The Sheet with Jeff Marek - Jet Greaves on Avoiding Arbitration, Team Canada & Columbus’ Future ft. Spencer Hyman

Episode Date: August 6, 2026

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Just reading in our chat here about how Shana Goldman had to cancel on Sabres Live, one of my favorite programs. Oh, Shana, Shana, one of our favorites here. I get all of my industry news from our chat, by the way. Welcome to the sheet once again for this Thursday, August 6th. Glad to have you aboard today. We've got a couple of really special guests for you coming up in a couple of moments and some interesting topics to get into as well. We will go over the Vili Covenin contract, which sort of winks at Kyle Dube. and not Kyle Dubus's history as a manager.

And I'll get into that here coming up in a couple of seconds. In the meantime, Zach, who I believe is wearing his tasteful Brantford Bulldogs chappo. We're going to be joined by Spencer Hyman coming up here towards the bottom of the hour. General Manager, one of the owners of the Bulldogs as well. We'll talk about Caden McGregor. And it's going to be a lot of sort of, I think probably like a gloss on where the OHL is at right now. now and what it's like being an OHL operator right now in the new universe. And if we get a chance, we should probably talk to him about something that I'm sure

the commissioner doesn't want to hear him talk about. And that is expansion. And because I am curious, too, because I look at, you know, across the CHL, I've always felt that the 20-team league in the OHL is the perfect hot house, right? It's a perfect hot house for developing elite-level players. But now with so many more Americans choosing to go to the CHL before they go to college and the influx of more Europeans, one more import this year, how does that change things? How does that change the configuration of being an operator? And how does that change things by way of expansion?

Where once upon a time you'd be concerned about getting it watered down, but then you look at all the players that are choosing to go to the CHL now, whereas they wouldn't before they would take alternative routes to get to college, most notably the USHL. now it's become a more viable option. So we'll get into that with Spencer Hyman coming up and we'll talk about Caden McGregor. It's not very often you see a first overall draft pick traded after one season, but that is a deal that Spencer and Mike Oak of Peterborough pulled off a couple of days ago.

In the meantime, I wanted to open up with this. Kelly Rudy. So it's really tough. You can always quibble about content. Okay? And I find that people's opinion of you is basically governed now more so than ever by what you say. And I get it.

I understand it. But I want to talk out because anyone can quibble about, oh, I don't like this guy's take. I don't like this person's view on this. I don't like what she said about this player. I get it. And then that's fine. But as far as being a broadcaster, Kelly Rudy has always been elite. And I had a really eye-opening moment, Zach, when I first started at a hockey night, 2008, before I went to SportsNet.

I remember having a conversation with Kelly, because I've always looked at Kelly and said, man, he looks so comfortable on television. And by extension, he's a very easy person to watch because he's so comfortable that he makes you feel comfortable watching him and listening to him. And I said, you know, it's really impressive, Kelly. You know, you transition from, you know, NHL goaltender to broadcaster. There was some overlap because, you know, when his kings were out, he would show up on Hockey Inn Canada. I said, like, how long did it take you to get that comfortable? He said 10 years. And I'm like, 10 years?

I'm like, you've looked comfortable from day one. He goes, no, it took me 10 years until I really felt comfortable. Kelly with the news yesterday on social media that his contracts not being renewed by SportsNet. Sportsnet will unveil, I believe, in September, who's going to be involved in their broadcasts. But I just wanted to get a couple of thoughts out of view because I might be a little bit close to it because I'm such a, A, I was a fan of Kelly Rudy when he was a goaltender. he was a colleague for a number of years, both at Hockey Night and then later at Sportsnet. And I can't say enough good things about A,

the broadcaster, and B, and more importantly, the human being who's always been sensitive to mental health issues. And that's always been at the forefront of everything that Kelly Rudy has always done. As someone growing up and you would have watched, like,

you probably don't know a universe that doesn't have Kelly Rudy on your television. No, I don't. It is, like, how weird is this for you? I'm like again, Kelly is not retiring. He's just like Act 3 is coming up next for Kelly. So I don't want to,

I'm not trying to retire Kelly. He's just not going to be on, on Rogers anymore. It's weird. When I saw that news yesterday, I kind of did a double take. I had to watch the video and then was kind of almost expecting like,

oh, like I'm going to be taking a light and load. And, you know, it was almost one of those that I was waiting for that, well, I'm not off TV. I'm taking a step back. And it's not the case.

that's not what the announcement was and it's it's surprising it's a little bit sad i i mean like for me as you just mentioned you know i don't know world's where kelly rudy is not on tv talking about hockey or telling me about hockey and then uh the other thing and i'll just say bluntly like right now when i turn on sports net here in canada the the three staples to me that i'm and this is not a knock on anybody else who's on the programming but the three to me me that I'm always looking forward to seeing when I turn on sports and that is Elliot Friedman, Kevin BXA and Kelly Rudy and during playoff coverage and I think everybody at sports and did an excellent job but those are the three that it's always like

okay yeah we're going to get something out of these guys that maybe I can learn from they're easy to listen to easy to watch whatever and not seeing Kelly Rudy in the lineup for next season is to be honest with you it's disappointing I don't know I'm interested to see where where he ends up and I'm excited for that next chapter for him and getting to continue to watch him. And I'm glad he's not actually retiring. But I mean, as somebody grew up with him on my TV, it's disappointing. But if anybody has sort of earned that right to like, okay, you know what? And I'm going to pack it in.

And that's my legacy and that's my work. It's Kelly. Like when you think about it, like with that transition, like when did Kelly turn pro 80, 81? I actually probably know this before I joined the program here. This is, I always, I always find stuff like this fascinating. How long do you go? So he turned pro, sorry, in, yeah, 1980 with Indianapolis, right, with the checker. So at that point, that was an affiliate for the New York Islanders,

he was drafted by the Allenders in the second round. So going back to 1980, hasn't missed paycheck. Yeah, true. Think about that for a second. like always worked. Like I could be missing something here. I don't think I am, but he essentially just went like right from the NHL into hockey night in Canada,

like uninterrupted all that way. Like if anybody has sort of earned the right to like take some time before you make your next decision on what you want to do, it's Kelly Rudy. And I've always maintained. Like there are a few. I always really loved watching Cassie Campbell Cassie Campbell, Pascall, do Rinkside.

I mean, Shirley Najack and I would always talk about how, like, she's a brilliant Rinkside host. And I would always also say, like, you know, watch how Cassie handles Rinkside and watch how Kelly does studio. And watch how comfortable he makes you feel. Watch how he is. Watch how he doesn't rush things. Watch how he doesn't, he doesn't rush to make sounds just because the camera's on. And one of the hardest things to do in television, and Kelly did this brilliantly, is when you're on a one shot. Okay?

When you're on a one shot and the red light is on, that's a lot of pressure to say something or do something. And you know you're really in control of the situation when you can do this. Right. That was the comfortability of Kelly Rudy. And it always, always amazed me. Just no matter what, whether he was part of a panel, whether he was on a one shot delivering, just how comfortable he was. regardless of whether you agreed or disagreed with the information. I'm talking about like the janitorial work of being a broadcaster.

Kelly Rudy was right up around the top, if not the top, as far as being an analyst and did it for a number of years as the game changed in front of him. Anyhow, I just want to make sure that we mentioned something about Kelly because I think he's, and I learned a lot from him, it told me a lot of great stories. I got a lot of insight into a lot of players that he was with, most specifically with the Los Angeles Kings and their run in 93.

but he was around some impressive people and not just hockey people as well. And he was always really quick to welcome new people into a group and share as much information with him as possible. Anyway, I look forward as we all do, Chapter 3 of Kelly Rudy's career. Jack Grease is going to be joining us here in a couple of seconds. I shouldn't say joining us because we recorded the interview yesterday. So we're going to play this interview with Jack Reeves.

You don't have to tell people that. Oh, okay. This is live in a couple of moments. Why are you wearing a different shirt, Merrick? Oh, I just change quickly. A wardrobe is to keep things fresh. So we'll get to. You're wearing the same shirt.

I'm looking at it right now. You could have. I tried to. I tried to. I had to remember like, okay, what did I wear for the interview? Just so there's like a conceptual continuity between the two shows. I want to talk really quickly about the Vili Covenin contract with the Pittsburgh Penguins. So I think a lot of people did the spit take.

Like the big spit, there were a couple of big spit takes like, holy smokes. I can't believe I'm seeing this number. The big one was Leo Carlin. Carlson, right? Like, that was a whopper. And I think that really softened the blow in a lot of ways for the Macklin-Cellibini deal. Like, if Carlson didn't come along and Celebrini just got 18 plus, we all would have went, wow, massive, incredible. But we were all sort of conditioned to the number 18. That what Celebrini got, kind of gave that a soft landing. But still, it was big. Pat Cain deal was big. I don't think anyone expected that number to come out with a Pat Cain deal. And then there's Vili Kovinen today. So the Pittsburgh Penguins signed Vili Kovinen to an eight-year deal. $4 million is the AAV, 23 years old, part of the Gensel deal. So if you're cynical, I'm with you.

I like cynical people. I like grumpy people. I like cynical people. 47 games in the NHL. Two goals, 41 points. $4 million a year. Eight-year contract. So that buys four, friends at Puckpeda will tell us, that buys four UFA seasons.

Now, this will be one of the last eight-year deals because that changes on September the 15th. We've long heard about identify your young core and bet on them. And that's what this is, clearly. You know, Jeff Follett on social media brought up a great point that there is still a one-third buyout window opportunity here if it doesn't work out at a certain point. So there is certainly that option. Although, I'll tell you what this one feels like to me. When Kyle Dubas was an agent at Uptown,

I don't know if it was his first client because I think Kyle Clifford was his first client, but one of his other first clients was Callie Yarncrook. Callie Yarncrook signed rather famously an eight-year deal, two million a copy. It kind of feels this similar, more similar than different to that. Now, I think that Vili Kovinen has the potential to be a really six top nine, maybe top six contributor for a long time for the Pittsburgh Penguins. But based on what we've seen so far from Kwavenin, it's a gamble.

Bluntly, it's a risk. You don't know. We don't know what this is going to end up like. But, you know, I think if you're Stan Bowman right now in Edmonton, you're saying, what do I have to pay Matt Savoy? And maybe we should do this as soon as possible before he starts to put up some more accounting stats. And it stings me even more. But it does kind of feel like that Calli-Yon-Crock deal. And instead of $2 million, it's $4 million, but inflation.

But that was one that I think really caught people. Jess said it's, you know, 47 games and two goals. And that's worth $4 million right now in the NHL. You have a quick thought on that one before we get the jet? my my reaction to it was less so about the it wasn't like one piece of the puzzle individually it was the puzzle put together that I was just like oh that's interesting I think the way you laid it out makes a lot of sense and when you kind of take a step back and you think about okay here's a guy who's taking because one of my initial questions was more so from from covenant's side less so than Pittsburgh and Dubas aside where I can understand that their approach to it, but I was looking at him saying, okay, why would you not be willing to bet on yourself here a little bit where you say, hey, like, I will take a step, I will be better, and then I can make more money going forward. This could also just be a kid who looks at it and says,

I'm going to guarantee myself $32 million. And when I kind of looked at it like that, and I thought, hey, it's not like he's had the most success here at the NHL level. And as to this point in his career, I should clarify, maybe he just says, hey, I don't I'm going to get an opportunity here to jump up. I get to guarantee myself money, but it was more so just seeing the contract, Jeff. I was like, what the hell just happened here?

Eight by four for a guy. Get used to new numbers, man. Get used to new numbers. It hasn't done much damage. I was like, okay, like I guess. But here's the thing that I always, and teams will always, and I'm sure if I talk to Kyle Dubas right now,

he tell me the same thing. We know this player more than anybody else. And I think that is something that we all kind of lose. sight of, nobody knows Covenin better than the Pittsburgh Penguins. And this is, we talk about, you know, adding up, you know, taking bets on players, you know, small bets. I think this one's a little bit bigger than a small bet,

but it's an accumulation of smaller deals that give you that thing that everybody is chasing and that's depth. And if this one works and if this one hits, that $4 million is going to look minuscule for the Pittsburgh Penguins and their salary cap. Just reminded me of when Dubas was an agent with Kelly, Yon Croke. I remember once he called me and said, I got the best name. I got the best name in the NHL.

I go, what's that? He goes, Yarncroke. I go, really? He goes, yeah, you know what his name translates to in English? No, what is it? Iron Hook. That's good. That's it.

He also told me that's, I remember this one famously, that Kyle Clifford's nickname was the colonel, because his middle name was Frederick. or is it Frank? Frank or Fedon? KFC. KFC. Yeah.

Spruital. The colonel. All right. Clever hockey nickname. That is a good one. The colonel. Why do they call you the Colonel? My middle name is Frank.

Huh? Clever one. Yeah, that's a good one. Okay, let's get the Jack Greaves. So sat down with Jack Greaves. Listen, that was one of those players that we looked at and said, that's not getting in the room, is it? That's not getting in the room for arbitration. The Columbus Blue Jackets, you know, here's someone that wants to play in Columbus,

took the number one starting job away from Elvis Mers-Likins last year. Good news story. Everybody loves them was a standout for Canada, the World Championships. They can't really be taking this one down to the wire, can they? Well, they pretty much did. But it worked out at the end, the end, for both Jack Reeves and the Columbus Blue Jackets, sat down with him yesterday to talk about the process of arbitration. And we talked about the World Championships,

where he was a standout for Team Canada. And much, much more. and I made the mistake of asking how tennis was going with his brother this year. No, Bueno. Here's Jack Gris of the Columbus Blue Jackets on the sheet. First of all, Jack Reeves, thanks so much for doing this. It was about a year ago the last time we spoke. And plenty has happened.

Someone became a number one goaltender in the NHL. Someone went to the World Championships. Someone almost went to arbitration. And someone got themselves a really nice contract. And that is you. describe the last 12 months since we last spoke here on the program. What's it felt like to you? Yeah, it's been a lot of fun for me.

I think there's been, you know, you touched on a lot of what happened. There's so many new experiences, which I've enjoyed so much. I feel like I've learned a ton in these last 12 months. You know, just I think the best way to learn is through experience, and I've been forcing to have a lot of those. You know, throughout the season was amazing to be able to play a lot of games and, you know, have those experiences throughout the year, which I really enjoyed and felt like I learned a lot from.

And then to be at World Championships was amazing. You know, to play for Team Canada and play in that atmosphere and, you know, just see new place as well. And being around the guys that we had in that locker room was amazing. And then, yeah, we've obviously touched on the contract stuff over the last little bit. It's been another good experience to learn just how some different things work. And I'm, you know, super grateful for how everything worked out. I want to ask about the contract and, you know, how close you're going to,

got to actually getting in the room. I'm sure you've heard plenty of the horror stories that have been passed on from year to year about what happens in arbitration. But let me swing back to the World Championships. Because coming out of that, and I know you're not someone that has his head in the ground about, you know, what's happening around him. Like you're aware of the conversation about, you know, could Jet Greaves be the next great Canadian hope in net? What goes through your mind when you hear that? I mean, you had a great world championship. Like, everybody noticed. Everybody noticed. And when you hear the, you know what, he could be Canada's hope and net here. What goes through your mind? You know what? I'm just, I'm honored to be even mentioned in that

conversation. You know, I've said it before, but you grow up being a kid in Canada, playing hockey, you dream about playing in the NHL and playing for a team Canada one day. So to be able to, just to have that experience that I did, I'm so grateful for. And I mean, I'm, I don't know what the future is going to bring. For me, the process stays the same. It's still just about continuing to improve every day and just help my hockey team win games, whichever team that is, you know, in this situation.

But, yeah, I'm definitely very grateful that people would even consider me for those conversations, but I also know that, I mean, I think there's a lot of amazing goalies. I think Barrington's done an amazing job. These past few tournaments for Canada, and he's definitely someone that I look up to, and, you know, I feel like I've, learned a lot from watching him and actually getting to know him a little bit.

So I've got a lot of respect for the guys that we have, you know, in Canada, the older guys. And I think there's a lot of really good young guys coming up as well. So I think it's, I'm just honored to have my name in that conversation. When you're in the tournament like that, I'm curious about players that you might not have known before that tournament who impressed you, not just on the ice, because we all watch that. but players and how they carry themselves in the room, outside the room, like so much of that rubs off on everybody. Like I look at, you know, the Pittsburgh Penguins

and, you know, get as many kids in the room so they can see the Crosby experience and be part of it, et cetera, et cetera. So like who was that for you at the World Championships this year? You know what? Like it's, it's cliche to say it, but it was honestly, like, first of all, like our whole group really. Like, I think that was the biggest thing that I saw. was like looking around our room, it was like every single guy was prepared really well every

single day. Like every guy late after practice and it kind of made it really clear to me like, okay, there's a reason that every guy in this room is, you know, a really good player in the NHL in the middle or at the beginning or at the end of a really good career. So it was cool just to see that, you know, like we'd camp Talbot there and just seeing like how he worked every day, you know, how much time he spends in his body, how much, you know, training. And I was really impressed with that. He's shredded, eh? He's, like, torn up like a bad report card.

Like, this guy's in insane shape. Unbelievable. So he was great to be around. I feel like I learned a lot from him. And then just, you know, like you go up and down our lineup, like we had, you know, I'm going to miss guys. But like the older guys, you know, Sid, Tamara's, O'Reilly, Shifley, like these guys that have been, you know, been around, like you can see you watch them for an hour at any

given point. You can see exactly why. And then, you know, the young guys, too, like Mac and seeing the way. he is and you know mintin and these um these other young guys that we had in our team as well was just um it was just fun to watch the guys and fun to be around and kind of just have those conversations i feel like i learned a ton from that group macklin celebrini's a special player what's uh what's you like you know practice what's what was the celebrating experience like for you yeah i mean i was fortunately we got to know each other a little bit before um we've just got some some mutual friends with a few

the Vancouver guys in our team. So we knew each other a bit before, which was nice having a familiar face there. But I think Mac, he does a really good job of like, you know, when he's at the rink, he's mature and he prepares extremely well. You know, he works really, really hard. His preparation before the practices is unbelievable. His recovery, like, he really takes it seriously. And you can see, you can see that on the ice, you know, like his motor, I think is unmatched. That's probably one of the best aspects of his game. And that doesn't just. happen as a fluke you know he puts yeah he puts a lot of it but i think he also does a really good job of you know like he's what 19 years old and off the ice like he enjoys you know like being around

the guys having fun laughing and joking around so i think that's probably why he can be so good so consistently is because he doesn't always have to be like you know he's not always necessarily the most you know like you're a fun guy to be around he's an awesome teammate which is like i think it's a it's a perfect mix where you're excited to be around him off the ice and just joke around you know, have a good time at dinner or whatever you're doing. And then, you know, on the ice, he's awesome to compete with and to learn from that way. Okay. Let's pull the curtain back here a little bit on the process of arriving at your deal.

And we'll get to, you know, the thoughts of the boogeyman, you know, arbitration here in a couple of seconds. But like, at what point does it begin? Like, you're represented by CAA. Like, at what point are you sitting down with your group and saying, okay, So what is our strategy here for July 1st? Yeah, you know what? We didn't have a ton of conversations throughout the year. We kind of just wanted to see how the year would play out,

which for me was nice just to be focused on just playing and helping our hockey team, which is always the most important thing, whether you need a new deal or you're, you know, you've got a bunch of years left. I think it always comes down to just playing, helping the team. So that was the focus. And I think it, you touched on CA. It helps me, you know, have to have. having agents that I know or respected.

I know they've been in the business for a while and I can trust them and, you know, for me, keep my focus on playing. But yeah, we had those conversations, I think, early in the offseason, just understanding, okay, what are we, what are we kind of looking for? What's our ideal? You know, they spoke with me and asked, you know, what would you prefer and what's best case scenario for you? This is what we think.

Just like having all those conversations of feeling it out on our side. of, you know, what we would like to do. I think, obviously, there's two sides in the negotiation, so you have to understand what both sides are wanting for. But for me, the biggest thing was just, I love being in Columbus. I've had an amazing experience in my five years there, and for me, I wanted to commit to being a blue jacket,

so to be able to do a multi-year deal was something we were excited about, and we were definitely pushing for. So then from there, it's kind of just, you know, between Pat and Don and figuring out numbers and all these things. So, I mean, this is your first, like this is your first big one, right? Like, you look at like this is a $15 million deal. Like, this is a lot of money.

And there's your first time going through it at this level. What did you learn along the way? Like, what did you collect up? Because you're going to be here again and you're going to be there to ring the bell again. What did you learn this time that you think you'll be able to apply next time? Um, that's a good question. I think, I think for me, one of the biggest things is just patience, you know, like you never really know how the process is going to go. Sometimes, you know, these things can get done right away. And sometimes it takes a little bit more time like it did in this case for us to, you know, come to an agreement. Obviously, we did it the morning of the arbitration hearing. Yep. And I, you know, I think both sides were excited to, to come to the deal that we did. Um, it was something that both sides felt good. about which was great so i think you know patience is the big thing and i think for me it's just really trusting the guidance of my agents i thought they did a a great job throughout of you know kind of

keeping me calm and helping me to understand you know because of course there's a lot of emotions you know there's uncertainty you never know how things are going to go i thought the agents my agents did a great job of just helping me to understand where things were throughout the process um what we were expecting how you know how the team was approaching and how we were approaching it it, which helped me to be a lot more comfortable throughout it. So I thought that was really positive. And I think that's a huge thing going forward is just really trusting their guidance. I mean, like I said, my job is to play and their job is to take care of the other.

They do good job of that. Did it go the way that, you know, Pat and Cam and like the way that they all laid it out? Like, they've been through this a million times. Did it go the way that they said it was going to go? Were there any sort of turns in the road that, you know, maybe. you didn't expect or did everything sort of go the way that your agents laid it out? I think, you know, where we ended up was kind of where we, I guess, where they had expected something along those lines. I mean, you never really know, you know, like I said,

timing is so unique to each situation, you know, like especially this year with our team, we had a lot of unrestricted free agents. You know, we have a lot of restricted free agents. So we knew that like the timing was something that we wouldn't, you know, we weren't sure. how that exactly was going to play out. But I think for the most part, I think they had a good gauge on it and even going into the arbitration hearing in that day and everything. I felt like they made things pretty clear with me, you know, what we were comfortable with, so on and so forth,

that it kind of took it out of my hands to an extent, which for me is, you know, obviously what I would prefer and just trust in their guidance in those situations. How much the dynamic is different for everybody, but how much would your teammates be in touch with you while you're going through this? Or did all your guys just sort of say like, just like stay away, let him do his thing? Or were they sort of on you the entire time? I was definitely speaking with the guys with the guys through it.

I mean, we have Cillinger was in a similar situation as myself. And then Van Tilly is also a restricted free agent. We're all just, you know, close friends. So it's more than anything just like supporting each other as buddies, you know, check it in how things are going, how you handle everything, how is the offseason going. I think there's been a lot more of that with the guys than necessarily like the exact details of every negotiation, but more just like supporting each other, which I think it's been great. I think we're really fortunate.

We've got a really good group in our team. The guys are really close. So just having those, you know, check-ins with the guys throughout. Sure. We're super happy with how everything worked out. And, you know, Silly was happy with his situation as well. So I'm super happy about that. And I'm excited for fans and getting his situation worked out now.

I was going to say, are you returning the favor with the texts? Are you on them? Yeah, I mean, you know, we're checking in. But nothing too much. Obviously, you know, he's with Pat as well. And, you know, we know that Pat and Don are going to sort things out. And they both, you know, they're both super experienced. They both do a really good job.

So I think more than anything is just, you know, check it in on a personal level. guys and yeah yeah i know it's um we're super fortunate that way i'll tell you know on this program we we we tend to talk a lot about you um and we talked a lot about your situation and i was i was kind of surprised that it got so far in the process i remember that the night before is saying like are they really going to get in the room like here's someone that really wants to be a bluejack and be in columbus a long time like i can't believe that it's getting that it's getting this deep in the count you know they're like okay it's full count here we go are they is

Is Jed actually going to get in the room? And one of the things, too, is, and I'm sure you've heard all the horror stories, there are things that are said in an arbitration hearing that bluntly are awful. Mike Milbury made Tommy Sallow cry in an arbitration hearing. Some of the things I'm sure that you've heard as well. Like, it's like the idea that you can't unring a bell. Like once it rings, like it's wrong. You can't unring it.

And what's said in that room, even though, Everybody's professional. Everybody's growing up. You know, you say, okay, this is just business. In the back of your mind, you're always thinking, right? You hear a lot of things. The night before you almost getting into the room for arbitration, what was going through your mind?

Like, were you preparing like, okay, I might hear some really awful things tomorrow. And what's that sleep like? Yeah, I know. It's such a unique situation, really. You know, there's nothing that I can really. really compared to, where you kind of in that situation where you know that in the next 24 to 48 hours, everything's going to be sorted out, but just not knowing at all really how it's going to play out is super, super unique. But I was fortunate just to, I've been fortunate throughout, you know, all this

process just to have a lot of, you know, really supportive people around me that have helped to keep me grounded and to keep my perspective in the right place, which was super important through this experience especially with all that uncertainty and and you know what i was grateful that just the way the negotiations went with our team it was honestly was super respectful throughout um and even as we got close to the hearing you know everything from from the blue jacket side was you know i felt like it was positive from both sides um like i don't think there was any strain on the relationship from either side at all you know i know that i pat you know cam um jim you know my whole of agents, we have a ton of respect for Don and for Lawrence and how they handled everything.

And I think that's reciprocated. So I think I'm super grateful, you know, knowing how it can go, you know, like you touched on some of those stories that it doesn't always go this way, that, you know, I'm grateful that even throughout this, I feel like we have, you know, a better relationship with these guys even than we did before, which is super positive. You know, Doug McLean, when he was a general manager of Columbus, told me a story about the, the Rick Nash contract coming out of his entry level deal. And it was a, it was a big number for a, for a player coming out of his entry level. Joel Resnick would have been the agent there.

And he said they were, they were flying back on Mr. McConnell's plane. And he said, Rick Nash walked over to him and said, Mr. McLean, thanks. That's a, that's a lot of money. And they both sort of a laugh about it. When you saw your number finally, what went through your mind? Was it the same thing that went through Rick? Nash's mind, that's a lot of money. Thank you. What went through your mind as a blue jacket? Was it like Rick Nash? Yeah, no, I mean, it's funny you mentioned Rick because he's obviously,

you know, he's in our organization. He's a huge part of it. He's someone that we, we see around a lot. So that's funny you mention him. But no, I was, I was super grateful. I'm super, you know, excited with how it worked out. And obviously, it's a, it's a huge commitment, you know, financially and, you know, with the term as well from the team. And I'm, very grateful for that belief and like i said it was something that i always you know i was excited to be a blue jacket and to commit to the team i really love um the team there the fans the the city the organization every aspect of it so i was just really grateful um as i still am you know for for the opportunity and for that you know belief from our from our hockey team it's i mean it's such

a such a blessing to be able to play hockey for a living period and then to be able to you know do it for that sort of money i'm super um super grateful for that absolutely Absolutely. Are you glad you went first? And then there was Cillinger and then Fantilli. So maybe guys will have forgotten when the bill comes in training camp. Yeah, we'll see. Hopefully it shakes out that way.

Okay, so give us the offseason for you and the outlook for next year as well. I mean, that's it. Cemented, deal's done. That's out of the way. Focus on hockey. What's your summer been like? And what do you look forward to next year? Yeah, summer's been positive.

I started with obviously an awesome experience at World Championships, which I think I learned a ton from and also grew that fire just to keep improving to ultimately try to win games and win championships. So it's been good. It's been a lot of work in the gym with my trainers there, just making sure the body is prepared physically for everything that's coming or could be coming throughout the season. And then just spending a lot of time with my goalie coach. My summer goalie coach here on the ice, just working on every detail of the game, has been important. important and I feel like we've had a lot of positive steps in that direction

I think it's just such a, for me it's such a fun part of it is that continuous process every every summer of looking into the game and seeing, okay, how could we improve, what's working, what's not working? So that's been a really fun part of it and then otherwise just spending time with family and friends playing a lot of tennis, enjoying that type

of stuff. I know you're big who's winning the family tennis matches here these days? You shouldn't You know what? My brother actually, we played a match last night. And he beat me in that one, which actually pushed in our singles matches this summer.

He actually pushed him to four and all. So it's not. It's a touchy subject in the house right now. All right. That's a sensitive one. Get off the tennis, get off the tennis, get back to the goaltending.

Well, like, I'm curious, what you work on specifically in the summers? Like, what is the one thing about goaltenders now. Like, goaltenders skate better now than we've ever seen,

like in the history of the game, period. But like, what do you work on in the summers? Well, start with off the ice. For me, conditioning is a huge thing. I think just, you know, you look at, you know, for me, like some of the best guys in the NHL and you see how many games they're able to play in a season. I think that takes a toll on your body,

and I think it's super important to be prepared for that physically. So I think having really strong conditioning can help your recovery, help you throughout the game, help you in long games and playoffs and things like this. So conditioning is a huge focus for me off the ice. And then on the ice, yeah, you touch on the skating a lot. I think what we do a lot with my goalie coaches in the summer, just because we have the luxury of that time, and it can be in a really controlled setting,

is we really break down a lot of the movements that happen in the game and slow them down and look at, you know, okay, where are the inefficiencies in this movement? How can this be more polished, quicker, more controlled, more stable, et cetera, and really just breaking those down and then throughout the summer, it's okay, how do we work this into the game

so that it happens subconsciously? So that's, you know, without getting too much into it, that's kind of a lot of what we're spending time on. The technical detail that goaltenders go through to me is fascinating. And I think to any hockey fan, when you hear goaltenders break down, like things like, you know, save, selection, post play,

like all these types. It's such a fast, it is one of, maybe the most fascinating position in all of hockey. Now, one of the things that I've been saying is Jack Reeves has the fastest glove in the NHL. Am I right? I don't know. I'm not the right person to answer that. I think there's a lot of really good guys around the league.

From what I've seen, like your glove is elite, dude. I appreciate that. Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate that. Who rivals you, though? Like who do you look at? I mean, I don't even know.

I mean, I think there's a lot of guys that have been doing it for, you know, a lot longer than I have that I got a lot of respect for. I think, you know, like Shisterkin comes to mind. I think he's, you know, for me, he's one of the best goals. He's in the NHL. I think he catches a lot of bucks. Um, Allmark as well. I think he's really good with his glove. And I mean, I think there's so many guys.

But, I mean, just to be in that conversation, I'm super honored. It's pretty cool. Um, listen, best of luck with the rest of the off season. rest of luck with the tennis against your brother. And good luck next season with the Blue Jackets. Congratulations again on the contract. Thanks so much for stopping by with me today. Thank you so much.

Thanks for having me on. I appreciate it. All right, that's Jack Reeves. So to put on your record, you used a coder ring there for some of the names that you might have heard, Pat is, of course, Pat Rieson of CAA. Cam is Cam Stewart from CAA. And Jim is Jim Hughes from CAA. Don is Don Wadd.

want to thank Todd, as in Todd Chirac, for hooking that up, of course, with the Media Relations Department with the Columbus Blue Jackets. And I'll tell you what, Zach, I used to love driving to Barry, hour and a half north of here, to go watch Jetgreaves play with the Barry Colts,

both with the late great, Dale Howard Chuck when he was coaching the Barry Colts and also Warren Reichel. And there was the one, I think it would have been his last year there. His goal-tending part, partner and they pretty much split it 50-50. How's this for a tandem in junior hockey?

Jet Grieves and Arter Shilofs. Was the net mining deal with the very colds? Not bad. Good luck. Good luck. Good luck. Yeah, no kidding. Holy. Not too much. Yeah, not too much fun. He was still fun to watch now. But a wonderful watch as well when he played with the very Colts of the Ontario

Hockey League. And speaking on the Ontario Hockey League, we are pleased to be joined now by the general manager of the Brentford Bulldogs. Zach put on his Bulldogs hat just for you, Spencer Hyman. How are you today? I love it. It looks great. I'm great.

How are you? I'm good. I saw the Cullen McRate deal got announced. Boston Bruins prospect goes to the Bulldogs. Can you give us a quick update on that one? Yeah, we're really excited about Colin. You know, he's a player we watched a ton of, obviously, last year, playing in Fargo in the USHL.

he's an elite two-way defenseman for a big man skates really well, contributes offensively. The biggest trait that I love them is how physical he plays. You know, going into a corner with him, I think a couple forwards are going to have to make a couple decisions. You know, they call him business decisions, but he's a very, very tough hockey player.

He's a leader, and he's a man. We're really excited to welcome to Bramford. So that trade consummated and announced today between you and Owen Sound. I was talking to a general manager in the Quebec League yesterday about how do you go year to year now putting together a team, knowing that there's a lot of different directions that players get pulled in. I know now the OHL, the Quebec League, the Western League, they're getting players that in previous years they wouldn't. but now it seems as if, you know, part of the development plan, certainly for high-end players, is you're spending time in junior in Canada. You're spending time.

But given that players, you know, the reality of going to college and the 19-year-old were like, how difficult is it for you on a day-to-day basis to try to put together a competitive team every season? It's a lot of work, of course. you know, a lot of recruiting, you know, in terms of identifying, you know, players that you have interest in. You know, then you look at the NCAA commitment and really, you know, a lot of the time you don't know what the plan is for that player because the schools don't know. They don't know how many guys they're going to lose to the NHO or to pro contracts. And it really is a ripple. You know, you try and plan as best as you can.

You have a vision for, you know, your lineup and kind of what you see and what you're, needs may be, you know, but ultimately, you know, there's, there's players like Colin that, you know, don't really know if they're going in until, you know, later in the offseason. And ultimately, I think him and Michigan State and Boston made an excellent rush. And, you know, taking some more time to develop in the CHL is an incredible opportunity for any player, you know, because they get, they get more opportunity, more ice time. They get another full year of getting physically strong. You know, the idea is when you get to, you know, pro hockey, here to college, you know, in a position to succeed in me.

You know, I... Hang on. We're going to... Spencer, hang on one second. We're just having a little bit of problem with your phone right now. We're going to get you to check back in because we're kind of skipping a little bit. So we're going to get Spencer back here in a couple of moments. So what he's sort of talking about here is, and mentioning Colin McCraight as well.

Boston Bruins, I want to say seventh round draft pick, big defenseman, comes in. the USHL. Tyler Nuller, by the way, who's a GM of Owen Sound said that he wasn't ever going to go there. So in some ways, it's kind of found prospects and draft picks for Owen Sound and all this one. And the brand for Bulldogs get the big defenseman in Cullen McCraight. The other thing that we'll go over with Spencer when he hops back on here is the big news of the week. And this one, even though there were rumors over the weekend about it, it's not very often their first overall draft pick in any junior hockey. gets traded in their second season. But Caden McGregor, who was drafted first overall in last year's OHL draft.

He's available in the NHL draft this year goes from the Peterborough Pizza to the brand for Bulldogs, Cooper Dennis, who's an outstanding player, like a 70, 80, maybe 90 point player depending on the environment, goes to the Peterborough Pizza on this one. But, you know, one of the things that I always, and I still do to this day, When the reality change, the development model change, and the pyramid change between junior hockey and NCAA, I'd always talk to people and I still do. The best thing you can do as a junior hockey operator is just make your program the best possible experience that you can. Don't worry about the decisions that players are making.

Don't worry about what's happening in Michigan State and Minnesota and North Dakota and Denver and all these plays. Don't be you all. Don't worry about that. Just go about trying to make your... your program the best you can possibly make it, whether it's get the best possible coaches that you can. And Mike Babcock, Jr., hired by Brantford, we had him on a couple of weeks ago. Gary Roberts, Strength and Conditioning Coach, you know, get yourself like really good billets,

get a great setup, make the arena experience great for the kids. Because these are all the things you can control. Make the dressing room great. Renovate the ring, like all these types of things to make your program the best possible program that you can make. Having said that, the reality now is, I'll get in this a little bit more towards the end of our conversation, I think, with Spencer, is putting together a team now is in some ways more challenging, but you do have more options now because you are getting different players

into the junior leagues across the CHL. We got you back. Do you want to finish your thought there? We just sort of had to cut you off at the end there. You want to finish up your thoughts, Spencer? Yeah, no, I was just saying, like, it's a great opportunity every year to build a competitive team. You know, for every one player we're going to lose to, you know, college hockey earlier or to, you know, pro hockey, we're gaining 10. You know, the CHL is the biggest destination for any junior hockey player.

And to me, I look at it as an incredible challenge to, you know, try and build a top team, you know, every year of kids that are developing. you know, and winning together. I want to, when you went off there for a couple of seconds, I mentioned the, the Caden McGregor deal, which I think shocked most. Like, it's not very often that a player like that becomes available. You had to give up a very good player in Cooper Dennis as well, and his story is certainly well told.

How did this, like, from your point of view, how did this one come together for the Bulldogs? Yeah, it was a process. You know, I think first off, you know, It was an unbelievable hockey trade. It was great working with Peter Bro's GM, Mike O'Conn, and he's a real professional. You know, I think from Peter Bros. End, you know, they've got, you know, Adam Novotny, who's a proven superstar in our league.

You know, Adam Levack, who is a Detroit Rebting draft pick. And, you know, you look at that line and adding a player right winger, you know, which was obviously a need in that position in Cooper. they may be one of, if not the best lines in the entire, you know, CHL this year. You know, and on our end, you know, we view Kaden as one of the premier young superstars in the entire CHL. You know, we are really excited, obviously, about, you know, him coming to Brantford. Obviously, Jake O'Brien, you know, starting with the year with Seattle and with the 19-year-old rural change, potentially playing this season with either Seattle or Coachella.

and losing Caleb Malhotra to Boston University. You know, we had an obvious need for a number one center, and Caden McGregor comes in and fills that role. You know, so we're really thrilled, obviously. Caden's an amazing kid. He's an amazing talent. You know, and we're so grateful to have the opportunity to work with him. You know, right now, I mean, he's on the list.

Like, you have a number of players that are going to get drafted this year in the NHL, and a number of which, Bluntly, will probably get selected in the first. round. Caden McGregor has that potential to be one of those players. What does he need to do to get there? You know what? I think he just needs to be himself. You know, and we're going to provide the support system for him just as we did

Caleb and Jake and some of our other players. You know, I think the idea, you know, having him train with Gary Roberts every day is going to be fantastic for him. Obviously, he had some injuries last year, supporting him with other, you know, know, really high-end elite players. But really, I think he just has to be himself. You know, you show up to the rink every day and you have a smile on your face and you're enjoying, you know, your teammates and, you know, the surrounding, you know, facility.

And, you know, he's just, he's a very, he's a very good kid. And he's an exceptional hockey player. And so, you know, we're really excited to give him the opportunity to be himself, to show himself, to show, you know, the entire hockey world, you know, who he is. And we're really excited that he's going to do that in the brand for Bulldogs, Jersey. You know, I was talking before he came on about just making your program the best it can possibly be. I've talked to so many junior hockey operators. And whenever we get sort of caught up in the conversation about, like, oh, look what,

what happened to the steelheads losing Porter Martone and, oh, what's going on? I just say, just make your program the best that you can possibly make. it make every single experience whether it's the dressing room whether it's the billets whether the the rink itself like all make it the best you can possibly be you just mentioned gary roberts a second ago whenever anyone asked me about the bulldogs i always say that you know gary roberts is a great for the kids and is a great recruit great person to have and to run your um strength and conditioning program because that's a real lure for kids yeah like it's like and i know I know your family

and I know how you think and how the Hyman family thinks it's like okay so how can we make this the best do you have a thought or two on what Gary Roberts means both to those kids and also as far as

recruiting yeah he's he's incredible you know Gary is I've said this countless times he's the best in the world at what he does you know you have the best player in the world trust him with his body

you know, in every facet in terms of treatment, recovery, and training. You know, he works with the best. But, you know, what I think is so special about Gary is just how much he cares. You know, he's been there as a player personally. He's also had, you know, his son Noah who graduated. He played for the Bulldogs, and he played for Sudbarino and Sound and graduated as going to college hockey this year. His other son, Sam, plays in Oshua.

You know, so he sees it from different lenses. He understands what these kids are going through because he's got his own kids in the same mix. He's also, you know, experienced himself as a player. And now he's experiencing it as a, you know, as an upper management executive within the league. And he's just so supportive of these kids. He's so caring for them, really about, you know,

he cares about everyone in an organization. And he's such a great, you know, resource and person for me to, you know, not only, you know, help our kids get ready to play, but to bounce ideas off of and talk things through. and just have his perspective, which is so meaningful to me and to our entire organization. So you talk about building a good program. I think programs are built through people. And when you have really good people within programs and you empower them to do their job

to the best of their ability, that creates a successful environment, which allows kids to perform at a high level. So from our standpoint, we're very, very, very honored to have Gary Roberts a part of our organization. And me as a young manager, I'm just very grateful to have him as support system for not only our players, but for also myself. Okay, I want to ask you about something that I saw on your hockey operations page on your website. Zach, if you can call this up, I got a big question for you. This is the most hard-hitting question you're going to get all interview here. So there's Caden McGregor and Cooper. There we go.

So management, and we've highlighted senior advisor of hockey operations, Brian Burke. How'd you get him the tie as tie? Really used to like the last call look with the hanging. How'd you get him to do up as tie, Spencer? That's the big question. You know what? That may or may not be AI. So I can't comment.

That's the only way to do it. Yeah, otherwise I don't know how Red Duffy would have got him to do that. So, you know, just what a legend, the best. You know, actually, you know, I was. I was, Berkey was, was awesome talking this trade through with, you know,

when, really, eh? Yeah. How much, I didn't know that. How much import did Berkey have? That's interesting.

He, he, he, so, Berkey told me, you know, uh, back in the day,

the number one rule is, uh, never make a trade one for one. Yeah. Because someone, I've heard that from. Yes. Yes.

Um, so, you know, so I brought it to him and he told him, he's like, well, what's the rule? And I said, you know,

I get it, but look at it from this perspective, and I think it's great for both sides, because it's different in junior versus pro. You know, teams are in different places, and their cycle and what they're doing, and he understands, you know, he was really excited about it. He said, you know, we're giving up an amazing player,

and we're getting an amazing player, and maybe it just fits better for both teams in this deal, so let's do it. But, yeah, no, he's awesome. He's the man, and for me to be able to bounce ideas off him and talk with him, I mean, what better person to go through, you know, different things for? You know, one of, he all, and he loves telling these stories.

You know, when he first started with Hartford, he would talk about, and this is back of the day where it's like, you know, Cliff Fletcher and Glenn Saylor and Larry Plow. Like, there's like some legendary older general managers. And he would always say, like, the way that we judged trades back then is, if the person you made the trade with got fired, it was a good deal. He said, we were all pirates. We were all pirates trying to.

get each other fired. Like there was no like, what do you need? What can I help you with? Like, okay, well, call me back in a couple of months. It's like, we're just trying to get each other fired. When you sit down and talk stories with Berkey, the one for one thing is an interesting one. If you look at a lot of

a lot of, you know, Berkey's deals, I remember the Calgary one, the Funuffin, you know, there's Keith Olly as part of it as well. So there's always that sort of backup to all of it. But is there anything that really, as far as advice goes, other than just like don't make one for one trades? Don't leave yourself exposed like that,

but anything else that's come to mind with Berkey, I would imagine that even just having them around, you know, the coach's room on game day has got to be great, great for your staff. Well, we were sitting in the draft and it was the first live OHO draft in, I guess, 25, 26 years.

And what an experience that was, I give the OHL so much credit. It was fantastic. Amazing for the teams and the kids and the families. And I won't mention the player that he said to me, but this is before we're about to make one of our picks and maybe the second or the third round and he goes, I'll tell you a quick story

and we had their target on this guy, this guy, this guy, this guy, and I never heard of those players and that's who we were going to take and he went and he went and then they ended up drafting a Hall of Famer that wasn't their target. And so, you know, in saying that,

the draft is an interesting one and obviously he's drafted some incredible players, you know, the Siddens and Pronger and Kessler and, you know, so on and so forth. And so, you know, I would just say in terms of the advice that he provides is you know, how to talk to your players.

You know, as a manager, you have to kind of under, you're not the coach. You know, you're not supposed to be in the room every day. You want to have a great relationship with the players. Junior hockey, it's a little bit different than pro because they're kids. But just really understanding, you know, the line and your role and,

you know, the fact that during the season, your support system for your coaching staff and for your players, but it's the coach's job to operate the team. And so, you know, I've just learned a lot with him on that in terms of how to operate on a day-to-day basis. And, you know, he's a great man, and I'm really grateful to have the opportunity to learn from him.

A couple of things I want to ask you about, too. And I do want to ask an OHL question. And you can probably, you can just say, like, you know, that's a commissioner question. but I'm still going to ask you. But let me, I'm fascinated with, with the rise of,

of German players and the rise of, and it's funny too, because, you know, Berkey, when he was running the Maple Leafs, there was an affiliation and association he put together

between Toronto and Manheim, right? And I remember Berkey would always tell me, he's like, look, this country is going to pop. They need to do something about their import rules. You need to get more German people playing.

But this is, it's an athletic culture, they're successful in all these other sports. the infrastructure's there, the money is there, like Germany is going to pop. He was right. Under that umbrella, what can you tell us about Max Calchay? Up for the draft this year, Mannheim as well, you got him in the import draft. I'm fascinated with German players.

What can you tell us about Calce? Max is one of the most special players I've watched play. You know, he's a natural center. I always look for players similar to my brother. because, you know, you can teach different things in hockey. That it factor, the, you know, the compete level, you know, mixed with IQ and skill. You have those three things, you're going to make it. And he has all three of those qualities.

Like, he's a special talent. He plays a very, very heavy game. I mean, to be 16 years old playing in the, you know, Delta Tier 1 league, that's unheard of. Youngest player to ever score in that league. you know, and for us, you know, we think he's a really special player. He's a top 10 pick in the 2027 draft, no doubt about it. And, you know, from my standpoint in terms of drafting him, you know, I say this truthfully, Jeff, I hope I never see him. And the reason I say that is because if I don't, if I don't, it means he's in a great spot, he's thriving, and he's having success.

And that's all I want for these kids. in saying that, if we become an option for him, you know, that would be the most incredible thing ever for us. And I believe for him too, because, you know, we have an understanding on how to develop, you know, elite hockey players. He is, he is no doubt about it, special, you know, and a really great kid. But I know he's focused on starting with Adler Mannheim,

and I hope he has a fantastic season with him. And should he choose to start his career, in North America a little bit earlier. We were here and we're an option and we'd love to have him. But, you know, we want what's best for him. And if that's staying there until he goes to the NHL, fantastic. So that's where you lean on Berkey, right? Because Dallas Akins, who's, you know, as much as Dallas, you know, he sort of grew up,

you know, he's one of the part of the Peterborough Mafia, as we like to call it, you know, under Roger Nelson and always defers to Roger. I mean, he's a big supporter of Brian Burke, has always loved Brian. He sort of was under Brian's wing in Toronto. That's where you lean on Berkey. Right? That's really like, can you call Dallas and get Calchay over here? Can you just work it this way?

Let's go. Burke to Eakins. I don't know if Dallas is going to want to give up one of his best players, but, you know, but, you know, I'll ask Berk to make the call. Burke, you'll make the call. Okay, so here's one that I've wondered about. I think a lot of us have to. We do know that across all three CHL leagues, expansion is top of mind for a lot of them.

When it comes to the OHL, I've always looked at one of the strengths of the league is the number of teams and the population that these teams draw from manufactures for my money the best hot house for elite level players. Anywhere. It seems as if it's perfect. And I've always been sensitive to, oh, don't, I understand the temptation to expand, but like, keep it high quality, keep it high quality, keep it elite. And I look now at the number of American kids that are playing. And I look at, you know, there's one more import that you're allowed every year and all the players that are coming from Europe.

And I've kind of had to change the way that I look at the number of teams in your league right now. I don't know if you've thought much about, you know, what expansion. could be like in the OHL? And you can say, that's a Crawford question, Merrick, don't ask me. But do you have a thought on expansion in the OHL? And would it anyway water down the product? Once upon a time, I would say yes,

but now I'm saying no. Yeah. You know, first off, I'd say I think we have a great commissioner, Brian, you know, and I trust his judgment on terms of, you know, where the league's going and expansion. You know, from my standpoint, I'd agree with you. There are so many players now coming from places that didn't produce hockey players maybe 10 years ago. I have three players from Florida, from the state of Florida, on my hockey club this year.

I mean, that's pretty crazy to say, right? I think our league could definitely support more teams. We would be in support of bringing in more teams, you know, especially American teams that, you know, have potential. will want to, you know, join the OHL, I think it would be fantastic for our league. I think if we can get more import spots with more teams, I think it would be incredible as well. You know, there's players, like you said, Jeff, the Germans are, you know, coming out with unbelievable players. Yeah.

The Czechs are coming, you know, they've been coming for a while, but they're like getting better every age group, and we've experienced tons of great Czech players. And then, you know, other countries in Europe, obviously Sweden, Finland, but then you look at the states. You've got states like Florida, like Texas, like California, Nevada. They're throwing out players now. They're producing superstar players. And I think you have to look back to the NHO and Gary Betman's vision and see what he installed

and, you know, hey, we need teams in these areas and this is why. And it's working and it's paying dividends and it's showing now. So I would be all for expansion. I think we could definitely support, you know, five to ten more teams, truthfully over the next however many years with the development and growth of players all over the world. It's a fascinating time.

It really is. I don't know about you, but I've kind of committed myself since the whole development pyramid changed to cutting people a lot of slack when what they say and what they do because this is all changing and we don't know.

We're starting now, Spencer, to get a feel for how this is all going to settle and what it's going to be like. But this is still raw for people. This is still new for people. And it really, a pet peeve, get on my high horse here, it really bugs me when people rip each other about decisions that are being made or comments that are being made right now. Because right now we're still sifting through the chaos of this new relationship.

And I think the smartest thing that anyone can do on either side of all of this is cut everybody slack. And just say like, you know what? this is all new, this is all raw and fresh. Let's get through this for a few years and start to see what it's going to settle into. What do you think of that? Yeah, I think you're being on.

You know, I think the biggest thing that there always needs to be, especially in our game, because our game is different than others. Like, respect is the most important thing. Respect for other organizations, respect for other leagues, respect for people. And ultimately, understanding, and this is something that I think my brother and my father, and myself, like our family, we have, you know, our understanding and our purpose of junior hockey is to develop people and then develop them as hockey players.

And ultimately, everyone in junior hockey, we're doing the same thing. We're trying to help kids move on to the next level, achieve their dreams, and they're playing for our teams as a stepping stone to get there. And it's our job to give them the platform, and it's our job to give them the support that they need because they're still kids and they're still growing and they're still developing. developing and help them get to the next level of college hockey or pro hockey and whatever is best for that individual player. So, you know, ultimately, I would agree with you, Jeff. I think, you know, everyone here in junior hockey is trying to do the same thing. And the most important thing is just to have mutual respect for one another. And, you know, to understand we all have the same goals.

Let me close with a question and a thought on Caleb Malhotra. This is where you can do a victory lap. Love you. From day one, you said this guys. First of all, was he's going to be top 10, and then after a while, like, no, he's not going to be top 10. He's going to be top 5. And then he's going to be top 3.

And he goes 3 to the Vancouver Canucks. Still in touch, even though he's off to be you. And you have a thought on how everything worked out last year for Caleb Malhotra and ending up with Vancouver. Yeah, 100%. We still text. And, you know, we're always going to be close with Caleb and all of our players. but I'm actually hoping he comes to our training camp

before he goes out to school to come skate and just get ready and it would be great for some of our players that, you know, Kate McGregor, look at Caleb Malhotra, right? Yeah. You know, just to be there, be a resource. Like we say once a bulldog, always a bulldog, and that's true. So, you know, Caleb is always in forever going to be a bulldog.

We're so proud of him. You know, I think the draft couldn't have worked out more perfect for him. I texted Ryan Johnson after the draft. I just said, you know, congrats, you got, you know, not only a superstar hockey player, but a superstar human. And I know you know that. And, you know, he texted me back.

I wasn't leaving without him. You know, so it's, uh, he's going to a place that understands who he is, you know, that loves him. And he loves them back. And I couldn't think of a, you know, a better match for him. So, you know, he's a special person. He's a special player. And I'm really excited to watch him at.

at Boston University this year and then so on and through his career and into the NHO and Washington score goals against my brother and you know a fun a fun little rivalry between between them which would be pretty cool so

Vancouver plays Edmonton who you're cheering for I'll cheer for Edmonton number 18 and then number 27 on the other side very good but I very diplomatic for sure hey listen listen my my coach's father is their coach.

My brother plays on their team. So, you know, I think the bulldogs will be cheering for the Oilers a lot this year and vice versa. And, you know, what a cool story. A lot of bulldogs around the NHL and more to come. Maybe as many is three to four in the first round of the 2027. NHL draft, we'll see. Thanks for spending a lot of time with us today. I really appreciate it.

Continued success. Congrats on the McGregor deal. Congrats on the McRate deal as announced today and anything else you have on the horizon. Thanks, as always for stopping by. Thanks, Jeff. You're the man. There is Spencer Hyman, co-owner of the Banford Bulldogs General Manager of the Banford Bulldogs as well. Hey, Bulldogs hat.

Yes. Anything? Jumping out at you there from your favorite OHL general manager? I know he just said it right at the end there. but the comments about Kayla Malhotra and Vancouver texting with Ryan Johnson and him saying, I wasn't leaving without him. Yeah. Wasn't leaving without.

It's good. It's great line. Yeah, I love that. And I think that's awesome. But I also, I'll just say too about, you know, Spencer and I know a lot of other junior hockey general managers now have the same mentality or similar mentality. but just speaking about players in development, and I know in specific, the one example he brought up was,

you know, a guy who he's hoping to go on to play for Mannheim, you know, and talking about Max Calchalli, yeah, but like talking about him going on and the opportunity for him to go play professionally and go play in the German league and saying, I hope we never see him.

It's how Spencer Hyman and the Bramford Bulldogs and probably a lot of other teams. It's supposed to be that way. It's supposed to be that way. It's supposed to be that. I know there's a lot of like older and old school operators who still want it to be like it used to be and have to change their thinking on a lot of this. Spencer does it quickly. There's a lot like Kitchener has done it quickly.

There's a lot of teams that have done that have done it really quickly. But that's the way it's supposed to be. Like that's the way it's always that's the way a lot of operators have always said that it should be. but their actions betray something else, but this is the way it should be. Right? Like this is the way, like everybody's going to have a different path.

Everybody has a different way to get to where they're going to end up here. And in this era of player choice, now there are more than ever. And again, put together the best possible program. So even if you're only going to have Caleb Malhotra for one year, make it a great experience for him. And then as you mentioned,

like Malhotra goes to, goes to camp and talks to Caden McGregor? Hangs out with Keaton McGregor? Like, come on, man, that's gold. That's cold. That's gold. Yeah. But I just thought it was nice to hear that.

And I think, you know, as you said, that's what it should be. And to hear Spencer come on here and speak of it that way, I just, it's got to be. It's got to be so hard now more so than never. Because I'm imagining now with so many players going so many different directions,

putting together a consistent team every year. You have to work harder than never as a manager in junior hockey now. And it seems as if a lot of it is your own players and then, you know, various players from the United States that come in and you kind of probably need to make up your mind every December. Like, okay, did it work? Do we have the team? or do we punt? bluntly. Like that's the way it's got to.

I can only imagine like the horror show of thinking, like if you're Quebec or Moncton right now, thinking of like, okay, how are we going to put together a competitive team, not this year, but the following year for our Memorial Cup bid. Right.

How are we going to show that we can have this team? Got me. Yeah. Grand parts, Wildcats. Over to you. Good luck. luck yeah good luck who even heard kitchener talk about it Mike McKenzie when he joined on the show and they were talking about um they were building a team that they were preparing to be able to

host the Memorial Cup with they missed out on the bid and then they just said ah pivot forget it we're like we'll but we'll go in anyways and then we'll figure it out like it's very interesting we lost the bid we won the Memorial Cup I think they would take that in you to hear that I think they're Okay with that. Yeah, they're fine. For those that don't know, Guelph, the storm are hosting the Memorial Cup in 2027.

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limited edition collections, and exclusive drops. Before we wrap up, do we have a final thought from you of the Bulldogs hat? That's what you're just going to be to me now. Half man, half hat. I completely understand. I wish I could push back on that and say, I wish you thought more of me, but no,

I get it. So I completely understand. No, I, you know what, I actually just got. I'm in from Coivinin that we talked about earlier. Anything?

No, I was just thinking about what we're going to grab from today. There was a lot of good stuff in this show. So I'm appreciative of everyone who tuned in here but um the grieves the grieves stuff was just interesting in talking about you know playing for canada and getting to represent Canada i'm glad we got to hear from them there it's interesting hearing about you know the not even just arbitration but the idea of arbitration and approaching arbitration uh is interesting you hear from from grieves there so it was a cool perspective and

i'm glad we got to have them on again yeah it's um and you know The, the arb hearings are all, you know, held in Toronto. So everybody flies to Toronto for these things as well. And I sort of threw it in there. Like, what's that sleep like the night before? Knowing that. I know. And nine times out of ten, more so even closer.

These deals get done before both parties get in the room. And like, that's the thing. Both parties get in the room, then it's on. You can have one party in the room and it ain't on when both parties get in. Then you go. But a lot of these deals get done in the law. because I don't think either side really wants to go. I really don't think because the way that it's structured is you're trying to impress upon an arbitrator why you shouldn't pay a lot of money for this player.

So you highlight the negatives where the player is obviously highlighting all of that player's positives. I'll tell you what. I really like baseball-style arbitration. And baseball-style arbitration, because right now the arbitrator chooses the number. Like both sides come in and, you know, one side wants this number, the other side wants that number, and the arbitrator sort of picks something. Most times it's in between because, bluntly, the arbitrator does want to get fired

because the arbitrator wants to keep working, thank you very much, you don't want to piss off one side. Baseball-style arbitration, I think, is better because both sides come in with a number and the arbitrator picks which one is right. That way, neither side tries to hit a home run. No one tries to come in too low and no one tries to come in too high.

It sort of forces you to be as honest and objective about things as possible. I like that. I like that too. That way no one, comes in like 12 million get out of here it's like okay well they believe 12 and this the side is saying 2.7 so somewhere like it's it's it just gets rid of like I remember loose skis once told me from report on business television I can't remember we're talking about

I can't remember what company we're talking about and he brought up a saying that's always stuck with me he would say he's talking about the market and he'd say Jeff the market can sustain a bear and the market can sustain a bull. But if you ever see a pig in the market, get out. The minute you see a pig, beat it. And that's why when you see like, okay, someone coming in like way too high or way too low, that's the pig in the market. That's why I look at that and go, I don't want that.

Give me the arbitrator to pick one. Pick one. Yeah, I like that. Get the pigs out of the market. It's one of those things too. I remember I had to very quickly adjust. I think it was at some point between. around like when I was in high school and in college, you know, like my buddies and I,

you always just shoot the shit talking about what's happening. You read an article or something and it would be like, these guys are five or six million dollars apart. I'm like, wow, that's a huge discrepancy. And they very quickly realized, well, they are technically that far apart, but are they really that far apart? Maybe not so much because at some point they're about to head to arbitration and they're going to meet somewhere in the middle.

So is one of those things that I was like, wow, this is, I can't believe these two guys value themselves or the player this differently. I think we can all recall the P.K. Sue ban arbitration where they got into the room, they hashed it out. And then at the end of it, like, I think it might have been the next day or maybe even like later on that night, Sue Ben's contract appeared. They weren't even put it in the arbitrator's just like, oh God, okay, here's a contract. Anyhow. Yeah. Thanks to Jack Reeves for stopping by the program. You got something else? I was just going to say, you think the arbitrator ever here is like the team's case? And he's like, why do you even want the player?

Like, let's get out here. Oh, dude, trust me. Well, I mean, I should ask Berkie about this. And when he was in Vancouver. So the great line, right? like with Marcus Naslin, Todd Boutuzzi, and Brendan Morrison, West Coast Express. This is a super line.

And Berkey, as part of his presentation for the Vancouver Canucks about why they shouldn't pay him, what Morrison was asking for, talked about the analogy of the elephant and the mouse and the elephant carrying the mouse across the river. And Berkey said, sir, Brendan Morrison's the mouse on this line. You don't unhear that. No, you don't. You don't hear that. That one, that was one of the more aggressive arbitrations.

Although I still maintain in the era of the behind the scenes shows that everybody wants to put together, you tell me you don't want to see the behind. You don't want to see an art. If you want to put together a dynamite, I take a dynamite behind the scenes show. get cameras in the arbitration hearings. Yeah. You know who would watch that? Everybody.

You know who would watch that? Everybody. You know who watch that? Everybody. Over and over and over again. Like there's a couple of places that are really sticky. That's one. And the other one is the conversations between referees in the war room.

Hmm. That would be a good one. Yep. Yeah. I would like that. I would like that. Live. live on TV.

Yeah. And now the referees are going over to the instant replay. We're going to go talk to the war room and we'll tune into the mics. When I was at Sportsnet, we did that for one year and it was fascinating. I think it might have just been OHL teams, if I recall correctly. It was fascinating. And they shut it down after one year. Yeah.

That was it. Ain't showing how the sausage is made. Anyhow, thanks to Todd Chirac of the Columbus Blue Jamies. Jacks for helping us on ramp Jack Reeves on the program today. Thank you, Todd. And thanks to Spencer Hyman of the Brantford Bulldogs, general manager and co-owner for stopping by

to talk about the Caden McGregor deal and all things Bulldog and junior hockey and some really interesting stuff about Gary Roberts and his importance there and how they got Brian Burke to put on a tie and we find out it may just have been AI. But it is kind of striking too when you see because that hockey ops page too and there's Brian and you're used to the loosened

tie around the shoulders look and there he is with his tie done up. Anyhow, Reid Duthy, get on that. All right, thanks to you for watching. Thanks to you for listening. If you're listening on your favorite podcast platform, we appreciate it. If you're watching on our DFO YouTube channel, we appreciate that as well. And as always, everybody in the chat, letting us know when Shana Goldman bails on a property like she did on Sabres Live. That's my first phone call after the show.

That's it. We're back on Tuesday. unless something enormous happens. At which point, emergency pod. Bet on it. We'll talk to you again Tuesday.