The Sheet with Jeff Marek - Jets Rolling Without Hellebuyck, Bouchard's Hot Start, and More ft. Sara Orlesky & Dennis King

Episode Date: October 8, 2026

On today’s episode of The Sheet with Jeff Marek, Jeff is joined by Sara Orlesky to break down the Winnipeg Jets’ hot start to the season without Connor Hellebuyck, the latest on the Hellebuyck trade situation, and what’s behind Winnipeg’s early success. They discuss the continued strong play of Kyle Connor and Mark Scheifele, Mario Ferraro’s impact since joining the team, and how Stuart Skinner and Clay Stevenson have looked in net. Jeff then welcomes former NHL scout Dennis King, who worked with both the Edmonton Oilers and Carolina Hurricanes, to share his experience from around the league, his scouting perspective, the latest NHL storylines and much more.SHOUTOUT TO OUR SPONSORS!!👍🏼Coca Cola: https://www.coca-cola.com/ca/en/offerings/coca-cola/hockey👍🏼Sports Interaction: https://www.sportsinteraction.com/thesheet👍🏼Taco Time: https://tacotimecanada.com/👍🏼Movember: https://movember.com/ Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

All right, break up the Jets. They are hot, hot, hot. Welcome once again to the sheet for this Thursday, October the 8th coming to you from the sports interaction studio and official sports betting partner of the NHL. And we're going to cover the Winnipeg Jets a lot today. And we're going to talk about Hellebuckoo. And we're going to talk about Stuart Skinner and Cole Perfetti and Josh Morrissey. And we're going to do it all with the great Sarah Oraleski. Coming up here in a couple of moments.

and then also towards the bottom of the hour, former hockey Twitter slash analytics legend turned one year scout with the Carolina Hurricanes who turned that one year into a Stanley Cup with said Carolina Hurricanes. We're going to talk to the man. We're going to talk to Dennis King coming up here towards the bottom of the hour.

But a number of things, Carolina will get into Edmonton Oilers stuff. That's where he was a prominent blogger, was around the Edmonton Oilers. And some other... One of the questions for Dennis, too, is when you sort of go through a, when you go through a season with an NHL team, in your mind, how many games really matter? It's formally an 82 game season, now an 84 game season,

but to teams, how many games actually matter? Now, you need to win and gather up enough points to get into the playoffs. That's certainly true. But as far as like learning who your team is and what you have under the hood to make decisions, how many games really? really matter. I think the answer may surprise you. In the meantime, a couple of things here that I wanted this to sort of get out there in the spirit of, you know, we're still following, and Dave and I were on this yesterday with DFO Insider, the situation in Detroit with Simon Edvinson and the situation right now with the Carolina Hurricanes and Alexander Nekheum and with the news of Alexander Romanoff out now for the New York Islander's second

season in a row. Just awful news for the player. Awful news for the team. Scott Mayfield, by the way, does draw in. If it was going to be Kessel, I think I might have gotten a trade request out of Mayfield. But the question then becomes, what do the Islanders do? Do they start to get into the Neketian sweepstakes and start to look at making a trade

for said player or in the spirit of offer sheets? Something to watch. Like, let's watch how Matthew Darsh works here. And if they try to get up right until, right up until the salary cap limits, like pick off a $2.5 million contract of, let's say, Miles Wood. So that'll get Zach's attention right away over another thing. So you pick up two and a half, get right up against it and then put them on LTIR and get the maximum, the maximum in LTIR relief, which would,

also include sending Miles Wood down to Hamilton of the American Hockey League. You're probably getting something in the $7.5 million range, and then you're starting to warm up to what could be something there for Simon Edvinson. Also, could the Detroit Red Wings, I think we're all sort of playing. And again, I want to be clear here. This is not a report. This is just wondering about things or idle speculation of what could happen here and who could be a suitor.

What's the one team that we know over the past however many months has gone out aggressively, I mean aggressively to get established NHL players like big ticket players, like, oh, I don't know, Artemmy Panarin, Jason Robertson, level players, the Seattle Cracken. Could there be something between Detroit and Seattle? that could satisfy both here around the defensemen and the number of young players specifically centers that the Seattle Cracken have. I want to pick up that conversation a little bit later on when Zach and I throw around a goofy idea around an email we got in the meantime.

The Winnipeg Jets are hot and who needs that old goalie because, you know, Skinner's getting it done for the Winnipeg Jets, Stevenson's getting it done for the Winnipeg Jets. Here to break it all down. is our good friend Sarah Orleski, senior host and producer for the Winnipeg Jets. And always a delight to talk to. Sarah, how are you? I guess everyone's happy in Winnipeg these days, right? Who's this Connor guy that all these national media people keep talking about? Who's this Hellebuck fella?

I don't know about Hellebuck. I mean, they better be talking about Kyle Connor with the job that he is, the job that he's done so far. But look, the energy around this team right now, Jeff, is so much better than what I thought it was going to be. because I think like so many people, there are a lot of question marks going into this season. And yes, it's a small sample size. I get that so far. But there are a lot of questions going in with the uncertainty surrounding what was going to happen in Nett and with Connor Hallibuck.

And I've got to tell you, just from day one, the energy around this group has been great. They talk about how it is not a distraction. And I legitimately believe them with it. And it's been an absolutely fantastic start. The energy inside Canada Life Center has been great. They've only had a couple of home games, but it's certainly it's been an environment that you want to be in. It's one of those teams, Sarah, and you're right there so you know it,

and you can feel it. You can feel it in the city. Like there are just some teams that need to have a good start and needed to have a good start. Winnipeg is at the top of the list for, I think, a lot of people, too, just to get away from, because you think about pressure points, right? Like if you're Kevin Shevolde off, you're saying yourself, I don't need to be forced into something early here. Like if the goaltending falls down early,

I don't need to be forced into this over 0 and 4 to kick off the season. I don't want to be forced into doing something. There's been the request from Connor Hallibuck, which is well publicized by himself and his agency. Like this is one of those teams that we looked at and said, this team needs to have a good start. So a couple of things. The goal tending has been excellent.

I always like it. When Stu Skinner, whichever team he's playing for it, whenever he does well. Because, man, that guy go through the car wash in Edmonton. Holy smokes. So I always like it when Stu Skinner does well. I'm happy to see American hockey league goaltenders come up and get an NHL shot and do well. Dylan Garand is another one with the New York Rangers right now. And I've always had a soft spot for Cole Perfetti.

As you and I have talked about before, I will always love Cole Perfetti because he was at Dale Howard. pick, right? Back in that draft, like that was the quote-unquote Howard Chuck Pick. So, but if you could isolate a couple of moments here or a couple of players or anything here, you can isolate and say, this is why Winnipeg's gotten out to this start. What would it be? Well, I mean, look, certainly goaltending has been part of the reason for it. So let's look at a couple of things that you said. I do think it is incredibly important for this team to get off to a good start.

and that's something that players spoke about going into this season. Before training camp even started, and we had the opportunity to sit down with some of the players, and they talked about how necessary it was. And not only because of the noise, the external noise, surrounding everything with the Connor Hallibuck situation, but more so they went from winning the president's trophy two seasons ago to missing the postseason last year.

And so they needed to have a good start to be able to bounce back. Then you add in the extra layers as well. Especially, you look at the Central Division. We all know what a challenge it can be. So you want to be able to get those points early on and to be able to establish yourself because inevitably there are going to be hiccups in a season. So get everybody going, grab those points while you can.

But goaltending has certainly been a story, much like you. It is impossible to not cheer for Stuart Skinner. In the short period of time that I have known him, It is, it is, he is just such a wonderful person to be around. It's hard to believe sometimes that he's only 27 years old. I think because he has been, there's been so much attention surrounding him over the last number of years because of the Oilers, because of the Stanley Cup finals that you forget. He's still very young in terms of, in terms of his age. So, so you look at that.

Certainly, goaltending has been one of the biggest storylines. But then I also think that this is a team that has really focused on galvanizing and creating that team environment. And I think that when you look at the distractions that could have existed with it, it could go one of two ways, right? I mean, you could either let that external noise come in and create a distraction for the team, have that cloud hanging over the uncertainty for it. Or it can galvanize a group and say, look, people don't believe in us right now. people, you know, think that we've gotten to where we've gotten because of Connor Hallibuck. No, let's show them what we can do. And I think that a number of players were looking for bounce back seasons, the ones that

they've gotten off to a good start, I think Scott or Neal has come in. He's switched up the game plan a little bit in terms of really emphasizing having speed on each line and wanting to play faster. That was a hot topic last season that they didn't have the speed that they needed. We've seen it early on. And I just think that right now you look, there's just, there is a good feeling when you walk in that room. But they have been led by Kyle Connor in terms of the production picking up where he left off last season. They've gotten some secondary scoring in there.

But there is just, there is a feeling when you're around this team, again, small sample size. But there's a feeling when you're around this team that this is a group that's going to play for each other. And that that never give up mentality, they're always. in it is something that I think we've seen early on that has the possibility to continue throughout this entire season. Let me ask about Cole Perfetti, and I'm glad you brought up Scott O'Neill, because it seemed like Rick Bonas had, you know, the bunchy cords attached to Cole Perfetti's hockey pants, and like he wasn't getting too far from the bench before he was snapped back and

had to watch. Scott Arneal has got him up on the first line, playing with Calconna, playing with Mark Shifley, and you're seeing right now three goals through. assists six points in four games for Cole Perfetti. Was this, in your estimation, was this at a necessity? Was it just time? Was he ready for it? Had he been ready for it before?

How do you look at Cole Perfetti right now? Because it always seemed to me that this was inevitable. He just needed a situation and a coach that said, go. We're willing to live with young hockey players' mistakes. Rick Bonas wasn't. It seems like Scott or Neil is. Well, I think, I mean, in fairness, I think that also you're looking at several seasons back with Rick. And so it's the evolution of Cole as well as he's gotten older as he's adjusted.

He's one of those players that needed the bounce back season. Last year didn't go the way that he had wanted it to because I think he started that he wasn't able to start the season. He had the, he was sidelined in the beginning, he was dealing with the injury. It took a long time for him to be able to come back. There's the weight of what's going to happen with his contract scenario as well. So he signs the extension of the offseason. He is definitely a player that they needed to take that next step. I also think it was a bit out of necessity that we know what that top line looked like

when it was Kyle Connor, Mark Schifley, Gabriel Valardi. But last season, it was too much on that line. And they weren't getting the secondary scoring. They needed to be able to spread the wealth a little bit more. So you give that opportunity to Cole. He was healthy in the summer. He was able to train. He was able to build on it.

He and Mark Schifley have a great relationship. Ontario boys, you know, so they've been able to train together as well. And I think it's just also it's the maturation of Cole that he's ready to take that next step in his game. It's paid dividends early on. So I think it's a mix of opportunity, but it's also that he's farther into his career. some of the things that we saw earlier on that we haven't seen at the start this season and I just think that he's making the most of his opportunity

and that's all you can ask for, right? Is that when you see players and I mean, Cole's been around for a little bit now but when you see the young players given the opportunity, that's what they want? Well, what are you going to do with it? Because there's always a lot of discussion here in Winnipeg about, you know, has the young player,

they need to give more opportunities to young players. You need this. Well, when the opportunity is there, you have to seize it. You have to take advantage of it. And we haven't always seen that. We're seeing it early on from coal. And the good thing with that is that hopefully it allows some of the other lines to get going as well. Did they dodge or did Winnipeg, Kevin Shevolde off here on the entire Winnipeg Jets organization, dodge a bullet with his contract, 24 years old?

I can't believe I'm saying this, only $6 million a year. Well, and you hope so, right? I mean, from a Jets perspective, you certainly hope that he exceeds all expectations with it and that you get another deal. We've seen Kevin Shevoldaoff be able to do that a number of times. And one thing that I really like about Cole, too, is, and obviously this has been a hot topic in terms of this market, is just Cole, committing to be here, wanting to be here. This is a great opportunity for him. He likes the city. He's being embraced here. Obviously, he has a very significant role already in scoring, what you could argue, is the biggest goal in Winnipeg Jets 2.0 history in the postseason against St. Louis

a couple seasons ago. So he, there's all, you just always waited for him to take that next step. Hopefully that's what we're seeing because the Winnipeg Jeds need their prospects to continue to develop, to become that cornerstone and that core group. We've seen it with the older players that were drafted and have stayed here, the Adam Lowry's, Mark Sheifley's, Kyle Connors. Well, Cole is an example of that next group that's coming in, that if the Jets are going to be able to have success, whether it be this season or hopefully for many years to come,

Cole is going to have to be a key part of it. I should have asked you this earlier, Sarah. Is there any update on Josh Morrissey? So we don't know. There's an optional skate this. morning that's supposed to be well attended so I don't know they're on the ice at the moment so we'll have to wait and see I don't know whether or not we'll get an update today or potentially I would go that it will probably get a better one tomorrow they play against Anaheim here at home so it'll

be interesting to see whether he's on the ice but I don't have any update for you at the moment okay um all good that was uh that was a way I mean that the hit with uh with with with Hughes and then One more shift and then nod out the next period. Whenever I see that, I just say like, uh-oh, uh-oh, because he tried to go and it's like, no, wasn't happening. Well, and he's another player. You think about the injuries that he's had that have kept him out of key moments and whether that be for the Jets and the postseason or you think of the Olympics,

wasn't able to play that he wanted four nations. He was sick. So he's somebody that very much had a great offseason, was healthy, he was really able to put in the work as well and was very excited or is very excited about this upcoming season and what this Jets team can do. So you hope that it isn't as it isn't something that's too significant. And if it keeps them out at all, maybe just a couple of games. Fingers crossed.

Okay. I'm going to just throw a name out of you. I just want to see your reaction. I'm not trying to bias the jury at all. Oh, dear. I don't have a good poker face. So all right. You got this, sir. You got this. Tyrell Bauer.

Oh, I might be president of his fan club. I got to tell you. So this is in, you know, he's played four seasons with the Manitoba Moose. He's been in the organization. But I have to say that he's not someone that I think enough people know about. And that is myself included. You know, that when he's spent, he has spent his career in the HAL and I think that's just sometimes, even though he has been a force there in terms of the physical style that we saw in the first two games that he played, you don't necessarily get the same attention, right, when you're down there. He comes up here, Jeff, if you ever have the opportunity to speak to him or have him on, he is one of the most articulate, thoughtful

players I have ever come across in 20 plus years. He is so, when you listen to him, it's like listening to a TED talk. He's just, he is, yeah, he's so appreciative of everything that he is having the opportunity to experience right now. He's a very much a team guy. You know, he's an Alberta kid that has just, has had to fight. He will tell you both literally and figuratively to be able to get the opportunity that he's in now. And I think it's something that there's still, there is a place for a player like him. He's worked really hard on not being one dimensional.

He's tried to work on his skating more. He's put in the time the last couple of off seasons to be able to get this opportunity. And how much he's going to play this season remains to be seen. But he is one of those players that you just, once he speak to him, you just, you cheer for him, Jeff. He's like a Stuart Skinner. You just, you like to see good things happen to good people.

And that's what it is with Ty Bauer. And what a name he is made for himself in very short order. He has everybody's attention with what he's been able to do. We're circling dates. Like we're circling Columbus with Matthew Olivier. We're circling Carolina with Nick DeLorea. Like this is, I mean, you've covered hockey for a long time. Like, you know, when you're someone like Bowler,

your first season going through it in the NHL, it's the gauntlet. Right? Like everybody's going to have a whack at this pinata. And it's going to be tough, but that's how you establish the rep. But I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that already Jets fans love this guy. Oh, you know, in short order, he became so popular. And that's where, again, I think that a lot of fans, even though he's been playing in this market, you don't get the same, obviously, the AHL does not have the same sort of eyes on it that the

NHL does. So I think that it wasn't just the way that he immediately came out and how physical he was and that presence, but then a number of people that were able to watch his intermission interview where you listen to him speak that he, just you immediately feel attached to someone. going back to my earlier comment about how you cheer for good things to happen to good people and I'm always one of those look you love to see your first round your high draft picks do well

but they're also supposed to right that's what you expect from them there is something about somebody that is a six round pick that is working their way up that doesn't get the attention that doesn't have the limelight on them doesn't have the same sort of expectations that when you see them achieve their dream of being able to play in the National Hockey League. That's the beauty of sports.

That's what I absolutely love. The human element of sports is what my favorite thing is. And that's the perfect example of it. It really is. Is this enough right now in Winnipeg? 3-0-1. Beat Colorado yesterday. 32-safe performance from Stuart Skinner.

Like you can never, until the whole thing gets resolved, you can never really forget about the Connor Hallibuck situation, but is this a, all summer it was front burner? Is it back burner already now for the Winnipeg Jets? Or are all of our conversations kind of like with Detroit, with, you know, Larkin and Edvenson, no matter what you talk about, is it still informed by, oh yeah, and they have this to deal with? very much on the back burner in my opinion you just you don't hear it discussed in the room the media doesn't really bring it up here because partly there's nothing new to there's nothing new to talk about so it's the same scenario and it's different obviously than what detroit's dealing with because connor halibuck isn't in winnipeg right now he's not playing here and because of the success that they've had the fact that stew skinner in short order and a combination i think

of not only how he's played, but there's definitely an element, I believe, as well, the people saying, you know, the fan base wanting to get behind him because of everything that's gone on with Connor Hallibutton for the summer. But I just, I think that there isn't much discussion about it. I said earlier that the players have talked about how they don't want this to be distraction. They're not letting it be one. I don't think that it is. It's just not, you don't hear a lot of talk about Connor Hallibuck, would that change if the record change? Potentially. But with the way that they've started, the way that they've played, they're playing an

entertaining brand of hockey and whether it's been Clay Stevens and Stuart Skinner and that they've gotten goaltending. And they're just really likable. It's just a really likable team, Jeff, right now. So I think that fans are buying in. It will be interesting to see how it all gets resolved. but I don't think that it is at the forefront of everybody's mind right now, which is a positive because you want to, Scott or Neal,

everybody has said you can only worry about the players that are here right now. Those are the ones that are on the ice. It's true. So far, they've been able to perform the way that Jets fans have hoped. Let me leave you with this one. In Washington, there were a lot of people that would have preferred Clay Stevenson, over Charlie Lindgren. One of the things that Lindgren had in his favor,

very well liked, good guy in the room. I can hear someone in my background already saying, yeah, that's great, good guy in the room. They don't flood the room. Give me the players. But I think that's what sort of nudged Washington into keeping Charlie Lindgren and making a risky proposition

in trying to get Clay Stevenson to Hershey. It was a gamble. I think in the back of everyone's mind at Washington, they were saying, I don't think he's going to clear waivers. Clearly he didn't. Were you surprised at A, a claim for a goaltender, or B, that it was specifically Clay Stevenson? So it wasn't. It was a name that we had heard bantered about here as possibilities, but you never know

whether or not exactly who management is looking up. But certainly that was a name that we had heard discussions about throughout the marketplace as somebody that could be a good fit here. He has a relationship with Stu Skinner. They train together sometimes in the summer. So there's a little bit of connection there. Was I surprised that they put in a claim for one? No, because the goaltenders that they had there are still looking to get experience in the

HL and not knowing what you have exactly with Stewart Skinner or you wanted to make sure that you had a backup that you felt comfortable with. And that's one of the things that I think we're going to have to watch throughout this season is I'm so intrigued as to how these two are going to be deployed with the 84 game season. Because in the past, obviously, Connor Hallibuck has started 60 plus games. It has, you've never, you know, they win the Jennings and it's Helibuck's name that's on there because you never have a backup that has played enough games to be able to qualify. Right. And so that's not going to be the case this year. We already know that. But our, so they need somebody, let's say that can play 30, 30, 30, you know, 30, 35 games,

ideally for it. They didn't have that. They weren't comfortable with it yet. With the goaltenders that they had in the system. So it wasn't a surprise that they were looking for somebody that was a little bit older, that even though Clay only had a handful of NHL games. Obviously, he's got the HL experience. He was with Hershey when they won the Calder. So you have an older goaltender that is able to help take some of the load off of Stuart Skinner. And I think that both of them have been very excited in short order to be able to work with Wade Flaherty, the goaltending coach here. We have always seen historically, if you look at it, the goaltenders that have played here, whether it be your starter or your backups,

play their best hockey, typically, if you look at numbers, when they're playing in Winnipeg and when they are working with late Flaherty. So it'll be interesting to see what sort of adjustments and what he can get out of Stuart Skinner and Clay Stevenson this year. Okay, I lied. One more quickie. Yeah. For me, the number, Sarah, is 20. I think after 20, you can start to see trends with things.

I think I was on Vancouver podcast, Secrester Price a couple weeks ago. And one of the questions I was asked, like, how many games do you want to see out of Elias Pedersen until you decide whether he's back to the form that we saw from a couple of years ago? And even though he's been great, I'm like, I want to see 20. And I feel that way about teams in the season as well. For me, it's 20 until we figure out,

or at least I can come to some conclusion, whether the Winnipeg Jets are actually good or not. We don't have that yet. They're 3.0 and 1. They look fantastic. Do you have a number in your head? Like, is it, is 20 too light? Do you want to see 30? You're willing to say, like, give me 10 games?

Like, I don't know if you have a number attached to, I'm willing to make a pronouncement after this many games. But if you do, what is it? So I don't. But I think that a quarter mark is certainly gives you a representation of what you're looking at. Yes, I said with the start of this season, I preface everything by going, look, they have been able to come up with the wins and the points early on, but yes, it's a small sample size. But you like what, you like the fight that they've

seen. It hasn't always been pretty, but you see the signs that you think, okay, this is something that hopefully this team can continue to build on. They're finding different ways to win. It's not always, it's not always the same style of game. It's not always five on five. Sometimes it's your power play, whatever it might be. They're finding different ways. I think that, I don't know what 20 games, where would that take us into? We're getting into like late, late, late November. We're mid, mid to late November. Like that's essentially a cut line.

Like teams are in or out by then. Right. I mean, what's the classic line that everyone always goes with, right? About American Thanksgiving and you look at where you sit in the top eight. This is a difficult start to the season for the Jets in terms of their schedule, the opponents. You take down Colorado. I know that Anaheim lost last night, but we were looking at it going, okay, what are the teams that haven't lost a game yet going into this week?

Well, Colorado was one. Then you have Anaheim, Minnesota. I don't believe it lost in regulation. I mean, there's just, there's a number of tough teams that were, that they're facing. So I don't think that we'll truly get a sense of the team confidently until sometime in November. But you just like to see these early building blocks. I think that knowing that they are doing, they're seeing success right now.

I always believe that if you see success early with the style of game, that it's easier to convince players, maybe that this is the way that, you know, you need to play in order to get defense leads off. That's all of the cliches that we could throw out there. I think, though, that if you look into November and get a sense of the team,

and because I am not one that bets, and I'm so incredibly cautious with everything, is they you hope that there's health because we've already seen a number of key injuries across the league and you hope that the Winnipeg Jets are able to stay healthy

because health was certainly impacted their season last year in terms of key players at the start of the season not being able to go Connor Hellebuck missed a stretch Josh Morrissey. So this team needs to stay healthy, but I think that it will get a sense

in November, I'm hoping, by the end of November, as to whether or not this team is able to sustain this, hopefully, for the long term. You're the best. Thanks, as always, for stopping by Sarah. Always did like to catch up. You'd be good. And whatever this is, like enjoy it, like every other Winnipecker is.

That's one of them to, hey, anytime I said, regardless of winner loss, I mean, they didn't win against Boston in the season opener. They lost in overtime. But I said, oh, it is exciting fun hockey to watch. And regardless of results, right now, who doesn't want to watch fun hockey? And that's certain. Even in that Boston game, you got, you got Bower and Castellick. Like, come on.

It was, oh, it was a ton of fun. Jeff, it's every game you go, this is fun hockey to watch. And I think if you're a fan, that's what you want to see right now. 100%. You're the best. As always, take care. And we'll have you on to talk about the Heritage Classic next time. And I'm crossing my fingers hoping that Winnipeg wears red pants.

I love red hockey pants with the blue. Well, we'll discuss it next time I'm on. All right. You're the best, Sarah. Thanks, Jack. We'll talk soon. The great Sarah O'Leski here on the sheet talking about the Winnipeg Jets. And their 3-0-1 started coming off a 32-save performance yesterday by Stuart Skinner.

They beat the Colorado Avalanche. 3-2 is the final Kyle Connor picks up two goals in that one. They are first in the central record of 3-0-1. This fan moment, a presentation of Coca-Cola being a hockey fan is a commitment. The superstitions, the chance, the pacing, the standing through overtime, because sitting somehow feels wrong, whether you're making the climb to the nosebleeds, rallying your section to start the wave

or keeping one eye on your game and the other on the out-of-town scores, true fandom puts in the work. And every shift deserves a nice cold Coca-Cola. Fan work is thirsty work. Now, we're about to bring on a hockey Twitter legend. We are about to bring on a Stanley Cup champion scout, formerly of the Carolina Hurricanes.

He's kind of like, Like there's a number of people, players, and I was just jotting down and trying to figure out which ones would come to mind. Yaroslav Puzar played 186 games in the NHL, four seasons, and he won three Stanley Cups. Yuri Huerdina played five seasons and won three Stanley Cups, one with Calgary and two with Pittsburgh. So as far as like making your entry into the pool, winning the ultimate prize, and then getting out, that is the story. so far for hockey, Twitter, legend, and Stanley Cup champion scout, Dennis King, who makes his first appearance here on the sheet.

Dennis, first of all, thanks so much for being aboard. And second, congratulations on winning the Stanley Cup. What does it mean to be a Stanley Cup champion the first time you were in? Do you have Yaroslav, Puzar, or Yuri Hordina-type vibes about yourself right now? This hockey stuff is easy. Well, I mean, I guess if you have

If you went up in the right organization Right off the bed, it's kind of easy But, you know, I I mean, there's not much I can count You know, I was in a spot with a team where they kind of They were close And it's not like always the extra element or anything You were the final piece of the puzzle, Dennis,

Yeah, for sure. Hang on, get your camera. There we go. There we go. We got you. The enemy of technology, Dennis King. There we go. All right, we're locked in. First of, Carolina Hurricane specifically, and I'll think of somebody, it's funny, I was mentioning Ellen Hutchingham the other day here on the show. Carolina, under Eric Tulski, does things a little bit differently.

I don't think that Ellen herself ever thought that she would end up scouting for an NHL team, but now she's a Stanley Cup champion scout as well. How did you get the gig originally? Like, how did this all come to be? I guess I was friends with Tulski for a very long time. He blogged when I was kind of blogging too. Yeah. So him and I had stayed in touch,

and occasionally whenever he would, as he got promoted, and if Carolina would make a move, he might reach out to me and say, hey, what do you think of this player, what are we getting in this player? especially in situations when they made a move with the Oilers because obviously I've been an Oilers fan forever, and so I know that team pretty well.

So then Eric and I just would talk about random things with just with players, the league, and about a year before I was hard, he kind of reached out and said, you know, I'm thinking about hiring another scout, would you be interested if so? And I said, yeah, absolutely. get in touch with me and we'll see how it goes and I'm a pretty you know easy come easy go

guy if I never if I didn't hear from Eric afterwards I would have been like oh okay and uh what I did and then I did the you know a couple of months interview process and hard last July jumped into it they were great I mean they did a great job of nurturing me just they giving me a lot of resources and kind of letting me go and you know I would have a summer idea is and like, okay, this has some merit. This doesn't have some merit. And we just kind of went from there. And I mean, as I said, I'm just in the right place at the right time. And this camera stuff is awful. Jeff, hold on. That's all right. No, no problem. We can, we can send someone over there to hold the camera for you if you, if you need for the next

appearance. In the meantime, it's the solo act. Yeah, no, but anyway. So I, yeah, so, I mean, I just kind of went from there. And very, very, supportive, as I said, very nurturing. You know, those guys don't miss when it comes to player acquisition. Then when you get inside and see what they have to use, fantastic. Well, that's the thing, too. I mean, Tulski was on after the Hurricanes won the Stanley Cup.

And one of the things he said, and he said, like, look, I'm not always going to bat a thousand. But we turned over 12 players and I went 12 for 12. I'm not always going to go 12 for 12. This organization is not going to go 12 for 12, but we just went 12 for 12. I want to bounce around a bunch of hockey topics with you. and get your thoughts on the Oilers, McDavid,

with a hell of a night last night specifically. But what did you learn from your time there? I mean, I'm sure that everybody goes into it thinking, you know, I know what's going on. And then you realize, hold on a second here. I didn't know about this. I didn't know about that. And this has changed my perspective on all of it.

Did you have those moments where you're like, yeah, because it's inevitable, right? Because you're dealing with a whole bunch of different people and sharing ideas. What are some of the things that you gleaned from working? with people who had been with your organization for a while? Well, I'd say the number one thing I learned was, you know, just how fantastic of a leader Eric was.

And basically about how you could come to a consensus on opinion. You know, we would have meetings, and Eric is just kind of like sitting back. We're discussing various players. We all have different opinions, different viewings, and Eric is taking notes. Eric is nodding. And then afterwards, he's got a great, great summation.

And, you know, on he goes. So it's kind of a really cool, really cool view into calm and stoic leadership. And the kind of things, there's only so much I could say, obviously. Yeah, of course. I don't want Eric to send the Black Ops team from my house. So, like, I'm having trouble with a camera. So can you imagine what I do with a sad? lessons. So, but I know, you kind of, I guess Jeff, this seems strange to say, because I'm older,

but I was at the kind of the infancy of analytics. So this is how I learned to evaluate players. Then when I get in there and I get all the access to their video, now I can kind of burnish that with a look at, okay, this guy's number is good. Why is it good? And you drill that on habits and tendencies, strengths and weaknesses. And now you know, okay, this is what this organization looks for. This is something that they really don't like. And that really, I mean, they do such a great job at that. Like, it really steals your focus in terms of who you select. You come to an idea early, okay, this guy is good and he can play. He can't play for Carolina. You know, it must be fascinating too,

and I'm sure that it affects all of your hockey watching subsequently. But one of the things that I've always looked at with the Carolina Hurricanes is, A, you have to be able to think quickly. You have to work hard. I mean, that's a non-negotiable with Rod Rindamore. You have to work hard. You have to think quickly. And you have to be an excellent athlete to play with this team.

As far as, like, looking at players around the NHL, does that meet the standard you think of who could play for the character? Because I think you're right. Not everybody can play for that team. That is a very, very challenging way to play, a very challenging way to play in the playoffs, and not everyone can do it. But think fast, wildly athletic, and work hard.

Does that seem to fit the bio of a Carolina Hurricanes player? Well, I mean, kind of seeing it right now with the Oilers, where there was a lot of discourse this summer about the others would like to emulate some of the best of Caroline's practices, which I hardly endorse. First thing is the full buy-in from Brindamore, which, I mean, you don't really get that throughout the league, not to that extent. The other thing is, yes, is conditioning. I mean, Edmonton is kind of, we'll see. maybe it's a bar product of not having a stable forward core,

but there's some situations now where a couple of players are trying to play this pressure system that Babcock is installing, and it's kind of like it's not even and it's not smooth. So I don't know if it's a thing where they're kind of not trusting everything yet, or I don't know if the dexterity isn't there from the feet perspective. But we'll kind of see, but, I mean, yeah, you're right. I mean, as I, you know, when I look, think back to that roster, I mean, yeah, you know, sometimes you don't have to be super smart. I mean, your brain can put you in a spot almost as quick as your feet can.

You know where to go, you know, so that means you don't have to be as athletic. But there's probably not more to more or two guys like that on that roster. That roster was built for conditioning, built for speed, built for stops and starts. And as I said, I'll see what the oilers now. is they're trying to ate that system somewhat. It's not that easy. Let me get there because we just saw, listen, we just saw trade. Philip Halliner goes from the Pittsburgh Penguins to the Edmonton Oilers.

My first thought when I first saw it, and Spencer Stastening goes the other way, the defenseman. My first thought when I saw it was they're bringing in someone for the PK. When you see the Oilers make a move like that, what goes, because mine is just like, oh, yeah, he's in for the PK, you know, not the best skater, but it works hard, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. When you see a move like that, what goes through your mind? Like, I'm sure you're thinking at a different level, like, okay, this is what Edmonton's trying to do here. It's part of a pattern that it's not just random. Well, I see that they've kind of changed, like the composition of their bottom six will be guys who basically keep the score even. And if you finish minus two or you finish plus two, I mean, that's fine because up top, you know, hopefully when everybody is back in,

you have cross-side line one line, McDavid on the other, and this is where you make your hay in terms of, five-on-five differential. So, Hounder is a guy is going to be looked at as low event. You know, he'll do his work on the boards. He'll be there. When you move the puck up to side, he'll be able to get it out, transition it out.

Or, you know, he'll be able to chip it out. He'll be able to take that. He's a bigger body so we can take that pressure with a defenseman pinching, for instance, the way that, you know, Florida has their defensemen just coming down the boards with abandon. And some of those guys are the... And a club.

And a club. Yes, exactly. And, you know, it kind of really put a dent in the Oilers' breakout in both years. So, Halner's a guy who theoretically can stick up to that pressure. And he's also got it if he gets on the boards, he'll dig in and he'll win some battles. And yes, he has the aptitude to kill Penley. So the Oilers are basically going to look for that third and fourth line to just be gauze that just keep the score even. You know, nothing happened. when they're out there and you let the big guys make the difference. So it's funny too. There are some teams we've seen this historically that'll go into a playoff series or just an individual game and they'll say, you know what, we're just going to play 50-50 puck all game

and take our chances with the power play. If you're Edmonton, are you then suggesting that the idea is bottom six plays 50-50 puck and you just wait until Connor and Leon catch their breath? Yeah. I'm not saying that that's a bad philosophy at all. I mean, there's certain, there's different ways to win the cup. I mean, you know, you could go back.

The first thing to think about it is, well, the, you know, one of the things, because I went back, you know, I was just bored one day and said, okay, like, you know, how does the sausage get made? You wouldn't believe the, like, the low number for Malkin and Crosby plus minus when they won the cup. they made the major separation on the third line because you had those top two lines that were facing the top competition

and then third line gets out against third line and they make the difference. So for the oilers, what they kind of look to do, I think, will be Dickinson will probably take half of the hard minutes and draw a little or McDavid will take the other half. So it's, but I mean, as I said, there's different ways to do with, you know, Florida did it with Lundell and Barkoff, primarily Barkoff. Getting all the tough matchups,

and then Bennett and Kachuk will come out and play against the third lines and make their hay. But with Edmathan, hopefully, when everybody is healthy, it's drosidling podgolz and there's one pair, McDavid and Hyman as the other,

and then you'll have your Savoy sprinkle in there. Maybe Alex DeBring it, who knows? De Brinket. And then your third line will be Dickinson, captain and Frederick just trying to say like, oh, at the end of the year, minus two, plus two, whatever. And that's how you win.

You hang on. That's how they'll try to win. I can't period of the lead here. So you think that that's a target for Edmonton, old Jeff Jackson client? Well, Jeff Jackson client, Stan Bowman obviously likes Americans. You have the idea that Detroit is basically, I mean, just kind of wisdom. Now maybe Detroit will kind of look to build around, say, the Sider and Raymond cluster. So why would they keep De Brinket to be kind of part of that?

And of course, Edmonton's primary trade ship would be a guy who played his college hockey in Michigan. Hang on a second here. So you think that that is, like, first of all, how would that work for Edmonton? Let's just get ahead of ourselves here. Alex, Alex De Brinket joins the Edmonton Oilers. How does, how does that work? Well,

Ozick Howard and 800 first round picks. No, I'm not saying like, I'm not saying like how that would come together. I'm more thinking like, who would you put them with? How would that work with the, with the Oilers mix? Because I think that's a,

I think that's a fascinating player to stick on the Edmonton Oilers. Oh, he would play with, he would play with, and Hyman. Hyman goes in, does the work. He's the F-1. The Brinket comes in, digs around a little bit,

support, try to fish the park head, or McDavid does it, and the Brinket goes and hangs around the face-off circles. And downward. I think it would work. And the brinket is not terrible defensively. He's kind of good enough two ways that he's just not, it isn't just, like, he's not empty calories, you know what I mean?

So I think that would be like kind of a perfect match. Obviously, there's had to be some money. you know, some retention and then some money that could go out. But we'll take care of that later. But I'm just saying if you could give me somebody that I think could just like step in there and it would kind of be seamless, that would be the guy. And, you know, just to get back to it, basically once I see the Oilers split McDavid and dry sidle, and once they can do that and play against the better teams and win,

well, that's when you kind of know that they're ready to win because, you know, honestly, and this is off another tangent, there's probably, there's less than 20 games a year that really matter in terms of showing you the caliber and quality of your team. Pause on that, because I mentioned that that you were coming up and this is one of the things I want to talk to you about. I also want to talk to you about boring hockey players

and how valuable they are. But over the course of 84 games, you mentioned under 20, what could the number be? as far as how many games on the calendar do you really learn anything about your team? What's the number for you? Well, you know, in terms of, I'll just look at Edmondon, so your games against Vegas and your games against Anaheim, you go to the Central.

I mean, how do you fare against Dallas, Colorado, Utah, and then you have your home and homes in the east with Florida and California, and Carolina primarily because, I mean, I don't know. The Atlantic has got like some good teams. I don't know how many great teams there are. But, yeah, those would be the six, seven, eight teams that you're like, okay, let's see how we do against those teams. And that seems, you know, it seems so obvious and simple.

And the first time that I came to think about this, actually was an Expos fan and now I'm a Nationals fan, and the Nationals from 2012 made the playoffs. someone always flame out in the first round. And I came to realize that they would win 90 games every year, and they would pound the bad teams, but they could never beat the Dodgers, they could never beat the Cardinals, the Giants,

and then when you got in the playoffs, those were the teams that you had to beat. So, you know, you and I talked about this a little bit last year, and you asked me when I thought of the Oilers, and I said, listen, check out their record against these teams. And, yeah, I mean, that kind of proved to be, actually, well, I mean, injuries didn't help, But yeah, so this is where it gets back to balance, Jeff.

The a others right now are basically, there's so many injuries that it's kind of like a house bar, and they're just gone out through the door, and all they took was like the first line. And blue shard and ankle. And they said, we'll go to Walmart tomorrow and get some more clothes. This is kind of what we're going to do for now. Let me, okay, let me throw a statement at you. You will never win a Stanley Cup until you have enough. boring hockey players.

True or false? Yeah. It's hard to debate that right off the bat. I mean, I, you know, I'm thinking about dynastic boilers. And yes, you had those guys who just, and it's not so much boring. I imagine, you know, physical play. It's not always boring. No, I get excited.

Do all the things in between the highlights, essentially. I have kids at play and they're nonstop on their phone. Look at this highlight. Look at this goal. Look at this play. and all that. I'm like, yeah, but that's not the game. The game is all the stuff that happens around that you look at and go like, well, nothing happened on that shift.

Okay, well, and, you know, this is where the neutral zone and zone entry denials are so important. Everybody will go look at that Drosital bomb that breakaway pass from last night. But I tell you, from having watched the oldest for so long, the first thing I noticed is, oh, my God, Drossett, was 10 feet below his own blue line. This is fantastic. Right.

So to me, it was like, man, I've seen, I've seen Drossettl, he's the best passer in the NHL and has been forever. I've seen that for a super long time. What really impressed me was he was back there providing another layer and another barrier to entry. So, yeah, I mean, that's, you know, I've got a buddy who works in the NHL, and he said to me one day that the oil. will win when the forwards start caring about what happens when they don't have the puck.

Keeping their stick on the ice in the defensive zone. That's a broad. Yeah. It's a broad. I get it. You know what? Like it looks like, you tell me, it looks to me like Connor McDavid is really trying, even the last thing, just flying everywhere. He's trying to do what Mike Babcock wants him to do.

Like pull up under the blue line instead of just like grabbing the park. and getting around the net and circles and looking for lanes. And it looks like he's really trying to do this, the Babcock way right now. What do you think of this marriage here? Babcock and do others? Yep, 100% agree. There's a ton of work happening off the park now that didn't never happen before. Very, very impressed, very surprised that that line is bought in immediately and those two guys.

Paulson's always been a worker. I'm not really surprised by that. So now the next de-evolution of that, Jeff, is McDavid and Droscel to helm their own lines and bring that work ethics so that their respective linemates know that this is the standard. And once I see that, and I'll know when I see it, and obviously we're living in the age of advanced stats, so you can't lie to us anymore about whether the process is good or not. You know, if you win 4-2 and you're expected goals at 5-on-5 is like 47 percent, well, you're probably in Montreal Canadians. But, you know, so you can't lie to people.

You'll see what's what. What do you think of the HABs, just out of curiosity? I think the HABs are everybody's darling more for cap management than anything else, and to which, I mean, yeah, it's kind of a really good setup that they've got there with a GM mixed with an agent, so who understands better to value than an agent, and they've got some fantastic contracts laid out. I mean, they're at their infancy. They won two series last year where they definitely should not have won one of them, and maybe

not both. And you see, to go back to the original point about how only a few games matter, I mean, look at their last six games against Carolina. five games last spring and last night. Like, this is who you have to beat, and this is how you show against that team, you know, you're not anywhere close. So I think everybody, because of the history in Montreal,

because of the style that they play, everybody is kind of in love with that team might become. But it's not there yet. And you knew that from the advanced metrics last year, but of course what what Montreal can do better than anybody else is they'll just find net money and that they found too

in Dobertshire and Fowler so that covers a lot of mistakes you know I spent a lot of time betting sports before I ever worked in the NHL and you kind of got to know at the end of a bet whether you were lucky or unlucky Montreal was one of the few teams

that I could bet Montreal, they could get out shot soundly, and I would be fine with it because price was price. Yeah. Okay, you're right. Like flip the pencil around and use the eraser. It's, so let me ask the two teams, again, like we've all watched a handful of games. The two teams that I'm most impressed with so far this season, Vegas and Utah, those are the teams that out of the gate I look at and go like, these guys already look like teams. Are my eyes? deceiving me and if so who do you like so far from what you see no yeah no that's an easy call i mean Vegas once Vegas got healthy last year like Vegas are just solid and steady they just do the same

just do the right things over and over again the issue with them is like you know how many games will mark stone and carlson be healthy everybody talked about how great Mitch marner was in the playoffs last year, go look at his numbers with him without William Carlson, which isn't to say that William Carlson is the ultimate kingmaker, but he certainly appeared to be last spring. There was a big difference in Mariners numbers once Carlson went out. And once Carlson went out, Carolina had a huge advantage with their matching. So if I'm a Vegas fan, you know, okay, what day do I wake up and Carlson is out for two months and Mark Stone is out for three? And, you know, to bring it back to the Oilers thing, I think

that Edmonton might be in that, hopefully not, but Edmonton might be hidden in that territory with Zach Hyman, and then they're lucky that it hasn't happened to echo him yet. But, no, Vegas is solid. Yeah, I really like the lines for, I really like the forward group for Utah, not overly sold on that defense just yet, but I really like the forward group. Man, I'm telling you, who's looked great,

even in the specter of two major injuries, and I kind of hate to say it, but that's Florida. Yeah. And that one hand you talk about it. Even with Brady Kitchuk and all the Cheerios beside his name? And listen, bud, even to, like, you want to talk about it, I'll go back to Carolina, and you want to talk about a team that's all in and does exactly as their coach tells them, their advanced numbers right off the bat.

And they went into, you know, going on Annan, tough building and Carolina opening night and control both games at five on five and their net bonding was terrible last year

and you know Zito's a mover and a shaker so yeah I very impressed with them off the hop and of course yes obviously Vegas and Utah as well we'll see about Colorado

with the depth on defense you know, that seems to be getting a bit older too. I don't know. And as I said, with Utah is like, they had like another really, really good defenseman. I mean, I would kind of consider them a bit more, but it's been bailing there for a long time,

so it's kind of about time. Okay, any player, the end on this one, any players from any of these teams early on that you think everybody is sleeping on? Like Colorado has always been able to pick off play. that other teams don't value enough. Carolina are probably the kings of that. But other players out there that you look at and go,

man, everyone's sleeping on this guy. And it's got to stop. Someone's going to smarten up and find this guy. I was just turning around and say, like, there was a player that might get lost in the mix that I think is kind of really good. It would be Igor Chiersnoff with San Jose. Yeah, he's excellent.

Because it was kind of why. watching, and what's going to happen in there is like, do you let the tail wag the dog in terms of salary cap allocation? If you have Kiefer Shorewood and Colin Graff, and you've signed them long term to considerable money, where do you think they're going to be slotted? And then, of course, there's a plethora of wingers there. So how does Chernoff get into that top six? And if he's only a third line winger, I wonder would he have more value to San Jose as a trade chip for the defense? Because if you want to talk about decourse that I'm not sold on, well, do you know the way to San Jose? Are you sold on the goaltending? Well, extend it one more position, too.

You sold on the goaltending in San Jose. Like, again, it's just one game. Like, they fixed off against Dallas. Dallas was due to finally pop and score some goals, and they just got steamrolled by the stars five cob look completely different completely difference without McLebriney but how do you feel about the goaltending there? Well I mean

I don't love it we'll have to see you know you're you're going to have to separate the numbers from the from the you know the shot suppression you look at that top four it's nursing Kessel Ring and

Trube's and you know Trubo was propped up by Jackson-Lacombe last year. So what's he going to look like without him? You've got oral out there. You're breaking in that kid the kid from the HLs from BC. So, yeah, as part of, you can. I mean, obviously, there's one of the things that I know how to do. You can't kind of separate it and say this is the goaltending without

without the shot suppression and the goal suppression included. But, yeah, no, I'm just, it's not their time. I mean, we could have a line conversation maybe when I get this camera fixed about whether San Jose should have jumped already. Yeah. And I kind of don't think they should have, but maybe shouldn't say that because maybe I'll want to work for my old friend, Mike Greer or something. Do you think of Luca Cagnoni, by the way? Yes. I watched him in the H.L. last year. I like him. It's just, I don't know if that's kind of the right spot for him right now. How many guys do you think are legit NHLers who, right, we'll end on this one.

legit NHLers that are sort of trapped in the American League right now? More than you know, I mean, if you kind of, I think every coach has got like one guy that he holds onto that could easily be replaced in the HL. So, I mean, you know, you do the math with that. You know, there's probably a six and a seven defenseman and an 11th and 12th forward that you could go pull out of the HL if you kind of wanted to. And, I mean, you know, people, who am I to say about? nepotism. I've got to stand the cup ring because I knew Tulsi and Dillianne. It's good if it works in your favor. You know, it's funny talking about, talking about that.

And the players in the American League, I was texting with someone over the weekend. And we were talking about Amadeus Lombardi, right? Not to pile on Detroit even more here, but we're talking about Lombardi and he said to me something along the lines of if the new WizKid general manager on the scene decides to call you to talk about an American League prospect that you have well down your depth chart it's probably a good idea to hang up instead of looking at your phone and saying oh Nigerian prince it says on my caller ID this might work out very well for me. me, probably a good idea to put the phone down instead. And now, Amadeus Lombardi is in the NHL

with the New Jersey Devils. Um, buddy, thanks so much for stopping by and, uh, and doing, and, and, and, and, and working the technology and everything. Yeah, no, we just have the, like, we've just got the internet in, uh, Newfoundland three years ago and it's been really, well, what you're going to find is you're going to find some great old Tully Blanchard wrestling matches, uh, on YouTube. I highly recommend you spend the rest of your day doing that. And well, no, I appreciate that. I was looking for something to do for the rest of the day. And thanks for that, Jeff.

Old NWA matches. Thank you, Dennis. We'll talk about it. We'll touch base soon. Thank you, Jeff. There is, Dennis King. Former Scout with the Carolina Hurricanes. Won a Stanley Cup.

This hockey stuff is easy. One year is a scout. One year wins a Stanley Cup. Just make like J.D. Salinger. You're right. Catcher in the Rye and then you're never heard from again. Anything for you? Oh, by the way, before

before we get to Zach here, I want to mention one thing about November. Port of mental health affects everyone when a man struggles or dies prematurely. The impact affects families, workplaces, and communities. In 2023, almost 75,000 Canadian men died before the age of 75.

And Canada lost 12.4 billion to avoidable illness and premature death among men and boys. Healthyer men help build healthier families and communities. Make a grow mitment, challenge a friend to grow together and change, men's health. Grow Mipment is your commitment to take on Move Move Move Move 60K, host something, or do it your own way.

To learn more, please visit Movember.com. All right. Anything out of Dennis or Sarah that tickles that chin of yours, that bearded chin? By the way, you're going to be up late. Yeah, it's a late one tonight. Tonight for Leafs well after dark. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it's a late one.

Well, I just think it's bullshit that my team. hasn't won a Cups in 67 and this guy comes in for one goddamn year. One year, Dennis. Yeah, that's it. Hockey's easy. Hockey's easy. Yeah. I just think it's interesting how Dennis views the game. I mean, we talk about these guys a lot, but just even looking at where you're talking

about the depth lines and I know he made some jokes about the Oilers, but like the 50-50 hockey that you brought up. And then you're looking elsewhere and saying, hey, these teams are going to wash out, where can we find where we can win in the day? discrepancies in the lineups. I just find that approach very interesting. I have a thought, I have a thought, I guess, or something I was wondering from the conversation with Sarah.

And it wasn't necessarily something that was brought up in particular. But Jeff, watching that game last night, and this is going to sound insane. And I understand that it sounds insane when I say this. But hear me out. I wonder if not having Connor Hellebuck and knowing that you don't have. Connor Hellebuck is better for the Winnipeg Jets as a whole. Because you have to pay more attention to what you're doing because the goalie's not going to bill you out.

Yes. It's a theory. It's a theory. And I watched it last night and I watched them against Colorado. If you're a bad team and your goalie covers up a bunch of mistakes, like yeah, hallelujah, need them. But if you're a good team, that's like, you know what? I can cheat a little bit more because I know the Hallibuck's going to bail me out.

And if you don't have them, you mind your knitting. I understand what you're saying. You mind your knitting a little bit more and you have enough skill and quality that you can still succeed and still excel. Yeah. That's not crazy at all. I don't think that's a crazy statement at all. Like long term, you'd probably rather have Connor Hallibuck.

Respectfully, Stuart Skinner. You probably what? But, you know, I watch this team. I want Skinner to do. Hang, I'm going to cut you off. I really want Stu Skinner to do well. Oh, yeah. I said there are a part of you that's like after the meat grind.

he went through in Edmondson. And I know he's not the, like, if you're a goalie that goes through a meat grinder in Edmonton, don't feel special because everybody goes through it. Yeah. But isn't there a soft spot and you're hard that's like, man, I really want this guy to do well?

Yeah, yeah. And I'm not saying I don't want him to do well. I'm just saying if you had to compare, you know, goalie A, goalie B and you compare the resumes. I'm taking Connor Hellbuck and that's no disrespect to Stuart Skinner. And I also want him to do well. But you get a, you get a solid goaltender in Stuart Skinner.

Like he's not, he's not a bad goal. goaltender by any stretch of the imagination. You put them in there. I watched that game last night. The commitment to detail, specifically in the defensive zone, in transition, when they're getting back towards their own net, it just seemed so dialed in in every aspect of the game.

The amount of times that you watch a corner battle take place where the support down to the corner where it's either the centerman who's supporting low or the wingers making sure they're taking away guys on the wall up to the point. Like it's so locked in, Jeff. The lapses in judgment are very much taken out of the game. And I feel like in ways that Winnipeg could afford to have in previous years. I don't disagree. Might just prepare them better for playoffs.

That's a crazy getting real ahead of ourselves. But playoffs if you get there. Well, it's four games. So like what the hell? Why not? We can talk. We can just pencil them in right now. But you know what I mean?

Colorado maybe. You know, Dallas, maybe, Utah, or Winnipeg? Yeah, 100%. You know what I mean. You know what I mean. Like, those are the kinds of things that if you can clean those up in your game,

it might just be an area that they just have completely forgotten about. Or parts of the details of the game that they just have said, we don't need to worry about those things. And then you get to the playoffs and you've got a guy who's played 65 games and you went, whoa, the hell happened here. Well, you went 82 without worrying about that. And he's tired. How come he's locked in his skates?

How come he can't move? How come like 60 footers are going over his shoulder from the St. Louis Blues? What's going on here? Yes, that to me makes a lot of sense. Quickly, I want to get to, and the way to get in, by the way, there's a couple of ways to get in here on the program. We should do more of this. And starting next week, we will. The sheet at the nation network.com is the email.

Sheet line is speakpipe.com slash the sheet. So that's the way to get us. Now, we got a really interesting email the other day. and it turned into an argument between you and me right before the show. Yes. When it involved you turning to me and what did you say something along the lines of, don't do the show in the green room. Yes.

So we're not going to do the show in the green room. Right. Yeah, exactly. We're doing the show here. So let's get this email because I have something that no one's going to like that I'm going to say. But nonetheless, okay. Why don't you read it off? I've said a lot of words.

I'm running out of words. This comes from our friend Paul in Spain. Yes. I want this out there now so that the NHL makes it happen for next year. To start the regular season on the first night, there should only be one game. The Stanley Cup champion on the road versus the president's trophy winner. Put it in prime time, let all the partners air this one game. That's also an interesting concept.

The next night, all the other teams kick off their seasons. We need this to happen, Paul in Spain. What if the Stanley Cup champion is also the president? president's trophy winner. Split squad? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, well, I mean, we know that won't happen because there's the curse, Jeff. So if you win the president's trophy, you could not possibly win the Stanley Cup. You know, it's always been a pet peeve and everyone's about to hate me. Because I'll think it's a stupid idea, but I still maintain if you like hockey, as opposed to just cheer for a team. If you like hockey and you're not just a, oh, I don't know, bearded Maple Leafs

fan staring at me right now from across the glass. If you're just a fan of hockey, the old challenge way is interesting. I always find it funny when people say yeah, we lost the Stanley Cup.

Like, oh yeah, Vegas lost the Stanley Cup to Carolina. They didn't lose a Stanley Cup. They never had it to begin with. They're not the defending Stanley Cup champions. You know who lost the Stanley Cup last year? The Florida Panthers lost the Stanley Cup. The Carolina Hurricane won the Stanley Cup and the Florida Panthers lost the Stanley Cup.

Now, they didn't compete in the Stanley Cup final, but they were the defending Stanley Cup champions. How would you feel? I'm going to get like no one agreeing with me on this one. No one. And I understand this. But again, if you just like hockey and the nerve to have like, oh, I don't know, a lineage of championships

and defeating the champions to win the championship, You win the Stanley Cup one year, you're automatically in the final the next year. Should have been the Florida Panthers and the Carolina Hurricanes. Your thoughts? I've never done so much head-shed to mention my life. That way you can legitimately say,

Florida lost the cup. I just view it differently. I know you do because if you were to the lens if you think the Maple Leafs are going to have a shot here at winning a Stanley Cup. No. Yes, because you cheer for a team. Take that out.

If you just cheer for hockey, no, no. You're nuzzling up to my side of things here. You win the Stanley Cup, you're automatically in the final. next year. No. Because you've got to defend the cup.

No. This is old, this is turning the last century stuff I'm talking about here. No, this is your wrestling brain that is taking over. You're winning the, boxing does this? All of the same milk.

M&A does this? All of the same milk. Okay. All of the same mindset there. You have to beat the champions to win the cup. Right. No. No.

I do not like this. No. The way I view it, though, is that. I told you. No one's going to like this idea. You were determining the best team in the NHL that season. I don't view it as though it's taking the defending Stanley Cup champions out.

Like defending Stanley Cup champions, I get why it's coined that, but I think that it's not the appropriate term for what the NHL, NFL, NBA, MLB, what those leagues are. It is not the defending in terms of they have an opportunity at the end or in one fight to defend said title. Like, it is about determining the best team in said league, the NHL for the sake, that season. It is not about the way which you put it. This is where the fundamental disagreement comes between us that you are defending the

Stanley Cup. Because if you were, sure, I'll concede, Jeff. I get it. I don't view it as defending the Cup. Who are the Stanley Cup champions right now? The Carolina Hurricanes were last season. No, no. By your argument.

It should be right now, there is not a Stanley Cup champion. Right. But ask anybody, who are the Cup champions right now? Oh, Carolina Hurricanes. The Carolina Hurricanes won the most recent Stanley Cup. So right now they are considered. No, not saying the words. Because it goes to your point.

And I just disagree. I think it's the only way we have to explain what it is. They won the most recent Stanley Cup. Right. So they're the defending. Stanley Cup champions. It is to determine Justin Bennett, thank you.

It is semantics. It is to determine the most recent, it is the most recent Stanley Cup champions. You play it out to determine the best team for that season. Pedro in the chat says he's right, though. It isn't a challenge cup anymore.

You're getting a block from the chat. I can't know. No. This is. Listen, I understand this is for a longer conversation where like nothing's really happening and I just want to bore the hell and annoy the hell out of Zach. We can just get them fired up on this one. This is the most, Jeff, a lot of the ideas you say and come up with him, I'm like, you know, I understand. I can get it.

Okay, maybe I don't like it. This one I'm adamantly like, no, zero percent. I know you hate it. I'm loving watching just twisting you up like a pretzel about this one. Like, do you get this mad when you vote? No. you don't i've seen you zach you don't get this mad when you vote but bring up a challenge cup idea hold on a second unfortunately i care more about sports in this nonsense so that's that's my

problem but this is probably the worst idea i think you've had oh i can do worse um thank you so much paul in spain for the uh the email and once again the way to get in to get me and zach fighting uh the sheet at the nation network dot com okay a couple more things here this is going to be interested because we have a number of games on the board. How many games we have going tonight? Is it like 11? I think we have 10. We got 10 games on the board tonight.

All right. So you get a lot to choose from here. Here we go, Zach. This segment brought to you by Sports Interaction, sports book, and casino. Every game is your game when you bet with sports interaction. Bet the action on every period, every shift, every shot, with Canada's homegrown sports book, sports interaction.

In Ontario or Alberta only, must be 19 plus in Ontario, 18 plus in Alberta. please play responsibly. What are you cooking up today, Zacharoo? Okay. So, more challenge cup ideas? I can't. No.

Okay. I have three bets, but you can put them all together and parlay them. And I know that there's a lot of games and a lot of things to choose from. And I'm also going to throw some things out there for people of things I like. But I have one official parlay here to give out. And it has more to do with the fact that I genuinely believe this. Like, I'm very confident in these picks tonight. Okay.

So hear me out. All right. If you're in Calgary right now and or a fan of the flames, close your ears. I apologize because this one you will not like. I think the Calgary flames stink, Jeff. And the Colorado Avalanche are coming off of a... Where is my fainting couch? The Colorado Avalanche are coming off of a loss last night to the Winnipeg Jets,

which we rightfully spent a lot of time discussing today. So I am looking for in this one the avalanche to win by minus one and a half here tonight against the Calgary Flames. I am also looking for Nathan McKinnon to get a goal here tonight at plus 105. And I am looking for Cal McCarr to get an anytime goal here tonight at. plus 310 in this game between the avalanche and the flames. I don't care, Jeff, that it's on the second night of the back-to-back for the avalanche. I don't care if there are guys that are tired. I think a tired avalanche team on a second night of a back-to-back

could go into Calgary and create chaos for the Calgary Flames, unfortunately for the flames. It wasn't as if Colorado played poorly. It was it 34 shots last night? and like I think the I think Winnipeg only threw like 20 at them maybe even less. So listen, Stu Skinner was flat out outstanding. So I would not be shocked at all if Colorado went in there and just starched the flames who are just like rudderless right now. Anyhow.

Just an angry McKinnon. Yeah, I know. We've seen it all before. You know what? Just give an empty net. Like I would have loved to come on here and give a bunch of different bets and a bunch of bunch of different games and I know that people are probably like, well, we had so much to choose from. What is this guy doing? Yeah. I don't know, dude. I pulled up to schedule tonight and I went,

that's it. That's where I'm going. 100%. 100%. Every game is your game when you bet with sports interaction from puck drop to overtime, bet with live odds on every play with easy deposits and payouts. Go to sports interaction.com slash the sheets to open an account. Ontario or Alberta only must be 19 plus in Ontario, 18 plus in Alberta. Please play. responsibly. Before we get out of here, a quick note from our good friends at Airbnb. Jeff and Zach here from the sheet again. We had an interesting summer to say the least. There was so much going on in hockey. We kept the feed hot all through July and August leading up to the start of the new season. But we were both able to get away at least a little bit in

between all the news and rumors and signings and drama that was the hockey season of 2026. Zach, I know you traveled. What did you get up to? Yeah, I feel like I spent my entire summer on the road bouncing from wedding to wedding. But staying in homes on Airbnb made the trips a whole lot easier. There's just something about staying somewhere that feels like your home rather than you're living out of a hotel room

for a weekend. It makes the trip a whole lot more comfortable. No, actually, a particularly fond memory for me this summer was pretty recent. It was a wedding in Prince Edward County where we got to stay at a home on Airbnb. We were right near the main street, near the water, walking distance to breweries

and everything that the county has to offer, like it's like brewing. For me, it was down south again with the family. And once again, since I'm an awful golfer, I drove a cart for the boys. Pretty much every single day we were away. But still, sun, ocean, good food, cool nights, made it all worthwhile.

back recharged. As for more trips this season, it looks like I'll be gone a bunch, mainly to junior hockey cities across the country. And it's trips like these why I love booking homes on Airbnb. You actually feel like you're part of a place, not just passing through it. And it's always a reminder that when we're gone, our house just sits there. Choosing to list our home on Airbnb could be a great way to make use of that space on our schedule and maybe have a little extra money coming in at the same time. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at Airbnb.ca slash host.

Okay, we've kept you late today. So on that, we're going to let Zach get home and have a nap before a very late one tonight for Leafs after dark, which may bleed into Leaf Sunrise. Who knows? Who knows how late this program is going to go today? So a big thank you to Sarah Orleski for stopping by to talk to us about the Winnipeg Jets and a big thank you as well. To Dennis, who was just outstanding. Dennis King, legendary blogger and hockey Twitter OG and, of course, scout with the Carolina Hurricanes last year when they just happened to win the Stanley Cup because hockey's easy.

If you get a chance, watch and or listen to yesterday's edition of the DFO Insider with you as truly Dave Panjota. If you missed any of today's show available right here at a daily faceoff YouTube channel or right here at Spotify or Apple Pods depending on where you are listening and yes, nice little billboard there. Very nice, Zach. DFO Insider every Wednesday

right here on our daily face off YouTube channel. That's it for me. Thanks for the buns and the use of the hall. We're back tomorrow 1 o'clock Eastern for the Friday edition of the sheet. Do we have those guests confirmed for tomorrow, by the way? Burke is confirmed. The other one not yet, so I don't want to say it.

Okay, if that one comes through, it's going to be a whopper. So stay tuned to the socials for that one. Class dismissed. Talk tomorrow.