her i just sensed the vibe and you'll notice a lot of the shots are out of focus in that sequence completely out of focus yeah and i was just so just first of all that that bell labs and i don't know where you guys found it but it is notoriously for us who live around here, this odd dystopian development, sort of this. It was Bell Labs for a long time. And then it was bought by a guy who developed it and wanted to create almost a village or a community around it.

And it's the weirdest. It's like if Mussolini had decided to plan like a like a subdivision a suburban subject like it's the weirdest giant cement for and they actually have that on their brochure yes it's as if but i don't know like perfect for what you would think is this kind of luminesque dystopian. And you walk into it and it's like a full court basketball, right? Yeah, it's huge. Built in there. And then like one coffee shop and Hasidic couples meeting each other.

It's the oddest. It's weird. We spend weeks there and it's like frozen yogurt, coffee. It's really crazy. It's a mixed use space. They've been trying to, yeah. And it really, the thing that really blew us away was that nobody had ever filmed anything there.

There have been no movies or maybe some commercials but you know that's one of the things when we're looking for locations you want to find something that's not you know hasn't been in every law and order episode or you know new york we shoot a lot right so this place was undiscovered it's like in you know if you notice now in atlanta like any show that you watch they're now using like Covington, Georgia. Like it's all, like if you watch stranger things and then walking dead, you're like, I'm pretty sure that's the same high school, this place. And there's that great scene when Mrs. Selvig was driving this really long, beautiful sort of drive into the Bell Labs offices. Yeah.

And you guys captured that so well. And there's that, what's that funny tower, Ben? Yeah, that's the water tower there that they built in the shape of a transistor. Okay, I didn't realize that. Yeah, because that's where the transistor was developed by Bell Labs back in the shape of a transistor. Okay, I didn't realize that. Yeah, because that's where the transistor was developed by Bell Labs back in the day. Wow. Yeah.

They've got to make everything shape. The water tower has to, does it have to hold water? No, it has to look like a transistor. Yeah, I know. It's so interesting. And we've really made that one of the sort of iconic things in the show that we put the Lumen logo on. But all of those houses, the Mussolini subdivision of houses that are built on the sides of that driveway, they built – because we've been working on the show for five years, right?

And when we first scouted this place, those houses were just being built. They had just decided to do subdivision on either side of the driveway, which we erase in the show. So when you see the wide scenes- Right. You don't see the houses. You don't see them. But they built them all around there as a way to, I guess, create a community. And it's a very, very interesting place. And that design and architecture, it was Eero Saarinen, the architect who designed it. Really? that design and architecture it was erosaranan the architect who designed it really yeah who

also did the twa terminal at jfk and right you know he's great mid-century architect so that's his design they expanded on it in the 80s and built on the sides a little more but those little specific sort of touches that he has on the inside are kind of what cued us for the rest of the design of the show because we found this as it was the first location we found. It's remarkable. And people don't know, like, there's an atrium there that's like nothing I've ever seen before. It's like these sides.

And I guess when they were working in Bell Labs, all those sides were the offices. It's the least efficient use of space you could ever possibly imagine it's just like what if we just put like single file offices down what appears to be three acres and 10 stories high of just open space yeah it's just a hollowed out like three football fields that could have been offices, but instead it's just open air. It's wild. And they just signed up one cafeteria space in the corner. That was the end of it. And I don't think even in seeing it on screen, you don't get the size of it, the scale of it when you're there. It's so much bigger. During COVID, so that space became during COVID a place where people went to kind

of avoid each other, but still have that feeling of being around people. And then those giant parking lots, they started showing outdoor movies and they started doing like music or comedy shows where people would sit in their cars because it's just this vast expanse. Wow. Wow. Yeah. That makes sense. And I I've been there when they've had like carnivals in the parking lot and right. All sorts of, you could do any of those. It's the craziest thing in spring of 2021, when we were shooting there in the vaccinations, we're just starting. There were people lined up all in that lobby getting that.

In fact, I remember a couple of people from the show got vaccinated there while we were doing the show. I got to tell you, if the FEMA camps come, that's where we're all going to be reeducated. For whatever's coming next, that is the place. That will be the place. That'll be the place where we all go to be reeducated. It'll be kind of ironic Yes Okay, let's take a quick break

At Lumen, things are not always what they seem Mark, Dylan, Helly, and Irving in MDR make a great team At Lumen, things are not always what they seem. Mark, Dylan, Helly, and Irving in MDR make a great team, but what else lies beyond the four white walls of their department? There seem to be more questions than answers as the secrets of Lumen are slowly revealed. There's definitely a lot more going on than you see. It's a little bit creepy. I agree. There are more Qs than As in this place. Yeah, for sure.

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We hope you join us as your weekly source for true crime news. Listen to and follow True Crime News, the podcast on the free Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts. John, what was like the main thing that drew you about the show? What was the thing about it that was so i follow adam scott everywhere so wherever whatever he does i jump in whether he's married to reese witherspoon or whether he's heading off into a dystopian i i follow uh you know that's why you were so you were such a fan of piranha 3d i would imagineD, obviously, for me, felt a little much. But I'm an Adam Scott fan, but I prefer you 2D. I prefer you.

Got it. I prefer Lego, to be honest with you. Okay. Keep that in mind. You know, Ben, anything you're in, directing or any of that stuff I watch, but what originally it had such a unique style, atmosphere, tone, you know, it anymore, it's so hard to find something where even the, the rhythm of it feels so fresh. And so you're really invested in the world that you guys build out and it's done so meticulously and there's touches in it that just feel so unique it reminds me of if you if you remember in the movie her where everyone's pants were just a little higher and you're like

is that is like is that going to mean anything or is is that just something where like in the future, our pants are higher. Like, so in the beginning, that's what intrigues you about the show is, are these little details salient? Are they merely, is it a bit of window dressing, but you're so invested in the intentionality that you guys infuse into the show. So much intention. And obviously the execution level is so high that you're immediately like, you feel anytime you're on a show like that, where you're watching and you're leaning in a little bit you feel yourself just drawn into this world that feels intentional unique but also utterly authentic to to what it is yeah and so that for me just even i mean that the opening credit sequence like even that where i'm just like sim adam scott in bed okay i'll follow this anywhere yeah you know i was just thrilled to

find something that had built its own unique and intentional universe. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's funny. I kind of get drawn in by things like that too. Even making something, it's hard to describe. And sometimes it sounds a little bit sort of, really, this is what you want to do. But for me, sometimes it's just living in that world.

And the music is a really important part of it for me too. Yes. And we, we work with Teddy Shapiro who I've worked with since back in the day, like dodgeball. I go all the way back. I knew him when he was still Shapiro, you know,

before he went with the, well, I changed my name to Styler, Ben Styler. The long eye. I didn't, I didn't know why I said, give me the short eye.

Don't give me the long I. Yes. Then he moved out to LA and got affected. But what I was saying is this, like, for me, I get drawn in when working on something to wanting to, like, live in that world, you know? And, like, as we're editing it, putting it together, the feeling, the visuals, the sound, and all that.

And it is something that has really, it has to do with the story and all that and it is it's something that has really it has to do with the story and all that too but there's just something about being in that world that you hopefully have created with all these different elements of the collaboration of everybody who works on it i'm also curious ben and adam i don't know if you feel this way when you're making those kinds of acting choices but you know on, especially something like The Daily Show, it's very ephemeral. And you go on one day, and you'll know immediately what the response is and all that. It's sort of like egg salad. You make it, and three days later, no matter how good it was, it's already gone. But you're ensconced in this world for so long, and like you were saying like five years yeah and you're making really strong

creative choices yeah how scary is it to do that for so long without any sense of sort of like how do you know when you've gone down a rabbit hole that's going to bear fruit how do you know when you've made because now you're making choices that build upon other choices and it kind of it goes out in these sort of concentric circles and unveiling that must be terrifying yes i would think yes adam do you want a hundred percent sure i mean first of all i totally agree john when you're watching something that feels like it has been wholly considered, like everything has been, it's comforting. It's something I appreciate. And honestly, as a fan, something I've always appreciated about what Ben does, whether it's Tropic Thunder or Escape at Dannemora, you feel like every detail you are looking at on that screen has been mulled over and figured out and considered, right? You are in very good hands, right? Yeah, yeah.

I, as a viewer, that's all I'm looking for. That is it. So to be in that world, and it was the same with Walter Mitty too, where you are, everything is there and ready. So you can trust completely in the world and in what, in your director and what Ben's doing. But yeah, that was, I think it hit me later than it hit Ben, but at a certain point when it was time for the season one to come out. Yeah, it was terrifying. And for me, it was when the billboards went up and I saw my face huge around town. And that was the first time I had experienced that.

That's when I freaked out because it's just like, we really took a big swing here. Yeah. We really like it. The top of your head is gone. Yeah. But like our people- Somebody had to say like i like this adam scott fella but not crazy about his whole head we gotta take the top scott's head that's right um that was that was the one we go that's the one that's the one it was just like

are people just gonna make fun of like is this, you had the same kind of moment too, right? Well, for me, it's yes, for sure. But what happens is I go into sort of when I'm working on something, it's different because I'm not, it's not like what you're doing on television where you're getting immediate feedback. You just make a commitment. If you're making a movie, it's the same thing. You make a commitment to it and you go and you work on it and then you show your first cut eventually. And that's when you're like, oh shit, I hope this works. And you try, but on this thing, it's different because it's, you know, nine or 10 episodes. So it's a much longer period of time. And we were doing it during COVID,

the first season, and it was literally in a bubble. You know, the whole thing was so insulated, and it was a great creative experience that, for me, I kind of, like, fool myself somehow when I'm working on something. I'm just in it. Like, when I do a take in a movie, I'm like, well, you know, maybe it won't be that take. Maybe it'll be the other take, so I don't have to worry about that now. Right. And so that frees me up i guess just to try stuff it wasn't until we finished the

last cut of uh the last episode i remember one night being at home because i was editing remotely with jeff richmond our editor and we finished and i remember just having this thought of like oh wait a minute like we've been doing this thing for like two years i think it's good i like it i really like it but like this thing could totally just fail it could just be like or nobody could watch it or people could think it's not it doesn't work and that but that i kind of like put that off until i have to think about it and then it is incredibly yeah this moment in time right now when we're about to release the new season um adam and i commiserate on it all the time it's that feeling of like oh shit i hope right you know and it's different the second

time around because the first time we had our you had no expectations just it was like i hope we're not embarrassed you know it's like i hope people because it's so novel i mean part of it is you know sometimes when you're creating something you have all these analogs i mean i don't know if you you know whenever i'm in a position to be able to build out a world you're always something, you have all these analogs. I mean, I don't know if you, you know, whenever I'm in a position to be able to build out a world, you're always sort of, you've got your Pinterest board of all the different influences and things, and you're pulling them from different places. But what you guys had made was so novel that it's really hard to find analogs. You can find inspirations, but if you're thinking about that, everything in television and film and all that is sort of boiled down to that. It's like gone with the wind with the Muppets. You're always trying to tie those two things

together. There was such oxygen in it, such inspiration, such different things that it's hard to find that. I imagine for you guys as a comfort, hard to be like, well, it'll be like this. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's funny. We made the first three episodes and I directed the first three and the last three. And I remember thinking after I made the first three, the last three and i remember thinking after i made the first three okay i think these are good i like these um and then i was like oh no but the last three i don't know if the last three are gonna live up to the first three because i didn't have as much prep time and it got more you know it's tougher as you go along you're shooting and right and then it was kind of like people a lot of people had this opposite reaction like oh i think it starts out kind of people some people are like it starts out kind of slow and then then i you get into it but i was

thinking the opposite like oh i thought like we nailed it in the first few episodes i hope though and especially because the last episode which we're talking about today right shot we shot the whole show like a movie where you'd go to like one location and shoot scenes from episode three six and nine at deborah Rickon's house, you know? Yeah. And then we're going to go to Lumen. Oh, that's hard for the actors too, I would imagine, because they're at different levels of investment

in their characters. Yeah. I imagine that's difficult. Yeah, and it's tough also just in terms of when you're thinking of a whole season, because I'd never really, I did that with Escape at Dannemore, I guess, but this was like, I don't know, it was bigger.

And when we got to Devin and Rickon's house to shoot, which is one of the first places we shot for the season, we shot all the scenes from episode one and whatever other episodes were there. And then we had to go and shoot the scenes for episode nine there. And this was like a month into the shoot. Wow. Or something like that.

And all of a sudden, Adam doing you know his she's alive moment it was like so out of context wow and i remember the whole and the way it was for episode nine was we would have to catch scenes for this episode every time we were like when we were at lumen when you came you know we would just catch scenes right we sometimes would go back and reshoot too but overall we were piecing this episode together piecemeal over the course of like nine months. So every once in a while, I'd check in with Jeff, our editor, and say like, how's nine coming along? It's like, well, we have this piece and that piece. And I remember being very insecure about nine thinking – because also I'd always imagined it.

It's going to be totally different visually than the rest of the show because the know the show is very you know everything's kind of very set and like ordered you know not a lot of handheld if any unless there's a specific thing but for episode nine we're like we're going to use steadicam the whole time and it's going to be flowing because we want to be in the point of view of these characters and so that felt weird every time we'd pull out the steadicam to shoot because i'm like you know it should be in their point of view the whole time but you can't be in their point of view the whole time because then you'll never see them. So how do you do that? And so I was constantly feeling like I hadn't quite figured it out. And was just sort of like doing whatever we could to try to tell the story,

making this choice. We knew that it was going to be very subjective. And I remember doing that, that the choices that you made that early up because what i love about nine is that it's different from you know so much of it is kind of not an office comedy but but that sense of you you have this sense of place and you can have a distance from it you know and but those party scenes are so claustrophobic and suspenseful and almost hitchcockian but to make that choice so far in advance and even adam for you the acting is so different that sense of when you come out and you say how's our baby like it's such a great like i don't know where the fuck i am right but but clearly i have a baby right like yeah it's such and the the speed at which you have to come up to knowledge as your innie is taking it in like the idea that

you guys did that week one blows my mind i remember doing it quite a bit of experimentation at those party scenes like remember that rig i almost was going to wear for some of it but it just ended up being too cumbersome yeah we had this sort of helmet cam type thing we used in i think in the first episode for heli's point of view when she's trying to get out the that's right where like the helmet would have a camera on it so you could actually see your hands and everything that's oh wow and we tried gopro yeah yeah and and right so the person's walking around like kind of like a camera you know robot or something and that didn't work and it was i remember that that's what i'm

saying like i remember us sort of improvising and going okay let's just do we'll do like handheld here we'll do the steadicam here and i mean talking about that that part of the episode um i agree adam is like having to every second he's having to kind of take in this recalibrating his relationships yeah and i remember just we'd have that discussion for every scene. Like even when you first see Rickon reading and then you go outside with him and we realize, oh, wait, you've never been outside before. But are we going to play that or not? Right. I remember trying a take where I was like reacting to the sky and stuff.

And it was like we can't – like we just have to stay on this one track because it became about like six things and it was just too much. And it was also about like reacting to the surroundings, but he also can't be found out until he says the wrong name to Cobell. So he can't be- But even that, what a great throwaway though like everything else

is so intentional with your character right yeah and then all of a sudden you're just like i miss cobell and he's like what no why did you he doesn't know her by any other name so just assumes that suit but i i remember i feel like i've said this on the podcast already a couple of times, but that was the moment where when we were shooting it, I went to Ben and Patricia and just kind of thought out loud about if the architecture has gotten us to the right place, this moment is going to be the moment where things start to fall. This is going to be so fun for the audience when I call her cobell and not knowing the percentage of whether they'll be

with us or not, but knowing like this will be so much fun. Right. And it's such an estimation of, of where the investment is, but it all delivered on that investment i mean that that whole episode is such a wonderful delivery on all the investment that the audience had put in as as a member of that audience uh it really was such a satisfying ride even torturo like being like car yeah that's so fun to watch oh my god yeah all that was just you're just like oh this is so awesome to watch the innies just try and figure this shit out yeah yeah i also always look forward to the meeting of mark and rick and uh any mark and and rick and because this you know idea that mark on the outside really doesn't like rick and mark on the inside idolizes him i just loved that juxtaposition i thought that was such a really smart idea by by

dan as a storyline and so looking forward to this meeting that finally, you know, any Mark will meet Rick and how will Rick and not knowing it's any Mark react to this version of Mark that like likes him. And, you know, and so that scene for me, and also I just, you know, I'm a Michael Chernus fan who plays Rick and he there's so much humor in what he's doing. Yeah.

To me, the best part of the entire scene honestly is that his his man friday's name is balfe oh i know it's not even a name i wrote balfe down to this morning while watching the episode it's my favorite too yeah um yeah it's what is that like was it ralph and then he just it's balf yeah okay but that's a dan dan erickson and names is just it's just a thing he's yeah he's great i mean also he says prepare the neti pot because his throat he just like does this thing after he's finished his reading that it's taken a lot out of him and he has to regroup. But then he's outside and then he confides in Mark that he's insecure about it. I'm like a sad hamburger waiter. That's the interesting – really interesting is that suddenly we see that Ricken is self-aware and aware of his relationship with Mark and where it is and how he sees him.

Right. Yeah. So that, I think you're right though, that the, it was the writing of this episode that brings together all these threads that makes it satisfying. I mean, honestly, cause when I watch it,

I just watched it last night and I was like, all right, you know, it flows and it works and it builds. And there are places where it like builds to crescendos and then kind of resets and then builds again, tension wise. But really what I think is the thing about the episode that people like is that it's bringing together all these stories.

You know what I mean? If you looked at it, if you said to somebody, Hey, this is a great episode of TV, watch this out of context, it would really be like, okay,

there's a guy driving and there's a guy talking, you know, but I think what it is for the fans of the show, it seems, is that it's very satisfying to see, you know, all these things come together. And of course, what Mark learns, what any Mark learns. And again, when we were shooting it, it was a little bit of a kind of a shot in the dark

in terms of like how much we could actually get away with in terms of like stopping the tension or actually get away with in terms of like stopping the tension or slowing down to like have the scene with Devin where you have to talk about who you, you know, who you are, where she's telling you who you are. Sure. And you're also editing it together before you have a sense of what the audience's investment will ultimately be. In other words, television in sort of the sense that it happened before streaming, like when you think about Seinfeld or those kinds of episodes, it's all sort of happening in real time. And so you're getting a sense of, you know, it's how Urkel

becomes the centerpiece of family matter. You're understanding what the audience is responding to, and you're adjusting, not necessarily in deference to that, but accordingly to what people are responding to. You did that in a vacuum and did it like, I mean, believe me, it's not perfect. I do have some bones to pick. Okay, let's take a quick reflection break. And when we come back, we'll get John's notes on the rest of the season. Okay, we're back. And John, do you have some uh for us for season one i mean it's not

really the it's these are not foundational necessarily it's really just one note and it's really not the whole season it's really it's focused more on episode nine and it the whole season is so considered in each character when it comes to giving the innies time why would you pick the character with the shortest wingspan that's a great question you got torturo there who's lanky as hell. I mean, he's got, he's a half pterodactyl. Yeah. He could have stood there like Wembignana dunking. You know, and you're in the meeting and you say, let me grab the guy.

Clearly, he's going to have the hardest time bridging this gap. 100%. Poor gap. 100%. Poor Dylan. 100%. Dylan is. It's the only note. And listen, I do have a sub stack dedicated to this. I'd appreciate it if you guys would at least subscribe.

Honestly, I never even thought about that, other than Dylan was so, he really wanted to do it. He really felt like he was the man he's super confident and i'll tell you something when we designed that set we literally had zach cherry go into that room we you know to stretch his arms out so we can get the exact length for his arms wow that's so smart because he had to he had to do that and i love that they were at disparate heights you know you would almost think like when someone goes in there to build those switches that they would have that

there'd be a sort of symmetry to it but the idea that he had to go one up and then one down i was just like that's so fucking perfect yeah it looks painful i mean painful horrible yeah it's definitely jeff man who is a production designer who came on for the later part of the season came in and he's a guy i've worked with over the years a lot and he that was his brainchild and he just really got that full kind of weird retro 80s ish vibe in that room too. Ben, you're saying Jeff Mann kind of designed the control room. Was there any Star Trek influence in the control room? Well, I mean, there's no like literal Star Trek influence. But for me, I think everything comes back to Star Trek.

It's like weirdly just like it's such a huge thing in my life that I'm so obsessed with, the original series. Yeah. And so even when we were making the hallways and you know i'm such a trekkie i have like you know the plans of what they had on stage nine at paramount where they had the bridge and the hallway and sick bay and all of it you know like that's awesome fascinating to me how they there was only just one little hallway section so jeremy hindle our production designer and I talked about that a lot when we

were creating all the hallways saying, okay, we're gonna have to reuse these a lot. And we'll have to figure out ways to do that. And so anyway, yeah, the room was really Jeff coming in. And he had a real sense for that. And I think we wanted to make sure that the monitors were CRT monitors. And we don't know, we just don't know what this room is really about. I love the dichotomy of, you know, it's such a futuristic technology and sort of this dystopian. And then you go into that control room

and you're like, is this where Alan Turing did the code breaking? Like there is a certain 1940s, 1950s kind of switchboard vibe. Like, oh, I'll just take out this one uh fuse and put it over here and flip that down you're just like that's wait in the future yeah they've gone you know analog yeah and being in there every little switch and button did feel it felt like we were walking into like 1973 or something and also all those books we

would pull out and flip through those were complete just filled with specific instructions and procedures and stuff yeah there actually was a real procedure that he did all of those steps were real in terms of like the you know what he had oh those aren't like those books aren't lorem ipsum, like Latin nonsense? They're not because we also know, even with the trailer that's out for season two now, people freeze the frame, like there's like a newspaper in the trailer

and they freeze frame and they read like all the, what's written there. So we knew that the handbooks and all that stuff, I didn't know that it would happen, but I assumed it might happen if people like the show and Kat Miller, our props person, would work with Dan Erickson to make sure that

all of the writing in every page of anything you read is real. So yeah. And we wanted to also give Zach something to actually do, you know, because when you're shooting something like that, it's like you have to get all the little pieces, right? So if you have an actual series of things that he has to do, it makes it easier to shoot it also like you have to get all the little pieces right so if you have an actual series of things he has to do it makes it easier to shoot it also because you know that you're covering each bit of action right and so we did that with him and then i would be lying though if i said that i did not many times over the course of making the show as we were getting ready to put it out in the world i was nervous that people would buy that whole thing

honestly oh you buy it one thousand percent i know but i was really like the things you're saying about hey it looks like it could be alan turing or that on the flip side if somebody didn't buy the show be like what the hell it looks like you know right it's like that's what makes it so yeah great so that's what was a relief when people were bought into the reality of the show that when they get to this crazy control room that it really, they believe. Listen, we buy into the whole, like, I still don't understand what they do. Right. What cleaning? I don't know what any of this is.

Right. And that's important. You're still invested in it. Yeah. invested in it yeah and that's important because we also you know want the audience to feel that even though you don't know what this stuff is about there's a reason for it and it's going somewhere i mean that's the sort of the bigger picture of what is it all about right yeah yeah totally um so this is really interesting because in this next scene we get to see heli's outie sort of in her natural environment she's in a a formal dress. She has an updo. She's talking

to Natalie, the woman who's been the liaison between Cobell and the board all along. And it quickly becomes clear that Helly is at the Lumen Gala. And actually, not only is she at the gala, she is actually Helena Egan. And the gala is dedicated to her contributions to the technology of severance what was your impression on the set when you came and visited i was there in so uh in that scene when heliar comes in and she's sort of walking through the the gallery of her severed story it's so overwhelming because it's practical. You know, so many times you go into those sets and they are, I don't want to say shortcuts, but they don't have to create the fullness of experience. So when I walked in and I saw the Severance story for Hellier and it's all laid out across and it's it's vast I mean

it's not a lot of times you walk on a set too and you'll be like I had no idea that the set of the price is right is so tiny like or the oh that wheel it looked gigantic it's it's like a so I was impressed by the scale and then even like that little the scene where uh the one I was impressed by the scale. And then even like that little, the scene where the one I was watching was when Patricia first interrupts Helyar as she's about to walk out. Oh yeah, let's take a listen to that scene. Is it you? What are you talking about? It is you, isn't it? I'm gonna kill your company.

Your company? Who the hell do you think you are? No. Your friends are gonna suffer. Mark will suffer. You'll be long gone. But we will keep them alive in pain. You're on.

She's walking out. She does that one look back. And you're just like, what a great moment of like, she's about to burn this fucking place down. And she just does this quick look just like, what a great moment of like, she's about to burn this fucking place down. And she just does this quick look back like, okay, I guess we're good. Just like, boom. It just, so I was really excited when I walked around it because of the feel of it was so evocative as you're walking it yeah those cubes are really cool and that was that was also jeff mann had i think he was inspired by some there

was like some expo in montreal and in the late 60s where he showed me these pictures of like black and white photography that was lit up on cubes And so that was his inspiration for that. Oh, yeah. You know, I didn't even think of that. But now that you say it, it does. It's got that, like, 60s, the world of the future presentation. It's got, like, a real expo vibe to it. Yeah. And also those pictures, we haven't talked about this, but the black and white pictures that Milchik has been taking all season.

So if you remember in episode two, right when she's getting the severance procedure milchick takes a picture of her in the operating room and you see that on one of the cubes and you so the idea was every time we'd shoot one of those scenes across the season we would you know shoot the shots with our still photographers who are amazing and then jeff mann who was doing production design at this point on the show, created these cubes. And it really had this feeling, yeah, like you were saying, John, of like this sort of world of tomorrow.

Yeah, yeah. And yeah, it was fun to also figure out how to tell that story and how Helly would basically come to the realization in that moment when she sees Helly, a severed story that oh my god this is what her whole life has been right yeah and sort of the crass commercialization of her entire life so far and that she's just this prop yeah essentially and that john stewart was at the gala walking around in the back i was was just walking around. I was checking out the expo trying to see if that was something I was interested in

trying, this severance experience. I thought it was interesting when her father was talking to her. You know, you have this relationship between the innies and the outies and the people that are experiencing it but the way that he spoke of her innie as a separate entity that had nothing to do with her you know i think he was talking about when that woman tried to hurt you you know when he's talking about the suicide attempt yeah oh you know what i would like to listen to that scene she's in here sir who know scene. Are you...

Are you still in me? No. Not anymore. Not anymore. I cried in my bed when they told me what she tried to do to you. What that Innie tried to do. Thank you for going through with it. The grandfather would cherish what you've done.

And one day, you will sit with me at my revolving. I thought that was such an interesting way for him to relate to this technology that i'm assuming he has a hand in you know that he has such disdain yeah for this creature yeah i mean definitely you get the sense that the innies are looked on as less than human right right um you know they're looked on as these creations and yet he's created them you're right so right that's right i was so like oh yeah and so like what is this guy up to what is that about and i think that in this bathroom scene there's this sort of connection he's having with her you can see he's obviously a strange guy but he has this sort of real connection with heli who he would think

is helena but is is heli and i think that's something that's there and interesting because you know you don't know what kind of relationship he has with his daughter you get the sense it's not a very i mean the fact that his daughter's in the in the ladies room and the assistant opens the door and says she's in here and he just comes in right you get the sense in the ladies room yeah why not i'm just excited to find out if we are going to see him at his revolving when he goes when he goes uh uh you'll be there at my revolving and i'm like what is this now wait what john i hope you'll come to my revolving when i haven't i'm gonna come to all of your revolvings i really you know a life well lived is one with a fully attended revolving but those are that's that's what i'm talking about those little moments of where you really do lay out the it's

the absurdity of our rituals the absurdity sometimes of of how we go through these performances at different points in our careers and our lives yeah that are meant to be infused with all this meaning and when you really strip them away you're like oh yeah it's a revolving it's a revolving to someone else it's just a revolving yeah it's a revolving yeah well to me that's like the basic idea of the show that i always was drawn to is that you meet these people and it is kind of like a workplace kind of work a day comedy vibe in the beginning of the banter and everything. But these people don't know who they are, what they're doing, why they're there. That's kind of a metaphor for life, you know?

No question. And I think that to me is always what's sort of resonated. Also, we should take note of how great Brit is in these scenes. And with her father coming in the bathroom and seeing Helly just trying to fucking figure out what's going, who this guy is, first of all. And what the fuck he's talking about. Just everything. She's just doing stellar work. That you guys do in episode nine is just beautifully rendered with how small those little realizations have to be. You're basically undercover spies that are working this party as agents and watching you negotiate that. that and figuring out who to trust, what the different relationships, how to be reserved, but still carry on that kind of human bargain we make in terms of conversation of like the

right nonverbal agreement. And also, Turturro in the episode, he doesn't have a single line except for Bert at the end. So the whole episode is just John Turturro. That was a heartbreaking one, to be honest. Like the Turturro arc in that, Heliar is surrounded by community. Mark, as cut off as he is after his wife's death,

is surrounded by community. John has a dog. It's nice, but he's alone. And he's got a box of memories and a dog. Yeah. It's nice, but he's alone. Yeah. And he's got a box of memories and a dog and a love that he can't have. And it just breaks your heart. And then to know that his love is so fun to imitate. Worldwide.

Worldwide. How many times on set you muck how can you not do the christopher walker but but that really to me was so stark is to see his life and his paintings are dark and and that like that hallway where you see the light and you just felt like so badly for his loneliness yeah yeah and he has such an inner life as an actor it's just yeah you just put the camera on his face and there's so much depth there you know yeah john is unbelievable and watching john figure out how to drive the car it's the best it's best. Even the power windows at one point, I think he figures out like the power windows. And it's also the question of like,

what does a severed person know intuitively, right? He obviously has some intuitive muscle memory of doing this. Yeah. He has driven, yeah. Yeah, and that's always an interesting question for the actors, I think, in every scene is that they get to choose sort of like how much comes through or how much doesn't.

Sometimes it's more in the forefront. Yeah. And, you know, it's really interesting because we talked to John Turturro about this when we had him on for the last episode, but we didn't want to spoil 109 at that time. So why don't we listen to that right now? When you finally come to consciousness in Irving's apartment and you find that trunk. Right, right. And we find all of this information that Irving has been amassing. And we find some little clues to Irving's past somehow. One of the things we see is a photograph.

Do you want to talk about that? That's the photograph of my father. It's the photograph of your father, yeah. Right, yeah, in the Navy. And I brought his actually uniform from World War II to the set. That's the first time and the only time I will

use that. I mean, I thought that was so special that you did that. And that moment of, okay, what does this mean? What is this history? Who is that person? You know, it's probably Irving's father, that it's actually your father just kind the end of the season, besides the cliffhanger that Adam has of, you know, what he says, is you pounding on that door. I think it's kind of symbolic of the whole show. Everybody's sort of pounding on that door. You know, everyone's in this raw state, you know, in a way. And so you are connected to the other people at the same time.

We're all going through that in different ways. I mean, Dylan is allowing us, you know, to do that. And so it was just an interesting challenge, I think, for all of us as actors to be embodying this other part of ourselves, you know, and not knowing exactly how to do that. Like drive a car, you know, find a place. You had to drive a car instinctually and you place you had to think you had to drive a car instinctually and you had to figure it out right yeah you came in good direction you were like just try that you know and that was kind of fun you know yeah it was great it was great to watch you do that and then that that raw emotion at the end i mean anybody who has ever felt anything in their life for a real love for somebody else and the pain of a relationship that doesn't go well, who's ever been there knows what that is.

And you just, you did that and you did it out of context. Shooting it was not easy because we shoot the show so out of order and in such bits and pieces. You just had to show up one night and do that. Totally disconnected from the rest of that episode. Yeah. Well, that's, you know, sometimes it's piecemeal work. That's why it's good when you've thought through the whole thing, you know, before. Yeah, right.

You know, and you have someone helping guide you there. But should we go back at the very end, just quickly? The very end is Dylan there, you know, as Milchick is trying to, and you were talking about like the perks that Milchick is offering him as he's trying to get into the security room. Should we play that? Maybe just to play one bit of that? Sure. I bet the tempers were disappointing. I can still get you back in there.

I can get you any perk you want, Dylan. Hey, there's stuff you don't even know about. There's paintball. There's coffee cozies. Dylan, come on. Just say the word and I'll get you a coffee cozy literally right now, Dylan. Come on, man. I want to remember my fucking kid being born.

You have two others. I can tell you about them just open the door and i'll tell you their names come on dylan dylan it's so fucked up it again speaks to imagine you think you're dealing with idiots. You think you're dealing with idiot children that a coffee cozy would be enough. This person has risked everything to open up the floodgates, to open up the Indian. He's like, I got a coffee cozy. He's like, I want to know my fucking children. Yeah. And he didn't know what, I almost thought there was going to be he was going to be like i can get your children coffee cozies like that he wasn't going to understand

but you realize oh milchick understands he just thinks the innies aren't capable of that level of emotional life yeah i think also the coffee cozies probably worked and would have worked before he had seen his kid in real life. Right. And then he's been right. Yeah. Milchick letting him see his kid or getting him in a situation where he could potentially meet his kid is an irreversible fuck up. And the thing really is kind of that when each of the MDR people, all four of them kind of get exposed to love and affection of some sort, that is when they all kind of start turning a little bit. When they get a taste of this human experience, that's when they start pulling away from Lumen in one way or another.

And I hate to say this, but there are times at The Daily Show when we reward the staff similarly to how Milchick does, and that we have had waffle parties for the staff. Dancing. I can't tell you how when I saw that, my heart sank. I thought, well, geez, we got that waffle. There's that, like, I don't know if you guys have ever seen it. It's like Dingles and Waffles truck. Yes. Right.

You know, after like a particularly long run, we'll bring in the Dingles and Waffle truck. Sure. And then as I'm watching, you know, Milchick promising, like, I can get you all the waffles you need. And I'm like, oh, dear God. Am I Milchick? Is that what this is? Promising, like, I can get you all the waffles you need. I'm like, oh, dear God. Am I Milchick?

Is that what this is? If you think we didn't get the waffle truck brought over to the Severn set, you would be wrong. The day I was there, Ben had gotten you guys ice cream. That's right. We went and got some ice cream. There was an ice cream truck. I got to partake in the ice. I got the reward without ever having to go through the trials and tribulations. Yeah. Yeah. What, what did you feel when Adam at the end says she's alive

and that moment happened? I mean, it's just hard. It's heartbreaking because it all like, it's one thing to want to struggle to figure out what's happening, but then to think that involved in that is the greatest betrayal that a human could maybe undergo. It's one thing to think like, hey, these guys are fucking with us. Like, waffle party? That's not so great. I don't like how that moves it from dystopian experiment to true malevolence like true evil now i now you're like oh this is this is an evil that's beyond something we can even comprehend, because we've seen Mark kind of gradually become disillusioned with

the company. But I think that he figured he had hit the ceiling of the depravity of this place when he decided, when they all did the overtime contingency and came out there stumbling across this photo. I don't think the furthest reaches of his imagination ever imagined that someone could do something this horrifying or a company could do something that's terrible. You know what struck me? And I don't know if you guys have, if this is in the lore or however you do it, but it was the first time that I thought, oh, Lumen is setting people up for severance because his wife dying is the event that drove him to sever so now you're

thinking oh wait are they conducting experiments and doing shit to people to drive them to sever like is that also being manipulated? Come on, tell me. These are not rhetorical questions. You answer me. We're not on your show, John. We don't have to. That's right.

This is our show, bro. Tracy said, all she said to me, I said I was doing this today, Tracy, my wife. She goes, I want every episode and I want it in bulk. I want to binge it. I don't want to sit through week to week. You will get those episodes and you will get them in full. John, this has been so much fun. Thank you for doing this.

Yeah, thanks, man. Guys, it's my my absolute pleasure and i know we're friends and everything but i continue to be impressed and just sort of grateful for for what you do thank you friend much much appreciated and i can't wait to to do this again season two brothers definitely truly an honor bye john all. Take it easy. All right. All right. Well, that's it for season one of the podcast. Wow. Congratulations.

Yeah, congrats. And if you're listening to this on the day it dropped, the premiere of season two is tomorrow, January 17th, on Apple TV+. Holy cow. It's finally here. Yes. I mean, it seemed like it never would come. Yeah, and we're dropping a new podcast episode about the premiere right after it airs. And we'll continue to drop new podcast episodes every week with some incredible new guests.

That's right. They come out right after the show, so you can listen right away. And I just want to thank all the guests who joined us for the recap of Season 1. And thank everybody for listening. Yeah. And I hope you guys enjoy season two. The severance podcast with Ben Stiller and Adam Scott is a presentation of Odyssey pineapple street studios, red hour productions,

and great Scott productions. If you like the show, be sure to rate and review this podcast on Apple podcasts, the Odyssey app, or your other podcast platform of choice. Our executive producers are Barry Finkel, Henry Malofsky, Jenna Weiss-Berman, and Leah Reese Dennis. The show is produced by Zandra Ellen and Naomi Scott. This episode was mixed and mastered by Chris Basil. We have additional engineering from Javi Cruces and Davey Sumner. Show clips

are courtesy of Fifth Season. Music by Theodore Shapiro. Special thanks to the team at Odyssey, Maura Curran, Eric Donnelly, Michael LeVay, Melissa Wester, Matt Casey,

Kate Rose, Kurt Courtney, and Hilary Schuff. And the team at Red Hour, John Lesher, Carolina Pesikov, Jean-Pablo Antonetti, Martin Valderudin,

Ashwin Ramesh, Maria Noto, John Baker, and Oliver Ager. And at Great Scott, Kevin Cotter, Josh Martin, and Christy Smith at Rise Management. We also had additional production help from Gabrielle Lewis, Ben Goldberg, Stephen Key, Kristen Torres, Emmanuel Hapsis, Marialexa Cavanaugh, and Melissa Slaughter. I'm Adam Scott. I'm Ben Stiller. And we will see you next time. Hey, Adam. Yeah?

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