The Sheet with Jeff Marek - Leafs Fire Brad Treliving ft. Pierre McGuire

Episode Date: March 31, 2026

On today’s episode of The Sheet, Jeff Marek is joined by longtime NHL executive and analyst Pierre McGuire to break down one of the biggest stories in hockey: the Toronto Maple Leafs firing General Manager Brad Treliving. The guys dig into what led to the decision, what it means for the organization moving forward, and how the move could impact the future of head coach Craig Berube as well as the direction of the Leafs’ core featuring Auston Matthews and William Nylander.They also react to the Leafs’ emotional “response game” against the Anaheim Ducks, which came just over an hour after the announcement of Treliving’s firing, including the physical tone set by Radko Gudas. Later, Jeff and Pierre shift their focus around the league with discussion on John Tortorella’s debut behind the bench of the Vegas Golden Knights, the latest injury concern for Cale Makar following Colorado’s win over the Calgary Flames, and more storylines shaping the NHL right now.Presented by bet365 — whatever the moment, it’s never ordinary.#NHL #LeafsForever #TorontoMapleLeafs #TheSheet #JeffMarek #PierreMcGuire #AustonMatthews #WilliamNylander #VegasGoldenKnights #ColoradoAvalanche #HockeyTalkLeave a voicemail: https://www.speakpipe.com/TheSheetEmail us: [e-mail] TO OUR SPONSORS!!👍🏼 Fan Duel: https://www.fanduel.com/👍🏼 Ninja: https://www.sharkninja.ca/ninja-crispi-pro-6-in-1-countertop-glass-air-fryer-rose-quartz/AS101CRS.html?utm_source=Meta&utm_medium=Paid+Social&utm_campaign=H1NinjaCrispi&utm_content=NinjaEN&dwvar_AS101CRS_color=cdb9b8Reach out to [e-mail] to connect with our Sales Team and discuss opportunities to partner with us!If you liked this, check out:🚨 OTT - Coming in Hot Sens | https://www.youtube.com/c/thewallyandmethotshow🚨 TOR - LeafsNation | https://www.youtube.com/@theleafsnation401🚨 EDM - OilersNation | https://www.youtube.com/@Oilersnationdotcom🚨 VAN - CanucksArmy | https://www.youtube.com/@Canucks_Army🚨 CGY - FlamesNation | https://www.youtube.com/@FNBarnBurner🚨 Daily Faceoff Fantasy & Betting | www.youtube.com/@DFOFantasyandBetting____________________________________________________________________________________________Connect with us on ⬇️Link Tree: https://linktr.ee/daily_faceoff💻 Website: https://www.dailyfaceoff.com🐦 Follow on twitter: https://x.com/DailyFaceoff💻 Follow on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/dailyfaceoffDaily Faceoff Merch:https://nationgear.ca/collections/daily-faceoffReach out to [e-mail] to connect with our Sales Team and discuss opportunities to partner with us! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

So you can tell who produces this program by way of who's doing the poll to kick off the show today. How much Leafs talk should we do? Option A, whole show. Option B, full show. Option C, 100% of the show. And option D, all of the show. Ladies and gentlemen, he is the host of Leafs After Dark. He is a producer of the sheet.

He is Zach Phillips, ladies and gentlemen. Yes, we're going to talk plenty about your Toronto Maple Leafs. after the big news yesterday is saying goodbye to Brad for Living as general manager, etc. And we are going to talk about Gouda Sundomi, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. So don't worry, you'll get plenty of that today. But that's not all. We have a lot more coming up on the program as well. So let's get to the blueprint, which is brought to you and powered by Fanduel.

Download the app today and play your game on Fandil. We are Fandual. We are moments away from hearing from Pierre McGuire, a regular here on this program. and elsewhere. We'll talk about Bradshaw Living Fired. Who's next? And maybe most importantly, with the Maple Leaf situation,

what type of general manager should this team hire next? We'll talk about the Radco-Gutus response game. And we should talk about as well, John Todrella's first game behind the bench with the Vegas Golden Knights. And so much to discuss on the Maple East front. And we'll get right to it with Pierre McGuire,

who knows a thing or two, about a thing or two, specifically around General. managers in the NHL. First of all, Peter, thanks as always for stopping by. Second of all,

I guess we're probably in an era now, whether we saw this with Kevin Adams and Yarmal Keckelan. We saw firing with eight games to go with the Vegas goal

of the nights, considering how the last couple of years have been around the NHL, I'm kind of thinking we should stop being surprised by stuff. You getting that feeling, too?

Like, just stop being shocked. Yeah, I'm not, I wasn't surprised last night with Brad getting, you know, let go. I wouldn't surprise by that. a little surprised by Bruce, only because Bruce had paid his penance. I think George McPhee and Kelly McCriman knew exactly what they had in Bruce.

You know, George had once hired Bruce in Washington and fired him. So he knew him really well. And he knew the kind of coach he is and was back at the day in the day. So I was a little more surprised by that. I wouldn't surprise by what happened with Toronto last night, especially after Saturday night in St. Louis. Jeff, I'm not even going to pretend. That's about as low as you can go. That's about and that's not a knock on St. Louis at all.

Don't take it that way. It's just Toronto didn't show up. And that, if you're a management person, Keith Pelley or ownership, you can't have that. Well, and here's the thing about that. Like that is Craig Barubi going back to the height of his success, Stanley Cup winner, revered, love there. A great moment for Craig Barrowby back in St. Louis. And 13 shots. Yeah, no.

13 shots and not a competitive shift in the game. I mean, it really was really was a tough one. And we'll get to Craig Ruby here in a couple of seconds. But let me ask you, let me ask you specifically about Brad Trilliving. I've looked at the Maple Leafs historically. And the thing that comes to my mind is this is, like they were with a couple of managers, there's always mitigating circumstances.

Like I'll paint the picture this way. I've had a couple of people that I've had this conversation with that when John Ferguson was running the Toronto Maple Leafs, Jeff Jackson would have been the assistant general manager. At that time, the Ontario teacher's pension on the Maple Leafs. And so what John Ferguson would have to do like every other manager is submit a budget. The problem was that Ferguson would have to submit two. One budget accounted for playoff revenue and the other was reflective of a rebuild.

And the one that Ferguson always sort of put forth with his recommendation was, the rebuild. But you're the Ontario teacher's pension and all you're concerned about is a return on investment. Which budget do you think gets approved? It's the one that accounts for playoff revenue, which gave, you know, Richard Petty cover to say, John submitted the budget and the board approved it. And the failing of us in media, specifically in Toronto, was we never thought to ask how many budgets did you have to submit because it wasn't just one. So there are mitigating circumstances to a lot of these situations when you're the manager of the Toronto Maple Leafs.

But the way that I've always looked at it here, I'm getting long-winded, is this is a team that has always looked for tactical solutions to strategic problems. And I put it this way. If there's a crime issue, the tactical solution is build more prisons to put all the criminals, but that doesn't address the strategic issue. It is just a tactical solution for the problem. And there's a lot of reasons for this, but I don't know that we've seen a management group in Toronto that can address the specific strategic issues that surround the Toronto Maple Leafs, because as you well know, it is not a market like any other. Long-winded intro,

but you have a thought on all of that. Yeah, but no, it's good. It's very appropriate. So I'm going to say this to you based on what I heard you say. Toronto makes beliefs over the last, let's say, six or seven years, I've had fundamentally flawed asset management ideology. They've had... They've had that...

They've had that coupled with a... And again, like every team went through COVID in the flat cap. But there are a couple of teams around the least. league that were really crushed by it and the Maple Leafs were won because those contracts were never given a chance to age well, whether it was Tavaras or Nielander or Marner or Austin Matthews. But yes, like with that asset management problem has been an organizational standards problem.

Everybody says it's so hard to play in Toronto. I say honk, that's not true. Not buying that ball. Go try to play in Montreal with two languages. go try to play in Vancouver, go try to play in Boston, go try to play in New York, go try to play in Philly. Ask Rick Tocke what it was like in Philly as a player and as a coach when it's not going well. So there are a lot of markets where it's hard to play.

I don't think Toronto is one of the hardest. That being said, their standards have slipped. What you saw Neelander do this year giving the finger to the TV camera and what you saw him showing up in the press box after doing that with just a sleeveless T-shirt and an NHL game, unacceptable. unacceptable. That's part of not having organizational standards. And it doesn't have to be a fashion show, but you have to show some decorum. You do. You're playing for an original six team in an amazing market with fans at care and pay so much to go watch

you play. But their asset management to go along with their standards, not good enough. The Mitchell Marner return was terrible. They misread the room on Mitchell Marner, unbelievably, and they got bullied into it. They misread the room big time. Their pro scouts drop the ball big time on Brandon Carlo. This is an unmitigated disaster that trade. Fraser Minton, how you couldn't find a spot for him in your lineup, that's poor asset management, especially when he's playing for you. Paying a first round pick for Scott Lawton,

based on what he just did and then getting a third back, that's terrible asset management. Who is responsible for the ideology of bringing in Dakota Joshua? And I want to know who wrote the script in Toronto for we're going to fix the DNA of the team and how they plan to approach it. It's a slick marketing phrase, but what were you going to do to address it? Because none of that stuff ever got addressed.

So you talked about media, and I'm with you on that 100%. But I'll tell you from a hockey management perspective, this is a case study in how to devalue assets, not how to create organizational standards, and then not how to implement young players that you've drafted and try to put into your organization. It's a textbook failure. That's what it is. So the question then becomes here. I do want to go back to the Carlo deal and the Lotton deal.

Those are two that are going to hang around the neck of Brad Trilliving for his tenure in Toronto. He's got one other one too where he wasn't in Toronto. The Kachuk trade. He's got a couple of goodies. Let me give him a software landing on that one because Jonathan Huberto is coming off 115 point season as one of the best. Who is in center icemen? Who was his center iceman?

Who was his center ice? So he didn't always play with Barkoff, but you know who the genius on, the genius on that line as we redo the Jonathan Hubertow situation was Anthony Declare. Because Declare would do the zone entry because of his speed, push back the blue line. And then all of a sudden all this ice would open up for Jonathan Huberto. And he got to Calgary and there was no Anthony Declare and there was no one making all this ice for him to play on. So it was a completely, a completely different situation. I would see you that. And and Kachuk did a masterful job of position and getting himself into a position

where he could essentially dictate where he was going. But I digress. There is that one. And trust me, the Calgary Flames don't forget. Right. That's why any, anytime you would hear the Maple Leafs talking to the Calgary Flames, it would always be, okay, but there's a tax on top of this one. because I don't think the Calgary Flames ever forgot about what happened there.

But the question becomes, and I don't think you can really answer this until you know what is going to happen with Austin Matthews. But what type of general manager do you think the Maple Leafs need here? Because I know like in the barking chain and the whisper circles it's been for a couple of months now, if the least make a move on the GM, it's Doug Armstrong. Doug Armstrong, Doug Armstrong, you've heard it, everybody's heard it. Doug Armstrong, Doug Armstrong. What type of GM does this team need? Somebody that's really organized. Somebody understands professional scouting, somebody that understands amateur scouting,

somebody that's not afraid to hire the very best people, they're going to have to do some house clean in there. That requires some courage as a general manager that's been around the league. It's not easy to do, but there has to be some house cleaning there. They're going to have to reevaluate their development process, especially down in the American Hockey League. They're going to have to evaluate their college scouting and the free agency of college players.

They've had a lot of swings, but they've had way more misses because of those swings at the college free agent level. So they've got a lot of work to do. And it requires somebody that's really super organized, some of it's not afraid to push buttons, and somebody that's really clairvoyant when it comes to understanding how the game's being played today.

And you've got to watch a lot of games to understand that because every team's different. But I would tell you this right now, they got a lot of work to do. Everybody thinks, oh, yeah, it's Toronto. It's a quick fix. This isn't going to be a quick fix. No. This is very painful.

And you know what it breaks my heart? I'm just going to say this quickly. I don't think I respect too many people as much I respect John Tavaris. I'm just telling you right now. And I see what he does day in and day out. And I know the way he's carried himself throughout the league. I just did a sit-down interview with Matt Martin, who loves him to death. We can't say enough good things about him.

And Matt Martin played and was a bodyguard for Stephen Stamco's when they played for the Sarnia's name. He thinks the world of Stephen, obviously. But when you hear him talk in reverence of John Tavares, it tells you all you need to know. And to see that he gave up a ton of money to stay in Toronto because he cares about the process there. And to see where it's going right now is very sad. I feel terrible for him. I feel really bad for him. So I don't disagree with.

any of that. I think that one of the first things though, because I'm with you, like this is going to be, I still think this is painful. You look at the marketplace, you look at, you look at the assets that the Maple Leafs have, or rather don't have, like the only way you're going to get out of this. Like, there's no one on free agency that's going to come in and save the day. You're going to have to trade your way out of it and you don't have any assets to trade so you can scotch those two ideas. It's not getting better anytime soon. So the question becomes the Austin Matthews question. and that in a lot of ways dictates what this franchise is going to be. Like if you're Austin Matthews, and they will have the conversation.

Like whoever's running the Toronto Maple Leafs is going to have the conversation with Judd-Moldaver, his representation from the team formerly Wasserman, and it's going to be either we can turn this thing around quickly or does Austin still want to be with us here as we go through the next three seasons, whatever it is as we try to get this thing going again. But until that conversation is had, how challenging is it to plan out the future? And keeping one thing in mind, again, with the Maple Leafs, nothing is simple. Keeping one thing in mind here, you know, end of the season, Rogers is going to own 100% of MLSC.

Rogers just entered another multi-billion dollar relationship with the NHL. And I'm sure they don't want to see the first three to five years of that relationship with the cash cow, of Maple Leafs in a rebuild. So that complicates things as well. I would imagine, Pierre. You've imagined correctly. So here's what I'll say to you. You're a multi-sport guy.

The Dallas Cowboys turned Hershey Walker into Super Bowl championship Dallas Cowboys. Austin Matthews has to be their Hershal Walker. He has to be. So he has to be. And he's the only asset you have right now that's going to garner major return Matthew Nyes is not going to bring you that. William Nealander is not going to bring you nearly the return that Austin Matthews will bring you. And so you have to create an auction, obviously with the permission of Austin, if he chooses to want to go.

But that's the only way. If you want to do a quicker part of this fix, that's one of the way you have to do it. And then the other part, this might not sit very well with people in Toronto. You got to sit down with Willie Neelander. If you're keeping him, he's got to get read the Riot Act. This is the way business is done here. And we like all the slick Willie stuff and all this other stuff and Willie style stuff. We get it.

You're allowed to have your own persona. But we're going to create an environment here where it's about you're working. You're going to work. And right now, I don't think there's that many guys working there. So given all of these realities that we just spelled it. out. You know, I thought it was interesting. Doug Armstrong was on with Andy Strickland yesterday in St. Louis saying that he's going

to run the draft for the St. Louis Blues, which I would say complicates a lot of the conversation around is Doug Armstrong, the next general manager to join the Toronto Maple Leafs? Because if he is, there ain't no way he's running the draft for the St. Louis Blues. But the plan right now is for him and St. Louis Blues. The question then becomes, given all these realities and what this team needs. Who are the names? You know, and I, the way that I'll, players are people that could run the team. No, people that can run the team. And I'll, I'll, frame it this way. You look at whether it's, you know, Zito or, or Julian Breezebois, like, teams get rewarded for having creative management, right? And whether it's something, even just something

is simple, you know, everybody looked at, you know, Kucheroff and said cap circumvention and, you know, how to look at, you know, Pat Cain and the Chicago Blackhawks and caps it. But you're finding creative ways to come up with solutions. You know, you look at Julianne Breesbois, who, you know, I'm going to move Michael Cercicchev and we're bringing in this J.J. Mosier guy that nobody really knows about. And you look at that trade now. We're talking about. We're kind of about asset management.

Yeah. And this is a thing. And you say to yourself like, okay, there is someone who's thinking differently and understanding the value of players. And let's not forget, too. At the same time, they were looking at the Surgachev and Mosier, they're bringing back Ryan McDonough. All at the same time.

Like, that's the kind of creativity that gets rewarded. Look at how Bill Zito built the Florida Panthers. That type of creativity, the battery between Bill Zito and Sunny Meda. Hey, we wanted to get tougher. We need a tough guy on our fourth line, but he's got to be able to skate. Boom, who do they go out and find? Johnny Gajee. And AJ Greer.

Yeah. And AJ Greer. Like, like all of a sudden, it's like, yeah. Tough, tough guys, but can skate and can do like that kind of, that kind of thinking. As opposed to just, let's just bring in Dakota Joshua because we need someone tough. And then there you go. That's that taken care of. That doesn't work.

Yeah. So the NEPO stuff doesn't work. Okay. And a lot of these hires were NEPO hires, guys that had sense of familiar. with guys and other stops in their career. That's got to stop, number one, number two. I know people, and I was a coach, and I also worked in scouting, and I also worked in upper men.

So I've got all three. I'd be really hesitant to have my head coach telling me which players to bring in and which ones to get rid of them. I would just tell you that right now, because coaches are terrible scouts. Coaches scout with too much passion and energy directed towards being negative about people in their own organization. That's just how coaches work.

Very seldom when you see coaches scout with positive energy. It's mostly negative energy. So that's why I wouldn't want to coach scouting from the old. They usually overrate players they used to have and they underrate players that they have. That's just how coaches work. It's a bad philosophy to have a head coach or an assistant coach running your scouting department because some cities they do and that's those are the cities where it's

thinking and eventually the coach gets fired. Can I can I slightly push on that one with one example? And that is when a coach has, like, I look at, you know, Joel Quenville and Gustav Forsling. Like, that was like, okay, like this is like, Quinville knows this player. This is why you get this player. You can, that's one example, but it does work. Yeah, and that was good. So he couldn't play in Vancouver, couldn't play in Chicago.

He couldn't play in Carolina. But he could play in Florida. Yeah, don't worry. I get it. So all those other coaches are dummies. I know. I get it. That was that was Joel saying.

saying like everybody's missing on this guy. Everybody's missing on this guy. This is what I'm talking about. They're guys that are positive and they're guys that are negative. So this poor kid got run around and everybody's like too small, can't defend. Yeah. I'm just, so Joel knew, Joel knew because he had them for reps and practice. You know, and so that that matters.

But it's a good pushback. I like it. I think it's really good. Are there names out there? Yeah, there are plenty of names. One guy that will never be mentioned is Nikki Bobroff. Nicky Bobroff should be considered to be a general manager for what he's done in Montreal. It's crazy that the pilferage that he's put forth in Montreal.

I know Marty the points of Chief Scout, but Nikki Bob Ross done a lot of that stuff. And he should be mentioned. Another guy is Martin Madden, Jr. You want to think outside the box, Martin Madden Jr. You want to get really smart and really creative? What did much? Everybody's comparing this Ken Hughes, Jeff Gordon thing in Montreal, what they're doing? one of the smartest hockey guys out there is actually a former scout of the St. Louis Blues

and worked for Ronnie Karan and with Peter Stasney and his name is Matt Cater. He's a brilliant guy and I can tell you right now I know he's been interviewed for other general manager jobs. He's a guy that should be considered. I'm not saying any of those guys should get the job. But if you want to do the interview process properly and you want to find out where the league is heading and where the brain power is, you interview people like that because they're on the boots on the ground workers.

They get it, you know, and so I don't know if they'll even do that. You know, I think they're going to go big name hunting. That's just the impression I have. Or if they keep it in house, they're going to hire Haley Wickenheiser. That's what they're going to do. Haley or Brandon Prettom? Or Brandon. I mean, with all their, I don't know.

I don't know if they would hire Brandon. He's been there for a while. I don't know as a GM. I think he's a tremendous hockey person, but I don't know if they would do that. But I think Haley would resonate, you know, with what maybe they want to do. I don't know. I really don't know. I've heard the name enough.

So I got to think they've had discussion about it. Interesting. All right. Anything do you think we're leaving on the table for Brad Trill Living here before we move on? I feel bad. I feel bad in certain ways. He definitely swung for the fence last year. There's no question he did.

I really admire that part of it. They miscalculated, I think, on the Fraser Minton part of it. I'm not sure they had to go that deep to get Brandon Carlo. I don't know who else was in the hunt, but I don't think they had to go that deep. And I think if they keep Stolars healthy in that playoff series, I think they probably beat Florida, but they didn't. So, and it's the way they lost, the way they lost, I mean, the way they lost game five and the way they lost game seven, that resonated with the fans. I don't know how much people remember that now, but back then. and they did remember, five and seven were crushing defeats.

They weren't just, and they were on home ice and they were savage defeats. They were. This is always tough, too, because there's a whole dynamic of, you know, publicly throwing a player under the bus, airing out laundry. But when it became obvious that Mitch Marner was not going to waive his no trade, whether it was for Vegas for Shea Theater, whether it was Carolina for Miko Ranton, And like it was real obvious that Martin,

but Tre Living never went out there and said like, look, we're trying to do something here. And this guy won't waver's no trade. And I know managers don't do that, but that is one of the things that's going to hang on, on Brad Tre Living here. So I got to ask you a question because you're so plugged in. Yeah, you're so plugged into these situations.

I'm going to ask you a question. No, you are. And you're really good at this. Why was there this unbelievable angst? towards Mitchell, Marner. Why couldn't they have sorted this out? I mean, I've coached players that have disliked the general manager that we all worked for. They disliked the ownership group that we might have been involved with.

You know what I mean? But you found a way to make it work, especially if they were an important player. I don't understand how this whole thing got so taken off the track. Talking about Mariner. Yeah. You know, I had this conversation, almost identical conversation with Adam Oates. And Adam Oates loves Mitch Marner. Like, loves Mitch Marner.

That should come as no surprise from one sublime playmaker to another. And he said, why is it always, Mitch has to do things for everybody else? Mitch has got to go fetch the puck for Austin Matthews. Mitch has to go and kill this penalty. Mitch has to go. but no one does anything for Mitch. He said, who's doing anything for Mitch Marner? Marner is being asked to do everything for everybody else.

But who's doing something for Mitch Marner? And ever since that conversation, and this is about a few years ago, I sort of watched the Maple Leafs in the Marner era thinking, you know what, Oates was on to something. And you know how well that resonates with how that resonates with players. You know, I'm the guy that's, you know, fetching the puck for Matthews as he's, you know, sniping in 60 plus, almost 70. Where's someone coming to help me out? Where's mine?

Well, you know what? Is amazing what you just said? So I had this talk with an NHL executive probably two weeks ago. They were asking me about Mitchell Marner. And I said, this reminds me of 1991, 92. It's actually 1990, 91 now that I think about it. I was a year off. I was a year off when Hartford had Ronnie Francis,

and he got run out of town on a rail. Go look, if you don't believe me, if you're a fan out there and you're reading this or watching this, go Google the storylines from the Hartford Kern about Ronnie Francis. You got run out of town on a rail. Can't do this, can't do that. Nobody was doing anything for Ronnie. Yeah.

But they were running him out of town bad. That's what Mariner's situation reminded me of. the Ron Francis and I played a role in that I was doing all the advance scouting for Pittsburgh at the time and Pittsburgh sent me into the old chair in hotel in downtown Hartford and I could watch I think there were three Hartford games that week and there were like three games in Springfield which was Hartford's minor league team we were trying to make a big deal with them and eventually we did make a big deal with them we traded John Cullen and the late Zarli Zalapski for Ronnie Francis Paul Danielson and Grant Jennings but if you go look at it

at the time that deal was done because ronnie francis got run out of town on the rail and there was no internet then there was no social media it was the media that crucified him and it's to what you were saying adam oates was telling me about mitch marner nobody was doing anything for ronnie ronnie had to do everything for everybody else yeah interesting turned out to be a pretty good player jeff he turned out to be a pretty good just a little bit Hall of Fame. Yeah, no, it's one of the best centers of his generation. Yeah, no problems there.

You mentioned Marneur, I do want to get to Vegas here in a second. Your thoughts on John Totorella. But the other thing from last night, I thought that the one player who came out the best from that Anaheim Toronto game was Radco Gudis. So I agree. That takes a lot of moxie and a lot of courage to do what he did. I don't even know if he was 100%.

He knew it was coming. stood up, took it, took it again. I mean, I respect the heck out of him. He took it. And I don't have a problem with what Matt. I know a lot of people going after Max today, don't me. I have no problem with that. He was doing, probably what.

Why? Why? Why go after Max? Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I'm on Mac. Max knew and Radcoe knew. That's fine. I respect Max a ton, but Radcoe even doing this,

he's not a fighter. You know it. I know what? I know what everybody in the league knows. It's not his thing. Can he body check? Yeah. Does he go over the edge?

100%? does. But he took it. He did. Here's the one that's a little crazy, though, if I'm Joel Quindville. Like, I'm not like and see a Leo Carlson get hurt in that game. I'm not like and see Cutter Gortier get hurt in that game. And I'm not sure that my guy, Goudis, was 100%. And you know, he took a bee last night. He's not 100% and like trying to throw punches against someone like Max Domi, who's firing a matcher while you got the bad ankle isn't the most, isn't a thought that tickles me under the

chin if I'm, or I go Gutus. But here's, see, I want to take this sort of one small step further and to play the, the what if game. And I think in the back of Gudis is mine, he's probably thinking this. Because he just went in there and, like, took a couple of punches. Like, okay, I earned it. You know, my bad, awful. I get it.

They owe me one. They owe me a shot. I'm going to let him give it to me. No problem. We'll call it even. Because I think even yesterday on the program, my thought was, okay, like, Guetus is strong. Like, you're right.

He's not a fighter. Like, he's not. Jeffrey Vial. Like, he's not in there throwing knuckles all the time, but he's strong, right? But he's strong. Yeah. Pierre, what happens if, like,

Max comes in, opens up and Goudis flashed chaos him? Then the whole game is nuts. Because then it's, then it's Pizzetta running at him and Carlo running. But the way that Goudis did it, and he protected himself, like you watch his left shoulder.

He eats a few, but he protects himself. and the slipped on the banana peel at the end and go down. We all know how it goes. You've seen this a million times. But I think that Goudis went in there going like, look, I'm just going to end this now, end all of it, snuff it all out. I'm just going to take a couple of shots because even if I try to beat him and I get in a

lucky punch, we've all seen it happen. This thing could just light a blaze if Goudis catches him. Can you imagine for one second? No. If Max is, if Max is counting the last. lights on his back. That game is still going on, Pierre. No, we would have had to bring in the California State Police.

That would have been a whole lot of nasty. It's a great point. You know what? I never considered it. That's one of the reasons I love coming on in the show. You always find a way to bring something else in, which is very relevant. That's relevant. I mean, but the truth is, Jeff, he knew he had to do it.

Yeah. Talking about Judas. He knew he had to step in there and do it. And he did it. Like, he's been in a league a long time. He's a good player. I'm not saying he is because I've coached the late Brian Marchman, and I always played him in certain roles.

And Muz was really good. Like, Brian played the proper way for us most of the time. Sometimes you go over the edge. But I see Goose and I see Marchman. I do. I see a very similar type player. And I tell you one thing, Marchman was a really good player for us.

He was a really good player in Winnipeg. He was a really good player in Chicago. And there was a young guy that he played with in Calgary. named Dion Finuff. That was really lucky that he broke in the league playing with Brian Marchman. I'll tell you that right now. And so I always got the soft spot in my heart for those guys. You know, I had Alfie Samuison, too.

Same kind of deal. You know, those guys matter. They matter. They're important. I know the fans can't stand them when they're playing against their star players, but those guys are important players. Yeah, play hard for sure. I thought that Gourdes came out of that.

Just looking great. He took his licks. Great. He said he was going to, owned up to it, and everyone kind of went. like respect respect respect respect respect for raggo gootis um thoughts on Vegas you know I was saying yesterday we got a we got to like honestly like when it when it comes to Vegas they don't care how anyone else does business they will do businesses they see fit they don't care what you think they

don't care what I think they care what they think and that's it yeah I spoke with george McPhee at a big event over in Europe back in late september early October he was fantastic and he didn't even try to apologize. He said, look, we create a standard internally. We work for Bill Foley and his family. We want to win. We're all about winning. It's nothing else. And so, Jeff, it's pretty amazing when you think about George, who is one of the toughest guys that played in his era, even though he's not very large. Unbelievable standards. You live and die by the standards. They've created. He and Kelly are phenomenal as a partnership. I think about when they had Gerard Galant, they go to the final the first year, no problem. Then all of a sudden, Gerard's no good.

we're bringing in Pete the board. I can tell you, I've spoken to Bill Foley millions of times in Vegas back when he's doing a lot of games there. He's an amazing, intense man, but a very unbelievably intelligent person. It's pathological. He can't stand San Jose. Can't stand San Jose. Vegas ate San Jose, and they hired Pete DeBore from San Jose to replace Jericho land.

And you go down the line and you'll leave Bruce Cassidy. George had fired Bruce Cassidy in Washington, but he thought Bruce gave him the best chance. to win. Guess what? They win the cup in 2023. Then Bruce and the players don't get along and George brings in John Tortorella. And I'm willing to bet money. Part of that is because Torch was coaching in New York when George was the manager in Washington. And Torch's team more times than not would be George's team in Washington, especially in the playoffs. Hello, Derek Step on. If you remember that game seven. So I'm just telling you, there's things that happen there, but they do and they

think about them. It's just not like, oh, we're going to flip the switch and bring in torts. There's a lot they thought about before they did that. So I'm glad you brought up Bill Foley because I think a lot of it and if not all of it starts from the very top and the expectation and the accountability, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. My favorite now, I've only spoken to Bill Foley twice. And the one time that I had a chance to interview him and I love asking owners this question. I know the NHL doesn't like it. but I always ask if there was no salary cap,

how much would you spend on your players? I love asking owners that question so much because we know the salary cap is there to keep them, to keep them from harming themselves. And he said without missing a beat, $150 million. I'm sure anyone at the initial or heard that just went like, oh, geez, Bill.

But that's it. Like he is, it doesn't matter. Whatever resources you need, you're going to get them because the expectation here is always Stanley Cup. And that goes all the way down to George and to Kelly. So just to put it to back your point up, I was at the pod in Edmonton for two and a half months when we had the pod hockey series Toronto and Edmonton.

And eventually we had a final of Dallas and Tampa. And what I remember the most is that's when Robin Lennar was coming into Vegas. Yeah. And they made the decision to start Robin Lennar over Mark Andre Flurry. And that's when Alan Walsh, Mark Andre's agent, put out the cartoon with the etude, two grute, the stabbing in the back. I was with Mark Andre that night in the lobby of the J.W. Mary, which I know you know in downtown Emmetton right next to the arena.

Yeah. And we just sat there and talked for about 20 minutes, just the two of us. Never once was he negative about the team. never once was he negative about Pete DeBore, never once was he negative about Mr. Foley. It was only positive. He goes, I'm part of this. I want to be part of it.

I'm going to be a great teammate. There'll be no negativity for me. He was amazing. I'm telling you, and it blew me away. And it told me how much they had convinced him that this was all part of the greater good for the Vegas Golden Knights. Well, it didn't turn out that way. Obviously, Mark Andre moved around a lot,

but Vegas never got back to the Stanley. Cup final either. You know, it's just one of those deals. But this is a Bill Foley one for you real quick. Yeah. He said, hey, I own all these vineyards all over the world. So I said, oh, that's good. He goes, you've probably heard of my company, the Foley family of wines. I go, not only have I heard of your company, Mr. Foley, I've tried some of your product. It's rather good. He goes, wines we're making that are the best right now or in New Zealand. I have this property in New Zealand. And I'm going, this is unbelievable. Like, he is so wise.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you find out how multi-dimensional he is. It's amazing. And I think, you know, when you got that going on and you're so intense, it goes from business to business to business. He doesn't short-sight anything. He's hard on everything, if you know what I mean. Yeah.

His hockey is just one of his businesses. Speaking of wines, I don't even know if he makes it. Remember Igor Laryonoff had that line? It was like slap shot Shiraz and it was like. I think it was one of them. Yeah, he still does. He still does. I always remember that one of my favorite stories was they,

Florida picked up Larry Yonoff at deadline. And I think you had a no trade. And in order to waive it, Florida had to, because you always paid for the player to, to go to the new market. But he had his entire wines. I think he only played like 18 games with the Panthers.

But they had, they were on the hook to bring his entire wine seller. To Florida. Igor's got some successful restaurants in St. Petersburg in Moscow. Oh, yeah? He's coaching in St. Petersburg right now. But yeah, he still does it. He's an amazingly intelligent man.

He's a guy you should try to get on your show. I've talked to him before. I would love to. I remember the last... He's such a good person. So the last time I talked to Laryonoff, we ended up talking about I'm getting off track here. We end up talking about rink size.

And I said, which do you prefer the international size or the 200 by 85 in the NHL? I'm expecting him to say, Big Ice, the artist needs the biggest canvas, all these types of things, right?

He says, no, NHL size. I said, why? He says, I step over the blue line. I'm in a position to score or help create a goal. I step over the blue line on the big ice. I still need a GPS. to find the net.

I want to step over the blue line and make plays. That's why I like the smaller. I was like, yeah, he's a brilliant hockey guy. I mean, I've had the privilege of talking to him a lot of different situations.

You know how close the people in Toronto were to have in an unbelievable front office? Scotty Bowman was brought in by Richard Petty to interview to take over the entire hockey. I remember that. Yeah, yeah. And I was,

it was in, I want to say it was in June. It was right after the Stanley Cup was over. And I was driving up north. to my home for the summer with my wife and two really young children at the time. Scotty goes, hey, what do you think of this? Craig Ramsey, Igor, you, me, and Barry Smith. We go to Toronto and we take over the Leafs.

So I go, are you serious? He goes, 100% serious. It was, all it took was for Scotty to say yes to Richard Petty. And that's what would have been the front office and the coaches. So hold on a second. This was the, this was, early early 2000. So was that, was that the gig that ended up going to John Ferguson?

Yes. That was that one. Because I know they, they had talked to, I think Lanny, they had talked to Neil Smith. They would have talked to as well for that one. It was a really,

yeah. It's pretty amazing. I know, I know Igor, Craig and I had talked about it. I know Barry and I were like, yeah, this would be. really cool. Wow. Why did it fall apart? Do you know? I don't know and I never asked. I never did. Scott, he obviously moved on from Detroit and eventually went to Chicago with Stan,

but he was still, he had given up coaching. You know, last coaching was 2002 when they beat Carolina. It's amazing. Jeff, he watches your show a lot and I don't know if he's watching today, but he'll eventually watch it later. But he is, he's watching more games. We talked this morning. He was talking about the Anaheim Toronto thing. It was pretty good. It was good. Did he like what Goudis did? He did. He respected Goudis a lot. He thought he was kind of worried the league might have, you know, stepped in a little early. But he really respected. George was there. George was there. He respected what Goudis did. I asked him about, I said, didn't you once have a line in Montreal where you started Robinson at center and Rick Scharck.

Trar and one wing and Pierre Bouchard on the other. Oh, wow, that's tough. Whoa. And he did. It was against Boston in the mid, I want to say like 77, 78, somewhere in there. Yeah. And he did it. And Larry took the draw.

Oh, he had Larry in the middle? Well, I remember, like. Heard played left wing and Char Charter played on the right side and Larry took the draw. Wow, that's a, that's a tough, that's a tough forward group right there. I remember the Canada Cup 76 watching the DVDs when they came out. And sure enough, there's Leigh Robinson at Wing. Like, what do you do with, Scott? Like, I was a kid growing up in Montreal.

I didn't know Scotty from a hole in the wall. And I used to watch every Canadian's game because that was my team. And I'll remember when they kill penalties. They had the big three. So they'd have Savard LePointon Robinson. And Savard would take the face off. And the Pointe Robinson, maybe it was Doug Jarvis. Maybe it was Doug Riceboro.

Maybe it was Jimmy Roberts, the late Jimmy Rob. But they would play with the big three defensemen killing penalties. It was unbelievable. Well, I mean, as you well know, like, and I think back to like, you know, Alan Stanley, for example, or even like Ray Bork. Like, defensemen taking draws isn't a foreign concept in hockey. And there are a lot of coaches that believe that it actually lines up better in some ways. Especially short-hand situations. I would agree with you.

We were talking about Ronnie before. I don't want to get too far away where we were talking, but just to tell you the greatness of Ronnie Francis, we would have and we'd go with five forwards on the power play in Pittsburgh. Larry Murphy was a D-Manor when Koff was there, Paul Coffey. But Ronnie would take the draw and then come back and play the point on the power play. Yeah. He would.

Like, he would take the draws on either side. Mary would be on the half wall. Joey Mullen be on the icing line a lot. Kevin Stevens would be in front. Larry would be up high and Ronnie would be up high. It was awesome. It's awesome. So top of the hour, Keith Pelly is going to speak.

So we'll find out more about the Brad for Living situation. What do you just as a closing question here, what do you expect to hear from Keith Pelley? I think Keith is really organized. He's going to talk about why they let Brad go. Why now? Like why now is it end of the season? Why would it happen now? Yeah, why are we doing now?

I think it's probably. to show people, hey, this is something we just did in it, you know, because Saturday night, we let the guy run the trade deadline, but we just didn't like the direction we were going. Yeah. And maybe maybe another part of it is they see how competitive the hiring market might be and they want to get a jump in terms of who the candidates are. So you just took us somewhere really interesting because I had that exact same thought

when I saw Rich Peverely get the bump up to Assistant General Manager in Dallas. Now, Dallas today announced it. contract extension for Jim Nill. And when, so Pevely goes up to the assistant general manager position. Whenever Jim Nill decides that it's it for, for his career,

as I'm led to believe, it'll either be Rich Pevely or Scott White. That ends up in that, in that position. But part of it, too, I had wondered about it and had people whispered to me like, there's more to this than just meets the eye. Certainly Peverly has

earned that spot, but Don't forget the National Predators are looking to fill their management staff here. And I'm not saying necessarily Rich Pevely for the big chair, but a chair with the Nashville predators. And this cuts that off right away. I agree 100%. I've known Rich a long time. He was a really good player at St. Lawrence University.

He's a Stanley Cup champion. Had his career cut short because of some heart troubles. But just a fantastic person, great father, awesome husband, great teammate. Hockey Dad. He was a really, really good player at St. Lawrence University. I can tell you that right now. We've had a lot of good players go through there. He was one of the better ones in his era in particular.

And it's translated into his career. I mean, he's a worker bee. He doesn't sit around the house. He works. So I think that's great to see people like that rewarded. I have a lot of respect for that. I really do. So given that Nashville is looking for a general manager,

Toronto is looking for a general manager. do you think that there are other teams out there further to your point they're like hold on a second here we may have like a preferred candidate someone we're thinking in the back of can you see another team who may want to make a decision with their general manager kind of say you know what we can't get left behind here the music's going to wind down and we're not going to have a chair yeah i do i think you're going to see more of that coming within the next seven to ten days i don't feel really good about saying who they are or where they are but i do think we're going to see more of that and one other thing Owners know they got a huge expansion check coming because we're going to have two expansion teams, maybe more down the road. And when you have expansion, you lose staff members. And so I think they're going to start to do what you just talked about with Peverley. Cut people off. I don't know why we're not talking more about this expansion stuff, but it's common. And it's one of the things that I'm a little surprised, it's not hockey related revenue.

So those checks that go to the owners were pretty substantial. Well, there was a union that may have asked, and when they were told no, said, okay, what else should we talk about? Let's go to the Olympics. The Olympics are a non-starter. We've got to go to the Olympics. I still to this day.

And I get it. Like, Batman won the war against Good Now in 2005. Like they got two things. They got the cap and they got their nemesis out. And they have been on a role ever since, ever since. And it continues now. I had this amazing conversation with Lou Lamarillo yesterday, not to name drop, but he was on the show. Yeah.

And he was a big part of the 05 collective bargaining conversation. Huge, yeah. He was a massive part of it. And he brought in every different angle from him being the athletic director of Robin's, to him being part of the Nets and the Yankees and, you know, the devils, all these different managerial ideologies that he had witnessed, whether it was being friends with George Steinbran or Randy Levine with the New York Yankees. It was crazy what he was bringing into it.

And they just outgunned. You know, people call it horsepower. The NHL had way more horsepower than the NHLPA. They did. They just had more horsepower. And Lou was a big part of it. And they knew how to win the public perception. You remember the phrase.

That's part of the worst power. The PR, you remember the phrase, treadmill to obscurity. If we don't get a salary cap, this league is headed on a treadmill to obscure. That resonated. I remember watching it. I was the only old leaf lunch show with Bill Waters. And we were just like, wow, that's a Picasso. The league just spun there.

You know, I never got enough attention. When Commissioner Betman got hired away from the NBA, they were the first league to really have a cap. Yep. He was a big part of the creation of the cap. Yes, he was. He was a huge part of it. And right away, not to relitigate the bat,

right away, he got talked out of it in 94 by Bob Goodnow, who said, like, come on, you're too smart to have a cap. You don't need a cap. Like, it really was a brilliant. play by Bob Goodnow at that point. Now, I think a lot of that had to do with, you know, there are a lot of owners that didn't own their buildings and there was pressure on because of the dates.

And I think after that, Betman said, like, look, if we're going to have any leverage in negotiations, we all have to own our buildings. That's the way it's got to happen. And that ended up happening. And the rest is history.

But how Goodnow is able to talk Betman out of the salary cap in 94, corrected in 2004, 2005. But that one was an interesting one. Pierre, always good. For the now and the then and the future as well with expansion, always good to catch up and go over hockey notes with you, my friend. You'll be well. Thanks for making this so much fun, Jeff. Thanks a lot. Enjoy the rest of

the season. I'll talk to you before the playoffs. Yes, sir, we will indeed. The great Pierre McGuire, who stops by here on a regular basis, thanks to Pierre. And just so we're sort of the team that I was wondering about when I talk about other teams that may look to do something with their manager. It's

always an uncomfortable situation, but I think a lot of people are wondering about the New Jersey Devils. And now that there are two teams out there that are looking for a new general manager, there are other teams out there as Pierre and I just talked about who are looking at their own team and saying, if we're thinking about doing it, we might want to get a jump on it here too. Because Nashville is into their process and Toronto is going to start going into their process as well. And again, Keith Pelly, President MLC will be speaking here in eight minutes time, the top of the hour. So I want to remind you of a couple of things. This segment of presentation of the Ninja Crispy Pro Countertop Glass Air Friar. Shark Ninja is elevating the air friar experience.

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It's customizable with 6 and 1 functions, max crisp air fry, bake, roast, re-chrisp, and dehydrate. For more information on the Ninja Krispy Pro, visit the link in our description, or go to shark ninja.ca.ca. Zach, anything from our conversation about your favorite team that you would like to point out or draw specific attention to?

I just don't understand the timing of it, really, just operating off the trade deadline and now doing it. Not necessarily even before the season ends, but 8.45 on a Monday night. We always joke about the 5 p.m. news dump on the Friday. Get it out there. Everyone's finished with the news programming.

4.59. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. This was kind of like all eyes in the world are on us here. The Radco Gudis game is an hour and 15 minutes away. And we fire our GM. And like, okay, that's the thing I just, it just felt weird. Feels a little bit messy.

I feel like all the way through, it just doesn't feel like a very well coordinated plan of attack that took place here, Jeff. I could be completely wrong. but that's my personal feel on it as we saw that news last night. There has been pushback on the idea that Brad Trilliving sort of knew that Keith Pelley was out there in market, talking to other people and said, like, look, if we're not going to be doing this long term and you're looking to fill the position, like, just do it now.

Just do it now. Now, there has been some pushback on that. I still do wonder if considering Nashville is in their process, and maybe there are other teams that could be in their process soon as well, that they want to get more of a head start on the market, considering we may be going through like an era where there's more than just two new general managers in the NHL. That's what I do wonder about here. That's fair.

And I think that that's probably fair if the team that you just alluded to like New Jersey comes out and does that because they recognize what happens. And they want to move off of Fitzgerald and find somebody else. Because the pattern here for New Jersey has not. I'm not saying that that's happening. I mean, in the whisper circles, that's the one we're all wondering about. No, I know. Sorry, I should have clarified. I'm just saying off, but based off the example that you're using there,

more so what I'm getting at is they've not put together a pattern here of sporadicness this season. And what we've seen from the Maple Leafs has felt like a lot of flying by the seat of their pants. All you have to do is look back to what their plan air cooler. was going into the Olympic break. Are they going to be sellers at the deadline? Are they going to be buyers at the deadline? Will they stand pat? Well, the next five games will tell us.

Why? Why will the next five games tell us? And then they won three of those and it was like, well, they might not sell as much. They might not sell the guys you think they're going to sell. And then they came back and then they kind of crap themselves effectively. And it was like, okay, now we have to sell. Each time some of these occurrences have come up.

It's being like, well, we'll figure it. out as we go. Even the marks of Bard firing. An assistant coach the assistant coach was the guy who had to go at that point in time, right? It just feels like the organization as a whole right now is not operating

A on the same page or B, with a clear plan in mind. Because I can take what you're saying about getting ahead of the curve and completely understand that and get on board with it when I'm looking at organizations that have seemed to be following some type of schedule or path.

I don't feel that way about the Maple Leafs and the way they're being run right now. I don't. It's going to be fascinating to hear what Keith Pelley says here coming up in a couple of moments. And so we let everybody get there on time. Let's put the spotlight on Zach. By the way, how was Mike Gisello,

Mike and Buffalo last night on the program? Was Mike spit and fire? Or was he feeling good? How was he? John Tavares, Max Thomey fan club. How was Mike? He was fired up. It was a good one.

I started the show at 1 a.m. We went for two hours last night on the post game. He texted me. He's like, I'm going on with Zach tonight. I'm like, holy geez, you're up late, bud. Nighty night. Yeah. It's just the whole combination of everything that led into the game to what happened in the game.

Led for a pretty good show and pretty fun time with Mike. He stayed on with me for an hour. So I had a blast. I got all day for that guy. I love him. The sheet is powered by Fanduel. Play your game with Fanduel. It's the NHL season.

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Who? Mike Gillis. Ask me about that after. But go. You don't throw that grenade in there. Come on. Go. Oh, man. Okay. Well, today's parlay will

be in theme with this. There's a lot of talk. about who should be the next GM of the Toronto Maple Leaf and I see online and I'm listening to different people talk about it and there's people who seem to believe that the next GM or president or whoever runs the operation here in Toronto they should be someone with bark. There's a lot of other people who seem to believe that it should be someone analytically driven, maybe someone a little bit geeky. You know what? At the end of the day, I don't care because from what we've just seen over the last three years with tree living,

it needs to be somebody who can at minimum Hagel. I think you know the three before I put it on screen. Wow, wow, wow. So Denver Barkie is the obvious one for the Philadelphia Flyers. A little nod to the London Knights there. Morgan Geeky and Brandon Hagel, $5 wins you $264 and $50.

Should it be someone with? With bark or someone geeky, I don't care as long as they can higgle. Have any of these hit? Have any of these hit? They're wildly entertaining. I love them. No. Last night we were close, though.

Oh, yeah? We missed on one leg. What was it? Snuggard didn't score. That was the only one that didn't get it. He's been great, too, on that first line with the same thing. Barzal scored, Nye scored, Snuggard did not. Close.

Alas. Alas. That was a fun one. Yeah, no, I think Mike Gillis, because I think there needs to be, like, if you're not going to have an official, you know, president of hockey operations, you need someone there who's done that role and someone in a presidential capacity. And also, you need like a forward thinker and a planner. Like, well, I was on with DFO Live and I was like talking to Hudson Tyler. And it's like, you need to have someone that can plan and not just. plug holes.

Or like there needs to be like a plan other than, well, we need this fourth line right winger and he's available. He's a fourth line right winger. So we're going to get that player. There needs to be something a lot deeper than that. And I think you need to have someone that is really creative. And, you know, one of the things that I think a lot of people point out with Mike where he was really

ahead of the curve is in sleep. Remember when Mike Gillis kind of re-did like sleep schedules for the Vancouver. You probably remember this. Maybe you don't remember this. So Mike Gillis, and now, by the way, everybody does this. But this is back in like 2009, 2010. And what Mike did is he hired people to do sleep studies for his team based on travel and how they could maximize their recuperation and rest through more effective sleeping and napping.

and everybody, honestly, Zach, at the NHL, everybody laughed. I could tell you honestly, and Mike knows this, everybody laughed at him. Like, this is the most important thing to the Vancouver Canucks. Like, what is Gillis doing? This is ridiculous. Oh, he's going to get like softer pillows for the Siddins. Okay, well, that's going to make the win more game. Now, how much, every team when you talk to, how much, every team that you talk to,

there's always a conversation about rest and recuperation. and sleep and how their athletes sleep and recover. Mike was the first. And that's always been how Mike Gillis thinks. Plus, he is kind of like the godfather when it comes to agents around the NHI. Like a lot of agents still call him for advice. Plus he's worked management for a number of years. He was the finalist, a final.

because it was him and Marty at the end for the executive director job at the National Hockey League Players Association and he's someone that takes long view and he's not someone that gets pushed or bullied into decisions. If I'm the Maple Leafs, Mike Gillis and I think of the staff

like progressive forward-thinking people that he could bring aboard, that is a that is if i'm a maple leaves fan that's catnip man that's catnip that's like a new a new vision forward okay you've sold me i'm in by the way by the way to be by the way just be done by the way sleeping yeah uh sleeping um yeah i can understand if he was like pitching that you have to go to sleep with like a green gel on your body and red lights in the room to get something out of you that like is deep, very deep within. Sleeping, guys, like, come on.

Sleeping, we all should have been able to predict that sleeping better would have helped you rest and recover. But nobody did. But nobody did. I know. Nobody did. I was like, what is Mike wasting his time for? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Have a couple of beers. The hotel bar. Go to sleep. Wake up and go skate. Whoopty-doo. That's what you do on the row. Like, no, man. Like Mike had it all mapped out.

Smart guy. smart, smart dude. Anyway, that's a, again, if I'm Keith Pelley, that's where I'm going with my next hire here. But we shall see, and we'll see in moments as Keith Pally starts talking here and explains what happened with Bradshaw Living. And to Zach's point, why? Why? Why last night? Before Goudis took his medicine? Why? Why? Why?

Have I said why enough here? All right. Enjoy the hockey tonight. We're back tomorrow. Tomorrow is of course Wednesday And we don't have Brian Because Brian's in Australia Wishes like at is he at Disneyland or Disney World He's one of the two

Brian's in Australia Oh Disney World So he's in Florida Because he's Disney World Brian Burke is in Australia So we'll have something for you tomorrow Don't worry We'll have a flavor puck or two for you

Here on the program So join us tomorrow right here Whether you are watching On YouTube If you've already subscribed, we thank you. If you haven't already, please consider doing so. Or are you listening on your favorite podcast platform? We thank you for giving us your attention today.

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