The Sheet with Jeff Marek - Live From Penticton ft. Dan Near & Graham Fraser

Episode Date: April 11, 2026

Jeff Marek is LIVE from Penticton for a special Saturday edition of The Sheet as he’s joined by Graham Fraser, owner of the Penticton Vees, and Dan Near, Commissioner of the WHL. With the WHL playoffs in full swing, the conversation turns to the biggest storylines around the league, the intensity of the postseason, and what to watch for as teams chase a spot in the Memorial Cup. The guys also dive into Kelowna hosting the Memorial Cup, what that means for the region and the league, and the growing excitement around junior hockey in British Columbia. Plus, they discuss Penticton’s transition into the WHL, what the Vees’ first season in the league will look like, the long-term vision for the franchise, and how the move reshapes the WHL landscape. All that and more from Penticton on this special Saturday edition of The Sheet.#TheSheet #WHL #PentictonVees #MemorialCup #JuniorHockey #Kelowna #JeffMarekLeave a voicemail: https://www.speakpipe.com/TheSheetEmail us: [e-mail] TO OUR SPONSORS!!👍🏼 Fan Duel: https://www.fanduel.com/👍🏼 Ninja: https://www.sharkninja.ca/ninja-crispi-pro-6-in-1-countertop-glass-air-fryer-rose-quartz/AS101CRS.html?utm_source=Meta&utm_medium=Paid+Social&utm_campaign=H1NinjaCrispi&utm_content=NinjaEN&dwvar_AS101CRS_color=cdb9b8Reach out to [e-mail] to connect with our Sales Team and discuss opportunities to partner with us!If you liked this, check out:🚨 OTT - Coming in Hot Sens | https://www.youtube.com/c/thewallyandmethotshow🚨 TOR - LeafsNation | https://www.youtube.com/@theleafsnation401🚨 EDM - OilersNation | https://www.youtube.com/@Oilersnationdotcom🚨 VAN - CanucksArmy | https://www.youtube.com/@Canucks_Army🚨 CGY - FlamesNation | https://www.youtube.com/@FNBarnBurner🚨 Daily Faceoff Fantasy & Betting | www.youtube.com/@DFOFantasyandBetting____________________________________________________________________________________________Connect with us on ⬇️Link Tree: https://linktr.ee/daily_faceoff💻 Website: https://www.dailyfaceoff.com🐦 Follow on twitter: https://x.com/DailyFaceoff💻 Follow on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/dailyfaceoffDaily Faceoff Merch:https://nationgear.ca/collections/daily-faceoffReach out to [e-mail] to connect with our Sales Team and discuss opportunities to partner with us! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

With all due respect to every other area and city and town in Canada, we love you too, but this is the most beautiful part of our country. And I always say the same thing when I come here and I leave. I say to myself, why am I leaving? Zach Phillips, our producer, this is his first time here. Zach, are you echoing the same thing? Why would you ever want to leave? Yeah, basically from the moment that we were landing and I was staring at mountains the entire way to getting in the car. and seeing trees and water and mountains.

The entire way here is amazing. It's gorgeous. So we're live inside the South Okanagan event center home with the Penticton v. dropping a tough one to PG yesterday, 4 to 1. Game 2 is tonight. So we'll be here for game 2 of this one. And it's a special, you know, sort of afternoon slash early evening edition of the program, the Western Hockey League edition of the sheet.

Glad to be aboard everyone here, super hospitable. It's, again, one of the more beautiful places in the country with one of the most successful junior hockey teams in the country, not behaving like an expansion team, the Penticton Vs. We're going to get there in a couple of seconds. Coming up on the program, the blueprint is powered by Fanduel.

Play your game and download the app today. Play your game on Fanduel. Coming up on the program, he is standing by in a couple of moments. We'll hear from the W.HL's Commissioner Dan Nier. We'll talk about the evolving junior hockey landscape. We will talk about the Western Hockey League playoffs. We will talk about the Penticton Vs and the Klona Rockets.

talk about the Memorial Cup. And we'll talk to Graham Frazier, who's one of the owners, the majority owner of the Penticton Vs. He has a couple of minority owners attached as well. Maybe you've heard of them, Mark Schifley and Mike Richter. I understand they're a big deal. In the meantime, this can invite to our first guest here of the program. He's the commissioner of the Western Hockey League. He is Dan Neer and he joins me now. Dan, thanks for being patient with my rambling opening. But really, whenever I come here, I always say, the same thing. Why am I not living here? My sister lives on the island. She's in Duncan. And every time I visit, I'm envious. No offense to all the other wonderful cities in the Western

Hockey League. But where do you place these two in the Okanagan? Well, I think you know I moved here from Oregon. And I'm up here in Calgary. And I really hadn't spent much time in the Okinawagon. And boy, if there's ever a chance to find a business trip to the teams in the Okinaw. And it's an automatic for me. I wish you would have invited me to be there in person because you would have had me there in a flash. We would have put out the red carpet for you. I'll tell you, one of the things too when I came in and just talking to Pat Lawyer, who's the, I suppose, the curator of this Hall of Fame, the British Columbia Hockey Hall of Fame, whether it's Kerry Price to Ernie Punch McLean, to Ray Ferraro, to Brian Burke,

to my favorite linesman, Jay Shares. Like, there's a real nod to hockey history the minute you walk into this complex. Like, I've always, I always, I always, heard about, you know, the great stories. They're just talking to Alan May about this last week on another podcast about the Okanagan Hockey School and all the players that have graduated from it. And like, this market specifically seems to really want to hang on to and take pride in their history. Yeah. And there are a lot of big names that people in hockey would know who spend time or live in the Okinawagon, who contribute to and are involved with the BC Hockey Hall of Fame, Jim Houston being one of them. And they do a tremendous job.

And if you walk through that hall, it's one of the hidden treasures in Canada. I know a lot of people talk about it. There's no price to get in. There's no slap shot cages and that kind of thing. But some of the coolest artifacts you'll see anywhere in hockey. I was just looking at some trail smoke eaters jerseys as a matter of fact. About five minutes before we hopped on the program today, absolutely gorgeous. Okay.

Before we get to the Western Hockey League, various issues in junior hockey, I just want you to sort of frame for us here, like the Penticton v and their place already as CHL Team 61, like their spot in the Western Hockey League. When I say, when you, when I, or when you hear the name Penticton viz, Dan, what goes through your mind? Well, I think, you know, you alluded to it around the hockey heritage in the community and the importance, like the role that hockey plays to residents of Penticton. And, you know, that's what our league is. We're a community oriented league.

And did we have questions about whether it? community of 30,000-ish, 40,000-ish people could sustain a Western hockey league team. Sure, we did. But then you get there, you see the facility, you meet with management and ownership, you see the track record in hockey history. But then you also see the way the community supports the club. And it couldn't have been a better fit or addition to our league. And, you know, you top that off with going out and winning 44 games or something like that

in their inaugural season. We play 68. So that's a pretty darn good winning percentage. And, you know, the last time I talked to you, I think was the day of the press conference. When I came on, we were talking mainly about Victory Plus. And so I was in Penticton at that time. And I had just finished telling the audience, hey, I know you're used to having about an 80% winning percentage here because the BCHL has a different kind of draft and recruiting structure. You can't expect that in the Western Hockey League.

What do you know they go out and win nearly 80% of their games? What were some of the concerns? I mean, you mentioned the population. Like, look, I come from a town in Ontario, Stoville, which is a population similar to what we see here in Penticton. So certainly that is one of the concerns you might have before it gets the Royal Ascent to become a Western Hockey League team. What else were some of the concerns before Penticton got in? You know, I don't know that there were a lot of concerns aside from will the market support 34 home games plus exhibition plus playoffs. You know, we're a little bit higher ticket price than the league that was their previous.

We have more home games than they had previously. And I think that takes a commitment and it takes a community relevance that's really, really important. I assume when you talk to Graham, he'll talk about some of the creative and unique things they've been talking about from, you know, documentary work they're working on to membership packages that allow community businesses to link up with fans in a really special way. This is a creative marketer and Graham and an incredible hockey guy and Fred that, really, they come as a package. So you've got a fantastic brand. You got a fantastic community. And then you've got a great management team.

Those are the types of ingredients that you need. And you need people who are willing to invest because the cost of doing business in junior hockey is only going up. I can promise you of that. And so you have to find ways to deliver incremental value to fans day after day after day. And this is a group that's working to do that. So give us a snapshot then of the Western Hockey League. I was talking to Brian Crawford the other day when the,

the Brantford Bulldogs were opening up, you know, their Hall of Fame. And Michael Ann Lowers is the first one to go in. And we're having a conversation about the Memorial Cup specifically. And throwing around various ideas on reforming. It does very much seem, Dan, like this thing is going to change, evolve. However you want to frame it, it sounds like the way that the Memorial Cup has been done. And it may just continue, you know, past Guelph, too, who knows. It sounds like there is an appetite now more.

so than ever to evolve what the Memorial Cup is and how it's contested. Is that fair? I don't know. Maybe you're, you know more than I do or perhaps different folks have different ambition. When I look at my punch list, revolutionizing the Memorial Cup isn't at the top of it. But what I would say, and you've probably seen from the Western League since I've come on, I'm two and a half years in, Mario, Brian, both fairly new commission. We are seeking to be innovative and to evolve the way that we do things.

And it's a really delicate balance of respecting all the traditions. But then, you know, trying to do things that the fans get excited about that brings new opportunity and exposure and breadth to the league that we haven't had before. And so I'm certainly open-minded about it, Jeff. But I'm not there yet that it requires a change. It is interesting because, you know, this is, you know, I was just talking a second ago about, you know, being in Regina for the 100-year anniversary of the Memorial Cup. I mean, this is something, again, steeped in history.

Sometimes that can be something you celebrate, and sometimes that can be seen as an anchor or something that kind of can weigh you down from actually moving forward. Like, I look at the history of the Memorial Cup is an important one, and you're talking to a guy whose first love was junior hockey. I understand that. You know, at the same time, understanding that right now, we exist in an attention economy where you need to always be reminding people that you're there,

reminding you're there, changing things, evolving things, doing whatever you can do to reflect the appetites of the modern hockey consumer. How do you balance that, not just with something like the Memorial Cup? And I know that's a Dan McKenzie question too, but also the Western Hockey League, which is steeped in an equally large tradition. Yeah, and that's a fair question. I think that, you know, to me, the duration of the tournament, it's a hard event to run and, you know, going for 10 days and keeping the community alive for that period of time. The format is one that people ask questions about.

If you win one game in the round robin, you're generally good and have a chance to win the whole thing. Like, there's conversations about that. But I think that one of the other really interesting conversations is what should the event be? and we're going to Colonna in the heart of the Okinawagin, one of Canada's most exciting places to be. And certainly in May and late May, I can't imagine a more beautiful landscape and all that behind it. But, you know, that's not the only thing our league represents. And Brandon bit on it this year. Medicine Hat bit on it this year.

Spokane bit on it this year. And Lefbridge bit on it this year. how does the event adapt and work in ways that we can be represented in the different centers in which we operate? And is that a priority to us? Because I think that, you know, events like curling in Canada have done a really good job at bringing communities together. And I think that we have some similarities to curling. But on the other side of it, I think we want to do things that attract a really young audience and folks who might not normally pay attention to an event like this who aren't fans of the individual. teams.

So we're trying to bridge those things together and do what's best for the future of the league. Would it be possible to play two games a day? Anything's possible. Like, that's the one thing I keep coming. I keep coming back to is one of the things, like, listen, I'm happy to watch the Memorial Cup if it lasts two weeks. Like, I'm fine.

I just love the, the tournament. But one of the things that I hear sometimes is, oh, is that thing still going on? Like, we live in such a short attention span world right now. The one thing that I'll just sort of submit this, you know, uncalled for. But like one of the things that I wonder about, would it be possible to make it like a Thursday to Monday, hot shot tournament, a couple of games a day? And it's all wrapped up in one weekend to reflect the sort of short term attention span that we're all developing now. Yeah, it's a good question. And I think it's one we ought to have conversations about what I'm not especially fond of is,

single elimination, March Madness style, Jeff. Like, I think that there's so much invested in a hockey season. I don't think that you always find out who the best team is in single elimination. And so I know you weren't necessarily going there, but you've got to find a way to structure it that accomplishes, you know, who's the best hockey team that week. Okay, a couple of other things. This is year one of the new junior hockey college hockey landscape. We're all trying to figure all of this out. I keep trying to remind people, like, make sure your nerves aren't too close to the skin.

Everything's going to work out eventually here. This is going to be like roller skating down a gravel road. This is what the first year of this is going to be like. What's it been like from your seat, your office, your perspective as a commissioner in the Western League? Well, there are no dull moments. And surprise, surprise. We're all very emotional and we're all very proud. of the work we do to develop these young athletes.

And, you know, we just came back from Las Vegas and we were meeting with some of the stakeholders on the college side. And it was a really important time, I think, to try and get an understanding of where we're together and where we're not and how we ought to think about the future. And, you know, the fact of the matter, Jeff, is for 50-plus years,

we've had this close, close partnership with the National Hockey League and have developed players, kind of how they've asked us to develop players. And we talk about strengths of our program being that it prepares you for life in pro hockey, whether that's the ECHL, the AHL or the NHL, as far as a number of games, playoff series, the rigors of a season and all of that. And it's really easy to say, well, it's too much of a grind.

And people might mock the fact that we're a little bit proud of that. But the other reality is the geography. the Western Canada is spread apart. Unless you want to condense the league geographically, there's not a way to do that without a significant amount of travel. Then the other side is saying, okay, we're playing 30-ish, 35-ish games, and we're into strength and conditioning

and skill development during the week and lots of nutrition and rest and recovery. And here's what I think, Jeff, I think that we're sitting there saying, okay, players, what are our gaps? What are the things that you would like to see from us? NHL GMs and scouts and everybody who were working for at the end of the day. And guess what?

The NCAA is probably doing the exact same thing and saying, hey, I don't know if we should have 30, 40 days off at Christmas time. One of the things is keeping certain players in the CHL is that they play 68 games. Maybe we should play 45. Like, I think that everybody's looking at what another is doing. They're trying to do a better job. And the vast majority of players are going to end up playing both. and there's not going to be very many who in that concentric circle that say, hey, at 18 or 19,

I'm looking to leave early. And those that do will have the choice to do so. Both sides will try and buy to keep those players at that time based on the merits of the development environment that they provide. But everybody's going to be okay. And the pendulum will swing hard. It'll swing back and you'll finally meet in the middle at some point. But we're not just going to sit here and wait. We're going to adapt our program to make it as desirable as possible.

What are some of the things just to other operators around the Western Hockey League? Because like, you're right. Like this is a recruiting battle now more so than ever. And players have more choice than they've ever had. What has the Western Hockey League done vis-a-vis the member teams about making sure that every single market is desirable for any kid that's thinking about going to the Western League? Yeah. So we've been doing two really important things. One is player communication and we've been engaging in player surveys and just asking them.

Everything from if you were the commissioner for a day, what would be the first thing that you change? And then asking them about every dimension from billeting to education to nutrition to on ice conditioning, like all of these things. And that feedback's been invaluable. And then the other side is we revisited our league operating standards. And I sent Ron Robeson, who works as a senior advisor, executive advisor for the league out to do an audit of every one of the clubs to say, hey, let's look at how you're performing against our existing standards and then a layer of new standards that we've put in. And no club was perfect, Jeff.

I think we went back to everybody and said, hey, here are areas of opportunity to augment the experience. And, you know, there's a lot of little things. And do you travel in the night before the game? What meals are catered and provided versus just stopping at a subway on a bus trip and everything in between there, you know, mental health and recovery. But what I will say is one of the things that showed up a lot better than most would expect is the strength and conditioning staff and equipment and facilities. We don't have Costco-sized weight rooms, but if you haven't been to the one in Penticton yet, you'll go in there. And I guess what you'll find are the same types of squat racks, probably the same Kaiser machines, probably all of the same technology, normatex, everything else that's going on everywhere else. It might be in smaller scale, but make no mistake.

It's not an inferior environment to build strength and conditioning. It's more about schedule and priorities. And I think that we're listening and to whatever the extent necessary will adapt and address those things. I'll tell you, you say Norma Tech as a hack runner, I love those things. Oh, the Norma Tech's are just about just the best. A couple of quick questions here for you. The idea of 19-year-olds playing in the American Hockey League, the Western Hockey League, Commissioner says what to that?

I say that there won't be that many. I think that certain NHL clubs are going to experiment with that. But as we, you know, we've talked to a lot of the NHL managers and tried to understand their perspective on it. But some of this is, again, about the pendulum. And when players are leaving and go to the NCAA, when they're going to pro hockey, and it's going to take some time to sort out. There's lots of data on players who have gone to play professional hockey early.

And the date is not super favorable for that. And at the same time, there's very, very few instances where I've heard someone say, man, I wish I, you know, I wish I hadn't stayed in the Western Hockey League as long as I did. You know, I think there's nine captains in the NHL right now who came out of the WHL. And I attribute that to the time they spent maturing here. And there's a big decision, Jeff, right now, around can I go to the next level versus should I go to the next level? And those things are slightly nuanced and different. I think there's a lot of players in our league who could play in different environments.

The question is, have you become a leader? Have you had to carry the team through adversity? Have you played in every situation? Have you worn a letter? So on and so forth. And you, you know, you juxtapose that against the benefits of some of these other environments. And again, it's going to be very personal to each player. But we're not so convinced that just because you can move to the next.

It's kind of an epidemic in youth sports. Everybody's always trying to get to the next thing. We think that patience is a virtue and that we do a pretty good job with those players. Is that the kids or is that the parents? And I say that as a hockey dad. It's neither. It's the agents. What a dope man.

It's everybody. It's everybody. No, the agents do their best to put players in the right spot. But it's a societal thing, right? A lot has changed. I'm being greedy with their time. I do have one that you can put to, bed because at the OHL Cup in Ontario for our viewers and listeners that may not know what that is,

that is a tournament at the end of every season for the U-16s in Ontario and the States. Honey-Baked won the whole thing this year and beat JRC. JRC has an underage player by the name of Cato Rourke, who's applied for exceptional status. You know, around that tournament, Dan, part of the whisper crowd, the barking chain, if you will, was the idea that there were either the league itself or there were operators in the Western League that didn't want or didn't feel cater work should be granted exceptional status because he was born in Texas and that is a Western Hockey League territory. Do you want to eliminate that one, put it to bed or throw a log on the fire? Yeah, there was no uproar. I think there were some

inquiries because you look a player up on elite prospects and you see he's from Round Rock, Texas. Yeah. But it's not about birthplace, Jeff. The rules among the CHL are related to residency. and Ontario has gone through a quite extensive process and has assured us that he meets all of the requirements for Ontario residency and has been there for four years and his family has. And so I don't see this being an issue, but if that changes, I'll let you know. Okay, perfect. You know how it works, right? Like the whispers and the lies run around the block before the truth gets out the front door. As always, Dan, thank you so much for stopping by the program today. Always a delight catching up with you. next time we'll roll out the red carpet and bring you to the Okanagan here in Penn-Secton and Colonna and we'll we can go at first sip after the game.

Thanks, Jeff. See you soon. There he is Dan Nair. The commissioner of the Western Hockey League on a special Saturday edition of the sheet. A couple of interesting things there about the competition between the CHL and NCAA putting to bed the Cato Rourke chatter. And there's still no decision on that, by the way, on Cato Work, whether he'll be granted exceptional status. I'm guessing that they're pretty happy that the draft this year and the OHL isn't to June. Let's bring Graham aboard. Graham Frazier is the owner of the Penticton V's.

And I was at first of all, Graham, thanks so much for stopping by. And it's a game day. I know. It was a tough one last night against PG, but expect the place to be rocking tonight for for games. Thanks so much for joining me here today. How are you? And welcome to the Okinawagon. I love it here. This is my, actually, my first time in Penticton. I've been to clone a bunch, my first time in Penticton. And I just mentioned this off the top of the program, the BC Hockey Hall of Fame. Now, no offense to any of the other junior hockey towns that have their own, Peterborough,

I'm looking your direction in Kingston and Ottawa. That's gorgeous. That's first class. Like I was mentioning, you know, the, I've got a thing. And when I was a kid, the new Westminster Bruins would always come to Ontario and beat up the Hamilton Fin Cups and would scare everybody. So I got a thing for Ernie McLean and the new Westminster Bruins. But like when you walk down that hallway, like is there a, the Kerry Price display is gorgeous. Is there one that you stop at, Graham?

Obviously, they've been ticked in V's history. Of course. Yeah, it's, other than that, when you get to know people personally, you tend to, like, you know, Scott Niedemeyer lives here, and I'm skiing bike with Scott. So a little partial looking at the Niedemeyers and then you're just the guys you know. It's remarkable. And so is this franchise. You know, I was just mentioning to Dan a couple of seconds ago, you know, what were some of the issues around the transition into the Western Hockey League? What was it from your perch? Well, you know, the biggest decision way to make is it's a small community right when you look at the the map of the w hl it's a lot of reginas and saskatoon's and vancouver and we're you know pentictin doesn't fit that mold

population-wise so we had to really analyze whether we thought we could make it work and um really what did make it work was our city came on board you know because we had at least with the bcchel that was completely different yeah and so we had to go to the city and say look if we want to make this move like more revenue has to come in to run a w hl team and uh you know after a few months of going through everything, you know, the council fully supported it. So it gave us the confidence that we could actually make this work. Did you know you would be this good this fast? Be honest. No, no, no, not a chance. It's funny because people were telling us we're going to win five games. You're going to win 10. It's going to take it three to five years to build. It's like you hear everything. And in the first game,

we went into Victoria and we out played them for two periods. And then we lost five nothing. I thought, well, I guess this might be a long one. Welcome to the Western League. Welcome to the Western League. Yeah. So, but no, I never would have expected to, you know, set records like we did. And win the division in year one, but I never doubt Fred. Fred's, I'm going to talk to Fred tomorrow, and I mean, he's legendary here, certainly. I want to ask you about a couple of minority owners with the team here, Mark Schaifley and Mike Richter. How did they come on board? They're kind of a big deal. Yeah, they're, yeah, well, they're personal friends. Mark was our billet when he played junior.

We were living in Ontario at the time. Oh, in Barry? In Barry. Yeah. So we lived up on Lake Simcoe, so Mark lived with us. Oh, I didn't know. And yeah, yeah, he lived with us. Elliot interviewed him at our house one time. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, because we had a rink at our house and Mark went out and skated. So, no, Mark lived with us for a couple years in junior and he's like one of our kids. Like, you know, he's just part of your family. We were talking this morning. Like, we talk every day. The 24-7 hockey guy. Like, that's the one thing I love about Mark Schafe. Yeah. There are some guys, as you know, when their team gets eliminated from the playoffs, they don't turn on the TV. Like, they're just done the season's over and it's going on

vacation. That's not Mark Schafe. No. I'm watching everything right to the bitter end. I went twice to Winnipeg this year and stayed with them and like watching games all the time. I love it. And he works with Adam Oates and he just doesn't watch his own game. Oh, yeah. Him and Adam get in the phone and analyze other guys' plays and what they do. And I've watched Mark transform himself into the player he is. I mean, just how he angles his body, everything he does. He's the most prepared guy ever.

You know, it's so funny you mention that about Adam Oates and angling body because I talk to Adam all the time. I find him to be like this the crazy, brilliance hockey scientist. Yeah. And his whole thing is despite what you may believe about hockey, you should be able to play hockey and not get a concussion. And everything is built around. And there's one thing that he told me that he does with the guys, which I would imagine drives Mark Schifley crazy. He said one of the things that players are programmed to do,

anyone watching, plays hockey, he's done this a million times, is when you're skating with one hand on your stick and you put your bottom hand on your stick, naturally your eyes go down. Even just for a split second out of it would say. And the minute you do that at the NHL level, you're just inviting disaster. So what he does with these guys?

And I would imagine this would drive the LHLGELD, elite of the elite Ikel and Shifley and these kind of guys crazy is what he'll do is he'll have them hold out their stick and they will practice putting their bottom hand on their stick with their head up right which you and but that's like that level of detail it is the level of detail and in mark studies every little thing because it's in you know it's funny i was watching the game in brand him he came to watch one of our games because he didn't make the Olympic team as you know and so he came to watch his play and we were doing these sauce pass and he says you know i never sauce hardly ever sauce the puck. It's one thing he works. He explained why. He says, I spent all my time trying to move the

defender so I can make a flat pass because percentage wise, there's so much more chance that the guy in the other end is going to get it on a flat pass than all the sauces. And we did a couple last night and going, I know what Mark's thinking. He's watching it because the guy fumbles it and whatever. So he tries to move the guy versus that is so atomotes. It's so adamance. That is so adamant. But I would never have thought of that. I've been in hockey my life. Never would I thought of that. Yeah. But that's just the example of what the last. level of what he's thinking of. Don't tell Mark Savard that because that was his entire career, was peeling out pucks off the wall and throwing sauce passes to the slot for Joe Thornton.

Fascinating guy. Did you ever think you would be doing this? Like, I want to get to triathlons here in a couple of seconds. As someone who's always wanted to even do a try, I try, I want to be selfish with your time here and ask you about triathlons. But did you ever think you'd be doing this right now? No, it's funny. I told a story at our press conference announcing it. I grew up in Grimmisbee and Terry. I played junior hockey there for four years. You know Kevin BXA? Kevin played for the same team as us. Kevin was here last weekend.

Oh, that's right. I saw that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He came to visit last weekend. He grew up in my neighborhood, not just my town. Like, literally, lay it, 500 feet away. I played ball tournaments. I'm a little older, so I was gone by the time he was there.

But anyway, you know, my dad took me to the Hamilton Forum to watch the Hamilton Red Wings play the Detroit Red Wings. Because back then they had a farm team, all the teams. So they could have this little game every year. Pat Quinn, Ricky Lee would have played in that. Yeah, Freddie Spack, all those, like Danny, Danny, Danny, Danny. Awesome. Yeah. So that kind of group. And Gordy Howe was there. And Alex DeVecchio was there. But so I walk in as a seven-year-old kid and I'm looking at this thing going, wow, this is the biggest thing ever. So I said, so to come full circle here like many years later and you're owning a team in the league, it was pretty emotional, like just to think that you're involved with something at that level.

Can you sort of rewind that a little bit for because I think every, the wonderful thing about Canada, I've always maintained. The wonderful thing about Canada is there's 40 million general managers and they all dream about being owners. Yeah. Of hockey teams. What was that journey like for you? And like what happens like that first time you get the keys of the car? Yeah. You know, I got involved 20 years ago now. They were building this rank in Pintycton and the local group didn't want to run it.

And I was running Iron Man here and they approached me to see because they knew as a hockey guy. If I was interested, I had no idea what I was buying into. I just said, sure, why not? Pull some money out the tree. We'll buy a hockey team. And I was actually buying with Pat LaFontaine at the time. That was going to get involved. A long story he ended up not getting involved because the deal fell through with the locals

and it got ugly and I had to, and I kept going, even though Pat said, I'm not doing that. But anyway, so we bought it 20 years ago and, you know, and it was a lot of fun. Like, you know, the first, I was still working at Iron Man. So I didn't, first 70 years, I didn't get that involved. Yeah. A couple games a year, whatever. But when we saw got out Iron Man, you know, I started working more as Fred and coming to more games and stuff like that. And then we moved here and 18.

You know, our kids all moved out West. My wife said, why don't we just, why don't we just go out here? So we're out here. And then this whole thing happened. like the Western Hockey League. You know, as you know, and you're talking to Dan about the NCAA rule changes. We always knew, Fred and I was knew that if that changed,

like we'd have to big decision to make. That would be the, that was our. We all thought that great, specifically about Pentax and like, okay, they're on the clock now. Yeah, we were on the clock very quickly. Like, you know, I knew it was coming already. Like, you know, I've been, you know, as a chairman of the BCH, I knew, I don't know why people didn't see it coming.

I thought, it's coming. Like, I know it's coming. Like, I know it's coming. Even you guys in the BCHHL said, how do you know? I said, trust me, it's coming. people, hang on, this is a part, people in hockey, and this is, no offense, this is just the nature of this sport for whatever reason. On both sides here, on the Canadian side of the United States, do a really good job of trying to will something not to happen or bearing their head in their sands about it. Like when we first started reporting about, hold on a second, there's going to be a change here.

Yeah. The first thing pushed back from a lot of other serious people in the industry was NCAA coaches will never allow it. I would say like, it's not up to the coaches. It's the hot up to the coaches. But, Jeff, you're bang on. Like, everyone, everyone's reactive and everyone wants to have it the way they want it. And they protect it. Talk themselves into what they want.

And I always say, I've been in business my whole life. And I'm more entrepreneur, I'm going, you've got to go where the puck's going. Yeah. If you're not going where the puck's going. And even right now, like, even in the WHL, like I went to the league meetings in there going, I knew the guys didn't get the NCAA thing. I know a lot of them are getting it now. Like, because the natural pecking or the market will take it where it's going

no matter what you think. Right. Yeah. Even these junior leagues, like the BCHL, all these other leagues, like, it's going to go where it's going to go. I know you're trying to force it somewhere. Yeah. But it's not going to change. So anyway, that's the reason we had to make the move.

Like we just said, I had a decision, my family and I, and we sat down and said, like, either we get out. Yeah. And so, and we've had our time, you know, and go to something else or we go all the way in. And, you know, I have two boys that, you know, adults. And we, you know, I said someday it's going to be yours anyways. And they. I love that. Like, you know what?

No. Like we're going to go in for a penny, in for a pound. So in, which we're in, we're all in. Yeah. Like now we're all in and, you know, we're working in it. And, you know, it's been a lot of work for your federal tell you tomorrow. The 18 months has been crazy. But, yeah.

But it's been very rewarding too. It's interesting. Just talking about Mark Sheafley, in a couple of weeks ago, we were in Brantford with the Bulldogs and the Hyman family of bought there. Although, you know, Zach Hyman is not day to day. That's his brother Spencer that does that. And there are other, you know, hockey players. Like, I'm firmly convinced, Graham, that, that NHLers, You know, they exit their career.

They've made 60 sheets, 80 sheet, whatever they make. The attraction, I think, to buying a junior team is this is when hockey was still pure. Yeah. Or pure-ish. And it didn't just become business and agents. Just to play. And I think that's part of the attraction. And that's why I wonder now with, you know, player salaries being where they're at and players

investing in various things, I really do expect. I know for a fact that when the Hyman's bought the bulls. Bulldogs. There were a lot of other NHL, current NHL players who started sort of sniffing around and asking Zach and the Hyman family and, you know, and Brian in the OHL, like, how does it so, how would this work if I wanted to? Part of his they have to like, and this is one thing with Mark, I said, like, because he's like family. I said, you've got to have an exit strategy. Like, what's your next thing you're going to? Right? Like, why don't you just learn a little bit about this while you're still playing? Just, you know, just observe more. He's going to day to day he can't

be here. And I said, when you get done, like, you know, you might have something you want to come here and I'll be older. I might want to, you know, say, hey, you guys take it over. Yeah. So you got to have that exit strategy. But the thing that I was sort of wanted to sort of curious your thoughts on this because you're deeply involved. Do you see more NHS, listen, Josh George is an assistant coach with the Colon of Rockets.

I've always wondered about, you know, Shay Weber or buying a hockey tea carry price. Like, do you see a day where there are more, even more than we have now? And there are some. I don't know why they would. Here's the reason. If any of them were thinking about it, and I had this conversation with the guy who owns a West Colonial Award. I was at lunch with him the other day.

And he's, I'm 65 this year. He's like 56 and we're sitting there going like, you still need, he called it the juice. It was a great line. Like you wake up and where else do you get the juice, right? So now you play your NHL career. You look at the dog. You look at the kids and you go,

what's going to give me the juice, right? Like so getting involved with something like me last night, and you know, I laughed because I got a germ and a heart rate. I don't know my watch here. Oh, yeah, yeah. And like, you know, it'll be like 95 watching the game. I'm sitting there. You know, my heart rate's using the force.

40s, but, you know, it just goes right up. That's the juice. We're a fan of sports to see how high we can take our blood pressure. Yes. It's the reason. That's the reason we're hockey fans. Well, I mean, it's fascinating. The way you talk about, you know, you still want the juice in your life. Like, you're a naturally competitive person, obviously. But I can recall one specific conversation.

So me and Elliot and Berkey, Brian Burke, who's in the British Columbia Hockey Hall of Fame, I just saw his shrine. So we used to do Wednesday nights together at SportsNet. And I would always kind of watch Berkey on leaving the studio and leaving the building. I'd walk out for him. And he was always happy to do the shows and always well prepared and had a great time and all that. But there was something that was missing. And I remember when he got the Pittsburgh Penguins job, I said to him, I said, Brian, I got to be honest with you.

I never wanted to offend you while we were working together. But I always felt that at the end of a shift, you were a little bit of. upset because you didn't have any skin in the game. Right. That you were just watching a game, talking about what happened, but it didn't matter who won and lost. Right. That you needed to have a dog in the fights. Yeah.

Some relevance. Right. It gives your relevance, right? A purpose. Yeah. You need a purpose to get out of bed and it's that relevant. And I, you know, you talk to triathlon. When I got out of Iron Man, I go watch them and I didn't feel part of it anymore.

Like, it's that feeling when you're out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're, you know, you're in charge of the whole thing one day. And now you're not really part of it. So, like, that's why the hockey kind of filled a void. When did you know this would?

And maybe the answer is, well, we still don't because it's still the maiden voyage here. But when did you realize that this was a success in the Western League? Are you there yet? Have you had that? That's a good question. Yeah, I think we've been a success. And because we already had a franchise and a foundation, like, we weren't like coming in without staff and zero.

So we kind of had a bit of a history of having success. So it's just a carry on. you know, I didn't think it'd be like this. And, you know, and having the crowds, the thing I didn't know is, are we going to fill the building enough? Are people going to come? Are we going to get the sponsors? Are we going to get, like, you got to run the business side to have success on the ice.

Like, they go together. So I think we've been very successful at that end. Like, I think we'll get better. Like, we still want that to get better. Because people didn't quite know what's the BCHL, what's the WHL. Sure. Now they're, now they come to the games. They go, okay, we can see the difference here.

So I think there's a bit of that. And, you know, a friend and I had this talk this morning. So, like, you've got to measure yourself a little different when you're in the WHL versus the BCHL. We could be good every year in the BCHL because it's recruiting league. Now with a draft league and all the different, how you get players, it's a little more difficult to be dynasties. So you've got to, you know, we, you know, kind of stay in the mix. Like you see, like some teams like London and Everett, they're always in the mix. We kind of just want to run our program that way.

We want to be in the mix. So the question then becomes, too, like, this is one of the things, it's funny you mentioned this way. And this is changing now. So I want to couch this by saying this is changing and it's obvious. And we've seen this in the last few seasons. But in the Western League specifically, there's one thing that the West didn't do that the Ontario League did and certainly the Quebec League did. And that was load up. It was feast or famine.

And we would look at the Western League and say, maybe a couple of tweaks here at trade deadline. But it's like just have like a good year, maybe get into the playoffs, get the revenue for one round. and that's enough. And now we're starting to see more of the Quebec League, Ontario League, vibe in the Western League where it's like, we're close we're going for it, boys. Does it feel that way? I know it's still new this year, but it does feel like we're loading up now. Yeah, and philosophically, you know, I struggle with that.

Like, you know, A, you've got to be loyal to your players that are coming to you. You know, like you don't want to be training everybody and moving them. They're still kids. Yep. And B, is that sport? you know the NCAA went through that in the final four basketball yeah Michigan just won they said they got all these seniors from all these other teams out of the portal and then they go kill everybody I kind of like the everyone has to work be smart do it versus just buy it like the struggle like you need

the struggle I think the you've got to be smart and through effort and work and building it the right way versus I can go buy it you know it's in the NHL you know baseball's bad for that right like the Dodgers are going to win again and but that's how we're going to have a lockout too yeah that's yeah Exactly. That's what that's leading to. So anyway, I guess maybe sometimes I'm more of a purist. I think that you should just, you know, everyone has to have a fair shot and versus, and I get the build up.

If you host a Memorial Cup, you're going to get your best players. But like you said, I think tweaks are fine. You know, like, why not get a couple, you know, older guys that are going to carry you? But if you're going to change your whole roster in January, it's a bit much. It's just, I mean, junior hockey, as you well know, I mean, it's such a, it's such a, I've always maintained, like the hardest trophy to win. in hockey is the Memorial Cup. Your window is so small.

Well, there's, what, 61 teams? To win that. And there's, thanks to Penticton, now there's 61. 61 teams. Yeah, there's 61 teams. In the CHI, like, it is so narrow to win this thing. That's why we're happy being in the final eight this year. Like, we don't want to lose.

Like, we want to keep going. But, like, it's, you know, just, you know, moving on is still a really tough. Every team's good in this league. That's the one thing. Like, we did not have an easy series against Seattle. That was a good hockey team. It's like there were, you know, even though it was four to one, every game was a game. you know sometimes when you're the uh when you're the new kid on the block the new team the new

new owner sometimes i don't know maybe you feel like you know what maybe i'm not going to voice issues or voice concern are you like that um do you feel that way like you've you've like listen bruce hamilton talks you know like there are like big names in this league that have been here a long time but you've been in hockey for a long time yeah like and i've been in sports a long time other sports so like sometimes you have a different perspective but i i think first two governor means i was very you know observing and learning and, you know, because you want to see the lay of the land and who's what. Sure. And you get to know some of the other owners.

And but, you know, there's ideas. I don't mind. I'll throw ideas out. That's my thing. I like ideas. So I'll throw ideas out. Sure. But I'm not going to jump into the controversy and tell the league how they should be running.

You know, I think. I've been here for five minutes. I'm going to tell you with the problem. I saw guys in the BCH Ltable coming in the first meeting. They're telling everybody how stupid they are. And I said, you know, you don't want to be that guy. Yeah. So if it's for the betterment of the league, especially in the business side and how we do things.

but the NCAA thing, we probably had more experience than they did. Yes. Right? With Fred and because that's what we came from. So I know that Dan leans heavily on Fred for ideas and stuff like that, you know, because Dan had to learn it himself.

But we already knew it. So here's something that I've wondered about you and Penticton. Being under the umbrella of the BCHL for as long as you were. And now in the Western League, what did you believe about the Western League? And what have you learned about the Western League? Because there's always that like, oh, well, here's how they,

do things over. Well, here's the problem with that. And then you get there and you're like, okay, now I get this. Like, what are some of the things that you learned about the Western League? The truth is, I knew the OHL a lot better than they did the WHL. Okay, tell me the problems of the oh, HL that. Yeah, because when we had Mark and we billed at other players too, right? So we, you know, we had lots of billets and stuff like that and kids that we knew on the Colt Spear and all those kids. That was our group. So we go watch all their games. Did you bill at Eckblatt too? Well, he lived down the street, but he's at our house almost full time. So, like, you know, he's still close to us. And that was a great hockey team, by the way. They had a lot of good players.

that year. And Barry's good again this year. Yeah, they're good this year. But yeah, it's hard to say what the problems were. I mean, A, I know the hockey's great. I mean, we heard that the academics isn't great, like, you know, before coming in. And then you get here and you go,

they work at the academics just as much as the other leagues. Like, it's not like the some, the kids are just all, you know, off never doing school or caring. So, but you know, the core of it is, we're in the BCHL, we're here. They're all great kids. It doesn't matter like what league, what level. I really love the kids.

kids we have. Like they're just, I mean, they're just really good outstanding man. And I took it pretty hard as I, you know, there's a lot of junior hockey bashing the last few years. You cover certain incidents, which are completely terrible incidents. But I've been at this 20 years and I haven't met too many bad kids. Like, so you're kind of going, well, let's tell the whole story. Because there are really, really good kids that work hard. They're doing their school. They come from good families. You know, and that's what it keeps me, just if they're all a bunch of thugs, I wouldn't be interested. Yeah. That's what I was saying that, like, that's how society changes. Everyone takes care of their little corner and if we all do that eventually things get better like give us the

sort of elevator pitch for kid X you know is is thinking about going to the penticton V I just got I just got drafted by the Penticton V's I'm considering what should I do give us give us a pitch for for why Penticton sure yeah that's first of all the geog first of all this I's going to say we have a pretty good advantage geographically weather wise we got a great facility but you know at the end of the day like friend I always talk about like the buzzword people using sports is culture you know everyone says they have a culture yeah when they're winning it's a good culture when they're not they're losing it's a bad culture yeah the trick is when you're losing can you still say you have a culture a good culture that's the hallmark of a great organization absolutely and we are we really take care

of our players here like at the end of the day like you know my wife we have them over for thanksgiving like we're much more of a family operation we get to i work out with the kids you get to know them yeah fred and his coaching staff have every resource to make you better and you know and i know Fred takes a lot of pride in where the kids go after. He will work his tail off to get them scholarships or get them where they go. Even when they're gone for 10 years, he's still their guy. He's almost like a guy, the mentor and agent that helps them through everything. So, you know, not too many kids have left here having a bad experience. So, you know, we just say that we take care of you. Like, we don't look at you as a commodity. We don't look at you as something

that's expendable. We look at you as a person. And we're going to give you everything you can to have a good experience. And we take pride in that. When they leave here and their families are all thanking us That's what it's about. Listen, I'm a hockey dad to you. One of the questions that I would have for any organization is assure me about the billets. Yes. I'm surrendering my kid. Tell me about the billets.

Yeah, yeah. No, the billets, I mean, junior hockey, it's the fabric of it. So, you know, we're very fortunate in this community that people love the team. So we do get billets and good billets and stuff like that. And if there's a problem, you move the kids, right? Like the parents, some kids don't jive with everybody you put them with. And believe me and Barry, that's how we ended up with Mark. He was staying somewhere else.

and we had another kid and then he was hanging at their house all the time and then they came and asked if he could move in he was sleeping in a basement and eating like frozen food you know with his billet you know my wife gave them gourmet meals like so he he moved in so we we understood how important billeting is there's all those little details right just everything how you treat them and how the community treats them our community really nurtures our kids how did you console mark out for that london series him and i watched in my basement to tell you the truth like that he got concussed in game six as you probably know. He shouldn't have been concussed. I got some bitterness about that. But, you know, he was in my basement and, you know, they actually lost in the last minute, you know,

Bo Horvatt. Bo Horvatt. Yeah, Eckblad turned it over. Poor Aaron. It was just like seconds to go. I know. And then whatever. But they were down, Anthony Camerer was a, who was our other billet, he was a nice player. He was a nice player. He was a good boy. I forgot about him. He was a good player. Yeah. Hardest hit ever in the world juniors he did. Yes. And, you know, and Zach Hall was another good call. He was a good call. He was a nice player. He was a good call. was injured. Mark wasn't playing. So they just got kind of run down. They were the better team and they should have won it. But no, it was, when they announced Beau Horv as the MVP, Mark was just so disappointed because he had doubled his points. Yeah. He carried them on his shoulders.

He did. Yeah. So anyway, that's why I was going to, when you didn't get the Olympic team, I went in to win a peg and just spent some time with them. Okay. I got to be selfish. One of the things I've always wanted to do is a triathlon. Yeah. Always. Like, I'm a hack runner. I'm just making Norma Tech jokes there with Dan a couple of seconds ago. But I've always wanted to do a triathlon. And I've used every single excuse in my latest one is I don't have time because I got three kids that play sports and I'm a I'm a newber. I'm not an athlete. I'm an Uber. I'm a, you know, I've always wanted to do a try, I try to see. For someone like me. Yeah. I'm just going to personalize it. I apologize. I'm occupying your time here now, viewer and listener. What

advice would you give for me for someone who's always wanted to try it? You're in the U.S. You know, Hall of Fame, the Canadian Hall of Fame alongside your wife as well. Like, what do you do? Oh, you know, it's the time thing I don't buy with anybody. I mean, I was, I did Iron Man's when I was doing putting on nine Iron Man's. Like, you know, I, you know, it's and I had three kids doing sports too. So I think that try try, try to try it. My buddies that have done that of, like, yeah, just roll out of bed and try it. You don't want to wing it, but you just want to, like, you know, can you swim is it, is another thing. Like, you have to be able to, no matter how short the swim is, you don't want to get in there safely. You have to take the proper swim training lesson so you're confident. Yeah. But, you know, it's, it's, it's,

I don't know. It's just the time thing. What I did when my kids were playing sports is I would drive my kids to help my boys to hockey and I would take my bike or my running stuff. And I would, I never watched a practice in my life. I would go out. Were you the dad doing the stairs? Well, I know. I was new what the trails were or whatever. And I'd go out and I would train. So I would, I would squeeze that in. So they had their hour practice. I got an hour run it. So it's just like time management doing stuff like that. But it's just I always tell people just go have fun at it. It's not that hard. Try try. Try is not that hard. You run 2.5K, you bike 10K, you do whatever.

But if you want to do an Iron Man, we're going to have a longer conversation. Yeah, I don't know that I have the time or discipline for that one. But I mean, listen, I do the line sure of it when hockey season's over. And so I just try to cram it all in and then summer. And the other thing is do it with your kids. Well, now they're at that age. You got 2010 to 2010. Because then it's way more fun.

Like, I have adult kids and all my stuff I like to do is with my kids. That's the best. We go to the gym almost every day. You're right. That is one of the most fun things to do with your kids. This has been great. Like, this just flew by. Nice to be here with you.

Thank you so much for stopping by early. I know it's a game day. I don't know if you're superstitious about game day. A lot of people in organizations don't talk on game day. Yeah. But the owner does. Yeah. Yeah.

Thanks. I'm a little superstitious. Okay. Thanks, Jeff. Thank you so much for this one. All right. Graham Frazier is the majority owner of the Penticton v. Tonight game two against Prince George.

Drop the tough one last night. Terrick Parasak with two goals in that one. 4 to 1. The final score, we'll see what happens later on this evening. In the meantime, to wrap things up here, as we normally do on the program. The sheet is powered by Fanduel. Play your game with Fanduel.

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If you have questions or concerns about your gambling, or the gambling of someone close to you, please contact Connects Ontario at 1-866-531-2,600 to speak to an advisor free of charge. The next voice you will hear is Zach Phillips, who's been in the Okanagan now for three hours and is not going home. No, definitely not. My girlfriend's going to have to come out here and get me if she wants me to come back to

Toronto. Just to recap of what we had for our bets yesterday, unfortunately, Jeff, we might have a double-cooked situation, the Islanders and my parlay, because the Islanders lost 3-0 to the Ottawa senators, and that was one of the legs. I had Anders Lee, no goals for the islanders. But he had a fight off the start of the game

with Brady Kachuk, shades of... It doesn't count for my parley. It does not. But if anyone else wants to get in, Frankenazer is playing right now, and Eastern County will be playing later in the tank of the... I don't know, what do you want to call it? The Tankable tankathon.

That's your jam, buddy. That's all me. That one is all you. You paint that Picasso, Paint that barn. Take your pick. Two still alive, but one done, which means the total parlay. It's cooked.

Awesome. All right. Zach Phillips. Thanks to Danier, Commissioner of the Western Hockey League for stopping by this special Saturday edition of the sheet, the Western Hockey League edition. And you just heard from Graham Frazier, the majority owner of the Penticton vs game two tonight. Listen, if you're in the area, this is a gorgeous place to watch hockey. And if you do come, come early and check out the British Columbia Hockey Hall of Fame.

It is full value. No slight to other, you know, CHL Hall of Fame's out there at various ranks. It's going to be tough to beat this one, though. In the meantime, on behalf of Zach Phillips and Amel Delage and everyone else here in Penticton, we are back Monday, 1 o'clock Eastern, which is 10 a.m. Pacific time.

There you go. I got muddled up on that one on social media today. I'm getting older. We're all getting older. It's been a long life. We'll talk to you Monday in Colona. I can't get out